<HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3500</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/3/01 4:41:41 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Wednesday, January 3 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3500<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Lemur Anti-Defamation League<BR>Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>"Knocked Down!" with KB3<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3498<BR>Wounded Characters and KB3<BR>Re: Commercial niches for ships<BR>Re: Commercial niches for ships<BR>Re: T4 Starships question<BR>Re: Beowulf Deckplans Are In Dallas!<BR>Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR>KB3 Combat Charts<BR>Re: The GGV System (Aack! Not Another Task System!)<BR>Morale<BR>Re: The GGV System (Aack! Not Another Task System!)<BR>RE: UNSUBSCRIBE<BR>Re: Oops!&nbsp; Re: Australia happened one hundred years ago...<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 18:53:51 -0800<BR>From: Russell Bornschlegel &lt;kaleja@estarcion.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Lemur Anti-Defamation League<BR><BR>Doug Berry wrote:<BR>&gt; At 05:27 PM 1/2/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;I've recently managed to pick up a copy of T4 Starships for cheap ($5)<BR>&gt; &gt; [snip]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Let me put it this way: you overpaid by about $6.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The problem with Starships is that the vessels weren't so much designed as<BR>&gt; thrown together by a cadre of LSD-crazed lemurs.&nbsp; <BR><BR>You say that like LSD-crazed lemurs are a _bad_ thing.<BR><BR>- -Russell B<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 22:05:43 EST<BR>From: Clifford N Linehan &lt;cnl.rubicon@juno.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR><BR>Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>The Associated Press 1/2/01 8:37 AM<BR><BR>SEATTLE (AP) -- Stonehenge it's not. <BR><BR>But the rectangular, 9-foot-tall, black, steel monolith that mysteriously<BR>appeared in a city park has plenty of people puzzled: What is it? Where'd<BR>it come from? Who put it there? <BR><BR>The renegade sculpture appeared on a grassy hill in Seattle's Magnuson<BR>Park, apparently on New Year's Eve. It resembles the shrieking black<BR>marker in Stanley Kubrick's landmark movie, "2001: A Space Odyssey." <BR><BR>It reminded Rebecca Sargent of Machu Picchu, the ancient Incan ruins --<BR>similar vibe, she said. <BR><BR>Her husband, Denny, was a little more cynical, humming the "Space<BR>Odyssey" theme as he moved forward to touch it. <BR><BR>"I feel my intelligence increasing by the moment," he said. <BR><BR>News of the structure's appearance circulated late New Year's Eve on<BR>Capitol Hill as the Infernal Noise Brigade, a marching band of<BR>anarchists, led a peaceful parade downtown. <BR><BR>It wouldn't be the city's first experience with anonymous art, if that's<BR>what it is. <BR><BR>There was the 700-pound steel ball and shackles placed on the right leg<BR>of the Seattle Art Museum's Hammering Man. <BR><BR>And there was the 1,800-pound metal heart Jason Sprinkle -- "Subculture<BR>Joe" -- placed at Westlake Park in 1996, in protest of various issues.<BR>That stunt cleared out a swath of downtown when police decided the<BR>artwork might contain a bomb, which it didn't. <BR><BR>John Thoe paused to regard the structure as he retrieved a boomerang<BR>Monday.<BR><BR>"It's cool," he said. "Especially on the first day of 2001."<BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 21:13:06 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: "Knocked Down!" with KB3<BR><BR>Another set of questions that pop up during a role playing session are:<BR><BR>"Did that NPC collapse when I shot him?"<BR><BR>"Was my character blown backwards when he got struck with that plasma<BR>bolt?"<BR><BR>"Who was knocked to the ground when that grenade when off?"<BR><BR>"If I pop that guy in the face hard enough, what will it take to knock<BR>him to the ground?"<BR><BR><BR><BR>You can answer these questions in a game session easily by using the KB3<BR>knock down rule.&nbsp; Like all of the KB3 rule set, this one is a simple<BR>rule--easy to remember, easy to implement.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; KB3 KNOCK DOWN RULE:&nbsp; Whenever there is a question about a<BR>character being knocked to the ground because of damage, simply have the<BR>character make an Attribute check versus the damage.<BR><BR>Remember, that under the KB3 rules set, attribute checks are made with a<BR>- -DM applied to the difficulty of the throw, and that DM is equal to the<BR>character's stat.<BR><BR>Example.<BR><BR>A grenade lands close to a character, exploding for 8D damage.&nbsp; Armor<BR>and range from the explosion reduce this damage to 15 points.<BR><BR>Is the character knocked down from the blast?<BR><BR>Using the KB3 knock down rule, this is a Dex check.&nbsp; If the character's<BR>Dex is Dex 7 (reduced after taking damage from the blast), then the roll<BR>would be 1D versus a target number of 8 (successful only if the E-Die is<BR>a "6").<BR><BR>NOTE:&nbsp; If the character has a skill, like Athletics, he could certainly<BR>use this skill as part of the attribute check.<BR><BR>ANOTHER NOTE:&nbsp; If the damage inflicted on the character is less than the<BR>character's stat, success is automatic (don't even worry about rolling).<BR><BR>STILL ANOTHER NOTE:&nbsp; Always resolve damage first.&nbsp; Because of this, you<BR>may have a lower Dex score you're dealing with--or one of the<BR>character's stats may be lowered to 0, making him unconscious (in which<BR>case, being knocked down is automatic).<BR><BR><BR><BR>I'll leave you with one more example.<BR><BR>Gvoudzon (Dex 8) is hit with the blast of a shotgun (4D damage), and<BR>Gvoudzon is not wearing armor.&nbsp; Total damage is 10 points, and in taking<BR>the damage, Gvoudzon reduces his Dex to Dex 5.&nbsp; None of Gvoudzon's<BR>phyisical stats were reduced to 0.<BR><BR>Was Gvoudzon knocked down?<BR><BR>He doesn't have Athletics or any other skill that would help him stay on<BR>his feet, so this defaults to a level-0 skill.&nbsp; Gvoudzon can throw 1D,<BR>and since it is an attribute check, a -5DM is applied to the difficulty.<BR><BR>Damage of the shot stands for a static target number in this instance,<BR>and the -5DM reduces this target number to 5 (10 - 5 = 5).<BR><BR>Gvoudzon must roll 5+ on 1D to remain standing after being hit with the<BR>shotgun blast.<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2001 20:17:49 -0700<BR>From: "Joseph Kimball" &lt;jekimball@prodigy.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3498<BR><BR>Asprin taken.&nbsp; Source of this headache: Win98's tendency to change the file<BR>name to all caps when saving a new file from my HTML editor.&nbsp; This has been<BR>fixed now and the link works.<BR>- - Joseph<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 06:52:10 -0600<BR>&gt; From: David Smart &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Personal Web site update<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Joseph Kimball<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Oops!&nbsp; That splitting headache last night must have been from those of<BR>you<BR>&gt; &gt; trying to get the address from my mind telepathically.&nbsp; Unfortunately,<BR>you<BR>&gt; &gt; missed, getting my wife instead of me.<BR>&gt; &gt; The address is:&nbsp; http://pages.prodigy.net/jekimball/traveler.htm<BR>&gt; &gt; - - Joseph<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hmmm.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; 'Fraid the link to the Magazine page from your home page<BR>&gt; doesn't<BR>&gt; work either.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Time to take more aspirin. ;)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 21:31:57 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Wounded Characters and KB3<BR><BR>Wounded characters do not operate at peak efficiency...they move<BR>slower...their reactions are not as quick...they're hurt.<BR><BR>KB3 DAMAGE RULE:&nbsp; To reflect this using the KB3 Traveller rules system,<BR>simply total all damage applied to a character and use that total as a<BR>DM to the difficulty throw of any tasks the character attempts to make.<BR><BR>NOTE that a damage DM applied because of wounds will counteract the<BR>benefit gained when performing an attribute roll.<BR><BR>Example.<BR><BR>Gvoudzon has been hurt by a shot gun blast.&nbsp; His physical stats of 788<BR>have been reduced to 553.&nbsp; He's still up and walking, but he's suffered<BR>10 points of damage.<BR><BR>Gvoudzon wants to tug open a stuck bulkhead door.&nbsp; The GM rules this is<BR>an attribute check based on Str.&nbsp; Gvoudzon's Str has been reduced to 5,<BR>and Gvoudzon has no skill (like Athletics) to help him in the task of<BR>forcing the door open.<BR><BR>This is a default skill, so Gvoudzon has it at Level-0.&nbsp; Gvoudzon has 1D<BR>he can throw, and since it is an attribute roll, a -5DM&nbsp; is applied to<BR>the difficulty.<BR><BR>The GM says that the task to force open the door is an Average (2D)<BR>task.&nbsp; Normally, Gvoudzon would roll 1D vs 2D-5, but since Gvoudzon is<BR>wounded, a +10DM is added to the difficulty.<BR><BR>The result is that Gvoudzon is rolling 1D vs 2D+5 to open the door.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>Another Example.<BR><BR>Gvoudzon has been shot.&nbsp; His physical stats have been reduced to 553,<BR>and Gvoudzon wants to fire back at his attacker.&nbsp; Gvoudzon has<BR>Rifleman-3.&nbsp; The target is at 42 meters, which is Short range, and the<BR>shot is considered Difficult (3D).<BR><BR>Gvoudzon will roll 4D vs 3D+10.<BR><BR>(Gvoudzon's 4D comes from his Rifleman skill.&nbsp; The 3D difficulty comes<BR>from the Short range shot with a Difficult difficulty.&nbsp; And the +10DM is<BR>included because of Gvoudzon's wounds.)<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 03:36:33 -0000<BR>From: "Ben Aaronovitch" &lt;bem@imaginaryfilms.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Commercial niches for ships<BR><BR>Actually the mine or high volume agriculture creates an interesting twist on the<BR>niche.<BR><BR>If the mine produces say 600 dtons a month then you will probably have a big<BR>bulk carrier doing the 'ferry' route. But it will run one way almost empty.<BR>Since its almost always better to get something from your cargo space I suspect<BR>the shipping price per dton would be much lower than average on the way out.<BR><BR>If the mining or the AG company owns or is chartering the ship it gives them an<BR>effective lock on transport.<BR><BR>Ben<BR><BR>'Let's be honest here - you paid for the women.'<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Bill Murrey - Scrooged<BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: Katharine Whitchurch &lt;katts@globalfreeway.com.au&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Monday, January 01, 2001 12:20 AM<BR>Subject: Re: Commercial niches for ships<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; The second is possible - if those 900 people are in one mine, then it could<BR>&gt; quite possibly send a lot of ore to Mora - more than if the 900 people were<BR>&gt; in something (I dunno, a farming or scientific colony) that produced less<BR>&gt; tonnage of output.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'd also be inclined to think there's a niche market in there for tourism -<BR>&gt; whether it's extreme adventure sports in a hellhole, or farm-stays for<BR>&gt; tourists, a mere parsec from Mora indicates to me that tourism should be a<BR>&gt; goer.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 22:58:20 -0500<BR>From: michael stasica &lt;stosh@sympatico.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Commercial niches for ships<BR><BR>Ben Aaronovitch wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Actually the mine or high volume agriculture creates an interesting twist on the<BR>&gt; niche.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; If the mine produces say 600 dtons a month then you will probably have a big<BR>&gt; bulk carrier doing the 'ferry' route. But it will run one way almost empty.<BR>&gt; Since its almost always better to get something from your cargo space I suspect<BR>&gt; the shipping price per dton would be much lower than average on the way out.<BR><BR>It could also pay for a more purpose built transport.&nbsp; There is a trucking fleet<BR>working<BR>in northern Ontario, Canada that uses a combination tank and flatbed trailer.<BR>Basically the<BR>tank is a standard trailer length and width, but only 1/2 as tall and slung closer<BR>to the ground.<BR>There is a full length flatbed mounted on top of the tank, the loads I have seen<BR>consist of<BR>lumber coming south and fuel going north<BR><BR>Would this be worthwhile for a starship? or is the ore going out of the mine<BR>packaged to<BR>avoid contaminating the hold for products coming in to the mine.<BR><BR>Michael<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2001 20:13:39 -0800<BR>From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>Subject: Re: T4 Starships question<BR><BR>knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I've recently managed to pick up a copy of T4 Starships for cheap<BR>&gt; ($5), but I've heard it referred to as "broken".&nbsp; I haven't really had<BR>&gt; a chance to fully read it yet, so can anyone tell me how badly flawed<BR>&gt; it is?<BR><BR>Very.&nbsp; The starship design system is quite good, but eh sample <BR>ships (ie 80% of the book) mostly can't be generated with that <BR>system, the deckplans are literally the worst I've ever seen, the <BR>b&amp;w art is dismal, and the Foss color plates are stuck in at <BR>random in the middle of the starship rules chapter.&nbsp; Of all the truly <BR>terrible books from T4, this is likely the worst.<BR><BR>- -John Snead sneadj@mindspring.com <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2001 23:26:22 EST<BR>From: JDoch226@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Beowulf Deckplans Are In Dallas!<BR><BR>The deckplans are very nicely done, but I was surprised and disappointed that <BR>they weren't in color.&nbsp; Especially when the advertising poster included in <BR>the set was in gorgeous color...&nbsp; Not sure why I assumed they'd be in color <BR>in the first place, probably a holdover from the Azhanti High Lightning <BR>deckplans.<BR><BR>Jed Docherty<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 20:57:24 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR><BR>&gt;From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR>...<BR>&gt;The problem with the A6M was that (like all designs) it was a compromise. <BR>&gt;Its spectaular maneverability (and range) was gained at the price of <BR>&gt;extremely poor firepower and durability [ObTravs: 1 - Beware design <BR>&gt;compromises, extreme performance in one area is usually bought at the <BR>&gt;price of dangeriously poor performance somewhere else. 2 - Design to <BR>&gt;mission and make sure your mission requirements are realistic]<BR><BR>&nbsp; Beware fighting enemy units with double the loaded mass of yours :|<BR><BR>&nbsp; ObTravs: the Imperium is willing to buy its victories in any coin<BR>they have to use - and they've had practice, too.<BR><BR>&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 22:53:43 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: KB3 Combat Charts<BR><BR>Here are the combat charts and notes you will need for a KB3 game.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>The Difficulty Table....<BR>- --------------------------------<BR>1D&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (3+)&nbsp;&nbsp; Level 1 Difficulty&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Easy<BR>2D&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (7+)&nbsp;&nbsp; Level 2 Difficulty&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Average<BR>3D&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (11+) Level 3 Difficulty&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Difficult<BR>4D&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (15+) Level 4 Difficulty&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Formidable<BR>5D&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (19+) Level 5 Difficulty&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Staggering<BR>6D&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (24+) Level 6 Difficulty&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Impossible<BR><BR><BR>*Roll a number of D6 equal to skill level plus the E-Die to roll a task<BR>throw.&nbsp; Compare to difficulty throw or static target number from the<BR>Difficulty Table.&nbsp; Skill options can be used on the task throw.<BR><BR>*Skill options allow you to use skill points to raise your Stat for<BR>measuring purposes or lower your difficulty number.<BR><BR>*Measuring a successful throw:&nbsp; GREATER SUCCESS occurs when total is<BR>less than stat.&nbsp; Regular SUCCESS occurs when total falls within a range<BR>of difficulty + stat.&nbsp; MARGINAL SUCCESS occurs when total is higher than<BR>difficulty + stat.<BR><BR>*Measuring a non-successful throw:&nbsp; Regular FAILURE occurs when total<BR>falls within a range of difficulty - stat.&nbsp; GREATER FAILURE occurs when<BR>total is lower than difficulty - stat.<BR><BR>*AUTOMATIC SUCCESS occurs when difficulty is reduced to 0 or below.<BR>AUTOMATIC FAILURE occurs when task throw results in a total of 0 or<BR>below.&nbsp; The E-Die could influence these rolls.&nbsp; Automatic Failure<BR>typically means a mishap or fumble occurred.<BR><BR>*E-Die rolls a "6"?&nbsp; Double all even numbered Die.&nbsp; E-Die rolls a "1"?<BR>Remove all odd numbered die from the throw.<BR><BR>*Attribute Checks:&nbsp; Apply a special -DM to the difficulty equal to the<BR>character's stat.<BR><BR>*Guageing Success with KB3 tasks:<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Even Dice:&nbsp; 50% chance of success.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1D Advantage:&nbsp; 70% chance of success (plus or minus 5%)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2D Advantage:&nbsp; 80% chance of success (plus or minus 5%)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 3D+ Advantage:&nbsp; 90% chance of success (plus or minus 5%)<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>The Movement Table....<BR>- -------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (1.5m squares)<BR>Crawl&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 6m per rd.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (4)<BR>Cautious Step&nbsp; 6m per rd.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (4)<BR><BR>Walk&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 15m per rd.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (10)<BR><BR>Run*&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 30m per rd.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (20)<BR><BR><BR>*Characters who run may do no other actions in that round.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>The Range Table....<BR>- ------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (1.5m squares)<BR>Contact&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 0-3m&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (2)<BR>V. Short&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4-15m&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (10)<BR>Short&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 16-45m&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (30)<BR>Medium&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 46-150m&nbsp;&nbsp; (100)<BR>Long&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 151-450m&nbsp; (300)<BR>V. Long&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 451-1500m(1000)<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>Fire Combat Difficulty Table....<BR>- ------------------------------------<BR>1D&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Easy&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Contact<BR>2D&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Average&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; V. Short<BR>3D&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Difficult&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Short<BR>4D&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Formidable&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Medium<BR>5D&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Staggering&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Long<BR>6D&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Impossible&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; V. Long<BR><BR><BR>*Each weapon includes a listing for its effective range.&nbsp; A weapon's<BR>maximum range is two range categories past its effective range.<BR><BR>*Apply the weapon's damage rating versus the armor rating of any<BR>protective gear worn by the target.&nbsp; If the weapon's damage rating is<BR>larger than the armor rating, subtract the two and apply damage to the<BR>character subject to the KE Max Damage rule.<BR><BR>*Damage dice stopped by rigid armor means no damage is applied to the<BR>character.&nbsp; Characters incur 1 point of damage for each die stopped by<BR>flexible armor (blunt trauma).<BR><BR>*KE Maximum Damage Rule:&nbsp; 3D is typical maxium damage inflicted by slug<BR>throwers.&nbsp; Shotguns have a max damage rating of 4D.&nbsp; There is no max<BR>damage rating applied to lasers.<BR><BR>*Any damage suffered by a character is totaled and used as a +DM to all<BR>difficulty throws.<BR><BR>*Characters may obtain advantaged DMs or disadvantaged DMs due to their<BR>Str or Dex, depending on weapon type, as per normal CT rules.&nbsp; CT range<BR>DMs also apply to fire combat throws.<BR><BR>*KB3 Knockdown Rule:&nbsp; Attribute check versus damage applied.<BR><BR>*Result on E-Die from an attack throw indicates hit location.&nbsp; Even<BR>number on the die means hit occured to the attacker's left.&nbsp; Odd<BR>numbered results means the hit occured to the attacker's right on the<BR>target.&nbsp; Skew the target results up and down a target's body by adding<BR>and subtracting DMs appropriate to the type of attack made.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; The KB3 Hit Location Grid:<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | 1 | 2 |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | 3 | 4 |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | 5 | 6 |<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>INITIATIVE:<BR><BR>BASE INITIATIVE = Dex + End + DMs<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Base Initiative DMs:&nbsp; + Leadership Skill;&nbsp; +1 Army/Marines/combat<BR>related service;&nbsp; +1 per term Army/Marines/combat related service.<BR><BR>INITIATIVE ROLL*:&nbsp; 1D + Base Initiative<BR><BR>*When Base Initiative of one character is greater than that of another<BR>character by 7+ points, no Initiative Roll is needed.&nbsp; When this is<BR>true, higher Base Initiative always goes first (or last--at player's<BR>option).<BR><BR>*Dex and End reduced by damage will lower Base Initiative.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>COMBAT ROUND*:&nbsp; 6 seconds long.<BR><BR>*Each character may act and move, or move and act in turn--in order of<BR>initiative.<BR><BR>*Characters who run may only move--no other actions allowed.<BR><BR>*Characters who do not move may perform two actions during the round.<BR><BR>*A character who does not move may conduct aimed fire during the round.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>HTH COMBAT POOLS:&nbsp; Offensive Pool based on Str.&nbsp; Defensive Pool based on<BR>Dex.&nbsp; Fatigue Pool based on End.<BR><BR>*DMs for weakened blows (per weapon) are included in CT rule book.&nbsp; 1<BR>point is added to a character's Fatigue Pool for each combat swing he<BR>makes.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 16:14:56 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: The GGV System (Aack! Not Another Task System!)<BR><BR>trentfs@ix.netcom.com wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; That was the idea.&nbsp; Somebody probably already ran these numbers back<BR>&gt; when the IHTIT rule first came up (late 97? -- sometime during my<BR>&gt; years-in-exile).&nbsp; Not that I'd mind you doing it again, though...<BR><BR>Well, I've got a big 15x7x7 table of results, which I won't post to<BR>the list because huge tables of raw numbers aren't really useful.<BR><BR>As I would have expected, the IHTIT rule means that having enough<BR>skill for the task is about as important as 7 points of stats.&nbsp; This<BR>makes more difference for more difficult tasks.&nbsp; Even a stat-15 has a<BR>high chance of failure if missing only 1 point of necessary skill,<BR>though this is really the only significant effect of skill in the<BR>system.<BR><BR>Given a typical mix of tasks (a few Simple, a few Impossible but<BR>mostly Average-Formidable), each point of skill has about the same<BR>effect as 2 points of attribute on average.&nbsp; Stats are still dominant<BR>over skills in general, but to a much lesser degree than without<BR>IHTIT.<BR><BR>Still, a very high attribute with minor skill is always better than an<BR>average attribute and extreme skill even with IHTIT.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 22:24:17 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Morale<BR><BR>Below is a proposed system for dealing with morale for NPCs of when PCs<BR>command military units of NPCs.&nbsp; Comments are welcome. A better formatted<BR>version of these rules can be found at http://www.travellercentral.com see<BR>House Rules.<BR><BR>Thanks, Tod<BR><BR>********************************************<BR><BR>Morale is used to determine the reaction of NPCs to events like attacks,<BR>minefields, surprises etc. Generally one of 2 things will happen: The NPC<BR>will make their morale check and continue there current activity, or the<BR>will break (fail their morale). Units failing there moral may cease acting,<BR>surrender or route. Player characters need not make morale checks. They will<BR>decide individually what to do in difficult situations.<BR><BR>Morale levels<BR>NPCs have a morale and rally value associated with their quality of training<BR>and experience. The morale roll is the base roll required to 'check'.<BR>Rolling the morale or higher means the unit has successfully checked. The<BR>rally value is the roll required to regroup a unit that has failed its<BR>morale. This roll is made by the units leader, and the leader add his level<BR>of Leader skill to the rally roll. If the unit leaders skill is such that he<BR>cannot fail to make a rally, that unit need not check morale<BR><BR>Type&nbsp; &nbsp; Morale&nbsp; &nbsp; Rally&nbsp; &nbsp; Notes<BR>Elite&nbsp; &nbsp; 3+&nbsp; &nbsp; 3+&nbsp; &nbsp; High morale specialist or shock troops (e.g. Imperial<BR>Marine Commandoes)<BR>Crack&nbsp; &nbsp; 4+&nbsp; &nbsp; 4+&nbsp; &nbsp; Seasoned veteran troops (e.g. Imperial Marines)<BR>Veteran&nbsp; &nbsp; 5+&nbsp; &nbsp; 6+&nbsp; &nbsp; Troops who have combat experience<BR>Trained&nbsp; &nbsp; 6+&nbsp; &nbsp; 8+&nbsp; &nbsp; Troops who have received extensive training, but have<BR>no battle experience.<BR>Green&nbsp; &nbsp; 7+&nbsp; &nbsp; 10+&nbsp; &nbsp; Basic trainees. Little more than basic military<BR>training.<BR>Raw&nbsp; &nbsp; 8+&nbsp; &nbsp; 12+&nbsp; &nbsp; Farmboy with rifle.<BR><BR>Checking Morale<BR>Units must check morale under the following circumstances:<BR><BR>1.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit is surprised/ambushed.<BR>2.&nbsp; &nbsp; Leader is killed or seriously wounded<BR>3.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit in site of another unit routing.<BR>4.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit reaches 25% casualties (add 1 to morale roll)<BR>5.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit reaches 50% casualties (add 3 to morale roll)<BR>6.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit reaches 75% casualties (add 5 to morale roll)<BR><BR>Units failing their moral will do one of the following:<BR><BR>1.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit fails its morale. Cease all offensive action. The unit 'hunkers<BR>down' and adopts a defensive posture. Unit may not attch unless rallied.<BR>2.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit fails its moral by 3. Retreat in good order. The unit withdrawls<BR>to a secure location unless rallied.<BR>3.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit fails it's moral by 5. Route/Surrender. Units that are trapped<BR>will surrender. Units with an escape path will route (i.e. assume headlong<BR>flight, often discarding weapons and equipment) unless rallied. Elite and<BR>Crack troops will never route.<BR><BR>Rallying<BR>In order to rally troops that have failed morale, the unit must have a<BR>surviving leader (at least leader-1). The rally roll is 2D6 + leader.<BR>Rallied troops improve their status by one level. Routed troops make and<BR>orderly withdraw, retreating troops adopt a defensive posture and defensive<BR>troops will attack.<BR><BR>Note:<BR>The GM may allow high levels of leader or high rally rolls to allow troops<BR>to jum several levels (e.g. routed troops turn and attack). The GM may also<BR>require morale roles when troops are given difficult or dangerous orders<BR>("the regiments will charge accross that mine field and attack the dug in<BR>machineguns and artillery")<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend"<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 02:18:59 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: The GGV System (Aack! Not Another Task System!)<BR><BR>Timothy Little wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Still, a very high attribute with minor skill is always better than an<BR>&gt; average attribute and extreme skill even with IHTIT.<BR><BR>Interesting results, Tim.<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 09:23:41 -0000 <BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: UNSUBSCRIBE<BR><BR>Here you go steven<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: steven [mailto:steven@terra-australis-mandes.com.au]<BR>&gt; Sent: 03 January 2001 00:12<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: UNSUBSCRIBE<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; UNSUBSCRIBE<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 21:57:48 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Oops!&nbsp; Re: Australia happened one hundred years ago...<BR><BR>&gt; From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" <BR>&gt; I think Alan was referring to the rather rapacious Imperialism that both<BR>&gt; of Britians pacific dominions engaged in (it go *so* bad here in NZ, that<BR>&gt; the [hardly enlightened] British refused to let the colonial government<BR>&gt; use Imperial troops to steal more land of the Maori). Actually, the early<BR>&gt; Imperialistic tendencies of the two dominions almost dragged Britian into<BR>&gt; war with the US over Hawaii. And then President Wilson was shocked <BR>&gt; when he asked the Australian Premier (William Hughes IIRC) if Australia <BR>&gt; really intended to take over PNG and exploit it as a colony only to be<BR>&gt; told "Yes, thats about right".<BR><BR>Near enough.&nbsp; Another way of putting it was that I was grumpy at all the<BR>hacks and hypocrites all over our media the other day and I needed to blow<BR>a certain amount of steam off.<BR><BR>Sorry to anyone I annoyed by doing so.<BR><BR>Actually the Queensland government tried to annex Papua (southern bit of<BR>PNG) before Federation.&nbsp; The British government told them to keep their<BR>grubby hands off it.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Several of the Australian colonies sent troops to help Britain in the Sudan<BR>before Federation.&nbsp; One of the first things the new federal government did<BR>was to send troops to South Africa to fight in the (2nd) Boer War.<BR><BR>&gt; Actually, I can see a rather good Trav senario in that. A mission to<BR>&gt; reign in an out of control Subsector/Sector Duke and keep it all hush<BR>&gt; hush at the same time.<BR><BR>Tricky.&nbsp; It would require the incredibly rare attribute of subtlety.&nbsp; Maybe<BR>that's what happened to Dulinor - Strephon sent a bunch of PCs to have a<BR>quiet chat with him.<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3500<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zc03.mx.aol.com (rly-zc03.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.3]) by air-zc01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 07:41:41 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zc03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 07:41:03 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id HAA98681;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 07:40:30 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 3 Jan 2001 07:40:06 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id HAA98616<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 07:40:06 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 07:40:06 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101031240.HAA98616@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3500<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3501</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/3/01 2:20:11 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Wednesday, January 3 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3501<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>V1999<BR>Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR>RE: V1999<BR>Re: Lend Lease<BR>Re: Oops!&nbsp; Re: Australia happened one hundred years ago...<BR>Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR>RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>Re: Back again<BR>RE: Back again<BR>OT Reseach Help - Adam Smith<BR>Re: OT Reseach Help - Adam Smith<BR>Re: OT Reseach Help - Adam Smith<BR>Beyond 2000&nbsp; Space-Vehicles&nbsp; Rocket Fuel<BR>Re: Beyond 2000&nbsp; Space-Vehicles&nbsp; Rocket Fuel<BR>Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>Re: Beyond 2000&nbsp; Space-Vehicles&nbsp; Rocket Fuel<BR>Intrepid<BR>Re: OT Reseach Help - Adam Smith<BR>RE: Intrepid<BR>Re: Aliens (was Re: Noble vs. military rank)<BR>Re: Australia happened one hundred years ago...<BR>ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH TASK SYSTEMS was Re: Star Worn? Comments<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 13:02:05 +0000<BR>From: Timothy.Collinson@solent.ac.uk<BR>Subject: V1999<BR><BR>As we've now gone through all of 2000 with a volume number of 1999, what<BR>prospect of this changing?<BR><BR>Or does the volume number not/no longer relate to the year?<BR><BR>tc<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 08:22:21 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: Michael Houghton &lt;herveus@Radix.Net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR>Hodwy!<BR><BR>&gt; Sethkimmel wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Of course, this means that someone else must engage the Zekes. The phrase <BR>&gt; &gt;"don't dogfight with Zekes" can also mean that you must use some other <BR>&gt; &gt;tactic to engage them, perhaps use a-a artillery.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; You still use fighters to shoot them down, you just don't<BR>&gt; dogfight them.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; A dogfight is a maneuverability contest.&nbsp; Most allied planes<BR>&gt; wouldn't win that contest with a Zeke.&nbsp; On the other hand,<BR>&gt; many allied fighters had other advantages, such as a higher<BR>&gt; top speed (especially in a dive).<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; See the Zeke before its pilot sees you.&nbsp; Roar in and pounce on<BR>&gt; it, killing it with the initial burst of firepower.&nbsp; If you miss,<BR>&gt; it starts turning to shake you and get on your tail.&nbsp; Don't bother<BR>&gt; trying to out-turn it, just use your higher speed (diving if<BR>&gt; necessary) to break off and circle very wide for another<BR>&gt; pass.&nbsp; Continue the slashing attacks as necessary, using your<BR>&gt; aircraft's advantages to completely control the engagement.<BR>&gt; If he never gets a chance to make you play his game, then the<BR>&gt; advantages his aircraft has are drastically reduced in<BR>&gt; effectiveness.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Yup, aircraft tactics are fascinating. ;-)<BR>&gt; <BR>Yep...and keep the speed up; the Zero had practically no aileron<BR>authority above 250-300 mph while the American fighters with their<BR>boosted controls could roll freely at high speed...<BR><BR>Or the Thatch weave. Pairs fly in something like a loose deuce,<BR>abeam each other. Bad guy makes pass on one partners tail. Partner<BR>turns *away* from other partner, giving wingman a shot up the ass <BR>of the attacker.<BR><BR>yours,<BR>Michael<BR>- -- <BR>Michael and MJ Houghton&nbsp;&nbsp; | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly<BR>herveus@radix.net&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | White Wolf and the Phoenix<BR>Bowie, MD, USA&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 13:25:59 -0000 <BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: V1999<BR><BR>Must be the Millenium Bug :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; As we've now gone through all of 2000 with a volume number of <BR>&gt; 1999, what<BR>&gt; prospect of this changing?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Or does the volume number not/no longer relate to the year?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; tc<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 08:40:42 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: Michael Houghton &lt;herveus@Radix.Net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Lend Lease<BR><BR>Howdy!<BR><BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; YB-40; add another Bendix top turret in the radio area and a &gt; boatload <BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;more ammo in the bomb bay.<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;They had more than that. I recall a figure of 17 50 cal machineguns and a <BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;nose mounted 20mm cannon.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Hmmm...are you sure you aren't thinking of the ground attack<BR>&gt; &gt; B-25 Mitchells?&nbsp; I've seen some of these with an amazing number<BR>&gt; &gt; of forward machine guns and cannon in addition to their tail<BR>&gt; &gt; and turret guns, but I don't recall the gunship B-17 having<BR>&gt; &gt; a 20mm.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; No, I'm going from memory of Martin Caidin's "Flying Fortress", a<BR>&gt; history of the B-17. Alas, my copy disappeared *years* ago. :-(<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I also recall that they *did* see service in Europe, but they never<BR>&gt; made that many, because problems stated elsewhere.<BR>&gt; <BR>And limited service at that... Caidin does relate the tale of trying<BR>to use one as bait to catch an Italian pilot who was using a captured<BR>P-38 to pick off stragglers. Naturally, they managed to get somewhat<BR>shot up on the mission when they managed to connect with this guy. <BR>He made a head-on attack against about 8 or 10 .50 cals. They did<BR>shoot him down.<BR><BR>Generally, the concept was not a success.<BR><BR>yours,<BR>Michael<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Michael and MJ Houghton&nbsp;&nbsp; | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly<BR>herveus@radix.net&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | White Wolf and the Phoenix<BR>Bowie, MD, USA&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 07:57:57 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Oops!&nbsp; Re: Australia happened one hundred years ago...<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Actually, I can see a rather good Trav senario in that. A mission to<BR>&gt;&gt; reign in an out of control Subsector/Sector Duke and keep it all hush<BR>&gt;&gt; hush at the same time.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Tricky.&nbsp; It would require the incredibly rare attribute of subtlety.&nbsp; Maybe<BR>&gt; that's what happened to Dulinor - Strephon sent a bunch of PCs to have a<BR>&gt; quiet chat with him.<BR><BR>"Can no one rid me of this troublesome Duke?" &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 09:00:53 -0800<BR>From: "Acting President Thing" &lt;thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR><BR>On Tuesday, January 02, 2001 7:05 PM<BR>Clifford N Linehan said,<BR><BR>&gt; Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>And I know some of the people that did it.<BR><BR>I like the BBC article.<BR><BR>http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/americas/newsid_1098000/1098419.s<BR>tm<BR><BR>"in the American city of Seattle. "&nbsp; No mention of the state.&nbsp; It's<BR>scarily appropriate.<BR><BR>G.D.D.<BR>Thing under the stairs,<BR>Minion of Shechemist &amp; GothBunny,<BR>Grand Master of the Electron Flow.<BR>===========================<BR>"Everybody's got something to hide except me and my monkey". -J.Lennon<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 17:01:37 -0000 <BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR><BR>If Washington was mentioned half the country would assume it meant DC.<BR>Sometimes I despair of our educational system :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Acting President Thing <BR>&gt; [mailto:thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net]<BR>&gt; Sent: 03 January 2001 17:01<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; On Tuesday, January 02, 2001 7:05 PM<BR>&gt; Clifford N Linehan said,<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; And I know some of the people that did it.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I like the BBC article.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/americas/newsid_1098000<BR>/1098419.s<BR>tm<BR><BR>"in the American city of Seattle. "&nbsp; No mention of the state.&nbsp; It's<BR>scarily appropriate.<BR><BR>G.D.D.<BR>Thing under the stairs,<BR>Minion of Shechemist &amp; GothBunny,<BR>Grand Master of the Electron Flow.<BR>===========================<BR>"Everybody's got something to hide except me and my monkey". -J.Lennon<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 11:25:18 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR>Walt Smith wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; A dogfight is a maneuverability contest.&nbsp; Most allied planes<BR>&gt; wouldn't win that contest with a Zeke.&nbsp; On the other hand,<BR>&gt; many allied fighters had other advantages, such as a higher<BR>&gt; top speed (especially in a dive).<BR><BR>All the real combat pilots I know call it a dogfight when<BR>it's a guns fight, i.e., not long-range missiles.&nbsp; As Walt<BR>describes, there are two different types of this fighting.<BR>One is commonly referred to these days as the<BR>Turn-and-Burn (TnB), also called an Angles Fight.<BR>The Zeroes were nearly unparalleld at this.<BR><BR>The other is the Boom-and-Zoom (BnZ), also called<BR>Energy Fighting (where Energy = Altitude + Speed).<BR>Perhaps the greatest example of this is the Focke-Wulf 190.<BR>High-speed diving slashing attacks on the intended victim,<BR>followed by an extension away from the target, and then<BR>gentle climbs back to altitude.&nbsp; In comparison to the<BR>Zeroes, planes like the F6 Hellcat and the F4U Corsair<BR>were BnZers.&nbsp; And of course, they had those lovely<BR>banks of .50 calibers in the wings.&nbsp; Shredding the<BR>paper kites of their opponents.<BR><BR>Planes usually excel at one form of fighting or another,<BR>though it's a spectrum and some are pretty good at<BR>both.&nbsp; Some of the later Spitfire variants were fairly<BR>good at either.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Still trying to choose a good WW2 combat flight simulator for<BR>&gt; my home PC.<BR><BR>For the moment, try WarBirds or Aces High.&nbsp; Keep your<BR>eyes open for the release of WWII Online (for early war<BR>European matchups - Battle of Britain style) and Target<BR>Berlin.&nbsp; Though I must warn you - all of your opponents<BR>will be real humans trying to kill you.<BR><BR>Check out www.dogfighter.com for reviews of these<BR>and non-online versions. [Disclaimer: This site is affiliated<BR>with my employer, Playnet, which is most of the guys<BR>that created WarBirds and subsequently left to make<BR>WWII Online, and now Traveller Online.]<BR><BR>And you must get a copy of Fighter Combat: Tactics &amp;<BR>Manuevering by Robert Shaw.&nbsp; It is THE bible for this<BR>stuff.&nbsp; I think it is still the only modern and serious text<BR>on the subject available to the general public.<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 17:22:43 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR><BR>Dean Jones wrote:<BR>&gt; If Washington was mentioned half the country would assume it<BR>&gt; meant DC. Sometimes I despair of our educational system :)<BR><BR>Naw, everyone knows the Seattle part of Washington is&nbsp; completely<BR>separate from the DC part of Washington.&nbsp; (Just like New York has<BR>Queens and Brooklyn.)&nbsp; :-^<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 14:21:21 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Back again<BR><BR><BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 18:21:50 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Back again<BR><BR>Dom wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>I think I speak for everyone here when I say "Huh?"<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 12:52:35 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: OT Reseach Help - Adam Smith<BR><BR>Sorry to be OT but I need some help finding an<BR>old quote and this motley crew is my best bet.<BR><BR>I'm looking for a passage that Adam Smith<BR>wrote, which said that economic conflict<BR>between Russia and America was inevitable.<BR><BR>I remember reading this long ago, but I can't<BR>find it on the net.&nbsp; Any one know this?<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 13:13:47 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: OT Reseach Help - Adam Smith<BR><BR>On 01/03/01 at 12:52 PM,&nbsp; "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;Sorry to be OT but I need some help finding an<BR>&gt;old quote and this motley crew is my best bet.<BR><BR>&gt;I'm looking for a passage that Adam Smith<BR>&gt;wrote, which said that economic conflict<BR>&gt;between Russia and America was inevitable.<BR><BR>&gt;I remember reading this long ago, but I can't<BR>&gt;find it on the net.&nbsp; Any one know this?<BR><BR>Did Adam Smith say that?&nbsp; I know de Toquville (sp) wrote about the "inevitable conflict between the Russian and American empires as one moved east and the other west."<BR><BR><BR>Eris,<BR>ps.&nbsp; you know who's watch Daar pocketed don't you?&nbsp; &lt;g&gt; <BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 14:38:26 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: OT Reseach Help - Adam Smith<BR><BR>&gt;I'm looking for a passage that Adam Smith<BR>&gt;wrote, which said that economic conflict<BR>&gt;between Russia and America was inevitable.<BR><BR>Well, it's not in "Wealth of Nations", and if you've read deeper into Adam <BR>Smith than that, you're a better man than I.<BR><BR>This general thought was fairly common in the nineteenth century, however. <BR>Alexis de Tocqueville's few paragraphs on the topic are the most famous, I'd <BR>say. My Reeve's translation reads:<BR><BR>"There are, at the present time, two great nations in the<BR>world which seem to tend towards the same end, although they<BR>started from different points: I allude to the Russians and the<BR>Americans.&nbsp; Both of them have grown up unnoticed; and whilst the<BR>attention of mankind was directed elsewhere, they have suddenly<BR>assumed a most prominent place amongst the nations; and the world<BR>learned their existence and their greatness at almost the same<BR>time.<BR><BR>All other nations seem to have nearly reached their natural<BR>limits, and only to be charged with the maintenance of their<BR>power; but these are still in the act of growth; all the<BR>others are stopped, or continue to advance with extreme<BR>difficulty; these are proceeding with ease and with celerity<BR>along a path to which the human eye can assign no term.&nbsp; The<BR>American struggles against the natural obstacles which oppose<BR>him; the adversaries of the Russian are men; the former combats<BR>the wilderness and savage life; the latter, civilization with all<BR>its weapons and its arts: the conquests of the one are therefore<BR>gained by the ploughshare; those of the other by the sword. The<BR>Anglo-American relies upon personal interest to accomplish his<BR>ends, and gives free scope to the unguided exertions and<BR>common-sense of the citizens; the Russian centres all the<BR>authority of society in a single arm: the principal instrument of<BR>the former is freedom; of the latter servitude. Their<BR>starting-point is different, and their courses are not the same;<BR>yet each of them seems to be marked out by the will of Heaven to<BR>sway the destinies of half the globe."<BR><BR>Note that it doesn't actually say that they'll come into conflict however. <BR>The only other reasonably famous person that I can think of who may have <BR>said this is Alfred Thayer Mahan. Maybe another geopolitician?<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 12:10:35 -0800<BR>From: "Dave Strebe" &lt;strebe@intergate.bc.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Beyond 2000&nbsp; Space-Vehicles&nbsp; Rocket Fuel<BR><BR>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C0757B.8C9201A0<BR>Content-Type: text/plain;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR>Any one care to comment on this. A possible new fission fuel for use<BR>in space craft?<BR><BR>http://www.beyond2000.com/news/Jan_01/story_953.html<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C0757B.8C9201A0<BR>Content-Type: application/octet-stream;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; name="Beyond 2000&nbsp; Space-Vehicles&nbsp; Rocket Fuel.url"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR>Content-Disposition: attachment;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; filename="Beyond 2000&nbsp; Space-Vehicles&nbsp; Rocket Fuel.url"<BR><BR>[DEFAULT]<BR>BASEURL=http://www.beyond2000.com/news/Jan_01/story_953.html<BR>[InternetShortcut]<BR>URL=http://www.beyond2000.com/news/Jan_01/story_953.html<BR>Modified=F0D8203EBE75C0011A<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C0757B.8C9201A0--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 14:12:15 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Beyond 2000&nbsp; Space-Vehicles&nbsp; Rocket Fuel<BR><BR>On 01/03/01 at 12:10 PM,&nbsp; "Dave Strebe" &lt;strebe@intergate.bc.ca&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;Any one care to comment on this. A possible new fission fuel for<BR>&gt;use in space craft?<BR><BR>&gt; http://www.beyond2000.com/news/Jan_01/story_953.html<BR><BR>It looks interesting, but we're a long way from taking vacations on Mars. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>I suspect producing enough Americanium-242 for this is going to cost a *lot* of money. At this point it looks like an "interesting concept" that should deserves "more research"...ie. more funding. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 13:23:07 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>Acting President Thing wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; On Tuesday, January 02, 2001 7:05 PM<BR>&gt; Clifford N Linehan said,<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; And I know some of the people that did it.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I like the BBC article.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/americas/newsid_1098000/1098419.s<BR>&gt; tm<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Cool...i really hope they let it stay up...it looks rather nice where it<BR>is.<BR><BR>My favorite comment so far has been from Slashdot:<BR><BR>"Oh no, someone has erected an instrument of evolution in the home of<BR>Microsoft and Grunge rock! We're doomed!"<BR><BR><BR><BR>- -- <BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>University of Arizona<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 12:48:00 -0800<BR>From: "Acting President Thing" &lt;thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>On Wednesday, January 03, 2001 12:23 PM<BR>Bruce Johnson said,<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Cool...i really hope they let it stay up...it looks rather nice where<BR>it<BR>&gt; is.<BR><BR>No such luck.&nbsp; It's already gone.&nbsp; They where supposedly debating<BR>weather to brace it up for permanent exhibit, or take it down in case it<BR>toppled on someone, but someone beat them to it.<BR><BR>http://www.king5.com/detailtopstory.html?StoryID=11513<BR><BR>G.D.D.<BR>Thing under the stairs,<BR>Minion of Shechemist &amp; GothBunny,<BR>Grand Master of the Electron Flow.<BR>===========================<BR>"It has yet to be proven that intelligence has any survival<BR>value". -Arthur C. Clarke<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 12:54:45 -0800<BR>From: "Acting President Thing" &lt;thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>Here is a more in depth article for those interested.<BR><BR>http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/SeattleTimes.woa/wa/<BR>gotoArticle?zsection_id=268466359&amp;text_only=0&amp;slug=newmono03m&amp;document_i<BR>d=134257927<BR><BR>G.D.D.<BR>Thing under the stairs,<BR>Minion of Shechemist &amp; GothBunny,<BR>Grand Master of the Electron Flow.<BR>===========================<BR>"It must be remembered that there is nothing more difficult to plan,<BR>more doubtful of success, nor more dangerous to managment than the<BR>creation of a new system.&nbsp; For the initiator has the enmity of all who<BR>would profit by the preservation of the old institution and merely<BR>lukewarm defenders in those who gain by the new ones." -Machiavelli<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 14:46:33 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Beyond 2000&nbsp; Space-Vehicles&nbsp; Rocket Fuel<BR><BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; On 01/03/01 at 12:10 PM,&nbsp; "Dave Strebe" &lt;strebe@intergate.bc.ca&gt; said:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;Any one care to comment on this. A possible new fission fuel for<BR>&gt; &gt;use in space craft?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; http://www.beyond2000.com/news/Jan_01/story_953.html<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; It looks interesting, but we're a long way from taking vacations on Mars. &lt;g&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I suspect producing enough Americanium-242 for this is going to cost a *lot* of money. At this point it looks like an "interesting concept" that should deserves "more research"...ie. more funding. &lt;g&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>More than that...there are the political implications...not only the<BR>silly-greenie stuff about 'Polluting space' but the serious greenie<BR>stuff like '_HOW_ much plutonium do I need to make and what do we do<BR>with the leftovers??' and many critical masses of Americium (not<BR>Americanium, btw) do we really want laying around.<BR><BR>How much bang _do_ you get from a critical mass of Am-242, anyway?? At<BR>1% of the mass needed for a critical mas of Uranium or Plutonium this<BR>could make for a tiny explosive.<BR><BR>Pocket nukes anyone?? Real nuclear hand grenades??<BR><BR><BR>- -- <BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>University of Arizona<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 13:53:04 -0800<BR>From: "Jeffrey Yin" &lt;jsyin@cats.ucsc.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Intrepid<BR><BR>I just got GT:Ground Forces, and have skimmed through it. Is it just me, or<BR>did the Intrepid get a lot heavier? IIRC, the TNE stats on the thing had it<BR>at 10t, whereas GT has it at 100t, I think. Also, TNE makes reference to the<BR>fact that the Imperium didn't even call it the Intrepid, but instead it had<BR>some weird name. Was it changed, or am I just mistaken?<BR><BR>Jeffrey Yin<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 16:00:53 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: OT Reseach Help - Adam Smith<BR><BR>Genius!&nbsp; Thanks to Paul and my lord and master<BR>Eris the Heretic.<BR><BR>we now return you to your Task War.<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 14:15:34 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Intrepid<BR><BR>I was originally called the Trepida in MT Rebellion Sourcebook &amp; 101<BR>Vehicles.&nbsp; Don't know why it changed in GT:GF....<BR><BR>Jesse "I just illustrate the things" DeGraff<BR>:)<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Jeffrey Yin<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2001 1:53 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Intrepid<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I just got GT:Ground Forces, and have skimmed through it. Is it<BR>&gt; just me, or<BR>&gt; did the Intrepid get a lot heavier? IIRC, the TNE stats on the<BR>&gt; thing had it<BR>&gt; at 10t, whereas GT has it at 100t, I think. Also, TNE makes<BR>&gt; reference to the<BR>&gt; fact that the Imperium didn't even call it the Intrepid, but<BR>&gt; instead it had<BR>&gt; some weird name. Was it changed, or am I just mistaken?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Jeffrey Yin<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 21:48:05 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Aliens (was Re: Noble vs. military rank)<BR><BR>At 16:21 -0500 31/12/00, Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions <BR>&lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;I think Ridley is a great director if you like "visually interesting", but<BR>&gt;his pace sux!&nbsp; In fact, the only film that Ridley did that I can put on my<BR>&gt;all time fav list (because it had "visually interesting" and pace) is<BR>&gt;Thelma &amp; Louise.<BR><BR>I think the fact that I like the pacing of Scott's films (eg Blade <BR>Runner, Alien, Gladiator) and also find them visually stimulating <BR>suggests that my taste in film may be just a little different to <BR>yours Ken! He's usually better than 99% of the other rubbish churned <BR>out by Hollywood.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 22:02:41 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Australia happened one hundred years ago...<BR><BR>At 10:10 -0500 1/1/01,&nbsp; "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;On Mon, 1 Jan 2001, Andrew Moffatt-Vallance wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Hey its the 21st Century, where's my fusion powered antigrav aircar?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Hey, it's 2001, where is my manned Jupiter mission?<BR><BR>Saturn.<BR><BR>NASA stated they wanted the mission from 2001, meaning the film <BR>(Jupiter). The contractor assumed they meant the book (Saturn) 2001 <BR>so sent the flight parameters in a different set of units. Ooops! <BR>Good thing that doesn't happen in real life...<BR><BR>Dom<BR>"Smaller, Faster, Cheaper - pick any two."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 22:07:26 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: ABSOLUTELY NOTHING TO DO WITH TASK SYSTEMS was Re: Star Worn? Comments<BR><BR>At 23:04 -0500 1/1/01,&nbsp; Idreea &lt;idrea_starryeyes@yahoo.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;Just a Quickie - has anyone (beyond Megan) downloaded 'Star Worn',<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;and are there any comments? I like having comments (good or bad) to<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;pass back to Andy because it encourages him to do things like this<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;again...<BR>&gt;Nope, I've missed it, where is it located?<BR><BR>Http://www.bits.org.uk/&nbsp;&nbsp; on the Archive Page<BR><BR>THIS IS ONLY AVAILABLE UNTIL SUNDAY 7 JANUARY 2001 UK TIME.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yd02.mx.aol.com (rly-yd02.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.2]) by air-yd02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 17:20:11 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yd02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 17:19:20 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id RAA20131;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 17:17:33 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 3 Jan 2001 17:16:56 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id RAA20026<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 17:16:56 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 17:16:56 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101032216.RAA20026@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3502</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/3/01 5:59:36 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Wednesday, January 3 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3502<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR>Loren on Deckplans<BR>Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>[FILK] On the bridge of the Arrival Vengeance<BR>RE: Intrepid<BR>Re: Intrepid<BR>Re: Intrepid<BR>RE: Intrepid<BR>RE: Intrepid<BR>RE: Back again<BR>Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>Re: Oops...<BR>Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>RE: Intrepid<BR>Re: Intrepid<BR>Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>Another question<BR>Re: Another question<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>RE: Back again<BR>Re: WFRP<BR>Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 22:10:47 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR><BR>At 23:04 -0500 1/1/01,&nbsp; "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" <BR>&lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Hrm... I think my new-year's resolution should be to use more<BR>&gt;commonly-known songs for filks....<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; WHO LET THE VARGR OUT?&nbsp; *woof! woof! woof!*<BR><BR>&lt;SPLORT&gt;<BR><BR>Damn, that was a waste of Stella Artois.<BR><BR>Chalk a kill, please.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 22:14:54 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Loren on Deckplans<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2001 10:11:20 -0600<BR>From: Loren Wiseman &lt;lkw@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Deck Plans Scale Question<BR><BR>Gentles:<BR><BR>I figured this would occur to many of you, so I am forwarding my answer to<BR>this question to the list as a whole:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Second, I am a rabid fan of deck plans and Cardboard Heroes (do you feel a<BR>&gt;&gt; "but" coming? Here it is:) I don't understand the scale of the new deck<BR>&gt;&gt; plans. The Cardboard Heroes appear to be a bit shorter than the 25 mm sets<BR>&gt;&gt; from 1987, but the scale of the plans for Brubek's and Beowulf appear to be<BR>&gt;&gt; about twice the scale of the figures. Any reason for this? Since they're<BR>&gt;&gt; packaged together, I assume they're meant to work together, but they don't.<BR>&gt;&gt; Is this intentional?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Yes. When we put 28mm figs on the prototypes, they didn't fit anything but<BR>&gt; 1" hexes.<BR><BR>This has caused some minor confusion, but it does make for some impressive<BR>plans.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Loren Wiseman<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Traveller Line Manager/Traveller Guru-in-Residence<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Editor, Journal of the Travellers' Aid Society&nbsp; http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; SJ Games<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; lkw@io.com http://www.io.com/~lkw/<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (512) 447-7866 VOX<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (512) 447-1144 FAX<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 22:54:39 -0000<BR>From: "Mark S Peace" &lt;mark.s.peace@dunelm.org.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR><BR>&gt; I like the BBC article.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/americas/newsid_1098000/1098419.s<BR>&gt; tm<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; "in the American city of Seattle. "&nbsp; No mention of the state.&nbsp; It's<BR>&gt; scarily appropriate.<BR><BR>Why, what relevance does the state have?<BR><BR>Mark.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 15:18:53 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR><BR>good question what relevance does Seattle have?<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Mark S Peace [mailto:mark.s.peace@dunelm.org.uk]<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2001 2:55 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR><BR><BR>&gt; I like the BBC article.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/americas/newsid_1098000/1098419.s<BR>&gt; tm<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; "in the American city of Seattle. "&nbsp; No mention of the state.&nbsp; It's<BR>&gt; scarily appropriate.<BR><BR>Why, what relevance does the state have?<BR><BR>Mark.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 18:26:56 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: [FILK] On the bridge of the Arrival Vengeance<BR><BR>Troubled, uncertain times for our heros, stranded deep in the dark <BR>heart of the Shattered Imperium.<BR><BR><BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; CAPTAIN JAMISON<BR>What would Cleon Zhunastu do<BR>If he was here right now?<BR>He'd make a plan and he'd follow through,<BR>That's what Cleon Zhunastu'd do!<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; LIEUTENANT WINDHOOK<BR>When Cleon Zhunastu was back on Sylea<BR>Fighting Chanestins bold,<BR>He sent in the Scouts to set their markets free<BR>And left them under-sold!<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; SELDRIAN<BR>When Cleon Zhunastu went to the Core<BR>The Zhodani he did save;<BR>He used his Ancient jump-gate disks<BR>And stopped the Empress Wave!<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (ALL)<BR>So what would Cleon Zhunastu do<BR>If he were here today?<BR>I'm sure he'd kick an ass or two,<BR>That's what Cleon Zhunastu'd do.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; SELDRIAN<BR>How I wish I weren't a clone of daddy;<BR>Neither of us can get a date on Friday...<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; WINDHOOK<BR>And I just want my admirals to stick up for INI...<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; JAMISON<BR>I'll take this cruiser and do some trading too,<BR>'Cause that's what Cleon Zhunastu'd do!<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (ALL)<BR>And what would Cleon Zhunastu do?<BR>He'd call all the Dukes on down<BR>And tell them to unite for true<BR>That's what Cleon Zhunastu'd do!<BR><BR>(bridge crew does brief instrumental)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (ALL)<BR>When Cleon Zhunastu traveled trough time<BR>To the year twelve hundred ten,<BR>He fought the evil Virus fleets<BR>And saved all sophonts once again!<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; SELDRIAN<BR>And when Cleon Zhunastu tore down the Black Curtain<BR>He beat up Lucan's goons<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; ALL<BR>'Cause Cleon Zhunastu doesn't take decoratin' tips from anybody...<BR><BR>So let's call all the fleets together<BR>And unite to stop the NPCs,<BR>And we'll save Avery 'n Ililek too<BR>'Cause that's what Cleon Zhunastu'd do!<BR><BR>And we'll save Avery 'n Ililek too,<BR>'Cause that's what Cleon Zhunastu'd do,<BR><BR>'Cause that's what Cleon Zhunastu'd do!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 17:58:52 -0600<BR>From: David Smart &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Intrepid<BR><BR>Jesse Degraff<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I was originally called the Trepida in MT Rebellion Sourcebook &amp; 101<BR>&gt; Vehicles.&nbsp; Don't know why it changed in GT:GF....<BR><BR>You're called "Trepida" in the MT books?<BR><BR>Dang! You *have* been illustrating Traveller for awhile!<BR><BR>&lt;g,d,r&gt;<BR><BR>David Smart (ass)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 18:05:24 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Intrepid<BR><BR>David Smart wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Jesse Degraff<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; I was originally called the Trepida in MT Rebellion Sourcebook &amp; 101<BR>&gt; &gt; Vehicles.&nbsp; Don't know why it changed in GT:GF....<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; You're called "Trepida" in the MT books?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Dang! You *have* been illustrating Traveller for awhile!<BR><BR>And there are those who call him "Tim".... ;-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 16:03:19 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Intrepid<BR><BR>Jeffrey Yin writes:<BR>&gt; I just got GT:Ground Forces, and have skimmed through it. Is it just me, or<BR>&gt; did the Intrepid get a lot heavier? IIRC, the TNE stats on the thing had it<BR>&gt; at 10t, whereas GT has it at 100t, I think. Also, TNE makes reference to<BR>&gt; the fact that the Imperium didn't even call it the Intrepid, but instead<BR>&gt; it had some weird name. Was it changed, or am I just mistaken?<BR><BR>In TNE it was the Trepida (which translates as 'fearful'); Loren decided to<BR>rename it.&nbsp; As for weight, it might originally have been 10 displacement tons,<BR>but it definately wasn't 10 tons.&nbsp; For its actual weight, though (as <BR>originally given in Star Mercs), I just&nbsp; asked Loren how much a heavy tank<BR>should weigh (A: 200 tons), and then made it weigh about that much.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 16:04:15 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Intrepid<BR><BR>Oops :)&nbsp; 'I' s/b 'It' in that sentence ;)<BR><BR>&gt; You're called "Trepida" in the MT books?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Dang! You *have* been illustrating Traveller for awhile!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;g,d,r&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; David Smart (ass)<BR><BR>Ain't that the truth ;)<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 16:13:40 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Intrepid<BR><BR>No, that's my roomate :)<BR>Jesse<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of John Groth<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2001 4:05 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Intrepid<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; David Smart wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Jesse Degraff<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; I was originally called the Trepida in MT Rebellion Sourcebook &amp; 101<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Vehicles.&nbsp; Don't know why it changed in GT:GF....<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; You're called "Trepida" in the MT books?<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Dang! You *have* been illustrating Traveller for awhile!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; And there are those who call him "Tim".... ;-)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; -- <BR>&gt; AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>&gt; "Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>&gt; Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 16:34:29 -0800<BR>From: "tsykoduk" &lt;tsykoduk@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Back again<BR><BR>Welp, I spread lemon juice all over my screen and held by Bic up to it..<BR>Mebby I need a Secret Decoder Ring??<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 00:42:40 GMT<BR>From: Postmark Design Bureau &lt;postmark.design@btinternet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR><BR>Ok, New Year's over - I'll answer this in case no one else has...<BR><BR><BR>Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Let's say your character is Dex-6, Pistol-6.&nbsp; And, he has to make an Easy<BR>&gt; (1D) roll.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What is the probability that a character will succeed rolling 2D versus<BR>&gt; 1D-5. (E-Die included)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; That has got to be higher than an 80% chance of success.<BR><BR>Target number is:<BR><BR>0,0,0,0,0,7<BR><BR>The player's roll is:<BR>0,2,0,4,0,6,<BR>3,4,5,6,7,8,<BR>4,5,6,7,8,9,<BR>5,6,7,8,9,10,<BR>6,7,8,9,10,11,<BR>13,16,15,20,17,24<BR><BR>so, since you need to roll greater, 1/6th is target 7<BR>16/36 rolls do not make this<BR><BR>ie<BR>16/216 = 93% success<BR><BR>nb the change of greater success is:<BR>5/6 * 16/216 = 37%<BR><BR><BR>of normal success is:<BR>1/6 * 17/216 = 8%<BR><BR>if the player decided to roll 2D6 vs 1D6, checking for greater<BR>success as Dex + 5, then<BR><BR>0,2,3,4,5,12<BR><BR>The player's roll is:<BR>0,2,0,4,0,6,<BR>3,4,5,6,7,8,<BR>4,5,6,7,8,9,<BR>5,6,7,8,9,10,<BR>6,7,8,9,10,11,<BR>13,16,15,20,17,24<BR><BR>success&nbsp;&nbsp; (36 + 33 + 32 + 31 + 28 + 6)/216 = 76% <BR>of which,<BR>normal&nbsp; &nbsp; ( 0 +&nbsp; 1 +&nbsp; 1 +&nbsp; 2 +&nbsp; 3 + 5)/216 =&nbsp; 6%<BR>greater&nbsp;&nbsp; (30 + 27 + 26 + 25 + 22 + 0)/216 = 60%<BR><BR><BR><BR>However, if Doug Berry or Mark Cook were firing at a target<BR>3m away and decided to aim for the eye instead of the body,<BR>I don't think they'd expect to miss the entire person 7%<BR>(or 24%) of the time.<BR><BR>I may be wrong.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Phil Kitching, http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo<BR>Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Products Division<BR>"Microwaving halfbaked ideas from across the galaxy"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 00:32:42 GMT<BR>From: Postmark Design Bureau &lt;postmark.design@btinternet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Oops...<BR><BR>James Jensen wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Kenneth, you were right about the chance fo two sets of 3D6 coming up<BR>&gt; identical. It's not ~0.5%. I did the math wrong. The ACTUAL chance is more<BR>&gt; to the tune of.... well, I can't give you the percentage because the<BR>&gt; calculator can't handle that low of a number. Just know that I was wrong<BR>&gt; and that you were right.<BR><BR>I think you need a new calculation, not a new calculator!<BR><BR>If the three dice are distinct (ie roll a read, a white and a blue)<BR>and they have to match (ie red vs red, etc)<BR><BR>Then the chance is 1/216, as you had.<BR><BR>If the dice are all the same, ie a roll of 1,2,3 can match a roll of 3,2,1<BR>then the chance will be much better than 0.5%<BR><BR>three dice the same (eg roll of 1,1,1):&nbsp;&nbsp; 6/216 * 1/216<BR>two dice the same&nbsp;&nbsp; (eg roll of 1,1,2):&nbsp; 30/216 * 3/216<BR>all dice different&nbsp; (eg roll of 1,2,3): 180/216 * 6/216<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; : 1176/46656<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; : 2.5%<BR>- -- <BR>Phil Kitching, http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo<BR>Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Products Division<BR>"Microwaving halfbaked ideas from across the galaxy"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 23:46:30 GMT<BR>From: Postmark Design Bureau &lt;postmark.design@btinternet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR><BR>Alan Bradley wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; From: Postmark Design Bureau <BR>&gt; &gt; Percentile dice have their place, certainly...<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; I'd never play ... Warhammer Roleplay with<BR>&gt; &gt; anything else :-)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;cough cough&gt;&nbsp; I'd never play Warhammer Roleplay.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;never admitted in public&gt;<BR>&gt; Actually, Warhammer Roleplay isn't quite such a pig as Warhammer itself. <BR>&gt; It actually has some quite cool stuff about medieval settings.<BR>&gt; &lt;/never admitted in public&gt;<BR><BR>I played WFRP when it first came out and then GM'd it weekly for 4 years<BR>straight.<BR><BR>IIRC, at the time the D&amp;D crowd thought that modules like G1-3 were cutting<BR>edge stuff. By comparison with WFRP, G1-3 is a set of prerolled random<BR>encounters.<BR><BR>Never played it since - not likely to either - there are too many good<BR>memories about it and the original party had stats that broke the system.<BR>Restarting with new characters never quite felt right. Plus two of the<BR>original key players have since died.<BR><BR><BR><BR>- -- <BR>Phil Kitching, http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo<BR>Postmark Design Bureau, Laser Communications Division<BR>"For when your message must get through"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 16:43:55 -0800<BR>From: "tsykoduk" &lt;tsykoduk@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Intrepid<BR><BR>In the copy of GF that I have, the Intrepid weighs in at 192 US tons (one of<BR>my pet peeves with GURPS) and displaces 4.15 Dtons. In my copy of the RCS<BR>Equipment Guide, the Intrepid weighs in at 255.6 metric tons and 10 Dtons..<BR>So it looks like the tank went on a diet.. ;)<BR><BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Jeffrey Yin<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2001 1:53 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Intrepid<BR><BR><BR>I just got GT:Ground Forces, and have skimmed through it. Is it just me, or<BR>did the Intrepid get a lot heavier? IIRC, the TNE stats on the thing had it<BR>at 10t, whereas GT has it at 100t, I think. Also, TNE makes reference to the<BR>fact that the Imperium didn't even call it the Intrepid, but instead it had<BR>some weird name. Was it changed, or am I just mistaken?<BR><BR>Jeffrey Yin<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 16:47:32 -0800<BR>From: "Jeffrey Yin" &lt;jsyin@cats.ucsc.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Intrepid<BR><BR>Oops. Forgot about them dtons. . .<BR><BR>Jeff Yin<BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "tsykoduk" &lt;tsykoduk@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2001 4:43 PM<BR>Subject: RE: Intrepid<BR><BR><BR>&gt; In the copy of GF that I have, the Intrepid weighs in at 192 US tons (one<BR>of<BR>&gt; my pet peeves with GURPS) and displaces 4.15 Dtons. In my copy of the RCS<BR>&gt; Equipment Guide, the Intrepid weighs in at 255.6 metric tons and 10<BR>Dtons..<BR>&gt; So it looks like the tank went on a diet.. ;)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Jeffrey Yin<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2001 1:53 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Intrepid<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I just got GT:Ground Forces, and have skimmed through it. Is it just me,<BR>or<BR>&gt; did the Intrepid get a lot heavier? IIRC, the TNE stats on the thing had<BR>it<BR>&gt; at 10t, whereas GT has it at 100t, I think. Also, TNE makes reference to<BR>the<BR>&gt; fact that the Imperium didn't even call it the Intrepid, but instead it<BR>had<BR>&gt; some weird name. Was it changed, or am I just mistaken?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Jeffrey Yin<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 20:19:38 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>&gt;&nbsp; The Associated Press 1/2/01 8:37 AM<BR><BR>&lt;fnord&gt;<BR>Memo to operations:<BR>The monolith in Seattle has made it's appearance 90 days too early. None of <BR>the hypnotic features seem to have activated, but the appearance will need to <BR>be explained by the PR unit.<BR>&lt;/fnord&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 01:20:15 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>Join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>Hello,<BR><BR>Email......<BR><BR>Traveller_KB3_TaskWar-subscribe@eGroups.com<BR><BR>to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group,<BR>an email group hosted by eGroups, a free, easy-to-use email group<BR>service.<BR><BR>JOIN NOW, IT'S EASY: By joining Traveller_KB3_TaskWar, you will be <BR>able to exchange messages<BR>with other group members and reduce the TML list traffic. eGroups <BR>also makes it easy to store<BR>photos and files, coordinate events and more.<BR><BR>Have fun.<BR><BR>Dom&nbsp; Del ;-)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 20:21:04 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Another question<BR><BR>What's the largest passenger carrying starship mentioned in print?<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 17:26:50 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Another question<BR><BR>GDWGAMES@aol.com writes:<BR>&gt; What's the largest passenger carrying starship mentioned in print?<BR><BR>Probably the 10 kiloton one in far trader.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 20:30:33 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>&gt; I was originally called the Trepida in MT Rebellion Sourcebook &amp; 101<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Vehicles.&nbsp; Don't know why it changed in GT:GF....<BR><BR>Because my Latin dictionary says _Trepida_ means "to hurry with alarm or <BR>cowardice" and I thought that was a dumb name for a tank. <BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 17:37:46 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>Makes perfect sense to me :)<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2001 5:31 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; I was originally called the Trepida in MT Rebellion Sourcebook &amp; 101<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; Vehicles.&nbsp; Don't know why it changed in GT:GF....<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Because my Latin dictionary says _Trepida_ means "to hurry with alarm or<BR>&gt; cowardice" and I thought that was a dumb name for a tank.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 01:35:41 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Back again<BR><BR>At 17:16 -0500 3/1/01, "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt; wrote<BR><BR>&gt;Dom wrote:<BR><BR>&lt;NOTHING!&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;I think I speak for everyone here when I say "Huh?"<BR><BR>I wrote a reply to Volker but my mailer ate it.<BR><BR>Basically, the summarised version is that my New Year in Germany (at <BR>a town called Aurich between Wilhelmshaven and Emden) was interesting <BR>because it gave a similar feeling to watching films of Sarejevo and <BR>Beirut. The fireworks were thick, fast and flying all over. 6 foot <BR>long Rockets ignited whilst still in the hand and fired all over, <BR>including in duels up and down the street. Catherine wheels ignited <BR>and dropped on the icy road to spin all over, bangers thrown around. <BR>And it was *everyone* doing it. Everywhere. And for hours!!!<BR><BR>After the staid and sober UK 5 Nov Guy Fawkes night, it was a bit of <BR>a shock. A lot of a shock. However, the beer was good, the company <BR>very pleasant and the time very enjoyable. I no longer believe the UK <BR>stereotype of Germans being very sober, regimented, and punctually <BR>formal. And I'd love to do it again....<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>PS However, the Dutch should be ashamed of themselves. I found the <BR>transition across the border from 60 mph German well gritted and <BR>de-iced roads to the Dutch skid rows scary. I had to slow to &lt;30 mph <BR>on the nominally 55 mph road because they had failed to grit anywhere <BR>between the last Dutch town some 6-10 miles in and the German border. <BR>The ice was nasty, and dangerous. Not impressed, and it was a shock <BR>to have to slow so much after travelling &gt;100 mph on the autobahn. I <BR>shall be telling as much to my Dutch colleagues at work tomorrow (I <BR>work at an Anglo-Dutch company) ;-)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 20:46:58 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: WFRP<BR><BR>Phil Kitching wrote:<BR>&gt; I played WFRP when it first came out and then GM'd it weekly for 4 years<BR>&gt;straight.<BR><BR>I also ran a WFRP campaign for a while, circa 1986-8.&nbsp; It was a lot of fun, as the rules had a lot of color built in, making it very easy to GM.&nbsp; The published adventures were also very evocative, if, in retrospect, pretty dismayingly linear.&nbsp; I eventually dropped the campaign for the more 'mature' joys of RuneQuest and Traveller.<BR><BR>&gt;IIRC, at the time the D&amp;D crowd thought that modules like G1-3 were cutting<BR>&gt;edge stuff. By comparison with WFRP, G1-3 is a set of prerolled random<BR>&gt;encounters.<BR><BR>Well, the D&amp;D crowd might be a little slow where you come from, but G1-3 were published ca. 1978, almost a decade before WFRP.&nbsp; "Cutting edge" D&amp;D in the mid-80s was stuff like the original Ravenloft and Dragonlance modules, and that Gygax 'King Kong' rip-off.<BR><BR>&gt;Never played it since - not likely to either - there are too many good<BR>&gt;memories about it and the original party had stats that broke the system.<BR>&gt;Restarting with new characters never quite felt right. Plus two of the<BR>&gt;original key players have since died.<BR><BR>Same here.&nbsp; I still have the books but they haven't been off the shelf in a decade.&nbsp; I think that game is best left to the golden nostalgia of my youth.&nbsp; And I just realized I'm no longer in contact with ANY of the players from that campaign -- it was run through the local game-club, with only a couple of my outside/school-friends involved, not any of those I still keep up with.<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 14:58:33 -0000<BR>From: "Rupert Boleyn" &lt;rboleyn@paradise.net.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR><BR>On 3 Jan 2001, at 13:41, Andrew Moffatt-Vallance wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; On 2 Jan 01, at 13:53, John Fox wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Hello Everyone:<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; The truth of the information was that the Spitfires fared rather badly<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; against the Zero as the defenders of Singapore will testify to.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; There were no Spitfires at Singapore, it was defended by Buffalos and a <BR>&gt; few Hurricanes, neither of which could maneuver with an A6M (Zero). The <BR>&gt; Spitfire could manuever with an A6M, but it was about the only Allied <BR>&gt; aircraft that ever could (including the F6F and F4U). But the Spitfire didn't<BR>&gt; reach the east until late 1943.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The problem with the A6M was that (like all designs) it was a compromise. <BR>&gt; Its spectaular maneverability (and range) was gained at the price of <BR>&gt; extremely poor firepower and durability [ObTravs: 1 - Beware design <BR>&gt; compromises, extreme performance in one area is usually bought at the <BR>&gt; price of dangeriously poor performance somewhere else. 2 - Design to <BR>&gt; mission and make sure your mission requirements are realistic]<BR><BR>The A6M's firepower was actually quite spectacular when it originally entered <BR>service (2 20mm cannon before WWII), however its lack of armour and its <BR>inability to carry a heavier armament meant that it became obselete quite <BR>quickly.<BR><BR>- --<BR>"Rupert Boleyn" &lt;rboleyn@paradise.net.nz&gt;<BR><BR>A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3502<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xb03.mx.aol.com (rly-xb03.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.104]) by air-xb04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 20:59:36 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xb03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 03 Jan 2001 20:58:55 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id UAA28694;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 20:57:47 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 3 Jan 2001 20:57:40 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id UAA28655<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 20:57:40 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 20:57:40 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101040157.UAA28655@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3502<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3503</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/4/01 7:50:46 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 4 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3503<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>Re: WFRP<BR>Re: Oops! <BR>Re: Back again<BR>re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR>Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>Re: [FILK] On the bridge of the Arrival Vengeance<BR>WFRP [FILK]<BR>Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR>re: another question<BR>Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR>Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>Re: Intrepid<BR>Re: Oops...<BR>Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>xTU Astrography<BR>Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>RE: Intrepid<BR>RE: Back again<BR>Re: Back again<BR>Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR>RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>RE: xTU Astrography<BR>RE: Another question<BR>RE: Another question<BR>Landgrab: Sting (and other things)<BR>*Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 15:01:54 -0000<BR>From: "Rupert Boleyn" &lt;rboleyn@paradise.net.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>On 3 Jan 2001, at 20:30, GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; I was originally called the Trepida in MT Rebellion Sourcebook &amp; 101<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; Vehicles.&nbsp; Don't know why it changed in GT:GF....<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Because my Latin dictionary says _Trepida_ means "to hurry with alarm or <BR>&gt; cowardice" and I thought that was a dumb name for a tank. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; LKW<BR><BR>I always assumed that it was called the _Trepida_ because of what it inspired <BR>in its enemies.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>"Rupert Boleyn" &lt;rboleyn@paradise.net.nz&gt;<BR><BR>A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 18:30:03 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: WFRP<BR><BR>&gt;From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: WFRP<BR>...<BR>&gt;Well, the D&amp;D crowd might be a little slow where you come from, but G1-3 were <BR>&gt;published ca. 1978, almost a decade before WFRP.&nbsp; "Cutting edge" D&amp;D in the <BR>&gt;mid-80s was stuff like the original Ravenloft and Dragonlance modules, and that<BR>&gt;Gygax 'King Kong' rip-off.<BR><BR>&nbsp; Speaking of "dismayingly linear" :|<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 18:32:00 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Oops! <BR><BR>...<BR>&gt; Tricky.&nbsp; It would require the incredibly rare attribute of subtlety.&nbsp; Maybe<BR>&gt; that's what happened to Dulinor - Strephon sent a bunch of PCs to have a<BR>&gt; quiet chat with him.<BR><BR>&nbsp; It would have gone OK if they hadn't the fusion grenade from R&amp;D...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 20:34:56 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Back again<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&lt;&lt;snip&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Basically, the summarised version is that my New Year in Germany (at<BR>&gt; a town called Aurich between Wilhelmshaven and Emden) was interesting<BR>&gt; because it gave a similar feeling to watching films of Sarejevo and<BR>&gt; Beirut. The fireworks were thick, fast and flying all over.<BR><BR>Hmmm.<BR><BR>Lots of fireworks (reminiscent of combat) in a German town called<BR>Aurich.<BR><BR>AuricTech's founder is an ethnic Solomani named Marcus Weishaupt (a good<BR>Germanic last name).<BR><BR>Coincidence?<BR><BR>I THINK NOT! ;-)<BR><BR>&lt;&lt;snip&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 18:59:16<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR><BR>At 10:10 PM 1/3/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;At 23:04 -0500 1/1/01,&nbsp; "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" <BR>&gt;&lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;Hrm... I think my new-year's resolution should be to use more<BR>&gt;&gt;commonly-known songs for filks....<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; WHO LET THE VARGR OUT?&nbsp; *woof! woof! woof!*<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&lt;SPLORT&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Damn, that was a waste of Stella Artois.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Chalk a kill, please.<BR><BR>Dom, wait a day or two before you relax..<BR><BR>... I'm writing it.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>"Some days, you just can't get rid&nbsp; of a bomb!"<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -Adam West, as Batman <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 19:39:02 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR><BR>&gt;From: Postmark Design Bureau &lt;postmark.design@btinternet.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>...<BR>&gt;I played WFRP when it first came out and then GM'd it weekly for 4 years<BR>&gt;straight.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;IIRC, at the time the D&amp;D crowd thought that modules like G1-3 were cutting<BR>&gt;edge stuff. By comparison with WFRP, G1-3 is a set of prerolled random<BR>&gt;encounters.<BR><BR>&nbsp; You mean they _weren't_?! :&gt;&nbsp; To be fair, some older AD&amp;D stuff was a<BR>heck of a lot better than a lot of the crap for 2nd ed, but too much was<BR>pretty limited or just plain sparse - but they were reasonably priced<BR>for what they were, at least.<BR><BR>And after IG, Trav players should be a bit more open about value for money.<BR><BR>&nbsp; BTW, people actually _pay_ money for _T4 Starships_ still?!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 22:38:48 +0000<BR>From: "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: [FILK] On the bridge of the Arrival Vengeance<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 18:26:56 -0500<BR>&gt;From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: [FILK] On the bridge of the Arrival Vengeance<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Troubled, uncertain times for our heros, stranded deep in the dark<BR>&gt;heart of the Shattered Imperium.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; CAPTAIN JAMISON<BR>&gt;What would Cleon Zhunastu do<BR>&gt;If he was here right now?<BR><BR>Ooooh, it's going to take some explaining to the people here why I suddenly <BR>burst out laughing and couldn't stop!<BR><BR>I now suddenly have the image of Strephon, Norris, and the rest drawn in <BR>South-Park style.<BR><BR>"Oh my God!&nbsp; He killed Strephon!"&nbsp; "You bastard!"<BR><BR>That was great!&nbsp; Thank you! =)<BR><BR>Cheers!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 23:01:50 +0000<BR>From: "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: WFRP [FILK]<BR><BR>Arrrgh!&nbsp; I can't stand it....&nbsp; This... must... be... done....!<BR><BR>Fortunately for you, this isn't the Shatner Singalong, so only the acting <BR>is bad. =)<BR><BR>Though I confess it's not entirely Traveller related, I've seen enough <BR>references to it that this sort of grabbed hold of me and insisted it get <BR>told before I go to Maine.&nbsp; So....<BR><BR>WFRP<BR>====<BR>(from: WKRP in Cincinnatti)<BR><BR>Gamer, if you've ever role-played<BR>Role-played, whatever the venue may be<BR>There's something that just should have never meant to be<BR>That's role-playin' with WFRP<BR><BR>Got kind of tired of Pudding's malfeasence<BR>Warhammer just kept churing out new versions<BR>I don't know, at the time it kinda made some sense<BR>Maybe I should find other diversions<BR><BR>I'll be WFRP, but is it role-play?<BR><BR>- -30-<BR><BR>Whew... I'm glad that's out of my system!<BR><BR>ObTrav: You know, someone mentioned in the JTAS forum that their <BR>characters, during the "down-time" in jump, would gather in the mess deck <BR>and play GURPS Traveller.&nbsp; While kind of silly, would RPGs exist in <BR>anything recognizable to us?&nbsp; Wargames, most certainly.&nbsp; (You can picture <BR>some armchair grognards hunkered over a table, with a set of memory-metal <BR>and chamaeleoline miniatures (no more painting&nbsp; minitures!&nbsp; Plug 'em into a <BR>console and have the little buggers change color as needed) spread out on a <BR>dynamic gaming-board.)&nbsp; But what about RPGs?&nbsp; For that matter, would <BR>science fiction have any sort of place in such a society as the 3I?&nbsp; What <BR>about the fantasy genre? or occult horror?&nbsp; Would you see games such as <BR>'Rapture' or 'Call of Cthulhu' (in it's five hundredth edition.)&nbsp; Or would <BR>games such as 'Blue Planet' become&nbsp; 'retrotech roleplay' or even <BR>'contemporary RPGs?'<BR><BR>And on that note, Cheers. =)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 23:13:14 EST<BR>From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/2/01 9:54:59 PM !!!First Boot!!!, jfox@verity.com writes:<BR><BR>&lt;&lt;&nbsp; The truth of the information was that the Spitfires fared rather badly <BR>against <BR>the Zero as the defenders of Singapore will testify to.&nbsp;&nbsp; &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>Interesting.....I thought that the Hurricane had it's a** handed to it by the <BR>Zero, but the vaunted Spitfire too? Were these early model Spit's and/or <BR>crewed with second string pilots (assuming the good stuff was saved for <BR>Europe)?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 22:38:45 -0600<BR>From: Paul Kerby &lt;ybrekp@mtco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: another question<BR><BR>GDWGAMES@aol.com writes:<BR>&gt; What's the largest passenger carrying starship mentioned in print?<BR><BR>There is the King Richard from FASA 5ktons, deckplans and all<BR><BR>How big was the "Regent"(?) class liner from the T4 starships book.<BR><BR>There is also the 10kton ship in GT:FT<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 17:57:31 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR><BR>On 3 Jan 01, at 23:13, Sethkimmel@aol.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In a message dated 1/2/01 9:54:59 PM !!!First Boot!!!, jfox@verity.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; &lt;&lt;&nbsp; The truth of the information was that the Spitfires fared rather badly<BR>&gt; against <BR>&gt;&nbsp; the Zero as the defenders of Singapore will testify to.&nbsp;&nbsp; &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; Interesting.....I thought that the Hurricane had it's a** handed to it by the<BR>&gt; Zero, but the vaunted Spitfire too? Were these early model Spit's and/or<BR>&gt; crewed with second string pilots (assuming the good stuff was saved for<BR>&gt; Europe)?<BR><BR>As I said before, there were no (nil, zero, nada, zilch) Spitfires in the Far <BR>East in 1941-42. The first to arrive were four squadrons (three RAAF and <BR>one RAF) of Mk Vs based around Darwin in mid 1943 (#1 Wing). But they <BR>did not begin to arrive in quantity until the Mk VIIIs started to arrive in late <BR>1943. Even the early Spitfires (Mk Is and IIs) would have been a match for <BR>the A6M Zero, the later models had it all over them.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 22:53:23 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>Hey, if you guys don't want to hear about my task system--no sweat.<BR>I'll pack up my dice and keep it to myself.<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 20:36:58 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Acting President Thing wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; On Tuesday, January 02, 2001 7:05 PM<BR>&gt;&gt; Clifford N Linehan said,<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; And I know some of the people that did it.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; I like the BBC article.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/americas/newsid_1098000/1098419.s<BR>&gt;&gt; tm<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Cool...i really hope they let it stay up...it looks rather nice where it<BR>&gt; is.<BR><BR>The city didn't get the chance. Someone removed it last night. :-)<BR><BR>&gt; My favorite comment so far has been from Slashdot:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "Oh no, someone has erected an instrument of evolution in the home of<BR>&gt; Microsoft and Grunge rock! We're doomed!"<BR><BR>Ah! That's what hapopened, the monolith imploded from the strain...<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 20:43:59 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Intrepid<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; In the copy of GF that I have, the Intrepid weighs in at 192 US tons (one of<BR>&gt; my pet peeves with GURPS) and displaces 4.15 Dtons. In my copy of the RCS<BR>&gt; Equipment Guide, the Intrepid weighs in at 255.6 metric tons and 10 Dtons..<BR>&gt; So it looks like the tank went on a diet.. ;)<BR><BR>I note that the new version is almost twice as demse as the old one<BR>(3.2 versus 1.8).<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 20:50:37 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Oops...<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; James Jensen wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Kenneth, you were right about the chance fo two sets of 3D6 coming up<BR>&gt;&gt; identical. It's not ~0.5%. I did the math wrong. The ACTUAL chance is more<BR>&gt;&gt; to the tune of.... well, I can't give you the percentage because the<BR>&gt;&gt; calculator can't handle that low of a number. Just know that I was wrong<BR>&gt;&gt; and that you were right.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I think you need a new calculation, not a new calculator!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; If the three dice are distinct (ie roll a read, a white and a blue)<BR>&gt; and they have to match (ie red vs red, etc)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Then the chance is 1/216, as you had.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; If the dice are all the same, ie a roll of 1,2,3 can match a roll of 3,2,1<BR>&gt; then the chance will be much better than 0.5%<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; three dice the same (eg roll of 1,1,1):&nbsp;&nbsp; 6/216 * 1/216<BR>&gt; two dice the same&nbsp;&nbsp; (eg roll of 1,1,2):&nbsp; 30/216 * 3/216<BR>&gt; all dice different&nbsp; (eg roll of 1,2,3): 180/216 * 6/216<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; : 1176/46656<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; : 2.5%<BR><BR>Might I point out that there's no need to *theorize*. Just write and<BR>run a *short* BASIC program to try all possible rolls... It'd take only<BR>a few minutes to run on even an XT!<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 23:32:29 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>On 01/03/01 at 10:53 PM,&nbsp; Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>&gt;Hey, if you guys don't want to hear about my task system--no sweat.<BR>&gt;I'll pack up my dice and keep it to myself.<BR><BR>Ken, Dom might want you to leave, but I want you to stay. We might cancel each other out, but tie goes to the poster. &lt;g&gt;&nbsp; <BR><BR>Keep posting!<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 21:52:22 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: xTU Astrography<BR><BR>Hi All,<BR><BR>My keyboard has been developing odd quirks lately - dropped <BR>characters, multiple characters - but last night it came up with a <BR>new one. The "D" key decided that what it really wanted to be was <BR>another "T" key. I'm now using an emergency replacement keyboard that <BR>has problems of its own, but at least has all 26 letters.<BR><BR>My question is this, assuming a similar flaw in the players' <BR>astrogation system (the "astrogation for dummies" version where you <BR>choose your destination by name) what fun places could you send your <BR>players other than where they thought they were going? Ignore jump <BR>limits for the moment; say the program takes a first jump towards the <BR>wrong destination.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 22:01:24 -0800<BR>From: "Trent Smith" &lt;trentfs@ix.netcom.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>&lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; Ken, Dom might want you to leave, but I want you to stay. We might cancel<BR>each other out, but tie goes to the poster. &lt;g&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Keep posting!<BR>&gt;<BR>Seconded.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 23:10:47 -0800<BR>From: "tsykoduk" &lt;tsykoduk@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Intrepid<BR><BR>TNE is 28 stons per dton to GURPS 46 stons per dton.<BR><BR><BR>TNE<BR>255.6 metric tons = 281.7508 short tons. 281.7508/10 dtons = 28 stons/dton<BR>Gurps<BR>192 stons/4.15 dtons = 46 stons per dton<BR><BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Leonard Erickson<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2001 8:44 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Intrepid<BR><BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; In the copy of GF that I have, the Intrepid weighs in at 192 US tons (one<BR>of<BR>&gt; my pet peeves with GURPS) and displaces 4.15 Dtons. In my copy of the RCS<BR>&gt; Equipment Guide, the Intrepid weighs in at 255.6 metric tons and 10<BR>Dtons..<BR>&gt; So it looks like the tank went on a diet.. ;)<BR><BR>I note that the new version is almost twice as demse as the old one<BR>(3.2 versus 1.8).<BR><BR>- --<BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 09:36:46 -0000 <BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Back again<BR><BR><BR>&gt; After the staid and sober UK 5 Nov Guy Fawkes night, it was a bit of <BR>&gt; a shock. A lot of a shock. However, the beer was good, the company <BR>&gt; very pleasant and the time very enjoyable. I no longer believe the UK <BR>&gt; stereotype of Germans being very sober, regimented, and punctually <BR>&gt; formal. And I'd love to do it again....<BR><BR>I think those stereotypes are based on the Victorian era Prussians, and that<BR>modern Germany has thawed out a good deal with the integration of Bavaria<BR>and Prussia into a unified Germany. Not that I'm saying that stereotypes are<BR>a valid way of looking at people, because as we all know milage varies. I<BR>found my time in Germany great fun too :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 11:40:38 +0100<BR>From: "Volker 'V.A.G' Greimann" &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Back again<BR><BR>At 20:34 03.01.01 -0600, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Lots of fireworks (reminiscent of combat) in a German town called<BR>&gt;Aurich.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;AuricTech's founder is an ethnic Solomani named Marcus Weishaupt (a good<BR>&gt;Germanic last name).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Coincidence?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I THINK NOT! ;-)<BR>I think so, since Aurich is a really small town in the North, and Weishaupt <BR>is a name from the south.<BR>On the other hand, maybe..., Adam Weishaupt WAS forced to flee from the <BR>south to places unknown after the Bavarian Illuminati were outlawed. Maybe <BR>he didnt go to the US and replace G. Washington after all.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 11:41:51 +0100<BR>From: "Volker 'V.A.G' Greimann" &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>At 22:53 03.01.01 -0600, you wrote:<BR><BR><BR>&gt;Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Hey, if you guys don't want to hear about my task system--no sweat.<BR>&gt;I'll pack up my dice and keep it to myself.<BR><BR>I dont mind it. I probably wont use it, but it still makes a fun read.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 11:28 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;004501c07613$c6f56100$287379a5@trentfs&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>While I'm enjoying discussions of KB3 and other task-resolution system <BR>proposals, I don't really want to go off to another mailing list to <BR>discuss JUST them.<BR><BR>Please continue, they are all part of the wide spectrum of things which <BR>comprise discussions of and about TRAVELLER. So are, for example, <BR>discussions of assorted 'battle wagons' from the Striker enthusiasts which <BR>don't of themselves interest me (but may still come in usful when players <BR>need one...)<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 00:42:07 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR><BR>On 4 Jan 01, at 14:58, Rupert Boleyn wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; The A6M's firepower was actually quite spectacular when it originally entered<BR>&gt; service (2 20mm cannon before WWII), however its lack of armour and its<BR>&gt; inability to carry a heavier armament meant that it became obselete quite<BR>&gt; quickly.<BR><BR>Yes, but they were probably the worst 20mm ever designed, their effective <BR>firepower was less than a 50 cal. (another ObTrav: Don't put crappy <BR>weapons on excellant platforms).<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 11:45:31 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>Loren wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; I was originally called the Trepida in MT Rebellion Sourcebook<BR>&gt; &gt; &amp; 101 Vehicles.&nbsp; Don't know why it changed in GT:GF....<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Because my Latin dictionary says _Trepida_ means "to hurry with<BR>&gt; alarm or cowardice" and I thought that was a dumb name for a tank. <BR><BR>Yeah but the 3I seems to have a thing about&nbsp; "dumb"&nbsp; names.&nbsp; Just<BR>look at the names of some of the AHL cruisers, or&nbsp; the&nbsp; names&nbsp; of<BR>some of the planets in the Spinward&nbsp; Marches.&nbsp; Evidently&nbsp; the&nbsp; 3I<BR>has a cultural quirk that says names&nbsp; have&nbsp; to&nbsp; be&nbsp; "dumb".&nbsp; Thus<BR>calling a tank "Trepida" probably isn't dumb enough.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 13:22:20 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: xTU Astrography<BR><BR>Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt; My question is this, assuming a similar flaw in the players' <BR>&gt; astrogation system (the "astrogation for dummies" version where you <BR>&gt; choose your destination by name) what fun places could you send your <BR>&gt; players other than where they thought they were going? Ignore jump <BR>&gt; limits for the moment; say the program takes a first jump towards the <BR>&gt; wrong destination.<BR><BR>Take this a step further: after an overhaul on a Vargr&nbsp; dominated<BR>world the jump-drive control subsystem was replaced and&nbsp; the&nbsp; new<BR>unit expects parameter strings in Vargr ... but&nbsp; the&nbsp; maintenance<BR>staff forgot to replace the navigation subsystem's device drivers<BR>accordingly.&nbsp;&nbsp; They&nbsp; *did*&nbsp; remember&nbsp;&nbsp; the&nbsp;&nbsp; j-drive&nbsp;&nbsp; monitoring<BR>subsystem at the engineers station so everything looks okay until<BR>...<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 15:22:33 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Another question<BR><BR>Loren wrote:<BR>&gt; What's the largest passenger carrying starship mentioned in print?<BR><BR>AFAIK all printed ships carry standard size passengers.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 15:29:21 -0000 <BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Another question<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Loren wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; What's the largest passenger carrying starship mentioned in print?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; AFAIK all printed ships carry standard size passengers.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Even Hiver ships?<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 15:36:56 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Landgrab: Sting (and other things)<BR><BR>(I think this got buried in the KB3_TaskWar when most people were<BR>away, so I'm reposting...)<BR><BR>There's been a couple of updates to StuffOnline ...<BR><BR>1) Well I've just posted the primary draft of the write-up of the<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; TML Landgrab for Sting (Sword Worlds).&nbsp; I wanted to&nbsp; get&nbsp; that<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; done before the end of the year and I just made&nbsp; it.&nbsp; As&nbsp; with<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; Yori this write-up contains IMTU information ...&nbsp; including&nbsp; a<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; lot of non-canon stuff on general Swordie&nbsp; culture&nbsp; (but&nbsp; that<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; couldn't be helped as there is so little cannon material about<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; the Swordies).&nbsp; Anyway, feedback please.<BR><BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; For those waiting for the second adventure for Yori: its still<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; being worked on and shouldn't be much longer (plus a few other<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; minor additions to the Yori write-up).<BR><BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; How are all the other landgrabs&nbsp; coming&nbsp; along?&nbsp; Anyone&nbsp; who's<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; done a Landgrab write-up but doesn't have a web&nbsp; site:&nbsp; I&nbsp; can<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; host them for you.<BR><BR>2) There's a few characters (former PCs) now posted.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR>http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/trisen/sol<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 15:46:51 -0000 <BR>From: Gerry Crowe &lt;gerry.crowe@intec-telecom-systems.com&gt;<BR>Subject: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand<BR>this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.<BR><BR>- ------_=_NextPart_001_01C07665.93BF82F0<BR>Content-Type: text/plain;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR><BR>Just returned to Traveller after a 2 year lay off, and now catching up on<BR>all the Xmas mail (I'm saying this so you all show me a little mercy for<BR>bringing this topic up again) :o)<BR><BR>When T4 appeared, like many others I disliked the system of 'half dice',<BR>plus the overpowering level of the Stat. This was my simple alternative that<BR>worked well for us, as it's main aim is to give the Skill an additional role<BR>(thus bringing it up to the level of the Stat). Kenneth and others may find<BR>some of it of use.<BR><BR>The target number for a Task is still the associated Stat + Skill <BR><BR>The difficulty of tasks are represented by increased numbers of dice, just<BR>like T4, but using whole dice like most of the other suggested alternatives.<BR><BR>Easy&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1D6 or auto<BR>Average&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 2D6<BR>Difficult&nbsp;&nbsp; 3D6<BR>Formidable&nbsp; 4D6<BR>Staggering&nbsp; 5D6<BR>Impossible&nbsp; 6D6<BR><BR>My main change was to add another use to the skills - *once* per task roll,<BR>you may reroll one die per point of skill. If you have no skill, you *must*<BR>reroll your lowest die. <BR><BR>So it goes like this<BR>Step 1 - Stat + Skill = Target Number<BR>Step 2 - roll the number of dice equal to the difficulty<BR>Step 3 - if desired, reroll a number of dice up to your skill level - you<BR>may only do this once, no matter how high your skill<BR>Step 4 - total the final dice thrown. If it's less than or equal to your<BR>target number, you succeed, if not you fail.<BR><BR><BR>Quick examples<BR><BR>Stat 4, Skill 1, Average<BR>Roll 2D6, reroll 1 if desired, total must be &lt;= 5 to succeed. Difficult but<BR>not impossible for a beginner with a lack of talent.<BR><BR>Stat 7, Skill 2, Difficult<BR>Roll 3D6, reroll up to 2 of them, total must be &lt;= 9 to succeed. Average<BR>proficient character, he's got a good chance of succeeding with the rerolls<BR><BR>Stat 6, Skill 4, Difficult<BR>Roll 3d6, reroll up to all of them (remember, you can only reroll once, so<BR>the 4th skill point cannot be used), total must be &lt;= 10 to succeed.<BR><BR>Stat 10, Skill 1, Difficult<BR>Roll 3D6, no rerolls, total must be &lt;= 11 to succeed.<BR><BR>Note these last two examples - they're the classic Stats vs Skills scenarios<BR>used by Kenneth in his KB2 article. However, even though the second scenario<BR>has a better target number, the skilled character is more likely to succeed<BR>due to his rerolls.<BR><BR>Stat12, Skill 6, Impossible<BR>Roll 6D6, reroll up to all of them, total must be &lt;= 18 to succeed.<BR><BR>This may seem too easy for an 'Impossible' roll, but then these are<BR>God-stats - and the odds are definitely lower than T4!<BR><BR>Unfortunately I'm not all that good with probabilites, so I can't give you<BR>exact numbers for each case, especially taking into account the rerolls.<BR>What I can tell you is that the fix certainly *feels* good when played.<BR><BR>Hoping someone finds this useful...<BR><BR>- ------------------------------------------------<BR>Gerry Crowe<BR>Doomtown Sheriff &amp; Keeper of the FAQ lurking at<BR>http://www.ghostrock.fsnet.co.uk <BR><BR>"This is my town...if you live to see the dawn, it is because I allow it..."<BR><BR><BR><BR>**********************************************************************<BR>This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and<BR>intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they<BR>are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify<BR>Nick West - Global Infrastructure Manager.<BR><BR>This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by<BR>MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses.<BR><BR>www.mimesweeper.com<BR>**********************************************************************<BR><BR>- ------_=_NextPart_001_01C07665.93BF82F0<BR>Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>&lt;!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;HEAD&gt;<BR>&lt;META HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-=<BR>1"&gt;<BR>&lt;META NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server version 5.5.2650.12"&gt;<BR>&lt;TITLE&gt;*Simple* fix to the T4 task system&lt;/TITLE&gt;<BR>&lt;/HEAD&gt;<BR><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>Just returned to Traveller after a 2 year lay off, and no=<BR>w catching up on all the Xmas mail (I'm saying this so you all show me a li=<BR>ttle mercy for bringing this topic up again) :o)</FONT></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>When T4 appeared, like many others I disliked the system =<BR>of 'half dice', plus the overpowering level of the Stat. This was my simple=<BR>alternative that worked well for us, as it's main aim is to give the Skill=<BR>an additional role (thus bringing it up to the level of the Stat). Kenneth=<BR>and others may find some of it of use.</FONT></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>The target number for a Task is still the associated Stat=<BR>+ Skill </FONT><BR></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>The difficulty of tasks are represented by increased numb=<BR>ers of dice, just like T4, but using whole dice like most of the other sugg=<BR>ested alternatives.</FONT></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>Easy&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 1D6 or aut=<BR>o</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Average&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 2D6</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Difficult&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 3D6</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Formidable&amp;nbsp; 4D6</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Staggering&amp;nbsp; 5D6</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Impossible&amp;nbsp; 6D6</FONT><BR></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>My main change was to add another use to the skills - *on=<BR>ce* per task roll, you may reroll one die per point of skill. If you have n=<BR>o skill, you *must* reroll your lowest die. </FONT></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>So it goes like this</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Step 1 - Stat + Skill =3D Target Number</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Step 2 - roll the number of dice equal to the difficulty=<BR></FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Step 3 - if desired, reroll a number of dice up to your =<BR>skill level - you may only do this once, no matter how high your skill&lt;/FON=<BR>T&gt;</P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>Step 4 - total the final dice thrown. If it's less than o=<BR>r equal to your target number, you succeed, if not you fail.</FONT><BR></P><BR><BR><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>Quick examples</FONT><BR></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>Stat 4, Skill 1, Average</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Roll 2D6, reroll 1 if desired, total must be &amp;lt;=3D 5 t=<BR>o succeed. Difficult but not impossible for a beginner with a lack of talen=<BR>t.</FONT></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>Stat 7, Skill 2, Difficult</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Roll 3D6, reroll up to 2 of them, total must be &amp;lt;=3D =<BR>9 to succeed. Average proficient character, he's got a good chance of succe=<BR>eding with the rerolls</FONT></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>Stat 6, Skill 4, Difficult</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Roll 3d6, reroll up to all of them (remember, you can on=<BR>ly reroll once, so the 4th skill point cannot be used), total must be &amp;lt;=<BR>=3D 10 to succeed.</FONT></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>Stat 10, Skill 1, Difficult</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Roll 3D6, no rerolls, total must be &amp;lt;=3D 11 to succee=<BR>d.</FONT><BR></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>Note these last two examples - they're the classic Stats =<BR>vs Skills scenarios used by Kenneth in his KB2 article. However, even thoug=<BR>h the second scenario has a better target number, the skilled character is =<BR>more likely to succeed due to his rerolls.</FONT></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>Stat12, Skill 6, Impossible</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Roll 6D6, reroll up to all of them, total must be &amp;lt;=<BR>=3D 18 to succeed.</FONT><BR></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>This may seem too easy for an 'Impossible' roll, but then=<BR>these are God-stats - and the odds are definitely lower than T4!</FONT></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>Unfortunately I'm not all that good with probabilites, so=<BR>I can't give you exact numbers for each case, especially taking into accou=<BR>nt the rerolls. What I can tell you is that the fix certainly *feels* good =<BR>when played.</FONT></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>Hoping someone finds this useful...</FONT><BR></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>------------------------------------------------</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Gerry Crowe</FONT><BR><BR><FONT size=3>Doomtown Sheriff &amp;amp; Keeper of the FAQ lurking at&lt;/FON=<BR>T&gt;<BR><BR><FONT size=3><A href='http://3d"http://www.ghostrock.fsnet.co.uk%22' target='3D"_=<BR' title='http://3d"http://www.ghostrock.fsnet.co.uk%22'>blank"&gt;http://www.ghostrock.fsnet.co.uk</A> </FONT><BR></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>&amp;quot;This is my town...if you live to see the dawn, it i=<BR>s because I allow it...&amp;quot; </FONT><BR></P><BR><BR>&lt;CODE&gt;<FONT size=3><BR><BR><BR><BR>**********************************************************************<BR><BR>This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and<BR><BR>intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they<BR><BR>are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify<BR><BR>Nick West - Global Infrastructure Manager.<BR><BR><BR><BR>This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by<BR><BR>MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses.<BR><BR><BR><BR>www.mimesweeper.com<BR><BR>**********************************************************************<BR><BR></FONT>&lt;/CODE&gt;<BR><BR>- ------_=_NextPart_001_01C07665.93BF82F0--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3503<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xd01.mx.aol.com (rly-xd01.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.166]) by air-xd02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 04 Jan 2001 10:50:46 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xd01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 04 Jan 2001 10:50:29 1900<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id KAA56960;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 10:46:03 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 4 Jan 2001 10:45:47 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id KAA56912<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 10:45:47 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 10:45:47 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101041545.KAA56912@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3503<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3504</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/4/01 1:10:40 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 4 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3504<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Another question<BR>Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3503<BR>re: another question<BR>Jumpspace<BR>Re: Intrepid<BR>RE: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>RE: Jumpspace<BR>Patrol Cruiser<BR>Re: WFRP [FILK]<BR>RE: Trepida<BR>RE: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR>RE: Trepida<BR>Re: Back again<BR>just a quickie<BR>RE: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR>Re: Landgrab: Sting (and other things) and KB3@E-groups<BR>Re: Landgrab: Sting (and other things)<BR>Re: WFRP [FILK]<BR>RE: Landgrab: Sting (and other things)<BR>Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 15:49:02 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Another question<BR><BR>Dean Jones wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Loren wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; What's the largest passenger carrying starship mentioned in print?<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; AFAIK all printed ships carry standard size passengers.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Even Hiver ships?<BR><BR>I was, of course, limiting my answer&nbsp; to&nbsp; Human&nbsp; ships&nbsp; typically<BR>found in the 3I.&nbsp; But wouldn't K'kree passengers be&nbsp; bigger&nbsp; than<BR>Hiver passengers?&nbsp; (They'd certainly need more&nbsp; space&nbsp; 'cos&nbsp; they<BR>get claustrophobia.)<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 08:59:15 -0700<BR>From: timmon@primenet.com<BR>Subject: Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>Kenneth - I second Eris. A debate on variant Traveller task systems beats<BR>the hell out of much of the usual hashed/rehashed/re-rehashed topics that<BR>have become the norm since you departed the last time.<BR><BR>Paul<BR><BR>At 11:32 PM 1/3/01 -0600, you wrote:<BR>&gt;On 01/03/01 at 10:53 PM,&nbsp; Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions<BR>&lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt; said:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Hey, if you guys don't want to hear about my task system--no sweat.<BR>&gt;&gt;I'll pack up my dice and keep it to myself.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Ken, Dom might want you to leave, but I want you to stay. We might cancel<BR>each other out, but tie goes to the poster. &lt;g&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Keep posting!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Eris<BR>&gt;-- <BR>&gt;-----------------------------------------------------------<BR>&gt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>&gt;http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>&gt;-----------------------------------------------------------<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 09:55:59 -0600 <BR>From: "Smart, David J (David)" &lt;dasmart@avaya.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3503<BR><BR>Paul Kerby &lt;ybrekp@mtco.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: re: another question<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; GDWGAMES@aol.com writes:<BR>&gt; &gt; What's the largest passenger carrying starship mentioned in print?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; There is the King Richard from FASA 5ktons, deckplans and all<BR><BR>For a liner, yes. There's another merchie in the MT books of the<BR>same displacement but it's more of a freighter even though it can<BR>carry a few passengers.<BR><BR>&gt; How big was the "Regent"(?) class liner from the T4 starships book.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; There is also the 10kton ship in GT:FT<BR><BR>Right. I believe MT publications top out at 5000dtons for anything<BR>other than combat ships. Hmm. I do seem to remember a mention about<BR>large bulk carriers but those usually don't carry passengers.<BR><BR>Crud. I've been playing Ultima Online too much. Time to focus more<BR>on Traveller. (poor me)<BR><BR>David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 16:08:42 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: Eamon Patrick Watters &lt;E.Watters@Queens-Belfast.AC.UK&gt;<BR>Subject: re: another question<BR><BR>GDWGAMES@aol.com sent:<BR>&gt; What's the largest passenger carrying starship mentioned in print?<BR><BR>Challenge 63 has the 'Affinity', a World Class Liner, 200,000dt, M1, J2<BR>IIRC.<BR><BR>There's also that Modular 500,000dt Imperial Transport at the back of the<BR>Rebellion Sourcebook, IIRC it had passenger modules.<BR><BR>Eamon Watters<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 17:20:38 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Jumpspace<BR><BR>I'm currently looking at the nature of jump (j-drives, jumpspace,<BR>etc) and I've noticed a small inconsistancy:<BR><BR>1) Some of the talk about jump drives seems to follow the&nbsp; notion<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; that when jumping a ship punches a whole out of&nbsp; the&nbsp; universe<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; and stays in its own mini pocket universe until the end of its<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; journey.&nbsp; This is supported in part&nbsp; by&nbsp; the&nbsp; hydrogen&nbsp; bubble<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; idea.<BR><BR>2) Some talk about jumpspace seems to follow the notion&nbsp; that&nbsp; it<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; is&nbsp; a&nbsp; hyperspace&nbsp; ...&nbsp; that&nbsp; is&nbsp; a&nbsp; parallel&nbsp; universe&nbsp; where<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; distances are smaller (or quicker&nbsp; to&nbsp; cross)&nbsp; than&nbsp; our&nbsp; own.<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; This is supported by the "crumpled tissue" metaphor.<BR><BR>So my question for the list is this:&nbsp; IYTU&nbsp; which&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; above<BR>ideas do you use, does each ship have its&nbsp; own&nbsp; jumpspace&nbsp; or&nbsp; is<BR>jumpspace a universal hyperspace (or have you another idea)?<BR><BR>If the second option then is there anything else in jumpspace and<BR>can ships get stuck there permanently?<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 09:33:27 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Intrepid<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson writes:<BR><BR>&gt; I note that the new version is almost twice as demse as the old one<BR>&gt; (3.2 versus 1.8).<BR><BR>This is probably a combination of armor having no volume (the Intrepid has<BR>160 tons of armor, which is around 0.7 dTons) and the much lower volume of<BR>crewstations in GURPS.&nbsp; Either that, or the Trepida is just bloated and<BR>underarmored, which is also possible (the imperial G-carrier in Striker <BR>was 600 tons or so, making it easily win on density).&nbsp; For that matter, a<BR>armor-F vehicle in High Guard has a minimum density of 2.25 and a likely<BR>density of 3+, making it denser than a heavy tank by quite a bit...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 17:31:29 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>Paul wrote:<BR>&gt; Kenneth - I second Eris. A debate on variant Traveller task<BR>&gt; systems beats the hell out of much of the usual hashed/rehashed/<BR>&gt; re-rehashed topics that have become the norm since you departed<BR>&gt; the last time.<BR><BR>I'd like to propose a new egroup list to discuss whether&nbsp; or&nbsp; not<BR>variant Traveller task systems should&nbsp; have&nbsp; their&nbsp; own&nbsp; list&nbsp; or<BR>remain part of the TML.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 09:37:37 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Jumpspace<BR><BR>Trevor,<BR><BR>In my gamews i have always believed that jumpspace was an alternate<BR>deminsion. when you would engage the jump engines they would "jump" you into<BR>this alternate deminsion for travel. to return to normal space you would<BR>ahve to engage the jump engines again to "jump" back into normal space.<BR><BR>in my campains yes ships can get stuck in this deminsion. If something<BR>happens to the jump drive you cant "Jump" back into normal space.<BR><BR>anyway that is the way i feel about it.<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Trevor, Peter [mailto:Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com]<BR>Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001 9:21 AM<BR>To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>Subject: Jumpspace<BR><BR><BR>I'm currently looking at the nature of jump (j-drives, jumpspace,<BR>etc) and I've noticed a small inconsistancy:<BR><BR>1) Some of the talk about jump drives seems to follow the&nbsp; notion<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; that when jumping a ship punches a whole out of&nbsp; the&nbsp; universe<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; and stays in its own mini pocket universe until the end of its<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; journey.&nbsp; This is supported in part&nbsp; by&nbsp; the&nbsp; hydrogen&nbsp; bubble<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; idea.<BR><BR>2) Some talk about jumpspace seems to follow the notion&nbsp; that&nbsp; it<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; is&nbsp; a&nbsp; hyperspace&nbsp; ...&nbsp; that&nbsp; is&nbsp; a&nbsp; parallel&nbsp; universe&nbsp; where<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; distances are smaller (or quicker&nbsp; to&nbsp; cross)&nbsp; than&nbsp; our&nbsp; own.<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; This is supported by the "crumpled tissue" metaphor.<BR><BR>So my question for the list is this:&nbsp; IYTU&nbsp; which&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; above<BR>ideas do you use, does each ship have its&nbsp; own&nbsp; jumpspace&nbsp; or&nbsp; is<BR>jumpspace a universal hyperspace (or have you another idea)?<BR><BR>If the second option then is there anything else in jumpspace and<BR>can ships get stuck there permanently?<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 18:16:17 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Patrol Cruiser<BR><BR>Does anyone know if this ship is going to be in GT: Starships? I know when <BR>Christopher Thrash asked the List way back when, what ships they wanted <BR>included, the Patrol Cruiser was one of them. I know Rob Prior is now the <BR>author and I didn't see the ship on the SJG preview page.<BR><BR>thanks<BR>Mike<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 13:36:22 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: "John P. Raynor" &lt;john.raynor@yale.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: WFRP [FILK]<BR><BR>On Wed, 3 Jan 2001, Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; ObTrav: You know, someone mentioned in the JTAS forum that their <BR>&gt; characters, during the "down-time" in jump, would gather in the mess deck <BR>&gt; and play GURPS Traveller.&nbsp; While kind of silly, would RPGs exist in <BR>&gt; anything recognizable to us?&nbsp; Wargames, most certainly.&nbsp; (You can picture <BR>&gt; some armchair grognards hunkered over a table, with a set of memory-metal <BR>&gt; and chamaeleoline miniatures (no more painting&nbsp; minitures!&nbsp; Plug 'em into a <BR>&gt; console and have the little buggers change color as needed) spread out on a <BR>&gt; dynamic gaming-board.)&nbsp; But what about RPGs?&nbsp; For that matter, would <BR>&gt; science fiction have any sort of place in such a society as the 3I?&nbsp; What <BR>&gt; about the fantasy genre? or occult horror?&nbsp; Would you see games such as <BR>&gt; 'Rapture' or 'Call of Cthulhu' (in it's five hundredth edition.)&nbsp; Or would <BR>&gt; games such as 'Blue Planet' become&nbsp; 'retrotech roleplay' or even <BR>&gt; 'contemporary RPGs?'<BR><BR>As I've stated before, I don't think that "science fiction," would even<BR>exist in the Third Imperium as a recognizable genre (the pace of<BR>technological change and scientific progress is far too glacial to<BR>generate any widespread interest, wonder, or anxiety).&nbsp; On the other hand,<BR>I see no reason that role-playing would ever die out.&nbsp; I suspect the<BR>dominant genre would be what we would call "historical fiction," with<BR>players casting themselves as, say, hard-boiled psi-hunters tangling with<BR>evil Zhodani subversives during the Psionic Suppressions, heroic Sylean<BR>Federation scouts bringing civilization to barbarous worlds at the end of<BR>the Long Night, or militant explorers from early Terra, confronting the<BR>First Imperium.&nbsp; Espionage and "contemporary adventure" would also be<BR>popular genres.&nbsp; I'm not sure about swords-and-sorcery fantasy, though (if<BR>it survives, there will be *massive* borrowing of mythological concepts<BR>from the Vilani and the various minor human races).<BR><BR>It occurs to me that if role-playing survives, it won't be a "new" hobby.<BR>It's entirely possible that there may be "clubs", building upon the same<BR>campaigns for *centuries*.&nbsp; The richness and complexity of the resulting<BR>campaign-worlds would make the works of Tolkein, M. A. R. Barker, the<BR>"Star Trek" universe and (yes) "Traveller" look like hasty, slap-dash<BR>affairs...<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - J. Raynor<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 14:01:55 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Trepida<BR><BR>Peter Trevor writes:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;I was originally called the Trepida in MT Rebellion Sourcebook<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&amp; 101 Vehicles.&nbsp; Don't know why it changed in GT:GF....<BR>&gt;&gt;Because my Latin dictionary says _Trepida_ means "to hurry with<BR>&gt;&gt;alarm or cowardice" and I thought that was a dumb name for a tank. <BR>&gt;Yeah but the 3I seems to have a thing about&nbsp; "dumb"&nbsp; names.&nbsp; Just<BR>&gt;look at the names of some of the AHL cruisers, or&nbsp; the&nbsp; names&nbsp; of<BR>&gt;some of the planets in the Spinward&nbsp; Marches.&nbsp; Evidently&nbsp; the&nbsp; 3I<BR>&gt;has a cultural quirk that says names&nbsp; have&nbsp; to&nbsp; be&nbsp; "dumb".&nbsp; Thus<BR>&gt;calling a tank "Trepida" probably isn't dumb enough.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Real world names are sometimes very dumb.&nbsp; How about<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; "Trojan" brand condoms?&nbsp; Think about it.&nbsp; Anyhow, as some<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; post pointed out, "Trepida" may refer to the feeling meant to<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; be inspired in the enemy.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 11:23:05 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand<BR>this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.<BR><BR>- ------_=_NextPart_001_01C07683.C34F6E90<BR>Content-Type: text/plain;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR><BR>I need to ask this. Where can i get a look at some of the differences<BR>between T4 and the Original traveller. All i have ever played is original<BR>traveller using the original books. books 1-9 plus what ever supplements i<BR>had.<BR><BR>does anyone have a comparison faq between the two?<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Gerry Crowe [mailto:gerry.crowe@intec-telecom-systems.com]<BR>Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001 7:47 AM<BR>To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>Subject: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR><BR><BR>Just returned to Traveller after a 2 year lay off, and now catching up on<BR>all the Xmas mail (I'm saying this so you all show me a little mercy for<BR>bringing this topic up again) :o)<BR><BR>When T4 appeared, like many others I disliked the system of 'half dice',<BR>plus the overpowering level of the Stat. This was my simple alternative that<BR>worked well for us, as it's main aim is to give the Skill an additional role<BR>(thus bringing it up to the level of the Stat). Kenneth and others may find<BR>some of it of use.<BR><BR>The target number for a Task is still the associated Stat + Skill <BR><BR>The difficulty of tasks are represented by increased numbers of dice, just<BR>like T4, but using whole dice like most of the other suggested alternatives.<BR><BR>Easy&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1D6 or auto <BR>Average&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 2D6 <BR>Difficult&nbsp;&nbsp; 3D6 <BR>Formidable&nbsp; 4D6 <BR>Staggering&nbsp; 5D6 <BR>Impossible&nbsp; 6D6 <BR><BR>My main change was to add another use to the skills - *once* per task roll,<BR>you may reroll one die per point of skill. If you have no skill, you *must*<BR>reroll your lowest die. <BR><BR>So it goes like this <BR>Step 1 - Stat + Skill = Target Number <BR>Step 2 - roll the number of dice equal to the difficulty <BR>Step 3 - if desired, reroll a number of dice up to your skill level - you<BR>may only do this once, no matter how high your skill<BR><BR>Step 4 - total the final dice thrown. If it's less than or equal to your<BR>target number, you succeed, if not you fail. <BR><BR><BR>Quick examples <BR><BR>Stat 4, Skill 1, Average <BR>Roll 2D6, reroll 1 if desired, total must be &lt;= 5 to succeed. Difficult but<BR>not impossible for a beginner with a lack of talent.<BR><BR>Stat 7, Skill 2, Difficult <BR>Roll 3D6, reroll up to 2 of them, total must be &lt;= 9 to succeed. Average<BR>proficient character, he's got a good chance of succeeding with the rerolls<BR><BR>Stat 6, Skill 4, Difficult <BR>Roll 3d6, reroll up to all of them (remember, you can only reroll once, so<BR>the 4th skill point cannot be used), total must be &lt;= 10 to succeed.<BR><BR>Stat 10, Skill 1, Difficult <BR>Roll 3D6, no rerolls, total must be &lt;= 11 to succeed. <BR><BR>Note these last two examples - they're the classic Stats vs Skills scenarios<BR>used by Kenneth in his KB2 article. However, even though the second scenario<BR>has a better target number, the skilled character is more likely to succeed<BR>due to his rerolls.<BR><BR>Stat12, Skill 6, Impossible <BR>Roll 6D6, reroll up to all of them, total must be &lt;= 18 to succeed. <BR><BR>This may seem too easy for an 'Impossible' roll, but then these are<BR>God-stats - and the odds are definitely lower than T4!<BR><BR>Unfortunately I'm not all that good with probabilites, so I can't give you<BR>exact numbers for each case, especially taking into account the rerolls.<BR>What I can tell you is that the fix certainly *feels* good when played.<BR><BR>Hoping someone finds this useful... <BR><BR>- ------------------------------------------------ <BR>Gerry Crowe <BR>Doomtown Sheriff &amp; Keeper of the FAQ lurking at <BR>http://www.ghostrock.fsnet.co.uk &lt;http://www.ghostrock.fsnet.co.uk&gt;&nbsp; <BR><BR>"This is my town...if you live to see the dawn, it is because I allow it..."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>**********************************************************************<BR>This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and<BR>intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they<BR>are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify<BR>Nick West - Global Infrastructure Manager.<BR><BR>This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by<BR>MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses.<BR><BR>www.mimesweeper.com<BR>**********************************************************************<BR><BR><BR><BR>- ------_=_NextPart_001_01C07683.C34F6E90<BR>Content-Type: text/html;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR><BR>&lt;!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"&gt;<BR>&lt;HEAD&gt;<BR>&lt;META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1"&gt;<BR>&lt;TITLE&gt;*Simple* fix to the T4 task system&lt;/TITLE&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;META content="MSHTML 5.50.4522.1800" name=GENERATOR&gt;&lt;/HEAD&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;SPAN class=049202319-04122000&gt;<FONT color=#0000ff face=Arial size=2>I need <BR>to ask this. Where can i get a look at some of the differences between T4 and <BR>the Original traveller. All i have ever played is original traveller using the <BR>original books. books 1-9 plus what ever supplements i had.</FONT>&lt;/SPAN&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;SPAN class=049202319-04122000&gt;<FONT color=#0000ff face=Arial <BR>size=2&gt;</FONT>&lt;/SPAN&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;SPAN class=049202319-04122000&gt;<FONT color=#0000ff face=Arial size=2>does <BR>anyone have a comparison faq between the two?</FONT>&lt;/SPAN&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;SPAN class=049202319-04122000&gt;<FONT color=#0000ff face=Arial <BR>size=2&gt;</FONT>&lt;/SPAN&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;&lt;SPAN class=049202319-04122000&gt;<FONT color=#0000ff face=Arial <BR>size=2&gt;Bill</FONT>&lt;/SPAN&gt;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;BLOCKQUOTE&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left&gt;<FONT face=Tahoma <BR> size=2&gt;-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> Gerry Crowe <BR>&nbsp; [mailto:gerry.crowe@intec-telecom-systems.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, <BR>&nbsp; January 04, 2001 7:47 AM<BR><B>To:</B> <BR>&nbsp; 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR><B>Subject:</B> *Simple* fix to the T4 task <BR>&nbsp; system<BR><BR></FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>Just returned to Traveller after a 2 year lay off, and now <BR>&nbsp; catching up on all the Xmas mail (I'm saying this so you all show me a little <BR>&nbsp; mercy for bringing this topic up again) :o)</FONT></P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>When T4 appeared, like many others I disliked the system of <BR>&nbsp; 'half dice', plus the overpowering level of the Stat. This was my simple <BR>&nbsp; alternative that worked well for us, as it's main aim is to give the Skill an <BR>&nbsp; additional role (thus bringing it up to the level of the Stat). Kenneth and <BR>&nbsp; others may find some of it of use.</FONT></P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>The target number for a Task is still the associated Stat + <BR>&nbsp; Skill </FONT></P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>The difficulty of tasks are represented by increased numbers <BR>&nbsp; of dice, just like T4, but using whole dice like most of the other suggested <BR>&nbsp; alternatives.</FONT></P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>Easy&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 1D6 or <BR>&nbsp; auto</FONT> <BR><FONT size=2>Average&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 2D6</FONT> <BR>&nbsp; <BR><FONT size=2>Difficult&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 3D6</FONT> <BR><FONT <BR>size=2&gt;Formidable&amp;nbsp; 4D6</FONT> <BR><FONT size=2>Staggering&amp;nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; 5D6</FONT> <BR><FONT size=2>Impossible&amp;nbsp; 6D6</FONT> </P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>My main change was to add another use to the skills - *once* <BR>&nbsp; per task roll, you may reroll one die per point of skill. If you have no <BR>&nbsp; skill, you *must* reroll your lowest die. </FONT></P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>So it goes like this</FONT> <BR><FONT size=2>Step 1 - Stat + <BR>&nbsp; Skill = Target Number</FONT> <BR><FONT size=2>Step 2 - roll the number of dice <BR>&nbsp; equal to the difficulty</FONT> <BR><FONT size=2>Step 3 - if desired, reroll a <BR>&nbsp; number of dice up to your skill level - you may only do this once, no matter <BR>&nbsp; how high your skill</FONT></P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>Step 4 - total the final dice thrown. If it's less than or <BR>&nbsp; equal to your target number, you succeed, if not you fail.</FONT> </P><BR><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>Quick examples</FONT> </P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>Stat 4, Skill 1, Average</FONT> <BR><FONT size=2>Roll 2D6, <BR>&nbsp; reroll 1 if desired, total must be &amp;lt;= 5 to succeed. Difficult but not <BR>&nbsp; impossible for a beginner with a lack of talent.</FONT></P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>Stat 7, Skill 2, Difficult</FONT> <BR><FONT size=2>Roll 3D6, <BR>&nbsp; reroll up to 2 of them, total must be &amp;lt;= 9 to succeed. Average proficient <BR>&nbsp; character, he's got a good chance of succeeding with the rerolls</FONT></P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>Stat 6, Skill 4, Difficult</FONT> <BR><FONT size=2>Roll 3d6, <BR>&nbsp; reroll up to all of them (remember, you can only reroll once, so the 4th skill <BR>&nbsp; point cannot be used), total must be &amp;lt;= 10 to succeed.</FONT></P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>Stat 10, Skill 1, Difficult</FONT> <BR><FONT size=2>Roll 3D6, <BR>&nbsp; no rerolls, total must be &amp;lt;= 11 to succeed.</FONT> </P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>Note these last two examples - they're the classic Stats vs <BR>&nbsp; Skills scenarios used by Kenneth in his KB2 article. However, even though the <BR>&nbsp; second scenario has a better target number, the skilled character is more <BR>&nbsp; likely to succeed due to his rerolls.</FONT></P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>Stat12, Skill 6, Impossible</FONT> <BR><FONT size=2>Roll 6D6, <BR>&nbsp; reroll up to all of them, total must be &amp;lt;= 18 to succeed.</FONT> </P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>This may seem too easy for an 'Impossible' roll, but then <BR>&nbsp; these are God-stats - and the odds are definitely lower than T4!</FONT></P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>Unfortunately I'm not all that good with probabilites, so I <BR>&nbsp; can't give you exact numbers for each case, especially taking into account the <BR>&nbsp; rerolls. What I can tell you is that the fix certainly *feels* good when <BR>&nbsp; played.</FONT></P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>Hoping someone finds this useful...</FONT> </P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>------------------------------------------------</FONT> <BR>&nbsp; <BR><FONT size=2>Gerry Crowe</FONT> <BR><FONT size=2>Doomtown Sheriff &amp;amp; <BR>&nbsp; Keeper of the FAQ lurking at</FONT> <BR><FONT size=2><A target=_blank <BR>href="http://www.ghostrock.fsnet.co.uk"&gt;http://www.ghostrock.fsnet.co.uk</A> <BR>&nbsp; </FONT></P><BR>&nbsp; 
<P><FONT size=2>"This is my town...if you live to see the dawn, it is because <BR>&nbsp; I allow it..." </FONT></P>&lt;CODE&gt;<FONT <BR> size=3&gt;<BR><BR>**********************************************************************<BR>This <BR>&nbsp; email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and<BR>intended <BR>&nbsp; solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they<BR>are addressed. <BR>&nbsp; If you have received this email in error please notify<BR>Nick West - Global <BR>&nbsp; Infrastructure Manager.<BR><BR>This footnote also confirms that this email <BR>&nbsp; message has been swept by<BR>MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer <BR>&nbsp; viruses.<BR><BR>www.mimesweeper.com<BR>**********************************************************************<BR>&lt;/BLOCKQUOTE&gt;</FONT>&lt;/CODE&gt;<BR><BR>- ------_=_NextPart_001_01C07683.C34F6E90--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 14:49:58 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: "John P. Raynor" &lt;john.raynor@yale.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Trepida<BR><BR>On Thu, 4 Jan 2001, Ian Ferguson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Peter Trevor writes:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;&gt;I was originally called the Trepida in MT Rebellion Sourcebook<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;&gt;&amp; 101 Vehicles.&nbsp; Don't know why it changed in GT:GF....<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;Because my Latin dictionary says _Trepida_ means "to hurry with<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;alarm or cowardice" and I thought that was a dumb name for a tank. <BR>&gt; &gt;Yeah but the 3I seems to have a thing about&nbsp; "dumb"&nbsp; names.&nbsp; Just<BR>&gt; &gt;look at the names of some of the AHL cruisers, or&nbsp; the&nbsp; names&nbsp; of<BR>&gt; &gt;some of the planets in the Spinward&nbsp; Marches.&nbsp; Evidently&nbsp; the&nbsp; 3I<BR>&gt; &gt;has a cultural quirk that says names&nbsp; have&nbsp; to&nbsp; be&nbsp; "dumb".&nbsp; Thus<BR>&gt; &gt;calling a tank "Trepida" probably isn't dumb enough.<BR><BR>Perhaps they do this for superstitious reasons, like calling a healthy<BR>baby "ugly" or "stupid" to prevent the bad spirits from becoming jealous<BR>and cursing it.&nbsp; Somehow, however, I doubt it.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - J. Raynor<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 13:05:17 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Back again<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; PS However, the Dutch should be ashamed of themselves. I found the<BR>&gt; transition across the border from 60 mph German well gritted and<BR>&gt; de-iced roads to the Dutch skid rows scary.<BR><BR>Well, the Dutch _are_ famed as skaters...;-P<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>University of Arizona<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 20:06:47 -0000<BR>From: "michael.scanlon" &lt;michael.scanlon@bmthonline.net&gt;<BR>Subject: just a quickie<BR><BR>hi there<BR><BR>I would like to ask a little question.<BR><BR>Can I subscribe to the traveller-digest mailing list at the same time as<BR>being subscribed to the traveller mailing list?<BR><BR>Mike.<BR><BR>Michael.Scanlon@Bmthonline.net<BR>ICQ#27333894<BR><BR>"Nothing that God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in Heaven for...."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 15:21:47 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: RE: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR>&gt;I need <BR>&gt;to ask this. Where can i get a look at some of the differences &gt;between T4 and <BR>&gt;the Original traveller. All i have ever played is original traveller &gt;using the <BR>&gt;original books. books 1-9 plus what ever supplements i had.<BR>&nbsp;<BR>&gt;does <BR>&gt;anyone have a comparison faq between the two?<BR>&nbsp;<BR>I don't know of a FAQ, but here's the basics.&nbsp; T4 is in many regards pretty similar to original Classic Traveller.&nbsp; Character generation is largely the same but gives character skill levels closer to those in Books 4-7 than Book 1.&nbsp; Characters in T4 will typically have around 1.25 skill points/year.&nbsp; There are also 11 professions instead of 6, and the list of skills is larger.<BR><BR>The biggest change is the Task System.&nbsp; Classic Traveller doesn't have one -- all rolls are ad-hoc.&nbsp; T4 adds a uniform Task System but, as you've probably noticed, a lot of people (me included) aren't too happy with it.&nbsp; The basic mechanic is rolling equal to or below a target number equal to skill+stat on a number of dice increasing with the difficulty of the task.&nbsp; Thus, Alex Jamison (stat 8, skill 3) is attempting a Difficult task: he must roll 11 or less on 2.5D (roll 3D, but divide the result of the 3rd die in half).&nbsp; Were it a Formidable task, he'd need to roll 11 or less on 3D, etc.&nbsp; (Note: MegaTraveller (the edition of Traveller current from 1987-92) also had a task system, an IMO much better one, but some folks (including, unfortunately, Marc Miller) didn't like the fact that you had to divide the value of stats by 5 to use them (reducing effective variation from 0-15 to 0-3)).<BR><BR>Combat is also somewhat changed, and most people seem pretty satisfied with the T4 combat system.&nbsp; The primary difference is having armor reduce damage instead of making you harder to hit.&nbsp; I can't speak much to it, because I still use AHL/Striker for combat.<BR><BR>Starship design uses a very detailed system called 'Fire, Fusion, &amp; Steel' which was originally developed as part of 'Traveller: The New Era.'&nbsp; There are also 2 simpler versions which consist of plug&amp;play lists of pre-designed FF&amp;S components.&nbsp; The gearheads all rave about FF&amp;S, but I'm not one of them.&nbsp; On the rare occasions when I need to design a ship, High Guard suits me fine.<BR><BR>Space Combat is a sort of watered-down Mayday/High Guard mix which pretty much nobody was satisfied with.<BR><BR>All of the rest of the rules (world creation, animals, encounters, etc.) are pretty much straight out of Classic Traveller.&nbsp; The trade &amp; commerce rules are from Book 7 instead of Book 3.<BR><BR>The format of the T4 rulebook, btw, is a cut&amp;paste job on 'The Traveller Book,' repeating the text of the earlier book verbatim in several sections.<BR><BR>That's the overview.&nbsp; If you want more detail, let me know which specific areas of comparison you're interested in.<BR><BR>Trent<BR>&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 18:40:01 -0000<BR>From: dojones.whitestar@btinternet.com<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrab: Sting (and other things) and KB3@E-groups<BR><BR>Peter Trevor wrote:<BR>&gt;(I think this got buried in the KB3_TaskWar when most people were<BR>&gt;away, so I'm reposting...)<BR><BR>Exactly.....<BR><BR>This is the sort of stuff *I* want to see on the TML. Task wars are so<BR>uninteresting to *me*. I wouldn't mind seeing the summary or the end<BR>product, but dredging through hundreds of messages in the digests just<BR>to get at the interesting Traveller related stuff bores the pants off me.<BR><BR>My opinion, that's all. Don't mean to offend anyone. And I would like to<BR>stay on the TML for the interesting stuff. It's just that whenever this topic<BR>comes up, traffic goes up massively, it's all just opinion, and the real<BR>stuff worth having is gone. I know if Stuart Ferris discussed every idea<BR>he had about H&amp;E on the TML, there'd be uproar. That's why it has a <BR>list on E-groups.<BR><BR>Regards<BR><BR>Derrick<BR><BR>Derrick Jones<BR>St Helens<BR>Lancashire UK<BR>http://www.btinternet.com/~dojones.whitestar<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 20:29:37 GMT<BR>From: "John G. Wood" &lt;elvwood@ntlworld.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrab: Sting (and other things)<BR><BR>Peter Trevor &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; (I think this got buried in the KB3_TaskWar when most people were<BR>&gt; away, so I'm reposting...)<BR><BR>I noted it, but haven't had a chance to look at Sting yet.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; How are all the other landgrabs&nbsp; coming&nbsp; along?<BR><BR>I have been expanding and reorganising Prilissa into multiple pages and <BR>developing an adventure, but haven't got far enough to post the revised <BR>version yet (I'm currently working on other things). I'll let people <BR>here know when the new version goes up (probably quite a bit later in <BR>the year). The original write-up is still at<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/Prilissa.html<BR><BR>John<BR>http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 20:38 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: WFRP [FILK]<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;Pine.GSO.4.10.10101041119350.25625-100000@mercury.cis.yale.edu&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>In the Anne McCaffrey 'Ship who sang' series, there is one - "The Ship Who <BR>Won" - where the brain ship &amp; her brawn spend most of their space-time <BR>playing 'Myths and Legends', which seems to be a virtual-reality D&amp;D game!<BR><BR>I think it's likely that there will be folk who like role-playing, and <BR>they will play all sorts of things just like we do. Swords and sorcery, <BR>historical, super-heroes, contemporary, futuristic... whatever you can <BR>think of, really.<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 12:50:28 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Landgrab: Sting (and other things)<BR><BR>My roomate Tim &amp; I are still working on Patinir.&nbsp; Online play with<BR>Mechwarrior 4 is hindering things at the moment though :D<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; How are all the other landgrabs&nbsp; coming&nbsp; along?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 10:09:38 -0000<BR>From: "Rupert Boleyn" &lt;rboleyn@paradise.net.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR><BR>On 5 Jan 2001, at 0:42, Andrew Moffatt-Vallance wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; On 4 Jan 01, at 14:58, Rupert Boleyn wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; The A6M's firepower was actually quite spectacular when it originally entered<BR>&gt; &gt; service (2 20mm cannon before WWII), however its lack of armour and its<BR>&gt; &gt; inability to carry a heavier armament meant that it became obselete quite<BR>&gt; &gt; quickly.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Yes, but they were probably the worst 20mm ever designed, their effective <BR>&gt; firepower was less than a 50 cal. (another ObTrav: Don't put crappy <BR>&gt; weapons on excellant platforms).<BR><BR>I hadn't heard that. Do you have a source, or more info on them?<BR><BR>- --<BR>"Rupert Boleyn" &lt;rboleyn@paradise.net.nz&gt;<BR><BR>A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3504<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yc02.mx.aol.com (rly-yc02.mail.aol.com [172.18.149.34]) by air-yc05.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 04 Jan 2001 16:10:40 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yc02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 04 Jan 2001 16:09:48 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id QAA69342;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 16:08:56 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 4 Jan 2001 16:08:44 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id QAA69297<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 16:08:44 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 16:08:44 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101042108.QAA69297@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3504<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3505</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/4/01 4:31:55 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 4 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3505<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: Jumpspace<BR>Re: just a quickie<BR>RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR>Sort of OT: Solar systems<BR>Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR>re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR>Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR>Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR>Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>test<BR>RE: Jumpspace<BR>Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>test<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Higher is Better vs. Sweet Spot<BR>RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 10:09:38 -0000<BR>From: "Rupert Boleyn" &lt;rboleyn@paradise.net.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>On 4 Jan 2001, at 8:59, timmon@primenet.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Kenneth - I second Eris. A debate on variant Traveller task systems beats<BR>&gt; the hell out of much of the usual hashed/rehashed/re-rehashed topics that<BR>&gt; have become the norm since you departed the last time.<BR><BR>What's more it is on topic. IIRC this has happened before - an on-topic <BR>'discussion' erupts and there's an move to get it shifted to another list. Why <BR>doesn't this happen for off-topic flame wars?<BR><BR>- --<BR>"Rupert Boleyn" &lt;rboleyn@paradise.net.nz&gt;<BR><BR>A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 15:13:20 -0600 <BR>From: "Smart, David J (David)" &lt;dasmart@avaya.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>While going through the last digest, I ran across<BR>references to MechWarrior Online and "The Ship Who<BR>Won" and that got me wondering. (uh, oh)<BR><BR>How many TML'rs play web-based online games and<BR>which ones? Just curious...<BR><BR>I play Ultima Online, 2nd Age myself.<BR><BR>David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 13:27:04 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: John Fox &lt;jfox@verity.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jumpspace<BR><BR>Peter:<BR>&nbsp; Have you considered the possibility that the jump engine works as a <BR>combination of the two methods.<BR>&nbsp; The jump engine forms a bubble around the ship.&nbsp; This bubble is then drawn <BR>into an extra-deminsional space where the ship moves at a certain rate.&nbsp; When <BR>the energy of this bubble disapates (ie the jump ends) the ship is spit back out <BR>into normal space.&nbsp; The fact that a jump-2 engine move further than a jump-1 one <BR>engine (but takes the same amount of time) means that the ship had a greater <BR>entering veloicty relative to the alternate dimension (governed by the engine <BR>energy output).&nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; Mis-jumps ocurr when a couple things happen (or do not happen).&nbsp; Ex1, ship <BR>uses unrefined fuel.&nbsp; That fly (or some other hydrocarbon material) that got <BR>sucked into the reactor has a different density that liquid H2. This cause a <BR>fuctuation in the field (due to varing energy output) as you were entering the <BR>jump and resulted in a different entering veloicty (than you wanted)&nbsp; to <BR>extra-dimensial space.&nbsp; Ex2, Gavity to strong, ship is pulled to much by gravity <BR>reduces speed or causes a momentary [we are talking very short here] denisty <BR>variation in the flow of H2 to the reactor.&nbsp; If the fuel is denser you get more <BR>velocity (travel further or faster time) or if is less dense you get less <BR>veloicty (travel shorter or longer time).<BR>&nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; Thought for the gearhead to ponder<BR>&nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; John W. Fox<BR>&nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; PS having only read the T4 book I think this makes sense.<BR>&nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>&gt; From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>&gt; To: "'traveller@lists.ient.com'" &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Jumpspace<BR>&gt; Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 17:20:38 -0000 <BR>&gt; MIME-Version: 1.0<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I'm currently looking at the nature of jump (j-drives, jumpspace,<BR>&gt; etc) and I've noticed a small inconsistancy:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 1) Some of the talk about jump drives seems to follow the&nbsp; notion<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; that when jumping a ship punches a whole out of&nbsp; the&nbsp; universe<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; and stays in its own mini pocket universe until the end of its<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; journey.&nbsp; This is supported in part&nbsp; by&nbsp; the&nbsp; hydrogen&nbsp; bubble<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; idea.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 2) Some talk about jumpspace seems to follow the notion&nbsp; that&nbsp; it<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; is&nbsp; a&nbsp; hyperspace&nbsp; ...&nbsp; that&nbsp; is&nbsp; a&nbsp; parallel&nbsp; universe&nbsp; where<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; distances are smaller (or quicker&nbsp; to&nbsp; cross)&nbsp; than&nbsp; our&nbsp; own.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; This is supported by the "crumpled tissue" metaphor.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; So my question for the list is this:&nbsp; IYTU&nbsp; which&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; above<BR>&gt; ideas do you use, does each ship have its&nbsp; own&nbsp; jumpspace&nbsp; or&nbsp; is<BR>&gt; jumpspace a universal hyperspace (or have you another idea)?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; If the second option then is there anything else in jumpspace and<BR>&gt; can ships get stuck there permanently?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Regards PLST<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 15:38:07 -0600<BR>From: Leslie Bates &lt;lesbates@minn.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: just a quickie<BR><BR>At 08:06 PM 1/4/01 -0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;hi there<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I would like to ask a little question.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Can I subscribe to the traveller-digest mailing list at the same time as<BR>&gt;being subscribed to the traveller mailing list?<BR><BR>Yes.<BR><BR>I am already.<BR><BR><BR>Les<BR><BR>====================================<BR>Revolutionaries are not nice people.<BR>==================================== <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 16:41:20 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>At 3:18 PM -0800 1/3/01, William Lane wrote:<BR>&gt;good question what relevance does Seattle have?<BR><BR>Well, within the immediate vicinity:<BR><BR>Home of Microsoft;<BR>Home of Boeing;<BR>Home of Amazon.com;<BR>Home of Weyerhauser;<BR>Home of the largest Muzak programming and broadcasting company in the world;<BR>Home of a buncha Trident subs;<BR>World's largest giant octopodes;<BR>World's largest concentration of breeding-age millionaires;<BR>Abodes of Frank Herbert, Tom Robbins, and various other literary luminaries;<BR>A neighborhood of elderly Norwegian fishermen that also in 1992 had <BR>the highest per-capita consumption of black tar heroin in the States;<BR>World's largest toaster museum;<BR>Home of an annual international Spam-sculpting competition;<BR><BR>Slightly further away, we have the Hanford reservation -- largest and <BR>most toxic nuclear/chemical waste facility on the planet, and (IIRC), <BR>still the largest producer of plutonium and assorted goodies. <BR>(Tourists sometimes get the Hanford nuclear reservation confused with <BR>the nearby/overlapping Yakama Indian reservation... coincidence? I <BR>think not.)<BR><BR><BR>I, for one, think teaching them to use chunks of pig to beat each <BR>other to death would be a step in the right direction.<BR><BR>Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 13:45:55 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>I play<BR><BR>Everquest and Asherons Call. Mostly Everquest.<BR><BR>Use to play Air Warrior. was a lot of fun but got old after a while. Also<BR>played jane's isreali air force online for a bit. thought about joining a<BR>squadron but never did.<BR><BR>hasta<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Smart, David J (David) [mailto:dasmart@avaya.com]<BR>Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001 1:13 PM<BR>To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>Subject: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR><BR>While going through the last digest, I ran across<BR>references to MechWarrior Online and "The Ship Who<BR>Won" and that got me wondering. (uh, oh)<BR><BR>How many TML'rs play web-based online games and<BR>which ones? Just curious...<BR><BR>I play Ultima Online, 2nd Age myself.<BR><BR>David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 08:47:18 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>Gerry Crowe wrote:<BR>[...T4-like system...]<BR>&gt; My main change was to add another use to the skills - *once* per<BR>&gt; task roll, you may reroll one die per point of skill. If you have no<BR>&gt; skill, you *must* reroll your lowest die.<BR><BR>Ow!&nbsp; I was looking forward to calculating the probabilities for your<BR>system.&nbsp; The very wide range of player-choice here makes it very<BR>difficult to do so.&nbsp; Obviously you'd always want to reroll 6s and<BR>never reroll 1s, but the rest would depend on the target number and<BR>what you've already got.<BR><BR>This is an interesting system to analyse :^)<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 14:00:05 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Bernie McGeehan &lt;einreb62@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Sort of OT: Solar systems<BR><BR>- --0-1189641421-978645605=:8743<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii<BR><BR>I got this link in my mail today...seems we'll be finding a lot more Sol-like systems as we venture out into the galaxy...would this force the stellar generation systems to be re-written?http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/astronomy/gas_giants_000104.htmlAlso there is a link to an article about the searth for Earth-like worlds.<BR><BR>"I don't know much about what I like, but I do know Art."&nbsp; &nbsp; me @ the Rijksmuseum, Amsterdam (Terra/Sol 3)http://prattfall.tripod.com/index.html<BR><BR><BR>- ---------------------------------<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Photos - Share your holiday photos online!<BR>- --0-1189641421-978645605=:8743<BR>Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii<BR><BR>I got this link in my mail today...seems we'll be finding a lot more Sol-like systems as we venture out into the galaxy...would this force the stellar generation systems to be re-written?<BR><BR><A href="http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/astronomy/gas_giants_000104.html" title=http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/astronomy/gas_giants_000104.html>http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/astronomy/gas_giants_000104.html</A><BR><BR>Also there is a link to an article about the searth for Earth-like worlds.<BR><BR>"I don't know much about what I like, but I do know Art."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; me @ the Rijksmuseum, Amsterdam (Terra/Sol 3)<BR><A href="http://prattfall.tripod.com/index.html" title=http://prattfall.tripod.com/index.html>http://prattfall.tripod.com/index.html</A>
<P><BR>&lt;hr size=1&gt;<B>Do You Yahoo!?</B><BR><BR><A href="http://photos.yahoo.com/" title=http://photos.yahoo.com/>Yahoo! Photos</A> - <BR>Share your holiday photos online!<BR>- --0-1189641421-978645605=:8743--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 09:04:59 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>Gerry Crowe wrote:<BR>&gt; Stat12, Skill 6, Impossible<BR>&gt; Roll 6D6, reroll up to all of them, total must be &lt;= 18 to succeed.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This may seem too easy for an 'Impossible' roll, but then these are<BR>&gt; God-stats - and the odds are definitely lower than T4!<BR><BR>That doesn't sound right.&nbsp; I thought T4 was almost the same, just<BR>without the option of a reroll?&nbsp; If so, then the probability of<BR>success is definitely higher than T4.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 21:44:47 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR><BR>At 10:45 -0500 4/1/01,&nbsp; "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; WHO LET THE VARGR OUT?&nbsp; *woof! woof! woof!*<BR>&gt; &gt;&lt;SPLORT&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Damn, that was a waste of Stella Artois.<BR>&gt; &gt;Chalk a kill, please.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Dom, wait a day or two before you relax..<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;... I'm writing it.<BR><BR>ohmigawd.<BR><BR><BR>Hmm. "How much is that Vargr in the air/raft?"<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 21:56:15 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>At 10:45 -0500 4/1/01,&nbsp; eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote:<BR>&gt;On 01/03/01 at 10:53 PM,&nbsp; Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions <BR>&gt;&lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt; said:<BR>&gt; &gt;Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>&gt; &gt;Hey, if you guys don't want to hear about my task system--no sweat.<BR>&gt; &gt;I'll pack up my dice and keep it to myself.<BR>&gt;Ken, Dom might want you to leave, but I want you to stay. We might <BR>&gt;cancel each other out, but tie goes to the poster. &lt;g&gt;<BR>&gt;Keep posting!<BR><BR>&lt;grin&gt;<BR><BR>Just couldn't resist it when eGroups was so easy to do this with and <BR>I'd spent 3-4 hours trawling through the digests from the Christmas <BR>period. No offence intended.<BR><BR>However, the list volume did go mad and everything else got swamped. <BR>I was having flashbacks to 96/97. I recall that there were complaints <BR>when those of us who like HG2 were kicking design ideas around at <BR>high volume a couple of years back - as a result, Don McK started the <BR>ct-starships list to cover the discussion. Likewise the ISBA lists.<BR><BR>So Ken, please feel free to post your task stuff, but don't be <BR>surprised if some of us gripe a little. Overall, what I've read of <BR>the debate has been interesting (and I have posted on it myself), but <BR>reading all the Digests from 22/12/00 really swamped me with it.<BR><BR>Have fun...<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 17:20:47 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Gerry Crowe wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Stat12, Skill 6, Impossible<BR>&gt;&gt; Roll 6D6, reroll up to all of them, total must be&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&gt; This may seem too easy for an 'Impossible' roll, but then these are<BR>&gt;&gt; God-stats - and the odds are definitely lower than T4!<BR><BR>&gt;That doesn't sound right.&nbsp; I thought T4 was almost the same, just<BR>&gt;without the option of a reroll?&nbsp; If so, then the probability of<BR>&gt;success is definitely higher than T4.<BR><BR>He's probably refering to T4 as published, where Staggering tasks were 3.5D and Impossible was 4D.&nbsp; However, it became obvious real quick that these weren't nearly difficult enough (especially considering the high skill-level of T4 characters) which started the initial flurry of Task System fixes in mid-late '96.&nbsp; I believe it was the illustrious Kenneth Bearden who came up with the revised difficulty chart that became Official when it was included in the T4 Ref Screen in Spring '97 (and which I posted a couple days ago re: proposed changes for T5).<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 22:22:15 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Gerry=20Crowe?= &lt;telfordtown@yahoo.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>Apologies to everyone on digest for my previous<BR>post...I'd forgotten how much majordomo digest *hates*<BR>MIME format! <BR><BR>Also wanted to add that example 4 is wrong in case I<BR>confused anyone - it should have read<BR><BR>Stat 10, Skill 1, Difficult <BR>Roll 3D6, reroll 1 if desired, total must be &lt;= 11 to<BR>succeed. <BR><BR>Stat 6 Skill 4 is still generally better than this,<BR>but not by a huge margin.<BR><BR>Finally, everything else such as uncertain rolls,<BR>spectacular success and failure etc, works as printed<BR>in the rulebook. Checks for the spectacular success<BR>and failure are made *after* the rerolls.<BR><BR>Have fun<BR><BR>=====<BR>- ------------------------------------------------<BR>Gerry Crowe<BR>Doomtown Sheriff &amp; Keeper of the FAQ lurking at<BR>http://www.ghostrock.fsnet.co.uk<BR><BR>"This is my town...if you live to see the dawn, it is because I allow it..."<BR><BR>____________________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk<BR>or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 14:43:05 -0800<BR>From: "Acting President Thing" &lt;thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR><BR>It's baaaack.<BR><BR>http://www.king5.com/detailtopstory.html?StoryID=11573<BR><BR>On an Island in Greenlake this time.<BR><BR>G.D.D.<BR>Thing under the stairs,<BR>Minion of Shechemist &amp; GothBunny,<BR>Grand Master of the Electron Flow.<BR>===========================<BR>"I would have succeeded if it weren't for those pesky God n' Jesus<BR>fellas!" -Eddie Izzard, "Dress to Kill"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 22:46:47 -0000<BR>From: "michael.scanlon" &lt;michael.scanlon@bmthonline.net&gt;<BR>Subject: test<BR><BR>Mike.<BR><BR>Michael.Scanlon@Bmthonline.net<BR>ICQ#27333894<BR><BR>"Nothing that God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in Heaven for...."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 18:06:58 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Jumpspace<BR><BR>Peter Trevor writes:<BR>&gt;I'm currently looking at the nature of jump (j-drives, jumpspace,<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;So my question for the list is this:&nbsp; IYTU&nbsp; which&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; above<BR>&gt;ideas do you use, does each ship have its&nbsp; own&nbsp; jumpspace&nbsp; or&nbsp; is<BR>&gt;jumpspace a universal hyperspace (or have you another idea)?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; IMTU a jump drive pushes the ship perpendicular to the 3<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; dimensions of 'normal' space.&nbsp; All the 'thrust' occurs at the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; time of jump (taking about 10 minutes while 'normal' space is<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; bent) after which the ship coasts through "jumpspace".<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Most of the hydrogen is used as reaction mass and<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; essentially jumps in the opposite direction, coming out of<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; "jumpspace" dispersed over 0-6 parsecs in about one week.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Attempting to maneuver in "jumpspace" will at least reduce<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; the accuracy of the jump, at most produce a missjump (I<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; use a roll involving Pilot and Navigation levels to determine<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; how close to the planned destination the ship arrives).&nbsp; As<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; far as current (TL 15) understanding allows, everything in<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; "jumpspace" will eventually 'drop' into 'normal' space.&nbsp; Thus,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; someone who leaps from a starship in "jumpspace" will<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; drop into 'normal' space eventually, but probably will<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; effectively missjump and arrive far from the ship.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; "Jumpspace" is just like 'normal' space in terms of the laws<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; of physics and such, so there is no need to protect the ship<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; or crew from anything unusual.&nbsp; There is no jump grid and<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; the jump drive does not operate except at the initiation of<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; jump.&nbsp; Jumping is kind of like throwing a ball in the air on<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Terra: it eventually returns on its own (but the jump always<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; takes the same period, moving faster for longer jumps, and<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; the ship does not bounce when it returns).<BR><BR>&gt;If the second option then is there anything else in jumpspace and<BR>&gt;can ships get stuck there permanently?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I have never explored the possibility of anything staying in<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; "jumpspace", but generally I would say not IMTU.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 18:07:13 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>At 2:43 PM -0800 1/4/01, Acting President Thing wrote:<BR>&gt;It's baaaack.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;http://www.king5.com/detailtopstory.html?StoryID=11573<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;On an Island in Greenlake this time.<BR><BR>I'm starting to think this is just a contract job by the Seattle <BR>Times/PI management to make their scab labor look exotic and <BR>competent.<BR><BR><BR>Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 23:40:18 -0000<BR>From: "michael.scanlon" &lt;michael.scanlon@bmthonline.net&gt;<BR>Subject: test<BR><BR>Mike.<BR><BR>Michael.Scanlon@Bmthonline.net<BR>ICQ#27333894<BR><BR>"Nothing that God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in Heaven for...."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 17:50:54 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>One day you will be able to play Traveller Online.<BR>My current job is to make that happen.&nbsp; :-&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;/shameless plug&gt;<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR><BR>"Smart, David J (David)" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; While going through the last digest, I ran across<BR>&gt; references to MechWarrior Online and "The Ship Who<BR>&gt; Won" and that got me wondering. (uh, oh)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; How many TML'rs play web-based online games and<BR>&gt; which ones? Just curious...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I play Ultima Online, 2nd Age myself.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 15:57:40 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>Would love to play traveller online if it really was traveller on line and<BR>not Evercamp like EQ is. <BR><BR>Hasta<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Steve (Bloo) Daniels [mailto:sdaniels@playnet.com]<BR>Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001 3:51 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR><BR>One day you will be able to play Traveller Online.<BR>My current job is to make that happen.&nbsp; :-&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;/shameless plug&gt;<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR><BR>"Smart, David J (David)" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; While going through the last digest, I ran across<BR>&gt; references to MechWarrior Online and "The Ship Who<BR>&gt; Won" and that got me wondering. (uh, oh)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; How many TML'rs play web-based online games and<BR>&gt; which ones? Just curious...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I play Ultima Online, 2nd Age myself.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 18:13:13 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>Then you will be happy.<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Would love to play traveller online if it really was traveller on line and<BR>&gt; not Evercamp like EQ is.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hasta<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Steve (Bloo) Daniels [mailto:sdaniels@playnet.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001 3:51 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; One day you will be able to play Traveller Online.<BR>&gt; My current job is to make that happen.&nbsp; :-&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;/shameless plug&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 18:18:57 -0600<BR>From: "James Jensen" &lt;cheeb0@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Higher is Better vs. Sweet Spot<BR><BR>Having only today begun to recover from the flu, I have taken time to learn <BR>the essentials of 3rd Edition D&amp;D. As I was reading in the DMG, where it <BR>sets forth the margin of success for skill rolls, which has a roll of DC+20 <BR>equal a perfect success, I started to think about Ken's analogy of a sweet <BR>spot system. And then it hit me.<BR><BR>Ken, you say that a higher is better system is unrealistic because of the <BR>"blow-through" effect that makes it so that extra energy is wasted. But, as <BR>with MT, you're looking at this the wrong way. You're assuming that a roll <BR>of DC+20 is just wasting energy. But the way I see it, DC+20 or higher is <BR>the sweet spot, and when you roll higher, you're exerting more control and <BR>precision. And this is accomplished more easily when you have a higher <BR>skill.<BR><BR>- -J. Jensen<BR>Administrator of the Milieu: 0 Aid Society<BR>http://members.nbci.com/cheebzero/trav_index.htm<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 16:18:59 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>You need a programmer who can code java and some c&nbsp; and c++? 8P<BR><BR>Always wanted to get into that market 8P<BR><BR>Hasta<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Steve (Bloo) Daniels [mailto:sdaniels@playnet.com]<BR>Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001 4:13 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR><BR>Then you will be happy.<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Would love to play traveller online if it really was traveller on line and<BR>&gt; not Evercamp like EQ is.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hasta<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Steve (Bloo) Daniels [mailto:sdaniels@playnet.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001 3:51 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; One day you will be able to play Traveller Online.<BR>&gt; My current job is to make that happen.&nbsp; :-&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;/shameless plug&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 18:29:04 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>http://www.corneredrat.com/jobs.html<BR><BR>I don't know when it was last updated though.&nbsp; It<BR>might be old.&nbsp; Never hurts to have the resume on<BR>file though.<BR><BR>Tell 'em Bloo sent ya.&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>P.S.&nbsp; Yes, that posting for a Mac programmer<BR>means cross platform.&nbsp; We don't make single<BR>platform games.<BR><BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; You need a programmer who can code java and some c&nbsp; and c++? 8P<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Always wanted to get into that market 8P<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hasta<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Steve (Bloo) Daniels [mailto:sdaniels@playnet.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001 4:13 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Then you will be happy.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; bloo<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; William Lane wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Would love to play traveller online if it really was traveller on line and<BR>&gt; &gt; not Evercamp like EQ is.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Hasta<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; &gt; From: Steve (Bloo) Daniels [mailto:sdaniels@playnet.com]<BR>&gt; &gt; Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001 3:51 PM<BR>&gt; &gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; One day you will be able to play Traveller Online.<BR>&gt; &gt; My current job is to make that happen.&nbsp; :-&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &lt;/shameless plug&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3505<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yh02.mx.aol.com (rly-yh02.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.34]) by air-yh01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 04 Jan 2001 19:31:55 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yh02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 04 Jan 2001 19:31:14 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id TAA77345;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 19:30:34 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 4 Jan 2001 19:28:35 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id TAA77262<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 19:28:34 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 19:28:34 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101050028.TAA77262@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3505<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3506</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/5/01 6:10:19 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 5 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3506<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR>Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>re: Jumpspace<BR>Syleans<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: Jump emergence<BR>Re: Back again<BR>re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR>Re: Jump emergence<BR>Re: Higher is Better vs. Sweet Spot<BR>RE: Trepida<BR>Re: just a quickie<BR>Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>RE: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR>RE: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR>RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Could someone do me a favour, please?<BR>Re: Star Worn? Comments<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>Re: Jumpspace<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 19:56:56 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR><BR>On Thu, 4 Jan 2001 19:28:34 -0500 (EST), Dominic Mooney<BR>&lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;At 10:45 -0500 4/1/01,&nbsp; "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; WHO LET THE VARGR OUT?&nbsp; *woof! woof! woof!*<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&lt;SPLORT&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;Damn, that was a waste of Stella Artois.<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;Chalk a kill, please.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Dom, wait a day or two before you relax..<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;... I'm writing it.<BR><BR>&gt;ohmigawd.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;Hmm. "How much is that Vargr in the air/raft?"<BR><BR>/me looks askance at Dom<BR><BR>"Vargr slavery doesn't even happen in Gashikan any more.&nbsp; What makes you<BR>think you can _buy_ him?"<BR><BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(Ask me via email about the ILink message network!)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 19:59:17 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR><BR>On Thu, 4 Jan 2001 19:28:34 -0500 (EST), "Acting President Thing"<BR>&lt;thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;It's baaaack.<BR><BR>&gt;http://www.king5.com/detailtopstory.html?StoryID=11573<BR><BR>&gt;On an Island in Greenlake this time.<BR><BR>/me visualizes climbing to the top of it, finding out that it's hollow, and<BR>someone packed the interior with little gold and silver stickers from the<BR>local teachers' supply store...<BR><BR>"My G-d, it's full of stars!"<BR><BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(Ask me via email about the ILink message network!)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 17:36:46 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Jumpspace<BR><BR>&gt;From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;I'm currently looking at the nature of jump (j-drives, jumpspace,<BR>&gt;etc) and I've noticed a small inconsistancy:<BR><BR>That would be understatement of the millenium (so far).<BR><BR>&gt;So my question for the list is this:&nbsp; IYTU&nbsp; which&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; above<BR>&gt;ideas do you use, does each ship have its&nbsp; own&nbsp; jumpspace&nbsp; or&nbsp; is<BR>&gt;jumpspace a universal hyperspace (or have you another idea)?<BR><BR>This would be good subject for the JTAS poll, I suppose.<BR><BR>In my Traveller universe, jump space is a different aspect of the universe<BR>where our familiar physical laws don't apply.&nbsp; To survive a passage in jump<BR>space, you bring a piece of normal space with you, and travel in a jump<BR>bubble (generated by the lanthanum grid in the hull).&nbsp; We don't really know<BR>what jump space is.&nbsp; We do know that if we run a certain current through the<BR>zuchai crystals in the jump drive, and if we align the crystals in a certain<BR>way with respect to local gravitational fields and gravitational fields in<BR>the normal space path that we want to take, we will rip a hole in normal<BR>space through which our ship will automatically tumble and emerge a fairly<BR>short time later a long way away.&nbsp; Whenever physicists try to explain what<BR>actually happens, they start talking in circles.&nbsp; I suspect it's a<BR>conspiracy on their part to cover up the fact that they really don't<BR>understand it, and that everyone has just reverse engineered some ancient or<BR>Ancient device that we can make work as users, but can't truly understand<BR>until we reach some new plane of comprehension of the universe.<BR><BR>That's how I see it, anyway.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 19:43:32 -0600<BR>From: Charles R Hensley &lt;hensley.cr@gte.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Syleans<BR><BR>Has anyone worked on background for the Syleans.&nbsp; According to Milieu 0,<BR>they are a minor human race. Has anyone worked up special social<BR>features, native language (do they still have one or has it been<BR>replaced??), etc.<BR><BR><BR>Charles H<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 21:09:20 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>&gt;I play Ultima Online, 2nd Age myself.<BR><BR>I used to play Ultima Online quite a lot, to the point that I wrote a <BR>freebie manual for it (still floating around the net) that Origin partially <BR>borrowed for the 2nd Age. Got a few free months out of that.<BR><BR>Eventually I switched to Asheron's Call and played that heavily for a year. <BR>I'm finding the same problem there as I did in UO, however: there are way <BR>too many knuckleheads playing massive multi-player games and it's impossible <BR>to avoid them.<BR><BR>ObTrav: even in the 56th century, the Third Imperium's massive multi-player <BR>games will not have found a solution for thirteen year old suburban white <BR>males who want to name their avatars "Captain Testicles".<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 00:20:25 -0500<BR>From: Thom Jones-Low &lt;tjoneslo@together.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jump emergence<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 12:15:06 +1100<BR>&gt; From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Jump emergence<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Thom Jones-Low wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Like how small a planetoid you can safely jump to. Given Marc<BR>&gt; &gt; Millers Jumpspace article variance of 3000 km in the emergence of a<BR>&gt; &gt; jump 1 drive.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Where was this?&nbsp; I thought the variation was more on the order of a<BR>&gt; couple of hundred thousand km according to Marc?<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; JumpSpace article from JTAS24 and recently reprinted in the online JTAS<BR>http://jtas.sjgames.com . <BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; "...jump drive is accurate to less than one part per ten billion. Over<BR>a jump distance of one parsec, the arriavel point of a ship can be<BR>predicted to within perhaps 3,000 kilometers (on larger jumps, the<BR>potential error is proportional larger)."<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; This article is considered the hard science canon for the jump drive<BR>physics and engineering.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thomas Jones-Low<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; tjoneslo@together.net<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 18:17:34<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Back again<BR><BR>At 11:40 AM 1/4/2001 +0100, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;On the other hand, maybe..., Adam Weishaupt WAS forced to flee from the <BR>&gt;south to places unknown after the Bavarian Illuminati were outlawed. Maybe <BR>&gt;he didnt go to the US and replace G. Washington after all.<BR><BR>That was his clone.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 18:20:29<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR><BR>At 09:44 PM 1/4/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Hmm. "How much is that Vargr in the air/raft?"<BR><BR>How mad is that Vargr in the air/raft?<BR>The one with the big ACR?<BR>'Cause if that Vargr tries to fire back<BR>I'll fusion-gun him 'til he's charred.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&nbsp; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>"But that's not the point!" raged Ford. "The point is that I am now a<BR>perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of<BR>limbs!"&nbsp; - The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 19:07:10 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jump emergence<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; JumpSpace article from JTAS24 and recently reprinted in the online JTAS<BR>&gt;http://jtas.sjgames.com .<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;[snip]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; This article is considered the hard science canon for the jump drive<BR>&gt;physics and engineering.<BR><BR>We're all in serious trouble, then 8^) The hardness and science <BR>aren't consistent. It /is/ the bravest attempt in canon.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 21:26:08 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Higher is Better vs. Sweet Spot<BR><BR>James Jensen wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Ken, you say that a higher is better system is unrealistic because of the<BR>&gt; "blow-through" effect that makes it so that extra energy is wasted.<BR><BR>I never said it was better. I like higher-is-better systems.&nbsp; There's nothing<BR>wrong with them.<BR><BR>I was just explaining the logic of a sweet spot system.<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 21:46:00 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: RE: Trepida<BR><BR>On 01/04/01 at 02:01 PM,&nbsp; Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt; said:<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Real world names are sometimes very dumb.&nbsp; How about<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; "Trojan" brand condoms?&nbsp; Think about it.&nbsp; Anyhow, as some<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; post pointed out, "Trepida" may refer to the feeling meant<BR>&gt;to<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; be inspired in the enemy.<BR><BR>The factory is in Troy, so what else would you call them? &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 22:25:30 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: just a quickie<BR><BR>On 01/04/01 at 08:06 PM,&nbsp; "michael.scanlon" &lt;michael.scanlon@Bmthonline.net&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;hi there<BR><BR>&gt;I would like to ask a little question.<BR><BR>&gt;Can I subscribe to the traveller-digest mailing list at the same<BR>&gt;time as being subscribed to the traveller mailing list?<BR><BR>yes you can<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 17:12:19 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>trentfs@ix.netcom.com wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; He's probably refering to T4 as published, where Staggering tasks<BR>&gt; were 3.5D and Impossible was 4D.<BR><BR>OK.&nbsp; Then stat-C skill-6 has a 90% chance of success in original T4.<BR><BR>It probably has somewhere above 80% chance with Gerry's modification<BR>(i.e. roll 18 or less on 6d6, rerolling any chosen subset of dice<BR>once).&nbsp; The exact chance depends upon how the player chooses to reroll<BR>dice, but a very simple method (reroll 4's and above) gives a 78%<BR>chance of success.&nbsp; No doubt a more sophisticated reroll criterion<BR>based on the exact target number and details of the other dice would<BR>give a higher chance of success.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 17:26:47 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>Steve (Bloo) Daniels wrote:<BR>&gt; P.S.&nbsp; Yes, that posting for a Mac programmer means cross platform.<BR>&gt; We don't make single platform games.<BR><BR>I couldn't tell from the Web site -- will the MMORPG stuff be<BR>available for Linux?<BR><BR>Need any Linux coders? ;^)<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 20:05:30 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>Rupert Boleyn wrote :<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What's more it is on topic. IIRC this has happened before - <BR>&gt; an on-topic 'discussion' erupts and there's an move to get <BR>&gt; it shifted to another list. <BR>&gt; Why doesn't this happen for off-topic flame wars?<BR><BR>That's because the TML is _for_ off-topic flame wars !<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 20:25:01 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>Paul Drye wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; ObTrav: even in the 56th century, the Third Imperium's<BR>&gt; massive multi-player games will not have found a<BR>&gt; solution for thirteen year old suburban white<BR>&gt; males who want to name their avatars "Captain Testicles".<BR><BR>Actually, we already have a solution to this.<BR><BR>Massive multi-player games that are by invitation only, with an active<BR>"God".<BR>Think of trying to get into an exclusive club.<BR><BR>I use this solution all time in LARP and tabletop games, and now there are<BR>free-ware UO severs, when I get a full-time connection, I may set up one of<BR>those as well.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 21:05:05 +1300<BR>From: "Rupert Boleyn" &lt;rboleyn@paradise.net.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Reply now to join the Traveller_KB3_TaskWar group<BR><BR>On 5 Jan 2001, at 20:05, Frank G. Pitt wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Rupert Boleyn wrote :<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; What's more it is on topic. IIRC this has happened before - <BR>&gt; &gt; an on-topic 'discussion' erupts and there's an move to get <BR>&gt; &gt; it shifted to another list. <BR>&gt; &gt; Why doesn't this happen for off-topic flame wars?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; That's because the TML is _for_ off-topic flame wars !<BR><BR>But that would make them on-topic.<BR><BR>- --<BR>"Rupert Boleyn" &lt;rboleyn@paradise.net.nz&gt;<BR><BR>A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 00:06:27 -0800<BR>From: "Kiri Aradia Morgan" &lt;tiamat@tsoft.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>From: Frank G. Pitt &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Date: Thursday, January 04, 2001 11:15 PM<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR><BR>&gt;Paul Drye wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; ObTrav: even in the 56th century, the Third Imperium's<BR>&gt;&gt; massive multi-player games will not have found a<BR>&gt;&gt; solution for thirteen year old suburban white<BR>&gt;&gt; males who want to name their avatars "Captain Testicles".<BR><BR><BR>When I was 19 and running games, I found this stupid, but I could deal with<BR>it.&nbsp; I'd have all the NPCs laugh at the guy, and if he kept beating up NPC's<BR>I'd make sure there were a few who could kick his ass.&nbsp; But I don't have<BR>that kind of patience any more.<BR><BR>&gt;Actually, we already have a solution to this.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Massive multi-player games that are by invitation only, with an<BR>&gt;active "God". Think of trying to get into an exclusive club.<BR><BR><BR>Yeah...&nbsp; except at conventions, I just won't play with people that I don't<BR>know.&nbsp; There is too much harassment and idiocy visited on female<BR>players/characters by gamers who are stoopid.&nbsp; I don't differentiate between<BR>knowing people online or in RL, but I do have to have some idea of your<BR>character before I will play with you.&nbsp; It's just one of those things.&nbsp; I've<BR>been in too many games with people who were in love with "pregnancy tables"<BR>and/or rape scenarios.&nbsp; (One of the worst offenders in a game I ran was<BR>another WOMAN... she played male characters who were rapists.)<BR><BR>Kiri&nbsp; ^_^<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 00:24:24 -0800<BR>From: "Pronto" &lt;pronto_r031@telus.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>&gt; One day you will be able to play Traveller Online.<BR>&gt; My current job is to make that happen.&nbsp; :-&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;/shameless plug&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; bloo<BR>&gt; <BR>Well, hurry up!&nbsp; :)<BR><BR><BR><BR>Pronto<BR>Next year, at Burning Man!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 20:58:54 +1100<BR>From: Robert Houghton &lt;rhoughto@one.net.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>Kiri Aradia Morgan wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Yeah...&nbsp; except at conventions, I just won't play with people that I don't<BR>&gt; know.&nbsp; There is too much harassment and idiocy visited on female<BR>&gt; players/characters by gamers who are stoopid.&nbsp; I don't differentiate between<BR>&gt; knowing people online or in RL, but I do have to have some idea of your<BR>&gt; character before I will play with you.&nbsp; It's just one of those things.&nbsp; I've<BR>&gt; been in too many games with people who were in love with "pregnancy tables"<BR>&gt; and/or rape scenarios.&nbsp; (One of the worst offenders in a game I ran was<BR>&gt; another WOMAN... she played male characters who were rapists.)<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>That's a worry...<BR><BR>Other Rob<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 10:26:18 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: =?iso-8859-1?q?Gerry=20Crowe?= &lt;telfordtown@yahoo.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;That doesn't sound right.&nbsp; I thought T4 was almost<BR>the same, just<BR>&gt;&gt;without the option of a reroll?&nbsp; If so, then the<BR>probability of<BR>&gt;&gt;success is definitely higher than T4.<BR><BR>&gt;He's probably refering to T4 as published, where<BR>Staggering tasks were <BR>&gt;3.5D and Impossible was 4D.&nbsp; However, it became<BR>obvious real quick that <BR>&gt;these weren't nearly difficult enough (especially<BR>considering the high <BR>&gt;skill-level of T4 characters) which started the<BR>initial flurry of Task <BR>&gt;System fixes in mid-late '96.&nbsp; I believe it was the<BR>illustrious Kenneth <BR>&gt;Bearden who came up with the revised difficulty chart<BR>that became <BR>&gt;Official when it was included in the T4 Ref Screen in<BR>Spring '97 (and which <BR>&gt;I posted a couple days ago re: proposed changes for<BR>T5).<BR><BR>Hmm, yes, you're right - I was referring to the system<BR>in the rulebook (like I said, I've been out of the<BR>loop for a while). Apologies for that.<BR><BR>Reading back through the recent digests, the IHTIT<BR>system is excellent! I think I'll try combining the<BR>IHTIT rule with my rerolls, but that might push the<BR>emphasis too far onto skills - we'll see.<BR><BR>=====<BR>- ------------------------------------------------<BR>Gerry Crowe<BR>Doomtown Sheriff &amp; Keeper of the FAQ lurking at<BR>http://www.ghostrock.fsnet.co.uk<BR><BR>"This is my town...if you live to see the dawn, it is because I allow it..."<BR><BR>____________________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk<BR>or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 10:27:50 -0000 <BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Pronto [mailto:pronto_r031@telus.net]<BR>&gt; Sent: 05 January 2001 08:24<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; One day you will be able to play Traveller Online.<BR>&gt; &gt; My current job is to make that happen.&nbsp; :-&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; &lt;/shameless plug&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>How's it going, bloo?<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 21:46:01 +1100<BR>From: "Robert O'Connor" &lt;robocon@ozemail.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Could someone do me a favour, please?<BR><BR>I'd like to get some PDFs off the WOTC online store.<BR>Unfortunately, only U.S. residents can download stuff (?copyright?).<BR><BR>Could one of our U.S. based list members please contact me off-list if<BR>able to help?<BR><BR>Ob Trav : Inter-jurisdiction trade.<BR><BR>Robert O'Connor<BR>Medico, Gamer<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 11:48:09 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Star Worn? Comments<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR>&gt; Just a Quickie - has anyone (beyond Megan) downloaded 'Star Worn',<BR><BR>Yes. YES!<BR><BR>&gt; and are there any comments? I like having comments (good or bad) to<BR>&gt; pass back to Andy because it encourages him to do things like this<BR>&gt; again...<BR><BR>Here we go...<BR><BR>Absolutely, 100% crazy (in the good sense of the word). I have to run<BR>this with (inflict it on?) a bunch of players here as soon as the exams<BR>are finished. Should be a blast.<BR><BR>Basically, this adventure is GREAT for anyone with a background in Star<BR>Wars and computers (like most of my friends). I especially like the way<BR>that the basic SW story is mirrored and twisted.<BR><BR>I WANT MORE !<BR><BR>;-)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 11:04 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;000c01c076ee$67dcee00$3ecc90c6@Ptiamat&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>Interesting point, Kiri - for me one of the greatest pleasures of <BR>conventions is getting to role-play with new people not the mob I meet <BR>every week!<BR><BR>But then in over 23 years of role-playing I've never had any problems with <BR>silly little boys :-)<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 11:24:43 -0000 <BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Loren wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; I was originally called the Trepida in MT Rebellion Sourcebook<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &amp; 101 Vehicles.&nbsp; Don't know why it changed in GT:GF....<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Because my Latin dictionary says _Trepida_ means "to hurry with<BR>&gt; &gt; alarm or cowardice" and I thought that was a dumb name for a tank. <BR>&gt; Peter wrote:<BR>&gt; Yeah but the 3I seems to have a thing about&nbsp; "dumb"&nbsp; names.&nbsp; Just<BR>&gt; look at the names of some of the AHL cruisers, or&nbsp; the&nbsp; names&nbsp; of<BR>&gt; some of the planets in the Spinward&nbsp; Marches.&nbsp; Evidently&nbsp; the&nbsp; 3I<BR>&gt; has a cultural quirk that says names&nbsp; have&nbsp; to&nbsp; be&nbsp; "dumb".&nbsp; Thus<BR>&gt; calling a tank "Trepida" probably isn't dumb enough.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>There are Sci-Fi societies with dumber naming conventions...look at Bank's<BR>Culture novels<BR><BR>(BTW, the new one, Look to Windward, contains a rather amusing sequence<BR>where to characters are listing the names of GCUs)<BR><BR>OB-TRAV: A minor species that uses similar names? How about their own ship<BR>designations? eg the Vicious Bastard class Cruiser _Not in the Face_ :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 11:59:12 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>Dean Jones wrote:<BR>&gt; OB-TRAV: A minor species that uses similar names? How about<BR>&gt; their own ship designations? eg the Vicious Bastard class<BR>&gt; Cruiser _Not in the Face_ :)<BR><BR>Ooo!&nbsp; That's so tempting ... must resist, must - ... &lt;swipe&gt; Okay<BR>that's going in my next session.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 12:04:06 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR><BR>Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>.........1.........2.........3.........4.........5.........6.....<BR>&gt; /me visualizes climbing to the top of it, finding out that it's<BR>&gt; hollow, and someone packed the interior with little gold and silver<BR>&gt; stickers from the local teachers' supply store...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; "My G-d, it's full of stars!"<BR><BR>ROFLOL<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 05:06:42 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Jumpspace<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; I'm currently looking at the nature of jump (j-drives, jumpspace,<BR>&gt;&gt; etc) and I've noticed a small inconsistancy:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; 1) Some of the talk about jump drives seems to follow the&nbsp; notion<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; that when jumping a ship punches a whole out of&nbsp; the&nbsp; universe<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; and stays in its own mini pocket universe until the end of its<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; journey.&nbsp; This is supported in part&nbsp; by&nbsp; the&nbsp; hydrogen&nbsp; bubble<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; idea.<BR><BR>Not really. If it was a "pocket univers" the "bubble" wouldn't *have*<BR>an edge. Instead, if you went in a straight line away from the ship, at<BR>some ppoint you'd find yourself approaching it again (and yes, if you<BR>looked back over your shoulder, it'd still be there too). <BR><BR>Think of an amoeba slithering around on a sphere. Finite area, no<BR>boundaries. <BR><BR>&gt;&gt; 2) Some talk about jumpspace seems to follow the notion&nbsp; that&nbsp; it<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; is&nbsp; a&nbsp; hyperspace&nbsp; ...&nbsp; that&nbsp; is&nbsp; a&nbsp; parallel&nbsp; universe&nbsp; where<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; distances are smaller (or quicker&nbsp; to&nbsp; cross)&nbsp; than&nbsp; our&nbsp; own.<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; This is supported by the "crumpled tissue" metaphor.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; So my question for the list is this:&nbsp; IYTU&nbsp; which&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; above<BR>&gt;&gt; ideas do you use, does each ship have its&nbsp; own&nbsp; jumpspace&nbsp; or&nbsp; is<BR>&gt;&gt; jumpspace a universal hyperspace (or have you another idea)?<BR><BR>Note that either of the above could result in a "stuck" ship, given the<BR>right circumstances. <BR><BR>Here's a third possibility:<BR><BR>The drive creates a "charge" or "field" around the ship. This warps<BR>space and forces the ship into "jumpspace" (whatever that may be). It<BR>also protects the ship from the (very different!) physics of jumpspace.<BR><BR>That's why anything stuck past the "boundary" vanishes. Matter can't<BR>exist in that "space". <BR><BR>Anyway, somehow this "charge" makes the ship move, possibly thru<BR>something having to do with details of how you "shape" the field as you<BR>bring it up. <BR><BR>Anyway, after about a week, enough charge "bleeds off" for you to be<BR>precipitated back into normal space. <BR><BR>This covers the observed effects too, and has the "advantage" that you<BR>*can't* get stuck in jumpspace (unless that's what those "ship<BR>destroyed" entries on the misjump chart really mean)<BR><BR>Oh yeah, by having the "drive" generating this weird "charge" which<BR>creates the field &amp; jump buble, you get around the "where does all that<BR>hydrogen go?" questions. It *is "burned" by the drive. But just as a<BR>rocket engine produces insane amounts of power, but can't be<BR>practically used to generate power, a jump drive can produce insane<BR>amounts of power, but only as this "charge". Which can't be used for<BR>things such as powering the ship's weapons. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3506<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xb03.mx.aol.com (rly-xb03.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.104]) by air-xb02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2001 09:10:19 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xb03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2001 09:09:53 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id JAA05170;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 09:09:14 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 5 Jan 2001 09:08:55 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id JAA05135<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 09:08:55 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 09:08:55 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101051408.JAA05135@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3506<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3507</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/5/01 2:47:37 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 5 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3507<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR>JTAS collection for sale<BR>Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR>RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>RE: Oops! <BR>RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>re: Syleans<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR>RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR>re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR>RE: Jumpspace<BR>Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR>Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR>Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 09:14:54 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>&gt;Massive multi-player games that are by invitation only, with an active<BR>&gt;"God". Think of trying to get into an exclusive club.<BR><BR>I'm holding out great hopes for Neverwinter Nights on that basis. It's hard <BR>to see how any moderated game would get really "massive" though. Then again, <BR>I saw the "House Forests" in the north of Britannia at their worst, so <BR>that's not necessarily a bad thing.<BR><BR>I suspect a tight group of 100 people on any MMORPG server would be much <BR>better than 2000+. Unfortunately with the cost of the technology needed to <BR>run a server, there's every reason to believe that that few customers would <BR>be commercial suicide.<BR><BR>Five years ago I though pen and paper was doomed. Now after I've seen UO <BR>collapse under its own weight nearly immediately, and AC slowly spiral into <BR>the hands of those who can play it ten hours a day, I'm not so sure. <BR>MMORPG's face a dauntingly intractable set of problems.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 09:16:14 -0500 <BR>From: Glenn Myers &lt;glenn.myers@ansys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: JTAS collection for sale<BR><BR>Hey all,<BR>Pardon this spam, please...<BR>I'm putting up my entire collection of JTAS. That includes about 20 of the<BR>issues so here is your chance to fill the holes in your collection.<BR><BR>http://cgi6.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewListedItems&amp;userid=arathar<BR><BR>Thanks,<BR><BR>Glenn<BR><BR>______________________________________________________<BR><BR>Glenn E. Myers<BR>ANSYS Inc.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Email: glenn.myers@ansys.com<BR>275 Technology Drive&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Phone: (724) 514-2913<BR>Canonsburg, PA 15317&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax:&nbsp;&nbsp; (724) 514-3118<BR>______________________________________________________<BR><BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 09:37:04 -0600<BR>From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>Gerry Crowe wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Hmm, yes, you're right - I was referring to the system<BR>&gt; in the rulebook (like I said, I've been out of the<BR>&gt; loop for a while). Apologies for that.<BR><BR>I understood what you meant Gerry. Like Ken's KB3, I doubt I could use<BR>your method effectively in my PBEMs, but it is certainly an interesting<BR>one.<BR><BR>&gt; Reading back through the recent digests, the IHTIT<BR>&gt; system is excellent! I think I'll try combining the<BR>&gt; IHTIT rule with my rerolls, but that might push the<BR>&gt; emphasis too far onto skills - we'll see.<BR><BR>Hee, hee! For some of us *that* would be impossible. &lt;g&gt;&nbsp; Remember there<BR>is a faction out here that thinks the skill level includes stat already,<BR>and doesn't really want to add them at all.<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 16:18:02 -0000 <BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>Gee, Kenj...I think you fogot Dr. Frasier Crane ;)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Kenji Schwarz [mailto:schwarz@fas.harvard.edu]<BR>&gt; Sent: 04 January 2001 21:41<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Cc: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; At 3:18 PM -0800 1/3/01, William Lane wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;good question what relevance does Seattle have?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Well, within the immediate vicinity:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Home of Microsoft;<BR>&gt; Home of Boeing;<BR>&gt; Home of Amazon.com;<BR>&gt; Home of Weyerhauser;<BR>&gt; Home of the largest Muzak programming and broadcasting <BR>&gt; company in the world;<BR>&gt; Home of a buncha Trident subs;<BR>&gt; World's largest giant octopodes;<BR>&gt; World's largest concentration of breeding-age millionaires;<BR>&gt; Abodes of Frank Herbert, Tom Robbins, and various other <BR>&gt; literary luminaries;<BR>&gt; A neighborhood of elderly Norwegian fishermen that also in 1992 had <BR>&gt; the highest per-capita consumption of black tar heroin in the States;<BR>&gt; World's largest toaster museum;<BR>&gt; Home of an annual international Spam-sculpting competition;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Slightly further away, we have the Hanford reservation -- largest and <BR>&gt; most toxic nuclear/chemical waste facility on the planet, and (IIRC), <BR>&gt; still the largest producer of plutonium and assorted goodies. <BR>&gt; (Tourists sometimes get the Hanford nuclear reservation confused with <BR>&gt; the nearby/overlapping Yakama Indian reservation... coincidence? I <BR>&gt; think not.)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I, for one, think teaching them to use chunks of pig to beat each <BR>&gt; other to death would be a step in the right direction.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Kenji<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 16:19:29 -0000 <BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Oops! <BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: shudson@lightspeed.ca [mailto:shudson@lightspeed.ca]<BR>&gt; Sent: 04 January 2001 02:32<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Oops! <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; ...<BR>&gt; &gt; Tricky.&nbsp; It would require the incredibly rare attribute of <BR>&gt; subtlety.&nbsp; Maybe<BR>&gt; &gt; that's what happened to Dulinor - Strephon sent a bunch of <BR>&gt; PCs to have a<BR>&gt; &gt; quiet chat with him.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; It would have gone OK if they hadn't the fusion grenade from R&amp;D...<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Hmm, Traveller/Paranoia Crossover?<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 12:29:59 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>On Fri, 5 Jan 2001, Jones, Dean wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; There are Sci-Fi societies with dumber naming conventions...look at Bank's<BR>&gt; Culture novels<BR><BR>Hey, their naming convention (or lack thereof) is cool!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 10:35:45 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park <BR><BR>ROFLMAOASMC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!<BR><BR>With tears in my eyes from laughing so hard,<BR>Jesse<BR><BR><BR>&gt; /me visualizes climbing to the top of it, finding out that it's <BR>&gt; hollow, and<BR>&gt; someone packed the interior with little gold and silver stickers from the<BR>&gt; local teachers' supply store...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; "My G-d, it's full of stars!"<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt; Jeff Zeitlin<BR>&gt; jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>&gt; (Ask me via email about the ILink message network!)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 12:44:00 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>Kiri Aradia Morgan wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I've<BR>&gt; been in too many games with people who were in love with "pregnancy tables"<BR>&gt; and/or rape scenarios.&nbsp; (One of the worst offenders in a game I ran was<BR>&gt; another WOMAN... she played male characters who were rapists.)<BR><BR>What kind of *sick* games are you playing?<BR><BR>Wait&nbsp; . . . no . .&nbsp; don't tell me.<BR>I really don't want to know.<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 10:45:55 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Syleans<BR><BR>&gt;From: Charles R Hensley &lt;hensley.cr@gte.net&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Has anyone worked on background for the Syleans.&nbsp; According to Milieu 0,<BR>&gt;they are a minor human race. Has anyone worked up special social<BR>&gt;features, native language (do they still have one or has it been<BR>&gt;replaced??), etc.<BR><BR>I haven't actually written anything up on the Syleans, but here is my take<BR>on them:<BR><BR>Sylea was first settled by the Ziru Sirka, and later conquered by the<BR>Terrans.&nbsp; Much intermarriage took place.&nbsp; Thus the Syleans are not a minor<BR>race in the sense of being descended from humans placed there by the<BR>Ancients (but see infra).&nbsp; They are a separate race only to the extent that<BR>they were separated from the rest of humaniti during the Long Night.&nbsp; That<BR>is not quite long enough for distinct racial characteristics to appear,<BR>although a distinct culture developed.<BR><BR>During the Long Night, the idea of Sylean nationalism took root; part of<BR>that process was the development of a racial identity.&nbsp; Some Sylean<BR>philosophers and political leaders began to refer to the Sylean minor race<BR>as something special, unique, and even divinely inspired.&nbsp; Ancient artifacts<BR>found on Sylea were magnified into proof that the Syleans had been put there<BR>by the Ancients for a special purpose.&nbsp; This approach proved very effective<BR>at improving Sylean pride in their heritage.&nbsp; Sylea became a great power and<BR>began to expand into the surrounding star systems.<BR><BR>Cleon Zhunastu was a Sylean of mixed Solomani and Vilani ancestry.&nbsp; He<BR>played the race card very effectively in getting the Syleans to back his<BR>agenda of taking over the known universe.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 12:47:51 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>"Jones, Dean" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; One day you will be able to play Traveller Online.<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; My current job is to make that happen.&nbsp; :-&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &lt;/shameless plug&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; How's it going, bloo?<BR><BR>Pretty good.&nbsp; Though, I'm not getting enough sleep lately.<BR>Working too hard, I guess.<BR><BR>Oh, you mean the game design?<BR>Hey, Kenji!&nbsp; What's the Vilani equivalent of Garret Morris<BR>on SNL saying "berry berry good"?&nbsp; "Berii berii guud"?<BR>&gt;-&gt;<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 10:48:46 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>me either for that matter.<BR><BR>I use to game with a couple fo women and we would never even remotly<BR>thinking of going in the direction you are describing.<BR><BR>UGG<BR><BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Steve (Bloo) Daniels [mailto:sdaniels@playnet.com]<BR>Sent: Friday, January 05, 2001 10:44 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>Kiri Aradia Morgan wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I've<BR>&gt; been in too many games with people who were in love with "pregnancy<BR>tables"<BR>&gt; and/or rape scenarios.&nbsp; (One of the worst offenders in a game I ran was<BR>&gt; another WOMAN... she played male characters who were rapists.)<BR><BR>What kind of *sick* games are you playing?<BR><BR>Wait&nbsp; . . . no . .&nbsp; don't tell me.<BR>I really don't want to know.<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 10:52:35 -0800<BR>From: Bill &lt;beast@aracnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>&gt;ROFLMAOASMC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;With tears in my eyes from laughing so hard,<BR>&gt;Jesse<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; /me visualizes climbing to the top of it, finding out that it's<BR>&gt;&gt; hollow, and<BR>&gt;&gt; someone packed the interior with little gold and silver stickers from the<BR>&gt;&gt; local teachers' supply store...<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; "My G-d, it's full of stars!"<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; --<BR>&gt;&gt; Jeff Zeitlin<BR>&gt;&gt; jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>&gt;&gt; (Ask me via email about the ILink message network!)<BR><BR>For those of you that are interested. The monolith disappeared that <BR>following night.<BR><BR>Only to reappear a couple of days later in Green Lake Park, also in Seattle.<BR>In a setting that reminded me of 2010<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 11:24:00 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Kiri Aradia Morgan &lt;tiamat@tsoft.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>On Fri, 5 Jan 2001, Steve (Bloo) Daniels wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Kiri Aradia Morgan wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; I've<BR>&gt; &gt; been in too many games with people who were in love with "pregnancy tables"<BR>&gt; &gt; and/or rape scenarios.&nbsp; (One of the worst offenders in a game I ran was<BR>&gt; &gt; another WOMAN... she played male characters who were rapists.)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What kind of *sick* games are you playing?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Wait&nbsp; . . . no . .&nbsp; don't tell me.<BR>&gt; I really don't want to know.<BR>&gt; <BR>D&amp;D, but this was over 10 years ago.<BR><BR>******************************************************************************<BR>Kiri Aradia Morgan&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 93!&nbsp; Thou Art God<BR>tiamat@tsoft.com<BR><BR>"If time passes, everything turns into beauty<BR>If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away<BR>Everything starts wearing fresh colors<BR>Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody<BR>Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic<BR>Desire is embraced in a dream..."&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -- X-JAPAN<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 13:33:44 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>Kiri Aradia Morgan wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; D&amp;D, but this was over 10 years ago.<BR><BR>I said *don't* tell me!&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>At least that means you can blame the DM, for not<BR>controlling the players.<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 19:22:19 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR><BR>At 09:08 -0500 5/1/01,&nbsp; Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Hmm. "How much is that Vargr in the air/raft?"<BR>&gt;/me looks askance at Dom<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"Vargr slavery doesn't even happen in Gashikan any more.&nbsp; What makes you<BR>&gt;think you can _buy_ him?"<BR><BR>"The one with the FGMP-15"<BR><BR>Mercenary?<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 19:23:49 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR><BR>At 09:08 -0500 5/1/01,&nbsp; "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Hmm. "How much is that Vargr in the air/raft?"<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;How mad is that Vargr in the air/raft?<BR>&gt;The one with the big ACR?<BR>&gt;'Cause if that Vargr tries to fire back<BR>&gt;I'll fusion-gun him 'til he's charred.<BR><BR>&lt;giggle&gt;<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 19:33:50 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Jumpspace<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow) wrote:<BR>&gt; Not really. If it was a "pocket univers" the "bubble" wouldn't<BR>&gt; *have* an edge.&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>Two questions:<BR><BR>1) So?&nbsp; The ship doesn't go anywhere while in jump, the jumpspace<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; bubble does.&nbsp; What's wrong with that?<BR><BR>2) Is it not possible to have a pocket&nbsp; universe&nbsp; that&nbsp; *doesn't*<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; curve back on itself?&nbsp; That beyond the boundary&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; jump<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; field is "nospace"?&nbsp; The jump bubble is only a *3d* bubble, in<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; 4d its just a fragment ripped from the normal universe like&nbsp; a<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; piece of torn rag.<BR><BR>One thing that bothers me about curved pocket universes&nbsp; is&nbsp; that<BR>they'd have to be perfectly balanced or they'd inflate rapidly or<BR>collapse (crushing the contents).&nbsp; Ships in jump wouldn't&nbsp; be&nbsp; so<BR>bad 'cos they're closed systems for the duration of the jump, but<BR>Grandfather's pocket&nbsp; universe&nbsp; has&nbsp; people&nbsp; visiting&nbsp; ...&nbsp; which<BR>increases the total mass.&nbsp; "Hi, Grandfather.&nbsp; We- &lt;CRUNCH&gt;"<BR><BR>Now I think about it a pocket&nbsp; universe&nbsp; that&nbsp; is&nbsp; curved&nbsp; in&nbsp; on<BR>itself must be beyond a certain size or the tidal forces&nbsp; of&nbsp; the<BR>curvature would rip any ship into hot&nbsp; plasma!&nbsp; Thus&nbsp; if&nbsp; a&nbsp; jump<BR>bubble was a pocket universe it has to be relatively flat in&nbsp; the<BR>vicinity of the ship.<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; Here's a third possibility:<BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>This sounds like&nbsp; jump&nbsp; drive&nbsp; as&nbsp; a&nbsp; sort&nbsp; of&nbsp; warp&nbsp; drive.&nbsp; The<BR>problems I have with this are<BR><BR>1) The approximately fixed time regardless of distance&nbsp; travelled<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; implies&nbsp; (to&nbsp; me&nbsp; anyway)&nbsp; that&nbsp; you&nbsp; *do*&nbsp; become&nbsp; completely<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; separated from the normal universe and not 'ride&nbsp; parallel&nbsp; to<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; it' ... the relocation is completely *unrelated* to&nbsp; the&nbsp; 3d+1<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; universe we preceive.<BR><BR>2) If a ship was in warp it could be influenced (and precipitated<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; out of jump) by massive objects (stars,&nbsp; planets,&nbsp; etc).&nbsp; Thus<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; an uncharted rogue brown dwarf could have&nbsp; dire&nbsp; consequencies<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; on shipping lanes but this isn't even hinted&nbsp; out&nbsp; as&nbsp; a&nbsp; rare<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; occurance in any canon I&nbsp; remember.&nbsp; (Yes,&nbsp; we&nbsp; do&nbsp; have&nbsp; jump<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; masking but thats something different,&nbsp; that&nbsp; only&nbsp; affects&nbsp; a<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; jump's end point.)<BR><BR>3) Your description sounds good&nbsp; but&nbsp; too&nbsp; straight&nbsp; forward.&nbsp; We<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; know that jump "is not well understood", which I interpret&nbsp; as<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; "only dimly understood".&nbsp; Therefore the&nbsp; explanation&nbsp; of&nbsp; jump<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; must be ... 'weirder'?<BR><BR><BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 12:43:32 -0700<BR>From: Merrick Burkhardt &lt;merrick@rt66.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR>on 1/2/01 7:45 AM, Walt Smith at firelock_ny@hotmail.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Sethkimmel wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Of course, this means that someone else must engage the Zekes. The phrase<BR>&gt;&gt; "don't dogfight with Zekes" can also mean that you must use some other<BR>&gt;&gt; tactic to engage them, perhaps use a-a artillery.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; You still use fighters to shoot them down, you just don't<BR>&gt; dogfight them.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; A dogfight is a maneuverability contest.&nbsp; Most allied planes<BR>&gt; wouldn't win that contest with a Zeke.&nbsp; On the other hand,<BR>&gt; many allied fighters had other advantages, such as a higher<BR>&gt; top speed (especially in a dive).<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; See the Zeke before its pilot sees you.&nbsp; Roar in and pounce on<BR>&gt; it, killing it with the initial burst of firepower.&nbsp; If you miss,<BR>&gt; it starts turning to shake you and get on your tail.&nbsp; Don't bother<BR>&gt; trying to out-turn it, just use your higher speed (diving if<BR>&gt; necessary) to break off and circle very wide for another<BR>&gt; pass.&nbsp; Continue the slashing attacks as necessary, using your<BR>&gt; aircraft's advantages to completely control the engagement.<BR>&gt; If he never gets a chance to make you play his game, then the<BR>&gt; advantages his aircraft has are drastically reduced in<BR>&gt; effectiveness.<BR><BR>The zero had low wing loading, and was indeed a great turn and burn<BR>plane--it was also a decent energy fighter. People forget that the major<BR>plus of the zero at the beginning of the war was its high speed. American<BR>planes like the F4F were more durable, and had a better instantaneous dive<BR>speed--the reason diving away from a zeke works is that the zero loses<BR>control authority at high speeds. Dive with a slight turn, and a zero<BR>handles like a DC-3.<BR><BR>Another thing you cannot discout is teamwork. Americans fly in winged pairs,<BR>and used the radio. Many IJN/IJAF planes removed thier (unreliable) radio<BR>sets to reduce weight and improve performance. Having someone yell out to<BR>break is often the difference between life and death.<BR><BR>I fly mostly F4Fs in Warbirds, and I do pretty well. Mostly this is because<BR>i have the benefit of knowing what NOT to do with a zeke ahead of time &lt;G&gt;.<BR><BR>merrick<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 15:36:18 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR>Merrick Burkhardt wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; The zero had low wing loading, and was indeed a great turn and burn<BR>&gt; plane--it was also a decent energy fighter. People forget that the major<BR>&gt; plus of the zero at the beginning of the war was its high speed.<BR><BR>SHHHH!&nbsp; Quit giving away my Zekrets!!!<BR><BR><BR>&gt; I fly mostly F4Fs in Warbirds, and I do pretty well. Mostly this is because<BR>&gt; i have the benefit of knowing what NOT to do with a zeke ahead of time &lt;G&gt;.<BR><BR>If you see =webs= in there, ask him out fighting =bloo=;<BR>his Spit vs. my zeke.&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 21:19:56 GMT<BR>From: Postmark Design Bureau &lt;postmark.design@btinternet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>Gerry Crowe (obviously someone who wants difficult probabilities to<BR>calculate) wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Quick examples<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Stat 4, Skill 1, Average<BR>&gt; Roll 2D6, reroll 1 if desired, total must be &lt;= 5 to succeed. Difficult but<BR>&gt; not impossible for a beginner with a lack of talent.<BR><BR>52%<BR><BR>spectacular failure 0.5%<BR>spectacular success 2.8% or 7.4% but success drops to 47% if you use rerolls<BR><BR>&gt; Stat 7, Skill 2, Difficult<BR>&gt; Roll 3D6, reroll up to 2 of them, total must be &lt;= 9 to succeed. Average<BR>&gt; proficient character, he's got a good chance of succeeding with the rerolls<BR><BR>If a player rolls 4,4,4 do they pick up one dice, reroll it and if that's not<BR>a 1, pick up another dice and reroll that, or do they just pick up two dice<BR>and reroll both (assuming they don't opt for a single reroll)?<BR><BR>I'll assume that second, and that in each case the player rerolls the optimal<BR>number of dice.<BR><BR>Not that I'm going to tell you what the optimal number of dice is.:)<BR><BR>70%<BR><BR>&gt; Stat 6, Skill 4, Difficult<BR>&gt; Roll 3d6, reroll up to all of them (remember, you can only reroll once, so<BR>&gt; the 4th skill point cannot be used), total must be &lt;= 10 to succeed.<BR><BR>82%<BR><BR>&gt; Stat 10, Skill 1, Difficult<BR>&gt; Roll 3D6, one reroll, total must be &lt;= 11 to succeed.<BR><BR>82%<BR><BR>It's amazing the effect of even a single reroll - unless I have my rerolling<BR>sums wrong.<BR><BR>&gt; Stat12, Skill 6, Impossible<BR>&gt; Roll 6D6, reroll up to all of them, total must be &lt;= 18 to succeed.<BR><BR>72%<BR><BR>&gt; This may seem too easy for an 'Impossible' roll, but then these are<BR>&gt; God-stats - and the odds are definitely lower than T4!<BR><BR>God stats in T4 are Stat 15, Skill 10!<BR><BR>Note that a character one point worse than KB's Joe average (666666, skill-0)<BR>never fails any easy task and that a stat of 12 cannot fail an average test<BR>involving that stat.<BR><BR>If I'm going to do the spreadsheet anyway, assuming no one rerolls for<BR>greater success:<BR><BR>Easy<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Stat<BR>Skill&nbsp; 0&nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp;&nbsp; 2&nbsp;&nbsp; 3&nbsp;&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp; 5&nbsp;&nbsp; 6&nbsp;&nbsp; 7&nbsp;&nbsp; 8&nbsp;&nbsp; 9&nbsp; 10&nbsp; 11&nbsp; 12&nbsp; 13&nbsp; 14&nbsp; 15<BR>&nbsp; 0&nbsp; &nbsp; 0% 16% 33% 50% 66% 83%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 1&nbsp;&nbsp; 30% 55% 75% 88% 97%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 2&nbsp;&nbsp; 55% 75% 88% 97%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 3&nbsp;&nbsp; 75% 88% 97%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp; 88% 97%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 5&nbsp;&nbsp; 97%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 6&nbsp; 100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 7&nbsp; 100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 8&nbsp; 100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR><BR>Average<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Stat<BR>Skill&nbsp; 0&nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp;&nbsp; 2&nbsp;&nbsp; 3&nbsp;&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp; 5&nbsp;&nbsp; 6&nbsp;&nbsp; 7&nbsp;&nbsp; 8&nbsp;&nbsp; 9&nbsp; 10&nbsp; 11&nbsp; 12&nbsp; 13&nbsp; 14&nbsp; 15<BR>&nbsp; 0&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 2%&nbsp; 8% 16% 27% 41% 58% 72% 83% 91% 97%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 7% 19% 35% 52% 68% 80% 89% 94% 98% 99%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 5% 21% 39% 56% 72% 84% 92% 97% 99% 99%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 3&nbsp;&nbsp; 21% 39% 56% 72% 84% 92% 97% 99% 99%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp; 39% 56% 72% 84% 92% 97% 99% 99%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 5&nbsp;&nbsp; 56% 72% 84% 92% 97% 99% 99%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 6&nbsp;&nbsp; 72% 84% 92% 97% 99% 99%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 7&nbsp;&nbsp; 84% 92% 97% 99% 99%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 8&nbsp;&nbsp; 92% 97% 99% 99%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR><BR>Difficult<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Stat<BR>Skill&nbsp; 0&nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp;&nbsp; 2&nbsp;&nbsp; 3&nbsp;&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp; 5&nbsp;&nbsp; 6&nbsp;&nbsp; 7&nbsp;&nbsp; 8&nbsp;&nbsp; 9&nbsp; 10&nbsp; 11&nbsp; 12&nbsp; 13&nbsp; 14&nbsp; 15<BR>&nbsp; 0&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 4%&nbsp; 9% 16% 25% 37% 50% 62% 74% 83% 90% 95%<BR>&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 5% 13% 23% 35% 48% 61% 73% 82% 89% 94% 97% 98% 99%<BR>&nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 7% 16% 29% 42% 57% 70% 81% 89% 94% 97% 98% 99% 99% 99%<BR>&nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 6% 15% 28% 43% 58% 71% 82% 90% 95% 97% 99% 99% 99% 99%100%<BR>&nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 6% 15% 28% 43% 58% 71% 82% 90% 95% 97% 99% 99% 99% 99%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 5&nbsp;&nbsp; 15% 28% 43% 58% 71% 82% 90% 95% 97% 99% 99% 99% 99%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 6&nbsp;&nbsp; 28% 43% 58% 71% 82% 90% 95% 97% 99% 99% 99% 99%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 7&nbsp;&nbsp; 43% 58% 71% 82% 90% 95% 97% 99% 99% 99% 99%100%100%100%100%100%<BR>&nbsp; 8&nbsp;&nbsp; 58% 71% 82% 90% 95% 97% 99% 99% 99% 99%100%100%100%100%100%100%<BR><BR>Formidable<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Stat<BR>Skill&nbsp; 0&nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp;&nbsp; 2&nbsp;&nbsp; 3&nbsp;&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp; 5&nbsp;&nbsp; 6&nbsp;&nbsp; 7&nbsp;&nbsp; 8&nbsp;&nbsp; 9&nbsp; 10&nbsp; 11&nbsp; 12&nbsp; 13&nbsp; 14&nbsp; 15<BR>&nbsp; 0&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 2%&nbsp; 5%&nbsp; 9% 15% 23% 33% 44% 55% 66%<BR>&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 4%&nbsp; 8% 15% 23% 33% 45% 56% 66% 76% 83% 89%<BR>&nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 2%&nbsp; 6% 12% 21% 31% 43% 56% 67% 77% 85% 90% 94% 97%<BR>&nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 2%&nbsp; 6% 13% 22% 34% 47% 59% 71% 80% 87% 93% 96% 98% 99%<BR>&nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 5% 12% 22% 34% 47% 60% 71% 81% 88% 93% 96% 98% 99% 99%<BR>&nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 5% 12% 22% 34% 47% 60% 71% 81% 88% 93% 96% 98% 99% 99% 99%<BR>&nbsp; 6&nbsp; &nbsp; 5% 12% 22% 34% 47% 60% 71% 81% 88% 93% 96% 98% 99% 99% 99% 99%<BR>&nbsp; 7&nbsp;&nbsp; 12% 22% 34% 47% 60% 71% 81% 88% 93% 96% 98% 99% 99% 99% 99% 99%<BR>&nbsp; 8&nbsp;&nbsp; 22% 34% 47% 60% 71% 81% 88% 93% 96% 98% 99% 99% 99% 99% 99% 99%<BR><BR>Staggering<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Stat<BR>Skill&nbsp; 0&nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp;&nbsp; 2&nbsp;&nbsp; 3&nbsp;&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp; 5&nbsp;&nbsp; 6&nbsp;&nbsp; 7&nbsp;&nbsp; 8&nbsp;&nbsp; 9&nbsp; 10&nbsp; 11&nbsp; 12&nbsp; 13&nbsp; 14&nbsp; 15<BR>&nbsp; 0&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 3%&nbsp; 5%&nbsp; 9% 15% 22% 30%<BR>&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 2%&nbsp; 5%&nbsp; 9% 15% 23% 31% 41% 51% 61%<BR>&nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 2%&nbsp; 4%&nbsp; 9% 15% 23% 32% 43% 54% 64% 73% 81%<BR>&nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 2%&nbsp; 5% 10% 17% 26% 37% 48% 59% 70% 78% 85% 90%<BR>&nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 2%&nbsp; 5% 10% 18% 27% 38% 50% 61% 71% 80% 87% 92% 95%<BR>&nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 4% 10% 17% 27% 38% 50% 61% 72% 80% 87% 92% 95% 97%<BR>&nbsp; 6&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 4% 10% 17% 27% 38% 50% 61% 72% 80% 87% 92% 95% 97% 98%<BR>&nbsp; 7&nbsp; &nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 4% 10% 17% 27% 38% 50% 61% 72% 80% 87% 92% 95% 97% 98% 99%<BR>&nbsp; 8&nbsp; &nbsp; 4% 10% 17% 27% 38% 50% 61% 72% 80% 87% 92% 95% 97% 98% 99% 99%<BR><BR>Impossible<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Stat<BR>Skill&nbsp; 0&nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp;&nbsp; 2&nbsp;&nbsp; 3&nbsp;&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp; 5&nbsp;&nbsp; 6&nbsp;&nbsp; 7&nbsp;&nbsp; 8&nbsp;&nbsp; 9&nbsp; 10&nbsp; 11&nbsp; 12&nbsp; 13&nbsp; 14&nbsp; 15<BR>&nbsp; 0&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 3%&nbsp; 6%&nbsp; 9%<BR>&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 3%&nbsp; 6% 10% 15% 22% 29%<BR>&nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 3%&nbsp; 6% 10% 16% 24% 32% 42% 51%<BR>&nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 2%&nbsp; 4%&nbsp; 8% 13% 20% 29% 39% 49% 59% 68%<BR>&nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 2%&nbsp; 4%&nbsp; 8% 14% 22% 31% 41% 52% 62% 71% 79%<BR>&nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 2%&nbsp; 4%&nbsp; 8% 14% 22% 31% 42% 52% 63% 72% 80% 86%<BR>&nbsp; 6&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 4%&nbsp; 8% 14% 22% 31% 42% 52% 63% 72% 80% 86% 91%<BR>&nbsp; 7&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 4%&nbsp; 8% 14% 22% 31% 42% 52% 63% 72% 80% 86% 91% 94%<BR>&nbsp; 8&nbsp; &nbsp; 0%&nbsp; 1%&nbsp; 4%&nbsp; 8% 14% 22% 31% 42% 52% 63% 72% 80% 86% 91% 94% 96%<BR><BR>Hmm, I'm pretty sure these numbers are rounded down, not rounded nearest.<BR><BR>ps<BR><BR>After all, these sums, I've now decided that my upcoming campaign will<BR>run using MegaTraveller - anyone know where the errata is?<BR><BR>pps<BR><BR>If anyone else wants probability tables calculated - it's someone else's<BR>turn for this task war.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Phil Kitching, http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo<BR>Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Products Division<BR>"Microwaving halfbaked ideas from across the galaxy"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3507<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zc04.mx.aol.com (rly-zc04.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.4]) by air-zc02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2001 17:47:37 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zc04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 05 Jan 2001 17:46:56 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id RAA24342;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 17:46:18 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 5 Jan 2001 17:45:49 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id RAA24294<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 17:45:48 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 17:45:48 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101052245.RAA24294@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3507<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3508</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/6/01 12:03:08 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Saturday, January 6 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3508<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR>re: Syleans<BR>Re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>Meaningful Ship Names<BR>Re: Jumpspace<BR>[BITS] Star-Worn - 2 DAYS LEFT!<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>Random Jumpspace Thoughts....<BR>re: Syleans<BR>Banners Sector<BR>RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>Re: Character-defined task rolls (medical comments)<BR>Re: Random Jumpspace Thoughts....<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>Evil Thought of the Day<BR>OT: U. S. ARMY OFFICIAL VOICE MAIL MESSAGE<BR>Re: Star Worn? Comments<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 17:52:16 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; What kind of *sick* games are you playing?<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Wait&nbsp; . . . no . .&nbsp; don't tell me.<BR>&gt; &gt; I really don't want to know.<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; D&amp;D, but this was over 10 years ago.<BR><BR>Well, that explains everything, doesn't it?<BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 18:29:08 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: *Simple* fix to the T4 task system<BR><BR>Phil Kitching wrote:<BR>&lt;lots, mostly big blocks of numbers, ending with...&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;After all, these sums, I've now decided that my upcoming campaign will<BR>&gt;run using MegaTraveller - anyone know where the errata is?<BR><BR>Wise choice.&nbsp; Watch out for those weird Interrupts (and interrupts-of-interrupts) in the combat system, though.<BR><BR>There's a link to the errata at Downport.com; I've also got it formatted as a Word document if that suits you better.<BR><BR>To the group now, is this errata complete?&nbsp; Maybe I'm showing my ignorance, but there's a couple areas where I still feel like I'm missing stuff (e.g. the errata gives To Hit mods for PAWS, but shouldn't there also be tables of To Pen mods for various defenses?&nbsp; Am I expected to adapt High Guard?&nbsp; Or am I just overlooking/misinterpreting something? -- Space Combat was never one of my strong suits)<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 19:10:44 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Syleans<BR><BR>On Fri, 5 Jan 2001 17:45:48 -0500 (EST), "Glenn M. Goffin"<BR>&lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;From: Charles R Hensley &lt;hensley.cr@gte.net&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Has anyone worked on background for the Syleans.&nbsp; According to Milieu 0,<BR>&gt;&gt;they are a minor human race. Has anyone worked up special social<BR>&gt;&gt;features, native language (do they still have one or has it been<BR>&gt;&gt;replaced??), etc.<BR><BR>&gt;I haven't actually written anything up on the Syleans, but here is my take<BR>&gt;on them:<BR><BR>[etceterated]<BR><BR>&gt;Cleon Zhunastu was a Sylean of mixed Solomani and Vilani ancestry.&nbsp; He<BR>&gt;played the race card very effectively in getting the Syleans to back his<BR>&gt;agenda of taking over the known universe.<BR><BR>You are hereby remanded into the custody of the Traveller-Culture list,<BR>where you are expected to develop this further, and submit it for inclusion<BR>in the Traveller-Culture databanks.<BR><BR>A failure of compliance on your part will result in a psychological mode<BR>switch on my part into a petulant whiny b*****d.<BR><BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(Ask me via email about the ILink message network!)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 15:12:38 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Filks (yes, with a [FILK])<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; On Thu, 4 Jan 2001 19:28:34 -0500 (EST), Dominic Mooney<BR>&gt; &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;At 10:45 -0500 4/1/01,&nbsp; "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; <BR>&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; WHO LET THE VARGR OUT?&nbsp; *woof! woof! woof!*<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; &gt;&lt;SPLORT&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; &gt;Damn, that was a waste of Stella Artois.<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; &gt;Chalk a kill, please.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;Dom, wait a day or two before you relax..<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;... I'm writing it.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;ohmigawd.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Hmm. "How much is that Vargr in the air/raft?"<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; /me looks askance at Dom<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "Vargr slavery doesn't even happen in Gashikan any more.&nbsp; What makes you<BR>&gt; think you can _buy_ him?"<BR><BR>It's *her*, and he was inquiring about "renting" her... &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>What can I say, some folks like doing it "doggie style". &lt;g,d&amp;rvvf&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 15:17:35 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; OB-TRAV: A minor species that uses similar names? How about their own ship<BR>&gt; designations? eg the Vicious Bastard class Cruiser _Not in the Face_ :)<BR><BR>Or the Lying Scum class ship I'll_Still_Respect_You_in_the_Morning?<BR><BR>Come to think of it, that'd be an interesting name for a Free Trader. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 16:22:00 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Kiri Aradia Morgan &lt;tiamat@tsoft.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>On Fri, 5 Jan 2001, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; OB-TRAV: A minor species that uses similar names? How about their own ship<BR>&gt; &gt; designations? eg the Vicious Bastard class Cruiser _Not in the Face_ :)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Or the Lying Scum class ship I'll_Still_Respect_You_in_the_Morning?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Come to think of it, that'd be an interesting name for a Free Trader. :-)<BR>&gt; <BR>I had a ship called Spit_or_Swallow once.<BR><BR>Kiri ^_^<BR>******************************************************************************<BR>Kiri Aradia Morgan&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 93!&nbsp; Thou Art God<BR>tiamat@tsoft.com<BR><BR>"If time passes, everything turns into beauty<BR>If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away<BR>Everything starts wearing fresh colors<BR>Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody<BR>Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic<BR>Desire is embraced in a dream..."&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -- X-JAPAN<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 16:30:03 -0800<BR>From: "Pronto" &lt;pronto_r031@telus.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Meaningful Ship Names<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow) writes:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Or the Lying Scum class ship I'll_Still_Respect_You_in_the_Morning?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Come to think of it, that'd be an interesting name for a Free Trader. :-)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; -- <BR>ROFL<BR><BR>Sounds like you have played in the same kind of games that I have.<BR><BR>Pronto<BR>Next year, at Burning Man!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 16:47:18 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Jumpspace<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow) wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Not really. If it was a "pocket univers" the "bubble" wouldn't<BR>&gt;&gt; *have* an edge.&lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Two questions:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; 1) So?&nbsp; The ship doesn't go anywhere while in jump, the jumpspace<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; bubble does.&nbsp; What's wrong with that?<BR><BR>Nothing at all. <BR><BR>&gt; 2) Is it not possible to have a pocket&nbsp; universe&nbsp; that&nbsp; *doesn't*<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; curve back on itself?&nbsp; That beyond the boundary&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; jump<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; field is "nospace"?&nbsp; The jump bubble is only a *3d* bubble, in<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; 4d its just a fragment ripped from the normal universe like&nbsp; a<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; piece of torn rag.<BR><BR>The point is that *we* are 3d. And that having an "edge" to any sort of<BR>"universe" poses a lot of problems. Starting with the fact tht normal<BR>physical laws need things to either extend to infinity, or to be able<BR>to "curve back". Otherwise you'll get some really weird effects. <BR><BR>As it is, even a closed universe is a problem if it's small enough.<BR><BR>&gt; One thing that bothers me about curved pocket universes&nbsp; is&nbsp; that<BR>&gt; they'd have to be perfectly balanced or they'd inflate rapidly or<BR>&gt; collapse (crushing the contents).&nbsp; Ships in jump wouldn't&nbsp; be&nbsp; so<BR>&gt; bad 'cos they're closed systems for the duration of the jump, but<BR>&gt; Grandfather's pocket&nbsp; universe&nbsp; has&nbsp; people&nbsp; visiting&nbsp; ...&nbsp; which<BR>&gt; increases the total mass.&nbsp; "Hi, Grandfather.&nbsp; We- &lt;CRUNCH&gt;"<BR><BR>Whereas a finite *and* bounded universe would "bleed to death" as<BR>virtual pairs came into existence at the edge and one member "fell<BR>off". <BR><BR>&gt; Now I think about it a pocket&nbsp; universe&nbsp; that&nbsp; is&nbsp; curved&nbsp; in&nbsp; on<BR>&gt; itself must be beyond a certain size or the tidal forces&nbsp; of&nbsp; the<BR>&gt; curvature would rip any ship into hot&nbsp; plasma!&nbsp; Thus&nbsp; if&nbsp; a&nbsp; jump<BR>&gt; bubble was a pocket universe it has to be relatively flat in&nbsp; the<BR>&gt; vicinity of the ship.<BR><BR>Which requires a large bubble *or* one with *very* non-uniform<BR>curvature. Consider an *extremely* oblate spheroid. The "edge" of the<BR>bubble might merely be the area where the curvature changes rapidly. <BR><BR>Thanks for making me think of that image. It may prove useful.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Here's a third possibility:<BR>&gt; &lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; This sounds like&nbsp; jump&nbsp; drive&nbsp; as&nbsp; a&nbsp; sort&nbsp; of&nbsp; warp&nbsp; drive.&nbsp; The<BR>&gt; problems I have with this are<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; 1) The approximately fixed time regardless of distance&nbsp; travelled<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; implies&nbsp; (to&nbsp; me&nbsp; anyway)&nbsp; that&nbsp; you&nbsp; *do*&nbsp; become&nbsp; completely<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; separated from the normal universe and not 'ride&nbsp; parallel&nbsp; to<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; it' ... the relocation is completely *unrelated* to&nbsp; the&nbsp; 3d+1<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; universe we preceive.<BR><BR>Except that it's already stated (in *many* places) that the 100<BR>diameter limit affects ships *in* jump. <BR><BR>&gt; 2) If a ship was in warp it could be influenced (and precipitated<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; out of jump) by massive objects (stars,&nbsp; planets,&nbsp; etc).&nbsp; Thus<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; an uncharted rogue brown dwarf could have&nbsp; dire&nbsp; consequencies<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; on shipping lanes but this isn't even hinted&nbsp; out&nbsp; as&nbsp; a&nbsp; rare<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; occurance in any canon I&nbsp; remember.&nbsp; (Yes,&nbsp; we&nbsp; do&nbsp; have&nbsp; jump<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; masking but thats something different,&nbsp; that&nbsp; only&nbsp; affects&nbsp; a<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; jump's end point.)<BR><BR>Nope. Marc has explicitly stated that *exactly* that can happen. <BR><BR>&gt; 3) Your description sounds good&nbsp; but&nbsp; too&nbsp; straight&nbsp; forward.&nbsp; We<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; know that jump "is not well understood", which I interpret&nbsp; as<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; "only dimly understood".&nbsp; Therefore the&nbsp; explanation&nbsp; of&nbsp; jump<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; must be ... 'weirder'?<BR><BR>Well, it's not *that* straightforward. Not once you try to talk about<BR>the "charge". Or even how you "aim" the ship". <BR><BR>The two main factors in it were getting the ship to "fall out" and<BR>having the hydrogen actually used for energy, but not in a manner that<BR>lets you do anything "normal" with the energy produced (which is always<BR>the big argument against jump drives actually "burning" the fuel)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 01:17:05 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: [BITS] Star-Worn - 2 DAYS LEFT!<BR><BR>"Star Worn" is a freebie (for two weeks only) from BITS, available on <BR>the archive page at the BITS website as an Acrobat PDF file. It is <BR>what we would generally refer to as a 'fun' adventure. These are <BR>generally run on the last day (Sunday) of GenCon UK amidst hangovers <BR>and and general sillyness.<BR><BR>Generally, the Traveller fun scenario is a mixture of a number of <BR>films and sci-fi cliches, with a twist of familiar characters from <BR>things as diverse as that film series from Lucasfilm, Red Dwarf, <BR>Terminator, Trek and a number of other sources (the old White Dwarf <BR>'The Travellers' strip - Mad Gav and Felix and Dinalt feature quite <BR>often, as have Sculder and Mulley from the X files).<BR><BR>Anyway, last year we put a free PDF of the scenario 'White Dwarf' on <BR>the website for two weeks. This year we've put up 'Star Worn'. Next <BR>year, who knows (we'll watch the responses!).<BR><BR>So check out the archive page at http://www.bits.org.uk/<BR><BR>STAR WORN WILL BE REMOVED ON SUNDAY.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 19:30:17 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; OB-TRAV: A minor species that uses similar names? How about their own ship<BR>&gt; &gt; designations? eg the Vicious Bastard class Cruiser _Not in the Face_ :)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Or the Lying Scum class ship I'll_Still_Respect_You_in_the_Morning?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Come to think of it, that'd be an interesting name for a Free Trader. :-)<BR><BR>I've always been partial to<BR>_Cornucopia_of_Excellent_Goods_at_Low_Prices_ as a name for a Free<BR>Trader.<BR><BR>But then, I'm always willing to Tuf it out.... ;-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 20:23:13 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Random Jumpspace Thoughts....<BR><BR>As I read the most recent posts about jumpspace, a few thoughts occur to<BR>me:<BR><BR>1.&nbsp; I've never cared for the implication that jump masking could lead to<BR>a ship precipitating from jump at vast distances from the targeted world<BR>(or deep-space area, for those of us who allow such), except as an<BR>actual misjump.&nbsp; I suggest that jump routes are not strictly linear, and<BR>that one of the reasons for variable jump duration (in normal jumps) is<BR>that the astrogator has plotted a curving jumpspace route to avoid the<BR>100-diameter range of known masses (comets, planets, planetoids [either<BR>rogue or in belts], black holes, the late Orson Welles, etc.). <BR>Admittedly, this means that astrogators can predict the time of<BR>emergence from jumpspace.&nbsp; However, that matches Marc Miller's statement<BR>(in his definitive Jump Space article, reprinted in SJG's JTAS) that<BR>"the ship's computer usually predicts the exact time of emergence and<BR>the bridge is well-manned for the event."<BR><BR>Precipitation from jumpspace outside normal variations (+-3000 km from<BR>predicted exit, x 10 for "the quality of drive tuning and...the accuracy<BR>of the computer controlling the jump") then becomes an actual misjump,<BR>caused either by technical problems (use of unrefined fuel, for<BR>instance) or by the intervention of an unanticipated mass (e.g., Oprah<BR>Winfrey between diets).<BR><BR>2.&nbsp; Marc Miller's seminal article on jumpspace also states that "the<BR>laws of conservation of mass and energy continue to operate on ships<BR>which have jumped; when a ship exits jump, it retains the speed and<BR>direction it had when it entered."&nbsp; I have always interpreted this to<BR>mean that the vector of a ship exiting jumpspace will be exactly opposed<BR>to that ship's vector upon entering jumpspace with respect to the<BR>governing bodies.<BR><BR>Thus, a starship jumping from the mainworld of System A (not jump masked<BR>by the primary star) to System B (which is jump masked by the primary<BR>star), with an outbound velocity of 100 km/sec from Mainworld A [the<BR>governing body outbound], would be inbound to Star B [the governing body<BR>inbound] at 100 km/sec.<BR><BR>Note that this also means that ships with vectors tangential to the<BR>100-diameter limit of the outbound governing body will have vectors<BR>tangential (on 3-d back azimuths) to the 100-diameter limit of the<BR>inbound governing body.<BR><BR>3.&nbsp; While directly contradicted by Marc Miller's article on jumpspace, I<BR>find it dramatically appropriate to allow ships to plot an exit from<BR>jumpspace closer than 100 diameters from the governing body, with risks<BR>equivalent to those found when entering jumpspace within 100 diameters<BR>of a given body (increased chance of misjump or ship destruction). <BR>Rapid Interface Infantry units, for instance, may find it tactically<BR>useful to risk losing a percentage of their transports (and thus troop<BR>strength) to jump within 10 diameters of the target world.&nbsp; Of course,<BR>both the RI troop commander and the transport squadron commander would<BR>have to agree to accept the increased risks (or be ordered by their<BR>mutual commander to do so).<BR><BR>As always, YMMV.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 21:38:56 -0600<BR>From: Charles R Hensley &lt;hensley.cr@gte.net&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Syleans<BR><BR>Glenn M. Goffin wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Sylea was first settled by the Ziru Sirka, and later conquered by the<BR>&gt;Terrans.&nbsp; Much intermarriage took place.&nbsp; Thus the Syleans are not a<BR>minor<BR>&gt;race in the sense of being descended from humans placed there by the<BR>&gt;Ancients (but see infra).&nbsp; They are a separate race only to the extent<BR>that<BR>&gt;they were separated from the rest of humaniti during the Long Night.<BR>That<BR>&gt;is not quite long enough for distinct racial characteristics to appear,<BR><BR>&gt;although a distinct culture developed.<BR><BR>Characteristics:<BR>2.1 meters avg hieght<BR>avg 90 kgs<BR>weaker<BR>10% albinos<BR>high proportion of left handedness<BR><BR><BR>M0C&nbsp; pg 89<BR>"By the time that the Vilani arrived around Year -8000, the Syleans had<BR>reached a technological level currently classified as TL2, at most."<BR>"Most Syleans simply integrated within Vilani society..."<BR>"By the time the Rule of man "liberated" the Syleans from Vilani rule,<BR>the population was 95% Vilani."<BR><BR>Charles H<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 15:04:31 -0000<BR>From: "Antony Farrell" &lt;Skaran@bigpond.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Banners Sector<BR><BR>Just to let people know, I have just posted the UPPs for the last subsector<BR>of the Banners Sector. The periods covered are 1117 and 1201.<BR><BR>Now it is time for the details work on selected parts.<BR>Let me know what you think.<BR><BR>You can find the details by going through<BR>www.users.bigpond.com/Skaran<BR><BR>and following the link through the Banners Pocket Empire.<BR><BR>Antony<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 10:10:46 -0000 <BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; OB-TRAV: A minor species that uses similar names? How <BR>&gt; about their own ship<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; designations? eg the Vicious Bastard class Cruiser _Not <BR>&gt; in the Face_ :)<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Or the Lying Scum class ship I'll_Still_Respect_You_in_the_Morning?<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Come to think of it, that'd be an interesting name for a <BR>&gt; Free Trader. :-)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I've always been partial to<BR>&gt; _Cornucopia_of_Excellent_Goods_at_Low_Prices_ as a name for a Free<BR>&gt; Trader.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; But then, I'm always willing to Tuf it out.... ;-)<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>&lt;Grin&gt;<BR>You're supposed to be Travelling, not Voyaging<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 03:06:57 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; OB-TRAV: A minor species that uses similar names? How about their own <BR>&gt; ship<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; designations? eg the Vicious Bastard class Cruiser _Not in the Face_ :)<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Or the Lying Scum class ship I'll_Still_Respect_You_in_the_Morning?<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Come to think of it, that'd be an interesting name for a Free Trader. :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I've always been partial to<BR>&gt; _Cornucopia_of_Excellent_Goods_at_Low_Prices_ as a name for a Free<BR>&gt; Trader.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; But then, I'm always willing to Tuf it out.... ;-)<BR><BR>I'm rather partial to Muddlin'_Through. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 12:21:10 +0000<BR>From: Martin Hardgrave &lt;martin@deira.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Character-defined task rolls (medical comments)<BR><BR>In message &lt;3A4ECD75.FD995FD0@ozemail.com.au&gt;, Robert O'Connor<BR>&lt;robocon@ozemail.com.au&gt; writes<BR>&gt;Realistically, you don't have to have great amounts of general<BR>&gt;intelligence or knowledge to be a successful physician and surgeon.<BR>&gt;Clinical skills and attention to detail will lead to a successful career<BR>&gt;almost every time. <BR><BR>Hence the old "what do you call the person who graduates bottom of the<BR>class in medical school? - Doctor" joke.<BR>- -- <BR>Martin Hardgrave<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 05:10:55 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Random Jumpspace Thoughts....<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; 2.&nbsp; Marc Miller's seminal article on jumpspace also states that "the<BR>&gt; laws of conservation of mass and energy continue to operate on ships<BR>&gt; which have jumped; when a ship exits jump, it retains the speed and<BR>&gt; direction it had when it entered."&nbsp; I have always interpreted this to<BR>&gt; mean that the vector of a ship exiting jumpspace will be exactly opposed<BR>&gt; to that ship's vector upon entering jumpspace with respect to the<BR>&gt; governing bodies.<BR><BR>Nope. that's *not* conserving energy or momentum. The vector would<BR>point in same direction (hint: an observer in a *third* star system<BR>should measure the energy and momentum as being the same before and<BR>after jump)<BR><BR>Of course, as was pointed out in the last discussion of this, comparing<BR>momentum of seperated objects gets real iffy under relativity. But for<BR>simiplicity, we can ignore that.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 08:03:09<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>At 03:17 PM 1/5/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR>&gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; OB-TRAV: A minor species that uses similar names? How about their own ship<BR>&gt;&gt; designations? eg the Vicious Bastard class Cruiser _Not in the Face_ :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Or the Lying Scum class ship I'll_Still_Respect_You_in_the_Morning?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Come to think of it, that'd be an interesting name for a Free Trader. :-)<BR><BR>In one game I ran, the players had an ancient free trader.&nbsp; They christened<BR>it the MV Duct Tape.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; http://gridlore.home.mondspring.com<BR><BR>"A mrgs einu sinni hluti minn systir..."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 13:57:20 -0600<BR>From: Leslie Bates &lt;lesbates@minn.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR><BR>At 08:03 AM 1/6/01, you wrote:<BR>&gt;At 03:17 PM 1/5/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; OB-TRAV: A minor species that uses similar names? How about their own ship<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; designations? eg the Vicious Bastard class Cruiser _Not in the Face_ :)<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Or the Lying Scum class ship I'll_Still_Respect_You_in_the_Morning?<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Come to think of it, that'd be an interesting name for a Free Trader. :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;In one game I ran, the players had an ancient free trader.&nbsp; They christened<BR>&gt;it the MV Duct Tape.<BR><BR>The overdue for the scrapyard ship I'd stick my players with was the SS<BR>Reliable.<BR><BR>Les<BR><BR>====================================<BR>Revolutionaries are not nice people.<BR>==================================== <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 14:01:22 -0600<BR>From: Leslie Bates &lt;lesbates@minn.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Evil Thought of the Day<BR><BR>What If 2001 was made with a more current style of dialogue?<BR><BR>"Open the pod bay doors, HAL."<BR><BR>"(BLEEP) you, Dave."<BR><BR><BR>Les<BR><BR>====================================<BR>Revolutionaries are not nice people.<BR>==================================== <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 19:46:46 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: OT: U. S. ARMY OFFICIAL VOICE MAIL MESSAGE<BR><BR>U. S. ARMY OFFICIAL VOICE MAIL MESSAGE<BR>1. Thank you for calling the United States Army. I'm sorry, but all of our<BR>Units are out at the moment, or are other-wise engaged. Please leave a message<BR>with:<BR>a. Your Country<BR>b. Name of Organisation<BR>c. The Region<BR>d. The specific crisis<BR>e. A number at which we can call you<BR>2. Which we will do just as soon as we have sorted out problems in:<BR>a. The Balkans<BR>b. Iraq<BR>c. Korea<BR>d. China<BR>e. Still working on the Y2K bug<BR>3. Please speak after the tone, or if you require more options, please listen<BR>to the following numbers:<BR>a. If your crisis is small, and close to the sea, press 1 for the United<BR>States Marine Corps.<BR>b. If your concern is distant, with a temperate climate and good hotels, and<BR>can be solved by one or two low risk, high altitude bombing runs, please press<BR>2 for the United States Air Force.<BR>c. PLEASE NOTE: This service is not available after 1630 hours, or on weekends.<BR>&nbsp; Special consideration will be given to customers requiring satellite or<BR>stealth technology who can provide additional research and development funding.<BR><BR>4. If your inquiry concerns a situation which can be resolved by a bit of grey<BR>flannel, bunting, flags and a really good marching band, please write, well in<BR>advance, to the United States Navy.<BR>5. Please note that Tomahawk missile service is extremely limited and will be<BR>provided on a first-come, first-served basis only.<BR>6. If your inquiry is not urgent, please press 3 for the Rapid Deployment<BR>Force.<BR>7. If you are in real serious trouble, please press 4. And your call will be<BR>routed to the United States Army Special Operations Command. Please note that<BR>a compulsory credit check will be required to ensure you can afford the<BR>inherent TDY costs. Also be aware that USASOC may bill your account at any<BR>time and is not required to tell you why, as it will be classified.<BR>8. If you require Nuclear/Hydrogen Weapon Technology or Missile Guidance<BR>Technology, please contact the White House at 202-456-1414 (be prepared to<BR>make a sizeable donation to the Democratic National Convention in Chinese<BR>currency). Or call the Sandia Corporation at 1-800-GOT-NUKES.<BR>9. If you are interested in joining the Army, and wish to be:<BR>a. Shouted at;<BR>b. Paid little;<BR>c. Have premature arthritis;<BR>d. Put your wife and family in a condemned hut miles from civilisation;<BR>e. Are prepared to work your ass off daily;<BR>f. Risking your life in all weather and terrain's;<BR>g. Both day &amp; night while watching Congress erode your original benefits<BR>package, then please stay on the line, as your call will be directed shortly<BR>to a bitter, passed-over Army Recruiter in an old strip mall down by the Post<BR>Office.<BR>Have a pleasant day, and thank you again just heaps for trying to contact the<BR>United States Army.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 19:43:34 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Star Worn? Comments<BR><BR>&gt;Absolutely, 100% crazy (in the good sense of the word). I have to run<BR>&gt;this with (inflict it on?) a bunch of players here as soon as the exams<BR>&gt;are finished. Should be a blast.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Basically, this adventure is GREAT for anyone with a background in Star<BR>&gt;Wars and computers (like most of my friends). I especially like the way<BR>&gt;that the basic SW story is mirrored and twisted.<BR><BR>Us? Mirror and twist a major production like that? Surely not....<BR><BR>&gt;I WANT MORE !<BR><BR>December 2001 hopefully.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3508<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yb01.mx.aol.com (rly-yb01.mail.aol.com [172.18.146.1]) by air-yb03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Sat, 06 Jan 2001 15:03:08 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yb01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sat, 06 Jan 2001 15:02:38 1900<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id PAA71397;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 15:01:36 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sat, 6 Jan 2001 14:58:33 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id OAA71286<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 14:58:33 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 14:58:33 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101061958.OAA71286@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3508<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3509</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/7/01 12:49:32 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sunday, January 7 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3509<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>OT:&nbsp;&nbsp; Pyramid/JTAS access problems<BR>near keyboard kill<BR>RE: Random Jumpspace Thoughts<BR>Thank you. (with a 3/4 height bow) Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3508<BR>Graphical fun<BR>Viking Space Lawyers Anyone? Truly Arcane Source Materials for an Alternative Law System <BR>RE: another question<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 16:01:21 -0500<BR>From: "Vincent Runci" &lt;vahid@prodigy.net&gt;<BR>Subject: OT:&nbsp;&nbsp; Pyramid/JTAS access problems<BR><BR>Apologies if this has already been brought up,<BR><BR>Is anyone else on the list experiencing problems<BR>getting on to either the Pyramid or JTAS websites?<BR><BR>It starts downloading for me but it never finishes.&nbsp; I am not currently<BR>experiencing any other online problems.<BR><BR>thanks, Vince Runci<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 15:44:53 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: near keyboard kill<BR><BR>Kiri types:<BR>&gt;On Fri, 5 Jan 2001, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; OB-TRAV: A minor species that uses similar names? How about their own <BR>&gt; ship<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; designations? eg the Vicious Bastard class Cruiser _Not in the Face_ :)<BR>&gt; &gt; Or the Lying Scum class ship I'll_Still_Respect_You_in_the_Morning?<BR>&gt; &gt; Come to think of it, that'd be an interesting name for a Free Trader. :-)<BR>&gt;I had a ship called Spit_or_Swallow once.<BR><BR>I had just put down my tea and swallowed, otherwise I would have splorted <BR>all over the keyboard.<BR><BR>"This is the Free Trader "Spit_or_Splort" requesting landing instructions."<BR><BR><BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>These opinions are mine, no one else wants `em.<BR>Joan of Arc: the patron saint of welders http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 16:24:32 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Random Jumpspace Thoughts<BR><BR>John Groth writes:<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;I suggest that jump routes are not strictly linear, and<BR>&gt;that one of the reasons for variable jump duration (in normal jumps) is<BR>&gt;that the astrogator has plotted a curving jumpspace route to avoid the<BR>&gt;100-diameter range of known masses (comets, planets, planetoids [either<BR>&gt;rogue or in belts], black holes, the late Orson Welles, etc.).<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I find it simpler to assume that movement through "jumpspace" is<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; perpendicular to the three dimensions of "normal" space.&nbsp; In this<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; way, there is no interaction at all between the jumping ship and<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; anything in "normal" space except at the points of exit and entry.<BR><BR>&gt;2.&nbsp; Marc Miller's seminal article on jumpspace also states that "the<BR>&gt;laws of conservation of mass and energy continue to operate on ships<BR>&gt;which have jumped; when a ship exits jump, it retains the speed and<BR>&gt;direction it had when it entered."&nbsp; I have always interpreted this to<BR>&gt;mean that the vector of a ship exiting jumpspace will be exactly opposed<BR>&gt;to that ship's vector upon entering jumpspace with respect to the<BR>&gt;governing bodies.<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That is an interesting interpretation, but doesn't it make more sense<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; go the other way?&nbsp; If you have reversed direction relative to the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; nearest world (leaving aside for the moment the problems<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; associated with the relative velocities of the source and destination<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; worlds), you have changed your speed and direction rather than<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; conserved it.&nbsp; A game reason for not doing it that way is that forcing<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ships to turn about, either in the source system or the destination<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; system, makes ships vulnerable to p*****s and other raiders.<BR><BR>&gt;3.&nbsp; While directly contradicted by Marc Miller's article on jumpspace, I<BR>&gt;find it dramatically appropriate to allow ships to plot an exit from<BR>&gt;jumpspace closer than 100 diameters from the governing body, with risks<BR>&gt;equivalent to those found when entering jumpspace within 100 diameters<BR>&gt;of a given body (increased chance of misjump or ship destruction). <BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I am in full agreement with you here.&nbsp; IMTU you can aim to jump<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; closer than 100 diameters, and even if you don't you may<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; sometimes arrive closer than 100 diameters due to errors in<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; jump calculations.&nbsp; It adds some interesting possibilities, changes<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; little in canon as it is rarely used (for obvious reasons), and makes<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; more sense to me with being able to attempt jumps from within<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 100 diameters.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 16:44:31 -0600<BR>From: William Barnett-Lewis &lt;wlewis@mailbag.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Thank you. (with a 3/4 height bow) Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3508<BR><BR>So perfectly true. Thank!<BR><BR>William<BR><BR>on 1/6/01 1:58 PM, Traveller-digest at owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 16:22:00 -0800 (PST)<BR>&gt; From: Kiri Aradia Morgan &lt;tiamat@tsoft.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3501<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; On Fri, 5 Jan 2001, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; OB-TRAV: A minor species that uses similar names? How about their own ship<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; designations? eg the Vicious Bastard class Cruiser _Not in the Face_ :)<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Or the Lying Scum class ship I'll_Still_Respect_You_in_the_Morning?<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Come to think of it, that'd be an interesting name for a Free Trader. :-)<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt; I had a ship called Spit_or_Swallow once.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Kiri ^_^<BR>&gt; ******************************************************************************<BR>&gt; Kiri Aradia Morgan&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 93!&nbsp; Thou Art God<BR>&gt; tiamat@tsoft.com<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; "If time passes, everything turns into beauty<BR>&gt; If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away<BR>&gt; Everything starts wearing fresh colors<BR>&gt; Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody<BR>&gt; Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic<BR>&gt; Desire is embraced in a dream..."&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -- X-JAPAN<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; ------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 23:44:34 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Graphical fun<BR><BR>I just finished doing a "cover" for&nbsp; the latest issue of Le Mercenaire, the<BR>magazine for merc in the Marches.<BR><BR>Jesse, I stole the Merc Cruiser off your site.&nbsp; Now I just need Glenn to<BR>post the latest goings on on Heya.<BR><BR>Check out http://merc.travellercentral.com for a look.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend"<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2001 08:39:00 -0500<BR>From: "Daniel Phelps" &lt;phelpsd@gate.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Viking Space Lawyers Anyone? Truly Arcane Source Materials for an Alternative Law System <BR><BR>Volume II of the Laws of Early Iceland (Gragas), from the <BR>University of Manitoba Press, is now available!!&nbsp; #1 was published in 1980.<BR><BR>The nice man at the press wrote -- "we've finally updated our website, so <BR>if you know of anyone/groups who might be interested, they can check <BR>under New Books at <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; http://www.umanitoba.ca/uofmpress "<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2001 15:43:40 -0500<BR>From: "Terry Carlino" &lt;carlino@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: another question<BR><BR>Were any of the High Lightning Class ships which were converted to<BR>commercial service used to transport passengers as well as cargo?<BR><BR><BR>Terry C<BR>All that is Gold does not glitter<BR>Not all who travel are lost<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Eamon Patrick Watters<BR>Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2001 11:09 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: re: another question<BR><BR>GDWGAMES@aol.com sent:<BR>&gt; What's the largest passenger carrying starship mentioned in print?<BR><BR>Challenge 63 has the 'Affinity', a World Class Liner, 200,000dt, M1, J2<BR>IIRC.<BR><BR>There's also that Modular 500,000dt Imperial Transport at the back of the<BR>Rebellion Sourcebook, IIRC it had passenger modules.<BR><BR>Eamon Watters<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3509<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (rly-yg01.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.1]) by air-yg01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 15:49:32 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sun, 07 Jan 2001 15:49:05 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id PAA25947;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sun, 7 Jan 2001 15:48:23 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sun, 7 Jan 2001 15:46:50 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id PAA25887<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sun, 7 Jan 2001 15:46:50 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2001 15:46:50 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101072046.PAA25887@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3509<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3510</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/8/01 3:17:56 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Monday, January 8 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3510<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>[www] 07 Jan 2001 - Freelance Traveller Updated<BR>GT: RoF 'Nothing to see here, please move along'<BR>Re: GT: RoF 'Nothing to see here, please move along'<BR>Silly/Awesome idea<BR>RE: Iris Valves<BR>Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Silly/Awesome idea<BR>Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Silly/Awesome idea<BR>RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>RE: Iris Valves<BR>re: Syleans<BR>RE: Iris Valves<BR>Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>RE: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR>re: Graphical fun<BR>Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2001 18:08:31 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: [www] 07 Jan 2001 - Freelance Traveller Updated<BR><BR>Freelance Traveller, the Electronic Fan-Supported Traveller Resource has<BR>posted its most recent update to http://come.to/FreelanceTraveller and<BR>http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/Default.htm.&nbsp; <BR><BR>In this update:<BR><BR>- Chapter ten of _The_Hostile_Stars_, Fred Ramen's ongoing serial story,<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; has been posted to Raconteur's Rest. <BR><BR>- A new question has come in to Freelance Traveller; find it on the Ask<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; Freelance Traveller page in the Information Center.<BR><BR>- Rick Stump has written a White Paper on Planetary Assault Operations.<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; Read it in Doing It My Way.<BR><BR>- Updated the Published Products list and the FAQ to reflect recent<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; SJGames releases.<BR><BR>- Minor formatting fixups throughout the site.<BR><BR>Your questions, comments, and ideas are always welcome at Freelance<BR>Traveller.&nbsp; Please write to freelancetraveller@yahoo.com with any and all<BR>of them, as we are in the process of reconfiguring the forms, and they may<BR>be temporarily disabled.&nbsp; Freelance Traveller depends on the good will of<BR>Traveller fans both to visit our site and justify our existence, and to<BR>write for us, making our existence possible.<BR><BR>Freelance Traveller is mirrored at http://w3.execnet.com/jeffz.<BR><BR>Freelance Traveller wishes to extend its thanks and appreciation to The<BR>Traveller Downport (http://www.downport.com) and to Executive Network<BR>Information Systems (http://www.execnet.com) for hosting services. Without<BR>organizations willing to cooperate with Freelance Traveller's ever-growing<BR>needs, we would be unable to bring you the articles and other resources<BR>that have made Freelance Traveller one of the premier Traveller sites on<BR>the 'net.<BR><BR><BR>Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture <BR>Enterprises, 1977-2000.&nbsp; Use of the trademark in <BR>this notice and in the referenced materials is not <BR>intended to infringe or devalue the trademark.<BR><BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin, Editor<BR>Freelance Traveller - The Electronic Fan-Supported Traveller Resource<BR>http://come.to/FreelanceTraveller<BR>http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/Default.htm<BR>freelancetraveller@yahoo.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 00:14:31 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: GT: RoF 'Nothing to see here, please move along'<BR><BR>I'm just reading the truly excellent GT: Rim of Fire by Jon Zeigler, <BR>and was intrigued by one of the references in the planetary write <BR>ups. Bear in mind that these only detail the interesting or important <BR>worlds in the Solomani Rim, as the supplement doesn't have the same <BR>paragraph for each system that GT: Behind the Claw does.<BR><BR>"3209 Pagliacci - is a backwater agricultural planet, most of which <BR>is uninhabited and unexplored. It is occasionally used as a stopover <BR>by ships heading towards Solomani or Hiver territory, but otherwise <BR>plays little role in the subsector economy." (c) 2000 SJ Games.<BR><BR>Doesn't this seems suspicious? All the other references are really <BR>important or economic power houses! What are Messers Zeigler and <BR>Wiseman trying to hide from us? eh? And no doubt that famous Solomani <BR>DeGraff is involved too as he did the cover for 'Rim of Fire'.<BR><BR>"Nothing to see here, please move along"<BR>"Pagliacci - see mostly harmless."<BR>"Please look at the red light..."<BR><BR>What are the powers-that-be hiding at Pagliacci?<BR><BR>FNORD - thus the Templars reveal their plottings by the lack of <BR>evidence in place. Must be a conspiracy! ;-)<BR><BR>Dom (jibbering)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2001 19:29:56 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: RoF 'Nothing to see here, please move along'<BR><BR>&gt;What are the powers-that-be hiding at Pagliacci?<BR><BR>From the name, it's probably the site of the infamous Crying Clown School. <BR>Heartless assassins, one and all, and they can fit over twenty of them into <BR>a grav car.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2001 19:33:36 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Silly/Awesome idea<BR><BR>I recently purchased the Fantasia 2000 DVD. If you haven't seen<BR>Fantasia 2000, you may want to skip this.<BR><BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR><BR>Ok, I was watching the "Pines of Rome" sequence and it struck me that<BR>if the whales had psi powers, it was *possible*. And I had this vision<BR>of someone encountering psionic whales doing this on some newly<BR>discovered world (obviously stocked by Grandfather :-)<BR><BR>"Sensors have detected a number of targets emerging from the ocean,<BR>they are flying low and slow in a loose formation..."<BR><BR>"Control to Eagle 3, check them out..."<BR><BR>"Eagle 3, roger."<BR><BR>&lt;incoherent noises&gt;<BR><BR>"Control to Eagle 3, what are the targets!&gt;<BR><BR>"Eagle 3 to Control. Bring up my video feed on channel 5 and tell me<BR>what *you* see... I've *gotta* be seeing things!"<BR><BR>&lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2001 22:39:38 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Iris Valves<BR><BR>I was vexed about how much space an Iris Valve took in the real world: The<BR>rule of thumb formula is 2 * portal diameter + x + y, where x = sealing area<BR>and y = mechanical allowance. This led to an AutoCAD drawing, and then to a<BR>(Primitive) animated GIF to prove the mechanical theory. The kicker is that<BR>the Iris Valve Segment pivots cannot be in the same plane as the Valve<BR>Segments: in other words, the area of the pivot which is intersected by an<BR>adjacent segment must be cut away to allow clearance for the valve to open<BR>and close. The minimum number of segments for an Iris Valve using constant<BR>radii is six.<BR><BR>It's a bit much to post the GIF as an attachment (116k), but anyone who<BR>wants a copy of the image is welcome to it. I'll clean it up and post it on<BR>a website in a few days, at any rate.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Best,<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Matt Helton<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2001 10:51:27 +0000<BR>From: Brian Caball &lt;boc@raidtec.ie&gt;<BR>Subject: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>If momentum and energy is conserved (and we assume they are) when you<BR>jump, does this not mean that you must have the same potential energy<BR>when you arrived as when you left? Thus, if jumping to and from planets<BR>of the same size and mass, if one jumps from 100 diameters, one would<BR>expect to arrive at 100 diameters. If one jumped from 10 diameters, one<BR>would expect to arrive at 10 diameters. <BR><BR>I realise you could turn this energy into heat, or whatever, in theory,<BR>but how could this be done in practice? It cannot be converted to Ke<BR>because then your momentum would be different. <BR><BR>It may be hazardous jumping too soon when going from jupiter to mars, as<BR>you may end up emerging only a few miles above (or below!) the martian<BR>surface.<BR><BR>- -Brian<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2001 08:22:28 -0500<BR>From: Kurt Feltenberger &lt;kurt@blazenet.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Silly/Awesome idea<BR><BR>At 07:33 PM 01/07/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;I recently purchased the Fantasia 2000 DVD. If you haven't seen<BR>&gt;Fantasia 2000, you may want to skip this.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Ok, I was watching the "Pines of Rome" sequence and it struck me that<BR>&gt;if the whales had psi powers, it was *possible*. And I had this vision<BR>&gt;of someone encountering psionic whales doing this on some newly<BR>&gt;discovered world (obviously stocked by Grandfather :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"Sensors have detected a number of targets emerging from the ocean,<BR>&gt;they are flying low and slow in a loose formation..."<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"Control to Eagle 3, check them out..."<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"Eagle 3, roger."<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&lt;incoherent noises&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"Control to Eagle 3, what are the targets!&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"Eagle 3 to Control. Bring up my video feed on channel 5 and tell me<BR>&gt;what *you* see... I've *gotta* be seeing things!"<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>Sounds a lot like Alan Dean Foster's "Cachalot."&nbsp; After reading that book, <BR>I fell in love with the concept of water worlds and I think each time I <BR>developed a water world this book influenced me.<BR><BR>Kurt Feltenberger<BR><BR>"To our Country! In her intercourse with foreign nations,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; may she always be in the right, but our country, right or wrong!"<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ~Stephen Decatur<BR><BR><BR>mailto:kurt@blazenet.net<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2001 07:58:57 -0700<BR>From: Merrick Burkhardt &lt;merrick@rt66.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR>on 1/5/01 2:36 PM, Steve (Bloo) Daniels at sdaniels@playnet.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Merrick Burkhardt wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; The zero had low wing loading, and was indeed a great turn and burn<BR>&gt;&gt; plane--it was also a decent energy fighter. People forget that the major<BR>&gt;&gt; plus of the zero at the beginning of the war was its high speed.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; SHHHH!&nbsp; Quit giving away my Zekrets!!!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; I fly mostly F4Fs in Warbirds, and I do pretty well. Mostly this is because<BR>&gt;&gt; i have the benefit of knowing what NOT to do with a zeke ahead of time &lt;G&gt;.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; If you see =webs= in there, ask him out fighting =bloo=;<BR>&gt; his Spit vs. my zeke.&nbsp; ;-)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; bloo<BR><BR><BR>Rgr, bloo, will do<BR><BR>Merrick "tater-" Burkhardt<BR><BR>PS-see ya in WB, and if yer a zeke and I'm a wildcat--RUN<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 05:18:05 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; If momentum and energy is conserved (and we assume they are) when you<BR>&gt; jump, does this not mean that you must have the same potential energy<BR>&gt; when you arrived as when you left? Thus, if jumping to and from planets<BR>&gt; of the same size and mass, if one jumps from 100 diameters, one would<BR>&gt; expect to arrive at 100 diameters. If one jumped from 10 diameters, one<BR>&gt; would expect to arrive at 10 diameters. <BR><BR>Actually, you need to take into account the gravity wells of both stars<BR>as well. And possibly of other stars. Just consider the difference in<BR>potential energy between Earth orbit and Mars orbit as measured with<BR>respect to the *sun*, never mind the planets themselves. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2001 08:21:25<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Silly/Awesome idea<BR><BR>At 07:33 PM 1/7/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Ok, I was watching the "Pines of Rome" sequence and it struck me that<BR>&gt;if the whales had psi powers, it was *possible*. And I had this vision<BR>&gt;of someone encountering psionic whales doing this on some newly<BR>&gt;discovered world (obviously stocked by Grandfather :-)<BR><BR>Actually, that sequence was Disney's way of telling us that Uncle Walt is<BR>on ice, but will soon reemerge and rise to new hights!&nbsp; Ia! Fthagn!&nbsp; M-I-C!<BR>(See you real soon!) K-E-Y (When the stars are right, uh-huh!)<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; http://gridlore.home.mondspring.com<BR><BR>"A mrgs einu sinni hluti minn systir..."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 16:48:46 -0000<BR>From: "michael.scanlon" &lt;michael.scanlon@bmthonline.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>hi there.<BR>I would like to think if I was lucky enough to make the safe jump in a<BR>situation where miss jump were possible, like if I was to jump quite close<BR>to a planet, due to reasons beyond my control ie emergency reasons; that<BR>during jump or at the process of jumping, calculations would allow for the<BR>re introduction of the ship at a safe distance from the destination planet.<BR>With this as a factor, jumping and then re emerging from jump space, being<BR>like a see saw effect on the distance from planets either end of the journey<BR>would not be an area of debate, but would introduce the resolution of<BR>starship design in respect to those assemblies involved in calculating and<BR>putting into effect the actual jump statistics.<BR>The resolution of such module assemblies having an effect which counter acts<BR>the possibility of the kind of errors as mention in the original momentum<BR>post. The function of this module if not in operation would result in the<BR>effect of equal distance in D's of the destination planet and the planet<BR>which the starship left from. Though this introduction of Starship Jump<BR>drive resolution could be catered for in higher tech designs of advanced<BR>jump drive technology.<BR><BR>: )<BR>Mike.<BR><BR>Michael.Scanlon@Bmthonline.net<BR>ICQ#27333894<BR><BR>"Nothing that God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in Heaven for...."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 09:29:45 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Brian Caball writes:<BR>&gt; If momentum and energy is conserved (and we assume they are) when you<BR>&gt; jump, does this not mean that you must have the same potential energy<BR>&gt; when you arrived as when you left? Thus, if jumping to and from planets<BR>&gt; of the same size and mass, if one jumps from 100 diameters, one would<BR>&gt; expect to arrive at 100 diameters. If one jumped from 10 diameters, one<BR>&gt; would expect to arrive at 10 diameters. <BR><BR>As '100 diameters' is nowhere near a constant potential energy, assuming that<BR>potential energy is conserved will result in significantly different results<BR>from what you're thinking.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 11:01:31 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Iris Valves<BR><BR>Let me know url when it is posted would love to look at it.<BR><BR>hasta<BR><BR>me<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Matthew W. Helton [mailto:mwhelton@cox-internet.com]<BR>Sent: Sunday, January 07, 2001 8:40 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Iris Valves<BR><BR><BR><BR>I was vexed about how much space an Iris Valve took in the real world: The<BR>rule of thumb formula is 2 * portal diameter + x + y, where x = sealing area<BR>and y = mechanical allowance. This led to an AutoCAD drawing, and then to a<BR>(Primitive) animated GIF to prove the mechanical theory. The kicker is that<BR>the Iris Valve Segment pivots cannot be in the same plane as the Valve<BR>Segments: in other words, the area of the pivot which is intersected by an<BR>adjacent segment must be cut away to allow clearance for the valve to open<BR>and close. The minimum number of segments for an Iris Valve using constant<BR>radii is six.<BR><BR>It's a bit much to post the GIF as an attachment (116k), but anyone who<BR>wants a copy of the image is welcome to it. I'll clean it up and post it on<BR>a website in a few days, at any rate.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Best,<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Matt<BR>Helton<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 11:06:04 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Syleans<BR><BR>&gt;From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;You are hereby remanded into the custody of the Traveller-Culture list,<BR>&gt;where you are expected to develop this further, and submit it for inclusion<BR>&gt;in the Traveller-Culture databanks.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;A failure of compliance on your part will result in a psychological mode<BR>&gt;switch on my part into a petulant whiny b*****d.<BR><BR>OK, I haven't read or posted anything on that list in a long time.&nbsp;&nbsp; I'll<BR>cross-post this there and see what discussion gets generated from which I<BR>can expand.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 11:18:38 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Iris Valves<BR><BR>Seconded!<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of William Lane<BR>&gt; Sent: Monday, January 08, 2001 11:02 AM<BR>&gt; To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Iris Valves<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Let me know url when it is posted would love to look at it.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; hasta<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; me<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Matthew W. Helton [mailto:mwhelton@cox-internet.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: Sunday, January 07, 2001 8:40 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Iris Valves<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I was vexed about how much space an Iris Valve took in the real world: The<BR>&gt; rule of thumb formula is 2 * portal diameter + x + y, where x =<BR>&gt; sealing area<BR>&gt; and y = mechanical allowance. This led to an AutoCAD drawing, and<BR>&gt; then to a<BR>&gt; (Primitive) animated GIF to prove the mechanical theory. The<BR>&gt; kicker is that<BR>&gt; the Iris Valve Segment pivots cannot be in the same plane as the Valve<BR>&gt; Segments: in other words, the area of the pivot which is intersected by an<BR>&gt; adjacent segment must be cut away to allow clearance for the valve to open<BR>&gt; and close. The minimum number of segments for an Iris Valve using constant<BR>&gt; radii is six.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; It's a bit much to post the GIF as an attachment (116k), but anyone who<BR>&gt; wants a copy of the image is welcome to it. I'll clean it up and<BR>&gt; post it on<BR>&gt; a website in a few days, at any rate.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Best,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Matt<BR>&gt; Helton<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 11:19:37 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>Read all about the news Tac Missile in Le Mercenaire, the Spinward Marches'<BR>magazine for mercenaries and professional adventurers.<BR><BR>See http://merc.travellercentral.com<BR><BR>The article is in issue 15.<BR>http://merc.travellercentral.com/issues/mercenaire15.html<BR><BR>Doug B, this means you.<BR>- ----<BR>When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend.<BR>- ----<BR>Tod Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellerguns.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 11:28:57 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR>Im going to pipe in on this. I have always been told that the way to fight<BR>zeros was not to dog fight them but to do as the "Flying Tigers" (original<BR>AVG not the army aircorps group who replaced them) did.<BR><BR>P40s could not hope to turn with a zero and in a strait dog fight was not<BR>matched to go against them. So the Tigers Would do these dive runs on them.<BR><BR>The would dive down building up speed. And then after the pass would use<BR>that Momentum to regain their Altitude.<BR><BR>now i am no expert in any stretch of the Imagination. But that is what i was<BR>told the Flying Tigers did and i think their Explots are probably one of the<BR>best in the entire war.<BR><BR>hasta<BR><BR>me<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 11:36:15 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Graphical fun<BR><BR>&gt;From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Jesse, I stole the Merc Cruiser off your site.&nbsp; Now I just need Glenn to<BR>&gt;post the latest goings on on Heya.<BR><BR>Nothing much has been going on on Heya during the year-end harvest festivals<BR>(which have led to much revelry in Vargr town).&nbsp; It is expected that the<BR>spring planting will lead to further engagements between the resettled Vargr<BR>farmers and the Heyan humans.&nbsp; This reporter, at least, predicts that the<BR>next battle will be fought on 16 or 17 February, according to the old Terran<BR>calendar.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2001 17:11:44 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR>Merrick Burkhardt wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; PS-see ya in WB, and if yer a zeke and I'm a wildcat--RUN<BR><BR>Unfortunately, you'll never see me in warbirds<BR>ever again.<BR><BR>Formerly&nbsp; =bloo=<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3510<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yc02.mx.aol.com (rly-yc02.mail.aol.com [172.18.149.34]) by air-yc01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Mon, 08 Jan 2001 18:17:56 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yc02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Mon, 08 Jan 2001 18:17:12 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id SAA83753;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 8 Jan 2001 18:16:11 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 8 Jan 2001 18:11:16 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id SAA83616<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 8 Jan 2001 18:11:16 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 18:11:16 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101082311.SAA83616@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3510<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3511</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/9/01 12:15:08 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Tuesday, January 9 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3511<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR>RE: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR>Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Cachalot the basis of ... was Silly/Awesome idea<BR>RE: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR>RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Azhanti High Lightning/Snapshot Scenarios<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3509<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: GT: RoF<BR>RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: WFRP<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: near keyboard kill<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2001 17:15:54 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR>Those are basic energy fighting tactics, affectionally called<BR>"Boom and Zoom".&nbsp; The Boom is the diving attack.&nbsp; The<BR>Zoom is the 'zoom' climb after the guns pass.<BR><BR>All described further up the thread.<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Im going to pipe in on this. I have always been told that the way to fight<BR>&gt; zeros was not to dog fight them but to do as the "Flying Tigers" (original<BR>&gt; AVG not the army aircorps group who replaced them) did.<BR><BR>[snip]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 15:22:16 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR>Oh sorry 8P<BR><BR>Hasta<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Steve (Bloo) Daniels [mailto:sdaniels@playnet.com]<BR>Sent: Monday, January 08, 2001 3:16 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR><BR>Those are basic energy fighting tactics, affectionally called<BR>"Boom and Zoom".&nbsp; The Boom is the diving attack.&nbsp; The<BR>Zoom is the 'zoom' climb after the guns pass.<BR><BR>All described further up the thread.<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Im going to pipe in on this. I have always been told that the way to fight<BR>&gt; zeros was not to dog fight them but to do as the "Flying Tigers" (original<BR>&gt; AVG not the army aircorps group who replaced them) did.<BR><BR>[snip]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2001 17:34:19 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR>hehe.&nbsp; I'm the one who's sorry for you.<BR>You don't have access to better.<BR>You will soon.&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Oh sorry 8P<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hasta<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Steve (Bloo) Daniels [mailto:sdaniels@playnet.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: Monday, January 08, 2001 3:16 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Those are basic energy fighting tactics, affectionally called<BR>&gt; "Boom and Zoom".&nbsp; The Boom is the diving attack.&nbsp; The<BR>&gt; Zoom is the 'zoom' climb after the guns pass.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; All described further up the thread.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; bloo<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; William Lane wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Im going to pipe in on this. I have always been told that the way to fight<BR>&gt; &gt; zeros was not to dog fight them but to do as the "Flying Tigers" (original<BR>&gt; &gt; AVG not the army aircorps group who replaced them) did.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; [snip]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 10:46:56 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>On Mon, Jan 08, 2001 at 10:51:27AM +0000, Brian Caball wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; If momentum and energy is conserved (and we assume they are) when you<BR>&gt; jump, does this not mean that you must have the same potential energy<BR>&gt; when you arrived as when you left?<BR><BR>Best to assume that momentum and energy are *not* conserved.&nbsp; Even in<BR>a Newtonian universe, this makes things *very* awkward.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Thus, if jumping to and from planets of the same size and mass, if<BR>&gt; one jumps from 100 diameters, one would expect to arrive at 100<BR>&gt; diameters.<BR><BR>What about the potential energy due to the star?&nbsp; What about galactic<BR>potential energy?<BR><BR>You will have big problems with the 100D limit -- in general, jump<BR>precipitation will violate the conservation laws you've carefully<BR>constructed.&nbsp; Of course you may be proposing an alternative to jump<BR>masking, not an addition, so this may not apply.<BR><BR>Travel between stars of different sizes will be greatly complicated.<BR>The life zones of one star may be at a greatly different potential<BR>energy level from another.&nbsp; This will force large amounts of in-system<BR>travel and make the difference in stellar types the primary<BR>determinant of travel times.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; It may be hazardous jumping too soon when going from jupiter to<BR>&gt; mars, as you may end up emerging only a few miles above (or below!)<BR>&gt; the martian surface.<BR><BR>Actually, it may be impossible to jump from Jupiter to Mars under this<BR>model.&nbsp; Mars is at a much lower potential within the Sun's gravity<BR>than Jupiter.<BR><BR><BR>Actually, it is possible.&nbsp; The minimum potential (Jupiter's surface at<BR>perhelion) is -2.00 GJ/kg.&nbsp; The maximum (Jupiter's aphelion, far from<BR>Jupiter) is -0.15 GJ/kg.&nbsp; The minimum potential at Mars (Mars' center<BR>at perhelion) is -0.72 GJ/kg, and maximum -0.48 GJ/kg.&nbsp; So they<BR>overlap, and hence a ship at just the right distance from Jupiter<BR>could reach Mars.&nbsp; The chance of emerging within Mars by accident is<BR>tiny, though.&nbsp; Most likely the ship would just miss Mars completely.<BR><BR>An Earth-Mars jump would be impossible though, as would a jump between<BR>Mars and any of Jupiter's moons (or further out).<BR><BR>A jump from the biozone of a nearby red dwarf like Barnard's Star or<BR>Wolf 359 to Sol would put the ship inside the orbit of Mercury -- not<BR>the most comfortable place to emerge from jumpspace.&nbsp; Jumping to a<BR>point in interstellar space from anywhere near a star would be<BR>impossible in the Rimward direction, but OK Coreward.<BR><BR><BR>- - Tim<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 16:23:20 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Timothy Tow &lt;t_pz_t@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Cachalot the basis of ... was Silly/Awesome idea<BR><BR>Was that waterworld in the Spinward Marches with the<BR>disappearing colonists based on Cachalot?<BR><BR>What other sci fi plot ideas have been paraphrased in<BR>traveller's historical timeline.<BR><BR>Here's another one. The scheming heir in the<BR>Space:1999 episode, The Dorcons, appears Lucanic, but<BR>then scheming heirs to the throne are Shakespearean as<BR>well.<BR><BR>Tim<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Photos - Share your holiday photos online!<BR>http://photos.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 16:23:38 -0800<BR>From: "tsykoduk" &lt;tsykoduk@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR>Yeah - that's called Boom and Zoom.<BR><BR>Note - in the dive, do not allow yourself to get coalt or lower, as you<BR>never regain as much as you dive... ;)<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of William Lane<BR>Sent: Monday, January 08, 2001 11:29 AM<BR>To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>Subject: RE: Dogfighting Zeroes (was Re: Lend Lease)<BR><BR><BR>Im going to pipe in on this. I have always been told that the way to fight<BR>zeros was not to dog fight them but to do as the "Flying Tigers" (original<BR>AVG not the army aircorps group who replaced them) did.<BR><BR>P40s could not hope to turn with a zero and in a strait dog fight was not<BR>matched to go against them. So the Tigers Would do these dive runs on them.<BR><BR>The would dive down building up speed. And then after the pass would use<BR>that Momentum to regain their Altitude.<BR><BR>now i am no expert in any stretch of the Imagination. But that is what i was<BR>told the Flying Tigers did and i think their Explots are probably one of the<BR>best in the entire war.<BR><BR>hasta<BR><BR>me<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 16:27:22 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>You know i read all this on jumps and jump drives and truthfully it makes me<BR>feel Like a complete idiot 8P<BR><BR>me 8P<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Timothy Little [mailto:tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net]<BR>Sent: Monday, January 08, 2001 3:47 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR><BR>On Mon, Jan 08, 2001 at 10:51:27AM +0000, Brian Caball wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; If momentum and energy is conserved (and we assume they are) when you<BR>&gt; jump, does this not mean that you must have the same potential energy<BR>&gt; when you arrived as when you left?<BR><BR>Best to assume that momentum and energy are *not* conserved.&nbsp; Even in<BR>a Newtonian universe, this makes things *very* awkward.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Thus, if jumping to and from planets of the same size and mass, if<BR>&gt; one jumps from 100 diameters, one would expect to arrive at 100<BR>&gt; diameters.<BR><BR>What about the potential energy due to the star?&nbsp; What about galactic<BR>potential energy?<BR><BR>You will have big problems with the 100D limit -- in general, jump<BR>precipitation will violate the conservation laws you've carefully<BR>constructed.&nbsp; Of course you may be proposing an alternative to jump<BR>masking, not an addition, so this may not apply.<BR><BR>Travel between stars of different sizes will be greatly complicated.<BR>The life zones of one star may be at a greatly different potential<BR>energy level from another.&nbsp; This will force large amounts of in-system<BR>travel and make the difference in stellar types the primary<BR>determinant of travel times.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; It may be hazardous jumping too soon when going from jupiter to<BR>&gt; mars, as you may end up emerging only a few miles above (or below!)<BR>&gt; the martian surface.<BR><BR>Actually, it may be impossible to jump from Jupiter to Mars under this<BR>model.&nbsp; Mars is at a much lower potential within the Sun's gravity<BR>than Jupiter.<BR><BR><BR>Actually, it is possible.&nbsp; The minimum potential (Jupiter's surface at<BR>perhelion) is -2.00 GJ/kg.&nbsp; The maximum (Jupiter's aphelion, far from<BR>Jupiter) is -0.15 GJ/kg.&nbsp; The minimum potential at Mars (Mars' center<BR>at perhelion) is -0.72 GJ/kg, and maximum -0.48 GJ/kg.&nbsp; So they<BR>overlap, and hence a ship at just the right distance from Jupiter<BR>could reach Mars.&nbsp; The chance of emerging within Mars by accident is<BR>tiny, though.&nbsp; Most likely the ship would just miss Mars completely.<BR><BR>An Earth-Mars jump would be impossible though, as would a jump between<BR>Mars and any of Jupiter's moons (or further out).<BR><BR>A jump from the biozone of a nearby red dwarf like Barnard's Star or<BR>Wolf 359 to Sol would put the ship inside the orbit of Mercury -- not<BR>the most comfortable place to emerge from jumpspace.&nbsp; Jumping to a<BR>point in interstellar space from anywhere near a star would be<BR>impossible in the Rimward direction, but OK Coreward.<BR><BR><BR>- - Tim<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2001 00:03:59 -0500<BR>From: "Walt Smith" &lt;firelock_ny@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Azhanti High Lightning/Snapshot Scenarios<BR><BR>Hello all.<BR><BR>Has anyone played their own AHL/Snapshot scenarios,<BR>and come up with some interesting ones that they'd<BR>like to share?&nbsp; How about house rules and variants?<BR><BR>Walt Smith<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2001 01:22:16 -0500<BR>From: "Walt Smith" &lt;firelock_ny@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3509<BR><BR>Terry Carlino wrote:<BR>&gt;Were any of the High Lightning Class ships which were converted to<BR>&gt;commercial service used to transport passengers as well as cargo?<BR><BR>IIRC, most of the cargo conversion AHL's kept (at least) one<BR>"Flight Crew" quarters deck for a passenger deck - I believe<BR>the one right above the Boat Deck (aftmost deck) was the usual.<BR><BR>Walt Smith<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2001 22:54:37 -0800<BR>From: "Mark F. Cook" &lt;markc@peak.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt; writes:<BR><BR>&gt;Subject: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Read all about the news Tac Missile in Le Mercenaire, the Spinward Marches'<BR>&gt;magazine for mercenaries and professional adventurers.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;See http://merc.travellercentral.com<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The article is in issue 15.<BR>&gt;http://merc.travellercentral.com/issues/mercenaire15.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Doug B, this means you.<BR><BR>Tod, you are a sick, sick, sick, clever, sick man! :^)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - Mark C.<BR><BR>&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 01:39:30 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Thus, if jumping to and from planets of the same size and mass, if<BR>&gt;&gt; one jumps from 100 diameters, one would expect to arrive at 100<BR>&gt;&gt; diameters.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What about the potential energy due to the star?&nbsp; What about galactic<BR>&gt; potential energy?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; You will have big problems with the 100D limit -- in general, jump<BR>&gt; precipitation will violate the conservation laws you've carefully<BR>&gt; constructed.&nbsp; Of course you may be proposing an alternative to jump<BR>&gt; masking, not an addition, so this may not apply.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Travel between stars of different sizes will be greatly complicated.<BR>&gt; The life zones of one star may be at a greatly different potential<BR>&gt; energy level from another.&nbsp; This will force large amounts of in-system<BR>&gt; travel and make the difference in stellar types the primary<BR>&gt; determinant of travel times.<BR><BR>Not necessarily.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; It may be hazardous jumping too soon when going from jupiter to<BR>&gt;&gt; mars, as you may end up emerging only a few miles above (or below!)<BR>&gt;&gt; the martian surface.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Actually, it may be impossible to jump from Jupiter to Mars under this<BR>&gt; model.&nbsp; Mars is at a much lower potential within the Sun's gravity<BR>&gt; than Jupiter.<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Actually, it is possible.&nbsp; The minimum potential (Jupiter's surface at<BR>&gt; perhelion) is -2.00 GJ/kg.&nbsp; The maximum (Jupiter's aphelion, far from<BR>&gt; Jupiter) is -0.15 GJ/kg.&nbsp; The minimum potential at Mars (Mars' center<BR>&gt; at perhelion) is -0.72 GJ/kg, and maximum -0.48 GJ/kg.&nbsp; So they<BR>&gt; overlap, and hence a ship at just the right distance from Jupiter<BR>&gt; could reach Mars.&nbsp; The chance of emerging within Mars by accident is<BR>&gt; tiny, though.&nbsp; Most likely the ship would just miss Mars completely.<BR><BR>&gt; An Earth-Mars jump would be impossible though, as would a jump between<BR>&gt; Mars and any of Jupiter's moons (or further out).<BR><BR>No, for jumps where you gain in potential energy, the excess goes into<BR>the jump flash. <BR><BR>For jump where you lose in potential energy, you have to supply the<BR>difference with the jump drive (which is only a problem if you are<BR>*way* too deep in a gravity well). <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 22:30:02 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>[...stuff...]<BR><BR>In the message to which I was replying, the idea was that jumps were<BR>only possible where potential energy levels at origin and destination<BR>were equal.<BR><BR>&gt; No, for jumps where you gain in potential energy, the excess goes<BR>&gt; into the jump flash.<BR><BR>That can be a *lot* of flash.&nbsp; For a large freighter jumping near the<BR>biozone of a class M star, it could be equivalent of a 10 megaton<BR>detonation.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; For jump where you lose in potential energy, you have to supply the<BR>&gt; difference with the jump drive (which is only a problem if you are<BR>&gt; *way* too deep in a gravity well). <BR><BR>Again, the energy differences can be enormous.&nbsp; If the jump drive can<BR>supply at least many kilotons of energy, it would work.<BR><BR><BR>- - Tim<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 06:57:08 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: RoF<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 00:14:31 +0000<BR>&gt; From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: GT: RoF 'Nothing to see here, please move along'<BR><BR>&gt; "3209 Pagliacci - is a backwater agricultural planet, most of which <BR>&gt; is uninhabited and unexplored. It is occasionally used as a stopover <BR>&gt; by ships heading towards Solomani or Hiver territory, but otherwise <BR>&gt; plays little role in the subsector economy." (c) 2000 SJ Games.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Doesn't this seems suspicious? All the other references are really <BR>&gt; important or economic power houses!<BR><BR>As one of only two low-tech but habitable planets in the Solomani Rim,<BR>Pagliacci was the setting for Double Adventure 4: Marooned/Marooned<BR>Alone. (The other is Newcomb, setting for Prison Planet). Jon was just<BR>quoting the canonical description of that world.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2001 07:58:24 -0500<BR>From: Eric Freitas &lt;efreitos@tampabay.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>At 17:16 12/15/00 +0000, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Fix yourself up with Cryostasis. It might not work, but you got a better<BR>&gt;chance than you'd have if you didn't get yourself frozen.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Dean<BR><BR><BR>The problem is that working coldsleep requires a few invasive procedures,<BR>including replacing your blood with another oxygen carrying medium that<BR>doesn't risk freezing at just above zero centigrade.&nbsp; In addition their are<BR>a host of medical sensors that must be monitored, along with very fine<BR>control of the cooling mechanism.&nbsp; If their is a power failure, probably going<BR>to die, so don't put your coldsleep capsule in Florida. ;)<BR><BR>Of course we have only tested this system on dogs so far (with total success),<BR>so whoever tries it first will be a hero! (..or at least a guinea pig).<BR><BR>Eric<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 13:30:19 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt; That can be a *lot* of flash.&nbsp; For a large freighter jumping near the<BR>&gt; biozone of a class M star, it could be equivalent of a 10 megaton<BR>&gt; detonation.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; For jump where you lose in potential energy, you have to supply the<BR>&gt; &gt; difference with the jump drive (which is only a problem if you are<BR>&gt; &gt; *way* too deep in a gravity well). <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Again, the energy differences can be enormous.&nbsp; If the jump drive can<BR>&gt; supply at least many kilotons of energy, it would work.<BR><BR>Hmmm ... I find it a bit difficult to swallow the&nbsp; idea&nbsp; of&nbsp; jump<BR>flash as a universal energy sink for just this last&nbsp; reason.&nbsp; How<BR>about if the PE difference is&nbsp; made&nbsp; up&nbsp; with&nbsp; an&nbsp; equivalent&nbsp; KE<BR>change?&nbsp; Thus when jumping from a large world to&nbsp; a&nbsp; small&nbsp; world<BR>(*) the emerging ship could gain&nbsp; a&nbsp; significant&nbsp; inward&nbsp; vector,<BR>when jumping the other way the same ship could gain a significant<BR>outward vector.<BR><BR>Alternatively: the 100D limit for jump entry is&nbsp; based&nbsp; on&nbsp; tidal<BR>forces (as discussed in the past) but jump exit is&nbsp; based&nbsp; on&nbsp; PE<BR>(and thus simple gravity formula) ...&nbsp; which&nbsp; for&nbsp; larger&nbsp; worlds<BR>makes the exit point&nbsp; much&nbsp; further&nbsp; out&nbsp; than&nbsp; the&nbsp; entry&nbsp; point<BR>(especially for gas giants).<BR><BR>* = Assuming for this example that there isn't a big disparity in<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; relative densities betwwen the two worlds.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 09:23:42 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Trevor, Peter writes:<BR><BR>&gt; Alternatively: the 100D limit for jump entry is&nbsp; based&nbsp; on&nbsp; tidal<BR>&gt; forces (as discussed in the past) but jump exit is&nbsp; based&nbsp; on&nbsp; PE<BR>&gt; (and thus simple gravity formula) ...&nbsp; which&nbsp; for&nbsp; larger&nbsp; worlds<BR>&gt; makes the exit point&nbsp; much&nbsp; further&nbsp; out&nbsp; than&nbsp; the&nbsp; entry&nbsp; point<BR>&gt; (especially for gas giants).<BR><BR>The problem is that gravitational potential is proportional to M/D, while <BR>tidal force is proportional to M/D^3.&nbsp; Gravitational potential is also almost<BR>always heavily dominated by the influence of the star (in fact, given 100D<BR>limits, it's more or less impossible for it not to be primarily influence for<BR>a terrestrial planet.&nbsp; The sun's gravitational potential is more significant<BR>than the earth's on the surface of the earth, by a factor of around 14.&nbsp; At<BR>100D, the sun is more important by a factor of 2,800).<BR><BR>If jumping from a G0 star (in the life zone) to an M0 star, you'll wind out at<BR>a distance of 2-3x the life zone.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 17:45:15 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Anthony Jackson wrote:<BR>&gt; The problem is that gravitational potential is proportional to<BR>&gt; M/D, while tidal force is proportional to M/D^3.&nbsp; Gravitational<BR>&gt; potential is also almost always heavily dominated by the influence<BR>&gt; of the star (in fact, given 100D limits, it's more or less<BR>&gt; impossible for it not to be primarily influence for a terrestrial<BR>&gt; planet.&nbsp; The sun's gravitational potential is more significant<BR>&gt; than the earth's on the surface of the earth, by a factor of<BR>&gt; around 14.&nbsp; At 100D, the sun is more important by a factor of<BR>&gt; 2,800).<BR><BR>I thought gravity&nbsp; was&nbsp; proportional&nbsp; to&nbsp; M/D^2?&nbsp;&nbsp; But&nbsp; otherwise<BR>"Yup!" to your point as a whole.&nbsp; Which is why&nbsp; we&nbsp; 'decided'&nbsp; on<BR>tidal force rather than gravity for defining the&nbsp; 100D&nbsp; limit&nbsp; in<BR>the 'first'&nbsp; place.&nbsp; My&nbsp; preference&nbsp; is&nbsp; to&nbsp; go&nbsp; with&nbsp; the&nbsp; first<BR>solution I proposed (balancing a PE change with a KE change), the<BR>second solution (quoted above) was just thown into the ring for a<BR>quick look and dismissal.&nbsp; However, my first&nbsp; solution&nbsp; does&nbsp; not<BR>conserve momentum.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 10:51:30 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Trevor, Peter writes:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I thought gravity&nbsp; was&nbsp; proportional&nbsp; to&nbsp; M/D^2?<BR>Gravity is.&nbsp; Gravitational potential energy is M/D.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2001 14:47:22 +0000<BR>From: "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: WFRP<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 20:38 +0000 (GMT)<BR>&gt;From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: WFRP [FILK]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;In-Reply-To: &lt;Pine.GSO.4.10.10101041119350.25625-100000@mercury.cis.yale.edu&gt;<BR>&gt;Greetings dear hearts.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;In the Anne McCaffrey 'Ship who sang' series, there is one - "The Ship Who<BR>&gt;Won" - where the brain ship &amp; her brawn spend most of their space-time<BR>&gt;playing 'Myths and Legends', which seems to be a virtual-reality D&amp;D game!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I think it's likely that there will be folk who like role-playing, and<BR>&gt;they will play all sorts of things just like we do. Swords and sorcery,<BR>&gt;historical, super-heroes, contemporary, futuristic... whatever you can<BR>&gt;think of, really.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Hugs and kisses,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Mexal.<BR><BR>Many thanks to all of you who replied to my ObTrav. =)<BR><BR>Something came to me after reading this comment and the one before, about <BR>science fiction RPGs.&nbsp; At the TL of the Imperium, scientists are starting <BR>to (successfully) plumb the depths of reality.&nbsp; The only way to go, as they <BR>say, is up.&nbsp; So SFRPGs, if they do indeed exist in the 3I (or the <BR>SolConFed, or even the Zhodani Consulate!) would be leaning more towards <BR>superscience and Ancients stuff.&nbsp; Hmmm... "STARDAWN: Science Fiction <BR>Role-Playing in the Far Past", an SFRPG about roleplaying in the time of <BR>the Ancients.<BR><BR>The Zhos might go for psionic-style stuff -- while they would be horrified <BR>by the anime Akira, something vaguely similar might appeal to them: RPing a <BR>team of intendants trying to stop a psionic terror, set in the next highest <BR>tech level ("Silchardal!&nbsp; Quick, your laser body pistol!")&nbsp; And, hey, the <BR>Thought Police might see RPGs as a useful venting of social tensions. =)<BR><BR><BR>- ---<BR>==============================================================<BR>Jonathan McDermott, CNE/MCSE&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; NOSPAMcaraig@mindspring.com<BR>System Administrator&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http:\\caraig.home.mindspring.com<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Anubis@SpatialWastes -*- Caraig,Dermott@FurryMUCK<BR>IMTU tc+ tn t4 ge++ -3i+ c+(**) jt pi+ va+ dr+ pr+ zh+() so@<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; "Never trust a computer you can't throw out a window."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -Steve Wozniak<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2001 15:01:23 +0000<BR>From: "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 00:06:27 -0800<BR>&gt;From: "Kiri Aradia Morgan" &lt;tiamat@tsoft.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>&gt;Yeah...&nbsp; except at conventions, I just won't play with people that I don't<BR>&gt;know.&nbsp; There is too much harassment and idiocy visited on female<BR>&gt;players/characters by gamers who are stoopid.&nbsp; I don't differentiate between<BR>&gt;knowing people online or in RL, but I do have to have some idea of your<BR>&gt;character before I will play with you.&nbsp; It's just one of those things.&nbsp; I've<BR>&gt;been in too many games with people who were in love with "pregnancy tables"<BR>&gt;and/or rape scenarios.&nbsp; (One of the worst offenders in a game I ran was<BR>&gt;another WOMAN... she played male characters who were rapists.)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kiri&nbsp; ^_^<BR><BR>Errr... that doesn't sound like a formula for a very happy gaming environment.<BR><BR>I haven't done much GMing in recent years (except on a MUCK, sort of -- <BR>does that count?) and I've run into some player characters who were, <BR>well... entirely too gritty and socially defunct, if not outright <BR>criminal.&nbsp; The only way to deal with them is to ensure that they receive <BR>immediate and instant consequences for their actions, throw their character <BR>in the slammer (or the appropriate legal venus -- YLLMV (Your Law Level May <BR>Vary)) and have a talk with the player.&nbsp; Sometimes that worked, sometimes <BR>that didn't.<BR><BR>It's worse in certain multiplayer environment where some characters are <BR>encouraged to be blackhats; some take their role seriously, trying to make <BR>the 'whitehats' lives interesting, while some have taken it as carte blanc <BR>(carte darc?) to develop some of the most hideously criminal and socially <BR>maladjusted beasts who use the excuse of "I'm a bad guy!" to justify anything.<BR><BR>I don't know; playing a blackhat has certain standards, which are even more <BR>stringent than playing whitehats.&nbsp;&nbsp; (This is compensated by having a better <BR>wardrobe, better hair, and better theme music than the good guys. <BR>&lt;g&gt;)&nbsp; Some gamemasters might wish to shy away from running any PCs other <BR>than whitehats.&nbsp; I think it can be done, but they have to be of a certain <BR>caliber.&nbsp; I think that characters like thugs and rapists and thrillkill <BR>murderers should be strictly NPCs.&nbsp; A con man or corsair with a complex <BR>past and a certain element of sympathy to their character would be more <BR>enjoyable to play, anyway.<BR><BR>I read an article once, that noted that, no, there is nothing really <BR>stopping a player from having a character who was scum-of-the-earths.&nbsp; But <BR>why would a player want to play said character?&nbsp; That's a question that <BR>should be asked before a GM lets that character loose in their world.<BR><BR>This is, of course, IMHO. =)<BR><BR>Cheers<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2001 15:07:44 +0000<BR>From: "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: near keyboard kill<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 15:44:53 -0500<BR>&gt;From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: near keyboard kill<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kiri types:<BR>&gt; &gt;On Fri, 5 Jan 2001, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; OB-TRAV: A minor species that uses similar names? How about their own<BR>&gt; &gt; ship<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; designations? eg the Vicious Bastard class Cruiser _Not in the Face_ :)<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Or the Lying Scum class ship I'll_Still_Respect_You_in_the_Morning?<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Come to think of it, that'd be an interesting name for a Free Trader. :-)<BR>&gt; &gt;I had a ship called Spit_or_Swallow once.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I had just put down my tea and swallowed, otherwise I would have splorted<BR>&gt;all over the keyboard.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"This is the Free Trader "Spit_or_Splort" requesting landing instructions."<BR><BR>*eep!*<BR><BR>This thread is just going to get worse, isn't it? =)<BR><BR>A selected com transcript:<BR>"Free Trader F298S, you are breaking orbit for landing before we gave you <BR>permission!&nbsp; What -- heck with it.&nbsp; Spaceguard, he's yours."<BR>"Free Trader, this is the patrol cruiser _Boot to the Head_...."<BR><BR>In the current Trav campaign I'm in, I don't think we've named our ship <BR>yet.&nbsp; Considering it's a Scout campaign, with one grizzled and one newbie <BR>scout, I'm almost fearful of what game we'll be coming up with. =)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3511<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xd01.mx.aol.com (rly-xd01.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.166]) by air-xd04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 09 Jan 2001 15:15:08 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xd01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 09 Jan 2001 15:14:41 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id PAA28506;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 15:09:46 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 9 Jan 2001 15:09:29 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id PAA28462<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 15:09:29 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 15:09:29 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101092009.PAA28462@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3511<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3512</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/10/01 12:11:21 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; Wednesday, January 10 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3512<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>RE: Azhanti High Lightning/Snapshot Scenarios<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: GT: RoF<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: near keyboard kill<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: near keyboard kill<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>re: Azhanti High Lightning/Snapshot Scenarios<BR>Black hat / white hat (was Re: Traveller and Other Games)<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR>mutiny<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>The whereabouts of Andrew Akins<BR>Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR>RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 12:37:36 -0800<BR>From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>Subject: RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>Eric Freitas &lt;efreitos@tampabay.rr.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 17:16 12/15/00 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;Fix yourself up with Cryostasis. It might not work, but you got a<BR>&gt; &gt;better chance than you'd have if you didn't get yourself frozen.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Dean<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The problem is that working coldsleep requires a few invasive<BR>&gt; procedures, including replacing your blood with another oxygen<BR>&gt; carrying medium that doesn't risk freezing at just above zero<BR>&gt; centigrade.&nbsp; In addition their are a host of medical sensors that must<BR>&gt; be monitored, along with very fine control of the cooling mechanism. <BR>&gt; If their is a power failure, probably going to die, so don't put your<BR>&gt; coldsleep capsule in Florida. ;)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Of course we have only tested this system on dogs so far (with total<BR>&gt; success), so whoever tries it first will be a hero! (..or at least a<BR>&gt; guinea pig).<BR><BR>What!!!&nbsp; <BR><BR>Has someone actually frozen a dog and revived it?&nbsp; I've only heard <BR>of work on amphibians and fish.&nbsp; Does anyone have a URL or other <BR>reference to this. <BR><BR>Many Thanks-<BR><BR>- -John Snead sneadj@mindspring.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 14:36:43 -0600 <BR>From: "Smart, David J (David)" &lt;dasmart@avaya.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Azhanti High Lightning/Snapshot Scenarios<BR><BR>Walt Smith<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Hello all.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Has anyone played their own AHL/Snapshot scenarios,<BR>&gt; and come up with some interesting ones that they'd<BR>&gt; like to share?&nbsp; How about house rules and variants?<BR><BR>Yep! The scenario I GM'd was of the AHL owned by<BR>Oberlindes. It stopped just outside the Imp border<BR>with the Vargr Extents for refit and R&amp;R for most<BR>of its crew. The two players were part of the<BR>onboard "port watch" when a Vargr team tried to<BR>hijack/cripple the ship.<BR><BR>The two players started at one end of the crew deck<BR>with the Vargr "somewhere" on the same deck. A<BR>standard search &amp; destroy with one wild card..the<BR>only help they could get was a lone ship's cook,<BR>3rd class, standing watch on the Engineering deck.<BR>The rest of the port watch crew were busy mopping<BR>up additional Vargr groups on other decks.<BR><BR>The players got really smart and told the cook to cut<BR>some of the lights in the corridors. Fifteen seconds<BR>later, the cook yelled over their comm unit "I found<BR>the switch!"<BR><BR>The entire deck went dark and the players started to<BR>float.<BR><BR>Despite the ensuing slapstick, the players did rather<BR>well until one player charged down a corridor, <BR>triggered a small engineering charge one of the Vargr<BR>had jury-rigged "claymore" fashion.<BR><BR>The other player took out the rest except for one with<BR>an auto-shotgun. He charged the shotgunner and ended<BR>up, um, "ablating".<BR><BR>All in all, it was a great intro to the various<BR>aspects of combat while allowing the players to<BR>experience a form of urban warfare in a small,<BR>controllable arena.<BR><BR>David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 14:45:31 -0600 <BR>From: "Smart, David J (David)" &lt;dasmart@avaya.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott posted:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt; I read an article once, that noted that, no, there is nothing<BR>&gt; really stopping a player from having a character who was <BR>&gt; scum-of-the-earths.&nbsp; But why would a player want to play said <BR>&gt; character?&nbsp; That's a question that should be asked before a<BR>&gt; GM lets that character loose in their world.<BR><BR>And then there's those that run Zhodani...<BR><BR>David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 21:31:28 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: RoF<BR><BR>At 15:09 -0500 9/1/01,&nbsp; Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2001 00:14:31 +0000<BR>&gt; &gt; From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: GT: RoF 'Nothing to see here, please move along'<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; "3209 Pagliacci - is a backwater agricultural planet, most of which<BR>&gt; &gt; is uninhabited and unexplored. It is occasionally used as a stopover<BR>&gt; &gt; by ships heading towards Solomani or Hiver territory, but otherwise<BR>&gt; &gt; plays little role in the subsector economy." (c) 2000 SJ Games.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Doesn't this seems suspicious? All the other references are really<BR>&gt; &gt; important or economic power houses!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;As one of only two low-tech but habitable planets in the Solomani Rim,<BR>&gt;Pagliacci was the setting for Double Adventure 4: Marooned/Marooned<BR>&gt;Alone. (The other is Newcomb, setting for Prison Planet). Jon was just<BR>&gt;quoting the canonical description of that world.<BR><BR>Damn! There I was trying to start a decent conspiracy theory and I <BR>get blown out of the water ;-)<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 08:44:56 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Trevor, Peter wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Hmmm ... I find it a bit difficult to swallow the&nbsp; idea&nbsp; of&nbsp; jump<BR>&gt; flash as a universal energy sink for just this last&nbsp; reason.&nbsp; How<BR>&gt; about if the PE difference is&nbsp; made&nbsp; up&nbsp; with&nbsp; an&nbsp; equivalent&nbsp; KE<BR>&gt; change?&nbsp; Thus when jumping from a large world to&nbsp; a&nbsp; small&nbsp; world<BR>&gt; (*) the emerging ship could gain&nbsp; a&nbsp; significant&nbsp; inward&nbsp; vector,<BR>&gt; when jumping the other way the same ship could gain a significant<BR>&gt; outward vector.<BR><BR>Well, the star is the main source of gravitational PE, not the planet.<BR>That nitpick aside; at the stars' 100D limits, a Sol-like star will<BR>have a PE of about -1 GJ/kg.&nbsp; A red dwarf star could have a tenth of<BR>that.<BR><BR>The biggest problem is that KE increases in both the inward and<BR>outward directions.&nbsp; It also depends on an absolute reference frame,<BR>but we're dealing with jumpspace which probably defines such a frame<BR>anyway.<BR><BR>If a ship starts at rest and jumps to a higher potential energy, then<BR>the ship would have to have negative kinetic energy to make up for it.<BR>This is impossible.&nbsp; As you have already noted, it also breaks<BR>conservation of momentum.&nbsp; A third law broken is conservation of<BR>angular momentum.<BR><BR>Of course, there is no reason to suppose that any of these<BR>conservation laws continue to hold when you introduce a new jumpspace<BR>universe connected to the normal one, particularly when it seems to<BR>lack many of the symmetries of our own.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 19:27:09 -0500<BR>From: "Fred Ramen" &lt;von_rammen@email.msn.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: near keyboard kill<BR><BR>"Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;In the current Trav campaign I'm in, I don't think we've named our ship<BR>yet.&nbsp; Considering it's a Scout campaign, with one grizzled and one newbie<BR>scout, I'm almost fearful of what name we'll be coming up with. =)&lt;&lt;<BR><BR>Hey, Jonathan, I thought we agreed on the IISS _Unforeseen Difficulties_ as<BR>the ship name!<BR><BR>(The initial adventure included no combat but several clever sabotages that<BR>turned a routine cargo delivery run into a near miss with a thermonuclear<BR>event :)<BR><BR>Fred Ramen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 15:31:41 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Anthony Jackson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; The problem is that gravitational potential is proportional to<BR>&gt;&gt; M/D, while tidal force is proportional to M/D^3.&nbsp; Gravitational<BR>&gt;&gt; potential is also almost always heavily dominated by the influence<BR>&gt;&gt; of the star (in fact, given 100D limits, it's more or less<BR>&gt;&gt; impossible for it not to be primarily influence for a terrestrial<BR>&gt;&gt; planet.&nbsp; The sun's gravitational potential is more significant<BR>&gt;&gt; than the earth's on the surface of the earth, by a factor of<BR>&gt;&gt; around 14.&nbsp; At 100D, the sun is more important by a factor of<BR>&gt;&gt; 2,800).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I thought gravity&nbsp; was&nbsp; proportional&nbsp; to&nbsp; M/D^2?&nbsp;&nbsp; But&nbsp; otherwise<BR>&gt; "Yup!" to your point as a whole.&nbsp; Which is why&nbsp; we&nbsp; 'decided'&nbsp; on<BR>&gt; tidal force rather than gravity for defining the&nbsp; 100D&nbsp; limit&nbsp; in<BR>&gt; the 'first'&nbsp; place.&nbsp; My&nbsp; preference&nbsp; is&nbsp; to&nbsp; go&nbsp; with&nbsp; the&nbsp; first<BR>&gt; solution I proposed (balancing a PE change with a KE change), the<BR>&gt; second solution (quoted above) was just thown into the ring for a<BR>&gt; quick look and dismissal.&nbsp; However, my first&nbsp; solution&nbsp; does&nbsp; not<BR>&gt; conserve momentum.<BR><BR>And now, for "extra credit" consider what needs to be done to conserve<BR>energy, momentum *and* angular momentum. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 15:33:03 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; [...stuff...]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In the message to which I was replying, the idea was that jumps were<BR>&gt; only possible where potential energy levels at origin and destination<BR>&gt; were equal.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; No, for jumps where you gain in potential energy, the excess goes<BR>&gt;&gt; into the jump flash.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; That can be a *lot* of flash.&nbsp; For a large freighter jumping near the<BR>&gt; biozone of a class M star, it could be equivalent of a 10 megaton<BR>&gt; detonation.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; For jump where you lose in potential energy, you have to supply the<BR>&gt;&gt; difference with the jump drive (which is only a problem if you are<BR>&gt;&gt; *way* too deep in a gravity well). <BR><BR>&gt; Again, the energy differences can be enormous.&nbsp; If the jump drive can<BR>&gt; supply at least many kilotons of energy, it would work.<BR><BR>Consider the amount of LH2 the drive consumes. Even if "merely" run<BR>thru a fusion reactor, that's a *lot* of energy.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2001 19:05:04 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: near keyboard kill<BR><BR>Fred Ramen wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;In the current Trav campaign I'm in, I don't think we've named our ship<BR>&gt; yet.&nbsp; Considering it's a Scout campaign, with one grizzled and one newbie<BR>&gt; scout, I'm almost fearful of what name we'll be coming up with. =)&lt;&lt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Hey, Jonathan, I thought we agreed on the IISS _Unforeseen Difficulties_ as<BR>&gt; the ship name!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; (The initial adventure included no combat but several clever sabotages that<BR>&gt; turned a routine cargo delivery run into a near miss with a thermonuclear<BR>&gt; event :)<BR><BR>Of course, to keep with the tradition of naming scout/couriers with "S"<BR>names, you could go with _Sudden Complications_.... ;-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 12:31:04 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; And now, for "extra credit" consider what needs to be done to conserve<BR>&gt; energy, momentum *and* angular momentum. :-)<BR><BR>Easy!&nbsp; Disallow jump travel except between points in an absolute state<BR>of rest and with identical potential energy.&nbsp; :^)<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 12:34:30 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Consider the amount of LH2 the drive consumes. Even if "merely" run<BR>&gt; thru a fusion reactor, that's a *lot* of energy.<BR><BR>You'd better hope it's 100% efficient, and not just 99.9% or so.&nbsp; You<BR>don't want that much energy turning up as heat upon entering or<BR>leaving jumpspace...<BR><BR>Of course, I suppose it might be possible to slowly feed it in or<BR>bleed it off while in transit.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 17:36:12 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson writes:<BR><BR>&gt; And now, for "extra credit" consider what needs to be done to conserve<BR>&gt; energy, momentum *and* angular momentum. :-)<BR><BR>Heh.&nbsp; Move some reaction mass in the opposite direction.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2001 19:52:13 -0600<BR>From: "D. Smart" &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt; writes:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;Read all about the news Tac Missile in Le Mercenaire, the Spinward Marches'<BR>&gt;magazine for mercenaries and professional adventurers.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;See http://merc.travellercentral.com<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The article is in issue 15.<BR>&gt;http://merc.travellercentral.com/issues/mercenaire15.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Doug B, this means you.<BR><BR>ROFLMAOAPIMP!<BR><BR>Oh, Tod, that's *hilarious*!<BR><BR>David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 18:24:03 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Azhanti High Lightning/Snapshot Scenarios<BR><BR>&gt;From: "Walt Smith" &lt;firelock_ny@hotmail.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Has anyone played their own AHL/Snapshot scenarios,<BR>&gt;and come up with some interesting ones that they'd<BR>&gt;like to share?&nbsp; How about house rules and variants?<BR><BR>Watch this space for the order of battle and victory conditions of the<BR>pursuit of Ming the Merciless by the rebel forces in the last (?) battle of<BR>the Mongo Civil War.&nbsp; Ming will have to escape through some underground<BR>passageways to a hidden escape vehicle.&nbsp; The rebels will have to capture him<BR>(preferably alive) before he is able to escape (or maybe they'll bring a<BR>video camera with a live feed, Rumanian insurrection style).&nbsp; The rebels are<BR>tank crews with whatever infantry weapons they have picked up from killed<BR>secret police officers.&nbsp; Ming and his henchmen are probably armed with<BR>secret police weapons as well.<BR><BR>We have lots of space and counters for this game, but someone will have to<BR>draw the underground passageways.&nbsp; I'll see if I have time before the game.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 18:24:09 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Black hat / white hat (was Re: Traveller and Other Games)<BR><BR>&gt;From: "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;I read an article once, that noted that, no, there is nothing really<BR>&gt;stopping a player from having a character who was scum-of-the-earths.&nbsp; But<BR>&gt;why would a player want to play said character?&nbsp; That's a question that<BR>&gt;should be asked before a GM lets that character loose in their world.<BR><BR>I think age and maturity of the players and referee are factors in this<BR>situation.&nbsp; I remember a sinking feeling one time when I was starting a game<BR>with several younger people and one of the teen-aged boys said to his<BR>friend, who had never played Traveller, "there's _no_ alignment ... think<BR>about it."<BR><BR>I (some 20 years later) actually have little complaint if players want to<BR>play corrupt, evil, domineering bastards, as long as they play them<BR>interestingly and don't whine if the characters get their comeuppance -- and<BR>don't forget, I also adhere to the corollary of Murphy's law that provides<BR>that no _good_ deed goes unpunished, either.&nbsp; It's all karma and it will all<BR>come back to haunt you -- so just let it go and have a good time.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2001 20:48:31 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>Tod Glenn wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Read all about the news Tac Missile in Le Mercenaire, the Spinward Marches'<BR>&gt; magazine for mercenaries and professional adventurers.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The article is in issue 15.<BR>&gt; http://merc.travellercentral.com/issues/mercenaire15.html<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Doug B, this means you.<BR><BR>I note that the photo of a ready-to-fire _Penguin_ has a yellow throat,<BR>while the basic illustration does not.&nbsp; Presumably, the yellow throat<BR>indicates an armed warhead, which leads me to believe that the _Penguin_<BR>warhead is some sort of contained plasma weapon.<BR><BR>I further assume that the penguins in question are not "flapping their<BR>little flippers wildly about,"** and are therefore aerodynamic.&nbsp; I shall<BR>piously refrain from inquiring about the location of the propellant<BR>charge.... O:-)<BR><BR>&lt;nitpick&gt;<BR><BR>Of course, a _true_ FS weapon would include penetration and damage stats<BR>(c.f. "Elephant Mounted Particle Accelerators").<BR><BR>&lt;/nitpick&gt;<BR><BR>**See _At Close Quarters_, page 26.***<BR><BR>***&lt;drill sergeant&gt; What?!?&nbsp; You don't _have_ ACQ?!?&nbsp; Well, GET IT!!!<BR>&lt;/drill sergeant&gt;<BR><BR>http://www.warehouse23.com/item.cgi?BITSRACQ<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2001 19:03:15 -0800<BR>From: "Kelly St.Clair" &lt;kellys@efn.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>On Tue, 09 Jan 2001 15:01:23 +0000, "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" <BR>&lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;It's worse in certain multiplayer environment where some characters are<BR>&gt;encouraged to be blackhats; some take their role seriously, trying to make<BR>&gt;the 'whitehats' lives interesting, while some have taken it as carte blanc<BR>&gt;(carte darc?) to develop some of the most hideously criminal and socially<BR>&gt;maladjusted beasts who use the excuse of "I'm a bad guy!" to justify anything.<BR><BR>Ironically, the version I've usually seen in my favored multiplayer <BR>environment (MUSH) is that any halfway decent blackhat gets dogpiled by a <BR>pack of bored do-gooders looking for some spotlight time.&nbsp; They mug him in <BR>a bar or other public venue, or bust down the door of his Evil Fortress <BR>before the carpet glue is dry.&nbsp; Everyone wants to be a Hero, and there <BR>aren't enough villains to go around.&nbsp; (Other than the fact that both sides <BR>are played by humans, it's not that different from the constant camping of <BR>monster spawn points on certain other MMORPGs.&nbsp; "Back off, you had the last <BR>one!")<BR><BR><BR>- --------------<BR>Kelly St.Clair&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "Homines est! Dici omnes! Soylens viridis HOMINES EST!"<BR>kellys@efn.org<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 23:03:48 EST<BR>From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/3/01 4:55:56 AM !!!First Boot!!!, shudson@lightspeed.ca <BR>writes:<BR><BR>&lt;&lt; Beware fighting enemy units with double the loaded mass of yours :| &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>yeah; the "jug" (P-47 Thunderbolt) EMPTY weighed more than a loaded <BR>Spitfire...:-)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2001 20:06:29 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>on 1/9/01 6:48 PM, John Groth at wombat@premier.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I further assume that the penguins in question are not "flapping their<BR>&gt; little flippers wildly about,"** and are therefore aerodynamic.&nbsp; I shall<BR>&gt; piously refrain from inquiring about the location of the propellant<BR>&gt; charge.... O:-)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;nitpick&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Of course, a _true_ FS weapon would include penetration and damage stats<BR>&gt; (c.f. "Elephant Mounted Particle Accelerators").<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;/nitpick&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>OK assume the penguin is frozen for dimensional stability.&nbsp; Like the RPG, a<BR>booster charge kicks the round out a safe distance, where the rocket motor<BR>ignites.&nbsp; Because this is Traveller, we assume TL 9 and make the rocket of<BR>the hypervelocity type.&nbsp; Current technology (8) let us build KE missiles<BR>that can achieve a velocity of nearly double that of a conventional tank<BR>round.<BR><BR>When I was in the army, they told us a T-72 APFSDS round would go a mile a<BR>second, so assume we can achieve double that.&nbsp; That's roughly 3200 meters<BR>per second.&nbsp; We lose velocity faster than a DS round because our coefficient<BR>of drag is higher (oh well) but we'll assume this is a short range weapon.<BR><BR>Doing some quick research, I note that penguins mass between 1.5 and 6Kg.<BR>We use 4kg for our 'ideal' penguin.<BR><BR>KE for our penguin at max velocity is 20.48 Megajoules<BR><BR>FFS2 gives a damage value of 431 D6<BR>Penetration is 84 (if I'm doing the calculation correctly).<BR><BR>Anyone else care to work this out?<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend"<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 23:11:42 EST<BR>From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/4/01 11:41:02 AM !!!First Boot!!!, <BR>a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz writes:<BR><BR>&lt;&lt; Yes, but they were probably the worst 20 mm ever designed, their effective <BR>firepower was less than a 50 cal. (another ObTrav: Don't put crappy <BR>weapons on excellent platforms). &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>What was wrong, poor rate of fire, or poor shells (failure to explode, and/or <BR>poor fragmentation)? Did the Japanese have copyright privileges to the <BR>Oerlikon like everybody else?<BR><BR>Ob Trav: does the Traveller universe have any weapon designs that are <BR>universal between polities like the 20 mm Oerlikon or the 40 mm Bofors?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 23:34:45 -0500 <BR>From: "Greenly, Jeff" &lt;greenlyj@rcbhsc.wvu.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: mutiny<BR><BR>&lt;decloaking&gt;<BR><BR>Are there any examples given in the canon of Imperial Naval/Military units<BR>committing mutiny or barratry? Please cite with references.<BR><BR>JD<BR><BR>&lt;cloaking&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 16:17:47 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>Kelly St.Clair wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Ironically, the version I've usually seen in my favored multiplayer<BR>&gt; environment (MUSH) is that any halfway decent blackhat gets dogpiled<BR>&gt; by a pack of bored do-gooders looking for some spotlight time.&nbsp; They<BR>&gt; mug him in a bar or other public venue, or bust down the door of his<BR>&gt; Evil Fortress before the carpet glue is dry.&nbsp; Everyone wants to be a<BR>&gt; Hero, and there aren't enough villains to go around.<BR><BR>Yeah, this led me to write a few articles in comp.games.development.design<BR>a couple of years ago suggesting that players could by default have 2<BR>characters: a Hero and a Villain.&nbsp; Advancement would depend upon<BR>playing both well, not just one.<BR><BR>There would also be a lot of one-shot characters around, mainly for<BR>players who can't be bothered going through detailed character<BR>creation and approval but want to get straight into the action.&nbsp; These<BR>could be anything from a city guard to a villain's henchman, wherever<BR>there is something going on.&nbsp; Essentially NPCs.<BR><BR>My idea took quite a beating, though I still have a slim hope that<BR>something useful could be salvaged from it.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 06:51:34 +0100<BR>From: "Patrik Holmstrm" &lt;glappkaeft@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: The whereabouts of Andrew Akins<BR><BR>Does anyone know if Andrew Akins is still developing his FFS spreadsheet and <BR>how I can contact him? His web page also seems to have disappeared.<BR><BR>Thanks<BR>Patrik Holmstrm<BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 19:47:46 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR><BR>On 9 Jan 01, at 23:11, Sethkimmel@aol.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In a message dated 1/4/01 11:41:02 AM !!!First Boot!!!, <BR>&gt; a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz writes:<BR><BR>&gt; &lt;&lt; Yes, but they were probably the worst 20 mm ever designed, their effective <BR>&gt;&nbsp; firepower was less than a 50 cal. (another ObTrav: Don't put crappy <BR>&gt;&nbsp; weapons on excellent platforms). &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; What was wrong, poor rate of fire, or poor shells (failure to explode, and/or<BR>&gt; poor fragmentation)? Did the Japanese have copyright privileges to the<BR>&gt; Oerlikon like everybody else?<BR><BR>Poor RoF, poor muzzle velocity, poor shell weight, poor reliabilty and <BR>quality control (both for gun and shells).<BR><BR>&gt; Ob Trav: does the Traveller universe have any weapon designs that are <BR>&gt; universal between polities like the 20 mm Oerlikon or the 40 mm Bofors?<BR><BR>The ISDP (Imperial Standard Data Packages). Complete schematics for <BR>thousands of things at every tech level.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 21:19:43 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Kelly St.Clair<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, 10 January 2001 16:03<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; On Tue, 09 Jan 2001 15:01:23 +0000, "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott"<BR>&gt; &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;It's worse in certain multiplayer environment where some characters are<BR>&gt; &gt;encouraged to be blackhats; some take their role seriously,<BR>&gt; trying to make<BR>&gt; &gt;the 'whitehats' lives interesting, while some have taken it as<BR>&gt; carte blanc<BR>&gt; &gt;(carte darc?) to develop some of the most hideously criminal and socially<BR>&gt; &gt;maladjusted beasts who use the excuse of "I'm a bad guy!" to<BR>&gt; justify anything.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Ironically, the version I've usually seen in my favored multiplayer<BR>&gt; environment (MUSH) is that any halfway decent blackhat gets<BR>&gt; dogpiled by a pack of bored do-gooders looking for some spotlight<BR>&gt; time.&nbsp; They mug him in a bar or other public venue, or bust down<BR>&gt; the door of his Evil Fortress before the carpet glue is dry.<BR>&gt; Everyone wants to be a Hero, and there aren't enough villains<BR>&gt; to go around.&nbsp; (Other than the fact that both sides<BR>&gt; are played by humans, it's not that different from the constant<BR>&gt; camping of&nbsp; monster spawn points on certain other MMORPGs.<BR>&gt; "Back off, you had the last one!")<BR><BR>IMO, the simplest way around this problem is to point out that there<BR>everyone is a good guy to someone, and everyone is a bad guy to someone<BR>else.<BR><BR>For Traveller consider the Imperial Marine Hero, on Zhodani populated worlds<BR>he's considered a "tool if the imperialistic barbarian oppressor",<BR>personally responsible for ruining the best way of life one could ever have.<BR><BR>I once really tweaked some D&amp;D players once by having one of the members of<BR>an orc tribe who they were bulldozing through for the third time to get the<BR>same dungeon, refuse to fight.<BR>They were so intrigued they stopped attacking for a bit.<BR><BR>Once they'd figured out how to talk to him, he said something along the<BR>lines of<BR>"Why the heck are you lot attacking us again ? You've killed lots of us so<BR>far, Graah, you killed my father last time, but what's the bloody point? Why<BR>do you keep coming back ?<BR>If all you wanted to do was annihilate us why didn't yuo wipe us all out the<BR>first time ?<BR>Are you really so damn cruel you want to wipe us out a bit at a time ?"<BR><BR>After they explained, I had the orc go ballistic on them<BR>"So you killed my father just to get to the old ruins ? We were just in your<BR>f___king way ?<BR>You're scum of the earth, you ruin families, destroy homes, amd all for your<BR>greed!<BR>Bastards! May you all have interesting lives!" He then turned and walked<BR>away, and the players were too stunned to stop him<BR><BR>I have to say that at least one character actually changed his ways after<BR>that, but it was too late, and I'm sure all those who have seen "The<BR>Princess Bride" can guess what happened a few game years later...<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3512<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yd01.mx.aol.com (rly-yd01.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.1]) by air-yd02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 03:11:21 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yd01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 03:10:58 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id DAA54193;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 03:09:45 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 10 Jan 2001 03:09:09 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id DAA53952<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 03:09:09 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 03:09:09 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101100809.DAA53952@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3512<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3513</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/10/01 8:40:45 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; Wednesday, January 10 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3513<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: mutiny<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Unsubbing for a while...<BR>RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: mutiny<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: mutiny<BR>Andrew Akins<BR>RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: near keyboard kill<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: The whereabouts of Andrew Akins<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 10:46:04 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: mutiny<BR><BR>Jeff Greenly wrote:<BR>&gt; Are there any examples given in the canon of Imperial Naval/<BR>&gt; Military units committing mutiny or barratry? Please cite with<BR>&gt; references.<BR><BR>Er, the whole Rebellion Era?<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR>(DIAW)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 01:48:22 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; And now, for "extra credit" consider what needs to be done to conserve<BR>&gt;&gt; energy, momentum *and* angular momentum. :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Heh.&nbsp; Move some reaction mass in the opposite direction.<BR><BR>Now explain how to do that with jump. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 11:42:06 +0000<BR>From: Phil Kitching &lt;postmark.design@btinternet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>Timothy Little wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Yeah, this led me to write a few articles in comp.games.development.design<BR>&gt;a couple of years ago suggesting that players could by default have 2<BR>&gt;characters: a Hero and a Villain.&nbsp; Advancement would depend upon<BR>&gt;playing both well, not just one.<BR><BR>There's something like this in WW's Wraith - whilst the evil demon** is in<BR>possession of your character, one of the other players gets your character<BR>sheet to be evil with.<BR><BR>**haven't actually played it, so don't know the technical terms, nor how this<BR>mechanism works in practice.<BR><BR><BR>Phil Kitching<BR>- --<BR>&nbsp; http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo/<BR>&nbsp; Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Technologies Division.<BR>"Microwaving half-baked ideas from across the Galaxy"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 14:22:37 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>On Wed, 10 Jan 2001, Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; And now, for "extra credit" consider what needs to be done to conserve<BR>&gt; &gt; energy, momentum *and* angular momentum. :-)<BR>&gt; Easy!&nbsp; Disallow jump travel except between points in an absolute state<BR>&gt; of rest and with identical potential energy.&nbsp; :^)<BR><BR>Absolute state of rest? <BR><BR>And if you can zero your angular momentum in respect to everything, that<BR>is gonna be cool...<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 06:32:13 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Unsubbing for a while...<BR><BR>...as I head off to Annual Training.<BR><BR>Save some flamewar for me! ;-)<BR><BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 11:13:23 -0000<BR>From: Matt Bond &lt;MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: shadow@krypton.rain.com [mailto:shadow@krypton.rain.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: 10 January 2001 09:48<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; And now, for "extra credit" consider what needs to be done <BR>&gt; to conserve<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; energy, momentum *and* angular momentum. :-)<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Heh.&nbsp; Move some reaction mass in the opposite direction.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Now explain how to do that with jump. :-)<BR><BR>When the Jump Bubble dissipates at re-entry of N-space, it opens a small<BR>hole first and releases the Hydrogen inside it as a 'jet', before<BR>completely collapsing and releasing the vessel...<BR><BR>The direction and velocity of the jet varies as needed to compensate for<BR>whichever factors need compensating...<BR><BR>(The stresses on the Jump Bubble vary according how unconserved various<BR>properties are, so the initial hole appears where required...)<BR><BR>:)<BR><BR>Matt<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 08:33:15 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: Victor Abraham Delnore &lt;vad9m@unix.mail.virginia.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: mutiny<BR><BR>There seems to have been a wave of mutinies aboard vessels of the<BR>Imperial Navy, although the reference is obscure.&nbsp; According to Supplement<BR>7, p. 34, the Gazelle-class close escort "was designed at a time when<BR>mutinies were a major threat to security."&nbsp; What year was it designed?<BR>Well, CT material is not very good about giving you a date in service of<BR>most military vessels.&nbsp; It would have to be some time after the Imperium<BR>reached TL 14.&nbsp; Maybe it had to do with the Solomani movement, which must<BR>have attracted the sympathies of some naval personnel--although I'd expect<BR>more officers than enlisted to side with the Solomani!<BR><BR>- --Abe Delnore<BR><BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>| V. A. Delnore&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; vad9m@virginia.edu&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |<BR>| Graduate Student&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (804) 971-8806&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |<BR>| Corcoran Department of History&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1821 Jefferson Park Ave #4&nbsp; &nbsp; |<BR>| University of Virginia&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Charlottesville VA 22903&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |<BR>| Mica mica parva stella miror quaenam sis tam bella&nbsp; (Anon. lyric) |<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 05:27:44<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>At 11:19 AM 1/8/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Read all about the news Tac Missile in Le Mercenaire, the Spinward Marches'<BR>&gt;magazine for mercenaries and professional adventurers.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;See http://merc.travellercentral.com<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The article is in issue 15.<BR>&gt;http://merc.travellercentral.com/issues/mercenaire15.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Doug B, this means you.<BR><BR>Since it was my turn to get the Office Flu (order determined by senority,<BR>as per the union contract), I have been crawling around the apartment<BR>resembling a cross between a Shoggoth and Robert Downy Jr. on a bad day.<BR><BR>Today, I remebered how to use my fingers long enough to launch the broswers.<BR><BR>Keyboard Kill.&nbsp; That is magnificent!<BR><BR>I might just have to design that sucker.. and can I steal the image for the<BR>upcoming _ACQ, the Silly Rules_?<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 05:34:14<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>At 08:48 PM 1/9/2001 -0600, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I note that the photo of a ready-to-fire _Penguin_ has a yellow throat,<BR>&gt;while the basic illustration does not.&nbsp; Presumably, the yellow throat<BR>&gt;indicates an armed warhead, which leads me to believe that the _Penguin_<BR>&gt;warhead is some sort of contained plasma weapon.<BR><BR>Actually, it appears to be a *really small* King Penguin.&nbsp; Perhaps they<BR>recruit rebellious teenage penguins, who are looking for an extreme sport<BR>to torment their parents with..<BR><BR>&gt;I further assume that the penguins in question are not "flapping their<BR>&gt;little flippers wildly about,"** and are therefore aerodynamic.&nbsp; I shall<BR>&gt;piously refrain from inquiring about the location of the propellant<BR>&gt;charge.... O:-)<BR><BR>Why do you think the second penguin is gray?&nbsp; he's been used a few times,<BR>and *knows* where that charge is going..<BR><BR>&gt;**See _At Close Quarters_, page 26.***<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;***&lt;drill sergeant&gt; What?!?&nbsp; You don't _have_ ACQ?!?&nbsp; Well, GET IT!!!<BR>&gt;&lt;/drill sergeant&gt;<BR><BR>Yeah, what he said.<BR><BR>BTW, I'm currently working on "The Return of the Golden Penguin" ACQ<BR>tournament for GenCon UK.&nbsp; To do this, I'm referring to my two best sources<BR>on British Culture.&nbsp; Dr. Who, and Monty Python.&nbsp; See ya there!<BR><BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&nbsp; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>"But that's not the point!" raged Ford. "The point is that I am now a<BR>perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of<BR>limbs!"&nbsp; - The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 05:39:28<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: mutiny<BR><BR>At 11:34 PM 1/9/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Are there any examples given in the canon of Imperial Naval/Military units<BR>&gt;committing mutiny or barratry? Please cite with references.<BR><BR>Someone else has mentioned the Gazelle-class.<BR><BR>In Ground Forces, I make the point that many Marine Regiments were<BR>disbanded at the end of the Civil War due to their actions during the<BR>conflict.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 08:56:17 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: Andy Akins &lt;andyakins@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Andrew Akins<BR><BR>Now that was weird...<BR><BR>I was offline for a while - having accepted a new job and moving and such. Just got back on, and got my new account...re-signed up for TML-digest...and the first digest I get has a message asking about my whereabouts...eerie.<BR><BR>So, I'm back if anyone else is looking for me. I'm now at:<BR><BR>&nbsp; andyakins@earthlink.net<BR><BR>Eventually the website will be back up at a new location too...I've got all the files, I just gotta shove them on a new webserver.<BR><BR>If anyone needs/wants any of my spreadsheets or such in the mean time, I can email them to you - or other people may have copies on their websites. I believe Freelance Traveller does...<BR><BR>&nbsp; Andy Akins<BR><BR><BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 14:01:52 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>&gt; Actually, it appears to be a *really small* King Penguin.&nbsp; <BR><BR>A Prince Regent peguin, perhaps? As King P's get bigger do they change<BR>species to Emperors?<BR><BR>&gt; Perhaps they<BR>&gt; recruit rebellious teenage penguins, who are looking for an <BR>&gt; extreme sport<BR>&gt; to torment their parents with..<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;I further assume that the penguins in question are not <BR>&gt; "flapping their<BR>&gt; &gt;little flippers wildly about,"** and are therefore <BR>&gt; aerodynamic.&nbsp; I shall<BR>&gt; &gt;piously refrain from inquiring about the location of the propellant<BR>&gt; &gt;charge.... O:-)<BR><BR>Could careful manipulation of the filppers could allow for mid-course<BR>correction?<BR><BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; BTW, I'm currently working on "The Return of the Golden Penguin" ACQ<BR>&gt; tournament for GenCon UK.&nbsp; To do this, I'm referring to my <BR>&gt; two best sources<BR>&gt; on British Culture.&nbsp; Dr. Who, and Monty Python.&nbsp; See ya there!<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Good choices. They pretty much tell you all you could ever want to know<BR>about Britain.<BR><BR>Dean <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 09:18:11 -0500<BR>From: Jonathan McDermott &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: near keyboard kill<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 19:27:09 -0500<BR>&gt;From: "Fred Ramen" &lt;von_rammen@email.msn.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: near keyboard kill<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;In the current Trav campaign I'm in, I don't think we've named our ship<BR>&gt;yet.&nbsp; Considering it's a Scout campaign, with one grizzled and one newbie<BR>&gt;scout, I'm almost fearful of what name we'll be coming up with. =)&lt;&lt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Hey, Jonathan, I thought we agreed on the IISS _Unforeseen Difficulties_ as<BR>&gt;the ship name!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;(The initial adventure included no combat but several clever sabotages that<BR>&gt;turned a routine cargo delivery run into a near miss with a thermonuclear<BR>&gt;event :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Fred Ramen<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR><BR>Oh, that's right!&nbsp; I'd forgotten about that.&nbsp; Yeargh, my memory's bad. =) <BR>Yes, it was the IISS scout ship _Unforseen Difficulties_.<BR><BR>Not to mention the little incident with someone cutting the access tube to <BR>the loading dock, letting in all that wonderful corrosive atmospheres.&nbsp; Ah, <BR>the joys of steamage tech in exotic atmospheres!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 09:24:54 -0500<BR>From: Jonathan McDermott &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 21:19:43 +1300<BR>&gt;From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: RE: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>&gt;I have to say that at least one character actually changed his ways after<BR>&gt;that, but it was too late, and I'm sure all those who have seen "The<BR>&gt;Princess Bride" can guess what happened a few game years later...<BR><BR>"Hello!&nbsp; I am Orctigo Montorcya.&nbsp; You killed my father.&nbsp; Prepare to die!"<BR><BR>Cheers<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 06:36:37<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>At 02:01 PM 1/10/2001 -0000, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Actually, it appears to be a *really small* King Penguin.&nbsp; <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;A Prince Regent peguin, perhaps? As King P's get bigger do they change<BR>&gt;species to Emperors?<BR><BR>Emperors are *huge*.. over 60cm tall in some examples.&nbsp; Kings look similar,<BR>but are smaller.&nbsp; They both have the yellow/orange coloring arouund the neck.<BR><BR>&gt;Could careful manipulation of the filppers could allow for mid-course<BR>&gt;correction?<BR><BR>Only in highly-trained birds<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; BTW, I'm currently working on "The Return of the Golden Penguin" ACQ<BR>&gt;&gt; tournament for GenCon UK.&nbsp; To do this, I'm referring to my <BR>&gt;&gt; two best sources on British Culture.&nbsp; Dr. Who, and Monty Python.&nbsp; See ya <BR>&gt;&gt;there!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Good choices. They pretty much tell you all you could ever want to know<BR>&gt;about Britain.<BR><BR>I can't wait to see one of the millions of abandoned quarries that<BR>evidently dominate the terrain.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&nbsp; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>"I am the penguin bold! We sailed the sea, to tringalee,<BR>in search of spanish gold" - The Magic Pudding - Norman Lindsay<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 14:39:30 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Good choices. They pretty much tell you all you could ever <BR>&gt; want to know<BR>&gt; &gt;about Britain.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I can't wait to see one of the millions of abandoned quarries that<BR>&gt; evidently dominate the terrain.<BR>&gt; -- <BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Actually there are two 'On Location' sites for Doctor who:<BR><BR>1) Wapsey's Wood Gravel Pit AKA 'Every planet in the Solar system'<BR><BR>and<BR><BR>2) Wapsey's Wood Gravel Pit from a differant camera angle, AKA 'Every planet<BR>in the universe'<BR><BR>Or were you talking about Monty Python? :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 14:42:38 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>Dean Jones wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; BTW, I'm currently working on "The Return of the Golden Penguin"<BR>&gt; &gt; ACQ tournament for GenCon UK.&nbsp; To do this, I'm referring to my <BR>&gt; &gt; two best sources on British Culture.&nbsp; Dr. Who, and Monty Python.<BR>&gt; &gt; See ya there!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Good choices. They pretty much tell you all you could ever <BR>&gt; want to know about Britain.<BR><BR>For education about Britain I'd add the film&nbsp; "Brazil" (*not* the<BR>"Love Will Find A Way" edit which had a happy ending).&nbsp; This will<BR>give insite into government organisations like the DSS&nbsp; and&nbsp; CSA,<BR>nationalised industry, local councils, etc.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 08:10:19 -0700<BR>From: timmon@primenet.com<BR>Subject: Re: The whereabouts of Andrew Akins<BR><BR>He is in the midst of a move to another state - new home, new job, etc.<BR>Told me he'd be out of the loop for a month or longer. Hope this info. helps.<BR><BR>Paul<BR><BR>At 06:51 AM 1/10/01 +0100, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Does anyone know if Andrew Akins is still developing his FFS spreadsheet and <BR>&gt;how I can contact him? His web page also seems to have disappeared.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Thanks<BR>&gt;Patrik Holmstrm<BR>&gt;_________________________________________________________________________<BR>&gt;Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 07:05:43 -0800<BR>From: "Thing" &lt;thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>On Wednesday, January 10, 2001 5:34 AM<BR>Douglas E. Berry said,<BR><BR>&gt; BTW, I'm currently working on "The Return of the Golden Penguin" ACQ<BR>&gt; tournament for GenCon UK.&nbsp; To do this, I'm referring to my two best<BR>sources<BR>&gt; on British Culture.&nbsp; Dr. Who, and Monty Python.&nbsp; See ya there!<BR><BR>You should also check into Blake's 7.<BR>Space ships, the same gravel pits, and a good death count.<BR>Remember, no one with screen time gets out alive.<BR><BR>G.D.D.<BR>ThingUnderTheStairs.<BR>===============<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 10:11:06 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>&gt;"Hello!&nbsp; I am Orctigo Montorcya.&nbsp; You killed my father.&nbsp; Prepare to die!"<BR><BR>"You don't by any chance happen to have six fingers on your right hand? One, <BR>two, uh...eleven, um, many...uhhhh...oh, just prepare to die."<BR><BR>ObTrav: "Of course I have six fingers! I'm a Hiver!!"<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 16:26:29 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>Phil Kitching wrote:<BR>&gt; There's something like this in WW's Wraith - whilst the evil demon** is in<BR>&gt; possession of your character, one of the other players gets your character<BR>&gt; sheet to be evil with.<BR><BR>Not quite: Another player plays your evil side. When that side makes a<BR>temporary takeover, you play the evil side for a while, while that other<BR>player plays your normal (but out-of-the-loop) side.<BR><BR>The game could be played with two players per character, competing for<BR>"screen time"...&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 07:50:57 -0800<BR>From: Evyn MacDude &lt;wmacdude@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>"Trevor, Peter" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Dean Jones wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; BTW, I'm currently working on "The Return of the Golden Penguin"<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; ACQ tournament for GenCon UK.&nbsp; To do this, I'm referring to my<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; two best sources on British Culture.&nbsp; Dr. Who, and Monty Python.<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; See ya there!<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Good choices. They pretty much tell you all you could ever<BR>&gt; &gt; want to know about Britain.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; For education about Britain I'd add the film&nbsp; "Brazil" (*not* the<BR>&gt; "Love Will Find A Way" edit which had a happy ending).&nbsp; This will<BR>&gt; give insite into government organisations like the DSS&nbsp; and&nbsp; CSA,<BR>&gt; nationalised industry, local councils, etc.<BR><BR>There is a Happy ending one?!?<BR><BR>- --<BR>Evyn<BR><BR>"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; For he to-day that sheds his blood with me<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; This day shall gentle his condition."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; -- William Shakespeare, King Henry the Fifth, IV:iii:60-63<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 16:03:48 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>Evyn MacDude wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; For education about Britain I'd add the film&nbsp; "Brazil" (*not* the<BR>&gt; &gt; "Love Will Find A Way" edit which had a happy ending).&nbsp; This will<BR>&gt; &gt; give insite into government organisations like the DSS&nbsp; and&nbsp; CSA,<BR>&gt; &gt; nationalised industry, local councils, etc.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; There is a Happy ending one?!?<BR><BR>Yup!&nbsp; The film studio thought they'd loose money releasing a film<BR>with a dark ending and&nbsp; so&nbsp; re-editted&nbsp; the&nbsp; film&nbsp; without&nbsp; Terry<BR>Gilliam.&nbsp; It was the original US-only release and is about 30mins<BR>shorter.&nbsp; If you get the 3-disk DVD set you'll get both this&nbsp; and<BR>the proper version plus an interesting documentry on "the battle"<BR>for Brazil between Gilliam and the studio.&nbsp; The hacked-up by&nbsp; the<BR>studio version is nicknamed "Love Will Find A Way".<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 08:06:01 -0800<BR>From: "Thing" &lt;thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>On Wednesday, January 10, 2001 7:50 AM<BR>Evyn MacDude said,<BR><BR>&gt; There is a Happy ending one?!?<BR><BR>I always thought that Brazil had a happy ending where he goes insane thereby<BR>escaping his tormentors.&nbsp; If this is the happy ending that was referred to,<BR>I want to see the other one.<BR><BR>G.D.D.<BR>ThingUnderTheStairs.<BR>====================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 16:07:55 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Thing [mailto:thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net]<BR>&gt; Sent: 10 January 2001 15:06<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; On Wednesday, January 10, 2001 5:34 AM<BR>&gt; Douglas E. Berry said,<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; BTW, I'm currently working on "The Return of the Golden Penguin" ACQ<BR>&gt; &gt; tournament for GenCon UK.&nbsp; To do this, I'm referring to my two best<BR>&gt; sources<BR>&gt; &gt; on British Culture.&nbsp; Dr. Who, and Monty Python.&nbsp; See ya there!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; You should also check into Blake's 7.<BR>&gt; Space ships, the same gravel pits, and a good death count.<BR>&gt; Remember, no one with screen time gets out alive.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Fantastic costuming, too. Plus, Avon is one of the best 'heros' ever to<BR>grace the small screen.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 16:27:16 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Eric Freitas [mailto:efreitos@tampabay.rr.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: 09 January 2001 12:58<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Technology Marches On: TL13 Arrives<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; At 17:16 12/15/00 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;Fix yourself up with Cryostasis. It might not work, but you <BR>&gt; got a better<BR>&gt; &gt;chance than you'd have if you didn't get yourself frozen.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Dean<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The problem is that working coldsleep requires a few invasive <BR>&gt; procedures,<BR>&gt; including replacing your blood with another oxygen carrying <BR>&gt; medium that<BR>&gt; doesn't risk freezing at just above zero centigrade.<BR><BR>I believe that they are currently experimenting with liquids which vitrify<BR>at the relevant temperatures. Sadly those available cause more cellular<BR>damage due to toxicity than freezing water does :(<BR><BR><BR>&nbsp; In <BR>&gt; addition their are<BR>&gt; a host of medical sensors that must be monitored, along with very fine<BR>&gt; control of the cooling mechanism. <BR><BR>Yup, but at present it's not suspended animation we're worrying about...it's<BR>preservation of a cadaver in the hope that resuscitation can be acchieved at<BR>a higher tech level. Even if reanimation isn't possible perhaps a reading of<BR>the chemical info in the brain is (assuming it doesn't get turned to a pulp<BR>by ice crystals or melted by the vitrifier)<BR><BR>If their is a power <BR>&gt; failure, probably going<BR>&gt; to die, so don't put your coldsleep capsule in Florida. ;)<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>They use vacuum flasks and liquid nitrogen. If the power goes out it just<BR>means the flask have to be topped up by torch-light.<BR><BR>&gt; Of course we have only tested this system on dogs so far <BR>&gt; (with total success),<BR>&gt; so whoever tries it first will be a hero! (..or at least a <BR>&gt; guinea pig).<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>There are actually a couple of dozen corpsicals at the moment, with various<BR>different cryo companies. The first human coldsleep volunteer, however would<BR>be both :)<BR><BR>Ob-Trav: Would people on low-tech worlds use a system like this to try and<BR>wait until their worlds tech level was high enough to recover them? How<BR>about worlds at TL12?<BR><BR>FInally, I'm feeling cheeky, so I'll start an unsubstantiated rumour...:<BR>Steve Jackson has arranged to be frozen when he dies.<BR>Remember: I have no evidence to back this rumour up, and no reason to assume<BR>it's true. See how long it takes before someone mentions it to you. &gt;:-&gt;<BR><BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3513<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yc04.mx.aol.com (rly-yc04.mail.aol.com [172.18.149.36]) by air-yc04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 11:40:45 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yc04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 11:40:22 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id LAA71334;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 11:29:46 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 10 Jan 2001 11:29:28 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA71288<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 11:29:27 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 11:29:27 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101101629.LAA71288@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3513<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3514</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/10/01 9:12:36 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 11 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3514<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Andrew Akins<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Blake's Seven<BR>Re: GT: RoF<BR>RE: Blake's Seven<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Andrew Akins<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 08:47:43 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Andrew Akins<BR><BR>Good to see ya' back my friend!&nbsp; Hope everything went well!!!<BR><BR>Best as always,<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Andy Akins<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2001 5:56 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Andrew Akins<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Now that was weird...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I was offline for a while - having accepted a new job and moving<BR>&gt; and such. Just got back on, and got my new account...re-signed up<BR>&gt; for TML-digest...and the first digest I get has a message asking<BR>&gt; about my whereabouts...eerie.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; So, I'm back if anyone else is looking for me. I'm now at:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; andyakins@earthlink.net<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Eventually the website will be back up at a new location<BR>&gt; too...I've got all the files, I just gotta shove them on a new webserver.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; If anyone needs/wants any of my spreadsheets or such in the mean<BR>&gt; time, I can email them to you - or other people may have copies<BR>&gt; on their websites. I believe Freelance Traveller does...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Andy Akins<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 09:16:23 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Since it was my turn to get the Office Flu (order determined by senority,<BR>&gt; as per the union contract), I have been crawling around the apartment<BR>&gt; resembling a cross between a Shoggoth and Robert Downy Jr. on a bad day.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Today, I remebered how to use my fingers long enough to launch the<BR>broswers.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Keyboard Kill.&nbsp; That is magnificent!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I might just have to design that sucker.. and can I steal the image for<BR>the<BR>&gt; upcoming _ACQ, the Silly Rules_?<BR>&gt; --<BR><BR>All my images are free for use by other gamers.&nbsp; Copyleft and all that jazz.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 09:31:37 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson writes:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Heh.&nbsp; Move some reaction mass in the opposite direction.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Now explain how to do that with jump. :-)<BR><BR>Perhaps that's what the fuel is for ;)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 10:17:37 -0800<BR>From: Russell Bornschlegel &lt;kaleja@estarcion.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Blake's Seven<BR><BR>Dean Jones wrote:<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; &gt; From: Thing [mailto:thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net]<BR>&gt; &gt; You should also check into Blake's 7.<BR>&gt; &gt; Space ships, the same gravel pits, and a good death count.<BR>&gt; &gt; Remember, no one with screen time gets out alive.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Fantastic costuming, too. Plus, Avon is one of the best 'heros' ever to<BR>&gt; grace the small screen.<BR><BR>Excellent source for Traveller campaign material, too, I think. If I recall <BR>correctly, the final episode where everyone bites it was originally aired<BR>right before Christmas in the UK, and, uh, apparently the holidays were <BR>ruined by and for a few overly-attached fans. <BR><BR>My favorite lines:<BR><BR>Vila: "I've got this shocking pain right behind my eyes."<BR>Avon: "Have you considered amputation?"<BR><BR>and<BR><BR>(Someone): "My people have a saying: trust freely given can never be <BR>betrayed, only mistaken."<BR>Avon: "Life expectancy must be fairly short among your people."<BR><BR>Easily the bleakest, most cynical science fiction series I've ever seen.<BR><BR>- -Russell B<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 12:26:42 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: RoF<BR><BR>On Tue, 9 Jan 2001, Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Damn! There I was trying to start a decent conspiracy theory and I <BR>&gt; get blown out of the water ;-)<BR><BR>You must be perilously close to the truth, or THEY wouldn't have acted so<BR>quickly to shoot you down...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 18:31:24 -0000<BR>From: "michael.scanlon" &lt;michael.scanlon@bmthonline.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Blake's Seven<BR><BR>AS I recall, there is no real proof that all got snuffed....<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Russell Bornschlegel<BR>Sent: 10 January 2001 18:18<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Blake's Seven<BR><BR><BR>Dean Jones wrote:<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; &gt; From: Thing [mailto:thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net]<BR>&gt; &gt; You should also check into Blake's 7.<BR>&gt; &gt; Space ships, the same gravel pits, and a good death count.<BR>&gt; &gt; Remember, no one with screen time gets out alive.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Fantastic costuming, too. Plus, Avon is one of the best 'heros' ever to<BR>&gt; grace the small screen.<BR><BR>Excellent source for Traveller campaign material, too, I think. If I recall<BR>correctly, the final episode where everyone bites it was originally aired<BR>right before Christmas in the UK, and, uh, apparently the holidays were<BR>ruined by and for a few overly-attached fans.<BR><BR>My favorite lines:<BR><BR>Vila: "I've got this shocking pain right behind my eyes."<BR>Avon: "Have you considered amputation?"<BR><BR>and<BR><BR>(Someone): "My people have a saying: trust freely given can never be<BR>betrayed, only mistaken."<BR>Avon: "Life expectancy must be fairly short among your people."<BR><BR>Easily the bleakest, most cynical science fiction series I've ever seen.<BR><BR>- -Russell B<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 12:59:09<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>At 07:05 AM 1/10/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;You should also check into Blake's 7.<BR>&gt;Space ships, the same gravel pits, and a good death count.<BR>&gt;Remember, no one with screen time gets out alive.<BR><BR>Another favorite.&nbsp; For years my standard Friday-Night-at-the-Con shirt was<BR>a blood-splattered shirt reading "My crew went to Garda-Prime and all I got<BR>was this lousy chest wound."<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 12:43:46 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Heh.&nbsp; Move some reaction mass in the opposite direction.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Now explain how to do that with jump. :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Perhaps that's what the fuel is for ;)<BR><BR>Won't work. In the case of jump, "in the opposite direction" would be<BR>*from* to destination *to* the point of departure. Nothing else is<BR>guaranteed to balance.<BR><BR>btw, anybody know of a reasonable *word* for "point of departure" (ie<BR>an antonym for "destination"? The idea comes up a *lot* in discussions<BR>of jump and it gets annoying typing long phrases for such a *simple*<BR>concept. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 12:54:23 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Yup, but at present it's not suspended animation we're worrying about...it's<BR>&gt; preservation of a cadaver in the hope that resuscitation can be acchieved at<BR>&gt; a higher tech level. Even if reanimation isn't possible perhaps a reading of<BR>&gt; the chemical info in the brain is (assuming it doesn't get turned to a pulp<BR>&gt; by ice crystals or melted by the vitrifier)<BR><BR>Actually, it seems to be fairly well established now that memory<BR>*isn't* stored chemically. Instead it has to do with things like<BR>synapse connections and activation potentials. <BR><BR>There's a fair chance that they'd be able to revive your body, but that<BR>either you'd have total amnesia, or that you'd be a vegetable.<BR><BR>&gt; They use vacuum flasks and liquid nitrogen. If the power goes out it just<BR>&gt; means the flask have to be topped up by torch-light.<BR><BR>"By the light of a flashlight", please. "Torchlight" involves burning<BR>materials stuck on the end of a stick.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 13:14:54 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Actually, it seems to be fairly well established now that memory<BR>&gt; *isn't* stored chemically. Instead it has to do with things like<BR>&gt; synapse connections and activation potentials. <BR><BR>Rather depends on your definition of 'chemically'.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 08:56:36 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Mikko V. I. Parviainen wrote:<BR>&gt; Absolute state of rest? <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; And if you can zero your angular momentum in respect to everything,<BR>&gt; that is gonna be cool...<BR><BR>Yeah, a much weaker form of "conservation".<BR><BR>If you're going to handwave an absolute reference frame for jumpspace<BR>to prevent time travel and the like, you may as well say that it is<BR>the only frame in which conservation laws hold.&nbsp; You've already done<BR>99% of the damage to the laws of physics as we know them by positing<BR>an absolute frame in the first place...<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 09:06:16 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Won't work. In the case of jump, "in the opposite direction" would be<BR>&gt; *from* to destination *to* the point of departure. Nothing else is<BR>&gt; guaranteed to balance.<BR><BR>Yes, if all (global) conservation laws have to hold in all reference<BR>frames, jump travel isn't possible as far as I can tell.&nbsp; That angular<BR>momentum one in particular is the one that really trips you up.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; btw, anybody know of a reasonable *word* for "point of departure" (ie<BR>&gt; an antonym for "destination"? The idea comes up a *lot* in discussions<BR>&gt; of jump and it gets annoying typing long phrases for such a *simple*<BR>&gt; concept. <BR><BR>I've been using "origin" in most contexts.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 17:39:01 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>At 03:09 -0500 10/1/01,&nbsp; Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;OK assume the penguin is frozen for dimensional stability.&nbsp; Like the RPG, a<BR>&gt;booster charge kicks the round out a safe distance, where the rocket motor<BR>&gt;ignites.<BR><BR><BR>Penguin: The RPG?<BR><BR>&gt;KE for our penguin at max velocity is 20.48 Megajoules<BR><BR>That is a scary amount of energy.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 20:37:00 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>I've just finished reading GT: Rim of Fire, and I think that it must <BR>be one of the best GURPS Traveller supplements so far. The thing that <BR>really shows this is the fact I got to the end of it and my mind was <BR>going 'What if I do this', 'I wonder if', 'Perhaps that would be'... <BR>the referee/GM side was really fired up. The last GT supplement that <BR>did this for me was GT:Alien Races 1 when I read the Zhodani section. <BR>Other books have been great for ideas on how to run a campaign (Far <BR>Trader especially) but this one gives me a great feeling.<BR><BR>Jon Zeigler has made the sector very very different to the Spinward <BR>Marches - the Imperial side has details on the politics between the <BR>Imperial nobility with the resulting infighting. The Solomani side <BR>has other sources of conflict between the Old Solomani <BR>(nationalistic) worlds and the New Solomani (supremacist and <BR>centralist) worlds. This is great is it gives a vibrant setting that <BR>is great to set a campaign in. Throw in a major border to cross, the <BR>most populated and highest trade region of Known space and you have <BR>the potential for a great setting. The historical snippets of <BR>material that has come from Andrew Moffatt-Vallance's Prometheus <BR>Rising project is also excellent, adding a real feel to the sector. I <BR>especially liked the comments on the Old Earth Union etc.<BR><BR>The listing of only the key (and or interesting) systems is great, as <BR>it gives the GM something to hang a campaign around with scope for <BR>individual creativity (something that I find hard with the paragraph <BR>for every world approach of _Behind the Claw_) whilst having as much <BR>detail as the old CT supplement for other worlds.<BR><BR>The feel of the Solomani in this is darker (IMO) that those in the <BR>DGP Solomani and Aslan (which tended to align&nbsp; more with the <BR>nationalistic view point) but more in line with the original <BR>descriptions in canon CT. I'd have liked to have seen a little more <BR>on the differences in ship design (beyond the heavier reliance on <BR>lasers) that are mentioned in the CT book, but as I'd use this with <BR>T4.x and HG2 I suspect that I don't really mind that much.<BR><BR>A very good setting, and quite different in feel to the Spinward Marches. 8/10<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 14:17:41 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>&gt;btw, anybody know of a reasonable *word* for "point of departure" (ie<BR>&gt;an antonym for "destination"? The idea comes up a *lot* in discussions<BR>&gt;of jump and it gets annoying typing long phrases for such a *simple*<BR>&gt;concept.<BR><BR>Origin?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 23:33:50 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>&gt; Another favorite.&nbsp; For years my standard Friday-Night-at-the-Con shirt was<BR>&gt; a blood-splattered shirt reading "My crew went to Garda-Prime and all I got<BR>&gt; was this lousy chest wound."<BR><BR>I go to Cons with mostly Vampire players. I made myself a (white)<BR>T-shirt with the following text:<BR><BR>Front:&nbsp; "Born to be Vlad"<BR><BR>Back: "My sire reached Golconda, but all I got was this lousy T-shirt"<BR>(Golconda is a Vampire RPG term, kind of like Nirvana)<BR><BR>Amused most, annoyed a few "tragically hip" goth types...&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 17:31:47 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Andrew Akins<BR><BR>On Wed, 10 Jan 2001 11:29:27 -0500 (EST), Andy Akins<BR>&lt;andyakins@earthlink.net&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;If anyone needs/wants any of my spreadsheets or such in the mean time, I<BR>&gt;can email them to you - or other people may have copies on their websites.<BR>&gt;I believe Freelance Traveller does...<BR><BR>Actually, no - what the computer connection does is simply provide a link<BR>to it on your own site (I think there are two exceptions, one of which is a<BR>program that Yours Truly wrote).<BR><BR>Do please let me know URLs when you're back up, so I can fix the link on<BR>FT.<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(Ask me via email about the ILink message network!)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 23:38:31 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; "By the light of a flashlight", please. "Torchlight" involves burning<BR>&gt; materials stuck on the end of a stick.<BR><BR>Depends on if you are American or English&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>ObTrav: Have words in some local dialect mean something not completely<BR>different from what they usually mean. Just enough to make a<BR>difference...<BR><BR>Can -&gt; Container<BR>Wheel -&gt; Car<BR>Pineapples -&gt; Grenades<BR>Flare -&gt; Plastic explosive<BR><BR>Might make for very interesting trade contract complications, odd<BR>misunderstandings, and other unpleasantness.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 16:41:08 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I've just finished reading GT: Rim of Fire, and I think that it must<BR>&gt; be one of the best GURPS Traveller supplements so far. T<BR><BR>Dom (and anyone else who would like to comment):<BR><BR>How "useable" are GT supplements if you aren't using GT rules?<BR><BR>I mean, no matter if you're running a CT, MT, or T4 game, the supplements are<BR>pretty interchangeable.&nbsp; TNE is interchangeable too, but you have to do more work<BR>if you want to use any of the rules or game mechanics.<BR><BR>How does GT fit in for someone who doesn't run a GT game?<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 14:56:27 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>&gt; How "useable" are GT supplements if you aren't using GT rules?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I mean, no matter if you're running a CT, MT, or T4 game, the supplements<BR>are<BR>&gt; pretty interchangeable.&nbsp; TNE is interchangeable too, but you have to do<BR>more work<BR>&gt; if you want to use any of the rules or game mechanics.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; How does GT fit in for someone who doesn't run a GT game?<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>I'm still running with CT rules, and buy and use all the GT supplements.<BR>The background material alone is worth it.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 18:29:25 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>Tod Glenn wrote:<BR>(quoting Kenneth Bearden)<BR>&gt; &gt; How "useable" are GT supplements if you aren't using GT rules?<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; I mean, no matter if you're running a CT, MT, or T4 game, the supplements<BR>are<BR>&gt;&gt; pretty interchangeable.&nbsp; TNE is interchangeable too, but you have to do<BR>more work<BR>&gt;&gt; if you want to use any of the rules or game mechanics.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; How does GT fit in for someone who doesn't run a GT game?<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;I'm still running with CT rules, and buy and use all the GT supplements.<BR>&gt;The background material alone is worth it.<BR><BR>Seconded.&nbsp; GURPS-specific rules typically are only a very small portion of each book (mostly topic-specific character templates and such).&nbsp; The bulk of each book is background/setting material, adventure hooks, and/or rules that have no more connection to GURPS than they do to Traveller and work equally well with either (e.g. the trade rules in 'Far Trader').&nbsp; Think of GT books as more akin to 'Traders &amp; Gunboats'(lots of info, a few stats) than 'Fighting Ships' (lots of stats, a little info).<BR><BR>In short, if the content of a GT book is something that interests you, by no means let concern about GURPS-specific game mechanics keep you away.<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 08:48:55 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>&gt; From: "Jones, Dean" <BR>&gt; &gt; From: Thing <BR>&gt; &gt; You should also check into Blake's 7.<BR>&gt; &gt; Space ships, the same gravel pits, and a good death count.<BR>&gt; &gt; Remember, no one with screen time gets out alive.<BR>&gt; Fantastic costuming, too. Plus, Avon is one of the best 'heros' ever to<BR>&gt; grace the small screen.<BR><BR>The longest running (&amp; highest level) D&amp;D character I ever played was at<BR>least partly based on Vila.&nbsp; Unfortunately, my character couldn't get away<BR>with being quite so much of a coward.&nbsp; On the other hand, I always was kind<BR>of hoping that Vila could get it together cornered rat style occasionally.<BR><BR>And then there is _the_ villain:&nbsp; Servalan.&nbsp; Oh my yes.&nbsp; I always did<BR>wonder, though, why she was quite so prone to wear impractical footwear<BR>while stumbling around quarr^h^h^h^h alien worlds.<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 20:47:20 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>Quick question:&nbsp; What are people's take on Emperor's Arsenal, Anomalies,<BR>and Annililik Run from the T4 run of supplements.&nbsp; Are they worth getting<BR>(for about $5 a pop)?<BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 02:26:55 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>on 10/1/01 2:42 pm, Trevor, Peter at Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Dean Jones wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; BTW, I'm currently working on "The Return of the Golden Penguin"<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; ACQ tournament for GenCon UK.&nbsp; To do this, I'm referring to my<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; two best sources on British Culture.&nbsp; Dr. Who, and Monty Python.<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; See ya there!<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Good choices. They pretty much tell you all you could ever<BR>&gt;&gt; want to know about Britain.<BR><BR>Ah, okay. :)<BR><BR>&gt; For education about Britain I'd add the film&nbsp; "Brazil" (*not* the<BR>&gt; "Love Will Find A Way" edit which had a happy ending).&nbsp; This will<BR>&gt; give insite into government organisations like the DSS&nbsp; and&nbsp; CSA,<BR>&gt; nationalised industry, local councils, etc.<BR><BR>For politics, you should try and find the satirical dramas: GBH and<BR>A Very British Coup. Also worth looking for any episodes of House of<BR>Cards, Yes Prime Minister and The New Statesman.<BR><BR>Our ports used to be type A, but since the sixties, they've steadily<BR>declined to a C. Greater London has population density 12, the<BR>Highlands of Scotland has population density 5. Other trivia supplied<BR>on request.<BR><BR>Hello Group. I'm new here... I just rescued my CT books from my parents'<BR>house over the holidays. Did some web digging, now I need to buy that<BR>lovely FFE stuff. :)<BR><BR>Are there many UK CT fans hereabouts?<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 15:28:34 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>On 10 Jan 01, at 20:47, knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Quick question:&nbsp; What are people's take on Emperor's Arsenal, Anomalies,<BR>&gt; and Annililik Run from the T4 run of supplements.&nbsp; Are they worth getting (for<BR>&gt; about $5 a pop)?<BR><BR>Emperor's Arsenal is certainly worth the $5 if you're running T4 rules. Its <BR>basically a big book of weapons. If you're not using T4 rules then its <BR>usefulness is limited<BR><BR>Anomalies is a book of adventures. Some are good, some are utter crud. If <BR>you need adventures on the fly its useful. At $5 probably worth it.<BR><BR>Annililik Run? Well what can be said about this? If you enjoy poorly written <BR>adventures featuring giant mutant space fungus then this is the adventure <BR>for you. Otherwise, you can take the Dom Mooney approach (is it worth $5 <BR>for a new mouse mat with a "spiffy" cover) [T4 mousemat joke credit to <BR>Dom]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 18:53:47<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>At 08:47 PM 1/10/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Quick question:&nbsp; What are people's take on Emperor's Arsenal, Anomalies,<BR>&gt;and Annililik Run from the T4 run of supplements.&nbsp; Are they worth getting<BR>&gt;(for about $5 a pop)?<BR><BR>Emperor's Arsenal, yes.<BR><BR>The other two.. run screaming.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 22:29:36 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Quick question:&nbsp; What are people's take on Emperor's Arsenal, Anomalies,<BR>&gt; and Annililik Run from the T4 run of supplements.&nbsp; Are they worth getting<BR>&gt; (for about $5 a pop)?<BR><BR>The Emperor's Arsenal is actually the best book on weapons ever published for<BR>Traveller (not the best weapon book ever made for weapons, mind you--but it<BR>is the best made for Traveller).<BR><BR>I like it a lot, and I use it a lot.<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 20:42:12 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Yes, if all (global) conservation laws have to hold in all reference<BR>&gt; frames, jump travel isn't possible as far as I can tell.&nbsp; That angular<BR>&gt; momentum one in particular is the one that really trips you up.<BR><BR>Yeah, somehow I don't think the players would like it if their ship<BR>came out spinning like a top. :-)<BR><BR>But using an exchange mass would work, except for the time factor...<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; btw, anybody know of a reasonable *word* for "point of departure" (ie<BR>&gt;&gt; an antonym for "destination"? The idea comes up a *lot* in discussions<BR>&gt;&gt; of jump and it gets annoying typing long phrases for such a *simple*<BR>&gt;&gt; concept. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I've been using "origin" in most contexts.<BR><BR>Trouble is, to come out right, it'd have to be "point of origin". &lt;sigh&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3514<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-za04.mx.aol.com (rly-za04.mail.aol.com [172.31.36.100]) by air-za03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 00:12:36 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-za04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 00:12:02 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id AAA99453;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 00:03:33 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 11 Jan 2001 00:03:15 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id AAA99348<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 00:03:15 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 00:03:15 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101110503.AAA99348@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3514<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3515</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/11/01 8:20:51 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 11 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3515<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR>Re: Blake's Seven<BR>RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3514<BR>Need some T4 reviews...<BR>RE: Blake's Seven<BR>Deck plans 2<BR>Re: mutiny<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 20:44:25 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; At 07:05 AM 1/10/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;You should also check into Blake's 7.<BR>&gt;&gt;Space ships, the same gravel pits, and a good death count.<BR>&gt;&gt;Remember, no one with screen time gets out alive.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Another favorite.&nbsp; For years my standard Friday-Night-at-the-Con shirt was<BR>&gt; a blood-splattered shirt reading "My crew went to Garda-Prime and all I got<BR>&gt; was this lousy chest wound."<BR><BR>You'd love the one Steve Barnes wore to Orycon one year. It had a full<BR>color, 3d and *very* lifelike "chestburster" stage Alien clawing its<BR>way out. <BR><BR>Even at a con *that* got some attention. &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 20:48:10 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Actually, it seems to be fairly well established now that memory<BR>&gt;&gt; *isn't* stored chemically. Instead it has to do with things like<BR>&gt;&gt; synapse connections and activation potentials. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Rather depends on your definition of 'chemically'.<BR><BR>Not really. If they are right, there *aren't* any "chemicals" you could<BR>extract to transfer memory. It's all a matter of structure, and<BR>possibly of the *patterns* of signals constantly flowing thru the<BR>neural net.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:08:15 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; Yeah, somehow I don't think the players would like it if their ship<BR>&gt; came out spinning like a top. :-)<BR><BR>:)<BR><BR>Now, let's see: how does the moment of inertia of a starship about its<BR>center compare to the moment of inertia of the same starship about an<BR>axis 2 parsecs away... a factor of 10^30 or so?<BR><BR><BR>&gt; But using an exchange mass would work, except for the time factor...<BR><BR>The time factor wrecks everything :( That's why I restricted myself to<BR>only global conservation.&nbsp; Local conservation seems shot no matter how<BR>you look at it.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Trouble is, to come out right, it'd have to be "point of origin". &lt;sigh&gt;<BR><BR>A jump from origin to destination sounds fine to me.&nbsp; Yes, you could<BR>make it jump from its point of origin to its destination point, but<BR>that seems excessively wordy.&nbsp; I prefer the former.<BR><BR>In general, I agree with your complaint: English just seems to lack a<BR>number of words that should exist.<BR><BR><BR>- - Tim<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:20:27 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Not really. If they are right, there *aren't* any "chemicals" you<BR>&gt; could extract to transfer memory. It's all a matter of structure,<BR>&gt; and possibly of the *patterns* of signals constantly flowing thru<BR>&gt; the neural net.<BR><BR>His point still stands: as far as we can tell, memories are composed<BR>of information that you might be able to extract from a frozen brain<BR>and reconstruct with sufficiently advanced technology.&nbsp; If you would<BR>want to, that is.<BR><BR>It's just a question of how much damage ice crystals in the brain do<BR>compared with future reconstruction techniques.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 19:33:36 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry wrote :<BR>&gt; Another favorite.&nbsp; For years my standard Friday-Night-at-the-Con shirt was<BR>&gt; a blood-splattered shirt reading "My crew went to Garda-Prime and<BR>&gt; all I got was this lousy chest wound."<BR><BR>Hey, that's a cool shirt !<BR><BR>You mind if I rip the idea off for the next con I go to ?<BR>I'd like to see how many people get it.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 19:33:35 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>Jones, Dean wrote :<BR>&gt; Fantastic costuming, too. Plus, Avon is one of the best 'heros' ever to<BR>&gt; grace the small screen.<BR><BR>Blake's not too bad either !<BR>&lt;grin&gt;<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 03:53:16 +1100<BR>From: "Katharine Whitchurch" &lt;katts@globalfreeway.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR><BR>&gt; From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>&gt; Actually, it appears to be a *really small* King Penguin.&nbsp; Perhaps they<BR>&gt; recruit rebellious teenage penguins, who are looking for an extreme sport<BR>&gt; to torment their parents with..<BR><BR>In a coincidence that I'm sure Messers Berry (among others) will blame on<BR>the Templars, I have had a long connection with FS (the purporters<BR>manufacturers of the device - after speaking with Leeeeegals, I cannot at<BR>this point in time and based on the information available to me confirm or<BR>deny whether it was manufactured by FS), and for a time I lived on King<BR>Island, a small windswept island in Bass Strait, between Tasmania and<BR>Australia.<BR><BR>My father was a teacher and one of the local bird-watchers, and he used to<BR>bring back specimens occasionally (my mother drew the line after the<BR>Albatross Incident. After that, the specimens went into a school freezer<BR>before re-shipment).<BR><BR>Well, one day a young, presumably rebellious King Penguin swam ashore one<BR>day, having missed his (presumed) target of Macquarie Island by a couple of<BR>thousand kilometers.<BR><BR>The penguin was clearly not long for this world, so he was taken to a secret<BR>FS laboratory for experiments ^k^k^k^k^k^k our laundry to live out his<BR>last few days before being frozen and shipped to a museum (some of his ticks<BR>apparently ended up in America).<BR><BR>Coincidence or conspiracy ... you be the judge.<BR><BR>Ian Whitchurch<BR><BR>PS The ObTravs should be obvious - just imagine the fun when a 'small<BR>package' turns out to be a biosample, especially if the world the players<BR>are on has a thing about biocontamination.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 09:42:35 +0000<BR>From: Timothy.Collinson@solent.ac.uk<BR>Subject: Re: Blake's Seven<BR><BR>Russell B wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Excellent source for Traveller campaign material, too, I think. If I<BR>recall<BR>&gt;correctly, the final episode where everyone bites it was originally aired<BR>&gt;right before Christmas in the UK, and, uh, apparently the holidays were<BR>ruined by and for a few overly-attached fans.<BR><BR>&gt;My favorite lines:<BR><BR>&gt;Vila: "I've got this shocking pain right behind my eyes."<BR>&gt;Avon: "Have you considered amputation?"<BR><BR>&gt;and<BR><BR>&gt;(Someone): "My people have a saying: trust freely given can never be<BR>&gt;betrayed, only mistaken."<BR>&gt;Avon: "Life expectancy must be fairly short among your people."<BR><BR>&gt;Easily the bleakest, most cynical science fiction series I've ever seen.<BR><BR><BR>Absolutely.&nbsp; But great fun.<BR><BR>One of my favourite lines (at least one that really sticks in my mind) is:<BR><BR>"Avon's idea of diplomacy is to break someone's leg and offer them a crutch<BR>afterwards."<BR><BR><BR>tc<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:34:42 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow) wrote:<BR>&gt; btw, anybody know of a reasonable *word* for "point of departure"<BR>&gt; (ie an antonym for "destination"? The idea comes up a *lot* in<BR>&gt; discussions of jump and it gets annoying typing long phrases for<BR>&gt; such a *simple* concept. <BR><BR>I tend to use "entry" (as in "jumpspace entry" for the&nbsp; point&nbsp; of<BR>departure)&nbsp; and&nbsp; "exit"&nbsp; (as&nbsp; in&nbsp;&nbsp; "jumpspace&nbsp;&nbsp; exit"&nbsp;&nbsp; for&nbsp;&nbsp; the<BR>destination).<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:47:44 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt; The time factor wrecks everything :( That's why I restricted<BR>&gt; myself to only global conservation.&nbsp; Local conservation seems<BR>&gt; shot no matter how you look at it.<BR><BR>You could go one step further and say&nbsp; that&nbsp; conservation&nbsp; occurs<BR>not&nbsp; at&nbsp; the&nbsp; global&nbsp; (universe)&nbsp; level&nbsp; but&nbsp; at&nbsp; the&nbsp; multiverse<BR>(universe plus jumpspace) level.&nbsp; Then you can balance the energy<BR>by using jumpspace as&nbsp; the&nbsp; universal&nbsp; energy&nbsp; sink&nbsp; ...&nbsp; dumping<BR>energy into it or taking it out as appropriate.<BR><BR>What bothers me most about the time factor is&nbsp; that&nbsp; most&nbsp; people<BR>treat jumpspace as Newtonian and yet&nbsp; its&nbsp; supposed&nbsp; to&nbsp; interact<BR>(under the&nbsp; right&nbsp; circumstances)&nbsp; with&nbsp; our&nbsp; non-Newtonian&nbsp; (ie.<BR>Eiensteinian) universe.&nbsp; Even&nbsp; if&nbsp; jumpspace&nbsp; were&nbsp; Newtonian&nbsp; it<BR>shouldn't have a 1:1 temporal&nbsp; relationship&nbsp; with&nbsp; all&nbsp; reference<BR>points in the universe.&nbsp; Therefore there is&nbsp; something&nbsp; very&nbsp; odd<BR>about the way time works in jumpspace ... and that could make&nbsp; an<BR>even worse mess of the local conservation laws.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:58:52 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: shadow@krypton.rain.com [mailto:shadow@krypton.rain.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: 10 January 2001 20:54<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Technology Marches On: TL13 Arrives<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Yup, but at present it's not suspended animation we're <BR>&gt; worrying about...it's<BR>&gt; &gt; preservation of a cadaver in the hope that resuscitation <BR>&gt; can be acchieved at<BR>&gt; &gt; a higher tech level. Even if reanimation isn't possible <BR>&gt; perhaps a reading of<BR>&gt; &gt; the chemical info in the brain is (assuming it doesn't get <BR>&gt; turned to a pulp<BR>&gt; &gt; by ice crystals or melted by the vitrifier)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Actually, it seems to be fairly well established now that memory<BR>&gt; *isn't* stored chemically. Instead it has to do with things like<BR>&gt; synapse connections and activation potentials. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; There's a fair chance that they'd be able to revive your <BR>&gt; body, but that<BR>&gt; either you'd have total amnesia, or that you'd be a vegetable.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; They use vacuum flasks and liquid nitrogen. If the power <BR>&gt; goes out it just<BR>&gt; &gt; means the flask have to be topped up by torch-light.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; "By the light of a flashlight", please. "Torchlight" involves burning<BR>&gt; materials stuck on the end of a stick.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>LOL, just got a mental image of a primitive tribe pouring buckets of Liquid<BR>N2 into dewar flasks, as a service to 'The Sleeping Ones'. <BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 11:04:12 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; "By the light of a flashlight", please. "Torchlight" <BR>&gt; involves burning<BR>&gt; &gt; materials stuck on the end of a stick.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Depends on if you are American or English&nbsp; ;-)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; ObTrav: Have words in some local dialect mean something not completely<BR>&gt; different from what they usually mean. Just enough to make a<BR>&gt; difference...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Can -&gt; Container<BR>&gt; Wheel -&gt; Car<BR>&gt; Pineapples -&gt; Grenades<BR>&gt; Flare -&gt; Plastic explosive<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Might make for very interesting trade contract complications, odd<BR>&gt; misunderstandings, and other unpleasantness.<BR><BR>Pants -&gt;Trousers<BR>Nicked -&gt; Alternately slang for 'Steal' or 'To notch with a knife'<BR>Handbag-&gt; IIRC Handbag in the States is either 'pocketbook' or purse<BR><BR>Ob-Trav: <BR>'Officer, someone just nicked my handbag!'<BR>"What? "<BR><BR>:)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 22:10:21 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Trevor, Peter wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; You could go one step further and say&nbsp; that&nbsp; conservation&nbsp; occurs<BR>&gt; not&nbsp; at&nbsp; the&nbsp; global&nbsp; (universe)&nbsp; level&nbsp; but&nbsp; at&nbsp; the&nbsp; multiverse<BR>&gt; (universe plus jumpspace) level.&nbsp; Then you can balance the energy<BR>&gt; by using jumpspace as&nbsp; the&nbsp; universal&nbsp; energy&nbsp; sink&nbsp; ...&nbsp; dumping<BR>&gt; energy into it or taking it out as appropriate.<BR><BR>In any practical sense, that's just the same as non-conservation of<BR>energy.&nbsp; Unless, of course, the energy of jumpspace can actually be<BR>depleted by such a procedure.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; What bothers me most about the time factor is&nbsp; that&nbsp; most&nbsp; people<BR>&gt; treat jumpspace as Newtonian and yet&nbsp; its&nbsp; supposed&nbsp; to&nbsp; interact<BR>&gt; (under the&nbsp; right&nbsp; circumstances)&nbsp; with&nbsp; our&nbsp; non-Newtonian&nbsp; (ie.<BR>&gt; Eiensteinian) universe.<BR><BR>No kidding!&nbsp; Hence my comment weeks ago that there's not much point<BR>in using relativity if you're going to introduce absolute jumpspace<BR>reference frames and suchlike.&nbsp; They just don't play nice together.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 11:07:37 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Actually, it seems to be fairly well established now that memory<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; *isn't* stored chemically. Instead it has to do with things like<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; synapse connections and activation potentials. <BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Rather depends on your definition of 'chemically'.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Not really. If they are right, there *aren't* any "chemicals" <BR>&gt; you could<BR>&gt; extract to transfer memory. It's all a matter of structure, and<BR>&gt; possibly of the *patterns* of signals constantly flowing thru the<BR>&gt; neural net.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Apologies...lazy use of language. Please susbtitute 'electro-chemical<BR>structure' for 'chemical info' in my post and it makes a little more sense.<BR>My AI professors always warned me that sloppy vocab. leads to sloppy<BR>thinking :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 11:34:55 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Frank G. Pitt [mailto:frankie@mundens.gen.nz]<BR>&gt; Sent: 11 January 2001 06:34<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Jones, Dean wrote :<BR>&gt; &gt; Fantastic costuming, too. Plus, Avon is one of the best <BR>&gt; 'heros' ever to<BR>&gt; &gt; grace the small screen.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Blake's not too bad either !<BR>&gt; &lt;grin&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Hmmm, Blake was too heroic and noble for my tastes...he actually tried to do<BR>something about the injustic and tyranny. Avon mostly tried to rip people<BR>off. I think my favourite scene was post-Blake...when Avon realised that<BR>he'd sold the incredibly valuable black gold to Servelan for worthless<BR>devalued money...and he broke into laughter. Vila couldn't figure out what<BR>was so funny :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 11:39:07 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt; Trevor, Peter wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; You could go one step further and say&nbsp; that&nbsp; conservation&nbsp; occurs<BR>&gt; &gt; not&nbsp; at&nbsp; the&nbsp; global&nbsp; (universe)&nbsp; level&nbsp; but&nbsp; at&nbsp; the&nbsp; multiverse<BR>&gt; &gt; (universe plus jumpspace) level.&nbsp; Then you can balance the energy<BR>&gt; &gt; by using jumpspace as&nbsp; the&nbsp; universal&nbsp; energy&nbsp; sink&nbsp; ...&nbsp; dumping<BR>&gt; &gt; energy into it or taking it out as appropriate.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; In any practical sense, that's just the same as non-conservation of<BR>&gt; energy.&nbsp; Unless, of course, the energy of jumpspace can actually be<BR>&gt; depleted by such a procedure.<BR><BR>Yes, that's what I'm suggesting.<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt; What bothers me most about the time factor is&nbsp; that&nbsp; most&nbsp; people<BR>&gt; &gt; treat jumpspace as Newtonian and yet&nbsp; its&nbsp; supposed&nbsp; to&nbsp; interact<BR>&gt; &gt; (under the&nbsp; right&nbsp; circumstances)&nbsp; with&nbsp; our&nbsp; non-Newtonian&nbsp; (ie.<BR>&gt; &gt; Eiensteinian) universe.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; No kidding!&nbsp; Hence my comment weeks ago that there's not much point<BR>&gt; in using relativity if you're going to introduce absolute jumpspace<BR>&gt; reference frames and suchlike.&nbsp; They just don't play nice together.<BR><BR>I *don't* thing jumpspace is Newtonian.&nbsp; I'm just&nbsp; saying&nbsp; it&nbsp; is<BR>commonly treated as such.&nbsp; I'm still pondering what jumpspace&nbsp; is<BR>... whether it is&nbsp; quantum&nbsp; mechanical&nbsp; on&nbsp; the&nbsp; macro&nbsp; scale&nbsp; or<BR>something else post-Eiensteinian I haven't figured out yet.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 12:44:42 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>Kenneth Bearden wrote:<BR>&gt; How "useable" are GT supplements if you aren't using GT rules?<BR><BR>Very. I use T4 (modified) rules, but I use the GT supplements I own<BR>(most, but not all... yet). They are full of background material, for<BR>the most part written without a single reference to GURPS.<BR><BR>If you are familiar with the basic rules of GURPS (download for free<BR>from SJgames), you can even convert some of the rules (character<BR>templates -&gt; careers) with not that much effort.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 12:49:31 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR>&gt; Quick question:&nbsp; What are people's take on Emperor's Arsenal, Anomalies,<BR>&gt; and Annililik Run from the T4 run of supplements.&nbsp; Are they worth getting<BR>&gt; (for about $5 a pop)?<BR><BR>Emperor's arsenal :&nbsp; Really good, at least if you use T4 rules. I don't<BR>know much about other rules variants.<BR><BR>Anomalies :&nbsp; Adventures. I haven't read all of them, but they vary<BR>wildly in quality. If you like ready-made adventures, you might as well<BR>buy it.<BR><BR>Annililik Run :&nbsp; Three adventures with a common theme (sort of). You can<BR>probably find better ones than this. At least if you have one eye and<BR>half a brain...<BR>Still, with some work you might be able to mold them into something<BR>useful.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 13:06:21 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>A number of times I've seen people remark at all GURPS books are good for <BR>the background alone no matter what type of genre you are running.<BR>Ive seen someone on the list use GURPS Dinosaurs for background :)<BR><BR>Mike<BR><BR><BR>&gt;From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>&gt;Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 14:56:27 -0800<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; How "useable" are GT supplements if you aren't using GT rules?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; I mean, no matter if you're running a CT, MT, or T4 game, the <BR>&gt;supplements<BR>&gt;are<BR>&gt; &gt; pretty interchangeable.&nbsp; TNE is interchangeable too, but you have to do<BR>&gt;more work<BR>&gt; &gt; if you want to use any of the rules or game mechanics.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; How does GT fit in for someone who doesn't run a GT game?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I'm still running with CT rules, and buy and use all the GT supplements.<BR>&gt;The background material alone is worth it.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Tod<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 09:07:03 -0500<BR>From: Jonathan McDermott &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 12:43:46 PST<BR>&gt;From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>&gt;btw, anybody know of a reasonable *word* for "point of departure" (ie<BR>&gt;an antonym for "destination"? The idea comes up a *lot* in discussions<BR>&gt;of jump and it gets annoying typing long phrases for such a *simple*<BR>&gt;concept.<BR><BR>Perhaps "origin" might work? I know I feel kind of borderline about it <BR>myself....<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 09:37:06 -0700<BR>From: "David J. Golden" &lt;goldendj@pcisys.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3514<BR><BR>At 12:03 am 1/11/01 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt;btw, anybody know of a reasonable *word* for "point of departure"<BR>(ie<BR>&gt;an antonym for "destination"? The idea comes up a *lot* in <BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; "Origin?"<BR>- --"Those who cast the votes decide nothing, those who count the votes<BR>decide<BR>everything." Josef Stalin<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 09:46:26 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>&gt;Quick question:&nbsp; What are people's take on Emperor's Arsenal, Anomalies,<BR>&gt;and Annililik Run from the T4 run of supplements.&nbsp; Are they worth getting<BR>&gt;(for about $5 a pop)?<BR><BR>Emperor's Arsenal is worth it.&nbsp; Just for the nice selection at each tech <BR>level &amp; the artwork.<BR><BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/ - Opinions should be yours too!<BR>64,999,987 firearm owners killed no one yesterday.<BR>Somehow, it didn't make the news.<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 14:50:26 -0000<BR>From: "Mark Preston" &lt;mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Blake's Seven<BR><BR>No _definate_ proof, true (and in the follow up stories I've read so<BR>far at least Villa Restor was still alive - and possibly Blake and<BR>Avon too). BTW, my favourite quote was Villa's "A thief is not WHAT I<BR>am, its WHO I am".<BR><BR>- --<BR>Mark A. Preston, The Magpie's Nest, Lancashire, UK<BR>Email&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; : mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk<BR>Website : www.mpreston.demon.co.uk<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of michael.scanlon<BR>&gt; Sent: 10 January 2001 18:31<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Blake's Seven<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; AS I recall, there is no real proof that all got snuffed....<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Russell<BR>&gt; Bornschlegel<BR>&gt; Sent: 10 January 2001 18:18<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Blake's Seven<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Dean Jones wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; From: Thing [mailto:thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net]<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; You should also check into Blake's 7.<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Space ships, the same gravel pits, and a good death count.<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Remember, no one with screen time gets out alive.<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Fantastic costuming, too. Plus, Avon is one of the best<BR>&gt; 'heros' ever to<BR>&gt; &gt; grace the small screen.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Excellent source for Traveller campaign material, too, I<BR>&gt; think. If I recall<BR>&gt; correctly, the final episode where everyone bites it was<BR>&gt; originally aired<BR>&gt; right before Christmas in the UK, and, uh, apparently the<BR>&gt; holidays were<BR>&gt; ruined by and for a few overly-attached fans.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; My favorite lines:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Vila: "I've got this shocking pain right behind my eyes."<BR>&gt; Avon: "Have you considered amputation?"<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; and<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; (Someone): "My people have a saying: trust freely given can never be<BR>&gt; betrayed, only mistaken."<BR>&gt; Avon: "Life expectancy must be fairly short among your people."<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Easily the bleakest, most cynical science fiction series<BR>&gt; I've ever seen.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -Russell B<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 15:39:53 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Deck plans 2<BR><BR>For those of you who enjoyed the Beowulf Deckplans, SJG is releasing a<BR>second set...for the modular cutter.Includes 7 modules and more cardboard<BR>heroes...including Newt and Virushi figures.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 08:21:00 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: mutiny<BR><BR>&gt;From: Victor Abraham Delnore &lt;vad9m@unix.mail.virginia.edu&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: mutiny<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;There seems to have been a wave of mutinies aboard vessels of the<BR>&gt;Imperial Navy, although the reference is obscure.&nbsp; According to Supplement<BR>&gt;7, p. 34, the Gazelle-class close escort "was designed at a time when<BR>&gt;mutinies were a major threat to security."&nbsp; What year was it designed?<BR><BR>&nbsp; IIRC, there's a ref to Gazelles in the SRW, so it would be an early<BR>TL E design. Yes, that contradicts other material from various sources.<BR><BR>&gt;Well, CT material is not very good about giving you a date in service of<BR>&gt;most military vessels.&nbsp; It would have to be some time after the Imperium<BR>&gt;reached TL 14.&nbsp; Maybe it had to do with the Solomani movement, which must<BR>&gt;have attracted the sympathies of some naval personnel--although I'd expect<BR>&gt;more officers than enlisted to side with the Solomani!<BR><BR>&nbsp; I suggested last year (?) that the issue was recruiting on worlds <BR>recently freed from the Solomani during the War - some agents would<BR>have been in place before the expansion, and some fellow-Travellers<BR>would have been genuinely sympathetic to the Movement.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Steven Hudson<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3515<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xb04.mx.aol.com (rly-xb04.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.105]) by air-xb02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 11:20:50 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xb04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 11:20:24 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id LAA23170;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 11:19:22 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 11 Jan 2001 11:18:14 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA23118<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 11:18:14 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 11:18:14 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101111618.LAA23118@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3515<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3516</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/11/01 2:07:06 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 11 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3516<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR>RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>RE: mutiny<BR>Blake's 7 (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR>Re: Deck plans 2<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>GT Cardboard Heros<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 08:15:47<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>At 08:44 PM 1/10/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;You'd love the one Steve Barnes wore to Orycon one year. It had a full<BR>&gt;color, 3d and *very* lifelike "chestburster" stage Alien clawing its<BR>&gt;way out. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Even at a con *that* got some attention. &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>I saw him do Tai Chi in that shirt at ConFrancisco.&nbsp; Sort of pulls your<BR>focus off.&nbsp; That was also the morning that Harlan Ellison walked into the<BR>room where we were doing our morning excercises, and Steve *leapt* into<BR>Harlan's arms.&nbsp; And Harlan caught him.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 08:13:10<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR><BR>At 03:53 AM 1/11/2001 +1100, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;In a coincidence that I'm sure Messers Berry (among others) will blame on<BR>&gt;the Templars, I have had a long connection with FS (the purporters<BR>&gt;manufacturers of the device - after speaking with Leeeeegals, I cannot at<BR>&gt;this point in time and based on the information available to me confirm or<BR>&gt;deny whether it was manufactured by FS), and for a time I lived on King<BR>&gt;Island, a small windswept island in Bass Strait, between Tasmania and<BR>&gt;Australia.<BR><BR>OK, this getting *too* weird.<BR><BR>Everyone who hasn't burned their T4 stuff in disgust, grab _Imperial<BR>Squadrons_.&nbsp; I get credit for "additional design."&nbsp; I did the four ships<BR>that were butchered by IG.&nbsp; Now, turn to page 9, and read the description<BR>of the Bass Strait (they mangled the spelling as well) DE.&nbsp; Note that the<BR>class is named for "early Terran-Vilani encounters".&nbsp; <BR><BR>Bass Strait is the sight of one of the most famous of all UFO sightings,<BR>the Valentich Incident.<BR><BR>http://www.ozemail.com.au/~vufors/valensum.htm<BR><BR>And now we see that one of the minds behind FS lived right on top of Oz's<BR>UFO central?!<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Well, one day a young, presumably rebellious King Penguin swam ashore one<BR>&gt;day, having missed his (presumed) target of Macquarie Island by a couple of<BR>&gt;thousand kilometers.<BR><BR>Ian, I think that penguin came to you for a reason.&nbsp; He wasn't lost, he was<BR>sent.&nbsp; Who needs monoliths?<BR><BR>&gt;The penguin was clearly not long for this world, so he was taken to a secret<BR>&gt;FS laboratory for experiments ^k^k^k^k^k^k our laundry to live out his<BR>&gt;last few days before being frozen and shipped to a museum (some of his ticks<BR>&gt;apparently ended up in America).<BR><BR>You see!! Your very words betray the programming! "Not long for THIS<BR>WORLD"!&nbsp; And the poor pengie wasn't dead, he was just resting!&nbsp; And he<BR>wasn't frozen, he was put in a cold sleep berth and shipped back to<BR>Dingir!!&nbsp; That penguin no more went to a museum than my spleen traveled to<BR>Israel!&nbsp; (Wait a minute.. my spleen did end up in Israel.&nbsp; Ignore that last<BR>bit -DB)<BR><BR>And his "ticks" ended up in America?&nbsp; Ticks are BUGS!!!!!&nbsp; How close is<BR>Normal, Illinois to WRIGHT-PATTERSON AFB?&nbsp; Haven't you ever wondered what<BR>made nice, normal wargamers like Marc and Loren suddenly decide to write<BR>*role-playing games?*&nbsp; Hmmmm??? <BR><BR>The answer is clear: TRAVELLER IS A VILANI PSYCH WAR OPERATION DESIGNED TO<BR>SOFTEN US UP FOR THE INEVITABLE INVASION!!!<BR><BR>Which is cool with me.&nbsp; Dibs on Quisling traitor in charge of California.<BR><BR>(My new vow: Never, ever post to the TML after reading over 300 messages in<BR>alt.conspiracy.)<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&nbsp; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>Animals who are not penguins can only wish they were.<BR>- -Chicago reader, 10/15/82<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 08:18:13<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>At 11:34 AM 1/11/2001 -0000, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Hmmm, Blake was too heroic and noble for my tastes...he actually tried to do<BR>&gt;something about the injustic and tyranny. Avon mostly tried to rip people<BR>&gt;off. I think my favourite scene was post-Blake...when Avon realised that<BR>&gt;he'd sold the incredibly valuable black gold to Servelan for worthless<BR>&gt;devalued money...and he broke into laughter. Vila couldn't figure out what<BR>&gt;was so funny :)<BR><BR>What I loved about Avon was that he was insane.&nbsp; Not a screaming, bouncing<BR>off the walls crazy, but a very quiet, methodical sociopath.<BR><BR>When I need an example of Lawful Evil for my DnD games, I point out Avon.<BR>Blake was Lawful Stupid, and Vila was Chaotic Neutral.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 08:24:18<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>At 01:06 PM 1/11/2001, you wrote:<BR>&gt;A number of times I've seen people remark at all GURPS books are good for <BR>&gt;the background alone no matter what type of genre you are running.<BR>&gt;Ive seen someone on the list use GURPS Dinosaurs for background :)<BR><BR>Absolutely!<BR><BR>For years before GT was even announced I'd by GURPS books just because of<BR>the their incredible value as source material!&nbsp; GURPS China helped me plan<BR>the first version of my "'Ware The East!" DnD campaign (the Mongol<BR>invasions of the 13th Century replayed with goblinoids as the Mongols.)<BR>I'm using the currency rules from G: Cyberworld in building a GURPS<BR>Space/WH40K/House setting.<BR><BR>One thing I've always wanted to try was a fantasy setting using the magic<BR>in G: Voodoo.&nbsp; No wizards sending fireballs around, but instead spirits and<BR>loa coming on deadly errands, and magic powders and potions for almost any<BR>occasion.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 09:14:23 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson writes:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Rather depends on your definition of 'chemically'.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Not really. If they are right, there *aren't* any "chemicals" you could<BR>&gt; extract to transfer memory. It's all a matter of structure, and<BR>&gt; possibly of the *patterns* of signals constantly flowing thru the<BR>&gt; neural net.<BR><BR>Ok, so you need to know the location of the chemicals.&nbsp; The brain generally<BR>uses chemicals to transmit signals.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 12:19:36 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR>&gt; Quick question:&nbsp; What are people's take on Emperor's Arsenal, Anomalies,<BR>&gt;and Annililik Run from the T4 run of supplements.&nbsp; Are they worth getting<BR>&gt;(for about $5 a pop)?<BR><BR>I'm sure other people've already answered, but here's my take:<BR><BR>'Emperor's Arsenal':&nbsp; Essential if you actually play T4; still worthwhile even if you don't.&nbsp; This was a definite highpoint in the T4 line (not to damn with faint praise).<BR><BR>'Anomalies': Anthology of about 9-10 adventures, maybe 2 or 3 of which are worthwhile.&nbsp; Not even as good as TNE's 'Smash &amp; Grab.'&nbsp; Maybe worth about $5 if you're desperate for adventures.<BR><BR>'Annililik Run':&nbsp; Total and complete garbage, written by Jim Ward who designed 'Metamorphosis Alpha' for TSR in 1976 and obviously knows nothing about Traveller ... or SF ... or good adventure-writing.&nbsp; Consider yourself having saved $5 by not buying this one.<BR><BR>I've brought this up before to massively indifferent response, but I really believe that somewhere on one of the multitude of Traveller websites there should be a FAQ of which books are worth buying and which to avoid.&nbsp; No one should, out of ignorance, end up paying good money for 'Starships' ever again!<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:32:19 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: mutiny<BR><BR>Steven Hudson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Well, CT material is not very good about giving you a date in<BR>&gt; &gt; service of most military vessels.&nbsp; It would have to be some time<BR>&gt; &gt; after the Imperium reached TL 14.&nbsp; Maybe it had to do with the<BR>&gt; &gt; Solomani movement, which must have attracted the sympathies of<BR>&gt; &gt; some naval personnel--although I'd expect more officers than<BR>&gt; &gt; enlisted to side with the Solomani!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I suggested last year (?) that the issue was recruiting on worlds <BR>&gt; recently freed from the Solomani during the War - some agents<BR>&gt; would have been in place before the expansion, and some fellow-<BR>&gt; Travellers would have been genuinely sympathetic to the Movement.<BR><BR>More likely the issue would&nbsp; be&nbsp; recruiting&nbsp; on&nbsp; worlds&nbsp; recently<BR>occupied by the Imperium during the War - some loyal agents would<BR>have been&nbsp; in&nbsp; place&nbsp; before&nbsp; the&nbsp; expansion,&nbsp; and&nbsp; some&nbsp; fellow-<BR>Travellers would have been genuinely sympathetic to the Movement.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 12:55:19 -0500<BR>From: Jonathan McDermott &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Blake's 7 (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 11:34:55 -0000<BR>&gt;From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: RE: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>&gt;Hmmm, Blake was too heroic and noble for my tastes...he actually tried to do<BR>&gt;something about the injustic and tyranny. Avon mostly tried to rip people<BR>&gt;off. I think my favourite scene was post-Blake...when Avon realised that<BR>&gt;he'd sold the incredibly valuable black gold to Servelan for worthless<BR>&gt;devalued money...and he broke into laughter. Vila couldn't figure out what<BR>&gt;was so funny :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Dean<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR><BR>I think one of the most telling things about the relationship between Avon <BR>and Blake was in the beginning of the series, when they discover the <BR>Liberator and are discussing the ship's teleporter.<BR><BR>Blake: (paraphrased) "It seems that this is a teleporter.&nbsp; I worked on a <BR>Federation project to develop it."<BR>Avon: "I worked on the same project."<BR>Blake: "Small world."<BR>Avon: "Large project."<BR><BR>Avon comes off as the realist and Blake the idealist.&nbsp; Avon isn't prone to <BR>using hyperbole.&nbsp; This scene not only defines the two characters but it <BR>sets them up for their relationship for the rest of the series.<BR><BR>Cheers<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 12:59:43 -0500<BR>From: Jonathan McDermott &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Deck plans 2<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 15:39:53 -0000<BR>&gt;From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Deck plans 2<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;For those of you who enjoyed the Beowulf Deckplans, SJG is releasing a<BR>&gt;second set...for the modular cutter.Includes 7 modules and more cardboard<BR>&gt;heroes...including Newt and Virushi figures.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Dean<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR><BR>Should we be grateful that there won't be Sayat Cardboard Heroes anytime <BR>soon? &lt;g,d,r&gt;&nbsp; Prrt CH's might be interesting, too....<BR><BR>They're coming out with a whole book about the Modular Cutters, aren't <BR>they?&nbsp; Someone in SJG must -really- like them.<BR><BR>Cheers<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:55:10 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>At 00:03 -0500 11/1/01, Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions <BR>&lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Dom (and anyone else who would like to comment):<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;How "useable" are GT supplements if you aren't using GT rules?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I mean, no matter if you're running a CT, MT, or T4 game, the supplements are<BR>&gt;pretty interchangeable.&nbsp; TNE is interchangeable too, but you have to <BR>&gt;do more work<BR>&gt;if you want to use any of the rules or game mechanics.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;How does GT fit in for someone who doesn't run a GT game?<BR><BR>I run T4.1 with High Guard 2 for ships, and little biddy bits of MT <BR>rules, and I find the GT supplements very useful.<BR><BR>The Alien Modules are great for flavour and ideas, very like the <BR>original CT books in usefulness.<BR><BR>Far Trader is a superb way of injecting a real mercantile feel into <BR>the game - loads of ideas that could be grabbed for trader.<BR><BR>First In is much the same for Scouts.<BR><BR>Haven't read Ground Forces yet but it looks good.<BR><BR>Starports pairs with Far Trader to cover more of the trade stuff - I <BR>would buy FT first though.<BR><BR>Rim of Fire I've already mentioned.<BR><BR>Behind the Claw has a paragraph description of every world in the <BR>Spinward Marches - I prefer RoF to this, but RoF is a number of books <BR>on.<BR><BR>Buy the Deck Plans for the Beowulf now - they are really superb.<BR><BR>Star Mercs really isn't my cup of tea at all.<BR><BR>GURPS is based on a 3D6 roll over a target number - the BITS task <BR>conversion system on our website guides how to convert to Traveller <BR>Speak, and GURPS lite is downloadable at SJG's site if you want a <BR>feel for the mechanics.<BR><BR>Personally, I feel the GT line is better produced than the last two <BR>Traveller editions.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 18:00:40 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>At 00:03 -0500 11/1/01, Traveller-digest&nbsp; knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR>&gt;Quick question:&nbsp; What are people's take on Emperor's Arsenal, Anomalies,<BR>&gt;and Annililik Run from the T4 run of supplements.&nbsp; Are they worth getting<BR>&gt;(for about $5 a pop)?<BR><BR>EA: Great list of weapons and flavour text including nukes for T4. <BR>Core Supplement if you have T4 to run.<BR><BR>Anomalies - had poor reviews on release, as showed too much knowledge <BR>of Droyne as Ancients, and had technology issues. Not read it yet so <BR>can' comment.<BR><BR>Annililik Run - DO NOT BUY THIS. BITS/CORE submitted a very nice <BR>adventure plot which was ignored by IG and turned into a D&amp;D Dungeon <BR>style crawl in space with absolutely no relation to canon (ships <BR>meeting in jump etc). This is unmitigated cr*p, worse than Starships <BR>for T4. When I get some time I'll put the original AR proposal on the <BR>CORE website http://www.core.org.uk/<BR><BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 18:02:19 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>At 00:03 -0500 11/1/01, Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Hello Group. I'm new here... I just rescued my CT books from my parents'<BR>&gt;house over the holidays. Did some web digging, now I need to buy that<BR>&gt;lovely FFE stuff. :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Are there many UK CT fans hereabouts?<BR><BR>Have a look at BITS http://www.bits.org.uk/ for the UK's Traveller <BR>Support Group and Publisher...<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 18:04:26 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>At 00:03 -0500 11/1/01,&nbsp; "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" <BR>&lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Annililik Run? Well what can be said about this? If you enjoy poorly written<BR>&gt;adventures featuring giant mutant space fungus then this is the adventure<BR>&gt;for you. Otherwise, you can take the Dom Mooney approach (is it worth $5<BR>&gt;for a new mouse mat with a "spiffy" cover) [T4 mousemat joke credit to<BR>&gt;Dom]<BR><BR>AR is very poor as a mouse mat because it has a very glossy cover. <BR>You'd really need an optical mouse to use this properly. Starships, <BR>on the other hand, is more of a map finish and better bound so ball <BR>based mice work much better ;-)<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 18:08:12 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>At 11:18 -0500 11/1/01,&nbsp; "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" <BR>&lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Annililik Run :&nbsp; Three adventures with a common theme (sort of). You can<BR>&gt;probably find better ones than this. At least if you have one eye and<BR>&gt;half a brain...<BR>&gt;Still, with some work you might be able to mold them into something<BR>&gt;useful.<BR><BR>Absolutely. Get some wallpaper paste and rip the Annililik Run up, <BR>and mould it into a nice papier mache object.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 18:26:16 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>on 11/1/01 8:15 am, Douglas E. Berry at gridlore@pop.mindspring.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 08:44 PM 1/10/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; You'd love the one Steve Barnes wore to Orycon one year. It had a full<BR>&gt;&gt; color, 3d and *very* lifelike "chestburster" stage Alien clawing its<BR>&gt;&gt; way out. <BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Even at a con *that* got some attention. &lt;eg&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I saw him do Tai Chi in that shirt at ConFrancisco.&nbsp; Sort of pulls your<BR>&gt; focus off.&nbsp; That was also the morning that Harlan Ellison walked into the<BR>&gt; room where we were doing our morning excercises, and Steve *leapt* into<BR>&gt; Harlan's arms.&nbsp; And Harlan caught him.<BR><BR>Steve is of quite light frame then? Harlan's no youthful muscleman. Still at<BR>least he didn't have to leap very high. :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 18:30:11 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>on 11/1/01 6:02 pm, Dominic Mooney at dom@cybergoths.u-net.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 00:03 -0500 11/1/01, Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Hello Group. I'm new here... I just rescued my CT books from my parents'<BR>&gt;&gt; house over the holidays. Did some web digging, now I need to buy that<BR>&gt;&gt; lovely FFE stuff. :)<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Are there many UK CT fans hereabouts?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Have a look at BITS http://www.bits.org.uk/ for the UK's Traveller<BR>&gt; Support Group and Publisher...<BR><BR>{FX: Monty Burns voice} Excellent!<BR><BR>Thank you, kind sir.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:29:26 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>&gt;Dean wrote:<BR>&gt;Apologies...lazy use of language. Please susbtitute 'electro-chemical<BR>&gt;structure' for 'chemical info' in my post and it makes a little more sense.<BR>&gt;My AI professors always warned me that sloppy vocab. leads to sloppy<BR>&gt;thinking :)<BR><BR>You had AI professors? Cool! What tech level was that? And did you <BR>get to skip lectures during power shortages?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:28:16 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; At 08:44 PM 1/10/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;You'd love the one Steve Barnes wore to Orycon one year. It had a full<BR>&gt;&gt;color, 3d and *very* lifelike "chestburster" stage Alien clawing its<BR>&gt;&gt;way out. <BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Even at a con *that* got some attention. &lt;eg&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I saw him do Tai Chi in that shirt at ConFrancisco.&nbsp; Sort of pulls your<BR>&gt; focus off.&nbsp; That was also the morning that Harlan Ellison walked into the<BR>&gt; room where we were doing our morning excercises, and Steve *leapt* into<BR>&gt; Harlan's arms.&nbsp; And Harlan caught him.<BR><BR>Harlan must be stronger than he looks!<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:29:27 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; They use vacuum flasks and liquid nitrogen. If the power goes out<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; it just means the flask have to be topped up by torch-light.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; "By the light of a flashlight", please. "Torchlight" involves burning<BR>&gt;&gt; materials stuck on the end of a stick.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; LOL, just got a mental image of a primitive tribe pouring buckets of Liquid<BR>&gt; N2 into dewar flasks, as a service to 'The Sleeping Ones'. <BR><BR>And just *where* are these "primitive" tribesmen *getting* LN2?<BR>:-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:30:58 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; ObTrav: Have words in some local dialect mean something not completely<BR>&gt;&gt; different from what they usually mean. Just enough to make a<BR>&gt;&gt; difference...<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Can -&gt; Container<BR>&gt;&gt; Wheel -&gt; Car<BR>&gt;&gt; Pineapples -&gt; Grenades<BR>&gt;&gt; Flare -&gt; Plastic explosive<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Might make for very interesting trade contract complications, odd<BR>&gt;&gt; misunderstandings, and other unpleasantness.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Pants -&gt;Trousers<BR>&gt; Nicked -&gt; Alternately slang for 'Steal' or 'To notch with a knife'<BR>&gt; Handbag-&gt; IIRC Handbag in the States is either 'pocketbook' or purse<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Ob-Trav: <BR>&gt; 'Officer, someone just nicked my handbag!'<BR>&gt; "What? "<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; :)<BR><BR>Nicked he might have trouble with. Handbag wouldn't be a problem. We<BR>use the word too. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:35:09 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; The answer is clear: TRAVELLER IS A VILANI PSYCH WAR OPERATION DESIGNED TO<BR>&gt; SOFTEN US UP FOR THE INEVITABLE INVASION!!!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Which is cool with me.&nbsp; Dibs on Quisling traitor in charge of California.<BR><BR>Only if I get Oregon. Or at least Portland (Tod can have Beaverton :-)<BR><BR>&gt; (My new vow: Never, ever post to the TML after reading over 300 messages in<BR>&gt; alt.conspiracy.)<BR><BR>Wouldn't it be *much* simpler to just not read alt.conspiracy?<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 19:54:13 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>&gt; I'm using the currency rules from G: Cyberworld in building a GURPS<BR>&gt; Space/WH40K/House setting.<BR><BR>I have some plans for using FF&amp;S2 to create WH40K vehicles and weapons.<BR>Add some careers to fit the environment, and I'll be ready to go.<BR><BR>Might be a big help bringing those WH40K fanatics into Traveller...<BR><BR>All this will have to wait for the usual 'undetermined amount of time'<BR>before I get free time to do it in. Off course.&nbsp; :-(<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 20:02:55 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney replied to my post:<BR>&gt; &gt;Still, with some work you might be able to mold them into something<BR>&gt; &gt;useful.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Absolutely. Get some wallpaper paste and rip the Annililik Run up,<BR>&gt; and mould it into a nice papier mache object.<BR><BR>Somebody make him stop! He's killing me!<BR><BR>Wheh... I needed that. I haven't laughed that hard for a long time.<BR><BR>I never drink while reading my mail. If I did, you would have had a sure<BR>kill. There are small drops of saliva on my monitor...<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 19:17:54 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: GT Cardboard Heros<BR><BR>Does anyone know if SJG plans to reprint their early 90's Traveller <BR>Cardboard heros figures. I'd like to pick up the Zhodani set. (visions of <BR>having the Zhodani attack the Beowolf :))<BR><BR>I haven't seen any sets for sale online.<BR><BR>Thanks<BR>Mike<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 12:34:03 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>&gt;From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; They use vacuum flasks and liquid nitrogen. If the power goes out it just<BR>&gt;&gt; means the flask have to be topped up by torch-light.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"By the light of a flashlight", please. "Torchlight" involves burning<BR>&gt;materials stuck on the end of a stick.<BR><BR>The writer may have been British.&nbsp; They call flashlights "torches".&nbsp; (They<BR>also call a wrench a "spanner", the trunk the "boot", and the hood the<BR>"bonnet".)&nbsp; It's either part of the richness of a great language or a pain<BR>in the neck, depending on your perspective.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 08:57:26 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>&gt; Bass Strait is the sight of one of the most famous of all UFO sightings,<BR>&gt; the Valentich Incident.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://www.ozemail.com.au/~vufors/valensum.htm<BR><BR>Wow, I never heard about that, and right on my doorstep!<BR><BR>I remember when I was rather young (sometime in the late seventies) my<BR>mother pointing out some red and white lights just above the horizon<BR>while we were driving toward Wynyard in north-west Tasmania.&nbsp; We never<BR>did find out what they were.&nbsp; They didn't look like aircraft lights,<BR>though as I said, I was rather young at the time.<BR><BR><BR>- - Tim<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:01:45 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Trevor, Peter wrote:<BR>&gt; Yes, that's what I'm suggesting.<BR><BR>OK.&nbsp; I wonder what effect that has on subsequent jump travel?<BR><BR>&gt; I *don't* thing jumpspace is Newtonian.&nbsp; I'm just saying it is<BR>&gt; commonly treated as such.&nbsp; I'm still pondering what jumpspace is<BR>&gt; ... whether it is quantum mechanical on the macro scale or something<BR>&gt; else post-Eiensteinian I haven't figured out yet.<BR><BR>I consider canonical jumpspace to be a game construct that only makes<BR>sense if you don't look at it too closely.&nbsp; As you look closer and<BR>closer, I find you have to invent stranger and stranger rules to<BR>explain it, becoming ever more difficult to avoid contradicting<BR>previous results.<BR><BR>Hmm -- a bit like our own universe, then :)<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3516<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xa03.mx.aol.com (rly-xa03.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.72]) by air-xa03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:07:06 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xa03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:05:38 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id RAA36748;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:01:12 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:00:56 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id RAA36703<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:00:56 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:00:56 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101112200.RAA36703@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3516<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3517</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/11/01 11:03:14 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 12 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3517<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR>Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: GT Cardboard Heros<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Mutiny, redux...<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>re: Deck plans 2<BR>RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>re: GT Cardboard Heros<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3516<BR>Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>Re[2]: Traveller and Other Games<BR>San Jose Traveller Meet - 20 Jan<BR>Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR>Re: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR>Re: Deckplans<BR>Re: GT Cardboard Heros<BR>RE: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 13:07:40<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>At 06:26 PM 1/11/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;on 11/1/01 8:15 am, Douglas E. Berry at gridlore@pop.mindspring.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; I saw him do Tai Chi in that shirt at ConFrancisco.&nbsp; Sort of pulls your<BR>&gt;&gt; focus off.&nbsp; That was also the morning that Harlan Ellison walked into the<BR>&gt;&gt; room where we were doing our morning excercises, and Steve *leapt* into<BR>&gt;&gt; Harlan's arms.&nbsp; And Harlan caught him.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Steve is of quite light frame then? Harlan's no youthful muscleman. Still at<BR>&gt;least he didn't have to leap very high. :)<BR><BR>Steve isn't one of the tallest people in the world either.&nbsp; I had a chance<BR>to spar with him.&nbsp; I had at least a foot in height, close to 60lbs, and a<BR>vastly superior reach.&nbsp; I became an expert on the weave of the carpet in<BR>the ANA Hotel.<BR><BR>I always dreamed of getting him, Harlan, and Lester and Judy-Lynn Del Ray<BR>on a single panel and calling it Evil Gnomes for a better tomorrow.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 13:04:33<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR><BR>At 10:35 AM 1/11/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Wouldn't it be *much* simpler to just not read alt.conspiracy?<BR><BR>But then where would I get good plots from?&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>Also, thanks to alt.conspiracy, I now know that I am in fact an Orthodox<BR>Rabbi, a communist, a Nazi, a bleeding-heart liberal, and that I have no<BR>knowledge of the military whatsoever.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 14:16:26<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR><BR>At 08:57 AM 1/12/2001 +1100, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I remember when I was rather young (sometime in the late seventies) my<BR>&gt;mother pointing out some red and white lights just above the horizon<BR>&gt;while we were driving toward Wynyard in north-west Tasmania.&nbsp; We never<BR>&gt;did find out what they were.&nbsp; They didn't look like aircraft lights,<BR>&gt;though as I said, I was rather young at the time.<BR><BR>Bass Strait is well-known, and I've heard the Valentich tape.&nbsp; He starts<BR>out puzzled, goes to annoyed, and in his last few transmissions he is<BR>plainly terrified.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 22:32:14 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>At 17:00 -0500 11/1/01,&nbsp; "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" <BR>&lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Dominic Mooney replied to my post:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;Still, with some work you might be able to mold them into something<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;useful.<BR>&gt; &gt; Absolutely. Get some wallpaper paste and rip the Annililik Run up,<BR>&gt; &gt; and mould it into a nice papier mache object.<BR>&gt;Somebody make him stop! He's killing me!<BR>&gt;Wheh... I needed that. I haven't laughed that hard for a long time.<BR>&gt;I never drink while reading my mail. If I did, you would have had a sure<BR>&gt;kill. There are small drops of saliva on my monitor...<BR><BR>I know some creatures (insects? things like termites etc) use saliva <BR>for the creation of their homes / nests out of cellulose based <BR>objects (paper/leaves/wood) but I wouldn't recommend using the <BR>Annililik Run for this. For a start, you may catch your tongue on one <BR>of the staples (which are bound to be rusty), not to mention it's <BR>guaranteed that the supplement will leave a nasty taste in your <BR>mouth, especially if you paid full price for it.<BR><BR>So, wallpaper paste is good, saliva is bad.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 23:15:12 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>on 11/1/01 8:34 pm, Glenn M. Goffin at gmgoffin@earthlink.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; The writer may have been British.&nbsp; They call flashlights "torches".&nbsp; (They<BR>&gt; also call a wrench a "spanner", the trunk the "boot", and the hood the<BR>&gt; "bonnet".)&nbsp; It's either part of the richness of a great language or a pain<BR>&gt; in the neck, depending on your perspective.<BR><BR>There's plenty of that, most due to retention of archaic words in common<BR>English use in the UK. It may make for a clearer language to remove them<BR>from common use as in the US, but it removes some of the romance derived<BR>from the etymology. For example, the term of derision 'berk' which is in<BR>common, acceptable use is derived from the Cockney rhyming slang "Berkshire<BR>Hunt" (think about it - very rude term), for a very unacceptable word for a<BR>'fanny' - be careful with that - it doesn't mean 'bum'. :)<BR><BR>The one I really like is that in the US, people pay the "check" with "bills"<BR>while here we pay the "bill" with a "cheque". ;)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 23:15:11 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT Cardboard Heros<BR><BR>on 11/1/01 7:17 pm, Michael McKeown at mmckeown67@hotmail.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Does anyone know if SJG plans to reprint their early 90's Traveller<BR>&gt; Cardboard heros figures. I'd like to pick up the Zhodani set. (visions of<BR>&gt; having the Zhodani attack the Beowolf :))<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I haven't seen any sets for sale online.<BR><BR>http://www.fspacerpg.com/users/rfields/sale.html<BR><BR>I just typed "cardboard heros zhodani" into google. There are a couple of<BR>other potential sources that don't seem to be responding. Hope it helps.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 18:30:52 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>On Thu, 11 Jan 2001 00:03:15 -0500 (EST), shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard<BR>Erickson) wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;btw, anybody know of a reasonable *word* for "point of departure" (ie<BR>&gt;an antonym for "destination"? The idea comes up a *lot* in discussions<BR>&gt;of jump and it gets annoying typing long phrases for such a *simple*<BR>&gt;concept. <BR><BR>Ummmm... The status boards at Grand Central that Metro-North uses to keep<BR>us informed concerning incoming trains list the 'origin' (that's the word<BR>at the top of the column) of the train in question...<BR><BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(Ask me via email about the ILink message network!)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:36:08 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I run T4.1 with High Guard 2 for ships, and little biddy bits of MT<BR>&gt; rules, and I find the GT supplements very useful.<BR><BR>When did High Guard 2 come out?<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 18:39:18 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Quick question:&nbsp; What are people's take on Emperor's Arsenal, <BR>&gt; Anomalies,<BR>&gt; &gt; and Annililik Run from the T4 run of supplements.&nbsp; Are they worth <BR>&gt; getting<BR>&gt; &gt; (for about $5 a pop)?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Emperor's arsenal :&nbsp; Really good, at least if you use T4 rules. I <BR>&gt; don't<BR>&gt; know much about other rules variants.<BR><BR>Well, I use CT (slightly modified), so it shouldn't be too hard to adapt.<BR>This seems to be the best regarded of the three.<BR><BR>&gt; Anomalies :&nbsp; Adventures. I haven't read all of them, but they vary<BR>&gt; wildly in quality. If you like ready-made adventures, you might as <BR>&gt; well<BR>&gt; buy it.<BR><BR>This seems to have, at best, a mixed reaction.&nbsp; I may pick it up, or I<BR>might not.&nbsp; Don't know yet.<BR><BR>&gt; Annililik Run :&nbsp; Three adventures with a common theme (sort of). You <BR>&gt; can<BR>&gt; probably find better ones than this. At least if you have one eye <BR>&gt; and<BR>&gt; half a brain...<BR>&gt; Still, with some work you might be able to mold them into something<BR>&gt; useful.<BR><BR>This may be the most reviled of the T4 supplements/adventures so far<BR>(ranking right up there with Starships).&nbsp; I think I'll stay far, far<BR>away...<BR><BR>Oh, and thanks to everyone for their feedback.&nbsp; It's much appreciated.<BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 00:48:50 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR>&gt; So, wallpaper paste is good, saliva is bad.<BR><BR>I rest my case.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 19:47:00 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>Kenneth Bearden wrote:<BR>&gt; When did High Guard 2 come out?<BR><BR>1980 -- assuming he's talking about HG, 2nd (revised) edition.&nbsp; If, however, this actually is some new in-the-works BITS product, then you can put me down for one pre-order...<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 19:54:08 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Annililik Run :&nbsp; Three adventures with a common theme (sort of). You <BR>&gt;&gt; can<BR>&gt;&gt; probably find better ones than this. At least if you have one eye <BR>&gt;&gt; and<BR>&gt;&gt; half a brain...<BR>&gt;&gt; Still, with some work you might be able to mold them into something<BR>&gt;&gt; useful.<BR><BR>&gt;This may be the most reviled of the T4 supplements/adventures so far<BR>&gt;(ranking right up there with Starships).&nbsp; I think I'll stay far, far<BR>&gt;away...<BR><BR>That's only because no one's recently brought up First Survey, Emperor's Vehicles, or that book of not-to-scale deckplans (What was that even called?&nbsp; I'd given up on T4 by then).&nbsp; I suspect a long argument could be held as to which T4 product is actually the worst of the lot.<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 20:20:24 -0500<BR>From: "Greenly, Jeff" &lt;greenlyj@rcbhsc.wvu.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Mutiny, redux...<BR><BR>&lt;decloaking&gt;<BR>Dear List<BR><BR>Thank you to all those who responded. If you will indulge me, I'd like to<BR>make a few comments...<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Are there any examples given in the canon of Imperial Naval/<BR>&gt;&gt; Military units committing mutiny or barratry? Please cite with<BR>&gt;&gt; references.<BR><BR>&gt;Er, the whole Rebellion Era?<BR><BR>This would be accurate, provided a)that the game is in that millieu, and<BR>b)that your definitions of mutiny and barratry are not the same as mine. It<BR>is my contention that a mutineer is rebelling against lawful authority, and<BR>an officer who committs barratry is doing the same. The officers and men of<BR>the ships and forces who choose sides during a rebellion could be said to be<BR>placing themselves under what they considered lawful authority, and are<BR>therefore not mutineers, but rebels. It's a fine hair, I admit, but a<BR>supportable one.&nbsp; <BR><BR><BR>&gt;Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 08:33:15 -0500 (EST)<BR>&gt;From: Victor Abraham Delnore &lt;vad9m@unix.mail.virginia.edu&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: mutiny<BR><BR>&gt;There seems to have been a wave of mutinies aboard vessels of the<BR>&gt;Imperial Navy, although the reference is obscure.&nbsp; According to Supplement<BR>&gt;7, p. 34, the Gazelle-class close escort "was designed at a time when<BR>&gt;mutinies were a major threat to security."&nbsp; What year was it designed?<BR>&gt;Well, CT material is not very good about giving you a date in service of<BR>&gt;most military vessels.&nbsp; It would have to be some time after the Imperium<BR>&gt;reached TL 14.&nbsp; Maybe it had to do with the Solomani movement, which must<BR>&gt;have attracted the sympathies of some naval personnel--although I'd expect<BR>&gt;more officers than enlisted to side with the Solomani!<BR><BR><BR>Thank you, Abe! I looked up the reference, and it is very much on point. It<BR>makes you wonder about the level of loyalty for Imperial Naval officers and<BR>crews, esp. during the Rim Wars. If you know that committing mutiny and<BR>running to one of a thousand different worlds is unlikely to even be noticed<BR>as more than normal attrition, much less punished, well, that's a lot of<BR>temptation... <BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; I suggested last year (?) that the issue was recruiting on worlds <BR>&gt;recently freed from the Solomani during the War - some agents would<BR>&gt;have been in place before the expansion, and some fellow-Travellers<BR>&gt;would have been genuinely sympathetic to the Movement.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;More likely the issue would&nbsp; be&nbsp; recruiting&nbsp; on&nbsp; worlds&nbsp; recently<BR>&gt;occupied by the Imperium during the War - some loyal agents would<BR>&gt;have been&nbsp; in&nbsp; place&nbsp; before&nbsp; the&nbsp; expansion,&nbsp; and&nbsp; some&nbsp; fellow-<BR>&gt;Travellers would have been genuinely sympathetic to the Movement.<BR><BR>These are both interesting comments.&nbsp; I'm not entirely sure that they refer<BR>to mutineers or barratrous officers, since the officers and/or men in<BR>question act under a lawful cloak of authority as agents provocateur,<BR>however illegal their actions may be under the rules of war. Those who are<BR>genuinely sympathetic to the enemy's cause and choose to act in forebearance<BR>of their oath of service to the Imperium are mutineers, though. At least<BR>these are my thoughts on the matter.<BR><BR>The reason for all of this is that in my current campaign, the PCs will be<BR>dealing with the results of a mutiny aboard an Imperial man o' war, and I<BR>wanted to set the adventure in a historical context. It's kind of a "Mutiny<BR>on the Bounty"-type storyline.<BR><BR>JD<BR><BR>&lt;cloaking&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:25:45 -0800<BR>From: Evyn MacDude &lt;wmacdude@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; The one I really like is that in the US, people pay the "check" with "bills"<BR>&gt; while here we pay the "bill" with a "cheque". ;)<BR><BR>Actually Gordon we do both here just to be that way.<BR><BR>- --<BR>Evyn<BR><BR>"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; For he to-day that sheds his blood with me<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; This day shall gentle his condition."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; -- William Shakespeare, King Henry the Fifth, IV:iii:60-63<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 18:41:11 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: re: Deck plans 2<BR><BR>&gt;From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Deck plans 2<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;For those of you who enjoyed the Beowulf Deckplans, SJG is releasing a<BR>&gt;second set...for the modular cutter.Includes 7 modules and more cardboard<BR>&gt;heroes...including Newt and Virushi figures.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &lt;drool&gt; Hmm, can the modules be set up to make a space station/factory<BR>or similar with relative ease...?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 20:41:22 -0600<BR>From: Richard Wilson &lt;rtwilson@rollanet.org&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>At 04:47 AM 1/11/01, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; The time factor wrecks everything :( That's why I restricted<BR>&gt; &gt; myself to only global conservation.&nbsp; Local conservation seems<BR>&gt; &gt; shot no matter how you look at it.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;You could go one step further and say&nbsp; that&nbsp; conservation&nbsp; occurs<BR>&gt;not&nbsp; at&nbsp; the&nbsp; global&nbsp; (universe)&nbsp; level&nbsp; but&nbsp; at&nbsp; the&nbsp; multiverse<BR>&gt;(universe plus jumpspace) level.&nbsp; Then you can balance the energy<BR>&gt;by using jumpspace as&nbsp; the&nbsp; universal&nbsp; energy&nbsp; sink&nbsp; ...&nbsp; dumping<BR>&gt;energy into it or taking it out as appropriate.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What bothers me most about the time factor is&nbsp; that&nbsp; most&nbsp; people<BR>&gt;treat jumpspace as Newtonian and yet&nbsp; its&nbsp; supposed&nbsp; to&nbsp; interact<BR>&gt;(under the&nbsp; right&nbsp; circumstances)&nbsp; with&nbsp; our&nbsp; non-Newtonian&nbsp; (ie.<BR>&gt;Eiensteinian) universe.&nbsp; Even&nbsp; if&nbsp; jumpspace&nbsp; were&nbsp; Newtonian&nbsp; it<BR>&gt;shouldn't have a 1:1 temporal&nbsp; relationship&nbsp; with&nbsp; all&nbsp; reference<BR>&gt;points in the universe.&nbsp; Therefore there is&nbsp; something&nbsp; very&nbsp; odd<BR>&gt;about the way time works in jumpspace ... and that could make&nbsp; an<BR>&gt;even worse mess of the local conservation laws.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Regards PLST<BR><BR>There was a Halloween issue of Challenge that talked about jump space <BR>anomalies. Some of these anomalies were temporal in nature. One in <BR>particular was the case of a liner&nbsp; on a regular run that appeared <BR>in-system on schedule but didn't respond to hails. When boarded, the crew <BR>and passengers were dead and had been for many years. Yet investigation <BR>clearly showed that the crew and passengers had been alive when they <BR>boarded the ship the week before.<BR><BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 19:36:29 -0800<BR>From: "Mark F. Cook" &lt;markc@peak.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>Jens Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; "By the light of a flashlight", please. "Torchlight" involves burning<BR>&gt; &gt; materials stuck on the end of a stick.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Depends on if you are American or English&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>This is a question I've been itching to ask for years:<BR><BR>If the British analog to the American term "flashlight" is "torch", what<BR>do the British call those burning sticks the peasants are always carrying<BR>when they storm Dr. Frankenstein's castle? :^)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - Mark C.<BR><BR>&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 19:47:46 -0800<BR>From: "Mark F. Cook" &lt;markc@peak.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:35:09 PST<BR>&gt;From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; The answer is clear: TRAVELLER IS A VILANI PSYCH WAR OPERATION DESIGNED TO<BR>&gt; &gt; SOFTEN US UP FOR THE INEVITABLE INVASION!!!<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Which is cool with me.&nbsp; Dibs on Quisling traitor in charge of California.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Only if I get Oregon. Or at least Portland (Tod can have Beaverton :-)<BR><BR>Fine. You Get Portland, Gresham, and 'burbs east, Tod gets Beaverton, Tigard,<BR>and 'burbs west... and *I* get the rest of the state!&nbsp; (Boy, howdy!!&nbsp; Once <BR>I get<BR>my hands on Boardman and the Umatilla Depot, *nobody's* gonna mess with me!!)<BR>:^)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - Mark C.<BR><BR>&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 20:14:19 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: re: GT Cardboard Heros<BR><BR>&gt;From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: GT Cardboard Heros<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Does anyone know if SJG plans to reprint their early 90's Traveller <BR>&gt;Cardboard heros figures. I'd like to pick up the Zhodani set. (visions of <BR>&gt;having the Zhodani attack the Beowolf :))<BR><BR>&nbsp; Early `80's, methinks? Unless there was a 25mm set?<BR><BR>&gt;I haven't seen any sets for sale online.<BR><BR>&nbsp; You were on my e-mail list for the ones I auctioned fall `99 :)<BR>Sadly, that should have been all of my spares...<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; SJG - Traveller _Cardboard Heroes_ (1982):<BR>&gt;NOTE - these full-color cardboard miniatures fold to form 20mm high counters <BR>&gt; with ~15mm high front &amp; back images of the depicted human characters.<BR>&gt;$8&nbsp;&nbsp; Set 1: Soldiers of Fortune - 3 uncut sheets each of 19 different<BR>characters <BR>&gt; and 15 pieces of small gear (flat), with original bag/label. As new condition.<BR>&gt;$5&nbsp;&nbsp; A) one uncut sheet each from Sets 2 &amp; 3 (Imperial Marines &amp; Zhodani, <BR>&gt; respectively). Each sheet is of 19 characters and 15 pieces of small gear<BR>(flat,<BR>&gt; non-fold-up); as each of these two Sets originally included three identical<BR>&gt; sheets (characters T2-1 to T2-19 Imperial Marines and T3-1 to T3-19 Zhodani)<BR>&gt; this includes all of those characters, but without the duplicates.<BR>&gt;$5&nbsp;&nbsp; B) as A), above, second set.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 22:21:06 -0600<BR>From: JR Holmes &lt;jrholmes@wi.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3516<BR><BR>On Thu, 11 Jan 2001 17:00:56 -0500 (EST),<BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest) wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:30:58 PST<BR>&gt;From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; ObTrav: Have words in some local dialect mean something not completely<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; different from what they usually mean. Just enough to make a<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; difference...<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Can -&gt; Container<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Wheel -&gt; Car<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Pineapples -&gt; Grenades<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Flare -&gt; Plastic explosive<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Might make for very interesting trade contract complications, odd<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; misunderstandings, and other unpleasantness.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Pants -&gt;Trousers<BR>&gt;&gt; Nicked -&gt; Alternately slang for 'Steal' or 'To notch with a knife'<BR>&gt;&gt; Handbag-&gt; IIRC Handbag in the States is either 'pocketbook' or purse<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Ob-Trav: <BR>&gt;&gt; 'Officer, someone just nicked my handbag!'<BR>&gt;&gt; "What? "<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Nicked he might have trouble with. Handbag wouldn't be a problem. We<BR>&gt;use the word too. :-)<BR><BR>Oh come now.&nbsp; You are missing at least one of the best (and some other<BR>common ones):<BR><BR>Panties -&gt; Knickers<BR>Elevator -&gt; Lift<BR>Trunk -&gt; Boot (automotive)<BR>Hood -&gt; Bonnet (automotive)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>JR Holmes<BR>jrholmes@wi.rr.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 22:50:45 -0600<BR>From: Leslie Bates &lt;lesbates@minn.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>At 07:47 PM 1/11/01 -0800, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; The answer is clear: TRAVELLER IS A VILANI PSYCH WAR OPERATION<BR>DESIGNED TO<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; SOFTEN US UP FOR THE INEVITABLE INVASION!!!<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Which is cool with me.&nbsp; Dibs on Quisling traitor in charge of California.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Only if I get Oregon. Or at least Portland (Tod can have Beaverton :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Fine. You Get Portland, Gresham, and 'burbs east, Tod gets Beaverton, Tigard,<BR>&gt;and 'burbs west... and *I* get the rest of the state!&nbsp; (Boy, howdy!!&nbsp; Once <BR>&gt;I get<BR>&gt;my hands on Boardman and the Umatilla Depot, *nobody's* gonna mess with me!!)<BR>&gt;:^)<BR><BR>Can I have Minnesota?<BR><BR>Les<BR><BR>====================================<BR>Revolutionaries are not nice people.<BR>==================================== <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 15:40:47 +0100<BR>From: Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR>Subject: Re[2]: Traveller and Other Games<BR><BR>Just read the thread title:<BR><BR>HERESY! There is but one game and Lorc Millman is its prophet.<BR><BR>Other games? Other games? The infamy, the idea alone...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 21:16:50 -0800<BR>From: "Kristian Miller" &lt;travellerne@3rd-imperium.com&gt;<BR>Subject: San Jose Traveller Meet - 20 Jan<BR><BR>Just a reminder that the San Jose Traveller meet will reconvene for 2001.<BR><BR>Primary game:&nbsp; Invasion: Earth<BR>Other games: Glenn's Traveller RPG<BR><BR>For directions and information email:<BR>travellerne@3rd-imperium.com<BR><BR>Kristian<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 18:43:55 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR><BR>On 11 Jan 01, at 18:02, Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 00:03 -0500 11/1/01, Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;Are there many UK CT fans hereabouts?<BR><BR>&gt; Have a look at BITS http://www.bits.org.uk/ for the UK's Traveller <BR>&gt; Support Group and Publisher...<BR><BR>Why does this conjure up images of groups of middle aged people sitting <BR>in a circle saying "Hi, my name's Andrew and I'm a Traveller player, but I <BR>haven't bought a supplement for 30 days"?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 21:44:31 -0800<BR>From: "Jeffrey Yin" &lt;jsyin@cats.ucsc.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR><BR>test<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 00:49:12 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Deckplans<BR><BR>&gt; They're coming out with a whole book about the Modular Cutters, aren't <BR>&gt;&nbsp; they?&nbsp; Someone in SJG must -really- like them.<BR><BR>And this is a bad thing because . . . ?<BR><BR>:&nbsp; )<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 00:54:19 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: GT Cardboard Heros<BR><BR>Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt; Asks<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Does anyone know if SJG plans to reprint their early 90's Traveller <BR>&gt;&nbsp; Cardboard heros figures. I'd like to pick up the Zhodani set. (visions of <BR>&gt;&nbsp; having the Zhodani attack the Beowolf :))<BR><BR>Time has not been kind to the original artwork. And they are smaller scale <BR>anyway. You'll have Joes soon enough . . . all things come to he who waits.<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 22:18:22 -0800<BR>From: Jesse DeGraff &lt;jdegraff@pacbell.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>I'll come up and help ya' Mark :)<BR>Jesse<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Mark F. Cook<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2001 7:48 PM<BR>&gt; To: Traveller Mail List<BR>&gt; Subject: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:35:09 PST<BR>&gt; &gt;From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt; &gt;Subject: Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; The answer is clear: TRAVELLER IS A VILANI PSYCH WAR <BR>&gt; OPERATION DESIGNED TO<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; SOFTEN US UP FOR THE INEVITABLE INVASION!!!<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Which is cool with me.&nbsp; Dibs on Quisling traitor in charge of <BR>&gt; California.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Only if I get Oregon. Or at least Portland (Tod can have Beaverton :-)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Fine. You Get Portland, Gresham, and 'burbs east, Tod gets <BR>&gt; Beaverton, Tigard,<BR>&gt; and 'burbs west... and *I* get the rest of the state!&nbsp; (Boy, <BR>&gt; howdy!!&nbsp; Once <BR>&gt; I get<BR>&gt; my hands on Boardman and the Umatilla Depot, *nobody's* gonna <BR>&gt; mess with me!!)<BR>&gt; :^)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - Mark C.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3517<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yb05.mx.aol.com (rly-yb05.mail.aol.com [172.18.146.5]) by air-yb05.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 02:03:14 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yb05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 02:02:37 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id BAA56320;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 01:52:01 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 12 Jan 2001 01:51:19 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id BAA56275<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 01:51:19 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 01:51:19 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101120651.BAA56275@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3517<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3518</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/12/01 11:11:08 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 12 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3518<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>RE: Deck plans 2<BR>RE: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>Ginger<BR>Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>Re: Cutter Deck Plans<BR>Re: Ginger<BR>Re: San Jose Traveller Meet - 20 Jan<BR>Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>RE: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR>Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 23:37:09 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>on 1/11/01 7:47 PM, Mark F. Cook at markc@peak.org wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:35:09 PST<BR>&gt;&gt; From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt;&gt; Subject: Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; The answer is clear: TRAVELLER IS A VILANI PSYCH WAR OPERATION DESIGNED TO<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; SOFTEN US UP FOR THE INEVITABLE INVASION!!!<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Which is cool with me.&nbsp; Dibs on Quisling traitor in charge of California.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Only if I get Oregon. Or at least Portland (Tod can have Beaverton :-)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Fine. You Get Portland, Gresham, and 'burbs east, Tod gets Beaverton, Tigard,<BR>&gt; and 'burbs west... and *I* get the rest of the state!&nbsp; (Boy, howdy!!&nbsp; Once<BR>&gt; I get<BR>&gt; my hands on Boardman and the Umatilla Depot, *nobody's* gonna mess with me!!)<BR>&gt; :^)<BR>&gt; - Mark C.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Which reminds me.&nbsp; Know where I can get an extended/threaded bbl for a<BR>CZ-75.&nbsp; I'm building a suppressor and Nielsen device in 9mm down at Bob's.<BR>I know that Glocks are really a problem for suppressors, so the CZ seems<BR>like a good choice. Machining titanium is a bitch!<BR><BR>Played with my subgun last week, but still no paperwork back from ATF.&nbsp; Any<BR>one who owns title II stuff should have a very good feeling for bureaucratic<BR>governments.<BR><BR>As for the Vilani Invasion, we just tell all the local professional girls<BR>that the fleets in. They've never been good against biowarfare.<BR><BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend"<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 23:39:36 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>on 1/11/01 7:36 PM, Mark F. Cook at markc@peak.org wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Jens Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; "By the light of a flashlight", please. "Torchlight" involves burning<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; materials stuck on the end of a stick.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Depends on if you are American or English&nbsp; ;-)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This is a question I've been itching to ask for years:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; If the British analog to the American term "flashlight" is "torch", what<BR>&gt; do the British call those burning sticks the peasants are always carrying<BR>&gt; when they storm Dr. Frankenstein's castle? :^)<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>I believe they distinguish the former as an electric torch.<BR>- --<BR>When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend"<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:06:33 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Deck plans 2<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Jonathan McDermott [mailto:caraig@mindspring.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: 11 January 2001 18:00<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Deck plans 2<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 15:39:53 -0000<BR>&gt; &gt;From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Subject: Deck plans 2<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;For those of you who enjoyed the Beowulf Deckplans, SJG is <BR>&gt; releasing a<BR>&gt; &gt;second set...for the modular cutter.Includes 7 modules and <BR>&gt; more cardboard<BR>&gt; &gt;heroes...including Newt and Virushi figures.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Dean<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Should we be grateful that there won't be Sayat Cardboard <BR>&gt; Heroes anytime <BR>&gt; soon? &lt;g,d,r&gt;&nbsp; Prrt CH's might be interesting, too....<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; They're coming out with a whole book about the Modular <BR>&gt; Cutters, aren't <BR>&gt; they?&nbsp; Someone in SJG must -really- like them.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>Yeah, G:T Modular Cutter is out this month.<BR><BR>No, I'm not on commission :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:12:32 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;&gt; "By the light of a flashlight", please. "Torchlight" <BR>&gt; involves burning<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;&gt; materials stuck on the end of a stick.<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Depends on if you are American or English&nbsp; ;-)<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; This is a question I've been itching to ask for years:<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; If the British analog to the American term "flashlight" is <BR>&gt; "torch", what<BR>&gt; &gt; do the British call those burning sticks the peasants are <BR>&gt; always carrying<BR>&gt; &gt; when they storm Dr. Frankenstein's castle? :^)<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I believe they distinguish the former as an electric torch.<BR><BR>Some source also refer to these bundles of burning twigs as 'Firebrands' and<BR>'Faggots'. I believe both terms now have new meanings.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:14:58 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Glenn M. Goffin [mailto:gmgoffin@earthlink.net]<BR>&gt; Sent: 11 January 2001 20:34<BR>&gt; To: Traveller-Digest<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Technology Marches On: TL13 Arrives<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; They use vacuum flasks and liquid nitrogen. If the power <BR>&gt; goes out it just<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; means the flask have to be topped up by torch-light.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;"By the light of a flashlight", please. "Torchlight" involves burning<BR>&gt; &gt;materials stuck on the end of a stick.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The writer may have been British.&nbsp; They call flashlights <BR>&gt; "torches".&nbsp; (They<BR>&gt; also call a wrench a "spanner", the trunk the "boot", and the hood the<BR>&gt; "bonnet".)&nbsp; It's either part of the richness of a great <BR>&gt; language or a pain<BR>&gt; in the neck, depending on your perspective.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Yup, Brit. Interesting note...we call a wrench a spanner but and adjustable<BR>spanner is a monkey-wrench. I don't know why.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 11:01:00 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>Tod Glenn wrote:<BR>&gt; I believe they distinguish the former as an electric torch.<BR><BR>Only when required to make it clear by context.&nbsp;&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>If you have a torch in the boot, it's an electric thing in the back of<BR>your car. Nothing else.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 02:03:20 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Ginger<BR><BR>I'm surprised I haven't seen any mention of this on here yet, but in case<BR>no-one's noticed,<BR>have a look at this :<BR><BR>http://www.zdnet.com/anchordesk/stories/story/0,10738,2673881,00.html?chkpt=<BR>zdhpnews02<BR><BR>And then here for a bit more info :<BR><BR>http://www.inside.com/jcs/Story?article_id=20218&amp;pod_id=8<BR><BR>And then here for a bio :<BR><BR>http://www.usfirst.org/bios/dean.html<BR><BR><BR>I'd normally think it was some sort of hoax, but then I looked at what this<BR>guy has _already_ done.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 08:19:13 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;If the British analog to the American term "flashlight" is "torch", what <BR>&gt;&gt;do the British call those burning sticks the peasants are always carrying <BR>&gt;&gt;when they storm Dr. Frankenstein's castle? :^)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I believe they distinguish the former as an electric torch.<BR><BR>When such a qualifier is needed, that is. Think about how often you need to <BR>talk about [the thing with batteries that has a little light bulb up front] <BR>in contrast to [the burning stick].<BR><BR>When two things have a similar function, or a similar background, it's not <BR>unusual for words to shift over to the more commonly used item. My favorite <BR>example is "chocolate". Until the middle of the 19th century, the word was <BR>used to refer to what we would call "hot chocolate". When the solid stuff <BR>that's used to cover Mars bars was invented 'round about 1850, it was called <BR>"bar chocolate" for a short while. But it became so immensely popular that <BR>the qualifier was dropped there and one added to the name of the drink. "Bar <BR>chocolate -&gt; chocolate", "Chocolate -&gt; Hot chocolate".<BR><BR>Another one I like is that, if you're hit by a car, you're "run over", when <BR>obviously you've actually been "rolled over". It's a throwback to <BR>horse-drawn days, and the older term has just been applied to the newer <BR>event because we don't need it for the old one so much any more....<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 10:36:17 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: "John P. Raynor" &lt;john.raynor@yale.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>On Thu, 11 Jan 2001, Leslie Bates wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 07:47 PM 1/11/01 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; The answer is clear: TRAVELLER IS A VILANI PSYCH WAR OPERATION<BR>&gt; DESIGNED TO<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; SOFTEN US UP FOR THE INEVITABLE INVASION!!!<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Which is cool with me.&nbsp; Dibs on Quisling traitor in charge of California.<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;Only if I get Oregon. Or at least Portland (Tod can have Beaverton :-)<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Fine. You Get Portland, Gresham, and 'burbs east, Tod gets Beaverton, Tigard,<BR>&gt; &gt;and 'burbs west... and *I* get the rest of the state!&nbsp; (Boy, howdy!!&nbsp; Once<BR>&gt; &gt;I get<BR>&gt; &gt;my hands on Boardman and the Umatilla Depot, *nobody's* gonna mess with me!!)<BR>&gt; &gt;:^)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Can I have Minnesota?<BR><BR>I'd be happy with Bethesda, Maryland, for two reasons:<BR><BR>(a) It's my home town, although I haven't lived there for years<BR><BR>(b) That's where the National Institutes of Heath are located, and<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; given what we already know about Vilani vulnerability to, and<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; ignorance of, infectious diseases, it might be useful...<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - J. Raynor<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 16:22:45 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>&gt;I'd be happy with Bethesda, Maryland, for two reasons:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;(a) It's my home town, although I haven't lived there for years<BR><BR>I'm in Gaithersburg...Not far from Bethesda...<BR><BR>Mike<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 11:23:44 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Cutter Deck Plans<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;drool&gt; Hmm, can the modules be set up to make a space station/factory<BR>&gt;&nbsp; or similar with relative ease...?<BR><BR>The intent is that you cut the module plans out and lay them on top of the <BR>cutter frame -- nothing prevents you from laying them out as a station or <BR>whatever.<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:51:10 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ginger<BR><BR>This guy is one of those really really smart, stubborn, icononclastic<BR>Heinlein-esque engineers who won't take no for an answer, so it could be<BR>just about _anything_. <BR><BR>Wings that work.<BR><BR>A personal autogyro.<BR><BR>An electric urban transport vehicle.<BR><BR>A set of strap-on kangaroo legs (though those have already been<BR>invented) <BR><BR>A motorized lounge-chair and personal satellite comunications system.<BR><BR>A Sayat dil^h^h^h 'device'of unimagineable power and perversion.<BR><BR>;-)<BR><BR>The clues are small, portable, and will change how people do things.<BR>Since 'Architecting cities around it' is one of the comments, the bets<BR>are on it being a form of personal transportation.<BR><BR>Given it's going to have months of unimagineable hype surrounding it it<BR>will almost certainly be a let-down, were it not for the fact that it's<BR>been dreamed up by Dean Kamen...<BR><BR>"Frank G. Pitt" wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I'm surprised I haven't seen any mention of this on here yet, but in case<BR>&gt; no-one's noticed,<BR>&gt; have a look at this :<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://www.zdnet.com/anchordesk/stories/story/0,10738,2673881,00.html?chkpt=<BR>&gt; zdhpnews02<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; And then here for a bit more info :<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://www.inside.com/jcs/Story?article_id=20218&amp;pod_id=8<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; And then here for a bio :<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://www.usfirst.org/bios/dean.html<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I'd normally think it was some sort of hoax, but then I looked at what this<BR>&gt; guy has _already_ done.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Frankie<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>University of Arizona<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:00:51 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: John Fox &lt;jfox@verity.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: San Jose Traveller Meet - 20 Jan<BR><BR>Kristian:<BR>&nbsp; Once again I must send in my regrets for not being able to attend.&nbsp; The South <BR>Bay Gaming Club is having their monthly minicon that day and I have already <BR>agreed to hep run two games (Full Thrust and General Quarters). So, why your <BR>group is defending earth and getting those MCrs jobs I will be defeating aliens <BR>and having the Russians try to beat the Germans in a WWI naval engagement.<BR>&nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; John Fox<BR>&nbsp; <BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Just a reminder that the San Jose Traveller meet will reconvene for 2001.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Primary game:&nbsp; Invasion: Earth<BR>&gt; Other games: Glenn's Traveller RPG<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; For directions and information email:<BR>&gt; travellerne@3rd-imperium.com<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Kristian<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 17:29:32 +0100<BR>From: Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR>Subject: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>On Friday, January 12, 2001, 4:36:17 PM, the following was written:<BR><BR>JPR&gt; On Thu, 11 Jan 2001, Leslie Bates wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; At 07:47 PM 1/11/01 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; The answer is clear: TRAVELLER IS A VILANI PSYCH WAR OPERATION<BR>&gt;&gt; DESIGNED TO<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; SOFTEN US UP FOR THE INEVITABLE INVASION!!!<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Which is cool with me.&nbsp; Dibs on Quisling traitor in charge of California.<BR>;-) Ill have Europe, then, except for France, which someone else can<BR>bother with.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 18:43:48 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt; Trevor, Peter wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Yes, that's what I'm suggesting.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; OK.&nbsp; I wonder what effect that has on subsequent jump travel?<BR><BR>If jumpspace is another 'brane' like our own universe then its so<BR>big that the effect of all the jumping ships in&nbsp; known&nbsp; space&nbsp; is<BR>insignificant.<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt; I *don't* thing jumpspace is Newtonian.&nbsp; I'm just saying it is<BR>&gt; &gt; commonly treated as such.&nbsp; I'm still pondering what jumpspace is<BR>&gt; &gt; ... whether it is quantum mechanical on the macro scale or<BR>&gt; &gt; something else post-Eiensteinian I haven't figured out yet.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I consider canonical jumpspace to be a game construct that only<BR>&gt; makes sense if you don't look at it too closely.&nbsp; As you look<BR>&gt; closer and closer, I find you have to invent stranger and stranger<BR>&gt; rules to explain it, becoming ever more difficult to avoid<BR>&gt; contradicting previous results.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Hmm -- a bit like our own universe, then :)<BR><BR>Having&nbsp; just&nbsp; read&nbsp; the&nbsp; article&nbsp; in&nbsp; Scientific&nbsp; American&nbsp; about<BR>Quintessence ... you're right: canonical jumpspace&nbsp; doesn't&nbsp; seem<BR>so bad!&nbsp; I've come&nbsp; to&nbsp; the&nbsp; conclusion&nbsp; that&nbsp; we&nbsp; have&nbsp; to&nbsp; take<BR>canonical *explanations* as 'popular misconceptions', and instead<BR>focus on trying to come up with a theory that explains&nbsp; canonical<BR>rules and incidences.&nbsp; (But I haven't heard or come up with one I<BR>like yet.)<BR><BR><BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 10:46:22 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>&gt;From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;The one I really like is that in the US, people pay the "check" with<BR>"bills"<BR>&gt;while here we pay the "bill" with a "cheque". ;)<BR><BR>That's true in a restaurant.&nbsp; However, each month we in the US also pay our<BR>bills (telephone, power, internet, etc.) with checks.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 18:52:57 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Richard Wilson wrote:<BR>&gt; There was a Halloween issue of Challenge that talked about jump<BR>&gt; space anomalies. Some of these anomalies were temporal in nature.<BR>&gt; One in particular was the case of a liner&nbsp; on a regular run that<BR>&gt; appeared in-system on schedule but didn't respond to hails. When <BR>&gt; boarded, the crew and passengers were dead and had been for many<BR>&gt; years. Yet investigation clearly showed that the crew and<BR>&gt; passengers had been alive when they boarded the ship the week<BR>&gt; before.<BR><BR>Yup.&nbsp; IIRC there's been a couple of stories like that.&nbsp; I've been<BR>thinking lately of (IMTU) making the jump duration roll&nbsp; *twice*:<BR>once for the crew and passengers of the jumping&nbsp; ship,&nbsp; and&nbsp; once<BR>for the universe ... to provide a slight&nbsp; temporal&nbsp; discontinuity<BR>on normal jumps.&nbsp; (Of course, if you want to get really weird you<BR>could make this roll separately for *each* crewman and&nbsp; passenger<BR>... even though they'd be able to interact with each other in&nbsp; an<BR>apparently normal fashion a different length of time&nbsp; would&nbsp; pass<BR>for each of them!)<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 18:56:44 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR><BR>Andrew Moffatt-Vallance wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Have a look at BITS http://www.bits.org.uk/ for the UK's Traveller <BR>&gt; &gt; Support Group and Publisher...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Why does this conjure up images of groups of middle aged people<BR>&gt; sitting in a circle saying "Hi, my name's Andrew and I'm a<BR>&gt; Traveller player, but I haven't bought a supplement for 30 days"?<BR><BR>Due to an unplanned explosion of laughter I now have&nbsp; to&nbsp; explain<BR>to my boss why I was reading a&nbsp; non-work&nbsp; related&nbsp; email.&nbsp; Thanks<BR>alot!<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR><BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 10:36:40 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Rather depends on your definition of 'chemically'.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Not really. If they are right, there *aren't* any "chemicals" you could<BR>&gt;&gt; extract to transfer memory. It's all a matter of structure, and<BR>&gt;&gt; possibly of the *patterns* of signals constantly flowing thru the<BR>&gt;&gt; neural net.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Ok, so you need to know the location of the chemicals.&nbsp; The brain generally<BR>&gt; uses chemicals to transmit signals.<BR><BR>Yes, but it's the signals and the "wiring" that constitute the memory,<BR>not the chemicals. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 10:38:46 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; on 11/1/01 8:34 pm, Glenn M. Goffin at gmgoffin@earthlink.net wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; The writer may have been British.&nbsp; They call flashlights "torches".&nbsp; (They<BR>&gt;&gt; also call a wrench a "spanner", the trunk the "boot", and the hood the<BR>&gt;&gt; "bonnet".)&nbsp; It's either part of the richness of a great language or a pain<BR>&gt;&gt; in the neck, depending on your perspective.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; There's plenty of that, most due to retention of archaic words in common<BR>&gt; English use in the UK. It may make for a clearer language to remove them<BR>&gt; from common use as in the US, but it removes some of the romance derived<BR>&gt; from the etymology.<BR><BR>Well, "electric torch" is ok. But just "torch" with no qualifiers leads<BR>to undesired implications *especially* given variable TLs. :-)<BR><BR>&gt; The one I really like is that in the US, people pay the "check" with "bills"<BR>&gt; while here we pay the "bill" with a "cheque". ;)<BR><BR>Well, "bills" are actually "notes" (from "promissory note", which is<BR>what they *are*). An *old April Fool joke is to ask someone if they'd<BR>like a $5 bill. When they say yes, you hand them a paper that says "You<BR>owe me $5". :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 10:43:08 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; At 10:35 AM 1/11/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Wouldn't it be *much* simpler to just not read alt.conspiracy?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; But then where would I get good plots from?&nbsp; :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Also, thanks to alt.conspiracy, I now know that I am in fact an Orthodox<BR>&gt; Rabbi, a communist, a Nazi, a bleeding-heart liberal, and that I have no<BR>&gt; knowledge of the military whatsoever.<BR><BR>Ah. Sort of like the guy I just gave up on in alt.callahans. If you<BR>disagree with him, you are a leftist or a liberal. If you agree with<BR>him you are a righgt wing conservative. <BR><BR>I forget whewre I heard the phrase, but it fits him *perfectly*: His<BR>mind is impentrable to logic.<BR><BR>&gt; -- <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>&gt;<BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 10:45:41 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; on 11/1/01 8:15 am, Douglas E. Berry at gridlore@pop.mindspring.com wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; At 08:44 PM 1/10/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; You'd love the one Steve Barnes wore to Orycon one year. It had a full<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; color, 3d and *very* lifelike "chestburster" stage Alien clawing its<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; way out. <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Even at a con *that* got some attention. &lt;eg&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; I saw him do Tai Chi in that shirt at ConFrancisco.&nbsp; Sort of pulls your<BR>&gt;&gt; focus off.&nbsp; That was also the morning that Harlan Ellison walked into the<BR>&gt;&gt; room where we were doing our morning excercises, and Steve *leapt* into<BR>&gt;&gt; Harlan's arms.&nbsp; And Harlan caught him.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Steve is of quite light frame then? Harlan's no youthful muscleman. Still at<BR>&gt; least he didn't have to leap very high. :)<BR><BR>Oh God!!&nbsp; *NOW* you've done it....<BR><BR>Sorry, but I was at the Westercon where Harlan was GOH and his GOH<BR>speech was Xeno&lt;something&gt;. All about the nastier side of "fans" and<BR>fandom. It was later printed in Asimov's.<BR><BR>One of the things that sparked it was that since Harlan had just turned<BR>50, one enterprising huckster was selling T-shirts with "50 short years<BR>of Harlan Ellison" blazoned across the front. <BR><BR>Harlan was unhappy on two counts. First, the reference to his height.<BR>Second, because the huckster wasn't offering him a piece of the action!<BR><BR>In any case, that speech damn near took the paint off the walls. A<BR>friend of mine who was wearing one of those T-shirts, borrowed a jacket<BR>from someone to cover it...<BR><BR>Do not invoke the name of the Fierce Short One lightly!<BR><BR>BTW, somewhere around here I have an audio tape of the trivia contest<BR>at that con. Harlan and some other writers formed a team to compete.<BR>Theother team got a multi-part question that started out with "Who is<BR>Kurt Vonnegut's favorite author?" The answer is, of course, "Kilgore<BR>Trout" (a fictional author who appears in a couple of Vonnegut's books)<BR><BR>The next part was "Who is Kilgore Trout's favorite author?" I forget<BR>the answer, but it *is* mentioned in one of the stories. <BR><BR>They went thru a couple more levels of this, ending with someone whose<BR>favorite author was Cordwainer Bird. Now, this is one of Harlan's<BR>registered pen-names. He uses it only for work where the<BR>publisher/editor/producer/director/whatever has *totally* screwed up<BR>the book/script/whatever. Things like "The Starlost". <BR><BR>In short, Harlan "gives them the Bird". :-)<BR><BR>So, when the other team answered "Cordwainer Bird" to applause and<BR>confirmation from the judge, Harlan screeched out "I'll kill the son of<BR>a ....". <BR><BR>If I ever locate that tape again, I need to make a WAV file. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3518<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xb05.mx.aol.com (rly-xb05.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.106]) by air-xb04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:11:08 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xb05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:10:36 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id OAA82796;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:09:04 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:08:11 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id OAA82691<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:08:11 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:08:11 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101121908.OAA82691@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3518<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3519</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/12/01 12:31:28 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 12 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3519<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>RE: Mutiny, redux...<BR>Ginger<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>re: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: San Jose Traveller Meet - 20 Jan<BR>Re: Ginger<BR>The truth comes out!!!<BR>Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR>Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>RE: Ginger<BR>Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>RE: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>RE: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>Re: Ginger<BR>Re: Ginger<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 11:05:22 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; I run T4.1 with High Guard 2 for ships, and little biddy bits of MT<BR>&gt;&gt; rules, and I find the GT supplements very useful.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; When did High Guard 2 come out?<BR><BR>About 6 months after the first edition. <BR><BR>"High Guard 2" is short for "High Gaurd, second edition". There were a<BR>lot of revisions, but they were all published in JTAS. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 19:19:18 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Mutiny, redux...<BR><BR>Jeff Greenly wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Are there any examples given in the canon of Imperial Naval/<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Military units committing mutiny or barratry? Please cite with<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; references.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;Er, the whole Rebellion Era?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This would be accurate, provided a)that the game is in that<BR>&gt; millieu, and b)that your definitions of mutiny and barratry are<BR>&gt; not the same as mine. It is my contention that a mutineer is<BR>&gt; rebelling against lawful authority, and an officer who committs<BR>&gt; barratry is doing the same. The officers and men of the ships<BR>&gt; and forces who choose sides during a rebellion could be said to<BR>&gt; be placing themselves under what they considered lawful authority,<BR>&gt; and are therefore not mutineers, but rebels. It's a fine hair, I<BR>&gt; admit, but a supportable one.&nbsp; <BR><BR>I'm sure that 'fine hair'&nbsp; broke&nbsp; on&nbsp; numerous&nbsp; occasions.&nbsp; Given<BR>firepower and permission to run amok I&nbsp; doubt&nbsp; the&nbsp; term&nbsp; "lawful<BR>authority" can be applied here.<BR><BR>For starters: some of the officers in Dulinor's troops would have<BR>known what was happening and until Strephon was dead they&nbsp; should<BR>have, ultimately, been loyal to Strephon.&nbsp; The fact that&nbsp; *after*<BR>the event Dulinor may have *become* the lawful authority&nbsp; (if&nbsp; he<BR>hadn't&nbsp; blown&nbsp; it)&nbsp; is&nbsp; not&nbsp; relevent.&nbsp;&nbsp; Their&nbsp; pre-assassination<BR>actions were treasonous and (as the&nbsp; senior&nbsp; admiralty&nbsp; were&nbsp; not<BR>part of the plot) mutinous.<BR><BR>Also:&nbsp; I've little doubt that after a while many of the&nbsp; military<BR>units on deep raiding missions would have stopped fighting for&nbsp; a<BR>cause (or whatever) and started fighting&nbsp; either&nbsp; for&nbsp; themselves<BR>... or bacause they no longer knew how&nbsp; to&nbsp; stop.&nbsp; They&nbsp; wouldn't<BR>return to base for fresh orders but go on killing and killing and<BR>killing!&nbsp; Those that did stop would become the first TEDs.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:22:06 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Ginger<BR><BR>My bet is on some kind of small transportation device.<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/ - Opinions should be yours too!<BR>"We don't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued<BR>other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and<BR>rifle their pockets for new vocabulary." - James D. Nicoll<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 11:23:12<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>At 10:45 AM 1/12/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR>&gt;In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;Sorry, but I was at the Westercon where Harlan was GOH and his GOH<BR>&gt;speech was Xeno&lt;something&gt;. All about the nastier side of "fans" and<BR>&gt;fandom. It was later printed in Asimov's.<BR><BR>Oh, Great Ghu.. *that* obsenity??&nbsp; (For those not in the know, Harlan once<BR>shook down every author he knew for their "worst fan" story, and then<BR>linked them all together to tell us what awful people we are.)<BR><BR>&gt;Harlan was unhappy on two counts. First, the reference to his height.<BR>&gt;Second, because the huckster wasn't offering him a piece of the action!<BR><BR>Harlan is unhappy when there is hydrogen present somewhere in the universe.<BR><BR>&gt;In any case, that speech damn near took the paint off the walls. A<BR>&gt;friend of mine who was wearing one of those T-shirts, borrowed a jacket<BR>&gt;from someone to cover it...<BR><BR>I saw him doing a panel once.&nbsp; This young neo, obviously in awe of being in<BR>the presense of a Real Author, timidly asked Microjerk a fairly simple,<BR>newbie-type question.<BR><BR>Harlan proceeds to rips this poor kid to shreds.&nbsp; I mean he got personal.<BR>This was a 13 year old kid!<BR><BR>So after Harlan finsihes, he calls for the next question.<BR><BR>"Mr. Ellison, when is _Last Dangerous Visions_ coming out?"<BR><BR>&lt;f/x: sun going nova&gt;<BR><BR>All he got for the rest of that session were questions about LDV, and one<BR>person asking him how it felt to be still outsold by Asimov, even though<BR>Asimov had been dead for years.<BR><BR>Oddly, Harlan hasn't come back to BayCon since then...<BR><BR>&gt;So, when the other team answered "Cordwainer Bird" to applause and<BR>&gt;confirmation from the judge, Harlan screeched out "I'll kill the son of<BR>&gt;a ....". <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;If I ever locate that tape again, I need to make a WAV file. :-)<BR><BR>Please do.&nbsp; :)<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 19:08:22 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>At 01:51 -0500 12/1/01, Traveller-digest Kenneth Bearden -- Walker <BR>Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; I run T4.1 with High Guard 2 for ships, and little biddy bits of MT<BR>&gt; &gt; rules, and I find the GT supplements very useful.<BR>&gt;When did High Guard 2 come out?<BR><BR>1980<BR><BR>HG1 was 1979. The starship design, combat and USP configuration are <BR>very different.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 19:13:29 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>At 01:51 -0500 12/1/01,&nbsp; trentfs@ix.netcom.com wrote:<BR>&gt;Kenneth Bearden wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; When did High Guard 2 come out?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;1980 -- assuming he's talking about HG, 2nd (revised) edition.&nbsp; If, <BR>&gt;however, this actually is some new in-the-works BITS product, then <BR>&gt;you can put me down for one pre-order...<BR><BR>Yes, that's the one.<BR><BR>The only starship related stuff from BITS is:<BR><BR>101 Starships for GT (Rob Prior's PDF for GT)<BR>Mayday M4.1 - a version of MayDay for T4 with a working combat system<BR>RPSCS v0.9 (T4 RPG combat system by a number of TML luminaries - not <BR>a BITS product we just host it)<BR><BR>All at www.bits.org.uk on the archive page.<BR><BR><BR>We are working on a Traveller Full Thrust conversion (using HG2 as a <BR>guide) which is on the eGroups group Traveller_FullThrust. The <BR>playtest is presently downloadable from that site.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 19:15:42 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>At 01:51 -0500 12/1/01,&nbsp; trentfs@ix.netcom.com wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;This may be the most reviled of the T4 supplements/adventures so far<BR>&gt; &gt;(ranking right up there with Starships).&nbsp; I think I'll stay far, far<BR>&gt; &gt;away...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;That's only because no one's recently brought up First Survey, <BR>&gt;Emperor's Vehicles, or that book of not-to-scale deckplans (What was <BR>&gt;that even called?&nbsp; I'd given up on T4 by then).&nbsp; I suspect a long <BR>&gt;argument could be held as to which T4 product is actually the worst <BR>&gt;of the lot.<BR><BR>In order -<BR><BR>Annililik Run - Worst<BR>Emperor's Vehicles - 2nd<BR>Starships - 3rd<BR>First Survey - 4th<BR><BR>3 &amp; 4 have some limited use<BR>2 is useless as no TL etc<BR>1 is best turned into a small papier mache object.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 19:17:30 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>At 01:51 -0500 12/1/01,&nbsp; "Mark F. Cook" &lt;markc@peak.org&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;If the British analog to the American term "flashlight" is "torch", what<BR>&gt;do the British call those burning sticks the peasants are always carrying<BR>&gt;when they storm Dr. Frankenstein's castle? :^)<BR><BR>futile?<BR><BR>Actually, we call them 'torches'.<BR><BR>'Torch' as in 'flashlight' is a shortening of 'electric torch'.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 19:21:27 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR><BR>At 01:51 -0500 12/1/01,&nbsp; "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" <BR>&lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Have a look at BITS http://www.bits.org.uk/ for the UK's Traveller<BR>&gt; &gt; Support Group and Publisher...<BR>&gt;Why does this conjure up images of groups of middle aged people sitting<BR>&gt;in a circle saying "Hi, my name's Andrew and I'm a Traveller player, but I<BR>&gt;haven't bought a supplement for 30 days"?<BR><BR>'Hi, my name's Dominic and I'm a Traveller player, but I haven't <BR>bought a supplement for 6 days. Unfortunately I slipped then and <BR>bought both the Beowulf Deckplans and GT:Ground Forces.'<BR><BR>&lt;giggle&gt;<BR><BR>The usual response at Cons is: 'Traveller is still around? Cool! I <BR>used to have the LBBs but I thought that it went out of print years <BR>ago!'.<BR><BR>Which is better than 'Traveller. Is that like D&amp;D?'<BR><BR>Actually, the latter probably means a newbie to hook ;-)<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:29:28 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>Leonrad Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; "High Guard 2" is short for "High Gaurd, second edition". There were a<BR>&gt;lot of revisions, but they were all published in JTAS. <BR><BR>My least favorite revision is the fact that under HG2 you can no longer use your ship's exhaust as a weapon!<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 11:37:11 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: San Jose Traveller Meet - 20 Jan<BR><BR>&gt;From: John Fox &lt;jfox@verity.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Once again I must send in my regrets for not being able to attend.&nbsp; The<BR>South<BR>&gt;Bay Gaming Club is having their monthly minicon that day and I have already<BR>&gt;agreed to hep run two games (Full Thrust and General Quarters). So, why<BR>your<BR>&gt;group is defending earth and getting those MCrs jobs I will be defeating<BR>aliens<BR>&gt;and having the Russians try to beat the Germans in a WWI naval engagement.<BR><BR>Well, some of our group will be liberating Earth.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:47:49 -0500<BR>From: "Walt Smith" &lt;firelock_ny@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ginger<BR><BR>Bruce Johnson wrote:<BR>&gt;This guy is one of those really really smart, stubborn, icononclastic<BR>&gt;Heinlein-esque engineers who won't take no for an answer, so it could be <BR>&gt;just about _anything_.<BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt;The clues are small, portable, and will change how people do things.<BR>&gt;Since 'Architecting cities around it' is one of the comments, the bets<BR>&gt;are on it being a form of personal transportation.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Given it's going to have months of unimagineable hype surrounding it it<BR>&gt;will almost certainly be a let-down, were it not for the fact that it's<BR>&gt;been dreamed up by Dean Kamen...<BR><BR>Following the bouncing URL's, the item has been patented, so<BR>isn't a secret anymore:<BR><BR>http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US05971091__<BR><BR>It's a somewhat Doctor-Seussian looking motorized scooter.<BR><BR>Walt Smith<BR>In my opinion, the Grinch is obviously a Onceler.<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 11:56:15 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: The truth comes out!!!<BR><BR>The truth about what happened to the Titanic comes out!&nbsp; Turns out it was<BR>penguins....<BR><BR>http://www.ifilm.com/ifilm/skeletons/film_detail/0,1263,766641,00.html<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 20:08:10 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famille Spofulam "Penguin"<BR><BR>on 12/1/01 6:45 pm, Leonard Erickson at shadow@krypton.rain.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Steve is of quite light frame then? Harlan's no youthful muscleman. Still at<BR>&gt;&gt; least he didn't have to leap very high. :)<BR><BR>&gt; One of the things that sparked it was that since Harlan had just turned<BR>&gt; 50, one enterprising huckster was selling T-shirts with "50 short years<BR>&gt; of Harlan Ellison" blazoned across the front.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Harlan was unhappy on two counts. First, the reference to his height.<BR>&gt; Second, because the huckster wasn't offering him a piece of the action!<BR><BR>Well, I'm not sure about the cause/effect hypothesis. I don't recall anybody<BR>making comments about his height before he produced a GoH speech in Glasgow,<BR>Scotland which was nearly entirely about how he *wasn't* sesnitive about his<BR>height, despite reports. He denigrated fans, editors, fellow authors and<BR>even mailmen for having the gall to suggest he was vertically challenged. :)<BR>He was a good GoH though, and he was appeased when introduced to Sue, who he<BR>subsequently married.<BR><BR>&gt; The next part was "Who is Kilgore Trout's favorite author?" I forget<BR>&gt; the answer, but it *is* mentioned in one of the stories.<BR><BR>Gobfrey Shrdlu? I say this based on the fact that the Glasgow SF group was<BR>called "Friends of Kilgore Trout" and the writers' circle "Friends of<BR>Gobfrey Shrdlu". An AI guess? :) Philip Jose Farmer has also written under<BR>the KT moniker - Venus on a Half-Shell.<BR><BR>&gt; So, when the other team answered "Cordwainer Bird" to applause and<BR>&gt; confirmation from the judge, Harlan screeched out "I'll kill the son of<BR>&gt; a ....". <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; If I ever locate that tape again, I need to make a WAV file. :-)<BR><BR>Please do, I'd love to hear it. :)<BR><BR>When Harlan was unable to attend Albacon in '84 (showing up instead the next<BR>year) he asked if he could send Norman Spinrad over instead. It was agreed,<BR>and NS was a great GoH. I entered the "Vogon Poetry Contest", where the<BR>object is to recite the most awful verse for as long as the judges will<BR>allow. Norman was judge of course. We wrote about a dozen nasty verses on<BR>the back of a huge pile of continuous computer printout (most of the paper<BR>was blank - there was no way we'd get past the early verses). We read a few<BR>verses, and when we got to the part about Harlan not being there... "But<BR>really things are not so bad, because we've got Nor-man Spin-rad",&nbsp; Norman<BR>ran down and tore off the rest of the paper. :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 11:09:08 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 10:35:09 PST<BR>&gt;&gt;From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt;&gt;Subject: Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; The answer is clear: TRAVELLER IS A VILANI PSYCH WAR OPERATION DESIGNED <BR>&gt; TO<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; SOFTEN US UP FOR THE INEVITABLE INVASION!!!<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Which is cool with me.&nbsp; Dibs on Quisling traitor in charge of California.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Only if I get Oregon. Or at least Portland (Tod can have Beaverton :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Fine. You Get Portland, Gresham, and 'burbs east, Tod gets Beaverton, Tigard,<BR>&gt; and 'burbs west... and *I* get the rest of the state!&nbsp; (Boy, howdy!!&nbsp; Once <BR>&gt; I get<BR>&gt; my hands on Boardman and the Umatilla Depot, *nobody's* gonna mess with me!!)<BR>&gt; :^)<BR><BR>Sorry, if *you* get Boardman and the Depot, *I* get Hanford!<BR><BR>(And in all seriousness, I don't think either of us wants to deal with<BR>such "unexploded bombs" as those two sites are )-:<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 11:12:42 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; On Thu, 11 Jan 2001, Leslie Bates wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; At 07:47 PM 1/11/01 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; The answer is clear: TRAVELLER IS A VILANI PSYCH WAR OPERATION<BR>&gt;&gt; DESIGNED TO<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; SOFTEN US UP FOR THE INEVITABLE INVASION!!!<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Which is cool with me.&nbsp; Dibs on Quisling traitor in charge of <BR>&gt; California.<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;Only if I get Oregon. Or at least Portland (Tod can have Beaverton :-)<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;Fine. You Get Portland, Gresham, and 'burbs east, Tod gets Beaverton, <BR>&gt; Tigard,<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;and 'burbs west... and *I* get the rest of the state!&nbsp; (Boy, howdy!!&nbsp; Once<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;I get<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;my hands on Boardman and the Umatilla Depot, *nobody's* gonna mess with <BR>&gt; me!!)<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;:^)<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Can I have Minnesota?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'd be happy with Bethesda, Maryland, for two reasons:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; (a) It's my home town, although I haven't lived there for years<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; (b) That's where the National Institutes of Heath are located, and<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; given what we already know about Vilani vulnerability to, and<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; ignorance of, infectious diseases, it might be useful...<BR><BR>And isn't Fort Dietrich nearby? Of *course*, we no longer have any of<BR>those nasty bio-weapons there... &lt;pious look&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 12:08:34 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Ginger<BR><BR>I'm not so sure that patent is referring to IT/Ginger.&nbsp; The patent date is<BR>Oct 26, 1999, which would *lead* me to believe that this patent is, as<BR>stated after all the diagrams, a continuation of his awesome wheelchair<BR>patent.&nbsp; I don't see this as **ground-breaking** a development for the<BR>general masses as that which is suggested by the IT/Ginger hype.&nbsp; Time will<BR>tell I suppose.&nbsp; Dammit, I HATE waiting for stuff!!&nbsp; :D<BR><BR>Best,<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; Following the bouncing URL's, the item has been patented, so<BR>&gt; isn't a secret anymore:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US05971091__<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; It's a somewhat Doctor-Seussian looking motorized scooter.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Walt Smith<BR>&gt; In my opinion, the Grinch is obviously a Onceler.<BR>&gt; _________________________________________________________________<BR>&gt; Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 11:14:17 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Jens Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; "By the light of a flashlight", please. "Torchlight" involves burning<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; materials stuck on the end of a stick.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Depends on if you are American or English&nbsp; ;-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; This is a question I've been itching to ask for years:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; If the British analog to the American term "flashlight" is "torch", what<BR>&gt; do the British call those burning sticks the peasants are always carrying<BR>&gt; when they storm Dr. Frankenstein's castle? :^)<BR><BR>One is a "torch", the other is an "electric torch". They just keep<BR>dropping the "electric" part.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 11:16:00 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Some source also refer to these bundles of burning twigs as 'Firebrands' and<BR>&gt; 'Faggots'. I believe both terms now have new meanings.<BR><BR>Well, yes, the Brits *do* use "fag" or "faggot" to refer to a<BR>cigarette. :-)<BR><BR>As I recall, the Brits *don't use "faggot" to refer to a nancy, if<BR>*that* was what you meant...<BR><BR>BTW, "Roger" as comm lingo (especially "Roger that!") is highly amusing<BR>if you know what "roger" *used* to mean (as in "Jolly Roger") &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 20:14:25 -0000<BR>From: "michael.scanlon" &lt;michael.scanlon@bmthonline.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt; Some source also refer to these bundles of burning twigs as 'Firebrands'<BR>and<BR>&gt; 'Faggots'. I believe both terms now have new meanings.<BR><BR>Well, yes, the Brits *do* use "fag" or "faggot" to refer to a<BR>cigarette. :-)<BR>&lt;&lt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;<BR>As I recall, the Brits *don't use "faggot" to refer to a nancy, if<BR>*that* was what you meant...<BR>&lt;&lt;&lt;<BR>Hmmm yeah right! Not. : )<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>BTW, "Roger" as comm lingo (especially "Roger that!") is highly amusing<BR>if you know what "roger" *used* to mean (as in "Jolly Roger") &lt;eg&gt;<BR>&lt;&lt;<BR>Would someone like to put some light on the subject.<BR><BR>Mike.<BR><BR>Michael.Scanlon@Bmthonline.net<BR>ICQ#27333894<BR><BR>"Nothing that God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in Heaven for...."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:21:15 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>&gt;That's only because no one's recently brought up First Survey,<BR>&gt;Emperor's Vehicles, or that book of not-to-scale deckplans (What was<BR>&gt;that even called?&nbsp; I'd given up on T4 by then).&nbsp; I suspect a long<BR>&gt;argument could be held as to which T4 product is actually the worst<BR>&gt;of the lot.<BR><BR>You know after a long time waiting for T4...when it did come out, and I got<BR>one of those Signed Hardback copies, it was such a load of dung...my vote<BR>for the main book as the worst...cause without it...the rest would not have<BR>happened.<BR><BR>*sigh*<BR><BR>BTW: Anyone know of any groups out there for 2300ad?<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:18:20 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>At 11:09 AM -0800 1/12/01, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;&gt; &gt; Which is cool with me.&nbsp; Dibs on Quisling traitor in charge of <BR>&gt;California.<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;Only if I get Oregon. Or at least Portland (Tod can have Beaverton :-)<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; Fine. You Get Portland, Gresham, and 'burbs east, Tod gets <BR>&gt;&gt;Beaverton, Tigard,<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; and 'burbs west... and *I* get the rest of the state!&nbsp; (Boy, howdy!!&nbsp; Once<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; I get<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; my hands on Boardman and the Umatilla Depot, *nobody's* gonna mess <BR>&gt;&gt;with me!!)<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; :^)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Sorry, if *you* get Boardman and the Depot, *I* get Hanford!<BR><BR>Well, as long as we're divvying up the future, let me stake my claim <BR>on Puget Sound, its submarine base, and the worthless cyberwallahs <BR>infesting its shores.&nbsp; It won't be pretty, but trust me, I'll know <BR>how to deal with *them*.<BR><BR>And our Vilani colleagues.&nbsp; Hell, I'll be the only one who can talk <BR>to them, presumably :)<BR><BR>Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:23:23 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ginger<BR><BR>Walt Smith wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Following the bouncing URL's, the item has been patented, so<BR>&gt; isn't a secret anymore:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US05971091__<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; It's a somewhat Doctor-Seussian looking motorized scooter.<BR><BR>Or is it this one?<BR>http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US06062600__<BR><BR>Or possibly a combination of both, now that he has<BR>all of the relevant patents, including one for a Cantilevered crankshaft<BR>stirling cycle machine<BR>http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US06062023__<BR><BR>he can combine it all in interesting ways.<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:28:49 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ginger<BR><BR>Take all the tranportation-related patents he's received<BR>in the last two years, and add up what you can do with<BR>the constituent parts, with non-patentable additions,<BR>which may nonetheless be difficult to come up with.<BR>I can think of one:&nbsp; Catepillar cars that climb stairs and<BR>other ground obstacles.&nbsp; One of the people who saw it<BR>said that people would want to build cities around it.<BR>If these things are cheaply made, then it fits the bill to me.<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>Jesse Degraff wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I'm not so sure that patent is referring to IT/Ginger.&nbsp; The patent date is<BR>&gt; Oct 26, 1999, which would *lead* me to believe that this patent is, as<BR>&gt; stated after all the diagrams, a continuation of his awesome wheelchair<BR>&gt; patent.&nbsp; I don't see this as **ground-breaking** a development for the<BR>&gt; general masses as that which is suggested by the IT/Ginger hype.&nbsp; Time will<BR>&gt; tell I suppose.&nbsp; Dammit, I HATE waiting for stuff!!&nbsp; :D<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Best,<BR>&gt; Jesse<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>&gt; deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>&gt; -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Following the bouncing URL's, the item has been patented, so<BR>&gt; &gt; isn't a secret anymore:<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; http://www.delphion.com/cgi-bin/viewpat.cmd/US05971091__<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; It's a somewhat Doctor-Seussian looking motorized scooter.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Walt Smith<BR>&gt; &gt; In my opinion, the Grinch is obviously a Onceler.<BR>&gt; &gt; _________________________________________________________________<BR>&gt; &gt; Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3519<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zb03.mx.aol.com (rly-zb03.mail.aol.com [172.31.41.3]) by air-zb02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:31:28 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zb03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:30:48 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id PAA86342;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:29:05 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:28:56 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id PAA86299<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:28:56 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:28:56 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101122028.PAA86299@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3519<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3520</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/12/01 5:50:26 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 12 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3520<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Deck plans 2<BR>RE: GT Cardboard Heros<BR>RE: Ginger<BR>Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>RE: Ginger<BR>RE: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>RE: Ginger<BR>RE: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Jolly Roger<BR>Re: Ginger<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: Ginger<BR>Lotta weird stuff this week<BR>Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>Re: Cutter Deck Plans<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: The truth comes out!!!<BR>Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 09:47:10 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Deck plans 2<BR><BR>Steven Hudson wrote :<BR>&gt; &gt;For those of you who enjoyed the Beowulf Deckplans, SJG is releasing a<BR>&gt; &gt;second set...for the modular cutter.Includes 7 modules and more cardboard<BR>&gt; &gt;heroes...including Newt and Virushi figures.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;drool&gt; Hmm, can the modules be set up to make a space station/factory<BR>&gt; or similar with relative ease...?<BR><BR>Just a suggestion, I find the Games Workshop "Space Hulk" (and asssociated<BR>products ) series a great source for generic ship plans.<BR><BR>(not to mention they have all these Imperial Marine figures and scale tanks<BR>and the like.... &lt;grin&gt;)<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 09:56:18 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: GT Cardboard Heros<BR><BR>GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt; Asks<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; Does anyone know if SJG plans to reprint their early 90's Traveller<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; Cardboard heros figures. I'd like to pick up the Zhodani set.<BR>&gt; &gt; (visions of&nbsp; having the Zhodani attack the Beowolf :))<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Time has not been kind to the original artwork. And they are<BR>&gt; smaller scale<BR><BR>Loren, I have an original sheet of Imperial marines that came up pretty good<BR>on the scanner.<BR><BR>Electronically, I can easily blow them up a bit, and digitally touch up the<BR>reults<BR>Do you want me to send you the .png ?<BR><BR>I also have an un-cut set of the Man-to-Man Cardboard heroes, if you ever<BR>need them.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 10:06:41 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Ginger<BR><BR>&gt; Mark Urbin wrote :<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; My bet is on some kind of small transportation device.<BR><BR>Ditto, I'd guess a bicycle or unicycle with the gyro stabilization<BR>technologyy and power source from the cros-country, staor-climbing<BR>wheelchair he built.<BR><BR>Or, given his fascination with helicopters, a personal, strap-on<BR>helicopter-like contraption.<BR>(Which would explain the statement from Jeff Bezos (i thnk) that the only<BR>question is whether we'll be allowed to use them.)<BR><BR>Frankie.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 12:59:46 -0800<BR>From: "Thing" &lt;thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>On Friday, January 12, 2001 12:18 PM<BR>Kenji Schwarz said,<BR><BR>&gt; Well, as long as we're divvying up the future, let me stake my claim<BR>&gt; on Puget Sound, its submarine base, and the worthless cyberwallahs<BR>&gt; infesting its shores.&nbsp; It won't be pretty, but trust me, I'll know<BR>&gt; how to deal with *them*.<BR><BR>I guess I better start entrenching my position then.&nbsp; I live about 15<BR>minutes from the sub base.<BR><BR>I gotta see if I can talk those ex-Seabees into building me my hardened<BR>computer bunker.<BR><BR>G.D.D.<BR>ThingUnderTheStairs.<BR>================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 13:02:10 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Ginger<BR><BR>&lt;&lt;Or, given his fascination with helicopters, a personal, strap-on<BR>helicopter-like contraption.&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>I was in WalMart the other day, and on one of the ubiquitous TV<BR>monitors they have up all over the store, some girl was demonstrating a<BR>strap-on ducted-fan pack (sort of like a jet pack, but with ducted<BR>fans).<BR><BR>As soon as I heard this inventor dude was into transportation stuff,<BR>that ducted-fan thingy popped into my head.&nbsp; I wonder if they're related.<BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Photos - Share your holiday photos online!<BR>http://photos.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 10:17:35 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote :<BR><BR>&gt; BTW, "Roger" as comm lingo (especially "Roger that!") is highly amusing<BR>&gt; if you know what "roger" *used* to mean (as in "Jolly Roger") &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>You mean as in "Roger the cabin boy" ?<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 13:06:19 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Ginger<BR><BR>No they are not. the ducted fan pack has been around a bit i was at the web<BR>page for it yesterday. this is not the item he invented. and my guess that<BR>since this exists that it is not that.<BR><BR>hasta<BR><BR>me<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Gerry Harris [mailto:harrisgwjr@yahoo.com]<BR>Sent: Friday, January 12, 2001 1:02 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Ginger<BR><BR><BR>&lt;&lt;Or, given his fascination with helicopters, a personal, strap-on<BR>helicopter-like contraption.&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>I was in WalMart the other day, and on one of the ubiquitous TV<BR>monitors they have up all over the store, some girl was demonstrating a<BR>strap-on ducted-fan pack (sort of like a jet pack, but with ducted<BR>fans).<BR><BR>As soon as I heard this inventor dude was into transportation stuff,<BR>that ducted-fan thingy popped into my head.&nbsp; I wonder if they're related.<BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>****************************************************************************<BR>******************<BR>ther Traveller - http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion -<BR>http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>****************************************************************************<BR>******************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war" - Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act<BR>3, Scene 1<BR>****************************************************************************<BR>******************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Photos - Share your holiday photos online!<BR>http://photos.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 10:23:32 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>David C. Broussard wrote :<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; You know after a long time waiting for T4...when it did come out,<BR>&gt; and I got<BR>&gt; one of those Signed Hardback copies, it was such a load of dung...my vote<BR>&gt; for the main book as the worst...cause without it...the rest<BR>&gt; would not have happened.<BR><BR>Here's a laugh for you alll, this from the latest Titan Games mail out :<BR><BR>&nbsp; Imperium Games, Inc:<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (T4: Mark Miller's Traveller)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Marc Miller's Traveller (1100A) (Hardcover) (autographed by<BR>Marc Miller) [$48.5, XF]<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Traveller: Milieu 0 (5) (1400S) [$17, NM]<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Traveller: First Survey 6 (1401S) [$17, NM]<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Traveller: Game Screen (1510) [$12.5, NM]<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Traveller: Pocket Empires 8 (1600) [$17, NM]<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Traveller: Amomalies 9 (1700) [$17, NM]<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Traveller: Fire, Fusion &amp; Steel (B) (1720) [$18, NM]<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Traveller: Emperor's Vehicles (C) (1730) [$18, NM]<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Traveller: Imperial Squadrons E (1750) [$18, NM]<BR><BR>They'll be lucky, huh ?<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 21:17:47 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>on 12/1/01 7:08 pm, Dominic Mooney at dom@cybergoths.u-net.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; HG1 was 1979. The starship design, combat and USP configuration are<BR>&gt; very different.<BR><BR>I must get the reprints compendium soon then, because my copy is HG1.<BR>Not collectable, just broken, right? :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:25:35 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>"michael.scanlon" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; BTW, "Roger" as comm lingo (especially "Roger that!") is highly amusing<BR>&gt; if you know what "roger" *used* to mean (as in "Jolly Roger") &lt;eg&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;&lt;<BR>&gt; Would someone like to put some light on the subject.<BR><BR>"Jolly Roger" is an English-ified version of the French "Jolie Rouge".<BR>Pirate's used to fly red flags, not black.&nbsp; A red flag meant that no<BR>quarter would be given, i.e., we'll kill you, take your stuff and<BR>burn your ship.<BR><BR>Red in French is Rouge.<BR>Jolie is French for Pretty.<BR>Pretty Red = Jolie Rouge = Jolly Roger.<BR><BR>The Black Flag, later with skull and crossbones came later.<BR>That Roberts fellow is attributed with them.<BR>http://www.autopen.com/jolly.roger.shtml<BR><BR>The pages here explain how the skull and crossbones is<BR>actually Templar symbolology.<BR>http://www.skullandcrossbones.org/articles/index.htm<BR><BR>"Roger" is also a nickname for the Devil, as in "Old Roger".<BR>It's also damned close to "Rogue".<BR><BR>However, I believe the poster who Mr. Scanlon was<BR>quoting is referring to the use of "roger" to mean intercourse,<BR>usually of the rougher nature and often specifically buggery.<BR><BR>Now that you know all that, "Roger" in the phrase "Roger that"<BR>comes from its use in telegraphy.&nbsp; Telegraphers used to use<BR>a single letter "R" to indicate "message Received".&nbsp; In the named<BR>alphabet, or whatever is you call it when you use a word for<BR>a letter, i.e., Alpha Bravo, etc., R used to be represented by<BR>Roger. Similarly, A and B used to be Able and Baker.<BR><BR>Thus, even though lots of military veterans will tell you that<BR>"Roger Wilco" is redundant and that *real* military folk will<BR>use one or the other, technically it means<BR>"Message Received,Will Comply".&nbsp; Nowadays, they tend<BR>to use "Copy" and "Acknowledged" to indicate receipt of<BR>message.<BR><BR>bloo<BR>p.s.&nbsp; google will answer a great many questions for you<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:27:04 -0600<BR>From: "Steve (Bloo) Daniels" &lt;sdaniels@playnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ginger<BR><BR>Gerry Harris wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I was in WalMart the other day, and on one of the ubiquitous TV<BR>&gt; monitors they have up all over the store, some girl was demonstrating a<BR>&gt; strap-on ducted-fan pack (sort of like a jet pack, but with ducted<BR>&gt; fans).<BR><BR>Individual solo VTOL:<BR>http://www.solotrek.com/<BR><BR>bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 16:29:05 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR>&gt;I must get the reprints compendium soon then, because my copy is HG1.<BR>&gt;Not collectable, just broken, right? :)<BR><BR>Both, actually.&nbsp; Keep your copy of HG1 as a collector's item, but if you're actually going to use it in play, use HG2.&nbsp; FWIW, the reprint contains the revised versions of Books 1-3 from 1981 which you likely also don't have.&nbsp; Some weapon damages are different, no x-boat routes table in Book 3, several other layout and formatting changes.<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 13:45:15 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ginger<BR><BR>Wow!&nbsp; I want one for my birthday!<BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Photos - Share your holiday photos online!<BR>http://photos.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 16:42:51 -0500<BR>From: "Daniel Phelps" &lt;phelpsd@gate.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Lotta weird stuff this week<BR><BR>This was sent to me by a friend, has it come up on the list in regard to<BR>White Hat/Black Hat?<BR><BR><BR>&gt;If you must, then do evil right:<BR>&gt; http://evilscience.net/manuals/doingevil/doingevil.htm<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:00:42 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>Thought that was Tommy Loy...<BR><BR>"Frank G. Pitt" wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote :<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; BTW, "Roger" as comm lingo (especially "Roger that!") is highly amusing<BR>&gt; &gt; if you know what "roger" *used* to mean (as in "Jolly Roger") &lt;eg&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; You mean as in "Roger the cabin boy" ?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Frankie<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>University of Arizona<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 09:13:55 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Conservation of Momentum and Energy in jump<BR><BR>Trevor, Peter wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; (Of course, if you want to get really weird you could make this roll<BR>&gt; separately for *each* crewman and passenger ... even though they'd<BR>&gt; be able to interact with each other in an apparently normal fashion<BR>&gt; a different length of time would pass for each of them!)<BR><BR>Get weirder: none at all, negative time or an infinite amount.&nbsp; ;^&gt;<BR><BR>(Forgive me, I've been posting far too much on consciousness,<BR>subjective time and identity in rec.arts.sf.science)<BR><BR><BR>- - Tim<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 16:42:42 -0600<BR>From: Leslie Bates &lt;lesbates@minn.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>At 05:29 PM 1/12/01 +0100, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Which is cool with me.&nbsp; Dibs on Quisling traitor in charge of<BR>California.<BR>&gt;;-) Ill have Europe, then, except for France, which someone else can<BR>&gt;bother with.<BR><BR>Why in God's name would anyone want France?<BR><BR>Les<BR><BR>====================================<BR>Revolutionaries are not nice people.<BR>==================================== <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:44:56 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: John Fox &lt;jfox@verity.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>The wine and the cheese!<BR>&nbsp; OH.. I forgot, that is California<BR>&nbsp; Sorry!<BR>&nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; John W. Fox<BR>&nbsp; Who Lives in CA<BR>&nbsp; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; At 05:29 PM 1/12/01 +0100, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Which is cool with me.&nbsp; Dibs on Quisling traitor in charge of<BR>&gt; California.<BR>&gt; &gt;;-) Ill have Europe, then, except for France, which someone else can<BR>&gt; &gt;bother with.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Why in God's name would anyone want France?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Les<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; ====================================<BR>&gt; Revolutionaries are not nice people.<BR>&gt; ==================================== <BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:59:52 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>&gt; BTW, "Roger" as comm lingo (especially "Roger that!") is highly amusing<BR>&gt; if you know what "roger" *used* to mean (as in "Jolly Roger") &lt;eg&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>I've still had a Brit friend make use of the term "getting rogered" and<BR>"rogering".&nbsp; Makes on wonder abour Mr. Rogers.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:35:32 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Cutter Deck Plans<BR><BR>&gt;From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Cutter Deck Plans<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;drool&gt; Hmm, can the modules be set up to make a space station/factory<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; or similar with relative ease...?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The intent is that you cut the module plans out and lay them on top of the <BR>&gt;cutter frame -- nothing prevents you from laying them out as a station or<BR>whatever.<BR><BR>&nbsp; No doubt the Cutters and the Beowulf deck-plans use the same scale<BR>and map symbols for full compatibility?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 18:54:12 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>&gt; for T4. When I get some time I'll put the original AR proposal on <BR>&gt; the CORE website http://www.core.org.uk/<BR><BR>Ooh, now that I'd be intertested in!<BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 18:52:54 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>Out of a sense of fairness, which T4 products were actually good?<BR><BR>On Fri, 12 Jan 2001 19:15:42 +0000 Dominic Mooney<BR>&lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt; writes:<BR>&gt; At 01:51 -0500 12/1/01,&nbsp; trentfs@ix.netcom.com wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;This may be the most reviled of the T4 supplements/adventures so <BR>&gt; far<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;(ranking right up there with Starships).&nbsp; I think I'll stay far, <BR>&gt; far<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;away...<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;That's only because no one's recently brought up First Survey, <BR>&gt; &gt;Emperor's Vehicles, or that book of not-to-scale deckplans (What <BR>&gt; was <BR>&gt; &gt;that even called?&nbsp; I'd given up on T4 by then).&nbsp; I suspect a long <BR>&gt; &gt;argument could be held as to which T4 product is actually the worst <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;of the lot.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; In order -<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Annililik Run - Worst<BR>&gt; Emperor's Vehicles - 2nd<BR>&gt; Starships - 3rd<BR>&gt; First Survey - 4th<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 3 &amp; 4 have some limited use<BR>&gt; 2 is useless as no TL etc<BR>&gt; 1 is best turned into a small papier mache object.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Dom<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 00:09 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;10112.111417.7n6.rnr.w165w@krypton.rain.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>I would tend to call the thing you put batteries in a 'torch' and the <BR>thing you ignite and wave around outside the local vampire's castle a <BR>'flaming brand'.<BR><BR>But then, I'm Welsh.<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 16:24:26 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>&gt; I would tend to call the thing you put batteries in a 'torch' and the<BR>&gt; thing you ignite and wave around outside the local vampire's castle a<BR>&gt; 'flaming brand'.<BR>&gt;<BR>Only artistes byronic heroes carry flaming brands.&nbsp; If it's peasants at the<BR>gates, then there burning sticks.<BR><BR>"Awright, look here.&nbsp; We want the monster, and you better gib em up, cuz we<BR>got these here burnin sticks"<BR><BR>So if you don't ignite it, It's just a brand?<BR><BR>Or is it a flaming brand when the big CocaCola logo catches on fire.<BR><BR>Fortunately, in these modern times we have flamethrowers for dealing with<BR>Vampires.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 09:19:51 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>&gt; From: Leonard Erickson<BR>&gt; &gt; (b) That's where the National Institutes of Heath are located, and<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; given what we already know about Vilani vulnerability to, and<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; ignorance of, infectious diseases, it might be useful...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; And isn't Fort Dietrich nearby? Of *course*, we no longer have any of<BR>&gt; those nasty bio-weapons there... &lt;pious look&gt;<BR><BR>Speaking of nasty:&nbsp; I don't have a link handy, so do a search on<BR>"mousepox".<BR><BR>(Oh, and I will take Toowoomba and south-western Queensland as my fief,<BR>_and_ be a member of the Junta of Brisbane.&nbsp; Hail the Grand Empire of<BR>Stars!)<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 01:55:10 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR>&gt; Out of a sense of fairness, which T4 products were actually good?<BR><BR>The following are (IMHO) good T4 supplements:<BR><BR>Emperor's arsenal<BR>Pocket empires<BR>Central supply catalog<BR>Long way home + Gateway (previously available from BITS)<BR><BR>The following are useful:<BR><BR>Aliens archive (some of the races in any case)<BR>Imperial squadrons<BR>Fire, fusion &amp; steel (but it requires a whole bunch of errata)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 01:56:35 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: The truth comes out!!!<BR><BR>Jesse Degraff wrote:<BR>&gt; The truth about what happened to the Titanic comes out!&nbsp; Turns out it was<BR>&gt; penguins....<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://www.ifilm.com/ifilm/skeletons/film_detail/0,1263,766641,00.html<BR><BR>ROTFLMAO!<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 20:34:01 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Famile Spofulam Penguin<BR><BR>On Fri, 12 Jan 2001 14:08:11 -0500 (EST), shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard<BR>Erickson) wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Ah. Sort of like the guy I just gave up on in alt.callahans. If you<BR>&gt;disagree with him, you are a leftist or a liberal. If you agree with<BR>&gt;him you are a righgt wing conservative. <BR><BR>I seem to remember having a JOT-type here, once, too.&nbsp; Or is what's left of<BR>my mind conflating kooks^Wpersonalities from several environments in which<BR>I can be found?<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(Ask me via email about the ILink message network!)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 01:47:33 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>on 12/1/01 10:44 pm, John Fox at jfox@verity.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; The wine and the cheese!<BR>&gt; OH.. I forgot, that is California<BR>&gt; Sorry!<BR><BR>Eeew! That nasty plonk from up Napa? It can't even come close to an aged<BR>Rhone wine such as Chateauneuf du Pape or St. Joseph. Your soil tends to be<BR>too rich for the ultimate vines. You could (and probably do) grow some nice<BR>olives though. There may be a couple of decent cheeses produced in CA, but I<BR>suspect they'd be the ones that use foreign recipes. Are there any truly<BR>local fromage especiales?<BR><BR>People turn France down based on (i) Quebecois - they just think they're<BR>French (ii) Paris - yes, they can be surly, but contrast a similar sized<BR>city ... NY? London? Urgh. In fact the French are charming, have a beautiful<BR>language, a fabulous country - look at Provence - and superb culture, arts<BR>and education. The real downside is Socialism, but that's true of both<BR>Britain (particularly the good bits - Scotland and Wales) and Germany too.<BR>:)<BR><BR>Let's see, I'll have Southern Africa (Kenya, Zambia, Zimbabwe, Botswana and<BR>South Africa). Come and see me if you want any diamonds, gold, copper,<BR>uranium, etc. Oh, and Burma for the rubies (damn useful for beam weapons).<BR>Some of the middle-east could be handy until I get my solar power sats up -<BR>anybody want to partner on that? :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR>PS: Volker - Burma doesn't count as Europe, you should have said Eurasia :)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3520<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zc01.mx.aol.com (rly-zc01.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.1]) by air-zc04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 20:50:26 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zc01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 20:49:27 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id UAA99471;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 20:45:52 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 12 Jan 2001 20:45:33 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id UAA99424<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 20:45:33 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 20:45:33 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101130145.UAA99424@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3520<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3521</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/13/01 6:10:35 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Saturday, January 13 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3521<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR>RE: Ginger<BR>The French? (was Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab))<BR>re: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR>Re: HG 1 &amp; 2<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>A question about salvage<BR>RE: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>RE: Deck plans 2<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Scary thoughts....<BR>Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>Re: Jolly Roger<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Jolly Roger<BR>Re: Jolly Roger<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>Re: Jolly Roger<BR>RE: mutiny<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>RE: Jolly Roger<BR>Re: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>Classic Traveller Chargen S/W?<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 01:49:32 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops...<BR><BR>on 12/1/01 10:42 pm, Leslie Bates at lesbates@minn.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Why in God's name would anyone want France?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Les<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; ====================================<BR>&gt; Revolutionaries are not nice people.<BR>&gt; ====================================<BR><BR>That's not a nice thing to say about American colonists. :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR>(Still supporting the Auld Alliance)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 21:20:31 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Ginger<BR><BR>Frank put into the Ether:<BR>&gt; &gt; Mark Urbin wrote :<BR>&gt; &gt; My bet is on some kind of small transportation device.<BR>&gt;Ditto, I'd guess a bicycle or unicycle with the gyro stabilization<BR>&gt;technologyy and power source from the cros-country, staor-climbing<BR>&gt;wheelchair he built.<BR>&gt;Or, given his fascination with helicopters, a personal, strap-on<BR>&gt;helicopter-like contraption.<BR>&gt;(Which would explain the statement from Jeff Bezos (i thnk) that the only<BR>&gt;question is whether we'll be allowed to use them.)<BR><BR>If it's a personal VTOL, then he beat these folks to the punch:<BR>http://www.solotrek.com/<BR><BR><BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>These opinions are mine, no one else wants `em.<BR>Joan of Arc: the patron saint of welders http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 22:37:35 EST<BR>From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>Subject: The French? (was Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab))<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley sez:<BR><BR>&gt;People turn France down based on (i) Quebecois - they just think they're<BR>&gt;French<BR><BR>The one Quebecois I've known was a friendly sort, but she was far from home <BR>(California) and had been dealing with being named by extremely "patriotic" <BR>parents all her life; her first name was France...<BR><BR>&gt;(ii) Paris - yes, they can be surly, but contrast a similar sized<BR>&gt;city ... NY? London? Urgh. <BR><BR>A friend of mine reports that Parisian waiters get less chilly when they <BR>find out that you're from some other part of the U.S. than New York, and <BR>mildly friendly if you're from San Francisco.<BR>Still, we all considered it quite amusing when one ref put a "Chez Attitude" <BR>Solomani restaurant out on the Spinward Main for us to trip over.<BR>Then we discovered it was a chain...<BR><BR>GC<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 17:53:22 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR><BR>On 12 Jan 01, at 19:21, Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 01:51 -0500 12/1/01,&nbsp; "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" <BR>&gt; &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Have a look at BITS http://www.bits.org.uk/ for the UK's Traveller<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Support Group and Publisher...<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;Why does this conjure up images of groups of middle aged people sitting<BR>&gt; &gt;in a circle saying "Hi, my name's Andrew and I'm a Traveller player, but I<BR>&gt; &gt;haven't bought a supplement for 30 days"?<BR><BR>&gt; 'Hi, my name's Dominic and I'm a Traveller player, but I haven't <BR>&gt; bought a supplement for 6 days. Unfortunately I slipped then and <BR>&gt; bought both the Beowulf Deckplans and GT:Ground Forces.'<BR><BR>Maybe its time for online support, newsgroup alt.traveller.survivor or <BR>alt.traveller.recovery perhaps :*)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 22:02:09 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: HG 1 &amp; 2<BR><BR>&gt;From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>...<BR>&gt;&gt; HG1 was 1979. The starship design, combat and USP configuration are<BR>&gt;&gt; very different.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I must get the reprints compendium soon then, because my copy is HG1.<BR>&gt;Not collectable, just broken, right? :)<BR><BR>&nbsp; A bit of both (I got one by accident and was quite pleased...), <BR>but mostly just replaced.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 17:32:13 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Let's see, I'll have Southern Africa (Kenya, Zambia, Zimbabwe,<BR>&gt; Botswana and South Africa). Come and see me if you want any<BR>&gt; diamonds, gold, copper, uranium, etc.<BR><BR>Hah, I'll have Australia (I'm lazy and don't want to move far).&nbsp; I'll<BR>have my own uranium, gold, copper, and a few diamonds and other<BR>precious stones, particularly after the DeBeers mob have been shot.<BR><BR>Hell, I can get a fair whack of minerals just here in Tasmania.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Oh, and Burma for the rubies (damn useful for beam weapons).<BR><BR>Nah, synthetic ones are much better for that and cheaper, too.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Some of the middle-east could be handy until I get my solar power<BR>&gt; sats up - anybody want to partner on that? :)<BR><BR>You can have it, I'll have more than enough desert for my liking.<BR><BR><BR>- - Tim<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 02:00:51 -0500<BR>From: "Greenly, Jeff" &lt;greenlyj@rcbhsc.wvu.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: A question about salvage<BR><BR>First, to those who replied to my questions and comments about mutiny in the<BR>Imperium, thanks a lot. I found most of your replies useful and insightful,<BR>and the references provided turned me on to a lot of other things that I can<BR>use. I have a follow-up question: Are there any references to Salvage Law<BR>within the Imperium in the CT canon (the campaign will start in 1107)<BR>especially as it pertains to warships? I have been using International<BR>Maritime law as an example, wherin a vessel which has been wrested from<BR>constituted authority through mutiny or barratry is still the property of<BR>the state of registry regardless of that vessel's condition. On the face of<BR>it, that would be the logical Imperial position, but I keep stumbling over<BR>the idea of planetary soverignty within the Imperium. If a vessel crashed on<BR>a planet, and the planetary government claimed the wreckage for whatever<BR>reason, how do you think the "local" representatives of the Imperium might<BR>deal with it? How do you think the Imperium would deal with a planetary<BR>government which granted asylum to a mutinous crew? What if the world was<BR>not loyal to the Imperium? <BR><BR>JD<BR><BR>Note: Mr. Trevor, the campaign I am working on begins in 1107, so the<BR>Rebellious Era in MT really doesn't apply. To be quite honest, IMTU the MT<BR>storyline simply wouldn't work. I am sorry I didn't specify the milieu I was<BR>referring to in my first post. <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 23:12:15 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: RE: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;Here's a laugh for you alll, this from the latest Titan Games mail out :<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Imperium Games, Inc:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (T4: Mark Miller's Traveller)<BR>...<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Traveller: Emperor's Vehicles (C) (1730) [$18, NM]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Traveller: Imperial Squadrons E (1750) [$18, NM]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;They'll be lucky, huh ?<BR><BR>&nbsp; The new management seems to have a variant approach to reality?...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 23:22:31 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: RE: Deck plans 2<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 09:47:10 +1300<BR>&gt;From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: RE: Deck plans 2<BR>...<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;drool&gt; Hmm, can the modules be set up to make a space station/factory<BR>&gt;&gt; or similar with relative ease...?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Just a suggestion, I find the Games Workshop "Space Hulk" (and asssociated<BR>&gt;products ) series a great source for generic ship plans.<BR><BR>&nbsp; OOP, sadly, like the best Pudding Workshop products...<BR><BR>&nbsp; A similar product from Global Games "Legions of Steel" line might <BR>still be available, although also OOP currently.<BR><BR>&gt;(not to mention they have all these Imperial Marine figures and scale tanks<BR>&gt;and the like.... &lt;grin&gt;)<BR><BR>&nbsp; Too pricy for most people. Mind you, I do have an armour company of<BR>Eldar for 40K, and a couple of regiments in the Epic scale :)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 02:56:57 -0800<BR>From: "Trent Smith" &lt;trentfs@ix.netcom.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>&lt;knightsky@juno.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Out of a sense of fairness, which T4 products were actually good?<BR>&gt;<BR>Here's my take:<BR><BR>More-or-less all good:<BR>Emperor's Arsenal (already dealt with)<BR>Pocket Empires (not anything I'm personally too interested in, but it's a<BR>comprehensive guide to this type of campaign)<BR>Psionic Institutes (solid CORE-desinged supplement, well worthwhile at less<BR>than full-price)<BR>Long Way Home + Gateway (quite good long adventure, originally published by<BR>BITS, split into two books (with some material repeated in both) by IG, so<BR>as to screw us out of a few extra bucks)<BR><BR>Qualified (mostly good, but with some flaws):<BR>Central Supply Catalog (comprehensive list of non-weapon equipment; would've<BR>been a lot better with professional layout and illustrations; also contains<BR>a vehicle design system that's not compatible with any of the other design<BR>systems)<BR>Aliens Archive (lots of mostly-gimmicky Minor Races; printed in a large font<BR>(to fill out the page count), and with lame cartoon-style illos)<BR>Milieu 0 Campaign (the hardback edition; the original 'Milieu 0' book (which<BR>had much good material, very poorly edited and laid-out) plus 32pp of new<BR>material that wasn't in the original edition; also contains 'First Survey'<BR>which is IMO the worst of the worst of T4, but you can ignore that part)<BR>T4 GM Screen (somewhat worthwhile because it contains the revised T4 task<BR>system, and the charts are better laid-out than in the rule book)<BR>Fire, Fusion, &amp; Steel (gearheads' system-of-choice; badly marred by typos<BR>and errata, also much too complex for many of us to actually use)<BR>Imperial Squadrons (the last T4 book I bought, never read it, but haven't<BR>heard as many complaints about it as some of the other stuff)<BR><BR>Just for completeness' sake:<BR>Missions of State (I never bought this, but apparently it's more-or-less the<BR>same as 'Anomalies' -- an anthology of adventures of widely-varying quality<BR>and canonicity)<BR>[that book of deck plans] (didn't buy this either; the idea was that these<BR>were deck-plan modules you could cut out and paste together as needed,<BR>except that they're in various inconsistent scales, and (as typical with T4)<BR>break with Traveller canon in several ways -- some people include this as<BR>one of the worst-of-the-worst)<BR><BR>None of the T4 books are by any means essential, but the first set are all<BR>good for their specific topics, and the others are worth a look too, so long<BR>as you keep your expectations low and didn't pay too much.&nbsp; In general,<BR>though, you'd still be better off buying GT books, BITS products, or the CT<BR>reprints, no matter what rule-system you're playing with.<BR><BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 01:15:53 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Scary thoughts....<BR><BR>On alt.callahans, someone brought up the idea of Steve Irwin (the<BR>Aussie who is always seen with his face far to close to things like<BR>poisonous snakes) doing a show on Dune. "And here's how you get water<BR>of life from an immature sandworm..."<BR><BR>It occurs to me tha it'd be great fun having the PCs' ship chartered by<BR>someone like this. &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 01:19:47 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; As I recall, the Brits *don't use "faggot" to refer to a nancy, if<BR>&gt; *that* was what you meant...<BR>&gt; &lt;&lt;&lt;<BR>&gt; Hmmm yeah right! Not. : )<BR><BR>"I was misinformed"<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; BTW, "Roger" as comm lingo (especially "Roger that!") is highly amusing<BR>&gt;&gt; if you know what "roger" *used* to mean (as in "Jolly Roger") &lt;eg&gt;<BR>&gt;&lt;&lt;<BR>&gt; Would someone like to put some light on the subject.<BR><BR>"Roger" is much the same as "bugger". (ie anal sex)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 01:26:15 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; "Jolly Roger" is an English-ified version of the French "Jolie Rouge".<BR>&gt; Pirate's used to fly red flags, not black.&nbsp; A red flag meant that no<BR>&gt; quarter would be given, i.e., we'll kill you, take your stuff and<BR>&gt; burn your ship.<BR><BR>I wonder if that's related to the Viking practice of hanging shield<BR>from the top of the mast. White for trade, red for raid. :-)<BR><BR>&gt; Thus, even though lots of military veterans will tell you that<BR>&gt; "Roger Wilco" is redundant and that *real* military folk will<BR>&gt; use one or the other, technically it means<BR>&gt; "Message Received,Will Comply".&nbsp; Nowadays, they tend<BR>&gt; to use "Copy" and "Acknowledged" to indicate receipt of<BR>&gt; message.<BR><BR>As Heinlein commented in one of his juveniles, there's a *world* of<BR>difference between "Roger" (I heard you, I got the message" and "Wilco"<BR>(I'll follow the instructions you just gave me).<BR><BR>I vaguely recall that in the Navy there's a similar difference between<BR>"Yes, sir!" and "Aye, aye, sir!".<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 11:28:35 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>At 20:45 -0500 12/1/01, Traveller-digest knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR>&gt;Out of a sense of fairness, which T4 products were actually good?<BR><BR>Milieu 0 Campaign (same as Milieu 0 but 32 extra pages of background, <BR>First Survey's maps and hardcover so a few dollars more).<BR>Pocket Empires (interesting treatment of interstellar polities, but I <BR>don't know anyone who actually has played it)<BR>Psionic Institutes (probably the best treatment of Psionics in Traveller)<BR>Aliens Archive (some minor races well described but fonts are large <BR>so less info)<BR><BR>If you actually want to play T4 the core rules are great once you get <BR>hold of Marc Miller's playest for T5. A fixed version of QSDS (the <BR>ship system) is on the BITS site.<BR><BR>Emperor's Arsenal - great weapons resource<BR><BR>Central Supply Catalog - basically a compilation of all the equipment <BR>from the various Traveller editions. Should be pretty generically <BR>usable.<BR><BR>Imperial Squadrons is interesting - some notes on playing in the <BR>Navy, plus the FFW rules linked to Pocket Empires.<BR><BR>FFS2 is pretty useful to mine for technology information. I'd <BR>recommend grabbing the errata from the web though.<BR><BR>The BITS adventures Long Way Home/Gateway (a linked pair) are pretty <BR>good too, but I'm biased.<BR><BR>IOn that note I'd also recommend all the BITS books (pretty much <BR>usable for all versions of Traveller)<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 11:51 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;10113.012615.0j3.rnr.w165w@krypton.rain.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>The one thing that REALLY annoys me in fictional voice procedure is when <BR>people end a conversation with 'Over and out'.<BR><BR>One or the other, please.<BR><BR>Over = I've finished talking, what do you have to say?<BR><BR>Out = I'm off, end transmission.<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 04:36:00 -0800<BR>From: "Pronto" &lt;pronto_r031@telus.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>&gt; In-Reply-To: &lt;10113.012615.0j3.rnr.w165w@krypton.rain.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Greetings dear hearts.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The one thing that REALLY annoys me in fictional voice procedure is when<BR>&gt; people end a conversation with 'Over and out'.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; One or the other, please.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Over = I've finished talking, what do you have to say?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Out = I'm off, end transmission.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hugs and kisses,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mexal.<BR>&gt;<BR>Over = I'm done talking<BR>Out =&nbsp; I'm done listening<BR><BR>Over and Out = I'm done talking and listening but if you want to talk, go<BR>ahead. But I still ain't listening!&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>Pronto<BR>Next year, at Burning Man!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 04:42:34<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>At 06:52 PM 1/12/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Out of a sense of fairness, which T4 products were actually good?<BR><BR>The ones that I still own and use for reference:<BR><BR>Pocket Empires<BR>Emperor's Arsenal<BR>Psionic Institutes<BR>Central Supply Catalog<BR>Aliens Archive<BR><BR>I also have the IG versions of Long Way Home and Gateway.&nbsp; I keep Imperial<BR>Squadrons ariund simply because it contains some of my first published work.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp;&nbsp; Templar Agent at Large.<BR>gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR><BR>TravGeekCode: <BR>tc+ tm+ !tn- t4@ ?tg+ tt@ to(CORPS)++ ru@ $ge++ 3i<BR>ii+ au st+ ls+ pi kk+ so(++) va++ dr+ zh+ sw++ ?da<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 04:46:34<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>At 01:47 AM 1/13/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Eeew! That nasty plonk from up Napa? It can't even come close to an aged<BR>&gt;Rhone wine such as Chateauneuf du Pape or St. Joseph. Your soil tends to be<BR>&gt;too rich for the ultimate vines. You could (and probably do) grow some nice<BR>&gt;olives though. There may be a couple of decent cheeses produced in CA, but I<BR>&gt;suspect they'd be the ones that use foreign recipes. Are there any truly<BR>&gt;local fromage especiales?<BR><BR>Monterey Jack<BR><BR>And I'm bringing some California wine and sourdough bread with me to<BR>GenConUK.&nbsp; But if you don't want any...<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 05:05:44 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>I seem to remember the black flag meaning "no quarter."&nbsp; Supposedly,<BR>one was used by Santa Anna at the Alamo to let the defenders know their<BR>fate.&nbsp; This is the first time I've heard of a red flag being used for<BR>such a purpose.<BR><BR>You learn something new every day.<BR><BR>Traveller:<BR><BR>Sir!&nbsp; They're flashing a smiley face at us.&nbsp; Do you think they're<BR>friendly?<BR><BR>No.&nbsp; The smiley face is the ancient Vilani symbol for "no quarter." <BR>Sound battlestations.<BR><BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. <BR>http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 05:31:24 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: RE: mutiny<BR><BR>&gt;From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: RE: mutiny<BR>... the issue was recruiting on worlds <BR>&gt;&gt; recently freed from the Solomani during the War - some agents<BR>&gt;&gt; would have been in place before the expansion, and some fellow-<BR>&gt;&gt; Travellers would have been genuinely sympathetic to the Movement.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;More likely the issue would&nbsp; be&nbsp; recruiting&nbsp; on&nbsp; worlds&nbsp; recently<BR>&gt;occupied by the Imperium during the War - some loyal agents would<BR>&gt;have been&nbsp; in&nbsp; place&nbsp; before&nbsp; the&nbsp; expansion,&nbsp; and&nbsp; some&nbsp; fellow-<BR>&gt;Travellers would have been genuinely sympathetic to the Movement.<BR><BR>&nbsp; Imperial running-dog lackey!!<BR><BR>&nbsp; Oh, wait, that's me this time. Sorry :&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 15:50 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;3.0.5.16.20010113044634.3dffc758@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts, especially Douglas.<BR><BR>If you are coming to Gen Con UK I hope I meet you in person :-) (With or <BR>without Californian wine and sourdough bread... I'd love to try the <BR>latter, if there's any to spare!)<BR><BR>Oh, and if there are any more lands to grab, can I have somewhere warm <BR>please? Egypt perhaps... the diving's good!<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 09:47:20 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>Gerry Harris wrote :<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Traveller:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Sir!&nbsp; They're flashing a smiley face at us.&nbsp; Do you think they're<BR>&gt; friendly?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; No.&nbsp; The smiley face is the ancient Vilani symbol for "no quarter." <BR>&gt; Sound battlestations.<BR><BR><BR>Bab5 :<BR>Their gunports are open....<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 04:48:50 -0800<BR>From: "Kelly St.Clair" &lt;kellys@efn.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>On Sat, 13 Jan 2001 01:47:33 +0000, Gordon Hundley <BR>&lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Eeew! That nasty plonk from up Napa? It can't even come close to an aged<BR>&gt;Rhone wine such as Chateauneuf du Pape or St. Joseph. Your soil tends to be<BR>&gt;too rich for the ultimate vines.<BR><BR>"Too rich" = "still has some nutrients in it, as opposed to the moon-dust <BR>that's left after a few centuries of French grapes."<BR><BR>If I want vinegar-flavored water, I can make that in my kitchen.&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>(Just kiddin'.&nbsp; Actually, my favorite whine remains, "But I was going into <BR>Tochi Station to pick up some *powwerr converrterrs*...")<BR><BR><BR>- --------------<BR>Kelly St.Clair&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "'Cause you've got Trouble<BR>kellys@efn.org&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Right here in fair Verona<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; With a capital T that rhymes with D<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That stands for Duel..."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 21:12:19 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Classic Traveller Chargen S/W?<BR><BR>Somebody just Asked Freelance Traveller about some of this.&nbsp; I remember<BR>it's been discussed.&nbsp; Pointers?<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(Ask me via email about the ILink message network!)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3521<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zd04.mx.aol.com (rly-zd04.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.228]) by air-zd02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Sat, 13 Jan 2001 21:10:35 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zd04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sat, 13 Jan 2001 21:10:08 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id VAA55983;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sat, 13 Jan 2001 21:09:32 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sat, 13 Jan 2001 21:08:52 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id VAA55929<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sat, 13 Jan 2001 21:08:52 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 21:08:52 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101140208.VAA55929@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3521<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3522</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/14/01 6:34:35 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sunday, January 14 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3522<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: GT Cardboard Heros<BR>another William Keith<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: A question about salvage<BR>Re: OT: U. S. ARMY OFFICIAL VOICE MAIL MESSAGE<BR>Re: It's the Cheese (was: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab))<BR>Sylea and Capital<BR>RE: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>re: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR>RE: Deck plans 2<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>re: A question about salvage<BR>RE: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Re: It's the Cheese (was: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab))<BR>re: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR>Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR>RE: It's the Cheese (was: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab))<BR>Re: Sylea and Capital<BR>Re: A question about salvage<BR>RE: A question about salvage<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3520<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3521<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>Traveller survivor (was: FS penguin)<BR>Introduction<BR>GRIP<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 20:18:29 -0600<BR>From: Jimmy Simpson &lt;nimrodd@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: GT Cardboard Heros<BR><BR>At 09:56 AM 1/13/2001 +1300, you wrote:<BR>&gt;GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt; Asks<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;&nbsp; Does anyone know if SJG plans to reprint their early 90's Traveller<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;&nbsp; Cardboard heros figures. I'd like to pick up the Zhodani set.<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; (visions of&nbsp; having the Zhodani attack the Beowolf :))<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Time has not been kind to the original artwork. And they are<BR>&gt; &gt; smaller scale<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Loren, I have an original sheet of Imperial marines that came up pretty good<BR>&gt;on the scanner.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Electronically, I can easily blow them up a bit, and digitally touch up the<BR>&gt;reults<BR>&gt;Do you want me to send you the .png ?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I also have an un-cut set of the Man-to-Man Cardboard heroes, if you ever<BR>&gt;need them.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Frankie<BR><BR>I have uncut sheets of all 3 Traveller Cardboard Hero sets.<BR><BR>Jimmy Simpson<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; nimrodd@mail.com<BR><BR>"The avalanche has already started.<BR>It is too late for the pebbles to vote."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Kosh Naranek (Babylon 5)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 18:17:24 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: another William Keith<BR><BR>My notes from a visit to the De Young Museum some time ago:<BR><BR>William Keith landscape painter 1838-1911 Aberdeen Scotland and Berkeley<BR>Cal. A broadside of Mt. Tamalpais 1870<BR><BR>Do we know whether he is an ancestor of the William Keith of Traveller fame?<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 02:49:04 -0000<BR>From: "Ben Aaronovitch" &lt;bem@imaginaryfilms.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>I love the magic system in G:Voodoo and you can use it (with modifications) for<BR>most African magic as well.<BR><BR>Ben Aaronovitch<BR><BR><BR>'Let's be honest here - you paid for the women.'<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Bill Murrey - Scrooged<BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: Douglas E. Berry &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2001 8:24 AM<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; One thing I've always wanted to try was a fantasy setting using the magic<BR>&gt; in G: Voodoo.&nbsp; No wizards sending fireballs around, but instead spirits and<BR>&gt; loa coming on deadly errands, and magic powders and potions for almost any<BR>&gt; occasion.<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 22:03:51 -0500<BR>From: Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A question about salvage<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 02:00:51 -0500<BR>&gt;From: "Greenly, Jeff" &lt;greenlyj@rcbhsc.wvu.edu&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: A question about salvage<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Are there any references to Salvage Law<BR>&gt;within the Imperium in the CT canon (the campaign will start in 1107)<BR>&gt;especially as it pertains to warships? <BR><BR>"...this artifact is allowed in imperial commerce under the salvage laws<BR>provided the ship is registered with imperial authorities (typical<BR>registration fee: Cr 100,000)."<BR><BR>Marc W. Miller, "Starship: Annic Nova," JTAS #1, p. 30.<BR><BR>"Battlefield Salvage: The area of space where the Battle of Two Suns was<BR>fought could have starship wreckage, both of Kinunir class ships and of<BR>other ships involved, in salvagable condition. Serviceable parts for the<BR>restoration of Kinunir could be available."<BR><BR>Adventure 1, The Kinunir, p. 43.<BR><BR>This passage implies that /Kinunir/ could be salvaged by the PC's and kept<BR>for their use; this is, however, suspect in light of later canon (cf.<BR>particularly the circumstances surrounding the transfer of /Emissary/ to<BR>Oberlindes Lines). The requirements for such a course of action are not<BR>otherwise spelled out.<BR><BR>"The Company will certainly insist on possession if it discovers that the<BR>group has found [a derelict]. They will probably not even pay salvage bonus."<BR><BR>Adventure 6, Expedition to Zhodane, p. 21.<BR><BR><BR>And on your previous question: the loss of the /Gyro Cadiz/ task force in<BR>984 was attributed to the actions of mutineers (the crew of the<BR>scout/courier /Black Gold/) by the only witness to leave an account. The<BR>relevant citation is Adventure 3, Twilight's Peak, pp. 52-55, but I won't<BR>quote any of it out of consideration for the list.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 01:23:04 EST<BR>From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: OT: U. S. ARMY OFFICIAL VOICE MAIL MESSAGE<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/6/01 7:59:06 PM !!!First Boot!!!, <BR>dom@cybergoths.u-net.com writes:<BR><BR>&lt;&lt; U. S. ARMY OFFICIAL VOICE MAIL MESSAGE &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>Don't know if I should laugh or cry...:-(<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 01:42:40 EST<BR>From: RBasler1@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: It's the Cheese (was: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab))<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/12/01 5:50:26 PM Pacific Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR>&lt;&lt; From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>on 12/1/01 10:44 pm, John Fox at jfox@verity.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; The wine and the cheese!<BR>&gt; OH.. I forgot, that is California<BR>&gt; Sorry!<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt; There may be a couple of decent cheeses produced in CA, but I<BR>suspect they'd be the ones that use foreign recipes. Are there any truly<BR>local fromage especiales?<BR>&nbsp; &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The Sonoma Cheese Factory in Sonoma, CA (in the square where the bear <BR>flag went up during the rebellion in 1846(?) BTW) makes an excellent Monterey <BR>Jack, which is a very nice, smooth, white cheese; one of my favorites after <BR>Jarlsberg.&nbsp; They also flavor it in nearly a dozen different varieties like <BR>pepper, garlic, and pesto (wonderful).&nbsp; I am currently working my way through <BR>a wedge of Habenero Jack that I bought up there when I visited my <BR>grandparents who live in Sonoma.&nbsp; That version is quite hot and a perfect <BR>late-night snack for a lunatic cast-iron stomached pepperhead like myself.<BR><BR>Rod Basler, COFIT<BR>(Finally got a job after being laid off...start on Monday - whoohoo!)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 01:09:12 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Sylea and Capital<BR><BR>Did Sylea change its name to Capital after the formation of the Third<BR>Imperium, or did they move the capital to a new world?&nbsp; I really have no<BR>idea.<BR><BR>Thanks,<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 01:09:14 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>&gt;From: "michael.scanlon" &lt;michael.scanlon@bmthonline.net&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;BTW, "Roger" as comm lingo (especially "Roger that!") is highly amusing<BR>&gt;&gt;if you know what "roger" *used* to mean (as in "Jolly Roger") &lt;eg&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Would someone like to put some light on the subject.<BR><BR>Female colonist to new female arrival about the local military governor:<BR>"Yes, he's quite the man.&nbsp; Rogered every girl in the colony, I'd wager."<BR><BR>New arrival (with cocked eyebrow):&nbsp; "_Every_ girl?"<BR><BR>(Points for first to identify the movie I've misquoted; extra credit for the<BR>correct lines.)<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 09:15:52 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR><BR>At 21:08 -0500 13/1/01,&nbsp; "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" <BR>&lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;Why does this conjure up images of groups of middle aged people sitting<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;in a circle saying "Hi, my name's Andrew and I'm a Traveller player, but I<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;haven't bought a supplement for 30 days"?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; 'Hi, my name's Dominic and I'm a Traveller player, but I haven't<BR>&gt; &gt; bought a supplement for 6 days. Unfortunately I slipped then and<BR>&gt; &gt; bought both the Beowulf Deckplans and GT:Ground Forces.'<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Maybe its time for online support, newsgroup alt.traveller.survivor or<BR>&gt;alt.traveller.recovery perhaps :*)<BR><BR>alt.traveller.addict?<BR><BR>Hmm, well, I resisted getting anything for Traveller this weekend <BR>(although my FLGS has the SOpM, Spinward Marches Campaign and a <BR>number of the other rarer books - fortunately I have them already). I <BR>only ended up with the new Blue Planet V2 RPG book 'First Colony', <BR>which looks (based on 45 pages so far) like it could well be used as <BR>a colony supplement for a GT:RoF based game.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 09:19:05 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Deck plans 2<BR><BR>At 21:08 -0500 13/1/01,&nbsp; shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson) wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; OOP, sadly, like the best Pudding Workshop products...<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Too pricy for most people. Mind you, I do have an armour company of<BR>&gt;Eldar for 40K, and a couple of regiments in the Epic scale :)<BR><BR>My FLGS has an unpunched copy of the very OOP GW game 'Apocalypse'. <BR>When someone enquired as to its high price tag (50 GBP) the owner <BR>responded 'Well, it's rare, and no more expensive than what they <BR>charge for a game now!'.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 09:27:08 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>At 21:08 -0500 13/1/01,&nbsp; "Trent Smith" &lt;trentfs@ix.netcom.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Just for completeness' sake:<BR>&gt;Missions of State (I never bought this, but apparently it's more-or-less the<BR>&gt;same as 'Anomalies' -- an anthology of adventures of widely-varying quality<BR>&gt;and canonicity)<BR><BR>There are two good adventures in this - _the Khiidkhar Incident_ <BR>(since reprinted by BITS in full unmangled version with deckplans, <BR>maps etc) and _Reverse Assimilation_ (Joseph Walsh, one of the CORE <BR>authors). The James Ward adventure is lousy, but not as bad as those <BR>he did in Annililik Run. The others have serious canon errors <BR>(Psionic FTL coms and jumps taking <A <BR Empire Pocket a and week,>almost as big as the 3I, all IIRC)<BR><BR>&gt;[that book of deck plans] (didn't buy this either; the idea was that these<BR>&gt;were deck-plan modules you could cut out and paste together as needed,<BR>&gt;except that they're in various inconsistent scales, and (as typical with T4)<BR>&gt;break with Traveller canon in several ways -- some people include this as<BR>&gt;one of the worst-of-the-worst)<BR><BR>Naval Architect's Manual - actually, most of this is quite usuable - <BR>the main flaws are the flavour text.<BR><BR>&gt;None of the T4 books are by any means essential, but the first set are all<BR>&gt;good for their specific topics, and the others are worth a look too, so long<BR>&gt;as you keep your expectations low and didn't pay too much.&nbsp; In general,<BR>&gt;though, you'd still be better off buying GT books, BITS products, or the CT<BR>&gt;reprints, no matter what rule-system you're playing with.<BR><BR>Agreed, generally. Especially the BITS bit ;-)<BR><BR>Dom (BITS Webmaster)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 01:35:34 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: re: A question about salvage<BR><BR>&gt;From: "Greenly, Jeff" &lt;greenlyj@rcbhsc.wvu.edu&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;I have a follow-up question: Are there any references to Salvage Law<BR>&gt;within the Imperium in the CT canon (the campaign will start in 1107)<BR>&gt;especially as it pertains to warships? I have been using International<BR>&gt;Maritime law as an example, wherin a vessel which has been wrested from<BR>[deletion]<BR>&gt;If a vessel crashed on<BR>&gt;a planet, and the planetary government claimed the wreckage for whatever<BR>&gt;reason, how do you think the "local" representatives of the Imperium might<BR>&gt;deal with it? How do you think the Imperium would deal with a planetary<BR>&gt;government which granted asylum to a mutinous crew? What if the world was<BR>&gt;not loyal to the Imperium?<BR><BR>I'm not aware of any references to salvage law in canon, but look at the<BR>archives of this list.&nbsp; It is a subject that gets discussed every few years.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 10:23:38 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>G:Voodoo is a good system.. I've been working on a magic system which<BR>involves psi powers (with appropriate limitations) and is based on Authentic<BR>Thaumaturgy, the Isaac Bonewits book. It's mostly stolen from that source<BR>and a Pyramid article and works quite well...it leaves magic less<BR>mechanistic. Still under development.<BR><BR>Dean <BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Ben Aaronovitch [mailto:bem@imaginaryfilms.demon.co.uk]<BR>&gt; Sent: 14 January 2001 02:49<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I love the magic system in G:Voodoo and you can use it (with <BR>&gt; modifications) for<BR>&gt; most African magic as well.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Ben Aaronovitch<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 'Let's be honest here - you paid for the women.'<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Bill Murrey - Scrooged<BR>&gt; ----- Original Message -----<BR>&gt; From: Douglas E. Berry &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt; To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, January 11, 2001 8:24 AM<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; One thing I've always wanted to try was a fantasy setting <BR>&gt; using the magic<BR>&gt; &gt; in G: Voodoo.&nbsp; No wizards sending fireballs around, but <BR>&gt; instead spirits and<BR>&gt; &gt; loa coming on deadly errands, and magic powders and potions <BR>&gt; for almost any<BR>&gt; &gt; occasion.<BR>&gt; &gt; --<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt; &gt; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 11:16 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: It's the Cheese (was: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab))<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;13.100dc394.2792a460@aol.com&gt;<BR>Greetings Rod.<BR><BR>Hoo-Yah!!! Good to hear you've found employment, well done :-)<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>PS Enjoy the cheese.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 05:44:10<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR><BR>At 05:53 PM 1/13/2001 +1300, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Maybe its time for online support, newsgroup alt.traveller.survivor<BR><BR>"We've stranded 16 Imperial citizens on a barren world.&nbsp; Here, they will<BR>compete for the Cr. 1,000,000 prize..."<BR><BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 05:47:30<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Waaay OT: Flashlight vs. Torch<BR><BR>At 11:16 AM 1/12/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;BTW, "Roger" as comm lingo (especially "Roger that!") is highly amusing<BR>&gt;if you know what "roger" *used* to mean (as in "Jolly Roger") &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>Sort of like taking Australians to a baseball game, and waiting for the<BR>seventh-inning stretch...<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 10:08:37 -0800<BR>From: "tsykoduk" &lt;tsykoduk@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: It's the Cheese (was: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab))<BR><BR>There are also a bunch of great restraunts (Che Peo in Sebastopol IIRC) in<BR>the area...<BR><BR>(Rasied just north of the Valley of the Moon - and, yes, that does explain a<BR>lot about me...)<BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The Sonoma Cheese Factory in Sonoma, CA (in the square where the bear<BR>flag went up during the rebellion in 1846(?) BTW) makes an excellent<BR>Monterey<BR>Jack, which is a very nice, smooth, white cheese; one of my favorites after<BR>Jarlsberg.&nbsp; They also flavor it in nearly a dozen different varieties like<BR>pepper, garlic, and pesto (wonderful).&nbsp; I am currently working my way<BR>through<BR>a wedge of Habenero Jack that I bought up there when I visited my<BR>grandparents who live in Sonoma.&nbsp; That version is quite hot and a perfect<BR>late-night snack for a lunatic cast-iron stomached pepperhead like myself.<BR><BR>Rod Basler, COFIT<BR>(Finally got a job after being laid off...start on Monday - whoohoo!)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 12:24:38 -0600<BR>From: Jimmy Simpson &lt;nimrodd@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Sylea and Capital<BR><BR>At 01:09 AM 1/14/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Did Sylea change its name to Capital after the formation of the Third<BR>&gt;Imperium, or did they move the capital to a new world?&nbsp; I really have no<BR>&gt;idea.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Thanks,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;--Glenn<BR><BR>I think that T4 said that Cleon changed the name from Sylea to Capital when <BR>he proclaimed the Third Imperium.&nbsp; This is without digging out my books.<BR><BR>Jimmy Simpson<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; nimrodd@mail.com<BR><BR>"The avalanche has already started.<BR>It is too late for the pebbles to vote."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Kosh Naranek (Babylon 5)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 18:26:57 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A question about salvage<BR><BR>The majority of the list is from Anglo-American law based countries ie US, <BR>Canada, England and NZ. I believe that most discussions of OTU salvage law <BR>and TU law in general is based around Anglo_American law. You probably could <BR>try a search engine and type in law of salvage. I know there are a few sites <BR>out there. You could use any examples of the British Navy or American Navy <BR>for Imperial Armed Forces...Just my humble two cents:-)<BR><BR>Mike<BR><BR><BR>&gt;From: "Greenly, Jeff" &lt;greenlyj@rcbhsc.wvu.edu&gt;<BR>&gt;Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;To: "'traveller@lists.ient.com'" &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: A question about salvage<BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 02:00:51 -0500<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;First, to those who replied to my questions and comments about mutiny in <BR>&gt;the<BR>&gt;Imperium, thanks a lot. I found most of your replies useful and insightful,<BR>&gt;and the references provided turned me on to a lot of other things that I <BR>&gt;can<BR>&gt;use. I have a follow-up question: Are there any references to Salvage Law<BR>&gt;within the Imperium in the CT canon (the campaign will start in 1107)<BR>&gt;especially as it pertains to warships? I have been using International<BR>&gt;Maritime law as an example, wherin a vessel which has been wrested from<BR>&gt;constituted authority through mutiny or barratry is still the property of<BR>&gt;the state of registry regardless of that vessel's condition. On the face of<BR>&gt;it, that would be the logical Imperial position, but I keep stumbling over<BR>&gt;the idea of planetary soverignty within the Imperium. If a vessel crashed <BR>&gt;on<BR>&gt;a planet, and the planetary government claimed the wreckage for whatever<BR>&gt;reason, how do you think the "local" representatives of the Imperium might<BR>&gt;deal with it? How do you think the Imperium would deal with a planetary<BR>&gt;government which granted asylum to a mutinous crew? What if the world was<BR>&gt;not loyal to the Imperium?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;JD<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Note: Mr. Trevor, the campaign I am working on begins in 1107, so the<BR>&gt;Rebellious Era in MT really doesn't apply. To be quite honest, IMTU the MT<BR>&gt;storyline simply wouldn't work. I am sorry I didn't specify the milieu I <BR>&gt;was<BR>&gt;referring to in my first post.<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 13:40:20 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: A question about salvage<BR><BR>My understanding that salvage laws on Earth, are based on Admiralty Law,<BR>which is somewhat universal, and as pointed out by Michael McKeown, based on<BR>Anglo-American Law. Admiralty Courts generally assume that all rulings of<BR>all Courts Admiralty apply to all cases more or less equally. Of course,<BR>there are hundreds of contradicting rulings, forms and standards and other<BR>fine points that would be lost on even the most astute armchair courtroom<BR>observer. Basically the Judge Advocate is the final arbiter of Admiralty<BR>Law. Appeals, while common, are rarely transferred to a different court. The<BR>powers given to the U.S. Admiralty Court are startling, even more so in the<BR>U.K. These courts are Policeman, Judge and Jury all in one, and only rarely<BR>does more than one Judge Advocate sit to hear a given case.<BR><BR>Some of the court rulings I've read are quite blunt, lacking in legal prose<BR>and script: I get the impression the Judges Advocates are more from Merchant<BR>Marine backgrounds (with one hell of a force of law to back them up) than<BR>Lawyers (Probably Law being a minor course of study). Admiralty Courts move<BR>slowly, sometimes taking years to be seated to hear a preliminary motion for<BR>action. Some cases: Murder, Theft, and Assault are acted on swiftly. Most<BR>personal crimes, Murder, Theft, and similar cases are usually given to a<BR>ship's port of registry for consideration by local law enforcement<BR>authorities, though not always. Cruise Ships as an example, usually are<BR>assigned jurisdiction to their "home" port, not their port of registry. In<BR>the U.S., most cases involving felonies at sea that are deferred to the<BR>local authorities end up being heard in Federal Court.<BR><BR>U.S. Judge Advocates in Admiralty Court have all of the powers of a superior<BR>court judge, in addition to their maritime jurisdiction and powers.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Matt Helton<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Michael McKeown<BR>Sent: Sunday, January 14, 2001 6:27 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: A question about salvage<BR><BR>The majority of the list is from Anglo-American law based countries ie US,<BR>Canada, England and NZ. I believe that most discussions of OTU salvage law<BR>and TU law in general is based around Anglo_American law. You probably could<BR>try a search engine and type in law of salvage. I know there are a few sites<BR>out there. You could use any examples of the British Navy or American Navy<BR>for Imperial Armed Forces...Just my humble two cents:-)<BR><BR>Mike<BR><BR><BR>&gt;From: "Greenly, Jeff" &lt;greenlyj@rcbhsc.wvu.edu&gt;<BR>&gt;Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;To: "'traveller@lists.ient.com'" &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: A question about salvage<BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 02:00:51 -0500<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;First, to those who replied to my questions and comments about mutiny in<BR>&gt;the<BR>&gt;Imperium, thanks a lot. I found most of your replies useful and insightful,<BR>&gt;and the references provided turned me on to a lot of other things that I<BR>&gt;can<BR>&gt;use. I have a follow-up question: Are there any references to Salvage Law<BR>&gt;within the Imperium in the CT canon (the campaign will start in 1107)<BR>&gt;especially as it pertains to warships? I have been using International<BR>&gt;Maritime law as an example, wherin a vessel which has been wrested from<BR>&gt;constituted authority through mutiny or barratry is still the property of<BR>&gt;the state of registry regardless of that vessel's condition. On the face of<BR>&gt;it, that would be the logical Imperial position, but I keep stumbling over<BR>&gt;the idea of planetary soverignty within the Imperium. If a vessel crashed<BR>&gt;on<BR>&gt;a planet, and the planetary government claimed the wreckage for whatever<BR>&gt;reason, how do you think the "local" representatives of the Imperium might<BR>&gt;deal with it? How do you think the Imperium would deal with a planetary<BR>&gt;government which granted asylum to a mutinous crew? What if the world was<BR>&gt;not loyal to the Imperium?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;JD<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Note: Mr. Trevor, the campaign I am working on begins in 1107, so the<BR>&gt;Rebellious Era in MT really doesn't apply. To be quite honest, IMTU the MT<BR>&gt;storyline simply wouldn't work. I am sorry I didn't specify the milieu I<BR>&gt;was<BR>&gt;referring to in my first post.<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 16:50:26 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3520<BR><BR>Frank Pitt writes:<BR><BR>&gt; Do you want me to send you the .png ?<BR><BR>Not necessary, but thanks anyway. We'll have an artist draw new ones when the <BR>time comes.<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 16:59:11 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3521<BR><BR>In a message dated 13-Jan-01 8:10:35 PM Central Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; Traveller:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; Sir!&nbsp; They're flashing a smiley face at us.&nbsp; Do you think they're<BR>&gt;&nbsp; friendly?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; No.&nbsp; The smiley face is the ancient Vilani symbol for "no quarter." <BR>&gt;&nbsp; Sound battlestations.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 23:27:30 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>on 13/1/01 4:46 am, Douglas E. Berry at gridlore@pop.mindspring.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Monterey Jack<BR><BR>Oh yeah, that would be Californian. :)<BR><BR>&gt; And I'm bringing some California wine and sourdough bread with me to<BR>&gt; GenConUK.&nbsp; But if you don't want any...<BR><BR>As a Scotsman, it would be remiss of me to refuse a free drink. However, if<BR>I'm in the country come GenConUK (when is it?) I'll bring some really<BR>special wine for you to sample.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 01:37:22 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Traveller survivor (was: FS penguin)<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>&gt; "We've stranded 16 Imperial citizens on a barren world.&nbsp; Here, they will<BR>&gt; compete for the Cr. 1,000,000 prize..."<BR><BR>Works great as a cover-up story for a crash...&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 20:19:52 -0500<BR>From: "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Introduction<BR><BR>Hi all,<BR><BR>I am new to RPGs. Though I'm primarily a historical miniatures gamer, I have<BR>been curious about Traveller since I saw it at a local game store back at in<BR>'80s.<BR><BR>Well, I was cruising around the net...ok, I was on Steve Jackson's site<BR>ordering Ogre miniatures and board games...and I stumbled upon GURPS<BR>Traveller.<BR><BR>That lead me to do some snooping around and I just got more and more<BR>interested. Well, up and go to the local game store (the only one in Macon,<BR>GA) and find, not GURPS, but the new reprint of the first nine books of<BR>Classic Traveller. It went home me...<BR><BR>I haven't read enough yet to ask questions, but be assured they are coming.<BR>I hope you all will bear with me as I struggle to comprehend this game in a<BR>gaming vacuum.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 21:31:29 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: GRIP<BR><BR>Generic Role-Playing for Internet Players.<BR><BR>There is a generic &amp; Traveller specific version.<BR><BR>Has anyone tried it?<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>www.urbin.net/EWW/ -- These opinions are mine, no one else wants `em.<BR>"Driving a Hudson Hornet on the disinformation triple bypass: cruising for<BR>burgers &amp; garage sales. Hooks baited, lines entangled, roadkill cooked"<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3522<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yd05.mx.aol.com (rly-yd05.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.5]) by air-yd02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 21:34:35 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yd05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 21:34:03 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id VAA09500;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 21:33:18 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sun, 14 Jan 2001 21:32:01 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id VAA09446<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 21:32:01 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 21:32:01 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101150232.VAA09446@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3522<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></A></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3523</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/15/01 5:38:31 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Monday, January 15 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3523<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: GRIP<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>Interesting Holiday<BR>Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR>Morale<BR>Re: Introduction<BR>re: Traveller Support Groups <BR>RE: A question about salvage<BR>Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>Imperial Bureaucracy<BR>Traveller survivors<BR>RE: GT Cardboard Heros<BR>Re: Sylea and Capital<BR>Re: A question about salvage<BR>Re: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>Re: Traveller survivors<BR>Re: Morale<BR>RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>Re: Introduction<BR>RE: A question about salvage<BR>RE: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR>Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 18:36:35 -0800<BR>From: "Brian Jenkins" &lt;brianjenk@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GRIP<BR><BR>I have quite a few times for both Traveller and other games.&nbsp; It is an<BR>excellent program for online play.&nbsp; I have the traveller specific version<BR>and I like it quite a bit.<BR><BR>Brian<BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Sunday, January 14, 2001 6:31 PM<BR>Subject: GRIP<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Generic Role-Playing for Internet Players.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; There is a generic &amp; Traveller specific version.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Has anyone tried it?<BR>&gt; --------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>- -<BR>&gt; www.urbin.net/EWW/ -- These opinions are mine, no one else wants `em.<BR>&gt; "Driving a Hudson Hornet on the disinformation triple bypass: cruising for<BR>&gt; burgers &amp; garage sales. Hooks baited, lines entangled, roadkill cooked"<BR>&gt; --------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>- -<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 19:05:27<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>At 11:27 PM 1/14/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; And I'm bringing some California wine and sourdough bread with me to<BR>&gt;&gt; GenConUK.&nbsp; But if you don't want any...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;As a Scotsman, it would be remiss of me to refuse a free drink. However, if<BR>&gt;I'm in the country come GenConUK (when is it?) I'll bring some really<BR>&gt;special wine for you to sample.<BR><BR>Hmm. better make this announcement early.<BR><BR>To all the fine UK folks who have offered me everything from a drink to an<BR>"unendeding pub crawl" during my stay, I have to tell you this: I take a<BR>heavy dose of Dilantin to control seizures.&nbsp; So I can't drink more than a<BR>glass of wine with dinner.&nbsp; I'm always willing to *sample* drinks, but I<BR>really have to watch it.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 22:25:20 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Interesting Holiday<BR><BR>While looking into some things for GT: Nobles, I came across this quote in J <BR>&amp; F Gies' _Life in a Medieval Castle_:<BR><BR>"The Rogation Days, the Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday before Ascension (the <BR>fortieth day after Easter), weve celebrated in the countryside under the name <BR>of Gangdays. The people of the villages went "a-ganging" &lt;deletions&gt; Small <BR>boys were ducked in brooks and ponds and their buttocks bumped against trees <BR>and rocks to help them memorize the village bounds."<BR><BR>The holiday where the village elders drag the young punks around and throw <BR>them in ponds . . . we could use more holidays like that!<BR><BR>OB Trav: If I'd made something like this up, I would have been chased from <BR>the podium and pelted with rotten fruit.<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 22:27:45 -0500<BR>From: "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 09:15:52 +0000<BR>&gt;From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: re: Traveller Support Groups (was: Famille Spofulam "Penguin")<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;At 21:08 -0500 13/1/01,&nbsp; "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance"<BR>&gt;&lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;Why does this conjure up images of groups of middle aged people sitting<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;in a circle saying "Hi, my name's Andrew and I'm a Traveller player, <BR>&gt; but I<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;haven't bought a supplement for 30 days"?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; 'Hi, my name's Dominic and I'm a Traveller player, but I haven't<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; bought a supplement for 6 days. Unfortunately I slipped then and<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; bought both the Beowulf Deckplans and GT:Ground Forces.'<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Maybe its time for online support, newsgroup alt.traveller.survivor or<BR>&gt; &gt;alt.traveller.recovery perhaps :*)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;alt.traveller.addict?<BR><BR>NEXT SEASON, on SURVIVOR!<BR><BR>"Well, Bob, the Spinward Marchers have just voted out another person last <BR>night.&nbsp; The group spokesperson said that the guy was insisting too much <BR>that Norris's warrant was on the Kinunir, so they had to get rid of him.<BR><BR>"Meanwhile, the SolRimmers -- they're trying to change their name, by the <BR>way, and when I asked them why, they only told me to 'ask a Sayat' -- <BR>haven't voted out anyone yet, but they are very big on policing <BR>themselves.&nbsp; It looks like this could be a very close match, Bob.&nbsp; Which <BR>group will survive on a desert island with nothing but food, water, and a <BR>direct daily feed to the Traveller Mailing List?&nbsp; Next on SURVIVOR!"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 19:44:44 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Morale<BR><BR>Morale<BR><BR>Thought and opinions solicited:<BR><BR>Morale levels<BR><BR>Morale is used to determine the reaction of NPCs to events like attacks,<BR>minefields, surprises etc. Troops do not always do what their leaders might<BR>desire. When troops encounter a difficult situation, are attacked or<BR>surprised, they must check morale. Generally one of 2 things will happen:<BR>The NPCs will make their morale check and continue their current activity,<BR>or the will break (fail their morale). Units failing there moral may cease<BR>acting, surrender or route. Player characters need not make morale checks.<BR>They will decide individually what to do in difficult situations.<BR><BR><BR>NPCs have a morale and rally value associated with their quality of training<BR>and experience. The morale roll is the base roll required to 'check'.<BR>Rolling the morale or higher means the unit has successfully checked. The<BR>rally value is the roll required to regroup a unit that has failed its<BR>morale. This roll is made by the units leader, and the leader adds his level<BR>of Leader skill to the rally roll. If the unit leader's skill is such that<BR>he cannot fail to make a rally, that unit need not check morale<BR><BR>Type&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Morale&nbsp; Rally&nbsp;&nbsp; Notes<BR><BR>Fanatic&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 2+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Berserkers, religious fanatics, Le Legion.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fanatics will never route or surrender.<BR><BR>Elite&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 3+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 3+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; High morale specialist or shock troops<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (e.g.Imperial Marine Commandoes)<BR><BR>Crack&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 4+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Seasoned veteran troops (e.g. Imperial Marines)<BR><BR>Veteran&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 5+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 6+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Troops who have combat experience<BR><BR>Trained&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 6+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 8+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Troops who have received extensive training,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; but have no battle experience.<BR><BR>Green&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 7+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 10+&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Basic trainees. Little more than basic<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; military training.<BR><BR>Raw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 8+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 12+&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Farmboy with rifle.<BR><BR>Checking Morale<BR>Units must check morale under the following circumstances:<BR><BR>1.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit is surprised/ambushed.<BR>2.&nbsp; &nbsp; Leader is killed or seriously wounded<BR>3.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit in site of another unit routing.<BR>4.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit reaches 25% casualties (add 1 to morale roll)<BR>5.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit reaches 50% casualties (add 3 to morale roll)<BR>6.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit reaches 75% casualties (add 5 to morale roll)<BR><BR>Units failing their moral will do one of the following:<BR><BR>1.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit fails its morale. Cease all offensive action. The unit 'hunkers<BR>down' and adopts a defensive posture. Unit may not attack unless rallied.<BR>2.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit fails its moral by 3. Retreat in good order. The unit withdrawls<BR>to a secure location unless rallied.<BR>3.&nbsp; &nbsp; Unit fails it's moral by 5. Route/Surrender. Units that are trapped<BR>will surrender. Units with an escape path will route (i.e. assume headlong<BR>flight, often discarding weapons and equipment) unless rallied. Elite and<BR>Crack troops will never route.<BR><BR>Rallying<BR>In order to rally troops that have failed morale, the unit must have a<BR>surviving leader (at least leader-1). The rally roll is 2D6 + leader.<BR>Rallied troops improve their status by one level. Routed troops make and<BR>orderly withdraw, retreating troops adopt a defensive posture and defensive<BR>troops will attack.<BR><BR>Note:<BR>The GM may allow high levels of leader or high rally rolls to allow troops<BR>to jump several levels (e.g. routed troops turn and attack). The GM may also<BR>require morale roles when troops are given difficult or dangerous orders<BR>("the regiments will charge accross that mine field and attack the dug in<BR>machineguns and artillery") or are perceived to be lead by uncaring or<BR>incompetent commanders.<BR><BR><BR>Thanks for the input,<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>- --<BR>When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend"<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 22:56:12 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Introduction<BR><BR>A hearty welcome to you! The more the merrier, both for Traveller players<BR>and questions about our favorite pastime :-)<BR><BR>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~&lt;&gt;&lt;~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>Colin Michael, webmaster@downport.com<BR>www.Downport.com - "The Traveller Domain"<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>&gt; I am new to RPGs. Though I'm primarily a historical miniatures gamer, I<BR>have<BR>&gt; been curious about Traveller since I saw it at a local game store back at<BR>in<BR>&gt; '80s.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Well, I was cruising around the net...ok, I was on Steve Jackson's site<BR>&gt; ordering Ogre miniatures and board games...and I stumbled upon GURPS<BR>&gt; Traveller.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; That lead me to do some snooping around and I just got more and more<BR>&gt; interested. Well, up and go to the local game store (the only one in<BR>Macon,<BR>&gt; GA) and find, not GURPS, but the new reprint of the first nine books of<BR>&gt; Classic Traveller. It went home me...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I haven't read enough yet to ask questions, but be assured they are<BR>coming.<BR>&gt; I hope you all will bear with me as I struggle to comprehend this game in<BR>a<BR>&gt; gaming vacuum.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 23:22:16 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Traveller Support Groups <BR><BR>My name is Mark, and I'm a Traveller Player.<BR>It's been 7 hours since I bought a Traveller product.<BR><BR>GM Screen &amp; Free Trader deckplans.&nbsp; Plus a copy of GURPS:Steampunk &amp; GRIPS.<BR>I should have spent the extra $15 for the Traveller version.&nbsp; The original <BR>three books as Windows Help files would have been worth it.<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>urbin@bigfoot.com -- These opinions are mine, no one else wants `em.<BR>"Blend 'B', meanwhile, is a PROUD blend, defiant yet petulant...a blend<BR>that grabs you, shakes you by the collar and cries, 'ACCEPT me, damn you,<BR>or turn me away-BUT FOR GOD'S SAKE DON'T POLLUTE ME WITH NON-DAIRY<BR>CREAMER!'" - Tripp Biscuit while coffee tasting.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 23:58:15 -0500<BR>From: Leigh Smith &lt;tenryuu@erols.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: A question about salvage<BR><BR>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR>- --------------11D8B45E0D91FC2D1C2B005C<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR>One place that has a very interesting take on the whole concept of<BR>maritime salvage (especially in connection to mutiny) is the web site<BR>concerning the Amistad case<BR>(http://amistad.mysticseaport.org/main/welcome.html).&nbsp; There are also<BR>sites that speak to maritime law (i.e.,<BR>http://www.wld.com/conbus/weal/wadmiral.htm and<BR>http://www.qis.net/chinalaw/prclaw28.htm - especially nice since it's<BR>based on the maritime law of the People's Republic of China).<BR><BR>&gt; My understanding that salvage laws on Earth, are based on Admiralty Law,<BR>&gt; which is somewhat universal, and as pointed out by Michael McKeown, based on<BR>&gt; Anglo-American Law. Admiralty Courts generally assume that all rulings of<BR>&gt; all Courts Admiralty apply to all cases more or less equally.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR><BR><BR>- --------------11D8B45E0D91FC2D1C2B005C<BR>Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii;<BR>name="tenryuu.vcf"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR>Content-Description: Card for Leigh Smith<BR>Content-Disposition: attachment;<BR>filename="tenryuu.vcf"<BR><BR>begin:vcard <BR>n:Smith;Leigh<BR>tel;home:703-569-4253<BR>tel;work:703-886-7798<BR>x-mozilla-html:FALSE<BR>adr:;;9242 Sprucewood Road;Burke;VA;22015-3561;USA<BR>version:2.1<BR>email;internet:tenryuu@erols.com<BR>title:Oracle Developer &amp; DBA Extraordinaire<BR>fn:Leigh Smith<BR>end:vcard<BR><BR>- --------------11D8B45E0D91FC2D1C2B005C--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 00:24:53 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>I _know_ I (used to) have an email address for him.&nbsp; I need one.&nbsp; Can<BR>someone give me a pointer?<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 00:50:58 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: Dalton Spence &lt;dalton.spence@hwcn.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR><BR>Is there any formal definition of the bureaucratic structure of the<BR>Third Imperium from the ministry level on down? The four ministries<BR>I can think of offhand are Commerce, Defense*, Finance and Justice,<BR>with the Imperial Interstellar Scout Service existing outside this<BR>hierarchy. (*The MoD consists of "the Imperial Navy, the Unified<BR>Armies of the Imperium, and the Imperial Marine Force." [GT:GF p.5])<BR><BR>While I don't expect the complete AAB version, a point form digest<BR>(five or six levels deep) would be useful in generating realistic<BR>titles for minor bureaucrats (eg. "Junior Assistant Superintendent<BR>of Ship Services [Certification office], Mora Imperial Downport").<BR><BR>Example (collected from GT: Starports)<BR><BR>Ministry of Commerce<BR>...<BR>*&nbsp; Starport Authority<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; +&nbsp; Administration Department<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Executive<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Line Office<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Concessions<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; o&nbsp; Amenity Services<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; o&nbsp; Business Space<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Legal<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Financial<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Personnel<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Labor Relations<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Records and Data Processing<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Public Relations<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Commercial Liason<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Military Liason<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Employee Residence<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Contracting<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; +&nbsp; Traffic Department<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Traffic Control<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Ship Registrar<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Vehicular Control<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; +&nbsp; Ship Services Department<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Berthing<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Fueling<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Stores and Provisioning<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Maintenance and Engineering<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Housekeeping<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Certification<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Hiring Hall<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; +&nbsp; Cargo Department<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Freight Handling<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Warehousing<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; HAZMAT Storage<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Brokerage Office<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Special Handling Unit<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; +&nbsp; Passenger Services Department<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Hospitality<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Hotel Accommodations<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Passenger Assitance<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Baggage<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Passenger Transport<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; +&nbsp; Security Department<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Tactical Teams<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Imperial Customs Service (part of the Revenue dept.)<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; +&nbsp; Medical Department<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; +&nbsp; Emergency Services<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Emergency Operations Center<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Crash, Fire and Rescue<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; +&nbsp; Flight Operations<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; +&nbsp; Physical Plant<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Engineering<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Power<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Data/Communications<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Transport<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Central Stores<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Commissary<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Housekeeping<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; +&nbsp; Facilities Department (Sector Level Only)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Survey and Siting<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -&nbsp; Civil Engineering<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; +&nbsp; Office of the Inspectorate-General (Directorate Level Only)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; @==================================================@<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Dalton S. Spence, B.Sc. &lt;dalton.spence@hwcn.org&gt; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Home Page: http://www.hwcn.org/~ag775/home.html&nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Family Motto: Virtute Acquiritur Honos&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |&nbsp; &nbsp; "Trade is the lifeblood of the Imperium."&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; Cleon I, First Emperor of the Third Imperium&nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |&nbsp; Tom Clancy helps Jimmy Carter and my cannibal.&nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; FNORD!&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; @==================================================@<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 08:28:19 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Traveller survivors<BR><BR>On Sun, 14 Jan 2001, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>&gt; At 05:53 PM 1/13/2001 +1300, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Maybe its time for online support, newsgroup alt.traveller.survivor<BR>&gt; "We've stranded 16 Imperial citizens on a barren world.&nbsp; Here, they will<BR>&gt; compete for the Cr. 1,000,000 prize..."<BR><BR>Hm, this sounds like a good idea to use in a Traveller live action game...<BR><BR>Maybe after I get my plans for the previous Traveller live done...<BR>(Anybody have any ideas how to prop a Hiver, preferably with player<BR>inside? We thought that cows would make good K'Kree...)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 17:22:57 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: RE: GT Cardboard Heros<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Loren, I have an original sheet of Imperial marines that came up pretty<BR>good<BR>&gt;&gt;on the scanner.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;I have uncut sheets of all 3 Traveller Cardboard Hero sets.<BR><BR>A year or two ago, a few of us sent scans of all the Cardboard Heroes to<BR>Keith - so SJG should already have electronic copies...<BR><BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 17:23:32 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: Sylea and Capital<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>&gt;Did Sylea change its name to Capital after the formation of the Third<BR>&gt;Imperium, or did they move the capital to a new world?<BR><BR>Sylea and Capital are one and the same. However, last time this question<BR>was asked on the TML, no-one could come up with a date. My assumption was<BR>that it changed in Year 0, but most people in M0 still call it "Sylea"<BR>(like Palestine is "Palestine", not "Occupied Palestinian Territories").<BR><BR>I assume the changeover is like the Long Night, a thing the designers knew<BR>occurred but never bothered to explicitly spell out (the LN, forex, doesn't<BR>have its own Lib Data reference, it's only mentioned obliquely by _other_<BR>Lib Data entries).<BR><BR>Maybe someone should ask Loren or Marc? And put their reply into the FAQ?<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 17:23:48 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: A question about salvage<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>&gt;a planet, and the planetary government claimed the wreckage for whatever<BR>&gt;reason, how do you think the "local" representatives of the Imperium might<BR>&gt;deal with it? How do you think the Imperium would deal with a planetary<BR>&gt;government which granted asylum to a mutinous crew? What if the world was<BR>&gt;not loyal to the Imperium?<BR><BR>I think Jeff's after a simple in-game response.<BR><BR>I'd say that if the planet is Imperial, then most military defence has been<BR>ceded to the empire and thus the Imperial forces. Remember that the<BR>planetary forces are considered to be second-line Imperial forces, anyway<BR>(see the 5FW board game). Thus the Imperium would *expect* the ship - or at<BR>least, the pieces - to be returned to the Navy. Same with the mutineers -<BR>if necessary, the Imperium would bring pressure to bear on the world. After<BR>all, mutiny is a high justice crime (it's a form of treason).<BR><BR>If the world is not Imperial, all bets are off. Anyone remember the MiG<BR>pilot who defected by landing at Tokyo International airport? The plane<BR>went to the States, where it was pulled apart and analysed. When the USSR<BR>requested it be returned, the plane was shipped back to them... in boxes.<BR>_Many_ boxes. I don't think the Sovs were too amused...<BR><BR>The Imperium may resort to destroying the vessel via meson ortillery -<BR>assuming they can find it. Hey, here's a job for those intrepid adventurers<BR>- - _hide_ the ship from Imperial sensors and spies (if they are hired by the<BR>planet), or _find_ the ship so it can be neutralised (if hired by the<BR>Impies).<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 11:04:00 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt; I _know_ I (used to) have an email address for him.&nbsp; I need one.&nbsp; Can<BR>&gt; someone give me a pointer?<BR><BR>jdegraff@pacbell.net<BR><BR>Note: This is from an old post.&nbsp;He might have changed address since<BR>then.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 21:16:22 +1100<BR>From: Robert Houghton &lt;rhoughto@one.net.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller survivors<BR><BR>"Mikko V. I. Parviainen" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; On Sun, 14 Jan 2001, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; At 05:53 PM 1/13/2001 +1300, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;Maybe its time for online support, newsgroup alt.traveller.survivor<BR>&gt; &gt; "We've stranded 16 Imperial citizens on a barren world.&nbsp; Here, they will<BR>&gt; &gt; compete for the Cr. 1,000,000 prize..."<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hm, this sounds like a good idea to use in a Traveller live action game...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Maybe after I get my plans for the previous Traveller live done...<BR>&gt; (Anybody have any ideas how to prop a Hiver, preferably with player<BR>&gt; inside? We thought that cows would make good K'Kree...)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>This has probably been asked before...but do Ithklur get intoxicated and go<BR>K'kree tipping?<BR><BR>Other rob<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 10:06:45 GMT<BR>From: TML@stempest.demon.co.uk (Stephen Tempest)<BR>Subject: Re: Morale<BR><BR>Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt; writes:<BR><BR><BR>&gt;Fanatic&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 2+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Berserkers, religious fanatics, Le Legion.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fanatics will never route or surrender.<BR><BR>How about giving them a worse morale, but if they fail, instead of<BR>routing they charge directly towards the nearest enemy, ignoring cover<BR>and expending all possible ammunition?<BR><BR>Stephen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 12:35:52 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>Jesse seems to have changed jobs...he's now at jedegraf@cisco.com . Congrats<BR>on the new job, Jesse (Pacific Bell to cisco, right?). Any chance of a free<BR>router? :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm [mailto:jenry023@student.liu.se]<BR>&gt; Sent: 15 January 2001 10:04<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; I _know_ I (used to) have an email address for him.&nbsp; I need <BR>&gt; one.&nbsp; Can<BR>&gt; &gt; someone give me a pointer?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; jdegraff@pacbell.net<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Note: This is from an old post.&nbsp;He might have changed address since<BR>&gt; then.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; * Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>&gt; | jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>&gt; | ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>&gt; * http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 13:04:28 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Introduction<BR><BR>welcome to the list..Its a great place to get Traveller info and join in the <BR>rants on female barbeque loving, comfortable shoe wearing Aslan ship <BR>borrowing techocrats :-)<BR><BR>Mike<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 13:06:36 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: A question about salvage<BR><BR>Jeff Greenly wrote:<BR>&gt; Note: Mr. Trevor, the campaign I am working on begins in 1107,<BR>&gt; so the Rebellious Era in MT really doesn't apply. To be quite<BR>&gt; honest, IMTU the MT storyline simply wouldn't work. I am sorry<BR>&gt; I didn't specify the milieu I was referring to in my first post. <BR><BR>No problem.&nbsp; My original reply was just a throw-away line&nbsp; but&nbsp; I<BR>guess I got a bit carried away.&nbsp; Actually MTU is set around&nbsp; 1107<BR>too, but your original question asked about 'canon' which I&nbsp; take<BR>to mean all milieus (including the varient GT).&nbsp; While I use&nbsp; the<BR>MT ruleset I also have some issues with the MT storyline.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 13:20:23 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR><BR>Dalton Spence wrote:<BR>&gt; Is there any formal definition of the bureaucratic structure<BR>&gt; of the Third Imperium from the ministry level on down? The<BR>&gt; four ministries I can think of offhand are Commerce, Defense*,<BR>&gt; Finance and Justice, with the Imperial Interstellar Scout<BR>&gt; Service existing outside this hierarchy. (*The MoD consists<BR>&gt; of "the Imperial Navy, the Unified Armies of the Imperium,<BR>&gt; and the Imperial Marine Force." [GT:GF p.5])<BR><BR>The Special Branch of the Minitry&nbsp; of&nbsp; Justice&nbsp; was&nbsp; detailed&nbsp; in<BR>FASA's High Guard magazine.<BR><BR>And there was a reference in (IIRC) GDW's Adventure&nbsp; 1&nbsp; (Kinunir)<BR>to a Ministry of Colonization.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 14:28:24 +0100<BR>From: Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR><BR>On Monday, January 15, 2001, 6:50:58 AM, the following was written:<BR><BR>DS&gt; Ministry of Commerce<BR>DS&gt; ...<BR>You forgot the Department of Redundancy, Dept.&nbsp; They are the ones<BR>who get the extra two forms whenever something has to be filled<BR>out in triplicate (i.e. everything).<BR><BR>Hmm, everybody is always forgetting them. Must be some kid of a<BR>conspiracy.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3523<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yh04.mx.aol.com (rly-yh04.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.36]) by air-yh04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Mon, 15 Jan 2001 08:38:30 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yh04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Mon, 15 Jan 2001 08:37:56 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id IAA32958;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 15 Jan 2001 08:36:42 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 15 Jan 2001 08:36:25 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id IAA32924<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 15 Jan 2001 08:36:25 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 08:36:25 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101151336.IAA32924@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3523<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3524</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/15/01 1:11:08 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Monday, January 15 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3524<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>I'm Confused<BR>Pre-Bar-B-Q Sport<BR>RE: I'm Confused<BR>RE: I'm Confused<BR>Re: Morale<BR>Solitaire?<BR>Re: Pre-Bar-B-Q Sport<BR>RE: I'm Confused<BR>RE: Jolly Roger<BR>RE: Jolly Roger<BR>RE: Solitaire?<BR>RE: I'm Confused<BR>RE: Introduction<BR>RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>Re: Jolly Roger<BR>Hello All<BR>Re: Solitaire?<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>Re: Interesting Holiday<BR>Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR>Re: Introduction<BR>Re: Solitaire?<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 09:29:08 -0500<BR>From: "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>Subject: I'm Confused<BR><BR>Although I recently bought the Classic Traveller reprints, I'm still<BR>somewhat confused about the various versions. What's more, judging by web<BR>presence, that popularity seems fairly well split between Classic Traveller<BR>and GURPS Traveller. What T4 is, I have no idea. There are some other little<BR>things like confusion over whether the BITS books are Classic or GURPS<BR>compatible (or both).<BR><BR>I have also been searching for Traveller miniatures. With the resurgence of<BR>Traveller and the re-issue of Striker soon, that the 15mm miniatures would<BR>be in demand. Does Marc Miller retain the molds or masters for these<BR>figures?<BR><BR>I know that these are simplistic questions. Please put up with me as I learn<BR>the game and try to catch up.<BR><BR>P.S.<BR>I downloaded GRIP last night. It runs kinda' slow. I suspect that VB was the<BR>language of choice. Still, what it does is impressive. The question is<BR>whether GRIP actually is used much in the RPG community.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 10:28:32 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Pre-Bar-B-Q Sport<BR><BR>&gt;This has probably been asked before...but do Ithklur get intoxicated and go<BR>&gt;K'kree tipping?<BR><BR>When ever possible.<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>urbin@bigfoot.com -- These opinions are mine, no one else wants `em.<BR>Vikings? There ain't no vikings here. Just us honest farmers. The town was<BR>burning, the villagers were dead. They didn't need those sheep anyway.<BR>That's our story and we're sticking to it.&nbsp; http://www.bigfoott.com/~urbin/<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 15:29:40 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: I'm Confused<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Although I recently bought the Classic Traveller reprints,<BR><BR>Kinda cool, aren't they? :)<BR><BR>I'm still<BR>&gt; somewhat confused about the various versions. <BR><BR>All opinions are IMO.<BR>OK. Classic Traveller, CT, was the original verson and is set in<BR>1105-1120ish. MegaTraveller, MT, is the second and is set after CT,<BR>following the assassination of the Emperor and the breakdown of the Imperium<BR>into civil war. Nice chargen system and plays fairly well ( I got mine from<BR>the BITS stand at this years DragonCon UK. Recommended for anyone that<BR>missed it). <BR>Traveller: The New Era (TNE) came next and represented the aftermath of the<BR>Rebellion in MT. It was set about 80 years later. It's OK.<BR>T4, AKA Marc Miller's Traveller (although I always though that's kinda like<BR>referring to Star Trek as Gene Roddenberry's Star Trek :) ), is the forth<BR>version of Traveller. It's set 1100 years prior to CT. I only own one T4<BR>product (Aliens Archive), and not the rule book for it. As I understand it<BR>there were some problems with proofreading and playtesting, but others know<BR>better than myself. Aliens looked fine (mostly).<BR>G:T is the latest and is actually a licenced adaption of the GURPS rules. In<BR>general the books try to be as generic as possible and minimise the use of<BR>GURPS jargon, so they're pretty good for mining for background info. It is,<BR>however a line released by a games company and designed to be used with<BR>their house rules, so when stats or vehicle designs are used they are<BR>written in GURPS.<BR><BR>What's more, <BR>&gt; judging by web<BR>&gt; presence, that popularity seems fairly well split between <BR>&gt; Classic Traveller<BR>&gt; and GURPS Traveller. What T4 is, I have no idea. There are <BR>&gt; some other little<BR>&gt; things like confusion over whether the BITS books are Classic or GURPS<BR>&gt; compatible (or both).<BR><BR>BITS are an independant publishing house based in the UK. BITS books tend to<BR>be even more background-focussed and generic than the GURPS books, but make<BR>use of both GURPS and the various Traveller mechanics to describe things.<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I have also been searching for Traveller miniatures. With the <BR>&gt; resurgence of<BR>&gt; Traveller and the re-issue of Striker soon, that the 15mm <BR>&gt; miniatures would<BR>&gt; be in demand. Does Marc Miller retain the molds or masters for these<BR>&gt; figures?<BR><BR>There has been speculation about minis from SJG,&nbsp; but they're doing so much<BR>stuff with their Ogre line I woulndn't hold my breath.<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I know that these are simplistic questions. Please put up <BR>&gt; with me as I learn<BR>&gt; the game and try to catch up.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; P.S.<BR>&gt; I downloaded GRIP last night. It runs kinda' slow. I suspect <BR>&gt; that VB was the<BR>&gt; language of choice. Still, what it does is impressive. The question is<BR>&gt; whether GRIP actually is used much in the RPG community.<BR><BR>Not by me, although I've been thinking about it.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 15:34:57 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: I'm Confused<BR><BR>Ray Rangel wrote:<BR>&gt; Although I recently bought the Classic Traveller reprints, I'm<BR>&gt; still somewhat confused about the various versions. What's more,<BR>&gt; judging by web presence, that popularity seems fairly well split<BR>&gt; between Classic Traveller and GURPS Traveller. What T4 is, I have<BR>&gt; no idea. There are some other little things like confusion over<BR>&gt; whether the BITS books are Classic or GURPS compatible (or both).<BR><BR>There should be a FAQ file lying round here somewhere, but in the<BR>meantime ...<BR><BR>- - First there was Traveller (now called CT), originally&nbsp; by&nbsp; GDW.<BR>&nbsp; This is what you get in the Reprints.&nbsp; In addition to the rules<BR>&nbsp; you get the&nbsp; 'classic&nbsp; era'&nbsp; campaign&nbsp; setting&nbsp; (Imperial&nbsp; year<BR>&nbsp; 1105-1112).<BR><BR>- - 10 years later CT was overhauled&nbsp; by&nbsp; GDW&nbsp; and&nbsp; DGP&nbsp; to&nbsp; become<BR>&nbsp; MegaTraveller (MT).&nbsp; In addition to the&nbsp; overhauled&nbsp; rules&nbsp; you<BR>&nbsp; get&nbsp; the&nbsp; 'rebellion&nbsp; era'&nbsp; campaign&nbsp; setting&nbsp; (Imperial&nbsp;&nbsp; year<BR>&nbsp; 1116-1120).&nbsp; Some people (including me) like the MT&nbsp; rules&nbsp; but<BR>&nbsp; not the MT setting.&nbsp; Also there were many typos and eratta.<BR><BR>- - Later GDW decided to re-release Traveller: The New&nbsp; Era&nbsp; (TNE).<BR>&nbsp; This replaces the prior rules with the GDW&nbsp; house&nbsp; system&nbsp; (aka<BR>&nbsp; Twilight:2000&nbsp; 2nd&nbsp; edition&nbsp; rules).&nbsp;&nbsp; In&nbsp;&nbsp; addition&nbsp;&nbsp; to&nbsp;&nbsp; the<BR>&nbsp; completely different rules you get&nbsp; the&nbsp; TNE&nbsp; campaign&nbsp; setting<BR>&nbsp; (Imperial year 1200+).&nbsp; There are many passionate supports&nbsp; and<BR>&nbsp; detractors of TNE, many consider it&nbsp; to&nbsp; be&nbsp; a&nbsp; different&nbsp; game<BR>&nbsp; altogether.<BR><BR>- - Then GDW closed.&nbsp; A new company was&nbsp; started&nbsp; to&nbsp; continue&nbsp; the<BR>&nbsp; licence called Imperium Games.&nbsp; They brought out T4&nbsp; which&nbsp; was<BR>&nbsp; derived from CT (think of the rules as part way between CT&nbsp; and<BR>&nbsp; MT).&nbsp; In addition to the rules you get the Milieu Zero&nbsp; setting<BR>&nbsp; (Imperial year 0-50).&nbsp; It&nbsp; was&nbsp; supposed&nbsp; to&nbsp; be&nbsp; a&nbsp; return&nbsp; to<BR>&nbsp; Traveller's roots but there were many production and&nbsp; editorial<BR>&nbsp; problems with the new company and it too closed.<BR><BR>- - Marc Miller (the creator of Traveller) is working on a modified<BR>&nbsp; version of T4 (originally called&nbsp; T4.1,&nbsp; now&nbsp; called&nbsp; T5).&nbsp; The<BR>&nbsp; release date is unknown.<BR><BR>- - In the meantime, Loren Wiseman (ex-GDW) has joined SJGames&nbsp; and<BR>&nbsp; has the rights to produce a GURPS version.&nbsp; This uses the GURPS<BR>&nbsp; ruleset and the setting&nbsp; is&nbsp; an&nbsp; alternative&nbsp; timeline&nbsp; to&nbsp; the<BR>&nbsp; rebellion era.&nbsp; (Be warned: GURPS isn't metric!)<BR><BR>Currently GT and&nbsp; the&nbsp; CT&nbsp; reprints&nbsp; are&nbsp; the&nbsp; only&nbsp; thing&nbsp; being<BR>published commercially, and&nbsp; both&nbsp; are&nbsp; enjoying&nbsp; great&nbsp; success.<BR>(Marc Miller is reprinting CT to raise money to fund&nbsp; the&nbsp; launch<BR>of T5.)&nbsp; But do not assume they are the&nbsp; only&nbsp; popular&nbsp; versions.<BR>Most of us mix-n-match to varrying degrees ... I use MT rules&nbsp; in<BR>CT setting and take source material from all versions.&nbsp; There&nbsp; is<BR>a separate mail list for TNE fanatics.<BR><BR>BITS produce T4/generic products that are usable with GT and MT.<BR><BR>(One other thing: if you hear&nbsp; of&nbsp; "Traveller:2300"&nbsp; or&nbsp; "2300AD"<BR>these are 2 editions of a completely separate GDW game.&nbsp; They are<BR>set in the Twilight:2000&nbsp; universe&nbsp; but&nbsp; 300&nbsp; years&nbsp; on.&nbsp; Do&nbsp; not<BR>confuse this with the Traveller universe.)<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; I have also been searching for Traveller miniatures. With the<BR>&gt; resurgence of Traveller and the re-issue of Striker soon, that<BR>&gt; the 15mm miniatures would be in demand. Does Marc Miller retain<BR>&gt; the molds or masters for these figures?<BR><BR>You might find some on the 2nd-hand market ... but note that&nbsp; TNE<BR>used so-called 25mm scale.&nbsp; ("15mm scale" uses&nbsp; 0.5&nbsp; inch&nbsp; square<BR>grid representing 1.5m x 1.5m, "25mm scale" uses&nbsp; 1&nbsp; inch&nbsp; square<BR>grid representing 2m x 2m.)&nbsp; GURPS uses a hexagon&nbsp; grid&nbsp; but&nbsp; I'm<BR>not sure of the scale.<BR><BR><BR><BR>There you go: clear as mud!<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 07:56:53 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Morale<BR><BR>on 1/15/01 2:06 AM, Stephen Tempest at TML@stempest.demon.co.uk wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt; writes:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Fanatic&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 2+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Berserkers, religious fanatics, Le Legion.<BR>&gt;&gt; Fanatics will never route or surrender.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; How about giving them a worse morale, but if they fail, instead of<BR>&gt; routing they charge directly towards the nearest enemy, ignoring cover<BR>&gt; and expending all possible ammunition?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Stephen<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Great Idea! I'll make the change.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend"<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 11:09:13 -0500<BR>From: "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Solitaire?<BR><BR>There is made mention of "solitaire" Traveller in the CT reprints. Is this<BR>really possible? How does one go about playing an RPG by one's self?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 18:16:40 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Pre-Bar-B-Q Sport<BR><BR>On Mon, 15 Jan 2001, Mark Urbin wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;This has probably been asked before...but do Ithklur get intoxicated and go<BR>&gt; &gt;K'kree tipping?<BR>&gt; When ever possible.<BR><BR>I have heard discomforting reports of people who get intoxicated and<BR>after that are into waiter tipping...<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 10:28:20 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: I'm Confused<BR><BR>&gt; Most of us mix-n-match to varrying degrees ... I use MT rules&nbsp; in<BR>&gt; CT setting and take source material from all versions.&nbsp; There&nbsp; is<BR>&gt; a separate mail list for TNE fanatics.<BR><BR>What is the ML for TNE?<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; BITS produce T4/generic products that are usable with GT and MT.<BR><BR>Do they have a website?<BR><BR>&gt; (One other thing: if you hear&nbsp; of&nbsp; "Traveller:2300"&nbsp; or&nbsp; "2300AD"<BR>&gt; these are 2 editions of a completely separate GDW game.&nbsp; They are<BR>&gt; set in the Twilight:2000&nbsp; universe&nbsp; but&nbsp; 300&nbsp; years&nbsp; on.&nbsp; Do&nbsp; not<BR>&gt; confuse this with the Traveller universe.)<BR><BR>Very different.&nbsp; Great game.<BR><BR>David C. Broussard<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 16:24:54 -0000<BR>From: "Mark Preston" &lt;mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Steve<BR>&gt; (Bloo) Daniels<BR>&gt; Sent: 12 January 2001 21:26<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Jolly Roger<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "michael.scanlon" wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; BTW, "Roger" as comm lingo (especially "Roger that!") is<BR>&gt; highly amusing<BR>&gt; &gt; if you know what "roger" *used* to mean (as in "Jolly Roger") &lt;eg&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &lt;&lt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Would someone like to put some light on the subject.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "Jolly Roger" is an English-ified version of the French<BR>&gt; "Jolie Rouge".<BR>[snip]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Red in French is Rouge.<BR>&gt; Jolie is French for Pretty.<BR>&gt; Pretty Red = Jolie Rouge = Jolly Roger.<BR>&gt;<BR>Pretty idea - but wrong, I'm afraid. FYI, the British flags flown on<BR>naval and merchant ships (respectively) is the whiite or the red<BR>ensign, and has been for an awful long while. In which case, a ship<BR>flying the "Jolly Roger" (from your description) would be any old<BR>merchant navy vessel.<BR><BR>The white ensign (and red) were (and are) also known as the "white<BR>duster" and "red duster". Flags in general were also known as<BR>"Jacks" - hence the Union Jack...but no-where I have found refers to<BR>them as "rogers", except for in the instance of the Jolly Roger. It<BR>is, however known that Captain Morgan flew a skull and crossbones<BR>(and, yes, he was almost certainly a Mason, and the skull and<BR>ctossbones are used in Masonic - not Templar - ritual). He is thought<BR>to have referred to it as "Roger" and to have called it "jolly"<BR>because of the grin on the skull. So far as I've found, this is about<BR>the only explanation of the name that holds any water.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 12:13:29 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Red in French is Rouge.<BR>&gt; &gt; Jolie is French for Pretty.<BR>&gt; &gt; Pretty Red = Jolie Rouge = Jolly Roger.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;Pretty idea - but wrong, I'm afraid.<BR><BR>Cecil Adams' "Straight Dope" column had a crack at this:<BR><BR>http://www.straightdope.com/classics/a1_292.html<BR><BR>He runs down the theories, including "jolie rouge". In the areas where I <BR>know my ass from my elbow, Uncle Cecil is quite well-informed, so I'd trust <BR>his explanations on this one too.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 17:16:24 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Solitaire?<BR><BR>Ray Rangel wrote:<BR>&gt; There is made mention of "solitaire" Traveller in the CT reprints.<BR>&gt; Is this really possible? How does one go about playing an RPG by<BR>&gt; one's self?<BR><BR>What&nbsp; this&nbsp; refers&nbsp; to&nbsp; is&nbsp; generating&nbsp; things&nbsp; (planets,&nbsp; ships,<BR>vehicles, etc) and analysing the&nbsp; Traveller&nbsp; universe.&nbsp; Traveller<BR>is both an RPG and a simulation tool.&nbsp; Hours of solo&nbsp; fun&nbsp; to&nbsp; be<BR>had!<BR><BR>For example: From CT sources only how big is the Regina starport?<BR>Bare in mind that the trading tables in CT are for tramp&nbsp; traders<BR>and ignore the large corporate regular&nbsp; shipping&nbsp; contracts&nbsp; that<BR>make up the bulk of interstellar transport.&nbsp; (To do this you will<BR>need to create an economic model *and*&nbsp; find&nbsp; the&nbsp; true&nbsp; cost&nbsp; of<BR>frieght by designing large freighters with the&nbsp; best&nbsp; "per&nbsp; dton"<BR>transport cost per year.)&nbsp; Answers on a postcard to ...<BR><BR>Alternatively: why not join the TML Landgrab (www.downport.com)?<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 17:23:04 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: I'm Confused<BR><BR>David C. Broussard wrote:<BR>&gt; What is the ML for TNE?<BR><BR>Unless someone beats me to it I'll have to check when I get&nbsp; home<BR>tonight ...<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt; BITS produce T4/generic products that are usable with GT and MT.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Do they have a website?<BR><BR>http://www.bits.org.uk/<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt; (One other thing: if you hear&nbsp; of&nbsp; "Traveller:2300"&nbsp; or&nbsp; "2300AD"<BR>&gt; &gt; these are 2 editions of a completely separate GDW game.&nbsp; They are<BR>&gt; &gt; set in the Twilight:2000&nbsp; universe&nbsp; but&nbsp; 300&nbsp; years&nbsp; on.&nbsp; Do&nbsp; not<BR>&gt; &gt; confuse this with the Traveller universe.)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Very different.&nbsp; Great game.<BR><BR>This also has an ML ... go to egroups.com and look for 2300ad.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 10:54:36 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Introduction<BR><BR>Ray Rangel writes:<BR>&gt;Hi all,<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Hi Ray!<BR><BR>&gt;I am new to RPGs. Though I'm primarily a historical miniatures gamer, I have<BR>&gt;been curious about Traveller since I saw it at a local game store back at in<BR>&gt;'80s.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That's a long while to stay curious.&nbsp; Better late than never.&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>&gt;Well, I was cruising around the net...ok, I was on Steve Jackson's site<BR>&gt;ordering Ogre miniatures and board games...and I stumbled upon GURPS<BR>&gt;Traveller.<BR>&gt;That lead me to do some snooping around and I just got more and more<BR>&gt;interested. Well, up and go to the local game store (the only one in Macon,<BR>&gt;GA) and find, not GURPS, but the new reprint of the first nine books of<BR>&gt;Classic Traveller. It went home me...<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Good choice.&nbsp; Repeat after me: "There is only one Traveller, and<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; High Guard is it's product."<BR><BR>&gt;I haven't read enough yet to ask questions, but be assured they are coming.<BR>&gt;I hope you all will bear with me as I struggle to comprehend this game in a<BR>&gt;gaming vacuum.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Welcome to the list!<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 11:06:28 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>Actually, the jdegraff@pacbell.net address is my HOME address through my DSL<BR>service, and jedegraf@cisco.com is my WORK address (and get in line, I get<BR>one first ;)&nbsp; I get the list in both places so I can keep up with it<BR>(mostly)!!&nbsp; You can easily reach me at either address.&nbsp; Be warned about my<BR>home address though.&nbsp; I've been getting so much spam lately from data-mining<BR>of pacbell.net addresses that I HAVE missed messages before in all the<BR>clutter.<BR><BR>Best,<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Jones, Dean<BR>&gt; Sent: Monday, January 15, 2001 4:36 AM<BR>&gt; To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Jesse seems to have changed jobs...he's now at jedegraf@cisco.com<BR>&gt; . Congrats<BR>&gt; on the new job, Jesse (Pacific Bell to cisco, right?). Any chance<BR>&gt; of a free<BR>&gt; router? :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Dean<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; &gt; From: Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm [mailto:jenry023@student.liu.se]<BR>&gt; &gt; Sent: 15 January 2001 10:04<BR>&gt; &gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: Re: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; I _know_ I (used to) have an email address for him.&nbsp; I need<BR>&gt; &gt; one.&nbsp; Can<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; someone give me a pointer?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; jdegraff@pacbell.net<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Note: This is from an old post.&nbsp;He might have changed address since<BR>&gt; &gt; then.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; * Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>&gt; &gt; | jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>&gt; &gt; | ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>&gt; &gt; * http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 14:32:31 -0500<BR>From: "Thom Harris" &lt;thomharr@mediaone.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>Here is the letter I received for Total Confusion XV convention. It is a<BR>really big Con with games for everyone....<BR><BR>Thom Harris - GOFIR - &lt;Gnarly Old Fart In Residence&gt;<BR>~I started out with nothing.....I still have most of it left~<BR>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>Total Confusion Dates: 22 - 25, 2001<BR><BR>Please respond to this email to totalcon1@yahoo.com nice message only my<BR>feelings get easily hurt.<BR><BR>In an effort to save money we (That's the royal 'we', made a bad decision)<BR>decide to not mail to our entire mailing list, so people with&nbsp; an email<BR>address did not get sent a snail mail version of this years pre-reg<BR>booklet. Sorry if you don't like it. We wont be doing it again.<BR><BR>My work schedule has made it hard to get things done, (Why can't I get laid<BR>off when I need to? The Convention runs so much better if I don't have to<BR>go to a real job.)<BR><BR>Don't worry your pre-reg is not to late and I'll be extending it a few days<BR>because as you read this, I am on my way to Florida on another business<BR>trip.&nbsp; Florida, the land of where we pay honor to a rat with big ears, and<BR>the fountain of youth was never found, are these two facts related,<BR>probably not but I'm bored at the airport and your already reading this.<BR><BR>So please check the web site for the latest events and pre-reg form.<BR><BR>One more week(then I'll be home and be hooked back into my internet<BR>connection) and I'll have an online version ready, you'll need to have a<BR>PayPal account to use it tho.<BR><BR>Coming soon, will be more info for the TC Fantasy and TC Mech events on our<BR>web site.<BR><BR>Please If you need a hard copy of the form here is our address send me a<BR>note. or email the convention address totalcon1@yahoo.com<BR><BR>Total Confusion Gaming Convention,<BR>PO Box 403<BR>N Chelmsford, MA 01863-0403<BR><BR>For the latest updates come see http://www.totalcon.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 19:44:29 +0000<BR>From: "Jonathan" &lt;thegreatkraken@postmark.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Hello All<BR><BR>Hi <BR><BR>I've just joined the list and I play G:T but I have a few qustions:<BR><BR>- - What is GRIP?<BR>- - What G:T books have been brought out?<BR><BR>If anyone could enlighten me I would be very greatful<BR><BR>Jonathan<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 20:52:19 +0100<BR>From: Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solitaire?<BR><BR>On Monday, January 15, 2001, 5:09:13 PM, the following was written:<BR><BR>RR&gt; There is made mention of "solitaire" Traveller in the CT reprints. Is this<BR>RR&gt; really possible? How does one go about playing an RPG by one's self?<BR><BR>What was meant back in them days, was that you can have fun on your<BR>own (not what you all now think), by playing with the rules. Create<BR>characters using the rules, invent their histories. Roll up worlds, or<BR>entire universes, construct spaceships, use them to ply the empty<BR>trade routes, play out space battles with pirates. Nothing you need a<BR>Ref for, using a bit of imagination, and it is fun.<BR>I roll up characters from time to time, just to see where they go,<BR>how far they advance, and what happens to them.<BR>Try it, its fun!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 20:03 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;3.0.5.16.20010114190527.466f24dc@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Greetings Douglas.<BR><BR>I am known for a pint pot filled with orange and mango squash - you are <BR>welcome to some of that :-)<BR><BR>We really must meet up at Gen Con UK.<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 20:03 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Interesting Holiday<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;79.ee6a127.2793c7a0@aol.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts, especially Loren.<BR><BR>Quite a well known mediaeval (and later) tradition, also known as 'Beating <BR>the Bounds'. Priest and choir (in full robes!) would process around the <BR>boundaries of the parish marking them with canes... said canes often being <BR>applied to the britches-seat of young apprentices to impress upon them <BR>where the boundaries lay.<BR><BR>There are loads of such traditions around. Want any more?<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 20:03 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;5.0.2.1.0.20010114222200.00a36880@mail.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>What's this then? Sounds like a TV game show...<BR><BR>Eeek. What a thing to dump your players in. They'd hate you :-)<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 20:03 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Introduction<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;007501c07e91$4370d680$c7174d0c@default&gt;<BR>Greetings Ray and welcome!<BR><BR>Be warned, this role-playing is addictive. I've been at it since 1977... <BR>:-)<BR><BR>One wonderful thing, and it's reflected by people on this list, is the <BR>range and variety of approaches - from miniature skirmish to intensive <BR>character-based role-play, high adventure, detailed combat simulation, <BR>politics, trading... you can do any or all of these and still call it <BR>TRAVELLER.<BR><BR>Some folk like to argue the minutae of 'How does a Jump drive really <BR>work?" or speculate on the 'official' timeline of events in the TRAVELLER <BR>UNIVERSE (normally abbreviated TU) - this timeline is based on published <BR>materials, adventures, sourcebooks, etc., and is known as 'canon'. Others <BR>like to float ideas for new ships or weapons, or come up with devious <BR>plots to throw at their players. Periodically, the rules get totally <BR>rewritten...<BR><BR>And sometimes we get plain silly (penguins) or stray completely off-topic. <BR>But it's all good fun. Come on in and join us!<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 15:09:38 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Solitaire?<BR><BR>On 01/15/01 at 11:09 AM,&nbsp; "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;There is made mention of "solitaire" Traveller in the CT reprints.<BR>&gt;Is this really possible? How does one go about playing an RPG by<BR>&gt;one's self?<BR><BR>You bet!&nbsp; You *can* do a lot of things all by one's self, although<BR>having a partner, or two, is generally better.&nbsp; &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>The most common solitare method of playing Traveller is design<BR>oriented.&nbsp; Creating a character can be a game in and of itself and I<BR>have spent many a pleasant hour doing so.&nbsp; Then you can create star<BR>systems, complete with ship, NPC and animal encounter tables.&nbsp; You<BR>can also design ships using Book 2 or High Guard.&nbsp; <BR><BR>You can do more than design, though.&nbsp; Once you have several<BR>characters, and a ship, you can crew your ship with your<BR>self-generated characters and have it travel to the star systems you<BR>created.&nbsp; Using nothing but encounter tables and die rolls, you can<BR>trade and fight your way across the galaxy. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Is it more fun with friends?&nbsp; Sure, but it *can* be fun alone too.<BR><BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3524<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-za02.mx.aol.com (rly-za02.mail.aol.com [172.31.36.98]) by air-za03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Mon, 15 Jan 2001 16:11:07 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-za02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Mon, 15 Jan 2001 16:10:34 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id QAA50338;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 15 Jan 2001 16:10:03 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 15 Jan 2001 16:09:47 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id QAA50291<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 15 Jan 2001 16:09:47 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 16:09:47 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101152109.QAA50291@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3524<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3525</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/15/01 4:20:30 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Monday, January 15 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3525<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Morale<BR>Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR>Re: Interesting Holiday<BR>Re: Introduction<BR>questions<BR>RE: I'm Confused<BR>Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR>New to the list<BR>Welcome Newbies!<BR>Re: New to the list<BR>Re: Morale<BR>Re: Interesting Holiday<BR>RE: Solitaire?<BR>Re: Morale<BR>Re: New to the list<BR>Re: Introduction<BR>Re: I'm Confused<BR>RE: I'm Confused<BR>RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>re:Hello All<BR>re:I'm Confused<BR>Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR>RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 06:37:18 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Morale<BR><BR>&gt; From: Tod Glenn <BR>&gt; NPCs have a morale and rally value associated with their quality of<BR>&gt; training and experience. <BR><BR>Morale values aren't _necessarily_ products of training quality and<BR>experience.&nbsp; Consider WWII Japanese infantry.&nbsp; While many units were well<BR>trained and experienced (in the early stages of their southern advance,<BR>much more experienced than their opponents), other units were basically<BR>labour battalions, naval base parties and so on.&nbsp; They still routinely<BR>fought to the death.&nbsp; <BR><BR>&gt; Fanatic&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 2+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Berserkers, religious fanatics, Le Legion.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Fanatics will never route or surrender.<BR><BR>This is the category least influenced by training and experience, of<BR>course, and probably includes the Japanese units I mentioned above.&nbsp; Note<BR>that it can include units that in terms of skill couldn't fight their way<BR>out of a wet paper bag.<BR><BR>The word is "rout", incidentally, not "route", although I suppose you could<BR>interpret it as "hitting the road".&nbsp; &nbsp; : )<BR><BR>And of course, apart from Camerone, there is little reason to put the<BR>Legion in this category.&nbsp; In fact, in most cases, the Legion have behaved<BR>very much like bog-standard regular troops, including exhibiting a<BR>considerable reluctance to fight at times.&nbsp; An example of this is the<BR>campaign in Syria and Lebanon in '41:&nbsp; the Vichy Legionnaires behaved like<BR>pretty standard troops, many being taken prisoner when their positions were<BR>overrun, while the Free French Legion units didn't seem to be thrilled<BR>about fighting other French forces, particularly other Legionnaires.<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 06:08:29 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR><BR>&gt; From: Volker <BR>&gt; You forgot the Department of Redundancy, Dept.&nbsp; They are the ones<BR>&gt; who get the extra two forms whenever something has to be filled<BR>&gt; out in triplicate (i.e. everything).<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Hmm, everybody is always forgetting them. Must be some kid of a<BR>&gt; conspiracy.<BR><BR>Good typo there:&nbsp; clearly the Department of Redundancy Department is indeed<BR>the offspring of a conspiracy.&nbsp; : )<BR><BR>Sadly, the real reason why they get forgotten is that they appeared in a<BR>Judges' Guild product!&nbsp; (Ley Sector, IIRC)<BR><BR>Ah, classic silliness.&nbsp; : )<BR><BR>And count an honorary keyboard kill.<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 16:24:45 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Interesting Holiday<BR><BR>On Mon, 15 Jan 2001 08:36:25 -0500 (EST), GDWGAMES@aol.com (Loren Wiseman -<BR>yes, _that_ Loren Wiseman) wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;While looking into some things for GT: Nobles, I came across this quote in J <BR>&gt;&amp; F Gies' _Life in a Medieval Castle_:<BR><BR>&gt;"The Rogation Days, the Monday, Tuesday, and Wednesday before Ascension (the <BR>&gt;fortieth day after Easter), weve celebrated in the countryside under the name <BR>&gt;of Gangdays. The people of the villages went "a-ganging" &lt;deletions&gt; Small <BR>&gt;boys were ducked in brooks and ponds and their buttocks bumped against trees <BR>&gt;and rocks to help them memorize the village bounds."<BR><BR>&gt;The holiday where the village elders drag the young punks around and throw <BR>&gt;them in ponds . . . we could use more holidays like that!<BR><BR>&gt;OB Trav: If I'd made something like this up, I would have been chased from <BR>&gt;the podium and pelted with rotten fruit.<BR><BR>No you wouldn't - the reverse is quite a common practice here in the Rotten<BR>Apple - we call it "wilding", and it helps the victims memorize the<BR>hazardous locations in the city (which is anything within the city limits).<BR><BR>Thanks for the reference; I'm going to see if I can dig up some<BR>corroborating documentation for it, and then I'm going to write to City<BR>Hall and propose it as a city holiday.<BR><BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 15:24:43 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Introduction<BR><BR>On 01/15/01 at 08:03 PM,&nbsp; mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson) said:<BR><BR>&gt;In-Reply-To: &lt;007501c07e91$4370d680$c7174d0c@default&gt;<BR>&gt;Greetings Ray and welcome!<BR><BR>&gt;Be warned, this role-playing is addictive. I've been at it since<BR>&gt;1977...&nbsp; :-)<BR><BR>What she said!&nbsp; &lt;g&gt; I started...officially...when the original D&amp;D<BR>came out in '74, and switched to Traveller in '77.<BR><BR>&gt;One wonderful thing, and it's reflected by people on this list, is<BR>&gt;the&nbsp; range and variety of approaches - from miniature skirmish to<BR>&gt;intensive&nbsp; character-based role-play, high adventure, detailed<BR>&gt;combat simulation,&nbsp; politics, trading... you can do any or all of<BR>&gt;these and still call it&nbsp; TRAVELLER.<BR><BR>Yep!&nbsp; Personally, I'm mostly interested in playing and GMing<BR>character-based roleplaying, I love to "gearhead" (design ships,<BR>equipment and weapons) and "worldbuild" (designing systems), and I<BR>guess everyone here knows I am addicted to tinkering with rule<BR>systems, too. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Some folk like to argue the minutae of 'How does a Jump drive<BR>&gt;really&nbsp; work?" or speculate on the 'official' timeline of events in<BR>&gt;the TRAVELLER&nbsp; UNIVERSE (normally abbreviated TU) - this timeline<BR>&gt;is based on published&nbsp; materials, adventures, sourcebooks, etc.,<BR>&gt;and is known as 'canon'. <BR><BR>The OTU (Official Traveller Universe), as opposed to (your) YTU or<BR>(my) MTU.&nbsp; Oh, and some of us (me in particular) are notorious<BR>heretics that like to tweek the OTU into our own MTU's...much to<BR>some people's distress...or completely ignore it and build our own.<BR><BR>&gt;Others&nbsp; like to float ideas for new ships<BR>&gt;or weapons, or come up with devious&nbsp; plots to throw at their<BR>&gt;players. Periodically, the rules get totally&nbsp; rewritten...<BR><BR>&gt;And sometimes we get plain silly (penguins) or stray completely<BR>&gt;off-topic.&nbsp; But it's all good fun. Come on in and join us!<BR><BR>Yes, do!<BR><BR>&gt;Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>We also bash folks about the head with "burning faggots", but only<BR>those that are excessively annoying.&nbsp; If you are only reasonably<BR>annoying, we'll use the penguin on you.&nbsp; &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR><BR>Eris,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; the Heretic<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 16:31:28 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: questions<BR><BR>"Jonathan" &lt;thegreatkraken@postmark.net&gt; types:<BR>&gt;I've just joined the list and I play G:T but I have a few qustions:<BR>&gt;- - What is GRIP?<BR><BR>Generic Role-Playing for Internet Play<BR>Check out http://www.rpgrealms.com/<BR><BR>It's a tool for running traditional pen &amp; paper RPGs over the net.<BR>Chat tools, file &amp; map sharing, dice rolling, and other features.<BR><BR>&gt;- - What G:T books have been brought out?<BR>The complete list can be found at http://www.sjgames.com/<BR><BR><BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/ - Opinions should be yours too!<BR>Did you read what I read?&nbsp; Write it right here in red.<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 15:36:59 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: RE: I'm Confused<BR><BR>On 01/15/01 at 03:29 PM,&nbsp; "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Although I recently bought the Classic Traveller reprints,<BR><BR>&gt;Kinda cool, aren't they? :)<BR><BR>&gt; I'm still<BR>&gt;&gt; somewhat confused about the various versions. <BR><BR>&gt;All opinions are IMO.<BR><BR>&gt;OK. Classic Traveller, CT, was the original verson and is set in<BR>&gt;1105-1120ish. <BR><BR>Dean isn't wrong, but I want to add a bit...<BR><BR>Originally, CT wasn't *set* in any universe, you designed your own. The universe that GDW developed grew up over the life of CT. IMO, the GDW TU is a nice place to play in, but is neither necessary or required by the little black books.<BR><BR>Eris,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; rolling his own since 1977!<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 21:44:31 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR><BR>on 15/1/01 1:20 pm, Trevor, Peter at Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; And there was a reference in (IIRC) GDW's Adventure&nbsp; 1&nbsp; (Kinunir)<BR>&gt; to a Ministry of Colonization.<BR><BR>Page 39, in Library Data.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 16:45:05 -0500<BR>From: "Robert A. Smith II" &lt;rsmith@rasinsurance.com&gt;<BR>Subject: New to the list<BR><BR>Hello TML.&nbsp; After several months of surfing through the TML archives, I<BR>finally joined.&nbsp; I just have a quick question.<BR><BR>IMTU, psionics are under the jurisdiction of Psi Corps.&nbsp; Besides, the Order<BR>of Zar Tis on Freelance Traveller are there any other prior career tables<BR>for psionics?<BR><BR>And as for the Vilani invading, since Bethesda, MD is already taken I'm<BR>calling dibs on Northern Virginia.<BR><BR>Angus<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 15:52:53 -0600<BR>From: "James Jensen" &lt;cheeb0@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Welcome Newbies!<BR><BR>Well, what do we have here? Two new guys! Man, you're out for a while and <BR>look what happens...<BR><BR>Well, welcome to the list. Please keep this email adress in your books: <BR>traveller-request@lists.ient.com You can unsubscribe there. You wouldn't <BR>believe how many people have asked how to unsubscribe.<BR><BR>Also, on the subject of solitaire games: I'll second what the others have <BR>said and add this: If you're running a site-based adventure (and this <BR>applies to ANY RPG, especially D&amp;D), then you can play by yourself. Just <BR>make the map as you go and fight everything you face. The random dungeon <BR>generators in the 1st edition AD&amp;D DMG and in the D&amp;D Adventure Game (the <BR>2nd Edition starter set, that is) are especially good. I've done it, and <BR>it's not half bad.<BR><BR>- -J. Jensen<BR>Administrator of the Milieu: 0 Aid Society<BR>http://members.nbci.com/cheebzero/trav_index.htm<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 22:04:20 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: New to the list<BR><BR>on 15/1/01 9:45 pm, Robert A. Smith II at rsmith@rasinsurance.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Hello TML.&nbsp; After several months of surfing through the TML archives, I<BR>&gt; finally joined.&nbsp; I just have a quick question.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; IMTU, psionics are under the jurisdiction of Psi Corps.&nbsp; Besides, the Order<BR>&gt; of Zar Tis on Freelance Traveller are there any other prior career tables<BR>&gt; for psionics?<BR><BR>Not specifically that I'm aware of, but it's an assignment for SORAG<BR>operatives.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 14:08:31 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Morale<BR><BR>&gt; Morale values aren't _necessarily_ products of training quality and<BR>&gt; experience.&nbsp; Consider WWII Japanese infantry.&nbsp; While many units were well<BR>&gt; trained and experienced (in the early stages of their southern advance,<BR>&gt; much more experienced than their opponents), other units were basically<BR>&gt; labour battalions, naval base parties and so on.&nbsp; They still routinely<BR>&gt; fought to the death.<BR><BR>True.&nbsp; Bear in mind this is a generic system.&nbsp; Certain worlds may have<BR>religious/philosophical make ups that tend to boost morale.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Fanatic&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 2+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Berserkers, religious fanatics, Le Legion.<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Fanatics will never route or surrender.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; This is the category least influenced by training and experience, of<BR>&gt; course, and probably includes the Japanese units I mentioned above.&nbsp; Note<BR>&gt; that it can include units that in terms of skill couldn't fight their way<BR>&gt; out of a wet paper bag.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The word is "rout", incidentally, not "route", although I suppose you<BR>could<BR>&gt; interpret it as "hitting the road".&nbsp; &nbsp; : )<BR><BR>Yes, I know.&nbsp; Mistype, thanks.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; And of course, apart from Camerone, there is little reason to put the<BR>&gt; Legion in this category.&nbsp; In<BR><BR>I was thinking in terms of Camerone.&nbsp; I'll note as such on the writeup.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 07:30:55 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Interesting Holiday<BR><BR>&gt; From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>&gt; The holiday where the village elders drag the young punks around and<BR>&gt; throw them in ponds . . . we could use more holidays like that!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; OB Trav: If I'd made something like this up, I would have been chased<BR>&gt; from the podium and pelted with rotten fruit.<BR><BR>Probably.&nbsp; : )<BR><BR>I actually saw a fruit-pelting once.&nbsp; Actually, it was with vegetables -<BR>celery stalks, IIRC.&nbsp; They weren't rotten, though.&nbsp; The targets thoroughly<BR>deserved it.&nbsp; Student politicians - smug little pigs on their way to<BR>becoming real politicians.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Hmm.&nbsp; Student politics in the 3I?&nbsp; Eww.<BR><BR>Anyway, on at least one world, throwing fruit at the nobility is probably a<BR>traditional holiday event.&nbsp; Perhaps it's a way of celebrating some kind of<BR>anti-noble uprising, and a traditional reminder that Madam Guillotine is<BR>still an option...<BR><BR>Another good one:&nbsp; the Trobriand Islanders still have a _traditional_<BR>harvest festival.&nbsp; All the males who are able to, leave for the duration of<BR>it.&nbsp; Apparently, a foreign missionary of some wacky fundamentalist sect<BR>stayed around one year, and was _most_ distressed.&nbsp; A Trobriander student I<BR>used to share a house with in Brisbane described it as:&nbsp; "it's not just the<BR>young and pretty women - it's the grandmothers too."&nbsp; But I guess such a<BR>festival couldn't really make it into print.&nbsp; : (&nbsp;&nbsp; : )<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 21:34:16 -0000<BR>From: "Mark Preston" &lt;mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Solitaire?<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Trevor, Peter<BR>&gt; Sent: 15 January 2001 17:16<BR>&gt; To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Solitaire?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Ray Rangel wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; There is made mention of "solitaire" Traveller in the CT reprints.<BR>&gt; &gt; Is this really possible? How does one go about playing an RPG by<BR>&gt; &gt; one's self?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What&nbsp; this&nbsp; refers&nbsp; to&nbsp; is&nbsp; generating&nbsp; things&nbsp; (planets,&nbsp; ships,<BR>&gt; vehicles, etc) and analysing the&nbsp; Traveller&nbsp; universe.<BR>&gt;<BR>[snip]<BR>...And to playing games on your own as well. It is quite definately<BR>possible.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 17:46:09 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Morale<BR><BR>Tod Glenn writes:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;Fanatic&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 2+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2+&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Berserkers, religious fanatics, Le Legion.<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;Fanatics will never route or surrender.<BR>&gt;&gt;How about giving them a worse morale, but if they fail, instead of<BR>&gt;&gt;routing they charge directly towards the nearest enemy, ignoring cover<BR>&gt;&gt;and expending all possible ammunition?<BR>&gt;Great Idea! I'll make the change.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; This is a lot like the "Berserker" rules in Squad Leader.&nbsp; In SL,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Russian units that roll a natural 2 on a morale check (low is<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; good in SL) due to enemy fire become Berserk, and must fire<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; on and charge the nearest enemy unit so as to engage them<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; in close combat.&nbsp; Such Berserk units are not subject to morale<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; checks, but could be returned to 'normal' status under certain<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; circumstancves IIRC.&nbsp; Standard Russian units have a morale of<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 7, meaning that they would have to roll 7- on 2D6 to maintain<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; morale (with a DM of -0 to -4 depending on the effectiveness of<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; firepower directed at them, and sometimes a DM of -1 to +3 for<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; a leader).&nbsp; Elite Russians have a morale of 8 and some others<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; have 6 or even 5, but any could go Berserk.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I happen to use SL as the basis for my own morale rules, and<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; vehicle combat, and battles between companies.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 15:31:54 -0800<BR>From: "Trent Smith" &lt;trentfs@ix.netcom.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: New to the list<BR><BR>Robert A. Smith II wrote:<BR>&gt; Hello TML.&nbsp; After several months of surfing through the TML archives, I<BR>&gt; finally joined.&nbsp; I just have a quick question.<BR>&gt;<BR>Welcome aboard!<BR><BR>&gt; IMTU, psionics are under the jurisdiction of Psi Corps.&nbsp; Besides, the<BR>Order<BR>&gt; of Zar Tis on Freelance Traveller are there any other prior career tables<BR>&gt; for psionics?<BR><BR>There's a career path for Psionicists in the T4 main rulebook (in the<BR>Psionics chapter, not char-gen).&nbsp; There's also the T4 book 'Psionic<BR>Institutes;' recently acclaimed one of the best T4 books, and well worth a<BR>look if you're interested in that aspect of the game.&nbsp; Someone else already<BR>mentioned SORAG (non-canonical book of Zhodani Secret Agents published by<BR>Paranoia Press in 1981; very long out-of-print, but there are still copies<BR>floating about on ebay and such).<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 15:43:18 -0800<BR>From: "Trent Smith" &lt;trentfs@ix.netcom.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Introduction<BR><BR>Ray Rangel wrote:<BR>&gt; I am new to RPGs. Though I'm primarily a historical miniatures gamer, I<BR>have<BR>&gt; been curious about Traveller since I saw it at a local game store back at<BR>in<BR>&gt; '80s.<BR><BR>Welcome aboard too!&nbsp; Wow, a whole flood of newbies.&nbsp; Let's see if we can not<BR>scare these guys off...<BR><BR>&gt; I haven't read enough yet to ask questions, but be assured they are<BR>coming.<BR>&gt; I hope you all will bear with me as I struggle to comprehend this game in<BR>a<BR>&gt; gaming vacuum.<BR>&gt;<BR>Traveller was designed by a bunch of long-time miniature/wargame designers,<BR>so if you've got a background there, making the switch shouldn't be too<BR>hard.&nbsp; Also, since you got the reprint edition you've got Loren Wiseman's<BR>'Introduction to Traveller,' a very valuable book.&nbsp; There's a school of<BR>thought that says people should start out with a 'simple' rpg (which usually<BR>means *D&amp;D) before moving on to the depth and complexity of something like<BR>Traveller, but I couldn't disagree more -- those games promote<BR>misconceptions that sometimes take years to break.&nbsp; You're in the right<BR>place; ask any and all questions you want -- I'm sure most of us are<BR>delighted enough that there are new people picking up the game that we won't<BR>mind re-answering even the oldest of questions (though we might point you to<BR>FAQs or archives for some...)<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 15:51:51 -0800<BR>From: "Trent Smith" &lt;trentfs@ix.netcom.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: I'm Confused<BR><BR>Ray Rangel&nbsp; wrote:<BR>&gt; I have also been searching for Traveller miniatures. With the resurgence<BR>of<BR>&gt; Traveller and the re-issue of Striker soon, that the 15mm miniatures would<BR>&gt; be in demand. Does Marc Miller retain the molds or masters for these<BR>&gt; figures?<BR>&gt;<BR>No Traveller miniatures were ever sold by GDW directly, they were all<BR>through licensees (Martian Metals and Grenadier, Rafm did some 25mm TNE<BR>minis in the early 90s) so I doubt that Marc Miller has any molds.&nbsp; SJG is<BR>now producing 'Ogre' minis and there's been speculation about a possible<BR>Traveller line as well, but those would likely be on a 25mm scale (to match<BR>the SJG deckplans and Cardboard Heroes).&nbsp; If you want 15mm Traveller minis<BR>you can look on ebay, where they're occasionally offered, but be warned --<BR>they don't go cheap!<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 22:04:20 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: I'm Confused<BR><BR>At 16:09 -0500 15/1/01,&nbsp; "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; BITS produce T4/generic products that are usable with GT and MT.<BR>&gt;Do they have a website?<BR><BR>Yes.<BR><BR>BITS http://www.bits.org.uk/<BR><BR>CORE (the writers group BITS grew from) http://www.core.org.uk/<BR><BR>Product information is also available at http://www.warehouse23.com/ <BR>where you can also mail order.<BR><BR>You can also mail order in the UK from http://www.leisuregames.co.uk/ <BR>(if this doesn't work try .com not .co.uk<BR><BR>BITS books (with the exception of the Bibliographies) typically <BR>retail at 5 GBP / $8 USD and are around 50 pages long, same size as <BR>the Little Black Books.<BR><BR>Dom (BITS Webmaster)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 22:06:27 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>At 16:09 -0500 15/1/01,&nbsp; "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Actually, the jdegraff@pacbell.net address is my HOME address through my DSL<BR>&gt;service, and jedegraf@cisco.com is my WORK address (and get in line, I get<BR>&gt;one first ;)&nbsp; I get the list in both places so I can keep up with it<BR>&gt;(mostly)!!&nbsp; You can easily reach me at either address.&nbsp; Be warned about my<BR>&gt;home address though.&nbsp; I've been getting so much spam lately from data-mining<BR>&gt;of pacbell.net addresses that I HAVE missed messages before in all the<BR>&gt;clutter.<BR><BR>Jesse,<BR><BR>Did you get my recent one re D3ID? or was it lost in the noise?<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 22:10:45 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re:Hello All<BR><BR>At 16:09 -0500 15/1/01,&nbsp; "Jonathan" &lt;thegreatkraken@postmark.net&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;I've just joined the list and I play G:T but I have a few qustions:<BR>&gt;- - What is GRIP?<BR><BR><BR><BR>A system to roleplay online.<BR><BR>&gt;- - What G:T books have been brought out?<BR><BR>Have a look at http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/<BR><BR>(that's a guess URL)<BR><BR>GURPS Traveller (1st &amp; 2nd Eds)<BR>Behind the Claw<BR>Rim of Fire<BR>First In<BR>Star Mercs<BR>Ground Forces<BR>Far Trader<BR>Starports<BR>Alien Races 1 - Vargr and Zhodani<BR>Alien Races 2 - Alsan and K'Kree<BR>Alien Races 3 - Droyne and Hivers<BR>DeckPlans 1 - Beowulf class Free Trader<BR><BR>Also look at the new JTAS http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 00:00:12 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re:I'm Confused<BR><BR>At 16:09 -0500 15/1/01,&nbsp;&nbsp; "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Although I recently bought the Classic Traveller reprints, I'm still<BR>&gt;somewhat confused about the various versions. What's more, judging by web<BR>&gt;presence, that popularity seems fairly well split between Classic Traveller<BR>&gt;and GURPS Traveller. What T4 is, I have no idea. There are some other little<BR>&gt;things like confusion over whether the BITS books are Classic or GURPS<BR>&gt;compatible (or both).<BR><BR>BITS books are generic Traveller books. The ones with stats <BR>(Lifeforms, Travellers) are T4 based, but T4 is so close to MT and CT <BR>that the stats can be used pretty much straight away (skills may be a <BR>little higher than Bk 2 but not too far from MT and Bks4-7).<BR><BR>Religions, Plots, Patrons, Cargos, Rendezvous all have no stats and <BR>are usable in almost all Traveller eras with all rules.<BR><BR>The two adventures have T4 and GT stats.<BR><BR>GT and TNE have conversion rules from previous editions.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 19:12:31 -0500<BR>From: "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR><BR>- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----<BR>Hash: SHA1<BR><BR><BR>&gt;Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 20:03 +0000 (GMT)<BR>&gt;From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;In-Reply-To: &lt;5.0.2.1.0.20010114222200.00a36880@mail.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Greetings dear hearts.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What's this then? Sounds like a TV game show...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Eeek. What a thing to dump your players in. They'd hate you :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Hugs and kisses,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Mexal.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR><BR>This is true.&nbsp; It'll&nbsp; probably be covered under the Geneva Convention at <BR>some point. =)<BR><BR>Cheers<BR><BR><BR>- - ---<BR>==============================================================<BR>Jonathan McDermott, CNE/MCSE&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; NOSPAMcaraig@mindspring.com<BR>System Administrator&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http:\\caraig.home.mindspring.com<BR>- - ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Anubis@SpatialWastes -*- Caraig,Dermott@FurryMUCK<BR>IMTU tc+ tn t4 ge++ -3i+ c+(**) jt pi+ va+ dr+ pr+ zh+() so@<BR>- - ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; "Never trust a computer you can't throw out a window."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -Steve Wozniak<BR>- -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----<BR>Version: PGPfreeware 6.5.3 for non-commercial use &lt;http://www.pgp.com&gt;<BR><BR>iQA/AwUBOmOR76kDj0qRvl0FEQKhvQCePK5QLyxx1MU6ezSgfKfBOvxFpYIAnis9<BR>PECY7khj+OVsdGNMeDrLB7/r<BR>=bW74<BR>- -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 16:19:51 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>No, but I've been thinking about that project.&nbsp; Meant to devote last weekend<BR>to it, but found out an airsoft game I thought was next weekend was last<BR>weekend.&nbsp; Next weekend though!<BR><BR>Resend your mail to me here at work!!<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Dominic Mooney<BR>&gt; Sent: Monday, January 15, 2001 2:06 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; At 16:09 -0500 15/1/01,&nbsp; "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Actually, the jdegraff@pacbell.net address is my HOME address<BR>&gt; through my DSL<BR>&gt; &gt;service, and jedegraf@cisco.com is my WORK address (and get in<BR>&gt; line, I get<BR>&gt; &gt;one first ;)&nbsp; I get the list in both places so I can keep up with it<BR>&gt; &gt;(mostly)!!&nbsp; You can easily reach me at either address.&nbsp; Be<BR>&gt; warned about my<BR>&gt; &gt;home address though.&nbsp; I've been getting so much spam lately from<BR>&gt; data-mining<BR>&gt; &gt;of pacbell.net addresses that I HAVE missed messages before in all the<BR>&gt; &gt;clutter.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Jesse,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Did you get my recent one re D3ID? or was it lost in the noise?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Cheers,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Dom<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3525<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-za03.mx.aol.com (rly-za03.mail.aol.com [172.31.36.99]) by air-za03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Mon, 15 Jan 2001 19:20:30 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-za03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Mon, 15 Jan 2001 19:20:00 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id TAA58301;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 15 Jan 2001 19:19:27 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 15 Jan 2001 19:19:19 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id TAA58255<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 15 Jan 2001 19:19:18 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 19:19:18 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101160019.TAA58255@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3525<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3526</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/16/01 5:07:48 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 16 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3526<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>Lord of the Rings Preview<BR>Re: New to the list<BR>Re: New to the list<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>Re: New to the list<BR>T5 'playtest'?<BR>Re: New to the list<BR>re:I'm Confused<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR>Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR>Re: Morale<BR>re: 15mm miniatures<BR>re: I'm Confused<BR>RE: Introduction<BR>Re: I'm Confused<BR>RE: Solitaire?<BR>RE: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR>Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR>Re: Solitaire?<BR>Re: T5 'playtest'?<BR>Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR>TNE ML (was: I'm Confused)<BR>RE: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR>RE: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>RE: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>RE: Ginger<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 00:30:17 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>At 19:19 -0500 15/1/01,&nbsp; "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;No, but I've been thinking about that project.&nbsp; Meant to devote last weekend<BR>&gt;to it, but found out an airsoft game I thought was next weekend was last<BR>&gt;weekend.&nbsp; Next weekend though!<BR><BR>Cheers...<BR><BR>&gt;Resend your mail to me here at work!!<BR><BR>Done.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 18:38:46 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Lord of the Rings Preview<BR><BR>I saw the preview for the Lord of the Rings trilogy last night.<BR><BR>Wow.<BR><BR>It's looks like they're finally going to do it right.<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 20:12:32 -0500<BR>From: "Robert A. Smith II" &lt;rsmith@rasinsurance.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: New to the list<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Hello TML.&nbsp; After several months of surfing through the TML archives, I<BR>&gt; &gt; finally joined.&nbsp; I just have a quick question.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; IMTU, psionics are under the jurisdiction of Psi Corps.&nbsp; Besides, the<BR>Order<BR>&gt; &gt; of Zar Tis on Freelance Traveller are there any other prior career<BR>tables<BR>&gt; &gt; for psionics?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Not specifically that I'm aware of, but it's an assignment for SORAG<BR>&gt; operatives.<BR><BR>Ok, I give.&nbsp; What the heck is SORAG?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 20:22:52 -0500<BR>From: "Robert A. Smith II" &lt;rsmith@rasinsurance.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: New to the list<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Hello TML.&nbsp; After several months of surfing through the TML archives, I<BR>&gt; &gt; finally joined.&nbsp; I just have a quick question.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; Welcome aboard!<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; IMTU, psionics are under the jurisdiction of Psi Corps.&nbsp; Besides, the<BR>&gt; Order<BR>&gt; &gt; of Zar Tis on Freelance Traveller are there any other prior career<BR>tables<BR>&gt; &gt; for psionics?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; There's a career path for Psionicists in the T4 main rulebook (in the<BR>&gt; Psionics chapter, not char-gen).&nbsp; There's also the T4 book 'Psionic<BR>&gt; Institutes;' recently acclaimed one of the best T4 books, and well worth a<BR>&gt; look if you're interested in that aspect of the game.&nbsp; Someone else<BR>already<BR>&gt; mentioned SORAG (non-canonical book of Zhodani Secret Agents published by<BR>&gt; Paranoia Press in 1981; very long out-of-print, but there are still copies<BR>&gt; floating about on ebay and such).<BR><BR>I'll have to reread the T4 main book tonight.&nbsp; As for 'Psionic Institutes',<BR>I never picked it up.&nbsp; Guess that means the wife will have to add it to my<BR>birthday wishlist. :) (Dear, are you paying attention?)&nbsp; Have to add the<BR>Paranoia Press book as well.&nbsp; It'll look nice sitting next to 'Scouts &amp;<BR>Assassins'.<BR><BR>Thanks,<BR>Angus<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 12:29:32 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Doug wrote:<BR>&gt;I have to tell you this: I take a<BR>&gt;heavy dose of Dilantin to control seizures.<BR><BR>Well, _that's_ an obvious typo, especially when you hail from Vland.<BR><BR>You meant a heavy dose of _Bilanidin_, didn't you?<BR><BR>;-) ;-) ;-)<BR><BR>- - Hyphen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 02:11:50 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: New to the list<BR><BR>on 16/1/01 1:12 am, Robert A. Smith II at rsmith@rasinsurance.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Hello TML.&nbsp; After several months of surfing through the TML archives, I<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; finally joined.&nbsp; I just have a quick question.<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; IMTU, psionics are under the jurisdiction of Psi Corps.&nbsp; Besides, the<BR>&gt; Order<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; of Zar Tis on Freelance Traveller are there any other prior career<BR>&gt; tables<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; for psionics?<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Not specifically that I'm aware of, but it's an assignment for SORAG<BR>&gt;&gt; operatives.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Ok, I give.&nbsp; What the heck is SORAG?<BR><BR>"SORAG (pronounced SOAR-ag) is a special purpose division of the Zhodani<BR>Consulate Combined Interstellar Forces. The name is an acronym for Study and<BR>Operations Recording Activities Group." p1, SORAG by Paranoia Press, 1981.<BR>Author Chuck Kallenbach II. 26 pages.<BR><BR>I've got the pink cover Games Workshop (UK) reprint of the same year. The<BR>psionics treatment is minor frankly. If you're a big fan of Classic<BR>Traveller, and not a canon-nazi it's worth having. But probably only at a<BR>reasonable price.<BR><BR>I just picked up the T4 Psionic Institutes today (as well as First Survey<BR>and the core rulebook) which has lots of neat rules, though I've yet to read<BR>through it all, damn this work thing.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 02:34:46 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: T5 'playtest'?<BR><BR>Somebody (Dom?) mentioned that the T4 rules were worth a go, particularly if<BR>you got hold of the T5 playtest or something? What's that, and can I get it,<BR>and from where? I like the idea of writing a Milieu 0 campaign.<BR><BR>Also, is the T4 FFS anything like the one that's in my largely untouched TNE<BR>box set?<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR>(Still trying to figure out how to trade a Lombard for a new G4 PowerBook)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 20:40:24 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: New to the list<BR><BR>On 01/15/01 at 08:22 PM,&nbsp; "Robert A. Smith II" &lt;rsmith@rasinsurance.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;I'll have to reread the T4 main book tonight.&nbsp; As for 'Psionic<BR>&gt;Institutes', I never picked it up.&nbsp; Guess that means the wife will<BR>&gt;have to add it to my birthday wishlist. :) (Dear, are you paying<BR>&gt;attention?)&nbsp; Have to add the Paranoia Press book as well.&nbsp; It'll<BR>&gt;look nice sitting next to 'Scouts &amp; Assassins'.<BR><BR>Not to mention that other Paranoia Press classic, _Merchants &amp;<BR>Merchandise_, right?&nbsp; I had all three out looking at them just<BR>the other day. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 18:25:33<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re:I'm Confused<BR><BR>At 12:00 AM 1/16/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;BITS books are generic Traveller books. The ones with stats <BR>&gt;(Lifeforms, Travellers) are T4 based, but T4 is so close to MT and CT <BR>&gt;that the stats can be used pretty much straight away (skills may be a <BR>&gt;little higher than Bk 2 but not too far from MT and Bks4-7).<BR><BR>*ahem*<BR><BR>At Close Quarters is an expanded personal combat system designed originally<BR>for T4, but which is usable with other versions.<BR><BR>Hey, if I don't toot my own horn, who will?<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 18:31:20<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>At 12:29 PM 1/16/2001 +1100, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Dear Folks -<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Doug wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;I have to tell you this: I take a<BR>&gt;&gt;heavy dose of Dilantin to control seizures.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Well, _that's_ an obvious typo, especially when you hail from Vland.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;You meant a heavy dose of _Bilanidin_, didn't you?<BR><BR>Damn you.&nbsp; Kirsten saw that, and she handed me my pills and said "you need<BR>to take your language lesson."<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 18:39:51<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR><BR>At 08:03 PM 1/15/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;In-Reply-To: &lt;5.0.2.1.0.20010114222200.00a36880@mail.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Greetings dear hearts.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What's this then? Sounds like a TV game show...<BR><BR>It is.&nbsp; A US version of the BBC's "Castaway" and a Swedish(?) show.<BR><BR>The idea: 16 people are stranded in a remote location for 39 days.&nbsp; Every<BR>few days, they gather together to vote one of their own out of the group.<BR>There are challenges (competitions) to earn special items (like real food)<BR>and immunity from being voted out.<BR><BR>When it gets down to the final eight, the people voted out act as a jury to<BR>decide between the final two contestants.&nbsp; The winner gets 1 million dollars.<BR><BR>The first season was smash success here, and phrases liked "voted off the<BR>island" and "the tribe has spoken" instantly entered the language.&nbsp; The<BR>eventual winner was Richard Hatch, a corporate trainer who had the<BR>disconcerting habit of walking around naked.&nbsp; I was cheering for Rudy, one<BR>of the original Navy SEALS and one tough old fart.<BR><BR>The show is addictive.&nbsp; Along with the stunning visuals (the first season<BR>was filmed on an Indonesian island), the voyeuristic pleasure of watching a<BR>live-action Lord of the Flies as this people plot, scheme and back-stab<BR>each other..<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp;&nbsp; Templar Agent at Large.<BR>gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR><BR>TravGeekCode: <BR>tc+ tm+ !tn- t4@ ?tg+ tt@ to(CORPS)++ ru@ $ge++ 3i<BR>ii+ au st+ ls+ pi kk+ so(++) va++ dr+ zh+ sw++ ?da<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 01:20:25 EST<BR>From: RBasler1@aol.com<BR>Subject: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/15/01 5:38:31 AM Pacific Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR>&lt;&lt; From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Traveller survivors<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt; <BR>Hm, this sounds like a good idea to use in a Traveller live action game...<BR><BR>Maybe after I get my plans for the previous Traveller live done...<BR>(Anybody have any ideas how to prop a Hiver, preferably with player<BR>inside?&nbsp; &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Well, anything reasonably affordable is going to look like a player in a <BR>suit, because our all-too-human limbs just don't bend that way, but here is a <BR>basic idea -(warning, this is just some nutty brainstorming -&nbsp; it might not <BR>work, and it might look atrocious):<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Get some sort of footstool that is on casters, or take the back off the <BR>lowest rolling computer chair you can find and have the player lay over it <BR>with their chest resting on the chair.&nbsp; The Hiver costume then is constructed <BR>from large sheets of ensolite foam and coathanger-wire hoops.&nbsp; If you want to <BR>get a little fancier, cover the ensolite with a flesh-colored spandex sheath <BR>to hide the blue foam, glue, and duct tape.&nbsp; If you want to get really fancy, <BR>slather liquid latex all over the spandex to make a nice "skin", and paint <BR>with latex or cell vinyl paint.&nbsp; Have the player stick an arm or leg into <BR>four of the limbs and use them to drag themselves around, rolling about on <BR>the chair (this costume would probably only work well indoors).&nbsp; They'd have <BR>to let the 'tail' limb drag, and keep the 'head' propped up in a 'striking <BR>cobra' position using several lengths of 10ga wire or delrin rod (bendable <BR>when hot, springy when cool), and keep the whole costume loose enough that <BR>the player's arm could be pulled inside and switched to the 'head' to operate <BR>the 'fingers' like a handpuppet.&nbsp; If you have two hivers, give them the most <BR>affordable 2-way headset radios you can find and have them wave their <BR>'fingers' to their heart's content while talking softly to each other via the <BR>radio.&nbsp; As for the communicator boxes they use to speak to non-hivers, if you <BR>want to get fancy, use a lavalier mike and a "Pignose" amplifier (yes, that's <BR>the brand name) in the prop computer.&nbsp; A Pignose is self-contained, runs off <BR>batteries (4 D-cells or something like that, I haven't used mine in ages and <BR>can't remember), and smaller than a shoebox.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Run a search on "Fursuit" or "Fursuiting", there are a lot of folks that <BR>are into the construction of elaborate anthropomorphic costumes, and there <BR>are a number of good websites on construction techniques.&nbsp; A good FAQ used to <BR>be at http://sr8.xoom.com/rsg0910/faq/ , but it may have changed.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Good luck, and be sure to send me some pictures of what you come up with, <BR>and feel free to email me off-list if you want to talk in more detail; <BR>special effects and makeup are hobbies of mine.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Rod Basler, COFIT.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 22:46:49 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Morale<BR><BR>&gt;From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Morale<BR>...<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I happen to use SL as the basis for my own morale rules, and<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; vehicle combat, and battles between companies.<BR><BR>&nbsp; It sounds like IYTU the mega-corps take competition kinda seriously?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 22:50:37 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: re: 15mm miniatures<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;&gt; I have also been searching for Traveller miniatures. With the resurgence of<BR>&gt;&gt; Traveller and the re-issue of Striker soon, that the 15mm miniatures would<BR>&gt;&gt; be in demand. Does Marc Miller retain the molds or masters for these figures?<BR><BR>&nbsp; FWIW, try:<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.polomania.com/stan/15mm.htm<BR><BR>&nbsp; The human adventurers and the little lizards look good; most of the<BR>other stuff on the site I wouldn't buy, though.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 23:05:16 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: re: I'm Confused<BR><BR>&gt;From: "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: I'm Confused<BR>...<BR>&gt;I have also been searching for Traveller miniatures. With the resurgence of<BR>&gt;Traveller and the re-issue of Striker soon, that the 15mm miniatures would<BR>&gt;be in demand. Does Marc Miller retain the molds or masters for these figures?<BR><BR>&nbsp; Citadel (aka "Pudding Workshop") has the good 15mm molds, and doesn't<BR>give a rats ass about making them available.<BR><BR>&nbsp; Grenadiers 25mm masters presumably are in the possession of the Italian<BR>company "Stratelibri" ( www. stratelibri.com IIRC).<BR><BR>&nbsp; RAFM has its own molds for the 25mm TNE figures, which are quite good.<BR>Ironically, although I'm complete for 25's I prefer the 15's.<BR><BR>&nbsp; As for the other 15mm's, I don't see why anyone should care, mostly...<BR>... except the K'kows, they were kool.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Steven Hudson<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 23:33:29 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: RE: Introduction<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Good choice.&nbsp; Repeat after me: "There is only one Traveller, and<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; High Guard is it's product."<BR><BR>&nbsp; Latitudinarian! Burn, heretic*!<BR><BR>The CT Creed: "There is no Game but Traveller, and High Guard is its Product"<BR><BR>&nbsp; * note "heretic", not "Heretic" - Eris is off the hook here...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 00:43:10 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: I'm Confused<BR><BR>&gt;From: "Trent Smith" &lt;trentfs@ix.netcom.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: I'm Confused<BR>...<BR>&gt;No Traveller miniatures were ever sold by GDW directly, they were all<BR>&gt;through licensees (Martian Metals and Grenadier, Rafm did some 25mm TNE<BR>&gt;minis in the early 90s) so I doubt that Marc Miller has any molds.&nbsp; SJG is<BR><BR>&nbsp; Rafm also did the TNE ships - both starships and small craft, including<BR>most of the CT stalwarts and a number of the TNE items - mostly Regency.<BR><BR>&gt;now producing 'Ogre' minis and there's been speculation about a possible<BR>&gt;Traveller line as well, but those would likely be on a 25mm scale (to match<BR>&gt;the SJG deckplans and Cardboard Heroes). <BR><BR>&nbsp; That would be _very_ cool.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 22:13:51 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Solitaire?<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Ray Rangel<BR>&gt; Sent: Tuesday, 16 January 2001 05:09<BR>&gt; To: Traveller<BR>&gt; Subject: Solitaire?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; There is made mention of "solitaire" Traveller in the CT reprints. Is this<BR>&gt; really possible? How does one go about playing an RPG by one's self?<BR><BR>It's not really an RPG, but it is possible.<BR><BR>Generate a Merchant, and make sure he or she has a ship.<BR>Then just jump around playing the trading game and having random ship<BR>encounters, playing "MayDay" against yourself when the ship encounters are<BR>hostile.<BR><BR>Or you can just keep generating characters, and making up stories about them<BR>that fit the generation rolls.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 22:31:40 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry wrote :<BR><BR>&gt; The show is addictive.&nbsp; Along with the stunning visuals (the first season<BR>&gt; was filmed on an Indonesian island), the voyeuristic pleasure of<BR>&gt; watching a live-action Lord of the Flies as this people plot, scheme and<BR>back-stab<BR>&gt; each other..<BR><BR>Hmm, personally I don't find this "reality TV" stuff even remotely<BR>interesting,<BR>other than perhaps the stuff on "stupid criminals", whcih can be really<BR>hilarious.<BR><BR>On the other hand, the program "Survival" is good, it's been one of the most<BR>educational programs I've seen on TV recently. While it was hyped to appeal<BR>to the same sort who liked "Survivors", it's actually got extremely good<BR>information on how to survive in a variety of different climates, and even I<BR>learned a couple of things from it, specifically from some Scandinavian<BR>special forces survival instructor.<BR><BR>When anyone asks me if I've seen "Survivors" I always say<BR>"Oh, that 1970's BBC series about most of the planet dying of a<BR>bio-engineered disease?"<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 23:11:25 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR><BR>On 15 Jan 01, at 0:50, Dalton Spence wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Is there any formal definition of the bureaucratic structure of the<BR>&gt; Third Imperium from the ministry level on down? The four ministries<BR>&gt; I can think of offhand are Commerce, Defense*, Finance and Justice,<BR>&gt; with the Imperial Interstellar Scout Service existing outside this<BR>&gt; hierarchy. (*The MoD consists of "the Imperial Navy, the Unified<BR>&gt; Armies of the Imperium, and the Imperial Marine Force." [GT:GF p.5])<BR><BR>Things you *need* for a functioning government. Somebody to keep the <BR>books (Ministry of Finance/Treasury). Somebody to talk to non-hostile <BR>foreigners (Ministy of Foreign Affairs/State). Somebody to deal with hostile <BR>foreigners (Defence). Somebody to make sure your citizens can talk to one <BR>another (Post Office). Somebody to play umpire between your citizens <BR>(Court System). Somebody to stop your citizens from killing each other or <BR>changing government unexpectedly (Law Enforcement). Somebody to write <BR>things down (Record Keeping) and somebody to make sure everyone <BR>knows what you mean when you say "give me five kilos of Groat meat" <BR>Standards). This is pretty much the *minimum* requirements.<BR><BR>Therefore we can safely say that the Imperium has a Treasury, Ministry of <BR>Foreign Affairs, Minstry of Defence, Ministry of Justice (this seems to <BR>include Courts and Law Enforcement, a bit unusual). Ministry of Commerce <BR>(these do some internal communication and standards with the Starport <BR>Authority and trade regulation). The IISS (these do internal comms and <BR>some standards). The Office of Calendar Compliance (Standards, though <BR>does this office fall under some other ministry?). Collage of Heralds <BR>(Record Keeping and possibly some standards). Other ministries may be <BR>added (Colonisation is mentioned), but are not strictly needed. As a rough <BR>guide, when dealing with a state with the communication difficulties of the <BR>Imperium, the fewer ministries, the better things will work (this may be why <BR>the courts and law enforcement have been combined into one).<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 23:11:25 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solitaire?<BR><BR>On 15 Jan 01, at 11:09, Ray Rangel wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; There is made mention of "solitaire" Traveller in the CT reprints. Is this<BR>&gt; really possible? How does one go about playing an RPG by one's self?<BR><BR>Well, other people have made reference to the fun of rolling up characters, <BR>running random encounters (I find this best in a merchant prince type <BR>settings) etc. But wait there's more. One of the Traveller double adventures <BR>(Marooned Alone, Dbl Adv 4 IIRC) is designed with solitaire play in mind <BR>and includes notes on how to do so. Also Supplement 6 (76 Patrons) has <BR>a section at the end of adventure seeds suitable for a single adventurer, all <BR>of which can be adapted for solitaire play with a little work. And in my <BR>experience, most of the published adventures can be made into solitaire <BR>games with a dint of effort (though sometimes you need to run multiple <BR>characters).<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 11:48:51 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: T5 'playtest'?<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR>&gt; Also, is the T4 FFS anything like the one that's in my largely untouched TNE<BR>&gt; box set?<BR><BR>Yes, but a bit updated. Adn smoe typoes ar addded.<BR><BR>I would recommend getting the errata as well. It clarifies a lot of<BR>things.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 11:51:17 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR><BR>"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>&gt; It is.&nbsp; A US version of the BBC's "Castaway" and a Swedish(?) show.<BR><BR>If I am correctly informed, the original show ("Robinsson") is Swedish.<BR>At least it has been showing here for a number of seasons already.<BR><BR>&gt; The first season was smash success here, and phrases liked "voted off the<BR>&gt; island" and "the tribe has spoken" instantly entered the language.<BR><BR>Over here, that last phrase entered the language a looong time ago&nbsp; :-)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 12:09:23 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: TNE ML (was: I'm Confused)<BR><BR>David C. Broussard wrote:<BR>&gt; What is the ML for TNE?<BR><BR>I'm not sure this is right, but try sending a&nbsp; subscribe&nbsp; message<BR>to:&nbsp; tne-rces-subscribe@tower-ml.org<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 12:34:16 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; What's this then? Sounds like a TV game show...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; It is.&nbsp; A US version of the BBC's "Castaway" and a Swedish(?)<BR>&gt; show.<BR><BR>Minor point of correction:<BR><BR>The BBC's "Castaway" show did involve dumping a load of people on<BR>a remote island (for a year)&nbsp; but&nbsp; the&nbsp; purpose&nbsp; was&nbsp; to&nbsp; form&nbsp; a<BR>community.&nbsp; No one was voted off, but some people left before the<BR>year was up.&nbsp; There was no 'winner', and no&nbsp; 'cash&nbsp; prize'.&nbsp; This<BR>was similar to a 70s BBC series called&nbsp; "Living In The Past"&nbsp; but<BR>with more personality clashes and a less clearly defined goal and<BR>boundaries.<BR><BR>Channel 4's "Big Brother"&nbsp; was&nbsp; closer&nbsp; to&nbsp; the&nbsp; US&nbsp; show.&nbsp; There<BR>several people were put in a house which was&nbsp; isolated&nbsp; from&nbsp; the<BR>outside&nbsp; world&nbsp; and&nbsp; filled&nbsp; with&nbsp; CCTV&nbsp; cameras&nbsp;&nbsp; that&nbsp;&nbsp; watched<BR>*everything*.&nbsp; Despite the group of&nbsp; contestants&nbsp; voting&nbsp; someone<BR>out the house each week actually conspiring to remove someone was<BR>considered cheating.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 12:47:22 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>&gt; David C. Broussard wrote :<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; You know after a long time waiting for T4...when it did come out,<BR>&gt; &gt; and I got<BR>&gt; &gt; one of those Signed Hardback copies, it was such a load of <BR>&gt; dung...my vote<BR>&gt; &gt; for the main book as the worst...cause without it...the rest<BR>&gt; &gt; would not have happened.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Here's a laugh for you alll, this from the latest Titan Games <BR>&gt; mail out :<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Imperium Games, Inc:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (T4: Mark Miller's Traveller)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Marc Miller's Traveller (1100A) (Hardcover) <BR>&gt; (autographed by<BR>&gt; Marc Miller) [$48.5, XF]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Traveller: Milieu 0 (5) (1400S) [$17, NM]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Traveller: First Survey 6 (1401S) [$17, NM]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Traveller: Game Screen (1510) [$12.5, NM]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Traveller: Pocket Empires 8 (1600) [$17, NM]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Traveller: Amomalies 9 (1700) [$17, NM]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Traveller: Fire, Fusion &amp; Steel (B) (1720) [$18, NM]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Traveller: Emperor's Vehicles (C) (1730) [$18, NM]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Traveller: Imperial Squadrons E (1750) [$18, NM]<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; They'll be lucky, huh ?<BR><BR><BR>Ye Ghods, I don't think even Quincey Kozial would have charged those process<BR>while he owned Titan. If anyone wants T4 books in the UK Esdevium in<BR>Aldershot has a whole bunch of unsold books for a couple of pounds each<BR>(they've been at Bargain basement prices for weeks now :) )<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 12:48:29 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>David C. Broussard wrote:<BR>&gt; BTW: Anyone know of any groups out there for 2300ad?<BR><BR>Look for "2300ad" and "2300tech" on www.egroups.com<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 12:58:07 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Ginger<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Frank put into the Ether:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Mark Urbin wrote :<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; My bet is on some kind of small transportation device.<BR>&gt; &gt;Ditto, I'd guess a bicycle or unicycle with the gyro stabilization<BR>&gt; &gt;technologyy and power source from the cros-country, staor-climbing<BR>&gt; &gt;wheelchair he built.<BR>&gt; &gt;Or, given his fascination with helicopters, a personal, strap-on<BR>&gt; &gt;helicopter-like contraption.<BR>&gt; &gt;(Which would explain the statement from Jeff Bezos (i thnk) <BR>&gt; that the only<BR>&gt; &gt;question is whether we'll be allowed to use them.)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; If it's a personal VTOL, then he beat these folks to the punch:<BR>&gt; http://www.solotrek.com/<BR><BR><BR>ABCNews yesterday published a statement by Kamen saying "We have a promising<BR>project, but nothing of the Earth-shattering nature that people are<BR>conjuring up," <BR><BR>http://abcnews.go.com/sections/scitech/DailyNews/itmystery010115.html<BR><BR>dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3526<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zc05.mx.aol.com (rly-zc05.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.5]) by air-zc02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:07:48 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zc05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:07:27 1900<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id IAA85434;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:02:32 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:00:18 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id IAA85387<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:00:18 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:00:18 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101161300.IAA85387@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3526<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3527</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/16/01 5:13:13 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 16 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3527<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3483<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 07:07:20 -0600<BR>From: Chuck Maddox &lt;cmaddox@xnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3483<BR><BR>&gt;Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Friday, December 29 2000&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3483<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>&gt;All rights reserved.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Re: Jump emergence<BR>&gt;Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>&gt;Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>&gt;Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>&gt;Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>&gt;Re: Traveller Space Combat System<BR>&gt;Re: Character-Defined Task Rolls<BR>&gt;Re: Character-Defined Task Rolls<BR>&gt;Re: Jump emergence<BR>&gt;Re: HazMat was ACQ was RE: BITS adventures...<BR>&gt;Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>&gt;Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>&gt;Re: Character-Defined Task Rolls<BR>&gt;Re: Character-Defined Task Rolls<BR>&gt;UNSUBSCRIBE<BR>&gt;Re: JJ0<BR>&gt;Re: JJ0<BR>&gt;RE: If MT were unknown...<BR>&gt;Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR>&gt;Re: System Traffic: Counting the Ships<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 12:15:06 +1100<BR>&gt;From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Jump emergence<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Thom Jones-Low wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Like how small a planetoid you can safely jump to. Given Marc<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Millers Jumpspace article variance of 3000 km in the emergence of a<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; jump 1 drive.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Where was this?&nbsp; I thought the variation was more on the order of a<BR>&gt;couple of hundred thousand km according to Marc?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;- --<BR>&gt;IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ <BR>&gt;as+ so- kk--<BR>&gt;Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 19:40:49 -0600<BR>&gt;From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; One problem: The KB3.34 skill options correspond to absolutely nothing<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; in the character world.&nbsp; It's just a dice-rolling decision which is<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; completely out of character.&nbsp; Fine for people who just like rolling<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; dice and playing with game mechanics of course, but less suited for<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; those who like to roleplay.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;You could look at it that way I guess.&nbsp; Or, you could look at it the way I do:<BR>&gt;Players are "pulled into" the action of the game world by actually <BR>&gt;experiencing<BR>&gt;decisions with their skills.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Players decide how best to use their skill and ability.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;If we accept that an attack roll in any RPG models the action of a character<BR>&gt;swinging a broadsword at his enemy, then KB3's skill options <BR>&gt;certainly model task<BR>&gt;decisions the character has to make in the same abstract way.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Mainly, though, dicing with KB3 is "fun".&nbsp; The "Gvoudzon's Run" post <BR>&gt;should show<BR>&gt;you that.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;If your character is an absolute expert, and he's got Skill-6, in <BR>&gt;most RPGs, like<BR>&gt;MT, you roll and add in your skill, and your roll is high, and that's it.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;There's nothing wrong with that.&nbsp; I like gaming that way too.&nbsp; And, <BR>&gt;I'm not saying<BR>&gt;that using KB3 is a "better way to go" than most "higher-is-better" systems.<BR>&gt;There's too many higher-is-better systems that I like out there.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What I am saying is that KB3 is another way to go with your gaming, <BR>&gt;and it's fun in<BR>&gt;its own right--the mechanics are actually fun, not just dead-head rolls.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Take your Skill-6 character above.&nbsp; Using KB3, a player gets to evaluate the<BR>&gt;difficulty of the task before him and tune his character's ability <BR>&gt;to best tackle<BR>&gt;that situation.&nbsp; More skill level gives you more options.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;If you've got a Skill-6, under KB3, you can throw 7 dice at task, if <BR>&gt;it is very<BR>&gt;hard to do (read:&nbsp; high target number).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Or, you can throw 1D at it, reducing your target number by 6.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Or, you can throw 1D at it, raising your stat for measuring <BR>&gt;purposes, attempting to<BR>&gt;achieve Greater Success.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Or, you can mix and match those options--whichever is appropriate to <BR>&gt;the situation.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Tim, I don't get anything out of it whether you use KB3 or not.&nbsp; I <BR>&gt;just know it is<BR>&gt;a good system, and I know it is fun to game with.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;If you'd give KB3 a fair shake and stop blindly shaking your head to it, you<BR>&gt;might...you just might...find yourself liking something that you <BR>&gt;can't accept now.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kenneth.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 19:41:00 -0600<BR>&gt;From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; I think we're up to around 50 versions of KB3 now, counting the<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; various combinations of modifiacations you've proposed to patch<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; various problems.&nbsp; Are you actually going to collect them into one<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; document?&nbsp; I'm sure I've missed a few dozen somewhere.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Well, no.&nbsp; There have been only two version of KB3 so far.&nbsp; And, the <BR>&gt;system is in<BR>&gt;playtesting, as I originally said when I released it to the list. <BR>&gt;The *aim* here<BR>&gt;*is* to work out any wrinkles.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I posted a several post series describing KB3 in detail when I first <BR>&gt;released it to<BR>&gt;the list.&nbsp; That was the first version.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Then, finding a few wrinkles, I posted a revised summary of the system that<BR>&gt;included three changes.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;That's two versions of KB3 released so far--the original, and the <BR>&gt;newest one with<BR>&gt;the three changes.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;And, *since* the system is in playtesting, it wouldn't bother me if <BR>&gt;there were 50<BR>&gt;versions of it.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The whole idea is to get it right.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;So far, I've been able to do that in two.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kenneth.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 19:41:13 -0600<BR>&gt;From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; We're throwing too much at it.&nbsp; We're wasting the character's energy<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; and ability.&nbsp; The "sweet spot" logic of the system is kicking in.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Bleh.&nbsp; "Sour spot" is more like it.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Tim,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Are you trying to get under my skin with comments like these?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Do you want to talk like two gamers discussing a system, or do you <BR>&gt;want to incite<BR>&gt;non-productive word fights?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I'd rather talk, agree to disagree on topics, and enjoy the <BR>&gt;conversation, myself.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kenneth.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 19:41:18 -0600<BR>&gt;From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Unfortunately it's worse than that.&nbsp; Additional skill in KB3 is not<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; just wasted, it actively detracts from level of success.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;No, they don't.&nbsp; As a player, you just have to use your resources<BR>&gt;intelligently--which is why dicing with KB3 is "fun".<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Here's the example lifted from the original post.&nbsp; As you can see, <BR>&gt;your success<BR>&gt;increases with your level--and you have choice in how you want your success<BR>&gt;increased.&nbsp; If you just need to tackle a large target number, roll all of your<BR>&gt;dice.&nbsp; Or, you may want to tailor your skill at the task at hand by <BR>&gt;using the KB3<BR>&gt;skill options.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;That's what is happening in the example here.&nbsp; There is a point <BR>&gt;where "number of<BR>&gt;dice" for success are traded to bring the target number down.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Joe Normal<BR>&gt;Average Throw of 7+<BR>&gt;GS made if throw is less than Stat-7<BR>&gt;KB3 skill option used on some throws.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Skill-0<BR>&gt;Throw 1D<BR>&gt;Task Success 0%&nbsp; (We're not using the E-Die in this example.)<BR>&gt;GS on 7-<BR>&gt;GS not possible.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Skill-1<BR>&gt;Throw 2D<BR>&gt;Task Success 58%<BR>&gt;GS on 7<BR>&gt;GS 17%<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Skill-2<BR>&gt;Throw 2D<BR>&gt;Reduce target number from 7+ to 6+.<BR>&gt;Task Success 72%<BR>&gt;GS on 6-7<BR>&gt;GS 31%<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Skill-3<BR>&gt;Throw 2D<BR>&gt;Reduce target number from 7+ to 5+.<BR>&gt;Task Success 83%<BR>&gt;GS on 5-6-7<BR>&gt;GS 42%<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Skill-4<BR>&gt;Throw 2D<BR>&gt;Reduce target number from 7+ to 4+.<BR>&gt;Task Success 92%<BR>&gt;GS on 4-5-6-7<BR>&gt;GS 50%<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Skill-5<BR>&gt;Throw 2D<BR>&gt;Reduce target number from 7+ to 3+.<BR>&gt;Task Success 97%<BR>&gt;GS on 3-4-5-6-7<BR>&gt;GS 56%<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Skill-6<BR>&gt;Throw 1D<BR>&gt;Reduce target number from 7+ to 1+.<BR>&gt;Task Success 100%<BR>&gt;GS on 1-2-3-4-5-67<BR>&gt;GS 100%<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;- ------------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;See.&nbsp; The more skilled you are, the better your chance of success.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kenneth.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 12:55:07 +1100<BR>&gt;From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Traveller Space Combat System<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Anthony Jackson wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; Wouldn't it be better to cast all results into a consistent<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; logarithmic base?&nbsp; e.g. 5 log10(Gs) - (5/3) log10(dTons) + 5?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Sure, but these are very close in meaning.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;No problem, this was more a a nitpick.&nbsp; :^)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; The problem is that the area of uncertainty isn't as great as you<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; think it is.&nbsp; My assumption is that evasion can be broken into<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; discrete 'legs', each of which involves moving far enough to evade<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; fire.&nbsp; If you use a perfect random algorithm for the movement in<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; each leg, the total distance moved will be roughly proportional to<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; the 3/2 power of the number of legs.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I'd rather make the 'known distance' case the base one, since its not<BR>&gt;going to be very often that a large number of ships engage at greatly<BR>&gt;differing distances.&nbsp; Make the short-range evasion case the special<BR>&gt;one.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The other matter is that even if you do use a 3/2-power rule, then the<BR>&gt;time-dependence changes in a way that your formula doesn't indicate.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; No it isn't.&nbsp; Wobbling is accelerating sideways, and if you have 1.0 G of<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; acceleration and want to go in a particular direction at 0.7 Gs, you can<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; reasonably move at 0.7 Gs sideways (pythagorean theorem) but can <BR>&gt;only freely<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; adjust your acceleration in the direction of travel by about 0.3 Gs.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;You are neglecting the ability to accelerate in a completely different<BR>&gt;direction for brief periods.&nbsp; This is enough to substantially widen<BR>&gt;the area in the direction of motion, even with a 0.7G-forward average.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Your assumption seems to be that of a continuous 0.7G component of<BR>&gt;acceleration in the desired direction, onto which are overlaid evasive<BR>&gt;0.7G accelerations in transverse directions and +- 0.3G in the forward<BR>&gt;direction.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; How the hell do you think you can get 86% in one direction and still<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; not more than half the uncertainty in position?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Oops, I was dividing by 2 twice.&nbsp; Sorry, double my numbers.&nbsp; Still<BR>&gt;quite different from yours at the high end, though.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;&nbsp; You've only got about 14% of play left in the direction of<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; acceleration (1/7) and 50% crosswise (1/2) for a total of 1/4 the<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; area from the front (-2)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;There are three problems here.&nbsp; One is that with anisotropic<BR>&gt;acceleration capacity, your "short-range" evasion model changes in a<BR>&gt;way that you didn't anticipate.&nbsp; The duration of your "legs" alters in<BR>&gt;the 'forward' direction, and you haven't allowed for that.&nbsp; The second<BR>&gt;is that with a high forward average component, it is not at all<BR>&gt;optimal to follow your assumed acceleration pattern -- you can do<BR>&gt;substantially better by evading in a non-ellipsoidal volume, and<BR>&gt;better still if you know where the enemy ship is.&nbsp; The third is that<BR>&gt;the formula relating area to evasion modifiers is 2.5log(area), which<BR>&gt;even with your area figures should give smaller modifiers than you<BR>&gt;typed.&nbsp; e.g. 1/14 area is -3, not -5.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; It does, but that's an abstraction for playability, and should not<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; be taken advantage of in terms of game mechanics.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;OK, but needles still have a disadvantage against multiple enemies<BR>&gt;compared with thin wedges and disks even in 3D.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;- --<BR>&gt;IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ <BR>&gt;as+ so- kk--<BR>&gt;Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 19:51:48 -0600<BR>&gt;From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Character-Defined Task Rolls<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; What makes his throw unique to him?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; The numbers he adds to the dice roll.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Did you read the example?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;If you've got a MT character with Dex-4, Pistol-0, there is nothing <BR>&gt;in the game to<BR>&gt;differintiate him from another character with Dex-1, Pistol-0.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;It's a straight, generic, 2D6 roll with NOTHING tied to that character.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;It's like dicing for armies in Risk.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;If you go with T4, you DO have a system tied to the characters--in fact their<BR>&gt;target numbers are defined by the characters.&nbsp; So there is a BIG <BR>&gt;difference between<BR>&gt;a Dex-4, Pistol-0 character and his poor, shot up shipmate who's got a Dex-1,<BR>&gt;Pistol-0.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;But, in T4, stats greatly overpower skills, so...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I've created KB3 where you can have a character with Dex-4, Pistol-0, and his<BR>&gt;ability to succeed on a task is defined by his skill and measured by his stat.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;It's not a generic 2D6 roll.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;And this character is unique compared to his shot up shipmate with a Dex-1,<BR>&gt;Pistol-0.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;MT is a GENERIC roll system modified by the character.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;T4 is a CHARACTER-DEFINED system, but stats over power skills.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;KB3 is a CHARCTER-DEFINED system, but unlike T4, there is not powerful stat<BR>&gt;problem.&nbsp; Skills and Stats have different jobs, although those jobs are<BR>&gt;interconnected.&nbsp; Skills define your chance of success.&nbsp; Stats <BR>&gt;measure your success<BR>&gt;or failure.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kenneth.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 19:55:20 -0600<BR>&gt;From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Character-Defined Task Rolls<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; What about the difficulty is unique to Michael?&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Nothing.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Nothing in KB3, either.&nbsp; (Unless you've got a KB3.51 I haven't seen)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What are you talking about?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The throw a character makes in KB3 is DEFINED by his skill level.&nbsp; It's not<BR>&gt;generic.&nbsp; It's not a 2D6 roll that every character gets.&nbsp; It's tied to the<BR>&gt;character.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The character's Stat MEASURES the character's success or failure.&nbsp; It's not<BR>&gt;generic.&nbsp; It's tied to the character.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;How many ways do I have to show you that?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kenneth.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 22:58:08 -0500<BR>&gt;From: Thom Jones-Low &lt;tjoneslo@together.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Jump emergence<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; I'm not finished beating a dead horse yet. I went back through my<BR>&gt;physics texts and references and did a little more math.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; The Tidal Acceleration is what limit the safe use of the jump drive.<BR>&gt;Tidal acceleration is calculated by the formula:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; Ta = (G * M / R^3) * h<BR>&gt;Where:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; G = Gravitational Constant 6.67E-11<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; M = Mass of the planet, star or other mass (kg)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; R = Radius from the center of the mass (m)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; h = separation of the object (m)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; The formula's units are acceleration (m/s^2).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; The Tidal acceleration is dependent upon the separation of the points<BR>&gt;in space. But not on the size of the starship, but rather the size of<BR>&gt;the opening into jump space. By assuming this opening is spherical and<BR>&gt;the same size regardless of the size of the jumping ship, h becomes a<BR>&gt;constant.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; The effect of the Tidal acceleration pulls the jump gate sphere apart<BR>&gt;along a radial line between the jump gate and the central mass, and<BR>&gt;compress it along the other two axies. If the jump opening becomes too<BR>&gt;distorted while the ship is making the transition, bad things happen.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; The fixed size of the jump opening creates an upper limit on the size<BR>&gt;of a jump capable starship. A 1,000,000 dTon sphere is 296 meters in<BR>&gt;diameter. So if the jump space opening is a little over 300 meters in<BR>&gt;diameter, you can build 1M dTon jump capable ships, but it become<BR>&gt;dangerous or difficult to build them larger. The Tigress, at 500 kDtons<BR>&gt;and 235 meters in diameter is probably about as large as the Naval<BR>&gt;architects want to get.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;- --<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thomas Jones-Low<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; tjoneslo@together.net<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 20:43:17 -0600<BR>&gt;From: Charles R Hensley &lt;hensley.cr@gte.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: HazMat was ACQ was RE: BITS adventures...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;&gt;&gt;And the ref gets to teach players why folks turn white when they see<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;&gt;&gt;that "diamond" sign with 3 "4"s on it. :-)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;&gt; Leonard, you owe me a beer,&nbsp; sorry no keyboards were injured.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I take it you understand the hazard diamond coding?&lt;eg&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Yes (just went through HazCom training again), and that my last group of<BR>&gt;players 1) did not, 2) do not care, 3) "how do we make this explode?",<BR>&gt;and/or 4) all of the above.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;normally, anything hazardous they would try to egnite/explode without<BR>&gt;ANY safety precautions.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I don't know how many characters I have killed because of this.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Charles H<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 13:49:55 +1100<BR>&gt;From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Well, no.&nbsp; There have been only two version of KB3 so far.&nbsp; And, the<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; system is in playtesting, as I originally said when I released it to<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; the list.&nbsp; The *aim* here *is* to work out any wrinkles.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Sure, I can accept that there are many versions.&nbsp; So far, there have<BR>&gt;been four different ways to use stats, three ways to determine<BR>&gt;difficulty numbers, four ways to apply skills, and two E-die<BR>&gt;possibilities.&nbsp; They combine to give a *lot* of different systems.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The problem I've been having is that whenever I comment on various<BR>&gt;aspects of a given system (mainly the bad points since you post enough<BR>&gt;yourself on the good points), you tell me I should use one of the<BR>&gt;hundreds of variants to fix that particular problem.&nbsp; However, the<BR>&gt;variants have their own problems, and the process is repeated when I<BR>&gt;mention them.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;- --<BR>&gt;IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ <BR>&gt;as+ so- kk--<BR>&gt;Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 13:53:01 +1100<BR>&gt;From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Analogy of a Sweet Spot<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; Bleh.&nbsp; "Sour spot" is more like it.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Are you trying to get under my skin with comments like these?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;It was no more than the sort of comment I'd make to a friend in the<BR>&gt;middle of a friendly discussion of game systems.&nbsp; :^)<BR>&gt;One of the limitations of a text-only interface, no doubt<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The more important stuff was everything else, which you snipped.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;- --<BR>&gt;IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ <BR>&gt;as+ so- kk--<BR>&gt;Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 13:59:45 +1100<BR>&gt;From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Character-Defined Task Rolls<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; If you've got a MT character with Dex-4, Pistol-0, there is nothing<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; in the game to differintiate him from another character with Dex-1,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Pistol-0.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;So?&nbsp; There's nothing in either system to distinguish his Str-9 from<BR>&gt;another character with Str-1 either.&nbsp; That's fine with me, since all I<BR>&gt;care about is his ability to actually use a pistol, and that's covered<BR>&gt;by skill.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; If you go with T4, you DO have a system tied to the characters--in<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; fact their target numbers are defined by the characters.&nbsp; So there<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; is a BIG difference between a Dex-4, Pistol-0 character and his<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; poor, shot up shipmate who's got a Dex-1, Pistol-0.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Is there a difference between Dex-4/Pistol-0 and Dex-1/Pistol-3 in T4?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Is there a difference between Str-9/Pistol-0 and Str-1/Pistol-0 in<BR>&gt;KB3?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; KB3 is a CHARCTER-DEFINED system,<BR>&gt;[Whereas MT is not]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;You can repeat that as much as you like, but it doesn't make it true.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;- --<BR>&gt;IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ <BR>&gt;as+ so- kk--<BR>&gt;Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 14:02:02 +1100<BR>&gt;From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Character-Defined Task Rolls<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; &gt; What about the difficulty is unique to Michael?&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Nothing.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; Nothing in KB3, either.&nbsp; (Unless you've got a KB3.51 I haven't seen)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; What are you talking about?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Nothing in KB3 makes the difficulty throw unique to the character.<BR>&gt;It's rolled (or chosen) by the Ref, independent of any character<BR>&gt;features.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;- --<BR>&gt;IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ <BR>&gt;as+ so- kk--<BR>&gt;Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 14:02:14 +1100<BR>&gt;From: "steven" &lt;steven@terra-australis-mandes.com.au&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: UNSUBSCRIBE<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Unsubscribe me off the list please<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 21:14:57 -0600<BR>&gt;From: "James Jensen" &lt;cheeb0@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: JJ0<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I guess you could use different colored die too.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Good idea. Thanks.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; Sorry for the confusion. Here's a example of a sweet-spot roll (using<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;d6s):<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; Player's Side&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; GM's Side<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; 6&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 6<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 5<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 3<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 2<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; The player has just rolled a sweet-spot or equal roll. All that matters<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;is<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; the three that he and the difficulty have in common, not the extra die.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;Now,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; one die is thrown, and if it comes up even, the player gets a Critical<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; Success. If it comes up odd, it's a Critical Failure.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;So...a player throws 3D6.&nbsp; Then the GM throws 3D6.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;Success can only occur when all three dice match equally?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;That can't be right.&nbsp; I must still be missing something.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Judging by the last part of your reply, I think you've figured this out, but<BR>&gt;just to be sure:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The dice only have to be equal if you want to "Blow the Curve" or get a<BR>&gt;Critical result. Also, the GM in the above example rolled 4D6 (a Hard task).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; BTW, I like to call getting a Critical Success with this system "Blowing<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;the<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; Curve".<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I like that.&nbsp; You've got a "blow".<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I may use that in KB3....the E-Die results of a "1" or a "6" will give you<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;a<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;"blow".<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I don't know why...but that's kind of cool.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;For family-friendliness's sake, I'd call rolling a "6" on the E-Die "Blowing<BR>&gt;Up" and rolling a "1" on the E-Die "Blowing Down".<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;- -J. Jensen<BR>&gt;Administrator of the Milieu: 0 Aid Society<BR>&gt;http://members.nbci.com/cheebzero/trav_index.htm<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;_________________________________________________________________<BR>&gt;Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 11:46:49 +1000<BR>&gt;From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: JJ0<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; From: Kenneth Bearden<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; BTW, I like to call getting a Critical Success with this system<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; "Blowing the Curve".<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; I like that.&nbsp; You've got a "blow".<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; I may use that in KB3....the E-Die results of a "1" or a "6" will give<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; you a "blow".<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;As in "this task system blows"?&nbsp;&nbsp; : )<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Alan Bradley<BR>&gt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 12:02:22 +1000<BR>&gt;From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: RE: If MT were unknown...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; From: "Frank G. Pitt"<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Kenneth Bearden wrote :<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; Can you imagine what the reception on this list would be like if MT had<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; never been written, and I was standing here touting the advantages of<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; this new system I had made up--KBMT!<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; Can you really imagine that?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Yes.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; You'd be looked at as if you were some sort of idiot and told to go away<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; and stop being silly.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &lt;grin&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Actually it reminds me a little of my response to the initial DGP task<BR>&gt;system for CT.&nbsp; I started reading it, thought "this looks like a good<BR>&gt;idea", and then my eyes glazed over and I fell asleep.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I don't think I have ever been able to read through a set of task rules in<BR>&gt;a single sitting.&nbsp; I still prefer to use a "roll two dice and pray" system:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; high rolls are good, low rolls are bad, and rolls in the middle work out<BR>&gt;whichever is best for drama and keeping the plot moving along.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Now I think about it, my response to MT was a more polite version of what<BR>&gt;Frankie suggested:&nbsp; "Well, I'll look at it if you insist.&nbsp; Hmm.&nbsp; No, I<BR>&gt;really can't be bothered playing it."&nbsp; (Of course, this was heavily<BR>&gt;influenced by the number of typos.)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;So Kenneth:&nbsp; in the case you have put forward I would also tell you to go<BR>&gt;away and stop wasting my time.&nbsp; : )<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Alan Bradley<BR>&gt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Sat, 30 Dec 2000 12:29:22 +1000<BR>&gt;From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Lend-Lease (with ObTrav's!!)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; From: Steven Hudson<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt;From: "Alan Bradley"<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt;Presumably the inner ring would include the Philippines.&nbsp; That would<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt;drag in the US.&nbsp; Empires tend to get offended when people mess with<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt;their colonies.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; True, but that's the wrong set of terms to raise public interest :&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;An attack on the Philippines would have been presented as a sinister<BR>&gt;Japanese aggression, just like the attack on Pearl.&nbsp; It mightn't have hit<BR>&gt;as hard, but Americans would have died, and things would have carried on<BR>&gt;from there.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Which begs the question of just who at Capital was allowing the Sollies<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; to remake the Sphere in their own image. Given the lack of repercussions<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; perhaps either solidarity once the war started led to forgiveness, or the<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; blame was owned by someone beyond reproach...?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;_Styryx_!&nbsp; _Everything_ is Styryx's fault.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;PS:&nbsp; Bad, but classic Australian film alert.&nbsp; On the tellie at the moment<BR>&gt;is a truly shockin' film: "The Rats of Tobruk".&nbsp; Wooden acting, superficial<BR>&gt;characterisation, thin plot, lots of Bren Carriers.&nbsp; A masterpiece.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Alan Bradley<BR>&gt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 22:19:46 -0500<BR>&gt;From: Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: System Traffic: Counting the Ships<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 09:16:24 -0800 (PST)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;Subject: Re: System Traffic: Counting the Ships<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;Starports has a system of estimating it which is probably wrong.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Cheap shot, Anthony. The method was published here for comments first, and<BR>&gt;found to be accurate within +/-20% of the actual value for the cases<BR>&gt;tested. I don't recall you proposing a better method at the time, either.<BR>&gt;In any event, Starports explicitly invites you to use Far Trader for<BR>&gt;greater accuracy if you have the time and inclination.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3483<BR>&gt;***********************************<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>&gt;If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>&gt;coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>&gt;address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>&gt;"local-traveller":<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>&gt;subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>&gt;in the commands above with "traveller".<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR><BR><BR>___________________________________________________________________________<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; ___/&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; /&nbsp; __&nbsp; /&nbsp;&nbsp; Chuck Maddox /// -- N9NON<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; /&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; /&nbsp; /&nbsp; /&nbsp; __&nbsp; /&nbsp;&nbsp; mailto:cmaddox@xnet.com<BR>_____/ __/__/__/ _____/&nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.xnet.com/~cmaddox<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3527<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-za02.mx.aol.com (rly-za02.mail.aol.com [172.31.36.98]) by air-za02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:13:13 1900<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-za02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:12:54 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id IAA85830;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:09:03 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:07:40 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id IAA85771<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:07:40 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:07:40 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101161307.IAA85771@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3527<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3528</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/16/01 2:30:08 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 16 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3528<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR>Where can I get Psionic Institutes? (was: Need some T4 reviews...)<BR>RE: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR>RE: Where can I get Psionic Institutes? (was: Need some T4 review s...)<BR>RE: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>RE: Interesting Holiday<BR>RE: Welcome Newbies!<BR>Paranoia Press classics<BR>replies to digest version<BR>Traveller experts needed??<BR>15mm Traveller figs<BR>RE: Traveller experts needed??<BR>Re: Paranoia Press classics<BR>RE: Traveller experts needed??<BR>RE: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR>re:T5 'playtest'?<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3527<BR>re:I'm Confused<BR>Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR>re:Hello All<BR>RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:12:07 -0500<BR>From: Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2001 00:50:58 -0500 (EST)<BR>&gt;From: Dalton Spence &lt;dalton.spence@hwcn.org&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Is there any formal definition of the bureaucratic structure of the<BR>&gt;Third Imperium from the ministry level on down? <BR><BR>Imperial Bureaucracy (v1.04, 16 Jan 01)<BR><BR>"Bureaucracy is the death of any achievement." - Albert Einstein<BR><BR>[Note that this has not been updated for the most recent GT publications.]<BR><BR>Named Organizations:<BR><BR>Imperial Family/Household (various) [not technically part of Imperial<BR>bureaucracy]<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Office of the Emperor (Supp 11, p. 15; Dragon #87, p. 76, by MWM)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Minister of Protocol (Surv Marg, p. 27)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Chancellor<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Office of Personal Transportation (Trav Adv, p. 00)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Reservations (Supp 3, p.2)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Ancients Foundation (with IISS) (Adv 4, p. 41)<BR><BR>Nobility (various) <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Moot/Peerage (various)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; seneschal (Supp 11, p. 18)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Regency for Intelligence and Security (various) <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; [may be apochryphal]<BR>Ministry of Colonization (various)<BR>Ministry of Commerce (various)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Trading Standards Bureau (Adv 4, p. 10)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Treasury (GT:FT, pp. 5-9)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Office of the Mint (Ch #29, p. 22)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; monetary board (GT:FT, p. 7)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Shipping Commission (GT:FT, p. 74)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Starport Authority (JTAS #19, pp. 37-42; GT:Starports)<BR>Ministry of Conservation (Adv 1, p. 4; Supp 3, p. 32)<BR>Ministry of Defense (Supp 11, p. 15)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Command (JTAS #6, p. 6)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Admiralty/Naval Office (Supp 9, p. 5; Ch #31, pp. 32-33)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; [Imperial Marine Corps?]<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Army (Book 6, p. 4) [Army Office?]<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Artillery (Adv 13, p. 6)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Army Intelligence (Adv 13, p. 8)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Military Resource Board (JTAS #8, p. 6)<BR>Ministry of Information and Communication (Ch #44, p. 35, Surv Marg, p. 33)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Interstellar Scout Service [?] (various)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Covert Survey Bureau (Adv 6, p. 11)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Censor Bureau (Surv Marg, p. 29)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Archives [?] (Adv 10, p. 6)<BR>Ministry of Justice (various)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Prisons (Supp 3, p. 2)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Exile Camps (Supp 3, p. 2)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; "imperial police" (Supp 6, p. 25)<BR>Ministry of State (Supp 6, p. 14)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Policy Board (Beltstrike, "Bowman System Reference Book," p. 8)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Ambassadors Extraordinary and Ministers Plenipotentiary <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (Surv Marg, pp. 28, 31; GT:FT, p. 73)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Consulates (Supp 11, p. 6; Trav Adv, p. 97)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Consul (GT:FT, p. 74)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Visas, Pensions, and Veterans Affairs (Trav Adv, p. 97)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Citizenship, Protection, and Welfare (Trav Adv, p. 97)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Shipping and Merchant Affairs (Trav Adv, p. 97)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Governors (Adv 11, pp. 52-53)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Embassies<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Ambassador/Legate (GT:FT, pp. 73-74)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Commercial Attache (GT:FT, p. 74)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Military Attache (Book 4, p. 9)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Naval Attache (Book 5, p. 9)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Diplomatic Corps/Foreign Service (Supp 4, p. 5, 24; GT:FT, pp.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 73-74, 81)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; "Imperial secret service" / "Intelligence Agency" (Supp 6, p. 36; Supp<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 11, p. 15)<BR>Ministry of Technology&nbsp; (Ch #43, p. 24)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Research Stations<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial University (JTAS #16, p. 16)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial University of Regina (Adv 6, p. 32)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Academy of Science and Medicine (JTAS #22, pp. 18-23)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Imperial Science Union (ibid.) <BR><BR><BR>Named Laws and Regulations:<BR><BR>Imperial Freight Regulations (Ch #31, p. 21)<BR>Imperial Navigation Act of 103 (Adv 13, p. 46, et al.)<BR>Imperial Safety Regulations (JTAS #5, p. 31)<BR>Official Secrets Act (JTAS #4, p. 13)/"Imperial secrets laws" (Adv 13, p. 11)<BR>Imperial Code of Military Justice (ICMJ, JTAS #10, p. 31)<BR>salvage laws (JTAS #1, p. 30)<BR><BR>- ---------------<BR>From: steve daniels &lt;stevedaniels@portcaddo.com&gt;<BR><BR>Milieu 0 (pp.46-47):<BR><BR>The Nobility<BR>The Moot<BR>The Bureacracy:<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; The Military<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Army<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Navy<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Marines<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; The Office of Standards (covers trade, justice, etc.)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Office of Calendar Compliance<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; The Imperial Office of Justice (later Ministry of Justice)<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; The Scout and Exploratory Services (later IISS)<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; The Ministry of Information<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; The Diplomatic Corps<BR><BR>Although discussed, the Bureau of Interstellar Affairs is not clearly<BR>affiliated with any other named office.<BR><BR>- ------------<BR><BR>From: shadowcat &lt;meow@advancenet.net&gt;<BR><BR>The Imperial Office [or was it Ministry] of Heraldy appears in Arrival<BR>Vengeance in reference to having approved changes to the crest of the <BR>Arrival Vengeance.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 15:30:43 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Where can I get Psionic Institutes? (was: Need some T4 reviews...)<BR><BR>"Jones, Dean" wrote:<BR>&gt; If anyone wants T4 books in the UK Esdevium in<BR>&gt; Aldershot has a whole bunch of unsold books for a couple of pounds each<BR>&gt; (they've been at Bargain basement prices for weeks now :) )<BR><BR>And how can I order those? Do they have Psionic Institutes?<BR><BR>I use T4, but I never got PI, thinking I didn't need it. I've partially<BR>changed my mind, and if I can get it cheap, I might as well buy it.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 14:57:27 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR><BR>Christopher Thrash wrote:<BR>&gt; Imperial Bureaucracy (v1.04, 16 Jan 01)<BR><BR>Looking at the Milieu 0 stuff made&nbsp; me&nbsp; realise:&nbsp; over&nbsp; the&nbsp; 1200<BR>years&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; 3I&nbsp; the&nbsp; bureaucracy&nbsp; would&nbsp; have&nbsp;&nbsp; changed&nbsp;&nbsp; its<BR>organisational&nbsp; structure&nbsp; a&nbsp; number&nbsp; of&nbsp; times.&nbsp; Many&nbsp; of&nbsp; those<BR>changes would reflect the "issues of the day" everytime there was<BR>a new Emperor.&nbsp; In general these changes would be either a&nbsp; shift<BR>of resources (making some ministries bigger and&nbsp; others&nbsp; smaller)<BR>or the creation of new offices or ministries&nbsp; to&nbsp; deal&nbsp; with&nbsp; new<BR>problems and situations.&nbsp; (For example:&nbsp; there&nbsp; would&nbsp; have&nbsp; been<BR>changes&nbsp; in&nbsp; a&nbsp; number&nbsp;&nbsp; of&nbsp;&nbsp; ministries&nbsp;&nbsp; during&nbsp;&nbsp; the&nbsp;&nbsp; Psionic<BR>Suppressions.)<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 15:12:54 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Where can I get Psionic Institutes? (was: Need some T4 review s...)<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; "Jones, Dean" wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; If anyone wants T4 books in the UK Esdevium in<BR>&gt; &gt; Aldershot has a whole bunch of unsold books for a couple of <BR>&gt; pounds each<BR>&gt; &gt; (they've been at Bargain basement prices for weeks now :) )<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; And how can I order those? Do they have Psionic Institutes?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I use T4, but I never got PI, thinking I didn't need it. I've <BR>&gt; partially<BR>&gt; changed my mind, and if I can get it cheap, I might as well buy it.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Same here, on all counts. I was thinking of going there this weekend, so<BR>I'll keep an eye out for you. IIRC, Esdevium are a big distributor ( I think<BR>the BITS lads can confirm this) and do mail order. <BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 15:31:47 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>&gt; Some of the middle-east could be handy until I get my solar <BR>&gt; power sats up -<BR>&gt; anybody want to partner on that? :)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Gordon.<BR><BR><BR>I'd recommend the use of black silicon in solar production. This month New<BR>Scientist has an article about this new material and the energy efficiency<BR>for solar power production could reach 97%<BR><BR>Ob-Trav: The PCs are hired to transport a Terawatt laser, silicon circuit<BR>boards and a few dozen cannisters of gas to a developing planet<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 14:21:57 -0000<BR>From: "Mark Preston" &lt;mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Interesting Holiday<BR><BR>Some of us, Mexal, live so far out in the sticks that they still do<BR>beat the bounds even these days. Not with choir and priest (never did<BR>here, since we are parishes in the Salford Hundred and the priest, if<BR>he did the bounds, was allowed to ask the bishop to join them) but<BR>with bands of farmers, locals and lads. And sometimes the Holcombe<BR>Hunt, unfortunately<BR><BR>- --<BR>Mark A. Preston, The Magpie's Nest, Lancashire, UK<BR>Email&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; : mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk<BR>Website : www.mpreston.demon.co.uk<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Megan Robertson<BR>&gt; Sent: 15 January 2001 20:03<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Cc: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Interesting Holiday<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In-Reply-To: &lt;79.ee6a127.2793c7a0@aol.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Greetings dear hearts, especially Loren.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Quite a well known mediaeval (and later) tradition, also<BR>&gt; known as 'Beating<BR>&gt; the Bounds'. Priest and choir (in full robes!) would<BR>&gt; process around the<BR>&gt; boundaries of the parish marking them with canes... said<BR>&gt; canes often being<BR>&gt; applied to the britches-seat of young apprentices to<BR>&gt; impress upon them<BR>&gt; where the boundaries lay.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; There are loads of such traditions around. Want any more?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hugs and kisses,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mexal.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 14:25:32 -0000<BR>From: "Mark Preston" &lt;mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Welcome Newbies!<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of James Jensen<BR>&gt; Sent: 15 January 2001 21:53<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Welcome Newbies!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Well, what do we have here? Two new guys! Man, you're out<BR>&gt; for a while and<BR>&gt; look what happens...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Well, welcome to the list. Please keep this email adress in<BR>&gt; your books:<BR>&gt; traveller-request@lists.ient.com You can unsubscribe there.<BR>&gt;<BR>And, in case no-one else mentions it, you should contact Andy Lilly<BR>and join BITS (If you are British, that is. If not, its still worth it<BR>though).<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 10:46:48 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Paranoia Press classics<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Not specifically that I'm aware of, but it's an assignment for SORAG<BR>&gt; &gt; operatives.<BR>&gt;Ok, I give.&nbsp; What the heck is SORAG?<BR><BR>Zhondani spooks.<BR><BR>This was one of the really cool supplements for CT put out by Paranoia Press.<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/ - Opinions should be yours too!<BR>Monday special, two valiums with a coffee chaser.<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 11:24:41 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: replies to digest version<BR><BR>Chuck Maddox writes<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3483<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Friday, December 29 2000&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3483<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>+800 lines of text<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; As you can see, replying to the digest tends to be a Bad Idea (TM).<BR>I find<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; it easy enough to copy and past the portions that I need from the<BR>digest to<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; a new message.<BR><BR>:)<BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 16:46:16 -0000<BR>From: "MJ Dougherty" &lt;martinjd@globalnet.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Traveller experts needed??<BR><BR>I need help (yes, we all knew that...)<BR><BR>No, I mean need help with the FFN game-product listings.<BR><BR>We're trying to create short listings of Traveller product. I need gurus and<BR>experts to compile this data.<BR><BR>I know some people already offered to help - if they and any others could<BR>contatc me direct we're ready to begin....<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 11:53:42 EST<BR>From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>Subject: 15mm Traveller figs<BR><BR>shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson) sez:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;From: "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Subject: I'm Confused<BR>&gt;...<BR>&gt;&gt;I have also been searching for Traveller miniatures. With the resurgence of<BR>&gt;&gt;Traveller and the re-issue of Striker soon, that the 15mm miniatures would<BR>&gt;&gt;be in demand. Does Marc Miller retain the molds or masters for these <BR>figures?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Citadel (aka "Pudding Workshop") has the good 15mm molds, and doesn't<BR>&gt;give a rats ass about making them available.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Grenadiers 25mm masters presumably are in the possession of the Italian<BR>&gt;company "Stratelibri" ( www. stratelibri.com IIRC).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; RAFM has its own molds for the 25mm TNE figures, which are quite good.<BR>&gt;Ironically, although I'm complete for 25's I prefer the 15's.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; As for the other 15mm's, I don't see why anyone should care, mostly...<BR>&gt;... except the K'kows, they were kool.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>There are a few companies which produce 15mm SF, though most lack that <BR>Traveller feel. Sadly, the original Traveller 15mm figures from Martian <BR>Metals are extinct, as the molds went the same way the company did: factory <BR>fire. If you can find them, they aren't bad for 15mm, just don't expect art.<BR><BR>GC<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 16:56:37 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller experts needed??<BR><BR>MJ Dougherty wrote:<BR>&gt; We're trying to create short listings of Traveller product. I<BR>&gt; need gurus and experts to compile this data.<BR><BR>Isn't there a BITS product that has all this info already?<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:07:18 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Paranoia Press classics<BR><BR>Copies of SORAG are available at www.securityleak.net. There is a cool <BR>article on the Core Expeditions as well at that site.<BR><BR>Mike<BR><BR><BR>&gt;From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;Subject: Paranoia Press classics<BR>&gt;Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 10:46:48 -0500<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Not specifically that I'm aware of, but it's an assignment for SORAG<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; operatives.<BR>&gt;&gt;Ok, I give.&nbsp; What the heck is SORAG?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Zhondani spooks.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;This was one of the really cool supplements for CT put out by Paranoia <BR>&gt;Press.<BR>&gt;-----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&gt;http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/ - Opinions should be yours too!<BR>&gt;Monday special, two valiums with a coffee chaser.<BR>&gt;-----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:07:29 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller experts needed??<BR><BR>The Traveller Bibliography.<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Trevor, Peter [mailto:Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: 16 January 2001 16:57<BR>&gt; To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Traveller experts needed??<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; MJ Dougherty wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; We're trying to create short listings of Traveller product. I<BR>&gt; &gt; need gurus and experts to compile this data.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Isn't there a BITS product that has all this info already?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Regards PLST<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 11:57:47 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR><BR>In addition, look for there to be Ministries to look after the Ministries.<BR><BR>For example:<BR><BR>The Ministry of Internal Communcation&nbsp; (How do ministries communicate)<BR>Ministry of Oversight (Sort of an Inspector Generals Office)<BR>Minsitry of Internal Justice (Because the Beaurocracy is not beholden to the<BR>normal laws)<BR>Ministry of Public Awareness (Those PSA come from somewhere)<BR>Ministry of Art (who commisioned all those statues of Dulinor anyway?)<BR>Minstry of Forms (Keeps track of all Official Forms)<BR>Ministry of Education<BR>Ministry of Higher Education<BR>Minitry of Research<BR>Ministry of Medicine<BR>Ministry of Vetrinary Medicine<BR>Ministry of Agriculture<BR>Ministry of Science (Botanical)<BR>Ministry of Science (Chemical)<BR>Ministry of Science (Physcial)<BR>Ministry of Science (Stellar)<BR>Ministry of Science (Nuclear)<BR>Ministry of Science (Planetary)<BR>Ministry of Science (Oceanic)<BR>Ministry of Holidays<BR>Ministry of Recreation<BR><BR>etc etc etc<BR><BR>I guess the point I have here is that in an 1100 year old buureaucracy there<BR>will be thousands of ministries and departments, that all cannot be killed<BR>because it is the Ministry of Budget and Accounting that tells the Moot and<BR>the Emperor what is essential.&nbsp; Once a Ministry is created...it will stay<BR>forever, because that is the nature of the Fund accounting system and<BR>bureaucacies everywhere.<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 18:17:29 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re:T5 'playtest'?<BR><BR>At 08:00 -0500 16/1/01,&nbsp; Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Somebody (Dom?) mentioned that the T4 rules were worth a go, particularly if<BR>&gt;you got hold of the T5 playtest or something? What's that, and can I get it,<BR>&gt;and from where? I like the idea of writing a Milieu 0 campaign.<BR><BR>It's a set of MS word files from Marc Miller with character <BR>generation and tasks. I got mine by emailing FarFuture@aol.com and <BR>asking nicely.<BR><BR>&gt;Also, is the T4 FFS anything like the one that's in my largely untouched TNE<BR>&gt;box set?<BR><BR>Yes, an evolution there of.<BR><BR>&gt;(Still trying to figure out how to trade a Lombard for a new G4 PowerBook)<BR><BR>&lt;activate technolust for G4 PB)<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 18:23:43 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3527<BR><BR>&gt;Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 16 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3527<BR>&gt;Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 07:07:20 -0600<BR>&gt;From: Chuck Maddox &lt;cmaddox@xnet.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3483<BR><BR>Err....Why? I got it first time...&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>Dom &lt;grin&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 18:26:13 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re:I'm Confused<BR><BR>At 08:00 -0500 16/1/01,&nbsp; "Douglas E. Berry" <BR>&lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;*ahem*<BR><BR>ohmigawd.<BR><BR>Doug, I'M SORRY! I thought there was one missing....<BR><BR>&gt;At Close Quarters is an expanded personal combat system designed originally<BR>&gt;for T4, but which is usable with other versions.<BR><BR>It will very easily slot in as a replacement for CT/MT and T4's <BR>combat systems as all rules *and weapons and armour* are there, along <BR>with a task equivalences system which gives you modifiers for CT and <BR>GT to equate to other editions. TNE and GT would need a little more <BR>work to use directly with ACQ though.<BR><BR>&gt;Hey, if I don't toot my own horn, who will?<BR><BR><BR>ACQ is a fantastic brilliant lovely product which at five quid a pop <BR>everyone should by two copies of (one for each side) and the new <BR>Deckplans for the Beowulf from SJ Games for thirteen quid, and then <BR>you'd never need to go out again.<BR><BR>BUY ACQ! You know you really want to ;-)<BR><BR><BR>Dom &lt;blush&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 12:06:39 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR><BR>"Frank G. Pitt" wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>&gt; Hmm, personally I don't find this "reality TV" stuff even remotely<BR>&gt; interesting,<BR>&gt; other than perhaps the stuff on "stupid criminals", whcih can be really<BR>&gt; hilarious.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; On the other hand, the program "Survival" is good, it's been one of the most<BR>&gt; educational programs I've seen on TV recently. While it was hyped to appeal<BR>&gt; to the same sort who liked "Survivors", it's actually got extremely good<BR>&gt; information on how to survive in a variety of different climates, and even I<BR>&gt; learned a couple of things from it, specifically from some Scandinavian<BR>&gt; special forces survival instructor.<BR><BR>Hmmm...that sounds like a series that The Discovery Channel is starting<BR>soon here. Oddly enough, the person doing the promos is none other than<BR>Rudy the ex-SEAL from Survivors. ;-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>University of Arizona<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 19:34:31 +0000<BR>From: "Jonathan" &lt;thegreatkraken@postmark.net&gt;<BR>Subject: re:Hello All<BR><BR>&gt;At 16:09 -0500 15/1/01,&nbsp; "Jonathan" &lt;thegreatkraken@postmark.net&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;I've just joined the list and I play G:T but I have a few qustions:<BR>&gt;&gt;- - What is GRIP?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;A system to roleplay online.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;- - What G:T books have been brought out?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Have a look at http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;(that's a guess URL)<BR>&gt;<BR>&lt;SNIP a big list of books&gt;<BR><BR>*Ticks books off and finds a depressingly low total*<BR>;-)<BR>&gt;Also look at the new JTAS http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Dom<BR><BR>Thanks<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 14:28:38 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR><BR>Oooooo, special effects makeup!&nbsp; One of my other hobbies :)<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Maybe after I get my plans for the previous Traveller live done...<BR>&gt;&nbsp; (Anybody have any ideas how to prop a Hiver, preferably with player<BR>&gt;&nbsp; inside?&nbsp; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&lt;&lt;snip of Rod's reply&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>I really like the idea of the rolling chair!&nbsp; It's about the only way that I<BR>see you can almost turn an upright bilaterally symetrical biped into a<BR>squat, radially symetrical hexapod.&nbsp; However, a cleaner solution may be<BR>possible, and may make the "actor" inside more comfortable.&nbsp; Put the Hiver<BR>on a "hover-chair"!&nbsp; Use a pedastal type affair similar to the illo on pg 5<BR>of AR3, just make the base thicker and taller to better conceal the human<BR>inside.&nbsp; Depending on how nuts you wanna' go (and I tend to wanna' 'Go Big<BR>or Go Home'), here's some other suggestions:<BR><BR>1.If you have access to one, use a powered wheelchair, scooter, or something<BR>hacked together so that the Hiver is easily self-propelled.&nbsp; The chair alone<BR>will work, but if the 'actor' has to self-propel for more than a minute or<BR>two at any given stint, he/she's gonna' get *real* tired real fast.&nbsp; Try it<BR>yourself with your office chair!&nbsp; Try to go forward for 50ft while hunched<BR>over and only allowing your legs to swing a foot and a half or so...Whatever<BR>it is, get it as low as possible so that the Hiver, if real, could easily<BR>straddle it to get on.<BR><BR>2.Put as big, powerful, and silent a fan as you can find in the 'blowhole'<BR>opening at the top of the Hiver body.&nbsp; This will help keep your Hiver<BR>comfortable :)&nbsp; A *tremendous* plus for the 'man in the rubber suit'.<BR>Consider adding a couple more as needed to keep the actor comfortable.<BR><BR>3.Give him/her a headset radio as suggested, but don't stop there.&nbsp; Give 'em<BR>a Camelbak so they can stay hydrated.&nbsp; Work a microphone(s) into the Hiver's<BR>harness or head so that they can hear.&nbsp; Work a small video camera into same<BR>so that they can see who they're interacting with.&nbsp; Our local huge<BR>electronics place, Fry's, currently has a sale on these little b&amp;w video<BR>cameras for about $30 dollars.&nbsp; Hook the camera to a small LCD monitor or<BR>LCD tv that'll accept the input.&nbsp; If the camera is mounted in the head of<BR>the Hiver, by moving the head they'll be able to see what the Hiver is<BR>looking at much better than if you were using hidden slits in the costume.<BR><BR>4.Add extended armrests to the chair so that as the actor is leaning over to<BR>manipulate the arms or prime limb they can rest their arms that much easier<BR>as needed.<BR><BR>5.Make the mock computer screen of the Hiver's chest computer real!&nbsp; You<BR>could have that connected to a laptop and act as the translator to the<BR>Hiver's sign language ;)<BR><BR>6.I'm not sure if it's the same foam that Rod mentioned, but Roger Corman<BR>used a type of sheet foam for the skin of the 16 foot tall title creature in<BR>the movie "Carnosaur".&nbsp; The foam was cut in pattern to form the skin, then<BR>butt-glued at the seams like a wetsuit.&nbsp; The skin was then sculpted with a<BR>soldering iron to give it 'dino skin'.&nbsp; The result, when airbrushed, was<BR>quite good considering the budget ;)<BR><BR>7.Put a skirt of black cloth or thin foam rubber sheet around the base of<BR>the pedestal between the rim and the floor.&nbsp; If you use rubber, this will<BR>help deaden the sound of the electronics inside as well as hide the casters<BR>of the chair.&nbsp; Make sure to give yourself enough ground clearance to clear<BR>any expected obstacles like carpet strips, etc.<BR><BR>8.Ingress / egress.&nbsp; The way I'd handle it would be to fasten the<BR>hover-chair base to the base of the chair that you're using.&nbsp; The actor can<BR>climb in over the sill of the hoverchair, then the Hiver body can be lowered<BR>over them onto velcro pads while he or she connects the electronics.<BR><BR>Voila!&nbsp; One pretty realistic Hiver :D<BR><BR>I've included the mail thread and an illustration at:<BR>http://www.vision-forge-graphics.com/jesse/traveller/htb_a_hiver.htm<BR><BR>Enjoy!<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3528<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zb03.mx.aol.com (rly-zb03.mail.aol.com [172.31.41.3]) by air-zb05.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:30:08 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zb03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:29:44 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id RAA07104;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:28:54 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:28:02 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id RAA07063<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:28:02 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:28:02 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101162228.RAA07063@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3528<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3529</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/16/01 6:31:39 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 16 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3529<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Double Adventure 7? Double Adventure 8?<BR>RE: Where can I get Psionic Institutes? (was: Need some T4 review s...)<BR>RE: Traveller experts needed??<BR>Re: Double Adventure 7? Double Adventure 8?<BR>Re: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>Re: 15mm Traveller figs<BR>Re: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>Re: Jolly Roger<BR>RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>RE: Jolly Roger<BR>RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>Children of Dune Question<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR>Re: Double Adventure 7? Double Adventure 8?<BR>RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>RE: Introduction<BR>Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR>Re: T5 'playtest'?<BR>Re: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR>Re: Jolly Roger<BR>A ship design question<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:43:21 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Double Adventure 7? Double Adventure 8?<BR><BR>Someone just pointed out through feedback to Freelance Traveller that the<BR>Supplements and Adventures Classic Reprints make mention of Double<BR>Adventure 7 (Perruques/Exit Visa) and Double Adventure 8 (Memory Alpha).<BR>These are not in the list that I received when I made up the Published<BR>Products lists for Freelance Traveller.&nbsp; Can anyone verify their existence,<BR>or provide an explanation/story?<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 22:40:01 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Where can I get Psionic Institutes? (was: Need some T4 review s...)<BR><BR>At 17:28 -0500 16/1/01, "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Same here, on all counts. I was thinking of going there this weekend, so<BR>&gt;I'll keep an eye out for you. IIRC, Esdevium are a big distributor ( I think<BR>&gt;the BITS lads can confirm this) and do mail order.<BR><BR>"Esdevium are a big distributor" ;-)<BR><BR>Esdevium are the most active of the UK distributors. They stock BITS <BR>books and reorder them ;-) Your FLGS in the UK almost certainly buys <BR>off them. They also organised a superb gaming area the last two <BR>GenCons, something that BITS used in 2000 with great success...<BR><BR>BTW If looking for the FarFuture Reprints or the BITS books in the <BR>Leisure Games Catalogue, look under Steve Jackson Games, GURPS <BR>Traveller.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 22:44:52 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller experts needed??<BR><BR>At 17:28 -0500 16/1/01,&nbsp;&nbsp; "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;MJ Dougherty wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; We're trying to create short listings of Traveller product. I<BR>&gt; &gt; need gurus and experts to compile this data.<BR>&gt;Isn't there a BITS product that has all this info already?<BR><BR>Yes.<BR><BR>The Traveller Bibliography<BR>The Periodicals Bibliography<BR><BR>Both available via usual channels, and superb works by Timothy <BR>Collinson. The latter will be on the website to get details of soon <BR>(I just need to get the graphics done - my recovery from HDD failure <BR>is almost done).<BR><BR>A gentleman from FF contacted us at GenCon to arrange URL links, but <BR>never emailed further. Unfortunately, i lost his email address after <BR>Dragonmeet 2000 when I lost my wallet (or had it stolen, I don't <BR>know!)<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 18:15:46 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: Double Adventure 7? Double Adventure 8?<BR><BR>Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt; Someone just pointed out through feedback to Freelance Traveller that the<BR>&gt;Supplements and Adventures Classic Reprints make mention of Double<BR>&gt;Adventure 7 (Perruques/Exit Visa) and Double Adventure 8 (Memory Alpha).<BR>&gt;These are not in the list that I received when I made up the Published<BR>&gt;Products lists for Freelance Traveller.&nbsp; Can anyone verify their existence,<BR>&gt;or provide an explanation/story?<BR><BR>This isn't official from Marc Miller, but it makes enough sense that here goes:&nbsp; Note that the list that includes those titles in labeled 'short adventures' instead of double adventures.&nbsp; These are not really 'lost' double adventures but simply miscellaneous short GDW-designed CT adventures that 'had to go somewhere.'&nbsp; FWIW, 'Exit Visa' was published in 'The Traveller Book,' 'A Plague of Perruques' was published in Traveller's Digest #10, and 'Memory Alpha' was published (modified for T4) with the T4 Ref Screen, and may have also shown up someplace else earlier.&nbsp; Why the first two are listed together as D7 I couldn't say; perhaps they were originally intended for publication that way, but it never happened (until now!)<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 18:23:21 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>On Tue, 16 Jan 2001 08:00:18 -0500 (EST), "Douglas E. Berry"<BR>&lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;At 12:29 PM 1/16/2001 +1100, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Dear Folks -<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Doug wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;I have to tell you this: I take a<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;heavy dose of Dilantin to control seizures.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Well, _that's_ an obvious typo, especially when you hail from Vland.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;You meant a heavy dose of _Bilanidin_, didn't you?<BR><BR>&gt;Damn you.&nbsp; Kirsten saw that, and she handed me my pills and said "you need<BR>&gt;to take your language lesson."<BR><BR>ROFL!<BR><BR>Of course, you realize that _that_ leads directly to Official Science<BR>Fiction Clich #42, Learning By Pill.<BR><BR>Assignment: Discuss the plausibility of this, in light of current knowledge<BR>in appropriately related subjects, and consider in your discussion the<BR>implications on game balance and the character of the Traveller Universe.<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 18:48:38 -0500<BR>From: Bill Rutherford &lt;worj@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: 15mm Traveller figs<BR><BR>At 11:53 AM 1/16/01 -0500, GypsyComet wrote:<BR>&gt;&lt;SNIP&gt;<BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; Citadel (aka "Pudding Workshop") has the good 15mm molds, and doesn't<BR>&gt; &gt;give a rats ass about making them available.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&lt;SNIP&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; RAFM has its own molds for the 25mm TNE figures, which are quite good.<BR>&gt; &gt;Ironically, although I'm complete for 25's I prefer the 15's.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR><BR>RAFM actually were the folk who manufactured the 15mm Citadel figures...&nbsp; I <BR>just took a look at a couple of packs to be sure my memory hadn't failed <BR>me.&nbsp; I purchased my last batch of these figures directly from RAFM back in <BR>1988 or 1989 (or was it 1990?&nbsp; So long ago...) or so.&nbsp; RAFM told me at that <BR>time that the figures were being discontinued.&nbsp; I called them a few years <BR>later (1994 or 1995?) and was told that the molds for the 15s had been <BR>stored for a couple of years and had probably been destroyed.&nbsp; Truth or <BR>fiction?&nbsp; I have no idea but that's what RAFM told me.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>Bill Rutherford<BR>worj@home.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 15:43:42 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Actually, the jdegraff@pacbell.net address is my HOME address through my DSL<BR>&gt; service, and jedegraf@cisco.com is my WORK address (and get in line, I get<BR>&gt; one first ;)&nbsp; I get the list in both places so I can keep up with it<BR>&gt; (mostly)!!&nbsp; You can easily reach me at either address.&nbsp; Be warned about my<BR>&gt; home address though.&nbsp; I've been getting so much spam lately from data-mining<BR>&gt; of pacbell.net addresses that I HAVE missed messages before in all the<BR>&gt; clutter.<BR><BR>All in favor of making the punishment for spamming be serving as<BR>weapons targets^H^H^H^H^H^H^Htesters for Ditzie?<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 15:49:25 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Pretty idea - but wrong, I'm afraid. FYI, the British flags flown on<BR>&gt; naval and merchant ships (respectively) is the whiite or the red<BR>&gt; ensign, and has been for an awful long while. In which case, a ship<BR>&gt; flying the "Jolly Roger" (from your description) would be any old<BR>&gt; merchant navy vessel.<BR><BR>Nope, because by his description it was a *solid* red flag, with<BR>nothing else on it. The red ensign has the Union Jack in the upper left<BR>corner. <BR><BR>&gt; The white ensign (and red) were (and are) also known as the "white<BR>&gt; duster" and "red duster". Flags in general were also known as<BR>&gt; "Jacks" - hence the Union Jack...<BR><BR>I vaguely recall that a "jack" was a specific *type* of flag. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 16:35:01 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>No objection from me!!!!&nbsp; I'll pull the trigger &gt;:D<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Leonard Erickson<BR>&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 3:44 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Actually, the jdegraff@pacbell.net address is my HOME address<BR>&gt; through my DSL<BR>&gt; &gt; service, and jedegraf@cisco.com is my WORK address (and get in<BR>&gt; line, I get<BR>&gt; &gt; one first ;)&nbsp; I get the list in both places so I can keep up with it<BR>&gt; &gt; (mostly)!!&nbsp; You can easily reach me at either address.&nbsp; Be<BR>&gt; warned about my<BR>&gt; &gt; home address though.&nbsp; I've been getting so much spam lately<BR>&gt; from data-mining<BR>&gt; &gt; of pacbell.net addresses that I HAVE missed messages before in all the<BR>&gt; &gt; clutter.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; All in favor of making the punishment for spamming be serving as<BR>&gt; weapons targets^H^H^H^H^H^H^Htesters for Ditzie?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>&gt; leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 16:42:40 -0800<BR>From: Bill &lt;beast@aracnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>I wanna know who this Jesse Degraff character is and why hasn't he <BR>answered my question about the fun shoot yet ;)<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 16:45:20 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>also if I remember correctly the British ensigns Flown actually look like<BR>this.<BR><BR>the White one has a horizontal and vertical red stripes dividing the flag in<BR>to quadrants&nbsp; with the British "union jack" in the top quadrant closest to<BR>the Staff.<BR><BR>the red one is identical to this but I just cant remember of the stripes are<BR>Blue or White.<BR><BR>as for a solid red flag I believe that during march 1836 during the siege at<BR>the Alamo the Mexicans Played the De guelljo (spelling is most likely wrong)<BR>or cut throat song to indicate to the Texans that no quarter was to be<BR>given. Now something in the back of my mind from Texas history in 7th grade<BR>says that the Mexicans also displayed a Solid red flag at the same time.<BR>However I'm 35 so that gives you an idea of how long ago that was LOL<BR><BR>so there if what I remember is true then there is the possibility that at<BR>one point a solid red flag was used to represent no quarter.<BR><BR>anyway Hasta<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com [mailto:shadow@krypton.rain.com]<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 3:49 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Jolly Roger<BR><BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Pretty idea - but wrong, I'm afraid. FYI, the British flags flown on<BR>&gt; naval and merchant ships (respectively) is the whiite or the red<BR>&gt; ensign, and has been for an awful long while. In which case, a ship<BR>&gt; flying the "Jolly Roger" (from your description) would be any old<BR>&gt; merchant navy vessel.<BR><BR>Nope, because by his description it was a *solid* red flag, with<BR>nothing else on it. The red ensign has the Union Jack in the upper left<BR>corner. <BR><BR>&gt; The white ensign (and red) were (and are) also known as the "white<BR>&gt; duster" and "red duster". Flags in general were also known as<BR>&gt; "Jacks" - hence the Union Jack...<BR><BR>I vaguely recall that a "jack" was a specific *type* of flag. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 16:57:07 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>Eh?&nbsp; Which question?<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Bill<BR>&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 4:43 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I wanna know who this Jesse Degraff character is and why hasn't he<BR>&gt; answered my question about the fun shoot yet ;)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 19:01:20 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Children of Dune Question<BR><BR>I just finished Children of Dune, and I have a question for those of you<BR>who consider yourselves Dune aficionados.<BR><BR>**spoiler alert**<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>My question is:&nbsp; Why did Leto II go through all that rigmarole<BR>(complicated plot trying to expose Jessica and the Bene Gesserit angle,<BR>the possessed Alia, bringing Farad'n to Dune, getting the Fremen rebels<BR>to rise up against Alia's Regency, confronting The Preacher, etc...),<BR>when all he really had to do was merge with the sandtrout to begin<BR>with--an act he ended up doing anyway.<BR><BR>I mean, if he was going to merge with the sandtrout and become<BR>super-human anyway, then why did he go through the motions of all that<BR>other stuff?<BR><BR>It seems like he could have accomplished his goals more efficiently had<BR>he done the merging in the first place--and it seems like much of the<BR>book was unnecessary.<BR><BR>Comments?<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 16:26:26 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; At 12:29 PM 1/16/2001 +1100, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;Dear Folks -<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Doug wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;I have to tell you this: I take a<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;heavy dose of Dilantin to control seizures.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Well, _that's_ an obvious typo, especially when you hail from Vland.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;You meant a heavy dose of _Bilanidin_, didn't you?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Damn you.&nbsp; Kirsten saw that, and she handed me my pills and said "you need<BR>&gt; to take your language lesson."<BR><BR>If you want to have some fun, scan the label on one of your pill<BR>bottles, and print a new one in Bilandin. Apply that to an empty and<BR>"accidentally" hand that one to the pharmacist when you go in for a<BR>refill. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 02:29:37 +0100<BR>From: Hans Rancke-Madsen &lt;rancke@diku.dk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR><BR>Reply-To: <BR>David C. Broussard writes:<BR>&gt;I guess the point I have here is that in an 1100 year old buureaucracy there<BR>&gt;will be thousands of ministries and departments, that all cannot be killed<BR>&gt;because it is the Ministry of Budget and Accounting that tells the Moot and<BR>&gt;the Emperor what is essential.&nbsp; Once a Ministry is created...it will stay<BR>&gt;forever, because that is the nature of the Fund accounting system and<BR>&gt;bureaucacies everywhere.<BR><BR>I think you're underestimating the powers of the Emperor. Any power held by the<BR>Moot or any ministry depends entirely on the inability of any one man to do<BR>everything. The Emperor needs to delegate 99.999999% of all business. But if he<BR>decides to nuke a ministry, it's gone, Moot or no Moot and regardless of any<BR>other ministry. And since a growing bureaucracy tends to become more and more<BR>inefficient, there will have been times during those 1100 years when emperors<BR>have been provoked into clearing house.<BR><BR><BR>Hans<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 20:31:38 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Double Adventure 7? Double Adventure 8?<BR><BR>GDW convention games. Marc is adding some stuff to spice up the fourth book<BR>a bit from just the same old doubles. Notice that the name of FFE04 has<BR>always been Double Adventures 1-6+<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Jeff Zeitlin" &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Someone just pointed out through feedback to Freelance Traveller that the<BR>&gt; Supplements and Adventures Classic Reprints make mention of Double<BR>&gt; Adventure 7 (Perruques/Exit Visa) and Double Adventure 8 (Memory Alpha).<BR>&gt; These are not in the list that I received when I made up the Published<BR>&gt; Products lists for Freelance Traveller.&nbsp; Can anyone verify their<BR>existence,<BR>&gt; or provide an explanation/story?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:37:18 -0800<BR>From: Bill &lt;beast@aracnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>&gt;Eh?&nbsp; Which question?<BR>&gt;Jesse<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>&gt;deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>&gt;-Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt;&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Bill<BR>&gt;&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 4:43 PM<BR>&gt;&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;&gt; Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; I wanna know who this Jesse Degraff character is and why hasn't he<BR>&gt;&gt; answered my question about the fun shoot yet ;)<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Bill<BR><BR>I was curious how many shotgun shells were in the air when you video <BR>taped Tod and I shooting the semi-auto shotguns.<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:47:27 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>ROFL!!!&nbsp; Well, you weren't lookin', now were you?&nbsp; If you go the page (<BR>http://vision-forge-graphics.com/jesse/shooting/dec00-shoot/index.htm ) if<BR>you've forgotten, it says:<BR><BR>"Hard to see in this shot, but Tod's buddy wanted this shot up here.&nbsp; He's<BR>got *3* shell casings in the air!&nbsp; One just ejecting from the gun, one about<BR>a foot below his muzzle and 2 feet directly above Tod's left hand, and<BR>another about 2 feet below and one forward of Tod's muzzle.&nbsp; See it?"<BR><BR>Now I can change the name since I'd forgotten yours ;)&nbsp; Hope to see you in<BR>May!!!<BR><BR>Best,<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Bill<BR>&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 5:37 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Eh?&nbsp; Which question?<BR>&gt; &gt;Jesse<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>&gt; &gt;deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>&gt; &gt;-Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Bill<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 4:43 PM<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; I wanna know who this Jesse Degraff character is and why hasn't he<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; answered my question about the fun shoot yet ;)<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Bill<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I was curious how many shotgun shells were in the air when you video<BR>&gt; taped Tod and I shooting the semi-auto shotguns.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:52:55 -0800<BR>From: "tsykoduk" &lt;tsykoduk@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Introduction<BR><BR>Naaa... we NEVER get off topic..<BR><BR>Now where was that thread about evil monkeys stealing electric torches from<BR>angry bears?<BR><BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>And sometimes we get plain silly (penguins) or stray completely off-topic.<BR>But it's all good fun. Come on in and join us!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:59:49 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR><BR>Hans Rancke-Madsen writes:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt; I think you're underestimating the powers of the Emperor. Any power held by<BR>&gt; the Moot or any ministry depends entirely on the inability of any one man<BR>&gt; to do everything. The Emperor needs to delegate 99.999999% of all business.<BR>&gt; But if he decides to nuke a ministry, it's gone, Moot or no Moot and<BR>&gt; regardless of any other ministry.<BR><BR>Well, sort of.&nbsp; Communications delay and bureaucratic inertia being what it<BR>is, a dedicated ministry might be able to hold out long enough to hope that<BR>the next emperor will reconstitute it.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 02:16:28 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: T5 'playtest'?<BR><BR>on 16/1/01 6:17 pm, Dominic Mooney at dom@cybergoths.u-net.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; It's a set of MS word files from Marc Miller with character<BR>&gt; generation and tasks. I got mine by emailing FarFuture@aol.com and<BR>&gt; asking nicely.<BR><BR>Okay, thanks.<BR><BR>&gt; &lt;activate technolust for G4 PB)<BR><BR>Mmmm, shiny. :) Should be possible to heat treat it like that natty Titanium<BR>jewellery that was all the rage back near the dawn of Traveller... in fact<BR>the G4 will probably do that to the base anyhow. :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 17:27:26 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; I really like the idea of the rolling chair!&nbsp; It's about the only way that I<BR>&gt; see you can almost turn an upright bilaterally symetrical biped into a<BR>&gt; squat, radially symetrical hexapod.&nbsp; However, a cleaner solution may be<BR>&gt; possible, and may make the "actor" inside more comfortable.&nbsp; Put the Hiver<BR>&gt; on a "hover-chair"!&nbsp; Use a pedastal type affair similar to the illo on pg 5<BR>&gt; of AR3, just make the base thicker and taller to better conceal the human<BR>&gt; inside.&nbsp; Depending on how nuts you wanna' go (and I tend to wanna' 'Go Big<BR>&gt; or Go Home'), here's some other suggestions:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; 1.If you have access to one, use a powered wheelchair, scooter, or something<BR>&gt; hacked together so that the Hiver is easily self-propelled.&nbsp; The chair alone<BR>&gt; will work, but if the 'actor' has to self-propel for more than a minute or<BR>&gt; two at any given stint, he/she's gonna' get *real* tired real fast.&nbsp; Try it<BR>&gt; yourself with your office chair!&nbsp; Try to go forward for 50ft while hunched<BR>&gt; over and only allowing your legs to swing a foot and a half or so...Whatever<BR>&gt; it is, get it as low as possible so that the Hiver, if real, could easily<BR>&gt; straddle it to get on.<BR><BR>Use the trick the folks at the BBC used for Daleks. Build it around a<BR>kids trike! You can pedal and steer easily. <BR><BR>&gt; 2.Put as big, powerful, and silent a fan as you can find in the 'blowhole'<BR>&gt; opening at the top of the Hiver body.&nbsp; This will help keep your Hiver<BR>&gt; comfortable :)&nbsp; A *tremendous* plus for the 'man in the rubber suit'.<BR>&gt; Consider adding a couple more as needed to keep the actor comfortable.<BR><BR>Given that this is supposed to be a "hover" chair, be sure to have the<BR>fan suck air *in* at the top, and blow air out around the bottom. Doing<BR>it the other way not only will tend to suck the "chair" to the floor,<BR>but it'll tend to suck in all the dust and other "crud" on the floor. <BR><BR>And this allows you to get away with a noisier fan.<BR><BR>&gt; 3.Give him/her a headset radio as suggested, but don't stop there.&nbsp; Give 'em<BR>&gt; a Camelbak so they can stay hydrated.<BR><BR>Given the likely size of this, you can build a gallon (or larger)<BR>Coleman "jug" into it!<BR><BR>&gt; Work a microphone(s) into the Hiver's harness or head so that they can hear.<BR><BR>A pair, hooked to a pair of headphones. That way he can tell which<BR>direction the sounds are coming from. <BR><BR>&gt; Work a small video camera into same<BR>&gt; so that they can see who they're interacting with.&nbsp; Our local huge<BR>&gt; electronics place, Fry's, currently has a sale on these little b&amp;w video<BR>&gt; cameras for about $30 dollars.&nbsp; Hook the camera to a small LCD monitor or<BR>&gt; LCD tv that'll accept the input.&nbsp; If the camera is mounted in the head of<BR>&gt; the Hiver, by moving the head they'll be able to see what the Hiver is<BR>&gt; looking at much better than if you were using hidden slits in the costume.<BR><BR>And they can stick the head right next to things to see them better,<BR>just as a hiver would do. <BR><BR>&gt; 5.Make the mock computer screen of the Hiver's chest computer real!&nbsp; You<BR>&gt; could have that connected to a laptop and act as the translator to the<BR>&gt; Hiver's sign language ;)<BR><BR>Old "handheld" computers work well for this. The main unit is<BR>essentially a screen with various connectors around the edge. The<BR>keyboard and mouse can be inside, or you can just run a serial cable<BR>and use a laptop running PC Anywhere or some such inside the Hiver.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 02:28:17 GMT<BR>From: TML@stempest.demon.co.uk (Stephen Tempest)<BR>Subject: Re: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson) writes:<BR><BR>&gt;I vaguely recall that a "jack" was a specific *type* of flag. <BR><BR>The jack is the flag flown at the front of a ship.&nbsp; British ships have<BR>flown the Union Jack in that position since the days of Charles I - at<BR>the time it was his personal emblem, and was only adopted as the<BR>national flag much later (which is why it's still popularly called the<BR>Union Jack even when it's nowhere near the sea).<BR><BR>The Red, White or Blue ensigns were flown at the back of Royal Navy<BR>ships, to determine which of the Navy's three colour-coded squadrons<BR>they belonged to.&nbsp; At some point in the early 19th century this was<BR>changed, so that all Navy ships flew the White Ensign, Naval Reserve<BR>ships the Blue Ensign, and merchant ships the Red Ensign.<BR><BR>(The Australian flag is a Blue Ensign with a few stars added ;-)&nbsp; )<BR><BR>Stephen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 02:32:39 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: A ship design question<BR><BR>Has anybody seen designs or had discussions about ships that jettison some<BR>of their superstructure post-jump? What I'm thinking of is that if a ship<BR>needs a huge percentage of its tonnage for fuelling a long jump, you'd want<BR>to jettison that tankage (and motors) like the lower stage of an atmospheric<BR>lift rocket, giving you a smaller craft that could jump again using a<BR>smaller fuel requirement. Post-survey, subsequent salvage missions could<BR>recover the drives to recoup some of the massive cost.<BR><BR>I don't recall seeing such a thing in the early canon.<BR><BR>I'm just thinking through some ideas for exploring rift space safely...<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3529<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zd03.mx.aol.com (rly-zd03.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.227]) by air-zd04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 21:31:39 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zd03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 21:30:45 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id VAA16140;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 21:29:50 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 16 Jan 2001 21:29:30 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id VAA16107<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 21:29:30 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 21:29:30 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101170229.VAA16107@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3529<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3530</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/17/01 6:45:06 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; Wednesday, January 17 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3530<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3528<BR>RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3529<BR>RE: A ship design question<BR>Re: Jolly Roger<BR>Re: Jolly Roger<BR>re: 15mm Traveller figs<BR>Re: 15mm Traveller figs<BR>RE: Prop Hivers<BR>FWD: OGRE's &amp; Combine Heavy Armor Company - Now Shipping!<BR>re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR>RE: Children of Dune Question<BR>Re: Jolly Roger<BR>Wiring Diagrams<BR>RE: Wiring Diagrams<BR>Re: Jolly Roger<BR>Re: A ship design question<BR>RE: Where can I get Psionic Institutes? (was: Need some T4 review s...)<BR>Re: A ship design question<BR>Re: Double Adventure 7? Double Adventure 8?<BR>Re : Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>Re: Double Adventure 7? Double Adventure 8?<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 21:29:57 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3528<BR><BR>In a message dated 16-Jan-01 4:30:08 PM Central Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; ACQ is a fantastic brilliant lovely product which at five quid a pop <BR>&gt;&nbsp; everyone should by two copies of (one for each side) and the new <BR>&gt;&nbsp; Deckplans for the Beowulf from SJ Games for thirteen quid, and then <BR>&gt;&nbsp; you'd never need to go out again.<BR><BR>Until the next deck plan set comes out. <BR><BR>:&nbsp; )<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 18:34:22 -0800<BR>From: Bill &lt;beast@aracnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>You are right... I missed it completely... Come to think of it I <BR>don't think I hit what I was shooting at either... But oh-well. It <BR>was still a blast... But my shoulder hurt for a couple days after <BR>that ;)<BR><BR>I'm hoping to make the May shoot.<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>&gt;ROFL!!!&nbsp; Well, you weren't lookin', now were you?&nbsp; If you go the page (<BR>&gt;http://vision-forge-graphics.com/jesse/shooting/dec00-shoot/index.htm ) if<BR>&gt;you've forgotten, it says:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"Hard to see in this shot, but Tod's buddy wanted this shot up here.&nbsp; He's<BR>&gt;got *3* shell casings in the air!&nbsp; One just ejecting from the gun, one about<BR>&gt;a foot below his muzzle and 2 feet directly above Tod's left hand, and<BR>&gt;another about 2 feet below and one forward of Tod's muzzle.&nbsp; See it?"<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Now I can change the name since I'd forgotten yours ;)&nbsp; Hope to see you in<BR>&gt;May!!!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Best,<BR>&gt;Jesse<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>&gt;deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>&gt;-Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt;&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Bill<BR>&gt;&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 5:37 PM<BR>&gt;&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;&gt; Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;Eh?&nbsp; Which question?<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;Jesse<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;-Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Bill<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 4:43 PM<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; I wanna know who this Jesse Degraff character is and why hasn't he<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; answered my question about the fun shoot yet ;)<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; Bill<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; I was curious how many shotgun shells were in the air when you video<BR>&gt;&gt; taped Tod and I shooting the semi-auto shotguns.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 21:36:17 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3529<BR><BR>In a message dated 16-Jan-01 8:31:39 PM Central Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; RAFM actually were the folk who manufactured the 15mm Citadel figures<BR><BR>IIRC, RAFM could not distribute the Citadel stuff in the US because Martian <BR>Metals contract gave them an exclusive in the USA. I always thought the <BR>Citadel stuff was superior, IMO.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 18:40:05 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: A ship design question<BR><BR>Uh-oh, it's the collapsible Jump-Tank-Flame-War-of-the-Apocolypse!!!<BR>Personally, I'm donning armor and diving for cover!<BR><BR>;)<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Gordon Hundley<BR>&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 6:33 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: A ship design question<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Has anybody seen designs or had discussions about ships that jettison some<BR>&gt; of their superstructure post-jump? What I'm thinking of is that if a ship<BR>&gt; needs a huge percentage of its tonnage for fuelling a long jump,<BR>&gt; you'd want<BR>&gt; to jettison that tankage (and motors) like the lower stage of an<BR>&gt; atmospheric<BR>&gt; lift rocket, giving you a smaller craft that could jump again using a<BR>&gt; smaller fuel requirement. Post-survey, subsequent salvage missions could<BR>&gt; recover the drives to recoup some of the massive cost.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I don't recall seeing such a thing in the early canon.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'm just thinking through some ideas for exploring rift space safely...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Gordon.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 13:53:37 +1100<BR>From: Robert Houghton &lt;rhoughto@one.net.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>A 'jack' is a flag especiall designated to be flown from a 'jackstaff',<BR>part of a ships rigging, usually a 6 to 8 foot attachment to the (i think)<BR>mainmast...<BR><BR>Other Rob<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Pretty idea - but wrong, I'm afraid. FYI, the British flags flown on<BR>&gt; &gt; naval and merchant ships (respectively) is the whiite or the red<BR>&gt; &gt; ensign, and has been for an awful long while. In which case, a ship<BR>&gt; &gt; flying the "Jolly Roger" (from your description) would be any old<BR>&gt; &gt; merchant navy vessel.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Nope, because by his description it was a *solid* red flag, with<BR>&gt; nothing else on it. The red ensign has the Union Jack in the upper left<BR>&gt; corner.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; The white ensign (and red) were (and are) also known as the "white<BR>&gt; &gt; duster" and "red duster". Flags in general were also known as<BR>&gt; &gt; "Jacks" - hence the Union Jack...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I vaguely recall that a "jack" was a specific *type* of flag.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>&gt; leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 03:20:09 -0000<BR>From: "Peter Scarrott" &lt;peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>The Jack was originally the short flag pole (only about 6-8' long on the<BR>stern (blunt end :-) ) of a ship where the identifying flag was flown.<BR>General corruption of the language has led the Union flag (National Flag of<BR>United Kingdom) to be referred to as the Union Jack.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; The white ensign (and red) were (and are) also known as the "white<BR>&gt;&gt; duster" and "red duster". Flags in general were also known as<BR>&gt;&gt; "Jacks" - hence the Union Jack...<BR>&gt;I vaguely recall that a "jack" was a specific *type* of flag.<BR><BR>Sorry coming in very late to this discussion, lost all last months digests<BR>:-(<BR>So a very belated Merry Xmas and Happy New Year etc.<BR><BR>Peter<BR>http://www.myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk (Trav &amp; AD&amp;D)<BR>peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR><BR>IMTU: tc+ tm tn++ t4- ru+ !3i+ c+ jt- au- ls ta- hi++ ith++ va+ as- so&nbsp; zh+<BR>vi-<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; And life is harsh and rarely fair.<BR><BR>Be wary of strong drink.&nbsp; It can make you shoot at tax collectors - and<BR>miss.<BR>Lazarus Long, Time Enough For Love (By Robert.Heinlan)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 22:02:39 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: re: 15mm Traveller figs<BR><BR>&gt;From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>&gt;Subject: 15mm Traveller figs<BR>...<BR>&gt; There are a few companies which produce 15mm SF, though most lack that <BR>&gt;Traveller feel. Sadly, the original Traveller 15mm figures from Martian <BR>&gt;Metals are extinct, as the molds went the same way the company did: factory <BR>&gt;fire. If you can find them, they aren't bad for 15mm, just don't expect art.<BR><BR>&nbsp; Frankly, IMHO most of them are crap - at least the early ones, and I'm <BR>looking forward to selling or trading them as soon as I find/catalog/photo<BR>them all. Except for a few of the vehicles, and the K'kows, of course.<BR><BR>&nbsp; I would never get rid of my (sadly, few) Citadel ones.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Steven Hudson<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 22:22:01 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: 15mm Traveller figs<BR><BR>&gt;From: Bill Rutherford &lt;worj@home.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: 15mm Traveller figs<BR>...<BR>&gt;RAFM actually were the folk who manufactured the 15mm Citadel figures...&nbsp; I <BR><BR>&nbsp; In NorAm, from GW masters.<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;stored for a couple of years and had probably been destroyed.&nbsp; Truth or <BR>&gt;fiction?&nbsp; I have no idea but that's what RAFM told me.<BR><BR>&nbsp; This is my info too.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 01:30:26 EST<BR>From: RBasler1@aol.com<BR>Subject: RE: Prop Hivers<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/16/01 2:30:08 PM Pacific Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR>&lt;&lt; <BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 14:28:38 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR><BR>Oooooo, special effects makeup!&nbsp; One of my other hobbies :)<BR><BR>&lt;massive snippage&gt; <BR>&nbsp; &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Cool!!&nbsp; I thought of the 'hover chair' idea, but wanted to make it as <BR>small and affordable as possible.&nbsp; Your configuration would be a great deal <BR>more comfortable for the player.&nbsp; Just remember to stock up on microwavable <BR>corndogs for snacks...and to keep the grease off the cctv camera lens.&nbsp; ;o)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; By the way, the general Fursuiting FAQ is hosted by Robert Goodwin and is <BR>at http://sr7.xoom.com/rsg0910/faq/<BR><BR>Rod Basler, COFIT<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 22:37:44 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: FWD: OGRE's &amp; Combine Heavy Armor Company - Now Shipping!<BR><BR>&nbsp; Here's just the two coolest things for OGRE mini's players - check their<BR>site for all the new goodies...<BR><BR>&nbsp; ObTrav: you can't think of one? Then you shouldn't wargame, and <BR>probably don't think of GURPS: OGRE as a Trav resource-book :&gt;<BR><BR><BR>&gt;SJ Games Daily Illuminator ( http://www.sjgames.com/ill/ )<BR>&gt;January 17, 2001: Now Shipping!<BR>&gt;--------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&gt;Five new products are shipping this week: <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Combine Set 1 - Ogre Mk V (<BR>http://www.sjgames.com/minis/ogre/combineset1/ ) (for Ogre Miniatures)<BR>&gt; The mighty Mark V terrorized the battlefields of the Last War . . . on<BR>both sides. It was introduced by the Combine, but Paneurope fielded its own<BR>Mark Vs built from captured templates. The Mark V was the biggest cybertank<BR>to see action in any numbers. It has the intelligence of a genius, the cold<BR>savagery of a shark, and the firepower of an armor battalion. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; This set contains a complete Ogre Mark V; a full "repair kit" - an extra<BR>tower and a full extra set of guns - in case of battle damage; a "swimming<BR>tower" to represent the Ogre when it's underwater; and a record card. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Stock #10-2101, ISBN 1-55634-465-1. $19.95. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; Combine Set 3 - Heavy Armor Company (<BR>http://www.sjgames.com/minis/ogre/combineset3/ ) (for Ogre Miniatures)<BR>&gt; The big tanks that rolled across Europe with the Ogres: two Combine heavy<BR>armor squadrons, eight units in all. Each squadron is made up of the<BR>squadron leader's "Alamo" superheavy tank (a brand new unit, never before<BR>available) and three "Ranger" heavy tanks. The set is packed in a reusable<BR>plastic case. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Each heavy armor squadron is worth 30 points in Ogre Miniatures (<BR>http://www.sjgames.com/ogre/miniatures/ ): one superheavy at 12 points, and<BR>three heavies at 6 each. The two squadrons in this box boost your army's<BR>value by 60 points. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Stock #10-2103, ISBN 1-55634-467-8. $19.95 <BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 23:29:31 -0800<BR>From: "Glenn M. Goffin" &lt;gmgoffin@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Imperial Bureaucracy<BR><BR>&gt;From: Dalton Spence &lt;dalton.spence@hwcn.org&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Is there any formal definition of the bureaucratic structure of the<BR>&gt;Third Imperium from the ministry level on down? The four ministries<BR><BR>In my Traveller Universe, the ministers serve and and the ministries exist<BR>at the pleasure of the Emperor.*&nbsp; Consequently, the bureaucratic structure<BR>changes over time.&nbsp; What time frame (which milieu) are you talking about?<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>*That pleasure is expressed in Imperial edicts.&nbsp; Unless the Emperor rescinds<BR>an edict, it continues to be the law.&nbsp; During the Civil War, no barracks<BR>emperor got very far in taking apart the bureaucracy (and they generally did<BR>not want to do so), so it continued as it had before.&nbsp; The ministers really<BR>ran the government.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 21:48:35 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Children of Dune Question<BR><BR>Kenneth Bearden&nbsp; wrote :<BR>&gt; I just finished Children of Dune, and I have a question for those of you<BR>&gt; who consider yourselves Dune aficionados.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; **spoiler alert**<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; My question is:&nbsp; Why did Leto II go through all that rigmarole<BR>&gt; (complicated plot trying to expose Jessica and the Bene Gesserit angle,<BR>&gt; the possessed Alia, bringing Farad'n to Dune, getting the Fremen rebels<BR>&gt; to rise up against Alia's Regency, confronting The Preacher, etc...),<BR>&gt; when all he really had to do was merge with the sandtrout to begin<BR>&gt; with--an act he ended up doing anyway.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I mean, if he was going to merge with the sandtrout and become<BR>&gt; super-human anyway, then why did he go through the motions of all that<BR>&gt; other stuff?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; It seems like he could have accomplished his goals more efficiently had<BR>&gt; he done the merging in the first place--and it seems like much of the<BR>&gt; book was unnecessary.<BR><BR>Ok, here's my take on it.<BR><BR>Firstly, I have to say the whole thing makes much more sense after<BR>God-Emperor.<BR>That makes it plain just exactly what is so horrible about following the<BR>Golden Path, which really is not explained in the earlier books.<BR><BR>Both Paul and Leto knew that the Golden Path was the way that they should go<BR>because of their presience.<BR><BR>But Paul refused to do it, and in fact abdicated power precisely to avoid<BR>having to follow the Golden Path. (And this was the whole point of<BR>confronting the Preacher, to say, why the hell did you abdicate your<BR>responsibility and pass this burden on to me ?<BR><BR>Following the Golden Path means you become a sandworm, you lose all the<BR>benefits of being human, you have to ruthlesssly suppress and kill good<BR>people, including your own family. You have to give up your life, your<BR>children, your wife, eveything that makes you you, merely to fulfill your<BR>own prophecy and save the human race. You know that you will be reviled,<BR>attacked and considered the worst tyrant in history once your reign is<BR>ended, by your own descendants, thousands of years in the future. And you<BR>know exactly what going to happen throughout that whole long, long, boring,<BR>time.<BR><BR>Leto didn't merge with the sandtrout at the beginning, because<BR>(a) He didn't want the Golden Path anymore than his father did.<BR>(b) Though it was inevitable, he wanted to put it off as long as possible,<BR>to have a bit of a life of his own before sacrificing himself.<BR>(c) Perhaps even Leto took some time to steel himself to the idea of having<BR>alien creatures covering his body, inserting their cilia into his pores and<BR>other orifices,&nbsp; and cutting him off from human contact.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; Comments?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Kenneth.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 08:47:08 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>on 17/1/01 3:20 am, Peter Scarrott at peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; The Jack was originally the short flag pole (only about 6-8' long on the<BR>&gt; stern (blunt end :-) ) of a ship where the identifying flag was flown.<BR>&gt; General corruption of the language has led the Union flag (National Flag of<BR>&gt; United Kingdom) to be referred to as the Union Jack.<BR><BR>Definitely not the stern. The jack-staff is used for signalling, not<BR>identification. Also, it's not the National flag, because we do not have<BR>just one. It is the flag of the Kingdom. Aren't the semantics of flags fun?<BR>There is technically a difference in size between a Jack and a Flag. In<BR>naval terms, the Union Jack indicates that the Admiral of the Fleet is<BR>aboard ship. It's not legal to fly the Union Jack or the Cross of St. George<BR>aboard a civil ship by orders of the Admiralty - the Cross of St. George<BR>(the national flag of England) indicates that an Admiral is aboard ship. You<BR>may fly the Saltire (Cross of St. Andrew) aboard a civil vessel, as it has<BR>no recognised meaning in naval signalling. You may not fly the Lion Rampant<BR>at all - it indicates that a member of the Scottish Royal family is present.<BR>The Queen, acting as the Queen of Scots may fly this flag in residence in<BR>Scotland as may the heir-apparent (the Duke of Rothesay), differentiated by<BR>a label azure.<BR><BR>http://scoutingresources.org.uk/councult_flags.html#Union%20Jack<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 17:55:24 -0000<BR>From: "Antony Farrell" &lt;Skaran@bigpond.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Wiring Diagrams<BR><BR>Has anyone on the list done a wiring diagram for any of the standard ships<BR>(the ubiquitous type S would be ideal) and while we are it, air conditioning<BR>ducts etc.<BR>Of course if anyone has full construction blue prints!<BR><BR>I would be very interested in seeing them.<BR><BR>Antony<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 23:38:24 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Wiring Diagrams<BR><BR>Antony Farrell wrote :<BR><BR>&gt; Has anyone on the list done a wiring diagram for any of the standard ships<BR>&gt; (the ubiquitous type S would be ideal) and while we are it, air<BR>&gt; conditioning ducts etc.<BR><BR>No.<BR>The diagrams for a A4 Skyhawk fill more than four foolscap lever-arch files.<BR><BR>I could probably find a picture of something that your casual obsverver<BR>wouldn't realize wasn't a spaceship somewhere in my old airforce stuff.<BR><BR>&gt; Of course if anyone has full construction blue prints!<BR>&gt; I would be very interested in seeing them.<BR><BR>Wouldn't we all ?<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 00:39:00 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; as for a solid red flag I believe that during march 1836 during the siege at<BR>&gt; the Alamo the Mexicans Played the De guelljo (spelling is most likely wrong)<BR><BR>"Te guello" is closer. It's mentioned (along with "su madre" :-) in<BR>"Lost Dorsai".<BR><BR>BTW, I explained the significance of "su madre..." to a friend by<BR>asking him to imagine wandering into a not very nice black neighborhood<BR>and yelling "Yo mama" at some gangbangers. <BR><BR>He got the point. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 00:43:03 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: A ship design question<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Has anybody seen designs or had discussions about ships that jettison some<BR>&gt; of their superstructure post-jump? What I'm thinking of is that if a ship<BR>&gt; needs a huge percentage of its tonnage for fuelling a long jump, you'd want<BR>&gt; to jettison that tankage (and motors) like the lower stage of an atmospheric<BR>&gt; lift rocket, giving you a smaller craft that could jump again using a<BR>&gt; smaller fuel requirement. Post-survey, subsequent salvage missions could<BR>&gt; recover the drives to recoup some of the massive cost.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I don't recall seeing such a thing in the early canon.<BR><BR>That's because the jump drives are a *lot* more expensive than rocket motors.<BR><BR>&gt; I'm just thinking through some ideas for exploring rift space safely...<BR><BR>It makes more sense to use a group of tankers to establish fuel dumps. <BR><BR>Or you can have 16 ships jump out, eight of them top off the other<BR>eight. Those eight jump out and top off 4, those for jump again and top<BR>off 2. One of those tops off the other, and you've gotten a ship 4<BR>times as far as you could otherwise. <BR><BR>Note that you use a less than maximum jump here. Possibly a *lot* less.<BR><BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 11:51:30 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Where can I get Psionic Institutes? (was: Need some T4 review s...)<BR><BR>&gt; At 17:28 -0500 16/1/01, "Jones, Dean" <BR>&gt; &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Same here, on all counts. I was thinking of going there this <BR>&gt; weekend, so<BR>&gt; &gt;I'll keep an eye out for you. IIRC, Esdevium are a big <BR>&gt; distributor ( I think<BR>&gt; &gt;the BITS lads can confirm this) and do mail order.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; "Esdevium are a big distributor" ;-)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Esdevium are the most active of the UK distributors. They stock BITS <BR>&gt; books and reorder them ;-) Your FLGS in the UK almost certainly buys <BR>&gt; off them. They also organised a superb gaming area the last two <BR>&gt; GenCons, something that BITS used in 2000 with great success...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; BTW If looking for the FarFuture Reprints or the BITS books in the <BR>&gt; Leisure Games Catalogue, look under Steve Jackson Games, GURPS <BR>&gt; Traveller.<BR><BR>&lt;grin&gt; actually, my FLGS *ARE* Esdevium...they run their own games shop in<BR>Aldershot and are my primary source of all things RPG. On a separate note:<BR>Jens...if I find a Psionics Institute when I'm at the FLGS this weekend<BR>should I pick one up for you? Mail me off-list.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 13:24:07 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A ship design question<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR>&gt; Has anybody seen designs or had discussions about ships that jettison some<BR>&gt; of their superstructure post-jump?<BR><BR>Note that Gordon writes "post-jump." What he is suggesting is therefore<BR>*not* jump tanks, and therefore not off limits for discussion.<BR><BR>I'll bite.&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>If I understand you correctly, you basically want to design a ship with<BR>a large fuel module, and use the fuel in that module to jump. When you<BR>get there, you dump the module (thereby reducing your tonnage) and jump<BR>again (with a lower fuel requirement).<BR><BR>Should work, but remember to add a jump grid to the area previously<BR>covered by the fuel module. This means that your jump grid will cover a<BR>larger area than the original surface area of the ship.<BR><BR>On a related note, jump tanks are given in some sources to be a valid<BR>way of jumping. You use the fuel in the tanks to power up, then quickly<BR>dump them *before* the jump takes place. This has been a topic of hot<BR>(the plasma kind of heat) debate on the TML, so I would advice&nbsp;against<BR>posting any designs using that solution here&nbsp; :-)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 13:41:27 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Double Adventure 7? Double Adventure 8?<BR><BR>Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt; Someone just pointed out through feedback to Freelance Traveller that the<BR>&gt; Supplements and Adventures Classic Reprints make mention of Double<BR>&gt; Adventure 7 (Perruques/Exit Visa) and Double Adventure 8 (Memory Alpha).<BR><BR>Slightly related question... is the reprint of the Double Adventures out<BR>yet? I've got the Adventures reprint, and it was very inspiring.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, Jan 18 2001 1:36:49 GMT+1100<BR>From: robocon@ozemail.com.au<BR>Subject: Re : Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>Re : Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>Jeff Zeitlin wrote :-<BR>&gt; Of course, you realize that _that_ leads directly to Official Science<BR>&gt; Fiction Clich #42, Learning By Pill.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Assignment: Discuss the plausibility of this, in light of current<BR>&gt; knowledge in appropriately related subjects, and consider in your<BR>&gt; discussion the implications on game balance and the character of<BR>&gt; the Traveller Universe.<BR><BR>The substrates of learning and memory remain complex.<BR>Interesting insights have been obtained with the tools of molecular<BR>biology in the last 20 years (some key words : long-term potentiation,<BR>glutamate, glycine and the NMDA receptor family).<BR><BR>It appears, given functional imaging studies with PET/SPECT, that<BR>multiple areas of the brain are called into action when performing a<BR>given task. The patterns of activation are peculiar to that task.<BR><BR>Learning by pill implies nanotech magic to me - the ability to<BR>alter multiple spatially separate areas of brain without disrupting<BR>existing patterns laid down by ordinary experience.<BR><BR>Canonically, crude memory erasure is available at TTL 14. I'd equate<BR>pill based learning with non-destructive memory transfers and thus<BR>put it at a minimum of TTL 16. <BR><BR><BR>Robert O'Connor<BR>Medico, Gamer<BR>This message was sent through MyMail http://www.mymail.com.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 14:40:49 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Double Adventure 7? Double Adventure 8?<BR><BR>Great. :-) Here I was going to buy the CT Reprints Double Adv. Volume just <BR>for "stranded on Arden" And here I get a new adventure...I have the <BR>Traveller Book...Got it in HS so I get 2 new adventures :-) Thanks Mark!<BR><BR>Mike<BR><BR><BR>&gt;From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Double Adventure 7? Double Adventure 8?<BR>&gt;Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 20:31:38 -0500<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;GDW convention games. Marc is adding some stuff to spice up the fourth book<BR>&gt;a bit from just the same old doubles. Notice that the name of FFE04 has<BR>&gt;always been Double Adventures 1-6+<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;----- Original Message -----<BR>&gt;From: "Jeff Zeitlin" &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Someone just pointed out through feedback to Freelance Traveller that <BR>&gt;the<BR>&gt; &gt; Supplements and Adventures Classic Reprints make mention of Double<BR>&gt; &gt; Adventure 7 (Perruques/Exit Visa) and Double Adventure 8 (Memory Alpha).<BR>&gt; &gt; These are not in the list that I received when I made up the Published<BR>&gt; &gt; Products lists for Freelance Traveller.&nbsp; Can anyone verify their<BR>&gt;existence,<BR>&gt; &gt; or provide an explanation/story?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3530<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yc04.mx.aol.com (rly-yc04.mail.aol.com [172.18.149.36]) by air-yc04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 09:45:06 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yc04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 09:44:30 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id JAA41854;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 09:42:19 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 17 Jan 2001 09:41:22 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id JAA41801<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 09:41:22 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 09:41:22 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101171441.JAA41801@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3530<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3531</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/17/01 2:58:11 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; Wednesday, January 17 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3531<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>upcoming 15mm SF mini's line: SPACELORDS?<BR>Psionic Institutes<BR>RE: Psionic Institutes<BR>Re: Children of Dune Question<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3529<BR>RE: Deck plans and ACQ(was:&nbsp; Traveller-digest V1999 #3528)<BR>OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR>RE: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR>RE: 15mm Traveller figs<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR>Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR>Re: Children of Dune Question<BR>RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR>RE: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR>RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR>RE: Jolly Roger<BR>Re: T5 'playtest'?<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3528<BR>Ships Deck Plans....<BR>Re: 15mm Traveller figs<BR>RE: 15mm Traveller figs<BR>Government and Law Level Codes<BR>Brubeks @ JTAS<BR>Re: A ship design question<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 06:54:28 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: upcoming 15mm SF mini's line: SPACELORDS?<BR><BR>&nbsp; This should be of some interest - their URL doesn't cover the<BR>upcoming product, IIRC, but it's:&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; www.hobbyproducts.com&nbsp; <BR><BR>&nbsp; These are the people who did the outstanding _Metal Magic_ line<BR>of 25mm SF mini's in the early `90's. Reasonably priced, too.<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;&nbsp; That said, a 15mm version is, IMHO, the best possible outcome; as<BR>&gt;a long-time _Traveller_ player I'm terribly fond of 15mm mini's on<BR>&gt;0.5" square grids. I may even buy duplicates of many SPACELORDS <BR>&gt;figs - some for hex-based skirmish and others for individual mounting<BR>&gt;on square bases.<BR><BR>"SPACELORDS is still 'in the pipeline' &lt;snippage&gt; but once avaiable, <BR>it will be 15mm, and hex-based like DEMONWORLD."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 14:50:57 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Psionic Institutes<BR><BR>www.nobleknight.com has copies for sale and I believe he ships <BR>internationally. I have bought from from here in the states and I give a <BR>high recommendation to Aaron!<BR>Also you might try www.dragontrove.com<BR><BR>Mike<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 14:52:29 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Psionic Institutes<BR><BR>I've bought from Aaron for a couple of years (mostly OOP Gurps books) and<BR>can recommend him too.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Michael McKeown [mailto:mmckeown67@hotmail.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: 17 January 2001 14:51<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Psionic Institutes<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; www.nobleknight.com has copies for sale and I believe he ships <BR>&gt; internationally. I have bought from from here in the states <BR>&gt; and I give a <BR>&gt; high recommendation to Aaron!<BR>&gt; Also you might try www.dragontrove.com<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Mike<BR>&gt; _________________________________________________________________<BR>&gt; Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 08:57:45 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Children of Dune Question<BR><BR>"Frank G. Pitt" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Firstly, I have to say the whole thing makes much more sense after<BR>&gt; God-Emperor.<BR><BR>I've noticed that.&nbsp; Questions in Dune were answered in Messiah.&nbsp; Messiah made<BR>*much* more sense after reading Children.<BR><BR>If the pattern follows, I will agree that Children will make more sense after<BR>I've read God-Emperor.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; (c) Perhaps even Leto took some time to steel himself to the idea of having<BR>&gt; alien creatures covering his body, inserting their cilia into his pores and<BR>&gt; other orifices,&nbsp; and cutting him off from human contact.<BR><BR>Great comments, Frankie.<BR><BR>I guess my point is:&nbsp; If Leto would have merged with the sandtrout earlier in<BR>Children, then being captured at the sietch and being forced to use the spice<BR>via injection would not have been a problem for him (I guess, as it turned out,<BR>it wasn't much of a problem for him anyway).<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 07:03:06 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3529<BR><BR>&gt;IIRC, RAFM could not distribute the Citadel stuff in the US because Martian <BR>&gt;Metals contract gave them an exclusive in the USA. I always thought the <BR>&gt;Citadel stuff was superior, IMO.<BR><BR>&nbsp; The Great Old One speaks wisdom!! :)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 15:03:26 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Deck plans and ACQ(was:&nbsp; Traveller-digest V1999 #3528)<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: GDWGAMES@aol.com [mailto:GDWGAMES@aol.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: 17 January 2001 02:30<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3528<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; In a message dated 16-Jan-01 4:30:08 PM Central Standard Time, <BR>&gt; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; ACQ is a fantastic brilliant lovely product which at five <BR>&gt; quid a pop <BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; everyone should by two copies of (one for each side) and the new <BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; Deckplans for the Beowulf from SJ Games for thirteen quid, <BR>&gt; and then <BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; you'd never need to go out again.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Until the next deck plan set comes out. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; :&nbsp; )<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Speaking of which, the next is for the Mod. cutter. Any date for the S-class<BR>scout?<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 08:02:28<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR><BR>_Penguin Boy_<BR><BR>by Douglas Berry<BR><BR>to the tune of: _Iron Man_ by Black Sabbath<BR><BR>I AM PENGUIN BOY!<BR><BR>Wish I had webbed feet<BR>Replace my nose with a shiny beak<BR>Waddling 'cross the rocks and ice<BR>Penguinhood's worth any price!<BR><BR>Swimming for all my meals<BR>Trying to avoid the hated seals<BR>Leaping high out of the sea<BR>'Ho the penguin life for me!<BR><BR>But it all seems so hopeless<BR>After all, I'm just human<BR><BR>With genetic tinkering, though<BR>At last, I have a plan<BR><BR>&lt;Instrumental break&gt;<BR><BR>Now my feathers glow<BR>Black on top and white below<BR>Earth has become my toy<BR>Run in fear from Penguin Boy!<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&nbsp; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>Animals who are not penguins can only wish they were.<BR>- -Chicago reader, 10/15/82<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 16:05:28 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR><BR>Thanks for the splort warning, Doug...I'd spent all day converting my KB to<BR>Dvorak and I'd hate to have to start again :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Douglas E. Berry [mailto:gridlore@pop.mindspring.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: 17 January 2001 08:02<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: OT Filk: Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 11:07:34 -0500<BR>From: Glenn Myers &lt;glenn.myers@ansys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: 15mm Traveller figs<BR><BR>I have found the Ral Partha and Laserburn line to be acceptable 15mm. <BR><BR>Check out my 15mm web page at http://www.icubed.com/~gemyers/15mm.htm<BR><BR>If anyone can identify the unknown figures at the bottom of the page please<BR>email me!<BR><BR>It includes the Ral Partha 15mm figs from the boxed games Galactic<BR>Grenadiers and Final Frontier. Those are a pretty good deal. They usually<BR>sell on Ebay for $20 and you get 40 15mm figs in each.<BR><BR>The individual figures made by Laserburn are of uneven quality. They are<BR>smaller and lighter than most. They do have some good detail, though. Some<BR>of the adventurers are very nice. I am not fond of the Warrior Lords. I<BR>DON'T like my battle troops to have swirling capes. Silly of me, I know...<BR>Still, they casme with assault Trikes, which were cool.<BR><BR>I really liked the Laserburn vehicles. The ATV at the top of the page is a<BR>Laserburn Tracked ATV with a turret added. Hopefully, I'll be putting the<BR>Grav ATV up, gotta paint it first, though.<BR><BR>______________________________________________________<BR><BR>Glenn E. Myers<BR>ANSYS Inc.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Email: glenn.myers@ansys.com<BR>275 Technology Drive&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Phone: (724) 514-2913<BR>Canonsburg, PA 15317&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax:&nbsp;&nbsp; (724) 514-3118<BR>______________________________________________________<BR><BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 08:11:30<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>At 04:26 PM 1/16/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;If you want to have some fun, scan the label on one of your pill<BR>&gt;bottles, and print a new one in Bilandin. Apply that to an empty and<BR>&gt;"accidentally" hand that one to the pharmacist when you go in for a<BR>&gt;refill. :-)<BR><BR>Urm.&nbsp; As amusing a concpet as that might be, when my meds go bad on me I'm<BR>pretty much seizing constantly.&nbsp; So I'm very reluctant to do anything to<BR>that bottle (at least until my medi-alert tag shows up.)&nbsp; Dilantin is one<BR>of those "the doctor *needs* to know you are on this" type medications.<BR><BR>Anyway, I order my refills on the web!<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 08:13:27<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR><BR>At 12:06 PM 1/16/2001 -0700, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Hmmm...that sounds like a series that The Discovery Channel is starting<BR>&gt;soon here. Oddly enough, the person doing the promos is none other than<BR>&gt;Rudy the ex-SEAL from Survivors. ;-)<BR><BR>And the promos were filmed in front of the Mojave Phone Booth!&nbsp; To of my<BR>favorite weird things in the universe in one strange commerical!&nbsp; Hail<BR>Eris!&nbsp; (the goddess one)<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 10:28:56 -0600<BR>From: Loren Wiseman &lt;lkw@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR><BR>Here's a chance to make some bucks.<BR><BR>I'm looking for manuscripts for a group of 32-page books dealing with a<BR>single world (16,000 to 17,000 words), for publication by SJ Games.<BR><BR>Contact me at lkw@io.com for more details.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Loren Wiseman<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Traveller Line Manager/Traveller Guru-in-Residence<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Editor, Journal of the Travellers' Aid Society&nbsp; http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; SJ Games<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; lkw@io.com http://www.io.com/~lkw/<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (512) 447-7866 VOX<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (512) 447-1144 FAX<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 12:13:03 EST<BR>From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Children of Dune Question<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/17/01 10:00:57 AM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>dreamer@brokersys.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; I guess my point is:&nbsp; If Leto would have merged with the sandtrout earlier <BR>in<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Children, then being captured at the sietch and being forced to use the <BR>&gt; spice<BR>&gt;&nbsp; via injection would not have been a problem for him (I guess, as it turned <BR>&gt; out,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; it wasn't much of a problem for him anyway).<BR><BR>Ah, but if I remember correctly, the sandtrout would not have merged with<BR>his body properly had it not already been saturated with spice.&nbsp; So the<BR>events had to happen in that order.<BR><BR>- ----------<BR>Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>set of people who will take offense at it."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 18:08 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;PIEFIHNLNBEMHOILBEBPKEAPCFAA.jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>Grrr. Wish I was in the right part of the world... I'd love to build that <BR>one :-)<BR><BR>Mobile self-powered base unit, foam latex Hiver body and some interesting <BR>sensory electronics... maybe even a few servo-driven bits to make the <BR>'fingers' move when the Hiver 'talks'...<BR><BR>The only thing more fun than building it is playing the Hiver.<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR>(frustrated) SFX technician.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 09:47:03 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; At 04:26 PM 1/16/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;If you want to have some fun, scan the label on one of your pill<BR>&gt;&gt;bottles, and print a new one in Bilandin. Apply that to an empty and<BR>&gt;&gt;"accidentally" hand that one to the pharmacist when you go in for a<BR>&gt;&gt;refill. :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Urm.&nbsp; As amusing a concpet as that might be, when my meds go bad on me I'm<BR>&gt; pretty much seizing constantly.&nbsp; So I'm very reluctant to do anything to<BR>&gt; that bottle (at least until my medi-alert tag shows up.)&nbsp; Dilantin is one<BR>&gt; of those "the doctor *needs* to know you are on this" type medications.<BR><BR>No, no, I said do it to an *empty* bottle. I know better than to<BR>suggest doing it to one that's actually got meds in it!<BR><BR>&gt; Anyway, I order my refills on the web!<BR><BR>Oh, drat!<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 09:48:45 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; At 12:06 PM 1/16/2001 -0700, you wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Hmmm...that sounds like a series that The Discovery Channel is starting<BR>&gt;&gt;soon here. Oddly enough, the person doing the promos is none other than<BR>&gt;&gt;Rudy the ex-SEAL from Survivors. ;-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; And the promos were filmed in front of the Mojave Phone Booth!&nbsp; To of my<BR>&gt; favorite weird things in the universe in one strange commerical!&nbsp; Hail<BR>&gt; Eris!&nbsp; (the goddess one)<BR><BR>Last I heard, the Mojave phone booth was gone. At least the most famous<BR>one. Seems it was getting too many calls from the curious.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 10:29:39 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR><BR>ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Douglas E. Berry<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2001 8:02 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: OT Filk: Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; _Penguin Boy_<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; by Douglas Berry<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; to the tune of: _Iron Man_ by Black Sabbath<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I AM PENGUIN BOY!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Wish I had webbed feet<BR>&gt; Replace my nose with a shiny beak<BR>&gt; Waddling 'cross the rocks and ice<BR>&gt; Penguinhood's worth any price!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Swimming for all my meals<BR>&gt; Trying to avoid the hated seals<BR>&gt; Leaping high out of the sea<BR>&gt; 'Ho the penguin life for me!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; But it all seems so hopeless<BR>&gt; After all, I'm just human<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; With genetic tinkering, though<BR>&gt; At last, I have a plan<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;Instrumental break&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Now my feathers glow<BR>&gt; Black on top and white below<BR>&gt; Earth has become my toy<BR>&gt; Run in fear from Penguin Boy!<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Animals who are not penguins can only wish they were.<BR>&gt; -Chicago reader, 10/15/82<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 10:35:55 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR><BR>In the immortal words of Bruce Willis "Come out t' the coast, we'll have a<BR>few laughs..."<BR><BR>BayCon's only 5 months away ;)<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Megan Robertson<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2001 10:08 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Cc: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Prop Hivers (was: Traveller survivors)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In-Reply-To: &lt;PIEFIHNLNBEMHOILBEBPKEAPCFAA.jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Greetings dear hearts.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Grrr. Wish I was in the right part of the world... I'd love to build that<BR>&gt; one :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mobile self-powered base unit, foam latex Hiver body and some interesting<BR>&gt; sensory electronics... maybe even a few servo-driven bits to make the<BR>&gt; 'fingers' move when the Hiver 'talks'...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The only thing more fun than building it is playing the Hiver.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hugs and kisses,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mexal.<BR>&gt; (frustrated) SFX technician.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 18:46 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: RE: Jolly Roger<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;07CFA3458AF6914BA74AC1CDA5E2B28515407D@rwscamis003.asera.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>UK Naval flags: -<BR><BR>'Union Jack' - as the UK national flag (which should be referred to as a <BR>'Union Flag'); on a ship it is worn on the jackstaff which is a shortish <BR>upright pole at the front. Normally worn in port, to indicate where the <BR>ship comes from.<BR><BR>'White Ensign' - formerly indicated ships under the control of an 'Admiral <BR>of the White', now used for all regular Royal Navy ships. It is white with <BR>a red cross, the Union Flag appearing in the top corner nearest the staff.<BR><BR>'Blue Ensign' - formerly ships under 'Admirals of the Blue', now flown on <BR>any ship commanded by someone who holds a commission in the Royal Naval <BR>Reserve. So you can, for instance, find yourself on a cruise ship flying <BR>the Blue Ensign. It is plain dark blue with the Union in the top corner <BR>nearest the staff.<BR><BR>'Red Ensign' - formerly on ships under 'Admirals of the Red', now flown by <BR>all UK-registered merchantmen (unless eligible to fly a Blue Ensign). It <BR>is plain red with the Union in the top corner nearest the staff.<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 19:16:18 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: T5 'playtest'?<BR><BR>At 21:29 -0500 16/1/01,&nbsp; Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &lt;activate technolust for G4 PB)<BR>&gt;Mmmm, shiny. :) Should be possible to heat treat it like that natty Titanium<BR>&gt;jewellery that was all the rage back near the dawn of Traveller... in fact<BR>&gt;the G4 will probably do that to the base anyhow. :)<BR><BR>Not as well as a P3 or P4 would ;-)<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 19:18:31 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3528<BR><BR>At 09:41 -0500 17/1/01, GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; ACQ is a fantastic brilliant lovely product which at five quid a pop<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; everyone should by two copies of (one for each side) and the new<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; Deckplans for the Beowulf from SJ Games for thirteen quid, and then<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; you'd never need to go out again.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Until the next deck plan set comes out.<BR>&gt;:&nbsp; )<BR><BR>Well, make that the next two sets if a subsidized liner is planned ;-)<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 11:48:11 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Ships Deck Plans....<BR><BR>I know this post came up before so sorry about bringing it back up. what i<BR>want to know is this.<BR><BR>If 1 there is a Set of Deck plans for a S type scout courier out there that<BR>is designed to use with 25mm minitures?<BR><BR>if not <BR><BR>Does someone have a set that can be printed out on a plotter type printer?<BR><BR>any info would be helpful<BR><BR>thanks<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 13:10:38 -0800<BR>From: Evyn MacDude &lt;wmacdude@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: 15mm Traveller figs<BR><BR>Glenn Myers wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I have found the Ral Partha and Laserburn line to be acceptable 15mm.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Check out my 15mm web page at http://www.icubed.com/~gemyers/15mm.htm<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; If anyone can identify the unknown figures at the bottom of the page please<BR>&gt; email me!<BR><BR>Unknown 1 are all Metal Magic figs, it's&nbsp; german company with any odd restocking<BR>policy.<BR><BR>- --<BR>Evyn<BR><BR>"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; For he to-day that sheds his blood with me<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; This day shall gentle his condition."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; -- William Shakespeare, King Henry the Fifth, IV:iii:60-63<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 16:44:38 -0500<BR>From: Glenn Myers &lt;glenn.myers@ansys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: 15mm Traveller figs<BR><BR>Really, are you sure? I can't find any of mine on the Stuff of Legends page<BR>for Metal Magic. Of course they don't have photos for everything.<BR><BR>http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~tpope/sol/metal-magic/spacelords.html<BR><BR>I really like them a lot. They have great detail and make good scout player<BR>miniatures. They have light armor, no battlesuits. They have a dimpled<BR>surface to the base I have never seen on any other figure.<BR><BR><BR>Evyn MacDude wrote:<BR><BR>Unknown 1 are all Metal Magic figs, it's&nbsp; german company with any odd<BR>restocking<BR>policy.<BR><BR>- --<BR>Evyn<BR><BR>"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; For he to-day that sheds his blood with me<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; This day shall gentle his condition."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; -- William Shakespeare, King Henry the Fifth, IV:iii:60-63<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 14:26:51 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Government and Law Level Codes<BR><BR>Hi All,<BR><BR>Could someone please post the Government and Law Level UWP codes for <BR>the different versions of Traveller? I don't think the Law Level <BR>codes changed between versions, but i've a vague suspicion they might <BR>have done.<BR><BR>TIA<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 22:38:19 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Brubeks @ JTAS<BR><BR>Anyone still use this?<BR><BR>If you do, I'll be swinging by around 2300 hrs GMT +0.00&nbsp; 17 Jan 2001<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 23:00:14 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A ship design question<BR><BR>on 17/1/01 12:24 pm, Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm at jenry023@student.liu.se<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; If I understand you correctly, you basically want to design a ship with<BR>&gt; a large fuel module, and use the fuel in that module to jump. When you<BR>&gt; get there, you dump the module (thereby reducing your tonnage) and jump<BR>&gt; again (with a lower fuel requirement).<BR><BR>Yes, I'm assuming calculating the tonnage of the jump fuel in as required<BR>mass to overcome for the jump. Standard calculations apply...<BR><BR>I'm even thinking that since the drives used to jump that mass will be<BR>thirsty, that they will not be required (or desired) in the subsequent<BR>jump(s). The discarded drives would be left with a coded transponder so that<BR>a recovery vessel could return them to the host shipyard.<BR><BR>&gt; Should work, but remember to add a jump grid to the area previously<BR>&gt; covered by the fuel module. This means that your jump grid will cover a<BR>&gt; larger area than the original surface area of the ship.<BR><BR>Yes, true enough.<BR><BR>&gt; On a related note, jump tanks are given in some sources to be a valid<BR>&gt; way of jumping. You use the fuel in the tanks to power up, then quickly<BR>&gt; dump them *before* the jump takes place. This has been a topic of hot<BR>&gt; (the plasma kind of heat) debate on the TML, so I would advice&nbsp;against<BR>&gt; posting any designs using that solution here&nbsp; :-)<BR><BR>That's just cheating. Let's see if anybody who favours that bites. &gt;:)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3531<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xa02.mx.aol.com (rly-xa02.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.71]) by air-xa05.mail.aol.com (v77_r1.13) with ESMTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 17:58:11 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xa02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 17:57:49 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id RAA60220;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 17:57:09 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 17 Jan 2001 17:57:00 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id RAA60185<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 17:57:00 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 17:57:00 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101172257.RAA60185@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3531<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3532</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/17/01 7:21:27 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; Wednesday, January 17 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3532<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Children of Dune Question<BR>Off-Topic: ASCII Starwars<BR>Re: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR>Re: A ship design question<BR>RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR>Re: Where can I get Psionic Institutes? (was: Need some T4 review s...)<BR>Re: A ship design question<BR>Re: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR>RE: A ship design question<BR>RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR>Re: A ship design question<BR>RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR>Question to/from Freelance Traveller<BR>Re: OT: Video (was: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors))<BR>RE: Question to/from Freelance Traveller<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3530<BR>RE: OT: Video (was: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors))<BR>Re: Children of Dune Question<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3531<BR>RE: Government and Law Level Codes<BR>Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR>Re: OT: Video (was: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors))<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 16:56:48 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Children of Dune Question<BR><BR>JFZeigler@aol.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Ah, but if I remember correctly, the sandtrout would not have merged with<BR>&gt; his body properly had it not already been saturated with spice.&nbsp; So the<BR>&gt; events had to happen in that order.<BR><BR>Hmm.&nbsp; Didn't realize that (and I just finished the book!).&nbsp; Doesn't mean that<BR>it's not there, though.<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 09:56:06 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Off-Topic: ASCII Starwars<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Just got sent this from a friend:<BR><BR>&gt;If you are a starwars fan and have web access, this will surely give you a<BR>&gt;laugh. Some people have way too much time on their hands..........<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;http://www.asciimation.co.nz/<BR><BR><BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 18:10:37 -0500<BR>From: "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 08:02:28<BR>&gt;From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;_Penguin Boy_<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;by Douglas Berry<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;to the tune of: _Iron Man_ by Black Sabbath<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I AM PENGUIN BOY!<BR><BR>BWAH!<BR><BR>Oh, dear.... this outburst of laughter is gonna take some explaining to the <BR>person who just walked in.... =)<BR><BR>Hrm... if I ever see you at a convention, should I be on the lookout for <BR>someone wearing, say, a tuxedo...? =)<BR><BR><BR>- ---<BR>==============================================================<BR>Jonathan McDermott, CNE/MCSE&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; NOSPAMcaraig@mindspring.com<BR>System Administrator&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http:\\caraig.home.mindspring.com<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Anubis@SpatialWastes -*- Caraig,Dermott@FurryMUCK<BR>IMTU tc+ tn t4 ge++ -3i+ c+(**) jt pi+ va+ dr+ pr+ zh+() so@<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; "Never trust a computer you can't throw out a window."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -Steve Wozniak<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 23:23:55 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A ship design question<BR><BR>on 17/1/01 8:43 am, Leonard Erickson at shadow@krypton.rain.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; I don't recall seeing such a thing in the early canon.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; That's because the jump drives are a *lot* more expensive than rocket motors.<BR><BR>Sure, but transponders that only respond to the manufacturer code are pretty<BR>low-tech, and therefore available. Since the first jump target is going to<BR>be known, it's easy to follow in a ship that can recover the drives (though<BR>not the hull of the jump tanks).<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; I'm just thinking through some ideas for exploring rift space safely...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; It makes more sense to use a group of tankers to establish fuel dumps.<BR><BR>Sure, I've done a system of calculations based on that too.<BR><BR>&gt; Or you can have 16 ships jump out, eight of them top off the other<BR>&gt; eight. Those eight jump out and top off 4, those for jump again and top<BR>&gt; off 2. One of those tops off the other, and you've gotten a ship 4<BR>&gt; times as far as you could otherwise.<BR><BR>You can do better than that using a repeating bi-directional relay system.<BR><BR>&gt; Note that you use a less than maximum jump here. Possibly a *lot* less.<BR><BR>Ack. However, using a relay with ships that jettison primary jump motors and<BR>their tankage will improve even on a simple tanker relay.<BR><BR>Given that during the IGS, each jump is into the unknown, it's a shame that<BR>these strategies haven't been explored properly. Or even strategies for the<BR>return of multi-million credit scouts that have got 'stuck' in inter-system<BR>space. Something worth having in T5 First Survey?<BR><BR>Losing the crew is somewhat bad - they are presumably expensive to train.<BR>Losing the hardware is criminal. The really big cost is the time to<BR>manufacture new ships in already over-booked shipyards. I'd envisage M0 as<BR>being a race to establish as many systems as possible as aligned to _your_<BR>empire. Almost like a space Renaissance - grab as much territory as feasible<BR>before the competition gets its hands/paws/tentacles on it.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 23:21 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;PIEFIHNLNBEMHOILBEBPEEBNCFAA.jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts, especially Jesse.<BR><BR>Stop tempting me, you lot. First of all it's "Come to Oregon and we'll let <BR>you shoot machine guns" and now this....<BR><BR>Grrr. I wish...<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 23:43:40 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Where can I get Psionic Institutes? (was: Need some T4 review s...)<BR><BR>on 17/1/01 11:51 am, Jones, Dean at Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &lt;grin&gt; actually, my FLGS *ARE* Esdevium...they run their own games shop in<BR>&gt; Aldershot and are my primary source of all things RPG. On a separate note:<BR>&gt; Jens...if I find a Psionics Institute when I'm at the FLGS this weekend<BR>&gt; should I pick one up for you? Mail me off-list.<BR><BR>I got away from work a bit early today and went there. :) I already had<BR>Psionic Institutes, so both copies were still there at close of play.<BR>They also have First Survey, M0 and M0 Campaign, two copies of FFE<BR>Supplements, and one copy of FFE Books (they had two...), and several of the<BR>BITS 101... series. As well as the FFE Books reprint, I bought Imperial<BR>Squadrons and M0, and their copies of the BITS adventures The Khiidkar<BR>Incident and Spacedogs (nice art Jesse).<BR><BR>Dean/Jens, if you do want to pick up something, they're quite amenable to<BR>putting it aside until you go in, just give 'em a call.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 15:59:09 -0800<BR>From: "Kelly St.Clair" &lt;kellys@efn.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A ship design question<BR><BR>A quick comment:<BR><BR>&gt;I'm even thinking that since the drives used to jump that mass will be<BR>&gt;thirsty, that they will not be required (or desired) in the subsequent<BR>&gt;jump(s). The discarded drives would be left with a coded transponder so that<BR>&gt;a recovery vessel could return them to the host shipyard.<BR><BR>Congratulations, you've just reinvented the rocket stage. :)<BR><BR>ObTrav:&nbsp; Recovery vessels, eh?&nbsp; Asimov's "THE MARTIAN WAY", anyone?<BR><BR><BR>- --------------<BR>Kelly St.Clair&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "'Cause you've got Trouble<BR>kellys@efn.org&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Right here in fair Verona<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; With a capital T that rhymes with D<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That stands for Duel..."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:06:15 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR><BR>on 17/1/01 11:00 pm, Megan Robertson at mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In-Reply-To: &lt;PIEFIHNLNBEMHOILBEBPEEBNCFAA.jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Greetings dear hearts, especially Jesse.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Stop tempting me, you lot. First of all it's "Come to Oregon and we'll let<BR>&gt; you shoot machine guns" and now this....<BR><BR>Go to most US states, and you can buy pistols in K-Mart, and the fun stuff<BR>in sporting goods stores. Connecticut is next door to NY, the cheap<BR>destination for us Brits, and a good place for finding responsible firearms<BR>places, and organised hunting (is that a dirty word in the UK now?).<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR>(King's Arthur's countryman caught in Connecticut Yankee appreciation)<BR><BR>http://homepage.mac.com/drgoon/<BR><BR>(12.8M movie from/edited in CT/NY)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 16:04:52 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: A ship design question<BR><BR>hehehe yeah isnt that what the booster rockets on the Shuttle do? help<BR>shuttle get to certain point then detach and parachute into ocean. there a<BR>recovery vessle homes in on transponder and recovers and returns to nasa for<BR>furture use 8)<BR><BR>hasta<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Kelly St.Clair [mailto:kellys@efn.org]<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2001 3:59 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: A ship design question<BR><BR><BR>A quick comment:<BR><BR>&gt;I'm even thinking that since the drives used to jump that mass will be<BR>&gt;thirsty, that they will not be required (or desired) in the subsequent<BR>&gt;jump(s). The discarded drives would be left with a coded transponder so<BR>that<BR>&gt;a recovery vessel could return them to the host shipyard.<BR><BR>Congratulations, you've just reinvented the rocket stage. :)<BR><BR>ObTrav:&nbsp; Recovery vessels, eh?&nbsp; Asimov's "THE MARTIAN WAY", anyone?<BR><BR><BR>- --------------<BR>Kelly St.Clair&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "'Cause you've got Trouble<BR>kellys@efn.org&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Right here in fair Verona<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; With a capital T that rhymes with D<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That stands for Duel..."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 16:08:20 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR><BR>I try :)<BR>Jesse<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Megan Robertson<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2001 3:21 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Cc: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Prop Hivers (was: Traveller survivors)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; In-Reply-To: &lt;PIEFIHNLNBEMHOILBEBPEEBNCFAA.jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Greetings dear hearts, especially Jesse.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Stop tempting me, you lot. First of all it's "Come to Oregon and <BR>&gt; we'll let <BR>&gt; you shoot machine guns" and now this....<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Grrr. I wish...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Hugs and kisses,<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Mexal.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:18:38 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A ship design question<BR><BR>on 17/1/01 11:59 pm, Kelly St.Clair at kellys@efn.org wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; A quick comment:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; I'm even thinking that since the drives used to jump that mass will be<BR>&gt;&gt; thirsty, that they will not be required (or desired) in the subsequent<BR>&gt;&gt; jump(s). The discarded drives would be left with a coded transponder so that<BR>&gt;&gt; a recovery vessel could return them to the host shipyard.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Congratulations, you've just reinvented the rocket stage. :)<BR><BR>Indeed. I wasn't inventing, just extrapolating into MTU. :)<BR><BR>&gt; ObTrav:&nbsp; Recovery vessels, eh?&nbsp; Asimov's "THE MARTIAN WAY", anyone?<BR><BR>Yeah - haven't read that for a couple of decades now. :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 16:17:40 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR><BR>Nice video Gordon, one videographer to another ;)<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Gordon Hundley<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2001 4:06 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Prop Hivers (was: Traveller survivors)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; on 17/1/01 11:00 pm, Megan Robertson at mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk<BR>&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; In-Reply-To: &lt;PIEFIHNLNBEMHOILBEBPEEBNCFAA.jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Greetings dear hearts, especially Jesse.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Stop tempting me, you lot. First of all it's "Come to Oregon<BR>&gt; and we'll let<BR>&gt; &gt; you shoot machine guns" and now this....<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Go to most US states, and you can buy pistols in K-Mart, and the fun stuff<BR>&gt; in sporting goods stores. Connecticut is next door to NY, the cheap<BR>&gt; destination for us Brits, and a good place for finding<BR>&gt; responsible firearms<BR>&gt; places, and organised hunting (is that a dirty word in the UK now?).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Gordon.<BR>&gt; (King's Arthur's countryman caught in Connecticut Yankee appreciation)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; http://homepage.mac.com/drgoon/<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; (12.8M movie from/edited in CT/NY)<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 20:04:04 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Question to/from Freelance Traveller<BR><BR>This showed up in the Ask Freelance Traveller mailbox today:<BR><BR>&gt;From: Joe Robinson (...@...)<BR>&gt;Subject: Variant form of Vargar<BR><BR>&gt;I have heard of a variant form of Vargar.&nbsp; It is about 7 or so feet tall <BR>&gt;and quite strong but stupid.&nbsp; They are a throw back of some type and a bit<BR>&gt;rare to find, kind of a neanderthal. Hve you heard or read anything about this?<BR><BR>To be honest, there _is_ something nagging at the bottom of my skull<BR>(though it might just be the normal stress of working with the neanderthals<BR>in the police department), but I can't pin it down.&nbsp; Anyone have any<BR>references?<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 01:13:46 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: OT: Video (was: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors))<BR><BR>on 18/1/01 12:17 am, Jesse Degraff at jedegraf@cisco.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Nice video Gordon, one videographer to another ;)<BR><BR>Thanks. It was my first hack with iMovie - having just bought a DVcam and<BR>Firewire card at wonderfully cheaper US prices - I set myself one hour to<BR>edit it and do the transitions. I did the whole edit in the bar of the<BR>Southbury Hilton to the amazement of the other customers. :)<BR><BR>Actually, I think Douglas Adams did a better job...<BR><BR>http://www.apple.com/applemasters/imovie/movielist.html<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>ObTrav: Survey Camera<BR><BR>A helmet mountable digital video camera with in-built wireless networking<BR>designed for Scout survey missions. The stereo optical receivers are<BR>typically built into a pair of night glasses. The camera does not record<BR>internally, but instead sends the AV data in packet radio bursts back to the<BR>recorder, typically a software function loaded on the Scout ship's computer.<BR>TL9+, Cr1000. Archival software for a ship's computer starts at Cr200, but<BR>more sophisticated software (TL10) contains expert systems that indexes<BR>uncatalogued flora, fauna and 'interesting' structures or geology, and can<BR>cost up to twenty times as much, depending on capabilities.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 17:16:22 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question to/from Freelance Traveller<BR><BR>I seem to remember something about this as well, but I'll be damned if I can<BR>pin it down.&nbsp; My memory is *notoriously* bad :)<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Jeff Zeitlin<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2001 5:04 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Question to/from Freelance Traveller<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; This showed up in the Ask Freelance Traveller mailbox today:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;From: Joe Robinson (...@...)<BR>&gt; &gt;Subject: Variant form of Vargar<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;I have heard of a variant form of Vargar.&nbsp; It is about 7 or so feet tall<BR>&gt; &gt;and quite strong but stupid.&nbsp; They are a throw back of some type<BR>&gt; and a bit<BR>&gt; &gt;rare to find, kind of a neanderthal. Hve you heard or read<BR>&gt; anything about this?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; To be honest, there _is_ something nagging at the bottom of my skull<BR>&gt; (though it might just be the normal stress of working with the<BR>&gt; neanderthals<BR>&gt; in the police department), but I can't pin it down.&nbsp; Anyone have any<BR>&gt; references?<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt; Jeff Zeitlin<BR>&gt; jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>&gt; (ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 20:17:25 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3530<BR><BR>&gt; BTW, I explained the significance of "su madre..." to a friend by<BR>&gt;&nbsp; asking him to imagine wandering into a not very nice black neighborhood<BR>&gt;&nbsp; and yelling "Yo mama" at some gangbangers.<BR><BR>I know people who think that's Spanish for "Yes boss"<BR><BR>:&nbsp; )<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 17:19:27 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: OT: Video (was: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors))<BR><BR>Very cool!&nbsp; You're very own Amaze-the-Natives kit :D&nbsp; Did you have it on a<BR>laptop or did you take your iMac to the bar with you (!!!)?<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Gordon Hundley<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2001 5:14 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: OT: Video (was: Prop Hivers (was: Traveller survivors))<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; on 18/1/01 12:17 am, Jesse Degraff at jedegraf@cisco.com wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Nice video Gordon, one videographer to another ;)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Thanks. It was my first hack with iMovie - having just bought a DVcam and<BR>&gt; Firewire card at wonderfully cheaper US prices - I set myself one hour to<BR>&gt; edit it and do the transitions. I did the whole edit in the bar of the<BR>&gt; Southbury Hilton to the amazement of the other customers. :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Actually, I think Douglas Adams did a better job...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; http://www.apple.com/applemasters/imovie/movielist.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Gordon.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; ObTrav: Survey Camera<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; A helmet mountable digital video camera with in-built wireless networking<BR>&gt; designed for Scout survey missions. The stereo optical receivers are<BR>&gt; typically built into a pair of night glasses. The camera does not record<BR>&gt; internally, but instead sends the AV data in packet radio bursts<BR>&gt; back to the<BR>&gt; recorder, typically a software function loaded on the Scout<BR>&gt; ship's computer.<BR>&gt; TL9+, Cr1000. Archival software for a ship's computer starts at Cr200, but<BR>&gt; more sophisticated software (TL10) contains expert systems that indexes<BR>&gt; uncatalogued flora, fauna and 'interesting' structures or geology, and can<BR>&gt; cost up to twenty times as much, depending on capabilities.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 20:16:07 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Re: Children of Dune Question<BR><BR>On Tue, 16 Jan 2001 19:01:20 -0600 Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane<BR>Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt; writes:<BR>&gt; I just finished Children of Dune, and I have a question for those of <BR>&gt; you<BR>&gt; who consider yourselves Dune aficionados.<BR><BR>I forwarded your question to one of the people in my gaming group (she's<BR>the resident spice-head), and she sent this response:<BR><BR><BR>Answer (my opinion): Of course, the obvious is that without all that, the<BR><BR>book could have been a short story!<BR><BR>But as to the character's reasons...<BR><BR>Leto II didn't KNOW the right course to take through most of the book.<BR>His <BR>first visions were only partial and he knew it. Attempting to act on them<BR><BR>could have brought disaster. He had intimations (through a<BR>nightmare/dream) <BR>that his skin was not his own, but at that time he didn't know what it <BR>meant. As different things happened in the book, and he was subjected to <BR>overloads of spice and stress, his comprehension continued to change.<BR>There <BR>were times when he BELIEVED that he had adjusted to the past within and<BR>was <BR>fit to rule/enact a vision, but later circumstances showed that he'd<BR>rested <BR>on his accomplishments prematurely.<BR><BR>Only near the end does Leto see the complete scope of his Golden Path,<BR>and <BR>what it will require of him in every painfully illuminated detail. And<BR>the <BR>only true peace he finds from the lives within is the bargain he struck<BR>with <BR>them, to follow the Golden Path and save all of Mankind.<BR><BR>In part, it is the actions of the Bene Gesserit, Jessica, Alia, Gurney,<BR>the <BR>Preacher, and the others that provides the stresses necessary to his<BR>vision <BR>within the spice trance and to the development of his character. To<BR>simply <BR>see is not enough; Leto must also UNDERSTAND what he's seeing, both in<BR>the <BR>outer world and in the inner, in the past, the present, and the myriad<BR>paths <BR>of the future.<BR><BR>Had Leto attempted the sandtrout skin before achieving both the clear<BR>vision <BR>and the necessary understanding, he could have obliterated the Golden<BR>Path <BR>by taking misinformed actions with his metamorphized form and power.<BR><BR>Does that help?<BR><BR>BTW, the Golden Path was Leto's method for controlling mankind's<BR>evolution <BR>beyond the point in time when he'd seen the "hunting" machines. These<BR>were <BR>an Ixian creation that got out of hand, which apparently used artificial <BR>presience to track down every living human, obliterating the species. <BR>Because of his Golden Path, those machines weren't invented, and also<BR>humans <BR>gained two benefits: a wild gene into the gene pool that allowed carriers<BR>to <BR>be invisible to presience, and the Scattering, which spread Mankind<BR>farther <BR>than even he could see.<BR><BR>Chris:)<BR><BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 20:25:11 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3531<BR><BR>&gt; If there is a Set of Deck plans for a S type scout courier out there that<BR>&gt;&nbsp; is designed to use with 25mm minitures?<BR><BR>Not yet. Presently . . . <BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 01:52:30 -0000<BR>From: "michael.scanlon" &lt;michael.scanlon@bmthonline.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Government and Law Level Codes<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;<BR>Subject: Government and Law Level Codes<BR>Hi All,<BR>Could someone please post the Government and Law Level UWP codes for<BR>the different versions of Traveller? I don't think the Law Level<BR>codes changed between versions, but i've a vague suspicion they might<BR>have done.<BR>&lt;&lt;&lt;<BR><BR>Hi there Gordon, here is the data I have found in four versions of Traveller<BR>for the law codes.<BR><BR>Mega Traveller &amp; Traveller New Era<BR><BR>code&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; General Description<BR>0&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; No Law (no prohibitions).<BR>1&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Low Law (body pistols, explosives, poison gas prohibited)<BR>2&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Low Law (portable energy weapons prohibited)<BR>3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Low law (machine guns, automatic rifles prohibited)<BR>4&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Moderate law (light assault weapons prohibited)<BR>5&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Moderate law (personal concealable weapons prohibited)<BR>6&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Moderate law (all firearms except firearms prohibited)<BR>7&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Moderate law (shotguns prohibited)<BR>8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; High law (blade weapons controlled; no open display)<BR>9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; High law (weapon possession outside the home prohibited)<BR>A&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Extreme law (weapon possession prohibited)<BR>B&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Extreme law (rigid control of civilian movement)<BR>C&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Extreme law (unrestricted invasion of privacy)<BR>D&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Extreme law (paramilitary law enforcement)<BR>E&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Extreme law (full-fledged police state)<BR>F&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Extreme law (all facets of daily life rigidly controlled)<BR>G&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Extreme law (severe punishment for petty infractions)<BR>H&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Extreme law (legalised oppressive practices)<BR>J&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Extreme law (routinely oppressive and restrictive)<BR>K&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Extreme law (excessively oppressive and restrictive)<BR>L&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Extreme law (totally oppressive and restrictive)<BR><BR>Classic Traveller and T4 are a subset of the above as they neither have law<BR>levels going above the code of A.<BR>Also for code 6 we have the error in the above which is stated as all<BR>firearms except shots guns being prohibited at that law level.<BR><BR>Mike.<BR><BR>Michael.Scanlon@Bmthonline.net<BR>ICQ#27333894<BR><BR>"Nothing that God of biomechanics wouldn't let you in Heaven for...."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 16:59:36<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Survivor Groups<BR><BR>At 09:48 AM 1/17/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Last I heard, the Mojave phone booth was gone. At least the most famous<BR>&gt;one. Seems it was getting too many calls from the curious.<BR><BR>Hrm.&nbsp; I had heard that it was being reconnected.<BR><BR>Looking at the Mojave Phone Booth site, I see the NPS has been their usual<BR>lovely selves over this issue.. "Visit the parks.. as long as you do what<BR>we think is appropriate for them, and don't get into any weird shit that we<BR>don't understand.&nbsp; Listen to our damn lectures about the desert tortoises!"<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 03:22:39 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: OT: Video (was: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors))<BR><BR>on 18/1/01 1:19 am, Jesse Degraff at jedegraf@cisco.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Very cool!&nbsp; You're very own Amaze-the-Natives kit :D&nbsp; Did you have it on a<BR>&gt; laptop or did you take your iMac to the bar with you (!!!)?<BR><BR>Yikes! No, I loaded iMovie onto my PowerBook. I figured if I did it in an<BR>hour there would be no chance of the battery running out before I finished<BR>it and gave it a few full-screen plays. :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3532<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yh04.mx.aol.com (rly-yh04.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.36]) by air-yh05.mail.aol.com (v77_r1.13) with ESMTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 22:21:26 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yh04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 22:20:24 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id WAA71261;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 22:19:45 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 17 Jan 2001 22:19:24 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id WAA71227<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 22:19:24 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 22:19:24 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101180319.WAA71227@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3532<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3533</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/17/01 9:59:55 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 18 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3533<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Ships Deck Plans....<BR>RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>landgrab 'rules'<BR>Spanish lesson...<BR>re: Question to/from Freelance Traveller<BR>Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>Re: Psionic Institutes and Out-of-Print Games<BR>RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>RE: OT: Video (was: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors))<BR>Re: A ship design question<BR>Re: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>RE: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>Re: A ship design question<BR>Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>Re: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>Re: Ships Deck Plans....<BR>Re: Question to/from Freelance Traveller<BR>Re: Children of Dune Question<BR>RE: Government and Law Level Codes<BR>Re: 15mm Traveller figs<BR>Re: Variants<BR>Re: Park Story<BR>Re: Owl-Con<BR>Ship Names (used to be something else)<BR>KB3 Experience System<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 22:24:37 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ships Deck Plans....<BR><BR>Seeker made a set named "Express Boat, Tender and Scout Ship", which is<BR>25mm. Was made for MT in 1987. Unfortunately, they are not very common.<BR>Check eBay, www.nobleknight.com, and some of the other places mentioned here<BR>recently. I general query to this list might even turn up a set :-)<BR>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~&lt;&gt;&lt;~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>Colin Michael, webmaster@downport.com<BR>www.Downport.com - "The Traveller Domain"<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "William Lane" &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>&gt; If 1 there is a Set of Deck plans for a S type scout courier out there<BR>that<BR>&gt; is designed to use with 25mm minitures?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 19:35:04 -0800<BR>From: "Mark F. Cook" &lt;markc@peak.org&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>&gt;You are right... I missed it completely... Come to think of it I<BR>&gt;don't think I hit what I was shooting at either... But oh-well. It<BR>&gt;was still a blast... But my shoulder hurt for a couple days after<BR>&gt;that ;)<BR><BR>Bill, that's what you get for shooting a Bennelli.&nbsp; People seem to think<BR>they're the greatest thing since sex and sliced bread but, IMNSHO,<BR>the semi-autos are all a POS. If you want to shoot a semi-auto 12 ga.<BR>all day long and not feel a single pang of discomfort, get a Remington<BR>11-87 Police model.&nbsp; Lori and I own *two* (his and hers.)&nbsp; They are,<BR>bar none, the gentlest 12 ga. I've ever fired.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - Mark C.<BR><BR>&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 03:50:04 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: landgrab 'rules'<BR><BR>Okay, I'm interested in playing the land-grab game. So, what I need to know<BR>is how I go about putting in a claim, and what the restrictions are.<BR><BR>Are claims limited to worlds in The Spinward Marches?<BR>To what Milieu are systems to be created for?<BR>Are there restrictions as to what systems are allowed?<BR>To what degree must canon be followed? If a system is partially described in<BR>an official Traveller publication, must I include that, and only generate<BR>what is not given? What about other (non-core) publications? Clashes with<BR>amateur publications/web sites?<BR><BR>That sort of thing...<BR><BR>I'd like to do at least one system to extreme detail.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 19:45:47 -0800<BR>From: "Mark F. Cook" &lt;markc@peak.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Spanish lesson...<BR><BR>Loren &lt;GDWGAMES@aol.com&gt; writes:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; BTW, I explained the significance of "su madre..." to a friend by<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; asking him to imagine wandering into a not very nice black neighborhood<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; and yelling "Yo mama" at some gangbangers.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I know people who think that's Spanish for "Yes boss"<BR><BR>Hmmm. Anybody who doesn't know the difference between "su madre" and<BR>"Si, jeffe" is in for a serious asskicking the next time they visit a Hispanic<BR>neighborhood! :^)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - Mark C.<BR><BR>&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 19:56:05 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: re: Question to/from Freelance Traveller<BR><BR>&gt;From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Question to/from Freelance Traveller<BR>...<BR>&gt;&gt;I have heard of a variant form of Vargar.&nbsp; It is about 7 or so feet tall <BR>&gt;&gt;and quite strong but stupid.&nbsp; They are a throw back of some type and a bit<BR>&gt;&gt;rare to find, kind of a neanderthal. Hve you heard or read anything about<BR>this?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;To be honest, there _is_ something nagging at the bottom of my skull<BR>&gt;(though it might just be the normal stress of working with the neanderthals<BR>&gt;in the police department), but I can't pin it down.&nbsp; Anyone have any<BR>&gt;references?<BR><BR>&nbsp; V&amp;V, p.63: Urzaeng sub-species:<BR>"Taller and more powerfully built than the average human, Urzaeng <BR>Vargr are capable of holding their own against an adult Aslan male<BR>in close combat. Originally bred by the Ancients for menial labour<BR>and guard duty, Urzaeng typically lack the full mental faculties<BR>enjoyed by other Vargr."<BR><BR>&nbsp; OTOh, maybe they at least have fashion sense?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Steven Hudson<BR><BR>The CT Creed: There is no Game but Traveller, and High Guard is its Product<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 19:48:04 -0800<BR>From: "Mark F. Cook" &lt;markc@peak.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>&gt; Greetings dear hearts, especially Jesse.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Stop tempting me, you lot. First of all it's "Come to Oregon and<BR>&gt; we'll let&nbsp; you shoot machine guns" and now this....<BR><BR>What *I* wanna know is how come Jesse keeps getting the credit for<BR>*MY* machine guns!?! :^)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - Mark C.<BR><BR>&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 22:08:24 -0600<BR>From: WDR &lt;eviloverlord668@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Psionic Institutes and Out-of-Print Games<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; &gt; From: Michael McKeown [mailto:mmckeown67@hotmail.com]<BR>&gt; &gt; Sent: 17 January 2001 14:51<BR>&gt; &gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: Psionic Institutes<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; www.nobleknight.com has copies for sale and I believe he ships<BR>&gt; &gt; internationally. I have bought from from here in the states<BR>&gt; &gt; and I give a<BR>&gt; &gt; high recommendation to Aaron!<BR>&gt; &gt; Also you might try www.dragontrove.com<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Mike<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>I'll second both of these recommendations - have been very satisfied<BR>with Noble Knight and Dragon's Trove.<BR><BR>Speaking of out-of-print games, does anyone know if Digest Group<BR>Publications produced any copies of the "A.I." RPG?&nbsp; Seems like it was<BR>advertised ~1992 or so in Challenge magazine.&nbsp; And other than "Vilani<BR>and Vargr" and "Solomani and Aslan", were any of the other DGP<BR>Megatraveller alien sourcebooks ever published (Zhodani and Droyne,<BR>etc.)?<BR><BR>Thanks!<BR>WDR<BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Vault/9327/main.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 20:13:11 -0800<BR>From: Bill &lt;beast@aracnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;You are right... I missed it completely... Come to think of it I<BR>&gt;&gt;don't think I hit what I was shooting at either... But oh-well. It<BR>&gt;&gt;was still a blast... But my shoulder hurt for a couple days after<BR>&gt;&gt;that ;)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Bill, that's what you get for shooting a Bennelli.&nbsp; People seem to think<BR>&gt;they're the greatest thing since sex and sliced bread but, IMNSHO,<BR>&gt;the semi-autos are all a POS. If you want to shoot a semi-auto 12 ga.<BR>&gt;all day long and not feel a single pang of discomfort, get a Remington<BR>&gt;11-87 Police model.&nbsp; Lori and I own *two* (his and hers.)&nbsp; They are,<BR>&gt;bar none, the gentlest 12 ga. I've ever fired.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - Mark C.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&gt; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&gt; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR><BR>I did not know you had one.... But then I'm not on the same level as <BR>the rest of you gun experts... I just like the noise and the smell of <BR>burnt powder.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 20:04:19 -0800<BR>From: Jesse DeGraff &lt;jdegraff@pacbell.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: OT: Video (was: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors))<BR><BR>;)<BR>jd<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Gordon Hundley<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2001 7:23 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: OT: Video (was: Prop Hivers (was: Traveller survivors))<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; on 18/1/01 1:19 am, Jesse Degraff at jedegraf@cisco.com wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Very cool!&nbsp; You're very own Amaze-the-Natives kit :D&nbsp; Did you<BR>&gt; have it on a<BR>&gt; &gt; laptop or did you take your iMac to the bar with you (!!!)?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Yikes! No, I loaded iMovie onto my PowerBook. I figured if I did it in an<BR>&gt; hour there would be no chance of the battery running out before I finished<BR>&gt; it and gave it a few full-screen plays. :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Gordon.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 23:16:23 EST<BR>From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: A ship design question<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/17/01 10:58:00 PM !!!First Boot!!!, <BR>gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk writes:<BR><BR>&lt;&lt; That's just cheating. Let's see if anybody who favours that bites. &gt;:) &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>From the flames, it appears to me to be: 1) the people who agree with you <BR>about "cheating" Vs 2) the people who point out that it's canon in at least <BR>two places (the Gazelle class close escort, and the mention in the JTAS <BR>blurbs in 5thFFW. IMHO, it's IMPOSSIBLE to reconcile these two sides (as well <BR>as who really cares...:-) )<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 20:19:50 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>on 1/17/01 7:35 PM, Mark F. Cook at markc@peak.org wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Bill, that's what you get for shooting a Bennelli.&nbsp; People seem to think<BR>&gt; they're the greatest thing since sex and sliced bread but, IMNSHO,<BR>&gt; the semi-autos are all a POS. If you want to shoot a semi-auto 12 ga.<BR>&gt; all day long and not feel a single pang of discomfort, get a Remington<BR>&gt; 11-87 Police model.&nbsp; Lori and I own *two* (his and hers.)&nbsp; They are,<BR>&gt; bar none, the gentlest 12 ga. I've ever fired.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; - Mark C.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>What Bill neglected to tell you was that we were shooting my 00 buck 2 3/4"<BR>magnums (law enforcement only).&nbsp; These are the most brutal loads I've shot<BR>yet, from any shotgun.<BR><BR>I like the Benellis because they are quick, and all the dirt and fouling<BR>goes out the barrel, not into the gas system.&nbsp; That and the fact that they<BR>are so famn simple. That being said, my personal scattergun is a Mossberg<BR>590 with heat shield and bayonet lug (hey, ya never know).<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend"<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 20:09:41 -0800<BR>From: Jesse DeGraff &lt;jdegraff@pacbell.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>Hell, **I** don't know!!!&nbsp; Maybe it's because I post all the pictures &amp;<BR>video ;)<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Mark F. Cook<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2001 7:48 PM<BR>&gt; To: Traveller Mail List<BR>&gt; Subject: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Greetings dear hearts, especially Jesse.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Stop tempting me, you lot. First of all it's "Come to Oregon and<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; we'll let&nbsp; you shoot machine guns" and now this....<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What *I* wanna know is how come Jesse keeps getting the credit for<BR>&gt; *MY* machine guns!?! :^)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - Mark C.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 23:20:42 EST<BR>From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: A ship design question<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/17/01 11:21:46 PM !!!First Boot!!!, <BR>gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk writes:<BR><BR>&lt;&lt; Losing the crew is somewhat bad - they are presumably expensive to train.<BR>Losing the hardware is criminal. &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>I would argue that the staff of the IISS would say you've got it bass <BR>ackwards...:-)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 20:22:39 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>on 1/17/01 7:48 PM, Mark F. Cook at markc@peak.org wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Greetings dear hearts, especially Jesse.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Stop tempting me, you lot. First of all it's "Come to Oregon and<BR>&gt;&gt; we'll let&nbsp; you shoot machine guns" and now this....<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What *I* wanna know is how come Jesse keeps getting the credit for<BR>&gt; *MY* machine guns!?! :^)<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>I think they view them as the TMLs machineguns, over which you have<BR>protective custody.&nbsp; My friends have the same theory about my gun<BR>collection.&nbsp; It is assumed that should things get ugly, I'll be supplying<BR>the hardware.<BR><BR>Patiently waiting for my form to come back...<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend"<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 20:24:21 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>on 1/17/01 7:35 PM, Mark F. Cook at markc@peak.org wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>If you want to shoot a semi-auto 12 ga.<BR>&gt; all day long and not feel a single pang of discomfort, get a Remington<BR>&gt; 11-87 Police model.&nbsp; Lori and I own *two* (his and hers.)&nbsp; They are,<BR>&gt; bar none, the gentlest 12 ga. I've ever fired.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; - Mark C.<BR><BR>Try shooting the Browning soft recoil trap gun (if you can find one).<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend"<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 23:24:29 EST<BR>From: Sethkimmel@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Ships Deck Plans....<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/18/01 3:24:54 AM !!!First Boot!!!, <BR>SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com writes:<BR><BR>&lt;&lt; Seeker made a set named "Express Boat, Tender and Scout Ship", which is<BR>25mm. Was made for MT in 1987. &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>The only one I DON'T have...:-(<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 23:25:35 -0500<BR>From: Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question to/from Freelance Traveller<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 20:04:04 -0500<BR>&gt;From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Question to/from Freelance Traveller<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;This showed up in the Ask Freelance Traveller mailbox today:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;From: Joe Robinson (...@...)<BR>&gt;&gt;Subject: Variant form of Vargar<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;I have heard of a variant form of Vargar.&nbsp; It is about 7 or so feet tall <BR>&gt;&gt;and quite strong but stupid.&nbsp; They are a throw back of some type and a bit<BR>&gt;&gt;rare to find, kind of a neanderthal. Hve you heard or read anything about<BR>this?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;To be honest, there _is_ something nagging at the bottom of my skull<BR>&gt;(though it might just be the normal stress of working with the neanderthals<BR>&gt;in the police department), but I can't pin it down.&nbsp; Anyone have any<BR>&gt;references?<BR><BR>"Of the few minority Vargr subspecies known to humaniti, most humans are<BR>probably the most aware of the unusual Urzaeng subspecies. Taller and more<BR>powerfully built than the average human, Urzaeng Vargr are capable of<BR>holding their own against an adult Aslan male in close combat. Originally<BR>bred by the Ancients for menial labor and guard duty, Urzaeng typically<BR>lack the full mental faculties enjoyed by other Vargr."<BR><BR>Vilani and Vargr, p. 63.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 22:36:42 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Children of Dune Question<BR><BR>knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Leto II didn't KNOW the right course to take through most of the book.<BR><BR>I disagree.&nbsp; He was talking about the "terrible" Golden Path in the beginning<BR>of the book.&nbsp; That lead me to believe that he knew what he was up<BR>against--and Paul knew too, which is why he copped out, leaving it for his<BR>son to do.<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 21:06:56 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Government and Law Level Codes<BR><BR>&gt;Hi there Gordon, here is the data I have found in four versions of Traveller<BR>&gt;for the law codes.<BR><BR><BR>Cool, thanks muchly Mike.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:11:21 EST<BR>From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: 15mm Traveller figs<BR><BR>Glenn Myers writes:<BR><BR>&gt;Really, are you sure? I can't find any of mine on the Stuff of Legends page<BR>&gt;for Metal Magic. Of course they don't have photos for everything.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~tpope/sol/metal-magic/spacelords.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I really like them a lot. They have great detail and make good scout player<BR>&gt;miniatures. They have light armor, no battlesuits. They have a dimpled<BR>&gt;surface to the base I have never seen on any other figure.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Evyn MacDude wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Unknown 1 are all Metal Magic figs, it's&nbsp; german company with any odd<BR>&gt;restocking policy.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Dimpled? Hmm. I never saw much of the line, though I have one or two around <BR>here somewhere, but they might be from the pre-plastic-base Citadel days. <BR>They had some rather nice 25mm SF that I didn't see around for long...<BR><BR>GC<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:21:20 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Variants<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;I have heard of a variant form of Vargar.&nbsp; It is about 7 or so feet tall <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;and quite strong but stupid.&nbsp; They are a throw back of some type and a bit<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;rare to find, kind of a neanderthal. Hve you heard or read anything about <BR>&gt; this?<BR><BR>Doesn't ring a bell with me . . . might be something DGP did that I've <BR>forgotten about.<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:29:06 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Park Story<BR><BR>&gt; "Visit the parks.. as long as you do what<BR>&gt;&nbsp; we think is appropriate for them, and don't get into any weird shit that we<BR>&gt;&nbsp; don't understand.&nbsp; Listen to our damn lectures about the desert tortoises!"<BR><BR>Some friends and I were touring the beach near Monterrey a few years back and <BR>were walking along some park trail festooned with signs about how you were <BR>not allowed mess with the plants or rocks (unnecessary advice for me, as I <BR>recognized most of the plants as poison oak). It was a cool, dismal day, and <BR>we were the only ones with the tour guice who was showing us the wonders of <BR>nature, when a ground squirrel ran out of the grass a few yards ahead of us, <BR>and paused to look at us. It had a mouthfull of nest-building building <BR>material, mostly stems of grass.<BR><BR>I immediately called out "Hey, you with the grass...put that back!"<BR><BR>Our guide laughed so hard she almost fell into the poison oak . . . it is so <BR>rare of me to think of the good lines sooner than 15 minutes after the event. <BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:30:28 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Owl-Con<BR><BR>For those of you on or near Planet Houston, I'll be there at Owl-Con this <BR>weekend. <BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:46:32 EST<BR>From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>Subject: Ship Names (used to be something else)<BR><BR>Jim Groth writes:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; OB-TRAV: A minor species that uses similar names? How about their own <BR>&gt; ship<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; designations? eg the Vicious Bastard class Cruiser _Not in the Face_ :)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Or the Lying Scum class ship I'll_Still_Respect_You_in_the_Morning?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Come to think of it, that'd be an interesting name for a Free Trader. :-)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; I've always been partial to<BR>&gt;&nbsp; _Cornucopia_of_Excellent_Goods_at_Low_Prices_ as a name for a Free<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Trader.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; But then, I'm always willing to Tuf it out.... ;-)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; - -- <BR>&gt;&nbsp; AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>&gt;&nbsp; "Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR><BR>Bad pun. Punishment is you gotta design the Eco-Cruiser from the book.<BR><BR>Simon Jester<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 23:52:13 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: KB3 Experience System<BR><BR>I designed the KB3 Experience System today.&nbsp; It's becoming a fully<BR>fledged system with all the bells and whistles.<BR><BR>Here's the brush strokes (non-finalized, non-playtested version of the<BR>experience rules--just the idea):<BR><BR><BR>(1)&nbsp; At the end of each gaming session, the GM will award experience<BR>points to the players for their PCs.&nbsp; These points will allow players to<BR>grow and expand their characters.&nbsp; The system is designed to reflect<BR>character growth based on standard T4/MT/CT character generation<BR>(meaning that the system will improve your character slowly--1 skill<BR>level per game year for a character that does not adventure that often,<BR>more points for characters who are placed in adventure situations more<BR>often).<BR><BR>(2)&nbsp; The award is typically one point, and a tally of points is kept<BR>next to the appropriate skill.&nbsp; GMs should award points to skills used<BR>during the night's gaming session that "had an impact" on the game.<BR>(ie&nbsp; I wouldn't give a PC a point for every skill he threw on during the<BR>session, but I would give the PC a point for those skills that had some<BR>sort of dramatic effect on the gaming session.)<BR><BR>(3)&nbsp; Awarding experience shouldn't be a big production--simply award one<BR>point to each skill that was used "in an important manner" during the<BR>game.&nbsp;&nbsp; Players simply make a mark on their character sheets to keep<BR>track of points.&nbsp; The awarding of experience at the end of the night<BR>should be a time the players enjoy--when they can look back on the game<BR>and be rewarded for the things that they attempted.&nbsp; The roll in<BR>question did not have to be a successful one--at the GM's option.&nbsp; As<BR>long as the roll was dramatic, and the GM deems the PC "learned<BR>something" from his skill roll attempt, an experience point can be<BR>awarded.<BR><BR>(4)&nbsp; GM's can award discretionary points too--for great ideas during the<BR>game or fantastic role playing.&nbsp; Since no roll is involved with these<BR>points, players can use these points whereever they want--grooming their<BR>characters in the direction they want them to go.<BR><BR>(5)&nbsp; Points can also be awarded for skills the PC does not have (this is<BR>how he learns new skills through experience) and for attributes (to<BR>improve STR, DEX, etc).&nbsp; When a PC earns experience points for a skill<BR>he does not have, simply write the skill on the character's sheet (in<BR>his skill list), but write the skill in parenthesis (the parenthesis<BR>will indicate that the character does not yet have the skill).<BR>Attributes are done the same way:&nbsp; for example (Dexterity) may be<BR>written on the character's skill list on his sheet, indicating that the<BR>PC has earned experience points for that attribute (you can only earn<BR>attribute experience points through attribute checks or by placing<BR>discretionary points toward the attribute).<BR><BR>(6)&nbsp; At the beginning of game sessions (or at the end of sessions after<BR>experience is awarded), the GM will allow players to roll to see if<BR>skill improvement has occurred.&nbsp; This is a skill throw, so players use<BR>whatever skill they are trying to improve (if you are learning a new<BR>skill, then you throw 1D).&nbsp; That throw is made against a difficulty<BR>throw based on the skill level you are trying to attempt (ie&nbsp; if you<BR>have Pistol-0 and you are trying to gain Pistol-1, then you will throw<BR>1D versus 2D).&nbsp; This is a skill throw, so the player may use KB3 skill<BR>options if he wishes.<BR><BR>(7)&nbsp; In order to improve your skill (or gain a new skill) through<BR>experience, the roll has to be successful as a Greater Success<BR>throw--all other results are failures.&nbsp; Use the stat most appropriate to<BR>govern the throw (ie, the GM may decide that Int is the appropriate stat<BR>for Pistol to be improved instead of Dex).<BR><BR>(8)&nbsp; Skill improvement attempts may be made on any skill that has enough<BR>prerequisite points.&nbsp; You have to have a number of points equal to your<BR>new skill level in order to attempt skill improvement (if you have<BR>Pistol-0, and you are attempting to gain Pistol-1, then you have to have<BR>1 experience point to attempt the improvement throw).&nbsp; If you do not<BR>succeed on your improvement throw, you loose 1 experience point for the<BR>attempt (it's the cost of trying).&nbsp; If a PC has more than the<BR>prerequisite points needed to attempt an improvement throw, then these<BR>extra points may be used like skill options (you can use them to lower<BR>your target number or improve your stat for measuring purposes).&nbsp; Any<BR>experience points used as skill options are lost after the throw is<BR>completed, whether successful or not.<BR><BR>(9)&nbsp; If a character's total skill levels is higher than his Int+Edu, but<BR>lower than double this amount, double the prerequisite points and doulbe<BR>the penalty for a non-successful throw.&nbsp; If the character's total skill<BR>levels are higher than 2 x Int+Edu, but lower than 3 x Int+Edu, then<BR>triple the prerequisite and penalty points, etc.<BR><BR>(10)&nbsp; If a skill improvement roll is successful, all experience points<BR>are lost (you've got to start with a clean slate at the next level).<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>How does all this play out?<BR><BR>Here's an example of the experience point system in action......<BR><BR><BR><BR>THE GAME SESSION:<BR><BR>Ted the PC has Pistol-0, and during the night's gaming session, he makes<BR>a spectacular shot with his pistol.&nbsp; It was a great moment in the game,<BR>and the player is pleased.<BR><BR><BR>EXPERIENCE POINT AWARDS:<BR><BR>After the game session is over, the GM awards Ted for making that shot.<BR>Ted is given 1 experience point, and the player marks this point on<BR>Ted's sheet, right next to his Pistol-0 skill.&nbsp; Ted already had 1 point<BR>of experience on that skill from&nbsp; previous game sessions, so now it<BR>totals 2.<BR><BR>The player running Ted also did a superb job role playing that evening,<BR>and the GM recognized this.&nbsp; As a reward for great play, the GM awards<BR>Ted a discretionary point for the outstanding role playing.<BR><BR>This discretionary point can be put on Ted's sheet where ever the player<BR>wishes--allowing the player to guide his character's growth.&nbsp; The player<BR>really wants Ted to improve his Pistol skill, so he puts it there.&nbsp; Ted<BR>ends the game session with 3 experience points on his Pistol skill.<BR><BR><BR>THE IMPROVEMENT THROW:<BR><BR>The GM always allows improvement throws before the beginning of the next<BR>game session, and the player running Ted has decided to give his Pistol<BR>skill a try (he could wait and try to rack up some more experience<BR>points if he wanted to).<BR><BR>Ted has Int 7, Edu 6, so he uses a total of 13 points to measure his<BR>prerequisites.&nbsp; Adding up all of Ted's skills, the player sees that Ted<BR>is just over this limit with total skills of 14 levels.&nbsp; That means<BR>that, in order to earn an improvement throw for his Pistol skill, Ted<BR>needs 2 points (It normally takes 1 point to attempt a throw on a level<BR>1 skill, but this is doubled because of Ted's total skill levels--that's<BR>2 points.&nbsp; And, those same 2 points are needed--again it is doubled--in<BR>case the throw is a failure).&nbsp; The player looks down at Ted's skill and<BR>sees that Pistol has racked up 3 experience points for last night's game<BR>session and previous game sessions.&nbsp; He's got what he needs to make an<BR>attempt.<BR><BR>The player running Ted throws 1D.&nbsp; 2 of his 3 experience points are used<BR>as the prerequisite points, and these same 2 points can be used in case<BR>of failure.&nbsp; 1 experience point is left over.&nbsp; Ted decides to use this<BR>point to his advantage, and he can use it to either reduce his target<BR>number or raise his stat for measuring purposes.<BR><BR>The GM states that either Dex or Int can be used to measure the<BR>throw--at the player's option.&nbsp; Ted uses his Int since it his higher<BR>than his Dex-5.&nbsp; And, since success on an improvement throw only occurs<BR>when Greater Success is thrown, the player decides to use his extra<BR>point increase his Int from 7 to 8 for measuring purposes.<BR><BR>Ted is attempting to attain Pistol-1, so the GM will throw 2D for<BR>difficulty.<BR><BR>The player running Ted throws 1D vs 2D.&nbsp; The player rolls a "6", and<BR>since this is the E-Die, that total is doubled to 12.&nbsp; The difficulty<BR>throw results in a 7, with nither a "1" nor a "6" on the E-Die.<BR><BR>Normally, the player would have succeeded on this throw with a Regular<BR>Success (the "7" difficulty is measured with the modified Int of 8), but<BR>a Greater Success is needed to succeed on an improvement throw.<BR><BR>Ted's Pistol skill is not improved this time.&nbsp; The player can try again<BR>when he has enough experience points to do so.<BR><BR>Ted would usually loose 1 point for the attempt, but 2 points are lost<BR>because of the "doubling" effect caused by his total skill levels being<BR>higher than the total of his Int+Edu.&nbsp; And, any experience points used<BR>as skill options are lost after the attempt, so Ted looses a third<BR>point.<BR><BR>The game session starts, and Ted moves into the game with his skill<BR>remaining at Pistol-0 and no experience points next to the skill.&nbsp; Ted<BR>will have to rack up some more points (at least 2) before he can make<BR>the attempt at improvement again.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>EXPERIENCE SYSTEM NOTES:<BR><BR>(A)&nbsp; If Ted would have made that improvement roll with a Greater<BR>Success--say he rolled total of 5 versus a difficulty throw of 4<BR>(Greater Success occurs because the roll beat the difficulty throw but<BR>was under the governing stat)--then Ted would have started the game with<BR>Pistol-1 and no experience points (because you loose all experience<BR>points when you go up a level--starting at the new level with a clean<BR>slate).<BR><BR><BR><BR>(B)&nbsp; I haven't quite worked out how I'm going to throw for attribute<BR>improvement, but it will be some sort of attribute check with the<BR>prerequiste points being equal to the level of the stat (you will RARELY<BR>improve your stats this way--which is how it should be).<BR><BR><BR><BR>(C) The experience system is designed to improve characters through<BR>their experiences--but there is another way character's can improve:<BR>through instruction and practice.&nbsp; People can lift weights, start<BR>running, read books, take classes, and have experts show them how to do<BR>things.&nbsp; I want to incorporate this aspect of character improvement into<BR>my system--and I haven't quite got that worked out yet.&nbsp; But, it will<BR>probably entail the awarding of experience points based on what the<BR>character does to learn something new--then the improvement rolls will<BR>be the same (just the method of obtaining experience points will be<BR>different).<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3533<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-za04.mx.aol.com (rly-za04.mail.aol.com [172.31.36.100]) by air-za04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:59:55 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-za04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:59:13 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id AAA77746;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:57:28 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:54:37 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id AAA77677<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:54:37 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:54:37 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101180554.AAA77677@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3533<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3534</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/18/01 8:05:12 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 18 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3534<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Variants<BR>Re: KB3 Experience System<BR>A Few Minor Worlds<BR>Variant Vargr question.<BR>Re: Children of Dune Question<BR>Link to the science behind a plasma weapon?<BR>Re: KB3 Experience System<BR>RE: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR>RE: Ships Deck Plans....<BR>RE: A ship design question<BR>Re: 15mm Traveller figs<BR>Getting rid of a HUGE collection...<BR>RE: Link to the science behind a plasma weapon?<BR>Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR>Re: Ships Deck Plans....<BR>Re: Getting rid of a HUGE collection...<BR>Re: Question to/from Freelance Traveller<BR>Plasma Guns Explained<BR>RE: 15mm Traveller figs<BR>Jamming guns<BR>RE: Wiring Diagrams<BR>RE: A ship design question<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 19:11:07 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Variants<BR><BR>On 18 Jan 01, at 0:21, GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;I have heard of a variant form of Vargar.&nbsp; It is about 7 or so feet tall <BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &gt;and quite strong but stupid.&nbsp; They are a throw back of some type and a bit<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &gt;rare to find, kind of a neanderthal. Hve you heard or read anything about <BR>&gt; &gt; this?<BR><BR>&gt; Doesn't ring a bell with me . . . might be something DGP did that I've <BR>&gt; forgotten about.<BR><BR>Indeed it is (and one of their less impressive ideas IMHO). They are the <BR>&lt;drum roll&gt; Urzaeng, described as "Taller and more powerfully built than <BR>the average human ... Urzaeng typically lack the full mental faculties <BR>enjoyed by other Vargr". Other (rather silly IMHO) variant Vargr described <BR>in V&amp;V are the Kokasha (the weak but brilliant version), the Akumgeda, <BR>Ksinanirz, Nakagun and Roth Thokken (all super psi's). All in all, not their <BR>best work.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:19:50 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: KB3 Experience System<BR><BR>Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I designed the KB3 Experience System today.<BR><BR>A couple of other notes about the experience system that may not be evident<BR>upon first reading....<BR><BR>(1)&nbsp; Since PCs are penalized through prerequisite points and failure cost if<BR>their total skill levels exceed the total of Int + Edu, players may choose<BR>*not to improve* skills where they have enough experience points to make an<BR>attempt.&nbsp; Player will keep an eye on their total skill levels and not<BR>blatantly improve everything they can.&nbsp; This is another fashion that players<BR>can groom their characters.<BR><BR>(2)&nbsp; Because players can groom the growth of their characters through<BR>discretionary experience points earned through role playing (and through the<BR>method described above in point #1), the standard Traveller character<BR>generation system is reflected in game play.<BR><BR>Under the chargen systems, players can pick skill charts but have to roll to<BR>see which skill they obtain.&nbsp; Under the KB3 experience system, players can<BR>groom their characters through the above methods, but they have less control<BR>on which skills will be awarded expereince points (because you never know<BR>which skill will have a dramatic impact on the game and result with the GM<BR>award of experience).<BR><BR>(3)&nbsp; Think of experience points as a method of measuring "the potential a<BR>character has of improving a skill".&nbsp; Experience points are not a measure of<BR>*absolute* learning.&nbsp; It's a measure of potential..."There's a chance that<BR>the PC learned something new about his skill...maybe he learned enough to<BR>improve it to the next level".<BR><BR>(4)&nbsp; Awarding points at the end of a game session should be "fun".&nbsp; Players<BR>should look forward to it.&nbsp; It is a time of sitting back, laughing with your<BR>gaming friends, reflecting over the night's gaming.<BR><BR>At the same time, the GM should not award experience points too freely.&nbsp; He<BR>should keep awards to 1 point per award topic:<BR><BR>"OK, you did some good role playing tonight--better than usual--so here's a<BR>discretionary point!"<BR><BR>- -----<BR><BR>"That was a great idea you had that saved every body's butt!&nbsp; Here's a<BR>discretionary point.&nbsp; Put it on anything you wish to improve!"<BR><BR>- -----<BR><BR>"Oh, that Edu attribute check you made was incredible!&nbsp; That one roll<BR>changed the whole game.&nbsp; You've are now know so much more about the scenario<BR>than you did before.&nbsp; Take an experience point on your Edu stat!"<BR><BR>- -----<BR><BR>"You're Piloting roll tonight saved the ship and kept your vessel from being<BR>boarded!&nbsp; Give yourself an experience point on your Pilot skill!"<BR><BR>- -----<BR><BR>"You don't have the Intrustion skill, but you were able to make that<BR>incredilbe roll, against all odds, deactivating that alarm.&nbsp; If the alarm<BR>had sounded, you and the group would have been in a world of hurt...give<BR>yourself an experience point on a new skill...Intrusion!"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 22:22:12 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: A Few Minor Worlds<BR><BR>- --============_-1232323545==_ma============<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"<BR><BR>Tordesillas (Gaea 0610) E-26793D-7 Rs&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 134 Tw G2V Solitary<BR><BR>Rurik&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 0860) D-3679DC-8 Po Rs&nbsp; &nbsp; 134 Eb G2V Solitary<BR><BR>Jewel&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 0820) E-267947-7 Hi&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 934 Tw G2V Solitary<BR><BR>Jung-Zei&nbsp; &nbsp; (Gaea 1035) D-267A8G-7 Hi Ag&nbsp; &nbsp; 134 Cn G2V Solitary<BR><BR>Usonia&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (Gaea 1040) C-267943-9 Ri&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 334 Fw G2V Solitary<BR><BR>Cabotia&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 1060) E-267849-9 Lo Ag Rs 334 Fw G2V Solitary<BR><BR>- --============_-1232323545==_ma============<BR>Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"<BR><BR>&lt;!doctype html public "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN"&gt;<BR>&lt;head&gt;&lt;style type="text/css"&gt;&lt;!--<BR>blockquote, dl, ul, ol, li { margin-top: 0 ; margin-bottom: 0 }<BR>--&gt;&lt;/style&gt;&lt;title&gt;A Few Minor Worlds&lt;/title&gt;&lt;/head&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Tordesillas (Gaea 0610) E-26793D-7<BR>Rs&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 134 Tw G2V Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;<BR>&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Rurik&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; (Gaea 0860)<BR>D-3679DC-8 Po Rs&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 134 Eb G2V Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;<BR>&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Jewel&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; (Gaea 0820)<BR>E-267947-7 Hi&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 934 Tw G2V<BR>Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;<BR>&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Jung-Zei&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; (Gaea 1035) D-267A8G-7 Hi<BR>Ag&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 134 Cn G2V Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;<BR>&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Usonia&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; (Gaea 1040) C-267943-9<BR>Ri&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 334 Fw G2V Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;<BR>&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Cabotia&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; (Gaea 1060) E-267849-9 Lo Ag<BR>Rs 334 Fw G2V Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;<BR>&lt;/div&gt;<BR><BR><BR>- --============_-1232323545==_ma============--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 01:24:10 EST<BR>From: Arvig@aol.com<BR>Subject: Variant Vargr question.<BR><BR>- --part1_f2.6a40f25.2797e60a_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>Everyone,<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Forgive me if I'm doing this wrong, this is my first time posting to=20<BR>this list, any message board list to be honest.&nbsp; Anyway, someone asked this:<BR><BR>&gt;From: Joe Robinson (...@...)<BR>&gt;Subject: Variant form of Vargar<BR><BR>&gt;I have heard of a variant form of Vargar.=A0 It is about 7 or so feet tall=20<BR>&gt;and quite strong but stupid.=A0 They are a throw back of some type and a bi=<BR>t<BR>&gt;rare to find, kind of a neanderthal. Hve you heard or read anything about=20<BR>this?<BR><BR>To be honest, there _is_ something nagging at the bottom of my skull<BR>(though it might just be the normal stress of working with the neanderthals<BR>in the police department), but I can't pin it down.=A0 Anyone have any<BR>references?<BR><BR><BR>Yes, I have one.&nbsp; The DGP publication "Vilani &amp; Vargr" makes mention of this=<BR>,=20<BR>can't remember what it's called, and due to a recent move it's packed away (=<BR>I=20<BR>know, sacrilege, I have yet to unpack my Traveller stuff) but they mention=20<BR>it, got the idea they were found trailing of Lair, the Vargr "homeworld"? =20<BR>Anyway, if memory serves, they got a couple point or two to strength and=20<BR>maybe endurance in MT, but took a one or two point hit to Intelligence.&nbsp; The=<BR>y=20<BR>were more aggressive and not too bright overall, but I took it to be more of=<BR>=20<BR>a variant manipulation, not a "Proto-Vargr".&nbsp; Anyway, dig up the book I=20<BR>mention above and that should help.<BR><BR>Evan Thomsen<BR><BR>arvig@aol.com<BR><BR><BR><BR>- --part1_f2.6a40f25.2797e60a_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/html; charset="ISO-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3>Everyone,<BR><BR><BR><BR>&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;Forgive me if I'm doing this wrong,=<BR>this is my first time posting to=20<BR><BR>this list, any message board list to be honest. &amp;nbsp;Anyway, someone as=<BR>ked this:<BR><BR><BR><BR>&amp;gt;From: Joe Robinson (...@...)<BR><BR>&amp;gt;Subject: Variant form of Vargar<BR><BR><BR><BR>&amp;gt;I have heard of a variant form of Vargar.=A0 It is about 7 or so fee=<BR>t tall=20<BR><BR>&amp;gt;and quite strong but stupid.=A0 They are a throw back of some type a=<BR>nd a bit<BR><BR>&amp;gt;rare to find, kind of a neanderthal. Hve you heard or read anything=20=<BR>about=20<BR><BR>this?<BR><BR><BR><BR>To be honest, there _is_ something nagging at the bottom of my skull<BR><BR>(though it might just be the normal stress of working with the neanderth=<BR>als<BR><BR>in the police department), but I can't pin it down.=A0 Anyone have any<BR><BR>references?<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>Yes, I have one. &amp;nbsp;The DGP publication "Vilani &amp;amp; Vargr" makes me=<BR>ntion of this,=20<BR><BR>can't remember what it's called, and due to a recent move it's packed aw=<BR>ay (I=20<BR><BR>know, sacrilege, I have yet to unpack my Traveller stuff) but they menti=<BR>on=20<BR><BR>it, got the idea they were found trailing of Lair, the Vargr "homeworld"=<BR>? &amp;nbsp;<BR><BR>Anyway, if memory serves, they got a couple point or two to strength and=<BR>=20<BR><BR>maybe endurance in MT, but took a one or two point hit to Intelligence.=20=<BR>&amp;nbsp;They=20<BR><BR>were more aggressive and not too bright overall, but I took it to be mor=<BR>e of=20<BR><BR>a variant manipulation, not a "Proto-Vargr". &amp;nbsp;Anyway, dig up the bo=<BR>ok I=20<BR><BR>mention above and that should help.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Evan Thomsen<BR><BR><BR><BR>arvig@aol.com<BR><BR><BR><BR></FONT><BR><BR>- --part1_f2.6a40f25.2797e60a_boundary--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:34:40 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Children of Dune Question<BR><BR>Here's a better expression of my point--something I wrote on the Dune<BR>newsgroup....<BR><BR>This may clarify what I'm trying to say...<BR><BR><BR>When Leto and Ghanima left Sietch Tabr (right before they went against the<BR>Corrino tigers), they were setting a plan in motion.&nbsp; It wasn't just Leto<BR>swishing around--he knew what he was doing.&nbsp; They planned on Ghanima<BR>believing<BR>that Leto was dead so that he could go out and get the sandtrout on.<BR><BR>Then, in the end of the book, when Leto snapped Ghanima back into knowing<BR>that<BR>he wasn't dead, she asked if their plan had worked.&nbsp; Leto said, "Good<BR>enough".<BR><BR>So, my point is that Leto knew all along that he would be donning the<BR>sandtrout<BR>skin as his voyage along the Golden Path.<BR><BR>If he knew this, then why the heck did he meander around in the desert, get<BR>captured in two other sietches, and risk death at the hands of Gurney and his<BR><BR>sidekick?<BR><BR>Why didn't he just don his sandtrout skin and go through the motions of<BR>having<BR>the rest of his plan put in motion?<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 17:40:47 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Link to the science behind a plasma weapon?<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>While reading the excellent Schlock Mercenary<BR>(http://www.schlockmercenary.com/) for today (Thurs Jan 18), I followed the<BR>author's advice and read the "Technology Behind the BH-209 Plasgun" link<BR>(http://www.schlockmercenary.com/chalain-vasimr.html).<BR><BR>A fun read, if anyone is interested.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 09:08:02 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: KB3 Experience System<BR><BR>On Wed, 17 Jan 2001, Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions wrote:<BR>&gt; I designed the KB3 Experience System today.&nbsp; It's becoming a fully<BR>&gt; fledged system with all the bells and whistles.<BR><BR>Sorry if this has been asked, or answered already, but is KB3 anywhere on<BR>the Web? I think it would be interesting to try out, but I need a single<BR>site with all the information, please. B-)<BR><BR>Last few weeks I have mostly been ignoring task debates...<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 20:31:48 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry wrote :<BR><BR>&gt; _Penguin Boy_<BR>&gt; by Douglas Berry<BR>&gt; to the tune of: _Iron Man_ by Black Sabbath<BR><BR>I'm sorry, Doug, but I kept trying to fit your words to "Particle Man" by<BR>They Might Be Giants<BR>It's probaby because I don't know "Iron Man".<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 20:59:30 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Ships Deck Plans....<BR><BR>William Lane wrote :<BR>&gt; I know this post came up before so sorry about bringing it back up. what i<BR>&gt; want to know is this.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; If 1 there is a Set of Deck plans for a S type scout courier out<BR>&gt; there that is designed to use with 25mm minitures?<BR><BR>There's the Judges Guild ones, and the ones in Snapshot. They're not 25mm<BR>but they could be photoccopied up if you have access to a percentage<BR>photocopier.<BR><BR>You have to calculate the percentage increase to go from 15mm to 25 mm, but<BR>it's not that hard<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 21:01:40 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: A ship design question<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley wrote :<BR>&gt; on 17/1/01 12:24 pm, Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm at jenry023@student.liu.se<BR>&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; If I understand you correctly, you basically want to design a ship with<BR>&gt; &gt; a large fuel module, and use the fuel in that module to jump. When you<BR>&gt; &gt; get there, you dump the module (thereby reducing your tonnage) and jump<BR>&gt; &gt; again (with a lower fuel requirement).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Yes, I'm assuming calculating the tonnage of the jump fuel in as required<BR>&gt; mass to overcome for the jump. Standard calculations apply...<BR><BR>This is exactly like carrying a jump-capable ship as a battle-rider on a<BR>jump-tender, except that the jump-tender is "disposable"<BR><BR>Don't know if that helps or not.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 01:04:05 -0800<BR>From: Evyn MacDude &lt;wmacdude@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: 15mm Traveller figs<BR><BR>Glenn Myers wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Really, are you sure?<BR><BR>No..... Are the bases Perfectly round?<BR><BR>- --<BR>Evyn<BR><BR>"We few, we happy few, we band of brothers;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; For he to-day that sheds his blood with me<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Shall be my brother; be he ne'er so vile,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; This day shall gentle his condition."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; -- William Shakespeare, King Henry the Fifth, IV:iii:60-63<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 02:03:50 -0800<BR>From: Roger Sanger &lt;rodge@nwnexus.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Getting rid of a HUGE collection...<BR><BR>Hi everyone,<BR><BR>I've come to the realization that I'm RPG-insane.&nbsp; :-)<BR><BR>During spring cleaning (so, I've started a little early), while dusting out my library, I couldn't help scratch my head wondering why on Earth I've accumulated 2000+ Traveller and other RPG gaming products (not counting 500 or so spares).&nbsp; At my weekly game session, it would take me a century or two to play it all!<BR><BR>Yes, I went Traveller nuts!&nbsp; I collected everything I could find on Traveller, even the fanzines.&nbsp; Then I collected every other sci-fi game I could find as support material for my Traveller campaign. I even collected Traveller paraphernalia -- posters, originals of the&nbsp; artwork, unpublished works in progress, etc. -- I even have an original red on black Traveller T-shirt!<BR><BR>After scratching my head almost bald about what to do with this stuff, I've started the daunting chore of inventorying most all of it for sale.&nbsp; (I need to clear some shelf space for some real books).<BR><BR>'Thought you might like first crack at the pile...&nbsp; So, if there is anything you want me to keep an eye out for (sci-fi or fantasy - the D&amp;D/AD&amp;D section of the collection is about as large as the sci-fi section) while I'm digging through this stuff,&nbsp; please drop me a note at rodge@nwnexus.com.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Sincerely,<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Roger Sanger<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; rodge@nwnexus.com<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; P.S.:&nbsp; Please don't clutter up this list with your replies.&nbsp; Send all queries directly to me at rodge@nwnexus.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 11:21:28 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Link to the science behind a plasma weapon?<BR><BR>&gt; Dear Folks -<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; While reading the excellent Schlock Mercenary<BR>&gt; (http://www.schlockmercenary.com/) for today (Thurs Jan 18), <BR>&gt; I followed the<BR>&gt; author's advice and read the "Technology Behind the BH-209 <BR>&gt; Plasgun" link<BR>&gt; (http://www.schlockmercenary.com/chalain-vasimr.html).<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; A fun read, if anyone is interested.<BR><BR><BR>Cool! I hadn't read Schlock yet this morning and I'm glad you posted this.<BR>Suggestion...can we build one for the TML fun shoot? Please?<BR><BR>Dean <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 12:28:30 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR><BR>Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt; Tordesillas (Gaea 0610) E-26793D-7 Rs&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 134 Tw G2V Solitary<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Rurik&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 0860) D-3679DC-8 Po Rs&nbsp; &nbsp; 134 Eb G2V Solitary<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Jewel&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 0820) E-267947-7 Hi&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 934 Tw G2V Solitary<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Jung-Zei&nbsp; &nbsp; (Gaea 1035) D-267A8G-7 Hi Ag&nbsp; &nbsp; 134 Cn G2V Solitary<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Usonia&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (Gaea 1040) C-267943-9 Ri&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 334 Fw G2V Solitary<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Cabotia&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 1060) E-267849-9 Lo Ag Rs 334 Fw G2V Solitary<BR><BR>Huh ? What are you trying to say ?<BR><BR>Some kind of explanation might come in handy&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>Meanwhile, I will speculate a bit about the meaning of the data given.<BR>All the stars are of the same spectral type as Sol, and they have<BR>planets. In addition, the atmospheres are all standard, and there is a<BR>70% hydrographic coverage. The population of all the given worlds are<BR>within one order of magnitude of Earth's population. The TL of all<BR>planets are late 20th century.<BR><BR>The worlds all seem to be more or less copies of our own. The question<BR>remains: Why did you post them? Is the TML planning to relocate?<BR><BR>The plot thickens...<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 12:41:44 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ships Deck Plans....<BR><BR>"Frank G. Pitt" wrote:<BR>&gt; You have to calculate the percentage increase to go from 15mm to 25 mm, but<BR>&gt; it's not that hard<BR><BR>166%<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 07:57:13 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Getting rid of a HUGE collection...<BR><BR>I had not heard that one before, but I had heard a few others...<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message ----- <BR>From: "Roger Sanger" &lt;rodge@nwnexus.com&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I've come to the realization that I'm RPG-insane.&nbsp; :-)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 08:00:12 -0500<BR>From: "Robert A. Smith II" &lt;rsmith@rasinsurance.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question to/from Freelance Traveller<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;From: Joe Robinson (...@...)<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;Subject: Variant form of Vargar<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;I have heard of a variant form of Vargar.&nbsp; It is about 7 or so feet<BR>tall<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;and quite strong but stupid.&nbsp; They are a throw back of some type<BR>&gt; &gt; and a bit<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;rare to find, kind of a neanderthal. Hve you heard or read<BR>&gt; &gt; anything about this?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; To be honest, there _is_ something nagging at the bottom of my skull<BR>&gt; &gt; (though it might just be the normal stress of working with the<BR>&gt; &gt; neanderthals<BR>&gt; &gt; in the police department), but I can't pin it down.&nbsp; Anyone have any<BR>&gt; &gt; references?<BR><BR>IIRC they are mentioned in Vilani and Vargr.&nbsp; Unfortunately, I don't have<BR>the book with me right now.<BR><BR>Angus<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 09:24:54 -0500<BR>From: "Walt Smith" &lt;firelock_ny@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Plasma Guns Explained<BR><BR>Caught this on the Schlock Mercenary site...the author<BR>claims to have put this together from NASA research,<BR>and applied it towards how one of his character's<BR>particular BFG works, "OMMMMINOUS HUMMMM" (tm) included.<BR>I thought it a good read, though I don't know enough<BR>of the proper kind of physics to vouch for its accuracy.<BR>Perhaps some of the resident science monsters could<BR>take a look?<BR><BR>http://www.schlockmercenary.com/chalain-vasimr.html<BR><BR>Walt Smith<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 09:30:01 -0500<BR>From: Glenn Myers &lt;glenn.myers@ansys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: 15mm Traveller figs<BR><BR>GypsyComet@aol.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Dimpled? Hmm. I never saw much of the line, though I have one or two around<BR><BR>&gt;here somewhere, but they might be from the pre-plastic-base Citadel days. <BR>&gt;They had some rather nice 25mm SF that I didn't see around for long...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;GC<BR><BR>I have some of those, they are the Spacefarers line. It is a very nice 25mm<BR>SF set. I know of a few more at my local hobby store if anyone is<BR>interested. <BR><BR>Evyn MacDude wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Really, are you sure?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;No..... Are the bases Perfectly round?<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Yes, they are perfectly round with little dimples on the top surface of the<BR>base around the boots. You can't see it in the scan but the figures have<BR>little com mikes coming off of their helmets.<BR><BR>Ah, you guys have convinced me I need to paint some 15mm. I'l put them in<BR>the queue.<BR><BR>______________________________________________________<BR><BR>Glenn E. Myers<BR>ANSYS Inc.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Email: glenn.myers@ansys.com<BR>275 Technology Drive&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Phone: (724) 514-2913<BR>Canonsburg, PA 15317&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax:&nbsp;&nbsp; (724) 514-3118<BR>______________________________________________________<BR><BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 09:34:52 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Jamming guns<BR><BR>Hi all,<BR><BR>I have been thinking about fleshing out the vague rules that I have for the<BR>jamming (or otherwise failure) of weapons in CT.&nbsp; My system is working on<BR>the assumption that most weapons will never (in game terms) jam under normal<BR>use unless basic maintenance has been neglected for a long time and/or the<BR>weapon has been exposed to, um, disrespect.&nbsp; Only when someone uses 'Panic<BR>Fire' do I allow a possibility of jamming (I define 'Panic Fire' as pulling<BR>the trigger more than once in a combat round, with up to 2 or 3 such pulls<BR>allowed depending on the weapon type, each with a -2 DM to hit).&nbsp; If the<BR>first roll to hit for the second pull of the trigger is very low, the weapon<BR>has jammed.<BR><BR>So, here is where I desire the advice of those better versed in firearms<BR>lore.&nbsp; I presume that some weapons are more reliable than others, based on<BR>their mechanism and/or electronics.&nbsp; This is my tentative table of jamming<BR>numbers:<BR><BR>2&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; revolver, snub pistol, gauss rifle (single shot), laser weapons<BR>3-&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ACR (single shot), gauss rifle (short burst), plasma/fusion weapons<BR>4-&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; autopistol, carbine, rifle, combat snub pistol, gauss rifle (long<BR>burst), ACR (burst)<BR>5-&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; shotgun, LMG, SMG, automatic rifle, assault rifle<BR><BR>Constructive comments are welcome.&nbsp; Destructive comments are tollerated.&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 22:56:58 -0000<BR>From: "Antony Farrell" &lt;Skaran@bigpond.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Wiring Diagrams<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Frank G. Pitt<BR>Sent: Wednesday, 17 January 2001 10:38 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Wiring Diagrams<BR><BR><BR>Antony Farrell wrote :<BR><BR>&gt; Has anyone on the list done a wiring diagram for any of the standard ships<BR>&gt; (the ubiquitous type S would be ideal) and while we are it, air<BR>&gt; conditioning ducts etc.<BR><BR>No.<BR>The diagrams for a A4 Skyhawk fill more than four foolscap lever-arch files.<BR><BR>I could probably find a picture of something that your casual obsverver<BR>wouldn't realize wasn't a spaceship somewhere in my old airforce stuff.<BR><BR>&gt; Of course if anyone has full construction blue prints!<BR>&gt; I would be very interested in seeing them.<BR><BR>Wouldn't we all ?<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>Something like that would be great<BR><BR>Antony<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 15:07:32 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: A ship design question<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Sethkimmel@aol.com [mailto:Sethkimmel@aol.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: 18 January 2001 04:21<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: A ship design question<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; In a message dated 1/17/01 11:21:46 PM !!!First Boot!!!, <BR>&gt; gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk writes:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;&lt; Losing the crew is somewhat bad - they are presumably <BR>&gt; expensive to train.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Losing the hardware is criminal. &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I would argue that the staff of the IISS would say you've got it bass <BR>&gt; ackwards...:-)<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Losing criminals is Hard-wired? :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR>Group 4 security<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3534<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xb02.mx.aol.com (rly-xb02.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.103]) by air-xb01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 11:05:12 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xb02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 10:12:19 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id KAA96859;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 10:11:35 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 18 Jan 2001 10:09:55 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id KAA96573<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 10:09:55 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 10:09:55 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101181509.KAA96573@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3534<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3535</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/18/01 2:19:19 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 18 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3535<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: KB3 Experience System<BR>Variant form of Vargar<BR>RE: A ship design question<BR>Re: Plasma Guns Explained<BR>Re: Landgrab rules'<BR>Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>RE: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR>Re: Jamming guns<BR>RE: Jamming guns<BR>RE: Plasma Guns Explained<BR>Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR>RE: Plasma Guns Explained<BR>Re: Plasma Guns Explained<BR>OOP CT LBB's Syracuse NY<BR>RE: Plasma Guns Explained<BR>RE: Plasma Guns Explained<BR>Re: Plasma Guns Explained<BR>Re: Jamming guns<BR>Re: Plasma Guns Explained<BR>Question on Jump<BR>Quick environmental question<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 09:24:44 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: KB3 Experience System<BR><BR>"Mikko V. I. Parviainen" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Sorry if this has been asked, or answered already, but is KB3 anywhere on<BR>&gt; the Web? I think it would be interesting to try out, but I need a single<BR>&gt; site with all the information, please. B-)<BR><BR>I don't have KB3 listed anywhere in its entirety yet (because I'm not done<BR>with it--actual playtesting is about to begin), but Jeff wants to put it up<BR>at FreeLance Traveller (so, you will be able to find it there in the future)<BR>and Jim V. will be publishing it in his Guildsman gaming zine (so, if you<BR>subscribe to that, you'll be able to see it there too).<BR><BR>I'll also post a finalized version of KB3 once it is completed, right here on<BR>the old TML.<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 11:01:55 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Variant form of Vargar<BR><BR>Joe Robinson (...@...) puts in the Ether:<BR>&gt;I have heard of a variant form of Vargar. It is about 7 or so feet tall<BR>&gt;and quite strong but stupid. They are a throw back of some type and a bit<BR>&gt;rare to find, kind of a neanderthal. Hve you heard or read anything about <BR>this?<BR><BR>Urzaeng is the name.&nbsp; Idea of fun is hand to hand with Male Aslan.<BR><BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>Opinions should be yours too! -- http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>"Tension, apprehension and dissension have begun." -- Alfred Bester<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 09:19:40 -0800<BR>From: "David P. Summers" &lt;summers@alum.mit.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: A ship design question<BR><BR>At 6:40 PM -0800 1/16/01, Jesse Degraff wrote:<BR>&gt;Uh-oh, it's the collapsible Jump-Tank-Flame-War-of-the-Apocolypse!!!<BR>&gt;Personally, I'm donning armor and diving for cover!<BR><BR><BR>No, what he is talking about are "demountable tanks" that you jetison <BR>after jump.&nbsp; I don't think anyone has a big problem with that.&nbsp; You <BR>can make a decent exploration craft with that idea.<BR><BR>______________________________<BR>summers@alum.mit.edu<BR>(This is the net.&nbsp; My e-mail address may be in Boston, but I'm in California.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 09:26:34 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Plasma Guns Explained<BR><BR>Walt Smith writes:<BR>&gt; Caught this on the Schlock Mercenary site...the author<BR>&gt; claims to have put this together from NASA research,<BR>&gt; and applied it towards how one of his character's<BR>&gt; particular BFG works, "OMMMMINOUS HUMMMM" (tm) included.<BR>&gt; I thought it a good read, though I don't know enough<BR>&gt; of the proper kind of physics to vouch for its accuracy.<BR>&gt; Perhaps some of the resident science monsters could<BR>&gt; take a look?<BR><BR>I can't really judge the plasma physics, but if used in atmosphere it will<BR>have a range of a couple of yards, which is in general the biggest problem<BR>with 'plasma guns' in traveller anyway.&nbsp; Plasma hits atmosphere, atmosphere<BR>scatters plasma, plasma turns into big fireball at mouth of gun.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 09:31:08<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrab rules'<BR><BR>At 03:50 AM 1/18/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Okay, I'm interested in playing the land-grab game. So, what I need to know<BR>&gt;is how I go about putting in a claim, and what the restrictions are.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Are claims limited to worlds in The Spinward Marches?<BR><BR>No.<BR><BR>&gt;To what Milieu are systems to be created for?<BR><BR>Any.<BR><BR>&gt;Are there restrictions as to what systems are allowed?<BR><BR>Try not to take one that's already being done.&nbsp; This creates a multiverse,<BR>and then you end up with the Crisis on Infinite Rhylanors, and George Perez<BR>kills you for making him do all that art research again (comic geek joke.)<BR><BR>&gt;To what degree must canon be followed? If a system is partially described in<BR>&gt;an official Traveller publication, must I include that, and only generate<BR>&gt;what is not given? What about other (non-core) publications? Clashes with<BR>&gt;amateur publications/web sites?<BR><BR>Well, it would be nice if you laid close to what has gone before.&nbsp; There<BR>have only been a handful of worlds detailed in depth, and with those you're<BR>pretty straight jacketed.&nbsp; If you want to follow the work done by fellow<BR>amateurs, be sure to give them a tip of the hat.<BR><BR>In other words, it's your planet to play with.<BR><BR>Speaking of issues canon, we've all heard Loren bemoan the fact that every<BR>little thing he says becomes canonical, no matter what was said or how he<BR>said it.&nbsp; I know understand what he means.<BR><BR>There's a sidebar in GF called "Memories".&nbsp; It is part of an interview with<BR>an old Marine, and he comes across as folksy as all hell, you just want to<BR>sit on the porch a spell with him and have a nice big pot o' greens come<BR>supper time.&nbsp; At the end of the piece, it is revealed that this guy is a<BR>Force legend, winner of four SEHs.<BR><BR>Well, as part of the rural atmosphere, I wrote the following lines:<BR><BR>"They're more than happy to just keep farming and herding hemoth like their<BR>daddies.."<BR><BR>and <BR><BR>"I always knew I'd wind up on the south end of a northbound ket!"<BR><BR>Hemoth and ket.&nbsp; Two made up at the moment names for animals.&nbsp; Yesterday I<BR>get a panicked email from a GM in Texas.&nbsp; His players are heading for Heya,<BR>and he needs the complete stats for both Hemoth and Ket, along with any<BR>encounter tables.&nbsp; I was almost afraid to write back.&nbsp; I fear he may have<BR>hinged an entire adventure around that sidebar.<BR><BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp;&nbsp; Templar Agent at Large.<BR>gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR><BR>TravGeekCode: <BR>tc+ tm+ !tn- t4@ ?tg+ tt@ to(CORPS)++ ru@ $ge++ 3i<BR>ii+ au st+ ls+ pi kk+ so(++) va++ dr+ zh+ sw++ ?da<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 09:32:50<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>At 07:48 PM 1/17/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;What *I* wanna know is how come Jesse keeps getting the credit for<BR>&gt;*MY* machine guns!?! :^)<BR><BR>Count the nyumber of times Jesse's picture appears on that page, compared<BR>to you.&nbsp; You're being squeezed out!<BR><BR>God as my witness, I will make the spring shoot if I have to Greyhound up.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 09:40:00<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR><BR>At 08:31 PM 1/18/2001 +1300, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Douglas E. Berry wrote :<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; _Penguin Boy_<BR>&gt;&gt; by Douglas Berry<BR>&gt;&gt; to the tune of: _Iron Man_ by Black Sabbath<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I'm sorry, Doug, but I kept trying to fit your words to "Particle Man" by<BR>&gt;They Might Be Giants<BR>&gt;It's probaby because I don't know "Iron Man".<BR><BR>Iron Man is a metal classic, off the required-listening album "Paranoid"<BR><BR>But now you've done it.<BR><BR>Penguin Boy, Penguin Boy<BR>In the pond admiring koi<BR>Will he eat them, we don't care<BR>Penguin Boy<BR><BR>Loren Man, Loren Man<BR>Writing Traveller is his plan<BR>Works in Austin at SJG<BR>Loren Man<BR><BR>more to come, I need to dig up Flood and hit the internatioal lyric server.<BR><BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 09:52:48 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jamming guns<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I have been thinking about fleshing out the vague rules that I have for<BR>the<BR>&gt; jamming (or otherwise failure) of weapons in CT.&nbsp; My system is working on<BR>&gt; the assumption that most weapons will never (in game terms) jam under<BR>normal<BR>&gt; use unless basic maintenance has been neglected for a long time and/or the<BR>&gt; weapon has been exposed to, um, disrespect.&nbsp; Only when someone uses 'Panic<BR>&gt; Fire' do I allow a possibility of jamming (I define 'Panic Fire' as<BR>pulling<BR>&gt; the trigger more than once in a combat round, with up to 2 or 3 such pulls<BR>&gt; allowed depending on the weapon type, each with a -2 DM to hit).&nbsp; If the<BR>&gt; first roll to hit for the second pull of the trigger is very low, the<BR>weapon<BR>&gt; has jammed.<BR><BR>The reality is that a modern, well designed weapons is very reliable.&nbsp; The<BR>likelyhood of a weapons malfunction is more likely to be related to the<BR>quality of the weapon and the maintenance (or lack thereof) it receives.<BR>The other main factor is the quality of ammunition.&nbsp; Pooly made ammunition<BR>is the number 1 cause of weapons stoppages (which may or may not be 'jams')<BR><BR>&gt; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; revolver, snub pistol, gauss rifle (single shot), laser weapons<BR>&gt; 3-&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ACR (single shot), gauss rifle (short burst), plasma/fusion<BR>weapons<BR>&gt; 4-&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; autopistol, carbine, rifle, combat snub pistol, gauss rifle (long<BR>&gt; burst), ACR (burst)<BR>&gt; 5-&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; shotgun, LMG, SMG, automatic rifle, assault rifle<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>The type of weapon involved has very little to do with the likelyhood of<BR>it's jamming, although maechanical operated systems can have a slight<BR>advantage if the cause of the stoppage is poor ammuntion. Automatic weapons<BR>that are fired alot will increase the likelyhood of stoopages due to greater<BR>part wear abd accumulation of fouling<BR><BR>IMTU, anytime someone rolls 2 on 2d6 when firing, something bad happened.<BR>The player then rerolls 2d6 to determine what happened and how bad is it.<BR>(Not, if the player has a cheap or poorly maintained weapon, it may<BR>malfunction on a 3 or even 4!)<BR><BR>Roll&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Stoppage&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Notes<BR>2&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Structural failure.&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; The weapon explodes, doing 1/2 damage<BR>(rounded up) to anyone with close range<BR>3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Structural failure&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; The weapon explodes, doing 1/2 damage<BR>(rounded up) to the firer<BR>4&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Part Breaks&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Must be repaired or replaed, requiring<BR>mechical or gunsmith<BR>5&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Action jammed&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Cannot be cleared in the field.&nbsp; You gun<BR>is now a club.&nbsp; See the armorer<BR>6&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Action jammed&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Can be cleared in the field, taking 1d6<BR>turns -1 turn per level weapon skill or mechanical<BR>7&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Stoppage&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Immediate action drill will clear the<BR>weapon roll 8+ -weapons skill to clear<BR>8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Stoppage&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Immediate action drill will clear the<BR>weapon roll 5+ -weapon skill<BR>9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Stoppage&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Immediate action drill will clear the<BR>weapon.<BR>10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Click&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Gun not loaded/empty. Oops.<BR>Character must load/reload weapon<BR>11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Click&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Round not chambered/ dud in<BR>chamber.&nbsp; lose one round while cycling the action<BR>12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Safety is on.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Lose a round of firing while cursing<BR>you own stupidity<BR><BR>Note: characters without the requisite gun combat skill may be able to fire<BR>a weapon, but will require help in fixing stoppages.<BR>Note 2:&nbsp; The quality of the weapon will effect the above rolls<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Cheap, poor quality weapon&nbsp; &nbsp; DM-3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; cost 50% of a standard<BR>weapon<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Quality weapons&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; DM+2&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Cost 125% of a<BR>standard weapon<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; MilSpec&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; DM+3&nbsp; &nbsp; Cost 200% of<BR>a standard Weapon<BR><BR><BR>Hope that helps<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 10:02:05 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Jamming guns<BR><BR>Don't forget that weapon *or ammo* quality /can/ have an adverse effect as<BR>well.&nbsp; By /can/ I mean that, for example, an AK47 may not be the best<BR>machined or stamped piece of hardware ever made, but it's pretty damn<BR>reliable.&nbsp; Other weapons of the same or even greater quality, on the other<BR>hand, may jamn horribly.&nbsp; Ammo, as witnessed by some of the ammo I had for<BR>Mark's HK21 at the last shoot, can also be a big factor.<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Ian Ferguson<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2001 5:35 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Jamming guns<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hi all,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I have been thinking about fleshing out the vague rules that I<BR>&gt; have for the<BR>&gt; jamming (or otherwise failure) of weapons in CT.&nbsp; My system is working on<BR>&gt; the assumption that most weapons will never (in game terms) jam<BR>&gt; under normal<BR>&gt; use unless basic maintenance has been neglected for a long time and/or the<BR>&gt; weapon has been exposed to, um, disrespect.&nbsp; Only when someone uses 'Panic<BR>&gt; Fire' do I allow a possibility of jamming (I define 'Panic Fire'<BR>&gt; as pulling<BR>&gt; the trigger more than once in a combat round, with up to 2 or 3 such pulls<BR>&gt; allowed depending on the weapon type, each with a -2 DM to hit).&nbsp; If the<BR>&gt; first roll to hit for the second pull of the trigger is very low,<BR>&gt; the weapon<BR>&gt; has jammed.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; So, here is where I desire the advice of those better versed in firearms<BR>&gt; lore.&nbsp; I presume that some weapons are more reliable than others, based on<BR>&gt; their mechanism and/or electronics.&nbsp; This is my tentative table of jamming<BR>&gt; numbers:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; revolver, snub pistol, gauss rifle (single shot), laser weapons<BR>&gt; 3-&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ACR (single shot), gauss rifle (short burst),<BR>&gt; plasma/fusion weapons<BR>&gt; 4-&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; autopistol, carbine, rifle, combat snub pistol, gauss rifle (long<BR>&gt; burst), ACR (burst)<BR>&gt; 5-&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; shotgun, LMG, SMG, automatic rifle, assault rifle<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Constructive comments are welcome.&nbsp; Destructive comments are<BR>&gt; tollerated.&nbsp; :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Peez<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 12:51:41 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Plasma Guns Explained<BR><BR>Yes, usually, the explanation given for that is that there is a carrier<BR>laser or Particle accelerator that shoots down the path of the beam that<BR>ionizes or vaporizes the atmosphere and allows the Plasma to go a bit<BR>further.&nbsp; I doubt that this explanation would truly work...<BR><BR>Another point to consider is that the plasma is travelling at a very high<BR>speed, and if its density is high...it should plow though the air fairly<BR>well.&nbsp; Dissipation is a given...but given a high enough escape velocity...it<BR>might travel a fair distance (100-300 feet).<BR><BR>No matter what...being downrage of one of these would not be pleasent.<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 10:55:46 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR><BR>&gt;Huh ? What are you trying to say ?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Some kind of explanation might come in handy&nbsp; ;-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Meanwhile, I will speculate a bit about the meaning of the data given.<BR>&gt;All the stars are of the same spectral type as Sol, and they have<BR>&gt;planets. In addition, the atmospheres are all standard, and there is a<BR>&gt;70% hydrographic coverage. The population of all the given worlds are<BR>&gt;within one order of magnitude of Earth's population. The TL of all<BR>&gt;planets are late 20th century.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The worlds all seem to be more or less copies of our own. The question<BR>&gt;remains: Why did you post them? Is the TML planning to relocate?<BR><BR>All i will say, Jen, is that you have nearly all the pieces, but so <BR>far you have not put them together correctly 8^)<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 13:05:34 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Plasma Guns Explained<BR><BR>ACtualyl, I just thought of another way this woudl work...of course it is<BR>not the standard PLasma gun route.&nbsp; What if instead of expelling a stream of<BR>plasma, you expelled a small magnetic bottle that held the components for<BR>the creation of plasma.&nbsp; I other words, the gun charges up a casing that<BR>consists of a magnetic bottle device and the plasma components.&nbsp; Then it<BR>shoots the casing at the target.&nbsp; At a predetermined time or range from its<BR>target the bottle would decay and you have a blast of plasma exploding onto<BR>the target.<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Anthony Jackson<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2001 11:27 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Plasma Guns Explained<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Walt Smith writes:<BR>&gt; &gt; Caught this on the Schlock Mercenary site...the author<BR>&gt; &gt; claims to have put this together from NASA research,<BR>&gt; &gt; and applied it towards how one of his character's<BR>&gt; &gt; particular BFG works, "OMMMMINOUS HUMMMM" (tm) included.<BR>&gt; &gt; I thought it a good read, though I don't know enough<BR>&gt; &gt; of the proper kind of physics to vouch for its accuracy.<BR>&gt; &gt; Perhaps some of the resident science monsters could<BR>&gt; &gt; take a look?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I can't really judge the plasma physics, but if used in atmosphere it will<BR>&gt; have a range of a couple of yards, which is in general the biggest problem<BR>&gt; with 'plasma guns' in traveller anyway.&nbsp; Plasma hits atmosphere,<BR>&gt; atmosphere<BR>&gt; scatters plasma, plasma turns into big fireball at mouth of gun.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 11:12:12 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Plasma Guns Explained<BR><BR>David C. Broussard writes:<BR>&gt; ACtualyl, I just thought of another way this woudl work...of course it is<BR>&gt; not the standard PLasma gun route.&nbsp; What if instead of expelling a stream<BR>&gt; of plasma, you expelled a small magnetic bottle that held the components<BR>&gt; for the creation of plasma.&nbsp; I other words, the gun charges up a casing that<BR>&gt; consists of a magnetic bottle device and the plasma components.&nbsp; Then it<BR>&gt; shoots the casing at the target.&nbsp; At a predetermined time or range from its<BR>&gt; target the bottle would decay and you have a blast of plasma exploding onto<BR>&gt; the target.<BR><BR>Why not just fire an explosive bullet?&nbsp; It would almost certainly be lighter<BR>and cheaper for the same yield. <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 14:22:19 -0500<BR>From: "Walt Smith" &lt;firelock_ny@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: OOP CT LBB's Syracuse NY<BR><BR>I'll probably kick myself for this...<BR><BR>A friend of mine came back from Syracuse with a stack of<BR>Classic Traveller Little Black Bookss for me - a mint<BR>condition Book 5 (High Guard), a near-mint Book 4 (Mercenary),<BR>poor (but complete) Books 2 &amp; 3 (Starships, Worlds &amp; Adventures),<BR>good Adventure 2 (Expedition to Zhodane).&nbsp; She said they had a<BR>"whole box" of LBB's, including more Book 5's, and they were<BR>marked down to forty-nine cents each.<BR><BR>Yes, forty-nine cents each.<BR><BR>Well, I'm not zooming up to Syracuse and snapping up the<BR>whole box for E-Bay...I hope no one else does either.<BR><BR>The place is:<BR>Altered States Game &amp; Hobby<BR>689 N.Clinton St.,<BR>Syracuse, NY 13204<BR>315-472-GAME<BR><BR>Don't know how many they have, or exactly what...<BR>good luck and good hunting.<BR><BR>Walt Smith<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 11:26:03 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Plasma Guns Explained<BR><BR>IIRC, Traveller plasma guns use a laser to tunnel through the<BR>atmosphere before firing the plasma bolt, thus negating the<BR>atmosphere's effects on the plasma (at least for a little while).<BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Get email at your own domain with Yahoo! Mail. <BR>http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 14:07:57 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Plasma Guns Explained<BR><BR>&gt; Why not just fire an explosive bullet?&nbsp; It would almost certainly<BR>&gt; be lighter<BR>&gt; and cheaper for the same yield.<BR><BR><BR>But would it be the same yeild?&nbsp; Initially yes it would...but as the<BR>technology increases you start to exceed the potential energy of a chemical<BR>reaction with subatomic rections..not to mention the inherant problems of<BR>hitting soemthing with a wash of 10 MegaKelvin degress semi fluid.&nbsp; That<BR>heat trasnferred alone would be tremendous...then there are the other PLasma<BR>side effects...magnetic disturbance...particle radiation etc.&nbsp; It becomes a<BR>horrific weapon against unhardened troops, and devestating to unprotected<BR>electronics.<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 12:42:26 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Plasma Guns Explained<BR><BR>David C. Broussard writes:<BR><BR>&gt; But would it be the same yeild? <BR><BR>No, it would probably be higher.&nbsp; There's nothing requiring that an explosive<BR>is a chemical explosive.&nbsp; All you need for an explosive is something capable<BR>of discharging energy fast enough to create a shockwave.<BR><BR>&gt; Initially yes it would...but as the<BR>&gt; technology increases you start to exceed the potential energy of a chemical<BR>&gt; reaction with subatomic rections..<BR><BR>Actually, your plasma cage is limited by the strength of the magnetic bottle,<BR>which is limited by chemical bonds, and in practice will be orders of magnitude<BR>weaker than chemical bonds.<BR><BR>&gt; not to mention the inherant problems of<BR>&gt; hitting soemthing with a wash of 10 MegaKelvin degress semi fluid.&nbsp; That<BR>&gt; heat trasnferred alone would be tremendous...then there are the other<BR>&gt; PLasma side effects...magnetic disturbance...particle radiation etc.<BR><BR>Shrug.&nbsp; I doubt the plasma would actually be that effective as an EMP bomb, <BR>and the typical plasma temperatures for traveller weapons doesn't produce<BR>radiation worthy of note.&nbsp; What you described is in fact an explosive bullet,<BR>it's just probably a very inefficient one.<BR><BR>If you want 'plasma bullets' figure that the shell is in fact a container of<BR>chemical laser fuel which induces inertial confinement fusion in a pellet of<BR>fusion fuel.&nbsp; That's more or less how fusion gun cartridges in TNE work, and<BR>they'd just be more efficient as simple explosives instead of as projectors.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 12:48:12 -0800<BR>From: "Pronto" &lt;pronto_r031@telus.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jamming guns<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR><BR>&gt; The reality is that a modern, well designed weapons is very reliable.&nbsp; The<BR>&gt; likelyhood of a weapons malfunction is more likely to be related to the<BR>&gt; quality of the weapon and the maintenance (or lack thereof) it receives.<BR>&gt; The other main factor is the quality of ammunition.&nbsp; Pooly made ammunition<BR>&gt; is the number 1 cause of weapons stoppages (which may or may not be<BR>'jams')<BR>&gt;<BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; The type of weapon involved has very little to do with the likelyhood of<BR>&gt; it's jamming, although maechanical operated systems can have a slight<BR>&gt; advantage if the cause of the stoppage is poor ammuntion. Automatic<BR>weapons<BR>&gt; that are fired alot will increase the likelyhood of stoopages due to<BR>greater<BR>&gt; part wear abd accumulation of fouling<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; IMTU, anytime someone rolls 2 on 2d6 when firing, something bad happened.<BR>&gt; The player then rerolls 2d6 to determine what happened and how bad is it.<BR>&gt; (Not, if the player has a cheap or poorly maintained weapon, it may<BR>&gt; malfunction on a 3 or even 4!)<BR>&gt;<BR>&lt;Roll table snipped but saved. Very nice, it will get used!&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; Note: characters without the requisite gun combat skill may be able to<BR>fire<BR>&gt; a weapon, but will require help in fixing stoppages.<BR>&gt; Note 2:&nbsp; The quality of the weapon will effect the above rolls<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Cheap, poor quality weapon&nbsp; &nbsp; DM-3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; cost 50% of a<BR>standard<BR>&gt; weapon<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Quality weapons&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; DM+2&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Cost 125% of<BR>a<BR>&gt; standard weapon<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; MilSpec&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; DM+3&nbsp; &nbsp; Cost 200%<BR>of<BR>&gt; a standard Weapon<BR>&gt;<BR>I'm assuming you mean 'Milspec' as those weapons that live up to what<BR>'Milspec' should be, rather than all military arms. Anbody remember the M-60<BR>MG? Or reaching farther back into history the Ross Rifle? They were both<BR>'Milspec' but they both had problems.<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hope that helps<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Tod<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>Pronto<BR>AKA Brain Taylor<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 12:52:19 -0800<BR>From: "Pronto" &lt;pronto_r031@telus.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Plasma Guns Explained<BR><BR>&gt; David C. Broussard writes:<BR>&gt; &gt; ACtualyl, I just thought of another way this woudl work...of course it<BR>is<BR>&gt; &gt; not the standard PLasma gun route.&nbsp; What if instead of expelling a<BR>stream<BR>&gt; &gt; of plasma, you expelled a small magnetic bottle that held the components<BR>&gt; &gt; for the creation of plasma.&nbsp; I other words, the gun charges up a casing<BR>that<BR>&gt; &gt; consists of a magnetic bottle device and the plasma components.&nbsp; Then it<BR>&gt; &gt; shoots the casing at the target.&nbsp; At a predetermined time or range from<BR>its<BR>&gt; &gt; target the bottle would decay and you have a blast of plasma exploding<BR>onto<BR>&gt; &gt; the target.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Why not just fire an explosive bullet?&nbsp; It would almost certainly be<BR>lighter<BR>&gt; and cheaper for the same yield.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>Because an explosive bullet launcher (I didn't want to say 'slug thrower')<BR>doesn't have that "Ominous Hummmm" TM.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Pronto<BR>AKA Brian Taylor<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 14:04:31 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Question on Jump<BR><BR>I have always been under the understanding that if a Jump 2 ship jumps 2 par<BR>secs it took a week in time. and that a jump 6 ship could do a 2 parsec jump<BR>in say a 3rd of a week. is this true? or is this wrong?<BR><BR>hasta<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 17:14:50 EST<BR>From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>Subject: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>Okay, for you experts out there:<BR><BR>I have a high-gravity world (about 1.3 G at the surface) with a dense<BR>oxynitrogen atmosphere.&nbsp; Total atmospheric pressure is about 1.75<BR>standard.&nbsp; The partial pressure of oxygen is about 0.15 atmospheres,<BR>so there should be enough for a human being to breathe.&nbsp; On the other<BR>hand, the *nitrogen* has a partial pressure of about 1.6 atmospheres.<BR>There's also the usual minor components (argon, carbon dioxide,<BR>water vapor, and so on).<BR><BR>I suspect that an unprotected human on this world will suffer nitrogen<BR>narcosis, but I have no idea how quickly it will set in, how intense it<BR>will be, or whether there will be actual toxicity over time.&nbsp; If anyone<BR>can give me some insight into this, I'd be quite grateful.&nbsp; The more<BR>accurate and detailed a response, the better.<BR><BR>Extra credit if you can figure out why I'm asking, as long as you're<BR>not Robert O'Connor :-).<BR><BR>- ----------<BR>Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>set of people who will take offense at it."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3535<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-za04.mx.aol.com (rly-za04.mail.aol.com [172.31.36.100]) by air-za04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 17:19:19 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-za04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 17:17:59 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id RAA12363;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 17:15:53 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 18 Jan 2001 17:15:41 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id RAA12310<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 17:15:41 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 17:15:41 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101182215.RAA12310@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3535<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3536</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/18/01 4:13:23 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 18 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3536<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>Re: Question on Jump<BR>Re: Jamming guns<BR>Ground Forces<BR>What happened to Urunishu?<BR>Re: Plasma Guns Explained<BR>RE: Jamming guns<BR>Re: Jamming guns<BR>RE: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR>Re: Link to the science behind a plasma weapon?<BR>Re: Jamming guns<BR>Re: Jamming guns<BR>RE: Ships Deck Plans....<BR>RE: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3530<BR>Re: Jamming guns<BR>RE: Question on Jump<BR>Re: Question on Jump<BR>Re: What happened to Urunishu?<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 14:17:55 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>Y'all realise that we've got yet ANOTHER t-shirt we have to do, right?<BR><BR>:)<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 14:26:54 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question on Jump<BR><BR>William Lane writes:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I have always been under the understanding that if a Jump 2 ship jumps 2<BR>&gt; par secs it took a week in time. and that a jump 6 ship could do a 2<BR>&gt; parsec jump in say a 3rd of a week. is this true? or is this wrong?<BR><BR>It's wrong.&nbsp; All jumps take a week.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 14:44:26 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jamming guns<BR><BR>&gt; Don't forget that weapon *or ammo* quality /can/ have an adverse effect as<BR>&gt; well.&nbsp; By /can/ I mean that, for example, an AK47 may not be the best<BR>&gt; machined or stamped piece of hardware ever made, but it's pretty damn<BR>&gt; reliable.<BR><BR>I make note of that in the malfunction roll. Normally a roll of 2 on 2D6<BR>means a 'jam'. Bad ammo might increase this to 3 or 4 !<BR><BR>See http://www.travellercentral.com :house rules:weapons malfunctions or<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com/rules/jamming.html to go straight to the<BR>data.&nbsp; I'm working on table for energy and primitive weapons.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 01:18:19 -0000<BR>From: "Ben Aaronovitch" &lt;bem@imaginaryfilms.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Ground Forces<BR><BR>I just bought myself Ground Forces and I'd just like to say how much I enjoyed<BR>it. Plus the picture on page 49 would have been a keyboard kill if I hadn't been<BR>sitting on the bus at the time.<BR><BR>Ben<BR><BR>'Let's be honest here - you paid for the women.'<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Bill Murrey - Scrooged<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 17:48:30 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: What happened to Urunishu?<BR><BR>I submit this to the giant collective brain of the TML....<BR><BR>I'm running into some contradictory information regarding the location of <BR>the world Urunishu. This name may ring a bell, as in canon it is the Vilani <BR>"best-guess" candidate for the human homeworld in times prior to contact <BR>with the Solomani. To the best of my knowledge it's mentioned only in CT's <BR>"Library Data A-M" and "Alien Module 6", but I don't think either have a <BR>location or UWP. Unfortunately, my copies of both books have taken a walk <BR>and I can't find them to double-check.<BR><BR>Where I'm running into a little trouble is with the semi-canonical sector <BR>data for Antares Sector. Some of it suggests that Urunishu is at 0124 <BR>Antares, and some of it even has a subsector of Antares named Urunishu in <BR>the right location. However the actual world listings at solstation.com <BR>place some planet called Ogguengan (A264677-A) at 0124, *and* there is no <BR>world named Urunishu elsewhere in the sector.<BR><BR>Am I missing something here? Are solstation.com's world listings <BR>non-canonical and in error? Are there any canonical references to Urunishu <BR>anywhere else that I have overlooked? In the absence of evidence I have <BR>decided that the world has been renamed since Vilani times -- the canonical <BR>stuff says there's a minor human race there, and it occurs to me that they <BR>may have asserted themselves and applied a "local language" name since the <BR>fall of the Ziru Sirka. But I'd like to make sure I'm not stepping on any <BR>pre-existing information before I go this way....<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 10:09:09 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Plasma Guns Explained<BR><BR>On Thu, Jan 18, 2001 at 09:24:54AM -0500, Walt Smith wrote:<BR>&gt; http://www.schlockmercenary.com/chalain-vasimr.html<BR><BR>There's a lot of very dubious stuff in there, such as pressureless<BR>containment, substantial charge separation in a dense plasma, and<BR>non-conservation of momentum, but if it works for your game go for it!<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 15:23:17 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Jamming guns<BR><BR>I'd actually written and sent my reply before your's showed up.&nbsp; Great minds<BR>thinking alike and all ;)<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Tod Glenn<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2001 2:44 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Jamming guns<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Don't forget that weapon *or ammo* quality /can/ have an<BR>&gt; adverse effect as<BR>&gt; &gt; well.&nbsp; By /can/ I mean that, for example, an AK47 may not be the best<BR>&gt; &gt; machined or stamped piece of hardware ever made, but it's pretty damn<BR>&gt; &gt; reliable.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I make note of that in the malfunction roll. Normally a roll of 2 on 2D6<BR>&gt; means a 'jam'. Bad ammo might increase this to 3 or 4 !<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; See http://www.travellercentral.com :house rules:weapons malfunctions or<BR>&gt; http://www.travellercentral.com/rules/jamming.html to go straight to the<BR>&gt; data.&nbsp; I'm working on table for energy and primitive weapons.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Tod<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 18:26:29 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: Jamming guns<BR><BR>Pronto (Brian Taylor) wrote:<BR>(responding to Tod Glenn)<BR>&gt;&gt; IMTU, anytime someone rolls 2 on 2d6 when firing, something bad happened.<BR>&gt;&gt; The player then rerolls 2d6 to determine what happened and how bad is it.<BR>&gt;&gt; (Not, if the player has a cheap or poorly maintained weapon, it may<BR>&gt;&gt; malfunction on a 3 or even 4!)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Roll table snipped but saved. Very nice, it will get used! <BR><BR>Agreed, nice table.&nbsp; As a CT grognard you may not know this (or even want to know it), but this table is almost perfectly compatible with the MegaTraveller Mishaps system: Roll of natural 2 is a Mishap, roll 2D (or occasionally 3D) to determine severity: 2 = None, 3-6 = Superficial, 7-10 = Minor, 11-14 = Major, 15+ = Destroyed.&nbsp; Now I have concrete descriptions for what each of those levels means!&nbsp; Again, thanks.<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>P.S.&nbsp; I suppose this table's been on Tod's website for ages, but I'd never seen it before.&nbsp; Like NBC used to say to advertise re-runs "if you haven't seen it, it's new to you!"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 23:30 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: RE: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;PIEFIHNLNBEMHOILBEBPCEDFCFAA.jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>OK Jesse, give: What's your latest t-shirt idea? And who's going to wear <BR>it?<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 23:30 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;c2.5e769da.2798c4da@aol.com&gt;<BR>Greetings Jon, and the rest of you good folk.<BR><BR>The main thing is, under pressure nitrogen is ever more easily dissolved <BR>in the bloodstream in preference to oxygen. The superficial effect is to <BR>make you act a bit drunk (hence 'Nitrogen Narcosis') but meanwhile your <BR>brain is being starved of oxygen which is not good for it to say the <BR>least. Not to mention that while affected by nitrogen narcosis people tend <BR>to do really silly things that they would realise were stupid if they were <BR>in their right minds.<BR><BR>Of course, that's just the start of it. Reduce the pressure and the <BR>nitrogen comes back out of your blood... Good, right? Nope! It tends to <BR>come out fast without any attention to where, and causes bubbles in your <BR>blood stream in awkward and embarassing places... causing extreme pain and <BR>potentially killing you. That's "The Bends", if you've ever heard of it. <BR>Nasty thing that can affect divers if they surface too quickly.<BR><BR>It's all down to things like partial pressures and differential blood gas <BR>absorbtion. If you need precise figures I can go hit the diving manuals.<BR><BR>ObTrav: Can't exotic atmospheres be FUN... provided you're the referee :-)<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 00:35:42 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR><BR>Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt; All i will say, Jen, is that you have nearly all the pieces, but so<BR>&gt; far you have not put them together correctly 8^)<BR><BR>Typical conspiracy theory mistake. Well, I'll work on it.<BR><BR>And my name is Jens, BTW. Read my signature carefully&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 10:41:43 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: Link to the science behind a plasma weapon?<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Howard wrote:<BR>&gt;Wow, thanks for the plug... how many people does this mailing list go out<BR>to, again?<BR>&nbsp;&gt;<BR>&gt;I'll have to pester Chalain to come up with some more science corner<BR>content for me.<BR>&gt;He has several in the works, but has gotten busy lately.<BR><BR>The Traveller Mailing List has around 200-400 members. Most are lurkers.&nbsp; ;<BR>- -)&nbsp; The members include astronomers, medicos, an economist and lawyer (or<BR>two!), people doing high energy cyclotron research, as well as many<BR>computer nerds like me (programmers through to sysops, techos, etc). There<BR>are many many serving or ex-military types as well (naval radar operators,<BR>air force, army heavy weapons, tankers, as well as infantry).<BR><BR>We regularly have discussions on the pseudo-science inherent in the game.<BR>These range from Done-To-Death topics such as "Rock-Dropping as Orbital<BR>Weaponry", "What is a Feudal Technocracy, Anyway?", "Are Missiles Valid in<BR>Space Combat (vs Point-Defence Weaponry)", and ramp up to hideously<BR>detailed but esoteric discussions about "Where Does All The Jump Fuel Go<BR>(And Are Drop-Tanks Viable)?"<BR><BR>Since Traveller is an s-f roleplaying game, most people on the list will<BR>have had characters who (for&nbsp; example) have owned or used battledress<BR>(powered armour), FGMP-15's (Fusion Gun, Man-Portable, Tech Level 15),<BR>gauss rifles, air/rafts (flying cars), and starships ('natch).<BR><BR>Both Schlock Mercenary (http://www.schlockmercenary.com/) and Freefall (<BR>http://www.purrsia.com/freefall/) are excellent fodder for TML members. In<BR>fact, I'm sure that many can recognise either the characters or the<BR>situations as ones that have been in their own games!! ;-) ;-)<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 15:46:38 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jamming guns<BR><BR>&gt; I'm assuming you mean 'Milspec' as those weapons that live up to what<BR>&gt; 'Milspec' should be, rather than all military arms. Anbody remember the<BR>M-60<BR>&gt; MG? Or reaching farther back into history the Ross Rifle? They were both<BR>&gt; 'Milspec' but they both had problems.<BR><BR>I mean milspec in the ideal.&nbsp; IMTU, a weapon or other piece of equipment<BR>must go through rigorous testing to get the MilSpec certification (i.e.<BR>suitable for Imperial issue).&nbsp; There are ISO like standards for each class<BR>of equipment, but random sample must actually pass these tests to retain<BR>certification (as opposed to just having a system documented).<BR><BR>MilSpec weapons will cost more, be heavier and usually not have fancy<BR>geegaws that are likely to break.&nbsp; Military characters will care about this,<BR>usually no one else will.<BR><BR>BTW, you can look at a neater form of the rules at<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com/rules/jamming.html , or just go to<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com and take the link to House Rules.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 15:49:53 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jamming guns<BR><BR>&gt; Agreed, nice table.&nbsp; As a CT grognard you may not know this (or even want<BR>to know it), but this table is almost perfectly compatible with the<BR>MegaTraveller Mishaps system: Roll of natural 2 is a Mishap, roll 2D (or<BR>occasionally 3D) to determine severity: 2 = None, 3-6 = Superficial, 7-10 =<BR>Minor, 11-14 = Major, 15+ = Destroyed.&nbsp; Now I have concrete descriptions for<BR>what each of those levels means!&nbsp; Again, thanks.<BR><BR>Interesting.&nbsp; I'll have to look at my MT books.<BR><BR>&gt; P.S.&nbsp; I suppose this table's been on Tod's website for ages, but I'd never<BR>seen it before.&nbsp; Like NBC used to say to advertise re-runs "if you haven't<BR>seen it, it's new to you!"<BR><BR>Just put it up today.&nbsp; Been in my GM's notebook forever, though.&nbsp; More is<BR>coming!<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 15:48:15 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Ships Deck Plans....<BR><BR>is there a place i can go to order these? or are they out of print and i<BR>have to hope for something on ebay?<BR><BR>and thank you all for the replys<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Frank G. Pitt [mailto:frankie@mundens.gen.nz]<BR>Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2001 12:00 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Ships Deck Plans....<BR><BR><BR>William Lane wrote :<BR>&gt; I know this post came up before so sorry about bringing it back up. what i<BR>&gt; want to know is this.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; If 1 there is a Set of Deck plans for a S type scout courier out<BR>&gt; there that is designed to use with 25mm minitures?<BR><BR>There's the Judges Guild ones, and the ones in Snapshot. They're not 25mm<BR>but they could be photoccopied up if you have access to a percentage<BR>photocopier.<BR><BR>You have to calculate the percentage increase to go from 15mm to 25 mm, but<BR>it's not that hard<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 15:51:19 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>Why, an "Oregon Full-Auto Visitor's Bureau" Official T-Shirt (tm) of course!<BR>Only $29.95 from the Official Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau website:<BR>www.itaintfairtotherestofus.com<BR><BR>Best,<BR>Jesse<BR>p.s.&nbsp; And no, that's not a real URL :)<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Megan Robertson<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2001 3:30 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Cc: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In-Reply-To: &lt;PIEFIHNLNBEMHOILBEBPCEDFCFAA.jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Greetings dear hearts.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; OK Jesse, give: What's your latest t-shirt idea? And who's going to wear<BR>&gt; it?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hugs and kisses,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mexal.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 16:54:04 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3530<BR><BR>The help's getting a bit surly, are they?<BR><BR>GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; BTW, I explained the significance of "su madre..." to a friend by<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; asking him to imagine wandering into a not very nice black neighborhood<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; and yelling "Yo mama" at some gangbangers.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I know people who think that's Spanish for "Yes boss"<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>University of Arizona<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 15:57:06 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Jamming guns<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; IMTU, anytime someone rolls 2 on 2d6 when firing, something bad<BR>happened.<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; The player then rerolls 2d6 to determine what happened and how bad is<BR>it.<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; (Not, if the player has a cheap or poorly maintained weapon, it may<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; malfunction on a 3 or even 4!)<BR><BR>I forgot to mention.&nbsp; If I'm feeling really evil, when a player rolls 2 for<BR>their gun to hit, sometimes I have them roll again to determin if they hit<BR>the randomly chosen other player, and where. Sometimes the player even<BR>manages to shoot themself.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 19:02:28 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question on Jump<BR><BR>William Lane writes:<BR>&gt;I have always been under the understanding that if a Jump 2 ship jumps 2 par<BR>&gt;secs it took a week in time. and that a jump 6 ship could do a 2 parsec jump<BR>&gt;in say a 3rd of a week. is this true? or is this wrong?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Wrong is a strong word.&nbsp; :) The rules (at least in CT) stipulate<BR>that one<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; jump takes one week, regardless of the distance or the drive (missjumps<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; excepted).&nbsp; Naturally you can do what you like IYTU, but a change like<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; that could radically change the feel of Traveller.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 19:10:23 -0500<BR>From: "Walt Smith" &lt;firelock_ny@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question on Jump<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR>&gt;I have always been under the understanding that if a Jump 2 ship<BR>&gt;jumps 2 parsecs it took a week in time. and that a jump 6 ship<BR>&gt;could do a 2 parsec jump in say a 3rd of a week. is this true? or<BR>&gt;is this wrong?<BR><BR>One of the characteristics of Jump is that no matter how far you<BR>go, no matter how powerful a drive you use, it always takes about<BR>a week to do it.&nbsp; "Jump always takes about a week" is what you<BR>should expect in any situation referring to the original Traveller<BR>universe, and most universes/campaigns based on it...unless<BR>explicitly stated otherwise, you can pretty much take it as a<BR>given.<BR><BR>Some people use a variant rule in their campaigns that allow<BR>high-Jump ships to make short jumps in shorter amounts of time,<BR>and that's perfectly OK - rule zero (the referee can change any<BR>rule he feels a need to at any time) applies, as always.<BR><BR>Walt Smith<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 16:11:08 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: What happened to Urunishu?<BR><BR>- --============_-1232259421==_ma============<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"<BR><BR>&gt;I submit this to the giant collective brain of the TML....<BR><BR>The response of one diseased neuron...<BR><BR>According to my AllWorld.xls file there is no world named Urunishu <BR>anywhere in known space. So let's go looking for a candidate...<BR><BR>There are three size 8, standard atmosphere worlds in Antares sector.<BR><BR>Antares<BR>0437 Gulan&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; D 863620-7 S Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 604 Im K2V&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>1014 Nasseathin C 868542-A S Ag Ni 320 Im F4V M1D Binary<BR>2013 Kasihaip&nbsp;&nbsp; A 868387-B&nbsp;&nbsp; Lo Ni 110 Im G3D&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR><BR>In known space there are 26 size 8 worlds with standard atmospheres <BR>and 70% hydrographics. (We could include a wider range of <BR>characteristics in our search, but the results quickly become <BR>unwieldy.)<BR><BR>Core 2938<BR>&nbsp; Shakiiga&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; B 867ACA-B&nbsp;&nbsp; Hi&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 710 Im K4V&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Core 3129<BR>&nbsp; Keras Vla&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; B 867430-A A Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 303 Im K0V&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Corridor 2903<BR>&nbsp; Uerrgno&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; D 867996-4&nbsp;&nbsp; Hi&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 601 Im K9VI K5D&nbsp; Binary<BR>Dagudashaag 0906<BR>&nbsp; Gvadh&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; B 867730-B&nbsp;&nbsp; Ag&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 103 Im F1V M4D&nbsp;&nbsp; Binary<BR>Dark Nebula 2405<BR>&nbsp; Niysk&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; E 867424-1&nbsp;&nbsp; Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 804 So M3V M8D&nbsp;&nbsp; Binary<BR>Dark Nebula 2610<BR>&nbsp; Satwor&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 867632-6&nbsp;&nbsp; Ni Ag&nbsp; &nbsp; 904 So M3V&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Diaspora 0237<BR>&nbsp; Sunz&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; C 8679A8-B&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 904 Im K9D&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Diaspora 2802<BR>&nbsp; Voss&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; C 867226-C&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 903 Im M6IV&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Solitary<BR>Ealiyasiyw 0104<BR>&nbsp; Ftearya&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; B 8675J7-9&nbsp;&nbsp; Ag Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 924 As G7III M8D Binary<BR>Empty Quarter 1238<BR>&nbsp; Nahur&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; C 86778B-7&nbsp;&nbsp; Ag Ri&nbsp; &nbsp; 913 Im M8V M6D&nbsp;&nbsp; Binary<BR>Fornast 2039<BR>&nbsp; Emeraulde&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; A 867226-F&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 402 Im M1V&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Glimmerdrift Reaches 2936<BR>&nbsp; Natalie&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; A 867338-B&nbsp;&nbsp; Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 600 Na F0V M4D&nbsp;&nbsp; Binary<BR>Hinterworlds 2429 (Amber Zone)<BR>&nbsp; Pyfis&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; D 867556-5&nbsp;&nbsp; Ni Ag&nbsp; &nbsp; 804 Na G4V M8D&nbsp;&nbsp; Binary<BR>Ilelish 1628<BR>&nbsp; Teyle&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; B 8679CG-9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 825 Im F9D M9D&nbsp;&nbsp; Binary<BR>Iwahfuah 0226<BR>&nbsp; Fyoe&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 8673G4-D&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 200 As M0V&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Ley 1206<BR>&nbsp; Ravish&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; B 867779-9&nbsp;&nbsp; Ri Ag&nbsp; &nbsp; 400 Im G4V&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Lishun 1730<BR>&nbsp; Luniku Mishu&nbsp; A 867424-F&nbsp;&nbsp; Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 813 Im K7V M3D&nbsp;&nbsp; Binary<BR>Old Expanses 2134<BR>&nbsp; Tama&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 867502-9&nbsp;&nbsp; Ag Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 921 Im F3V M4D&nbsp;&nbsp; Binary<BR>Old Expanses 2204<BR>&nbsp; Imdra&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; D 867447-6&nbsp;&nbsp; Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 102 Im M2V&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Riftspan Reaches 3039<BR>&nbsp; Auhahkei&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 8675MB-B&nbsp;&nbsp; Ag Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 220 As K4V&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Solomani Rim 1827<BR>&nbsp; Terra&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; A 867A69-F B Hi&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 414 Im G2V&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Spica 0322<BR>&nbsp; Renfrew&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; C 8678B8-7&nbsp;&nbsp; Tn&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 312 So G9VI&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Solitary<BR>Spinward Marches 2715<BR>&nbsp; Porozlo&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; A 867A74-B&nbsp;&nbsp; Hi&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 201 Im M1V M9D&nbsp;&nbsp; Binary<BR>Trojan Reach 2123<BR>&nbsp; Asim&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; B 867564-6&nbsp;&nbsp; Ag Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 205 As F2D&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Trojan Reach 3213<BR>&nbsp; Kedus&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; D 867400-3&nbsp;&nbsp; Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 913 As F8D&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Vland 1628<BR>&nbsp; Akumid&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 867357-F&nbsp;&nbsp; Lo Ni Cp 923 Im K0V&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR><BR>And just for fun, here are the worlds in hex 1024 of each sector 8^)<BR><BR>Alpha Crucis 0124<BR>&nbsp; Lundvall&nbsp; &nbsp; E 9A457C-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 415 Im M1V&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Antares 0124<BR>&nbsp; Ogguengan&nbsp;&nbsp; A 264677-A&nbsp;&nbsp; Ag Ni Ri 400 Im G3V M2D Binary<BR>Daibei 0124<BR>&nbsp; Dalton&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; B 888110-B&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 614 Im K6VI&nbsp; &nbsp; Solitary<BR>Deneb 0124<BR>&nbsp; Gulistan&nbsp; &nbsp; C AB2358-7 S Lo Ni Fl 820 Im K6II&nbsp; &nbsp; Solitary<BR>Ealiyasiyw 0124<BR>&nbsp; Khaoworl&nbsp; &nbsp; D 2106M8-8&nbsp;&nbsp; Na Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 634 As M1V M0D Binary<BR>Fornast 0124<BR>&nbsp; Hankel&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; C 654320-A&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 502 Im G2V M5D Binary<BR>Hinterworlds 0124<BR>&nbsp; Relar&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; C 467669-4&nbsp;&nbsp; Ni Ri Ag 115 Na K1V M5D Binary<BR>Hlakhoi 0124<BR>&nbsp; Uakhos&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; D 1001M6-7&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 902 As M3V M3D Binary<BR>Iwahfuah 0124<BR>&nbsp; Yewuahiwa&nbsp;&nbsp; C 9D65H4-C&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 804 As K3V M2D Binary<BR>Lishun 0124<BR>&nbsp; Inru&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; C 425553-9&nbsp;&nbsp; Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 203 Im K0V M7D Binary<BR>Massilia 0124<BR>&nbsp; K'Zass&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; B 246965-C&nbsp;&nbsp; Hi In Cp 714 Im G3V M9D Binary<BR>Reaver's Deep 0124<BR>&nbsp; Davide&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; C 400573-9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 504 Id K8V&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Riftspan Reaches 0124<BR>&nbsp; Khtyeai&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; A 6455L6-B&nbsp;&nbsp; Ag Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 102 A8 M4V&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Spica 0124<BR>&nbsp; Athabasca&nbsp;&nbsp; A 534535-C&nbsp;&nbsp; Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 500 So M0V&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Solitary<BR>Zarushagaar 0124<BR>&nbsp; Quag&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; B 100434-E&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 224 Im M5IV&nbsp; &nbsp; Solitary<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR>- --============_-1232259421==_ma============<BR>Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"<BR><BR>&lt;!doctype html public "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN"&gt;<BR>&lt;head&gt;&lt;style type="text/css"&gt;&lt;!--<BR>blockquote, dl, ul, ol, li { margin-top: 0 ; margin-bottom: 0 }<BR>--&gt;&lt;/style&gt;&lt;title&gt;Re: What happened to Urunishu?&lt;/title&gt;&lt;/head&gt;<BR>&lt;blockquote type="cite" cite&gt;I submit this to the giant collective<BR>brain of the TML....&lt;/blockquote&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;<BR>&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;The response of one diseased neuron...&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;<BR>&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;According to my AllWorld.xls file there is no world named<BR>Urunishu anywhere in known space. So let's go looking for a<BR>candidate...&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;<BR>&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;There are three size 8, standard atmosphere worlds in Antares<BR>sector.&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;<BR>&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Antares&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;0437 Gulan&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; D 863620-7 S<BR>Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 604 Im K2V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;1014 Nasseathin C 868542-A S Ag Ni 320 Im F4V M1D<BR>Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;2013 Kasihaip&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; A 868387-B&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Lo Ni 110 Im<BR>G3D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;<BR>&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;In known space there are 26 size 8 worlds with standard<BR>atmospheres and 70% hydrographics. (We could include a wider range of<BR>characteristics in our search, but the results quickly become<BR>unwieldy.)&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;<BR>&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Core 2938&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Shakiiga&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; B<BR>867ACA-B&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Hi&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 710 Im<BR>K4V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Core 3129&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Keras Vla&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; B 867430-A A<BR>Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 303 Im<BR>K0V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Corridor 2903&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Uerrgno&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; D<BR>867996-4&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Hi&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 601 Im<BR>K9VI K5D&amp;nbsp; Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Dagudashaag 0906&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Gvadh&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; B<BR>867730-B&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ag&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 103 Im F1V<BR>M4D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Dark Nebula 2405&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Niysk&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; E<BR>867424-1&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 804 So M3V<BR>M8D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Dark Nebula 2610&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Satwor&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; A<BR>867632-6&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ni Ag&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 904 So<BR>M3V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Diaspora 0237&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Sunz&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>C<BR>8679A8-B&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>904 Im K9D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Diaspora 2802&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Voss&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>C<BR>867226-C&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>903 Im M6IV&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Ealiyasiyw 0104&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Ftearya&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; B<BR>8675J7-9&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ag Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 924 As G7III M8D<BR>Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Empty Quarter 1238&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Nahur&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; C<BR>86778B-7&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ag Ri&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 913 Im M8V M6D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Fornast 2039&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Emeraulde&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; A<BR>867226-F&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>402 Im M1V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Glimmerdrift Reaches 2936&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Natalie&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; A<BR>867338-B&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 600 Na F0V<BR>M4D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Hinterworlds 2429 (Amber Zone)&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Pyfis&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; D<BR>867556-5&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ni Ag&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 804 Na G4V M8D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Ilelish 1628&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Teyle&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; B<BR>8679CG-9&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>825 Im F9D M9D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Iwahfuah 0226&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Fyoe&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>A<BR>8673G4-D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>200 As M0V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Ley 1206&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Ravish&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; B<BR>867779-9&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ri Ag&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 400 Im<BR>G4V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Lishun 1730&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Luniku Mishu&amp;nbsp; A 867424-F&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 813 Im K7V M3D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Old Expanses 2134&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Tama&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>A 867502-9&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ag Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 921 Im F3V M4D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Old Expanses 2204&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Imdra&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; D<BR>867447-6&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 102 Im<BR>M2V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Riftspan Reaches 3039&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Auhahkei&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; A<BR>8675MB-B&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ag Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 220 As<BR>K4V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Solomani Rim 1827&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Terra&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; A<BR>867A69-F B Hi&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 414 Im<BR>G2V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Spica 0322&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Renfrew&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; C<BR>8678B8-7&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Tn&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 312 So<BR>G9VI&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Spinward Marches 2715&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Porozlo&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; A<BR>867A74-B&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Hi&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 201 Im M1V<BR>M9D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Trojan Reach 2123&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Asim&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>B 867564-6&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ag Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 205 As<BR>F2D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Trojan Reach 3213&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Kedus&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; D<BR>867400-3&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 913 As<BR>F8D&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Vland 1628&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Akumid&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; A<BR>867357-F&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Lo Ni Cp 923 Im<BR>K0V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;<BR>&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;And just for fun, here are the worlds in hex 1024 of each sector<BR>8^)&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;<BR>&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Alpha Crucis 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Lundvall&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; E<BR>9A457C-8&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>415 Im M1V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Antares 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Ogguengan&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; A 264677-A&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ag Ni Ri<BR>400 Im G3V M2D Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Daibei 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Dalton&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; B<BR>888110-B&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>614 Im K6VI&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Deneb 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Gulistan&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; C AB2358-7 S Lo Ni Fl 820 Im<BR>K6II&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Ealiyasiyw 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Khaoworl&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; D 2106M8-8&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Na<BR>Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 634 As M1V M0D Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Fornast 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Hankel&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; C<BR>654320-A&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>502 Im G2V M5D Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Hinterworlds 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Relar&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; C<BR>467669-4&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ni Ri Ag 115 Na K1V M5D Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Hlakhoi 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Uakhos&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; D<BR>1001M6-7&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>902 As M3V M3D Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Iwahfuah 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Yewuahiwa&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; C<BR>9D65H4-C&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>804 As K3V M2D Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Lishun 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Inru&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; C<BR>425553-9&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 203 Im K0V<BR>M7D Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Massilia 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;K'Zass&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; B 246965-C&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>Hi In Cp 714 Im G3V M9D Binary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Reaver's Deep 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Davide&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; C<BR>400573-9&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>504 Id K8V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Riftspan Reaches 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Khtyeai&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; A 6455L6-B&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>Ag Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 102 A8 M4V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Spica 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Athabasca&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; A 534535-C&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>Ni&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; 500 So M0V&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;Zarushagaar 0124&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&lt;tt&gt;&amp;nbsp;Quag&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; B<BR>100434-E&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;<BR>224 Im M5IV&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Solitary&lt;/tt&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;<BR>&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;TTFN&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&lt;div&gt;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; g&lt;/div&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;div&gt;-- <BR><BR>=============================================<BR><BR>&amp;quot;Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR><BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR><BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying.&amp;quot;<BR><BR>=============================================&lt;/div&gt;<BR><BR><BR>- --============_-1232259421==_ma============--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3536<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-za01.mx.aol.com (rly-za01.mail.aol.com [172.31.36.97]) by air-za03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 19:13:23 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-za01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 19:12:46 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id TAA17394;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 19:11:36 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 18 Jan 2001 19:11:24 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id TAA17348<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 19:11:24 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 19:11:24 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101190011.TAA17348@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3536<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3537</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/18/01 11:14:54 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 19 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3537<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR>RE: Question on Jump<BR>Re: A ship design question<BR>Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>Re: Spanish lesson...<BR>Re: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR>Re: Landgrab rules'<BR>Re: Question on Jump<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>Re: Question on Jump<BR>Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>Re: A ship design question<BR>Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>KB3 Concentration Rule<BR>KB3 Multiple Actions<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>Re: Question on Jump<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 16:27:21 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR><BR>&gt;Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; Tordesillas (Gaea 0610) E-26793D-7 Rs&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 134 Tw G2V Solitary<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; Rurik&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 0860) D-3679DC-8 Po Rs&nbsp; &nbsp; 134 Eb G2V Solitary<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; Jewel&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 0820) E-267947-7 Hi&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 934 Tw G2V Solitary<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; Jung-Zei&nbsp; &nbsp; (Gaea 1035) D-267A8G-7 Hi Ag&nbsp; &nbsp; 134 Cn G2V Solitary<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; Usonia&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (Gaea 1040) C-267943-9 Ri&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 334 Fw G2V Solitary<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Cabotia&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 1060) E-267849-9 Lo Ag Rs 334 Fw G2V Solitary<BR><BR>I just realized i missed out one of the minor worlds.<BR><BR>Barton&nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 1325) E-267847-9&nbsp; Lo Ag Rs&nbsp; 234 Fw G2V Solitary<BR><BR>That may or may not help you solve the puzzle 8^)<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 16:27:15 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question on Jump<BR><BR>well please understand. the last time i ran a traveller campain was 1989.<BR>and i am trying to remember a lot of stuff. My memory is fuzzy. At one time<BR>i knew this stuff inside and out. Most things ran along the lines of<BR>Standard Core traveller (books 1-8 and the supplements). I added a race or 2<BR>of my own. gave the imperium a little more manifest destiny (ie the idea WE<BR>will rule the galaxy kind of thing). However i tried to keep the technology<BR>as it was in core traveller.<BR><BR>Since the last time i gamed i ahve since moved 4 or 5 times. a lot of the<BR>stuff i had is gone. all the deck plans and ships i designed are gone. all<BR>my star maps are gone. all lost in the moves. so im really starting fresh.<BR>got players who are very new to traveller so my mistakes wont be to<BR>disaterous. I am slowly starting to get back into the swing of things. But<BR>there are things i cant remember.<BR><BR>For example at one point in the game Some&nbsp; nasty guys broke into the hanger<BR>bay their ship was in. the pilot wanted to throttle the engines up and i<BR>guess fry these guys. in the back of my mind i kept thinking that the<BR>manuver engines are not like jet engines and they cant be throttled to say<BR>15% or something.<BR><BR>Again I could very well be wrong. i am searching the books right now looking<BR>for the answer.<BR><BR>I was shown this mailing list in hopes of getting help in the areas i cant<BR>remember. <BR><BR>Somethings i do remember. anyway any advice is wanted and appreciated.<BR><BR>thanks<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Ian Ferguson [mailto:ian@vax2.concordia.ca]<BR>Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2001 3:02 PM<BR>To: traveller@ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Question on Jump<BR><BR><BR>William Lane writes:<BR>&gt;I have always been under the understanding that if a Jump 2 ship jumps 2<BR>par<BR>&gt;secs it took a week in time. and that a jump 6 ship could do a 2 parsec<BR>jump<BR>&gt;in say a 3rd of a week. is this true? or is this wrong?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Wrong is a strong word.&nbsp; :) The rules (at least in CT) stipulate<BR>that one<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; jump takes one week, regardless of the distance or the drive<BR>(missjumps<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; excepted).&nbsp; Naturally you can do what you like IYTU, but a change<BR>like<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; that could radically change the feel of Traveller.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 15:55:19 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: A ship design question<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; on 17/1/01 8:43 am, Leonard Erickson at shadow@krypton.rain.com wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; I don't recall seeing such a thing in the early canon.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; That's because the jump drives are a *lot* more expensive than rocket <BR>&gt; motors.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Sure, but transponders that only respond to the manufacturer code are pretty<BR>&gt; low-tech, and therefore available. Since the first jump target is going to<BR>&gt; be known, it's easy to follow in a ship that can recover the drives (though<BR>&gt; not the hull of the jump tanks).<BR><BR>But a ship that can jump there AND JUMP BACK WITH THE DRIVES, ETC could<BR>make the jump *without* the intermediate stop in the first place.<BR><BR>And demounting the drives, AND THE PUMPS AND PLUMBING THEY NEED is not<BR>an easy task. <BR><BR>&gt; Ack. However, using a relay with ships that jettison primary jump motors and<BR>&gt; their tankage will improve even on a simple tanker relay.<BR><BR>Not really. The tanks are going to be part of the "structure" that<BR>holds a lot of other stuff. And almost *have* to be rather well<BR>integrated into all of this. <BR><BR>Once you include time and *labor* in the costs, you'll likely lose any<BR>advantage you gained by not retreiving the whole "stage". <BR><BR>&gt; Given that during the IGS, each jump is into the unknown, it's a shame that<BR>&gt; these strategies haven't been explored properly. Or even strategies for the<BR>&gt; return of multi-million credit scouts that have got 'stuck' in inter-system<BR>&gt; space. Something worth having in T5 First Survey?<BR><BR>Actually, the jumps *aren't* into the unknown. Give *current*<BR>astronomical gear, and making observations from (say) opposite sides of<BR>neptunes orbit, will allow mapping star locations to high accuracy for<BR>*hundreds* of parsecs. <BR><BR>Use observations from systems a parsec or two apart, and you can map<BR>stars as far as you can see (inside the galaxy). <BR><BR>And using stuff like Palomar or the newer large telescopes and you can<BR>map the planetary systems for most of a sector.<BR><BR>Even with a "small" (say 1 meter) scope carried on board the scout ship,<BR>it'll be simple to get data that's accurate to a few million km from<BR>even 6 parsecs away.<BR><BR>Scouts won't have *detailed* info, but they aren't jumping blind.<BR>They'll know where the star is, and likely where any GGs are. Possibly<BR>even the larger planets. <BR><BR>"Mapping" range *far* exceeds "jump" range.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 16:18:36 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Y'all realise that we've got yet ANOTHER t-shirt we have to do, right?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; :)<BR>&gt; Jesse<BR><BR>Speaking of T-shirts...<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;"Lee S. Billings" wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Celine (proud owner of a "Harrington Steading" embroidered polo shirt)<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Want! WANT! <BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Where did you get it?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Available from http://www.pegasuspublishing.com. Fair warning, they're<BR>&gt;a little pricey ($40), but very nice. He's got a pretty good line of<BR>&gt;other licensed Honor Harrington stuff as well.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 16:21:36 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Spanish lesson...<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Loren &lt;GDWGAMES@aol.com&gt; writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; BTW, I explained the significance of "su madre..." to a friend by<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&nbsp; asking him to imagine wandering into a not very nice black neighborhood<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&nbsp; and yelling "Yo mama" at some gangbangers.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;I know people who think that's Spanish for "Yes boss"<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hmmm. Anybody who doesn't know the difference between "su madre" and<BR>&gt; "Si, jeffe" is in for a serious asskicking the next time they visit a <BR>&gt; Hispanic<BR>&gt; neighborhood! :^)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - Mark C.<BR><BR>I still remember the explosion when our assistant Scoutmaster realized<BR>that we *hadn't* been saying "Jawohl, herr commandant!" in reply to his<BR>overly frequent orders. <BR><BR>I forget who started it, but we were going "Jawohl, herr common dunce!"<BR>&lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 16:11:06 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Contact for Jesse DeGraff?<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; That being said, my personal scattergun is a Mossberg<BR>&gt; 590 with heat shield and bayonet lug (hey, ya never know).<BR><BR>&lt;anti-gun idiot&gt;<BR><BR>Bayonet lug! Evil! Wicked! Awful!<BR><BR>&lt;/anti-gun idiot&gt;<BR><BR>All of our SKSes have bayonets. In fact a friend took a picture of his,<BR>mine, and kathy's guns that have bayonets. A total of 7. There'd be 8,<BR>except he still hasn't found a Mossberg with a bayonet lug yet. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 16:39:17 -0800<BR>From: "Kelly St.Clair" &lt;kellys@efn.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrab rules'<BR><BR>On Thu, 18 Jan 2001 09:31:08, "Douglas E. Berry" <BR>&lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Try not to take one that's already being done.&nbsp; This creates a multiverse,<BR>&gt;and then you end up with the Crisis on Infinite Rhylanors, and George Perez<BR>&gt;kills you for making him do all that art research again (comic geek joke.)<BR><BR>I don't usually drink at my keyboard, but I was today...<BR><BR>Doug, you were &gt;this&lt; close to getting a genuine SPLORT outta me.<BR><BR>Just think of the fun when the Strephons from Imperium-MT and Imperium-GT <BR>(and possibly more) meet each other...<BR><BR><BR>- --------------<BR>Kelly St.Clair&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "'Cause you've got Trouble<BR>kellys@efn.org&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Right here in fair Verona<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; With a capital T that rhymes with D<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That stands for Duel..."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 16:33:41 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Question on Jump<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I have always been under the understanding that if a Jump 2 ship jumps 2 par<BR>&gt; secs it took a week in time. and that a jump 6 ship could do a 2 parsec jump<BR>&gt; in say a 3rd of a week. is this true? or is this wrong?<BR><BR>Nope. A jump takes a week. A J6 ship takes just as long to jump 2<BR>parsecs as a J2 ship. <BR><BR>Which sets up the annoying to battle comanders fact that if you invade<BR>a system, and someone jumps out, you *can't* get to the system they<BR>jumped to ahead of them. Except by pure luck (the slight random<BR>variation in jump duration).<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 16:36:25 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Okay, for you experts out there:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I have a high-gravity world (about 1.3 G at the surface) with a dense<BR>&gt; oxynitrogen atmosphere.&nbsp; Total atmospheric pressure is about 1.75<BR>&gt; standard.&nbsp; The partial pressure of oxygen is about 0.15 atmospheres,<BR>&gt; so there should be enough for a human being to breathe.&nbsp; On the other<BR>&gt; hand, the *nitrogen* has a partial pressure of about 1.6 atmospheres.<BR>&gt; There's also the usual minor components (argon, carbon dioxide,<BR>&gt; water vapor, and so on).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I suspect that an unprotected human on this world will suffer nitrogen<BR>&gt; narcosis, but I have no idea how quickly it will set in, how intense it<BR>&gt; will be, or whether there will be actual toxicity over time.&nbsp; If anyone<BR>&gt; can give me some insight into this, I'd be quite grateful.&nbsp; The more<BR>&gt; accurate and detailed a response, the better.<BR><BR>Nitrogen has a partial pressure of .8 atm at sea level. Which means<BR>that using scuba gear at 30 feet underwater you are breathing nitrogen<BR>1.6 atm partial pressure. Nitrogen narcosis isn't a much of a problem.<BR><BR>The real problem is that leaving the planet will involve hours of<BR>decompression, as you've been doing the equivalent of "saturation<BR>diving" for days to weeks.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 17:18:31 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question on Jump<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson writes:<BR><BR>&gt; Which sets up the annoying to battle comanders fact that if you invade<BR>&gt; a system, and someone jumps out, you *can't* get to the system they<BR>&gt; jumped to ahead of them. Except by pure luck (the slight random<BR>&gt; variation in jump duration).<BR><BR>Not to mention that you can't really tell where they went, either.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 20:34:57 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Please bear with a first-ever post.<BR><BR>I was hoping y'all had thoughts about the spread of Imperial tech throughout<BR>the settled galaxy.&nbsp; How could it be possible in the CT/GURPS Imperium or<BR>similar-tech organizations that tech levels could sink as far down as<BR>pre-Industrial?&nbsp; In the absence of a prime directive, any lower-tech world<BR>frequented enough by starfarers would mob the most dilapidated free trader<BR>that limped into the system.&nbsp; And if the world has any starport, it would be<BR>extremely hard to prevent the leaching of higher-tech equipment across the<BR>XT line.&nbsp; What are some solutions to this seeming enigma?&nbsp; More orbital-only<BR>starports than meets the eye (Dad to tot on a TL3 world: "that's Deneb,<BR>that's Arcturus, that's the stardemon that can zap you from heaven")?&nbsp; Or<BR>generally higher tech levels that starport modifiers would indicate?<BR><BR>Mike Daumen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 20:37:04 EST<BR>From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/18/01 6:36:43 PM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk writes:<BR><BR>&gt; The main thing is, under pressure nitrogen is ever more easily dissolved <BR>&gt;&nbsp; in the bloodstream in preference to oxygen. The superficial effect is to <BR>&gt;&nbsp; make you act a bit drunk (hence 'Nitrogen Narcosis') but meanwhile your <BR>&gt;&nbsp; brain is being starved of oxygen which is not good for it to say the <BR>&gt;&nbsp; least. Not to mention that while affected by nitrogen narcosis people tend <BR>&gt;&nbsp; to do really silly things that they would realise were stupid if they were <BR>&gt;&nbsp; in their right minds.<BR><BR>Yep.&nbsp; In GURPS terms I plan to simulate this by requiring HT rolls to<BR>avoid a DX and IQ penalty over time.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Of course, that's just the start of it. Reduce the pressure and the <BR>&gt;&nbsp; nitrogen comes back out of your blood... Good, right? Nope! It tends to <BR>&gt;&nbsp; come out fast without any attention to where, and causes bubbles in your <BR>&gt;&nbsp; blood stream in awkward and embarassing places... causing extreme pain and <BR>&gt;&nbsp; potentially killing you. That's "The Bends", if you've ever heard of it. <BR>&gt;&nbsp; Nasty thing that can affect divers if they surface too quickly.<BR><BR>Good point, since although characters won't be leaving the planet very<BR>often they *will* be going from the outside into Earth-normal conditions<BR>inside their habitats.&nbsp; This may be where careless people can take<BR>damage fast.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; It's all down to things like partial pressures and differential blood gas <BR>&gt;&nbsp; absorbtion. If you need precise figures I can go hit the diving manuals.<BR><BR>I would appreciate it.&nbsp; I need to come up with game rules for this that<BR>won't get me laughed out of court when they appear in print.<BR><BR>- ----------<BR>Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>set of people who will take offense at it."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 20:39:35 EST<BR>From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/18/01 8:12:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; Nitrogen has a partial pressure of .8 atm at sea level. Which means<BR>&gt;&nbsp; that using scuba gear at 30 feet underwater you are breathing nitrogen<BR>&gt;&nbsp; 1.6 atm partial pressure. Nitrogen narcosis isn't a much of a problem.<BR><BR>Even after (say) hours of strenuous work under heavy gravity?<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; The real problem is that leaving the planet will involve hours of<BR>&gt;&nbsp; decompression, as you've been doing the equivalent of "saturation<BR>&gt;&nbsp; diving" for days to weeks.<BR><BR>Good point.&nbsp; How damaging is it if this step is skipped?&nbsp; Will a person<BR>in this situation who was in moderately good health die of the bends<BR>rarely?&nbsp; Occasionally?&nbsp; Frequently?&nbsp; Almost invariably?<BR><BR>- ----------<BR>Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>set of people who will take offense at it."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 02:44:03 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A ship design question<BR><BR>on 18/1/01 11:55 pm, Leonard Erickson at shadow@krypton.rain.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Actually, the jumps *aren't* into the unknown. Give *current*<BR>&gt; astronomical gear, and making observations from (say) opposite sides of<BR>&gt; neptunes orbit, will allow mapping star locations to high accuracy for<BR>&gt; *hundreds* of parsecs.<BR><BR>Star mapping isn't the important bit...<BR><BR>&gt; Scouts won't have *detailed* info, but they aren't jumping blind.<BR>&gt; They'll know where the star is, and likely where any GGs are. Possibly<BR>&gt; even the larger planets.<BR><BR>...but this is, and you're right. the only planetary details that are needed<BR>are the locations of the gas giants. LGGs can be inferred from (even)<BR>planetary based observations of occultations. Which blows the requirement<BR>for my hypothetical ships right out. Thanks for the wake-up call. :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 20:49:30 -0600<BR>From: Charles R Hensley &lt;hensley.cr@gte.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>Mark C. wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Greetings dear hearts, especially Jesse.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Stop tempting me, you lot. First of all it's "Come to Oregon and<BR>&gt; &gt; we'll let&nbsp; you shoot machine guns" and now this....<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What *I* wanna know is how come Jesse keeps getting the credit for<BR>&gt;*MY* machine guns!?! :^)<BR><BR>It's all in the Marketing. Jesse is better at selling.<BR><BR>Charles H<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 23:21:02 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: KB3 Concentration Rule<BR><BR>Playing around with the KB3 rules tonight, and I've added a few things.<BR><BR>Typically, in a KB3 round, a character can act and move.&nbsp; If the<BR>character concentrates on his task throughout the entire round, he can<BR>subtract 1D from his difficulty (at the expense of loosing his<BR>movement).<BR><BR>Aiming is handled like this.&nbsp; A PC can make a snapshot and move, or he<BR>can use his entire round to make his shot--he's taking extended aim<BR>instead of moving or making quick snapshots.<BR><BR>If a PC wants to focus his attention on some other skill, and only do<BR>that one action during the round, he can subtract 1D from his<BR>difficulty.<BR><BR>Etc.<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 23:36:51 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: KB3 Multiple Actions<BR><BR>I've tweaked the KB3 Mulitple Action rule a bit.<BR><BR>A PC can make more than one action during a round provided there is time<BR>in the round to perform more than one action.<BR><BR>If you dig through your backpack, the GM will probably rule that that<BR>action is the only action you can make during the round.&nbsp; But, if you<BR>want to pull the trigger of your weapon more than once, it is logical to<BR>assume that you can do that multiple times in a six second combat round.<BR><BR>If the Multiple Action rule is used, 1D is added to all difficulty<BR>throws for each additional action taken (for example, if you want to<BR>fire your pistol three times during the round, all three shots will have<BR>2D added to the difficulties of all three attack throws).<BR><BR>Additionally....<BR><BR>PC's are limited on the number of actions they can take in a round by<BR>their skill level.&nbsp; If you have skill-1, you can only make 1 action that<BR>round with that skill.&nbsp; If you have skill-2, you can make two skill<BR>throws...etc.<BR><BR>So, if you want to fire your pistol twice in a round, you have to have<BR>Pistol-2 (or higher) to be able to do that.<BR><BR>If you have a dagger in one hand and a pistol in the other, and you want<BR>to fire the pistol and throw the dagger in the same round, you have to<BR>have Pistol-2 AND Dagger-2 to be able to pull that off.<BR><BR>And, no matter how you mix it up, you still have to contend with the 1D<BR>difficulty penalty per additional action after the first.<BR><BR><BR><BR>No roll actions....<BR><BR>Sometimes, a PC will make multiple actions with tasks that do not<BR>require rolls.&nbsp; For instance, a PC may want to reach his hand into a<BR>belt pouch and pull out some caltrops (an action), and then toss those<BR>caltrops to the ground at this feet (another action).&nbsp; No roll is<BR>required to do either of these actions, but performing both in a round<BR>is definitely a multiple action.<BR><BR>As long as the GM OK's the move, a character can do this--and the game<BR>moves on.<BR><BR>The GM just needs to keep perspective of what can be accomplished in 6<BR>seconds when these situations come up.<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 00:54:50 -0500<BR>From: michael stasica &lt;stosh@sympatico.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Okay, for you experts out there:<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; I have a high-gravity world (about 1.3 G at the surface) with a dense<BR>&gt; &gt; oxynitrogen atmosphere.&nbsp; Total atmospheric pressure is about 1.75<BR><BR>&gt; SNIP<BR><BR>&gt; The real problem is that leaving the planet will involve hours of<BR>&gt; decompression, as you've been doing the equivalent of "saturation<BR>&gt; diving" for days to weeks.<BR><BR>SNIP<BR><BR>But in a typical starship would this be an issue?&nbsp; The whole ship could be<BR>used as a decompression chamber over the course of travel time to<BR>jump point and during jump.<BR><BR>Michael<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 22:23:50 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Question on Jump<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&gt; Which sets up the annoying to battle comanders fact that if you invade<BR>&gt;&gt; a system, and someone jumps out, you *can't* get to the system they<BR>&gt;&gt; jumped to ahead of them. Except by pure luck (the slight random<BR>&gt;&gt; variation in jump duration).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Not to mention that you can't really tell where they went, either.<BR><BR>But you can often make good guesses.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 22:24:18 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; In a message dated 1/18/01 8:12:40 PM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>&gt; shadow@krypton.rain.com writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Nitrogen has a partial pressure of .8 atm at sea level. Which means<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; that using scuba gear at 30 feet underwater you are breathing nitrogen<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; 1.6 atm partial pressure. Nitrogen narcosis isn't a much of a problem.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Even after (say) hours of strenuous work under heavy gravity?<BR><BR>You'll need to ask a diving expert, but as I recall, there still<BR>shouldn't be a problem for most folks. <BR><BR>And given that even with a wetsuit, it can get pretty cold 30 feet<BR>down, you are already doing "heavy work". <BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; The real problem is that leaving the planet will involve hours of<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; decompression, as you've been doing the equivalent of "saturation<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; diving" for days to weeks.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Good point.&nbsp; How damaging is it if this step is skipped?<BR><BR>Just about a guaranteed case of the bends.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Will a person<BR>&gt; in this situation who was in moderately good health die of the bends<BR>&gt; rarely?&nbsp; Occasionally?&nbsp; Frequently?&nbsp; Almost invariably?<BR><BR>That's something you'll have to dig up research on. But it won't be good.<BR><BR>Besides diving, also check out "caisson disease". Workers in<BR>pressurized caissons used for tunneling under rivers, or for excavating<BR>down to bedrock to set pilings used to have a *lot* of accidents where<BR>there was a sudden pressure loss.<BR><BR>One thing I'm fairly sure of. A sudden drop from 2 atm to 1 atm will<BR>cause painful bends and probably cripple you, at least temporarily.<BR><BR>Luckily, in this case, the treatment is simply "recompressing" you to<BR>the outside air pressure, and then waiting for the bubbles to go back<BR>into solution. Then you have to be decompressed extra carefully.<BR><BR>I rather expect that starships visiting planets with air pressure<BR>different enough to worry about will use the time in jump to adjust the<BR>air pressure. And if anybody has trouble, slap them into a low berth.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 22:31:37 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; In a message dated 1/18/01 6:36:43 PM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>&gt; mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; The main thing is, under pressure nitrogen is ever more easily dissolved <BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; in the bloodstream in preference to oxygen. The superficial effect is to <BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; make you act a bit drunk (hence 'Nitrogen Narcosis') but meanwhile your <BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; brain is being starved of oxygen which is not good for it to say the <BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; least.<BR><BR>Wait second. "Oxygen starvation" is *not* a factor. Because oxygen<BR>*doesn't* dissolve in the blood to an extent worth worrying about. It<BR>combines *chemically* with the hemoglobin in red blood cells. And when<BR>the concentration gradient between the cells is right, it's exchanged<BR>for CO2. <BR><BR>&gt; Good point, since although characters won't be leaving the planet very<BR>&gt; often they *will* be going from the outside into Earth-normal conditions<BR>&gt; inside their habitats.&nbsp; This may be where careless people can take<BR>&gt; damage fast.<BR><BR>Actually, given the pressures stated, there's no good reason to use<BR>earth normal pressures in the habitats. And lots of reasons *not* to. <BR><BR>At *worst*, they'd be at the same pressure as the outside, but with a<BR>different gas mix.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; It's all down to things like partial pressures and differential blood gas <BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; absorbtion. If you need precise figures I can go hit the diving manuals.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I would appreciate it.&nbsp; I need to come up with game rules for this that<BR>&gt; won't get me laughed out of court when they appear in print.<BR><BR>And I suspect that the "danger" point for nitrogen narcosis is above<BR>the pressures you've got.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3537<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yb03.mx.aol.com (rly-yb03.mail.aol.com [172.18.146.3]) by air-yb04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 02:14:54 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yb03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 02:14:30 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id CAA32506;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 02:11:28 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 19 Jan 2001 02:11:10 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id CAA32448<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 02:11:10 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 02:11:10 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101190711.CAA32448@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3537<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3538</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/19/01 9:47:17 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 19 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3538<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>re: starports and techlevels<BR>RE: Okay, the millennium came early.<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>RE: Honor Harrington Goodies<BR>Re : Quick Environmental Question (longish)<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3535<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3535<BR>RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR>RE: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR>Re: Question on Jump<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re:Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 02:33:26 EST<BR>From: Arvig@aol.com<BR>Subject: re: starports and techlevels<BR><BR>- --part1_9a.ee53063.279947c6_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>Michael Daumen "daumen@mindspring.com" writes this in part:<BR><BR>&gt;Please bear with a first-ever post.<BR><BR>I was hoping y'all had thoughts about the spread of Imperial tech throughout<BR>the settled galaxy.=A0 How could it be possible in the CT/GURPS Imperium or<BR>similar-tech organizations that tech levels could sink as far down as<BR>pre-Industrial?=A0 &lt;<BR><BR>Well, this is my second-ever post, so please bear back with me.&nbsp; :)&nbsp; I=20<BR>personally always looked at it this way, take a look at present day Earth. =20<BR>One could argue that Earth right now in the early 21st century (circa AD=20<BR>2001) Earth is probably at a CT tech level of roughly 8.&nbsp; Fine, but on Earth=<BR>=20<BR>itself, there's at least a few nations that if one only counts local=20<BR>manufacturing level, are at a CT tech level of 5 or 6, and some sections tha=<BR>t=20<BR>are even lower, look at a tribe in the Amazon rain forest for instance.&nbsp; Yet=<BR>=20<BR>most of the lower tech nations have international class airports, access to=20<BR>high tech goods and companies like UPS, Fed-Ex and others in which to order=20<BR>more, communication from television and radio to the Internet, and so forth.=<BR>=20<BR>When one sees that even on just one planet a spread of two to three tech=20<BR>levels, even when it has extensive communications networks, having tech=20<BR>levels all the way from zero to 15 in the CT Imperium isn't all that odd. =20<BR><BR>Michael, feel free to respond via this forum, or e-mail me at "arvig@aol.com=<BR>"=20<BR>if you wish to continue this.<BR><BR>Evan Thomsen<BR><BR><BR><BR>=20<BR><BR>- --part1_9a.ee53063.279947c6_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/html; charset="ISO-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3>Michael Daumen "daumen@mi=<BR>ndspring.com" writes this in part:<BR><BR><BR><BR>&amp;gt;Please bear with a first-ever post.<BR><BR><BR><BR>I was hoping y'all had thoughts about the spread of Imperial tech throug=<BR>hout<BR><BR>the settled galaxy.=A0 How could it be possible in the CT/GURPS Imperium=<BR>or<BR><BR>similar-tech organizations that tech levels could sink as far down as<BR><BR>pre-Industrial?=A0 &amp;lt;<BR><BR><BR><BR>Well, this is my second-ever post, so please bear back with me. &amp;nbsp;:)=<BR>&amp;nbsp;I=20<BR><BR>personally always looked at it this way, take a look at present day Eart=<BR>h. &amp;nbsp;<BR><BR>One could argue that Earth right now in the early 21st century (circa AD=<BR>=20<BR><BR>2001) Earth is probably at a CT tech level of roughly 8. &amp;nbsp;Fine, but=<BR>on Earth=20<BR><BR>itself, there's at least a few nations that if one only counts local=20<BR><BR>manufacturing level, are at a CT tech level of 5 or 6, and some sections=<BR>that=20<BR><BR>are even lower, look at a tribe in the Amazon rain forest for instance.=20=<BR>&amp;nbsp;Yet=20<BR><BR>most of the lower tech nations have international class airports, access=<BR>to=20<BR><BR>high tech goods and companies like UPS, Fed-Ex and others in which to or=<BR>der=20<BR><BR>more, communication from television and radio to the Internet, and so fo=<BR>rth. &amp;nbsp;<BR><BR>When one sees that even on just one planet a spread of two to three tech=<BR>=20<BR><BR>levels, even when it has extensive communications networks, having tech=20<BR><BR>levels all the way from zero to 15 in the CT Imperium isn't all that odd=<BR>. &amp;nbsp;<BR><BR><BR><BR>Michael, feel free to respond via this forum, or e-mail me at "arvig@aol=<BR>.com"=20<BR><BR>if you wish to continue this.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Evan Thomsen<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>&amp;nbsp;</FONT><BR><BR>- --part1_9a.ee53063.279947c6_boundary--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 10:45:47 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Okay, the millennium came early.<BR><BR>LOL...I kind of imagined this with a lazy, folky guitar playing over the<BR>whole thing :) Most impressive, E.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Kenji Schwarz [mailto:schwarz@fas.harvard.edu]<BR>&gt; Sent: 31 December 2000 03:24<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Okay, the millennium came early.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 'nother filk for youse.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Details are probably all wrong, but I haven't been following close, <BR>&gt; I'm afraid to say.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; ---------------------------------<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; KENNETH BEARDEN: Okay, TML; you're my little test subjects, so I have <BR>&gt; to show you how to improve on a Traveller.&nbsp; This is called KB3. It <BR>&gt; counts your stats fully, just like your skills!; you roll these dice <BR>&gt; and count them up like this, and you sing this song:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; I have a better system,<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; No matter what they say.<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Unless you're dead and buried,<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; With KB you shall play.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Oh, KB, KB, KB<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; No matter what they say<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; KB, KB, KB<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; With KB you shall play.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Now you try it, TML.&nbsp; Just roll dice equal to your stat minus half <BR>&gt; the odd-numbered count of skill levels, against a secret dice I roll, <BR>&gt; and subtract the number of the E-dice, like this!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; TML:&nbsp; (incomprehensible muttering)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; TIMOTHY LITTLE: Hey, what the hell are you doing?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; BEARDEN;&nbsp; Oh, hey, Timothy, we're perfecting KB3.&nbsp; You wanna help?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; LITTLE: Suuuure!<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Here's a funny system<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Design prob'ly took one day<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; And I'm not gonna play with it<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; 'Till E-dice go away.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; BEAREN:&nbsp; Hey!!! Shut your mouth, math geek!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; LITTLE:<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Stats<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Don't help you aim.<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Stats<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; That's why they're lame.<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; BEARDEN<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Stats&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; KB, KB, KB<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Don't help you aim.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; No matter what they say<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Stats.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; KB, KB, KB<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; That's why they're lame.&nbsp; &nbsp; My system you shall play.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; JAMES JENSEN:&nbsp; What's going on?&nbsp; Oh... it's that KB3 thing.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; LITTLE:&nbsp; It's soooo realistic.&nbsp; You throw all these dice and subtract <BR>&gt; a bunch more depending on another dice throw the referee makes, then <BR>&gt; you compare them.&nbsp; I could be doing arithmetic all day!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; JENSEN:&nbsp; Let me try.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; I'll try<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; To make it work.<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; I checked;<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; These numbers suck.<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; BEARDEN<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; I'll try &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Oh, KB, KB, KB<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; To make it work&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; No matter what they say<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; I checked;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; KB, KB, KB<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; These numbers suck.&nbsp;&nbsp; My system you shall play<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; LITTLE<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; I'll try &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Oh, KB, KB, KB<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; To make it work&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; No matter what they say&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Stats<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; I checked;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; KB, KB, KB&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Don't <BR>&gt; help you aim<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; These numbers suck.&nbsp;&nbsp; My system you shall play.&nbsp;&nbsp; Stats<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; I'll try &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Oh, KB, KB, KB&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That's why <BR>&gt; they're lame.<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; To make it work&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; No matter what they say&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Stats<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; I checked;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; KB, KB, KB&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Don't <BR>&gt; help you aim<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; These numbers suck.&nbsp;&nbsp; My system you shall play.&nbsp;&nbsp; Stats<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That's why <BR>&gt; they're lame.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; DOUG BERRY:&nbsp; Hello, guys!&nbsp; You're all testing a new task resolution <BR>&gt; system! Isn't&nbsp; that great?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; LITTLE:&nbsp; Oh, yes, Mr. Berry, it's sooo very statistically sound!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; BERRY:<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Now when you learn<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; To work penguins in<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; You'll know<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Why keyboards will never win<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; (Keep rolling more...)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; ---------------------------<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Well, you get the idea.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Will only finish this if no one is preemptively inspired.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Kenji<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 22:51:23 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Please bear with a first-ever post.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I was hoping y'all had thoughts about the spread of Imperial tech throughout<BR>&gt; the settled galaxy.&nbsp; How could it be possible in the CT/GURPS Imperium or<BR>&gt; similar-tech organizations that tech levels could sink as far down as<BR>&gt; pre-Industrial?&nbsp; In the absence of a prime directive, any lower-tech world<BR>&gt; frequented enough by starfarers would mob the most dilapidated free trader<BR>&gt; that limped into the system. <BR><BR>Doesn't necessarily happen that way here on earth. Otherwise we'd not<BR>have huge areas still at the animal power level. <BR><BR>What *will* happen is that high tech gadgets the locals can afford and<BR>want will spread. <BR><BR>Thus, even isolated villages had radios, and now have telephones. <BR><BR>&gt; And if the world has any starport, it would be<BR>&gt; extremely hard to prevent the leaching of higher-tech equipment across the<BR>&gt; XT line.&nbsp; What are some solutions to this seeming enigma?&nbsp; More orbital-only<BR>&gt; starports than meets the eye (Dad to tot on a TL3 world: "that's Deneb,<BR>&gt; that's Arcturus, that's the stardemon that can zap you from heaven")?&nbsp; Or<BR>&gt; generally higher tech levels that starport modifiers would indicate?<BR><BR>The answer is rather more simple than may have occured to you. <BR><BR>What are the locals going to *pay* for this high tech stuff with? <BR><BR>They need to have something that is valuable to the high tech folks.<BR>Either to trade directly for the high tech stuff, or that they can<BR>trade for currency which they can then use to buy the high tech stuff.<BR><BR>And don't forget that they have to buy consumables as well (gasoline,<BR>batteries, spare parts, etc). <BR><BR>So you'll have a *lot* of high tech stuff that won't be worth the<BR>price (most vehicles). And other items that the locals *are* willing to<BR>pay for. Like radios, weapons, etc.<BR><BR>And don't forget that TL is (mostly) what the locals can produce,<BR>except for overpriced import stuff.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 00:23:28 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Okay, for you experts out there:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; I have a high-gravity world (about 1.3 G at the surface) with a dense<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; oxynitrogen atmosphere.&nbsp; Total atmospheric pressure is about 1.75<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; SNIP<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; The real problem is that leaving the planet will involve hours of<BR>&gt;&gt; decompression, as you've been doing the equivalent of "saturation<BR>&gt;&gt; diving" for days to weeks.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; SNIP<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; But in a typical starship would this be an issue?&nbsp; The whole ship could be<BR>&gt; used as a decompression chamber over the course of travel time to<BR>&gt; jump point and during jump.<BR><BR>Sure. *IF* you do it that way. but a recently arrived ship may just<BR>debark passengers into a "low pressure" transients hotel were they can<BR>compress to local pressure quickly, and decompress at their leisure. <BR><BR>There are valid engineering reasons why you might want to avoid running<BR>the ship's internal pressure above a certain value. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 07:08:26 -0600<BR>From: "Shadowcat" &lt;res053z0@gte.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Honor Harrington Goodies<BR><BR>I have a Royal Manticoran Navy ballcap and a Honor Harrington <BR>"Battle Tour" t-shirt, they are nice quality, and look great.<BR>I heard that somebody showed up at Darkover in 99 dressed in a <BR>Sphinxian Forestry Service uniform, complete with a plushtoy <BR>Treecat... I want one! unfortunately I understand it was handmade<BR>and one of a kind...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, Jan 20 2001 0:10:20 GMT+1100<BR>From: robocon@ozemail.com.au<BR>Subject: Re : Quick Environmental Question (longish)<BR><BR>Re : Quick Environmental Question (longish)<BR><BR>Jon Zeigler wrote :-<BR>&gt; I suspect that an unprotected human on this world will suffer<BR>&gt; nitrogen narcosis, but I have no idea how quickly it will set in,<BR>&gt; how intense it will be, or whether there will be actual toxicity<BR>&gt; over time.<BR><BR>The 'bends' (decompression sickness, DCS) will occur if the<BR>tissue:blood partial pressure gradient for nitrogen exceeds 2:1.<BR>Blood equilibrates with alveolar and ambient air rapidly (~1 minute).<BR>So it can happen in a wide variety of situations.<BR><BR>Nitrogen narcosis is very similar to ethanol intoxication, so rules<BR>should be easy to adapt.<BR><BR>Commercial diving regulations limit you to a depth of 50m breathing<BR>air. This implies a partial pressure for nitrogen of<BR>(0.79*50/9.8)~4 ATA ;<BR>I suspect that this represents an ED50 for nitrogen (causes<BR>moderate narcosis in 50% of population) ; the median anaesthetic <BR>concentration (minimum alveolar concentration, MAC) is about<BR>6 ATA.<BR><BR>&gt; Even after (say) hours of strenuous work under heavy gravity?<BR>The effects of gravity will be more significant than that of the<BR>atmosphere.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; The real problem is that leaving the planet will involve hours of<BR>&gt;&gt; decompression, as you've been doing the equivalent of "saturation<BR>&gt;&gt; diving" for days to weeks.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Good point. How damaging is it if this step is skipped? Will a person<BR>&gt; in this situation who was in moderately good health die of the bends<BR>&gt; rarely? Occasionally? Frequently? Almost invariably?<BR><BR>With appropriate treatment (recompression within 6 hours),<BR>DCS is survivable almost 100% of the time,<BR>in the absence of massive gas embolism causing cardiac arrest, in <BR>which case mortality exceeds 75% at 24 hours post incident.<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote :-<BR>&gt; Actually, given the pressures stated, there's no good reason to use<BR>&gt; earth normal pressures in the habitats. And lots of reasons *not* to.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; At *worst*, they'd be at the same pressure as the outside, but with a<BR>&gt; different gas mix.<BR>I agree. Pressure differentials will require significant (de)compression<BR>times.<BR><BR>E.g. for the International Space Station, 14 hours of preparation<BR>are required for EVA (1 ATA of air -&gt; 0.3 ATA of 95% O2). It is expected<BR>that the incidence of DCS will be 2% per person day of EVA, even<BR>with this protocol.<BR><BR><BR>Jon, I hope this info is of some use.<BR>The problems with all the nitrates, nitrites and higher oxides of nitrogen<BR>in this world's environment await.<BR><BR>;-)<BR><BR>Robert O'Connor<BR>Medico, Gamer <BR>This message was sent through MyMail http://www.mymail.com.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 08:15:36 -0500<BR>From: michael stasica &lt;stosh@sympatico.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; Okay, for you experts out there:<BR><BR>&gt; SNIP<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; But in a typical starship would this be an issue?&nbsp; The whole ship could be<BR>&gt; &gt; used as a decompression chamber over the course of travel time to<BR>&gt; &gt; jump point and during jump.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Sure. *IF* you do it that way. but a recently arrived ship may just<BR>&gt; debark passengers into a "low pressure" transients hotel were they can<BR>&gt; compress to local pressure quickly, and decompress at their leisure.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; There are valid engineering reasons why you might want to avoid running<BR>&gt; the ship's internal pressure above a certain value.<BR><BR>Yes, after I sent this off I had a scary thought about being jumped by some<BR>ethically<BR>challenged merchants on the way outsystem.&nbsp; Course the pressure might be an<BR>advantage<BR>in a boarding situation, but a liability in a battle.<BR><BR>But then this method may make it easier to don Vacc Suits, depending on YTU and<BR>whether<BR>or not the Vacc Suits are full pressure or not.<BR><BR>Michael<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 10:52:34 -0500<BR>From: Leigh Smith &lt;tenryuu@erols.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3535<BR><BR>&gt; Shrug.&nbsp; I doubt the plasma would actually be that effective as an EMP bomb,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; and the typical plasma temperatures for traveller weapons doesn't produce<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; radiation worthy of note.&nbsp; What you described is in fact an explosive bullet,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; it's just probably a very inefficient one.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>What people who consider this need to keep in mind is that "plasma" is just a fancy way of saying<BR>"ionized gas". Those "Tesla balls" (you know, the funky balls that you touch and the "lightning"<BR>inside follows your fingers and your hair stands on end) are actually plasma discharges.&nbsp; So are<BR>lightning bolts (i.e., the visible "bolt" is a line of plasma caused by the ionization of the<BR>atmosphere caused by the electron charge difference either within the cloud or, in the case of<BR>cloud-ground bolts, between the bottom of the cloud and the ground).&nbsp; The main difference is in<BR>the electron-volt capacity of the discharge.&nbsp; Lightning from thunderstorms can release energy in<BR>the MeV (millions of volts) and the bolts can be up to 3 miles in length.&nbsp; BTW, a good site for<BR>information on lightning is http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/k/j/kjk176/Lightning.html<BR><BR>Anyone who's seen those "lightning strike" weather maps should know that they're generated by<BR>listening to the radio discharge that a lightning bolt makes.&nbsp; You can hear this yourself by<BR>listening to an AM radio station during a thunderstorm.&nbsp; Even when a lightning strike doesn't<BR>directly hit a power station it does tremendous interruption in power transmission due to the EMP<BR>effects of the discharge.<BR><BR>And remember that "thunder" is actually caused by the tremendous expansion of the atmosphere when<BR>the plasma "ignites".&nbsp; Even a near miss by a plasma bolt should do percussive damage to the target<BR>a la a grenade.<BR><BR>The biggest drawback to a "plasma" weapon would be making the discharge occur in a straight line.<BR>That is where a laser as a "pre-generator" would be necessary to ensure a straight discharge.&nbsp; The<BR>laser would fire and cause excitation of the molocules in an atmosphere in a straight line to the<BR>target, then a large EM discharge would cause the conversion of these excited atoms to plasma.<BR>So, a plasma weapon would actually be a two-phase weapon using a laser "pump" and then some form<BR>of EM discharge.&nbsp; Ironically, I'd think that, rather than being dangerous to use in an environment<BR>with an atmosphere, a plasma weapon would be damn near impossible to use in an environment withOUT<BR>an atmosphere to ionize.<BR><BR>As for ship-mounted plasma weapons, I get the impression that they are more in the line of linear<BR>accellerators create a small ball of plasma and then use large magnets to accellerate the plasma<BR>toward the target.&nbsp; The fact that plasma is, by definition, composed of charged particles, it<BR>would be relativly easy to deflect by the use of directed magnetic fields.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Leigh Smith<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 08:06:13 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Mark Cook &lt;markc@peak.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>Jon F. Zeigler &lt;JFZeigler@aol.com&gt; writes:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; The real problem is that leaving the planet will involve hours of<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; decompression, as you've been doing the equivalent of "saturation<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; diving" for days to weeks.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Good point.&nbsp; How damaging is it if this step is skipped?&nbsp; Will a person<BR>&gt; in this situation who was in moderately good health die of the bends<BR>&gt; rarely?&nbsp; Occasionally?&nbsp; Frequently?&nbsp; Almost invariably?<BR><BR>I can answer that. First, a little background: I've been a recreational<BR>diver for over 25 years. I'm a trained rescue diver and (in my youth)<BR>I dove for Lane County Search &amp; Rescue.<BR><BR>Regarding Decompression Sickness (AKA DCS, "the bends"), the severity<BR>of response is directly related to the degree of saturation.&nbsp; DCS is<BR>caused by super saturation of nitrogen into body tissue, followed by<BR>rapid (uncontrolled) desaturation.&nbsp; Nitrogen gas forms bubbles in<BR>the body (location varies) and damage occurs.&nbsp; (A Note: nitrogen is<BR>more easily absorbed by fat than by muscle, so overweight people are<BR>at a higher risk.)<BR><BR>Bubbles can form anywhere in the body, but statistically tend to<BR>migrate to skeletal articulation pockets (joints).&nbsp; This can force<BR>the joint open, causing severe localized pain and (potentially)<BR>permanent damage.&nbsp; Bubbles also frequently form in the interstices<BR>of the spinal column, which can lead to nerve damage, paralysis,<BR>and death from asphyxiation (paralyzed respirator nerves.)<BR><BR>If the exposure is severe enough, youth and health are no protection,<BR>although a young, healthy person will typically exhibit a lower<BR>severity of onset than an overweight or elderly person, given exposure<BR>to identical environments.&nbsp; Note: women are more susceptible than<BR>men, if all other factors (age and weight) are equal, due to a higher<BR>percentage of total adipose tissue.<BR><BR>Onset of DCS can occur immediately or up to 12 hrs. following rapid<BR>decompression, although increased N2 saturation will tend to decrease<BR>the delay of onset.<BR><BR>Symptoms are paralysis, severe pain (typically in the joints), ringing<BR>in the ears, aphasia, loss of coordination, fatigue, weakness, numbness,<BR>respirator distress, itching, and unconsciousness.&nbsp; (On one occasion,<BR>I witnessed DCS trigger a violent episode of the hiccups.&nbsp; The gas<BR>bubbles forming in the spine irritated the phrenic nerve.)<BR><BR>Treatment can include IV (D5W or Ringers Solution), administration<BR>of oxygen, injectable anti-infammatory corticosteroids, and<BR>recompression in a hyperbaric chamber.&nbsp; Prompt hyperbaric treatment<BR>can completely (in most cases) eliminate the DCS episode, while<BR>the other forms of treatment exist primarily to decease the severity<BR>of the episode.<BR><BR>In game terms, if a severe cause of the bends is indicated, and no<BR>treatment is given, roll 2d6:<BR><BR>&nbsp; Results<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; 2-4:&nbsp; Death<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; 5-11: Permanent paralysis or joint damage. (The lower the number,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; the greater the severity or extent of damage.)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; 12:&nbsp;&nbsp; Full recovery.<BR><BR>Hope this helps.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - Mark C.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Instructor, Willamette Small Arms Academy<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; EOD, U.S.M.C. 1st MarDiv (Camp Pendleton), Class of '75<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Full-Auto Director, Albany Rifle &amp; Pistol Club, Albany, OR<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; NRA (Life), GOA (Life), SAF (Life), CCRKBA (Life)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Front Sight First Family member #1<BR><BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 64,999,987 firearm owners killed no one yesterday.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Somehow, it didn't make the news.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 16:22:26 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3535<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Leigh Smith [mailto:tenryuu@erols.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: 19 January 2001 15:53<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3535<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Shrug.&nbsp; I doubt the plasma would actually be that effective <BR>&gt; as an EMP bomb,<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; and the typical plasma temperatures for traveller weapons <BR>&gt; doesn't produce<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; radiation worthy of note.&nbsp; What you described is in fact <BR>&gt; an explosive bullet,<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; it's just probably a very inefficient one.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What people who consider this need to keep in mind is that <BR>&gt; "plasma" is just a fancy way of saying<BR>&gt; "ionized gas". Those "Tesla balls" (you know, the funky balls <BR>&gt; that you touch and the "lightning"<BR>&gt; inside follows your fingers and your hair stands on end) are <BR>&gt; actually plasma discharges. <BR><BR>I think that those are called 'Plasma balls' and that they contain small<BR>Tesla coils. The thing you touch that makes you hair stand on end is a Van<BR>der Graff generator.<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 16:42:14 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Prop Hivers (was:&nbsp; Traveller survivors)<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; In-Reply-To: &lt;PIEFIHNLNBEMHOILBEBPEEBNCFAA.jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Greetings dear hearts, especially Jesse.<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Stop tempting me, you lot. First of all it's "Come to <BR>&gt; Oregon and we'll let<BR>&gt; &gt; you shoot machine guns" and now this....<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Go to most US states, and you can buy pistols in K-Mart, and <BR>&gt; the fun stuff<BR>&gt; in sporting goods stores. Connecticut is next door to NY, the cheap<BR>&gt; destination for us Brits, and a good place for finding <BR>&gt; responsible firearms<BR>&gt; places, and organised hunting (is that a dirty word in the UK now?).<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>With dogs, yes...unless you're a cabinet minister and managed to be 'too<BR>busy' to actually vote :)<BR>For non-Brits: The Foxhunting bill is a very contentious issue and the PM<BR>and most of the cabinet were publicly in favour of requiring a licence for<BR>hunts or an outright ban. A ban was voted on, but half the cabinet did not<BR>vote, either because they suddenly had urgent business in Ireland or through<BR>abstension. It'll probably get overturned in the Lords anyway :(<BR><BR>Dean<BR>For the record: I like shooting guns, but only at non-living targets.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 16:44:05 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;_Penguin Boy_<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;by Douglas Berry<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;to the tune of: _Iron Man_ by Black Sabbath<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;I AM PENGUIN BOY!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; BWAH!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Oh, dear.... this outburst of laughter is gonna take some <BR>&gt; explaining to the <BR>&gt; person who just walked in.... =)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Hrm... if I ever see you at a convention, should I be on the <BR>&gt; lookout for <BR>&gt; someone wearing, say, a tuxedo...? =)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; ---<BR>&gt; ==============================================================<BR>&gt; Jonathan McDermott, CNE/MCSE&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; NOSPAMcaraig@mindspring.com<BR>&gt; System Administrator&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http:\\caraig.home.mindspring.com<BR>&gt; ------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR><BR>Or a Linux T-shirt? :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 09:21:18 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question on Jump<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson writes:<BR><BR>&gt; But you can often make good guesses.<BR><BR>Sure, but even without setting up deep space depots there's typically 3-5<BR>useful locations within a planetary system, sufficiently separated that it's<BR>hard to reach one from another before the enemy can refuel.&nbsp; Multiply by<BR>the number of systems in reach, and interception just isn't very likely.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 09:25:26 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson writes:<BR><BR>&gt; The answer is rather more simple than may have occured to you. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What are the locals going to *pay* for this high tech stuff with? <BR>&lt;snip&gt; <BR>&gt; So you'll have a *lot* of high tech stuff that won't be worth the<BR>&gt; price (most vehicles). And other items that the locals *are* willing to<BR>&gt; pay for. Like radios, weapons, etc.<BR><BR>Note that a natural consequence of this is that there are certain low-tech<BR>industries which will die out completely, because for practical purposes<BR>'low-tech' == 'poor'.&nbsp; For example, you may well see low-tech pickup trucks,<BR>and even low-tech pickup trucks which have been converted by bolting plates<BR>of armor on them, but you won't see low-tech tanks or fighters, because a<BR>higher-tech weapon system is typically _still_ a better bargain.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 12:44:41 -0500<BR>From: Laning &lt;laning@wizard.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re:Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>Frank Herbert is dead.&nbsp; There is nothing literary about Tom Robbins (IMHO).<BR>Curious info about the Norwegian fishermen, but just how does one gather<BR>accurate statistics about consumption of highly illegal substances?&nbsp; "Ya,<BR>sure by gosh and by golly, Sven uses a lot.&nbsp; Even more than Lars.&nbsp; But I<BR>use twice as much as Sven."&nbsp; As Olie, Sven, and Lars wink at each other<BR>while the earnest young survey taker scribbles excited notes on his clipboard.<BR><BR>Ideally, the monolith should have appeared in an excavation in the center<BR>of Tycho crater on the moon.&nbsp; But, I grudgingly admit there might be<BR>logistical obstacles to carrying out that prank.<BR><BR>Seattle.&nbsp; The thought of Bill Gates being granted a quantum leap of new<BR>powers over the rest of humanity makes me tremble in fear.&nbsp; Almost makes<BR>you wonder what Norman Spinrad would do with that story idea.<BR><BR>ObTrav:&nbsp; Just how much of what the old, veteran scouts tell you they've<BR>experienced "out there" should you really believe?<BR><BR>- -Laning<BR>Political Correctness Disclaimer:&nbsp; I apologize to anyone offended by the<BR>gross and poorly conceived caricatures of Norwegian-American names and<BR>speech dialect.&nbsp; I'm not even sure whether the names I chose are Norwegian<BR>or Swedish or what in origin.&nbsp; It is a poorly constructed, but hopefully a<BR>funny image of the old, immigrant fishermen stringing along the credulous<BR>social worker about some tall tale just to pass the time.<BR><BR>On Thu, 4 Jan 2001 16:41:20 -0500, Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>wrote:<BR>&gt;Subject: RE: Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;At 3:18 PM -0800 1/3/01, William Lane wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;good question what relevance does Seattle have?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Well, within the immediate vicinity:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Home of Microsoft;<BR>&gt;Home of Boeing;<BR>&gt;Home of Amazon.com;<BR>&gt;Home of Weyerhauser;<BR>&gt;Home of the largest Muzak programming and broadcasting company in the world;<BR>&gt;Home of a buncha Trident subs;<BR>&gt;World's largest giant octopodes;<BR><BR>&gt;World's largest concentration of breeding-age millionaires;<BR>&gt;Abodes of Frank Herbert, Tom Robbins, and various other literary luminaries;<BR>&gt;A neighborhood of elderly Norwegian fishermen that also in 1992 had <BR>&gt;the highest per-capita consumption of black tar heroin in the States;<BR>&gt;World's largest toaster museum;<BR>&gt;Home of an annual international Spam-sculpting competition;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Slightly further away, we have the Hanford reservation -- largest and <BR>&gt;most toxic nuclear/chemical waste facility on the planet, and (IIRC), <BR>&gt;still the largest producer of plutonium and assorted goodies. <BR>&gt;(Tourists sometimes get the Hanford nuclear reservation confused with <BR>&gt;the nearby/overlapping Yakama Indian reservation... coincidence? I <BR>&gt;think not.)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I, for one, think teaching them to use chunks of pig to beat each <BR>&gt;other to death would be a step in the right direction.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3538<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-ye04.mx.aol.com (rly-ye04.mail.aol.com [172.18.151.201]) by air-ye02.mail.aol.com (v77.35) with ESMTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 12:47:17 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-ye04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 12:46:30 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id MAA55073;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 12:45:50 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 19 Jan 2001 12:45:01 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id MAA55023<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 12:45:01 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 12:45:01 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101191745.MAA55023@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3538<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3539</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/19/01 3:03:46 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 19 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3539<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Starports and Tech Levels<BR>Re: Starports and Tech Levels<BR>RE: Starports and tech levels<BR>HG Stats<BR>Re:Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>RE: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR>RE: Question on Jump<BR>RE: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>BITS Adventure?<BR>RE: BITS Adventure?<BR>Starports and tech levels<BR>A.I. (was Re: Psionic Institutes and Out-of-Print Games)<BR>Mercenaries (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3538)<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 11:14:19 +1100<BR>From: "Katharine Whitchurch" &lt;katts@globalfreeway.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and Tech Levels<BR><BR>&gt; From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Starports and tech levels<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Please bear with a first-ever post.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I was hoping y'all had thoughts about the spread of Imperial tech<BR>throughout<BR>&gt; the settled galaxy.&nbsp; How could it be possible in the CT/GURPS Imperium or<BR>&gt; similar-tech organizations that tech levels could sink as far down as<BR>&gt; pre-Industrial?&nbsp; In the absence of a prime directive, any lower-tech world<BR>&gt; frequented enough by starfarers would mob the most dilapidated free trader<BR>&gt; that limped into the system.&nbsp; And if the world has any starport, it would<BR>be<BR>&gt; extremely hard to prevent the leaching of higher-tech equipment across the<BR>&gt; XT line.&nbsp; What are some solutions to this seeming enigma?&nbsp; More<BR>orbital-only<BR>&gt; starports than meets the eye (Dad to tot on a TL3 world: "that's Deneb,<BR>&gt; that's Arcturus, that's the stardemon that can zap you from heaven")?&nbsp; Or<BR>&gt; generally higher tech levels that starport modifiers would indicate?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mike Daumen<BR><BR>Opinions differ on this, but for my money TL is usually the 'normal' level<BR>of tech that the planet can produce and maintain locally (you dont have to<BR>be completely consistent with this - I can imagine the same 'what is TL'<BR>debates happening in the IISS). It is the 'usual' level of technology you<BR>will encounter on the planet. It is not going to be the technology that the<BR>secret police, palace guards, good hospitals etc are going to have access<BR>to.<BR><BR>The problem is not in the fact that the locals can mob the nearest Free<BR>Trader and buy themselves half a dozen aircars and a Greeble Processing<BR>Plant. The problem is how do they pay for it, the spare parts and the<BR>technicians ... Imperial non-intervention is very much a two-edged sword in<BR>this, and the Imperium does not try to develop the worlds of the Imperium<BR>(that reaction to that idea was part of what led Dulinor down the path of<BR>rebellion).<BR><BR>If you assume that economic development is not a 'normal' process, then you<BR>can explain the vast TL discrepencies within the Imperium - they arent TL3<BR>because it's what they want, they are TL3 because every time someone sets up<BR>a TL4 factory, it gets undercut by Free Traders selling TL4 widgets for less<BR>than the cost of local production (economies of scale and all that). The TL4<BR>factory then goes broke. And 80% of the graduates of the Technical College<BR>go to the starport and sign up as Third Assistant Drive Hands on Free<BR>Traders, in order to earn hard currency to send home.<BR><BR>Add to this the sources of foriegn earnings (mining deposits, the nice<BR>tourist hotels etc) being under the control of off-world commercial<BR>interests, then you may well get worlds that cannot afford to develop -<BR>except of course for the bits that are profitable to do so. I can easily see<BR>'enclaves' of high technology, as develop in the Third World today (eg<BR>Freeport mine is probably TL7. The rest of West Papua is probably TL3. Tops.<BR>With some TL5-6).<BR><BR>Ian Whitchurch<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 10:20:09 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and Tech Levels<BR><BR>Katharine Whitchurch writes:<BR><BR>&gt; Opinions differ on this, but for my money TL is usually the 'normal' level<BR>&gt; of tech that the planet can produce and maintain locally (you dont have to<BR>&gt; be completely consistent with this - I can imagine the same 'what is TL'<BR>&gt; debates happening in the IISS). It is the 'usual' level of technology you<BR>&gt; will encounter on the planet. It is not going to be the technology that the<BR>&gt; secret police, palace guards, good hospitals etc are going to have access<BR>&gt; to.<BR><BR>I've wound up deciding that TL is basically a measure of wealth, since in <BR>practice a poorer society will be lower-tech.<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; If you assume that economic development is not a 'normal' process, then you<BR>&gt; can explain the vast TL discrepencies within the Imperium - they arent TL3<BR>&gt; because it's what they want, they are TL3 because every time someone sets<BR>&gt; up a TL4 factory, it gets undercut by Free Traders selling TL4 widgets for<BR>&gt; less than the cost of local production (economies of scale and all that).<BR><BR>Well, no.&nbsp; Free Traders almost certainly won't bother to sell TL4 widgets,<BR>the profit margin is too low, and Free Traders don't really have any <BR>percentage in being actively hostile to development.&nbsp; The problem is that<BR>there simply isn't the capital available to _build_ the TL4 factory.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 13:25:00 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Michael Daumen writes:<BR>&gt;Please bear with a first-ever post.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Always good to get another contributor!<BR><BR>&gt;I was hoping y'all had thoughts about the spread of Imperial tech throughout<BR>&gt;the settled galaxy.&nbsp; How could it be possible in the CT/GURPS Imperium or<BR>&gt;similar-tech organizations that tech levels could sink as far down as<BR>&gt;pre-Industrial?&nbsp; In the absence of a prime directive, any lower-tech world<BR>&gt;frequented enough by starfarers would mob the most dilapidated free trader<BR>&gt;that limped into the system.&nbsp; And if the world has any starport, it would be<BR>&gt;extremely hard to prevent the leaching of higher-tech equipment across the<BR>&gt;XT line.&nbsp; What are some solutions to this seeming enigma?&nbsp; More orbital-only<BR>&gt;starports than meets the eye (Dad to tot on a TL3 world: "that's Deneb,<BR>&gt;that's Arcturus, that's the stardemon that can zap you from heaven")?&nbsp; Or<BR>&gt;generally higher tech levels that starport modifiers would indicate?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Yup, that can be a problem to explain.&nbsp; First, however, you have to<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; define tech levels.&nbsp; This has been a topic of discussion here on the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; TML from time to time, and not everyone agrees on the details.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Some define tech level (TL) by the artifacts produced locally.&nbsp; Others<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; are more flexible, defining TL by the artifacts produced or serviced<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; locally.&nbsp; I take TL to indicate the artifacts that are generally in use<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; and available locally.&nbsp; In all cases, bother higher and lower TL<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; artifacts are likely to be present to at least some degree.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Although some worlds might be considered to have sunk in TL<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; while in contact with the interstellar community, it is more likely that<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; their TL was already low before trade relations were established.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; This may be because the world is home to a race that has not<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; developed interstellar technology (perhaps a world seeded with<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; humans by the Ancients), or a world that has suffered some major<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; disaster that "knocked society back to the stone age" (if you can<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; accept that sort of thing) while the world is cut off from the rest of<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; the universe.&nbsp; Maybe the world is populated by a semi-intelligent<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; race of aliens incapable of progressing past a low TL.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Then there is the issue of staying at a lower TL after contact is<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; established with those high TL neighbours.&nbsp; Poor worlds may not<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; have the resources to import high TL equipment.&nbsp; Local politics<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; may resist advancement for its own sake, or just the import of<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; things and ideas.&nbsp; The world may have been contacted recently,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; and has not had time to advance in TL.&nbsp; The population may be<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; too low to support higher TL.&nbsp; Their may be an embargo enforced<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; by nearby worlds.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; OK, I'll stop running on.&nbsp; Hope this helps.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 12:33:52 -0600<BR>From: Loren Wiseman &lt;lkw@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: HG Stats<BR><BR>I need a kind soul to e-mail me the High Guard profile for the modular<BR>cutter. PLease sent it to both gdwgames@aol.com and lkw@io.com.<BR><BR>Thanks!<BR><BR><BR><BR>Loren Wiseman<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Traveller Line Manager/Traveller Guru-in-Residence<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Editor, Journal of the Travellers' Aid Society&nbsp; http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; SJ Games<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; lkw@io.com http://www.io.com/~lkw/<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (512) 447-7866 VOX<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (512) 447-1144 FAX<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 10:39:15 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re:Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>&gt;Curious info about the Norwegian fishermen, but just how does one gather<BR>&gt;accurate statistics about consumption of highly illegal substances?<BR><BR>We have ways 8^)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 11:13:59<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>Mark C. wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;What *I* wanna know is how come Jesse keeps getting the credit for<BR>&gt;*MY* machine guns!?! :^)<BR><BR>Hey, I know they're your weapons.&nbsp; I could spend an enjoyable weekend just<BR>helping to clean some of the things you have in that safe.<BR><BR>Now, if y'all only had a good distance range.&nbsp; I might be getting ahold of<BR>a sniper-modified M-1903A1 Springfield soon, and once I get the sights<BR>zeroed, it would be fun to show you, Jesse, Tod, and any other interested<BR>parties just what shooting is all about!<BR><BR>Three successive rounds through the same 2" diameter target, from the prone<BR>supported position, at 200m, or I buy dinner.<BR><BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>Embrace Fascism.&nbsp; &nbsp; The uniforms look cool<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 11:24:43<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR><BR>At 04:44 PM 1/19/2001 -0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Hrm... if I ever see you at a convention, should I be on the <BR>&gt;&gt; lookout for someone wearing, say, a tuxedo...? =)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Or a Linux T-shirt? :)<BR><BR>As a public service:<BR><BR>How To Find Me At A Convention.<BR><BR>A. Follow the trail of empty Coke cans.<BR><BR>B. Check the schedule for any hard-science panels.&nbsp; I will be there, even<BR>if I'm supposed to be doing another panel at the same time.<BR><BR>C. Listen for the sounds of a luecture being given by someone with a fairly<BR>deep voice.&nbsp; Could be about anything.. space-based industries, the<BR>political roots of the Vietnam debacle, Genghis Kahn.. I'll be the one<BR>giving it.<BR><BR>D. Find Kirsten.&nbsp; If it is anywhere near a mealtime, I will show up in five<BR>minutes, and announce "screw the plans, we're going to eat *now*"<BR><BR>E. Get up at 0600.&nbsp; I'll be the only other person in the hotel that is<BR>moving.&nbsp; We'll do breakfast.<BR><BR>F. Check the Game Room.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 15:17:22 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question on Jump<BR><BR>William Lane writes:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;I have always been under the understanding that if a Jump 2 ship<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;jumps 2 par secs it took a week in time. and that a jump 6 ship<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;could do a 2 parsec jump in say a 3rd of a week. is this true? or<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;is this wrong?<BR>&gt;&gt;Wrong is a strong word.&nbsp; :) The rules (at least in CT) stipulate<BR>&gt;&gt;that one jump takes one week, regardless of the distance or the<BR>&gt;&gt;drive<BR>&gt;well please understand. the last time i ran a traveller campain was 1989.<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Don't worry about it, this is a good place to ask questions.&nbsp; I hope<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; that I didn't come across as condesending, that was not my intent.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I should also warn you to take my answers with a grain of salt: I am<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; often wrong myself.&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>&gt;For example at one point in the game Some&nbsp; nasty guys broke into the hanger<BR>&gt;bay their ship was in. the pilot wanted to throttle the engines up and i<BR>&gt;guess fry these guys. in the back of my mind i kept thinking that the<BR>&gt;manuver engines are not like jet engines and they cant be throttled to say<BR>&gt;15% or something.<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I don't recall seeing anyting in CT, but I would certainly allow<BR>variable<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; thrust from maneuver engines.&nbsp; Fry those nasty guys!<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 12:28:28 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>My shooting club leader and I once had a "minute-of-lunch" contest (looser<BR>buys lunch) at the local 100yd range.&nbsp; He was shooting a nice bolt-action<BR>varmint rifle in something like 22-250 (that a caliber??) useing a custom<BR>handload that he'd worked up.&nbsp; I was using my Match AR-15 and plain vanilla<BR>PMC milspec ammo.&nbsp; I still only lost by one eigth of an inch :)&nbsp; I'll use<BR>Tod's AI rifle and go "minute-of-lunch" with you.&nbsp; I enjoy loosi^h^h^h er,<BR>trying, though I might have a chance with that puppy.&nbsp; That thing is<BR>NICE!!!!<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Douglas E. Berry<BR>&gt; Sent: Friday, January 19, 2001 11:14 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mark C. wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;What *I* wanna know is how come Jesse keeps getting the credit for<BR>&gt; &gt;*MY* machine guns!?! :^)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hey, I know they're your weapons.&nbsp; I could spend an enjoyable weekend just<BR>&gt; helping to clean some of the things you have in that safe.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Now, if y'all only had a good distance range.&nbsp; I might be getting ahold of<BR>&gt; a sniper-modified M-1903A1 Springfield soon, and once I get the sights<BR>&gt; zeroed, it would be fun to show you, Jesse, Tod, and any other interested<BR>&gt; parties just what shooting is all about!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Three successive rounds through the same 2" diameter target, from<BR>&gt; the prone<BR>&gt; supported position, at 200m, or I buy dinner.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Embrace Fascism.&nbsp; &nbsp; The uniforms look cool<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 20:31 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;32.f6d99bf.2798f440@aol.com&gt;<BR>Greetings Jeff, and anyone else interested.<BR><BR>Ah, now I have some time to write a bit more (was falling asleep when I <BR>wrote the last comments...).<BR><BR>Nitrogen like any other gas is contained in a dissolved state in the body <BR>in proportion to the surrounding pressure. When you are stablised at a <BR>given pressure, your body becomes saturated, i.e. contains the maximum <BR>amount that it can do at that given pressure. When pressure increases <BR>(e.g. going onto this planet of yours) more nitrogen goes into solution in <BR>the tissues. The higher the pressure gradient between the nitrogen in the <BR>air in your lungs and that in your bloodstream, the faster it dissolves <BR>into your plasma. So as this plasma circulates to body tissues, the <BR>nitrogen pressure in the plasma is greater than that of the tissues and so <BR>it diffuses across into the tissues. Eventually you will reach saturation <BR>again, but this takes several hours. This will not of itself cause you any <BR>problems... while you stay at that pressure.<BR><BR>It's when you reduce the pressure that the fun starts. As the pressure <BR>drops, your tissues become supersaturated, i.e. they contain MORE nitrogen <BR>that they can hold at the ambient pressure, and it begins to dissolve out <BR>back into your blood plasma. You can tolerate this a bit - otherwise <BR>surfacing from a dive would be a problem - but if the pressure gradient <BR>becomes too great, e.g. from a very sudden drop in pressure, decompression <BR>sickness can develop. Bubbles of nitrogen form in the tissues as it tries <BR>to escape faster than the blood can carry it away. (Mind you, very small <BR>bubbles do occur anyway but dissipate before they cause a problem - this <BR>is why you have to wait a while before undertaking a second dive.)<BR><BR>Because these bubbles can literally form anywhere within the body, <BR>decompression sickness is an aliment that can present an array of <BR>symptoms. Also, some people are more susceptible than others (or by, for <BR>example, drinking alcohol just before a pressure change, render themselves <BR>more susceptible - that's one to watch with a bunch of players!) - if you <BR>are fat or getting a bit long in the tooth your body releases nitrogen <BR>more slowly hence the potential for developing a dangerous differential <BR>between nitrogen levels in your tissues and elsewhere. Cold temperatures <BR>or extreme exertion can also cause problems (and excellent plot devices!).<BR><BR>Symptoms do not always appear immediately, over half do not manifest until <BR>more than an hour has elapsed since the pressure decrease. A mild form <BR>involves minor damage to the capillaries in the skin, which makes a nasty <BR>red rash on the skin (usually shoulders and upper chest). That's not <BR>dangerous of itself, but may indicate more severe problems.<BR><BR>About 75% of cases suffer pain in the joints and limbs. Again this is, <BR>although unpleasant, not life-threatening of itself and will ease with <BR>treatmnet. You'll usually find all the problems in the same limb, rather <BR>than, say, both elbows hurting.<BR><BR>However severe problems may result from bubbles affecting the nervous <BR>system. These are thought to be caused by nitrogen bubbles preventing the <BR>flow of blood through the capillaries serving the nervous system, <BR>particularly in the case of spinal cord problems. This causes numbness and <BR>paralysis in the lower extremities which moves upwards.<BR><BR>If the problem is in the brain, you can suffer a stroke - similar to that <BR>caused by an air embolism. You can suffer blurred vision, headaches, <BR>confusion, unconsciousness or even drop dead. <BR><BR>One of the worst problems can be caused in the lungs themselves. If <BR>bubbles form there, they block the blood vessels and cause the blood flow <BR>to back up, the left side of the heart recieves less blood than it should, <BR>and your blood pressure and pulse drops. You will also suffer pain in <BR>breathing and a short, irritated cough; and may feel that you are not <BR>getting enough to breathe. A complete failure of your circulatory system <BR>can result (the heart needs blood itself if it is to keep working).<BR><BR>The main form of treatment is to increase pressure and then lower it again <BR>only far more slowly. This is why sufferers of 'the bends' are put in <BR>hyperbaric chambers. While getting them there, give them pure oxygen. If <BR>your planet has an orbital docking facility, it probably has decompression <BR>chambers for people who encounter problems returning to 'normal' after a <BR>visit to the surface.<BR><BR>An increase in the partial pressures of nitrogen, particularly a sudden <BR>one, can affect the nervous system temporarily. This is 'nitrogen <BR>narcosis'. It is thought to be caused by nitrogen being dissolved in the <BR>lipids in neurons (nerve cells) and interfering with the transmission of <BR>signals. Effects include sleepiness, memory loss, poor judgement, <BR>dizziness, hallucinations, and loss of coordination. It won't harm you of <BR>itself, but you are far more likely to do something careless or stupid <BR>that does hurt! Reducing pressure will normally sort the problem out.<BR><BR>Doubling the pressure causes few problems from nitrogen narcosis, most <BR>people begin to notice it at four times Earth standard. Individuals react <BR>differently (but fairly consistently) although the effects are lessened by <BR>frequent exposure to increase pressure. (This acclimatisation is lost <BR>pretty fast if you stop going into high pressure for even a few days.) <BR>Note that the combination of pressure with the use of any sedative drug <BR>will increase your susceptibilty to nitrogen narcosis, and render it <BR>likely to manifest at much lower pressures than you'd otherwise expect. <BR>This includes alcohol and most drugs used to treat motion sickness, also <BR>barbiturates, tranquilisers, sleeping pills, hayfever remedies, and even <BR>drugs given for diarrhea. Oh, and scopolamine (which might give devious <BR>referees ideas for interrogation...).<BR><BR>Hope this helps. Don't forget that one of the main causes of problems when <BR>diving (this is all stuff I've learned during diver training by the way) <BR>is stress - as in physiological stress reactions as well as plain panic. <BR>Just imagine the person who's not had to operate in a strange atmosphere <BR>before :-)<BR><BR>Also fun things like 'lung expansion injuries' - it is not a good idea to <BR>hold your breath while the pressure drops. Air therein expands and can <BR>rupture the lungs leading to such as air embolisms (air being forced from <BR>the lung into the capillaries around it - and getting air in your <BR>bloodstream is potentially fatal as eventually an air bubble reaches a <BR>blood vessel that is too small for it to get through which is a problem <BR>for the tissues waiting for blood on the far side of the blockage. Hearts <BR>stop, brains suffer brain damage and other fun things.)<BR><BR>Not sure where my dive chart has got to - the one that you use to <BR>calculate dive times based on depth, etc., and work out the decompression <BR>stops. I'll have a hunt, I think my dive manuals have migrated to the <BR>porch which is a) freezing cold and b) well stacked with a mix of botany <BR>and theology textbooks as well!<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 15:35:10 EST<BR>From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/19/01 2:25:45 AM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; Wait second. "Oxygen starvation" is *not* a factor. Because oxygen<BR>&gt;&nbsp; *doesn't* dissolve in the blood to an extent worth worrying about. It<BR>&gt;&nbsp; combines *chemically* with the hemoglobin in red blood cells. And when<BR>&gt;&nbsp; the concentration gradient between the cells is right, it's exchanged<BR>&gt;&nbsp; for CO2. <BR><BR>Aha.&nbsp; On the other hand, what about (as Robert points out) nitrogen<BR>oxides?&nbsp; Since this planet has a fair amount of surface water, I imagine<BR>the air won't have high concentrations of these, but I seem to recall that<BR>even fairly small amounts of NO or NO2 are pretty toxic.<BR><BR>I also seem to recall that some forms of life can gain energy by breaking<BR>down nitrogenous compounds into things like NO2.&nbsp; I wonder if this place<BR>might have smog-producing plants?<BR><BR>Meanwhile, you'd also get some nitrgen compounds dissolved in the<BR>water.&nbsp; The surface water itself might be a very weak nitric-acid solution.<BR><BR>Waitaminute.&nbsp; Another thought.&nbsp; This place probably doesn't have much<BR>of an ozone layer, and its primary star isn't a placid little K-type.&nbsp; Go out<BR>unprotected and you face sunburn and melanoma. . .<BR><BR>Any feedback, folks?&nbsp; Geochemistry is not my long suit.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Actually, given the pressures stated, there's no good reason to use<BR>&gt;&nbsp; earth normal pressures in the habitats. And lots of reasons *not* to. <BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; At *worst*, they'd be at the same pressure as the outside, but with a<BR>&gt;&nbsp; different gas mix.<BR><BR>[snip]<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; And I suspect that the "danger" point for nitrogen narcosis is above<BR>&gt;&nbsp; the pressures you've got.<BR><BR>I suspect you're right.&nbsp; I'm beginning to think that the folks who designed<BR>this world in the first place didn't think to crack a diving manual.&nbsp; "Canon"<BR>has it that going out without at least a respirator is pretty bad for you.<BR>Which is why I'm trying to find some reason why it should be :-).<BR><BR>- ----------<BR>Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>set of people who will take offense at it."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 21:47:50 +0100<BR>From: Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR>Subject: BITS Adventure?<BR><BR>Hi, I was just rereading last years christmas special, Star Worn, and<BR>noticed something I didnt see before: A new Bits Adventure called<BR>"Delta 3 is down"...<BR>Since I never heard of it before on this list, id like to inquire<BR>whats up with that ;-)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 13:15:22 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: BITS Adventure?<BR><BR>It's basically, umm.....waiting for me to finish the cover &lt;sheepish grin&gt;.<BR>It woulda' been in print already if I'd have finished the cover when BITS<BR>origianlly wanted it!<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Volker<BR>&gt; Sent: Friday, January 19, 2001 12:48 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: BITS Adventure?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hi, I was just rereading last years christmas special, Star Worn, and<BR>&gt; noticed something I didnt see before: A new Bits Adventure called<BR>&gt; "Delta 3 is down"...<BR>&gt; Since I never heard of it before on this list, id like to inquire<BR>&gt; whats up with that ;-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 16:35:20 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&lt;quote&gt;<BR>I personally always looked at it this way, take a look at present day Earth.<BR>One could argue that Earth right now in the early 21st century (circa AD<BR>2001) Earth is probably at a CT tech level of roughly 8.&nbsp; Fine, but on Earth<BR>itself, there's at least a few nations that if one only counts local<BR>manufacturing level, are at a CT tech level of 5 or 6, and some sections<BR>that<BR>are even lower, look at a tribe in the Amazon rain forest for instance.&nbsp; Yet<BR>most of the lower tech nations have international class airports, access to<BR>high tech goods and companies like UPS, Fed-Ex and others in which to order<BR>more, communication from television and radio to the Internet, and so forth.<BR>When one sees that even on just one planet a spread of two to three tech<BR>levels, even when it has extensive communications networks, having tech<BR>levels all the way from zero to 15 in the CT Imperium isn't all that odd.<BR>&lt;quote&gt;<BR><BR>***I agree, but statistically, those low-tech sections of Earth are so small<BR>as to barely affect the average.&nbsp; And there is no mechanism in Traveller<BR>that takes into account your (accurate) view of planetary TL as a range<BR>rather than one number.&nbsp; In your analysis Earth's TL is (correctly) 8.<BR><BR>&lt;quote&gt;<BR>What *will* happen is that high tech gadgets the locals can afford and<BR>want will spread.<BR><BR>Thus, even isolated villages had radios, and now have telephones.<BR>&lt;quote&gt;<BR><BR>***YES!&nbsp; And the social upheaval that results is staggering.&nbsp; Just apply<BR>that on a planetary scale and the construction of a starport on a lowtech<BR>world would rip its civilization apart.&nbsp; Which leads me to believe that many<BR>ports on such worlds would be highport-only, or concealed to prevent such<BR>upheaval.<BR><BR>&lt;quote&gt;<BR>What are the locals going to *pay* for this high tech stuff with?<BR><BR>They need to have something that is valuable to the high tech folks.<BR>Either to trade directly for the high tech stuff, or that they can<BR>trade for currency which they can then use to buy the high tech stuff.<BR><BR>And don't forget that they have to buy consumables as well (gasoline,<BR>batteries, spare parts, etc).<BR>&lt;quote&gt;<BR><BR>***But won't there be markets for cheaper low tech products on other planets<BR>of the same tech level?&nbsp; If not, why would anyone visit these godforsaken<BR>worlds?&nbsp; Look in the opening pages of GURPS Traveller: Far Trader for an<BR>analysis of this.<BR><BR>Plus, these worlds have cheap labor.&nbsp; Just as on Earth, high population low<BR>tech worlds will be meccas for industries seeking to lower their overhead.<BR>That will also facilitate the diffusion of higher-techs throughout the<BR>Imperium.&nbsp; Now that you have the megacorps involved . . . .<BR><BR>&lt;quote&gt;<BR>Note that a natural consequence of this is that there are certain low-tech<BR>industries which will die out completely, because for practical purposes<BR>'low-tech' == 'poor'.&nbsp; For example, you may well see low-tech pickup trucks,<BR>and even low-tech pickup trucks which have been converted by bolting plates<BR>of armor on them, but you won't see low-tech tanks or fighters, because a<BR>higher-tech weapon system is typically _still_ a better bargain.<BR>&lt;quote&gt;<BR><BR>***That's a great, and probably realistic, image.&nbsp; I still maintain that<BR>there will be a lot fewer of these low tech worlds around than the canon<BR>would have you believe.&nbsp; That the presence and interaction of the Imperium<BR>is going to bring these planets out of their muck much quicker than Earth<BR>advanced.&nbsp; Regardless of whether a world can pay for high-tech goods, those<BR>who think they can will risk the well-being of their fellows to get ahead.<BR>Surely the leaders of such woulds could amass the funds necessary to get at<BR>the good stuff.&nbsp; For an idea of how these worlds might feel, read the story<BR>"Mozart in Mirrorshades" in _Mirrorshades:&nbsp; The Cyberpunk Anthology_.<BR>Preventing this process which sounds contrary to Imperial policy.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 17:58:10 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: A.I. (was Re: Psionic Institutes and Out-of-Print Games)<BR><BR>On Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:54:37 -0500 (EST), WDR &lt;eviloverlord668@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Speaking of out-of-print games, does anyone know if Digest Group<BR>&gt;Publications produced any copies of the "A.I." RPG?&nbsp; Seems like it was<BR>&gt;advertised ~1992 or so in Challenge magazine.&nbsp; And other than "Vilani<BR>&gt;and Vargr" and "Solomani and Aslan", were any of the other DGP<BR>&gt;Megatraveller alien sourcebooks ever published (Zhodani and Droyne,<BR>&gt;etc.)?<BR><BR>No, this fell into Roger &lt;spit&gt; Sanger's hands with the collapse of DGP,<BR>and Roger &lt;spit&gt; Sanger has done with it what he has done with _every_<BR>project that has ever fallen into his hands.<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 18:01:14 -0500<BR>From: "Walt Smith" &lt;firelock_ny@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Mercenaries (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3538)<BR><BR>Anthony Jackson wrote:<BR>&gt;Note that a natural consequence of this is that there are certain low-tech <BR>&gt;industries which will die out completely, because for<BR>&gt;practical purposes'low-tech' == 'poor'.&nbsp; For example, you may well<BR>&gt;see low-tech pickup trucks, and even low-tech pickup trucks which<BR>&gt;have been converted by bolting plates of armor on them, but you<BR>&gt;won't see low-tech tanks or fighters, because a higher-tech weapon<BR>&gt;system is typically _still_ a better bargain.<BR><BR>I think you'll see some light stuff still being built.&nbsp; While<BR>a TL-12 grav tank is immune to TL-6 weaponry, a TL-6 world<BR>can't have very many of them...so you'll see TL-6 APC's,<BR>IFV's and Patrol vehicles, probably equipped with only<BR>a smattering of higher-tech devices (especially communications<BR>and sensors).&nbsp; The platoon of grav tanks will win any stand-up<BR>fight the planetary government sends them to, but they can't<BR>be used for long-term police actions, guerrila hunting and<BR>that sort of thing.&nbsp; You may not see TL-6 AFV's, but IMO<BR>you'll certainly see TL-6 lighter combat and paramilitary<BR>vehicles.<BR><BR>A real problem will be things like backpack-sized or hand-held<BR>high-tech anti-vehicular weaponry.&nbsp; A Free Trader can bring enough<BR>crates of these in one run to probably put paid to every<BR>low-tech vehicle the planetary government owns.&nbsp; All the rebels<BR>need to do is find a Free Trader captain willing to loan them<BR>the money to pay for them.&nbsp; If they lose, they're dead anyway...<BR>if they win, their new government is in deep debt to off-world<BR>weapons merchants.&nbsp; Lovely.<BR><BR>Was it Pohl or David Drake who pointed out the civilization<BR>ending possibilites of interstellar mercenaries?<BR><BR>You see, you have two groups vying for control of the planet.<BR>Each side represents themselves as the rightful and eventual<BR>ruler of the planet, and thus makes deals for future payment<BR>based on owning the entire planet.&nbsp; Now introduce high-tech,<BR>highly-trained mercenaries.&nbsp; The side who has them will win,<BR>the side that doesn't will die.&nbsp; Complete impoverishment is<BR>preferable to death, so each side will bid for the mercenaries'<BR>services far, far more than they can really afford.&nbsp; The<BR>mercenaries win the planet for whoever offered them a higher<BR>payment, then take their payment away from the planet (by<BR>force, if necessary) and leave.&nbsp; The winners are broke,<BR>defenseless, and probably will see the same problems in a<BR>generation or less that led to them calling the mercenaries<BR>in the first place.<BR><BR>(No, the lower-resource world can't create an effective<BR>standing army to protect themselves with.&nbsp; A world-conquering<BR>mercenary force hired for a crucial eight weeks costs less than<BR>a standing local-tech army does over a decade or so, and that<BR>standing army won't have the tech or the training to fight<BR>off the mercenaries.&nbsp; The ruling government would be better<BR>off having a police force, and - like the rebels - hiring<BR>offworld mercenaries as needed.)<BR><BR>The mercenaries, meanwhile, are spending all that loot on<BR>expensive new weapons, training new recruits, and paying off<BR>the pensions of their widows, orphans and maimed.&nbsp; They'll<BR>still be a combat factor that no local government can afford<BR>*not* to hire.&nbsp; Capital gets concentrated, through the<BR>mercenaries' purchases, in a few high-tech armament factory<BR>worlds, while the worlds around them become impoverished,<BR>strife-torn backwaters.<BR><BR>Then the armament factory worlds start running out of<BR>trading partners...oops...<BR><BR>An interstellar government that wants anything to govern<BR>had better keep mercenaries on a leash almost tight<BR>enough to strangle 'em, and should seriously consider<BR>tightening it even more.<BR><BR>Walt Smith<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3539<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yh01.mx.aol.com (rly-yh01.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.33]) by air-yh02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 18:03:46 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yh01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 18:03:11 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id SAA66460;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 18:02:02 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 19 Jan 2001 18:01:47 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id SAA66416<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 18:01:47 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 18:01:47 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101192301.SAA66416@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3539<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3540</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/19/01 5:30:50 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 19 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3540<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>RE: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>Re: Mercenaries (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3538)<BR>Re: A.I. (was Re: Psionic Institutes and Out-of-Print Games)<BR>Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR>Re: A.I. (was Re: Psionic Institutes and Out-of-Print Games)<BR>Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>Re: Mercenaries (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3538)<BR>Keyboard alert! was: Fw: [transhumanspace] Digest Number 24<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>[OT] Thanks!<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 15:11:23 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Mark Cook &lt;markc@peak.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>Doug Berry &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; writes:<BR><BR>&gt; Now, if y'all only had a good distance range.&nbsp; I might be getting ahold of<BR>&gt; a sniper-modified M-1903A1 Springfield soon, and once I get the sights<BR>&gt; zeroed, it would be fun to show you, Jesse, Tod, and any other interested<BR>&gt; parties just what shooting is all about!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Three successive rounds through the same 2" diameter target, from the prone<BR>&gt; supported position, at 200m, or I buy dinner.<BR><BR>and Jesse Degraff &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt; writes:<BR><BR>&gt; My shooting club leader and I once had a "minute-of-lunch" contest (looser<BR>&gt; buys lunch) at the local 100yd range.&nbsp; He was shooting a nice bolt-action<BR>&gt; varmint rifle in something like 22-250 (that a caliber??) useing a custom<BR>&gt; handload that he'd worked up.&nbsp; I was using my Match AR-15 and plain vanilla<BR>&gt; PMC milspec ammo.&nbsp; I still only lost by one eigth of an inch :)&nbsp; I'll use<BR>&gt; Tod's AI rifle and go "minute-of-lunch" with you.<BR><BR>OK, Jesse uses Tod Accuracy Int'l., Doug uses his 1903A1, and I use<BR>*my* 1903A1 with the 3-9x Leopold Vari-X (my regular hunting rifle.)<BR>The 2 losers split the dinner tab. :^)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - Mark C.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Instructor, Willamette Small Arms Academy<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; EOD, U.S.M.C. 1st MarDiv (Camp Pendleton), Class of '75<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Full-Auto Director, Albany Rifle &amp; Pistol Club, Albany, OR<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; NRA (Life), GOA (Life), SAF (Life), CCRKBA (Life)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Front Sight First Family member #1<BR><BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 64,999,987 firearm owners killed no one yesterday.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Somehow, it didn't make the news.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 15:27:39 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>:D<BR>Jesse<BR><BR><BR>&gt; OK, Jesse uses Tod Accuracy Int'l., Doug uses his 1903A1, and I use<BR>&gt; *my* 1903A1 with the 3-9x Leopold Vari-X (my regular hunting rifle.)<BR>&gt; The 2 losers split the dinner tab. :^)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - Mark C.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Instructor, Willamette Small Arms Academy<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; EOD, U.S.M.C. 1st MarDiv (Camp Pendleton), Class of '75<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Full-Auto Director, Albany Rifle &amp; Pistol Club, Albany, OR<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; NRA (Life), GOA (Life), SAF (Life), CCRKBA (Life)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Front Sight First Family member #1<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; -----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&gt;&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&gt;&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: <BR>&gt; 541-745-5818&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>&gt; -----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 64,999,987 firearm owners killed no one yesterday.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Somehow, it didn't make the news.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 15:41:08 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Mercenaries (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3538)<BR><BR>Walt Smith writes:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I think you'll see some light stuff still being built.&nbsp; While<BR>&gt; a TL-12 grav tank is immune to TL-6 weaponry, a TL-6 world<BR>&gt; can't have very many of them...so you'll see TL-6 APC's,<BR>&gt; IFV's and Patrol vehicles<BR><BR>i.e. the converted trucks I mentioned.<BR><BR>&gt; A real problem will be things like backpack-sized or hand-held<BR>&gt; high-tech anti-vehicular weaponry.&nbsp; A Free Trader can bring enough<BR>&gt; crates of these in one run to probably put paid to every<BR>&gt; low-tech vehicle the planetary government owns.<BR><BR>Which is why the planetary government won't use low-tech armored vehicles.<BR>Sure, you can kill a lightly armored panel truck with an FGMP, but you<BR>can do the same thing with a medium machine gun.&nbsp; By and large, you should<BR>look at modern third world paramilitary factions for a guess as to what <BR>they'll use and make.&nbsp; Figure on lots of mortars, assault rifles, <BR>recoilless rifles, and trucks, with relatively little heavy stuff.<BR><BR>&gt; based on owning the entire planet.&nbsp; Now introduce high-tech,<BR>&gt; highly-trained mercenaries.&nbsp; The side who has them will win,<BR>&gt; the side that doesn't will die.<BR><BR>Not necessarily.&nbsp; All the side without them has to do is survive until the<BR>other side runs out of money -- sure, you can hire forces capable of killing<BR>anything on the planet, but you gotta find it to kill it.&nbsp; Again, think <BR>modern low intensity conflicts.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 15:57:15 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. (was Re: Psionic Institutes and Out-of-Print Games)<BR><BR>&gt;[snip]<BR>&gt;&lt;spit&gt;<BR>&gt;[snip]<BR>&gt;&lt;spit&gt;<BR>&gt;[snip]<BR><BR>Careful, Jeff. You're gonna mess up your keyboard. 8^)<BR><BR><BR><BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 23:58:51 GMT<BR>From: "John G. Wood" &lt;elvwood@ntlworld.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR><BR>Hi,<BR><BR>&gt; I'm looking for manuscripts for a group of 32-page books dealing with a<BR>&gt; single world (16,000 to 17,000 words), for publication by SJ Games.<BR><BR>I'm interested, and would like more details. If there is a sample outline <BR>(maybe the one used for Kamsii) I think it would probably answer most of my <BR>questions. <BR><BR>Many thanks,<BR><BR>John<BR>http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 19:10:14 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. (was Re: Psionic Institutes and Out-of-Print Games)<BR><BR>Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt; On Thu, 18 Jan 2001 00:54:37 -0500 (EST), WDR <BR>wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;Speaking of out-of-print games, does anyone know if Digest Group<BR>&gt;&gt;Publications produced any copies of the "A.I." RPG?&nbsp; Seems like it was<BR>&gt;&gt;advertised ~1992 or so in Challenge magazine.&nbsp; And other than "Vilani<BR>&gt;&gt;and Vargr" and "Solomani and Aslan", were any of the other DGP<BR>&gt;&gt;Megatraveller alien sourcebooks ever published (Zhodani and Droyne,<BR>&gt;&gt;etc.)?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;No, this fell into Roger &lt;spit&gt; Sanger's hands with the collapse of DGP,<BR>&gt;and Roger &lt;spit&gt; Sanger has done with it what he has done with _every_<BR>&gt;project that has ever fallen into his hands.<BR><BR>I also remember tell (in a MTJ editorial maybe?) of a massive hard-drive crash at DGP c. 1991 or 92 that wiped out much of the work up to that date on 'A.I.'&nbsp; How much survived, and how much they were able to reconstruct later, I suppose only he-who-shall-remain-nameless (hint, see above) can say for sure.<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 00:10:50 GMT<BR>From: "John G. Wood" &lt;elvwood@ntlworld.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR><BR>John G. Wood &lt;elvwood@ntlworld.com&gt; wrote:<BR>[stuff intended just for Loren]<BR><BR>D'oh! I hate it when I do that...<BR><BR>John<BR>http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 16:00:59 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Also fun things like 'lung expansion injuries' - it is not a good idea to <BR>&gt; hold your breath while the pressure drops. Air therein expands and can <BR>&gt; rupture the lungs leading to such as air embolisms (air being forced from <BR>&gt; the lung into the capillaries around it - and getting air in your <BR>&gt; bloodstream is potentially fatal as eventually an air bubble reaches a <BR>&gt; blood vessel that is too small for it to get through which is a problem <BR>&gt; for the tissues waiting for blood on the far side of the blockage. Hearts <BR>&gt; stop, brains suffer brain damage and other fun things.)<BR><BR>And this is why they drum "don't try to hold your breath" into spacers<BR>as well. 1 atm in your lungs, and 0 outside is just as dangerous as 2<BR>inside and 1 outside.<BR><BR>Explosive decompression has its own set of problems as well. Things<BR>like the sudden pressure change causing blood pressure drops that put<BR>you into shock. Which means that even the 30 seconds of useful<BR>conciousness you'd otherwise have is wasted. <BR><BR>&gt; Not sure where my dive chart has got to - the one that you use to <BR>&gt; calculate dive times based on depth, etc., and work out the decompression <BR>&gt; stops. I'll have a hunt, I think my dive manuals have migrated to the <BR>&gt; porch which is a) freezing cold and b) well stacked with a mix of botany <BR>&gt; and theology textbooks as well!<BR><BR>The fun part is getting figures for decompression *from* 1 atm to lower<BR>pressures....<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 16:42:03 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>on 1/19/01 11:13 AM, Douglas E. Berry at gridlore@pop.mindspring.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Now, if y'all only had a good distance range.&nbsp; I might be getting ahold of<BR>&gt; a sniper-modified M-1903A1 Springfield soon, and once I get the sights<BR>&gt; zeroed, it would be fun to show you, Jesse, Tod, and any other interested<BR>&gt; parties just what shooting is all about!<BR><BR>I will personally escort you to TriCounty Gun Club, North of Albany by about<BR>an hour's drive, and boasting a proper 600 yard range. you must shoot my<BR>Remington 40x with the accuracy international stock.&nbsp; Head shots at 600<BR>yards are not a problem.<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Three successive rounds through the same 2" diameter target, from the prone<BR>&gt; supported position, at 200m, or I buy dinner.<BR><BR>Personally, I always liked 3 round through a penny at 100 yards.&nbsp; I have one<BR>5 round group at 100 yards that measured .426 using factory ammo (155gn<BR>Sierra Match King Palma Federal match).&nbsp; Mostly luck, I'll admit, but 2" at<BR>200 yards should not be a problem (ask Jesse about this rifle).<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>- --<BR>"When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend"<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 16:50:43 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; OK, Jesse uses Tod Accuracy Int'l., Doug uses his 1903A1, and I use<BR>&gt; *my* 1903A1 with the 3-9x Leopold Vari-X (my regular hunting rifle.)<BR>&gt; The 2 losers split the dinner tab. :^)<BR><BR>Hey, maybe I will use my AI stocked 40x.&nbsp; Or as a real test of the marksman,<BR>and not the gun, how about we all shoot the same rifle.&nbsp; We'll shoot for<BR>group size, rather than accuracy so no one's zero gets messed up.<BR><BR>I volunteer my Whitworth .458.&nbsp; It has been known to shoot a cloverleaf at<BR>50 yards with 405gn cast lead bullets and 72 gns of 4895. Express sites,<BR>naturally.<BR><BR>And yes, I have used this as my hunting rifle.&nbsp; Try hunting in the west<BR>coast of Oregon, and you'll see why a 500 yard rifle is pointless.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend"<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 10:08:27 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Mercenaries (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3538)<BR><BR>&gt; From: "Walt Smith" <BR>&gt; I think you'll see some light stuff still being built.&nbsp; While<BR>&gt; a TL-12 grav tank is immune to TL-6 weaponry, a TL-6 world<BR>&gt; can't have very many of them...so you'll see TL-6 APC's,<BR>&gt; IFV's and Patrol vehicles, probably equipped with only<BR>&gt; a smattering of higher-tech devices (especially communications<BR>&gt; and sensors).&nbsp; <BR>...<BR>&gt; A real problem will be things like backpack-sized or hand-held<BR>&gt; high-tech anti-vehicular weaponry.&nbsp; <BR><BR>This is also something that can be used to fix the TL-12 grav-tank problem.<BR>A TL-15 missile will sort it out nicely, and can be mounted on a TL-6<BR>vehicle quite easily.&nbsp; Picture a horse-towed TOW launcher, opposing WW2<BR>Panthers and Tigers. <BR><BR>I actually think that a certain amount of "paper, scissors, rock" can be<BR>played with force multipliers like comms gear, sensors and missiles.&nbsp; "Bang<BR>for the buck" is not a simple thing to analyse.&nbsp; It may well be possible<BR>that lots of "cheap" small systems might be more cost-effective than a<BR>small number of expensive systems like tanks. <BR><BR>&gt; (No, the lower-resource world can't create an effective<BR>&gt; standing army to protect themselves with.&nbsp; A world-conquering<BR>&gt; mercenary force hired for a crucial eight weeks costs less than<BR>&gt; a standing local-tech army does over a decade or so, and that<BR>&gt; standing army won't have the tech or the training to fight<BR>&gt; off the mercenaries.&nbsp; The ruling government would be better<BR>&gt; off having a police force, and - like the rebels - hiring<BR>&gt; offworld mercenaries as needed.)<BR><BR>"Guard" units, sufficient to deal with raiders/ethically challenged<BR>merchants/player characters are a good idea.&nbsp; Training can be dealt with by<BR>hiring mercs on a cadre mission.<BR><BR>Ian Whitchurch noted on the "Re: Starports and Tech Levels" thread<BR>&gt; And 80% of the graduates of the Technical College go to the starport and<BR>&gt; sign up as Third Assistant Drive Hands on Free Traders, in order to earn<BR>&gt; hard currency to send home.<BR><BR>If we have some of these graduates joining off-world armies instead, and<BR>assume that at least some of the survivors eventually return home, we have<BR>a trained high-tech cadre for our "Guards".&nbsp; (Hmm, I don't know much about<BR>the Nepalese army - presumably they would pull something like this with the<BR>various Gurkha units in various other armies.)<BR><BR>Then again, there is the technique used by many of the tiny German states<BR>in the 17th-19th centuries:&nbsp; find an ally willing to subsidise your forces<BR>in return for their support in your ally's wars.&nbsp; No, it's not _quite_<BR>turning them into mercenaries - they are still your standing army, it's<BR>just that they are fighting someone else's war.&nbsp; If you need to fight a war<BR>of your own, you just have to get them back home.<BR><BR>The degree of cynicism with which you do this may vary:&nbsp; some of the<BR>participants in this trade will be just plain straightforward mercs, while<BR>others will be more or less genuine allies of their patrons.<BR><BR>In addition, some high-tech worlds may feel it in their interests to<BR>subsidise the military forces of lower-tech worlds around them, whether on<BR>economic or strategic grounds.&nbsp; (RW examples:&nbsp; Australia and Papua New<BR>Guinea.)<BR><BR>The Imperium has issues with "excessive off-world interference" of this<BR>sort, but only if it isn't the subsector duke's cousin that is doing the<BR>interfering...&nbsp; Then again, "excessive off-world interference" is an issue<BR>for mercs as well.<BR><BR>As always, what you can get away with depends on who you know.<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 09:39:51 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Keyboard alert! was: Fw: [transhumanspace] Digest Number 24<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; From: "David L. Pulver" &lt;dlpulver@sympatico.ca&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Population distribution (Was: Re: Thoughts on Transhumanism)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; At 12:50 PM 1/18/01 Juergen Hubert wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;Let's not forget that agriculture will also change drastically. It was<BR>&gt; &gt;already hinted that eating "real" meat will become optional. Whoops,<BR>&gt; &gt;there goes most of the cattle industry, the only survivors being those<BR>&gt; &gt;who specialize in high-quality luxury food (and they will get lots of<BR>&gt; &gt;protests from animal rights activists, too.)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This is true; from what I've seen of Deep Beyond, Jon Zeigler will cover<BR>&gt; this sort of thing and its effects. In some areas, I suspect that farmers<BR>&gt; are doing a lot of pharming: while many industrialized countries just use<BR>&gt; the bacteria vats, your Peruvian or Afghani or Khazak herder might be<BR>&gt; using cheap South African or Iraqi medicine sheep / goats /&nbsp; llamas<BR>&gt; whatever, especially if the second-gen versions are robust enough to<BR>&gt; breed. Beware the psycho-llama.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 16:06:28 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; The answer is rather more simple than may have occured to you. <BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; What are the locals going to *pay* for this high tech stuff with? <BR>&gt; &lt;snip&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; So you'll have a *lot* of high tech stuff that won't be worth the<BR>&gt;&gt; price (most vehicles). And other items that the locals *are* willing to<BR>&gt;&gt; pay for. Like radios, weapons, etc.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Note that a natural consequence of this is that there are certain low-tech<BR>&gt; industries which will die out completely, because for practical purposes<BR>&gt; 'low-tech' == 'poor'.&nbsp; For example, you may well see low-tech pickup trucks,<BR>&gt; and even low-tech pickup trucks which have been converted by bolting plates<BR>&gt; of armor on them, but you won't see low-tech tanks or fighters, because a<BR>&gt; higher-tech weapon system is typically _still_ a better bargain.<BR><BR>Note that most of the third world is going straight to cell phones, as<BR>they don't require the *huge* investments in laying cables and the<BR>like. <BR><BR>As I've noted in the past, I'd expect that any world with a decent<BR>starport will have an array of "low level" commsats (much like the<BR>failed Iridium network), if only for the convenience of offworlders. <BR><BR>And natives will be able to pick up the phones for use with this<BR>system. And many villages with have a (to borrow James Schmitz's useful<BR>label) Comweb terminal. It'll be the telephone, encyclopedia,<BR>weatherman, and lots of other things. <BR><BR>This produces "interesting" effects. Like the natives being able to<BR>spread warnings faster than the PCs can travel. And co-ordinate widely<BR>scattered bands into a *nasty* ambush. &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>BTW, I expect that some types of energy weapons will be preferred over<BR>gunpowder type weapons. Why? Because rather than having to make a long<BR>trip to get more cartridges, you can simply crank away at a generator<BR>for a while. If you are hunting for food, or to protect your village<BR>against dangerous predators, setting some people (or the local<BR>horse/mule equivalent) to turning a generator to recharge the power<BR>pack is a *much* better deal.<BR><BR>And I expect that traders will know this. Sure, bullets would be a<BR>continuing sale, but a load of low maintenace generators rigged to be<BR>turned by low tech power sources (anything from hand cranks to water<BR>wheels to animals walking in a circle to windmills) can be sold for<BR>more, and you aren't going to saturate the planet with even a couple of<BR>shiploads of them. <BR><BR>Medical supplies *will* be a big money maker. And the comweb will make<BR>it possible for a few doctors at the port to talk locals thru a lot of<BR>things.<BR><BR>BTW, I rather suspect that it will have been discovered over the<BR>millenia that the best way to handle this is for the medic or trader<BR>(or a person who is both!) to offer things on a "I'll show you mine if<BR>you'll show me yours" basis. <BR><BR>This allows the local doctor/shaman/whatever to keep his position, thus<BR>eliminating a potential problem. It also enables the traders to get a<BR>look at anything the locals may have discovered that could be useful.<BR><BR>A *lot* of drugs have come from "native remedies". And finding a new<BR>one that has "potential" can be *very* profitable. Even if it doesn't<BR>pan out, the drug companies will pay rather large "finders fees".<BR><BR>So any low tech world that's not newly contacted will have varying<BR>sorts of tech available. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 16:30:03 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Then there is the issue of staying at a lower TL after contact is<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; established with those high TL neighbours.&nbsp; Poor worlds may not<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; have the resources to import high TL equipment.&nbsp; Local politics<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; may resist advancement for its own sake, or just the import of<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; things and ideas.&nbsp; The world may have been contacted recently,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; and has not had time to advance in TL.&nbsp; The population may be<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; too low to support higher TL.&nbsp; Their may be an embargo enforced<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; by nearby worlds.<BR><BR>Or the inhabitants may be Amish. :-)<BR><BR>It's perfectly possible for a culture to take a good hard look at high<BR>tech and decide that they don't *want* it. Many people have trouble<BR>understanding this. But it's a very real "attitude" (there's got to be<BR>a better word than that).<BR><BR>I can see such worlds being *very* picky about what tech they do and<BR>don't accept. And if they are halfway intelligent, they can handle the<BR>"rebel" and otherwise "discontented" members of their own populace by<BR>*helping* them get off world. Or at least move to the port. <BR><BR>It could be religious, or it could be a belief in "appropriate<BR>technology". Or even having the wisdom to stop and think thru *all* the<BR>potential side effects of a new item or technology before adopting it. <BR><BR>Any of these will drive Merchant characters *nuts*. &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 17:06:49 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson writes:<BR><BR>&gt; BTW, I expect that some types of energy weapons will be preferred over<BR>&gt; gunpowder type weapons. Why? Because rather than having to make a long<BR>&gt; trip to get more cartridges, you can simply crank away at a generator<BR>&gt; for a while. If you are hunting for food, or to protect your village<BR>&gt; against dangerous predators, setting some people (or the local<BR>&gt; horse/mule equivalent) to turning a generator to recharge the power<BR>&gt; pack is a *much* better deal.<BR><BR>That really depends on the relative costs and maintenance requirements of <BR>the weapons.&nbsp; I wouldn't be too surprised to see a market for 'survival'<BR>weapons which are designed with solar collectors.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 12:11:36 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>&gt; And this is why they drum "don't try to hold your breath" into spacers<BR>&gt; as well. 1 atm in your lungs, and 0 outside is just as dangerous as 2<BR>&gt; inside and 1 outside.<BR><BR>Very much so.&nbsp; Even worse in some ways, since that gas will try to<BR>expand to a much greater volume (but still fatal either way, so its a<BR>little academic).&nbsp; It's not like you *could* hold your breath against<BR>1 atm difference, but even trying would be bad.<BR><BR>&gt; Explosive decompression has its own set of problems as well. Things<BR>&gt; like the sudden pressure change causing blood pressure drops that put<BR>&gt; you into shock. Which means that even the 30 seconds of useful<BR>&gt; conciousness you'd otherwise have is wasted. <BR><BR>More like 10-15 seconds -- the time it takes for completely<BR>deoxygenated blood to get to your brain.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; The fun part is getting figures for decompression *from* 1 atm to<BR>&gt; lower pressures....<BR><BR>That's not so bad -- even unpressurized aircraft can go rather high<BR>pretty quickly, without much in the way of nasty effects apart from<BR>the expected oxygen depletion at high altitudes.&nbsp; Of course, going<BR>from 1 atm N2/O2 mix to 0.2 atm or less of pure O2 could be quite a<BR>different matter.<BR><BR><BR>- - Tim<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 15:43:13 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; In a message dated 1/19/01 2:25:45 AM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>&gt; shadow@krypton.rain.com writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Wait second. "Oxygen starvation" is *not* a factor. Because oxygen<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; *doesn't* dissolve in the blood to an extent worth worrying about. It<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; combines *chemically* with the hemoglobin in red blood cells. And when<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; the concentration gradient between the cells is right, it's exchanged<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; for CO2. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Aha.&nbsp; On the other hand, what about (as Robert points out) nitrogen<BR>&gt; oxides?&nbsp; Since this planet has a fair amount of surface water, I imagine<BR>&gt; the air won't have high concentrations of these, but I seem to recall that<BR>&gt; even fairly small amounts of NO or NO2 are pretty toxic.<BR><BR>They also won't last significant amounts of time in open air. They are<BR>toxic *because* they are reactive. And they'll react with rock just as<BR>readily as with lung tissue.<BR><BR>To have a hazardous level you need something *creating* them steadily.<BR>Here on earth lightning creates tiny amounts. and the internal<BR>combustion engine creates enough for places like LA to have reached the<BR>lower "toxic" levels during temperature inversions.<BR><BR>You aren't going to have that sort of thing happening.<BR><BR>&gt; I also seem to recall that some forms of life can gain energy by breaking<BR>&gt; down nitrogenous compounds into things like NO2.&nbsp; I wonder if this place<BR>&gt; might have smog-producing plants?<BR><BR>I can't see *how* that reaction would be energeticly favorable. <BR><BR>Photosynthesis does produce O2, but that's actually a matter of using<BR>*external* energy to produce glucose, with the O2 production being an<BR>unfortunate side effect.<BR><BR>&gt; Meanwhile, you'd also get some nitrgen compounds dissolved in the<BR>&gt; water.&nbsp; The surface water itself might be a very weak nitric-acid solution.<BR><BR>It'd take some doing. The sort of reactions you are talking about are<BR>less efficient than photosynthesis. That means that photosynthetic<BR>organisms will crowd them out in short order.<BR><BR>&gt; Waitaminute.&nbsp; Another thought.&nbsp; This place probably doesn't have much<BR>&gt; of an ozone layer, and its primary star isn't a placid little K-type.&nbsp; Go out<BR>&gt; unprotected and you face sunburn and melanoma. . .<BR><BR>Sorry, but since it's got a *thicker* atmosphere, less will reach the<BR>ground. And in any case, given that there's enough O2 to breathe, you'd<BR>better believe that there will be an ozone layer. The more energetic<BR>sun will actually *encourage* ozone production in the upper atmosphere.<BR><BR>&gt; I suspect you're right.&nbsp; I'm beginning to think that the folks who designed<BR>&gt; this world in the first place didn't think to crack a diving manual.&nbsp; "Canon"<BR>&gt; has it that going out without at least a respirator is pretty bad for you.<BR>&gt; Which is why I'm trying to find some reason why it should be :-).<BR><BR>The NOx idea is unlikely at best. If there's a lot of volcanic<BR>activity, then you could get lots of sulfur oxides. And there's always<BR>the old standby. Have more CO2 in the air. It doesn't take all that<BR>much to make long term exposure a *real* bad idea. <BR><BR>There's an area in Africa where CO2 from some sort of volcanic activity<BR>"pools" in low lying areas. And kills animals. A TV program I've seen a<BR>couple of times showed a preadtor going after a carcass and barely<BR>managing to get back out alive (and without the carcass!).<BR><BR>Winds will stir things up and make the areas safe. And as the day<BR>progesses, the ground warms up and convection disperses the CO2. <BR><BR>Also, with volcanic activity, there may be a lot of dust in the air.<BR>Most of it truly *nasty* for the lungs if you inhale it. Even though<BR>Portland only caught the fringe of a few dust clouds from Mt. St.<BR>Helens, I'm all *too* familiar with *that*. <BR><BR>You see, I worked in a class 1000 clean room, and the first time we got<BR>hit by a dust cloud, the company was nice enough to pass out disposable<BR>dust masks to the folks going off shift. We got our own after that...<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 15:37:35 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Okay, for you experts out there:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; SNIP<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; But in a typical starship would this be an issue?&nbsp; The whole ship<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; could be used as a decompression chamber over the course of travel<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; time to jump point and during jump.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Sure. *IF* you do it that way. but a recently arrived ship may just<BR>&gt;&gt; debark passengers into a "low pressure" transients hotel were they<BR>&gt;&gt; can compress to local pressure quickly, and decompress at their<BR>&gt;&gt; leisure.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; There are valid engineering reasons why you might want to avoid<BR>&gt;&gt; running the ship's internal pressure above a certain value.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Yes, after I sent this off I had a scary thought about being jumped<BR>&gt; by some ethically challenged merchants on the way outsystem.&nbsp; Course<BR>&gt; the pressure might be an advantage in a boarding situation, but a<BR>&gt; liability in a battle.<BR><BR>On the other hand, I expect that life support systems (especially any<BR>biological components) will work a *lot* better if you aren't always<BR>playing with the pressure. <BR><BR>&gt; But then this method may make it easier to don Vacc Suits, depending<BR>&gt; on YTU and whether or not the Vacc Suits are full pressure or not.<BR><BR>The suits are going to *have* to be full pressure. As others have<BR>noted, it takes 14+ *hours* of prep to get the N2 out of your blood<BR>before going EVA in a 3 psi suit. There's no way in hell that's going<BR>to be practical in an "everyday activity" setup like Traveller. <BR><BR>The suits *have* to be something you just check out, put on, and use.<BR>With checkout being "rushed" in emergencies.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 20:29:38 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: Michael Houghton &lt;herveus@Radix.Net&gt;<BR>Subject: [OT] Thanks!<BR><BR>Howdy!<BR><BR>In a few minutes, I head off to Johns Hopkins to do a sleep study overnight.<BR><BR>Someone had posted an impassionded plea that we seek medical advice if we<BR>thought we had sleep apnea. I confess that that plea was the straw that got<BR>me off my ass. Thanks!<BR><BR>yours,<BR>Michael<BR>- -- <BR>Michael and MJ Houghton&nbsp;&nbsp; | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly<BR>herveus@radix.net&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | White Wolf and the Phoenix<BR>Bowie, MD, USA&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3540<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zc05.mx.aol.com (rly-zc05.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.5]) by air-zc04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 20:30:50 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zc05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 20:30:16 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id UAA72181;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 20:29:51 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 19 Jan 2001 20:29:43 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id UAA72134<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 20:29:43 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 20:29:43 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101200129.UAA72134@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3540<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3541</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/20/01 3:07:21 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Saturday, January 20 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3541<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Honor Harrington Goodies<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3535<BR>Re: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR>Re: Quick environmental question (THANKS)<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starpots and Tech Levels<BR>Re: A.I. (was Re: Psionic Institutes and Out-of-Print Games)<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re : Quick environmental question (longish)<BR>Re: A.I. (was Re: Psionic Institutes and Out-of-Print Games)<BR>Re: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: [OT] Thanks!<BR>Re: Quick environmental question (THANKS)<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 16:37:05 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; ***I agree, but statistically, those low-tech sections of Earth are so small<BR>&gt; as to barely affect the average.<BR><BR>Better take another look. *most* of the earth's population is lower<BR>tech than me and thee.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &lt;quote&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; What *will* happen is that high tech gadgets the locals can afford and<BR>&gt; want will spread.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Thus, even isolated villages had radios, and now have telephones.<BR>&gt; &lt;quote&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; ***YES!&nbsp; And the social upheaval that results is staggering.&nbsp; Just apply<BR>&gt; that on a planetary scale and the construction of a starport on a lowtech<BR>&gt; world would rip its civilization apart.&nbsp; Which leads me to believe that many<BR>&gt; ports on such worlds would be highport-only, or concealed to prevent such<BR>&gt; upheaval.<BR><BR>There may not be *quite* as much upheaval as you think. Between<BR>cultures that can handle things better than most on earth have *and*<BR>the desire of the merchants to *not* have that sort of chaos going on<BR>(bad for business), I expect that long experience will have shown how<BR>to introduce stuff with the least disruption.<BR><BR>After all, if that sort of disruption was going to take place, it'd<BR>have happened decades, if not *centuries* ago.<BR><BR>&gt; &lt;quote&gt;<BR>&gt; What are the locals going to *pay* for this high tech stuff with?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; They need to have something that is valuable to the high tech folks.<BR>&gt; Either to trade directly for the high tech stuff, or that they can<BR>&gt; trade for currency which they can then use to buy the high tech stuff.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; And don't forget that they have to buy consumables as well (gasoline,<BR>&gt; batteries, spare parts, etc).<BR>&gt; &lt;quote&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; ***But won't there be markets for cheaper low tech products on other planets<BR>&gt; of the same tech level?&nbsp; If not, why would anyone visit these godforsaken<BR>&gt; worlds?&nbsp; Look in the opening pages of GURPS Traveller: Far Trader for an<BR>&gt; analysis of this.<BR><BR>If the planets are at the same tech level, production costs will be<BR>pretty much the same. Add in transport costs and you can't compete with<BR>local products.<BR><BR>A higher tech world can produce some lower tech stuff enough cheaper to<BR>be worth shipping, but that still requires a product that the high tech<BR>world *wants*.<BR><BR>Check trade patterns on earth. What low tech countries export are raw<BR>materials, "unique" products (plant &amp; animal materials mostly, but also<BR>gemstones and the like), and "labor". Oh yeah, food is also an export<BR>("bulk food", not specialty stuff like fruits that don't grow well in<BR>the destination country)<BR><BR>Raw materials will be cases where there are deposits rich enough and<BR>easy enough to mine with local tech that the price including shipping<BR>is cheaper than mining asteroids or the like.<BR><BR>And rich enough deposits may be worth importing high tech gear and<BR>operators to do the mining (some of the gold mines on Irin Jaya(sp)).<BR><BR>Unique products are things like woods (mahogany, teak), dyestuffs (some<BR>natural dyes are still valued), various other plants of plant products<BR>(including fruits, flowers and veggies for the "luxury trade"). Ditto<BR>for furs, ivory, and other animal products. <BR><BR>"Labor" as an "export" isn't so much shipping laborers offworld, as it<BR>is shipping unskilled jobs (mostly assembly work) to the low tech<BR>world. <BR><BR>It's often cheaper to ship parts to a low tech world, train locals to<BR>assemble them, and ship the finished assemblies back than to do the<BR>assembly on the high tech world. <BR><BR>However, robotics at the levels available on "stellar tech" worlds make<BR>*this* a lot less likely than it is on earth.<BR><BR>Bulk food may or may not be profitable. <BR><BR>I expect that "unique products" is the main reason why anybody bother<BR>contacting low tech worlds (other than as refueling points). With raw<BR>materials coming a close second. <BR><BR>&gt; Plus, these worlds have cheap labor.&nbsp; Just as on Earth, high population low<BR>&gt; tech worlds will be meccas for industries seeking to lower their overhead.<BR><BR>See above. The robotics tech in Traveller is too good for cheap,<BR>relatively unskilled labor to be worth the trouble. You can reprogram<BR>robots for a new product faster and more easily than you can humans.<BR>And robots don't strike, demand pay increases, etc.<BR><BR>&gt; ***That's a great, and probably realistic, image.&nbsp; I still maintain that<BR>&gt; there will be a lot fewer of these low tech worlds around than the canon<BR>&gt; would have you believe.&nbsp; That the presence and interaction of the Imperium<BR>&gt; is going to bring these planets out of their muck much quicker than Earth<BR>&gt; advanced.&nbsp; Regardless of whether a world can pay for high-tech goods, those<BR>&gt; who think they can will risk the well-being of their fellows to get ahead.<BR>&gt; Surely the leaders of such woulds could amass the funds necessary to get at<BR>&gt; the good stuff.&nbsp; For an idea of how these worlds might feel, read the story<BR>&gt; "Mozart in Mirrorshades" in _Mirrorshades:&nbsp; The Cyberpunk Anthology_.<BR>&gt; Preventing this process which sounds contrary to Imperial policy.<BR><BR>Preventing disruption of trade will be contrary to Imperial policy. And<BR>to the long term interests of the traders. So tech won't introduced or<BR>offered willy nilly. Remember, these people have *millenia* of<BR>experience at this. <BR><BR>And some of the low tech types are going to want to examine things more<BR>carefully before accepting them. This has happened in some cases even<BR>on earth! <BR><BR>I figure that getting *an* item of high tech gear is merely a matter of<BR>money, except for a few items that bothe the imperium and the megacorps<BR>and even the free traders know will lead to trouble. <BR><BR>Getting a *number* of such items may be a different story. <BR><BR>But note that this is a *lot* different than the Prime Directive. The<BR>rule isn't "No gear above local tech level". Instead it's "Don't overly<BR>disrupt the local society, it's bad for trade"<BR><BR>Yes, disruption is good for arms merchants. Butit's not good for<BR>ecerybody else. And eliminating potential customers is *very*<BR>short-sighted. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 17:13:32 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Honor Harrington Goodies<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; I have a Royal Manticoran Navy ballcap and a Honor Harrington <BR>&gt; "Battle Tour" t-shirt, they are nice quality, and look great.<BR><BR>I'm planning on buying some of that sort of thing. But I think I'd<BR>rather have an "Elysian Space Navy" cap. :-)<BR><BR>And the Harrington Steading stuff is on my list.<BR><BR>I note that pegasus publishing's web site also has Vorkogian related<BR>stuff as well. ImpSec "eyes" are only $6 a pair! And I *have* to get<BR>one of the ImpSec Interrogation t-shirts &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>Then there's the Miskatonic University stuff. Like the Alchemy<BR>Department lab coat. <BR><BR>And the IOU stuff. <BR><BR>But the absolute *sickest* thing on there has to be the Sub-genius<BR>Illuminati shirt. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 17:21:47 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3535<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Lightning from thunderstorms can release energy in the MeV (millions<BR>&gt; of volts) and the bolts can be up to 3 miles in length.<BR><BR>Whoa!<BR><BR>MeV is "millions of electronvolts", not "millions of volts". An<BR>"electronvolt" is the energy required to move an elerctron thru a<BR>potential difference of one volt. It's 1.60219e-19 joules.<BR>One Mev = 160 femtojoules = 160 milli-micro-micro-joules<BR><BR>It's a *tiny* amount of energy, but on an *atomic* scale, it's<BR>significant. <BR><BR>Lightning strikes probably have energies in the kilojoule to megajoule range.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 17:29:28 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; E. Get up at 0600.&nbsp; I'll be the only other person in the hotel that is<BR>&gt; moving.&nbsp; We'll do breakfast.<BR><BR>Nah, there will be *lots* of folks moving. Most of them won't have gone<BR>to bed yet.<BR><BR>You going to make Westercon? As I recall, we have it here in Portland<BR>this year.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 23:21:58 EST<BR>From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question (THANKS)<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/19/01 8:20:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; I also seem to recall that some forms of life can gain energy by breaking<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; down nitrogenous compounds into things like NO2.&nbsp; I wonder if this place<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; might have smog-producing plants?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; I can't see *how* that reaction would be energeticly favorable. <BR><BR>Probably wouldn't.&nbsp; A little research tells me that what I was remembering<BR>was the action of nitrifying bacteria in the soil.&nbsp; Those work by converting<BR>ammonium into nitrites and nitrates.&nbsp; Since it's an aerobic process, it<BR>won't work as efficiently on this planet where oxygen is relatively scarce.<BR>It doesn't produce gaseous nitrogen oxides anyway.<BR><BR>Besides, I've found that "canon" for this world has atmospheric nitrogen<BR>oxides being pretty scarce.&nbsp; So scratch that notion.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Meanwhile, you'd also get some nitrgen compounds dissolved in the<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; water.&nbsp; The surface water itself might be a very weak nitric-acid <BR>solution.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; It'd take some doing. The sort of reactions you are talking about are<BR>&gt;&nbsp; less efficient than photosynthesis. That means that photosynthetic<BR>&gt;&nbsp; organisms will crowd them out in short order.<BR><BR>Except that CO2 is relatively scarce in the atmosphere here -- not<BR>enough free oxygen, and less carbon available in the environment.<BR>So you'll get carbon-photosynthesis, but you'll also have a wider<BR>variety of anaerobic organisms.&nbsp; The canon description makes a<BR>handwave involving a photosynthetic reaction "unknown on Earth"<BR>which involves energy storage using nitrates. . .<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; The NOx idea is unlikely at best. If there's a lot of volcanic<BR>&gt;&nbsp; activity, then you could get lots of sulfur oxides. And there's always<BR>&gt;&nbsp; the old standby. Have more CO2 in the air. It doesn't take all that<BR>&gt;&nbsp; much to make long term exposure a *real* bad idea. <BR><BR>Can't do that, tempting as it is.&nbsp; Canon describes CO2 as being<BR>relatively scarce, and I suspect increasing the amount to the levels<BR>you're talking about would make the rest of the biochemistry as<BR>described fall apart.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Also, with volcanic activity, there may be a lot of dust in the air.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Most of it truly *nasty* for the lungs if you inhale it. Even though<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Portland only caught the fringe of a few dust clouds from Mt. St.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Helens, I'm all *too* familiar with *that*. <BR><BR>A possibility.&nbsp; I've also noticed that the partial pressure of oxygen<BR>is pretty marginal -- while it's probably sufficient, people undergoing<BR>strenuous work (and just moving around on the surface will be kind<BR>of strenuous) would find it lacking.&nbsp; Meanwhile, higher gravity gives<BR>you a shorter scale height, so you wouldn't have to get too far above<BR>sea level before "marginal" O2 became completely insufficient.<BR><BR>I think I'll downplay the "nitrogen narcosis" idea, since it doesn't look<BR>as if the partial pressure of nitrogen is high enough to produce rapid or<BR>serious effects.&nbsp; Can't dump it entirely, but I think rules involving a very<BR>occasional check for minor DX or IQ loss might be sufficient.<BR><BR>Meanwhile, you folks have convinced me that the "bends" is just not<BR>a serious problem in this environment -- too many ways to mitigate it,<BR>especially for people who will be living on this planet their whole lives.<BR><BR>A general note: thanks to everyone who's been responding on this one.<BR>You've saved me considerable legwork in several fields I'm not qualified<BR>for :-).<BR><BR>- ----------<BR>Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>set of people who will take offense at it."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 00:16:21 -0500<BR>From: michael stasica &lt;stosh@sympatico.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; SNIP<BR><BR>&gt; Or the inhabitants may be Amish. :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; It's perfectly possible for a culture to take a good hard look at high<BR>&gt; tech and decide that they don't *want* it. Many people have trouble<BR>&gt; understanding this. But it's a very real "attitude" (there's got to be<BR>&gt; a better word than that).<BR><BR>Ludite comes to mind.&nbsp; But an exact definition escapes me.<BR><BR>Michael<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 19:46:19 +1100<BR>From: "Katharine Whitchurch" &lt;katts@globalfreeway.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starpots and Tech Levels<BR><BR>&gt; From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>&gt; Note that a natural consequence of this is that there are certain low-tech<BR>&gt; industries which will die out completely, because for practical purposes<BR>&gt; 'low-tech' == 'poor'.&nbsp; For example, you may well see low-tech pickup<BR>trucks,<BR>&gt; and even low-tech pickup trucks which have been converted by bolting<BR>plates<BR>&gt; of armor on them, but you won't see low-tech tanks or fighters, because a<BR>&gt; higher-tech weapon system is typically _still_ a better bargain.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>A quick footnote here. One of the clauses in the Imperial Rules of War deals<BR>with "excessive extra-planetary influence". Now, of course, this important<BR>term is not defined, mostly to allow the Sophont on the Spot the maximum<BR>flexibility in dealing with the problem.<BR><BR>I can see it as quite possible that the Imperial Representitive on, say, TL5<BR>Heya may bounce imports of higher tech weaponary as being 'excessive<BR>extra-planetary influence', so the conflict on Heya may well be fought with<BR>TL5 tanks or fighters.<BR><BR>But this would be because the Imperial representitive wants it that way - a<BR>TL11 grav tank is worth a roughly infinite number of TL5 tanks.<BR><BR>Ian Whitchurch<BR><BR>PS Speaking of lo-tech troops CanCon is next weekend ... I'm running the<BR>Russian II Corps in the big Napoleonics game ... we should have about 50<BR>players in the game, with about 5000 figures a side.<BR><BR>We're caught on the wrong side of a river with 70 000 of our closest French<BR>friends.<BR><BR>The French think they've pulled a Freidland again, and in a strange way<BR>they're right :)<BR><BR>The bad news for them is that we're inside a loop of the river, and there<BR>will be Russian batteries from the Russian Reserve Corps and English heavy<BR>batteries from their I Corps as well ... you guys are all invited to the<BR>strategy session is on the Friday night, where important issues such as<BR>whether to open the vodka before or after the champagne will be discussed.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 01:51:42 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. (was Re: Psionic Institutes and Out-of-Print Games)<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;[snip]<BR>&gt; &gt;&lt;spit&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;[snip]<BR>&gt; &gt;&lt;spit&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;[snip]<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Careful, Jeff. You're gonna mess up your keyboard. 8^)<BR><BR>Hey!&nbsp; He's trying to rig his own keyboard kill!&nbsp; No fair!<BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 01:59:18 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt; It's perfectly possible for a culture to take a good hard look at <BR>&gt; high<BR>&gt; tech and decide that they don't *want* it. Many people have trouble<BR>&gt; understanding this. But it's a very real "attitude" (there's got to <BR>&gt; be<BR>&gt; a better word than that).<BR><BR>"worldview"?<BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 10:05:55 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>[On low-tech planets]<BR>On Fri, 19 Jan 2001, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; It's perfectly possible for a culture to take a good hard look at high<BR>&gt; tech and decide that they don't *want* it. Many people have trouble<BR>&gt; understanding this. But it's a very real "attitude" (there's got to be<BR>&gt; a better word than that).<BR>[snip]<BR>&gt; Any of these will drive Merchant characters *nuts*. &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>If you haven't already, check out Night's Dawn trilogy by Peter F.<BR>Hamilton.<BR><BR>It has a place like this, and a brilliant merchant. B-)<BR><BR>The trilogy gets worse in the end, but most of it is good. Even a bit<BR>traveller-like, even with nanotecnology and such stuff.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 19:51:43 +1100<BR>From: "Robert O'Connor" &lt;robocon@ozemail.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re : Quick environmental question (longish)<BR><BR>Jon Zeigler wrote :-<BR>&gt; Aha.&nbsp; On the other hand, what about (as Robert points out) nitrogen<BR>&gt; oxides?&nbsp; Since this planet has a fair amount of surface water, I imagine<BR>&gt; the air won't have high concentrations of these, but I seem to recall that<BR>&gt; even fairly small amounts of NO or NO2 are pretty toxic.<BR><BR>Yep :-<BR>Concentration&nbsp; &nbsp; Effect<BR>6-10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; statutory limits for occupational exposure (8 hours/24)<BR>50-150&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; airway inflammation - cough, shortness of breath in all persons<BR>exposed<BR>350&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 50% of subjects exposed will die*<BR>560-940&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; lethal dose to 100% of subjects exposed*<BR><BR>(concentration in mg/m^3 air at 1 atm and 25 C ; * - estimated!)<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote :-<BR>&gt; To have a hazardous level you need something *creating* them steadily.<BR>&gt; Here on earth lightning creates tiny amounts. and the internal<BR>&gt; combustion engine creates enough for places like LA to have reached the<BR>&gt; lower "toxic" levels during temperature inversions.<BR><BR>The original creators of the world postulated that the ecology was rich<BR>in niches for detrital food webs and 'reducers'.<BR><BR>So energy gains are often small, but various substances get produced :-<BR>6CO2 + 6NH3 + 6O2 -&gt; C6H12O6 + 6HNO3<BR><BR>2HNO3 + 2H2O + sunlight -&gt; 2NH3 + 4H2O<BR>(assimilative nitrate reduction in chloroplasts)<BR><BR>Or, using sulphur :-<BR>6CO2 + 3H2S + 6H2O -&gt; C6H12O6 + 3H2SO4<BR>(but requires anoxic environment)<BR><BR>Methanogenesis in anoxic environments ('swamp gas') is also another<BR>possibility.<BR><BR>&gt; There's an area in Africa where CO2 from some sort of volcanic activity<BR>&gt; "pools" in low lying areas. And kills animals.<BR>The most famous example was in Cameroon.<BR>CO2 diffuses into lakes, ponds, etc.<BR>The water becomes saturated with the gas. Subsequent volcanic or seismic<BR>activity leads to outgassing, like a big bottle of soft drink/soda.<BR>(E.g. Coke is pressurised to almost 4 ATA CO2).<BR><BR>&gt; Also, with volcanic activity, there may be a lot of dust in the air.<BR>&gt; Most of it truly *nasty* for the lungs if you inhale it.<BR>Agreed, it is a very good source for particulates.<BR><BR>The following generalisations can be made :-<BR>'Diameter'&nbsp; &nbsp; Fate<BR>5+ micrometres&nbsp; 95% trapped by nasopharynx<BR>1-5 micrometres sediment in small airways (terminal and respiratory<BR>bronchioles)<BR>&lt; 0.1 microm&nbsp; &nbsp; diffuse into alveoli<BR>Only 30% of 0.5 micrometre particles remain in the lung during<BR>normalresting breathing (the rest are exhaled).<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Clearance of retained particles is via two mechanisms : uptake by<BR>tissue macrophages and the 'mucociliary elevator' - an adult human<BR>produces about 40-50cc of mucus a day from the respiratory tree ;<BR>usually this is swallowed.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Inhalation of particulates can have a range of effects, e.g. :-- cough,<BR>wheeze, shortness of breath, bronchospasm (asthma) ;- pneumonia,<BR>pneumonitis, fibrosis (scarring) of the lung from chronic irritation and<BR>inflammation ; some rare cancers.<BR><BR>Particle concentration&nbsp; &nbsp; Effect<BR>75 microg/m3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Typical rural atmosphere<BR>260&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Typical urban atmosphere, TL 6-8<BR>375&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Mild hazard in susceptible individuals<BR>625&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Moderate hazard in susceptible individuals<BR>875&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Moderate hazard in otherwise healthy people<BR>1000&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Severe hazard, all persons<BR>[mcg/m3 air at 1 atm and 25C]*<BR><BR><BR>Robert O'Connor<BR>Medico, Gamer<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 01:02:28<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. (was Re: Psionic Institutes and Out-of-Print Games)<BR><BR>At 07:10 PM 1/19/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I also remember tell (in a MTJ editorial maybe?) of a massive hard-drive <BR>&gt;crash at DGP c. 1991 or 92 that wiped out much of the work up to that date <BR>&gt;on 'A.I.'&nbsp; How much survived, and how much they were able to reconstruct <BR>&gt;later, I suppose only he-who-shall-remain-nameless (hint, see above) can say <BR>&gt;for sure.<BR><BR>Oh, fer Pete's sake!<BR><BR>When writing Ground Forces, I had at least four copies on both my hard<BR>drive and three floppies.&nbsp; After each writing session, I'd make sure that<BR>all the back up disks were updated.&nbsp; So when I did have a hard drive<BR>problem, I just uploaded a copy from back up.<BR><BR>- --<BR><BR>Duugirashir Irebamenagiin&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&nbsp; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>Inquisitor Maximus, Reformed Canon Church of Sylea<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 01:07:28<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: OT Filk:&nbsp; Warning! Keyboard kills possible!<BR><BR>At 05:29 PM 1/19/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR>&gt;In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;You going to make Westercon? As I recall, we have it here in Portland<BR>&gt;this year.<BR><BR>Hm.&nbsp; Right now, I'm trying to see if I can swing GenConUK.&nbsp; If that isn't<BR>feasible, I might try to convince Kirsten that Westercon would be a<BR>suitable alternative.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>"There is no emoticon to express how I feel!"<BR>- -Comic Shop Guy, "The Simpsons"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 00:04:52 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; BTW, I expect that some types of energy weapons will be preferred over<BR>&gt;&gt; gunpowder type weapons. Why? Because rather than having to make a long<BR>&gt;&gt; trip to get more cartridges, you can simply crank away at a generator<BR>&gt;&gt; for a while. If you are hunting for food, or to protect your village<BR>&gt;&gt; against dangerous predators, setting some people (or the local<BR>&gt;&gt; horse/mule equivalent) to turning a generator to recharge the power<BR>&gt;&gt; pack is a *much* better deal.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; That really depends on the relative costs and maintenance requirements of <BR>&gt; the weapons.&nbsp; I wouldn't be too surprised to see a market for 'survival'<BR>&gt; weapons which are designed with solar collectors.<BR><BR>Nope. Solar cells are both too expensive (though that may go down) and<BR>*way* too bulky. They take up far too much space per kilowatt. They are<BR>also *fragile*.<BR><BR>But generators can be pretty damned rugged. And can be hooked to a lot<BR>of different power sources.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 00:07:08 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: [OT] Thanks!<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Howdy!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In a few minutes, I head off to Johns Hopkins to do a sleep study overnight.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Someone had posted an impassionded plea that we seek medical advice if we<BR>&gt; thought we had sleep apnea. I confess that that plea was the straw that got<BR>&gt; me off my ass. Thanks!<BR><BR>That may have been me. <BR><BR>Check out alt.support.sleep-disorders (not sure about the hypen) if you<BR>do have it. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 00:09:21 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question (THANKS)<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; In a message dated 1/19/01 8:20:34 PM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>&gt; shadow@krypton.rain.com writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Probably wouldn't.&nbsp; A little research tells me that what I was remembering<BR>&gt; was the action of nitrifying bacteria in the soil.&nbsp; Those work by converting<BR>&gt; ammonium into nitrites and nitrates.&nbsp; Since it's an aerobic process, it<BR>&gt; won't work as efficiently on this planet where oxygen is relatively scarce.<BR>&gt; It doesn't produce gaseous nitrogen oxides anyway.<BR><BR>If there's enough oxygen to breathe, and free water, oxygen is *not*<BR>"scarce". <BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; It'd take some doing. The sort of reactions you are talking about are<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; less efficient than photosynthesis. That means that photosynthetic<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; organisms will crowd them out in short order.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Except that CO2 is relatively scarce in the atmosphere here -- not<BR>&gt; enough free oxygen, and less carbon available in the environment.<BR><BR>Again, "free oxygen" is anything *but* rare if the atmosphere is<BR>breathable. <BR><BR>&gt; So you'll get carbon-photosynthesis, but you'll also have a wider<BR>&gt; variety of anaerobic organisms.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Nope. Anaerobic organisms can't stand amounts of oxygen that are *far*<BR>lower than what we can breathe. <BR><BR>&gt; The canon description makes a<BR>&gt; handwave involving a photosynthetic reaction "unknown on Earth"<BR>&gt; which involves energy storage using nitrates. . .<BR><BR>Not as efficient as glucose. And likely to result in plants (and<BR>animals?) that are *highly* flammable. <BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; The NOx idea is unlikely at best. If there's a lot of volcanic<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; activity, then you could get lots of sulfur oxides. And there's always<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; the old standby. Have more CO2 in the air. It doesn't take all that<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; much to make long term exposure a *real* bad idea. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Can't do that, tempting as it is.&nbsp; Canon describes CO2 as being<BR>&gt; relatively scarce, and I suspect increasing the amount to the levels<BR>&gt; you're talking about would make the rest of the biochemistry as<BR>&gt; described fall apart.<BR><BR>The thing is, without reasonable amounts of CO2 there won't *be* a<BR>biochemistry. That's where *all* the carbon used by life on a planet<BR>comes from.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; Also, with volcanic activity, there may be a lot of dust in the air.<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; Most of it truly *nasty* for the lungs if you inhale it. Even though<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; Portland only caught the fringe of a few dust clouds from Mt. St.<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; Helens, I'm all *too* familiar with *that*. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; A possibility.&nbsp; I've also noticed that the partial pressure of oxygen<BR>&gt; is pretty marginal -- while it's probably sufficient, people undergoing<BR>&gt; strenuous work (and just moving around on the surface will be kind<BR>&gt; of strenuous) would find it lacking.&nbsp; Meanwhile, higher gravity gives<BR>&gt; you a shorter scale height, so you wouldn't have to get too far above<BR>&gt; sea level before "marginal" O2 became completely insufficient.<BR><BR>No, that's a Type F atmosphere. <BR><BR>A&nbsp; &nbsp; Exotic&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Requires special protective equipment<BR>B&nbsp; &nbsp; Corrosive&nbsp; &nbsp; Requires protective suit<BR>C&nbsp; &nbsp; Insidious&nbsp; &nbsp; Requires protective suit<BR>D&nbsp; &nbsp; Dense, high&nbsp; &nbsp; Breathable at above a minimum altitude<BR>E&nbsp; &nbsp; Ellipsoid&nbsp; &nbsp; Breathable at certain latitudes<BR>F&nbsp; &nbsp; Thin, low&nbsp; &nbsp; Breathable below certain altitudes<BR><BR>Classic example of type D is Plateau. <BR>Classic example of type E is Jinx.<BR>Classic example of type F is Canyon.<BR>All from Niven's Known Space.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3541<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yh04.mx.aol.com (rly-yh04.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.36]) by air-yh01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 06:07:21 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yh04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 06:07:06 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id GAA94686;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 06:06:35 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sat, 20 Jan 2001 06:06:25 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id GAA94623<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 06:06:25 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 06:06:25 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101201106.GAA94623@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3541<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3542</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/20/01 11:47:51 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Saturday, January 20 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3542<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>Re: Quick environmental question (THANKS)<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starpots and Tech Levels<BR>Re: A.I. RPG<BR>Re: A.I. RPG<BR>Two Questions...<BR>Re: Two Questions...<BR>Re: Quick environmental question<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: A.I.<BR>Re: Quick environmental question (THANKS)<BR>Re: Quick environmental question (THANKS)<BR>Re: Getting rid of a HUGE collection...<BR>Re:Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR>Re: Getting rid of a HUGE collection...<BR>God Emperor of Dune<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 01:47:57 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; SNIP<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Or the inhabitants may be Amish. :-)<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; It's perfectly possible for a culture to take a good hard look at high<BR>&gt;&gt; tech and decide that they don't *want* it. Many people have trouble<BR>&gt;&gt; understanding this. But it's a very real "attitude" (there's got to be<BR>&gt;&gt; a better word than that).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Ludite comes to mind.&nbsp; But an exact definition escapes me.<BR><BR>Nope, in fact you've shown *exactly* the sort of misunderstanding I',m<BR>talking about in the sentence before the one you responded to.<BR><BR>Technology (*any* technology) has costs as well as benefits. And<BR>sometimes the beniefits aren't worth the costs. <BR><BR>For example, a tractor may allow a farmer to cultivate more land. But<BR>it also requires him to buy fuel and spare parts. And likely requires<BR>him to replace his plows and other tools.<BR><BR>On top of that, he has to buy fertilizer that he formerly got for free<BR>from his draft animals. <BR><BR>Then consider that he may not be *able* to expand the area he<BR>cultivates even if he *does* have a tractor. Say because he's farming<BR>all the land that's suitable, or because he's farmming all the land he<BR>owns, and is surrounded by neighbors. <BR><BR>So a tractor has a *negative* cost/benefit ratio for him. <BR><BR>On the other hand, if you can sell him disease resistant seed, that's<BR>going to be a quite different matter.<BR><BR>Seeds with "improved yield" may or may not be a good idea. It depends<BR>on things like whether they need more fertilizer or more water. If they<BR>do, they may not be a good idea.<BR><BR>See, that's the thing. *All* "improvements" need to be checked out<BR>*carefully* for drawbacks. <BR><BR>Alas, most of the people pushing that idea have biases against various<BR>technologies and don't give them an *honest* evaluation.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 05:42:19 -0500<BR>From: "Daniel Phelps" &lt;phelpsd@gate.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Was written:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; It's perfectly possible for a culture to take a good hard look at<BR>&gt;&gt; high<BR>&gt;&gt; tech and decide that they don't *want* it. Many people have trouble<BR>&gt;&gt; understanding this. But it's a very real "attitude" (there's got to<BR>&gt;&gt; be<BR>&gt;&gt; a better word than that).<BR><BR><BR>A good example of this is the example of the first introduction of&nbsp; firearms<BR>into Japan in the 16th? 17th? century.&nbsp; Such weapons, after being<BR>introduced, went out of favor and were essentially abolished for<BR>political/cultural reasons for an extended period of time.&nbsp; Thinking about<BR>it, the use of carriages in Medieval/Renn Era Japan would be an example as<BR>well.&nbsp; My remembrance is that while known only the Emperor had one as they<BR>were determined to be detrimental to roads.&nbsp; The lack of roads suitable and<BR>the will to create them was also cited if I remember correctly.&nbsp; Thus<BR>palanquins were the mod of travel.&nbsp;&nbsp; As my memory of where I read this is<BR>fuzzy does anyone know more of the specifics of this bit of possibly ill<BR>remembered of history?<BR><BR>I remember a classic story where wheeled vehicles/conveyances could not be<BR>used because of religious prohibitions.&nbsp; This included rollers by the way.<BR>It presented interesting problems to some folks who had crashed and need to<BR>move some heavy objects to get themselves off planet.<BR><BR>Dan<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 11:59 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Oregon Full-Auto Visitors Bureau<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;B68E20E3.3AB9%webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>AAEEERRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!<BR><BR>Stop it.<BR><BR>My trigger finger is itching :-(<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 11:59 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;20010120121136.A7940@freeman.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>On low pressure effects, I read a rather nasty thriller a couple of months <BR>ago about a catestrophic decompression of an airliner at high altitude. <BR>Even with a crash dive from the pilot (more because he collapsed onto the <BR>controls than did it on purpose!) vitually everybody except those in small <BR>enclosed spaces (a bloke who was in the lavvie) suffered serious permanent <BR>brain damage if they survived at all.<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 11:59 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question (THANKS)<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;10120.000921.2U6.rnr.w165w@krypton.rain.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>Unknown (on Earth) photosynthetic pathways involving storage of <BR>nitrates????<BR><BR>Hmmm.... don't give me ideas.... and would you believe when I looked in <BR>the porch in daylight I found the dive manuals nestling underneath a text <BR>book entitled "The Biochemistry of Photosynthesis"?<BR><BR>(My doctoral research was plant physiology.... )<BR><BR>Hey, want something slightly better than a handwave for the photosynthetic <BR>pathway? I'm sure I could invent a spot of pseudo-biochemistry if you <BR>like.<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 21:37:26 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt; From: michael stasica <BR>&gt; Ludite comes to mind.&nbsp; But an exact definition escapes me.<BR><BR>The Luddites were an organised and armed rebel movement in 18th century<BR>England noted for destroying the machinery in textile mills that were<BR>displacing manual textile workers and driving them into poverty.<BR><BR>Naturally enough, they were slandered by the powers that be, and portrayed<BR>as mindless, anti-progress vandals.&nbsp; In fact, they were the good guys.<BR>(IMHO, of course.)<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 21:49:59 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starpots and Tech Levels<BR><BR>&gt; From: Ian Whitchurch<BR>&gt; PS Speaking of lo-tech troops CanCon is next weekend ... I'm running the<BR>&gt; Russian II Corps in the big Napoleonics game ... we should have about 50<BR>&gt; players in the game, with about 5000 figures a side.<BR><BR>&lt;jealous&gt;&nbsp; :&nbsp; (<BR><BR>&gt; The French think they've pulled a Freidland again, and in a strange way<BR>&gt; they're right :)<BR><BR>I wonder why?&nbsp; :&nbsp; )<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; English heavy batteries from their I Corps as well ... you guys are all<BR>&gt; invited to the strategy session is on the Friday night, where important<BR>&gt; issues such as whether to open the vodka before or after the champagne<BR>&gt; will be discussed.<BR><BR>Again&nbsp; :&nbsp; (<BR><BR>Champagne before vodka, definitely.&nbsp; Since there are English officers<BR>present, probably port in between.<BR><BR>I believe there is a Pike and Shot competition on at CanCon - that would be<BR>my thing of choice, if I had been able to make it.&nbsp; Trouble with Pike and<BR>Shot is that everyone and their dog play New Model Army.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 09:31:01 EST<BR>From: Kagehira@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. RPG<BR><BR>- --part1_7a.f6e0607.279afb25_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/19/01 3:03:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt;Speaking of out-of-print games, does anyone know if Digest Group<BR>&gt; &gt;Publications produced any copies of the "A.I." RPG?&nbsp; Seems like it was<BR>&gt; &gt;advertised ~1992 or so in Challenge magazine.&nbsp; And other than "Vilani<BR>&gt; &gt;and Vargr" and "Solomani and Aslan", were any of the other DGP<BR>&gt; &gt;Megatraveller alien sourcebooks ever published (Zhodani and Droyne,<BR>&gt; &gt;etc.)?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; No, this fell into Roger &lt;spit&gt; Sanger's hands with the collapse of DGP,<BR>&gt; and Roger &lt;spit&gt; Sanger has done with it what he has done with _every_<BR>&gt; project that has ever fallen into his hands.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>It never went much past a few page draft....... Basically an attempt at <BR>character generation and a few example pieces of equipment. Joe was supposed <BR>to write a novel based on the world a few years back (somewhere around '95 I <BR>think), I don't think that went anywhere either.<BR><BR>The attempts that tried expanding beyond that didn't work, I think I cam up <BR>with part of a solution to the problem at the time (in any case I have one <BR>now).<BR><BR>Bryan<BR><BR><BR>- --part1_7a.f6e0607.279afb25_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT size=2>In a message dated 1/19/01 3:03:46 PM Pacific Standard Time, <BR><BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>&lt;BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"&gt;&amp;gt;Speaking of out-of-print games, does anyone know if Digest Group<BR><BR>&amp;gt;Publications produced any copies of the "A.I." RPG? &amp;nbsp;Seems like it was<BR><BR>&amp;gt;advertised ~1992 or so in Challenge magazine. &amp;nbsp;And other than "Vilani<BR><BR>&amp;gt;and Vargr" and "Solomani and Aslan", were any of the other DGP<BR><BR>&amp;gt;Megatraveller alien sourcebooks ever published (Zhodani and Droyne,<BR><BR>&amp;gt;etc.)?<BR><BR><BR><BR>No, this fell into Roger &amp;lt;spit&amp;gt; Sanger's hands with the collapse of DGP,<BR><BR>and Roger &amp;lt;spit&amp;gt; Sanger has done with it what he has done with _every_<BR><BR>project that has ever fallen into his hands.<BR><BR>&lt;/BLOCKQUOTE&gt;<BR><BR><BR><BR>It never went much past a few page draft....... Basically an attempt at <BR><BR>character generation and a few example pieces of equipment. Joe was supposed <BR><BR>to write a novel based on the world a few years back (somewhere around '95 I <BR><BR>think), I don't think that went anywhere either.<BR><BR><BR><BR>The attempts that tried expanding beyond that didn't work, I think I cam up <BR><BR>with part of a solution to the problem at the time (in any case I have one <BR><BR>now).<BR><BR><BR><BR>Bryan<BR><BR></FONT><BR><BR>- --part1_7a.f6e0607.279afb25_boundary--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 09:42:36 EST<BR>From: Kagehira@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. RPG<BR><BR>- --part1_68.b4d7407.279afddc_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/20/01 3:07:21 AM Pacific Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Oh, fer Pete's sake!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; When writing Ground Forces, I had at least four copies on both my hard<BR>&gt; drive and three floppies.&nbsp; After each writing session, I'd make sure that<BR>&gt; all the back up disks were updated.&nbsp; So when I did have a hard drive<BR>&gt; problem, I just uploaded a copy from back up.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR><BR>That was you. Joe wasn't so hot on backup's though (as for Roger I don't <BR>know, but Joe had the dataloss), so he lost a bit of material (more than once <BR>I think over the years)..... (and neither am I, mostly because I don't have <BR>what I consider a good backup device).<BR><BR>Bryan<BR><BR><BR>- --part1_68.b4d7407.279afddc_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT size=2>In a message dated 1/20/01 3:07:21 AM Pacific Standard Time, <BR><BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>&lt;BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"&gt;Oh, fer Pete's sake!<BR><BR><BR><BR>When writing Ground Forces, I had at least four copies on both my hard<BR><BR>drive and three floppies. &amp;nbsp;After each writing session, I'd make sure that<BR><BR>all the back up disks were updated. &amp;nbsp;So when I did have a hard drive<BR><BR>problem, I just uploaded a copy from back up.<BR><BR><BR><BR>&lt;/BLOCKQUOTE&gt;<BR><BR><BR><BR>That was you. Joe wasn't so hot on backup's though (as for Roger I don't <BR><BR>know, but Joe had the dataloss), so he lost a bit of material (more than once <BR><BR>I think over the years)..... (and neither am I, mostly because I don't have <BR><BR>what I consider a good backup device).<BR><BR><BR><BR>Bryan<BR><BR></FONT><BR><BR>- --part1_68.b4d7407.279afddc_boundary--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 09:37:04 -0500<BR>From: "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Two Questions...<BR><BR>First, since I am new to this whole RPG thing, can you suggest some on-line<BR>retailers (US)?<BR><BR>Second, since the prospect of getting Traveller miniatures seems to be nil<BR>to none, can you suggest suitable substitutes?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 15:21:11 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Two Questions...<BR><BR>I've used www.dragontrove.com and www.nobleknight.com a number of times and <BR>give high marks for service to both...<BR><BR><BR>- ----Original Message Follows----<BR>From: "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To: "Traveller" &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Two Questions...<BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 09:37:04 -0500<BR><BR>First, since I am new to this whole RPG thing, can you suggest some on-line<BR>retailers (US)?<BR><BR>Second, since the prospect of getting Traveller miniatures seems to be nil<BR>to none, can you suggest suitable substitutes?<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 15:47:13 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question<BR><BR>This thread reminds me of "shadows". GT: BTC has the atmosphere of Yorbund <BR>(IIRC), having a high concentration of fluorine. CT has a corrosive <BR>atmosphere. Even a few breaths of it could leave the PC's with lung damage. <BR>A suit leak deep in the pyramids could prove fatal.<BR><BR>Mike<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 09:43:31 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>On Sat, 20 Jan 2001 00:04:52 PST shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Nope. Solar cells are both too expensive (though that may go down) and<BR>&gt;*way* too bulky. They take up far too much space per kilowatt. They are<BR>&gt;also *fragile*.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Not at TL 16. Heck, nearly not at TL 8! Current commercial solar power<BR>supplies are pretty tough. They're just expensive, and the cost differential<BR>is coming down rapidly....there are more and more homes being built in the<BR>boonies here in Az using solar power because running the powerline that mile<BR>or so from the nearest pole isn't cost effective. Some more shenanigans like<BR>PGE is pulling in CA, and a LOT more people and businesses are going to start<BR>considering getting the heck off the grid. <BR><BR>Of course, these homes are also dependent on cell phones (and CB or HAM<BR>radios) for commo.<BR><BR>At TL 16 solar collectors may be large, but they'll just be the roof shingles.<BR><BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 12:02:11 -0500<BR>From: Thom Jones-Low &lt;tjoneslo@together.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 16:35:20 -0500<BR>&gt; From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Starports and tech levels<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &lt;quote&gt;<BR>&gt; Note that a natural consequence of this is that there are certain <BR>&gt; low-tech industries which will die out completely, because for <BR>&gt; practical purposes 'low-tech' == 'poor'.&nbsp; For example, you may well <BR>&gt; see low-tech pickup trucks, and even low-tech pickup trucks which <BR>&gt; have been converted by bolting plates of armor on them, but you <BR>&gt; won't see low-tech tanks or fighters, because a higher-tech weapon <BR>&gt; system is typically _still_ a better bargain.<BR>&gt; &lt;quote&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; ***That's a great, and probably realistic, image.&nbsp; I still maintain <BR>&gt; that there will be a lot fewer of these low tech worlds around than <BR>&gt; the canon would have you believe.&nbsp; That the presence and interaction <BR>&gt; of the Imperium is going to bring these planets out of their muck <BR>&gt; much quicker than Earth advanced.&nbsp; Regardless of whether a world <BR>&gt; can pay for high-tech goods, those who think they can will risk <BR>&gt; the well-being of their fellows to get ahead. Surely the leaders <BR>&gt; of such woulds could amass the funds necessary to get at the good <BR>&gt; stuff.&nbsp; For an idea of how these worlds might feel, read the <BR>&gt; story "Mozart in Mirrorshades" in _Mirrorshades:&nbsp; The Cyberpunk <BR>&gt; Anthology_. Preventing this process which sounds contrary to <BR>&gt; Imperial policy.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Actually if you do the analysis, something like 90% of the Imperium's<BR>population is at TL9 or better, Steller tech.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Look at http://maps.grandsurvey.com for Anthony Jackson's analysis of<BR>the know canon Imperial maps, plus trade route map. <BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; So in there is support in canon for your assertion that the "Low Tech"<BR>areas of the Imperium are so small to be almost insignficant. And small<BR>enough that the handwaves of Luddite/Amish/anit-technology or nature<BR>reserve worlds makes some sense. <BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The last impediment to why all the worlds in the Imperium are not TTL15<BR>is the assumption that each succeding TL requires as much infrastructure<BR>investment as all of the previous ones. So getting a world to TTL 9 is a<BR>relativly cheap investment even for a high population world. But beyond<BR>that each succeeding TL is a serious investment, and jumping TLs is even<BR>more expensive. <BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thomas Jones-Low<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; tjoneslo@together.net<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 12:46:55 -0500<BR>From: Thom Jones-Low &lt;tjoneslo@together.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A.I.<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 01:02:28<BR>&gt; From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: A.I. (was Re: Psionic Institutes and Out-of-Print Games)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; At 07:10 PM 1/19/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;I also remember tell (in a MTJ editorial maybe?) of a massive hard-drive<BR>&gt; &gt;crash at DGP c. 1991 or 92 that wiped out much of the work up to that date<BR>&gt; &gt;on 'A.I.'&nbsp; How much survived, and how much they were able to reconstruct<BR>&gt; &gt;later, I suppose only he-who-shall-remain-nameless (hint, see above) can say<BR>&gt; &gt;for sure.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Oh, fer Pete's sake!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; When writing Ground Forces, I had at least four copies on both my hard<BR>&gt; drive and three floppies.&nbsp; After each writing session, I'd make sure that<BR>&gt; all the back up disks were updated.&nbsp; So when I did have a hard drive<BR>&gt; problem, I just uploaded a copy from back up.<BR>&gt; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Yes, but you are at the long end of huge number the "Oh my god, my hard<BR>drive just crashed and I lost six years worth of work!!!, They never<BR>crash, not on me!!!" stories.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I work with some large companies, and a bad hard drive there would<BR>destroy a whole lot of irreplaceable data. Despite being told the<BR>dangers. And I'm sure a number of the other computer consultants on this<BR>list can relate a number of equally scary stories.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; So, bonus point to you for having learned the "If it's important, back<BR>it up" lesson. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thomas Jones-Low<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; tjoneslo@together.net<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 11:59:16 EST<BR>From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question (THANKS)<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/20/01 6:07:58 AM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; Not as efficient as glucose. And likely to result in plants (and<BR>&gt;&nbsp; animals?) that are *highly* flammable. <BR><BR>Heh.&nbsp; I seem to remember a throwaway line from canon material<BR>about a "grenade fruit."<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; The thing is, without reasonable amounts of CO2 there won't *be* a<BR>&gt;&nbsp; biochemistry. That's where *all* the carbon used by life on a planet<BR>&gt;&nbsp; comes from.<BR><BR>I know that much :-).&nbsp; There is CO2 in this environment, there just<BR>isn't very much -- hence the handwave about the biology needing to<BR>conserve carbon and using something other than glucose to store<BR>energy.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;No, that's a Type F atmosphere. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;A&nbsp; Exotic&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Requires special protective equipment<BR>&gt;B&nbsp; Corrosive&nbsp;&nbsp; Requires protective suit<BR>&gt;C&nbsp; Insidious&nbsp;&nbsp; Requires protective suit<BR>&gt;D&nbsp; Dense, high Breathable at above a minimum altitude<BR>&gt;E&nbsp; Ellipsoid&nbsp;&nbsp; Breathable at certain latitudes<BR>&gt;F&nbsp; Thin, low&nbsp;&nbsp; Breathable below certain altitudes<BR><BR>Yes, Leonard, I do know what the atmosphere codes mean :-).&nbsp; This<BR>case doesn't exactly fit into any of them, I'm afraid -- the canonical<BR>case of a Type F is a "thin, low" atmosphere which only reaches<BR>breathable pressures at low altitudes.&nbsp; Here the atmosphere is quite<BR>dense, but the oxygen partial pressure is marginal even at sea level,<BR>so you get the same effect as a Type F as far as breathability goes.<BR>(Traveller normally assumes that the partial pressure of oxygen<BR>is directly proportional to the total atmospheric pressure, but there's<BR>no reason why this has to be the case in reality.)<BR><BR>- ----------<BR>Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>set of people who will take offense at it."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 12:01:28 EST<BR>From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Quick environmental question (THANKS)<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/20/01 7:01:47 AM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk writes:<BR><BR>&gt; Hey, want something slightly better than a handwave for the photosynthetic <BR>&gt;&nbsp; pathway? I'm sure I could invent a spot of pseudo-biochemistry if you <BR>&gt;&nbsp; like.<BR><BR>If you want to for curiosity's sake.&nbsp; I suspect for the material that will<BR>see print I had better leave it as a handwave.&nbsp; I'm having a hard time<BR>believing in this biochemistry as it is, and in any case these details<BR>are a bit beyond what we want in an RPG setting.<BR><BR>- ----------<BR>Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>set of people who will take offense at it."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 12:35:20 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Getting rid of a HUGE collection...<BR><BR>Hi, Roger --<BR><BR>I am, in fact, looking to complete my collection of some <BR>Traveller-related items, and would be interested in buying them if <BR>you've got them for a price I can manage:<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; DGP<BR>The Traveller Digest (iss. 1-3, 5)<BR>Megatraveller Digest (any issues)<BR>101 Robots<BR>101 Vehicles<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; FASA<BR>(pretty much anything by the Keith brothers, besides the _Sky Raiders_ trilogy)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; GAMELORDS<BR>The Mountain Environment, the Desert Environment, and any of the <BR>three "environmental adventure" books they published.<BR><BR>I'd also be interested in _Call of Cthulhu_ RPG stuff you might have, <BR>if you come up with a list...<BR><BR>Thanks very much for letting us know about this; I appreciate the opportunity!<BR><BR>Kenji<BR><BR><BR><BR>At 2:03 AM -0800 1/18/01, Roger Sanger wrote:<BR>&gt;Hi everyone,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I've come to the realization that I'm RPG-insane.&nbsp; :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;During spring cleaning (so, I've started a little early), while <BR>&gt;dusting out my library, I couldn't help scratch my head wondering <BR>&gt;why on Earth I've accumulated 2000+ Traveller and other RPG gaming <BR>&gt;products (not counting 500 or so spares).&nbsp; At my weekly game <BR>&gt;session, it would take me a century or two to play it all!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Yes, I went Traveller nuts!&nbsp; I collected everything I could find on <BR>&gt;Traveller, even the fanzines.&nbsp; Then I collected every other sci-fi <BR>&gt;game I could find as support material for my Traveller campaign. I <BR>&gt;even collected Traveller paraphernalia -- posters, originals of the <BR>&gt;artwork, unpublished works in progress, etc. -- I even have an <BR>&gt;original red on black Traveller T-shirt!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;After scratching my head almost bald about what to do with this <BR>&gt;stuff, I've started the daunting chore of inventorying most all of <BR>&gt;it for sale.&nbsp; (I need to clear some shelf space for some real books).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;'Thought you might like first crack at the pile...&nbsp; So, if there is <BR>&gt;anything you want me to keep an eye out for (sci-fi or fantasy - the <BR>&gt;D&amp;D/AD&amp;D section of the collection is about as large as the sci-fi <BR>&gt;section) while I'm digging through this stuff,&nbsp; please drop me a <BR>&gt;note at rodge@nwnexus.com.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sincerely,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Roger Sanger<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; rodge@nwnexus.com<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; P.S.:&nbsp; Please don't clutter up this list with your replies. <BR>&gt;Send all queries directly to me at rodge@nwnexus.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 12:52:00 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re:Mysterious black monolith appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>At 12:44 PM -0500 1/19/01, Laning wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Curious info about the Norwegian fishermen, but just how does one gather<BR>&gt;accurate statistics about consumption of highly illegal substances?&nbsp; "Ya,<BR>&gt;sure by gosh and by golly, Sven uses a lot.&nbsp; Even more than Lars.&nbsp; But I<BR>&gt;use twice as much as Sven."&nbsp; As Olie, Sven, and Lars wink at each other<BR>&gt;while the earnest young survey taker scribbles excited notes on his clipboard.<BR><BR>Nah.&nbsp; Combination of treatment facility and ER intake records plus <BR>law enforcement (city, state, federal) arrest and surveillance <BR>reports.&nbsp; Nicely summarized by your friendly DEA.&nbsp; Social workers in <BR>the glorious land of opportunity of the PNW generally don't find this <BR>neighborhood a big priority, compared to the others.<BR><BR>Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 13:12:07 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Getting rid of a HUGE collection...<BR><BR>Oh, *crap*.<BR><BR>Sorry about that, everyone.<BR><BR><BR>Doing the devil's work every day,<BR><BR>Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 13:40:14 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: God Emperor of Dune<BR><BR>*spoiler*<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>I just read the chapter where the God-Emperor is travelling to Onn for<BR>the royal viewing.&nbsp; He's in his cart, and he has his Fish Speaker troops<BR>around him, with the new Duncan in command.<BR><BR>Museum Fremen scrabble up from the sides of the road, waving a petition,<BR>yelling about an auidence.<BR><BR>Moneo, Leto's majordomo, is not concerned, because he prearranged this<BR>"audience" with the Museum Fremen.<BR><BR>The Fremen approach, drop their travel cloaks--then drop their<BR>under-robes to reveal that each is wearing a plain Atreides uniform,<BR>just like Duncan Idaho.<BR><BR>Then their faces change....the Museum have been replaced with Face<BR>Dancers!&nbsp; It is a hoard of Duncan Idahos!<BR><BR>The Fish Speakers move to protect the God-Emperor, but the Face Dancers<BR>have lasguns--the Fish Speakers are only using stun clubs!<BR><BR>What a fight!<BR><BR>Leto retracts the wheels on the royal cart and moves into anti-grav<BR>mode.&nbsp; There's this huge, half-man, half-worm being wading through the<BR>Face Dancer hoard with bodies being deflected and mowed down like a semi<BR>plowing through a cluster of nats.<BR><BR>And all the time, the God-Emperor is laughing...this deep, belly laugh<BR>coming from the cart.<BR><BR>This series is so, friggin', awesome.<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3542<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-ye01.mx.aol.com (rly-ye01.mail.aol.com [172.18.151.198]) by air-ye04.mail.aol.com (v77.35) with ESMTP; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 14:47:51 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-ye01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 14:47:19 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id OAA13256;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 14:44:31 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sat, 20 Jan 2001 14:42:37 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id OAA13183<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 14:42:37 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 14:42:37 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101201942.OAA13183@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3542<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3543</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/21/01 2:24:21 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sunday, January 21 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3543<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Mercenaries<BR>Who's making the money?<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Two Questions...<BR>Jump Masking<BR>RE: Mysterious black tar heroin appears in Seattle park<BR>GT PBeM?<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: A.I. RPG<BR>RE: Commie Atheist Films (was: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3417)<BR>Re: God Emperor of Dune<BR>Re: A.I. RPG<BR>Two Questions... one answer<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: God Emperor of Dune<BR>Re: Mysterious black tar heroin appears in Seattle park<BR>Re: Two Questions...<BR>Re: Two Questions...<BR>Re: A.I. RPG<BR>RE: Landgrab rules'<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 08:14:03 +1100<BR>From: "Katharine Whitchurch" &lt;katts@globalfreeway.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Mercenaries<BR><BR>&gt; From: "Walt Smith" &lt;firelock_ny@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Mercenaries (was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3538)<BR>&gt; A real problem will be things like backpack-sized or hand-held<BR>&gt; high-tech anti-vehicular weaponry.&nbsp; A Free Trader can bring enough<BR>&gt; crates of these in one run to probably put paid to every<BR>&gt; low-tech vehicle the planetary government owns.&nbsp; All the rebels<BR>&gt; need to do is find a Free Trader captain willing to loan them<BR>&gt; the money to pay for them.&nbsp; If they lose, they're dead anyway...<BR>&gt; if they win, their new government is in deep debt to off-world<BR>&gt; weapons merchants.&nbsp; Lovely.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>The key phrases here are "Imperial Rules of War" and "excessive<BR>extra-planetary influence". Basically, IMO once a conflict is declared, then<BR>each of the belligerents is going to have to declare what assistance they<BR>are receiving to the Imperial Representitive. If the Imperial Representitive<BR>is doing their job, they should warn the belligerents once they are<BR>beginning to float close to the edge of the rules.<BR><BR>&lt;good reasons for why the Rules of War developed they did snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; An interstellar government that wants anything to govern<BR>&gt; had better keep mercenaries on a leash almost tight<BR>&gt; enough to strangle 'em, and should seriously consider<BR>&gt; tightening it even more.<BR><BR>I believe one of the many reasons the Imperium out-competed it's rivals in<BR>the expansion period was that the development of the Rules of War allowed<BR>this problem to be avoided.<BR><BR>Ian Whitchurch<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 14:57:38 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Who's making the money?<BR><BR>&gt;Some more shenanigans like<BR>&gt;PGE is pulling in CA, and a LOT more people and businesses are going to start<BR>&gt;considering getting the heck off the grid.<BR><BR>It's not Pure Greed &amp; Exploitation...<BR><BR>Look back to who paid for the junkets that resulted in deregulation.<BR><BR>This is a good example for cut throat merchant campaigns.<BR><BR><BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>urbin@bigfoot.com -- These opinions are mine, no one else wants `em.<BR>"This has the characteristic look and feel of a complete fiasco."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 12:02:38 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt;Thom Jones-Low wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; The last impediment to why all the worlds in the Imperium are not TTL15<BR>&gt;is the assumption that each succeding TL requires as much infrastructure<BR>&gt;investment as all of the previous ones. So getting a world to TTL 9 is a<BR>&gt;relativly cheap investment even for a high population world. But beyond<BR>&gt;that each succeeding TL is a serious investment, and jumping TLs is even<BR>&gt;more expensive.<BR><BR>This is the part of the rationale i've always had trouble with. It <BR>says, in effect, that you have to build a copper wire telegraphy <BR>system before you can install a cellular or satellite network, that <BR>you have to build waterwheel driven factories before coal fired <BR>before solar powered, that you have to build and use each generation <BR>of computer before the current best. This is somewhat shaky when <BR>considering internal development. Some cultures or planets might skip <BR>a step, as a result of differential resource availability if for no <BR>other reason. When we consider assistance from an outside source, as <BR>in Pocket Empires where an uplifted colony must pass through each <BR>tech level in turn, it is downright screwy, and does no match what we <BR>see on Earth today where lesser developed countries adopt - and <BR>sometimes build - the latest computers without first using rooms full <BR>of vacuum tubes, and install cellular networks and satellite TV <BR>without first building wire and cable networks.<BR><BR>By this rationale, we really shouldn't be allowed to put research <BR>satellites in Mars orbit as the is no wire telegraphy system in place <BR>on Mars.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 12:05:55 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Two Questions...<BR><BR>&gt;First, since I am new to this whole RPG thing, can you suggest some on-line<BR>&gt;retailers (US)?<BR><BR>Not U.S., but North American<BR><BR>http://www.sentrybox.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 20:20:42 GMT<BR>From: Postmark Design Bureau &lt;postmark.design@btinternet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Jump Masking<BR><BR>I'll have to admit that I'm not convinced by jump masking, especially<BR>the "rock halfway to the destination problem", however...<BR><BR>If jump masking causes a ship to automatically drop out of jump at the <BR>100D limit, how do I jump from within a 100D limit.<BR><BR>Surely, I'll be dropped directly out of jump (after a week) due to<BR>jump masking.<BR><BR>Now if you simply had the restriction that the exit point had to be<BR>outside a 100D limit, then there is no problem.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Phil Kitching, http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo<BR>Postmark Design Bureau, Laser Communications Division<BR>"For when your message must get through"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 16:02:40 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Mysterious black tar heroin appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>Laning wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Curious info about the Norwegian fishermen, but just how does one gather<BR>&gt;accurate statistics about consumption of highly illegal substances?&nbsp; "Ya,<BR>&gt;sure by gosh and by golly, Sven uses a lot.&nbsp; Even more than Lars.&nbsp; But I<BR>&gt;use twice as much as Sven."&nbsp; As Olie, Sven, and Lars wink at each other<BR>&gt;while the earnest young survey taker scribbles excited notes on his<BR>clipboard.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; While the use of heroin might be illegal, that doesn't mean that there's no<BR>evidence of its use. Heroin is pretty dangerous, as far as drugs go, so<BR>there are going to be people dying or going into the local hospitals for a<BR>variety of reasons: overdoses, fires and so on. Heroin is also quite<BR>addictive and there are a variety of services which are offered to addicts<BR>through clinics, hospitals and doctors' offices. Given the fact that heroin<BR>is usually injected by its users, there's a pretty good chance that the<BR>local heroin-using community will show an increase in diseases which are<BR>spread through intravenous drug use, such as HIV and Hep C. Finally, there's<BR>the local police. They're going to be busting people for buying, selling and<BR>carrying drugs. They're going to be doing the best they can to keep tabs on<BR>the local drug flow. While they're doing this, they're going to be keeping<BR>pretty detailed notes. That much data could be synthesized and analyzed by<BR>pretty much anybody who has slept through a couple of Soc 101 lectures.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 21:42:45 +0000<BR>From: "Jonathan" &lt;thegreatkraken@postmark.net&gt;<BR>Subject: GT PBeM?<BR><BR>Hi<BR><BR>Are there any G:T PBeM games on at the moment?<BR><BR>Jonathan<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 13:05:55 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; I remember a classic story where wheeled vehicles/conveyances could not be<BR>&gt; used because of religious prohibitions.&nbsp; This included rollers by the way.<BR>&gt; It presented interesting problems to some folks who had crashed and need to<BR>&gt; move some heavy objects to get themselves off planet.<BR><BR>Poul Anderson, "The Three-Cornered Wheel". It's one of the David<BR>Falkyn(sp?) stories. I believe it's in the collection "Trader Team". <BR><BR>David and friends worked for Solar Spice &amp; Liquors, which was headed by<BR>Nicholas van Rijn, another classic character. And they are in the same<BR>universe as one Dominic Flandry, just centuries before his time. <BR><BR>There's also at least one story set in the same universe but a *long*<BR>time after Flandry: "Starfog". <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 13:10:51 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; On Sat, 20 Jan 2001 00:04:52 PST shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Nope. Solar cells are both too expensive (though that may go down) and<BR>&gt;&gt;*way* too bulky. They take up far too much space per kilowatt. They are<BR>&gt;&gt;also *fragile*.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Not at TL 16. Heck, nearly not at TL 8! Current commercial solar power<BR>&gt; supplies are pretty tough. They're just expensive, and the cost differential<BR>&gt; is coming down rapidly...<BR><BR>Thing is, they are *still* bulky. And since I expect that (at least<BR>early on) delivery is *not* included, the natives will have to<BR>transport *and assemble* things themselves. <BR><BR>I think a generator will be a lot more suitable. Especially if they<BR>have to relocate occaisonally. <BR><BR>&gt; At TL 16 solar collectors may be large, but they'll just be the roof <BR>&gt; shingles.<BR><BR>They'll still need to be *very* idiot proofed if you are selling them<BR>to low tech natives.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 13:18:04 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. RPG<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; That was you. Joe wasn't so hot on backup's though (as for Roger I don't <BR>&gt; know, but Joe had the dataloss), so he lost a bit of material (more than <BR>&gt; once <BR>&gt; I think over the years)..... (and neither am I, mostly because I don't have <BR>&gt; what I consider a good backup device).<BR><BR>Tape drives *work*. <BR><BR>But a semi-viable alternative is to get a RAID controller and set up a<BR>drive array. At the "lowest" level, it means that everything gets<BR>written to a *pair* of drives. If one fails, the system keeps running<BR>on the remaining drive, with no data loss.<BR><BR>At higher levels, the data is recorded across more drives in ways that<BR>correct errors. <BR><BR>Besides error correction, this sort of setup also reduces access time,<BR>as it is possible to read data from multiple drives. <BR><BR>It's still susceptible to viruses, and software goofs that trash data.<BR>As well as major hardware failures (say, lightning hits the computer).<BR>And to theft. <BR><BR>So some sort of backup that can be removed is a good idea.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 18:27:12 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Commie Atheist Films (was: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3417)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; This is a very late response, but I've been mulling it over for about a<BR>month. The Holidays, the removal of four wisdom teeth, an ongoing D&amp;D<BR>campaign, the horror of "Cardboard Heroes" and a short-lived web design job<BR>have all conspired to keep me from reading and responding to the list. Now<BR>that I have some free time, I decided to respond.<BR><BR>Kenji wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I've seen it described as Constructivist, but that label tends to get<BR>&gt;slapped on any piece of work by non-emigre Russians between 1905 and<BR>&gt;oh, say, 1945<BR><BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Anyone who's dating Constructivism before about '13 or '14 or after the<BR>early-to-mid thirties is full of crap (roll the "r" for best effect). Anyone<BR>who's dating Constructivism as far back as '05 simply doesn't know anything<BR>about the artistic movements of the 20th century[1] and should probably have<BR>their license to talk about art revoked, with extreme prejudice.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; However, since I said that the sets from "Aelita" show the influence of<BR>Constructivism, I guess I have to defend that claim. The sets and costumes<BR>were designed by Alexandra Exter and Isaac Rabinovich. Exter was one of the<BR>middling luminaries of the Constructivist movement. She's not one of the<BR>artists who springs to mind immediately when talking about Constructivism,<BR>but she was a self-professed member of the movement from about 1921 (or so)<BR>onward, and anyone who does a little research into Constructivism will<BR>probably run across her at some point. Her set and costume designs for the<BR>stage, as well as what I've seen of "Aelita", exhibit the hallmarks of<BR>Constructivism. In this case it can be oversimplified, for the sake of<BR>brevity, as an attempt to translate the two-dimensional style of cubism to a<BR>three-dimensional medium. I know nothing about Rabinovich, but if he was<BR>working on costumes and sets in the mid-20s, there's a damned good chance he<BR>was involved with the Constructivist movement too (and there's an even<BR>better chance if he was hanging around and working with Exter).<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; There's a pretty good reason to refer to the look of Aelita as<BR>Constructivist.<BR><BR>&gt;Five or six years ago I tried to find a copy of the movie to see it<BR>&gt;again, and came up with absolutely nothing, in any format.&nbsp; I'm glad<BR>&gt;to know it's more available now -- a strong case can be made that<BR>&gt;it's the ultimate source of the "futuristic style" in film.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; More than a strong case can be made. There's no doubt that this<BR>little-watched film set the tone for the look and feel of sci-fi from the<BR>20s through to the 60s. As you pointed out, the influence on "Metropolis" is<BR>obvious and well documented[2]. There's another very important link in the<BR>chain which should not be overlooked: the first "Flash Gordon" serial<BR>produced in 1937. The set and costume designers clearly owe a debt to both<BR>"Aelita" (judging from the stills I've seen of that film) and "Metropolis".<BR>The influence of the "Flash Gordon" serials cannot be emphasized enough.<BR>I'll refrain from commenting about "Flash Gordon" beyond pointing out that<BR>the strip was a two-bit ripoff of Buck Rogers.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; [1] Most of the artistic movements of the 20th century, and pretty much all<BR>of the really innovative ones, stem from Cubism. Cubism could not have<BR>existed without Cezanne's later works. These later works were exhibited in a<BR>big retrospective in 1907. At this point, Georges Braque and Pablo Picasso<BR>saw the development of his style, and found that they shared a vision of<BR>where this style was leading. In 1908 Braque's L'Estaque paintings were<BR>unveiled, and the Cubist movement was officially underway.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; At that point Modern art, in all of its glory, was born.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; To make a long story short, about five years later a Russian by the name of<BR>Vladimir Tatlin would visit Picasso in Paris. They would discuss the tenants<BR>of Cubism at great length. Tatlin would begin kicking around the idea of a<BR>movement which would translate these motifs into architecture and sculpture.<BR>The seeds of Constructivism would be planted. About seven years later, in<BR>1920, Tatlin would publish the Constructivist Manifesto. Many artists in the<BR>new and idealistic Soviet Union would latch onto this movement and identify<BR>with it, and their works would define the Constructivist style. In the early<BR>30s, the Soviets would decide that an artistic movement known as Socialist<BR>Realism was "better" and they would discourage the creation of all forms of<BR>abstract art. The Constructivist movement (among others) would begin to<BR>collapse. Many Constructivists would leave the Soviet Union and get involved<BR>in, and influence, other artistic movements.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Basically, though, you can't have Constructivism without Cubism, and you<BR>can't have Cubism without the Cezanne retrospective in 1907. Anyone who's<BR>claiming that Constructivism was around in 1905, two years before the big<BR>Cezanne retrospective, is talking out of his (or her) butt. On the other<BR>hand, anyone who's placing Constructivism as late as '45 had better have a<BR>good rationale behind it.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; [2] This is especially true in the Workers' Undercity. The "Metropolis"<BR>itself smacks of a combination of Art Deco, which was in its infancy at the<BR>time, and good, ol' fashioned Cubism. Indeed, if you take a look at the<BR>paintings which were done for the film, there's one which looks like<BR>Picasso's "Houses on a Hill (Horta de Ebro)" on steroids.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I'm not sure if this is really an accident. I've always found it very<BR>interesting that the Metropolis itself exhibits the influence of Art Deco,<BR>which was an American style, and that the Workers' Undercity exhibits the<BR>influence of the Russian / Soviet Constructivism. Both movements were seen<BR>as being emblematic of their country's progress. That, combined with the<BR>underlying moral of the film, has always suggested to me that there was<BR>something rather prophetic going on in that film. Whether it was intentional<BR>or not, I'm not sure, but it's always intrigued me.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; ObTrav: I have several, but they would probably fall on deaf ears to some<BR>extent. One is that I've often envisioned Ziru Siirka sculpture and<BR>architecture to be similar in some ways to Constructivism, but with the<BR>massive scale of the Socialist Realist sculptures. On many worlds, these<BR>crumbling behemoths would still exist and be used from day to day. With the<BR>dawning of the Third Imperium, the propagandists would combine Solomani<BR>Neo-Classicism and Vilani Quasi-Constructivism into one style, reflecting<BR>Cleon's ideas about the Imperium being the legitimate heir to the Ziru<BR>Siirka and the Rule of Man. The result would be these gigantic Neo-Classical<BR>facades with these truly massive abstracted human forms pretty much grafted<BR>on. Anyone who was around when I was mucking about with rendering software<BR>has seen the type of sculpture I'm talking about.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 00:01 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: God Emperor of Dune<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;3A69E99E.55E521FD@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts, especially Kenneth.<BR><BR>One of the best parts about that scene is the tactic the REAL Duncan Idaho <BR>uses to show which one he is :-)<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 12:14:54 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. RPG<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; So some sort of backup that can be removed is a good idea.<BR><BR>Many people have CD writers these days.&nbsp; CDRs are far from ideal as an<BR>archive medium, but they're cheap, removable, hold a substantial<BR>amount of data, and can be completely immune to viruses or other<BR>software problems once written depending upon the hardware you use to<BR>read them.<BR><BR><BR>ObTrav: What forms of backup are common?&nbsp; What are their properties?<BR>Can they be read with lower-tech equipment?<BR><BR><BR>- - Tim<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 17:26:12 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Two Questions... one answer<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;Second, since the prospect of getting Traveller miniatures seems to be nil<BR>&gt;to none, can you suggest suitable substitutes?<BR><BR>&nbsp; SJG's _Cardboard Heroes_, and patience - real Traveller miniatures <BR>or genuinely good substitutes may be available later this year?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 18:13:28 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt;From: "Daniel Phelps" &lt;phelpsd@gate.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>...<BR>&gt;it, the use of carriages in Medieval/Renn Era Japan would be an example as<BR>&gt;well.&nbsp; My remembrance is that while known only the Emperor had one as they<BR>&gt;were determined to be detrimental to roads.&nbsp; The lack of roads suitable and<BR>&gt;the will to create them was also cited if I remember correctly.&nbsp; Thus<BR>&gt;palanquins were the mod of travel.&nbsp;&nbsp; As my memory of where I read this is<BR>&gt;fuzzy does anyone know more of the specifics of this bit of possibly ill<BR>&gt;remembered of history?<BR><BR>&nbsp; Porters could customarily be commandeered locally (corvee), whereas<BR>widespread use of animal traction - particularly horses - would have<BR>been a terrible strain on late Tokugawa infrastructure.<BR><BR>&gt;I remember a classic story where wheeled vehicles/conveyances could not be<BR>&gt;used because of religious prohibitions.&nbsp; This included rollers by the way.<BR>&gt;It presented interesting problems to some folks who had crashed and need to<BR>&gt;move some heavy objects to get themselves off planet.<BR><BR>&nbsp; IIRC, Poul Anderson - but it only precluded _round_ rollers :)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Steven Hudson<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 21:15:13 EST<BR>From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/20/01 9:12:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>shudson@lightspeed.ca writes:<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; IIRC, Poul Anderson - but it only precluded _round_ rollers :)<BR><BR>"The Three-Cornered Wheel."&nbsp; One of the Boy's Life stories, if I recall.<BR><BR>- ----------<BR>Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>set of people who will take offense at it."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 21:33:46 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt; Actually if you do the analysis, something like 90% of the Imperium's<BR>&gt; population is at TL9 or better, Steller tech.<BR><BR>Grrr, perhaps the problem is Traveller wastes a lot of digits on low-tech<BR>worlds that don't exist.&nbsp; A holdover from Sylean expansion I suspect.&nbsp; IMTU<BR>the tech levels have been compressed a bit and tend to track GURPS more<BR>closely (but not perfectly).&nbsp;&nbsp; I also have modified the starport digit to<BR>reflect what we have been talking about.<BR><BR>G- Ground-only.&nbsp; Probably a one-class downgrade from comparable A-C<BR>starports. (Spaceport digits moved to S-U)<BR>H- Highport-only.&nbsp; Either because of hostile surface conditions or the<BR>desire to minimize Imperial interaction with the locals.&nbsp; No regular traffic<BR>to the surface.<BR>P- Private starport.&nbsp; Quality unknown/not disclosed.<BR>R-Restricted starport.&nbsp; Imperial facilities, fallow worlds, prison planets.<BR>Don't expect a cordial welcome unless invited.<BR><BR>BTW only a few weeks ago we hit a new tech level, congrats everyone for a<BR>job well done.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 21:43:36 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: God Emperor of Dune<BR><BR>Megan Robertson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; One of the best parts about that scene is the tactic the REAL Duncan Idaho<BR>&gt; uses to show which one he is :-)<BR><BR>No kiddin'.&nbsp; That was awesome.<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 06:06:13 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Mysterious black tar heroin appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>on 20/1/01 9:02 pm, Chris Seamans at semo@pil.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; That much data could be synthesized and analyzed by<BR>&gt; pretty much anybody who has slept through a couple of Soc 101 lectures.<BR><BR>Why would you sleep through lectures about the upcoming BITS product "101<BR>Societies"?<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 06:06:13 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Two Questions...<BR><BR>on 20/1/01 2:37 pm, Ray Rangel at ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; First, since I am new to this whole RPG thing, can you suggest some on-line<BR>&gt; retailers (US)?<BR><BR>I've no experience here, but these look to be worthwhile:<BR><BR>http://www.travellertrader.com/<BR>&nbsp; Traveller only, used<BR>http://www.nobleknight.com/nkg.asp<BR>&nbsp; Big mail order, new and used<BR>http://www.titan-games.com/<BR>&nbsp; Mark Miller's local? new and used<BR>http://www.earthsea.com/<BR>&nbsp; New and used<BR>http://www.hyperbooks.com/catalog/games.html<BR>&nbsp; RPGs in eBook form... more people should do this<BR><BR>Where in the US are you? I'll try find something local.<BR><BR>&gt; Second, since the prospect of getting Traveller miniatures seems to be nil<BR>&gt; to none, can you suggest suitable substitutes?<BR><BR>Sure, but keep your eyes peeled for reasonably-priced used miniatures. I<BR>picked up the Citadel Traveller boxed sets 2 &amp; 3 today in a small local<BR>store.<BR><BR>Try these (long list, 'cos I was researching this today):<BR><BR>http://warbard.iwarp.com/sg2figures.html<BR>&nbsp; Shows the GZG and Irregular Miniatures figures, gives contacts for Peter<BR>Pig, Tabletop, Stan Johansen, FreiKorps and Brigade miniatures.<BR><BR>http://www.gtns.net/gzg/<BR>&nbsp; The GZG line, also 1/300th<BR><BR>http://www.irregularminiatures.co.uk/indexes/15mmindex.htm<BR>&nbsp; The Irregular line<BR><BR>http://hometown.aol.com/eaglewars/private/sews.html<BR>&nbsp; US retailer of Irregular line<BR><BR>http://www.peterpig.demon.co.uk/index.htm<BR>&nbsp; The Peter Pig line<BR><BR>http://www.brookhursthobbies.com/index.htm<BR>&nbsp; US distributor for Peter Pig<BR><BR>http://www.polomania.com/stan/15mm.htm<BR>&nbsp; The Stan Johansen line<BR><BR>http://www.gtns.net/freikorp/freikorp/fk-sf.html<BR>&nbsp; The FreiKorps line<BR><BR>http://brigadegames2.homestead.com/index.html<BR>&nbsp; The Brigade line, also 1/300th SF<BR><BR><BR>http://website.lineone.net/~grendel.co/scotiasf.html<BR>&nbsp; 1/300th scale SF vehicles<BR><BR>http://www.gladiator.clara.net/hardkill.htm<BR>&nbsp; 1/300th scale SF vehicles/infantry<BR><BR>http://members.netscapeonline.co.uk/adlerminiatures/<BR>&nbsp; 1/300th scale SF vehicles<BR><BR>http://www.historyinminiature.com/maylist.html#esfict<BR>&nbsp; 1/300th scale SF buildings, etc<BR><BR>http://www.theminiaturespage.com/lib/scf300/infantry.html<BR>&nbsp; 1/300th scale SF from Scotia, Heroics&amp;Ros, GW, Adler, Irregular, RZ, GZG<BR><BR><BR>http://www.brigademodels.co.uk/sfs/spaceshp.htm<BR>&nbsp; 1/3000th scale spaceships (requires membership of SFSFW)<BR><BR>http://zippnet.net/~dldproductions/MAINCATPG.html<BR>&nbsp; 1/2400th scale spaceships<BR><BR>http://zappa.brainiac.com/spaceship/spaceship.html<BR>&nbsp; Big list of old and new spaceship miniatures<BR><BR><BR>Maybe you can find something suitable for your campaign in that lot.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 19:56:41 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Two Questions...<BR><BR>On 20 Jan 01, at 9:37, Ray Rangel wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; First, since I am new to this whole RPG thing, can you suggest some on-line<BR>&gt; retailers (US)?<BR><BR>Sorry, can't help here.<BR><BR>&gt; Second, since the prospect of getting Traveller miniatures seems to be nil to<BR>&gt; none, can you suggest suitable substitutes?<BR><BR>I've found various "plastic" figures quite useful, With a craft knife, a couple <BR>of boxes of "toy soldiers" and some pva glue you can work wonders <BR>(especially since Airfix has just reissued its old Astronaut figure set). The <BR>various "modern" sets can fill in for most circumstances (the various <BR>"airfield" sets make wonderful starport workers). Aliens are a problem, but <BR>without some specific Traveller mini's there's not much can be done about <BR>that.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 09:11:20 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. RPG<BR><BR>On Sun, 21 Jan 2001, Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt; ObTrav: What forms of backup are common?&nbsp; What are their properties?<BR>&gt; Can they be read with lower-tech equipment?<BR><BR>Given the low progress of Imperial tech, I would think that most backups<BR>would be designed to be readable with low tech.<BR><BR>Perhaps engraved disks of metal - they can be read even with a simple <BR>microscope, if the engravings are large enough.<BR><BR>Still, are there Imperium-wide standards for file formats? (If their<BR>data systems use such outdated concepts as 'file' B-) We have problems<BR>with Word files ten years old, with current versions of Word. Or perhaps<BR>cryptology is a healthy industry in the Imperium...<BR><BR>The tech stagnation might still be the solution to this. Or, see TeX.<BR><BR>Another problem : is the Galanglic alphabet the same all over 3I? I could<BR>imagine that it has at least many dialects, as it is spoken as the daily<BR>language on many planets. (Or is it? How many planets speak their own<BR>languages? How big is the translation business, either from local<BR>language to another or from local language to Anglic? Or is Anglic the<BR>hated compulsory language in schools?)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 23:34:28 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Landgrab rules'<BR><BR>Kelly St.Clair wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Try not to take one that's already being done.&nbsp; This creates a<BR>&gt; &gt; multiverse, and then you end up with the Crisis on Infinite<BR>&gt; &gt; Rhylanors, and George Perez kills you for making him do all<BR>&gt; &gt; that art research again (comic geek joke.)<BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt; Just think of the fun when the Strephons from Imperium-MT and Imperium-GT<BR>&gt; (and possibly more) meet each other...<BR><BR>A la' "The Five Doctors" ?<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3543<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yc03.mx.aol.com (rly-yc03.mail.aol.com [172.18.149.35]) by air-yc01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 05:24:21 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yc03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 05:23:35 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id FAA45275;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 05:22:59 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sun, 21 Jan 2001 05:22:31 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id FAA45237<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 05:22:31 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 05:22:31 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101211022.FAA45237@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3543<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3544</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/21/01 12:50:15 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sunday, January 21 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3544<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Starports and tech levels<BR>RE: A.I. RPG<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>RE: Commie Atheist Films (was: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3417)<BR>Re: A.I. RPG<BR>OT: Backups (was: A.I. RPG)<BR>RE: Backups (was: A.I. RPG)<BR>Re: A.I. RPG<BR>Re: A.I. RPG<BR>Re: A.I. RPG<BR>Re: A.I. RPG<BR>RE: Landgrab rules'<BR>RE: Starports and tech levels<BR>TML sniper competition<BR>RE: Backups (was: A.I. RPG)<BR>Re: TML sniper competition<BR>Re: A.I. RPG<BR>RE: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 23:46:32 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Alan Bradley<BR>&gt; Sent: Sunday, 21 January 2001 00:37<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; From: michael stasica<BR>&gt; &gt; Ludite comes to mind.&nbsp; But an exact definition escapes me.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The Luddites were an organised and armed rebel movement in 18th century<BR>&gt; England noted for destroying the machinery in textile mills that were<BR>&gt; displacing manual textile workers and driving them into poverty.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Naturally enough, they were slandered by the powers that be, and portrayed<BR>&gt; as mindless, anti-progress vandals.&nbsp; In fact, they were the good guys.<BR>&gt; (IMHO, of course.)<BR><BR>Ned Ludd a hero ?<BR><BR>Only if you consider groups such as the Teamsters, the Australian<BR>dock-workes, and other "Organized Labour" groups whose primary purpose is<BR>the maintenance of their own power base through violence and intimidation,<BR>heroes.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 23:50:27 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: A.I. RPG<BR><BR>Kagehira@aol.com wrote :<BR>&gt;That was you. Joe wasn't so hot on backup's though (as for Roger I don't<BR>&gt;know, but Joe had the dataloss), so he lost a bit of material (more than<BR>once<BR>&gt;I think over the years)..... (and neither am I, mostly because I don't have<BR>&gt;what I consider a good backup device).<BR><BR>IMO, the best back up device is another hard drive. 12Gb ones can be bought<BR>for less than $200.<BR>If you can put it another machine, and backup over a network so much the<BR>better, but failing complete destruction of the computer, it is very rare<BR>for two harddrives to die at the same time.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 23:02:05 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; In a message dated 1/20/01 9:12:44 PM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>&gt; shudson@lightspeed.ca writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; IIRC, Poul Anderson - but it only precluded _round_ rollers :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "The Three-Cornered Wheel."&nbsp; One of the Boy's Life stories, if I recall.<BR><BR>No, it was in Analog.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 22:03:11 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Commie Atheist Films (was: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3417)<BR><BR>&gt; From: "Chris Seamans" <BR>&gt; Many artists in the new and idealistic Soviet Union would latch onto this<BR>&gt; movement and identify with it, and their works would define the<BR>&gt; Constructivist style. In the early 30s, the Soviets would decide that an<BR>&gt; artistic movement known as Socialist Realism was "better" and they would<BR>&gt; discourage the creation of all forms of abstract art. <BR><BR>This is as good an example of what Stalinism means as anything else. <BR>Something creative, energetic and vibrant gets turned into its opposite.<BR><BR>&gt; I'm not sure if this is really an accident. I've always found it very<BR>&gt; interesting that the Metropolis itself exhibits the influence of Art<BR>&gt; Deco, which was an American style, and that the Workers' Undercity<BR>&gt; exhibits the influence of the Russian / Soviet Constructivism. Both<BR>&gt; movements were seen as being emblematic of their country's progress.<BR>&gt; That, combined with the underlying moral of the film, has always<BR>&gt; suggested to me that there was something rather prophetic going on in<BR>&gt; that film. Whether it was intentional or not, I'm not sure, but it's<BR>&gt; always intrigued me.<BR><BR>It sounds like the styles parallel the class divisions in the society.&nbsp; (I<BR>hadn't noticed, because I don't know much about art.)&nbsp; Probably not a<BR>coincidence.&nbsp; I will have to look out for this next time I see the film.<BR><BR>ObTrav:&nbsp; While on an agricultural world, the PCs encounter a black<BR>monolith.&nbsp; Who created it, and what is it for?&nbsp; Is it art?&nbsp; Why is someone<BR>trying to kill them?&nbsp; Why are the local groats such an abundant source of<BR>hallucinogens?&nbsp; Why are the local groatherds so self-consciously<BR>picturesque?&nbsp; Why would anyone live on a fleapit world like this?<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:37:30 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. RPG<BR><BR>On Sat, 20 Jan 2001 13:18:04 PST shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; That was you. Joe wasn't so hot on backup's though (as for Roger I don't<BR>&gt;&gt; know, but Joe had the dataloss), so he lost a bit of material (more than<BR>&gt;&gt; once<BR>&gt;&gt; I think over the years)..... (and neither am I, mostly because I don't have<BR>&gt;&gt; what I consider a good backup device).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Tape drives *work*.<BR><BR>Some of the time...and they're _quite_ happy telling you 'Oh,yeah I did this<BR>backup just fine, all's OK' when the tape is dead as a doornail.<BR><BR>For personal stuff I say buy a CD-R or RW; they're quite cheap these days,<BR>with a little shopping they can be had for less than $100. Back up projects to<BR>a CD as you go in ISO_9660 format (for write only disks they can be had for as<BR>little as 10 cents each when you buy in quantity); and you have an endless<BR>revision trail. (ISO_9660 won't overwrite older files, but will place a<BR>version number on duplicate file names, much like VMS does, for the same<BR>reason: audit trail)<BR><BR>Keep a copy off site somewhere (friend or relatives house, a safety deposit<BR>box, a desk drawer where you work, something like that) and even if total<BR>catastrophe strikes, you're covered. If your house burns down, and your<BR>carefully made backups are sitting on the shelf next to your computer they<BR>don't do you a lot of good. <BR><BR>Dantz Retrospect Express is an _excellent_ backup utility, and I think it even<BR>comes in Windows flavor now. It works just fine with CDR's.<BR><BR>&gt;But a semi-viable alternative is to get a RAID controller and set up a<BR>&gt;drive array. At the "lowest" level, it means that everything gets<BR>&gt;written to a *pair* of drives. If one fails, the system keeps running<BR>&gt;on the remaining drive, with no data loss.<BR><BR>Having run RAID systems on our servers for the last eight years or so, I can<BR>attest to the magic of having a drive go bad, yanking it, sliding in a new one<BR>and watching it reformat and rebuild the data ...all while the system is up<BR>running. 'Sufficiently advanced technology' indeed.<BR><BR>They're also susceptible to controller failures. The only time we've lost data<BR>on our LAN was when a drive controller went south recently, and took _two_ of<BR>the drives with it. Can't rebuild that. <BR><BR>And of course, Murphy waved his little wand and made it happen at 5 PM, so we<BR>lost pretty much the maximum we could lose, which at that point in our backup<BR>scheme was close to 48 hours. (backup size had outrun our tape capacity and<BR>speed, and we were stuck doing incrementals on the servers every other day...) <BR><BR>Fortunately our users were forgiving. (and it happened on a Friday, when<BR>classes were not in session, so not much work had gotten done _anyway_ ;-)<BR><BR>Finally there's the 'Open Source Backup', based on an apocryphal tale told<BR>about Linus Torvalds: when asked if he had backup copies of some Linux kernel<BR>code, he allegedly replied "I don't do backups, I just let the world mirror my<BR>hard drive."<BR><BR>;-)<BR><BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 16:15:04 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: OT: Backups (was: A.I. RPG)<BR><BR>There's another option: if&nbsp; you&nbsp; don't&nbsp; bother&nbsp; backing&nbsp; up&nbsp; your<BR>replaceable software (like Windows,&nbsp; IE,&nbsp; Office,&nbsp; etc)&nbsp; or&nbsp; your<BR>replaceable data (stuff you've downloaded from&nbsp; elsewhere),&nbsp; some<BR>of us have relatively small amounts of *critical* data to&nbsp; backup<BR>... maybe a few Mb.&nbsp; In this case you can just dump&nbsp; it&nbsp; on&nbsp; your<BR>website&nbsp; using&nbsp; any&nbsp; ftp&nbsp; program.&nbsp; (Place&nbsp; it&nbsp; in&nbsp;&nbsp; a&nbsp;&nbsp; separate<BR>subdirectory with an index.html file saying "nothing to see here,<BR>move along".)&nbsp; This gives you quick&nbsp; and&nbsp; easy&nbsp; off-site&nbsp; storage<BR>that's cheaper than investing in new hardware.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 10:07:23 -0800<BR>From: "tsykoduk" &lt;tsykoduk@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Backups (was: A.I. RPG)<BR><BR>Hehehehe - my docs directory is about 500 megs in size..<BR><BR>I also would not trust the ISP/Web provoider to secure my 'stuff' any child<BR>with 1/2 a brain could download all your stuff.<BR><BR>OBTrav:<BR>How many of you have hackers in your traveller games? IMTU they are common.<BR>I had one try and hack into a ships computer while they were in jump. Sadly,<BR>the PC was caught.. ;)<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Trevor, Peter<BR>Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2001 8:15 AM<BR>To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>Subject: OT: Backups (was: A.I. RPG)<BR><BR><BR>There's another option: if&nbsp; you&nbsp; don't&nbsp; bother&nbsp; backing&nbsp; up&nbsp; your<BR>replaceable software (like Windows,&nbsp; IE,&nbsp; Office,&nbsp; etc)&nbsp; or&nbsp; your<BR>replaceable data (stuff you've downloaded from&nbsp; elsewhere),&nbsp; some<BR>of us have relatively small amounts of *critical* data to&nbsp; backup<BR>... maybe a few Mb.&nbsp; In this case you can just dump&nbsp; it&nbsp; on&nbsp; your<BR>website&nbsp; using&nbsp; any&nbsp; ftp&nbsp; program.&nbsp; (Place&nbsp; it&nbsp; in&nbsp;&nbsp; a&nbsp;&nbsp; separate<BR>subdirectory with an index.html file saying "nothing to see here,<BR>move along".)&nbsp; This gives you quick&nbsp; and&nbsp; easy&nbsp; off-site&nbsp; storage<BR>that's cheaper than investing in new hardware.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 09:13:49 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. RPG<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; On Sat, 20 Jan 2001 13:18:04 PST shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; That was you. Joe wasn't so hot on backup's though (as for Roger I don't<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; know, but Joe had the dataloss), so he lost a bit of material (more than<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; once<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; I think over the years)..... (and neither am I, mostly because I don't <BR>&gt; have<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; what I consider a good backup device).<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Tape drives *work*.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Some of the time...and they're _quite_ happy telling you 'Oh,yeah I did this<BR>&gt; backup just fine, all's OK' when the tape is dead as a doornail.<BR><BR>Which is why I *always* do a "verify" after a backup. And won't touch<BR>software that doesn't have a "read the tape and compare it to the<BR>contents of the drive" verify, as opposed to the "verify during write" BS.<BR><BR>I don't trust backups or copies to disks until I've done a compare<BR>either. Which has saved my ass a time or two.<BR><BR>&gt; For personal stuff I say buy a CD-R or RW; they're quite cheap these days,<BR>&gt; with a little shopping they can be had for less than $100. Back up projects <BR>&gt; to<BR>&gt; a CD as you go in ISO_9660 format (for write only disks they can be had for <BR>&gt; as<BR>&gt; little as 10 cents each when you buy in quantity); and you have an endless<BR>&gt; revision trail. (ISO_9660 won't overwrite older files, but will place a<BR>&gt; version number on duplicate file names, much like VMS does, for the same<BR>&gt; reason: audit trail)<BR><BR>Ah yes, I recall doing a bit of work with VMS (we had a Vax running<BR>Netware for VMS on our LAN at one job). <BR><BR>&gt; Keep a copy off site somewhere (friend or relatives house, a safety deposit<BR>&gt; box, a desk drawer where you work, something like that) and even if total<BR>&gt; catastrophe strikes, you're covered. If your house burns down, and your<BR>&gt; carefully made backups are sitting on the shelf next to your computer they<BR>&gt; don't do you a lot of good. <BR><BR>True. The backups we made of the LAN server got hauled to the admin<BR>building along with the backups frome the VAX. And the backups from the<BR>admin building got hauled to the plant. Since the two buildings were a<BR>couple hundred yards apart, which nothing but grass and parking lot in<BR>between, that was safe enough. Anything that could get both the system<BR>*and* the backups would have rendered things like lack of backups more<BR>than a little irrelevant. :-)<BR><BR>The other big mistake people make is in having *a* set of backups. This<BR>is bad because if something goes wrong while you are updating the<BR>backups (or while *restoring* from them) you've just lost your data. <BR><BR>You need at least *two* sets of backup media that you alternate between.<BR><BR>Oh yeah, the final "oops"... not having a copy of the backup software<BR>install disks. Kinda hard to restore the backups when you can't install<BR>the software. So you need a disk or disks that will restore your system<BR>to the point where you can read the backups.<BR><BR>Also, given the way Windows makes it essentially impossible to move<BR>applications between drives, you need something that will backup the<BR>*entire* system, not merely the data and other "changed files". <BR><BR>Otherwise you may be forever tracking down and reinstalling all your<BR>software. To say nothing of reconfiguring it.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;But a semi-viable alternative is to get a RAID controller and set up a<BR>&gt;&gt;drive array. At the "lowest" level, it means that everything gets<BR>&gt;&gt;written to a *pair* of drives. If one fails, the system keeps running<BR>&gt;&gt;on the remaining drive, with no data loss.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Having run RAID systems on our servers for the last eight years or<BR>&gt; so, I can attest to the magic of having a drive go bad, yanking it,<BR>&gt; sliding in a new one and watching it reformat and rebuild the data<BR>&gt; ...all while the system is up running. 'Sufficiently advanced<BR>&gt; technology' indeed.<BR><BR>&gt; They're also susceptible to controller failures. The only time we've<BR>&gt; lost data on our LAN was when a drive controller went south recently,<BR>&gt; and took _two_ of the drives with it. Can't rebuild that.<BR><BR>True enough. And I've been in the position of having *one* of the several<BR>volumes on the server be (an early form of) RAID, while the others were<BR>just standalone drives. Of course it was a standalone that failed. :-)<BR><BR>&gt; And of course, Murphy waved his little wand and made it happen at 5 PM, so we<BR>&gt; lost pretty much the maximum we could lose, which at that point in our backup<BR>&gt; scheme was close to 48 hours. (backup size had outrun our tape capacity and<BR>&gt; speed, and we were stuck doing incrementals on the servers every other <BR>&gt; day...) <BR><BR>Well, we were in the position of being able to use early DAT drives at<BR>a point when a 640 meg HD was still big. :-) And our system was used<BR>for so much stuff that we had to schedule downtime. Luckily, the backup<BR>software kept a list of files that were "locked" (ie being updated) as<BR>it went thru the volumes, and made a second pass to try to get them.<BR>Occasionally it'd hit one that was locked on both passes. but not often<BR>enough to be a major concern.<BR><BR>&gt; Finally there's the 'Open Source Backup', based on an apocryphal tale<BR>&gt; told about Linus Torvalds: when asked if he had backup copies of some<BR>&gt; Linux kernel code, he allegedly replied "I don't do backups, I just<BR>&gt; let the world mirror my hard drive."<BR><BR>&gt; ;-)<BR><BR>Cute.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 09:34:12 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. RPG<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; On Sun, 21 Jan 2001, Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; ObTrav: What forms of backup are common?&nbsp; What are their properties?<BR>&gt;&gt; Can they be read with lower-tech equipment?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Given the low progress of Imperial tech, I would think that most backups<BR>&gt; would be designed to be readable with low tech.<BR><BR>Not necessarily. Don't confuse "backup" and "archival storage".<BR><BR>Backups are intended to restore data if there's a problem. And as such,<BR>there's no need to have them readable by lower tech. And at least one<BR>*major* reason NOT to. Namely speed.<BR><BR>Archival storage is intended to save data that you may want to look at<BR>later. That is a good thing to be able to read on multiple platforms,<BR>even at the cost of some speed.<BR><BR>One current format is COM (Computer Output Microfiche). Basicly the<BR>computer uses a device that writes text directly to microfiche.<BR>Microfiche is a sort of microfilm "card". <BR><BR>The stuff is much lighter than metal, and based on tests and experience<BR>should be good for several centuries if stored in reasonable conditions.<BR><BR>&gt; Still, are there Imperium-wide standards for file formats? (If their<BR>&gt; data systems use such outdated concepts as 'file' B-) We have problems<BR>&gt; with Word files ten years old, with current versions of Word. Or perhaps<BR>&gt; cryptology is a healthy industry in the Imperium...<BR><BR>Given the rate of progress, as well as the time span since they started<BR>using computers, I don't see version changes happening to any extent.<BR><BR>File formats will have been settled for millenia. And likely have<BR>provisions for extensions/options. <BR><BR>A *current* example of this is the SYLK (Symbolic Link) format that<BR>many spreadsheets *still* support. I can take an SYLK file from one of<BR>several old 8-bit systems, transfer it to a current system and load it.<BR>No problem. <BR><BR>More to the point, I can take an SYLK file from a *current* system and<BR>import it into the 15+ year old program on the 8-bit system and it'll<BR>get the data, formulas, and such formatting and "special" commands as<BR>it supports. <BR><BR>&gt; Another problem : is the Galanglic alphabet the same all over 3I? I could<BR>&gt; imagine that it has at least many dialects, as it is spoken as the daily<BR>&gt; language on many planets.<BR><BR>Different dialects don't mean different alphabets. And in any case,<BR>Unicode will pretty much solve this sort of problem on Earth, and if a<BR>32-bit character set isn't enough for the Imperium, a 64-bit one *will*<BR>be. This makes text a bit bulkier, but not unmanageably so.<BR><BR>&gt; (Or is it? How many planets speak their own languages?<BR><BR>Many may have their own.<BR><BR>&gt; How big is the translation business, either from local<BR>&gt; language to another or from local language to Anglic?<BR><BR>At higher TLs computers will do most of it, with humans checking the output.<BR><BR>&gt; Or is Anglic the hated compulsory language in schools?)<BR><BR>Not likely to be hated. Not when it's the key to getting on on all<BR>those trade deals and the link.<BR><BR>It's unlikely to be *imposed*. It's just that *not* knowing it would be<BR>a major handicap.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 09:50:55 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. RPG<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; IMO, the best back up device is another hard drive. 12Gb ones can be bought<BR>&gt; for less than $200.<BR>&gt; If you can put it another machine, and backup over a network so much the<BR>&gt; better, but failing complete destruction of the computer, it is very rare<BR>&gt; for two harddrives to die at the same time.<BR><BR>Actually, with multi-gigabyte drives, backing up over a network *isn't*<BR>that great an idea. The network is a *lot* slower than the drive bus. <BR><BR>But removable racks are cheap (for IDE/ATAPI $25, 50-pin SCSI $50,<BR>68-pin SCSI $100). So you shut down the system, plug in a drive, restart,<BR>mirror the existing drive, shut down, pull the drive and restart. And<BR>take the drive somewhere safe.<BR><BR>And the main reason you have to do all that shut down/restart stuff is<BR>because the OSes don't deal well with removable drives.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 09:47:18<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. RPG<BR><BR>At 09:31 AM 1/20/2001 EST, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;It never went much past a few page draft....... Basically an attempt at <BR>&gt;character generation and a few example pieces of equipment. Joe was supposed <BR>&gt;to write a novel based on the world a few years back (somewhere around '95 I <BR>&gt;think), I don't think that went anywhere either.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The attempts that tried expanding beyond that didn't work, I think I cam up <BR>&gt;with part of a solution to the problem at the time (in any case I have one <BR>&gt;now).<BR><BR>Hm.&nbsp; So they were advertising a game they hadn't written yet, and sailed<BR>off the Traveller gravy train on the odd hope that this game might<BR>eventually be written, and might be good enough to sell.<BR><BR>Note to self: keep day job.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 09:58:48<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Landgrab rules'<BR><BR>At 11:34 PM 1/21/2001 +1300, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Kelly St.Clair wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Try not to take one that's already being done.&nbsp; This creates a<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; multiverse, and then you end up with the Crisis on Infinite<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Rhylanors, and George Perez kills you for making him do all<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; that art research again (comic geek joke.)<BR>&gt;&lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Just think of the fun when the Strephons from Imperium-MT and Imperium-GT<BR>&gt;&gt; (and possibly more) meet each other...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;A la' "The Five Doctors" ?<BR><BR>They were all from the same universe, just from different spots along<BR>Gallifrey's timeline.&nbsp; The High Council broke all sorts of rules to<BR>assemble the various Doctors.<BR><BR>(Digression: The Legion of Rassilon got to see The Five Doctors four days<BR>before its official US broadcast (we beat New Jersey Network and Princeton<BR>club by a day!) By far the loudest cheer of the night was when the Council<BR>told the Master that all he needed to do to get a new set of regenerations<BR>was save the Doctor.. the look on his face..)<BR><BR>(Another Digression: Anthony Ainley, who played the Master for the later<BR>part of the series, came to TimeCon one year, and addressed a LoR meeting.<BR>He is a wonderful man, witty, clever, always smiling.&nbsp; One of our members<BR>asked if he could do a little "Master" for us.&nbsp; He paused, explained that<BR>they had just finished shooting a season long epic called "Trial of a Time<BR>Lord", and looked down for a moment.<BR><BR>The Master looked up at us.&nbsp; He gave the speech which the Master gives in<BR>Ep. 5, IIRC.&nbsp; The room was completely silent afterwards for about five<BR>seconds.&nbsp; Then we all started breathing again.)<BR><BR>Why yes, I'm a fanboy geek.. why do you ask?&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>What you would get with Crisis in Infinite Imperiums are all the potential<BR>Strephons.&nbsp; Evil Strephon.&nbsp; Old Strephon.&nbsp; Bizarro Strephon (who, as<BR>Emperor, is the lowest ranking person in the Bizarro Imperium.)<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>"Pardon me, excuse me, Giant vampiric flightless winged<BR>squirrel, coming through.."&nbsp; -Tim the Paladin, "Yamara"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 10:02:45<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>At 11:46 PM 1/21/2001 +1300, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Only if you consider groups such as the Teamsters, the Australian<BR>&gt;dock-workes, and other "Organized Labour" groups whose primary purpose is<BR>&gt;the maintenance of their own power base through violence and intimidation,<BR>&gt;heroes.<BR><BR>Umm.. I'm a Teamster (Local 665)&nbsp; Read up on working conditions for<BR>laborers before the labor movement.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 11:18:39 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: TML sniper competition<BR><BR>Mark, Doug, Jesse et al.<BR><BR>With all the talk about having a shoot off with the loser buying dinner, I<BR>thought you might like to see what I'll be bringing.&nbsp; This is the infamous<BR>sniper that Jesse mentioned. This is the first gun where I worried about<BR>barometric pressure when shooting!<BR><BR>see:&nbsp; http://www.travellerguns.com/tech/sniper.html<BR><BR>(Can't help it, I just love to show off this gun, and have people shoot it.<BR>Even someone with only the rudiments of rifle marksmanship can be pretty<BR>deadly with this thing out to 500m. Unfortunately, our range only goes to<BR>600 yards, so I don't yet know how it'll perform at 1000.)<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>When the pin is pulled, Mr. Grenade is not our friend"<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 19:33:53 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Backups (was: A.I. RPG)<BR><BR>tsykoduk wrote:<BR>&gt; Hehehehe - my docs directory is about 500 megs in size..<BR><BR>Okay that would be impractical, but myself I have under&nbsp; 25Mb&nbsp; of<BR>truely unreplaceable material that&nbsp; I&nbsp; would&nbsp; genuniely&nbsp; hate&nbsp; to<BR>loose.&nbsp; I did suggest this option for those with small amounts of<BR>data to backup ... its not appropriate to everyone.<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; I also would not trust the ISP/Web provoider to secure my<BR>&gt; 'stuff' any child with 1/2 a brain could download all your<BR>&gt; stuff.<BR><BR>Very little of my 25Mb is highly confidential ... most of it&nbsp; has<BR>value only to me.&nbsp; Of&nbsp; course&nbsp; this&nbsp; will&nbsp; vary&nbsp; from&nbsp; person&nbsp; to<BR>person.&nbsp; As for 'vandalism' if you use this method&nbsp; once&nbsp; a&nbsp; week<BR>the chance that you'll be hit the same week your house burns down<BR>is very low.&nbsp; A bigger problem is trying to get people to&nbsp; notice<BR>your web site in the first place ... and to get feedback is often<BR>like trying to get blood from a stone.&nbsp; :-(<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; OBTrav:<BR>&gt; How many of you have hackers in your traveller games? IMTU they<BR>&gt; are common. I had one try and hack into a ships computer while<BR>&gt; they were in jump. Sadly, the PC was caught.. ;)<BR><BR>About 25% of my campaigns.&nbsp; Low TL worlds don't&nbsp; have&nbsp; computers,<BR>mid TL worlds protect the "good stuff"&nbsp; by&nbsp; keeping&nbsp; it&nbsp; isolated<BR>from any global net, and high TL worlds&nbsp; have&nbsp; reliable&nbsp; security<BR>(relentlessly tested by dedicated computer company AIs).<BR><BR>Loopholes exploitable by hackers only occur&nbsp; when&nbsp; a&nbsp; world's&nbsp; TL<BR>improves and new computer technology enters&nbsp; use&nbsp; before&nbsp; it&nbsp; has<BR>been fully tested.&nbsp; The slow TL progression of the 3I means&nbsp; that<BR>these periods are fairly uncommon.<BR><BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 11:55:26<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: TML sniper competition<BR><BR>At 11:18 AM 1/21/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Mark, Doug, Jesse et al.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;With all the talk about having a shoot off with the loser buying dinner, I<BR>&gt;thought you might like to see what I'll be bringing.&nbsp; This is the infamous<BR>&gt;sniper that Jesse mentioned. This is the first gun where I worried about<BR>&gt;barometric pressure when shooting!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;see:&nbsp; http://www.travellerguns.com/tech/sniper.html<BR><BR>Folks, we're using his weapon.&nbsp; Hell, just getting some range time would be<BR>worth the cost of dinner.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 14:13:56 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: A.I. RPG<BR><BR>On 01/21/01 at 08:37 AM,&nbsp; Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Tape drives *work*.<BR><BR>&gt;Some of the time...and they're _quite_ happy telling you 'Oh,yeah I<BR>&gt;did this backup just fine, all's OK' when the tape is dead as a<BR>&gt;doornail.<BR><BR>Yes, that's true, but they *usually* work, and that's why you make multiple backups.<BR><BR>&gt;For personal stuff I say buy a CD-R or RW; they're quite cheap<BR>&gt;these days, with a little shopping they can be had for less than<BR>&gt;$100.&nbsp; &lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>And this is a good idea, too!<BR><BR>&gt;Keep a copy off site somewhere (friend or relatives house, a safety<BR>&gt;deposit box, a desk drawer where you work, something like that) and<BR>&gt;even if total catastrophe strikes, you're covered. If your house<BR>&gt;burns down, and your carefully made backups are sitting on the<BR>&gt;shelf next to your computer they don't do you a lot of good. <BR><BR>I tell my students a story about the businessman that makes three backups every day. One copy stays in the office safe, one goes home with him and one goes home with his secretary. His theory is that if the office, his and his secretary's house all go "poof" in one night then his data doesn't matter any more anyway. &lt;g&gt;&nbsp; <BR><BR>&lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Finally there's the 'Open Source Backup', based on an apocryphal<BR>&gt;tale told about Linus Torvalds: when asked if he had backup copies<BR>&gt;of some Linux kernel code, he allegedly replied "I don't do<BR>&gt;backups, I just let the world mirror my hard drive."<BR><BR>In his case, that might be enough. &lt;g&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; <BR><BR>The sort of data that was being discussed originally, a manuscript, wouldn't take much space.&nbsp; There are plenty of sites on the internet that will give, or rent, you storage space for backup purposes. <BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 14:47:36 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>On 01/21/01 at 10:02 AM,&nbsp; "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;At 11:46 PM 1/21/2001 +1300, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Only if you consider groups such as the Teamsters, the Australian<BR>&gt;&gt;dock-workes, and other "Organized Labour" groups whose primary purpose is<BR>&gt;&gt;the maintenance of their own power base through violence and intimidation,<BR>&gt;&gt;heroes.<BR><BR>&gt;Umm.. I'm a Teamster (Local 665)&nbsp; Read up on working conditions for<BR>&gt;laborers before the labor movement.<BR><BR>I figured this would turn into an "interesting" argument when I read<BR>Frank's post.&nbsp; &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>While there certainly have been unions, maybe union locals would be<BR>a fairer statement, that use violence and intimidation to acquire and<BR>maintain their power base, there are also valid historical reasons<BR>for the establishment of militant unions.&nbsp; <BR><BR>However, I just can't see Ned Ludd's followers as the precursors to<BR>the trade union movement any more than the french "saboteurs" were.<BR>Both these groups were rural in make up, opposed to the<BR>industrial movement, and took militant "anti-machine" actions.&nbsp; I'd<BR>compare them more to the Grange movement than unionization. <BR><BR>Ob Trav:&nbsp; When you create a Starport consider the local position on<BR>unions and unionism.&nbsp; Does this world require that all<BR>loading/unloading of cargo be done by the local version of the<BR>Dockworkers?&nbsp; Is cargo transportation done exclusively by members of<BR>the Teamsters?&nbsp; Can the PC's "join" the locals by paying a fee, thus<BR>moving their own cargos?&nbsp; Are the local unions corrupt or clean?<BR>Maybe the being that drives the fuel truck has to be in "the<BR>teamsters", but he won't actual load the fuel, that requires a<BR>member of "the Chem workers", and in reality niether will do<BR>anything without appropriate bribes from the PC's.&nbsp; Lots of<BR>interesting possiblities there. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Eris <BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3544<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zb05.mx.aol.com (rly-zb05.mail.aol.com [172.31.41.5]) by air-zb01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 15:50:15 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zb05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 15:49:39 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id PAA67014;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 15:48:38 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sun, 21 Jan 2001 15:47:45 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id PAA66949<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 15:47:45 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 15:47:45 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101212047.PAA66949@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3544<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3545</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/21/01 3:26:01 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sunday, January 21 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3545<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Unions and Such<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Two Questions...<BR>RE: Starports and tech levels<BR>NEWSFLASH:&nbsp; Imperial Invaders Repelled At Lunar Orbit!<BR>Re: Link to the science behind a plasma weapon? (LONG)<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>CANCON Attendees?<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 11:09:22 +1100<BR>From: "Katharine Whitchurch" &lt;katts@globalfreeway.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt; From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Thom Jones-Low wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; This is the part of the rationale i've always had trouble with. It<BR>&gt; says, in effect, that you have to build a copper wire telegraphy<BR>&gt; system before you can install a cellular or satellite network, that<BR>&gt; you have to build waterwheel driven factories before coal fired<BR>&gt; before solar powered, that you have to build and use each generation<BR>&gt; of computer before the current best. This is somewhat shaky when<BR>&gt; considering internal development. Some cultures or planets might skip<BR>&gt; a step, as a result of differential resource availability if for no<BR>&gt; other reason.<BR><BR>Some might manage the transition, but a lot of others wont. In the real<BR>world, during the 1950-1970 'long boom', a lot of money got wasted in the<BR>Third World attempting to skip stages in development. One of the hangovers<BR>from this was a lot of third world debt. As a rule of thumb, it will fail<BR>three times for every time it succeeds. Development is complex, and it is<BR>easy to hit unexpected bottlenecks.<BR><BR>If you have a look at the list of underdeveloped countries in 1910, and<BR>compare the list to today, you will find perhaps three (Japan, Taiwan, South<BR>Korea) that jumped a long way in the league table. And South Korea's<BR>chaebols are fundamentally insolvent right now.<BR><BR>&gt;When we consider assistance from an outside source, as<BR>&gt; in Pocket Empires where an uplifted colony must pass through each<BR>&gt; tech level in turn, it is downright screwy, and does no match what we<BR>&gt; see on Earth today where lesser developed countries adopt - and<BR>&gt; sometimes build - the latest computers without first using rooms full<BR>&gt; of vacuum tubes, and install cellular networks and satellite TV<BR>&gt; without first building wire and cable networks.<BR><BR>Awww, crap. The progress you see in the three countires that succeeded in<BR>development was textiles (TL5) to steel, ships and chemicals (TL6) to cheap<BR>electronics and cheap cars (TL7), to more advanced electronics and cars<BR>(TL8). You might be able to skip a couple of stages in a particular sector,<BR>but you cant skip stages everywhere (cf the Great Leap Forward).<BR><BR>I can flat out guarantee you that just because Nigeria installs Starband, it<BR>doesnt mean they are going to develop high-tech industry and a space<BR>program.<BR><BR>This slow and steady sequence lets you build up a set of organisational and<BR>technical skills throughout the economy.<BR><BR>Now, where this breaks down in Traveller is that firstly you cant<BR>industrialise behind tariff walls (a strategy that can backfire, but is IMO<BR>an essential strategy for development), as that is interfering with<BR>interstellar trade, secondly worlds tend to get their best and brightest<BR>sucked offworld into hard-currency earning jobs (OK, some of them may come<BR>back 'home' twenty years later and bring back not only technology but also<BR>techniques), and thirdly the good, profitable bits of a worlds economy tend<BR>to be owned by off-world interests who dont like the idea of what the social<BR>chaos thrown up by development will do to their nice, stable, profitable<BR>little concern.<BR><BR>To cut a long story short, if you have a look at development economics, I<BR>think you can easily justify a bunch of poor, broke, unable to afford to<BR>develop worlds.<BR><BR>&gt; By this rationale, we really shouldn't be allowed to put research<BR>&gt; satellites in Mars orbit as the is no wire telegraphy system in place<BR>&gt; on Mars.<BR><BR>Straw Man.<BR><BR>Ian Whitchurch<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 17:02:38 -0500<BR>From: "Greenly, Jeff" &lt;greenlyj@rcbhsc.wvu.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Unions and Such<BR><BR>Fellow Travellers,<BR><BR>The labor union and its effect on industrialized society is a seriously<BR>polarizing issue and certainly worth looking at for its value as plot and<BR>storyline in our games. I do want to say that I think it's a bit<BR>irresponsible to fire off a post that so predjudicially bashes organized<BR>labor. I am not a union member, and I believe that the unions have done and<BR>are continuing to do some bad things, but I know that I enjoy benefits and<BR>good working conditions that union members have fought and died for. I live<BR>in West Virginia, a state with a rich, violent union history. This is the<BR>cradle of the UMWA, and if the name Matewan doesn't mean anything to you,<BR>look it up. On the other hand, the UMWA here in WVa went out on strike<BR>during World War II, slowing war production with contractual disputes over<BR>mine procedures. Roosevelt sent the Navy(!) in and busted it up, and<BR>rightfully so, I think. Two of my group's campaigns have centered around<BR>union activity, and it is a seriously cool plot device! There's a lot of<BR>passion and rage when you deal with oppressed labor movements, and if the<BR>PCs are doing the oppressing, well, there are some moral issues they may<BR>have to deal with. (like the Pinkertons here in West Virginia-- Private<BR>detectives hired to restore management control over mines in southern WVa<BR>and Kentucky. They were equipped in some cases with Thompson SMGs and<BR>Browning 50s!) And like eris is saying, a union can be a wonderful tool for<BR>twisting your characters' tails with disputes over who's gonna do what job<BR>and union dues and so on.<BR><BR>Just my .02<BR><BR>Jeff<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 14:47:36 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>On 01/21/01 at 10:02 AM,&nbsp; "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>said:<BR><BR>&gt;At 11:46 PM 1/21/2001 +1300, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Only if you consider groups such as the Teamsters, the Australian<BR>&gt;&gt;dock-workes, and other "Organized Labour" groups whose primary purpose is<BR>&gt;&gt;the maintenance of their own power base through violence and intimidation,<BR>&gt;&gt;heroes.<BR><BR>&gt;Umm.. I'm a Teamster (Local 665)&nbsp; Read up on working conditions for<BR>&gt;laborers before the labor movement.<BR><BR>I figured this would turn into an "interesting" argument when I read<BR>Frank's post.&nbsp; &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>While there certainly have been unions, maybe union locals would be<BR>a fairer statement, that use violence and intimidation to acquire and<BR>maintain their power base, there are also valid historical reasons<BR>for the establishment of militant unions.&nbsp; <BR><BR>However, I just can't see Ned Ludd's followers as the precursors to<BR>the trade union movement any more than the french "saboteurs" were.<BR>Both these groups were rural in make up, opposed to the<BR>industrial movement, and took militant "anti-machine" actions.&nbsp; I'd<BR>compare them more to the Grange movement than unionization. <BR><BR>Ob Trav:&nbsp; When you create a Starport consider the local position on<BR>unions and unionism.&nbsp; Does this world require that all<BR>loading/unloading of cargo be done by the local version of the<BR>Dockworkers?&nbsp; Is cargo transportation done exclusively by members of<BR>the Teamsters?&nbsp; Can the PC's "join" the locals by paying a fee, thus<BR>moving their own cargos?&nbsp; Are the local unions corrupt or clean?<BR>Maybe the being that drives the fuel truck has to be in "the<BR>teamsters", but he won't actual load the fuel, that requires a<BR>member of "the Chem workers", and in reality niether will do<BR>anything without appropriate bribes from the PC's.&nbsp; Lots of<BR>interesting possiblities there. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Eris <BR>- - -- <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 16:13:26 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>On 01/21/01 at 11:09 AM,&nbsp; "Katharine Whitchurch" &lt;katts@globalfreeway.com.au&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;Thom Jones-Low wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; This is the part of the rationale i've always had trouble with.<BR>&gt;&gt; It says, in effect, that you have to build a copper wire<BR>&gt;&gt; telegraphy system before you can install a cellular or satellite<BR>&gt;&gt; network, that you have to build waterwheel driven factories<BR>&gt;&gt; before coal fired before solar powered, that you have to build<BR>&gt;&gt; and use each generation of computer before the current best.<BR>&gt;&gt; This is somewhat shaky when considering internal development.<BR>&gt;&gt; Some cultures or planets might skip a step, as a result of<BR>&gt;&gt; differential resource availability if for no other reason.<BR><BR>&gt;Some might manage the transition, but a lot of others wont.&nbsp; In the<BR>&gt;real world, during the 1950-1970 'long boom', a lot of money got<BR>&gt;wasted in the Third World attempting to skip stages in development.<BR>&gt;One of the hangovers from this was a lot of third world debt.&nbsp; As a<BR>&gt;rule of thumb, it will fail three times for every time it succeeds.<BR>&gt;Development is complex, and it is easy to hit unexpected<BR>&gt;bottlenecks.<BR><BR><BIG snip><BR><BR>Let's say a TL4 world sells its raw materials and intellectual<BR>properties to buy a *few* TL9 products.&nbsp; Let's further say that the<BR>high-tech products it buys aren't frivolous (ie. consumer or<BR>military toys), but form the backbone of a real infrastructure<BR>improvement in medicine, communications, transportation,<BR>manufacturing, or some other useful technology.&nbsp; Time passes, and<BR>the readily available goods for foreign trade begins to dry up.<BR>The high-tech systems need maintenance, but the locals can't do it<BR>and importing technicians costs money the TL4 world can't afford, so<BR>the high-tech systems begin to break down.&nbsp; With maintenance not<BR>done the systems need replacement before long, and that further<BR>drains the world's declining funds.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Meanwhile, while all this is happening, who among the locals is<BR>developing the intermediate technologies that would be sustainable<BR>locally?&nbsp; No one, that's who.&nbsp; It's just not cost effective to<BR>invest billions in developing an "oil economy" when you have access<BR>to cheap fusion and gravitics...right?&nbsp; What happens then when the<BR>fusion reactors and grav vehicles need replacing, and you don't have<BR>the money to do it?&nbsp; <BR><BR>At best, an economy that follows this path will find a level of<BR>stagnation that they can maintain, but that they just don't have the<BR>accumulated capital (including intellectual) to advance beyond.<BR><BR>Now, throw in the "Long Night" and a severe cutback in interstellar<BR>trade.&nbsp; Worlds that depend too much on the import of high-tech will<BR>be in *really* big trouble.<BR><BR>I can readily believe that many worlds will be very concerned about<BR>maintaining a locally sustainable level of technology.&nbsp; A TL4 world,<BR>might not want many TL9 products, instead it might really want TL5<BR>or 6 products and (especially) tools. <BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 23:20:51 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Two Questions...<BR><BR>Ray Rangel wrote:<BR>&gt; First, since I am new to this whole RPG thing, can you suggest some on-line<BR>&gt; retailers (US)?<BR><BR>http://www.warehouse23.com/<BR><BR>Searching for 'Traveller' will give you just about everything you might<BR>need.<BR><BR>This is the current version of the game. That means that it is in print,<BR>and you won't have to search through lots of used-books places to get<BR>what you want.<BR><BR>They do paper miniatures (folded hard paper with images) for both<BR>Traveller and fantasy settings as well.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 14:20:44 -0800<BR>From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>"Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; &gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; &gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Alan Bradley<BR>&gt; &gt; Sent: Sunday, 21 January 2001 00:37 To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; From: michael stasica<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Ludite comes to mind.&nbsp; But an exact definition escapes me.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; The Luddites were an organised and armed rebel movement in 18th<BR>&gt; &gt; century England noted for destroying the machinery in textile mills<BR>&gt; &gt; that were displacing manual textile workers and driving them into<BR>&gt; &gt; poverty.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Naturally enough, they were slandered by the powers that be, and<BR>&gt; &gt; portrayed as mindless, anti-progress vandals.&nbsp; In fact, they were<BR>&gt; &gt; the good guys. (IMHO, of course.)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Ned Ludd a hero ?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Only if you consider groups such as the Teamsters, the Australian<BR>&gt; dock-workes, and other "Organized Labour" groups whose primary purpose<BR>&gt; is the maintenance of their own power base through violence and<BR>&gt; intimidation, heroes.<BR><BR>I very much do on both counts.&nbsp; Consider the world w/o such <BR>organizations.&nbsp; There are only two effective ways to stop <BR>businesses from oppressing the hell out of their workers, <BR>government controls and strong unions.&nbsp; The 2nd tends to be more <BR>efficient and effective than the first.&nbsp; The fact that (in the US at <BR>least) the working hours are o average way up, while the total (not <BR>hourly) income of the middle and lower middle class has been <BR>essentially stable (in terms of constant dollars) is in large part due <BR>to the decline in the powers of unions.&nbsp; In the first half of the 20th <BR>century, unions members fought and died for labor conditions we <BR>all now take for granted.&nbsp; Just because an organization has <BR>problems, doesn't mean it isn't vitallly necessary.<BR><BR><BR>- -John Snead sneadj@mindspring.com<BR><BR><BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 14:35:13 -0800<BR>From: "Kristian Miller" &lt;travellerne@3rd-imperium.com&gt;<BR>Subject: NEWSFLASH:&nbsp; Imperial Invaders Repelled At Lunar Orbit!<BR><BR>NEWSFLASH: Terra/Solomani Rim,<BR>Imperial Invaders Repelled At Lunar Orbit!<BR>Terra Stands Firm Against Imperium<BR>April 15 Designated "Terran System Defense Boat Memorial Day!"<BR>- -----------------------------------<BR>The Imperial fleet that began its unsuccessful invasion of Terra during the<BR>first week of April was repelled from the Terra system by a determined<BR>defense by the Terran system defense boats and remnants of the Solomani<BR>Navy.&nbsp; Massive Imperial reinforcements were brought in but were only able to<BR>cause minor damage to the AECO starport and land an army in central Siberia.<BR>The Imperial landings in Siberia were immediately cut off from supply by<BR>guerrillas and Confederation armies stationed in Asia.&nbsp; Surrender of the<BR>surrounded Imperial units is expected in the next few weeks.<BR><BR>The first new SDB squadrons to replace losses from the Imperial invasion<BR>will be available November of this year.&nbsp; In the meantime it is expected<BR>that the Imperial Navy will continue its campaign of harassment against the<BR>Terra system.<BR><BR>Rumours started by Imperial sympathizers, that planetary defense units<BR>"performed worse than Imperial mercenaries," are untrue.&nbsp; All planetary<BR>defense units performed like the superior Solomani troops that they are and<BR>inflicted heavier than expected losses on Imperial naval units.<BR>- ---------------------------------------<BR><BR>Glenn and I faced off over "Invasion: Earth" yesterday.&nbsp; We diced for sides<BR>and I ended up defending Terra.&nbsp; I spread my ground units out pretty evenly<BR>over the entire planet but concentrated all my naval assets in the far orbit<BR>box.&nbsp; Glenn attacked with his navy but had to witdraw when most of it and<BR>several troop units were destroyed.&nbsp; He used 12 waves of emergency<BR>reinforcements to replenish his navy (guarenteeing that the game would be at<BR>most a draw in the Imperial favor) but managed to destroy the rest of the<BR>Solomani naval units.<BR><BR>I think we learned that the Imperial player should secure the system and<BR>Luna in the first quarter; maybe land troops on Luna before he loses two of<BR>his transport squadrons in the second turn; but, wait until the end of the<BR>first quarter to do normal unit replacement instead of emergency<BR>replacement.<BR><BR>As for the Solomani player, concentrating your naval forces in the far orbit<BR>box seems to be a good idea; but, they should probably scatter soon after<BR>the first wave instead of being destroyed in a desparate defense (unless you<BR>have the capability to destroy several Imperial naval units carrying lots of<BR>troops.<BR><BR>Kristian<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 09:43:10 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: Link to the science behind a plasma weapon? (LONG)<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Howard Asked:<BR>&gt;I have in my possession a document that I think CAME from the Traveller<BR>list... it's a treatment<BR>&gt;of a can of ravioli as a railgun weapon, basically&nbsp; discussing the results<BR>of impact at various speeds.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I've been reluctant to post it anywhere because I cannot credit it. Any<BR>ideas?<BR><BR>Can anyone identify "Bill", the source of the calculations for the Ravioli<BR>Rail-Gun? (This must have been something I missed ;-).<BR><BR>Please email me and Howard Tayler &lt;schlock@keenspot.com&gt; directly if you<BR>know the answer (and are willing to risk your life and/or reputation ;-) ;<BR>- -).<BR><BR>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+&nbsp; begin message reposted from Howard&nbsp; +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+<BR><BR>This needs to get cleaned up, tracked back to its source, verified, and<BR>given a framed place of honor on the Science Corner.<BR><BR>- -dB<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Pronto [mailto:pronto_r031@telus.net]<BR>Sent: Thursday, December 21, 2000 11:30 PM<BR>To: SomebodyStrange@aol.com; Padre; David Brady<BR>Subject: Fw: Nostalgia Week Continues (long, but _worth_ it!)<BR><BR>&gt; Over the past couple of days, I've reposted material from the TML's<BR>&gt; illustrious (recent) past.&nbsp; I have mentioned (and reposted) discussions<BR>&gt; ranging from Hiver Kung-Fu Theater to the Son of Santanocheev.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;hiver handwave&gt; Trivial, compared to what I'm about to repost. &lt;/hiver<BR>&gt; handwave&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In December of 1998, a few months after I joined the TML, a post<BR>&gt; appeared that, IMHO, sums up the glory that the TML has known.&nbsp; Sadly,<BR>&gt; my archive of this post rests on a computer that is no longer<BR>&gt; functioning.&nbsp; I mentioned this thread a short time ago.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Fortunately, the TML is a truly global, truly sharing organization.&nbsp; One<BR>&gt; of our members heard my plea, and forwarded the original Ravioli Rail<BR>&gt; Gun post which I repost here tonight.&nbsp; My thanks to this individual (I<BR>&gt; refrain from mentioning this person's name for possible privacy<BR>&gt; reasons).&nbsp; You know who you are; feel free to let the TML know that it<BR>&gt; is by your grace that our newer members can now view this epochal post.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; May we all learn and profit from this example.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; **begin repost [original post: 30 Dec 1998]**<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; ------------------------------<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Date: Wed, 30 Dec 1998 08:31:46 -0500<BR>&gt; From: "Peter H. Brenton" &lt;pbrenton@mit.edu&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: HUMOR/Physics; Under enough pressure, ravioli behaves as a gas.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; This is humor only people at MIT...or on the Traveller Mailing<BR>&gt; list...can<BR>&gt; appreciate.&nbsp; Ravioli rail guns anyone?<BR>&gt; While humorous in primary intent, this article also contains important<BR>&gt; information about impact effects at vars. speeds...of a can of ravioli.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; - ------- Forwarded Message<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;To: 0xdeadbeef@substance.abuse.blackdown.org<BR>&gt; &gt;Subject: Under enough pressure, ravioli behaves as a gas.<BR>&gt; &gt;Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 11:43:20 -0500<BR>&gt; &gt;From: glen mccready &lt;glen@qnx.com<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt; [snip forwards]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;There was still one aspect of the whole concept of a ravioli-loaded<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;railgun type wepon which we, lolling about late on a weeknight, with<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;only a few neurons randomly firing, could not resolve.&nbsp; Would a chunk<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;of metal (can of ravioli) impacting another, larger, rest mass<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;structure (star destroyer) produce an "explosion" effect, or simply<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;punch an appropriately shaped hole as it passed through?&nbsp; Bill?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;What am I, the neighborhood blast physicist???&nbsp; Well, maybe... :-)<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;It all depends on speed of impact versus the speed of sound in the<BR>target<BR>&gt; &gt;(what is called the Mach number, where Mach 1 means the speed of sound,<BR>&gt; &gt;Mach 2 is twice the speed of sound, etc), and the speed of the ravioli<BR>&gt; &gt;versus the speed of light in the target (which I'll call the Cerenkov<BR>&gt; &gt;number, where Cerenkov 1 is the speed of light in anything; Cerenkov 1.3<BR>&gt; &gt;is the speed of high-energy protons in a water-cooled reactor (that's<BR>why<BR>&gt; &gt;you get that nifty blue glow), and you can get up to Cerenkov 2.4 using<BR>&gt; &gt;diamonds and nuclear accellerators.&nbsp; In the late 40's people used to<BR>talk<BR>&gt; &gt;about Cerenkov numbers, but they don't anymore.&nbsp; Pity.).&nbsp; Lastly,<BR>there's<BR>&gt; &gt;the ravioli velocity expressed as a fraction of the speed of light in a<BR>&gt; &gt;vacuum (that is, as a fraction of "c").&nbsp; "C" velocities are always<BR>between<BR>&gt; &gt;0 and 1.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;At low speeds (REAL low) the ravioli will simply flow over the surface,<BR>&gt; &gt;yielding a space-cruiser with a distinctly Italian paint job.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Faster (still well below speed-of-sound in the target) the metal of the<BR>&gt; &gt;space-cruiser's skin will distort downward, making what we Boston<BR>drivers<BR>&gt; &gt;call a "small dent".<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Faster still, you may have a "big dent" or maybe even a "big dent with a<BR>&gt; &gt;hole in the middle", caused by the ravioli having enough energy to push<BR>&gt; &gt;the dent through, stretching and thinning the hull metal till the metal<BR>&gt; &gt;finally tears in the middle of the dent.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Getting up past Mach 1 (say, 5000 feet/sec for steel), you start to get<BR>&gt; &gt;punch-a-hole-shaped-like-the-object effects, because the metal is being<BR>&gt; &gt;asked to move faster than the binding forces in the object can propagate<BR>&gt; &gt;the "HEY!&nbsp; MOVE!" information.&nbsp; (After all, sound is just the binding<BR>&gt; &gt;forces between atoms in a material moving the adjacent atoms -- and the<BR>&gt; &gt;speed of sound is how fast the message to "move" can propagate.)&nbsp; From<BR>&gt; &gt;this, we see that WileE Coyote often reached far-supersonic speeds<BR>because<BR>&gt; &gt;he often punched silhouette-type holes in rocks, cliffs, trucks, etc.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Around Mach 4 or so, another phenomenon starts -- compressive heating.<BR>&gt; &gt;This is where the leading edge of the ravioli actually starts being<BR>heated<BR>&gt; &gt;by compression (remember PV=nRT, the ideal gas law?)&nbsp; Well, ravioli<BR>isn't<BR>&gt; &gt;a gas, but under enough pressure, ravioli behaves as a gas.&nbsp; It is<BR>&gt; &gt;compressed at the instant of impact and gets hot -- very hot.&nbsp; Likewise,<BR>&gt; &gt;the impact point on the hull is compressed and gets hot.&nbsp; Both turn to<BR>&gt; &gt;gasses -- real gasses, glowing-white-hot gasses.&nbsp; The gasses expand<BR>&gt; &gt;spherically, causing crater-like effects, including a raised rim and a<BR>&gt; &gt;basically parabolic shape.&nbsp; In the center of the crater, some material<BR>is<BR>&gt; &gt;vaporized, then there's a melt zone, then a larger "bent" zone, and the<BR>&gt; &gt;raised rim is caused because the gas expansion bubble center point (the<BR>&gt; &gt;bending force) is actually *inside* the hull plate.&nbsp; If the hull plate<BR>&gt; &gt;isn't thick enough, then the gas-expansion bubble pushes through to the<BR>&gt; &gt;other side, and you get a structural breach event (technically speaking,<BR>&gt; &gt;a "big hole") in the side of the space-cruiser.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Compressive heating really hits the stride up around 20,000 feet/sec<BR>(Mach<BR>&gt; &gt;4 in steel, Mach 15 in air) and continues as a major factor all the way<BR>&gt; &gt;up to the high fractional Cerenkov speeds, where nuclear forces begin to<BR>&gt; &gt;take effect.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Aside: the "re-entry friction heating" that spacecraft endure when the<BR>&gt; &gt;reenter the atmosphere is NOT friction.&nbsp; It's really compressive heating<BR>&gt; &gt;of the air in the path.&nbsp; As long as the spacecraft is faster than Mach<BR>1,<BR>&gt; &gt;the air can't know to get out of the way, so it bunches up in front of<BR>&gt; &gt;the spacecraft.&nbsp; When you squeeze any gas, it gets hot.&nbsp; So, the glowing<BR>&gt; &gt;"reentry gas" is really just squeezed air, which heats the spacecraft<BR>heat<BR>&gt; &gt;shield by conduction and infrared.&nbsp; The hypersonic ravioli can be<BR>expected<BR>&gt; &gt;to behave similarly.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;As we increase speed from the high Mach numbers (about 10 miles/sec) all<BR>&gt; &gt;the way up to about 150,000 miles/sec, not much different happens except<BR>&gt; &gt;that the amount of kinetic energy (which turns into compressive heat)<BR>&gt; &gt;increases.&nbsp; This is a huge range of velocity, but it's uninteresting<BR>&gt; &gt;velocity.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;At high fractional Cerenkov speeds, the ravioli is now beginning to<BR>travel<BR>&gt; &gt;at relativistic velocities.&nbsp; Among other things, this means that the<BR>&gt; &gt;ravioli is aging more slowly than usual, and the ravioli can looks<BR>&gt; &gt;compressed in the direction of travel.&nbsp; But that's really not important<BR>&gt; &gt;right now.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;As we pass Cerenkov 1.0 in the target, we get a new phenomenon --<BR>Cerenkov<BR>&gt; &gt;radiation.&nbsp; This is that distinctive blue glow seen around water-cooled<BR>&gt; &gt;reactors.&nbsp; It's just (relatively) harmless light (harmless compared to<BR>&gt; &gt;the other blast effects, that is).&nbsp; I mention it only because it's so<BR>&gt; &gt;nifty...<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;At around .9 c (Cerenkov 1.1) , the ravioli starts to perceptibly weigh<BR>&gt; &gt;more.&nbsp; It's just a relativistic mass increase -- all the additional<BR>weight<BR>&gt; &gt;is actually energy, available to do compressive heating upon impact.<BR>The<BR>&gt; &gt;extra weight is converted to heat energy according to the equation<BR>E=mc^2;<BR>&gt; &gt;it looks like compressive heating but it's not.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;[Here's where I'm a little hazy on the numbers; I'm at work and<BR>&gt; &gt;don't have time to rederive the Lorentz transformations.]<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;At around .985 c (Cerenkov 1.2 or so), the ravioli now weighs twice what<BR>&gt; &gt;it used to weigh. For a one pound can, that's two pounds... or about<BR>sixty<BR>&gt; &gt;megatons of excess energy.&nbsp; All of it turns to heat on impact.&nbsp; Probably<BR>&gt; &gt;very little is left of the space-cruiser.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;At around .998 c, the impacting ravioli begins to behave less like<BR>ravioli<BR>&gt; &gt;and more like an extremely intense radiation beam.&nbsp; Protons in the water<BR>&gt; &gt;of the ravioli begin to successfully penetrate the nuclei of the hull<BR>&gt; &gt;metal.&nbsp; Thermonuclear interactions, such as hydrogen fusion, may take<BR>&gt; &gt;place in the tomato sauce.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;At around .9998 c, the ravioli radiation beam is still wimpy as far as<BR>&gt; &gt;nuclear accellerator energy is concerned, but because there is so much<BR>of<BR>&gt; &gt;it, we can expect a truly powerful blast of mixed radiation coming out<BR>of<BR>&gt; &gt;the impact site.&nbsp; Radiation, not mechanical blast, may become the<BR>largest<BR>&gt; &gt;hazard to any surviving crew members.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;At around .9999999 c, the ravioli radiation may begin to produce<BR>&gt; &gt;"interesting" nuclear particles and events (heavy, short-lived<BR>particles).<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;At around .999999999999 c, the ravioli impact site may begin to resemble<BR>&gt; &gt;conditions in the original "big bang"; equilibrium between matter and<BR>&gt; &gt;energy; free pair production; antimatter and matter coexisting in<BR>&gt; &gt;equilibrium with a very intense gamma-ray flux, etc.[1]<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Past that, who knows?&nbsp; It may be possible to generate quantum black<BR>holes<BR>&gt; &gt;given a sufficiently high velocity can of ravioli.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; --Bill<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;[1]According to physicist W. Murray, we may also expect raining frogs,<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; plagues of locusts, cats and dogs living together, real Old Testament<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; destruction.&nbsp; You get the idea...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; **end repost**<BR><BR>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+&nbsp; end message reposted from Howard&nbsp; +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+<BR><BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 15:13:58 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt;Let's say a TL4 world sells its raw materials and intellectual<BR>&gt;properties to buy a *few* TL9 products.&nbsp; Let's further say that the<BR>&gt;high-tech products it buys aren't frivolous (ie. consumer or<BR>&gt;military toys), but form the backbone of a real infrastructure<BR>&gt;improvement in medicine, communications, transportation,<BR>&gt;manufacturing, or some other useful technology.&nbsp; Time passes, and<BR>&gt;the readily available goods for foreign trade begins to dry up.<BR>&gt;The high-tech systems need maintenance, but the locals can't do it<BR>[snip]<BR><BR>Why not? Time has passed. Have they used none of this time to train <BR>themselves to maintain the equipment? You said it was non-frivolous <BR>stuff that formed the backbone of a real infrastructure, including <BR>manufacturing. Why wouldn't they buy and install that portion of the <BR>infrastructure related to maintenance? Why don't they import the <BR>ability (material and intellectual) to maintain their new toys? They <BR>sound quite sensible otherwise.<BR><BR>My main complaint in the first instance was not worlds pulling <BR>themselves up by their bootstraps - in that case you have to consider <BR>will and world view - but worlds which are being developed by allies <BR>or conquerors a la Pocket Empires. Why must i invest time and money <BR>building a rail network for steam engines if my goal is superhighways <BR>and internal combustion engines? The rails are built simply to be <BR>abandoned. The factories are built to be torn down. The workers are <BR>trained to have skills unneeded in ten years. Granted this is often <BR>the way government projects are run today, but we don't have the <BR>advantage of having the full specifications for the next technology <BR>available.<BR><BR>I didn't have to learn to ride a horse before i could learn to drive <BR>a car. If i were transported into the past, the locals would consider <BR>me as stupid and inept as we would consider them if they were <BR>transported to our times, because i couldn't operate or manufacture <BR>their technology. The locals of a lower tech planet have the same <BR>intelligence as those of a higher tech planet. It would probably take <BR>a generation or more to educate a core group in the new high tech, <BR>but i don't see why the locals need to be taught to build steam <BR>engines and railroads if the goal is to teach them to build internal <BR>combustion engines and super-highways. Get them young and you don't <BR>have to tell them that pushing the green button wakes the spirits <BR>trapped in the spirit cage and makes the air-raft fly. Even some of <BR>the old timers wouldn't need to things explained in that way.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 10:08:42 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: CANCON Attendees?<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Ian Whitchurch wrote:<BR>&gt;PS Speaking of lo-tech troops CanCon is next weekend ... I'm running the<BR>&gt;Russian II Corps in the big Napoleonics game ... we should have about 50<BR>&gt;players in the game, with about 5000 figures a side.<BR><BR>OK, so how many TMLers are going to be at CANCON? I was figuring on<BR>dropping in to look at the stalls, at least.<BR><BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 18:18:00 -0500<BR>From: Thom Jones-Low &lt;tjoneslo@together.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 21:33:46 -0500<BR>&gt; From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Starports and tech levels<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Actually if you do the analysis, something like 90% of the Imperium's<BR>&gt; &gt; population is at TL9 or better, Steller tech.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Grrr, perhaps the problem is Traveller wastes a lot of digits on low-tech<BR>&gt; worlds that don't exist.&nbsp; A holdover from Sylean expansion I suspect.&nbsp; IMTU<BR>&gt; the tech levels have been compressed a bit and tend to track GURPS more<BR>&gt; closely (but not perfectly).&nbsp;&nbsp; I also have modified the starport digit to<BR>&gt; reflect what we have been talking about.<BR>&gt; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; If you have 10 worlds at TL8- with populations of 100,000, and one<BR>world with population 1,000,000,000 (one billion) and TL12, you have 99%<BR>of the population living at TL12, but they only live on 10% of the<BR>worlds. This is the way the Imperium is laid out, a small number of high<BR>population, high TL worlds with many low population, middle to low TL<BR>worlds. <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; It's actually a holdover from the First Imperium, where the Vilani did<BR>not have the inclination to terraform planets, and only settled and<BR>invested in the "best" ones. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thomas Jones-Low<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; tjoneslo@together.net<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 18:25:04 -0500<BR>From: Thom Jones-Low &lt;tjoneslo@together.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 12:02:38 -0800<BR>&gt; From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This is the part of the rationale i've always had trouble with. It<BR>&gt; says, in effect, that you have to build a copper wire telegraphy<BR>&gt; system before you can install a cellular or satellite network, that<BR>&gt; you have to build waterwheel driven factories before coal fired<BR>&gt; before solar powered, that you have to build and use each generation<BR>&gt; of computer before the current best. This is somewhat shaky when<BR>&gt; considering internal development. Some cultures or planets might skip<BR>&gt; a step, as a result of differential resource availability if for no<BR>&gt; other reason. When we consider assistance from an outside source, as<BR>&gt; in Pocket Empires where an uplifted colony must pass through each<BR>&gt; tech level in turn, it is downright screwy, and does no match what we<BR>&gt; see on Earth today where lesser developed countries adopt - and<BR>&gt; sometimes build - the latest computers without first using rooms full<BR>&gt; of vacuum tubes, and install cellular networks and satellite TV<BR>&gt; without first building wire and cable networks.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; By this rationale, we really shouldn't be allowed to put research<BR>&gt; satellites in Mars orbit as the is no wire telegraphy system in place<BR>&gt; on Mars.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; TTFN<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; g<BR>&gt; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The infrastructure I am talking about here is the knowledge base,<BR>manufacturing and repair facilites. Some of this goes back to the "What<BR>is TL?" discussion, and I'm assuming the more conserative manufacture<BR>and repair definition. There is a big difference between buying an<BR>advance technology item and understanding it well enough to be able to<BR>build a repair it. <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I'm also assuming the overall system TL is an average of all the<BR>technology areas, not the maximum. So you are correct, to take Mars from<BR>the current TL0 to TL8 you don't need to go through the copper wire<BR>telegraph or heliograph first. <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; So a TL 7 world may well have a TL11 satellite weather tracking and<BR>communications system, but most of the people still drive beast drawn<BR>carts and hand pump their water. <BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; There are two effects here. First is the higher technology is more<BR>complex. Second, what is considered effective use of technology requires<BR>more interconnected pieces. Using your examples, the TL5 communications<BR>technology (copper wire telegraph) requires only a few operators,<BR>switches and a chunk of copper wire. But at TL7, a communications<BR>network requires various different types of terminals for everyone,<BR>routers &amp; switches and a larger quantity of higher grade wire. <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; There is also the effect of needing tools to build the tools to build<BR>the widget. From about TL5 on, each TL adds one layer to this effect,<BR>where some is replacement for existing technology and some is building<BR>new tools to support the new technology. The best expression of this<BR>(supported somewhat by the World generation rules) is describing a<BR>minimum required population to support a given TL. The examples i've see<BR>have been variants of the 10^GTL population. You can have a planet with<BR>a smaller population, but it is dependent upon external trade to support<BR>it's technology. <BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Also, there is a big difference between building a new colony where you<BR>can lay in all new technology and an existing world with a large<BR>population (like most of the Imperium). Most of the worlds in the<BR>Imperium have been populated for thousands of years, and with large<BR>populations require a massive investment to move forward. <BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thomas Jones-Low<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; tjoneslo@together.net<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3545<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yd04.mx.aol.com (rly-yd04.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.4]) by air-yd03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 18:26:01 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yd04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 18:25:31 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id SAA72938;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 18:24:20 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sun, 21 Jan 2001 18:24:10 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id SAA72894<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 18:24:10 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 18:24:10 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101212324.SAA72894@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3545<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></BIG></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3546</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/21/01 10:54:45 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Monday, January 22 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3546<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: TML sniper competition<BR>RE: Starports and tech levels (flame on!)<BR>Re: Unions and Such<BR>Re: Unions and Such<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: TML sniper competition<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: TML sniper competition<BR>RE: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Back Ups<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Query: The Githiaskio<BR>RE: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>RE: Mysterious black tar heroin appears in Seattle park<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 23:28 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: TML sniper competition<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;B690760F.3B23%webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Drooollll!!!!<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:44:28 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels (flame on!)<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;"Douglas E. Berry" <BR>&gt; &gt;Umm.. I'm a Teamster (Local 665)&nbsp; Read up on working conditions for<BR>&gt; &gt;laborers before the labor movement.<BR><BR>Is Local 666 the one that covers handbasket operators?<BR><BR>&gt; From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>&gt; I figured this would turn into an "interesting" argument when I read<BR>&gt; Frank's post.&nbsp; &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>: )&nbsp; Frank's as nuts in his own way as I am in mine.&nbsp; I won't be getting<BR>into a flame war with him...<BR><BR>&gt; While there certainly have been unions, maybe union locals would be<BR>&gt; a fairer statement, that use violence and intimidation to acquire and<BR>&gt; maintain their power base, there are also valid historical reasons<BR>&gt; for the establishment of militant unions.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Also, labour racketeering has, at various points, (particularly in the US)<BR>been deliberately fostered to defeat/tame/corrupt militant unions.&nbsp; In<BR>countries other than the US, the presence of powerful Social Democratic or<BR>Labour parties has also tended to tame/corrupt unions, since the<BR>possibility of careers in parliament or even positions in government tends<BR>to encourage moderation/collaboration/manipulation.&nbsp; (For example, in<BR>Australia, the "AWU faction" in the Labor Party has recently been busted<BR>for engaging in vote rigging.)<BR><BR>&gt; However, I just can't see Ned Ludd's followers as the precursors to<BR>&gt; the trade union movement any more than the french "saboteurs" were.<BR>&gt; Both these groups were rural in make up, opposed to the<BR>&gt; industrial movement, and took militant "anti-machine" actions.&nbsp; I'd<BR>&gt; compare them more to the Grange movement than unionization. <BR><BR>The Luddites, at least, refrained from attacking mills where the employees<BR>were treated well.<BR><BR>There are, of course, considerable differences between these early<BR>movements and later unionism, but the common elements are there.&nbsp; There are<BR>also parallels with medieval guilds and later unions too...<BR><BR>Ob Trav:&nbsp; Lots, depending on whether or not you want to go into this kind<BR>of stuff.<BR><BR>Just one:&nbsp; Tukera Lines organises an "Employees' Association" to block the<BR>rise of unionisation amongst its staff.&nbsp; Members of the "unauthorised"<BR>union start getting strongarmed into joining the Employees' Association. <BR>Trouble is, the "unofficial" union is led by the Ine Givar.&nbsp; The IG and the<BR>Vemene get into a black war fought over a whole sector or more.&nbsp; <BR><BR>The PCs are <BR>(1) asked to join the IG-led union (which also organises free traders, and<BR>members of lines other than Tukera).&nbsp; The Vemene "ask" them not to.<BR><BR>(2) hired to transport (or escort) a union official, who the Vemene will<BR>attempt to hit, or a Tukera official the IG will attempt to hit.<BR><BR>(3) caught up in a mercenary strike against a union office.<BR><BR>(4) hired to carry out a mercenary strike against a union (or Tukera)<BR>office, training camp or other facility.<BR><BR>(5) hired to break into a union (or Tukera) office.<BR><BR>(6) hired to provide security to a union (or Tukera) office.<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 09:16:49 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Unions and Such<BR><BR>&gt; From: "Greenly, Jeff" <BR>&gt; Fellow Travellers,<BR><BR>That's "Comrade" to you.&nbsp; : )<BR><BR>&gt; I live in West Virginia, a state with a rich, violent union history. This<BR>&gt; is the cradle of the UMWA, and if the name Matewan doesn't mean anything<BR>&gt; to you, look it up. <BR><BR>Oh yeah.&nbsp; <BR><BR>If all else fails, there's a film of this name by John Sayles.&nbsp; Eminently<BR>quotable.&nbsp; Sayles himself appears in a cameo:&nbsp; he gave himself the best<BR>lines in the film.&nbsp; Just lift the plot. <BR><BR>&gt; There's a lot of passion and rage when you deal with oppressed labor<BR>&gt; movements, and if the PCs are doing the oppressing, well, there are some<BR>&gt; moral issues they may have to deal with. (like the Pinkertons here in<BR>&gt; West Virginia-- Private detectives hired to restore management control<BR>&gt; over mines in southern WVa and Kentucky. They were equipped in some cases<BR>&gt; with Thompson SMGs and Browning 50s!)<BR><BR>There is also a Dashiell Hammett story called, (my brain has failed), umm,<BR>Red Harvest?&nbsp; It was one of his early ones and it got him into trouble<BR>because of the amount of violence.&nbsp; That's why most of the violence in the<BR>Maltese Falcon happens "off-stage".<BR><BR>Anyway, it deals with this kind of private detective stuff.&nbsp; Hammett<BR>himself went through some of it - which is why he quit and became a<BR>writer...<BR><BR>OBTRAV:&nbsp; Maltese Falcon/Millenium Falcon/Ford Falcon.&nbsp; Umm, some kind of<BR>McGuffin.<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 19:18:07 EST<BR>From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Unions and Such<BR><BR>Heh.&nbsp; Far be it from me to question unionism.&nbsp; One would have to be<BR>pretty ignorant of social history to claim that unions aren't important<BR>institutions and well worth preserving.<BR><BR>It's worth remembering, though, that human history is full of institutions<BR>which start out by serving useful (nay, vitally needed) functions in society,<BR>and end up as more-or-less corrupt machines for self-perpetuation.&nbsp; That's<BR>just how human institutions seem to work.&nbsp; I imagine all of us can point<BR>to present-day examples (although that's a good exercise for another<BR>forum than this one).<BR><BR>ObTrav: What institutions fall under this heading in the Third Imperium?<BR>I imagine under the David Nilsen worldview, the Imperial nobility itself<BR>would qualify. . .<BR><BR>- ----------<BR>Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>set of people who will take offense at it."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 17:12:37 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt;[snip] The best expression of this<BR>&gt;(supported somewhat by the World generation rules) is describing a<BR>&gt;minimum required population to support a given TL.<BR><BR>Which world generation rules?<BR><BR>&gt;The examples i've see<BR>&gt;have been variants of the 10^GTL population. You can have a planet with<BR>&gt;a smaller population, but it is dependent upon external trade to support<BR>&gt;it's technology.<BR><BR>Makes sense to me. It's unlikely we will ever generate a consensus as <BR>to what tech level is, but it seems evident from these various <BR>discussions that tech level is not a characteristic of the world but <BR>of the population. So if you settle a pre-populated world, or you <BR>have a balkanized world, you have multiple tech levels on a single <BR>world.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; Also, there is a big difference between building a new colony where you<BR>&gt;can lay in all new technology and an existing world with a large<BR>&gt;population (like most of the Imperium). Most of the worlds in the<BR>&gt;Imperium have been populated for thousands of years, and with large<BR>&gt;populations require a massive investment to move forward.<BR><BR>I have a quibble with this statement. Most of the worlds in the <BR>Imperium have low populations. HiPop worlds comprise the vast <BR>majority of the population, but the minority of the worlds.<BR><BR>Imperial Main Worlds (According to my AllWorld.xls file)<BR>Population<BR>UWP&nbsp; &nbsp; n<BR>0&nbsp; &nbsp; 281<BR>1&nbsp; &nbsp; 427<BR>2&nbsp; &nbsp; 686<BR>3&nbsp; &nbsp; 896<BR>4&nbsp; &nbsp; 1357<BR>5&nbsp; &nbsp; 1392<BR>6&nbsp; &nbsp; 1218<BR>7&nbsp; &nbsp; 1035<BR>8&nbsp; &nbsp; 876<BR>9&nbsp; &nbsp; 624<BR>A&nbsp; &nbsp; 257<BR>Total&nbsp; &nbsp; 9049<BR><BR>Let's remove the Pop-0 worlds, just because they're weird. The total <BR>number of worlds to consider is thus 8768.<BR><BR>4.87% of Imperial Main Worlds have &lt; 100 people.<BR>12.79% have &lt; 1,000 people.<BR>22.91% have &lt; 10,000 people.<BR>38.39 % have &lt; 100,000 people.<BR>54.27% have &lt; 1,000,000 people.<BR>68.16% have &lt; 10,000,000 people.<BR>79.96% have &lt; 100,000,000 people.<BR>89.95% have &lt; 1,000,000,000 people.<BR>97.07% have &lt; 10,000,000,000 people.<BR>2.93% have &gt;= 10,000,000,000 people.<BR><BR>A million people is a very small number when talking about uplifting, <BR>but 54.27% of Imperial worlds with at least some population have less <BR>than a million people. I wouldn't even consider 10 million people to <BR>be a large population. When 68.16% of Imperial worlds with a non-zero <BR>population have less than 10 million people, i don't think it is <BR>accurate to say most of the worlds in the Imperium have large <BR>populations.<BR><BR>Assuming every world has a population multiplier of 1, HiPop worlds <BR>(UWP A) have 2,570,000,000,000 people, or 78.04% of the Imperium's <BR>total population on 2.93% of the main worlds.<BR><BR>Anyone care to work out how large a colonization effort is needed <BR>according to the World Tamers Handbook (GDW, TNE) to plant a colony <BR>of one million people? A high population world wouldn't even notice <BR>the loss of one million people.<BR><BR>BTW, has anyone solved the puzzle of the A Few Minor Worlds post?<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 17:46:43 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: TML sniper competition<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; At 11:18 AM 1/21/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;Mark, Doug, Jesse et al.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;With all the talk about having a shoot off with the loser buying dinner, I<BR>&gt;&gt;thought you might like to see what I'll be bringing.&nbsp; This is the infamous<BR>&gt;&gt;sniper that Jesse mentioned. This is the first gun where I worried about<BR>&gt;&gt;barometric pressure when shooting!<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;see:&nbsp; http://www.travellerguns.com/tech/sniper.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Folks, we're using his weapon.&nbsp; Hell, just getting some range time would be<BR>&gt; worth the cost of dinner.<BR><BR>Well, as long as it's "group size", then I guess it's fair. Otherwise,<BR>I'd want some practice shots. I'm one of the folks who can be handed a<BR>rifle that needs sighting in and do a halfway decent job of hitting the<BR>target by "correcting" in my head. I won't get tight groups that way,<BR>but I'll be in the general vicinity of my aim point. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 18:02:34 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Let's say a TL4 world sells its raw materials and intellectual<BR>&gt;&gt;properties to buy a *few* TL9 products.&nbsp; Let's further say that the<BR>&gt;&gt;high-tech products it buys aren't frivolous (ie. consumer or<BR>&gt;&gt;military toys), but form the backbone of a real infrastructure<BR>&gt;&gt;improvement in medicine, communications, transportation,<BR>&gt;&gt;manufacturing, or some other useful technology.&nbsp; Time passes, and<BR>&gt;&gt;the readily available goods for foreign trade begins to dry up.<BR>&gt;&gt;The high-tech systems need maintenance, but the locals can't do it<BR>&gt; [snip]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Why not? Time has passed. Have they used none of this time to train <BR>&gt; themselves to maintain the equipment? You said it was non-frivolous <BR>&gt; stuff that formed the backbone of a real infrastructure, including <BR>&gt; manufacturing. Why wouldn't they buy and install that portion of the <BR>&gt; infrastructure related to maintenance? Why don't they import the <BR>&gt; ability (material and intellectual) to maintain their new toys? They <BR>&gt; sound quite sensible otherwise.<BR><BR>Simple. Consider that say, Zaire, can import cell phones. But they<BR>*can't* repair them. The cell sites can have modules swapped in and<BR>out, but the modules aren't repairable either. <BR><BR>To be able to maintain such WITHOUT IMPORTED PARTS requires facilities<BR>that their local economy *can't* support. It takes a fair sized set of<BR>chemical plants just to produce the hyperpure silicon, and the<BR>materials used in processing it. <BR><BR>It takes more stuff to produce silicon wafers from that. And still more<BR>to make chips from that. I used to work in that end of things. The<BR>non-trade secret stuff I could tell you would take up *pages*. And<BR>wouldn't be enough to let you build it or run it.<BR><BR>Then you need to produce the plastics, circuit boards, wire, etc. <BR><BR>Then consider that you need to be able to produce and maintain all the<BR>equipment used in those facilities. That requires special alloys, all<BR>sort of metal fabrication facilities etc.<BR><BR>And there just plain aren't enugh *people* to do all that *and* produce<BR>food and keep the economy going. Nor enough money to pay for it. <BR><BR>&gt; My main complaint in the first instance was not worlds pulling <BR>&gt; themselves up by their bootstraps - in that case you have to consider <BR>&gt; will and world view - but worlds which are being developed by allies <BR>&gt; or conquerors a la Pocket Empires. Why must i invest time and money <BR>&gt; building a rail network for steam engines if my goal is superhighways <BR>&gt; and internal combustion engines? The rails are built simply to be <BR>&gt; abandoned. The factories are built to be torn down. The workers are <BR>&gt; trained to have skills unneeded in ten years. Granted this is often <BR>&gt; the way government projects are run today, but we don't have the <BR>&gt; advantage of having the full specifications for the next technology <BR>&gt; available.<BR><BR>You don't necessarily need to build rail networks. But they actually<BR>*are* a better investment than highways, at least until you get CG. <BR><BR>But you need to consider the *huge* difference between what you can use<BR>and what you can maintain. If you need to import *parts* (as opposed to<BR>raw materials), then it's *not* *your* tech level. <BR><BR>&gt; The locals of a lower tech planet have the same <BR>&gt; intelligence as those of a higher tech planet. It would probably take <BR>&gt; a generation or more to educate a core group in the new high tech, <BR>&gt; but i don't see why the locals need to be taught to build steam <BR>&gt; engines and railroads if the goal is to teach them to build internal <BR>&gt; combustion engines and super-highways. Get them young and you don't <BR>&gt; have to tell them that pushing the green button wakes the spirits <BR>&gt; trapped in the spirit cage and makes the air-raft fly. Even some of <BR>&gt; the old timers wouldn't need to things explained in that way.<BR><BR>As I noted, if you are going for a planned advance from their current<BR>TL to a higher one, and don't want to make them *totally* dependent* on<BR>offworld parts and supplies, you *do* have to go one step at a time. <BR><BR>But you can (and should) skip some steps. For example, the internal<BR>combustion engine is best skipped. Steam engines *can* be built that'll<BR>do the job *and* both use less fuel and produce less pollution. And<BR>electrics are likely workable as well.<BR><BR>Likewise, highways are pointless. Railroads will do for most purposes<BR>until you can get to the general use of CG.<BR><BR>Yes, a lot of high TL stuff *will* get used. But until it can be<BR>*built* locally, it's always at the mercy of offworld merchants. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 03:05:05 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: TML sniper competition<BR><BR>on 21/1/01 7:18 pm, Tod Glenn at webmaster@travellercentral.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; see:&nbsp; http://www.travellerguns.com/tech/sniper.html<BR><BR>Very nice, you lucky chap. :)<BR><BR>Have you seen these?<BR><BR>http://www.snipercentral.com/tango51.htm<BR><BR>They make some extraordinary claims it. The are lots of other really cool<BR>rifles on this site.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:49:06 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>On 21 Jan 01, at 14:47, eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; However, I just can't see Ned Ludd's followers as the precursors to<BR>&gt; the trade union movement any more than the french "saboteurs" were.<BR>&gt; Both these groups were rural in make up, opposed to the<BR>&gt; industrial movement, and took militant "anti-machine" actions.&nbsp; I'd<BR>&gt; compare them more to the Grange movement than unionization. <BR><BR>The Luddites were originally quite moderate. All they wanted was <BR>increased wages for those working on the machines (a share of the <BR>benefits of productivity), wages that reflected the longer working hours that <BR>resulted and retraining for those made unemployeed by the machines. It <BR>was only when the mill owners resorted to violence to break them that they <BR>started smashing machinery (even then they responded to violence against <BR>people with violence against the machinery). The Luddites make a <BR>facinating study in early labour activism.<BR><BR>&gt; Ob Trav:&nbsp; When you create a Starport consider the local position on<BR>&gt; unions and unionism.&nbsp; Does this world require that all<BR>&gt; loading/unloading of cargo be done by the local version of the<BR>&gt; Dockworkers?&nbsp; Is cargo transportation done exclusively by members of<BR>&gt; the Teamsters?&nbsp; Can the PC's "join" the locals by paying a fee, thus<BR>&gt; moving their own cargos?&nbsp; Are the local unions corrupt or clean?<BR>&gt; Maybe the being that drives the fuel truck has to be in "the<BR>&gt; teamsters", but he won't actual load the fuel, that requires a<BR>&gt; member of "the Chem workers", and in reality niether will do<BR>&gt; anything without appropriate bribes from the PC's.&nbsp; Lots of<BR>&gt; interesting possiblities there. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>There's a sidebar in GT: Starports and at least one JTAS adventure that I <BR>can think of.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 22:52:23 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Back Ups<BR><BR>&gt; When writing Ground Forces, I had at least four copies on both my hard<BR>&gt;&nbsp; drive and three floppies.&nbsp; After each writing session, I'd make sure that<BR>&gt;&nbsp; all the back up disks were updated.&nbsp; So when I did have a hard drive<BR>&gt;&nbsp; problem, I just uploaded a copy from back up.<BR><BR>I had similar thoughts at the time . . .<BR><BR>That said, I am still not 100% vigilant making backups, although I am better <BR>than I used to be. I believe the Herr Sanger has tried to hire writers to <BR>finish A.I., with no sucess. <BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:25:58 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Why not? Time has passed. Have they used none of this time to train<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; themselves to maintain the equipment? You said it was non-frivolous<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; stuff that formed the backbone of a real infrastructure, including<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; manufacturing. Why wouldn't they buy and install that portion of the<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; infrastructure related to maintenance? Why don't they import the<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; ability (material and intellectual) to maintain their new toys? They<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; sound quite sensible otherwise.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Simple. Consider that say, Zaire, can import cell phones. But they<BR>&gt;*can't* repair them.<BR><BR>Why not? This doesn't answer the above question as to /why/ Zaire is <BR>capable of importing cell phones but not the knowledge and <BR>infrastructure to repair them. FWIW i think there is an answer, but <BR>not the one various people have been intimating - see below.<BR><BR>&gt;The cell sites can have modules swapped in and<BR>&gt;out, but the modules aren't repairable either.<BR><BR>Why not?<BR><BR>&gt;To be able to maintain such WITHOUT IMPORTED PARTS requires facilities<BR>&gt;that their local economy *can't* support. It takes a fair sized set of<BR>&gt;chemical plants just to produce the hyperpure silicon, and the<BR>&gt;materials used in processing it.<BR><BR>[snip]<BR><BR>Ah ha! A reasonable answer.<BR><BR>&gt;And there just plain aren't enough *people* to do all that *and* produce<BR>&gt;food and keep the economy going. Nor enough money to pay for it.<BR><BR>Yes, i agree with you here. It takes a certain minimum number of <BR>people to support a technological economy. Seems reasonable. In <BR>general, it seems likely that higher tech levels will have higher <BR>minimum necessary populations. However,above a certain tech level, <BR>robots and other automation will reduce the number of people <BR>necessary. Let's be very generous and say that it only requires a <BR>population of more then one million to support any tech level of 5 or <BR>above. This means that the tech level in a world's UWP cannot be <BR>locally sustainable tech level as there are 4856 worlds in the <BR>Imperium with tech levels of 5 or above and populations below one <BR>million (53.66% of all worlds). This would also mean that 5040 <BR>Imperial worlds /cannot/ have sustainable tech levels above 4. In <BR>fact, only 345 Imperial worlds have tech levels of 4 or below. So, <BR>UWP tech code is not locally sustainable tech level.<BR><BR>Here is a table of Tech Level by Population:<BR>NUMBER OF IMPERIAL WORLDS OF POP X WITH TECH Y<BR>Pop&nbsp; &nbsp; Tech<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; 0&nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 4<BR>0&nbsp; &nbsp; 44&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 7<BR>1&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 7<BR>2&nbsp; &nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 6<BR>3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 13<BR>4&nbsp; &nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 21<BR>5&nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 14&nbsp; &nbsp; 24<BR>6&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 8&nbsp; &nbsp; 9&nbsp; &nbsp; 10&nbsp; &nbsp; 33<BR>7&nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 7&nbsp; &nbsp; 15&nbsp; &nbsp; 28<BR>8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 7&nbsp; &nbsp; 12&nbsp; &nbsp; 17<BR>9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 4<BR>A<BR>Total&nbsp; &nbsp; 54&nbsp; &nbsp; 26&nbsp; &nbsp; 39&nbsp; &nbsp; 66&nbsp; &nbsp; 160<BR><BR>Pop&nbsp; &nbsp; Tech<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 6&nbsp; &nbsp; 7&nbsp; &nbsp; 8&nbsp; &nbsp; 9&nbsp; &nbsp; A<BR>0&nbsp; &nbsp; 10&nbsp; &nbsp; 10&nbsp; &nbsp; 22&nbsp; &nbsp; 28&nbsp; &nbsp; 36&nbsp; &nbsp; 30<BR>1&nbsp; &nbsp; 15&nbsp; &nbsp; 15&nbsp; &nbsp; 24&nbsp; &nbsp; 32&nbsp; &nbsp; 44&nbsp; &nbsp; 57<BR>2&nbsp; &nbsp; 19&nbsp; &nbsp; 24&nbsp; &nbsp; 55&nbsp; &nbsp; 67&nbsp; &nbsp; 68&nbsp; &nbsp; 69<BR>3&nbsp; &nbsp; 37&nbsp; &nbsp; 34&nbsp; &nbsp; 60&nbsp; &nbsp; 75&nbsp; &nbsp; 102&nbsp; &nbsp; 119<BR>4&nbsp; &nbsp; 36&nbsp; &nbsp; 54&nbsp; &nbsp; 80&nbsp; &nbsp; 124&nbsp; &nbsp; 150&nbsp; &nbsp; 175<BR>5&nbsp; &nbsp; 37&nbsp; &nbsp; 79&nbsp; &nbsp; 85&nbsp; &nbsp; 132&nbsp; &nbsp; 152&nbsp; &nbsp; 175<BR>6&nbsp; &nbsp; 56&nbsp; &nbsp; 84&nbsp; &nbsp; 93&nbsp; &nbsp; 144&nbsp; &nbsp; 166&nbsp; &nbsp; 159<BR>7&nbsp; &nbsp; 40&nbsp; &nbsp; 53&nbsp; &nbsp; 97&nbsp; &nbsp; 105&nbsp; &nbsp; 118&nbsp; &nbsp; 133<BR>8&nbsp; &nbsp; 26&nbsp; &nbsp; 53&nbsp; &nbsp; 76&nbsp; &nbsp; 98&nbsp; &nbsp; 89&nbsp; &nbsp; 99<BR>9&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 19&nbsp; &nbsp; 30&nbsp; &nbsp; 22&nbsp; &nbsp; 39&nbsp; &nbsp; 64<BR>A&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 9&nbsp; &nbsp; 23&nbsp; &nbsp; 18<BR>Total&nbsp; &nbsp; 279&nbsp; &nbsp; 427&nbsp; &nbsp; 626&nbsp; &nbsp; 836&nbsp; &nbsp; 987&nbsp; &nbsp; 1098<BR><BR>Pop&nbsp; &nbsp; Tech<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; B&nbsp; &nbsp; C&nbsp; &nbsp; D&nbsp; &nbsp; E&nbsp; &nbsp; F&nbsp; &nbsp; G&nbsp; &nbsp; H<BR>0&nbsp; &nbsp; 30&nbsp; &nbsp; 18&nbsp; &nbsp; 26&nbsp; &nbsp; 13&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1<BR>1&nbsp; &nbsp; 63&nbsp; &nbsp; 44&nbsp; &nbsp; 33&nbsp; &nbsp; 36&nbsp; &nbsp; 44&nbsp; &nbsp; 7<BR>2&nbsp; &nbsp; 82&nbsp; &nbsp; 96&nbsp; &nbsp; 68&nbsp; &nbsp; 50&nbsp; &nbsp; 64&nbsp; &nbsp; 6<BR>3&nbsp; &nbsp; 112&nbsp; &nbsp; 100&nbsp; &nbsp; 89&nbsp; &nbsp; 66&nbsp; &nbsp; 78&nbsp; &nbsp; 4<BR>4&nbsp; &nbsp; 165&nbsp; &nbsp; 170&nbsp; &nbsp; 127&nbsp; &nbsp; 124&nbsp; &nbsp; 114&nbsp; &nbsp; 5<BR>5&nbsp; &nbsp; 176&nbsp; &nbsp; 157&nbsp; &nbsp; 130&nbsp; &nbsp; 104&nbsp; &nbsp; 107&nbsp; &nbsp; 12<BR>6&nbsp; &nbsp; 117&nbsp; &nbsp; 128&nbsp; &nbsp; 93&nbsp; &nbsp; 55&nbsp; &nbsp; 57&nbsp; &nbsp; 5<BR>7&nbsp; &nbsp; 120&nbsp; &nbsp; 105&nbsp; &nbsp; 69&nbsp; &nbsp; 80&nbsp; &nbsp; 57&nbsp; &nbsp; 2<BR>8&nbsp; &nbsp; 113&nbsp; &nbsp; 96&nbsp; &nbsp; 56&nbsp; &nbsp; 67&nbsp; &nbsp; 63&nbsp; &nbsp; 1<BR>9&nbsp; &nbsp; 54&nbsp; &nbsp; 74&nbsp; &nbsp; 62&nbsp; &nbsp; 100&nbsp; &nbsp; 133&nbsp; &nbsp; 19<BR>A&nbsp; &nbsp; 21&nbsp; &nbsp; 28&nbsp; &nbsp; 29&nbsp; &nbsp; 32&nbsp; &nbsp; 75&nbsp; &nbsp; 16<BR>Total&nbsp; &nbsp; 1053&nbsp; &nbsp; 1016&nbsp; &nbsp; 782&nbsp; &nbsp; 727&nbsp; &nbsp; 796&nbsp; &nbsp; 77&nbsp; &nbsp; 1<BR><BR>&gt;[snip]<BR>&gt;You don't necessarily need to build rail networks. But they actually<BR>&gt;*are* a better investment than highways, at least until you get CG.<BR><BR>I know, i was just using an example of two different level technologies.<BR><BR>&gt;[snip]<BR>&gt;As I noted, if you are going for a planned advance from their current<BR>&gt;TL to a higher one, and don't want to make them *totally* dependent* on<BR>&gt;offworld parts and supplies, you *do* have to go one step at a time.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;But you can (and should) skip some steps. For example, the internal<BR>&gt;combustion engine is best skipped. Steam engines *can* be built that'll<BR>&gt;do the job *and* both use less fuel and produce less pollution. And<BR>&gt;electrics are likely workable as well.<BR><BR>Summary - you must go one step at a time except when you skip steps. <BR>Not very helpful 8^)<BR><BR>FWIW i agree with your second statement, some steps should and can be <BR>skipped. Why build an unsustainable internal combustion engine <BR>infrastructure just so you can abandon it for an unsustainable CG <BR>infrastructure?<BR><BR>In the case of an outside power raising a world's tech level, smaller <BR>populations are much easier to raise quickly but small populations <BR>cannot maintain high tech levels independent of stellar society.<BR><BR>Even being generous, the majority of Imperial worlds have <BR>unsustainable tech levels (But the majority of the population lives <BR>at a sustainable tech level). So what is tech level as listed in the <BR>UWP? It could be the tech level of locally produced goods. This is <BR>not the same thing as locally sustainable tech level. A factory might <BR>be located at a resource site. The world produces tech level X goods <BR>of one specific type, but it relies upon trade with other worlds to <BR>maintain its factory and for other tech level X goods.<BR><BR>The character of the Imperium is not detailed enough in canon that <BR>consideration of the relationship between population and tech level <BR>changes that character, but it becomes clear that the Imperium is <BR>composed of heartland and hinterland - high pop, high tech worlds and <BR>everyone else.<BR><BR>BTW if 78.04 percent of the Imperial population comes from the 257 <BR>worlds with populations over 10 billion, the farmboy (or anyone else) <BR>from one of the 8793 other worlds is going to be a rare bird in the <BR>Navy, Marines or Scout Service. OTOH hinterlands have traditionally <BR>been disproportionately strong recruiting grounds for military and <BR>paramilitary services as they offer an escape into the larger world.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:29:00 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Query: The Githiaskio<BR><BR>Hello All,<BR><BR>What if anything happened to the Githiaskio (JTAS 16) in MT, TNE, T4 or G:T?<BR><BR>For that matter, what happened to any of the minor races introduced <BR>in Contact articles? Could we compile a list?<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:30:57 +0400<BR>From: "Andrew Long" &lt;dyrnwynn@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>On Sun, 21 Jan 2001 10:02:45, "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; At 11:46 PM 1/21/2001 +1300, you wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&lt;Snip&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Umm.. I'm a Teamster (Local 665)&nbsp; Read up on working conditions for<BR>&gt; laborers before the labor movement.<BR>&gt; - --<BR>No arguments. But the problem is the same as with all power groups. Things swing too far in the other direction, and you get another set of problems. For a recent example, see the problems the UK had with the Miners and the TGWU in the '70s. Eventually, Margaret Thatcher managed to bring the unions back into line, but then SHE went too far. the thing about Thatcher, she was easier to bring down than the Unions were...<BR><BR>Andy<BR>========================================<BR>Andy long&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Dyrnwynn@HotMail.com<BR>========================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:29:43 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt; Yes, i agree with you here. It takes a certain minimum number of<BR>&gt; people to support a technological economy. Seems reasonable.<BR><BR>One thing that doesn't seem to have been addressed so far -- as far as<BR>I can see, virtually all the worlds of the Imperium (and beyond) were<BR>originally settled by societies with interstellar capability.<BR><BR>On Earth (as far as I can tell), every society that is incapable of<BR>sustaining modern technology was never capable of doing so.&nbsp; This<BR>means that nearly all those sub-stellar worlds either deliberately<BR>chose to avoid relying on high technology, or lost it (probably during<BR>the Long Night).<BR><BR>Either case is likely to produce a society in which people are less<BR>likely to want to rely on high-tech than just about anyone on Earth.<BR><BR><BR>Now, for local sustainability -- how many industrialised nations on<BR>Earth could sustain their current industrial base if they were cut off<BR>from outside countries?&nbsp; As it is, one earthquake damaging one of the<BR>chip manufacturing plants in a distant country drives prices up by a<BR>factor of between two and ten, for months.<BR><BR>Certainly I believe that many industrialised nations *could* be<BR>self-sustaining, but the simple fact is that most aren't because they<BR>don't need to be.&nbsp; In the Traveller universe, this may well be false<BR>- -- the Imperium did go through the Long Night, after all, and probably<BR>isn't anxious to repeat it.<BR><BR>One thing I don't really understand though, is what keeps the<BR>population of the low-pop worlds so small over centuries?&nbsp; Many of<BR>them seem to have good living environments, abundant natural<BR>resources, and you'd think someone would set up some sort of industry<BR>there to take advantage of lower local costs.<BR><BR>Sure, the locals might not have cutting-edge technical knowledge to<BR>begin with, but they can be trained and employed cheaper than workers<BR>on a big rich world.&nbsp; This is already a major force driving<BR>industrialisation of many countries on Earth.&nbsp; But then, we've never<BR>experienced a complete collapse of international trade, so the<BR>sociology may be completely different in the Imperium.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Even being generous, the majority of Imperial worlds have <BR>&gt; unsustainable tech levels (But the majority of the population lives <BR>&gt; at a sustainable tech level). So what is tech level as listed in the <BR>&gt; UWP? It could be the tech level of locally produced goods.<BR><BR>If most of the population is at high tech levels, for whom are these<BR>unsustainable middle-tech goods being produced?<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 01:47:38 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Mysterious black tar heroin appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Why would you sleep through lectures about the upcoming BITS product "101<BR>&gt;Societies"?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Ach! Why I would never even think of such a thing! BITS lectures? Sign me<BR>up. :)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 22:52:37 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>&gt;Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; Yes, i agree with you here. It takes a certain minimum number of<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; people to support a technological economy. Seems reasonable.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;One thing that doesn't seem to have been addressed so far -- as far as<BR>&gt;I can see, virtually all the worlds of the Imperium (and beyond) were<BR>&gt;originally settled by societies with interstellar capability.<BR><BR>The exception are the worlds seeded by the ancients. I believe these <BR>worlds, where the humans do not know where they came from, are the <BR>minority.<BR><BR>&gt;On Earth (as far as I can tell), every society that is incapable of<BR>&gt;sustaining modern technology was never capable of doing so.&nbsp; This<BR>&gt;means that nearly all those sub-stellar worlds either deliberately<BR>&gt;chose to avoid relying on high technology, or lost it (probably during<BR>&gt;the Long Night).<BR><BR>I don't follow the logic, but i agree with the conclusion.<BR><BR>&gt;Either case is likely to produce a society in which people are less<BR>&gt;likely to want to rely on high-tech than just about anyone on Earth.<BR><BR>I don't see how this follows. The Long Night was 1000+ years ago - <BR>except for Milieu 0. How many social desires and taboos do you <BR>remember from the Norman Conquest era?<BR><BR>&gt;Now, for local sustainability -- how many industrialised nations on<BR>&gt;Earth could sustain their current industrial base if they were cut off<BR>&gt;from outside countries?[snip]<BR><BR>Without forewarning, none.<BR><BR>&gt;Certainly I believe that many industrialised nations *could* be<BR>&gt;self-sustaining, but the simple fact is that most aren't because they<BR>&gt;don't need to be.&nbsp; In the Traveller universe, this may well be false<BR>&gt;-- the Imperium did go through the Long Night, after all, and probably<BR>&gt;isn't anxious to repeat it.<BR><BR>It's hard to see how higher pop worlds could not be self sustaining. <BR>Likewise, it's hard to see how lower pop worlds could be. It's the <BR>ones in the middle that seem to have a choice.<BR><BR>&gt;One thing I don't really understand though, is what keeps the<BR>&gt;population of the low-pop worlds so small over centuries?&nbsp; Many of<BR>&gt;them seem to have good living environments, abundant natural<BR>&gt;resources, and you'd think someone would set up some sort of industry<BR>&gt;there to take advantage of lower local costs.<BR><BR>It's a puzzlement 8^)<BR><BR>&gt;[snip]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Even being generous, the majority of Imperial worlds have<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; unsustainable tech levels (But the majority of the population lives<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; at a sustainable tech level). So what is tech level as listed in the<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; UWP? It could be the tech level of locally produced goods.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;If most of the population is at high tech levels, for whom are these<BR>&gt;unsustainable middle-tech goods being produced?<BR><BR>I didn't say most of the population was at high tech levels. I said <BR>most of the population was on high pop worlds, that high pop, high <BR>tech worlds dominate the Imperium and that most of the population <BR>lives at a sustainable tech level. These are independent statements. <BR>Going back to my database, i get the following numbers for population <BR>at tech level.<BR><BR>IMPERIAL POPULATION BY TECH LEVEL<BR>&nbsp; (assuming all pop multipliers to be 1)<BR>TL&nbsp; &nbsp; Pop&nbsp; &nbsp; %Total&nbsp; &nbsp; %&lt;=TL&nbsp; &nbsp; %&gt;=TL<BR>0&nbsp; &nbsp; 10.1E6&nbsp; &nbsp; ~0&nbsp; &nbsp; ~0&nbsp; &nbsp; 100.0<BR>1&nbsp; &nbsp; 458.3E6&nbsp; &nbsp; 0.01&nbsp; &nbsp; 0.01&nbsp; &nbsp; 100.0<BR>2&nbsp; &nbsp; 779.5E6&nbsp; &nbsp; 0.02&nbsp; &nbsp; 0.04&nbsp; &nbsp; 99.99<BR>3&nbsp; &nbsp; 2.4E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 0.07&nbsp; &nbsp; 0.11&nbsp; &nbsp; 99.96<BR>4&nbsp; &nbsp; 6.0E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 0.18&nbsp; &nbsp; 0.29&nbsp; &nbsp; 99.89<BR>5&nbsp; &nbsp; 6.1E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 0.18&nbsp; &nbsp; 0.48&nbsp; &nbsp; 99.71<BR>6&nbsp; &nbsp; 44.9E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 1.36&nbsp; &nbsp; 1.84&nbsp; &nbsp; 99.52<BR>7&nbsp; &nbsp; 78.7E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 2.39&nbsp; &nbsp; 4.23&nbsp; &nbsp; 98.16<BR>8&nbsp; &nbsp; 123.0E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 3.73&nbsp; &nbsp; 7.96&nbsp; &nbsp; 95.77<BR>9&nbsp; &nbsp; 279.3E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 8.48&nbsp; &nbsp; 16.44&nbsp; &nbsp; 92.04<BR>A&nbsp; &nbsp; 255.4E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 7.76&nbsp; &nbsp; 24.20&nbsp; &nbsp; 83.56<BR>B&nbsp; &nbsp; 276.6E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 8.40&nbsp; &nbsp; 32.60&nbsp; &nbsp; 75.80<BR>C&nbsp; &nbsp; 364.8E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 11.08&nbsp; &nbsp; 43.67&nbsp; &nbsp; 67.40<BR>D&nbsp; &nbsp; 358.4E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 10.88&nbsp; &nbsp; 54.56&nbsp; &nbsp; 56.33<BR>E&nbsp; &nbsp; 427.6E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 12.98&nbsp; &nbsp; 67.54&nbsp; &nbsp; 45.44<BR>F&nbsp; &nbsp; 889.9E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 27.02&nbsp; &nbsp; 94.56&nbsp; &nbsp; 32.46<BR>G&nbsp; &nbsp; 179.1E9&nbsp; &nbsp; 5.44&nbsp; &nbsp; 100.0&nbsp; &nbsp; 5.44<BR>H&nbsp; &nbsp; 1.0E0&nbsp; &nbsp; 0&nbsp; &nbsp; 100.0&nbsp; &nbsp; 0<BR>Total&nbsp; &nbsp; 3.3E12<BR><BR>O.K., most of the population is at high tech levels. 8^)<BR><BR>As to who the unsustainable middle tech goods are being produced for, <BR>i would expect that high pop world heartlands are surrounded by <BR>hinterlands of nearly the same tech level. I can predict, however, <BR>that this is not the case, because the world generation system does <BR>not consider nearby worlds. The distribution of tech levels will be <BR>more or less random.<BR><BR>IMPERIAL WORLDS BY POPULATION AND TECH LEVEL<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tech Level<BR>Pop&nbsp; &nbsp; 0&nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 6&nbsp; &nbsp; 7&nbsp; &nbsp; 8<BR>0&nbsp; &nbsp; 44&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 7&nbsp; &nbsp; 10&nbsp; &nbsp; 10&nbsp; &nbsp; 22&nbsp; &nbsp; 28<BR>1&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 7&nbsp; &nbsp; 15&nbsp; &nbsp; 15&nbsp; &nbsp; 24&nbsp; &nbsp; 32<BR>2&nbsp; &nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 6&nbsp; &nbsp; 19&nbsp; &nbsp; 24&nbsp; &nbsp; 55&nbsp; &nbsp; 67<BR>3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 13&nbsp; &nbsp; 37&nbsp; &nbsp; 34&nbsp; &nbsp; 60&nbsp; &nbsp; 75<BR>4&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 21&nbsp; &nbsp; 36&nbsp; &nbsp; 54&nbsp; &nbsp; 80&nbsp; &nbsp; 124<BR>5&nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 14&nbsp; &nbsp; 24&nbsp; &nbsp; 37&nbsp; &nbsp; 79&nbsp; &nbsp; 85&nbsp; &nbsp; 132<BR>6&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 8&nbsp; &nbsp; 9&nbsp; &nbsp; 10&nbsp; &nbsp; 33&nbsp; &nbsp; 56&nbsp; &nbsp; 84&nbsp; &nbsp; 93&nbsp; &nbsp; 144<BR>7&nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 7&nbsp; &nbsp; 15&nbsp; &nbsp; 28&nbsp; &nbsp; 40&nbsp; &nbsp; 53&nbsp; &nbsp; 97&nbsp; &nbsp; 105<BR>8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 7&nbsp; &nbsp; 12&nbsp; &nbsp; 17&nbsp; &nbsp; 26&nbsp; &nbsp; 53&nbsp; &nbsp; 76&nbsp; &nbsp; 98<BR>9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 19&nbsp; &nbsp; 30&nbsp; &nbsp; 22<BR>A&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 9<BR>Total&nbsp; &nbsp; 54&nbsp; &nbsp; 26&nbsp; &nbsp; 39&nbsp; &nbsp; 66&nbsp; &nbsp; 160&nbsp; &nbsp; 279&nbsp; &nbsp; 427&nbsp; &nbsp; 626&nbsp; &nbsp; 836<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tech Level<BR>Pop&nbsp; &nbsp; 9&nbsp; &nbsp; A&nbsp; &nbsp; B&nbsp; &nbsp; C&nbsp; &nbsp; D&nbsp; &nbsp; E&nbsp; &nbsp; F&nbsp; &nbsp; G&nbsp; &nbsp; H<BR>0&nbsp; &nbsp; 36&nbsp; &nbsp; 30&nbsp; &nbsp; 30&nbsp; &nbsp; 18&nbsp; &nbsp; 26&nbsp; &nbsp; 13&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1<BR>1&nbsp; &nbsp; 44&nbsp; &nbsp; 57&nbsp; &nbsp; 63&nbsp; &nbsp; 44&nbsp; &nbsp; 33&nbsp; &nbsp; 36&nbsp; &nbsp; 44&nbsp; &nbsp; 7<BR>2&nbsp; &nbsp; 68&nbsp; &nbsp; 69&nbsp; &nbsp; 82&nbsp; &nbsp; 96&nbsp; &nbsp; 68&nbsp; &nbsp; 50&nbsp; &nbsp; 64&nbsp; &nbsp; 6<BR>3&nbsp; &nbsp; 102&nbsp; &nbsp; 119&nbsp; &nbsp; 112&nbsp; &nbsp; 100&nbsp; &nbsp; 89&nbsp; &nbsp; 66&nbsp; &nbsp; 78&nbsp; &nbsp; 4<BR>4&nbsp; &nbsp; 150&nbsp; &nbsp; 175&nbsp; &nbsp; 165&nbsp; &nbsp; 170&nbsp; &nbsp; 127&nbsp; &nbsp; 124&nbsp; &nbsp; 114&nbsp; &nbsp; 5<BR>5&nbsp; &nbsp; 152&nbsp; &nbsp; 175&nbsp; &nbsp; 176&nbsp; &nbsp; 157&nbsp; &nbsp; 130&nbsp; &nbsp; 104&nbsp; &nbsp; 107&nbsp; &nbsp; 12<BR>6&nbsp; &nbsp; 166&nbsp; &nbsp; 159&nbsp; &nbsp; 117&nbsp; &nbsp; 128&nbsp; &nbsp; 93&nbsp; &nbsp; 55&nbsp; &nbsp; 57&nbsp; &nbsp; 5<BR>7&nbsp; &nbsp; 118&nbsp; &nbsp; 133&nbsp; &nbsp; 120&nbsp; &nbsp; 105&nbsp; &nbsp; 69&nbsp; &nbsp; 80&nbsp; &nbsp; 57&nbsp; &nbsp; 2<BR>8&nbsp; &nbsp; 89&nbsp; &nbsp; 99&nbsp; &nbsp; 113&nbsp; &nbsp; 96&nbsp; &nbsp; 56&nbsp; &nbsp; 67&nbsp; &nbsp; 63&nbsp; &nbsp; 1<BR>9&nbsp; &nbsp; 39&nbsp; &nbsp; 64&nbsp; &nbsp; 54&nbsp; &nbsp; 74&nbsp; &nbsp; 62&nbsp; &nbsp; 100&nbsp; &nbsp; 133&nbsp; &nbsp; 19<BR>A&nbsp; &nbsp; 23&nbsp; &nbsp; 18&nbsp; &nbsp; 21&nbsp; &nbsp; 28&nbsp; &nbsp; 29&nbsp; &nbsp; 32&nbsp; &nbsp; 75&nbsp; &nbsp; 16<BR>Total&nbsp; &nbsp; 987&nbsp; &nbsp; 1098&nbsp; &nbsp; 1053&nbsp; &nbsp; 1016&nbsp; &nbsp; 782&nbsp; &nbsp; 727&nbsp; &nbsp; 796&nbsp; &nbsp; 77&nbsp; &nbsp; 1<BR><BR>There is a strong mode among Pop A worlds at TL F (75), but there is <BR>no strong pattern between TL 7-E inclusive. Other patterns are left <BR>as an exercise for the reader. 8^)<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3546<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xb02.mx.aol.com (rly-xb02.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.103]) by air-xb01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 01:54:45 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xb02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 01:54:06 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id BAA88582;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 01:53:11 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 22 Jan 2001 01:52:58 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id BAA88536<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 01:52:58 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 01:52:58 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101220652.BAA88536@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3546<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3547</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/22/01 5:21:33 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Monday, January 22 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3547<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: TML sniper competition<BR>Allegiance Codes<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Deckplan plea!<BR>Re : Query: The Githaskio<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Allegiance codes<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3546<BR>RE: Landgrab rules'<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 02:23:38 EST<BR>From: RBasler1@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: TML sniper competition<BR><BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: TML sniper competition<BR><BR>Mark, Doug, Jesse et al.<BR><BR>With all the talk about having a shoot off with the loser buying dinner, I<BR>thought you might like to see what I'll be bringing.&nbsp; This is the infamous<BR>sniper that Jesse mentioned. This is the first gun where I worried about<BR>barometric pressure when shooting!<BR><BR>see:&nbsp; http://www.travellerguns.com/tech/sniper.html<BR><BR>(Can't help it, I just love to show off this gun, and have people shoot it.<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;loads URL into browser...pauses.....reaches for napkin to wipe the drool off the keyboard&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Umm, does a post have to produce a beverage-related spew to count as a keyboard kill, or can profuse salivation be considered an honorary kill?<BR>:o)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Rod BAsler, COFIT<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 23:32:50 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Allegiance Codes<BR><BR>Hi All,<BR><BR>Does anyone know where i can find an explanation of all the allegiance codes?<BR><BR>TIA<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 00:15:44 -0800<BR>From: "Kelly St.Clair" &lt;kellys@efn.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>On Sun, 21 Jan 2001 22:52:37 -0800, Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>(several things, but this stands out)<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;Either case is likely to produce a society in which people are less<BR>&gt; &gt;likely to want to rely on high-tech than just about anyone on Earth.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I don't see how this follows. The Long Night was 1000+ years ago -<BR>&gt;except for Milieu 0. How many social desires and taboos do you<BR>&gt;remember from the Norman Conquest era?<BR><BR>Many.&nbsp; Though I'm not enough of a history student to give detailed <BR>references, I'm sure many others on this list are about to :)<BR><BR>Better question, which should illustrate the point:&nbsp; how many social <BR>customs and taboos in the Bible, the Torah, and other documents of similar <BR>vintage do you remember/are still followed today?<BR><BR>Hell, IMO, half of the problems we have today are because we're still <BR>following the rules that worked great for tribal societies; go ahead and <BR>overbreed your habitat, because it gives you more warriors to go next door, <BR>kill the people there and take their land and stuff.&nbsp; You'll lose people <BR>too, but you couldn't support them anyway.&nbsp; Everyone who is Not Us is <BR>competition - kill them, displace them or assimilate them.<BR><BR>ObTrav:&nbsp; why do Humans and Vargr get along so well?&nbsp; Because we're still <BR>half pack-hunter ourselves - look at chimp behavior, or (human) small group <BR>dynamics.<BR><BR><BR>- --------------<BR>Kelly St.Clair&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "'Cause you've got Trouble<BR>kellys@efn.org&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Right here in fair Verona<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; With a capital T that rhymes with D<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That stands for Duel..."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 00:44:56 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>&gt;Kelly wrote:<BR>&gt;Better question, which should illustrate the point:&nbsp; how many social <BR>&gt;customs and taboos in the Bible, the Torah, and other documents of <BR>&gt;similar vintage do you remember/are still followed today?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Hell, IMO, half of the problems we have today are because we're <BR>&gt;still following the rules that worked great for tribal societies; go <BR>&gt;ahead and overbreed your habitat, because it gives you more warriors <BR>&gt;to go next door, kill the people there and take their land and <BR>&gt;stuff.&nbsp; You'll lose people too, but you couldn't support them <BR>&gt;anyway.&nbsp; Everyone who is Not Us is competition - kill them, displace <BR>&gt;them or assimilate them.<BR><BR>Very true, but have any of these prevented you from adopting <BR>technology to apply them?<BR>Over breeding, for example, is a result of old rules coupled with new <BR>technology.<BR><BR>In some parts of known space there have been several cycles of rise <BR>and fall. Perhaps an anti-stellar technology stance has had an <BR>opportunity to become deep rooted. But, looking over the figures i've <BR>been posting, the main question is not why do so many people live at <BR>low tech levels (they don't) or why are so many worlds at low tech <BR>levels (they're not) but why are so many worlds so sparsely <BR>populated. And, of course, just what does that pesky UWP tech number <BR>mean, anyway? 8^)<BR><BR>The anti-stellar tech attitude doesn't work well to explain moderate <BR>technologies anyway, as most of them need constant stellar contact to <BR>maintain their technology. Since they need stellar contact to <BR>maintain what they have, what is the barrier to having even more?<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 20:30:49 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>On Sun, Jan 21, 2001 at 10:52:37PM -0800, Gordon Horne wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;Either case is likely to produce a society in which people are less<BR>&gt; &gt;likely to want to rely on high-tech than just about anyone on Earth.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I don't see how this follows. The Long Night was 1000+ years ago - <BR>&gt; except for Milieu 0. How many social desires and taboos do you <BR>&gt; remember from the Norman Conquest era?<BR><BR>Most of the fundamental structure of our laws, customs and taboos<BR>comes from before then, to begin with.&nbsp; Most of them without even<BR>being recognised as such without historical research.&nbsp; Furthermore, in<BR>Traveller terms this is on a planet that has virtually no respect for<BR>tradition compared with most worlds.<BR><BR>If you factor in the effects of probably the biggest human-caused<BR>disaster in a technological civilization's history, I think many of<BR>the lessons learned from it are going to be hanging around for many<BR>millennia, whether justified or not.<BR><BR>Furthermore, such traditions would be amply justified.&nbsp; It only takes<BR>one civilization-wrecking event to show that relying on fragile<BR>interstellar travel and outsiders to keep your society running is, in<BR>general, a bad idea.&nbsp; As a descendant of such a disaster, are you<BR>going to use local sustainable technology and develop slowly, or<BR>listen to those short-sighted fools who see only the profits and not<BR>the dangers they pose to everyone?&nbsp; (Those who do not remember history<BR>are condemned to repeat it)<BR><BR><BR>&gt; It's hard to see how higher pop worlds could not be self sustaining. <BR><BR>Quite easily -- just like our current industrial nations are not self<BR>sustaining.&nbsp; They could be mutually interdependent, relying on<BR>interstellar trade.&nbsp; It is entirely possible that the higher tech<BR>levels of the Imperium require a wider industrial base than any single<BR>world can sustain.<BR><BR>My interpretation of the TL listings are that they describe the<BR>highest level of technology for which you are likely to find any given<BR>item.&nbsp; This is the interpretation that would interest a traveller.<BR><BR>A TL-9 world may manufacture TL-C components and have TL12 medicine,<BR>and even a few universities turning out brilliant scientists and<BR>engineers with TL-E knowledge, but lacks TL-A transportation<BR>technology because it doesn't need it and investing in it would be<BR>costly.&nbsp; If listed as TL-C or TL-E, interstellar travellers would be<BR>rudely surprised to find that such a world lacks the components to<BR>repair their TL-B drive.<BR><BR>So at least IMTU, there could be TL-E worlds that can't manufacture<BR>any TL-E goods at all, especially if they are a trade hub for worlds<BR>that can.&nbsp; Those components might be built (even from raw materials)<BR>on worlds that are generally TL-A.<BR><BR><BR>In short, I think I've answered my own question -- it is not necessary<BR>that *any* world be capable of maintaining the highest tech levels.<BR>However, I suspect there will be a strong social pressure to make sure<BR>that any given planet can at least survive and maintain a significant<BR>portion of its industry even if completely isolated from other star<BR>systems.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt;If most of the population is at high tech levels, for whom are<BR>&gt; &gt;these unsustainable middle-tech goods being produced?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I didn't say most of the population was at high tech levels.<BR><BR>I know you didn't -- I deduced that myself from my own data :)<BR>But I think I answered my own question.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 01:37:40 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;Likewise, highways are pointless. Railroads will do for most purposes<BR><BR>&nbsp; Ob:C.J.Cherryh - read the _Foreigner_ trilogy. Inflict plots that<BR>occur to GM while reading upon PC's. Flee.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 21:13:29 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Very true, but have any of these prevented you from adopting <BR>&gt; technology to apply them?<BR><BR>There are plenty of examples of very old customs and laws that *have*<BR>prevented certain technologies from being developed or adopted.&nbsp; Many<BR>forms of human experimentation are frowned upon, for example.&nbsp; Then<BR>there's a lot of problems in obtaining certain drugs, chemicals, and<BR>other technologies.<BR><BR>But the question is a red herring in a way: The point was that even on<BR>Earth, 1000-year-old traditions still hold a lot of force.&nbsp; The fact<BR>that they don't interact much with technology is largely because they<BR>aren't *concerned* with technology, not that they are powerless.<BR><BR>Earth has never had a case where over-reliance on external technology<BR>has collapsed it's civilization.&nbsp; You can bet that if it did happen,<BR>some pretty strong societal views on the subject would result.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; but why are so many worlds so sparsely populated. And, of course,<BR>&gt; just what does that pesky UWP tech number mean, anyway? 8^)<BR><BR>I think I'm satisfied with my interpretation of the UWP tech level<BR>now.&nbsp; The former question still puzzles me greatly though.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;Since they need stellar contact to maintain what they have, what is<BR>&gt;the barrier to having even more?<BR><BR>I suspect most Imperial worlds aren't generally averse to stellar<BR>contact, or even to having higher technology than they can maintain<BR>locally.&nbsp; It would be an aversion to *relying* on that technology if<BR>they can't maintain it locally.<BR><BR>Imagine that virtually every member of your society passes on<BR>traditions that reinforce the idea that relying on products that are<BR>not made locally is bad.&nbsp; Not necessarily "incest" bad, but at least<BR>"lying" bad.&nbsp; People might do it when it benefits them, but they won't<BR>want to be *seen* to be doing it.&nbsp; This could easily translate into<BR>written (and unwritten) laws governing interstellar trade.&nbsp; There<BR>might be variations, such as exemptions for offworld medical tech.<BR>There may be limits to how much of your income you can spend on<BR>offworld products, or tariffs to make sure that local industry doesn't<BR>wither away.<BR><BR>Now, imagine that *every* world has various degrees of this.&nbsp; In some,<BR>it may be only traces left over from past centuries, lingering in old<BR>laws and remnants in unspoken customs.&nbsp; In others, it may be<BR>full-blown isolationism.&nbsp; But all will at least be able to understand<BR>it in a way that may seem foreign to humans of Earth now, since they<BR>all have a shared history (even a millenium ago) of how far you can<BR>fall.&nbsp; Not just one nation, or one planet, but a whole interstellar<BR>civilization.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 02:47:18 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>&gt;From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>...<BR>&gt;industrialisation of many countries on Earth.&nbsp; But then, we've never<BR>&gt;experienced a complete collapse of international trade, so the<BR>&gt;sociology may be completely different in the Imperium.<BR><BR>&nbsp; Or at least not since the first time that London was an <BR>administrative hub in an empire :)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 10:47:06 +0000<BR>From: Phil Kitching &lt;postmark.design@btinternet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Michael Daumen wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Actually if you do the analysis, something like 90% of the Imperium's<BR>&gt;&gt; population is at TL9 or better, Steller tech.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Grrr, perhaps the problem is Traveller wastes a lot of digits on low-tech<BR>&gt;worlds that don't exist.&nbsp; A holdover from Sylean expansion I suspect.&nbsp; IMTU<BR>&gt;the tech levels have been compressed a bit and tend to track GURPS more<BR>&gt;closely (but not perfectly).&nbsp;&nbsp; I also have modified the starport digit to<BR>&gt;reflect what we have been talking about.<BR><BR>Welcome to the Imperial Core.<BR><BR>The generation system in book 3 seems to be designed to generate frontier<BR>areas (eg Sylea in M0 or the Spinward Marches in M1100) where there are<BR>lots of reasons why the TL varies.<BR><BR>When you open the Solomani Rim supplement, you see a lot more uniformity.<BR><BR><BR>Phil Kitching<BR>- --<BR>&nbsp; http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo/<BR>&nbsp; Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Technologies Division.<BR>"Microwaving half-baked ideas from across the Galaxy"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:09:26 +0000<BR>From: Phil Kitching &lt;postmark.design@btinternet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>Gordon Horne wrote:<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;As to who the unsustainable middle tech goods are being produced for, <BR>&gt;i would expect that high pop world heartlands are surrounded by <BR>&gt;hinterlands of nearly the same tech level. I can predict, however, <BR>&gt;that this is not the case, because the world generation system does <BR>&gt;not consider nearby worlds. The distribution of tech levels will be <BR>&gt;more or less random.<BR><BR>This is not correct.<BR><BR>There is plenty of evidence that, for example, the Spinward Marches<BR>and the Solomani Rim were *not* generated using the same system.<BR><BR>Unless Rim got very lucky on the dice rolls!<BR><BR><BR>Phil Kitching<BR>- --<BR>&nbsp; http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo/<BR>&nbsp; Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Technologies Division.<BR>"Microwaving half-baked ideas from across the Galaxy"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 03:37:19 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>&gt;If you factor in the effects of probably the biggest human-caused<BR>&gt;disaster in a technological civilization's history, [snip]<BR><BR>Was the Long Night a disaster? So says Cleon the First who so <BR>graciously rescued many worlds from it's deprivations. But he had to <BR>beat quite hard on some of them to convince them they needed <BR>rescuing. See previous threads on whether or not the Long Night was <BR>really a tragedy or just the victors writing history.<BR><BR>&gt;Furthermore, such traditions would be amply justified.&nbsp; It only takes<BR>&gt;one civilization-wrecking event to show that relying on fragile<BR>&gt;interstellar travel and outsiders to keep your society running is, in<BR>&gt;general, a bad idea.&nbsp; As a descendant of such a disaster, are you<BR>&gt;going to use local sustainable technology and develop slowly, or<BR>&gt;listen to those short-sighted fools who see only the profits and not<BR>&gt;the dangers they pose to everyone?&nbsp; (Those who do not remember history<BR>&gt;are condemned to repeat it)<BR><BR>And no dissenters in a thousand years? Look how many descendents of <BR>Jews have managed to justify eating pork or lighting fires on the <BR>Sabbath. Of course, if the dissenters leave, it might explain the low <BR>populations. 8^)<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; It's hard to see how higher pop worlds could not be self sustaining.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Quite easily -- just like our current industrial nations are not self<BR>&gt;sustaining.<BR><BR>Sorry, i meant without potential to be self sustaining. Given a <BR>billion or more people and an Earth-like world or space travel, a <BR>world should have sufficient skills and resources to keep things <BR>running without relying on other star systems. (Space travel &lt;&gt; star <BR>travel.)<BR><BR>Without doubt, the worlds of the Imperium are mutually interdependent <BR>as you say below. It is a trading empire. This is not the same as <BR>incapable of self-sufficiency if circumstances change.<BR><BR>&gt;They could be mutually interdependent, relying on<BR>&gt;interstellar trade.&nbsp; It is entirely possible that the higher tech<BR>&gt;levels of the Imperium require a wider industrial base than any single<BR>&gt;world can sustain.<BR><BR>Greater than any single /system/ can maintain? But that gets into the <BR>problem that the Traveller universe is even less developed at the <BR>intra-system level than the inter-system.<BR><BR>&gt;My interpretation of the TL listings are that they describe the<BR>&gt;highest level of technology for which you are likely to find any given<BR>&gt;item.&nbsp; This is the interpretation that would interest a traveller.<BR><BR>[snip]<BR><BR>That explains the what and the how quite neatly, but it doesn't <BR>address the why. Way back at the beginning of this thread it was <BR>asked why do some planets have lower tech levels than would seem <BR>likely from their starports. Of course, a starport represents <BR>fueling, maintenance and construction facilities, it doesn't relate <BR>directly to tech level. A class A starport on a TL 9 world can make <BR>TL 9 starships. If you want to get your TL 15 starship fixed there, <BR>you're out of luck.<BR><BR>There are some intriguing worlds in the Imperium however...<BR><BR>Old Expanses 3225&nbsp; &nbsp; Haven A 537000-0 Ba Lo Ni<BR><BR>Ley 1303&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Revel&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 585658-5&nbsp; &nbsp; Ag<BR>Empty Quarter 0138&nbsp; &nbsp; Rundeau&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 787777-6&nbsp; &nbsp; Ag Ri<BR>Empty Quarter 2237&nbsp; &nbsp; Signet&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 7836BE-7&nbsp; &nbsp; Ni<BR>Empty Quarter 1230&nbsp; &nbsp; Narada&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 757744-7&nbsp; &nbsp; Ag<BR>Solomani Rim 0110&nbsp; &nbsp; Iddamakur&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 7799AB-7&nbsp; &nbsp; Hi In<BR>Delphi 0314&nbsp; &nbsp; Soranal&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 687374-8&nbsp; &nbsp; Ni<BR>Empty Quarter 1527&nbsp; &nbsp; Cobweb Station&nbsp; &nbsp; A 774334-8&nbsp; &nbsp; Lo Ni<BR>Diaspora 2939&nbsp; &nbsp; Sofar&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 8B4575-8 N<BR>Reaver's Deep 3211&nbsp; &nbsp; Lome&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 786500-8<BR>Spnwrd Mrchs 2814&nbsp; &nbsp; Jae Tellona&nbsp; &nbsp; A 560565-8 N&nbsp; &nbsp; Ni De<BR>Delphi 0724&nbsp; &nbsp; McAllister&nbsp; &nbsp; A 574524-8&nbsp; &nbsp; Ni Ag<BR>Empty Quarter 2030&nbsp; &nbsp; Pynchan&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 257640-8&nbsp; &nbsp; Ag Ni<BR>Spnwrd Mrchs 2202&nbsp; &nbsp; Kinorb&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 663659-8&nbsp; &nbsp; Ni Ri<BR>Old Expanses 2611&nbsp; &nbsp; Warner&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 564655-8 N&nbsp; &nbsp; Ag Ni Ri<BR>Ley 1209&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Geberah&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A A77676-8&nbsp; &nbsp; Ag<BR>Corridor 2537&nbsp; &nbsp; Nowbee&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 55277B-8&nbsp; &nbsp; Po<BR>Deneb 0409&nbsp; &nbsp; L'sis&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 764896-8 N&nbsp; &nbsp; Ri<BR>Deneb 0504&nbsp; &nbsp; Ash&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 540887-8 S&nbsp; &nbsp; Po De<BR>Core 2914&nbsp; &nbsp; Mikhag Kuu&nbsp; &nbsp; A 668873-8&nbsp; &nbsp; Ri<BR>Corridor 1005&nbsp; &nbsp; Mount&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 675887-8 C<BR>Antares 1438&nbsp; &nbsp; Sihvylai&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 757887-8<BR>Antares 1911&nbsp; &nbsp; Mata&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 6868BC-8 N<BR>Solomani Rim 2623&nbsp; &nbsp; Hathor&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 78A997-8&nbsp; &nbsp; Hi Wa<BR>Solomani Rim 3109&nbsp; &nbsp; Champa&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 6629B9-8 S&nbsp; &nbsp; Hi<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; All pre-stellar, but lots of naval bases to help explain things.<BR><BR>Of 1535 Imperial worlds of TL 9 or above with class A starports, 197 <BR>(12.83%) have fewer than 1000 people. Somewhere in the rules or other <BR>writing it says that explaining strange UWPs is a challenge for the <BR>referee and part of the fun of Traveller. Sometimes i think i could <BR>do with less fun. 8^)<BR><BR>Personally, i would expect regions of fairly uniform TL. As i said <BR>earlier in this thread, the world generation system takes no account <BR>of neighbouring systems.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 22:34:17 +1100<BR>From: Paul Harris &lt;paul.harris@dytech.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Deckplan plea!<BR><BR>Does anyone have an electronic copy of the Deckplans for a Type-T 400 DT<BR>Patrol Cruiser. <BR><BR>My players have managed to get hold of that type of ship, and they have,<BR>naturally, modified the interior. <BR><BR>I have seen the GURPS version of the deckplans, and decided against<BR>using them because they use hex grids rather than square grid. <BR><BR>Can anyone help me out? <BR><BR>Paul Harris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:00:14 +1100<BR>From: "Robert O'Connor" &lt;robocon@ozemail.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re : Query: The Githaskio<BR><BR>Gordon Horne wrote :-<BR>&gt; What if anything happened to the Githiaskio (JTAS 16) in MT, TNE, T4 or G:T?<BR><BR>Go to the Steve Jackson site and search for G:T Alien Races 4.<BR>If you're a Pyramid subscriber, the GURPSified 'squids with ids' are in<BR>the articles archive.<BR><BR><BR>Robert O'Connor<BR>Medico, Gamer<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:49:19 GMT<BR>From: "John G. Wood" &lt;elvwood@ntlworld.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Kelly wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Hell, IMO, half of the problems we have today are because we're <BR>&gt; &gt;still following the rules that worked great for tribal societies; go <BR>&gt; &gt;ahead and overbreed your habitat, because it gives you more warriors <BR>&gt; &gt;to go next door, kill the people there and take their land and <BR>&gt; &gt;stuff.&nbsp; You'll lose people too, but you couldn't support them <BR>&gt; &gt;anyway.&nbsp; Everyone who is Not Us is competition - kill them, displace <BR>&gt; &gt;them or assimilate them.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Very true, but have any of these prevented you from adopting <BR>&gt; technology to apply them?<BR><BR>No, but in our history the problems the rules were set up to prevent <BR>have never included "disaster caused by over-reliance on unsustainable <BR>technology". An analogy: some things could be done better in the <BR>military by ignoring the chain of command, but try it and you will not <BR>be thanked. The reason for the rule is seen as *so* much more important <BR>than the problem you solved by breaking it that you are seen to have <BR>done a bad thing, even though the results were beneficial.<BR><BR>Also (and I realise you're not disputing this), tech doesn't just <BR>appear. Our tribal attitudes have prevented us from researching and <BR>developing tech in areas that contradict those attitudes, because even <BR>if the need is recognised by some they still need to fund the R&amp;D (and <BR>bigger guns are so much more "important"). Only in prosperous periods <BR>with a spirit of free inquiry does this sort of thing happen at all.<BR><BR>&gt; Over breeding, for example, is a result of old rules coupled with new <BR>&gt; technology.<BR><BR>A perfect example. If controlling population by preventing new births <BR>had been seen as more important than new ways of killing the neighbours <BR>- - or even if it had been given the same priority as saving people's <BR>lives - how soon would we have had reliable contraception? And if <BR>children had been seen as men's responsibility rather than women's, <BR>would we now be using male pills?<BR><BR>ObTrav: A lot of worlds IMTU have higher environmental tech than their <BR>UWP rating, because they need it to survive and it is therefore a <BR>priority. With millennia of settlement on non-Earthlike worlds I can see <BR>this being a common attitude.<BR><BR>John<BR>http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:54:46 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt; Was the Long Night a disaster? So says Cleon the First who so<BR>&gt; graciously rescued many worlds from it's deprivations. But he had to<BR>&gt; beat quite hard on some of them to convince them they needed<BR>&gt; rescuing.<BR><BR>Was it perhaps that after relying on themselves for so long, they were<BR>highly reluctant to join an Imperium that they viewed as likely to<BR>collapse out from under them yet again?<BR><BR><BR>&gt; And no dissenters in a thousand years? Look how many descendents of <BR>&gt; Jews have managed to justify eating pork or lighting fires on the <BR>&gt; Sabbath.<BR><BR>As I said, some cultures would hold such traditions to lower intensity<BR>than others.&nbsp; However, not eating pork on religious/moral/traditional<BR>grounds is a more common practice as a proportion of total population<BR>now than it was over 1000 years ago.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Of course, if the dissenters leave, it might explain the low<BR>&gt; populations. 8^)<BR><BR>That it would :^)<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Greater than any single /system/ can maintain? But that gets into<BR>&gt; the problem that the Traveller universe is even less developed at<BR>&gt; the intra-system level than the inter-system.<BR><BR>That it does.&nbsp; I'd like to know why despite having solved all the<BR>difficult problems of space travel and even interstellar travel, and<BR>having demonstrated willingness to expend huge resources on<BR>terraforming new worlds, there are virtually no space habitats or<BR>large scale off-planet industry.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; That explains the what and the how quite neatly, but it doesn't <BR>&gt; address the why. Way back at the beginning of this thread it was <BR>&gt; asked why do some planets have lower tech levels than would seem <BR>&gt; likely from their starports.<BR><BR>I expect that these worlds would be the ones with a fair bit of trade<BR>of offworld goods, even manufacturing facilites, but only in specific<BR>areas (e.g. starships).&nbsp; Possibly even ultra-high-tech insystem ship<BR>construction facilities with antimatter production factories, but not<BR>much in the way of general tech of use to a visitor (the facilities<BR>may even be off-limits to non-company personnel), and the local planet<BR>is a low-tech mudball of interest only to the farmers and their fleas<BR>living there :)<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Of course, a starport represents fueling, maintenance and<BR>&gt; construction facilities, it doesn't relate directly to tech level. A<BR>&gt; class A starport on a TL 9 world can make TL 9 starships. If you<BR>&gt; want to get your TL 15 starship fixed there, you're out of luck.<BR><BR>I'd say that's oversimplifying matters a bit.&nbsp; I would expect that all<BR>class-A TL-9 starports can make TL-9 starships, but I'd also expect<BR>most of them to be able to handle higher-tech starships.&nbsp; If canon<BR>dictates otherwise, then said canon is not part of MTU :)<BR><BR><BR>&gt; There are some intriguing worlds in the Imperium however...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Old Expanses 3225&nbsp; &nbsp; Haven A 537000-0 Ba Lo Ni<BR><BR>Yep, that sounds like a planet in a system much like I described<BR>above, only without the farmers.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Of 1535 Imperial worlds of TL 9 or above with class A starports, 197<BR>&gt; (12.83%) have fewer than 1000 people. Somewhere in the rules or<BR>&gt; other writing it says that explaining strange UWPs is a challenge<BR>&gt; for the referee and part of the fun of Traveller. Sometimes i think<BR>&gt; i could do with less fun. 8^)<BR><BR>I'd just say the planet is what is described by the UWP, the *real*<BR>action is in space.<BR><BR>Of course, this does get back to the question of why such a situation<BR>might be stable.&nbsp; Surely *someone* wants to live on the planet, and it<BR>doesn't take many centuries before their descendants turn it into Yet<BR>Another Pop-9 World if there isn't a good reason why not.<BR><BR>I mean even at only 3% growth/year, it's only about 4 centuries<BR>between pop-3 and pop-9.&nbsp; I don't see why a millennia-long birth/death<BR>ratio of 1.00 is so much more likely than 0.99 (extinction) or 1.01<BR>(filling the planet) unless explicit measures are taken to keep it<BR>that way.&nbsp; If there are such explicit measures, why are they nowhere<BR>mentioned?<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Personally, i would expect regions of fairly uniform TL. As i said<BR>&gt; earlier in this thread, the world generation system takes no account<BR>&gt; of neighbouring systems.<BR><BR>I'm not so sure.&nbsp; It would make sense, I agree.&nbsp; I would expect<BR>frontier areas to have less uniform TLs, but not for more than a<BR>hundred or two years at most.&nbsp; Sure, high-tech gods exploiting<BR>low-tech natives is a feasible explanation in the short term, but not<BR>over centuries to millennia.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:05:46 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Allegiance codes<BR><BR>There is a file on the BARD pages? of freelance traveller that has all of<BR>them listed and the system that they are for ie TNE or MT...If its not there<BR>try altavista or google.com search engines and type in allegiance codes and<BR>traveller that's how I found the file..<BR><BR>Mike<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:13:31 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3546<BR><BR>&gt; I don't see how this follows. The Long Night was 1000+ years ago -<BR>&gt; except for Milieu 0. How many social desires and taboos do you<BR>&gt; remember from the Norman Conquest era?<BR>&gt;<BR>I would say 1/3 of the Anglo-American legal system predates the Norman<BR>Conquest.<BR>And another third dates from within 150 years of 1066 - the part with<BR>property and<BR>individual rights that many scholars feel is responsible for the<BR>triumph/domination of<BR>free market capitalism/democracy/liberty in the lofty senses.<BR><BR>Based on the rate of tech level change in the period starting with Year 0,<BR>the<BR>Imperium has advanced at a very slow pace.&nbsp; It was fusion-plus that gave<BR>Sylea a<BR>crucial edge over its neighbors; has there been anything comparable since<BR>then?<BR>Certainly there have been low-pop societies that have managed to outstrip<BR>the<BR>Imperial average rate of change.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:18:44 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Landgrab rules'<BR><BR>Fanboy geek here as well :-) Hoping and praying the eighth doctor will make <BR>an appearnce in a movie :-)<BR><BR>Mike<BR><BR><BR>- ----Original Message Follows----<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Landgrab rules'<BR>Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 09:58:48<BR><BR>At 11:34 PM 1/21/2001 +1300, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Kelly St.Clair wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Try not to take one that's already being done.&nbsp; This creates a<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; multiverse, and then you end up with the Crisis on Infinite<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Rhylanors, and George Perez kills you for making him do all<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; that art research again (comic geek joke.)<BR>&gt;&lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Just think of the fun when the Strephons from Imperium-MT and <BR>Imperium-GT<BR>&gt;&gt; (and possibly more) meet each other...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;A la' "The Five Doctors" ?<BR><BR>They were all from the same universe, just from different spots along<BR>Gallifrey's timeline.&nbsp; The High Council broke all sorts of rules to<BR>assemble the various Doctors.<BR><BR>(Digression: The Legion of Rassilon got to see The Five Doctors four days<BR>before its official US broadcast (we beat New Jersey Network and Princeton<BR>club by a day!) By far the loudest cheer of the night was when the Council<BR>told the Master that all he needed to do to get a new set of regenerations<BR>was save the Doctor.. the look on his face..)<BR><BR>(Another Digression: Anthony Ainley, who played the Master for the later<BR>part of the series, came to TimeCon one year, and addressed a LoR meeting.<BR>He is a wonderful man, witty, clever, always smiling.&nbsp; One of our members<BR>asked if he could do a little "Master" for us.&nbsp; He paused, explained that<BR>they had just finished shooting a season long epic called "Trial of a Time<BR>Lord", and looked down for a moment.<BR><BR>The Master looked up at us.&nbsp; He gave the speech which the Master gives in<BR>Ep. 5, IIRC.&nbsp; The room was completely silent afterwards for about five<BR>seconds.&nbsp; Then we all started breathing again.)<BR><BR>Why yes, I'm a fanboy geek.. why do you ask?&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>What you would get with Crisis in Infinite Imperiums are all the potential<BR>Strephons.&nbsp; Evil Strephon.&nbsp; Old Strephon.&nbsp; Bizarro Strephon (who, as<BR>Emperor, is the lowest ranking person in the Bizarro Imperium.)<BR>- --<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>"Pardon me, excuse me, Giant vampiric flightless winged<BR>squirrel, coming through.."&nbsp; -Tim the Paladin, "Yamara"<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3547<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zd04.mx.aol.com (rly-zd04.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.228]) by air-zd03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:21:33 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zd04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:20:57 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id IAA02092;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:19:31 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:19:16 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id IAA02047<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:19:16 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:19:16 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101221319.IAA02047@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3547<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background="" bgColor=#3dffff><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3548</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/22/01 12:59:46 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Monday, January 22 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3548<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Water merchants<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Deckplan plea!<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>Re: Query: The Githiaskio<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>RE: Deckplan plea!<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>Solomani Rim<BR>Barriers to improving technology levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Tech Levels<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Query: The Githiaskio<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:35:58 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Water merchants<BR><BR>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C0844E.57E95980<BR>Content-Type: text/plain;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="Windows-1252"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>Why is water not a more common cargo for interstellar trade?&nbsp; It is =<BR>crucial to life, convertible into fuel, efficient as a shield against =<BR>cosmic radiation, and does not exist in many star systems.<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C0844E.57E95980<BR>Content-Type: text/html;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="Windows-1252"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>&lt;!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"&gt;<BR>&lt;HEAD&gt;<BR>&lt;META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-1252" =<BR>http-equiv=3DContent-Type&gt;<BR>&lt;META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2014.210" name=3DGENERATOR&gt;<BR>&lt;STYLE&gt;&lt;/STYLE&gt;<BR>&lt;/HEAD&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;DIV&gt;Why is water not a more common cargo for interstellar trade?&amp;nbsp; =<BR>It is=20<BR>crucial to life, convertible into&amp;nbsp;fuel,&amp;nbsp;efficient=20<BR>as&amp;nbsp;a&amp;nbsp;shield against cosmic radiation, and does not exist in =<BR>many star=20<BR>systems.&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C0844E.57E95980--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:43:48 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>on 22/1/01 2:02 am, Leonard Erickson at shadow@krypton.rain.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Yes, a lot of high TL stuff *will* get used. But until it can be<BR>&gt; *built* locally, it's always at the mercy of offworld merchants.<BR><BR>Exactly. I've often made higher tech items available on lower tech planets<BR>in my campaigns, but at increased cost. The cost is dependant on the<BR>difference in TL, and the capacity and frequency of trade routes. When I was<BR>in Lagos, Lusaka and Harare, I saw contemporary European and Japanese<BR>electronics products for sale. The prices were such that you'd be very keen<BR>to think about buying them. In most cases it makes sense to personally<BR>import such goods, and sell them for profit when leaving.<BR><BR>Note that you should increase prices over the standard trade tables when<BR>setting the values of retail outlets.<BR><BR>Also, the types of governments will radically effect this. It's common for<BR>dictatorships to have a lot of wealth spread thinly among the top supporters<BR>of the regime. Many African nations import Mercedes limos, for example.<BR>However, in order to satisfy the wealthy businessmen and minor government<BR>staff, less valuable (eg Ford) vehicles will be produced locally, with major<BR>components bought in for the local assembly lines. While these will cost as<BR>much or more than the products produced in their native countries, the<BR>workmanship will typically be lower and the production times longer and<BR>indeed patchy. A couple of Suez blockades could halt production for a year<BR>or more.<BR><BR>You could expect TL12 computers to be produced in Sacnoth and fitted at<BR>higher cost to starships built at the TL10 shipyards in Gram. The result<BR>would be that the class B starport at Sacnoth doing decent trade in repairs<BR>for Sword World naval vessels despite not being a starship manufacturing<BR>hub.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 05:52:08 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>&gt;From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>...<BR>&gt;I mean even at only 3% growth/year, it's only about 4 centuries<BR>&gt;between pop-3 and pop-9.&nbsp; I don't see why a millennia-long birth/death<BR>&gt;ratio of 1.00 is so much more likely than 0.99 (extinction) or 1.01<BR>&gt;(filling the planet) unless explicit measures are taken to keep it<BR>&gt;that way.&nbsp; If there are such explicit measures, why are they nowhere<BR>&gt;mentioned?<BR><BR>&nbsp; 3% growth/year is pretty impressive, and unless it's immigration-<BR>driven it's not likely going to do much for capital per head.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 09:29:55 EST<BR>From: JDoch226@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Deckplan plea!<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/22/01 5:21:33 AM Pacific Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR>&lt;&lt; I have seen the GURPS version of the deckplans,&nbsp; &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>Sorry, I can't help with a square grid deckplan for a Type-T 400 T Patrol <BR>Cruiser, but&nbsp; where has GURPS published their hex plan for it?<BR>Thanks,<BR>Jed Docherty<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 10:33:14 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Gordon Horne <BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;BTW if 78.04 percent of the Imperial population comes from the 257 <BR>&gt;worlds with populations over 10 billion, the farmboy (or anyone else) <BR>&gt;from one of the 8793 other worlds is going to be a rare bird in the <BR>&gt;Navy, Marines or Scout Service. OTOH hinterlands have traditionally <BR>&gt;been disproportionately strong recruiting grounds for military and <BR>&gt;paramilitary services as they offer an escape into the larger world.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; This has been my assumption.&nbsp; For simplicity, I base the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; representation of various worlds in Imperial service on the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; UWP population digit (there are typically ten times as<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; many personel from a pop 10 world as from a pop 1 world).<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; The Imperial Navy is still dominated by citizens of the hi-<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; pop worlds, but there are lots of Heyan farm-boy types as<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; well.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 10:39:54 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>John G. Wood writes:<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;A perfect example. If controlling population by preventing new births <BR>&gt;had been seen as more important than new ways of killing the neighbours <BR>&gt;- - or even if it had been given the same priority as saving people's <BR>&gt;lives - how soon would we have had reliable contraception? And if <BR>&gt;children had been seen as men's responsibility rather than women's, <BR>&gt;would we now be using male pills?<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Probably not.&nbsp; Although social attitudes about pregnancy<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; and responsibility have certainly biased research, there are<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; some technical (and other) challenges to a birth control pill<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; for males that make it more difficult to develop than one for<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; females.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 10:39:10 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: "John P. Raynor" &lt;john.raynor@yale.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>On Mon, 22 Jan 2001, Michael Daumen wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Why is water not a more common cargo for interstellar trade?&nbsp; It is<BR>&gt; crucial to life, convertible into fuel, efficient as a shield against<BR>&gt; cosmic radiation, and does not exist in many star systems.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR><BR>But water *does* exist in just about every star system.&nbsp; In the outer<BR>star system, where it's cold, water is plentiful, in the form of comets<BR>and various other rock-and-ice bodies, like the moons of gas giants.<BR>Water is, furthermore, very easy to recycle, so even if a world (or,<BR>more plausibly, a sealed habitat of some kind) has to import enough<BR>water to get started, it probably won't have to import any more.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - J. Raynor<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 07:57:20 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>Somebody's been watching "Ice Pirates" again.<BR><BR><BR>- --- "John P. Raynor" &lt;john.raynor@yale.edu&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; On Mon, 22 Jan 2001, Michael Daumen wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Why is water not a more common cargo for interstellar trade?&nbsp; It is<BR>&gt; &gt; crucial to life, convertible into fuel, efficient as a shield<BR>&gt; against<BR>&gt; &gt; cosmic radiation, and does not exist in many star systems.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; But water *does* exist in just about every star system.&nbsp; In the outer<BR>&gt; star system, where it's cold, water is plentiful, in the form of<BR>&gt; comets<BR>&gt; and various other rock-and-ice bodies, like the moons of gas giants.<BR>&gt; Water is, furthermore, very easy to recycle, so even if a world (or,<BR>&gt; more plausibly, a sealed habitat of some kind) has to import enough<BR>&gt; water to get started, it probably won't have to import any more.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - J. Raynor<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 10:59:52 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>&gt;Water is, furthermore, very easy to recycle, so even if a world (or,<BR>&gt;more plausibly, a sealed habitat of some kind) has to import enough<BR>&gt;water to get started, it probably won't have to import any more.<BR><BR>On the other hand, just because they *could* make a tight water cycle <BR>doesn't mean it's the most economic way of solving the problem. There's also <BR>the issue of the people and goods that leave the world -- the water system <BR>*can't* be sealed. It might be cheaper to build a moderately leaky habitat <BR>and just top it up with water as needed, rather than implementing draconian <BR>measures.<BR><BR>For some reason I'm picturing customs officials on the way out of the system <BR>saying "Are you sure you wouldn't like a tinkle break before you leave, <BR>sirs? No, really, we insist."<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 07:56:21<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Query: The Githiaskio<BR><BR>At 08:29 PM 1/21/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Hello All,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What if anything happened to the Githiaskio (JTAS 16) in MT, TNE, T4 or G:T?<BR><BR>I made a mention of them in GF, they "man" the Marine Force's 12th Special<BR>Assault Group.&nbsp; (sidebar, page 6.)<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:05:27<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>At 08:35 AM 1/22/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Why is water not a more common cargo for interstellar trade?&nbsp; It is<BR>crucial to life, convertible into fuel, efficient as a shield against<BR>cosmic radiation, and does not exist in many star systems.<BR><BR>It does not exist on many *planets*.&nbsp; I may be corrected, but water seems<BR>to be quite available in asteroids and out in the cometary clouds.&nbsp; Just<BR>grab a few billion gallons of ice cube, strap a maneuver drive to it,<BR>s/l/a/m i/t i/n/t/o t/h/e p/l/a/n/e/t...&nbsp; err, bring it into an appropriate<BR>orbit, and mine it for water.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 08:15:53 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Deckplan plea!<BR><BR>They haven't to the best of my knowledge...Maybe Jed's seen some stuff for<BR>the upcoming "Starships"?<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of JDoch226@aol.com<BR>&gt; Sent: Monday, January 22, 2001 6:30 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Deckplan plea!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In a message dated 1/22/01 5:21:33 AM Pacific Standard Time,<BR>&gt; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;&lt; I have seen the GURPS version of the deckplans,&nbsp; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Sorry, I can't help with a square grid deckplan for a Type-T 400 T Patrol<BR>&gt; Cruiser, but&nbsp; where has GURPS published their hex plan for it?<BR>&gt; Thanks,<BR>&gt; Jed Docherty<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:44:26 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>On Mon, 22 Jan 2001, Gerry Harris wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; On Mon, 22 Jan 2001, Michael Daumen wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Why is water not a more common cargo for interstellar trade?&nbsp; It is<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; crucial to life, convertible into fuel, efficient as a shield<BR>&gt; &gt; against<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; cosmic radiation, and does not exist in many star systems.<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR>&gt; Somebody's been watching "Ice Pirates" again.<BR><BR>Or V. <BR><BR>I was something about 10 years old when V was shown in the Finnish TV -<BR>and I thought it very strange for aliens to come to Earth for _water_ and<BR>_people_for_cattle_...<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 10:39:45 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Solomani Rim<BR><BR>&gt;Me:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;As to who the unsustainable middle tech goods are being produced for,<BR>&gt;&gt;i would expect that high pop world heartlands are surrounded by<BR>&gt;&gt;hinterlands of nearly the same tech level. I can predict, however,<BR>&gt;&gt;that this is not the case, because the world generation system does<BR>&gt;&gt;not consider nearby worlds. The distribution of tech levels will be<BR>&gt;&gt;more or less random.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Phil:<BR>&gt;This is not correct.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;There is plenty of evidence that, for example, the Spinward Marches<BR>&gt;and the Solomani Rim were *not* generated using the same system.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Unless Rim got very lucky on the dice rolls!<BR><BR>That's an excellent point. The Rim in particular is much closer to <BR>what i would expect from a rational world generation system - i.e., <BR>someone making it up 8^) The astrography of the the rim makes it an <BR>economic hub of the Imperium, one of only two or three and possibly <BR>the largest. It raises some interesting questions about the <BR>relationship between the Solomani and the Imperium when one of the <BR>most vital areas of the Imperium is conquered territory.<BR><BR>However, the worlds in the rim still represent a minority of Imperial <BR>worlds. The distribution of population tech level and starports is <BR>still ugly elsewhere, with the (partial) exception of the Spinward <BR>Marches which are obviously hand crafted.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 14:09:21 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Barriers to improving technology levels<BR><BR>http://www.theonion.com/onion3701/mad_scientists.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 11:19:34 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Very true, but have any of these prevented you from adopting<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; technology to apply them?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;No, but in our history the problems the rules were set up to prevent<BR>&gt;have never included "disaster caused by over-reliance on unsustainable<BR>&gt;technology".<BR><BR>Mesopotamia, Easter Island and the American Mid-West (ongoing). To <BR>our credit we are developing rules to slow or halt the last. (For the <BR>uninitiated, these are all crises of destroying land productivity. <BR>Iraq and neighbours would still be a fertile crescent today except <BR>our ancient irrigation technology poisoned the soil. Easter Island is <BR>a near wasteland because we used all the trees. The soils of the <BR>American Mid-West are blowing away as a direct result of our farming <BR>methods. FWIW the Chinese have the most sustainable agriculture <BR>system, having produced for several thousand years without long-term <BR>decline in productivity. The present Western system is more produces <BR>more, but with a measurable decline in productivity for input over <BR>just a few years.)<BR><BR>There is also Eastern Europe (pollution), possibly the Green <BR>Revolution (it's certainly been a disaster for some), possibly <BR>Hanford and similar sites, acid rain, the ozone holes and dozens more <BR>historical and modern. No, we haven't destroyed our world, but we are <BR>remarkably ignorant of the things we have stuffed up. We are <BR>beginning to develop rules to prevent problems like these in the <BR>future.<BR><BR>&gt;Also (and I realise you're not disputing this), tech doesn't just<BR>&gt;appear. Our tribal attitudes have prevented us from researching and<BR>&gt;developing tech in areas that contradict those attitudes, because even<BR>&gt;if the need is recognised by some they still need to fund the R&amp;D (and<BR>&gt;bigger guns are so much more "important"). Only in prosperous periods<BR>&gt;with a spirit of free inquiry does this sort of thing happen at all.<BR><BR>Someone earlier mentioned the taboo against human experimentation, <BR>but that's actually quite recent. In the past we did horrible things <BR>to each other, and learned a lot from it. That's not your point, of <BR>course, i just wanted to mention it. I agree with with you that our <BR>tribal attitudes constrain technological development. For example, in <BR>North America, our cult of individual freedom of movement has greatly <BR>restricted the development and installation of public transportation <BR>technologies. The private automobile is a totem to freedom and <BR>individuality. 8^)<BR><BR>Tribal attitudes can also promote inquiry.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Over breeding, for example, is a result of old rules coupled with new<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; technology.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;A perfect example. If controlling population by preventing new births<BR>&gt;had been seen as more important than new ways of killing the neighbours<BR>&gt;- or even if it had been given the same priority as saving people's<BR>&gt;lives - how soon would we have had reliable contraception?<BR><BR>Thanks to exponential growth, this particular problem went from <BR>intellectual to visceral quite quickly by our perceptual time scale. <BR>The common reaction among those who understood the problem was to try <BR>and develop ways to support more people rather than ways to limit the <BR>numbers. Many people still see this as the solution. We seem to have <BR>a biological taboo against less than maximum procreation.<BR><BR>&gt;And if<BR>&gt;children had been seen as men's responsibility rather than women's,<BR>&gt;would we now be using male pills?<BR><BR>An excellent point. Just to comment on the particular example, it <BR>seems at the moment that the male pill has even nastier side effects <BR>than the female variety, which is an unpleasant little beast itself. <BR>How would this effect our choice? The male condom is much more used <BR>than the female variety which is not as simple to use or effective. <BR>There are also more drastic methods for both men and women which some <BR>people use.<BR><BR>Often our choice in technologies has been short term gain coupled <BR>with long term problems. Even when we can see the long term problems <BR>we tend to choose the associated short term gain.<BR><BR>&gt;ObTrav: A lot of worlds IMTU have higher environmental tech than their<BR>&gt;UWP rating, because they need it to survive and it is therefore a<BR>&gt;priority. With millennia of settlement on non-Earthlike worlds I can see<BR>&gt;this being a common attitude.<BR><BR>That's a good idea, but it adds another item to the list of things <BR>the UWP tech code is not. Weren't you inspired by impossible worlds <BR>to be creative? According to the rules, you were supposed to be 8^) <BR>You still run into the problem that the infrastructure to support a <BR>high environmental tech locally requires a larger population than <BR>many worlds which need it have.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 14:51:08 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Tech Levels<BR><BR>&gt;You don't necessarily need to build rail networks. But they actually<BR>&gt;*are* a better investment than highways, at least until you get CG.<BR>&gt;But you need to consider the *huge* difference between what you can use<BR>&gt;and what you can maintain. If you need to import *parts* (as opposed to<BR>&gt;raw materials), then it's *not* *your* tech level.<BR><BR>Oh ya.&nbsp; *Cheap* Contr-Grav really changes things.<BR>Take out the "cheap" and you can see things like Government Troops in <BR>imported Air/Rafts flying along the rail lines to protect them for the rebels.<BR><BR><BR><BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>Opinions should be yours too! - http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>"What's a FAQ? Boy, I wish someone would put a list of answers<BR>for common questions such as this..."<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:15:13 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: "John P. Raynor" &lt;john.raynor@yale.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>On Mon, 22 Jan 2001, Paul Drye wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Water is, furthermore, very easy to recycle, so even if a world (or,<BR>&gt; &gt;more plausibly, a sealed habitat of some kind) has to import enough<BR>&gt; &gt;water to get started, it probably won't have to import any more.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; On the other hand, just because they *could* make a tight water cycle<BR>&gt; doesn't mean it's the most economic way of solving the problem. There's also<BR>&gt; the issue of the people and goods that leave the world -- the water system<BR>&gt; *can't* be sealed. It might be cheaper to build a moderately leaky habitat<BR>&gt; and just top it up with water as needed, rather than implementing draconian<BR>&gt; measures.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; For some reason I'm picturing customs officials on the way out of the system<BR>&gt; saying "Are you sure you wouldn't like a tinkle break before you leave,<BR>&gt; sirs? No, really, we insist."<BR><BR>A more subtle solution: free strong tea or coffee in starport departure<BR>lounges, and the waiting rooms of the offices where exit visas are applied<BR>for and processed.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - J. Raynor<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:47:17 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>&gt;Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; Was the Long Night a disaster? So says Cleon the First who so<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; graciously rescued many worlds from it's deprivations. But he had to<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; beat quite hard on some of them to convince them they needed<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; rescuing.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Was it perhaps that after relying on themselves for so long, they were<BR>&gt;highly reluctant to join an Imperium that they viewed as likely to<BR>&gt;collapse out from under them yet again?<BR><BR>Were they relying on themselves? There were a lot of pocket empires <BR>out there. How many worlds truly relied on themselves compared to how <BR>many were in small interstellar states or engaged in interstellar <BR>trade? I suspect it was a minority.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Of course, if the dissenters leave, it might explain the low<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; populations. 8^)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;That it would :^)<BR><BR>Silly point, if the people that wanted to eat pork had to leave their <BR>birth world, the pig would be remarkably widespread in space. 8^)<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Greater than any single /system/ can maintain? But that gets into<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; the problem that the Traveller universe is even less developed at<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; the intra-system level than the inter-system.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;That it does.&nbsp; I'd like to know why despite having solved all the<BR>&gt;difficult problems of space travel and even interstellar travel, and<BR>&gt;having demonstrated willingness to expend huge resources on<BR>&gt;terraforming new worlds, there are virtually no space habitats or<BR>&gt;large scale off-planet industry.<BR><BR>The out of game answer is that it is a historical accident. The <BR>original designers didn't put space habitats or space industry in the <BR>rules. Some early supplements - e.g., Belter - did have habitats and <BR>off planet industry, but they were only broadly described and were <BR>not presented in game terms. Asteroid worlds, of course, are space <BR>habitats, but other than a UWP Size of 0 they are not distinguished <BR>from other worlds. Also, i don't recall off hand seeing a canon <BR>asteroid world that was not built into the asteroid itself rather <BR>than in free space.<BR><BR>I have never heard a convincing in game answer. IMTU space habitats <BR>are ubiquitous.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; That explains the what and the how quite neatly, but it doesn't<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; address the why. Way back at the beginning of this thread it was<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; asked why do some planets have lower tech levels than would seem<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; likely from their starports.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I expect that these worlds would be the ones with a fair bit of trade<BR>&gt;of offworld goods, even manufacturing facilites, but only in specific<BR>&gt;areas (e.g. starships).&nbsp; Possibly even ultra-high-tech insystem ship<BR>&gt;construction facilities with antimatter production factories, but not<BR>&gt;much in the way of general tech of use to a visitor (the facilities<BR>&gt;may even be off-limits to non-company personnel), and the local planet<BR>&gt;is a low-tech mudball of interest only to the farmers and their fleas<BR>&gt;living there :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; Of course, a starport represents fueling, maintenance and<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; construction facilities, it doesn't relate directly to tech level. A<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; class A starport on a TL 9 world can make TL 9 starships. If you<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; want to get your TL 15 starship fixed there, you're out of luck.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I'd say that's oversimplifying matters a bit.&nbsp; I would expect that all<BR>&gt;class-A TL-9 starports can make TL-9 starships, but I'd also expect<BR>&gt;most of them to be able to handle higher-tech starships.&nbsp; If canon<BR>&gt;dictates otherwise, then said canon is not part of MTU :)<BR><BR>Canon doesn't really say one way or the other. There are examples of each.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Of 1535 Imperial worlds of TL 9 or above with class A starports, 197<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; (12.83%) have fewer than 1000 people. Somewhere in the rules or<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; other writing it says that explaining strange UWPs is a challenge<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; for the referee and part of the fun of Traveller. Sometimes i think<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; i could do with less fun. 8^)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I'd just say the planet is what is described by the UWP, the *real*<BR>&gt;action is in space.<BR><BR>I'm not sure i understand this. Are you suggesting that in these <BR>systems the population necessary to support the starport (and <BR>presumably it's reason for being) live off the planet in space <BR>habitats? I'd like that. It creates two new problems: the rules state <BR>that the main world (the systems UWP) is the most important world in <BR>the system; some of these planets are quite nice, why are the people <BR>living in space rather than on the surface (instead of just as well <BR>as on the surface)? Actually, given my distaste for garden worlds <BR>that are "just like home" i could come up with lots of different fun <BR>solutions to that last problem. 8^)<BR><BR>Here are some example worlds with Starport A, standard atmosphere and <BR>population &lt;1000.<BR>Antares 0639&nbsp; &nbsp; Dagi&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 568003-A A&nbsp; &nbsp; Lo Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 401 Im F2V M9D<BR>Antares 1734&nbsp; &nbsp; Wythi&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 766245-9 A&nbsp; &nbsp; Lo Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 702 Im F9V M7D<BR>Corridor 0601&nbsp; &nbsp; Greenrok&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 560236-C&nbsp; &nbsp; Lo Ni De <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; 501 Im M2VI M5D<BR>Corridor 2403&nbsp; &nbsp; Myathena&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 666268-B&nbsp; &nbsp; Lo Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 413 Im M5V<BR>Corridor 2906&nbsp; &nbsp; Kifrusis&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 568235-E H&nbsp; &nbsp; Lo Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 812 Im K6V<BR>Dagudashaag 1207&nbsp; &nbsp; Imau&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 564233-C N&nbsp; &nbsp; Lo Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 502 Im F8V<BR>Daibei 0333&nbsp; &nbsp; Erickson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 366001-E&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 802 Im K0V M1D<BR>Deneb 0332&nbsp; &nbsp; Aosta&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 669236-C&nbsp; &nbsp; Lo Ni Re&nbsp; &nbsp; 412 Im M1V<BR>Diaspora 1524&nbsp; &nbsp; Bezan&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 663100-F&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 604 Im K9V<BR>Fornast 1319&nbsp; &nbsp; Artemis&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 360224-F&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 104 Im M7V<BR>Fornast 2039&nbsp; &nbsp; Emeraulde&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 867226-F&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 402 Im M1V<BR>Gushemege 0537&nbsp; &nbsp; Wols&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 764137-E&nbsp; &nbsp; Lo Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 200 Im M6V M4D<BR>Ilelish 0127&nbsp; &nbsp; Tyr&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 565200-E&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 413 Im F2V<BR>Lishun 1609&nbsp; &nbsp; Giike Ruz&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 360224-F C&nbsp; &nbsp; Lo Ni De <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; 912 Im F4D M4D<BR>Massilia 0434&nbsp; &nbsp; Rigold&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 264000-E&nbsp; &nbsp; Ni Ba Lo&nbsp; &nbsp; 413 Im M1D<BR>Massilia 0736&nbsp; &nbsp; Block&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 561101-E N&nbsp; &nbsp; Ni Lo&nbsp; &nbsp; 800 Im F2V<BR>Old Expanses 1922&nbsp; &nbsp; Cupprio&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 665200-B&nbsp; &nbsp; Lo Ni&nbsp; &nbsp; 514 Im K1V<BR>Zarushagaar 0607&nbsp; &nbsp; Ophiucus&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 465220-F <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; 402 Im F7V<BR>Zarushagaar 0909&nbsp; &nbsp; Mailbelle&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 465220-F N <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; 730 Im K5V<BR>Zarushagaar 1116&nbsp; &nbsp; Odew&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 667253-F&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 102 Im G9V M5D<BR>Zarushagaar 1223&nbsp; &nbsp; Bell&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 465220-F S&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 203 Im F7D M2D<BR>Zarushagaar 1411&nbsp; &nbsp; Niver&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 465220-D&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 402 Im F8VI<BR>Zarushagaar 1511&nbsp; &nbsp; Ypse&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 465220-F N&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 601 Im G6V<BR>Zarushagaar 1709&nbsp; &nbsp; Seadreamer&nbsp; &nbsp; A 465220-D&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 304 Im F1V<BR>Zarushagaar 2207&nbsp; &nbsp; Wattyf&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 465220-F&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 503 Im G4VI<BR>Zarushagaar 2831&nbsp; &nbsp; Strom&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 667253-D&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 810 Im F8VI<BR>Zarushagaar 2918&nbsp; &nbsp; Sheldon&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 425220-F N&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 214 Im M0V<BR>Zarushagaar 3117&nbsp; &nbsp; Malla&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; A 465220-E&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 825 Im F5VI M8D<BR><BR>On life-bearing worlds i can come up with 28 different reasons to <BR>keep people off the planet.<BR><BR>&gt;Of course, this does get back to the question of why such a situation<BR>&gt;might be stable.&nbsp; Surely *someone* wants to live on the planet, and it<BR>&gt;doesn't take many centuries before their descendants turn it into Yet<BR>&gt;Another Pop-9 World if there isn't a good reason why not.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I mean even at only 3% growth/year, it's only about 4 centuries<BR>&gt;between pop-3 and pop-9.&nbsp; I don't see why a millennia-long birth/death<BR>&gt;ratio of 1.00 is so much more likely than 0.99 (extinction) or 1.01<BR>&gt;(filling the planet) unless explicit measures are taken to keep it<BR>&gt;that way.&nbsp; If there are such explicit measures, why are they nowhere<BR>&gt;mentioned?<BR><BR>Perfectly logical. Remember, though, that the world generation system <BR>is random with a very small degree of internal modification.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Personally, i would expect regions of fairly uniform TL. As i said<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; earlier in this thread, the world generation system takes no account<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; of neighbouring systems.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I'm not so sure.&nbsp; It would make sense, I agree.&nbsp; I would expect<BR>&gt;frontier areas to have less uniform TLs, but not for more than a<BR>&gt;hundred or two years at most.&nbsp; Sure, high-tech gods exploiting<BR>&gt;low-tech natives is a feasible explanation in the short term, but not<BR>&gt;over centuries to millennia.<BR><BR>I meant regions centered on HiPop worlds with tech close to the local <BR>HiPop world. There will be exceptional areas of course.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:53:47 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Query: The Githiaskio<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;What if anything happened to the Githiaskio (JTAS 16) in MT, TNE, T4 or G:T?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I made a mention of them in GF, they "man" the Marine Force's 12th Special<BR>&gt;Assault Group.&nbsp; (sidebar, page 6.)<BR><BR>Cool!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:56:40 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>&gt;For some reason I'm picturing customs officials on the way out of <BR>&gt;the system saying "Are you sure you wouldn't like a tinkle break <BR>&gt;before you leave, sirs? No, really, we insist."<BR><BR>As a customs officer i have stood in the cubicle with people under <BR>custody while they use the facilities. I wasn't measuring their water <BR>output though. 8^)<BR><BR>Or how about that planet in the Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy <BR>where they weigh you on arrival and departure and surgically remove <BR>any excess mass at departure. 8^0<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yh05.mx.aol.com (rly-yh05.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.37]) by air-yh03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:59:46 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yh05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:59:13 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id PAA19278;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:58:08 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:56:52 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id PAA19205<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:56:52 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:56:52 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101222056.PAA19205@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3549</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/22/01 4:08:52 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Monday, January 22 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3549<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>FS Jetpack under development<BR>RE: Water merchants<BR>Re: FS Jetpack under development<BR>Tech level stuff<BR>Re: Scary thoughts....<BR>Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>RE: FS Jetpack under development<BR>Re: Allegiance codes<BR>Fusion Plus &lt;spit&gt; [was Starports and tech levels]<BR>Re: Scary thoughts....<BR>Inspectors for Imperial Rules of War<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR>RE: BITS Adventure?<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR>Re: Two Questions...<BR>Re: Mysterious black tar heroin appears in Seattle park<BR>Re: FS Jetpack under development<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Query: The Githiaskio<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 22:15:16 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: FS Jetpack under development<BR><BR>A scout team recently managed to stumble onto a secret testing ground<BR>used by the FS high-speed technology department. They got away with the<BR>following photo of a test run of a new personal jet pack:<BR><BR>http://www.heise.de/ct/motive/00/04a/p800.jpg<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:14:44 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Water merchants<BR><BR>Well personally i think water can be a viable export. i see no reason why<BR>tankers can not and should not be developed. might import water to help<BR>supplement "moister evaporators" (aka starwars in fact i think that is what<BR>uncle owen farmed was water). also since water can be a commodity going to a<BR>water world might have restrictions or even fines of skimming water for<BR>fuel. lets face it governments love to tax things and if they can find any<BR>half baked reason they will tax it 8P<BR><BR>For simplicity of the first adventure for both me and them their landing tax<BR>was just 100 cr. Lucky i did not charge by the ton 8P<BR><BR>&gt;Or how about that planet in the Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy <BR>&gt;where they weigh you on arrival and departure and surgically remove <BR>&gt;any excess mass at departure. 8^0<BR><BR>So what if you lose mass before departure? does that mean they have to<BR>surgically add mass to you?<BR><BR>&gt;=============================================<BR>&gt;"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>&gt;cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>&gt;without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>&gt;=============================================<BR><BR>any really well calculated (or maybe miscalculated) mis-jump will do the job<BR>nicely 8P<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:43:13 -0800<BR>From: "Dave Strebe" &lt;strebe@intergate.bc.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FS Jetpack under development<BR><BR>really some sort of 'SPLORK' rating/warning should have proceeded this.<BR>- ----- Original Message ----- <BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Monday, January 22, 2001 1:15 PM<BR>Subject: FS Jetpack under development<BR><BR><BR>&gt; A scout team recently managed to stumble onto a secret testing ground<BR>&gt; used by the FS high-speed technology department. They got away with the<BR>&gt; following photo of a test run of a new personal jet pack:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://www.heise.de/ct/motive/00/04a/p800.jpg<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; * Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>&gt; | jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>&gt; | ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>&gt; * http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:30:55 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Tech level stuff<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Yes, a lot of high TL stuff *will* get used. But until it can be<BR>&gt; &gt; *built* locally, it's always at the mercy of offworld merchants.<BR>&gt;Exactly. I've often made higher tech items available on lower tech planets<BR>&gt;in my campaigns, but at increased cost. The cost is dependant on the<BR>&gt;difference in TL, and the capacity and frequency of trade routes. When I was<BR>&gt;in Lagos, Lusaka and Harare, I saw contemporary European and Japanese<BR>&gt;electronics products for sale. The prices were such that you'd be very keen<BR>&gt;to think about buying them. In most cases it makes sense to personally<BR>&gt;import such goods, and sell them for profit when leaving.<BR><BR>Much fun can be had with this...<BR>For example <BR>http://spacevermin.homepage.com/FIC/TRAV/traveller_maintenace_blues.html<BR><BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>Opinions should be yours too! - http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>"What's a FAQ? Boy, I wish someone would put a list of answers<BR>for common questions such as this..."<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 10:34:31 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scary thoughts....<BR><BR>Subject: Scary thoughts....<BR><BR><BR>&gt; On alt.callahans, someone brought up the idea of Steve Irwin (the<BR>&gt; Aussie who is always seen with his face far to close to things like<BR>&gt; poisonous snakes) doing a show on Dune. "And here's how you get water<BR>&gt; of life from an immature sandworm..."<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; It occurs to me tha it'd be great fun having the PCs' ship chartered by<BR>&gt; someone like this. &lt;eg&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Leonard, we must be sharing a psychic link.&nbsp; I'm cuurently running a PC who<BR>based on "Croc Hunter". I call him Steve Corwin<BR>after Steve Irwin and a deranged American naturalist named Jeff Corwin, who<BR>has the interesting habit of stuffing his hand into holes and crevices to<BR>see what lives there. He's known as "Groat Hunter".<BR><BR>BTW, are groats canonical, and what exactly do the other members think of<BR>when referring to a groat.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 10:46:39 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re[2]: Vilani Psy-Ops... (land grab)<BR><BR>&gt; At 01:47 AM 1/13/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Eeew! That nasty plonk from up Napa? It can't even come close to an aged<BR>&gt; &gt;Rhone wine such as Chateauneuf du Pape or St. Joseph. Your soil tends to<BR>be<BR>&gt; &gt;too rich for the ultimate vines. You could (and probably do) grow some<BR>nice<BR>&gt; &gt;olives though. There may be a couple of decent cheeses produced in CA,<BR>but I<BR>&gt; &gt;suspect they'd be the ones that use foreign recipes. Are there any truly<BR>&gt; &gt;local fromage especiales?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Monterey Jack<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Doug, missed the original post, but I wouldn't hold up Chateauneuf du Pape<BR>as an example of a grand vin, more a triumph of marketing (a cool name) and<BR>an very cool bottle.<BR><BR>Interestingly, one of the finest brandies being made world wide comes from<BR>Yukiah CA.&nbsp; Germain Robin consistantly beats the great French brandies in<BR>blind tastings.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:41:10 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>&gt;Or how about that planet in the Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy<BR>&gt;where they weigh you on arrival and departure and surgically remove<BR>&gt;any excess mass at departure. 8^0<BR><BR>Actually -- and seriously -- I was thinking about reversing the situation <BR>from "The Moon Is Harsh Mistress": import water into the system as a <BR>side-effect of importing agricultural goods. As a planet, you specialize in <BR>computer chips or something to trade back. Over time, you'd build up quite a <BR>lake of the stuff after people are, um, "done" with their grapes and <BR>Christmas oranges.<BR><BR>Not sure if it would work though -- both in terms of sheer volume of goods <BR>you'd need to import to make it worthwhile, and because a lot of industrial <BR>processes use *a lot* of water....<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:36:27 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: FS Jetpack under development<BR><BR>Intelligence assessment:<BR><BR>1: Afterburning engines - possibly needs fine tuning of the fuel mixture -<BR>Could also be pre-autolean purge stage.<BR>2: Prototypical safety helmet - painted a rakish color of Red. Vuarnet-style<BR>eyewear.<BR>3: Quick jettison harness (Integrated Backbrace?).<BR>4: Rigid Ski Boots.<BR>5: High Speed, Low Drag skis.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm<BR>Sent: Monday, January 22, 2001 3:15 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: FS Jetpack under development<BR><BR>A scout team recently managed to stumble onto a secret testing ground<BR>used by the FS high-speed technology department. They got away with the<BR>following photo of a test run of a new personal jet pack:<BR><BR>http://www.heise.de/ct/motive/00/04a/p800.jpg<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:50:31 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Allegiance codes<BR><BR>&gt;Mike McKeown wrote:<BR>&gt;There is a file on the BARD pages? of freelance traveller that has all of<BR>&gt;them listed and the system that they are for ie TNE or MT...If its not there<BR>&gt;try altavista or google.com search engines and type in allegiance codes and<BR>&gt;traveller that's how I found the file..<BR><BR>Thanks. I found it at http://www.downport.com/hiwg/archive.html at <BR>the bottom of the page under "Misc."<BR><BR>TTYL<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:54:55 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Fusion Plus &lt;spit&gt; [was Starports and tech levels]<BR><BR>&gt;Michael Duamen wrote:<BR>&gt;Based on the rate of tech level change in the period starting with Year 0,<BR>&gt;the<BR>&gt;Imperium has advanced at a very slow pace.&nbsp; It was fusion-plus that gave<BR>&gt;Sylea a<BR>&gt;crucial edge over its neighbors; has there been anything comparable since<BR>&gt;then?<BR>&gt;Certainly there have been low-pop societies that have managed to outstrip<BR>&gt;the<BR>&gt;Imperial average rate of change.<BR><BR>Fusion-plus doesn't exist in most incarnations of Traveller whereas <BR>the Imperium does. Personally i think it was sheer bloody mindedness <BR>and a hefty bribe to the game authors that gave Sylea the edge.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:55:18 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scary thoughts....<BR><BR>&gt;BTW, are groats canonical, and what exactly do the other members think of <BR>&gt;when referring to a groat.<BR><BR>And anyone who says "Victoria's Secret Lingerie" is in trouble.<BR><BR>They're canonical. From p. 142 of "The Traveller Adventure":<BR><BR>"Groat: Herbivore native to Fulacin in the Rhylanor subsector."<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:08:13 +0100<BR>From: anders.backman@aniware.se (Anders Backman)<BR>Subject: Inspectors for Imperial Rules of War<BR><BR>&gt;The key phrases here are "Imperial Rules of War" and "excessive<BR>&gt;extra-planetary influence". Basically, IMO once a conflict is declared, then<BR>&gt;each of the belligerents is going to have to declare what assistance they<BR>&gt;are receiving to the Imperial Representitive. If the Imperial Representitive<BR>&gt;is doing their job, they should warn the belligerents once they are<BR>&gt;beginning to float close to the edge of the rules.<BR><BR>And who, actually, is checking that these conflicts comply to the Imperial<BR>Rules of War IRW)? Either some kind of Diplomatic figures entirely civilian<BR>or maybe some IISS guys? The Navy, Army, Marines can NOT do the job<BR>properly IMHO.<BR>There are lots of adventure possibilities here:<BR><BR>"Lone second noble son examines war atrocity and must flee from angry<BR>army+mercenaries to report to nearest scoutbase"<BR><BR>"Brutal, evil PC mercs must babysit softfooted ignorant noble investigator<BR>during a shooting war"<BR><BR>"The crooked IRW inspectors is bribed by the opposition so that anything<BR>goes in their behaviour but anything the PCs do may lead to court martial."<BR><BR>For all refs and players that don't military campaigns (too much<BR>bookkeeping, to little importance on PC action (if realistic) and way too<BR>likely killing the PCs by random artillery etc) but still like to use them<BR>as backdrops.<BR><BR>The Dorsai trilogy by Gordon Dickson had some kind of mercenary inspectors<BR>(in purple cloaks if I remember correctly) that fit the bill.<BR><BR>- --<BR>/Anders Backman<BR>Game developer at Aniware AB<BR>http://www.agharta.nu/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 17:14:00 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Why is water not a more common cargo for interstellar trade?&nbsp; It is<BR>&gt; &gt; crucial to life, convertible into fuel, efficient as a shield against<BR>&gt; &gt; cosmic radiation, and does not exist in many star systems.<BR><BR>&gt; But water *does* exist in just about every star system.&nbsp; In the outer<BR>&gt; star system, where it's cold, water is plentiful, in the form of comets<BR>&gt; and various other rock-and-ice bodies, like the moons of gas giants.<BR>&gt; Water is, furthermore, very easy to recycle, so even if a world (or,<BR>&gt; more plausibly, a sealed habitat of some kind) has to import enough<BR>&gt; water to get started, it probably won't have to import any more.<BR>&gt;<BR>Never saw Ice Pirates, don't really remember V.&nbsp; I agree that hydrogen is<BR>plentiful, but can we be so sure about water?&nbsp; How many hydrographic-zero<BR>worlds are there in systems lacking planetoid belts?&nbsp; Plus the tech level<BR>for water recycling is prob. A, higher for manufacturing it.&nbsp; And then you<BR>need energy and oxygen, which are presumably in lesser supply.<BR><BR>I bet it is still cheaper to haul the stuff around certain system (that's<BR>what is done with gas giants, right?), and perhaps in just the right<BR>subsector.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 15:54:04 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: BITS Adventure?<BR><BR>At 18:01 -0500 19/1/01, Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Hi, I was just rereading last years christmas special, Star Worn, and<BR>&gt;noticed something I didnt see before: A new Bits Adventure called<BR>&gt;"Delta 3 is down"...<BR>&gt;Since I never heard of it before on this list, id like to inquire<BR>&gt;whats up with that ;-)<BR><BR>And then "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt; replied:<BR><BR>&gt;It's basically, umm.....waiting for me to finish the cover &lt;sheepish grin&gt;.<BR>&gt;It woulda' been in print already if I'd have finished the cover when BITS<BR>&gt;origianlly wanted it!<BR><BR>Jesse, I've never said that publicly ;-)&nbsp; It would have been out at <BR>Dragonmeet 2000 (late Nov) but Jesse's been tied up doing all that <BR>gorgeous art he does for SJG (and they pay better than us). And he <BR>tried to set himself on fire.....<BR><BR><BR>_Delta 3 is Down_ is an adventure set in the Spinward Marches. The <BR>players are the crew of a Zhodani courier, carrying important <BR>military plans. This doesn't end up where it shouldn't be. Oh no. And <BR>it definitely doesn't end up anywhere near the criminally insane <BR>gunwielding twisted loons across the border from the Driantia <BR>Zhdantia.<BR><BR>It was a tournament adventure in 1999, and will include details on an <BR>Imperial border system and some starship deckplans like SpaceDogs did.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 14:38:27 -0800<BR>From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>&gt; ...<BR>&gt; &gt;I mean even at only 3% growth/year, it's only about 4 centuries<BR>&gt; &gt;between pop-3 and pop-9.&nbsp; I don't see why a millennia-long<BR>&gt; &gt;birth/death ratio of 1.00 is so much more likely than 0.99<BR>&gt; &gt;(extinction) or 1.01 (filling the planet) unless explicit measures<BR>&gt; &gt;are taken to keep it that way.&nbsp; If there are such explicit measures,<BR>&gt; &gt;why are they nowhere mentioned?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; 3% growth/year is pretty impressive, and unless it's immigration-<BR>&gt; driven it's not likely going to do much for capital per head.<BR><BR>Very true.&nbsp; Also, if our world is any indication, high tech results in <BR>drastically lower population growth. Almost every first world nation <BR>is now in negative population growth.&nbsp; The population of the US is <BR>still growing (albeit slowly), but solely because of immigration. The <BR>population of most of Western Europe and of Japan are actually <BR>declining (slowly for the moment, but the trend is clear).<BR><BR>It actually makes sense that much of the Imperium would not have <BR>had significant population growth since the Long Night.&nbsp; The First <BR>World's combination of easily available contraception (which [like <BR>most easily used moderate to high tech medicines] I believe would <BR>be a very popular import for many lower tech worlds) and children <BR>no longer having any real economic value has removed the desire <BR>most people have for large families and the desire many people <BR>have more any or more than one child.&nbsp; <BR><BR>I don't see any reason to believe that this would be different for <BR>most of the Imperium.&nbsp; The only question at that point would be <BR>why there are so many worlds with 10s of billions of inhabitants <BR>and why more of them don't move to less crowded worlds.<BR><BR>- -John Snead sneadj@mindspring.com&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 17:39:49 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR><BR>&gt;Never saw Ice Pirates, don't really remember V.&nbsp; I agree that hydrogen is <BR>&gt;plentiful, but can we be so sure about water?<BR><BR>Oxygen is also plentiful, so yeah, we're sure. Once you get outside the <BR>orbit of Mars, out where water can freeze, the solar system is lousy with <BR>the results of puttin glots of hydrogen and oxygen together. There's no <BR>reason to believe that our system is unusual, so it's a pretty good guess <BR>that other systems are lousy with it too. I can't think of a reasonable <BR>natural mechanism for getting rid of it all either.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 22:36:41 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Two Questions...<BR><BR>At 05:22 -0500 21/1/01, Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;First, since I am new to this whole RPG thing, can you suggest some on-line<BR>&gt; &gt;retailers (US)?<BR>&gt;Not U.S., but North American<BR>&gt;http://www.sentrybox.com<BR><BR>http://www.warehouse23.com/<BR><BR>You can get the BITS Traveller stuff there.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 22:38:59 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Mysterious black tar heroin appears in Seattle park<BR><BR>At 05:22 -0500 21/1/01,&nbsp; Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;on 20/1/01 9:02 pm, Chris Seamans at semo@pil.net wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; That much data could be synthesized and analyzed by<BR>&gt; &gt; pretty much anybody who has slept through a couple of Soc 101 lectures.<BR>&gt;Why would you sleep through lectures about the upcoming BITS product "101<BR>&gt;Societies"?<BR><BR>Huh?!<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 14:58:48 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FS Jetpack under development<BR><BR>Is this your magnum "Opus."<BR><BR>[For the rest of you, this is a Bloom County reference]<BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 14:59:57 -0800<BR>From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>"John G. Wood" &lt;elvwood@ntlworld.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Over breeding, for example, is a result of old rules coupled with<BR>&gt; &gt; new technology.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; A perfect example. If controlling population by preventing new births<BR>&gt; had been seen as more important than new ways of killing the<BR>&gt; neighbours - - or even if it had been given the same priority as<BR>&gt; saving people's lives - how soon would we have had reliable<BR>&gt; contraception? And if children had been seen as men's responsibility<BR>&gt; rather than women's, would we now be using male pills?<BR><BR>Except that archaic attitudes are not most of the problem.&nbsp; As I <BR>stated in&nbsp; previous post, the first world is largely below <BR>replacement, and eliminating immigration, no First World nations <BR>are more than a fraction above replacement level (references <BR>available if you are interested).<BR><BR>The problem is that in much of the 3rd world, the lack of social <BR>support networks, combined with the use of children as cheap <BR>agricultural labor means that having large families is an economic <BR>good for most people in such places. The problem is not "the dead <BR>hand of tradition" but present day economic realities.&nbsp; As the <BR>various nations develop their population growth declines rapidly. <BR><BR>IMHO, that's one of the primary reasons First World nations should <BR>finance development efforts.&nbsp; W/o them, the third world will become <BR>*really* ugly in a few decades, and such problems can easily <BR>spread, since nations like the US and France have been quite <BR>happy to sell some of those nations advanced weapons. Change <BR>the economics and the traditions will change in a generation or <BR>less.&nbsp; The history of the 20th century proves this quite well. <BR><BR><BR>- -John Snead sneadj@mindspring.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:06:44 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Why not? Time has passed. Have they used none of this time to train<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&nbsp; themselves to maintain the equipment? You said it was non-frivolous<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&nbsp; stuff that formed the backbone of a real infrastructure, including<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&nbsp; manufacturing. Why wouldn't they buy and install that portion of the<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&nbsp; infrastructure related to maintenance? Why don't they import the<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&nbsp; ability (material and intellectual) to maintain their new toys? They<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&nbsp; sound quite sensible otherwise.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Simple. Consider that say, Zaire, can import cell phones. But they<BR>&gt;&gt;*can't* repair them.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Why not? This doesn't answer the above question as to /why/ Zaire is <BR>&gt; capable of importing cell phones but not the knowledge and <BR>&gt; infrastructure to repair them. FWIW i think there is an answer, but <BR>&gt; not the one various people have been intimating - see below.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;The cell sites can have modules swapped in and<BR>&gt;&gt;out, but the modules aren't repairable either.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Why not?<BR><BR>The answer to both the above is "because they aren't *designed* to be<BR>repaired". It costs more in terms of technician time to repair a cell<BR>phone than it does to purchase a new one. And the parts are essentially<BR>unobtainble anyway. <BR><BR>Heck, if you've got the right sort of small screwdrivers around, open<BR>up a modern calculator, or a remote control. You'll find a circuit<BR>board, a chip, the emitter or display module, and some cute conductive<BR>rubber pads on the back of the keys. That's *it*. There's nothing *to*<BR>repair. <BR><BR>&gt;&gt;To be able to maintain such WITHOUT IMPORTED PARTS requires facilities<BR>&gt;&gt;that their local economy *can't* support. It takes a fair sized set of<BR>&gt;&gt;chemical plants just to produce the hyperpure silicon, and the<BR>&gt;&gt;materials used in processing it.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; [snip]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Ah ha! A reasonable answer.<BR><BR>Well, duh! &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;And there just plain aren't enough *people* to do all that *and* produce<BR>&gt;&gt;food and keep the economy going. Nor enough money to pay for it.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Yes, i agree with you here. It takes a certain minimum number of <BR>&gt; people to support a technological economy. Seems reasonable. In <BR>&gt; general, it seems likely that higher tech levels will have higher <BR>&gt; minimum necessary populations. However,above a certain tech level, <BR>&gt; robots and other automation will reduce the number of people <BR>&gt; necessary.<BR><BR>True, but it still takes an *enormous* investment to get the factories<BR>and robots *built*.<BR><BR>&gt; Let's be very generous and say that it only requires a <BR>&gt; population of more then one million to support any tech level of 5 or <BR>&gt; above.<BR><BR>Actually, you can support a lot with a small relatively population *if*<BR>you are very selective about the tech you decide to support.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;[snip]<BR>&gt;&gt;As I noted, if you are going for a planned advance from their current<BR>&gt;&gt;TL to a higher one, and don't want to make them *totally* dependent* on<BR>&gt;&gt;offworld parts and supplies, you *do* have to go one step at a time.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;But you can (and should) skip some steps. For example, the internal<BR>&gt;&gt;combustion engine is best skipped. Steam engines *can* be built that'll<BR>&gt;&gt;do the job *and* both use less fuel and produce less pollution. And<BR>&gt;&gt;electrics are likely workable as well.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Summary - you must go one step at a time except when you skip steps. <BR>&gt; Not very helpful 8^)<BR><BR>Well, the problem is that after TL 8, we don't have the data required<BR>to tell us what can be skipped.<BR><BR>Some stuff on the TL tables isn't really advances, in the sense we are<BR>interested in here. <BR><BR>And you have to keep in mind that a lot of "advances" *are* possible at<BR>"lower" TLs, because all that's required is *knowledge*, not<BR>infrastructure. <BR><BR>An example I've used is that you could show the *Romans* how to build<BR>crude radios. A crystal set receiver is well within their capabilities.<BR>And so are spark gap transmitters. For that matter, they might even be<BR>able to build *alternator* type transmitters (yes, before tubes got<BR>very common, they used alternators running at the proper frequency, as<BR>transmitters!) <BR><BR>&gt; FWIW i agree with your second statement, some steps should and can be <BR>&gt; skipped. Why build an unsustainable internal combustion engine <BR>&gt; infrastructure just so you can abandon it for an unsustainable CG <BR>&gt; infrastructure?<BR><BR>Right.<BR><BR>&gt; In the case of an outside power raising a world's tech level, smaller <BR>&gt; populations are much easier to raise quickly but small populations <BR>&gt; cannot maintain high tech levels independent of stellar society.<BR><BR>Depends on the technology. See my comments about Roman radios above. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:02:44 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Query: The Githiaskio<BR><BR>On Mon, 22 Jan 2001 01:52:58 -0500 (EST), Gordon Horne<BR>&lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;What if anything happened to the Githiaskio (JTAS 16) in MT, TNE, T4 or G:T?<BR><BR>Good question.&nbsp; Since nothing is listed that I'm aware of, why not tell us?<BR><BR>&gt;For that matter, what happened to any of the minor races introduced <BR>&gt;in Contact articles? Could we compile a list?<BR><BR>Well, I won't answer the "what happened" question, but herewith the aliens<BR>I remember seeing CONTACT or equivalent for, except for those that later<BR>got full-fledged Alien Modules.&nbsp; Unfortunately, I don't remember what<BR>issues of what magazines they appeared in...<BR><BR>Dynchia (Human minor race)<BR>Jgd-Il-Jagd (Gas-giant floater creatures)<BR>Prrt (Felinoids, both similarities to and differences from Aslan)<BR>Newts/Bwaps (Salamanderoids)<BR>Githiaskio (Squidoids)<BR><BR>Any others, I'd have to rummage for...<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 11:09:37 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Ian Ferguson wrote:<BR>&gt; UWP population digit (there are typically ten times as<BR>&gt; many personel from a pop 10 world as from a pop 1 world).<BR><BR>That's an extremely small number of people in Imperial service!<BR><BR>There are only about 400 worlds with pop-1.&nbsp; Each such world could<BR>supply at most about 10 people (assuming such worlds are largely<BR>staffed by Imperial servicebeings), so there are at most only about<BR>200,000 in Imperial service across the entire Imperium, or about 20<BR>per world.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; The Imperial Navy is still dominated by citizens of the hi-<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; pop worlds, but there are lots of Heyan farm-boy types as<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; well.<BR><BR>The problem is that there are *massively* more people on high-pop<BR>worlds than on low-pop ones.&nbsp; The entire population of *all* worlds<BR>under Pop-8 would constitute a *single* pop-A world (of which there<BR>are over 200).&nbsp; If you consider "low pop" to be "under a million", the<BR>proportion of low-pop citizens in about 1 in 20 000.<BR><BR>You'd have to stretch pretty far to make low-pop people a significant<BR>proportion of *anything*, Imperium-wide.&nbsp; This is not simply a<BR>"city/country" sort of split that you'd find on Earth.&nbsp; More people<BR>are born on high-pop worlds every *day* than a whole *generation* on<BR>low-pop worlds.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3549<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xd05.mx.aol.com (rly-xd05.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.170]) by air-xd01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:08:52 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xd05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:08:14 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id TAA27194;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:07:06 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:06:59 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id TAA27147<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:06:59 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:06:59 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101230006.TAA27147@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3549<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3550</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/22/01 5:39:23 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Monday, January 22 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3550<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Now I've gone and done it!<BR>Re: CANCON<BR>Re: FS Jetpack under development<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Inspectors for Imperial Rules of War<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR>RE: Water merchants<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>EnviroTech [was: Starports and tech levels]<BR>RE: FS Jetpack under development<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>RE: BITS Adventure?<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 11:13:26 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;ObTrav: A lot of worlds IMTU have higher environmental tech than their<BR>&gt; &gt;UWP rating, because they need it to survive and it is therefore a<BR>&gt; &gt;priority. With millennia of settlement on non-Earthlike worlds I can see<BR>&gt; &gt;this being a common attitude.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; That's a good idea, but it adds another item to the list of things <BR>&gt; the UWP tech code is not. Weren't you inspired by impossible worlds <BR>&gt; to be creative? According to the rules, you were supposed to be 8^) <BR>&gt; You still run into the problem that the infrastructure to support a <BR>&gt; high environmental tech locally requires a larger population than <BR>&gt; many worlds which need it have.<BR><BR>I'm not so certain about that.&nbsp; Environmental tech is likely to be one<BR>of those things that is largely self-sustaining.&nbsp; After all, that's<BR>basically it's *purpose*.<BR><BR>Besides, high-tech things that are absolutely essential to survival<BR>are likely to have a lot more resources devoted to maintenance<BR>structure than things like televisions that are merely convenient.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:19:34 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Timothy Little writes:<BR><BR>&gt; The problem is that there are *massively* more people on high-pop<BR>&gt; worlds than on low-pop ones.&nbsp; The entire population of *all* worlds<BR>&gt; under Pop-8 would constitute a *single* pop-A world (of which there<BR>&gt; are over 200).&nbsp; If you consider "low pop" to be "under a million", the<BR>&gt; proportion of low-pop citizens in about 1 in 20 000.<BR><BR>This is one reason I've considered redefining the population digit as follows:<BR>0:&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;30 thousand<BR>1:&nbsp; &nbsp; 30-100 thousand<BR>2:&nbsp;&nbsp; 100-300 thousand<BR>3:&nbsp;&nbsp; 0.3-1 million<BR>4:&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1-3 million<BR>5:&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 3-10 million<BR>6:&nbsp; &nbsp; 10-30 million<BR>7:&nbsp; &nbsp; 30-100 million<BR>8:&nbsp;&nbsp; 100-300 million<BR>9:&nbsp;&nbsp; 0.3-1 billion<BR>A:&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1-3 billion<BR><BR>Of course, this results in modern earth being pop-B, but its still overall a<BR>more sensible population distribution.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 11:31:26 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt; I have never heard a convincing in game answer. IMTU space habitats<BR>&gt; are ubiquitous.<BR><BR>I haven't yet made a decision on that IMTU.&nbsp; The near-absence of space<BR>habitats in published material is undesirable to me, but how many do I<BR>want?&nbsp; Enough that the population of planets pales in comparison?<BR>They have had thousands of years to develop them, after all.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt;I'd just say the planet is what is described by the UWP, the *real*<BR>&gt; &gt;action is in space.<BR>[...]<BR>&gt; It creates two new problems: the rules state that the main world<BR>&gt; (the systems UWP) is the most important world in the system;<BR><BR>It *is* the "most important world".&nbsp; No other world is more important.<BR>It's just that there are 100 times as many people living on 1200<BR>different non-worlds in the system :)<BR><BR>&gt; some of these planets are quite nice, why are the people living in<BR>&gt; space rather than on the surface (instead of just as well as on the<BR>&gt; surface)? Actually, given my distaste for garden worlds that are<BR>&gt; "just like home" i could come up with lots of different fun<BR>&gt; solutions to that last problem. 8^)<BR><BR>Yes, so could I.&nbsp; I also have the same dislike for "just like home".<BR><BR>The big problem is trying to decide just how much of the Imperium's<BR>population lives in space, compared to those living on dirtballs.&nbsp; If<BR>the UWPs reflect only planetary population and that being only a small<BR>fraction of the total, the UWPs start to look a lot less relevant.<BR>Likewise for technology.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; On life-bearing worlds i can come up with 28 different reasons to <BR>&gt; keep people off the planet.<BR><BR>I take it your "28" is a placeholder for "any number of very good<BR>reasons"?&nbsp; :)<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Perfectly logical. Remember, though, that the world generation system <BR>&gt; is random with a very small degree of internal modification.<BR><BR>Very true.&nbsp; We are probably trying to work backwards from a result<BR>that was never intended to survive such scrutiny.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:28:38 -0500<BR>From: "Robert A. Smith II" &lt;rsmith@rasinsurance.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Now I've gone and done it!<BR><BR>My players just presented me with a major turning point in my Traveller<BR>campaign and I could use some input from the TML peanut gallery on where to<BR>go from here.&nbsp; I should start with a little background on MTU, which<BR>diverges significantly from the OTU.<BR><BR>It is currently early in year 1111 and the FFW is still raging in the<BR>Marches.&nbsp; The Solomani Rim is an autonomous region.&nbsp; Psionics are controlled<BR>by PsiCorp, which originated in the Rim (of course).&nbsp; Rejuv, ala Elizabeth<BR>Moon's Familias Space, replaced the anagagthics of Traveller.&nbsp; The only<BR>other major difference from OT is black crystal communications ala Anne<BR>McCaffrey's Crystal Singers series--although the only systems that have sets<BR>currently are capital, rich and some high population worlds in the Imperium,<BR>it's client states and the Darrian Confederation.<BR><BR>Here's where it get's interesting.&nbsp; One of the player character's recognized<BR>another as a dead ringer for his aunt, the duchess of the Vilani world where<BR>the rejuv treatment was developed.&nbsp; His father was the duke until a scandal<BR>(which the PC never learned the details of) caused him to be ousted and his<BR>sister (the PC's aunt) to become the duchess.&nbsp; He made a big stink about the<BR>other PC being his aunt, which caused the party to perform genetic tests of<BR>them both.&nbsp; The tests proved that they were related.&nbsp; It also proved that<BR>they were both clones.&nbsp; What was not revealed to the rest of the party is<BR>that the party's geneticist did further testing that proved the DNA clone<BR>tags in her DNA were artificial (she's the original, not the clone).<BR><BR>The nephew ponied up the credits to contact his father over the black<BR>crystal network and spilled the story about the other PC being a clone of<BR>his aunt. Shortly after this, the party took a HumInt contract with the<BR>Darrians and are currently undercover in the Sword Worlds with the Merchants<BR>of the party posing as blockade runners in order to carry information back<BR>to the Darrians.&nbsp; Since then Mariel, the alleged clone, has received a<BR>cordial order to appear at Regina for an investigation into the matter of<BR>her being a clone.&nbsp; Mariel and another PC are posing as a married couple and<BR>she has become pregnant, with twins.<BR><BR>Here's where it gets messy.&nbsp; Mariel was raised as a Darrian in the<BR>Confederation.&nbsp; She is psionic and as a Darrian citizen is not subject to<BR>the PsiCorp laws.&nbsp; The PC posing as her husband has turned out to be a<BR>latent psionic and the twins appear to be potentially strong psis. She is<BR>actually the real duchess, but was never told this fact.&nbsp; The party has<BR>uncovered the truth of the situation including the details of the plot that<BR>replaced her with a clone and saw the duke ousted from power.<BR><BR>If I haven't lost you yet, here's the dilemma.&nbsp; When all of this comes to<BR>light it will cause a *major* scandal among the nobles--no big deal.&nbsp; Most<BR>likely, the current duchess will be removed and Mariel will take her<BR>rightful place.&nbsp; The dilemma is PsiCorp.&nbsp; As a citizen of the Imperium, she<BR>and her children will be subject to PsiCorp.&nbsp; She won't have anything to do<BR>with PsiCorp.<BR><BR>Also, she has no desire to be the duchess and is planning on offering to<BR>keep her mouth shut about the scandal if the nobility will allow her to<BR>continue with her life as it is.&nbsp; The problem with this plan is that there<BR>is a Psi Cop among the crew and he knows the sitch.&nbsp; PsiCorp would also be<BR>*very* anxious to get their hands on her children for their eugenics program<BR>and would be willing to blow this whole thing wide open.<BR><BR>The way I see it if the nobility takes her offer, PsiCorp will make sure the<BR>coverup is leaked.&nbsp; If the nobles then stand by her, the Solomoni<BR>Confederation will seceed from the Imperium in a major civil war.<BR><BR>OTOH, she has considered going to the Darrian Order of Zar Tis to keep her<BR>children out of the hands of PsiCorp.&nbsp; If she were to take this tack, I see<BR>the Imperium putting pressure on the Darrians which would possibly push them<BR>into joining the Zhos and turning the FFW into a psi-war ala Babylon 5.<BR><BR>I didn't mean for this to be so long...Do y'all see any other possible<BR>permutations to the political consequences?<BR><BR>Angus<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 11:16:16 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: CANCON<BR><BR>Dear Jeff -<BR><BR>You asked:<BR>&gt;...are there any Traveller or&nbsp; Nephilim events happening?<BR><BR>Last time I looked, no Traveller but I'm not sure about Nephilim.<BR><BR>Try looking at their home page:<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http://usrwww.mpx.com.au/~cgs/cancon.htm<BR><BR>and navigate to CANCON 2001.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:34:29 -0500<BR>From: "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FS Jetpack under development<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 22:15:16 +0100<BR>&gt;From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: FS Jetpack under development<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;A scout team recently managed to stumble onto a secret testing ground<BR>&gt;used by the FS high-speed technology department. They got away with the<BR>&gt;following photo of a test run of a new personal jet pack:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;http://www.heise.de/ct/motive/00/04a/p800.jpg<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>&gt;| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>&gt;| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>&gt;* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR><BR>LOL!&nbsp; WOnderful, thank you!&nbsp; Surely the scout team must be rewarded <BR>handsomely for&nbsp; this information!&nbsp; But is it an Emperor Penguin, or an <BR>Adelie? and do they have a version for Prrt? =)<BR><BR><BR>- ---<BR>==============================================================<BR>Jonathan McDermott, CNE/MCSE&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; NOSPAMcaraig@mindspring.com<BR>System Administrator&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http:\\caraig.home.mindspring.com<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Anubis@SpatialWastes -*- Caraig,Dermott@FurryMUCK<BR>IMTU tc+ tn t4 ge++ -3i+ c+(**) jt pi+ va+ dr+ pr+ zh+() so@<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; "Never trust a computer you can't throw out a window."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -Steve Wozniak<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 16:48:10 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>&gt;[snip]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt;I'd just say the planet is what is described by the UWP, the *real*<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &gt;action is in space.<BR>&gt;[...]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; It creates two new problems: the rules state that the main world<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; (the systems UWP) is the most important world in the system;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;It *is* the "most important world".&nbsp; No other world is more important.<BR>&gt;It's just that there are 100 times as many people living on 1200<BR>&gt;different non-worlds in the system :)<BR><BR>Those are awfully small space habitats. Some of the "problem worlds" <BR>we're talking about have fewer than one thousand inhabitants.<BR><BR>&gt;[snip]<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; On life-bearing worlds i can come up with 28 different reasons to<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; keep people off the planet.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I take it your "28" is a placeholder for "any number of very good<BR>&gt;reasons"?&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>There were 28 starport A, standard atmosphere, &lt; 1,000 inhabitants <BR>worlds in the list. If we were to include similar worlds with &lt; <BR>10,000 or less than 100,000 inhabitants i would need more excuses. 8^)<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; Perfectly logical. Remember, though, that the world generation system<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; is random with a very small degree of internal modification.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Very true.&nbsp; We are probably trying to work backwards from a result<BR>&gt;that was never intended to survive such scrutiny.<BR><BR>The fun part is trying to put the thing back together /after/ you've <BR>broken it 8^)<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:51:03 -0500<BR>From: "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Inspectors for Imperial Rules of War<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:08:13 +0100<BR>&gt;From: anders.backman@aniware.se (Anders Backman)<BR>&gt;Subject: Inspectors for Imperial Rules of War<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;And who, actually, is checking that these conflicts comply to the Imperial<BR>&gt;Rules of War IRW)? Either some kind of Diplomatic figures entirely civilian<BR>&gt;or maybe some IISS guys? The Navy, Army, Marines can NOT do the job<BR>&gt;properly IMHO.<BR>&gt;There are lots of adventure possibilities here:<BR><BR>&lt;snip *good* ideas&gt;<BR><BR>Well, as you say, it could very well be the job of second- and third-sons <BR>of nobles, the ones always sent off on fact-finding missions.&nbsp; IISS would <BR>be able to do this as well, with not only the regular courier/xboat <BR>services but also Grand Survey, and also dedicated teams.&nbsp; (Anyone here <BR>take as canon the concept of the Scout Rangers mentioned in a fairly recent <BR>JTAS? They'd probably be on top of any perceived IRW violation right <BR>quick.)&nbsp; Then again, the Imperial Marines are billed as the Party Poopers, <BR>so would they be keeping watch, or just drop in when the IISS or OCC <BR>notified the local Marine colonel about an IRW violation?<BR><BR>Keep in mind, too, that the IRWs are unwritten.&nbsp; They're tacit agreements <BR>as to what member-worlds can and can't do to one another, probably <BR>explained to the planetary leadership over snifters of brandy in the <BR>drawing room after the 'Welcome the Imperium' social function.<BR><BR>"You see -- oh, fine drink this is, by the way.&nbsp; You'll have an excellent <BR>market for it -- You see, the Imperium doesn't... *officially* tolerate war <BR>between members.&nbsp; Obviously, this is a bit hard to enforce everywhere, so <BR>- -- speaking unofficially, of course -- there are certain... limits that the <BR>Imperium tolerates between it's members.&nbsp; What's that?&nbsp; Oh, yes, Marquessa <BR>- -- I must say, the title suits you very well, oh, I know you're 'planetary <BR>president,' but to the Imperium.... oh, where was I?&nbsp; Ah, yes.&nbsp; Yes, <BR>Marquessa, I'm afraid that even though you and your dastardly neighbors one <BR>jump away, whom you've had ongoing hostilities with for the past century, <BR>may still very much conduct... er... occasional adventures against one <BR>another.&nbsp; Nothing that will destroy the customer base -- that is, the <BR>civilians, of course.&nbsp; Might I have another glass of that wonderful brandy, <BR>your Ladyship...?&nbsp; Oh, dear, you look rather stunned, perhaps you should <BR>have a glass as well...."<BR><BR>There's also the ever-present Office of Calendar Compliance, and whatever <BR>it mutated into in Milieu 1100.<BR><BR>Cheers<BR><BR><BR>- ---<BR>==============================================================<BR>Jonathan McDermott, CNE/MCSE&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; NOSPAMcaraig@mindspring.com<BR>System Administrator&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http:\\caraig.home.mindspring.com<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Anubis@SpatialWastes -*- Caraig,Dermott@FurryMUCK<BR>IMTU tc+ tn t4 ge++ -3i+ c+(**) jt pi+ va+ dr+ pr+ zh+() so@<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; "Never trust a computer you can't throw out a window."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -Steve Wozniak<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 11:58:37 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR><BR>Michael Daumen wrote:<BR>&gt; Never saw Ice Pirates, don't really remember V.&nbsp; I agree that<BR>&gt; hydrogen is plentiful, but can we be so sure about water?<BR><BR>Absolutely.&nbsp; Oxygen is one of the most common elements in the<BR>universe, after hydrogen and helium.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; How many hydrographic-zero worlds are there in systems lacking<BR>&gt; planetoid belts?<BR><BR>Sure, some planets lack hydrogen.&nbsp; If they also lack gas giants, you'd<BR>have to go further out, but you'd never have to leave the system to<BR>find hydrogen.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Plus the tech level for water recycling is prob. A, higher for<BR>&gt; manufacturing it.&nbsp; And then you need energy and oxygen, which are<BR>&gt; presumably in lesser supply.<BR><BR>Actually, energy is very plentiful.&nbsp; Oxygen is almost *too* plentiful<BR>on planets -- it's what prevents you from just going out and picking<BR>up a chunk of iron or aluminium metal.&nbsp; Smelting metals is the process<BR>of *removing* oxygen from the ore.<BR><BR>All you lack on a hydro-0 world is hydrogen (by no coincidence;<BR>"hydrogen" means "water-maker").<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 21:19:47 -0000<BR>From: "Mark Preston" &lt;mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Water merchants<BR><BR>We don't have a lot of planets to check at the moment, but in the<BR>solar system there is water on Venus (atmospheric), Earth (of course),<BR>Mars (sub-surface permafrost, polar ice and possibly sub-surface<BR>free-water), Saturn, Neptune and Uranus (though it hardly matters for<BR>gas giants) and four moons - two of which are thought to have<BR>sub-surface oceans (Europa and Titan).<BR><BR>Good odds for water being common.<BR><BR>- --<BR>Mark A. Preston, The Magpie's Nest, Lancashire, UK<BR>Email&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; : mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk<BR>Website : www.mpreston.demon.co.uk<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Douglas E. Berry<BR>&gt; Sent: 22 January 2001 08:05<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; At 08:35 AM 1/22/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Why is water not a more common cargo for interstellar trade?&nbsp; It is<BR>&gt; crucial to life, convertible into fuel, efficient as a<BR>&gt; shield against<BR>&gt; cosmic radiation, and does not exist in many star systems.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; It does not exist on many *planets*.&nbsp; I may be corrected,<BR>&gt; but water seems<BR>&gt; to be quite available in asteroids and out in the cometary<BR>&gt; clouds.&nbsp; Just<BR>&gt; grab a few billion gallons of ice cube, strap a maneuver<BR>&gt; drive to it,<BR>&gt; s/l/a/m i/t i/n/t/o t/h/e p/l/a/n/e/t...&nbsp; err, bring it<BR>&gt; into an appropriate<BR>&gt; orbit, and mine it for water.<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:16:24 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Anthony Jackson wrote:<BR>&gt; This is one reason I've considered redefining the population digit as follows:<BR>&gt; 0:&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;30 thousand<BR>&gt; 1:&nbsp; &nbsp; 30-100 thousand<BR>&gt; 2:&nbsp;&nbsp; 100-300 thousand<BR>&gt; 3:&nbsp;&nbsp; 0.3-1 million<BR>&gt; 4:&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1-3 million<BR>&gt; 5:&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 3-10 million<BR>&gt; 6:&nbsp; &nbsp; 10-30 million<BR>&gt; 7:&nbsp; &nbsp; 30-100 million<BR>&gt; 8:&nbsp;&nbsp; 100-300 million<BR>&gt; 9:&nbsp;&nbsp; 0.3-1 billion<BR>&gt; A:&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1-3 billion<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Of course, this results in modern earth being pop-B, but its still overall a<BR>&gt; more sensible population distribution.<BR><BR>I think I might just steal that.<BR><BR>I'd put it a couple of steps higher (A -&gt; 10-30 billion), but that's<BR>because I like the idea of the highest population worlds having more<BR>people than modern Earth -- it has a suitably "crowded worlds of the<BR>future" feel to it, with megacities and arcologies and such :)<BR><BR>Earth can sit squarely in pop-9.<BR><BR>I still don't know what to do about space-dwellers.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:21:40 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>On Mon, Jan 22, 2001 at 04:48:10PM -0800, Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt; Those are awfully small space habitats. Some of the "problem worlds" <BR>&gt; we're talking about have fewer than one thousand inhabitants.<BR><BR>Sure, you'd adjust the numbers for each world.&nbsp; I was just arbitrarily<BR>picking out numbers to demonstrate the concept that habitats could<BR>easily be more populous than planets, but don't count in any UWP<BR>because they aren't worlds.&nbsp; That would also explain why the only<BR>space habitats listed in UWPs are inhabited asteroids -- manmade<BR>bodies don't count.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt;I take it your "28" is a placeholder for "any number of very good<BR>&gt; &gt;reasons"?&nbsp; :)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; There were 28 starport A, standard atmosphere, &lt; 1,000 inhabitants <BR>&gt; worlds in the list.<BR><BR>Ah, I see now :)<BR><BR><BR>&gt; The fun part is trying to put the thing back together /after/ you've<BR>&gt; broken it 8^)<BR><BR>Yes.&nbsp; As you said, sometimes I could do with less fun.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 17:25:06 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: EnviroTech [was: Starports and tech levels]<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt;ObTrav: A lot of worlds IMTU have higher environmental tech than their<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &gt;UWP rating, because they need it to survive and it is therefore a<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &gt;priority. With millennia of settlement on non-Earthlike worlds I can see<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &gt;this being a common attitude.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; That's a good idea, but it adds another item to the list of things<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; the UWP tech code is not. Weren't you inspired by impossible worlds<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; to be creative? According to the rules, you were supposed to be 8^)<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; You still run into the problem that the infrastructure to support a<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; high environmental tech locally requires a larger population than<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; many worlds which need it have.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I'm not so certain about that.&nbsp; Environmental tech is likely to be one<BR>&gt;of those things that is largely self-sustaining.&nbsp; After all, that's<BR>&gt;basically it's *purpose*.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Besides, high-tech things that are absolutely essential to survival<BR>&gt;are likely to have a lot more resources devoted to maintenance<BR>&gt;structure than things like televisions that are merely convenient.<BR><BR>Unfortunately, smaller environmental systems tend to require more <BR>maintenance than larger when the top level is the same (supporting <BR>humans). Smaller systems also have less slop than larger and require <BR>more active control and more secondary support (emergency filters and <BR>reservoirs, stand-by pumps, etc...). A thousand person support system <BR>will use fewer resources than a million person system, but it will <BR>require relatively more resources, including relatively more labour. <BR>Larger systems are more stable.<BR><BR>As an aside, ship environmental systems are much less capable than <BR>settlement systems because of their relatively small size, if for no <BR>other reason. Ships would need to periodically "plug into" a larger <BR>environmental system to reset their systems. The number of ships a <BR>settlement system could support in a given period of time would be <BR>limited by the its own size. Small settlements in inhospitable <BR>settings would not want to see too many ships in a given period. <BR>Conversely, they would require a certain minimum number of visiting <BR>ships in a given period because their habitat was designed with the <BR>inputs in mind. The largest settlement environmental systems wouldn't <BR>care either way.<BR><BR>Size matters.<BR><BR>Antares 0834&nbsp; &nbsp; Kamkishu&nbsp; &nbsp; A 000123-C&nbsp; &nbsp; Lo Ni As&nbsp; &nbsp; 800 Im G4V<BR>Will require a relatively large environmental system in which humans <BR>are a minor component to support its 80-90 personnel indefinitely. <BR>Visiting ships might be strictly forbidden to inter-connect their <BR>environmental systems, or Kamkishu environment might be designed to <BR>accept a sudden exchange (waste in - oxygen, food and water out) with <BR>N ships every T time period with the internal between ships not to <BR>exceed dTmax or be less than dTmin.<BR><BR>Verge 2735&nbsp; &nbsp; Vienna&nbsp; &nbsp; C 000300-C&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 404 Im M8V M6D<BR>Sometimes the denizens of Verge will charge a visiting ship an <BR>exorbitant price to inter-connect environmental systems. Sometimes <BR>they will refuse all together. Sometimes they will refuse to let a <BR>visiting ship leave until they inter-connect environmental systems. <BR>The 4-5 thousand inhabitants live on the edge.<BR><BR>Massilia 1028&nbsp; &nbsp; Dreva&nbsp; &nbsp; E 30089D-7&nbsp; &nbsp; Va Na&nbsp; &nbsp; 610 Im F1V M6D<BR>If the 60-70 million inhabitants of Dreva all live in one large <BR>environmental system or an massively interconnected system, they <BR>won't notice the small amount of traffic likely to be attracted to <BR>their class E starport. If they live i numerous separate <BR>environmental habitats, or even minimally connected ones, how to <BR>distribute the load of a visiting ship would be an issue. Visiting <BR>ships might be refused inter-connection. this would be in keeping <BR>with the E starport rating. An E port probably indicates low traffic <BR>levels, and the Dreva environment is most likely designed with only <BR>its internal loads considered.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 17:29:06 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: FS Jetpack under development<BR><BR>ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!<BR><BR>Doug, I didn't know you were doing testing for FS.&nbsp; The SCANDAL!!!!&nbsp; ;)<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Jens 'Spacejens'<BR>&gt; Rydholm<BR>&gt; Sent: Monday, January 22, 2001 1:15 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: FS Jetpack under development<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; A scout team recently managed to stumble onto a secret testing ground<BR>&gt; used by the FS high-speed technology department. They got away with the<BR>&gt; following photo of a test run of a new personal jet pack:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; http://www.heise.de/ct/motive/00/04a/p800.jpg<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; * Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>&gt; | jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>&gt; | ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>&gt; * http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:11:53 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Phil replied to Gordon thus:<BR>&gt;&gt;the world generation system does<BR>&gt;&gt;not consider nearby worlds. The distribution of tech levels will be<BR>&gt;&gt;more or less random.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;This is not correct.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;There is plenty of evidence that, for example, the Spinward Marches<BR>&gt;and the Solomani Rim were *not* generated using the same system.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Unless Rim got very lucky on the dice rolls!<BR><BR>From memory of previous discussions, the Marches and Rim were hand-rolled.<BR><BR>The Marches used a generation system that was a precursor to the Book 6<BR>version, and there was extensive post-generation tweaking. This is obvious<BR>when you consider features such as the Spinward Main, the world placement<BR>and tech and pop distributions in the Sword Worlds, the Abyss Rift, the<BR>quarantining of the Consulate and SW's from the Imperial border (ie. the<BR>inherent choke-points in the system), the choice of subsector capitals, the<BR>xboat routes, etc etc.<BR><BR>The Rim used a modified generation system where the extremes were avoided,<BR>creating a more uniform distribution of worlds, especially in terms of tech<BR>levels. I believe they were also given a +1 to their Pop rolls, thus the<BR>abundance of Hi Pop worlds in the region. This is probably what contributes<BR>to the Rim having the highest amount of trade, according to the (much<BR>later) analysis and rules from _Far Trader_.<BR><BR>For interest, the Core world were given a +1 tech level modifier when they<BR>were created by DGP (ie. I mean the 1105 version, NOT the Milieu 0 version<BR>of Core).<BR><BR>After all, when Marc et al wrote up the sectors and created their initial<BR>"sketch map" of the Imperium and surrounds (the "Big Black Map"), who in<BR>their right mind would have thought that one day we would not only have the<BR>details of every single world in the Imperium, but also be able to<BR>calculate all the trade routes???<BR><BR>(Loren, Marc, feel free to add any comments of your own in here!)<BR><BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 17:38:26 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: BITS Adventure?<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;It's basically, umm.....waiting for me to finish the cover<BR>&gt; &lt;sheepish grin&gt;.<BR>&gt; &gt;It woulda' been in print already if I'd have finished the cover when BITS<BR>&gt; &gt;origianlly wanted it!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Jesse, I've never said that publicly ;-)<BR><BR><BR>*Publically* being the key word there ;)&nbsp; Saturday was a wash, but I was<BR>definately getting there on Sunday until LW crashed before I'd thought to<BR>save what I was doing.&nbsp; DOH!!!!&nbsp; I should know better than this!&nbsp; The worst<BR>example was when I was doing the Vanderbilt for G:T 2nd Ed.&nbsp; I was about 75%<BR>done with modeling the ship, hadn't saved it once, and LW crashed on me so I<BR>had to start over from scratch.&nbsp; Ugh!&nbsp; Remember you budding Traveller<BR>digital artists:&nbsp; Save often, render fast, and retire young ;)&nbsp; Tonight I<BR>get to re-create all the work I did yesterday.<BR><BR><BR>&nbsp; It would have been out at<BR>&gt; Dragonmeet 2000 (late Nov) but Jesse's been tied up doing all that<BR>&gt; gorgeous art he does for SJG (and they pay better than us).<BR><BR><BR>I wasn't going to mention that publically ;)<BR><BR><BR>And he<BR>&gt; tried to set himself on fire.....<BR><BR><BR>ROFL!!!!!!!!&nbsp; The good news is that my roommates are finally letting me near<BR>heating oil again because I got a purpose-built, temp limited deep-fryer<BR>from my Mom as a semi-joke Christmas gift.&nbsp; The other gift was a good fire<BR>extinguisher ;D<BR><BR>Best,<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3550<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zd03.mx.aol.com (rly-zd03.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.227]) by air-zd04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 20:39:23 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zd03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 20:38:48 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id UAA30960;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 20:37:59 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 22 Jan 2001 20:37:51 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id UAA30916<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 20:37:50 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 20:37:50 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101230137.UAA30916@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3550<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background="" bgColor=#3dffff><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3551</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/23/01 4:15:02 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 23 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3551<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR>Re: Deckplan plea!<BR>Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives (I'm catching up)<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR>MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Query: The Githiaskio<BR>RE:WBH<BR>RE: Deckplan plea!<BR>Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>Githiaskio<BR>Deckplans for the Patrol Cruiser<BR>RE:WBH<BR>Re: Now I've gone and done it!<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>RE: Unions<BR>Re: Type T Patrol Cruiser Deckplan<BR>Re: Now I've gone and done it<BR>RE: Now I've gone and done it!<BR>Flawed First Survey<BR>RE: Githiaskio<BR>Re: Flawed First Survey<BR>Re: Flawed First Survey<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 17:39:01 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;&nbsp; How many hydrographic-zero worlds are there in systems lacking<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; planetoid belts?<BR><BR>1129 in the Imperium. Of which 141 are size 0 worlds. So assuming <BR>those are in the "main world belt," there are 988 hydrographic-zero <BR>worlds in systems lacking planetoid belts in the Imperium. Of those <BR>988, 57 also lack gas giants. No data is available as to whether <BR>those 57 systems also lack other planets or moons with water or ice <BR>or cometary bodies.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 17:40:22 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au writes:<BR><BR>&gt; creating a more uniform distribution of worlds, especially in terms of tech<BR>&gt; levels. I believe they were also given a +1 to their Pop rolls, thus the<BR>&gt; abundance of Hi Pop worlds in the region. This is probably what contributes<BR>&gt; to the Rim having the highest amount of trade, according to the (much<BR>&gt; later) analysis and rules from _Far Trader_.<BR><BR>Actually, the main reason the Rim has lots of trade is that it seems to have<BR>gotten a bonus to port code.&nbsp; Its population is very high, but it also <BR>doesn't have many hi-pop worlds with poor starports.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 02:14:58 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR><BR>on 23/1/01 1:39 am, Gordon Horne at gordon.horne@home.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; How many hydrographic-zero worlds are there in systems lacking<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; planetoid belts?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 1129 in the Imperium. Of which 141 are size 0 worlds. So assuming<BR>&gt; those are in the "main world belt," there are 988 hydrographic-zero<BR>&gt; worlds in systems lacking planetoid belts in the Imperium. Of those<BR>&gt; 988, 57 also lack gas giants. No data is available as to whether<BR>&gt; those 57 systems also lack other planets or moons with water or ice<BR>&gt; or cometary bodies.<BR><BR>Just one question... how the heck do you do that? :) Is there some trick to<BR>generating stats from Gal24 or have you exported everything into a mammoth<BR>spreadsheet?<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:18:44 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: Deckplan plea!<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Paul Harris asked:<BR>&gt;Does anyone have an electronic copy of the Deckplans for a Type-T 400 DT<BR>&gt;Patrol Cruiser.<BR><BR>Try Paul Schirf's EXCELLENT page of deckplans (I'm planning on adding an<BR>extra star whenever I can update my link page) at:<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.perkworks.com/traveller/<BR><BR>His version of the Patrol Cruiser is called the "400 Ton Trenchant Class<BR>Patrol Cruiser" with full pics, deckplans and GURPS stats. Plus the<BR>_Campaign Cartographer 2_ file, if you need it. ;-)<BR><BR>Of course, other sites have artwork, such as "On Patrol" found on Mike<BR>Linsenmayer's "Virtual Space" site:<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.bigbailey.com/vspace/<BR><BR>Go to the "Art Work" page and look at the thumbnails.<BR><BR>I had hoped that Stewart P. S. Eyres' page<BR>(http://www.jb.man.ac.uk/~spe/Plans/Plans.html) would have the PC; sorry,<BR>it has everything else _but_!<BR><BR>I _think_ that's it, even after searching through the Deckplans webring<BR>(http://users.hartwick.edu/~smithw/deckring.htm).<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 20:23:00 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Technology Marches On:&nbsp; TL13 Arrives (I'm catching up)<BR><BR>As I have been catching up on TML digest posts&nbsp; (I was at Annual<BR>Training), I saw the following exchange:<BR><BR>&gt; They use vacuum flasks and liquid nitrogen. If the power goes out it just<BR>&gt; means the flask have to be topped up by torch-light.<BR><BR>"By the light of a flashlight", please. "Torchlight" involves burning<BR>materials stuck on the end of a stick.<BR><BR>As I see it, when dealing with Mad Science, "torchlight" (using<BR>Leonard's definition) is an entirely appropriate source of illumination<BR>(see Kenji's posting of a story from _The Onion_ for additional<BR>information).&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 13:50:05 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Water is, furthermore, very easy to recycle, so even if a world (or,<BR>&gt;&gt;more plausibly, a sealed habitat of some kind) has to import enough<BR>&gt;&gt;water to get started, it probably won't have to import any more.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; On the other hand, just because they *could* make a tight water cycle <BR>&gt; doesn't mean it's the most economic way of solving the problem. There's also <BR>&gt; the issue of the people and goods that leave the world -- the water system <BR>&gt; *can't* be sealed. It might be cheaper to build a moderately leaky habitat <BR>&gt; and just top it up with water as needed, rather than implementing draconian <BR>&gt; measures.<BR><BR>No need for "draconian" measures. If the habitat imports food, then it<BR>*will* wind up with excess water. Guaranteed. The basic reaction for<BR>getting energy from food is:<BR><BR>carbohydrates + oxygen -&gt; water + CO2<BR><BR>Cx(H2O)y + x O2 -&gt; y H2O + x CO2<BR><BR>Also, air recycling will have to remove excess water, and all the<BR>practical methods are fairly simple to get the water out of. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 18:41:08 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR><BR>&gt;Just one question... how the heck do you do that? :) Is there some trick to<BR>&gt;generating stats from Gal24 or have you exported everything into a mammoth<BR>&gt;spreadsheet?<BR><BR>I've been dumping various people's sector notes into a giant <BR>spreadsheet. Who did what is lost to the mists of time, in part <BR>because i edit the data so everything has the same detail, in part <BR>because i've kept lousy records 8^(<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 22:14:52 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>OK, just for kicks I set Heaven and Earth to spit out GURPS Traveller/First <BR>In systems. I'm now having a hard time reconciling what it produces with the <BR>way worlds are in the Imperium.<BR><BR>I punched in the UWP of a world with a rather odd set of physical stats, a <BR>"real" one from canon. It's only size 2, but has an essentially Earth-like <BR>atmosphere and some water. We all know that this world could never exist out <BR>here in the real universe, but also know that the Classic and MegaTraveller <BR>worldgen systems would kick out some weird outliers, and we'd all live with <BR>them. The systems in Scouts and World Builders Handbook nevertheless let you <BR>continue on detailing these worlds logically, impossible or not.<BR><BR>However, when I feed this world to H&amp;E and have it give me a "First In" <BR>world, it tells me that the world has an atmospheric pressure of 0.0 <BR>atmospheres, which directly contradicts the UWP. It's a "6", standard <BR>atmosphere, not a "0". I mean, I realize that a world that small would <BR>*really* have no atmosphere, but it contradicts what exists about this world <BR>in canon -- as generated it has a breathable atmosphere, and 0.0 atm isn't <BR>going to cut it when it comes to generating further details!<BR><BR>How do I go about generating a GURPS Traveller world that will at least <BR>vaguely map onto what is "known" about this world? It would seem that the GT <BR>worldgen system doesn't let you produce (or at least generate more useable <BR>detail) about quite a large swatch of the worlds in the 3I if it does <BR>something like this. Do I just ignore the First In rules? Is there another <BR>system for generating more detail in G:T that doesn't flatly contradict the <BR>UWP? Come to think, has Traveller entirely moved away from UWPs in G:T?<BR><BR>I don't (yet) own any G:T stuff, so my apologies if these are really basic <BR>questions -- I guess that last one almost certainly is....<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:28:40 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: Query: The Githiaskio<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Jeff wrote:<BR>&gt;Well, I won't answer the "what happened" question, but herewith the aliens<BR>&gt;I remember seeing CONTACT or equivalent for, except for those that later<BR>&gt;got full-fledged Alien Modules.&nbsp; Unfortunately, I don't remember what<BR>&gt;issues of what magazines they appeared in...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Dynchia (Human minor race)<BR>&gt;Jgd-Il-Jagd (Gas-giant floater creatures)<BR>&gt;Prrt (Felinoids, both similarities to and differences from Aslan)<BR>&gt;Newts/Bwaps (Salamanderoids)<BR>&gt;Githiaskio (Squidoids)<BR><BR>I think I have a few of those (with references) in my Library Data. Try<BR>looking at the Reference Texts, then the Alien Race list.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:47:02 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Don Roberts &lt;tne1201@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE:WBH<BR><BR>HELP!!!!!<BR>I am a fairly new traveller player.&nbsp; (What I mean by<BR>new is that I came in when TNE was just starting out<BR>in 93 and MT was on the way out).&nbsp; I do not have a<BR>copy of the materials contained in the WBH or GS/GC<BR>for MT/CT.<BR>After seeing what these materials are capable of<BR>generating I would love to have a copy or a reprint of<BR>this information or at the very least a photocopy. I<BR>noticed that in early 99 on the TML archives someone<BR>was producing photocopies of the work and sending them<BR>out. If this person (or anyone else) can do this I<BR>would be eternally grateful.&nbsp; <BR><BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 22:57:24 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Schirf" &lt;pc@PerkWorks.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Deckplan plea!<BR><BR>Paul Harris asked:<BR>&gt; Does anyone have an electronic copy of the Deckplans<BR>&gt; for a Type-T 400 DT Patrol Cruiser.<BR><BR>David Jaques wrote:<BR>&gt; Try Paul Schirf's EXCELLENT page of deckplans at:<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.perkworks.com/traveller/<BR><BR>Nice to see that I'm still getting good reviews!&nbsp; I've been away from<BR>Traveller Deckplans for well over a year now but I intend on adding a few<BR>more ships to my site soon... including a huge one of my own design.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:04:05 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need some T4 reviews...<BR><BR>On Sat, 13 Jan 2001, Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 20:45 -0500 12/1/01, Traveller-digest knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Out of a sense of fairness, which T4 products were actually good?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Milieu 0 Campaign (same as Milieu 0 but 32 extra pages of background, <BR>&gt; First Survey's maps and hardcover so a few dollars more).<BR><BR>Well, I was just at my F-but-not-very-LGS yesterday and sure enough, there<BR>was Milieu 0 Campaign.&nbsp; I must say I really like what I've read of it so<BR>far.&nbsp; It's got the venture-out-into-the-unexplored-night feeling I miss in<BR>the Classic/GURPS era (I'm young, so I got started with TNE).&nbsp; Plus lots<BR>of meat about how Cleon wants his empire to work and why he sets it up the<BR>way he does, which is useful for understanding the later Imperium.&nbsp; <BR>Definitely worth violating my "No more Imperium Games products, ever" oath<BR>from last summer.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 00:06:25 -0500<BR>From: michael stasica &lt;stosh@sympatico.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>"Mikko V. I. Parviainen" wrote:<BR><BR>SNIP<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Somebody's been watching "Ice Pirates" again.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Or V.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I was something about 10 years old when V was shown in the Finnish TV -<BR>&gt; and I thought it very strange for aliens to come to Earth for _water_ and<BR>&gt; _people_for_cattle_...<BR><BR>What bothered me was the aliens going to Southern California for water. I<BR>just<BR>bought the complete V miniseries (5 tapes), and in view of the political<BR>stink<BR>recently here in Canada about the U.S. wanting to buy water from Canada could<BR><BR>not stop laughing.<BR><BR>Michael<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 00:10:46 EST<BR>From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>Subject: Githiaskio<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;What if anything happened to the Githiaskio (JTAS 16) in MT, TNE, T4 or <BR>G:T?<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>They have also been covered for G:T in the (electronic) pages of either <BR>Pyramid or JTAS. Worth every penny, those subscriptions...<BR><BR>GC<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 00:18:56 EST<BR>From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>Subject: Deckplans for the Patrol Cruiser<BR><BR>A set of these with a 1m hexgrid overlay is available on Paul Schirf's site, <BR>and may be the ones he refered to:<BR><BR>http://www.perkworks.com/traveller/CC2.html<BR><BR>The Hammerhead on my site uses the same design assumptions except for hull <BR>config, and is based on another piece of GDW artwork (the Challenge ad for <BR>Fighting Ships of the Shattered Imperium, if anyone cares).<BR><BR>http://members.aol.com/gypsycomet/index.html<BR>(follow the ships link)<BR><BR>The original in-print version was in FASAs Adventure Class Ships V2. Not the <BR>greatest rendition and long out of print and hard to find.<BR><BR>GC<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:55:57 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: RE:WBH<BR><BR>On 01/22/01 at 07:47 PM,&nbsp; Don Roberts &lt;tne1201@yahoo.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;HELP!!!!!<BR>&gt;I am a fairly new traveller player.&nbsp; (What I mean by<BR>&gt;new is that I came in when TNE was just starting out<BR>&gt;in 93 and MT was on the way out).&nbsp; I do not have a<BR>&gt;copy of the materials contained in the WBH or GS/GC<BR>&gt;for MT/CT.<BR><BR>&gt;After seeing what these materials are capable of<BR>&gt;generating I would love to have a copy or a reprint of this<BR>&gt;information or at the very least a photocopy. I noticed that in<BR>&gt;early 99 on the TML archives someone was producing photocopies of<BR>&gt;the work and sending them out. If this person (or anyone else) can<BR>&gt;do this I would be eternally grateful.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Suggestion one, get a copy of _First In_ from Steve Jackson Games.<BR>It's not going to give you quite the same results as WBH, but it<BR>does the same thing for GT within the GURPS framework.&nbsp; Converting<BR>back to Traveller UWP's isn't difficult.<BR><BR>Suggestion two, check out ebay, Traveller Trader, and some of the<BR>other online stores.&nbsp; Copies of WBH come through occasionally, and<BR>aren't *too* expensive.<BR><BR>Suggestion three, grab a copy of Heaven &amp; Earth, runs under Win9x.<BR>It generates systems with most, maybe all, the of WBH.&nbsp; Upside is<BR>that it's free.&nbsp; Downside is that it is really big and resource<BR>hungry and still underdevelopment.<BR><BR>Suggestion four...I probably shouldn't add this one, but what the<BR>hey..., convince Roger Sanger to reprint WBH.&nbsp; Roger has posted to<BR>the list in the last week and, as far as I know, he owns the rights<BR>to all the DGP books, so you can reach him and maybe he can legally<BR>make copies.<BR><BR>If Marc is making money selling the Big Black Books, and I don't<BR>doubt he is, then Roger could make money selling reprints of some of<BR>the better DGP books.&nbsp; As to why he isn't doing that, I haven't a<BR>clue.&nbsp; I don't know if he has a current licence from Marc, maybe<BR>that's why he isn't.&nbsp; IAC, I strongly suspect reprints of SOM and<BR>WBH would sell very well, as would a collection of the Traveller and<BR>MegaTraveller Digests, so it seems like it would be in the interest<BR>of both the license owner and the owner of the publication rights to<BR>make it happen.<BR><BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 22:59:08 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Now I've gone and done it!<BR><BR>On Mon, 22 Jan 2001 19:28:38 -0500 rsmith@rasinsurance.com (Robert A. Smith<BR>II) wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;The way I see it if the nobility takes her offer, PsiCorp will make sure the<BR>&gt;coverup is leaked.&nbsp; If the nobles then stand by her, the Solomoni<BR>&gt;Confederation will seceed from the Imperium in a major civil war.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;OTOH, she has considered going to the Darrian Order of Zar Tis to keep her<BR>&gt;children out of the hands of PsiCorp.&nbsp; If she were to take this tack, I see<BR>&gt;the Imperium putting pressure on the Darrians which would possibly push them<BR>&gt;into joining the Zhos and turning the FFW into a psi-war ala Babylon 5.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I didn't mean for this to be so long...Do y'all see any other possible<BR>&gt;permutations to the political consequences?<BR><BR>She, her husband and the twins could 'die' in a tragic air raft crash. A<BR>certain Psi Cop could be implicated in possible sabotage. Black eye for<BR>PsiCorp, a quiet transfer of power to another relative for the Rejuv world,<BR>and the kettle is kept simmering, not boiling over.<BR><BR>She and family either move quietly to Darrian or Zhodani space, or re-appear<BR>as a different family in Imperial space. <BR><BR>It sort of depends...if the PsiCop is an NPC it works out beautifully. The<BR>group moves to a different area of space, and they have a dangerous adversary:<BR>the PsiCop, who has probably been disciplined severely, perhaps even disoowned<BR>by PsiCorp (The nobles screaming about rogue PsiCops killing Duchesses and<BR>their family over mere suspicion that they had psi talents wouldn't hurt in<BR>the slightest)<BR><BR>No Imperium-wide political consequences are going to go on while the true<BR>duchess is considered dead.<BR><BR><BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 00:04:21 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>On 01/22/01 at 08:35 AM,&nbsp; "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;Why is water not a more common cargo for interstellar trade?&nbsp; It is<BR>&gt;crucial to life, convertible into fuel, efficient as a shield<BR>&gt;against cosmic radiation, and does not exist in many star systems.<BR><BR>As others have posted, there is a lot of it around, but you are at least partly right, IMO. In certain specialized situations, I think water would be a viable cargo.&nbsp; A low-tech planet desert planet might pay enough to make it worth a merchant towing an iceberg in from the outer system and "softly" dropping it on the surface. If that's worth doing, then it might be worth shipping a cargo hold full from a wet world a parsec away.&nbsp; Maybe.<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:23:50 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Unions<BR><BR>I have avoided commenting on the reactions to my comment about unions,<BR>obviously it's another of those subject that people feel too strongly over<BR>for it to be worth debating sensibly.<BR><BR>But here's a data point.<BR><BR>I'm currently watching on TV the police escorting one group of dockworkers<BR>to their jobs at a port here in New Zealand, because another group of<BR>dockworkers don't want them working there.<BR><BR>The police are having to use force to move the picketers, who are illegally<BR>blocking a public thoroughfare, as well as assaulting the police officers<BR>and throwing things at the vehicle, even though though it was supposed to be<BR>a "non-violent" picket.<BR><BR>Both groups have their own unions. The company employing the first lot of<BR>dockworkers pays more than the second group's award rates, thus working for<BR>the new company is better for the local union's members, and there are laws<BR>in New Zealand saying that workers at a company can belong to any union they<BR>like (or no union at all) so the local union does not neccesarily stand to<BR>loose members.<BR><BR>The company also wants to employ local labour, but the local watersiders<BR>have knifed one person and are intimidating others, so no-one local feels<BR>safe being employed by the new company. At the same time the excuse the<BR>union is using for industrial action is that local jobs are being<BR>threatened. Even with these threats, the company has still managed to employ<BR>several locals who are willing to stand up to the union.<BR><BR>The company involved is small and New Zealand owned, so they haven't got the<BR>excuse of profits going to an overseas multinational.<BR><BR>One of the 'problems' the union is complaining about is that this company<BR>uses software that tells the stevedores where to put the logs they are<BR>loading, and this software is far better at this job than the stevedores !<BR><BR>This means more logs on a ship, and thus cheaper shipping costs for the<BR>customer, not to mention safer ships, as the logs are less likely to move in<BR>transit being better packed.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:37:51 -0800<BR>From: Roger Sanger &lt;rodge@nwnexus.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Type T Patrol Cruiser Deckplan<BR><BR>Deck plans for the Lurushaar Kilaalum Class Type T 400 ton Patrol Cruiser appeared in Adventure Class Ships Vol. II, published by the Freedonian Aeronaughtical and Space Administration (fasa) in 1982.&nbsp; Square grid (1.5 meters per square).&nbsp; The deck plan sheet measures 22" x 17".&nbsp; Deck plans for&nbsp; nine other ships and 2 booklets were also included in the boxed set.<BR><BR>BTW, it is one of the items in my collection I'm putting up for sale.&nbsp; I've gone almost brain dead inventorying this stuff (there's over 2500 items), but I'm still working on it.&nbsp; I'll have at least a preliminary list complete with prices ready in a few days.&nbsp; If there are any items you are looking for from Traveller, from other sci-fi RPGs, or even fantasy (1000+ items from D&amp;D/AD&amp;D), there's a good chance I have them.&nbsp; Let me know, and I'll keep an eye out for them while I continue to plow through this stuff -- I have several piles set aside for TML'ers so far, so act quickly!<BR><BR>Regarding the sale, please send replies directly to me at rodge@nwnexus.com, so as not to clutter this mailing list.&nbsp; Thanks.<BR><BR>Rodge<BR>rodge@nwnexus.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 00:10:02 -0800<BR>From: Roger Sanger &lt;rodge@nwnexus.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Now I've gone and done it<BR><BR>Will the real Duchess please stand up!<BR><BR>If the PC doesn't want the position of Duchess, she can always abdicate.&nbsp; Then the next rightful heir gets it, and depending on the laws in your campaign, it may very well be the clone who succeeds.<BR><BR>Another possibility is removing the DNA clone tags (if you can put artificial ones in, then you should be able to remove tags too), but I imagine this depends on how far nanotechnology is developed in your game universe.&nbsp; Along with some decent forging, the clone could be passed off as an identical twin (such natural clones are totally acceptable in polite society).&nbsp; Note that clones without DNA tags are indistinguishable from twins, unless the DNA donor is noticeably older, or too many of them turn up (more than sextuplets becomes pretty hard to swallow).<BR><BR>Yet another potential outcome would be to change the artificial tags on the PC to truly match those on her clone.&nbsp; Then they'll both be "clones", and the Duchy goes to the next rightful heir.<BR><BR>How wily is the defacto Duchess?&nbsp; If she's smart, she could have her DNA donor captured, her DNA analyzed, and her own DNA tags modified so that she appears to be the original.&nbsp; If the original (PC) were to disappear, it would be pretty hard for anybody to prove anything.&nbsp; Then send in the clowns, uh DNA experts, to validate the Duchess' identity.<BR><BR>Rodge<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 08:05:14 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Now I've gone and done it!<BR><BR>&gt; If I haven't lost you yet, here's the dilemma.&nbsp; When all of <BR>&gt; this comes to<BR>&gt; light it will cause a *major* scandal among the nobles--no <BR>&gt; big deal.&nbsp; Most<BR>&gt; likely, the current duchess will be removed and Mariel will take her<BR>&gt; rightful place.&nbsp; The dilemma is PsiCorp.&nbsp; As a citizen of the <BR>&gt; Imperium, she<BR>&gt; and her children will be subject to PsiCorp.&nbsp; She won't have <BR>&gt; anything to do<BR>&gt; with PsiCorp.<BR><BR>I take it that having Mariel refuse the patent of nobility isn't an option?<BR>In the OTU members of noble families aren't forced to take titles.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 04:12:04 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Flawed First Survey<BR><BR>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C084F2.A4B43740<BR>Content-Type: text/plain;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="Windows-1252"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>Why does the FAQ state that T4's "First Survey" is fundamentally flawed?<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C084F2.A4B43740<BR>Content-Type: text/html;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="Windows-1252"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>&lt;!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"&gt;<BR>&lt;HEAD&gt;<BR>&lt;META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-1252" =<BR>http-equiv=3DContent-Type&gt;<BR>&lt;META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2014.210" name=3DGENERATOR&gt;<BR>&lt;STYLE&gt;&lt;/STYLE&gt;<BR>&lt;/HEAD&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT size=3>Why does the FAQ state that T4's "First Survey" is=20<BR>fundamentally flawed?</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C084F2.A4B43740--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 09:21:19 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Githiaskio<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &gt;What if anything happened to the Githiaskio (JTAS 16) in <BR>&gt; MT, TNE, T4 or <BR>&gt; G:T?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; They have also been covered for G:T in the (electronic) <BR>&gt; pages of either <BR>&gt; Pyramid or JTAS. Worth every penny, those subscriptions...<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Both probably...Traveller stuff published in Pyramid was made available to<BR>JTAS subscribers.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:57:37 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Flawed First Survey<BR><BR>Michael Daumen wrote:<BR>&gt; Why does the FAQ state that T4's "First Survey" is fundamentally<BR>&gt; flawed?<BR><BR>Several reasons:<BR><BR>1) Check the UWPs carefully. Notice how every world has the same law and<BR>government levels?<BR><BR>2) Too many high-TL (D+, ie above TL12) worlds exist without any<BR>explanation whatsoever.<BR><BR>3) No relation between system coordinates and the descriptions in the<BR>campaign material (Milleu 0).<BR><BR>There are probably more reasons...<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 01:04:58 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Flawed First Survey<BR><BR>On 23 Jan 01, at 12:57, Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Michael Daumen wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Why does the FAQ state that T4's "First Survey" is fundamentally<BR>&gt; &gt; flawed?<BR><BR>[snip]<BR><BR>&gt; There are probably more reasons...<BR><BR>The suprising number of Pop-B worlds (100's of billions). Many of which are <BR>uninhabitable worlds that somehow survived the Long Night.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:17:35 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>Paul Drye wrote:<BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt; in canon -- as generated it has a breathable atmosphere, and 0.0 atm isn't<BR>&gt; going to cut it when it comes to generating further details!<BR><BR>First In uses real world physics. The worlds of the Imperium don't.<BR><BR>Such a small planet would have to have a high density in order to keep a<BR>standard atmosphere. Play around a bit with First In and you will see<BR>that this very rarely happens. The size class number (proportional to<BR>mass, inversly proportional to diameter) must fall within a certain<BR>interval, while at the same time the planet's gravity (proportional to<BR>mass and diameter) must also fall within a given interval. For very<BR>small diameters, this rarely (if ever) happens.<BR><BR>&gt; How do I go about generating a GURPS Traveller world that will at least<BR>&gt; vaguely map onto what is "known" about this world?<BR><BR>First In states that you modify the size class (in First In) of the<BR>planet by one step in the desired direction, thus fudging the result. In<BR>order to be scientifically plausible, this would require special<BR>explanation.<BR><BR>&gt; Do I just ignore the First In rules?<BR><BR>&lt;heretic mode on&gt;<BR>No, you ignore the official 3I.&nbsp; ;-)<BR>&lt;heretic mode off&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; Come to think, has Traveller entirely moved away from UWPs in G:T?<BR><BR>They are not in any of the published sector books in any case... ;-)<BR><BR>&gt; I don't (yet) own any G:T stuff, so my apologies if these are really basic<BR>&gt; questions -- I guess that last one almost certainly is....<BR><BR>If you want scientific realism, use the First In rules. If you want the<BR>OTU, don't use them the way they're written. That's my opinion.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3551<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xd04.mx.aol.com (rly-xd04.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.169]) by air-xd02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 07:15:02 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xd04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 07:14:43 1900<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id HAA53070;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 07:14:14 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 23 Jan 2001 07:14:02 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id HAA53026<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 07:14:02 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 07:14:02 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101231214.HAA53026@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3551<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3552</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/23/01 7:27:44 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 23 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3552<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR>Re: Two Questions...<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>Re: Flawed First Survey<BR>Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: Flawed First Survey<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR>RE: Now I've gone and done it!<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Flawed First Survey<BR>Re: Flawed First Survey<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>RE: water merchants<BR>RE: Water merchants<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 23:18:13 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR><BR>[How many desert world systems lack planetoid belts?]<BR><BR>Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt; 1129 in the Imperium. Of which 141 are size 0 worlds. So assuming <BR>&gt; those are in the "main world belt," there are 988 hydrographic-zero <BR>&gt; worlds in systems lacking planetoid belts in the Imperium. Of those <BR>&gt; 988, 57 also lack gas giants. No data is available as to whether <BR>&gt; those 57 systems also lack other planets or moons with water or ice <BR>&gt; or cometary bodies.<BR><BR>It would be extremely unlikely, it my opinion, for a system with any<BR>planets at all to be without any water nearby.&nbsp; I can't think of<BR>anything at all that would clear out an entire system's volatiles, not<BR>even a supernova.<BR><BR>Well, maybe the Ancients could have done it :)<BR><BR>At the least, you'd have cometary bodies out on the dark edges of the<BR>system that aren't going anywhere soon.&nbsp; Just waiting for a thruster<BR>to bring them slowly in over a few months at thousandths of a gee and<BR>put them in orbit.&nbsp; Put it behind a reflective sunshield, let it reach<BR>equilibrium at 150-200K in orbit, and carve off chunks as needed.&nbsp; Or<BR>ferry a few thousand tons each day to the surface.<BR><BR>*Much* cheaper than hauling water in from other star systems in tiny<BR>10,000-ton lots at millions of credits per lot.<BR><BR>If for some extraordinary reason the whole system lacks any water at<BR>all, you could find a neighbouring system and fling a really big<BR>snowball at near-c speeds over a decade or so.&nbsp; It would still cost a<BR>lot less than shipping via jump.&nbsp; Of course, such a system would have<BR>to have something pretty special to justify settling it at all.&nbsp; No<BR>gas giants, no asteroids, no water, no native life, no breathable<BR>atmosphere.<BR><BR><BR>- - Tim<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:21:54 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Two Questions...<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR>&gt; http://www.warehouse23.com/<BR><BR>I already suggested that one&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>&gt; You can get the BITS Traveller stuff there.<BR><BR>... but I forgot to specifically mention BITS. Doh!<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 23:44:51 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; A low-tech planet desert planet might pay enough to make it worth a<BR>&gt; merchant towing an iceberg in from the outer system and "softly"<BR>&gt; dropping it on the surface. If that's worth doing, then it might be<BR>&gt; worth shipping a cargo hold full from a wet world a parsec away.<BR><BR>Shipping 1,000,000 tons of water by jump drive costs probably about<BR>100 MCr in freight.<BR><BR>Towing 1,000,000 tons of water from the outer system over a few months<BR>takes thrusters and control systems costing about 10 MCr (these are<BR>then reusable if desired).&nbsp; Of course, a million tons is a body only a<BR>couple of hundred metres across.&nbsp; It might be worthwhile grabbing<BR>something bigger.&nbsp; The longer you can wait, the more you can tow with<BR>the same equipment.<BR><BR>It would have to be a very small colony who don't expect to be around<BR>long to make it more worthwhile to ship in water than to tow local<BR>iceballs in.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 07:57:31 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Re: Flawed First Survey<BR><BR>On Tue, 23 Jan 2001 04:12:04 -0500 "Michael Daumen"<BR>&lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt; writes:<BR>&gt; Why does the FAQ state that T4's "First Survey" is fundamentally <BR>&gt; flawed?<BR><BR>Shortly before joining the TML, I asked Doug Berry the same question. <BR>His response seems to pretty well sum it up:<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt;In the TML FAQ, it says that First Survey is "generally held to be<BR>&gt;fundamentally flawed."&nbsp; Why?<BR><BR>Several reasons.<BR><BR>First of all, all the worlds have identical Government and Law Level<BR>numbers.&nbsp; This was a problem with the program that generated the world<BR>profiles.&nbsp; Also, despite the commentary in _Milieu 0_ that the newly born<BR>Third Imperium had a technological advantage at TL12, there were many<BR>worlds at TL12 or better.<BR><BR>They had Vland with a population of 4.&nbsp; Only a few tens of thousands of<BR>people on one of Humaniti's homeworld?<BR><BR>None of the important locations mentioned in M:0 can be reliably located.<BR>In particular, the Chasetin Kingdom's location is uncertain.&nbsp; This is<BR>unforgivable for those of us who wanted to play out the last days of the<BR>Sylean Confederation.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 08:06:36 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt; OK, just for kicks I set Heaven and Earth to spit out GURPS<BR>Traveller/First<BR>&gt; In systems. I'm now having a hard time reconciling what it produces with<BR>the<BR>&gt; way worlds are in the Imperium.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I punched in the UWP of a world with a rather odd set of physical stats, a<BR>&gt; "real" one from canon. It's only size 2, but has an essentially Earth-like<BR>&gt; atmosphere and some water. We all know that this world could never exist<BR>out<BR>&gt; here in the real universe, but also know that the Classic and<BR>MegaTraveller<BR>&gt; worldgen systems would kick out some weird outliers, and we'd all live<BR>with<BR>&gt; them. The systems in Scouts and World Builders Handbook nevertheless let<BR>you<BR>&gt; continue on detailing these worlds logically, impossible or not.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; However, when I feed this world to H&amp;E and have it give me a "First In"<BR>&gt; world, it tells me that the world has an atmospheric pressure of 0.0<BR>&gt; atmospheres, which directly contradicts the UWP. It's a "6", standard<BR>&gt; atmosphere, not a "0". I mean, I realize that a world that small would<BR>&gt; *really* have no atmosphere, but it contradicts what exists about this<BR>world<BR>&gt; in canon -- as generated it has a breathable atmosphere, and 0.0 atm isn't<BR>&gt; going to cut it when it comes to generating further details!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; How do I go about generating a GURPS Traveller world that will at least<BR>&gt; vaguely map onto what is "known" about this world? It would seem that the<BR>GT<BR>&gt; worldgen system doesn't let you produce (or at least generate more useable<BR>&gt; detail) about quite a large swatch of the worlds in the 3I if it does<BR>&gt; something like this. Do I just ignore the First In rules? Is there another<BR>&gt; system for generating more detail in G:T that doesn't flatly contradict<BR>the<BR>&gt; UWP? Come to think, has Traveller entirely moved away from UWPs in G:T?<BR>&gt;<BR>I find that H &amp; E makes a lot of uncomfortably hot or cold mainworlds.&nbsp; Once<BR>I switched to CT/GS this problem lessened, but then you lose the more<BR>realistic data.<BR>G:T has a page on converting UPPs but avoids them.&nbsp; The only things that<BR>track UPP are population and starport (albeit in a different form).<BR><BR>Oh, and is there a reason why my posts are followed by some garble (And I<BR>don't mean responses ha-ha)?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:19:31 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Flawed First Survey<BR><BR>I've asked this before...any hints on covering CT/MT data back to the M0 <BR>timeperiod? That way I won't feel like I wasted money getting the volume <BR>brand new :-)<BR><BR>Mike<BR><BR><BR>- ----Original Message Follows----<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Flawed First Survey<BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 07:57:31 -0500<BR><BR><BR><BR>On Tue, 23 Jan 2001 04:12:04 -0500 "Michael Daumen"<BR>&lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt; writes:<BR>&gt; Why does the FAQ state that T4's "First Survey" is fundamentally<BR>&gt; flawed?<BR><BR>Shortly before joining the TML, I asked Doug Berry the same question.<BR>His response seems to pretty well sum it up:<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt;In the TML FAQ, it says that First Survey is "generally held to be<BR>&gt;fundamentally flawed."&nbsp; Why?<BR><BR>Several reasons.<BR><BR>First of all, all the worlds have identical Government and Law Level<BR>numbers.&nbsp; This was a problem with the program that generated the world<BR>profiles.&nbsp; Also, despite the commentary in _Milieu 0_ that the newly born<BR>Third Imperium had a technological advantage at TL12, there were many<BR>worlds at TL12 or better.<BR><BR>They had Vland with a population of 4.&nbsp; Only a few tens of thousands of<BR>people on one of Humaniti's homeworld?<BR><BR>None of the important locations mentioned in M:0 can be reliably located.<BR>In particular, the Chasetin Kingdom's location is uncertain.&nbsp; This is<BR>unforgivable for those of us who wanted to play out the last days of the<BR>Sylean Confederation.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 00:43:56 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>Michael Daumen wrote:<BR>&gt; I find that H &amp; E makes a lot of uncomfortably hot or cold<BR>&gt; mainworlds.<BR><BR>What do you expect on an alien world, Paradise?&nbsp; I suppose you'd<BR>complain about NH3/CH4/H2O atmospheres, too?&nbsp; :^)<BR><BR>You could always do what I did from a previous GURPS Space game --<BR>generate a few hundred thousand systems by computer, then apply a<BR>simulation of settlers radiating out from homeworlds, taking all the<BR>best ones they could find under certain constraints.&nbsp; Apply a (really)<BR>basic trade and population model, and you have the skeleton for the<BR>inhabited worlds in your universe.<BR><BR>Now, this is probably a bit much if you just want a world, not a<BR>universe.&nbsp; Doing this realistically is going to be trickier, but still<BR>possible.<BR><BR>One theoretical method would be to use the basic world generation<BR>methods as a baseline, and generate joint probabilities for various<BR>parameters.&nbsp; If you *know* some particular parameter (e.g. you want a<BR>world that definitely has native life and suitable for large-scale<BR>colonisation), you can use that to define conditional probabilities on<BR>the joint distribution.&nbsp; From that, you get a tailor-made generation<BR>of features for your semi-random world.<BR><BR>I have some program fragments lying around on my hard drive that do<BR>various parts of this.&nbsp; Unfortunately I don't have the original world<BR>generation tables for any published game system at all.&nbsp; This makes it<BR>more than a little difficult to complete the task and make a great<BR>Traveller world-builder program.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Oh, and is there a reason why my posts are followed by some garble (And I<BR>&gt; don't mean responses ha-ha)?<BR><BR>I &lt;fnord&gt; didn't see &lt;fnord&gt; anything strange after your &lt;fnord&gt; last<BR>posts.&nbsp; In fact, I don't &lt;fnord&gt; remember seeing any of your &lt;fnord&gt;<BR>posts before, although seeing your name makes &lt;fnord&gt; me feel vaguely<BR>uncomfortable &lt;fnord&gt; and apprehensive.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 00:43:52 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Very true, but have any of these prevented you from adopting <BR>&gt;&gt; technology to apply them?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; No, but in our history the problems the rules were set up to prevent <BR>&gt; have never included "disaster caused by over-reliance on unsustainable <BR>&gt; technology".<BR><BR>Actually, that *has* happened to *several* cultures right here on<BR>Earth. The folks who built Angkor Wat to name the best known example. I<BR>forget the exact details of that one. <BR><BR>Another was a culture in Mexico(?) that had extensive irrigation<BR>systems using water from a huge dam they'd built up over several<BR>generations.&nbsp; Then the dam failed. And they realized there was no way<BR>to get it repaired well enough to grow the crops they'd need to support<BR>the current population. So they just abandoned their "city", and spread<BR>back out into the surrounding territories so that they'd be able to<BR>live off the land (luckily they still knew how). <BR><BR>And that was the end of agriculture in *that* area. <BR><BR>&gt; A perfect example. If controlling population by preventing new births <BR>&gt; had been seen as more important than new ways of killing the neighbours <BR>&gt; - or even if it had been given the same priority as saving people's <BR>&gt; lives - how soon would we have had reliable contraception?<BR><BR>I hate to point this out, but there was a simple method of dealing with<BR>unwanted births, practiced pretty much uniformly around the world until<BR>you get cities and not much wildreness near them.<BR><BR>It's called "exposure". You take that baby out from the village and<BR>leave it.<BR><BR>Remember, until decent medicine came along, parents didn't even<BR>*consider* getting attached to children until they were 4-6 years old.<BR>Too many fied before reacging that age.<BR><BR>Never assume that other cultures share our attitudes. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 01:00:26 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;That it does.&nbsp; I'd like to know why despite having solved all the<BR>&gt;&gt;difficult problems of space travel and even interstellar travel, and<BR>&gt;&gt;having demonstrated willingness to expend huge resources on<BR>&gt;&gt;terraforming new worlds, there are virtually no space habitats or<BR>&gt;&gt;large scale off-planet industry.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The out of game answer is that it is a historical accident. The <BR>&gt; original designers didn't put space habitats or space industry in the <BR>&gt; rules. Some early supplements - e.g., Belter - did have habitats and <BR>&gt; off planet industry, but they were only broadly described and were <BR>&gt; not presented in game terms. Asteroid worlds, of course, are space <BR>&gt; habitats, but other than a UWP Size of 0 they are not distinguished <BR>&gt; from other worlds. Also, i don't recall off hand seeing a canon <BR>&gt; asteroid world that was not built into the asteroid itself rather <BR>&gt; than in free space.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I have never heard a convincing in game answer. IMTU space habitats <BR>&gt; are ubiquitous.<BR><BR>There's a fairly simple reason, given OTU history. <BR><BR>Space habs are *fragile*. They are just too damned easy to destroy. Or<BR>at least to make uninhabitable. They are *big*, and they can't dodge.<BR>Any reasonable (for a civilian installation) defenses can easily be<BR>saturated. <BR><BR>And for that matter, things like solar flares mean you want a few<BR>*feet* of shielding between you and the star. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 01:04:01 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; The problem is that in much of the 3rd world, the lack of social <BR>&gt; support networks, combined with the use of children as cheap <BR>&gt; agricultural labor means that having large families is an economic <BR>&gt; good for most people in such places. The problem is not "the dead <BR>&gt; hand of tradition" but present day economic realities.&nbsp; As the <BR>&gt; various nations develop their population growth declines rapidly. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; IMHO, that's one of the primary reasons First World nations should <BR>&gt; finance development efforts.&nbsp; W/o them, the third world will become <BR>&gt; *really* ugly in a few decades, and such problems can easily <BR>&gt; spread, since nations like the US and France have been quite <BR>&gt; happy to sell some of those nations advanced weapons. Change <BR>&gt; the economics and the traditions will change in a generation or <BR>&gt; less.&nbsp; The history of the 20th century proves this quite well. <BR><BR>Well, the overpopulation problem in most of Africa, and a good chunk of<BR>Asia is going to be an *underpopulation* problem soon. AIDs is<BR>*endemic*. And it's going to make the black Death look like a bad cold.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:59:40 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt; I &lt;fnord&gt; didn't see &lt;fnord&gt; anything strange after your &lt;fnord&gt; last<BR>&gt; posts.&nbsp; In fact, I don't &lt;fnord&gt; remember seeing any of your &lt;fnord&gt;<BR>&gt; posts before, although seeing your name makes &lt;fnord&gt; me feel vaguely<BR>&gt; uncomfortable &lt;fnord&gt; and apprehensive.<BR><BR>I believe the correct wording is:<BR><BR>"... both apprehensive and uneasy, a feeling which grew ..."<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 01:08:47 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; Space habs are *fragile*. They are just too damned easy to<BR>&gt; destroy. Or at least to make uninhabitable. They are *big*, and they<BR>&gt; can't dodge.&nbsp; Any reasonable (for a civilian installation) defenses<BR>&gt; can easily be saturated.<BR><BR>You'd need overwhelming enough force that you would equally well be<BR>able to bomb an equivalent planet back into the Stone Age.&nbsp; Of course,<BR>therein lies the advantage of planets -- you *can* be bombed back into<BR>the Stone Age, and still live.<BR><BR>Well, so long as your planet doesn't get hit by near-c%$@% NO CARRIER<BR><BR><BR>There is still the problem that destroying all planetary installations<BR>is a much speedier process than methodically sweeping through a whole<BR>star system stomping out every space habitat cluster, bringing<BR>overwhelming force to each one.&nbsp; And possibly every tenth person has<BR>some sort of insystem spaceboat that can carry a lot of refugees (or<BR>potential guerilla fighters) in more directions than you can follow.<BR><BR>Sure, most of them would die.&nbsp; So would most high-tech people living<BR>on a planet if all the cities were flattened and infrastructure<BR>destroyed.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; And for that matter, things like solar flares mean you want a few<BR>&gt; *feet* of shielding between you and the star. <BR><BR>That's pretty trivial.&nbsp; Even most starships have at least that -- even<BR>if the cargo bay is mostly empty, there's still a few metres of liquid<BR>hydrogen to hide behind.<BR><BR><BR>- - Tim<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:34:06 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR><BR>on 23/1/01 2:41 am, Gordon Horne at gordon.horne@home.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Just one question... how the heck do you do that? :) Is there some trick to<BR>&gt;&gt; generating stats from Gal24 or have you exported everything into a mammoth<BR>&gt;&gt; spreadsheet?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I've been dumping various people's sector notes into a giant<BR>&gt; spreadsheet. Who did what is lost to the mists of time, in part<BR>&gt; because i edit the data so everything has the same detail, in part<BR>&gt; because i've kept lousy records 8^(<BR><BR>Nice one. Any chance of making it available?<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:26:05 -0000<BR>From: "Mark Preston" &lt;mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Now I've gone and done it!<BR><BR>Sorry to snip you mega-message, but its a tad long to quote.<BR><BR>Have you thought that with a potential noble scandal (far too close to<BR>the Imperial command for comfort) that is definately connected to the<BR>Darrians, probably to Zhodani (I presume the Imperium is still a bit<BR>rabid about Psi IYTU) and far too close to the Solomani Rim for<BR>comfort there is one obvious reaction that the nobles can't fail to<BR>realise? We're talking quiet assasination here folks - and who would<BR>be the obvious assassins? Well, no prizes for working that one out.<BR><BR>- --<BR>Mark A. Preston, The Magpie's Nest, Lancashire, UK<BR>Email&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; : mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk<BR>Website : www.mpreston.demon.co.uk<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:01:36 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Timothy Little writes:<BR>&gt;Ian Ferguson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;UWP population digit (there are typically ten times as<BR>&gt;&gt;many personel from a pop 10 world as from a pop 1 world).<BR>&gt;That's an extremely small number of people in Imperial service!<BR>&gt;There are only about 400 worlds with pop-1.&nbsp; Each such world could<BR>&gt;supply at most about 10 people (assuming such worlds are largely<BR>&gt;staffed by Imperial servicebeings), so there are at most only about<BR>&gt;200,000 in Imperial service across the entire Imperium, or about 20<BR>&gt;per world.<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; True, but my PC's never worked that out.&nbsp; It would have been<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; boring if almost every Imperial employee in the Regina<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; subsector was from Rethe.&nbsp; It is juat a game mechanic.&nbsp; In<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; fact, of course, it rarely comes up (only twice that I recall.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 09:04:41 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Flawed First Survey<BR><BR>On Tue, 23 Jan 2001 knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; None of the important locations mentioned in M:0 can be reliably located.<BR>&gt; In particular, the Chasetin Kingdom's location is uncertain.&nbsp; This is<BR>&gt; unforgivable for those of us who wanted to play out the last days of the<BR>&gt; Sylean Confederation.<BR><BR>That's disturbing, since I bought M:0 Campaign not 48 hours ago and have<BR>discovered I like the setting.&nbsp; Is there any unofficial consensus on this<BR>list as to where such things are actually located?&nbsp; Same goes for usable <BR>UWP's: did anyone ever come up with any?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 08:08:57 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Flawed First Survey<BR><BR>On Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:19:31&nbsp; mmckeown67@hotmail.com (Michael McKeown) wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I've asked this before...any hints on covering CT/MT data back to the M0<BR>&gt;timeperiod? That way I won't feel like I wasted money getting the volume<BR>&gt;brand new :-)<BR><BR>The hints came from Marc himself, way back when T4 was still coming out. He<BR>said a modified version of the procedure in Hard Times had been used to<BR>'devolve' the worlds. Presumably it was supposed to knock things back below<BR>TL12 and such, but obviously the program was flawed badly. There are Pop A<BR>worlds out there with Atm 0 and TL 0! That's right...Stone-age, High-pop,<BR>vaccuum worlds.<BR><BR>Alas, with _any_ of the Survey's in print, much of the data is suspect. Mark<BR>Gelinas wrote in a Challenge article (one of the last Challenges to be<BR>published) that 'the data in the Second Survey looks like a computer with it's<BR>needle stuck in a groove.' This was an article on collapsing worlds for TNE.<BR>If you can find it, it's a worthwhile article.<BR><BR>The Spinward Marches and Solomani Rim were hand tweaked from a computer<BR>generated base (and I'd dearly love to see that program some time!); all the<BR>rst were cranked out by a different program, and never really looked at.<BR><BR>My explanation is that in both Survey's the Scouts sent out to do the surveys<BR>got _real_ bored, _real_ fast, found themselves a nice beach, set up their<BR>still and simply hung out, listening to old Jimmy Buffet CD's, getting<BR>stonkered on Scout Brew and making it all up. ;-)<BR><BR>"Survey Run"<BR><BR>"Wasting away again on a Survey run...<BR>Looking for my long lost thermos of Brew<BR>Some people say that the Admin's to blame...<BR>But I know...it's nobody's fault...<BR><BR>Sorry , my filking skills arent' up to it...too bad, I've got _fragments_ of a<BR>half a dozen Buffet filks in my head. <BR><BR>Hell..."A Pirate looks at 40" hardly needs _any_ filking at all! "A Pirate<BR>Looks at 4 Terms" ;-) <BR><BR><BR><BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 08:15:41 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>On Tue, 23 Jan 2001 00:43:52 PST shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Very true, but have any of these prevented you from adopting<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; technology to apply them?<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; No, but in our history the problems the rules were set up to prevent<BR>&gt;&gt; have never included "disaster caused by over-reliance on unsustainable<BR>&gt;&gt; technology".<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Actually, that *has* happened to *several* cultures right here on<BR>&gt;Earth. The folks who built Angkor Wat to name the best known example. I<BR>&gt;forget the exact details of that one.<BR><BR>Actually, didn't Ankor Wat fall prey to eing invaded?<BR><BR>&gt;Another was a culture in Mexico(?) that had extensive irrigation<BR>&gt;systems using water from a huge dam they'd built up over several<BR>&gt;generations.&nbsp; Then the dam failed. And they realized there was no way<BR>&gt;to get it repaired well enough to grow the crops they'd need to support<BR>&gt;the current population. So they just abandoned their "city", and spread<BR>&gt;back out into the surrounding territories so that they'd be able to<BR>&gt;live off the land (luckily they still knew how).<BR><BR>I've never heard that one, but the Mayan culture probably failed due to<BR>over-reliance on irrigation and subsequent crop failures. There's more and<BR>more evidence coming to light of pperiodic and worsening famines in the area;<BR>eventually, as you said, they just gave up and spread back out. That this was<BR>sustainable was simply because their population had crashed some 95% by now,<BR>and most of the people still left alive were the ones who were subsistence<BR>farming out in the sticks _anyway_. <BR><BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:18:45 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: water merchants<BR><BR>Michael Daumen writes:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;Why is water not a more common cargo for interstellar trade?&nbsp; It is<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;crucial to life, convertible into fuel, efficient as a shield against<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;cosmic radiation, and does not exist in many star systems.<BR>&gt;&gt;But water *does* exist in just about every star system.<BR>&gt;&gt;Water is, furthermore, very easy to recycle, so even if a world (or,<BR>&gt;&gt;more plausibly, a sealed habitat of some kind) has to import enough<BR>&gt;&gt;water to get started, it probably won't have to import any more.<BR>&gt;Never saw Ice Pirates, don't really remember V.&nbsp; I agree that hydrogen is<BR>&gt;plentiful, but can we be so sure about water?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Pretty close to certain, as has been explained in other posts.<BR><BR>&gt;How many hydrographic-zero worlds are there in systems lacking<BR>&gt;planetoid belts?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; If you assume that Kuiper belts and Oort clouds are rare, you<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; still have to take into account all the other worlds in the system.<BR><BR>&gt;Plus the tech level for water recycling is prob. A, higher for<BR>&gt;manufacturing it.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; We can "manufacture" water now.&nbsp; As long as you have<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; hydrogen and oxygen, it is as easy as lighting a match.&nbsp; :)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; We can also recycle water.<BR><BR>&gt;And then you need energy and oxygen, which are presumably in<BR>&gt;lesser supply.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Energy is generally pretty cheep and available in Traveller,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; but making water from hydrogen and oxygen actually does<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; not require energy.&nbsp; Rather, it releases energy.<BR><BR>&gt;I bet it is still cheaper to haul the stuff around certain system (that's<BR>&gt;what is done with gas giants, right?), and perhaps in just the right<BR>&gt;subsector.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I could certainly see shipping water around a system, and there<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; might even be a market for shipping water in some cases.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; For Cr 1000 per ton of cargo, water could be moved for Cr 1 per<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; liter.&nbsp; Buying a liter of water today on Terra can cost you that<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; much, and I would expect it to be more expensive on a desert<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; world.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:28:16 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Water merchants<BR><BR>William Lane writes:<BR>&gt;Well personally i think water can be a viable export. i see no reason why<BR>&gt;tankers can not and should not be developed. might import water to help<BR>&gt;supplement "moister evaporators" (aka starwars in fact i think that is what<BR>&gt;uncle owen farmed was water). also since water can be a commodity going to a<BR>&gt;water world might have restrictions or even fines of skimming water for<BR>&gt;fuel. lets face it governments love to tax things and if they can find any<BR>&gt;half baked reason they will tax it 8P<BR>&gt;For simplicity of the first adventure for both me and them their landing tax<BR>&gt;was just 100 cr. Lucky i did not charge by the ton 8P<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I would expect worlds to generally restrict landing outside of the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; starport, with punishments ranging from stiff fines (Cr 10^4 to<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 10^5) to jail time (or worse for some worlds).&nbsp; Evading customs<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; and immigration rules would be the main concern, and then there<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; is the refueling problem.&nbsp; Unrefined fuel is Cr 100 per ton IIRC.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Why spend Cr 3000 on 30 tons of unrefined fuel (somebody is<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; buying it or it wouldn't be offered for sale) when you can dip into<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; the local ocean for free?&nbsp; The fines would probably have to be<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; high enough that skimming the nearest lake is not an attractive<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; option.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3552<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xd03.mx.aol.com (rly-xd03.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.168]) by air-xd05.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:27:44 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xd03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:27:15 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id KAA60954;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:26:44 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:26:29 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id KAA60903<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:26:28 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:26:28 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101231526.KAA60903@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3552<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3553</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/23/01 11:05:44 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 23 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3553<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>RE: Now I've gone and done it!<BR>Re: Flawed First Survey<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>RE: FS Jetpack under development<BR>Re: Flawed First Survey<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>CT Character Gen software<BR>TNE System<BR>Re: water merchants<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR>Re: water merchants<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Flawed First Survey<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>fnord?<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 08:31:51 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>On Tue, 23 Jan 2001 01:00:26 PST shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Space habs are *fragile*. They are just too damned easy to destroy. Or<BR>&gt;at least to make uninhabitable. They are *big*, and they can't dodge.<BR>&gt;Any reasonable (for a civilian installation) defenses can easily be<BR>&gt;saturated.<BR><BR>Hmmm, right here in my books it talks about making really, really _tough_<BR>space habs out of asteroids...<BR><BR>TL-8 space habs are fragile.<BR><BR>TL-12:16 space habs are not. No more fragile than well-armored starships are.<BR><BR>Also your analysis presumes a constant state of warfare. <BR><BR>Does New York City have defence emplacments everywhere? (and no the Intrepid<BR>doesn't count, the Armory, if it has anything in it anymore, is only small<BR>arms, but doesn't the Salvation Army run it now? and the National Guard base<BR>up at Bear Mountain(?) does have a tank, but it's on a pedestal at the front<BR>gate.) <BR><BR>Does London? Does Hong Kong? Does Tokyo?<BR><BR>This, IMO is the terrible legacy of MT. A peaceful (mainly) Imperium was<BR>turned into a hellish place just so players had an easy way to play with their<BR>big toys.<BR><BR>For the vast majority of it's lifespan, the vast majority of the Third<BR>Imperium was at utter peace.<BR><BR>Even when when the N Frontier Wars were going on, even the Civil War, did not<BR>appreciably affect the VAST MAJORITY of the Third Imperium.<BR><BR>Not until the Black War period of the Rebellion did attacks against Civilian<BR>targets take place, and then mainly in the areas _between_ the factions. <BR><BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:34:08 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Now I've gone and done it!<BR><BR>Robert Angus Smith II writes:<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;He made a big stink about the<BR>&gt;other PC being his aunt, which caused the party to perform genetic tests of<BR>&gt;them both.&nbsp; The tests proved that they were related.&nbsp; It also proved that<BR>&gt;they were both clones.&nbsp; What was not revealed to the rest of the party is<BR>&gt;that the party's geneticist did further testing that proved the DNA clone<BR>&gt;tags in her DNA were artificial (she's the original, not the clone).<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Just curious: what are "clone tags"?&nbsp; Do genetic engineers add<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; some sort of extra DNA to the clone egg?&nbsp; Is this required by the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; technology, some law, or not at all?&nbsp; How did the "tags" get into<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; all of the original's cells?<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 03:23:26 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Flawed First Survey<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Why does the FAQ state that T4's "First Survey" is fundamentally flawed?<BR><BR>Because one of the digits in the UWP is a repeat of the previous digit.<BR>As I recall it's the Government and Law Level digits. Which means that<BR>*all* the UWPs are broken, because they don't really *have* a Law Level<BR>digit thanks to this *stupid* mistake.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 01:11:20 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Or how about that planet in the Hitch Hikers Guide to the Galaxy<BR>&gt;&gt;where they weigh you on arrival and departure and surgically remove<BR>&gt;&gt;any excess mass at departure. 8^0<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Actually -- and seriously -- I was thinking about reversing the situation <BR>&gt; from "The Moon Is Harsh Mistress": import water into the system as a <BR>&gt; side-effect of importing agricultural goods. As a planet, you specialize in <BR>&gt; computer chips or something to trade back. Over time, you'd build up quite a <BR>&gt; lake of the stuff after people are, um, "done" with their grapes and <BR>&gt; Christmas oranges.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Not sure if it would work though -- both in terms of sheer volume of goods <BR>&gt; you'd need to import to make it worthwhile, and because a lot of industrial <BR>&gt; processes use *a lot* of water....<BR><BR>Yes, but the don't "use up" that water. It's either used as a coolant<BR>(and thus can be re-used after passing thru a cooling unit) or it's<BR>used as a convenient solvent, in which case it has to be purified<BR>eventually anyway.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 01:07:01 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Gordon Horne wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; I have never heard a convincing in game answer. IMTU space habitats<BR>&gt;&gt; are ubiquitous.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I haven't yet made a decision on that IMTU.&nbsp; The near-absence of space<BR>&gt; habitats in published material is undesirable to me, but how many do I<BR>&gt; want?&nbsp; Enough that the population of planets pales in comparison?<BR>&gt; They have had thousands of years to develop them, after all.<BR><BR>Bring in the "sustainable tech" thread, try to find a copy of "Outcasts<BR>of the Heaven Belt". I think it's by Joan Vinge. <BR><BR>It's got some damn good reasons *not* to have a extensive space based<BR>civilization in a system without a planet that's habitable with low<BR>tech or no tech.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 08:28:30<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>At 10:14 PM 1/22/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt;OK, just for kicks I set Heaven and Earth to spit out GURPS Traveller/First <BR>&gt;In systems. I'm now having a hard time reconciling what it produces with the <BR>&gt;way worlds are in the Imperium.<BR><BR>Well, that's because the original UWPs weren't linked to any real<BR>scientific process.&nbsp; Just a drunkard's walk of dice and DMs that could<BR>result in some *very* odd worlds.<BR><BR>_First In_ is far more realistic.&nbsp; Much of it is based on _World-Building<BR>by Stephen L. Gillett (Writers Digest Books, 1996).&nbsp; This book is a must<BR>for rigorous planet construction.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I punched in the UWP of a world with a rather odd set of physical stats, a <BR>&gt;"real" one from canon. It's only size 2, but has an essentially Earth-like <BR>&gt;atmosphere and some water. We all know that this world could never exist out <BR>&gt;here in the real universe, but also know that the Classic and MegaTraveller <BR>&gt;worldgen systems would kick out some weird outliers, and we'd all live with <BR>&gt;them. The systems in Scouts and World Builders Handbook nevertheless let you <BR>&gt;continue on detailing these worlds logically, impossible or not.<BR><BR>Well, I'd argue on wether an impossible world is in fact logical.. but<BR>that's not the point.<BR><BR>The point is that a world that small would have to be incredibly dense to<BR>have the gravity to hold an Earth like atmosphere.&nbsp; So _First In_ doesn't<BR>allow it.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;However, when I feed this world to H&amp;E and have it give me a "First In" <BR>&gt;world, it tells me that the world has an atmospheric pressure of 0.0 <BR>&gt;atmospheres, which directly contradicts the UWP. It's a "6", standard <BR>&gt;atmosphere, not a "0". I mean, I realize that a world that small would <BR>&gt;*really* have no atmosphere, but it contradicts what exists about this world <BR>&gt;in canon -- as generated it has a breathable atmosphere, and 0.0 atm isn't <BR>&gt;going to cut it when it comes to generating further details!<BR><BR>Speaking as the Grand Canon Inquisitor, I have to say that this is one of<BR>the places where I merrily break from what was published.&nbsp; Slowly ramp up<BR>the size of the world until it gives you an atmosphere of at least .75<BR>standard surface pressure.<BR><BR>Traveller has always tried for a more hard science take.&nbsp; A larger world<BR>won't change that much about the planet from a role-playing perspective.<BR><BR>&gt;How do I go about generating a GURPS Traveller world that will at least <BR>&gt;vaguely map onto what is "known" about this world? It would seem that the GT <BR>&gt;worldgen system doesn't let you produce (or at least generate more useable <BR>&gt;detail) about quite a large swatch of the worlds in the 3I if it does <BR>&gt;something like this. Do I just ignore the First In rules? Is there another <BR>&gt;system for generating more detail in G:T that doesn't flatly contradict the <BR>&gt;UWP? Come to think, has Traveller entirely moved away from UWPs in G:T?<BR><BR>Yep.&nbsp; And good riddance!&nbsp; Designing a system should give you story ideas.<BR>A cold string of numbers doesn't do that.<BR><BR>&gt;I don't (yet) own any G:T stuff, so my apologies if these are really basic <BR>&gt;questions -- I guess that last one almost certainly is....<BR><BR>Well, I'd recommend _First In_ even over my own work.&nbsp; But I'm a planetary<BR>gearhead (do we need a name for this?), and I love the little details.<BR><BR>- --<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>"I created the universe; give ME the gift certificate!!"<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - Lisa Simpson, Overachiever<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 08:15:46<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: FS Jetpack under development<BR><BR>At 05:29 PM 1/22/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Doug, I didn't know you were doing testing for FS.&nbsp; The SCANDAL!!!!&nbsp; ;)<BR><BR>The term, my dear Jesse, is "industrial espionage..."<BR><BR>Press conference, Gridlore Technologies, LIC<BR><BR>PRESS MOB:&nbsp; "Baron Gridlore! Baron Gridlore!"<BR><BR>GRIDLORE: "Oh, all right.. You. In the ugly yellow jacket."<BR><BR>REPORTER: "Sir, it has been alleged that the new GT "Zowie" High-speed ice<BR>transportation system is in fact nothing but a direct copy of a Famile<BR>Spofulam design.&nbsp; Any comment?"<BR><BR>GRIDLORE: "Bollocks!&nbsp; Heresy!&nbsp; Slander!&nbsp; What possible reason in the 11,000<BR>worlds could they have to make this ridiculous (and actionable) claim?"<BR><BR>REPORTER: "Well, your model *does* seem to have a FS logo worked into the<BR>engine cover.<BR><BR>GRIDLORE: "Press conference over, have a nice day!"<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&nbsp; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>"I am the penguin bold! We sailed the sea, to tringalee,<BR>in search of spanish gold" - The Magic Pudding - Norman Lindsay<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:06:08 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: "William 'Commander X' Prankard" &lt;cmdrx@ao.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Flawed First Survey<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:19:31 <BR>&gt;From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Flawed First Survey<BR><BR>&gt;I've asked this before...any hints on covering CT/MT data back to the M0 <BR>&gt;timeperiod? That way I won't feel like I wasted money getting the volume <BR>&gt;brand new :-)<BR><BR>&gt;Mike<BR><BR>You might like to look at an article I did for Freelance Traveller a while<BR>back.&nbsp; It was a formula for regressing CT/MT UPP data 1000 or so years to<BR>M:0 standards. Based a bit on TNE's collapse rules. <BR><BR>URL: http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/features/rules/1100to0.html<BR><BR>\\&nbsp; &nbsp; //&nbsp; Commander X<BR>\\&nbsp; //&nbsp;&nbsp; CEO X-TEK Industries of Deneb, LIC<BR>&nbsp; T E K&nbsp;&nbsp; Starship Contractor &amp; High Energy Weapons Research<BR>//&nbsp; \\&nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.ao.net/~cmdrx/xtek<BR>//&nbsp; &nbsp; \\&nbsp; 0608 D557777-A kk- va+ so+ zh+ da+ A723<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 11:06:27 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>On Tue, 23 Jan 2001, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; ...But I'm a planetary<BR>&gt; gearhead (do we need a name for this?)...<BR><BR>I think Loren called us rockheads in a JTAS editorial once.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:11:38 EST<BR>From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/22/01 10:17:14 PM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>p_drye@hotmail.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; How do I go about generating a GURPS Traveller world that will at least <BR>&gt;&nbsp; vaguely map onto what is "known" about this world? It would seem that the <BR>GT <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; worldgen system doesn't let you produce (or at least generate more useable <BR>&gt;&nbsp; detail) about quite a large swatch of the worlds in the 3I if it does <BR>&gt;&nbsp; something like this. Do I just ignore the First In rules? Is there another <BR>&gt;&nbsp; system for generating more detail in G:T that doesn't flatly contradict <BR>the <BR>&gt;&nbsp; UWP? Come to think, has Traveller entirely moved away from UWPs in G:T?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; I don't (yet) own any G:T stuff, so my apologies if these are really basic <BR>&gt;&nbsp; questions -- I guess that last one almost certainly is....<BR><BR>Well, it's certainly possible to use _First In_ to flesh out canonical<BR>worlds from Traveller.&nbsp; I do it all the time.&nbsp; I'm not convinced that a<BR>computer program will do a satisfying job of it.<BR><BR>The basic world-design sequence in _First In_ is designed for relative<BR>realism.&nbsp; That means it *will not* give you results similar to those of <BR>the CT world-generation system, if you use it to design worlds at<BR>random and from scratch.<BR><BR>On the other hand, many steps in the sequence have "Traveller Notes"<BR>associated with them, suggesting alternative approaches geared toward<BR>matching CT world-generation more closely.&nbsp; So you can season to taste.<BR>If you use all the Traveller Notes then what you get is fairly close to<BR>canon.<BR><BR>Meanwhile, if you want to take a canonically-generated UWP and flesh<BR>it out using _First In_, you can use the guidelines in the book to do it.<BR>I find that's more an art than a science.&nbsp; You have to decide which<BR>improbable features of a given world you're willing to live with.<BR><BR>For example, when converting those little tiny worlds with dense<BR>atmospheres, I usually just assume really high density (sometimes<BR>several times the density of solid iron) and move on.&nbsp; Of course, at<BR>one point I got so irritated with these situations that I wrapped a<BR>small planet in a plastic bag to keep its atmosphere in. . .<BR><BR>- ----------<BR>Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>set of people who will take offense at it."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:14:25 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: CT Character Gen software<BR><BR>Anybody know of any I can download?<BR>Support for Mercenary &amp; High Guard extended character generation would be <BR>great.<BR><BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>Opinions should be yours too! -- http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>"Tension, apprehension and dissension have begun." -- Alfred Bester<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 09:28:41 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: TNE System<BR><BR>Does anyone know who owns the rights to the GDW House Rules system,<BR>which was the engine for TNE?<BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 17:42:15 GMT<BR>From: TML@stempest.demon.co.uk (Stephen Tempest)<BR>Subject: Re: water merchants<BR><BR>Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt; writes:<BR><BR>&gt;Michael Daumen writes:<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I could certainly see shipping water around a system, and there<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; might even be a market for shipping water in some cases.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; For Cr 1000 per ton of cargo, water could be moved for Cr 1 per<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; liter.&nbsp; Buying a liter of water today on Terra can cost you that<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; much, and I would expect it to be more expensive on a desert<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; world.<BR><BR>"Regina water.&nbsp; From the crisp, sparkling streams and fountains of<BR>Regina.&nbsp; Now available at major retailers all over the Marches for<BR>only Cr2.99 per litre."<BR><BR>Stephen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:21:36 -0600<BR>From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>Gregory Carl Kettler wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; On Tue, 23 Jan 2001, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; ...But I'm a planetary<BR>&gt; &gt; gearhead (do we need a name for this?)...<BR><BR>&gt; I think Loren called us rockheads in a JTAS editorial once.<BR><BR>That beats what I was calling it...planetheading by planetheads. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:31:57 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;&gt; Just one question... how the heck do you do that? :) Is there <BR>&gt;some trick to<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&nbsp; generating stats from Gal24 or have you exported everything into a mammoth<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&nbsp; spreadsheet?<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; I've been dumping various people's sector notes into a giant<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; spreadsheet. Who did what is lost to the mists of time, in part<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; because i edit the data so everything has the same detail, in part<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; because i've kept lousy records 8^(<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Nice one. Any chance of making it available?<BR><BR>Well... i haven't kept very good notes as to who i got the various <BR>sectors from. I suppose i could look for each of them again but IIRC <BR>it's not always clear where they got the data. Without proper credits <BR>i don't think i should make it available.<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; g<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:35:33 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: water merchants<BR><BR>On Tue, 23 Jan 2001, Stephen Tempest wrote:<BR>&gt; "Regina water.&nbsp; From the crisp, sparkling streams and fountains of<BR>&gt; Regina.&nbsp; Now available at major retailers all over the Marches for<BR>&gt; only Cr2.99 per litre."<BR><BR>This could be labelled as something along the lines of Evian (bottled<BR>water available at least in many European countries), like<BR>Daehenob<BR>Diputs<BR>Elbillug<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:35:18 -0600<BR>From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>JFZeigler@aol.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In a message dated 1/22/01 10:17:14 PM Eastern Standard Time,<BR>&gt; p_drye@hotmail.com writes:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; How do I go about generating a GURPS Traveller world that will at least<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; vaguely map onto what is "known" about this world? It would seem that the<BR>&gt; GT<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; worldgen system doesn't let you produce (or at least generate more useable<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; detail) about quite a large swatch of the worlds in the 3I if it does<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; something like this. Do I just ignore the First In rules? Is there another<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; system for generating more detail in G:T that doesn't flatly contradict<BR>&gt; the<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; UWP? Come to think, has Traveller entirely moved away from UWPs in G:T?<BR><BR>Traveller hasn't, but the GURPS Traveller variant seems to have. Unlike<BR>Doug, I still want to see that "cold string of numbers" next to a<BR>planet's name. &lt;g&gt;&nbsp; Of course, that is just the beginning of the<BR>description, not the end of it. <BR><BR>&gt; Well, it's certainly possible to use _First In_ to flesh out canonical<BR>&gt; worlds from Traveller.&nbsp; I do it all the time.&nbsp; I'm not convinced that a<BR>&gt; computer program will do a satisfying job of it.<BR><BR>I use the computer program to give me a "first draft" image of a system.<BR>Once I have a first draft that looks interesting, and sparks some ideas,<BR>I start modifying, tweaking, and fleshing it out. <BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; For example, when converting those little tiny worlds with dense<BR>&gt; atmospheres, I usually just assume really high density (sometimes<BR>&gt; several times the density of solid iron) and move on.&nbsp; Of course, at<BR>&gt; one point I got so irritated with these situations that I wrapped a<BR>&gt; small planet in a plastic bag to keep its atmosphere in. . .<BR><BR>I put a plastic bag around one, used ancient tech gravity enhancers on<BR>another, and wrapped a third in nanomachines that kept the air in. &lt;g&gt; <BR><BR>For most really small worlds with thin+ atmospheres I go with "space<BR>habitats."&nbsp; I convert the world into one, or more, very large Oneil<BR>pairs with the atmosphere and population on the inside of the counter<BR>rotating cylinders. In this case the "diameter" of the main world is a<BR>fiction and what is really being measured is the habital interior<BR>surface area. <BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:35:33 -0000<BR>From: "Stuart Ferris" &lt;stuart.ferris@virgin.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>The crux of the matter is that 'First In' doesn't handle 'canon' worlds very<BR>well.<BR><BR>'First In' takes a scientific approach to System creation and is better<BR>suited to creating worlds from scratch.<BR><BR>The 'canon' worlds are simply randomly generated numbers based on a very<BR>simple die and table format. There is absolutely no science involved at all.<BR><BR>The dilemma I had when writing the routines for GURPS System Generation was<BR>staying faithful to the rules, but still maintaining 'canon' data.<BR><BR>Stuart Ferris<BR>stuart.ferris@virgin.net<BR>http://freespace.virgin.net/stuart.ferris/index.htm<BR><BR>"A people should know when they're conquered"<BR>Quintus Magnus, Regimental Commander, Army of the North<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:42:47 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; ...But I'm a planetary<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &gt; gearhead (do we need a name for this?)...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; I think Loren called us rockheads in a JTAS editorial once.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;That beats what I was calling it...planetheading by planetheads. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>I like rockheads. Loren, do you want to claim credit for coining the term?<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:45:35 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: Flawed First Survey<BR><BR>Gregory Carl Kettler wrote:<BR>&gt; On Tue, 23 Jan 2001 knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; None of the important locations mentioned in M:0 can be reliably located.<BR>&gt;&gt; In particular, the Chasetin Kingdom's location is uncertain.&nbsp; This is<BR>&gt;&gt; unforgivable for those of us who wanted to play out the last days of the<BR>&gt;&gt; Sylean Confederation.<BR><BR>&gt;That's disturbing, since I bought M:0 Campaign not 48 hours ago and have<BR>&gt;discovered I like the setting.&nbsp; Is there any unofficial consensus on this<BR>&gt;list as to where such things are actually located?&nbsp; Same goes for usable <BR>&gt;UWP's: did anyone ever come up with any?<BR><BR>For de-glitched UWPs, I remember seeing a big file of them on a website someplace (cue maintainer of said website).<BR><BR>As for locating the worlds mentioned in the text, your best bet is to try and track down issues 9 &amp; 10 of the Traveller's Digest (Roger Sanger probably has them, I'm pretty sure nobleknight.com does too).&nbsp; These issues have extensive historical Library Data for Core Sector which forms the basis of much of the M:0 text, as well as maps of 4 subsectors c. 1100.&nbsp; Between the two, you'll have a pretty good idea where everything's supposed to be, even if you have to crank back the UWPs by hand.<BR><BR>Which brings me to the fundamental underlying flaw of First Survey (as opposed to the fundamental obvious flaw of the Law Level glitch):&nbsp; the UWPs make absolutely no concession to what we know of these worlds from later (which is to say earlier) canon.&nbsp; Through the Traveller's Digest and other sources we've got relatively detailed historical and cultural info on quite a few worlds and regions, basically none of which is reflected in the random UWPs of First Survey.&nbsp; I don't have the sources in front of me right now, but I specifically remember instances of worlds which had been described as significant cultural centers which in FS have a different name, Pop. Code of 2-3, and Pre-Stellar Tech.&nbsp; Sure a lot can change in 1000 years, but that's excuse-making when the fact of the matter is that this data plain and simply wasn't checked over or thought about to any significant degree.<BR><BR>My recommendation for how to use FS is to take the maps and physical-digits from the Players' section and then generate the rest by hand, using the TD Library Data as a guide if you have it.&nbsp; This method could not possibly be any more arbitrary or canon-breaking than the 'official' product, and is likely to be a good deal less-so (since you'll probably only be doing a subsector or two at a time and, G*d forbid, actually putting some thought into it).<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>P.S.&nbsp; Back when FS was first announced, it was to consist of only the Player's Data (positions and physical UWP) for 49 Sectors, causing a great outcry on the TML that such a book would be useless: "We *need* full UWPs for every world!".&nbsp; However, in retrospect, would that have really been any more useless than what we actually got?&nbsp; At least you wouldn't have to feel like you're violating Sacred Canon every time you adjust something so that it actually makes sense.<BR><BR>(Sorry for the length of this post, but the FS fiasco is one of my most dearly-held Traveller grudges, and I'm rarely given such a golden opportunity to rail against it in public)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:52:00 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt;Well, it's certainly possible to use _First In_ to flesh out canonical<BR>&gt;worlds from Traveller.&nbsp; I do it all the time.&nbsp; I'm not convinced that a<BR>&gt;computer program will do a satisfying job of it.<BR><BR>Me neither. I actually use the computer program (and, in the past, just <BR>running the WBH system with dice) to start the Rube Goldberg machine in my <BR>head going "ka-chunk, ka-chunk, ka-chunk". I find that trying to justify at <BR>some of the weird juxtapositions I get produces very interesting results. <BR>This is particularly true for the social data -- there is, alas, less room <BR>to maneuver on the physical characteristics.<BR><BR>To give an example, at least two of the most interesting thoughts I've had <BR>regarding my current world project's societies have started with me saying <BR>"That couldn't happen...no, wait maybe it could...." about something the <BR>random numbers produced.<BR><BR>One brilliant thing about real-world history is that you can find almost <BR>anything in it if you dig deeply enough. File off the serial numbers and mix <BR>and match the relevant cases appropriately, and you can produce some <BR>fantastically fun and unobvious societies. No blatant ripoffs of the Chinese <BR>(or something) for me!<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 11:00:07 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: fnord?<BR><BR>&nbsp; I don't know if it's on-line or not (probably is...) but TML'ers<BR>would be well-advised _not_ to read todays "Bizarro" comic...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:58:39 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt;The crux of the matter is that 'First In' doesn't handle 'canon' worlds <BR>&gt;very well.<BR><BR>Indeed. That was actually what I was thrusting at. My "real" question, now <BR>that I've had a chance to think about it, is "How is this handled in <BR>'official' publications?" I mean, understand that they've done the Spinward <BR>Marches and the Solomani Rim (again!), so did they just stick with what <BR>existed on the "impossible" worlds, or did SJ Games surreptitiously jigger <BR>them so that they all match what First In could spit out?<BR><BR>&gt;The dilemma I had when writing the routines for GURPS System Generation was <BR>&gt;staying faithful to the rules, but still maintaining 'canon' data.<BR><BR>I can see where you'd have a problem in that you punch in the UWP, yet also <BR>use the G:T rules despite UWPs being done away with there -- I hadn't <BR>realized they'd done that.<BR><BR>Still love the map generator in H&amp;E, Stuart. Inventing a world map from <BR>whole cloth was such a pain before. Now with that feature it takes far less <BR>time.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 19:02:56 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt;The dilemma I had when writing the routines for GURPS System &gt;Generation <BR>&gt;was staying faithful to the rules, but still maintaining &gt;'canon' data.<BR><BR>I think that's when you fudge the GT: First In results. IIRC that's what <BR>John recommended in a sidebar...<BR><BR>In this thread Doug mentioned the book "world buidling" I can recommend it <BR>heartily. Espically for someone lacking a hard science background like me <BR>:-) It has a companion about generating alien races as well. That volume is <BR>great for Traveller GM's as well.<BR><BR>Mike<BR><BR><BR>- ----Original Message Follows----<BR>From: "Stuart Ferris" &lt;stuart.ferris@virgin.net&gt;<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:35:33 -0000<BR><BR>The crux of the matter is that 'First In' doesn't handle 'canon' worlds very<BR>well.<BR><BR>'First In' takes a scientific approach to System creation and is better<BR>suited to creating worlds from scratch.<BR><BR>The 'canon' worlds are simply randomly generated numbers based on a very<BR>simple die and table format. There is absolutely no science involved at all.<BR><BR>The dilemma I had when writing the routines for GURPS System Generation was<BR>staying faithful to the rules, but still maintaining 'canon' data.<BR><BR>Stuart Ferris<BR>stuart.ferris@virgin.net<BR>http://freespace.virgin.net/stuart.ferris/index.htm<BR><BR>"A people should know when they're conquered"<BR>Quintus Magnus, Regimental Commander, Army of the North<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3553<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yb04.mx.aol.com (rly-yb04.mail.aol.com [172.18.146.4]) by air-yb04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:05:44 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yb04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:05:11 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id OAA69852;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:03:46 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:03:29 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id OAA69806<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:03:29 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:03:29 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101231903.OAA69806@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3553<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3554</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/23/01 1:15:41 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 23 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3554<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Flawed First Survey<BR>Re: CT Character Gen software<BR>Re: Flawed First Survey<BR>re: TNE System<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>re: TNE System<BR>Way OT: AIDs _pandemic_<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Pops, TLs &amp; wealth...<BR>Re: fnord?<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:39:16 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; For example, when converting those little tiny worlds with dense<BR>&gt; atmospheres, I usually just assume really high density (sometimes<BR>&gt; several times the density of solid iron) and move on.&nbsp; Of course, at<BR>&gt; one point I got so irritated with these situations that I wrapped a<BR>&gt; small planet in a plastic bag to keep its atmosphere in. . .<BR><BR>Actually, try sitting down and working out *how long* it'll take the<BR>atmosphere to go from "standard" to thin enough to require breathing<BR>gear. <BR><BR>The answer depends on a number of assumptions we can't easily check,<BR>but the error bars for the Moon go back *beyond* the Ancients, as I<BR>recall. <BR><BR>That is, a *lot* of places could have been given an atmosphere by the<BR>Ancients, and still have a breathable, if thin atmosphere *now*. <BR><BR>It pays to remember that all those formula in the books *don't* say "A<BR>small world can't have a breathable atmosphere". They say "a small<BR>world can't *keep* a breathable atmosphere OVER GEOLOGICAL TIMESPANS."<BR>*Big* difference.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 19:29:51 -0000<BR>From: "Stuart Ferris" &lt;stuart.ferris@virgin.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt;Still love the map generator in H&amp;E, Stuart. Inventing a world map from<BR>&gt;whole cloth was such a pain before. Now with that feature it takes far<BR>&gt;less time.<BR><BR>I'm hoping to refine it even further, so that coastlines are created more<BR>realistically. i.e jagged, uneven coastlines.<BR><BR>Stuart Ferris<BR>stuart.ferris@virgin.net<BR>http://freespace.virgin.net/stuart.ferris/index.htm<BR><BR>"A people should know when they're conquered"<BR>Quintus Magnus, Regimental Commander, Army of the North<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:32:50 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt;That is, a *lot* of places could have been given an atmosphere by the<BR>&gt;Ancients, and still have a breathable, if thin atmosphere *now*.<BR><BR>And this is, in fact, one of the "interesting thoughts" I've had about my <BR>current project.<BR><BR>You can use the Ancients to justify a lot. I try to avoid using them, <BR>otherwise it gets boring, but one other place they've popped up is as an <BR>excuse for the chemically-unlikely (yet still a science-fiction chestnut) <BR>world with a fluorine atmosphere.<BR><BR>The Ancients are entirely too out in the open these days. At the risk of <BR>showing my munchkin-ness, I remember the days back before it was even clear <BR>that they were the Droyne and they were much more interesting when they were <BR>mysterious. I won't say I take notes when I watch the X-Files, but I try to <BR>introduce that sort of shifting-sand mysteriousness (mysteriosity?) when it <BR>comes to dealing with them. My attitude is "Weird hyperpowerful devices have <BR>been done to death, let's try for something obscure." Try to use Arthur C. <BR>Clarke's plenary indulgence to do something odd, you know? Something like an <BR>"impossible" world is fun.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 11:43:44 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt; Actually, try sitting down and working out *how long* it'll take the<BR>&gt; atmosphere to go from "standard" to thin enough to require breathing<BR>&gt; gear. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The answer depends on a number of assumptions we can't easily check,<BR>&gt; but the error bars for the Moon go back *beyond* the Ancients, as I<BR>&gt; recall. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; That is, a *lot* of places could have been given an atmosphere by the<BR>&gt; Ancients, and still have a breathable, if thin atmosphere *now*. <BR><BR>Aside from the size-1 worlds (the moon is size-2) that does help a lot.<BR>Unfortunately, there's a bunch of size-1 worlds with breathable atmospheres<BR>as well (of course, you can just boost them to size 2).<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 11:47:07 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Craig Berry &lt;cberry@cinenet.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Flawed First Survey<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 03:23:26 PST<BR>&gt; From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Why does the FAQ state that T4's "First Survey" is fundamentally flawed?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Because one of the digits in the UWP is a repeat of the previous digit.<BR>&gt; As I recall it's the Government and Law Level digits. Which means that<BR>&gt; *all* the UWPs are broken, because they don't really *have* a Law Level<BR>&gt; digit thanks to this *stupid* mistake.<BR><BR>And beyond this (as if more is needed), the worlds and political entities<BR>as described in FS fail horribly to match information provided in other<BR>Milieu 0 sources.&nbsp; For example, a world described as the capital of a<BR>strong pocket empire, the breaking of which was key to the expansion of<BR>the young Imperium, has (IIRC) pop level 4.&nbsp; Hardy warriors indeed!<BR><BR>First Survey, like too many of the Imperium Games products, was what I<BR>like to call "fractally broken" -- not merely bad, but bad on every scale,<BR>with pockets of small badness concealed within larger badnesses, bad from <BR>any analytical viewpoint, self-similarly bad.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; Craig Berry - http://www.cinenet.net/~cberry/<BR>--*--&nbsp; "The hills are burning, and the wind is raging; and the clock<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; strikes midnight in the Garden of Allah." - Don Henley<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 19:56:14 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: CT Character Gen software<BR><BR>on 23/1/01 5:14 pm, Mark Urbin at urbin@bigfoot.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Anybody know of any I can download?<BR>&gt; Support for Mercenary &amp; High Guard extended character generation would be<BR>&gt; great.<BR><BR>Jeremy Reaban produced travcgen, a Windows 95 VB program for CT chracters.<BR>It may not be sufficient in that it generates Book 1/Supplement 4<BR>characters. <BR><BR>http://members.nbci.com/lamorak/util.html<BR><BR>Gregory Svenson produced MTCG, which is for MegaTraveller. It produces more<BR>advanced characters using the MegaTraveller rules under DOS, more akin to<BR>books 4-7. It could serve your purposes, and the source code (in C, for some<BR>nasty DOS IDE) is available.<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Hollow/5776/traveller.html<BR><BR>Peter Keel modified the sources of MTCG to the more common Makefile method<BR>used in Unix/POSIX systems. This will compile under Linux, BSD, and<BR>Darwin/MacOS X. You could also compile it for Cygwin, the GNU environment<BR>for Windows systems.<BR><BR>http://killer.discordia.ch/Roleplay/Traveller/Software/<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 19:49:00 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Flawed First Survey<BR><BR>At 10:26 -0500 23/1/01,&nbsp; Gregory Carl Kettler <BR>&lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; None of the important locations mentioned in M:0 can be reliably located.<BR>&gt; &gt; In particular, the Chasetin Kingdom's location is uncertain.&nbsp; This is<BR>&gt; &gt; unforgivable for those of us who wanted to play out the last days of the<BR>&gt; &gt; Sylean Confederation.<BR>&gt;That's disturbing, since I bought M:0 Campaign not 48 hours ago and have<BR>&gt;discovered I like the setting.&nbsp; Is there any unofficial consensus on this<BR>&gt;list as to where such things are actually located?&nbsp; Same goes for usable<BR>&gt;UWP's: did anyone ever come up with any?<BR><BR>Marc Miller posted a fixed version of the data - I'm not sure if all <BR>the bugs were worked out. It should be at the Missouri Archive <BR>(linked from BITS jumpsite page).<BR><BR>I have posted a number of times on this but have lost the emails in a <BR>hard drive crash. Will pull a back up out and go hunting....<BR><BR>Santry and Cordova are wrong (text is done by Jo Grant and <BR>astrography wasn't always his best).<BR><BR>Keshi is the capital of the Chanestin Kingdom, but has stats wrong. <BR>I'd suggest that it's post reprisals.<BR><BR>If you email me direct it'll serve as a reminder to dig the stuff out.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:01:35 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: re: TNE System<BR><BR>&gt;From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: TNE System<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Does anyone know who owns the rights to the GDW House Rules system,<BR>&gt;which was the engine for TNE?<BR><BR>&nbsp; Hmm, that was used in TNE, T:2K2e/Merc2K, C&amp;D, and what else?<BR>Didn't Dark Conspiracy use it too after a bit?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:07:14 -0800<BR>From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson) wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; The problem is that in much of the 3rd world, the lack of social<BR>&gt; &gt; support networks, combined with the use of children as cheap<BR>&gt; &gt; agricultural labor means that having large families is an economic<BR>&gt; &gt; good for most people in such places. The problem is not "the dead<BR>&gt; &gt; hand of tradition" but present day economic realities.&nbsp; As the<BR>&gt; &gt; various nations develop their population growth declines rapidly. <BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; IMHO, that's one of the primary reasons First World nations should<BR>&gt; &gt; finance development efforts.&nbsp; W/o them, the third world will become<BR>&gt; &gt; *really* ugly in a few decades, and such problems can easily spread,<BR>&gt; &gt; since nations like the US and France have been quite happy to sell<BR>&gt; &gt; some of those nations advanced weapons. Change the economics and the<BR>&gt; &gt; traditions will change in a generation or less.&nbsp; The history of the<BR>&gt; &gt; 20th century proves this quite well. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Well, the overpopulation problem in most of Africa, and a good chunk<BR>&gt; of Asia is going to be an *underpopulation* problem soon. AIDs is<BR>&gt; *endemic*. And it's going to make the black Death look like a bad<BR>&gt; cold.<BR><BR>Very true.&nbsp; It's interesting to note that for around the last 40 years <BR>(I've not seen data from before the 60s) population projections have <BR>been consistently higher than the actual results. The maximum <BR>projected world population has been consistently dropping.&nbsp; The <BR>most recent UN projections which include mortality from AIDs have <BR>dropped even more.&nbsp; I think the current figure is now a bit under 10 <BR>billion.&nbsp; It looks like we will (thankfully) never reach Pop A.&nbsp; <BR><BR>I'm also curious what the mid to long-term results of China one-<BR>child policy and the resulting jump in female infanticide.&nbsp; Anyone <BR>here know if the sex ration in the PRC is noticeably skewed yet?&nbsp; It <BR>could be really ugly there in a few decades.<BR><BR>- -John Snead sneadj@mindspring.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 15:07:50 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: "John P. Raynor" &lt;john.raynor@yale.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>On Tue, 23 Jan 2001, Paul Drye wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The Ancients are entirely too out in the open these days. At the risk of<BR>&gt; showing my munchkin-ness, I remember the days back before it was even clear<BR>&gt; that they were the Droyne and they were much more interesting when they were<BR>&gt; mysterious. I won't say I take notes when I watch the X-Files, but I try to<BR>&gt; introduce that sort of shifting-sand mysteriousness (mysteriosity?) when it<BR>&gt; comes to dealing with them. My attitude is "Weird hyperpowerful devices have<BR>&gt; been done to death, let's try for something obscure." Try to use Arthur C.<BR>&gt; Clarke's plenary indulgence to do something odd, you know? Something like an<BR>&gt; "impossible" world is fun.<BR><BR>I agree, that the Ancients are over-used and over-explained.&nbsp; As far as<BR>I'm concerned, citizens of the Third Imperium should find the Ancients<BR>utterly inexplicable.&nbsp; Think of a paleolithic hunter visiting the wreckage<BR>of a computer programmer's office, after the office took a glancing blow<BR>from an atomic weapon.&nbsp; Forget about the computer!&nbsp; The *plastic coffee<BR>cup* sitting on the desk would be wonderful and nearly incomprehensible to<BR>somebody who has never seen pottery, and never encountered anything that<BR>isn't made of an instantly recognizable natural material.&nbsp; And the<BR>technological between the computer programmer (Tech Level 7-8) and the<BR>paleolithic hunter (Tech Level 0) is probably *smaller* than the gap<BR>between the Ancients and the Third Imperium!<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - J. Raynor<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:09:33 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Craig Berry &lt;cberry@cinenet.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 08:28:30<BR>&gt; From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The point is that a world that small would have to be incredibly dense to<BR>&gt; have the gravity to hold an Earth like atmosphere.&nbsp; So _First In_ doesn't<BR>&gt; allow it.<BR><BR>...because _First In_ is looking at worlds which evolve in relative<BR>isolation, and which haven't been subject to terraforming or other<BR>technical intrusions.&nbsp; In a universe featuring the Ancients, just about<BR>*anything* on a planetary scale can be handwaved.&nbsp; The only problem is<BR>that, as others have pointed out, the original random UPP creation system<BR>results in so many implausible worlds that the handwave density becomes<BR>rather extreme.&nbsp; This is ill-suited to a 'hard-SF' game feel (though great<BR>for space opera).<BR><BR>As for the specific problem of a 2,000 mile diameter world having an<BR>Earthlike atmoshphere, the following dodges spring immediately to mind.<BR><BR>* A Nivenesque "Smoke Ring" situation aorund a neutron star or black hole.<BR>&nbsp; Gases are in equilibrium throughout a toroidal volume, concentrating<BR>&nbsp; around the planet.<BR><BR>* The Ancients or another culture dumped a very dense atmosphere on the<BR>&nbsp; world, perhaps originally supplemented by gravity generators or the<BR>&nbsp; like to hold it in place.&nbsp; The air has been leaking away ever since;<BR>&nbsp; the current situation is a temporary "sweet spot" on the long slide<BR>&nbsp; to vacuum -- though it will be millennia yet before the atmosphere<BR>&nbsp; is too thin to breathe without assistance.<BR><BR>* The air is only breathable part-time.&nbsp; A very elliptical orbit,<BR>&nbsp; implausibly variable star, or complex multi-star system thaw out<BR>&nbsp; an otherwise vacuum-iceball world now and then, creating a brief<BR>&nbsp; 'summer' during which the frozen atmosphere sublimes and local<BR>&nbsp; life comes out of hibernation in a frenzy of activity.&nbsp; This is<BR>&nbsp; another way to have a breathable atmosphere last longer than it<BR>&nbsp; otherwise would on such a small world.&nbsp; (See _A Deepness in the<BR>&nbsp; Sky_ for a great portrayal of this happening to an Earth-sized<BR>&nbsp; planet.)<BR><BR>* The planet is incredibly dense; an accident of timing and location<BR>&nbsp; allowed this star system to codense from the extremely rich residue<BR>&nbsp; of a large supernova, and further sorting and condensation processes<BR>&nbsp; caused a whole lot of heavy elements to end up in this planet's core,<BR>&nbsp; and quite a bit in the crust as well.&nbsp; Mining will be a key industry<BR>&nbsp; here; there will also probably be a lot of scientists studying<BR>&nbsp; the uniquely metal-rich planets and star.<BR><BR>&gt; Speaking as the Grand Canon Inquisitor, I have to say that this is one of<BR>&gt; the places where I merrily break from what was published.&nbsp; Slowly ramp up<BR>&gt; the size of the world until it gives you an atmosphere of at least .75<BR>&gt; standard surface pressure.<BR><BR>That's the sensible thing to do most of the time, of course.&nbsp; Too many<BR>handwaves spoils the soup.<BR><BR>&gt; Yep.&nbsp; And good riddance!&nbsp; Designing a system should give you story ideas.<BR>&gt; A cold string of numbers doesn't do that.<BR><BR>Well, it does me. :)&nbsp; (Then again, I find numbers kinda warm and fuzzy.)<BR><BR>&gt; Well, I'd recommend _First In_ even over my own work.<BR><BR>You know, come to think of it, you'd imagine _Ground Forces_ would<BR>include sections on plate tectonics and so forth...<BR><BR>&gt; But I'm a planetary gearhead (do we need a name for this?),<BR><BR>Given the Latin root of the base word and the appropriate feel, how about<BR>"terrarist"? :)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; Craig Berry - http://www.cinenet.net/~cberry/<BR>--*--&nbsp; "The hills are burning, and the wind is raging; and the clock<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; strikes midnight in the Garden of Allah." - Don Henley<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:16:13 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Craig Berry &lt;cberry@cinenet.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:35:33 -0000<BR>&gt; From: "Stuart Ferris" &lt;stuart.ferris@virgin.net&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The 'canon' worlds are simply randomly generated numbers based on a very<BR>&gt; simple die and table format. There is absolutely no science involved at<BR>&gt; all. <BR><BR>Not quite; the size is a straight random 2D-2 roll, but after that<BR>atmoshphere is influenced by size (larger worlds tend to have denser<BR>atmospheres) and hydrographic percentage by atmosphere (denser atmospheres<BR>tend to cover more water).&nbsp; Admittedly it's crude and still leads to<BR>absurd situations, but it's not 'absolutely no science'.&nbsp; More like<BR>'pathetically little science'. :)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; Craig Berry - http://www.cinenet.net/~cberry/<BR>--*--&nbsp; "The hills are burning, and the wind is raging; and the clock<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; strikes midnight in the Garden of Allah." - Don Henley<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:16:27 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: TNE System<BR><BR>TNE, T2K2, Merc 2000, Cadillacs and Dinosaurs, and Dark Conspiracy. <BR>That's the one.&nbsp; The reason I'm asking is that there are a few people<BR>who'd evinced an interest in converting certain games to this system,<BR>but as it is no longer available, they've asked if copies could be made<BR>available.<BR><BR>I'd like to do it all nice and legal, ya know.<BR><BR>- --- Steven Hudson &lt;shudson@lightspeed.ca&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Subject: TNE System<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Does anyone know who owns the rights to the GDW House Rules system,<BR>&gt; &gt;which was the engine for TNE?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Hmm, that was used in TNE, T:2K2e/Merc2K, C&amp;D, and what else?<BR>&gt; Didn't Dark Conspiracy use it too after a bit?<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:25:57 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Way OT: AIDs _pandemic_<BR><BR>on 23/1/01 9:04 am, Leonard Erickson at shadow@krypton.rain.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Well, the overpopulation problem in most of Africa, and a good chunk of<BR>&gt; Asia is going to be an *underpopulation* problem soon. AIDs is<BR>&gt; *endemic*. And it's going to make the black Death look like a bad cold.<BR><BR>Incorrect. It's much worse than that. The population isn't going down, the<BR>mortality rate is increasing, which means a reduction in the proportion of<BR>able-bodied folk of working age, but within a still growing population. More<BR>than 14 million Africans have already died without a reduction in the<BR>continents population.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:04:57 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; On Tue, 23 Jan 2001 00:43:52 PST shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Very true, but have any of these prevented you from adopting<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; technology to apply them?<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; No, but in our history the problems the rules were set up to prevent<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; have never included "disaster caused by over-reliance on unsustainable<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; technology".<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Actually, that *has* happened to *several* cultures right here on<BR>&gt;&gt;Earth. The folks who built Angkor Wat to name the best known example. I<BR>&gt;&gt;forget the exact details of that one.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Actually, didn't Ankor Wat fall prey to eing invaded?<BR><BR>The *culture* ended due to failure of their agricultural system. <BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Another was a culture in Mexico(?) that had extensive irrigation<BR>&gt;&gt;systems using water from a huge dam they'd built up over several<BR>&gt;&gt;generations.&nbsp; Then the dam failed. And they realized there was no way<BR>&gt;&gt;to get it repaired well enough to grow the crops they'd need to support<BR>&gt;&gt;the current population. So they just abandoned their "city", and spread<BR>&gt;&gt;back out into the surrounding territories so that they'd be able to<BR>&gt;&gt;live off the land (luckily they still knew how).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I've never heard that one,<BR><BR>It's a pretty limited example, but very instructive. They failed before<BR>getting completely committed to the agricultural society bit, *and* it<BR>happened someplace that didn't get messed with much until later. <BR><BR>I seem to recall that it was part of a program on "lost cultures" or<BR>some such that I saw a few years back. <BR><BR>I think they spotted the remains of the dam while surveying for (of all<BR>things!) a dam to provide water for irrigation. And they called in the<BR>archeologists to check out the site.<BR><BR>&gt; but the Mayan culture probably failed due to<BR>&gt; over-reliance on irrigation and subsequent crop failures. There's more and<BR>&gt; more evidence coming to light of pperiodic and worsening famines in the area;<BR>&gt; eventually, as you said, they just gave up and spread back out. That this was<BR>&gt; sustainable was simply because their population had crashed some 95% by now,<BR>&gt; and most of the people still left alive were the ones who were subsistence<BR>&gt; farming out in the sticks _anyway_. <BR><BR>Well, this one hadn't gotten big enough *to* have as much of a crash.<BR>It's thought that they looked at the dam, looked at the crops dying for<BR>lack of water, and at all the work it'd take to fix things and basicly<BR>went "The hell with it!".<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 15:24:18 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Pops, TLs &amp; wealth...<BR><BR>&gt;Well, the overpopulation problem in most of Africa, and a good chunk of<BR>&gt;Asia is going to be an *underpopulation* problem soon. AIDs is<BR>&gt;*endemic*. And it's going to make the black Death look like a bad cold.<BR><BR>Good observation.&nbsp; Also remember that parts of Asia can afford the <BR>combination drugs that keeps HIV+ folk alive &amp; reasonably healthy.&nbsp; Those <BR>parts that can't afford it...refer back to the 'it gonna get ugly' comments.<BR><BR><BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>Opinions should be yours too! - http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>"What's a FAQ? Boy, I wish someone would put a list of answers<BR>for common questions such as this..."<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 21:33:16 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: fnord?<BR><BR>Steven Hudson wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; I don't know if it's on-line or not (probably is...) but TML'ers<BR>&gt; would be well-advised _not_ to read todays "Bizarro" comic...<BR><BR>http://www.ucomics.com/bizarro/<BR><BR>And&nbsp;yes, I agree. Don't read it.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 21:38:03 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>Gregory Carl Kettler wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; ...But I'm a planetary<BR>&gt; &gt; gearhead (do we need a name for this?)...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I think Loren called us rockheads in a JTAS editorial once.<BR><BR>Does that make Modular Cutter fans 'blockheads' ?<BR><BR>*ducks for cover*<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:36:16 -0800<BR>From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson) wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; The out of game answer is that it is a historical accident. The<BR>&gt; &gt; original designers didn't put space habitats or space industry in<BR>&gt; &gt; the rules. Some early supplements - e.g., Belter - did have habitats<BR>&gt; &gt; and off planet industry, but they were only broadly described and<BR>&gt; &gt; were not presented in game terms. Asteroid worlds, of course, are<BR>&gt; &gt; space habitats, but other than a UWP Size of 0 they are not<BR>&gt; &gt; distinguished from other worlds. Also, i don't recall off hand<BR>&gt; &gt; seeing a canon asteroid world that was not built into the asteroid<BR>&gt; &gt; itself rather than in free space.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; I have never heard a convincing in game answer. IMTU space habitats<BR>&gt; &gt; are ubiquitous.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; There's a fairly simple reason, given OTU history. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Space habs are *fragile*. They are just too damned easy to destroy. Or<BR>&gt; at least to make uninhabitable. They are *big*, and they can't dodge.<BR>&gt; Any reasonable (for a civilian installation) defenses can easily be<BR>&gt; saturated. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; And for that matter, things like solar flares mean you want a few<BR>&gt; *feet* of shielding between you and the star. <BR><BR>Actually, shielding is no problem.&nbsp; Canonically, superdense and <BR>bonded superdense are both as cheap as steel is for us. Both stop <BR>radiation *far* better than steel (and equal thickness of superdense <BR>stops 10 million x as much radiation, while bonded superdense <BR>stops 100 million x as much as steel). BOth are also considerably <BR>better than an equal thickness of lead. 5 cm of superdense or 2.5 <BR>cm of bonded superdense should be enough shielding for pretty <BR>much any purpose, as well as providing reasonable armor.&nbsp; <BR>Coincidentally, that's around the same thickness as standard <BR>starship hulls are in MT (armor 40).<BR><BR>For even greater protection, go the Larry Niven route, and find a <BR>nickel-iron asteroid, bore a hole though the center, fill the hole with <BR>bags of water, cap the ends, spin it, and heat it with solar mirrors <BR>until it melts.&nbsp; As the water turns to steam you'll get a nice big <BR>bubble of nickel-iron ready for habitation as soon as this cools <BR>(Niven used someone's [I forget who] serious proposal for this, it <BR>looks like this method would actually work.&nbsp; If you are careful, you <BR>could easily get a hull several meters thick. 5 meters of nickel-iron <BR>will protect you from just about any threat short of meson guns and <BR>nukes (including the worst solar flares imaginable).<BR><BR>- -John Snead sneadj@mindspring.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:12:29 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR><BR>After nearly a week of supreme disinterest i have decided to reveal <BR>the solution to the puzzle of A Few Minor Worlds.<BR><BR>You will remember (come on... just nod and say yes):<BR>Tordesillas (Gaea 0610)&nbsp; &nbsp; E-26793D-7 Rs&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 134 Tw G2V Solitary<BR><BR>Rurik&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 0860)&nbsp; &nbsp; D-3679DC-8 Po Rs&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 134 Eb G2V Solitary<BR><BR>Jewel&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 0820)&nbsp; &nbsp; E-267947-7 Hi&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 934 Tw G2V Solitary<BR><BR>Jung-Zei&nbsp; &nbsp; (Gaea 1035)&nbsp; &nbsp; D-267A8G-7 Hi Ag&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 134 Cn G2V Solitary<BR><BR>Usonia&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (Gaea 1040)&nbsp; &nbsp; C-267943-9 Ri&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 334 Fw G2V Solitary<BR><BR>Cabotia&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 1060)&nbsp; &nbsp; E-267849-9 Lo Ag Rs&nbsp; &nbsp; 334 Fw G2V Solitary<BR><BR>Barton&nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 1325)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; E-267847-9&nbsp; Lo Ag Rs&nbsp; &nbsp; 234 Fw G2V Solitary<BR><BR>These map to:<BR>Tordesillas&nbsp; &nbsp; Brazil<BR>Rurik&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Russia<BR>Jewel&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; India<BR>Jung-Zei&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; China<BR>Usonia&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; U.S.A.<BR>Cabotia&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Canada<BR>Barton&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Australia<BR><BR>The territory of Brazil was ceded to the Portuguese crown by the <BR>Treaty of Tordesillas in 1494.<BR>The house of Rurik established the first Russian state at Kiev in the <BR>9th century.<BR>India was "the jewel in the crown of the British Empire."<BR>Jung-Zei is "Middle Star(Planet)" vice Jung-gou, "Middle Kingdom."<BR>Usonia is from Frank Lloyd Wright's coinage Usonian for indigenous U.S. style.<BR>Cabotia was an alternate name for Canada suggested at confederation.<BR>Sir Edmund Barton was the first Prime Minister of Australia after federation.<BR><BR>Planet size was determined as follows:<BR>SQRT((Area of Country X 10/3) / 4) * 2<BR><BR>Atmosphere and Hydrosphere are Earth's.<BR><BR>Population is the country's present day population.<BR><BR>Government and Law Level are prejudiced estimates in Traveller terms.<BR><BR>Trade codes are likely seeming estimates, again prejudiced.<BR><BR>Starport is based on present day launching capacity.<BR><BR>Planetoid Belts are the Asteroid Belt, the Kuiper Belt and the <BR>recently discovered (or rather, posited and initially confirmed) belt <BR>of several thousand asteroids with orbits entirely between Earth and <BR>Mars. Well, i had to be sneaky somewhere 8^)<BR><BR>Gas Giant are Jupiter, Saturn, Neptune and Uranus.<BR><BR>Allegiance codes are Cn: China, Eb Eastern Block, Fw: First World, Tw <BR>Third World. The last is not accurate, i know, but i sent the <BR>original message before i caught the mistake. Dw would probably be <BR>better. It's unlikely anyone was relying on the allegiance code to <BR>crack the puzzle. 8^/<BR><BR>The solitary G2V star is, of course, the sun.<BR><BR>Except for the size, i think they make quite nice worlds. 8^)<BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3554<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zc01.mx.aol.com (rly-zc01.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.1]) by air-zc02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:15:41 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zc01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:15:02 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id QAA75654;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:13:53 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:12:44 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id QAA75597<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:12:44 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:12:44 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101232112.QAA75597@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3554<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3555</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/23/01 5:04:59 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 23 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3555<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: fnord?<BR>TNE systems<BR>re: TNE System<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>RE: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>RE: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: FS Jetpack under development<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: CT Character Gen software<BR>RE: Starports and tech levels<BR>Re: Now I've gone and done it!<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3552<BR>Re: Now I've gone and done it!<BR>RE: Now I've gone and done it!<BR>Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>re: TNE System<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels<BR>Population (was Re: Starports and tech levels)<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:39:53 -0500<BR>From: Jonathan McDermott &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: fnord?<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 21:33:16 +0100<BR>&gt;From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: fnord?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Steven Hudson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; I don't know if it's on-line or not (probably is...) but TML'ers<BR>&gt; &gt; would be well-advised _not_ to read todays "Bizarro" comic...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;http://www.ucomics.com/bizarro/<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;And yes, I agree. Don't read it.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>&gt;| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>&gt;| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>&gt;* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>*SHPLORT!*<BR><BR>"Trust me, boss... it would take too long to explain... sorry for startling <BR>you and everyone else in the office...."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:52:25 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: TNE systems<BR><BR>I know that Dark Con is being reprinted.&nbsp; Same GDW House rules.&nbsp; The <BR>material is split into smaller Player &amp; GM books.<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>Opinions should be yours too! - http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>"What's a FAQ? Boy, I wish someone would put a list of answers<BR>for common questions such as this..."<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:00:07 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: re: TNE System<BR><BR>&gt;From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: re: TNE System<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;TNE, T2K2, Merc 2000, Cadillacs and Dinosaurs, and Dark Conspiracy. <BR>&gt;That's the one.&nbsp; The reason I'm asking is that there are a few people<BR>&gt;who'd evinced an interest in converting certain games to this system,<BR>&gt;but as it is no longer available, they've asked if copies could be made<BR>&gt;available.<BR><BR>&nbsp; Get the _Dark Conspiracy_ edition current from _Archangel <BR>Entertainment_ (IIRC; out of loop...). Not only do you get<BR>the system and recognizable hardware for the stats to map to,<BR>but most of the stuff is already there to run a Cthul^h^h<BR>Space 1889 game, too.&nbsp; :&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Steven Hudson<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:02:14 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt;From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>...<BR>&gt;&gt; And for that matter, things like solar flares mean you want a few<BR>&gt;&gt; *feet* of shielding between you and the star. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Actually, shielding is no problem.&nbsp; Canonically, superdense and <BR>&gt;bonded superdense are both as cheap as steel is for us. Both stop <BR>&gt;radiation *far* better than steel (and equal thickness of superdense <BR>&gt;stops 10 million x as much radiation, while bonded superdense <BR>&gt;stops 100 million x as much as steel).<BR><BR>&nbsp; Remember, that only appears in MT, IIRC. CT players should<BR>continue to exercise caution and use their vast lift capacity<BR>and cheap energy to assemble structures from rock as needed :)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Steven Hudson<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:23:23 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Remember, that only appears in MT, IIRC. CT players should<BR><BR>Actually, Superdense and Bonded Superdense are introduced in teh orginal<BR>Striker Boxed Game.&nbsp; This was a CT supplement AFAIK...thus I always<BR>considered them cannon for CT also.<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:21:36 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>&gt;&gt;Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>&gt;...<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&nbsp; And for that matter, things like solar flares mean you want a few<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&nbsp; *feet* of shielding between you and the star.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Actually, shielding is no problem.&nbsp; Canonically, superdense and<BR>&gt;&gt;bonded superdense are both as cheap as steel is for us. Both stop<BR>&gt;&gt;radiation *far* better than steel (and equal thickness of superdense<BR>&gt;&gt;stops 10 million x as much radiation, while bonded superdense<BR>&gt;&gt;stops 100 million x as much as steel).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Remember, that only appears in MT, IIRC. CT players should<BR>&gt;continue to exercise caution and use their vast lift capacity<BR>&gt;and cheap energy to assemble structures from rock as needed :)<BR><BR>In Beltstrike (CT) it is mentioned that everyone on the space station <BR>got a dose of radiation when the magnetic shield generators went <BR>down. So CT uses rock and magnetic fields.<BR><BR><BR>TTFN<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; g<BR>- -- <BR>=============================================<BR>"Any referee or gamemaster in a space based RPG that<BR>cannot wipe out an entire party of player characters<BR>without resorting to 'bad guys with guns' just isn't trying."<BR>=============================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:24:41 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>David C. Broussard writes:<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Remember, that only appears in MT, IIRC. CT players should<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Actually, Superdense and Bonded Superdense are introduced in teh orginal<BR>&gt; Striker Boxed Game.&nbsp; This was a CT supplement AFAIK...thus I always<BR>&gt; considered them cannon for CT also.<BR><BR>Yes, SD/bonded SD are canon.&nbsp; The radiation resistance, however, is not CT<BR>canon, and is in fact contradicted by the fact that high guard had radiation<BR>hits, which that level of radiation shielding would generally prevent. <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:21:00 +1100<BR>From: Paul Harris &lt;paul.harris@dytech.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>MT had radiation hit tables as well. So I don't think radiation<BR>resistance is a property of SD and BSD. <BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Anthony Jackson [mailto:ajackson@molly.iii.com]<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2001 9:25 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Cc: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR><BR>David C. Broussard writes:<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Remember, that only appears in MT, IIRC. CT players should<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Actually, Superdense and Bonded Superdense are introduced in teh<BR>orginal<BR>&gt; Striker Boxed Game.&nbsp; This was a CT supplement AFAIK...thus I always<BR>&gt; considered them cannon for CT also.<BR><BR>Yes, SD/bonded SD are canon.&nbsp; The radiation resistance, however, is not<BR>CT<BR>canon, and is in fact contradicted by the fact that high guard had<BR>radiation<BR>hits, which that level of radiation shielding would generally prevent. <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:33:55 -0800<BR>From: "David P. Summers" &lt;summers@alum.mit.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>At 12:35 PM -0600 1/23/01, Eris Reddoch wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;Come to think, has Traveller entirely moved away from UWPs in G:T?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Traveller hasn't, but the GURPS Traveller variant seems to have. Unlike<BR>&gt;Doug, I still want to see that "cold string of numbers" next to a<BR>&gt;planet's name. &lt;g&gt;&nbsp; Of course, that is just the beginning of the<BR>&gt;description, not the end of it.<BR><BR>I always hated having to memorize the order of the numbers and, for <BR>some of them, what the codes meant.<BR><BR>______________________________<BR>summers@alum.mit.edu<BR>(This is the net.&nbsp; My e-mail address may be in Boston, but I'm in California.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:24:16 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: FS Jetpack under development<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Jens posted:<BR>&gt;A scout team recently managed to stumble onto a secret testing ground<BR>&gt;used by the FS high-speed technology department. They got away with the<BR>&gt;following photo of a test run of a new personal jet pack:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;http://www.heise.de/ct/motive/00/04a/p800.jpg<BR><BR>Well, I know Doug is in the transportation industry, but this is<BR>ridiculous!!!<BR><BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:31:43 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Timothy spoke thus about star system generation:<BR>&gt;We are probably trying to work backwards from a result<BR>&gt;that was never intended to survive such scrutiny.<BR><BR>Some of the most sensible words offered on this topic to date!!<BR><BR>(The system is designed to produce _interesting_ worlds/systems/sectors,<BR>not necessarily _internally consistent_, _logical_, and _"accurate"_<BR>worlds. Anyway, how accurate can you be when modelling something that only<BR>exists in our collective imaginations??)<BR><BR>This phrase could be used with a number of other artifacts within the OTU;<BR>hmmm, jumpspace and jump drives, reactionless thrusters, length of the Long<BR>Night and other timescales, the Terran conquest of the Ziru Sirka, noblesse<BR>oblige and the Imperial feudal system...<BR><BR>Any other contenders?<BR><BR>;-)<BR><BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:44:13 -0600<BR>From: "D. Smart" &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: CT Character Gen software<BR><BR>Mark Urbin posted:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Anybody know of any I can download?<BR>&gt; Support for Mercenary &amp; High Guard extended character<BR>&gt; generation would be great.<BR><BR>My absolute favorite (which I use for my MT campaigns) is<BR>Hugh Foster's TravGen. It can be downloaded from his site<BR>at:<BR><BR>http://www.gamestruth.com/Hugh/<BR><BR>Click on the "Downloads" link at the left and look near<BR>the bottom of the page.<BR><BR>David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:57:08 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>The radiation hits from HG though came about from close proximity Nuclear<BR>devices, meson guns, or particle accelerators.&nbsp; Totally different then a<BR>standard level of Cosmic radiation.&nbsp; AS for SD/BSD stopping radiation...I<BR>think it would stop most radiation...but since in HG and CT Nuke Missiles<BR>were surface contact detonations, as were Spinal PA mounts...the hull itself<BR>was already compromised by that point.&nbsp; At least that was how I viewed it.<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:03:30 -0500<BR>From: "Robert A. Smith II" &lt;rsmith@rasinsurance.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Now I've gone and done it!<BR><BR>&gt; From: Bruce Johnson<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; She, her husband and the twins could 'die' in a tragic air raft crash. A<BR>certain Psi Cop could be implicated in possible sabotage. Black eye for<BR>PsiCorp, a &gt; quiet transfer of power to another relative for the Rejuv<BR>world,&nbsp; and the kettle is kept simmering, not boiling over.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; She and family either move quietly to Darrian or Zhodani space, or<BR>re-appear as a different family in Imperial space.<BR><BR>And the party has the medical expertise to do a little plastic surgery.&nbsp; I<BR>may have to give the party's doctors some hints.<BR><BR>&gt; It sort of depends...if the PsiCop is an NPC it works out beautifully. The<BR>group moves to a different area of space, and they have a dangerous<BR>adversary:<BR>&gt; the PsiCop, who has probably been disciplined severely, perhaps even<BR>disoowned by PsiCorp (The nobles screaming about rogue PsiCops killing<BR>&gt; Duchesses and their family over mere suspicion that they had psi talents<BR>wouldn't hurt in the slightest)<BR><BR>The PsiCop is a pseudo-NPC.&nbsp; He is played a by a friend when he is home from<BR>college.<BR><BR>&gt; From: Roger Sanger<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Will the real Duchess please stand up!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; If the PC doesn't want the position of Duchess, she can always abdicate.<BR>Then the next rightful heir gets it, and depending on the laws in your<BR>campaign, &gt; it may very well be the clone who succeeds.<BR><BR>And...<BR>&gt; From: "Jones, Dean"<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I take it that having Mariel refuse the patent of nobility isn't an<BR>option? In the OTU members of noble families aren't forced to take titles.<BR><BR>That is an optoin. Neither the players nor I thought of that one.&nbsp; She could<BR>still be considered a Darrian citizen and be free of the PsiCorp.<BR><BR>Thanks for the ideas.<BR><BR>Angus<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:09:32 -0500<BR>From: "Robert A. Smith II" &lt;rsmith@rasinsurance.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3552<BR><BR>&gt; From: "Mark Preston" &lt;mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Sorry to snip you mega-message, but its a tad long to quote.<BR><BR>No prob.&nbsp; It was a *bit* longer than I would have liked.<BR><BR>&gt; Have you thought that with a potential noble scandal (far too close to the<BR>Imperial command for comfort) that is definately connected to the Darrians,<BR>&gt; probably to Zhodani (I presume the Imperium is still a bit rabid about Psi<BR>IYTU) and far too close to the Solomani Rim for comfort there is one obvious<BR>&gt; reaction that the nobles can't fail to realise? We're talking quiet<BR>assasination here folks - and who would be the obvious assassins? Well, no<BR>prizes for<BR>&gt; working that one out.<BR><BR>Considering Mariel is my wife's character, I would rather avoid this option.<BR>I don't like the idea of sleeping in the shed for the forseeable future. :)<BR>But I like the way you think...twisted...<BR><BR>Angus<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:17:20 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Now I've gone and done it!<BR><BR>On Mon, 22 Jan 2001 20:37:50 -0500 (EST), "Robert A. Smith II"<BR>&lt;rsmith@rasinsurance.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I didn't mean for this to be so long...Do y'all see any other possible<BR>&gt;permutations to the political consequences?<BR><BR>A couple of things to remember:<BR><BR>(a) Unless you've changed it, the Daryen are aligned generally with the<BR>Imperium, because of fear of the Zhodani.<BR><BR>(b) Unless you've changed it, the Daryen have the Star Trigger.&nbsp; If the<BR>Daryen don't want to give her up, is the Imperium really going to push hard<BR>enough to risk the Daryen _demonstrating_ the Star Trigger, as a message to<BR>say "Back off!"?<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:17:03 -0500<BR>From: "Robert A. Smith II" &lt;rsmith@rasinsurance.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Now I've gone and done it!<BR><BR>&gt; From: Ian Ferguson<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;He made a big stink about the other PC being his aunt, which caused the<BR>party to perform genetic tests of them both.&nbsp; The tests proved that they<BR>were<BR>&gt; &gt;related.&nbsp; It also proved that they were both clones.&nbsp; What was not<BR>revealed to the rest of the party is that the party's geneticist did further<BR>testing that<BR>&gt; &gt;proved the DNA clone tags in her DNA were artificial (she's the original,<BR>not the clone).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Just curious: what are "clone tags"?&nbsp; Do genetic engineers add some sort<BR>of extra DNA to the clone egg?&nbsp; Is this required by the technology, some<BR>law, or &gt;not at all?&nbsp; How did the "tags" get into all of the original's<BR>cells?<BR><BR>IMTU the cloning process introduces "clone tags" to the DNA.&nbsp; With the right<BR>equipment, enough time and expertise they can be removed.&nbsp; However,&nbsp; given<BR>the right equipment, more time and expertise it can be determined if they<BR>were removed.&nbsp; Also, as happened in the game it can be determined that they<BR>were artificially placed in the DNA.<BR><BR>Angus<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 15:19:27 -0800<BR>From: "David P. Summers" &lt;summers@alum.mit.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>At 8:24 AM -0800 1/11/01, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>&gt;One thing I've always wanted to try was a fantasy setting using the magic<BR>&gt;in G: Voodoo.&nbsp; No wizards sending fireballs around, but instead spirits and<BR>&gt;loa coming on deadly errands, and magic powders and potions for almost any<BR>&gt;occasion.<BR><BR><BR>I have an article on using the system for Fantasy Spirit Magic that <BR>was published in Pyramid.&nbsp; (Doug actually knows this, but I can toot <BR>my own horn can't I :-)&nbsp; Also, GURPS Spirits is about to come out. <BR>(Might be useful for those who want spiritualist, ghosts and vodoo in <BR>their Traveller campaigns...)<BR><BR>______________________________<BR>summers@alum.mit.edu<BR>(This is the net.&nbsp; My e-mail address may be in Boston, but I'm in California.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 22:33:19 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: TNE System<BR><BR>At 16:12 -0500 23/1/01,&nbsp;&nbsp; shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson) wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Does anyone know who owns the rights to the GDW House Rules system,<BR>&gt; &gt;which was the engine for TNE?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Hmm, that was used in TNE, T:2K2e/Merc2K, C&amp;D, and what else?<BR>&gt;Didn't Dark Conspiracy use it too after a bit?<BR><BR>Dark Conspiracy does use it (it's still in print).<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:39:23 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>On Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:26:28 -0500 (EST), Timothy Little<BR>&lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;You could always do what I did from a previous GURPS Space game --<BR>&gt;generate a few hundred thousand systems by computer, then apply a<BR>&gt;simulation of settlers radiating out from homeworlds, taking all the<BR>&gt;best ones they could find under certain constraints.&nbsp; Apply a (really)<BR>&gt;basic trade and population model, and you have the skeleton for the<BR>&gt;inhabited worlds in your universe.<BR><BR>Hmmm... I'd thought of doing this for the 'canonical' map of Charted Space<BR>- - start with only the inhabited homeworlds, and start the expansion at the<BR>appropriate relative times, and see what develops, given the natural mains<BR>and all.&nbsp; That, however, brings up important questions:<BR><BR>Initially, all worlds will start with J1, which makes following the mains<BR>natural.&nbsp; But, how long does it take to establish a Deep Base (to allow<BR>bridging of J2 gaps), and how do you decide where to establish them?<BR><BR>What is the largest sustainable rate of emigration for colonies, and what's<BR>the smallest viable colony?&nbsp; How, if at all, does finding a 'native'<BR>sophont race affect this?&nbsp; What is the TL effect, if any?<BR><BR>What is the largest _technologically_feasible_ rate of emigration for<BR>colonies?<BR><BR>What growth rate should be assumed for planetary populations, and is it<BR>different for colonies vs. the homeworld?&nbsp; And what effect does immigration<BR>by (say) Vilani to the (say) Luriani homeworld have on the population<BR>growth rate of the latter?<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 17:40:41 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; I &lt;fnord&gt; didn't see &lt;fnord&gt; anything strange after your &lt;fnord&gt; last<BR>&gt; &gt; posts.&nbsp; In fact, I don't &lt;fnord&gt; remember seeing any of your &lt;fnord&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; posts before, although seeing your name makes &lt;fnord&gt; me feel vaguely<BR>&gt; &gt; uncomfortable &lt;fnord&gt; and apprehensive.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I believe the correct wording is:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; "... both apprehensive and uneasy, a feeling which grew ..."<BR><BR>&lt;audience response&gt;<BR><BR>"Unlike your neck!"<BR><BR>&lt;/audience response&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 15:52:07 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels<BR><BR>David C. Broussard writes:<BR>&gt; The radiation hits from HG though came about from close proximity Nuclear<BR>&gt; devices, meson guns, or particle accelerators.&nbsp; Totally different then a<BR>&gt; standard level of Cosmic radiation.<BR><BR>Yup, it is.&nbsp; Cosmic rays have orders of magnitude greater penetration than<BR>radiation associated with nuclear weapons (PA weapons don't really specify<BR>energy levels, multiple GEV weapons aren't entirely unbelievable for <BR>traveller PAWs).&nbsp; I'd probably just say that SD/bonded SD simply provide<BR>protection equivalent to the steel they replace (which means a minimum <BR>FFS2 hull, at AV 20 (7 cm steel, or 56 g/cm^2), is tolerable protection<BR>from solar flares, though it won't do much against cosmic rays).<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:57:46 -0800<BR>From: "Kelly St.Clair" &lt;kellys@efn.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Population (was Re: Starports and tech levels)<BR><BR>On Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:07:14 -0800, sneadj@mindspring.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I'm also curious what the mid to long-term results of China one-<BR>&gt;child policy and the resulting jump in female infanticide.&nbsp; Anyone<BR>&gt;here know if the sex ration in the PRC is noticeably skewed yet?&nbsp; It<BR>&gt;could be really ugly there in a few decades.<BR><BR>Add to this the fact that a lot of urban women are strangely unwilling to <BR>give up their careers and independence to become dutiful wives, skewing <BR>things even further...<BR><BR>Apparently, there's already a trade in women from villages outside China; <BR>imagine a combination of mail-order brides and smuggling illegal immigrants <BR>into the US, with all the abuses, broken promises and exploitation of both.<BR><BR>ObTrav:&nbsp; The PCs are approached by a rough-looking character (or a very <BR>smooth one, take your pick) who wants to arrange passage for himself and as <BR>many fearful, illiterate peasant girls as the ship's staterooms will <BR>physically hold.&nbsp; Or maybe they're listed as "livestock", and the PCs don't <BR>find out until they load/open the crates.<BR><BR><BR>- --------------<BR>Kelly St.Clair&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "'Cause you've got Trouble<BR>kellys@efn.org&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Right here in fair Verona<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; With a capital T that rhymes with D<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That stands for Duel..."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:03:18 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Initially, all worlds will start with J1, which makes following the mains<BR>&gt; natural.&nbsp; But, how long does it take to establish a Deep Base (to allow<BR>&gt; bridging of J2 gaps), and how do you decide where to establish them?<BR><BR>IMnon-TU, I didn't have to worry about that since the only limit to<BR>distance was time and resupply.<BR><BR>In a Traveller universe, I'd probably apply a modifier to<BR>"attractiveness" of a planet based on how far outside jump range it<BR>is.&nbsp; I'd just assume Deep Bases to be established anywhere needed,<BR>adding costs in time, materials and labour.<BR><BR>For Jump-1 technology, the "costs" might go<BR><BR>Parsecs&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 4<BR>Cost&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 8&nbsp; &nbsp; 15<BR><BR>or something like that.&nbsp; So a system has to be four times more<BR>"valuable" in some sense to make it worthwhile choosing over a "main"<BR>world.&nbsp; On the scale of planetary colonisation and development, I<BR>think the up-front capital and labour costs of a deep base are pretty<BR>trivial and can be safely ignored.&nbsp; The cost comes in the fact that<BR>every ton of fuel has to be shipped there and stored, rather than<BR>refined.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; What is the largest sustainable rate of emigration for colonies,<BR><BR>In the history of some countries, about 3% per year has been sustained<BR>for at least a decade or more.&nbsp; 0.1 to 1% is pretty typical.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; and what's the smallest viable colony?<BR><BR>That depends greatly on what's available locally, and what technology<BR>you have.&nbsp; On Earth, colonies starting with a hundred or so have<BR>prospered -- but that's with a perfect atmosphere, edible native life,<BR>good temperatures, and (in the range of planetary environments) very<BR>mild weather, and no need to maintain complex technology.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; What is the largest _technologically_feasible_ rate of emigration<BR>&gt; for colonies?<BR><BR>Are you including "economically feasible" in that?<BR><BR>Technologically alone, an emigration rate of 20% per year might be<BR>sustained under some pretty extreme social conditions -- such as<BR>near-perpetual pregnancy with induced twinning (it works in breedings<BR>animals already, artificical wombs if the technology is sufficient),<BR>raising of children in large-scale institutions, and shipping most of<BR>them offworld once they reach a viable age with a bare minimum of what<BR>they might need for survival at the other end.<BR><BR>I can't think of any remotely plausible reason why anyone might want<BR>to do this though.&nbsp; I mean, it would take at least 15 years or so from<BR>conception (of either the plan or the new colonists) to the first big<BR>wave of arrivals.&nbsp; By then, the source planet has *quadrupled* its<BR>population, mainly with prepubescent children.&nbsp; Even assuming 20<BR>children per person involved in looking after them, that's a fifth of<BR>the original population.&nbsp; Without artificial wombs, a large fraction<BR>of women of child bearing age would have to be pregnant for much of<BR>the time, and have their babies taken away at the end.&nbsp; With<BR>artificial wombs, you'd still need a huge number of people to maintain<BR>them.<BR><BR>Technologically possible?&nbsp; Yes, I believe so.&nbsp; Likely?&nbsp; Not on your<BR>life.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; What growth rate should be assumed for planetary populations, and is<BR>&gt; it different for colonies vs. the homeworld?<BR><BR>That's a tricky one.&nbsp; It would depend on what sort of social model you<BR>have.&nbsp; Long-term birth rates of 1-5% are likely, with death rates of<BR>about 1-3%.&nbsp; However, birth rate also depends on what proportion of<BR>women are of child bearing age, which depends on both birth and death<BR>rates in the past.<BR><BR>In the past, high birth rates have been affected by the balance<BR>between benefits and disadvantages of having children more than<BR>anything else.&nbsp; This depends on many factors, such as how close-knit<BR>families are, sources of income, religious views, costs of raising<BR>children, and so on.&nbsp; It is limited above by proportion of women<BR>capable of having children, and how often they can do so (though maybe<BR>not in high-tech societies).<BR><BR>Death rates are equally variable, limited below by old age at about 1%<BR>per year or so.&nbsp; Warfare, disease, famine or other disasters could<BR>increase the death rate in the short term to any number you like.<BR>Anagathics and other advanced medicine could reduce the minimum below<BR>1%.<BR><BR>Basically, pick a number.&nbsp; I'd guess that 1-2% growth would make a<BR>reasonable average.&nbsp; I'd advise against a long-term negative growth<BR>rate if you want to end up with an interstellar empire at all :)<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; And what effect does immigration by (say) Vilani to the (say)<BR>&gt; Luriani homeworld have on the population growth rate of the latter?<BR><BR>Negative, due to interracial warfare?&nbsp; Positive, since there are more<BR>people to grow from as a base?&nbsp; Either positive or negative, as social<BR>values and economic effects diffuse or solidify between the cultures?<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3555<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yb04.mx.aol.com (rly-yb04.mail.aol.com [172.18.146.4]) by air-yb01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:04:58 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yb04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:03:56 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id UAA84691;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:00:56 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:00:31 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id UAA84652<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:00:31 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:00:31 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101240100.UAA84652@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3555<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3556</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/24/01 6:12:34 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; Wednesday, January 24 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3556<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Credit where due<BR>Re: Credit where due<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: fnord?<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: fnord?<BR>Vilani Word List?<BR>Re: Vilani Word List?<BR>Re: fnord?<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3553<BR>Re: Rockheads<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3554<BR>"Penguin Awareness Day"<BR>RE: Credit where due<BR>Re: Credit where due<BR>Bad joke (Was : RE: Credit where due) [OT]<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3555<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Credit where due<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Origins award<BR>Re: "Penguin Awareness Day"<BR>RE: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: Credit where due<BR>RE: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:21:22 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Credit where due<BR><BR>What does a credit get you in this Imperium?&nbsp; Does it have any intrinsic<BR>value, like the dollar once did?&nbsp; Or is it only valuable because of<BR>galaxy-wide good will?&nbsp; Personally I think that a credit should be<BR>redeemable on any Imperial world for X joules of energy - a compromise<BR>between the two viewpoints.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 17:34:25 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Credit where due<BR><BR>Michael Daumen writes:<BR>&gt; What does a credit get you in this Imperium?&nbsp; Does it have any intrinsic<BR>&gt; value, like the dollar once did?&nbsp; Or is it only valuable because of<BR>&gt; galaxy-wide good will?&nbsp; Personally I think that a credit should be<BR>&gt; redeemable on any Imperial world for X joules of energy - a compromise<BR>&gt; between the two viewpoints.<BR><BR>The Imperial credit is apparently a fiat currency.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:38:45 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>At 12:07 PM -0800 1/23/01, sneadj@mindspring.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I'm also curious what the mid to long-term results of China one-<BR>&gt;child policy and the resulting jump in female infanticide.&nbsp; Anyone<BR>&gt;here know if the sex ration in the PRC is noticeably skewed yet?&nbsp; It<BR>&gt;could be really ugly there in a few decades.<BR><BR>It's not going to be the picturesque anguish that China-watchers are <BR>hoping for, I think.&nbsp; The reality is that the major barrier to <BR>Chinese males finding wives is economic more than demographic, and <BR>the 'ugliness' has been going on for the last decade or two. The <BR>skewed ratio would have to skew a *lot* more before it made much <BR>difference for your average Zhou.<BR><BR>Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 17:58:45 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: fnord?<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;*SHPLORT!*<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"Trust me, boss... it would take too long to explain... sorry for startling <BR>&gt;you and everyone else in the office...."<BR><BR>&nbsp; Some people just don't know how to take friendly warnings...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:19:36 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt;&gt; Actually, try sitting down and working out *how long* it'll take the<BR>&gt;&gt; atmosphere to go from "standard" to thin enough to require breathing<BR>&gt;&gt; gear. <BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; The answer depends on a number of assumptions we can't easily check,<BR>&gt;&gt; but the error bars for the Moon go back *beyond* the Ancients, as I<BR>&gt;&gt; recall. <BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; That is, a *lot* of places could have been given an atmosphere by the<BR>&gt;&gt; Ancients, and still have a breathable, if thin atmosphere *now*. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Aside from the size-1 worlds (the moon is size-2) that does help a lot.<BR>&gt; Unfortunately, there's a bunch of size-1 worlds with breathable atmospheres<BR>&gt; as well (of course, you can just boost them to size 2).<BR><BR>Or you can just assume the atmosphere is the result of a more recent<BR>terraforming attempt. <BR><BR>For that matter, consider making it something that's heavy enough to<BR>stick around, but *not* breathable.<BR><BR>I *really* wish that atmospheric *pressure* and *composition* were<BR>treated seperately. :-(<BR><BR>Getting back to the "heavy" atmosphere, stuff like Xenon and Radon will<BR>stick around for quite some time. <BR><BR>How does did the planet get so much of them? Well, it's quite a bit<BR>denser than normal. And just lousy with uranium, thorium, etc. :-)<BR><BR>*Breathing* is the least of your worries on the surface of *that*. &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:55:18<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: fnord?<BR><BR>At 11:00 AM 1/23/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; I don't know if it's on-line or not (probably is...) but TML'ers<BR>&gt;would be well-advised _not_ to read todays "Bizarro" comic...<BR><BR>:)<BR><BR>Great minds think alike.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; http://gridlore.home.mondspring.com<BR><BR>"A mrgs einu sinni hluti minn systir..."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 22:23:27 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>Well, is there one?<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 19:37:22 -0800<BR>From: Bill &lt;beast@aracnet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>&gt;Well, is there one?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Cheers,<BR>&gt;Paul Drye<BR>&gt;_________________________________________________________________________<BR>&gt;Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>I don't know if there is a "list"<BR>I have heard that there are a number of word generators.<BR>I have some crude ones using Filmaker Pro for Vargr, Vilani and Aslan<BR><BR>You'll need Filemaker 4 or 5 to use them though.<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:01:28 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: fnord?<BR><BR>on 1/23/01 6:55 PM, Douglas E. Berry at gridlore@pop.mindspring.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 11:00 AM 1/23/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; I don't know if it's on-line or not (probably is...) but TML'ers<BR>&gt;&gt; would be well-advised _not_ to read todays "Bizarro" comic...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; :)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Great minds think alike.<BR><BR><BR>http://www.ucomics.com/bizarro/viewbz.htm<BR><BR>- --<BR>"Good intentions will always be pleaded for every assumption of<BR>authority. It is hardly too strong to say that the Constitution was made<BR>to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are<BR>men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern. They<BR>promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 00:08:04 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3553<BR><BR>&gt; Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Does anyone know who owns the rights to the GDW House Rules system,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; which was the engine for TNE?<BR><BR>TNE IPRs belong to Marc.<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 00:10:56 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Rockheads<BR><BR>In a message dated 23-Jan-01 1:05:44 PM Central Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; I like rockheads. Loren, do you want to claim credit for coining the term?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR><BR>As long as it doesn't cost me anything.<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 00:16:04 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3554<BR><BR>&gt; First Survey, like too many of the Imperium Games products, was what I<BR>&gt;&nbsp; like to call "fractally broken" -- not merely bad, but bad on every scale,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; with pockets of small badness concealed within larger badnesses, bad from <BR>&gt;&nbsp; any analytical viewpoint, self-similarly bad.<BR><BR>&lt;/humility&gt;<BR>And all because they didn't hire me.<BR>&lt;humility&gt;<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 21:37:44 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: "Penguin Awareness Day"<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; About This Day<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Penguin Awareness Day - January 20th<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Celebrate our wonderful tuxedo-wearing friends everywhere on<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; January 20th. Penguin awareness day is set aside to increase<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; awareness of these special Antarctic birds. <BR><BR>&nbsp; Oh, we're aware of them alright - I'll bet that there's a _reason_ that <BR>Rafm's "Call of Cthulhu" package #2971 includes a penguin - our so-called<BR>"wonderful (Illuminated, Cthulhu-loving) tuxedo-wearing friends _everywhere_"!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 18:37:47 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Credit where due<BR><BR>Anthony Jackson wrote :<BR>&gt; The Imperial credit is apparently a fiat currency.<BR><BR>You can buy Fiats with it ?<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:12:11 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Credit where due<BR><BR>Michael Daumen wrote:<BR>&gt; What does a credit get you in this Imperium?&nbsp; Does it have any intrinsic<BR>&gt; value, like the dollar once did?&nbsp; Or is it only valuable because of<BR>&gt; galaxy-wide good will?<BR><BR>As I understand it, it is not backed by anything tangible.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Personally I think that a credit should be redeemable on any<BR>&gt; Imperial world for X joules of energy - a compromise between the two<BR>&gt; viewpoints.<BR><BR>Energy in what form?&nbsp; "Here's your 10 GJ of energy, in the form of<BR>heat in this here lump of rock.&nbsp; Do you want to take the rock with<BR>you, or transfer its energy now?"<BR><BR>The problems with energy as an "intrinsic value" are too numerous to<BR>exhaustively list.&nbsp; The book "Life, the Universe, and Everything"<BR>points out a few problems with choosing a ubiquitous currency base.<BR>The Spanish Conquistadors discovered a few problems with using a base<BR>subject to large changes in supply.&nbsp; The huge variance in types makes<BR>"a given amount of energy" even less meaningful than "a given number<BR>of atoms of matter", and adds possible confusion over definitions.<BR><BR>In effect, it becomes a fiat currency by default since no-one would<BR>even care that one day in the past it was defined as being equivalent<BR>to some amount of energy.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:07:04 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Bad joke (Was : RE: Credit where due) [OT]<BR><BR>On Wed, 24 Jan 2001, Frank G. Pitt wrote:<BR>&gt; Anthony Jackson wrote :<BR>&gt; &gt; The Imperial credit is apparently a fiat currency.<BR>&gt; You can buy Fiats with it ?<BR><BR>What car does the Pope drive?<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>Fiat Lux. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 00:08:50 -0800<BR>From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3555<BR><BR>Paul Harris &lt;paul.harris@dytech.com.au&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; MT had radiation hit tables as well. So I don't think radiation<BR>&gt; resistance is a property of SD and BSD. <BR><BR>Given that they were mostly for having a nuke go on near your hull <BR>or similar exceedingly energetic events which produce vast <BR>amounts of radiation, even when compared to solar flares, I'd say <BR>that SD &amp; BSD actually have very good radiation resistance. <BR>Without that, there wouldn't be any need to roll, the entire ship and <BR>crew would glow in the dark.<BR><BR>- -John Snead sneadj@mindspring.com <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:29:12 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; The Ancients are entirely too out in the open these days. At the risk of <BR>&gt; showing my munchkin-ness, I remember the days back before it was even clear <BR>&gt; that they were the Droyne and they were much more interesting when they were <BR>&gt; mysterious. I won't say I take notes when I watch the X-Files, but I try to <BR>&gt; introduce that sort of shifting-sand mysteriousness (mysteriosity?) when it <BR>&gt; comes to dealing with them. My attitude is "Weird hyperpowerful devices have <BR>&gt; been done to death, let's try for something obscure." Try to use Arthur C. <BR>&gt; Clarke's plenary indulgence to do something odd, you know? Something like an <BR>&gt; "impossible" world is fun.<BR><BR>This is why I recommend Andre Norton's old SF. The "Forerunners" are a<BR>generic name that applies to *all* the civilizations that existed<BR>before the historical records of any surviving race. And given that the<BR>Zacathans seem to have at least 10,000 years of history (maybe more,<BR>it's been a *long* time since I read those books) "prehistoric is a<BR>whole different thing in her universe.<BR><BR>"The Zero Stone" and its sequel "Uncharted Stars" are a good place to<BR>start if you are interested the way she handled this sort of thing.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 04:41:23 -0500<BR>From: "Daniel Phelps" &lt;phelpsd@gate.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Credit where due<BR><BR>Was written:<BR><BR><BR>&gt;What does a credit get you in this Imperium?&nbsp; Does it have any intrinsic<BR>&gt;value, like the dollar once did?&nbsp; Or is it only valuable because of<BR>&gt;galaxy-wide good will?&nbsp; Personally I think that a credit should be<BR>&gt;redeemable on any Imperial world for X joules of energy - a compromise<BR>&gt;between the two viewpoints.<BR><BR><BR>For the sake of argument what about a Blishian solution to the question.<BR>Peg it to something almost universally desireable which is tangable and<BR>consumable like antiagathics?<BR><BR>Dan<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:55:57 -0000<BR>From: Matt Bond &lt;MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 19:29:51 -0000<BR>&gt; From: "Stuart Ferris" &lt;stuart.ferris@virgin.net&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;Still love the map generator in H&amp;E, Stuart. Inventing a <BR>&gt; world map from<BR>&gt; &gt;whole cloth was such a pain before. Now with that feature it <BR>&gt; takes far<BR>&gt; &gt;less time.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I'm hoping to refine it even further, so that coastlines are <BR>&gt; created more<BR>&gt; realistically. i.e. jagged, uneven coastlines.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Stuart Ferris<BR><BR>I wouldn't bother...<BR><BR>If you were to view Earth on the scale of a Traveller World Map, then<BR>you would only see relatively smooth curves or straight lines...<BR>Certainly not crinkle-cut coastlines a la Norway.<BR><BR>Of course, if you *want* to have crinkly coastlines you could always<BR>have a 'zoom' feature...<BR><BR>Create large scale maps of individual hexes (with rivers, forests, large<BR>towns &amp; major cities etc), then zoom in on the hexes of *that* map etc<BR>(streams, woods, smaller towns and villages etc)...<BR><BR>&lt;drool&gt;<BR><BR>But I doubt this would be feasible... &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Matt<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 18:53:05 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt; From: Jeff Zeitlin <BR>&gt; Initially, all worlds will start with J1, which makes following the mains<BR>&gt; natural.&nbsp; But, how long does it take to establish a Deep Base (to allow<BR>&gt; bridging of J2 gaps), and how do you decide where to establish them?<BR><BR>I wouldn't go with Deep Bases for crossing J2 gaps.&nbsp; Instead, I would build<BR>ships with fuel for two consecutive jumps.&nbsp; Navigation might be a problem<BR>though, if you wanted it to be.&nbsp; For moving "normal" J1 ships across gaps,<BR>you could either use demountable (collapsible?&nbsp; I've forgotten the<BR>definitions.&nbsp; *Not* drop) tanks, or even have 2xJ1 tenders that can carry<BR>them across battle rider style.&nbsp; Then the J1 ships can carry on as before<BR>in the new main. <BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 05:41:23 -0500<BR>From: Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 12:11:38 EST<BR>&gt;From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The basic world-design sequence in _First In_ is designed for relative<BR>&gt;realism.&nbsp; That means it *will not* give you results similar to those of <BR>&gt;the CT world-generation system, if you use it to design worlds at<BR>&gt;random and from scratch.<BR><BR>If you're interested in a statistical summary of the results that First In<BR>does give, I have done some of the work and posted it:<BR><BR>http://www.io.com/~thrash/firstin.html<BR><BR>The analysis itself is skewed towards habitable mainworlds, but may have<BR>some general usefulness nonetheless.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:55:32 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>Christopher Thrash wrote:<BR>&gt; If you're interested in a statistical summary of the results that First In<BR>&gt; does give, I have done some of the work and posted it:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://www.io.com/~thrash/firstin.html<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The analysis itself is skewed towards habitable mainworlds, but may have<BR>&gt; some general usefulness nonetheless.<BR><BR>Nice analysis. Useful as an eye-opener.<BR><BR>On average, one in every 5367 systems develop intelligent life.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:13:13 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Origins award<BR><BR>Read today's (January 24th) daily Illuminator:<BR><BR>http://www.sjgames.com/ill/<BR><BR>I recommend that everyone who cares (should be a lot of people around<BR>here) send a mail to Rick (address at the end of the Illuminator) and<BR>tell him their feelings.<BR><BR>Also, any and all game designers apparently have the possibility to<BR>nominate their work. Instructions for doing so are in the Illuminator.<BR>The deadline is the 27th, so its kind of urgent.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 04:47:57 -0800<BR>From: "Thing" &lt;thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: "Penguin Awareness Day"<BR><BR>On Tuesday, January 23, 2001 9:37 PM<BR>Steven Hudson said,<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Oh, we're aware of them alright - I'll bet that there's a _reason_ that<BR>&gt; Rafm's "Call of Cthulhu" package #2971 includes a penguin - our so-called<BR>&gt; "wonderful (Illuminated, Cthulhu-loving) tuxedo-wearing friends<BR>_everywhere_"!<BR><BR>I just noticed this last night myself.&nbsp; I've been going over a lot of<BR>material seeing if I could adapt some of "At the Mountains of Madness" for<BR>Traveller.<BR><BR>G.D.D.<BR>ThingUnderTheStairs.<BR>====================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:45:13 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>Matt Bond wrote:<BR>&gt; Stuart Ferris wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Still love the map generator in H&amp;E, Stuart. Inventing a<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; world map from whole cloth was such a pain before. Now with<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; that feature it takes far less time.<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; I'm hoping to refine it even further, so that coastlines are<BR>&gt; &gt; created more realistically. i.e. jagged, uneven coastlines.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I wouldn't bother...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; If you were to view Earth on the scale of a Traveller World Map,<BR>&gt; then you would only see relatively smooth curves or straight<BR>&gt; lines... Certainly not crinkle-cut coastlines a la Norway.<BR><BR>I disagree, Matt.&nbsp; While you are correct in pointing out&nbsp; that&nbsp; a<BR>Traveller world map is fairly crude&nbsp; I&nbsp; think&nbsp; you've&nbsp; overstated<BR>your case.&nbsp; There is scope&nbsp; for&nbsp; enhancing&nbsp; the&nbsp; coastlines&nbsp; (and<BR>other features).&nbsp; I've just started playing&nbsp; with&nbsp; some&nbsp; software<BR>called FractalTerrains (by the&nbsp; same&nbsp; people&nbsp; who&nbsp; made&nbsp; Campaign<BR>Cartographer) ... check out my map of Sting for the TML&nbsp; landgrab<BR>for an example (but I added the&nbsp; hex&nbsp; grid&nbsp; manually).&nbsp; What&nbsp; I'd<BR>like to see is H&amp;E be able to link into FT if FT is installed ...<BR>I know VB allows you to use another application's classes&nbsp; but&nbsp; I<BR>don't know if it would work here.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR>http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/trisen/sol<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:59:48 +0000<BR>From: Phil Kitching &lt;postmark.design@btinternet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Credit where due<BR><BR>Daniel Phelps you wrote:<BR>&gt;Was written:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;What does a credit get you in this Imperium?&nbsp; Does it have any intrinsic<BR>&gt;&gt;value, like the dollar once did?&nbsp; Or is it only valuable because of<BR>&gt;&gt;galaxy-wide good will?&nbsp; Personally I think that a credit should be<BR>&gt;&gt;redeemable on any Imperial world for X joules of energy - a compromise<BR>&gt;&gt;between the two viewpoints.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;For the sake of argument what about a Blishian solution to the question.<BR>&gt;Peg it to something almost universally desireable which is tangable and<BR>&gt;consumable like antiagathics?<BR><BR>Okay<BR><BR>"One thousand credits gets your 1 Dt of cargo freighted one jump"*<BR><BR>[* one jump-1 to the economics revisionists!]<BR><BR>There you are - "consumable", "tangable", "almost universally desireable"<BR>and ideally suited to a trading culture.<BR><BR>It's also stable and causes lower tech currency to be traded at a discount,<BR>since otherwise their merchant ships can't meet the standard.<BR><BR>Exactly what is required by the rules.<BR><BR><BR>Phil Kitching<BR>- --<BR>&nbsp; http://www.btinternet.com/~salvo/<BR>&nbsp; Postmark Design Bureau, Emerging Technologies Division.<BR>"Microwaving half-baked ideas from across the Galaxy"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:02:15 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I disagree, Matt.&nbsp; While you are correct in pointing out&nbsp; that&nbsp; a<BR>&gt; Traveller world map is fairly crude&nbsp; I&nbsp; think&nbsp; you've&nbsp; overstated<BR>&gt; your case.&nbsp; There is scope&nbsp; for&nbsp; enhancing&nbsp; the&nbsp; coastlines&nbsp; (and<BR>&gt; other features).&nbsp; I've just started playing&nbsp; with&nbsp; some&nbsp; software<BR>&gt; called FractalTerrains (by the&nbsp; same&nbsp; people&nbsp; who&nbsp; made&nbsp; Campaign<BR>&gt; Cartographer) ... check out my map of Sting for the TML&nbsp; landgrab<BR>&gt; for an example (but I added the&nbsp; hex&nbsp; grid&nbsp; manually).&nbsp; What&nbsp; I'd<BR>&gt; like to see is H&amp;E be able to link into FT if FT is installed ...<BR>&gt; I know VB allows you to use another application's classes&nbsp; but&nbsp; I<BR>&gt; don't know if it would work here.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Totally! That would be awesome. You could produce maps at home using H&amp;E<BR>that looked like Jesse'd modelled them!<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:38:56 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Still love the map generator in H&amp;E, Stuart. Inventing a world map from<BR>&gt;&gt;whole cloth was such a pain before. Now with that feature it takes far<BR>&gt;&gt;less time.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'm hoping to refine it even further, so that coastlines are created more<BR>&gt; realistically. i.e jagged, uneven coastlines.<BR><BR>Fractals!<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:25:12 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; But I'm a planetary gearhead (do we need a name for this?),<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Given the Latin root of the base word and the appropriate feel, how about<BR>&gt; "terrarist"? :)<BR><BR>Alas, "terra" is *not* the proper root. Terra is "dirt" or "ground".<BR>Tellus (as in "Tellus Mater" = "Mother Earth" is). We are "Tellurians",<BR>not "Terrans".<BR><BR>And even if you use "terra" relate stuff, you get "terrestrial" as the<BR>starting point. :-(<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:07:24 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: "John P. Raynor" &lt;john.raynor@yale.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>On Tue, 23 Jan 2001, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; Alas, "terra" is *not* the proper root. Terra is "dirt" or "ground".<BR>&gt; Tellus (as in "Tellus Mater" = "Mother Earth" is). We are "Tellurians",<BR>&gt; not "Terrans".<BR><BR>I believe E. E. "Doc" Smith got this particular bit of pedantry right.<BR>On the other hand, that's not surprising, since Smith also used words<BR>like "yclept," apparently with a straight face.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - J. Raynor<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3556<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zb01.mx.aol.com (rly-zb01.mail.aol.com [172.31.41.1]) by air-zb01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:12:34 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zb01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:11:46 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id JAA13277;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:07:44 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:07:29 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id JAA13242<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:07:29 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:07:29 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101241407.JAA13242@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3556<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3557</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/24/01 1:10:38 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; Wednesday, January 24 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3557<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR>Interstellar War Query<BR>RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: Interstellar War Query<BR>Re: Interstellar War Query<BR>RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Vilani Word List?<BR>RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Origins award<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3556<BR>RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Vilani Word List?<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3555<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3556<BR>Re: Credit where due<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:57:19 -0600<BR>From: Loren Wiseman &lt;lkw@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR><BR>At 23:58 +0000 1/19/01, John G. Wood wrote:<BR>&gt;Hi,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; I'm looking for manuscripts for a group of 32-page books dealing with a<BR>&gt;&gt; single world (16,000 to 17,000 words), for publication by SJ Games.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I'm interested, and would like more details. If there is a sample outline<BR>&gt;(maybe the one used for Kamsii) I think it would probably answer most of my<BR>&gt;questions.<BR><BR>We need the manuscript to be abut 16-17,000 words, preferably on the high<BR>side (it is easier to edit down than up). I don't yet have a draft outline<BR>or a list of proposed contents, but basically I want a short discussion of<BR>the system as a whole, A discussion of the main world, including geography,<BR>ecology, society &amp; culture, and anything else special about the place.<BR>Cover important cities, the starport, and anything else relevant.<BR><BR>First, check out our author solicitation page to see what we need in a<BR>proper proposal:<BR>http://www.sjgames.com/general/author/<BR>This page will guide you to other pages on how to write for us, what we<BR>expect from authors, and so on.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Loren Wiseman<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Traveller Line Manager/Traveller Guru-in-Residence<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Editor, Journal of the Travellers' Aid Society&nbsp; http://jtas.sjgames.com/<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; SJ Games<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; lkw@io.com http://www.io.com/~lkw/<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (512) 447-7866 VOX<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (512) 447-1144 FAX<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:17:23 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>I find the period of the Interstellar wars fascinating.&nbsp; Lately, I've<BR>been wanting to translate the starships in Imperium into TNE for use as<BR>a backdrop to a new campaign set in the 22nd century.&nbsp; I'm running into<BR>a number of problems, though.<BR><BR>What are the sizes of the warships?<BR><BR>According to High Guard, the maximum ship size, at each tech level, is<BR>dependent upon the computer available at that tech level, and yields<BR>the following results:<BR><BR>TL 7-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1000 dtons<BR>TL 9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4000 dtons<BR>TL10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 10,000 dtons<BR>TL11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 50,000 dtons<BR>TL12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 100,000 dtons<BR>TL13&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1,000,000 dtons<BR><BR>So, if our two adversaries are at TL11 (Jump-2) capable, the maximum<BR>ship size should be only 50,000 tons.<BR><BR>Fighting Ships of the Shattered Imperium, an MT product, puts the BB11<BR>at 300,000 dtons, six times the maximum size allowed by High Guard.<BR><BR>Other CT sources (Trillion Credit Squadron comes to mind) also<BR>contradict the maximum hull size rule above (at TL9, I cannot see the<BR>three hollowed-out asteroid ships displacing only 4000 tons).<BR><BR>The 50,000 dton figure would be perfect, except for a few minor<BR>quibbles.&nbsp; One, each BB is supposed to be able to carry a reinforced<BR>division of infantry - which I take to be about 20,000 troops.&nbsp; Even if<BR>these guys were carried in low berths to save on life support costs,<BR>they're going to take up 40 percent of the available space aboard, not<BR>leaving much for weapons, sensors and whatnot.<BR><BR>Smaller warship sizes would be ideal for this campaign (a 3000-5000<BR>dton warship would be equivalent to an early 20th century battleship at<BR>10 tonnes per displacement ton), and give it something of a 2300AD feel<BR>(the Tallyrand is only equivalent to a 7400 dton warship, and it's<BR>huge).&nbsp; This would keep cruisers in the 800-1200 dton range and<BR>destroyers at about 600 tons or less.&nbsp; I could work around the<BR>"reinforced division" thingy, I suppose, by loading up the spearhead<BR>battalion aboard the warship and having the rest of the division loaded<BR>aboard transports.<BR><BR>Has anyone else gamed out this time period?&nbsp; If so, did you do any ship<BR>designs for your campaign?&nbsp; Would you care to share them?&nbsp; I can<BR>convert anything from CT and MT to TNE readily enough, but I'm not<BR>familiar with any of the other Traveller iterations.<BR><BR>By the way, might it not be possible that Terrans did not invent the<BR>Jump Drive after all, but that they discovered a derelict Vilani ship<BR>in the asteroid belt and simply reverse-engineered the thing?&nbsp; Seems<BR>that's what the Aslan did.<BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:30:57 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Other CT sources (Trillion Credit Squadron comes to mind) also<BR>&gt; contradict the maximum hull size rule above (at TL9, I cannot see the<BR>&gt; three hollowed-out asteroid ships displacing only 4000 tons).<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Asteroid ships like the _Rock_ probably get a break from maximum ship sizes<BR>due to the fact that you're not actually constructing a ship from scratch,<BR>you're installing ship systems into hollowed out stone or nickel/iron. The<BR>Rock loses a lot of its size if the rocky walls were to be converted to<BR>standard hull metal.<BR><BR>&gt; By the way, might it not be possible that Terrans did not invent the<BR>&gt; Jump Drive after all, but that they discovered a derelict Vilani ship<BR>&gt; in the asteroid belt and simply reverse-engineered the thing?&nbsp; Seems<BR>&gt; that's what the Aslan did.<BR><BR>The Aslan invention/back engineering of the jump drive is one of the corner<BR>stones of one of the games I'm playing now. <BR>Why not go all the way...perhaps noone except the Ancients actually invented<BR>the jump drive...the Major Races were just better at expoiting it and<BR>keeping the truth hidden.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:42:38 -0000<BR>From: "Mark S Peace" &lt;mark.s.peace@dunelm.org.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:12:29 -0800<BR>&gt; From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; After nearly a week of supreme disinterest i have decided to reveal<BR>&gt; the solution to the puzzle of A Few Minor Worlds.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; You will remember (come on... just nod and say yes):<BR>&gt; Tordesillas (Gaea 0610) E-26793D-7 Rs 134 Tw G2V Solitary<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Rurik&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 0860) D-3679DC-8 Po Rs 134 Eb G2V Solitary<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Jewel&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 0820) E-267947-7 Hi 934 Tw G2V Solitary<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Jung-Zei&nbsp; &nbsp; (Gaea 1035) D-267A8G-7 Hi Ag 134 Cn G2V Solitary<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Usonia&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (Gaea 1040) C-267943-9 Ri 334 Fw G2V Solitary<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Cabotia&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 1060) E-267849-9 Lo Ag Rs 334 Fw G2V Solitary<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Barton&nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 1325) E-267847-9&nbsp; Lo Ag Rs 234 Fw G2V Solitary<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; These map to:<BR>&gt; Tordesillas Brazil<BR>&gt; Rurik Russia<BR>&gt; Jewel India<BR>&gt; Jung-Zei China<BR>&gt; Usonia U.S.A.<BR>&gt; Cabotia Canada<BR>&gt; Barton Australia<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Planet size was determined as follows:<BR>&gt; SQRT((Area of Country X 10/3) / 4) * 2<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Atmosphere and Hydrosphere are Earth's.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Population is the country's present day population.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Government and Law Level are prejudiced estimates in Traveller terms.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Trade codes are likely seeming estimates, again prejudiced.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Starport is based on present day launching capacity.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Planetoid Belts are the Asteroid Belt, the Kuiper Belt and the<BR>&gt; recently discovered (or rather, posited and initially confirmed) belt<BR>&gt; of several thousand asteroids with orbits entirely between Earth and<BR>&gt; Mars. Well, i had to be sneaky somewhere 8^)<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>I don't get this.&nbsp; The populations are wrong (eg Australia 200 million - I<BR>don't think so), some of the government codes are wrong (eg Russia -<BR>Religious dictatorship ???), and the law levels are wrong (I don't even know<BR>what codes C, D and G mean.)&nbsp; Are you using non-standard UPPs?<BR><BR>Mark<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 00:53:41 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Initially, all worlds will start with J1, which makes following the mains<BR>&gt;&gt; natural.&nbsp; But, how long does it take to establish a Deep Base (to allow<BR>&gt;&gt; bridging of J2 gaps), and how do you decide where to establish them?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; IMnon-TU, I didn't have to worry about that since the only limit to<BR>&gt; distance was time and resupply.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In a Traveller universe, I'd probably apply a modifier to<BR>&gt; "attractiveness" of a planet based on how far outside jump range it<BR>&gt; is.&nbsp; I'd just assume Deep Bases to be established anywhere needed,<BR>&gt; adding costs in time, materials and labour.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; For Jump-1 technology, the "costs" might go<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Parsecs&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 4<BR>&gt; Cost&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 8&nbsp; &nbsp; 15<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; or something like that.<BR><BR>Nope. If 2 parsecs is "4", then the costs go like this (or *worse*, not<BR>better!):<BR><BR>Parsecs&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 6 <BR>Cost&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 16&nbsp;&nbsp; 64&nbsp;&nbsp; 256&nbsp; 1024<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4^0&nbsp; 4^1&nbsp; 4^2&nbsp; 4^3&nbsp; 4^4&nbsp; 4^5<BR><BR>It's an exponential progression. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:42:30 EST<BR>From: JFZeigler@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/24/01 11:22:55 AM Eastern Standard Time, <BR>harrisgwjr@yahoo.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; The 50,000 dton figure would be perfect, except for a few minor<BR>&gt;&nbsp; quibbles.&nbsp; One, each BB is supposed to be able to carry a reinforced<BR>&gt;&nbsp; division of infantry - which I take to be about 20,000 troops.&nbsp; Even if<BR>&gt;&nbsp; these guys were carried in low berths to save on life support costs,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; they're going to take up 40 percent of the available space aboard, not<BR>&gt;&nbsp; leaving much for weapons, sensors and whatnot.<BR><BR>For what it's worth, while I was researching the IW period for RIM OF<BR>FIRE, I think we wound up concluding that each counter in the IMPERIUM<BR>boardgame actually represented a squadron of similar ships rather than a<BR>single capital ship.&nbsp; Even under pretty conservative assumptions regarding<BR>the population of the Vilani Rim Province, it was clear that both sides could<BR>afford many more ships than the boardgame suggested.<BR><BR>If your BBs are 50,000 dtons but there are 3-4 of them in a squadron,<BR>then I don't think you have as much problem carrying a division of<BR>infantry along.<BR><BR>- ----------<BR>Jon F. Zeigler: Mathematician, computer geek, amateur historian, freelance<BR>writer, occasional scribbler of bad poetry<BR>"For any statement, no matter how innocuous, there exists a nonempty<BR>set of people who will take offense at it."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:01:02 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: "John P. Raynor" &lt;john.raynor@yale.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>On Wed, 24 Jan 2001, Gerry Harris wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Has anyone else gamed out this time period?&nbsp; If so, did you do any ship<BR>&gt; designs for your campaign?&nbsp; Would you care to share them?&nbsp; I can<BR>&gt; convert anything from CT and MT to TNE readily enough, but I'm not<BR>&gt; familiar with any of the other Traveller iterations.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; By the way, might it not be possible that Terrans did not invent the<BR>&gt; Jump Drive after all, but that they discovered a derelict Vilani ship<BR>&gt; in the asteroid belt and simply reverse-engineered the thing?&nbsp; Seems<BR>&gt; that's what the Aslan did.<BR><BR>I've been thinking about trying to run a "Pocket Empires" campaign based<BR>on this premise, except that instead of discovering Vilani wreckage in the<BR>asteroid belt, the Terrans find a badly damaged *Vegan* warship, resting<BR>on one of Earth's continental shelves (the warship was damaged in battle<BR>during the Vilani conquest of the Vegans, misjumped into the Terra system,<BR>tried to refuel, and sank by mistake).<BR><BR>For added fun, however, the Terrans discover the Vegan wreckage in *1975*,<BR>long before the end of the collapse of the Soviet Union and the end of the<BR>Cold War.&nbsp; By the late 1990s, individual Terran nations are launching<BR>*really* crude starships (largely Tech Level 8, with a few Tech Level 9<BR>components).&nbsp; Of course, they know the Vilani are lurking out there...<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - J. Raynor<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:11:42 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>John P. Raynor wrote:<BR>&gt; I've been thinking about trying to run a "Pocket Empires"<BR>&gt; campaign based on this premise, except that instead of<BR>&gt; discovering Vilani wreckage in the asteroid belt, the Terrans<BR>&gt; find a badly damaged *Vegan* warship, resting on one of Earth's<BR>&gt; continental shelves (the warship was damaged in battle during<BR>&gt; the Vilani conquest of the Vegans, misjumped into the Terra<BR>&gt; system, tried to refuel, and sank by mistake).<BR><BR>This reminds me a bit of the film "Sphere" (but without the time-<BR>travel or psionic device part of the plot.):&nbsp; An alien spacecraft<BR>is found wrecked on the sea&nbsp; floor&nbsp; ...&nbsp; the&nbsp; investigation&nbsp; team<BR>discover the dead crew were human.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 06:32:06 +1300<BR>From: pbroeder@wave.co.nz<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>John Snead wrote:<BR>Very true.&nbsp; It's interesting to note that for around the last 40 years<BR>(I've not seen data from before the 60s) population projections have<BR>been consistently higher than the actual results. The maximum<BR>projected world population has been consistently dropping.&nbsp; The<BR>most recent UN projections which include mortality from AIDs have<BR>dropped even more.&nbsp; I think the current figure is now a bit under 10<BR>billion.&nbsp; It looks like we will (thankfully) never reach Pop A.<BR><BR>I'm also curious what the mid to long-term results of China one-<BR>child policy and the resulting jump in female infanticide.&nbsp; Anyone<BR>here know if the sex ration in the PRC is noticeably skewed yet?&nbsp; It<BR>could be really ugly there in a few decades.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<BR>The New state of the World Atlas (1990) Says that China has 10% fewer<BR>women than it should, or 50 million short.<BR>The Britannica annual (1989) says 5% or about 25 million short, but<BR>isn't actually measuring the shortfall of women. On the other hand I<BR>suspect the first atlas is just a teeny bit biased...<BR>Sorry I don't have anything more up to date - My references are in dire<BR>need of an update...<BR><BR>Jonathan, NZ<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:26:37 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>At 10:23 PM -0500 1/23/01, Paul Drye wrote:<BR>&gt;Well, is there one?<BR><BR>Yeah, dere is.&nbsp; Yoo wanna make sumptin of it, buddy?<BR><BR>Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:26:29 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>Gerry Harris wrote:<BR>&gt; By the way, might it not be possible that Terrans did not invent<BR>&gt; the Jump Drive after all, but that they discovered a derelict<BR>&gt; Vilani ship in the asteroid belt and simply reverse-engineered<BR>&gt; the thing?&nbsp; Seems that's what the Aslan did.<BR><BR>I've heard a rumour in the past that the *Ancients* didn't invent<BR>jump drive ... they discovered that&nbsp; an&nbsp; even&nbsp; earlier&nbsp; race&nbsp; had<BR>*constructed* jumpspace, and the Ancients exploited it!<BR><BR>No doubt all the races since&nbsp; the&nbsp; Ancients&nbsp; have&nbsp; just&nbsp; reverse-<BR>engineered&nbsp; derelict&nbsp; Ancient&nbsp; ships.&nbsp; Except&nbsp; the&nbsp; Solomani,&nbsp; of<BR>course, who are clever enough not&nbsp; to&nbsp; need&nbsp; a&nbsp; helping&nbsp; hand&nbsp; to<BR>attain greatness.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:26:12<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>I agree about the overuse of the Ancients to explain things.<BR><BR>I do have one world in Lunion that drives the scientists nuts.<BR><BR>It was obviously terraformed at one point, and has been slowly losing its<BR>overly-thick atmosphere for a very long time.<BR><BR>In fact, it was terraformed at least a million years before the Ancients<BR>came on the scene!&nbsp; They've even found the remains of a small Ancient base<BR>on the surface that was abondoned long before the Final War.<BR><BR>What's the story?&nbsp; Beats the hell out of me.&nbsp; I just like having this one,<BR>single remant of some long vanished race bugging people.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:28:49<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Origins award<BR><BR>At 01:13 PM 1/24/2001 +0100, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Also, any and all game designers apparently have the possibility to<BR>&gt;nominate their work. Instructions for doing so are in the Illuminator.<BR>&gt;The deadline is the 27th, so its kind of urgent.<BR><BR>Well, now I can claim that GF was nominated for the Origins Award!<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:30:57<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>At 09:55 AM 1/24/2001 -0000, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Of course, if you *want* to have crinkly coastlines you could always<BR>&gt;have a 'zoom' feature...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Create large scale maps of individual hexes (with rivers, forests, large<BR>&gt;towns &amp; major cities etc), then zoom in on the hexes of *that* map etc<BR>&gt;(streams, woods, smaller towns and villages etc)...<BR><BR>I have a wonderful little program called Terralogicus that does precisely<BR>this.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:34:05<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR><BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR><BR>You will remember (come on... just nod and say yes):<BR>Tordesillas (Gaea 0610) E-26793D-7 Rs&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 134 Tw G2V Solitary<BR>Rurik&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 0860) D-3679DC-8 Po Rs&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 134 Eb G2V Solitary<BR>Jewel&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 0820) E-267947-7 Hi&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 934 Tw G2V Solitary<BR>Jung-Zei&nbsp; &nbsp; (Gaea 1035) D-267A8G-7 Hi Ag&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 134 Cn G2V Solitary<BR>Usonia&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (Gaea 1040) C-267943-9 Ri&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 334 Fw G2V Solitary<BR>Cabotia&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; (Gaea 1060) E-267849-9 Lo Ag Rs&nbsp; 334 Fw G2V Solitary<BR>Barton&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (Gaea 1325) E-267847-9 Lo Ag Rs&nbsp; 234 Fw G2V Solitary<BR><BR>A few problems.<BR><BR>"Rs" isn't a standard trade code.<BR><BR>Rurik can't be Poor.&nbsp; It has an atmosphere of 6 and 70% water.<BR><BR>Jung-Zei can't be both Hi-Pop and Agricultural.&nbsp; The maximum population for<BR>an agricultural world is 7.<BR><BR>Usonia can't be Rich.&nbsp; Once again, population is too high.<BR><BR>Neither Cabotia nor Barton are Low-Pop.&nbsp; One more time, the population<BR>numbers are too high for Agricultural worlds.<BR><BR>Tordesillas and Jung-Zei can't have those government and law combinations.<BR><BR>The biggest problem was that I don't think that anybody had any clue as to<BR>what this was all about.&nbsp; It wasn't really presented as a brain teaser,<BR>just, as the title states, "a few minor worlds."<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:33:39 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3556<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Alas, "terra" is *not* the proper root. Terra is "dirt" or "ground".<BR>&gt; &gt; Tellus (as in "Tellus Mater" = "Mother Earth" is). We are "Tellurians",<BR>&gt; &gt; not "Terrans".<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I believe E. E. "Doc" Smith got this particular bit of pedantry right.<BR>&gt; On the other hand, that's not surprising, since Smith also used words<BR>&gt; like "yclept," apparently with a straight face.<BR><BR>What's wrong with "yclept?" It's a perfectly cromulent word!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:55:20 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>Also the Aslan.&nbsp; They reverse-engineered a Solomani starship<BR>(Pathfinder).<BR><BR>- --- "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; Gerry Harris wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; By the way, might it not be possible that Terrans did not invent<BR>&gt; &gt; the Jump Drive after all, but that they discovered a derelict<BR>&gt; &gt; Vilani ship in the asteroid belt and simply reverse-engineered<BR>&gt; &gt; the thing?&nbsp; Seems that's what the Aslan did.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I've heard a rumour in the past that the *Ancients* didn't invent<BR>&gt; jump drive ... they discovered that&nbsp; an&nbsp; even&nbsp; earlier&nbsp; race&nbsp; had<BR>&gt; *constructed* jumpspace, and the Ancients exploited it!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; No doubt all the races since&nbsp; the&nbsp; Ancients&nbsp; have&nbsp; just&nbsp; reverse-<BR>&gt; engineered&nbsp; derelict&nbsp; Ancient&nbsp; ships.&nbsp; Except&nbsp; the&nbsp; Solomani,&nbsp; of<BR>&gt; course, who are clever enough not&nbsp; to&nbsp; need&nbsp; a&nbsp; helping&nbsp; hand&nbsp; to<BR>&gt; attain greatness.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Regards PLST<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:00:50 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt;It was obviously terraformed at one point, and has been slowly losing its <BR>&gt;overly-thick atmosphere for a very long time.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;In fact, it was terraformed at least a million years before the Ancients <BR>&gt;came on the scene!&nbsp; They've even found the remains of a small Ancient base <BR>&gt;on the surface that was abondoned long before the Final War.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What's the story?<BR><BR>Hmmmmm.<BR><BR>"Comparison of isotope ratios between Rabwhar (1822 Spinward Marches)and <BR>other nearby bodies in the same system have provided a clue. The best <BR>current theory is that the world harbored a scientific base dedicated to <BR>studying the long-term effects of terraforming a world. To that end, Rabwhar <BR>was terraformed then enclosed in a bubble of distorted space-time. Within <BR>the bubble, time moved at approximately a 4000:1 ratio as compared to the <BR>rest of the universe. The 0.7 MY discrepancy between the time when the world <BR>was terraformed and the hey-day of the Ancients corresponds to a period of <BR>somewhat less than 200 years in which the bubble was active. The error bars <BR>of these studies are disturbingly large, but this is a promising line of <BR>inquiry that is sure to be followed up in the future."<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:01:50 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Well, is there one?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Yeah, dere is.&nbsp; Yoo wanna make sumptin of it, buddy?<BR><BR>Gimme! Please.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:48:35 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; On Tue, 23 Jan 2001, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Alas, "terra" is *not* the proper root. Terra is "dirt" or "ground".<BR>&gt;&gt; Tellus (as in "Tellus Mater" = "Mother Earth" is). We are "Tellurians",<BR>&gt;&gt; not "Terrans".<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I believe E. E. "Doc" Smith got this particular bit of pedantry right.<BR>&gt; On the other hand, that's not surprising, since Smith also used words<BR>&gt; like "yclept," apparently with a straight face.<BR><BR>I had to look that one up myself. But to use Doc's own terminology, he<BR>was a precisionist, and *used* his enormous (even by the standards of<BR>his own day) vocabulary.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 10:44:57 -0800<BR>From: Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR><BR>You're right. Reality sucks and i'm an idiot 8^)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 10:52:40 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3555<BR><BR>sneadj@mindspring.com writes:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Given that they were mostly for having a nuke go on near your hull <BR>&gt; or similar exceedingly energetic events which produce vast <BR>&gt; amounts of radiation, even when compared to solar flares, I'd say <BR>&gt; that SD &amp; BSD actually have very good radiation resistance. <BR><BR>The thing is, radiation resistance is basically exponential in thickness.<BR>If you just claim that SD is as good as a comparable thickness of steel<BR>(which is already unrealistic), an unarmored ship (AF 20, in T4 -- 7 cm <BR>steel equivalent) is going to reduce radiation by 1.5-2 orders of magnitude,<BR>and a moderately armored ship (AF 60) will drop it by 4-5 orders of magnitude.<BR>If you make it 100x better per unit thickness, minimum ship armor would drop<BR>radiation by a factor of about 10^10, which is enough to make a nuclear weapon<BR>irrelevant at any range where it won't vaporize the ship.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 20:44:31 +0100<BR>From: "Tage Borg" &lt;tage@hem.passagen.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3556<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Alas, "terra" is *not* the proper root. Terra is "dirt" or "ground".<BR>&gt; &gt; Tellus (as in "Tellus Mater" = "Mother Earth" is). We are "Tellurians",<BR>&gt; &gt; not "Terrans".<BR><BR>I thought 'tellus' was greek, 'terra' latin.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; /Tage<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 08:02:26 +1100<BR>From: "Katharine Whitchurch" &lt;katts@globalfreeway.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Credit where due<BR><BR>&gt; From: Phil Kitching &lt;postmark.design@btinternet.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Credit where due<BR>&gt; "One thousand credits gets your 1 Dt of cargo freighted one jump"*<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; [* one jump-1 to the economics revisionists!]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; There you are - "consumable", "tangable", "almost universally desireable"<BR>&gt; and ideally suited to a trading culture.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; It's also stable and causes lower tech currency to be traded at a<BR>discount,<BR>&gt; since otherwise their merchant ships can't meet the standard.<BR><BR>The problem is that such a value schema isnt stable, and secondly the<BR>initial value is wrong.<BR><BR>Now, if you have the right to pay someone Cr1000 and demand their ship<BR>transport your dton of cargo, then that isnt really a problem, because the<BR>normal price of transporting cargo a parsec is a lot lower than that.<BR><BR>The ugliness comes in when someone turns up with Cr 78 000, and demands your<BR>Far Trader moves a cargo to somewhere stupidly dangerous.<BR><BR>The instability in value is because every time someone invents a better<BR>starship-related widget, the price price of starships falls, and secondly<BR>because the operating costs of starships are intimatly associated with the<BR>rate of interest in the Imperium - if this spikes, then people are going to<BR>need to earn more money to make mortgage payments (if existing ships have<BR>fixed mortgages, then new ships are going to have this problem).<BR><BR>Basically, I'm not saying it never happened (I think the Vilani Imperium did<BR>just this), but I am saying that it makes no more sense to base your<BR>currency on a service than on a good.<BR><BR>Me, I think what backs the Imperial Credit is the knowledge you can take<BR>that red strip of plastic, and can buy a hundred credits worth of goods,<BR>services or Famile Spofulam Jet Bike Refills at any of eleven thousand or so<BR>worlds (OK, so maybe you cant buy 1 liter packs of DFG at every world ...<BR>but you get the point).<BR><BR>Ian Whitchurch<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3557<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yg02.mx.aol.com (rly-yg02.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.2]) by air-yg02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:10:38 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yg02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:09:54 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id QAA30231;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:06:26 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:05:51 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id QAA30190<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:05:51 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:05:51 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101242105.QAA30190@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3557<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3558</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/24/01 11:58:42 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 25 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3558<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Interstellar War Query<BR>Re: Interstellar War Query<BR>Re: Credit where due<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Radiation Resistance<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:29:55 -0800<BR>Re: Origins award<BR>Re: Radiation Resistance<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>BITS Products/Origins etc<BR>RE: BITS Products/Origins etc<BR>RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Big Starports and Barren Planets<BR>We Have Met The Zhos..And They Are Us!<BR>Re: Bad joke (Was : RE: Credit where due) [OT]<BR>[none]<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: <BR>Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query)<BR>RE: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>RE: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:31:36 -0500<BR>From: Ethan Henry &lt;ethan.henry@sitraka.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; By the way, might it not be possible that Terrans did not invent the<BR>&gt; Jump Drive after all, but that they discovered a derelict Vilani ship<BR>&gt; in the asteroid belt and simply reverse-engineered the thing?&nbsp; Seems<BR>&gt; that's what the Aslan did.<BR><BR>&lt;crazy guy&gt;<BR><BR>Possible? POSSIBLE?&nbsp; It's PROBABLE! It's probably damn too near the truth<BR>for the comfort of the high-and-mighty Solomani Party Secretariat! Oh Yes!<BR>They tell you all about Prof. Bob Meson and the meson gun and that guy that<BR>"invented" the jump drive but LET ME TELL YOU - is it a coincidence that<BR>the jump drive was oh-so-convienently "discovered" jump after finding that<BR>"archaeological site" on Europa or Io or whereever up there in the asteroid<BR>belt? I doubt it! Ask one of them fancy jump-drive-scientists how the damn<BR>thing works and can they tell you? Oh, they go on and on about field and<BR>tensors and vectors and this and that, but when one of the damn things<BR>breaks what do they do - THEY REPLACE THE WHOLE DAMN THING! Doesn't sound<BR>to me like the know how it works. And how freakining long did it take the<BR>Terrans to even clue in to the fact that you could jump father than Pluto?<BR>Huh? Like you'd build it and not know how blazing far it could go! HUH?<BR>They're like a bunch of TL-0 savages with their cellcomm systems,<BR>worshiping the tiny little magic boxes that make voices come out, OH LET ME<BR>TELL YOU!<BR><BR>And another thing...<BR><BR>&lt;/crazy guy&gt;<BR><BR>Ethan<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:54:40 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>On 24 Jan 01, at 8:17, Gerry Harris wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I find the period of the Interstellar wars fascinating.&nbsp; Lately, I've<BR><BR>[snip]<BR><BR>&gt; Has anyone else gamed out this time period?&nbsp; If so, did you do any ship<BR><BR>http://www.downport.com/amv/Promrise/Index.htm<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:55:52 -0500<BR>From: "Daniel Phelps" &lt;phelpsd@gate.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Credit where due<BR><BR>I wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;For the sake of argument what about a Blishian solution to the question.<BR>&gt;&gt;Peg it to something almost universally desireable which is tangable and<BR>&gt;&gt;consumable like antiagathics?<BR><BR><BR>The reply was:<BR>&gt;Okay<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;"One thousand credits gets your 1 Dt of cargo freighted one jump"*<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;[* one jump-1 to the economics revisionists!]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;There you are - "consumable", "tangable", "almost universally desireable"<BR>&gt;and ideally suited to a trading culture.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;It's also stable and causes lower tech currency to be traded at a discount,<BR>&gt;since otherwise their merchant ships can't meet the standard.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Exactly what is required by the rules.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>No what I think you need is something consumable for which the demand is<BR>theatrically completely elastic.&nbsp;&nbsp; Blish's solution would fit the bill in<BR>that we are talking about a universally desired commodity for which supply<BR>will never exceed demand.&nbsp; What do the economists on the list think of this<BR>suggestion?<BR><BR>Dan<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:09:46 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>On Wed, Jan 24, 2001 at 06:53:05PM +1000, Alan Bradley wrote:<BR>&gt; I wouldn't go with Deep Bases for crossing J2 gaps.&nbsp; Instead, I would build<BR>&gt; ships with fuel for two consecutive jumps.<BR><BR>Ah, yes, of course.&nbsp; You're quite right -- 2 parsecs shouldn't be much<BR>less attractive than 1 after all.<BR><BR>It's only when you get to about 6 parsecs or so that a Deep Base might<BR>be more attractive.<BR><BR><BR>- - Tim<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:16:34 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Craig Berry &lt;cberry@cinenet.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:25:12 PST<BR>&gt; From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; But I'm a planetary gearhead (do we need a name for this?),<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Given the Latin root of the base word and the appropriate feel, how about<BR>&gt; &gt; "terrarist"? :)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Alas, "terra" is *not* the proper root. Terra is "dirt" or "ground".<BR>&gt; Tellus (as in "Tellus Mater" = "Mother Earth" is). We are "Tellurians",<BR>&gt; not "Terrans".<BR><BR>&lt;bristle&gt;Precisely why (along with the pun value) I choice<BR>"terrarist".&lt;/bristle&gt; It's similar to "rockhead", meant to suggest a<BR>creator in the medium of dirt or ground.&nbsp; There's no connection to the<BR>planet Earth, or Terra, or Tellus, or Fred.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; Craig Berry - http://www.cinenet.net/~cberry/<BR>--*--&nbsp; "The hills are burning, and the wind is raging; and the clock<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; strikes midnight in the Garden of Allah." - Don Henley<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:30:21 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; For Jump-1 technology, the "costs" might go<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Parsecs&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 4<BR>&gt; &gt; Cost&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 8&nbsp; &nbsp; 15<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; or something like that.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Nope. If 2 parsecs is "4", then the costs go like this (or *worse*, not<BR>&gt; better!):<BR><BR>Not necessarily.&nbsp; They only go up exponentially if *everything*<BR>involved goes up exponentially.&nbsp; As I see it, the biggest component of<BR>cost will be having to tie up these expensive ships for longer, and<BR>additional costs associated with possibly perishable cargo.&nbsp; Hence the<BR>biggest effect will be roughly linear.&nbsp; On top of that, you get an<BR>initially small cost in fuel being shipped to Deep Bases successively<BR>further away, and a cost of building and maintaining Deep Bases that<BR>grows roughly linearly in (J-1) at first, but has a small exponential<BR>term.<BR><BR>Yes, over really long distances this will become very close to<BR>exponential, dominated by fuel costs.&nbsp; But the first few terms won't<BR>be.<BR><BR><BR>Of course, as I had forgotten, you don't need a Deep Base to go<BR>anything less than about 6 or 7 parsecs, regardless of Jump<BR>technology.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:28:04 -0800<BR>From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>Subject: Radiation Resistance<BR><BR>Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; The thing is, radiation resistance is basically exponential in<BR>&gt; thickness. If you just claim that SD is as good as a comparable<BR>&gt; thickness of steel (which is already unrealistic),<BR><BR>Why? Superdense is denser than steel.<BR><BR>- -John Snead sneadj@mindspring.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:35:09 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>Matt Bond wrote:<BR>&gt; If you were to view Earth on the scale of a Traveller World Map, then<BR>&gt; you would only see relatively smooth curves or straight lines...<BR><BR>You certainly would not.&nbsp; I've *got* Earth on the scale of a Traveller<BR>World Map, and it doesn't have straight lines or smooth curves<BR>anywhere that I can see.<BR><BR>&gt; Certainly not crinkle-cut coastlines a la Norway.<BR><BR>That is more crinkly than most.&nbsp; But with very few exceptions,<BR>coastlines are more or less crinkly.&nbsp; In fact, I challenge you to find<BR>me a section of coastline anywhere that *is* a smooth curve on the<BR>scale of a Traveller World Map.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:29:55 -0800<BR>From: "Pat Connaughton" &lt;patconnaughton@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:29:55 -0800<BR><BR>unsubscribe<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 23:07:08 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Origins award<BR><BR>At 16:05 -0500 24/1/01,&nbsp; "Douglas E. Berry" <BR>&lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Also, any and all game designers apparently have the possibility to<BR>&gt; &gt;nominate their work. Instructions for doing so are in the Illuminator.<BR>&gt; &gt;The deadline is the 27th, so its kind of urgent.<BR>&gt;Well, now I can claim that GF was nominated for the Origins Award!<BR><BR>Doug,<BR><BR>I'm not sure if BITS are eligible as a UK non-GAMA company, but you <BR>may want to nominate At Close Quarters, or get James to do so if <BR>there is an appropriate class.<BR><BR>Ditto Tim Collinson and the Periodicals Bibliography.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:39:29 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Radiation Resistance<BR><BR>sneadj@mindspring.com writes:<BR>&gt; Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; The thing is, radiation resistance is basically exponential in<BR>&gt; &gt; thickness. If you just claim that SD is as good as a comparable<BR>&gt; &gt; thickness of steel (which is already unrealistic),<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Why? Superdense is denser than steel.<BR><BR>I meant comparable in armor value -- i.e. SD is 7x stronger than steel, and<BR>thus 1 cm SD would protect like 7 cm steel.&nbsp; Realistic would probably be 1 cm<BR>SD protects like 2 cm steel.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:59:59 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>Christopher Thrash wrote:<BR>&gt; If you're interested in a statistical summary of the results that First In<BR>&gt; does give, I have done some of the work and posted it:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://www.io.com/~thrash/firstin.html<BR><BR>It's a pity that the analysis didn't include class M stars,<BR>considering that they outnumber every other type of star.<BR>Unfortunately I don't have First In, so I can't complete the analysis<BR>:(<BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:58:23 -0700<BR>From: johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu<BR>Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>On Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:55:20 -0800 (PST) harrisgwjr@yahoo.com (Gerry Harris)<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Also the Aslan.&nbsp; They reverse-engineered a Solomani starship<BR>&gt;(Pathfinder).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;--- "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Gerry Harris wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; By the way, might it not be possible that Terrans did not invent<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; the Jump Drive after all, but that they discovered a derelict<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Vilani ship in the asteroid belt and simply reverse-engineered<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; the thing?&nbsp; Seems that's what the Aslan did.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; I've heard a rumour in the past that the *Ancients* didn't invent<BR>&gt;&gt; jump drive ... they discovered that&nbsp; an&nbsp; even&nbsp; earlier&nbsp; race&nbsp; had<BR>&gt;&gt; *constructed* jumpspace, and the Ancients exploited it!<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; No doubt all the races since&nbsp; the&nbsp; Ancients&nbsp; have&nbsp; just&nbsp; reverse-<BR>&gt;&gt; engineered&nbsp; derelict&nbsp; Ancient&nbsp; ships.&nbsp; Except&nbsp; the&nbsp; Solomani,&nbsp; of<BR>&gt;&gt; course, who are clever enough not&nbsp; to&nbsp; need&nbsp; a&nbsp; helping&nbsp; hand&nbsp; to<BR>&gt;&gt; attain greatness.<BR><BR>IMTU this is the case...the jump drive 'relics' were carefully seeded in human<BR>systems at some point during the Ancients period, whether as some sort of<BR>insurance or, more likely, as some sort of weird experiment.<BR><BR>Major races, such as the Vilani, Solomani, and Vargr are ones that managed to<BR>conceal the fact that they found rather than discovered it.<BR><BR>Canon even supports this to some extent in that all the jump drives initially<BR>discovered behave in much the same way; the only exception are the Hivers who<BR>invented an inferior type of jump drive, somewhat like T2300's stutterwarp,<BR>before adopting the superior Imperium jump drive.<BR><BR>However, the last time we had this dicsussion, Marc posted that the Solomani<BR>had indeed discovered jump drive from first principles, not by reverse<BR>engineering Vilani or Ancient technology. Therefore it is Canon that we did<BR>invent Jump Drive.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 00:07:07 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: BITS Products/Origins etc<BR><BR>Doug/Tim et al.<BR><BR>I've submitted 101 Patrons (Best RPG Adventure), The Periodical <BR>Bibliography (Best Game Aid) and ACQ (Best SF Miniatures Game) into <BR>the awards process so you don't need to.<BR><BR>I'm not sure if Jesse's gorgeous art for 101 Patron's cover can also <BR>be submitted - if anyone finds it can can they prompt me or him.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:36:32 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: BITS Products/Origins etc<BR><BR>I'm not sure what you're stating or asking regarding 101 Patrons.&nbsp; Are you<BR>asking if it's eligible?&nbsp; If so, it might be able to be entered in the<BR>graphic design category.&nbsp; I think there's a snowball's chance of it<BR>*winning* though since that one little supplement would be up against whole<BR>game systems, etc.&nbsp; If you're asking for the original artwork, I can resend<BR>it to you.<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Dominic Mooney<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2001 4:07 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: BITS Products/Origins etc<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Doug/Tim et al.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I've submitted 101 Patrons (Best RPG Adventure), The Periodical<BR>&gt; Bibliography (Best Game Aid) and ACQ (Best SF Miniatures Game) into<BR>&gt; the awards process so you don't need to.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'm not sure if Jesse's gorgeous art for 101 Patron's cover can also<BR>&gt; be submitted - if anyone finds it can can they prompt me or him.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Cheers,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:31:37 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>In the book, the spacecraft was American, having been launched in the<BR>21st century, it fell through a wormhole and crashed in the ocean in<BR>the 17th.&nbsp; It was then discovered in the 20th.&nbsp; Crichton didn't do as<BR>much with that premise as he could have, though, and the book was kind<BR>of flat.<BR><BR>- --- "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; John P. Raynor wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; I've been thinking about trying to run a "Pocket Empires"<BR>&gt; &gt; campaign based on this premise, except that instead of<BR>&gt; &gt; discovering Vilani wreckage in the asteroid belt, the Terrans<BR>&gt; &gt; find a badly damaged *Vegan* warship, resting on one of Earth's<BR>&gt; &gt; continental shelves (the warship was damaged in battle during<BR>&gt; &gt; the Vilani conquest of the Vegans, misjumped into the Terra<BR>&gt; &gt; system, tried to refuel, and sank by mistake).<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This reminds me a bit of the film "Sphere" (but without the time-<BR>&gt; travel or psionic device part of the plot.):&nbsp; An alien spacecraft<BR>&gt; is found wrecked on the sea&nbsp; floor&nbsp; ...&nbsp; the&nbsp; investigation&nbsp; team<BR>&gt; discover the dead crew were human.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Regards PLST<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 00:47:50 -0000<BR>From: "Ben Aaronovitch" &lt;bem@imaginaryfilms.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>Cos they're cute little doggiewoggies who wag there tail-ums, altogther now -<BR>ah.<BR><BR>Ben<BR><BR>'Let's be honest here - you paid for the women.'<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Bill Murrey - Scrooged<BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: Kelly St.Clair &lt;kellys@efn.org&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Monday, January 22, 2001 8:15 AM<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR><BR>&gt; On Sun, 21 Jan 2001 22:52:37 -0800, Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; (snipped)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; ObTrav:&nbsp; why do Humans and Vargr get along so well?&nbsp; Because we're still<BR>&gt; half pack-hunter ourselves - look at chimp behavior, or (human) small group<BR>&gt; dynamics.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 01:43:09 -0000<BR>From: "Ben Aaronovitch" &lt;bem@imaginaryfilms.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Big Starports and Barren Planets<BR><BR>In my ongoing masochistic attempt to renovate an entire sector I have come<BR>across a number of class A or B starports assigned to mainworlds with no<BR>population (and occasionally no planet).<BR><BR>However, upon mapping trade routes I sometimes find that these starports often<BR>lie on major trade routes. In these instances I decide that the SPA in its<BR>wisdom has built the facility as a glorified petrol station. In which case I<BR>usually put them in orbit around a convenient gas giant (that size 4 zero<BR>atmosphere planet makes more sense if its Europa). This gives ready access for<BR>the starports fuel scoopers and cuts down on delays due to jump masking (because<BR>the GG is further out).<BR><BR>This traveller pontification was brought to you by fair trade coffee, when you<BR>absolutely positively have to fall asleep at work tomorrow.<BR><BR>Ben<BR><BR>'Let's be honest here - you paid for the women.'<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Bill Murrey - Scrooged<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 22:41:29 -0600<BR>From: "D. Smart" &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR>Subject: We Have Met The Zhos..And They Are Us!<BR><BR>The New Scientist site has posted an interesting<BR>story about the discovery of "mind-reading" cells<BR>existing in every human being.<BR><BR>It's at:<BR>http://www.newscientist.com/features/features.jsp?id=ns22751<BR><BR><BR>ObTrav: No wonder the Vilani have infiltrated us.<BR>&lt;fnord&gt;<BR><BR>David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 23:45:49 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Bad joke (Was : RE: Credit where due) [OT]<BR><BR>On 01/24/01 at 09:07 AM,&nbsp; "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;On Wed, 24 Jan 2001, Frank G. Pitt wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Anthony Jackson wrote :<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; The Imperial credit is apparently a fiat currency.<BR>&gt;&gt; You can buy Fiats with it ?<BR><BR>&gt;What car does the Pope drive?<BR><BR>Uh...the Popemobile?&nbsp; &lt;gd&amp;r&gt;<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt;Fiat Lux. <BR><BR><BR><BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 06:31:31 <BR>From: "John Lambert" &lt;hovtej@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: [none]<BR><BR>who<BR>end<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 22:22:40 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:25:12 PST<BR>&gt;&gt; From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; But I'm a planetary gearhead (do we need a name for this?),<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Given the Latin root of the base word and the appropriate feel, how about<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; "terrarist"? :)<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Alas, "terra" is *not* the proper root. Terra is "dirt" or "ground".<BR>&gt;&gt; Tellus (as in "Tellus Mater" = "Mother Earth" is). We are "Tellurians",<BR>&gt;&gt; not "Terrans".<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;bristle&gt;Precisely why (along with the pun value) I choice<BR>&gt; "terrarist".&lt;/bristle&gt; It's similar to "rockhead", meant to suggest a<BR>&gt; creator in the medium of dirt or ground.&nbsp; There's no connection to the<BR>&gt; planet Earth, or Terra, or Tellus, or Fred.<BR><BR>Easy! I wasn't trying to insult you. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 22:23:52 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;It was obviously terraformed at one point, and has been slowly losing its <BR>&gt;&gt;overly-thick atmosphere for a very long time.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;In fact, it was terraformed at least a million years before the Ancients <BR>&gt;&gt;came on the scene!&nbsp; They've even found the remains of a small Ancient base <BR>&gt;&gt;on the surface that was abondoned long before the Final War.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;What's the story?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hmmmmm.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "Comparison of isotope ratios between Rabwhar (1822 Spinward Marches)and <BR>&gt; other nearby bodies in the same system have provided a clue. The best <BR>&gt; current theory is that the world harbored a scientific base dedicated to <BR>&gt; studying the long-term effects of terraforming a world. To that end, Rabwhar <BR>&gt; was terraformed then enclosed in a bubble of distorted space-time. Within <BR>&gt; the bubble, time moved at approximately a 4000:1 ratio as compared to the <BR>&gt; rest of the universe.<BR><BR>Won't work. You'd have to enclose not merely the world, but the star as<BR>well. Otherwise the world freezes over because it's getting 1/4000th as<BR>much energy from the star, and shifted downward by a factor of 4000 at<BR>that!<BR><BR>Let's see, assuming a G type star, the received energy level is<BR>equivalent to a planet almost 64 times as far from the star. <BR><BR>Yep, it'd be frozen over. Even before we adjust the wavelength of the<BR>received radiation.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 01:01:57 -0800<BR>From: "Pat Connaughton" &lt;patconnaughton@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: <BR><BR>Query?<BR><BR><BR>- ----- Original Message ----- <BR>From: John Lambert &lt;hovtej@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2001 6:31 AM<BR><BR><BR>&gt; who<BR>&gt; end<BR>&gt; _________________________________________________________________<BR>&gt; Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:20:06 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query)<BR><BR>On Wed, 24 Jan 2001, Gerry Harris wrote:<BR>&gt; In the book, the spacecraft was American, having been launched in the<BR>&gt; 21st century, it fell through a wormhole and crashed in the ocean in<BR>&gt; the 17th.&nbsp; It was then discovered in the 20th.&nbsp; Crichton didn't do as<BR>&gt; much with that premise as he could have, though, and the book was kind<BR>&gt; of flat.<BR><BR>&lt;nitpick&gt;<BR>The Finnish translation of the book annoyed me quite much. The title was<BR>translated as "Vieras tulevaisuudesta", which means something like "A<BR>Visitor from the Future". That kind of spoiled the suspension of<BR>characters in the book not knowing where the sphere was from.<BR><BR>The title of the movie was translated as the same, probably because the<BR>book was assumed to be known. <BR>&lt;/nitpick&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 21:02:10 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote :<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Alas, "terra" is *not* the proper root. Terra is "dirt" or "ground".<BR>&gt; Tellus (as in "Tellus Mater" = "Mother Earth" is). We are "Tellurians",<BR>&gt; not "Terrans".<BR><BR>But you can't use Tellus, it's the trademark of a vaccuum cleaner company.<BR><BR>&gt; And even if you use "terra" relate stuff, you get "terrestrial" as the<BR>&gt; starting point. :-(<BR><BR>So :&nbsp; we are the Terrestrials, take us to your leader !<BR><BR>Or is that Terrestrians ?<BR><BR>or Terrestriani ?<BR><BR>Personally, I think the planet gearheads should call themselves<BR>"Territorials"<BR>&lt;grin&gt;<BR><BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 02:54:02 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Alas, "terra" is *not* the proper root. Terra is "dirt" or "ground".<BR>&gt;Tellus (as in "Tellus Mater" = "Mother Earth" is). We are "Tellurians",<BR>&gt;not "Terrans".<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; That's an interesting take, but it's not entirely consistent with the way<BR>the Romans used the word.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; [Before I start, I'd like to point out that this is all pretty much moot as<BR>there's no reason why a term for a "planetary gearhead" would have to refer<BR>to the planet Earth... in fact, I'm not really following that line of<BR>logic.]<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Terra meant "dirt", "soil" or "earth" (not in the sense of Earth as in "the<BR>planet Earth"), but it also meant cosmological "land" (as opposed to the<BR>heavens and water), "ground" (as in a solid dry area), "region", or<BR>"country" as well as something similar in a number of ways to our own usage<BR>of the word "world".<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tellus was, for the most part, pretty close to the word terra in meaning,<BR>with some minor differences. It could be used to refer to earth/soil, to<BR>land, and to the ground. Much like the word terra, the term had a usage<BR>would could be compared to the way the English word "world" is used, but<BR>which is subtly different from "terra". Tellus was a slightly more poetic<BR>word than terra, and it didn't quite carry the same cosmological connotation<BR>(if I recall correctly, but I may be wrong on that point).<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tellus was also the name of a goddess, and this goddess went by a number of<BR>other names including Terra, Tellus Mater and Terra Mater. She was an<BR>agricultural goddess, and as a result a very strong case could be made that<BR>all of her names refer to her as a personification of the fertile nature of<BR>the land or the soil. This goddess doesn't appear to synch up as closely<BR>with the contemporary understanding of "Mother Earth" as, say, the Greek<BR>Gaia does, but in some cases the fit is pretty close. Even so, to claim that<BR>Tellus is "right" -- which you have done -- pretty much ignores the fact<BR>that terra had a meaning similar to the English word "world", both alone (as<BR>used by Cicero and others) and when combined with the Latin word for disk or<BR>circle (as in the case of "orbis terrarum").<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Basically, it's quite possible to use either Latin word as a root. I'd be<BR>very reluctant to make the claim that either is "right" because neither<BR>really maps perfectly onto the notion of the Earth as a planet, but both of<BR>them can be used to refer to "the world". Given that both words can be lined<BR>up extremely well with the word "earth", it's pretty reasonable to use<BR>either of them (or both of them) to refer to our planet, in the same way<BR>that our planet came to be referred to as "Earth" in English.<BR><BR>&gt;And even if you use "terra" relate stuff, you get "terrestrial" as the<BR>&gt;starting point. :-(<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Not really. The English word "terrestrial" comes from a different Latin<BR>word (terrestris) which was an adjective with a meaning along the lines of<BR>"from the ground (or land)" or "on the ground (or land)". One variation<BR>(terrestria) refers to creatures which dwell and travel on the ground (or<BR>land). It's one possible route someone who's creating a Latin-derived word<BR>could take (and given the rationale above, it's reasonable to scale the word<BR>in the same way as I mentioned above with terra and tellus, i.e.<BR>"extra-terrestrial" to refer to an alien creature), but it's not the only<BR>route someone could take.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3558<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xd05.mx.aol.com (rly-xd05.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.170]) by air-xd04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 02:58:42 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xd05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 02:58:07 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id CAA54386;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 02:57:16 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 25 Jan 2001 02:56:16 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id CAA54333<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 02:56:16 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 02:56:16 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101250756.CAA54333@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3558<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3559</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/25/01 8:58:40 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 25 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3559<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>RE: Bad joke (Was : RE: Credit where due) [OT]<BR>RE: Vilani Word List?<BR>RE: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3556<BR>RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>Extreme Planetary conditions<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3556<BR>RE: GT: Rim of Fire<BR>Cargonaut (and also DGP (attn: Rodge))<BR>Re: Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query)<BR>Re: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR>Re: Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query)<BR>Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR>RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR>New First Survey<BR>GT Starships<BR>re: Interstellar War Query<BR>RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>Andrew Akin's spreadsheet<BR>Re: Andrew Akin's spreadsheet<BR>RE: GT Starships<BR>Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR>RE: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:34:47 -0000<BR>From: "Antony Farrell" &lt;Skaran@bigpond.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>I have done some translations of warships into TNE.<BR><BR>In my Banners sector pocket empire (Follow the link through the Pocket<BR>Empire button) I have done up versions of the ED-11 (Estoc class), CA-11<BR>(Vilardi class) and a BB-11 (Vanguard class, though this one is a different<BR>configuration to the one in Fighting Ships). There is also an ED-12 (Lugudar<BR>class) and the Solomani Tamarov class is there version of an ED-13<BR><BR>In my normal campaign I have some vessels of TL9 through 11 (Follow the link<BR>through Starships &amp; Spacecraft), all built using FFS1.<BR><BR>Find them though www.users.bigpond.com/Skaran<BR><BR>Antony<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:34:48 -0000<BR>From: "Antony Farrell" &lt;Skaran@bigpond.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Bad joke (Was : RE: Credit where due) [OT]<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Sent: Thursday, 25 January 2001 5:46 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Bad joke (Was : RE: Credit where due) [OT]<BR><BR><BR>On 01/24/01 at 09:07 AM,&nbsp; "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>said:<BR><BR>&gt;On Wed, 24 Jan 2001, Frank G. Pitt wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Anthony Jackson wrote :<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; The Imperial credit is apparently a fiat currency.<BR>&gt;&gt; You can buy Fiats with it ?<BR><BR>&gt;What car does the Pope drive?<BR><BR>Uh...the Popemobile?&nbsp; &lt;gd&amp;r&gt;<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR><BR>Actually he doesn't drive he has a chauffeur.<BR><BR>Antony<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt;Fiat Lux.<BR><BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:39:13 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Kenji Schwarz [mailto:schwarz@fas.harvard.edu]<BR>&gt; Sent: 24 January 2001 17:27<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Cc: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Vilani Word List?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; At 10:23 PM -0500 1/23/01, Paul Drye wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Well, is there one?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Yeah, dere is.&nbsp; Yoo wanna make sumptin of it, buddy?<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Uh...how about making a Vilani/English language course? A couple thousand<BR>rabid Star Trek fans can't be wrong.* :)<BR><BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>*Unless the question is 'Should one wear a Star Fleet Dress Uniform to a<BR>formal dinner? '.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:42:37 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>Good one.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Cos they're cute little doggiewoggies who wag there tail-ums, <BR>&gt; altogther now -<BR>&gt; ah.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Ben<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 'Let's be honest here - you paid for the women.'<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Bill Murrey - Scrooged<BR>&gt; ----- Original Message -----<BR>&gt; From: Kelly St.Clair &lt;kellys@efn.org&gt;<BR>&gt; To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Sent: Monday, January 22, 2001 8:15 AM<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; On Sun, 21 Jan 2001 22:52:37 -0800, Gordon Horne <BR>&gt; &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt;<BR>&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; (snipped)<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; ObTrav:&nbsp; why do Humans and Vargr get along so well?&nbsp; <BR>&gt; Because we're still<BR>&gt; &gt; half pack-hunter ourselves - look at chimp behavior, or <BR>&gt; (human) small group<BR>&gt; &gt; dynamics.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:44:31 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3556<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Michael Daumen [mailto:daumen@mindspring.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: 24 January 2001 17:34<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3556<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Alas, "terra" is *not* the proper root. Terra is "dirt" <BR>&gt; or "ground".<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Tellus (as in "Tellus Mater" = "Mother Earth" is). We are <BR>&gt; "Tellurians",<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; not "Terrans".<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; I believe E. E. "Doc" Smith got this particular bit of <BR>&gt; pedantry right.<BR>&gt; &gt; On the other hand, that's not surprising, since Smith also <BR>&gt; used words<BR>&gt; &gt; like "yclept," apparently with a straight face.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What's wrong with "yclept?" It's a perfectly cromulent word!<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Dexitroboping Zwilnik! Go emmfoz yourself! :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 02:10:25 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>Thanks.<BR><BR>- --- Antony Farrell &lt;Skaran@bigpond.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; I have done some translations of warships into TNE.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; In my Banners sector pocket empire (Follow the link through the<BR>&gt; Pocket<BR>&gt; Empire button) I have done up versions of the ED-11 (Estoc class),<BR>&gt; CA-11<BR>&gt; (Vilardi class) and a BB-11 (Vanguard class, though this one is a<BR>&gt; different<BR>&gt; configuration to the one in Fighting Ships). There is also an ED-12<BR>&gt; (Lugudar<BR>&gt; class) and the Solomani Tamarov class is there version of an ED-13<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; In my normal campaign I have some vessels of TL9 through 11 (Follow<BR>&gt; the link<BR>&gt; through Starships &amp; Spacecraft), all built using FFS1.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Find them though www.users.bigpond.com/Skaran<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Antony<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:45:47 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR><BR>Hi Folks, <BR><BR>For my own nefarious purposes, I need a world with the following conditions:<BR><BR>Abundence of high-purity silicates on surface. If the environment also<BR>contained anything which could function similarly to liquid crystal, that<BR>would be a bonus.<BR>Thin atmosphere rich in sulphur compounds (in particular sulphur<BR>hexafluoride).<BR>Occasional high-intensity bombardment by stellar radiation (something<BR>equivalent to the effects of 100 fs from a femtosecond YAG laser). Note that<BR>this needs only to be in short bursts,&nbsp; not a sustained blast.<BR><BR>Gravity isn't too important, but shouldn't be too much above a G.<BR><BR>Firstly: Is it possible for such an environment to occur naturally? (I'm<BR>trying to simulate lab conditions to create a specific material naturally)<BR>Second: Are there any worlds listed with UPPs like this that I can landgrab?<BR>On the fringes would be good, because I'd like it nice and unexplored.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 22:37:55 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3556<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Alas, "terra" is *not* the proper root. Terra is "dirt" or "ground".<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Tellus (as in "Tellus Mater" = "Mother Earth" is). We are "Tellurians",<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; not "Terrans".<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I thought 'tellus' was greek, 'terra' latin.<BR><BR>No, they are both Latin. I think the Greek is "Gaea".<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:25:27 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: GT: Rim of Fire<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;At 8:24 AM -0800 1/11/01, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;One thing I've always wanted to try was a fantasy setting <BR>&gt;using the magic<BR>&gt;&gt;in G: Voodoo.&nbsp; No wizards sending fireballs around, but <BR>&gt;instead spirits and<BR>&gt;&gt;loa coming on deadly errands, and magic powders and potions <BR>&gt;for almost any<BR>&gt;&gt;occasion.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I have an article on using the system for Fantasy Spirit Magic that <BR>&gt;was published in Pyramid.&nbsp; (Doug actually knows this, but I can toot <BR>&gt;my own horn can't I :-)&nbsp; Also, GURPS Spirits is about to come out. <BR>&gt;(Might be useful for those who want spiritualist, ghosts and vodoo in <BR>&gt;their Traveller campaigns...)<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>I've got the playtest file for Spirit and it's very thorough. That and<BR>Voodoo could be useful for a spiritualist PC...even/especially if magic<BR>doesn't work. <BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:47:33 +0100<BR>From: Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR>Subject: Cargonaut (and also DGP (attn: Rodge))<BR><BR>On Wednesday, January 24, 2001, 3:57:19 PM, the following was written:<BR><BR>LW&gt; At 23:58 +0000 1/19/01, John G. Wood wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;Hi,<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>Tee-Hee, I am a happy camper ;-) (One that loves E-Bay)<BR><BR>Last week I bid on the complete "Lost Traveller" Collection and today,<BR>a large package arrived. Paul, if you are still around, thanks a lot,<BR>you did an excellent job. I have not started reading it yet, but the<BR>books look excellent. I got Rogues in Space twice now, but that<BR>doesnt matter, as they are both different editions, and I am, as RS<BR>called it, Traveller insane ;-)<BR><BR>BTW: Rodge, since you have returned to the TML, one question. Do you<BR>still have the rights to the DGP Materials? If so, what are the<BR>chances of _finally_ seeing them reprinted, or you selling the rights<BR>to someone who could get that done?<BR>At this point, the DGP stuff is treated as "forbudden canon" by SJG<BR>and MM, but wed like to see it become part of the usuable Traveller canon<BR>once again.<BR>So how about it?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 08:29:50 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query)<BR><BR>&gt;The Finnish translation of the book annoyed me quite much. The title was <BR>&gt;translated as "Vieras tulevaisuudesta", which means something like "A <BR>&gt;Visitor from the Future". That kind of spoiled the suspension of characters <BR>&gt;in the book not knowing where the sphere was from.<BR><BR>Other direct translations of Finnish titles for famous science fiction <BR>stories:<BR><BR>"War of the Worlds" -- "They All Catch a Cold and Die"<BR>"Ender's Game" -- "It's Not a Game, It's Real!"<BR>"Dune" -- "Paul Atreides, the Kwisatz Haderach Who Will Be Emperor"<BR>"Fahrenheit 451" -- "Memorizing Books"<BR>"The Martian Chronicles" -- "*We* Are The Martians!"<BR><BR>Honestly, that Crichton translator ought to be fired....<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 06:12:44 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR><BR>Simply say such a world exists in a known system, but is not the main<BR>world.<BR><BR>- --- "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Hi Folks, <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; For my own nefarious purposes, I need a world with the following<BR>&gt; conditions:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Abundence of high-purity silicates on surface. If the environment<BR>&gt; also<BR>&gt; contained anything which could function similarly to liquid crystal,<BR>&gt; that<BR>&gt; would be a bonus.<BR>&gt; Thin atmosphere rich in sulphur compounds (in particular sulphur<BR>&gt; hexafluoride).<BR>&gt; Occasional high-intensity bombardment by stellar radiation (something<BR>&gt; equivalent to the effects of 100 fs from a femtosecond YAG laser).<BR>&gt; Note that<BR>&gt; this needs only to be in short bursts,&nbsp; not a sustained blast.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Gravity isn't too important, but shouldn't be too much above a G.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Firstly: Is it possible for such an environment to occur naturally?<BR>&gt; (I'm<BR>&gt; trying to simulate lab conditions to create a specific material<BR>&gt; naturally)<BR>&gt; Second: Are there any worlds listed with UPPs like this that I can<BR>&gt; landgrab?<BR>&gt; On the fringes would be good, because I'd like it nice and<BR>&gt; unexplored.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Dean<BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:16:41 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query)<BR><BR>On Thu, 25 Jan 2001, Paul Drye wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;The Finnish translation of the book annoyed me quite much. The title was <BR>&gt; &gt;translated as "Vieras tulevaisuudesta", which means something like "A <BR>&gt; &gt;Visitor from the Future". That kind of spoiled the suspension of characters <BR>&gt; &gt;in the book not knowing where the sphere was from.<BR>[snip]<BR>&gt; Honestly, that Crichton translator ought to be fired....<BR><BR>Well, yes, that what I thought, too.<BR><BR>Actually, most Finnish translations are good, and without spoilers.<BR>(Execpt movies, they suck almost universally.)<BR><BR>The German translations of Babylon 5 episode names were pretty bad. If you<BR>can read German, http://www.midwinter.de/lurk/countries/master/eplist.html<BR>has the German names.<BR><BR>(http://www.midwinter.com/lurk/countries/master/eplist.html has the<BR>original names.)<BR><BR>- -- +++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:54:15 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: "John P. Raynor" &lt;john.raynor@yale.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR><BR>On Wed, 24 Jan 2001, Loren Wiseman wrote:<BR>&gt; At 23:58 +0000 1/19/01, John G. Wood wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Hi,<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; I'm looking for manuscripts for a group of 32-page books dealing with a<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; single world (16,000 to 17,000 words), for publication by SJ Games.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;I'm interested, and would like more details. If there is a sample outline<BR>&gt; &gt;(maybe the one used for Kamsii) I think it would probably answer most of my<BR>&gt; &gt;questions.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; We need the manuscript to be abut 16-17,000 words, preferably on the high<BR>&gt; side (it is easier to edit down than up). I don't yet have a draft outline<BR>&gt; or a list of proposed contents, but basically I want a short discussion of<BR>&gt; the system as a whole, A discussion of the main world, including geography,<BR>&gt; ecology, society &amp; culture, and anything else special about the place.<BR>&gt; Cover important cities, the starport, and anything else relevant.<BR><BR>Has anything canonical been written about Mertactor (the "capital" of<BR>District 268)?&nbsp; I know it was mentioned in "Adventure 10: Safari Ship,"<BR>and received a paragraph of coverage in "G.T.: Behind the Claw," but is<BR>it, otherwise, a blank slate?<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - J. Raynor<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:25:19 -0500<BR>From: "Walt Smith" &lt;firelock_ny@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu wrote:<BR>&gt;Canon even supports this [all jump drives are derived from<BR>&gt;Ancients artifacts] to some extent in that all the jump drives<BR>&gt;initially discovered behave in much the same way; the only exception<BR>&gt;are the Hivers whoinvented an inferior type of jump drive, somewhat<BR>&gt;like T2300's stutterwarp, before adopting the superior Imperium jump<BR>&gt;drive.<BR><BR>IMO Canon supports the Vargr (or, at least, *some* Vargr) as<BR>independent inventors as well.&nbsp; Early Vargr jump drives are<BR>referred to as using inferior Barium elements, and AFAIK they<BR>are the only major race to build jump drives in this fashion.<BR><BR>Their jump drives must be original, a copy would have been<BR>built better.&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>Walt Smith<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:36:14 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR><BR>&gt;Has anything canonical been written about Mertactor (the "capital" of<BR>&gt;District 268)?&nbsp; I know it was mentioned in "Adventure 10: Safari Ship,"<BR>&gt;and received a paragraph of coverage in "G.T.: Behind the Claw," but is<BR>&gt;it, otherwise, a blank slate?<BR><BR>I've no idea if this counts as canonical or not, but a licensed commercial <BR>text-based adventure game called "The Volentine Gambit" was set on <BR>Mertactor, and went into considerable detail about the world. Sometime in <BR>the early- to mid-80s, IIRC.<BR><BR>Amazingly, punching "The Volentine Gambit" into Google produced this <BR>document, which covers the high points:<BR><BR>http://ground.icaen.uiowa.edu/apple2/upl1998/Sep98/Gambit.docs.txt<BR><BR>God, I love the web.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 14:34:15 -0000<BR>From: "Mark Preston" &lt;mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: New First Survey<BR><BR>Ok, so we all admit (even Marc, it seems from the messages) that First<BR>Survey is....welll...garbage. How about someone (like BITS maybe?)<BR>getting a whole lot of us together and doing a decent version?<BR><BR>- --<BR>Mark A. Preston<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 15:52:35 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: GT Starships<BR><BR>I haven't seen the play test files and I was curious..are the details about <BR>starship operation on the level of the Starship Operators Manual? (DGP). I <BR>know that SJG cant use the text in the book but some of the general ideas <BR>are in GDW products like zucchai (sp) crystals, jump capacitors and jump <BR>governors....As a GM I like using the SOM to decide what breaks on the PC's <BR>ship :-)<BR><BR>Mike<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 07:59:57 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: re: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>&gt;From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Interstellar War Query<BR>...<BR><BR>&nbsp; You've got the wrong values - per pages 26 &amp; 28 of HG2, you use<BR>the upper values of the ranges, not the lower. The wording is a<BR>bit torturous :)<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;According to High Guard, the maximum ship size, at each tech level, is<BR>&gt;dependent upon the computer available at that tech level, and yields<BR>&gt;the following results:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;TL 7-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1000 dtons<BR>&gt;TL 9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4000 dtons<BR>&gt;TL10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 10,000 dtons<BR>&gt;TL11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 50,000 dtons<BR>&gt;TL12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 100,000 dtons<BR>&gt;TL13&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1,000,000 dtons<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:13:14 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;In the book, the spacecraft was American, having been launched in the<BR>&gt;21st century, it fell through a wormhole and crashed in the ocean in<BR>&gt;the 17th.&nbsp; It was then discovered in the 20th.&nbsp; Crichton didn't do as<BR>&gt;much with that premise as he could have, though, and the book was kind<BR>&gt;of flat.<BR><BR>Hmm, Crichton and Worm Holes...why am I suddenly getting a weird Jim Henson<BR>vibe? :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:27:55 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Andrew Akin's spreadsheet<BR><BR>I'm trying to find a copy of Mr. Akin's spreadsheet for ship design, but <BR>all the links I've found are 404.<BR><BR>Can anyone point me to it?<BR>Thanks!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>Opinions should be yours too! - http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>"What's a FAQ? Boy, I wish someone would put a list of answers<BR>for common questions such as this..."<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:40:19 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Andrew Akin's spreadsheet<BR><BR>Mark Urbin wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I'm trying to find a copy of Mr. Akin's spreadsheet for ship design, but<BR>&gt; all the links I've found are 404.<BR><BR>I have a number of ships designed with the Akins spreadsheet on my Web<BR>site, with the spreadsheets provided (Excel 5.0 format, zipped).&nbsp; See my<BR>sig file for the URL.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:35:49 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: GT Starships<BR><BR>I remember that a couple of months ago Rob was after some details of<BR>Operational procedures aboard naval vessels. Not sure what the current<BR>situation is, tho.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>&gt;-----Original Message-----<BR>&gt;From: Michael McKeown [mailto:mmckeown67@hotmail.com]<BR>&gt;Sent: 25 January 2001 15:53<BR>&gt;To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;Subject: GT Starships<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I haven't seen the play test files and I was curious..are the <BR>&gt;details about <BR>&gt;starship operation on the level of the Starship Operators <BR>&gt;Manual? (DGP). I <BR>&gt;know that SJG cant use the text in the book but some of the <BR>&gt;general ideas <BR>&gt;are in GDW products like zucchai (sp) crystals, jump <BR>&gt;capacitors and jump <BR>&gt;governors....As a GM I like using the SOM to decide what <BR>&gt;breaks on the PC's <BR>&gt;ship :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Mike<BR>&gt;_________________________________________________________________<BR>&gt;Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:55:19 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: "John P. Raynor" &lt;john.raynor@yale.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR><BR>On Thu, 25 Jan 2001, Paul Drye wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;Has anything canonical been written about Mertactor (the "capital" of<BR>&gt; &gt;District 268)?&nbsp; I know it was mentioned in "Adventure 10: Safari Ship,"<BR>&gt; &gt;and received a paragraph of coverage in "G.T.: Behind the Claw," but is<BR>&gt; &gt;it, otherwise, a blank slate?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I've no idea if this counts as canonical or not, but a licensed commercial<BR>&gt; text-based adventure game called "The Volentine Gambit" was set on<BR>&gt; Mertactor, and went into considerable detail about the world. Sometime in<BR>&gt; the early- to mid-80s, IIRC.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Amazingly, punching "The Volentine Gambit" into Google produced this<BR>&gt; document, which covers the high points:<BR><BR>Interesting, although it differs fairly radically from how I envisioned<BR>it (I envisioned Mertactor's relatively thick and breathable atmosphere as<BR>the result of terraforming, rather as a consequence of a small, but<BR>unusually dense, world). &lt;shrug&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - J. Raynor<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:54:09 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR><BR>Hmm, That's OK. I'm trying to create a black silicon based species and<BR>wanted to try to reduce the hand-waving to a minimum. Black silicon is<BR>fabricated by subjecting a fairly pure source of silicon to an intense light<BR>source (ie the laser) in an atmosphere of complex sulphur compounds. The<BR>silicon forms a surface of micron-scale spikes topped with spheres with the<BR>sulphur and fluorine embedded into it. The S and Fl seem to introduce extra<BR>electron states into the silicon band gap which enable low-power (such as<BR>infra-red) photons to climb up to the conduction band in steps. Simplified,<BR>the absorption of the black silicon is at around 97% visible and IR light,<BR>rather than the 60% visible, 0.1% IR managed by grey silicon. Black silicon<BR>also seems to be a very impressive transmitter as well.<BR>As far as the critters themselves go, I see a lot of big standing stones<BR>communicating by mircowave-frequency laser. The actual thinking apparatus is<BR>likely to be either optical (that's what I wanted the liquid crystal<BR>for...switching) or just plain electronic. Not much good as far as PCs go<BR>(OK, you're a big black laser powered rock rooted on a planet with a sulphur<BR>atmosphere) but I rather liked the idea. I've speculated on the possiblity<BR>of planetary surface travel by downloading themselves onto each other via<BR>comms laser (microfreq combined with black silicon antennae might actually<BR>give the bandwidth to do this in a couple of hours) and the laser could even<BR>allow for a form of reproduction : they form seeds then the other rocks blow<BR>them to pieces with their lasers!<BR>I decided to name these guys the Sentinels (after the Geoff Crammond game on<BR>the Commodore 64).<BR><BR>Adventure seed: A mineralogical survey has detected vast deposits of black<BR>silicon, a valuable material for communications arrays, on an uninhabited<BR>planet in-system. Since black silicon is expensive to manufacture, mining is<BR>far cheaper. However, it seems someone wants the mining expedition to fail,<BR>because a miner has just been found dead, with multiple laser-burns in his<BR>suit...<BR>Of course, the Sentinels were just trying to talk to him!<BR><BR>What do you think?<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR><BR>&gt;-----Original Message-----<BR>&gt;From: Gerry Harris [mailto:harrisgwjr@yahoo.com]<BR>&gt;Sent: 25 January 2001 14:13<BR>&gt;To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Simply say such a world exists in a known system, but is not the main<BR>&gt;world.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;--- "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Hi Folks, <BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; For my own nefarious purposes, I need a world with the following<BR>&gt;&gt; conditions:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Abundence of high-purity silicates on surface. If the environment<BR>&gt;&gt; also<BR>&gt;&gt; contained anything which could function similarly to liquid crystal,<BR>&gt;&gt; that<BR>&gt;&gt; would be a bonus.<BR>&gt;&gt; Thin atmosphere rich in sulphur compounds (in particular sulphur<BR>&gt;&gt; hexafluoride).<BR>&gt;&gt; Occasional high-intensity bombardment by stellar radiation (something<BR>&gt;&gt; equivalent to the effects of 100 fs from a femtosecond YAG laser).<BR>&gt;&gt; Note that<BR>&gt;&gt; this needs only to be in short bursts,&nbsp; not a sustained blast.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Gravity isn't too important, but shouldn't be too much above a G.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Firstly: Is it possible for such an environment to occur naturally?<BR>&gt;&gt; (I'm<BR>&gt;&gt; trying to simulate lab conditions to create a specific material<BR>&gt;&gt; naturally)<BR>&gt;&gt; Second: Are there any worlds listed with UPPs like this that I can<BR>&gt;&gt; landgrab?<BR>&gt;&gt; On the fringes would be good, because I'd like it nice and<BR>&gt;&gt; unexplored.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Dean<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;=====<BR>&gt;Gerry Harris<BR>&gt;***************************************************************<BR>&gt;*******************************<BR>&gt;ther Traveller - http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>&gt;Soldier's Companion - <BR>&gt;http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316&gt;/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>&gt;***************************************************************<BR>&gt;*******************************<BR>&gt;"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war" - Antony, "Julius <BR>&gt;Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>&gt;***************************************************************<BR>&gt;*******************************<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;__________________________________________________<BR>&gt;Do You Yahoo!?<BR>&gt;Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>&gt;http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3559<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yd05.mx.aol.com (rly-yd05.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.5]) by air-yd01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:58:40 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yd05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:57:59 1900<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id LAA74070;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:57:04 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:56:23 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA74022<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:56:23 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:56:23 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101251656.LAA74022@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3559<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3560</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/25/01 2:18:19 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 25 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3560<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Andrew Akin's spreadsheet<BR>Using Light For storage<BR>Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR>RE: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR>RE: Using Light For storage<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: <BR>Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR>Re: Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query)<BR>Re: <BR>RE: Using Light For storage<BR>Re: Vilani Word List?<BR>Re: Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query)<BR>Re:<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3556<BR>JTAS chat tonight<BR>Re: Interstellar War Query<BR>Re: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3559<BR>RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3559<BR>re: Interstellar War Query<BR>Re: GT Starships<BR>Question....<BR>Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR>Re: JTAS chat tonight<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 08:53:04 -0800<BR>From: Jesse DeGraff &lt;jdegraff@pacbell.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Andrew Akin's spreadsheet<BR><BR>I've just put it up in my resources section at:<BR>http://vision-forge-graphics.com/jesse/traveller/resources/<BR><BR>Best,<BR>Jesse<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Mark Urbin<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2001 8:28 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Andrew Akin's spreadsheet<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I'm trying to find a copy of Mr. Akin's spreadsheet for ship design, but <BR>&gt; all the links I've found are 404.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Can anyone point me to it?<BR>&gt; Thanks!<BR>&gt; ------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&gt; -----------<BR>&gt; Opinions should be yours too! - http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>&gt; "What's a FAQ? Boy, I wish someone would put a list of answers<BR>&gt; for common questions such as this..."<BR>&gt; ------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&gt; -----------<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:22:02 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: John Fox &lt;jfox@verity.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Using Light For storage<BR><BR>Hello Everyone:<BR>&nbsp; Last Thrusday (ie the 18th) the New York Times had an article about how some <BR>physics people at two labratories had slowed light down to a speed of zero.&nbsp; <BR>They then proceeded to reconstitute the light so it came out exactly as it had <BR>entered.<BR>&nbsp; The article states that this is a step towards optical storage of memory. <BR>Granted this was done in a gas (Na if I remember correctly) it still is <BR>promising.<BR>&nbsp; I would say that optical computers are closer than we think.<BR>&nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; John W. Fox<BR>&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 18:41:08 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A Few Minor Worlds<BR><BR>"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>&gt; The biggest problem was that I don't think that anybody had any clue as to<BR>&gt; what this was all about.&nbsp; It wasn't really presented as a brain teaser,<BR>&gt; just, as the title states, "a few minor worlds."<BR><BR>Hey, I got it. I even figured a lot of things out, but not all of the<BR>puzzle...<BR><BR>:-)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 12:42:13 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR><BR>Dean Jones writes:<BR>&gt;Hmm, That's OK. I'm trying to create a black silicon based species and<BR>&gt;wanted to try to reduce the hand-waving to a minimum. Black silicon is<BR>&gt;fabricated by subjecting a fairly pure source of silicon to an intense light<BR>&gt;source (ie the laser) in an atmosphere of complex sulphur compounds.<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I don't understand exactly the process that you describe, but you<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; didn't seem to explain how organisms of some sort resulted from<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; the processes above.&nbsp; I might be able to give you more useful<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; comments if the genesis of life on this world was more<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; explicit.<BR><BR>&gt;As far as the critters themselves go, I see a lot of big standing stones<BR>&gt;communicating by mircowave-frequency laser. The actual thinking apparatus is<BR>&gt;likely to be either optical (that's what I wanted the liquid crystal<BR>&gt;for...switching) or just plain electronic.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I recommend thinking in terms of the evolution of these life forms.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; How did they start?&nbsp; How does their heredity work?&nbsp; How did they<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; get energy and other resources?&nbsp; How did they reproduce?&nbsp; What<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; traits would then be favoured by natural selection?&nbsp; Why would<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; intelligence be favoured?&nbsp; How do they compete with each other?<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; What are limiting factors in growth and reproduction?&nbsp; Do they<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ever have a reason to cooperate?<BR><BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;Adventure seed: A mineralogical survey has detected vast deposits of black<BR>&gt;silicon, a valuable material for communications arrays, on an uninhabited<BR>&gt;planet in-system. Since black silicon is expensive to manufacture, mining is<BR>&gt;far cheaper. However, it seems someone wants the mining expedition to fail,<BR>&gt;because a miner has just been found dead, with multiple laser-burns in his<BR>&gt;suit...<BR>&gt;Of course, the Sentinels were just trying to talk to him!<BR>&gt;What do you think?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sounds very cool.&nbsp; Of course, the strong magnetic field of the planet,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; and the powerful solar activity, interfere with the sensors of the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; explorers so that they cannot detect the curious activity of the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; local rock formations.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 17:43:52 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Using Light For storage<BR><BR>John Fox wrote:<BR>&gt; Last Thrusday (ie the 18th) the New York Times had an article<BR>&gt; about how some physics people at two labratories had slowed light<BR>&gt; down to a speed of zero.&nbsp; They then proceeded to reconstitute the<BR>&gt; light so it came out exactly as it had entered.<BR>&gt; The article states that this is a step towards optical storage of<BR>&gt; memory.&nbsp; Granted this was done in a gas (Na if I remember<BR>&gt; correctly) it still is promising.<BR>&gt; I would say that optical computers are closer than we think.<BR><BR>Well if the light (ie.&nbsp; energy)&nbsp; comes&nbsp; out&nbsp; exactly&nbsp; as&nbsp; it&nbsp; had<BR>entered I think they've just invented a jump drive energy sink!<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:06:26 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Craig Berry &lt;cberry@cinenet.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 22:22:40 PST<BR>&gt; From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; &lt;bristle&gt;Precisely why (along with the pun value) I chose<BR>&gt; &gt; "terrarist".&lt;/bristle&gt; It's similar to "rockhead", meant to suggest a<BR>&gt; &gt; creator in the medium of dirt or ground.&nbsp; There's no connection to the<BR>&gt; &gt; planet Earth, or Terra, or Tellus, or Fred.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Easy! I wasn't trying to insult you. <BR><BR>No prob, was just having fun...though throwing "Fred" in there would<BR>defuse the tone.&nbsp; My sense of humor seems to have increased in damage<BR>potential this week, been one of those "wrong time to quit sniffing glue"<BR>ones.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; Craig Berry - http://www.cinenet.net/~cberry/<BR>--*--&nbsp; "The hills are burning, and the wind is raging; and the clock<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; strikes midnight in the Garden of Allah." - Don Henley<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:46:21 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: <BR><BR>John Lambert wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; who <BR><BR>Who wrote "M-m-m-m-m-myyyygeneration..."?<BR><BR>&gt; end<BR><BR>Who are the Doors?<BR><BR>I'll take strange queries for 500, Alex!<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>University of Arizona<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 18:52:52 -0000<BR>From: "Mark S Peace" &lt;mark.s.peace@dunelm.org.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 22:41:29 -0600<BR>&gt; From: "D. Smart" &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: We Have Met The Zhos..And They Are Us!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The New Scientist site has posted an interesting<BR>&gt; story about the discovery of "mind-reading" cells<BR>&gt; existing in every human being.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Even more interesting in an article in the magazine about habitable planets<BR>around red dwarf stars.<BR><BR>Mark<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:56:09<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query)<BR><BR>At 08:29 AM 1/25/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Honestly, that Crichton translator ought to be fired....<BR><BR>Ask Jerry Pournelle about the German translation of _The Mercenary_ some<BR>time.. :)<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:19:29<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: <BR><BR>At 11:46 AM 1/25/2001 -0700, you wrote:<BR>&gt;John Lambert wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; who <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Who wrote "M-m-m-m-m-myyyygeneration..."?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; end<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Who are the Doors?<BR><BR>Survey says!<BR><BR>X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X<BR>X&nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; X<BR>&nbsp; X&nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; X<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; XX&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; XX&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; XX<BR>&nbsp; X&nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; X<BR>X&nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; X<BR>X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; X<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; _<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; /|<BR>Oh, I'm sorry.. the correct answer is, of course, The WhO<BR><BR><BR><BR>&nbsp; <BR><BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:25:19 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: John Fox &lt;jfox@verity.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Using Light For storage<BR><BR>Peter et al:<BR><BR>&nbsp; As I understood the article (going from memory here) the light gets slowed <BR>down by the gas and converted into a property called spin (quatum level stuff <BR>here).&nbsp; This ca be recalled (forced to move out?) by appling another beam of <BR>light with a certain frequency (hence energy) at a perpendicular to the incoming <BR>light ray.&nbsp; The spin is then converted back into light and the light beam exits <BR>the test chamber with exactly the same qualities (and quantity if I remeber <BR>correctly).&nbsp; The net reuslt was that it appeared as if the light ray had a speed <BR>of zero.&nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; The experiment had been duplicated by both teams (using slightly different <BR>gases and setup independent of each other). My understanding was they were using <BR>low powered lasers.&nbsp; As for the amount of energy that can be put in and recalled <BR>that was not mentioned.&nbsp; <BR><BR>John<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Well if the light (ie.&nbsp; energy)&nbsp; comes&nbsp; out&nbsp; exactly&nbsp; as&nbsp; it&nbsp; had<BR>&gt; entered I think they've just invented a jump drive energy sink!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Regards PLST<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:40:31 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>At 1:01 PM -0500 1/24/01, Paul Drye wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;Well, is there one?<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Yeah, dere is.&nbsp; Yoo wanna make sumptin of it, buddy?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Gimme! Please.<BR><BR>Awright.&nbsp; Gimme a day.&nbsp; The most complete and up-to-date version <BR>(IMHO) is stored as a database file for a particular piece of <BR>software I doubt many of you have or would want to have.&nbsp; I'll knock <BR>it out as pretty-pretty formatted RTF wordprocessor style and email <BR>it to you... have you got Word, and if so, what stage of what species <BR>(vers. #, Mac/PC)?<BR><BR>Anyone else who wants a copy, just email me (off-list!)<BR><BR>It's still very incomplete, but the truth is I've pretty much given <BR>up work on the whole Vilani language project.<BR><BR>Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:49:33 -0600<BR>From: Leslie Bates &lt;lesbates@minn.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query)<BR><BR>At 09:56 AM 1/25/01, you wrote:<BR>&gt;At 08:29 AM 1/25/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Ask Jerry Pournelle about the German translation of _The Mercenary_ some<BR>&gt;time.. :)<BR>&gt;-- <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt;http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>In short, what did he do to it?<BR><BR>Les<BR><BR><BR>=======================================================<BR>Objects on screen may be more hostile than they appear.<BR>=======================================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 19:50:37 <BR>From: "John Lambert" &lt;hovtej@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re:<BR><BR>Busted!<BR><BR>I've rejoined the Traveller list after several years absence and wanted to <BR>see who was still signed on from before. However, I sent the "who" query to <BR>the list rather than to Majordomo. I had planned on lurking for awhile.<BR><BR>I'm glad to see that a lot of the old timers are still here and I'm looking <BR>forward to "meeting" the newer travellers. For reference, I'm listed in the <BR>"Citizens of the TML" and have a very abbreviated description of being <BR>"spaced" quoted in the TML FAQ.<BR><BR>John<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:56:42 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3556<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; I believe E. E. "Doc" Smith got this particular bit of pedantry<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; right.&nbsp; On the other hand, that's not surprising, since Smith also<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; used words like "yclept," apparently with a straight face.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; What's wrong with "yclept?" It's a perfectly cromulent word!<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Dexitroboping Zwilnik! Go emmfoz yourself! :)<BR><BR>Slight detail here. "Yclept" is a real word. You can find it in a<BR>dictionary. Just not in a "pocket" dictionary. :-)<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson, sometimes yclept Shadow<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:41:00 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: JTAS chat tonight<BR><BR>Where: JTAS Online &lt;http://jtas.sjgames.com&gt;<BR>When: Thursday, Jan 25, 7PM CST (1am GMT) <BR>Who: Loren Wiseman <BR>Topic: Loren discusses the GURPS Traveller line.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:59:37 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;Canon even supports this [all jump drives are derived from<BR>&gt;&gt;Ancients artifacts] to some extent in that all the jump drives<BR>&gt;&gt;initially discovered behave in much the same way;<BR><BR>Sorry, but that's called "the laws of physics".<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 12:05:43 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hi Folks, <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; For my own nefarious purposes, I need a world with the following conditions:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Abundence of high-purity silicates on surface. If the environment also<BR>&gt; contained anything which could function similarly to liquid crystal, that<BR>&gt; would be a bonus.<BR>&gt; Thin atmosphere rich in sulphur compounds (in particular sulphur<BR>&gt; hexafluoride).<BR><BR>These two conditions are incompatible. <BR><BR>If a world has enough fluorine for SF6 to be a normal atmospheric<BR>component, that won't *be* any oxygen compounds (such as silicates) in<BR>the crust. You'd have silicon fluoride, with oxygen fluoride as an<BR>atmospheric component.<BR><BR>Also, "high purity silicates" is an overly vague term. I suspect you<BR>mean high purity silica (SiO2). <BR><BR>Finally, "liquid crystals" are a family of complex carbon compounds<BR>that can't exist in the presence of the SF6. And I'n not sure that any<BR>sort of carbon-fluorine compound would have the requisite properties.<BR><BR>&gt; Occasional high-intensity bombardment by stellar radiation (something<BR>&gt; equivalent to the effects of 100 fs from a femtosecond YAG laser).<BR><BR>You haven't told us the wavelength *nor* the energy. <BR><BR>And laser radiation is&nbsp; more than a little different than other forms<BR>of radiation.<BR><BR>&gt; Firstly: Is it possible for such an environment to occur naturally?<BR><BR>No. The elemental abundance of fluorine is such that a world like this<BR>is essentially impossible. You'd need an *incredibly* skewed elemental<BR>abundance in the solar system in question.<BR><BR>&gt; (I'm<BR>&gt; trying to simulate lab conditions to create a specific material naturally)<BR>&gt; Second: Are there any worlds listed with UPPs like this that I can landgrab?<BR>&gt; On the fringes would be good, because I'd like it nice and unexplored.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Dean<BR>&gt;<BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:47:43 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3559<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:54:15 -0500 (EST)<BR>&gt; From: "John P. Raynor" &lt;john.raynor@yale.edu&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Has anything canonical been written about Mertactor (the "capital" of<BR>&gt; District 268)?&nbsp; I know it was mentioned in "Adventure 10: Safari Ship,"<BR>&gt; and received a paragraph of coverage in "G.T.: Behind the Claw," but is<BR>&gt; it, otherwise, a blank slate?<BR><BR>Mertactor was used as the example for starport construction in<BR>GT: Starports. It also appeared in passing in one of the adventure seeds<BR>in GT: Far Trader.<BR><BR>For classic source material, you might want to check Beltstrike and<BR>Tarsus. They are both set in District 268 and may have reason to refer to<BR>the nominal subsector capital.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 12:51:38 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3559<BR><BR>I use to have the Tarsus boxed set. was a great traveller item 8)<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Christopher Thrash [mailto:thrash@io.com]<BR>Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2001 12:48 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3559<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:54:15 -0500 (EST)<BR>&gt; From: "John P. Raynor" &lt;john.raynor@yale.edu&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Attn: Landgrab Participants<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Has anything canonical been written about Mertactor (the "capital" of<BR>&gt; District 268)?&nbsp; I know it was mentioned in "Adventure 10: Safari Ship,"<BR>&gt; and received a paragraph of coverage in "G.T.: Behind the Claw," but is<BR>&gt; it, otherwise, a blank slate?<BR><BR>Mertactor was used as the example for starport construction in<BR>GT: Starports. It also appeared in passing in one of the adventure seeds<BR>in GT: Far Trader.<BR><BR>For classic source material, you might want to check Beltstrike and<BR>Tarsus. They are both set in District 268 and may have reason to refer to<BR>the nominal subsector capital.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 12:55:02 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>Okay, the computer model table says "Ship is the ship requiring this<BR>computer as a minimum."&nbsp; Page 28 reinforces this:&nbsp; "Ship size shows the<BR>hull tonnage code which requires this computer model as a minimum;..."<BR><BR>A 1000 dton ship requires at least a Model 2 computer, which is not<BR>available till TL 7.&nbsp; Therefore I figure that a 1000 dton ship cannot<BR>be built before TL 7.<BR><BR>If, for some reason, I'm not seeing the forest for the trees here (and<BR>it is possible, as I've been known to suffer from heavy cranial<BR>flatulence), let me know.<BR><BR>- --- Steven Hudson &lt;shudson@lightspeed.ca&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Subject: Interstellar War Query<BR>&gt; ...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; You've got the wrong values - per pages 26 &amp; 28 of HG2, you use<BR>&gt; the upper values of the ranges, not the lower. The wording is a<BR>&gt; bit torturous :)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; ...<BR>&gt; &gt;According to High Guard, the maximum ship size, at each tech level,<BR>&gt; is<BR>&gt; &gt;dependent upon the computer available at that tech level, and yields<BR>&gt; &gt;the following results:<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;TL 7-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1000 dtons<BR>&gt; &gt;TL 9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4000 dtons<BR>&gt; &gt;TL10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 10,000 dtons<BR>&gt; &gt;TL11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 50,000 dtons<BR>&gt; &gt;TL12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 100,000 dtons<BR>&gt; &gt;TL13&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1,000,000 dtons<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:57:33 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT Starships<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 15:52:35 <BR>&gt; From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: GT Starships<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I haven't seen the play test files and I was curious..are the details about <BR>&gt; starship operation on the level of the Starship Operators Manual? (DGP). <BR><BR>Same level of detail, but more general.<BR><BR>http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/starships/<BR><BR>&gt; I know that SJG cant use the text in the book but some of the general<BR>&gt; ideas are in GDW products like zucchai (sp) crystals, jump capacitors<BR>&gt; and jump governors....As a GM I like using the SOM to decide what breaks on the PC's <BR>&gt; ship :-)<BR><BR>You should be pleased, then.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:08:14 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Question....<BR><BR>Ok,<BR><BR>hope i dont sound silly. <BR><BR>Long time ago i allowed blasters to be "invented" in the imperium. my<BR>thoughts at the time is that energy weapons manufactures would try and find<BR>a way to negate reflec armor. so after many years of research the discovered<BR>blasters.<BR><BR>my&nbsp; feeling was that blasters where not lasers. they were closer related to<BR>a meson gun. they generated and fired a stream of energized particles. these<BR>particles upon hitting matter of greater density than atmosphere would then<BR>cause a reaction and detonate there by exploding and doing damage that way.<BR>this way if a person was wearing reflec they would be for most intents and<BR>purposes unprotected.<BR><BR>because of the particles exploding when hitting matter of a certain density<BR>or greater i restricted these weapons use on certain worlds where the<BR>atmosheric density was to high to allow the weapon to be fired. of course<BR>the less dense the atmospher the better. In zero g these weapons would ahve<BR>no recoil and would blow holes in Refleced vacc suits.<BR><BR>anyway that was what i did. i did it more to add spice to the game.<BR><BR>what i want to know is there any scientific bases for this type of weapon?<BR>or was i just in my youth being to nieve?<BR><BR>thanks for any info<BR><BR>take care.<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:25:50 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Tim Mac &lt;satelism@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>Brand new and have a few questions.<BR><BR>Played Traveller a few years back and loved it.<BR>Started reading Peter F. Hampton's "Reality<BR>Dysfuntion" series and decided to check out the local<BR>Net Sceane for Traveller. BTW, the book series is one<BR>of the best I have read in a long while and would make<BR>a great Traveller background and campaign.<BR><BR>OK, <BR><BR>Instead of wondering where people play and if they do<BR>F2F games or PBEM I'll ask this.<BR><BR>Anyone in N. CA area, specifically Sacramento area<BR>that would like a good player to add to their group.<BR><BR>Well, lets see if this even gets to the server properly.<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:13:10 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Bernie McGeehan &lt;einreb62@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR><BR>What is the date for that issue? I must have issed<BR>that when it went by...<BR>- --- Mark S Peace &lt;mark.s.peace@dunelm.org.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 22:41:29 -0600<BR>&gt; &gt; From: "D. Smart" &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: We Have Met The Zhos..And They Are Us!<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; The New Scientist site has posted an interesting<BR>&gt; &gt; story about the discovery of "mind-reading" cells<BR>&gt; &gt; existing in every human being.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Even more interesting in an article in the magazine<BR>&gt; about habitable planets<BR>&gt; around red dwarf stars.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Mark<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>"I don't know much about what I like, but I do know Art."&nbsp; &nbsp; me @ the Rijksmuseum, Amsterdam (Terra/Sol 3)http://prattfall.tripod.com/index.html<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:13:57 -0600<BR>From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: JTAS chat tonight<BR><BR>Christopher Thrash wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Where: JTAS Online &lt;http://jtas.sjgames.com&gt;<BR>&gt; When: Thursday, Jan 25, 7PM CST (1am GMT)<BR>&gt; Who: Loren Wiseman<BR>&gt; Topic: Loren discusses the GURPS Traveller line.<BR><BR>Dang! They always have these things when I'm working. I'll be home by<BR>9:30 pm cst and will try to drop in, but I'm guessing it'll be over by<BR>then. ;-&lt;<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3560<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xd03.mx.aol.com (rly-xd03.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.168]) by air-xd02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 17:18:19 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xd03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 17:17:38 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id RAA87088;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 17:17:13 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 25 Jan 2001 17:15:37 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id RAA87033<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 17:15:37 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 17:15:37 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101252215.RAA87033@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3560<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3561</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/25/01 5:52:57 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, January 25 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3561<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Question....<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Low TL Trav worlds and the Amish<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re:<BR>Re:<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Question....<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Question.....<BR>RE: Question.....<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>RE: Question.....<BR>RE: Question.....<BR>re: New First Survey<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: Vilani Word List?<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3559<BR>Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:25:47 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>Tim Mac wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&lt;&lt;snip&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Instead of wondering where people play and if they do<BR>&gt; F2F games or PBEM I'll ask this.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Anyone in N. CA area, specifically Sacramento area<BR>&gt; that would like a good player to add to their group.<BR><BR>Eris Reddoch (the Heretic, not the Goddess) has a list of TMLers and<BR>their physical locations on his Web site, sorted alphabetically by state<BR>(USA), county (UK), or province (Canada) [I don't recall the name for<BR>the various political subdivisions of Australia, but Eris has sorted our<BR>Australian members as well.].&nbsp; Here's the URL (scroll down to near the<BR>bottom of the page for the link):<BR><BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr/<BR><BR>BTW, Eris, please add the following e-mail address for me to my entry:<BR><BR>aurictech@esweeet.com<BR><BR>&lt;&lt;snip&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:22:01 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question....<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; what i want to know is there any scientific bases for this type of weapon?<BR>&gt; or was i just in my youth being to nieve?<BR><BR>I don't know how scientific it is, but in the Star Wars game, blasters fire gas<BR>that is heated to a plasma state (in fact, I know the Star Wars game is very<BR>light on real science).&nbsp; They seem very close to Traveller's plasma guns<BR>(although much higher tech).<BR><BR>A cartridge is slapped into your blaster, and the cartridge contains a Tibana<BR>gas (that's what Lando was mining on Bespin in the Empire Strikes Back).&nbsp; The<BR>gun does the rest--heats the gas to a plasma state, magnetically sending the<BR>plasma or "blaster bolt" down the barrell, towards the target.<BR><BR>For what its worth...<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:26:26 -0600<BR>From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>Tim Mac wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Brand new and have a few questions.<BR><BR>&gt; Played Traveller a few years back and loved it.<BR>&gt; Started reading Peter F. Hampton's "Reality<BR>&gt; Dysfuntion" series and decided to check out the local<BR>&gt; Net Sceane for Traveller. BTW, the book series is one<BR>&gt; of the best I have read in a long while and would make<BR>&gt; a great Traveller background and campaign.<BR><BR>&gt; OK,<BR><BR>&gt; Instead of wondering where people play and if they do<BR>&gt; F2F games or PBEM I'll ask this.<BR><BR>&gt; Anyone in N. CA area, specifically Sacramento area<BR>&gt; that would like a good player to add to their group.<BR><BR>I maintain a list of "travellers" and their locations on my web site. I<BR>have a couple of hundred people so far, and am always willing to add<BR>more. I encourage folks to use the list to help find other people<BR>interested in Traveller who live near them, or live somewhere they plan<BR>to travel. I have lists available in both text and comma delimited<BR>format.&nbsp; The url is http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr/.<BR><BR>Sorry, no one listed as living specifically in Sacramento, but there are<BR>several CA listings that might be in your general area.<BR><BR>If anyone would like to be added send me your Name, City,<BR>State/Province/Region, and Country. Optionally, and only if give me<BR>permission, I also list your email address and/or web site url.<BR><BR>&gt; Well, lets see if this even gets to the server properly.<BR><BR>It certainly did.<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 17:25:01 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Low TL Trav worlds and the Amish<BR><BR>Recently there was some discussion about low TL worlds in the Third<BR>Imperium, and why certain worlds may choose to remain low-tech.&nbsp; For<BR>those who are interested in this, there's an article in Wired regarding<BR>the Amish and how they choose what technologies they accept and why.<BR><BR>http://www.wirednews.com/wired/archive/7.01/amish_pr.html<BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:36:40 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>Tim Mac wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Brand new and have a few questions.<BR><BR>Welcome aboard!<BR><BR>Your newbie essay assignment:<BR><BR>Discuss the ramifications of the elimination in _Fire, Fusion, and<BR>Steel_ (2d edition) of the "one hardpoint per 100 dtons" limit from<BR>Classic Traveller.&nbsp; Your essay should address the argument that detailed<BR>hull surface area requirements in FF&amp;S2 serve as an adequate game<BR>balance, thus eliminating the game-balance need for the tonnage-based<BR>limit on weapons mounts.<BR><BR>&lt;tongue-in-cheek&gt;<BR><BR>BTW, I am disappointed in some of my fellow TMLers.&nbsp; I went away on<BR>National Guard Annual Training; when I returned, I found that several<BR>TML newbies had announced themselves, yet they had not been assigned<BR>newbie essay topics.&nbsp; Just because (AFAIK) no new TMLer has acutally<BR>posted an assigned essay is no reason to fail to assign them.<BR><BR>&lt;/tongue-in-cheek&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:33:07 -0600<BR>From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re:<BR><BR>Bruce Johnson wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; John Lambert wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; who<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Who wrote "M-m-m-m-m-myyyygeneration..."?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; end<BR><BR>&gt; Who are the Doors?<BR><BR>&gt; I'll take strange queries for 500, Alex!<BR><BR>Um, Bruce...that would be Who are the Who? &lt;g&gt; <BR><BR>The question you answered would be either....<BR><BR>Bruce, music of the 60's for 200. Light My Fire!<BR><BR>or <BR><BR>Bruce, famous Exhibitionists for 500. This 60's music group's lead<BR>singer couldn't keep his pants on.<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:35:21 -0600<BR>From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re:<BR><BR>John Lambert wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Busted!<BR><BR>Yes you were! &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; I've rejoined the Traveller list after several years absence and wanted to<BR>&gt; see who was still signed on from before. However, I sent the "who" query to<BR>&gt; the list rather than to Majordomo. I had planned on lurking for awhile.<BR><BR>&gt; I'm glad to see that a lot of the old timers are still here and I'm looking<BR>&gt; forward to "meeting" the newer travellers. For reference, I'm listed in the<BR>&gt; "Citizens of the TML" and have a very abbreviated description of being<BR>&gt; "spaced" quoted in the TML FAQ.<BR><BR>I think the address you send your "who" to is<BR>majordomo@lists.ient.com...but I could be wrong.&nbsp; That *should* be in<BR>the faq, but probably isn't.<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:36:47 -0600<BR>From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>John Groth wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Eris Reddoch (the Heretic, not the Goddess) has a list of TMLers and<BR>&gt; their physical locations on his Web site, sorted alphabetically by state<BR>&gt; (USA), county (UK), or province (Canada) [I don't recall the name for<BR>&gt; the various political subdivisions of Australia, but Eris has sorted our<BR>&gt; Australian members as well.].&nbsp; Here's the URL (scroll down to near the<BR>&gt; bottom of the page for the link):<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr/<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; BTW, Eris, please add the following e-mail address for me to my entry:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; aurictech@esweeet.com<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;&lt;snip&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>I'll do it this weekend, John and thanks for the plug.<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:52:58 +1100<BR>From: Rob &lt;rhoughto@one.net.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question....<BR><BR>Speaking of guns<BR><BR>What about the guns in Arnies new one, 6th day,&nbsp; the look like lasers or p-beams<BR>but have muzzle flash. Probably isn't&nbsp; plasma cos the flash blows sorta backwards<BR><BR>Other Rob<BR><BR>Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; William Lane wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; what i want to know is there any scientific bases for this type of weapon?<BR>&gt; &gt; or was i just in my youth being to nieve?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I don't know how scientific it is, but in the Star Wars game, blasters fire gas<BR>&gt; that is heated to a plasma state (in fact, I know the Star Wars game is very<BR>&gt; light on real science).&nbsp; They seem very close to Traveller's plasma guns<BR>&gt; (although much higher tech).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; A cartridge is slapped into your blaster, and the cartridge contains a Tibana<BR>&gt; gas (that's what Lando was mining on Bespin in the Empire Strikes Back).&nbsp; The<BR>&gt; gun does the rest--heats the gas to a plasma state, magnetically sending the<BR>&gt; plasma or "blaster bolt" down the barrell, towards the target.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; For what its worth...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:53:30 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>On Thu, 25 Jan 2001, John Groth wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Welcome aboard!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Your newbie essay assignment:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Discuss the ramifications of the elimination in _Fire, Fusion, and<BR>&gt; Steel_ (2d edition) of the "one hardpoint per 100 dtons" limit from<BR>&gt; Classic Traveller.&nbsp; Your essay should address the argument that detailed<BR>&gt; hull surface area requirements in FF&amp;S2 serve as an adequate game<BR>&gt; balance, thus eliminating the game-balance need for the tonnage-based<BR>&gt; limit on weapons mounts.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Hey!&nbsp; How come he gets a gearhead question!&nbsp; Why didn't I get a gearhead<BR>question?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 22:53:40 -0000<BR>From: "Peter Scarrott" &lt;peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question.....<BR><BR>William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt; posted<BR>&gt;hope i dont sound silly.<BR>Don't worry we alls ound silly some of the time :-)<BR><BR>&gt;Long time ago i allowed blasters to be "invented" in the imperium. my<BR>&gt;thoughts at the time is that energy weapons manufactures would try and find<BR>&gt;a way to negate reflec armor. so after many years of research the<BR>discovered<BR>&gt;blasters.<BR>Errrr, quick question, negating reflec already existed, slug throwers? or am<BR>I missing the point here?<BR><BR>&gt;my&nbsp; feeling was that blasters where not lasers. they were closer related to<BR>&gt;a meson gun. they generated and fired a stream of energized particles.<BR>these<BR>&gt;particles upon hitting matter of greater density than atmosphere would then<BR>&gt;cause a reaction and detonate there by exploding and doing damage that way.<BR>&gt;this way if a person was wearing reflec they would be for most intents and<BR>&gt;purposes unprotected.<BR>non physisist comment : How does the energised particles distinguish between<BR>densities of matter.&nbsp; I would have thought that some of the particles would<BR>detonate in the air (interacting wioth air particles).<BR><BR>&gt;because of the particles exploding when hitting matter of a certain density<BR>&gt;or greater i restricted these weapons use on certain worlds where the<BR>&gt;atmosheric density was to high to allow the weapon to be fired. of course<BR>&gt;the less dense the atmospher the better. In zero g these weapons would ahve<BR>&gt;no recoil and would blow holes in Refleced vacc suits.<BR>Recoil should be unaffected by zero-G or the density of the atmosphere I<BR>believe.<BR><BR>&gt;anyway that was what i did. i did it more to add spice to the game.<BR>Good enough reason for doing it.<BR><BR>&gt;what i want to know is there any scientific bases for this type of weapon?<BR>&gt;or was i just in my youth being to nieve?<BR>Don't think there is but one of the Real Life (TM) physicists on this list<BR>should be able to confirm or deny.<BR><BR>Peter<BR>http://www.myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk (Trav &amp; AD&amp;D)<BR>peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR><BR>IMTU: tc+ tm tn++ t4- ru+ !3i+ c+ jt- au- ls ta- hi++ ith++ va+ as- so&nbsp; zh+<BR>vi-<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; And life is harsh and rarely fair.<BR><BR>Never appeal to a man's 'better nature.'&nbsp; He may not have one.<BR>Lazarus Long, Time Enough For Love (By Robert.Heinlan)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 17:09:56 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question.....<BR><BR>This reminds me of a conversation my wife and I had when Space Rangers was<BR>on TV.<BR><BR>She made the comment that why are these people in space using slug throwers.<BR><BR>My comment was that the slug thrower is much like the sword.&nbsp; It is simple,<BR>cheap, and efficient.&nbsp; Energy weapons are expensive, complex, and fragile.<BR><BR>Thus, unless there is a darn good reason (armour so good that slug throwers<BR>will not work is a good one), there is little reason to use anything other<BR>then a slug thrower.<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 17:11:46 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>Gregory Carl Kettler wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; On Thu, 25 Jan 2001, John Groth wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Welcome aboard!<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Your newbie essay assignment:<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Discuss the ramifications of the elimination in _Fire, Fusion, and<BR>&gt; &gt; Steel_ (2d edition) of the "one hardpoint per 100 dtons" limit from<BR>&gt; &gt; Classic Traveller.&nbsp; Your essay should address the argument that detailed<BR>&gt; &gt; hull surface area requirements in FF&amp;S2 serve as an adequate game<BR>&gt; &gt; balance, thus eliminating the game-balance need for the tonnage-based<BR>&gt; &gt; limit on weapons mounts.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Hey!&nbsp; How come he gets a gearhead question!&nbsp; Why didn't I get a gearhead<BR>&gt; question?<BR><BR>Well:<BR><BR>1.&nbsp; What newbie essay assignment (if any) did you get? (If you did not<BR>receive a newbie essay assignment, skip question #2.)<BR><BR>2.&nbsp; Did you ever post your essay response?&nbsp; If not, why not?<BR><BR>3.&nbsp; You may post an answer to Tim's essay assignment at any time.&nbsp; I<BR>suggest that you give Tim a fair shot at answering the question first,<BR>to avoid the possibility of plagiarism.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 15:20:09 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question.....<BR><BR>&gt;Errrr, quick question, negating reflec already existed, slug throwers? or<BR>am<BR>&gt;I missing the point here?<BR><BR>yes slug throwers exist. but this was a movement by the energy weapon<BR>companys. IE ok lets develop an energy weapon that by passes reflec. Sort of<BR>like trying to find new markets and such.<BR><BR>For example Smith and wesson produces Slug throwers. then A company rpoduces<BR>kevlar that negates their weapon so they develope kevlar piercing ammo so<BR>that their weapons can again do what they were intended to. Now they ahve a<BR>market for both their slug thrower and ammunition.<BR><BR>&gt;Recoil should be unaffected by zero-G or the density of the atmosphere I<BR>&gt;believe.<BR><BR>Recoil in this aspect.<BR><BR>if im in zero g and i fire a revolver at person xxx to negate the reflec<BR>they are wearing that shot should send me tumbling (i dont care if the<BR>target goes tumbling 8P). I am no expert but i would assume (yes i know it<BR>is that nasty word there 8P) that the explosive force of that shot will act<BR>just like a small thruster.<BR><BR>However if i fire an energy weapon like a laser (and a blaster in my<BR>opinion) there is no recoil for the firer to deal with. it is an energy<BR>weapon.<BR><BR>now people can say ah but you got Guass rifles. yes they exist but they are<BR>in my opinion another form of slug thrower. Why wouldnt an energy weapon<BR>company look to broaden its market for zero g weapons. more models to choose<BR>from. more replacement parts to sell. yada yada yada. i know im not a<BR>marketing expert but it seems to me that energy weapon companys might move<BR>in this sort of direction.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;non physisist comment : How does the energised particles distinguish<BR>between<BR>&gt;densities of matter.&nbsp; I would have thought that some of the particles would<BR>&gt;detonate in the air (interacting wioth air particles).<BR><BR>im nota phsycist either 8P but again i dont think air has the same desity as<BR>water. again this is why i am asking if this is scientifically possable. i<BR>mean can you make particles that can pass though say less dense matter and<BR>detonate on impact with higher dense matter? personally i doubt it. but you<BR>never know.<BR><BR>granted it is a bit "star warsy" and i did it back then to add a little<BR>flavor. give the chars a few more weapons choices and yada yada yada.<BR><BR>anyway<BR><BR>hope i have not upset anyone 8P<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Peter Scarrott [mailto:peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk]<BR>Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2001 2:54 PM<BR>To: Traveller TML<BR>Subject: Re: Question.....<BR><BR><BR>William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt; posted<BR>&gt;hope i dont sound silly.<BR>Don't worry we alls ound silly some of the time :-)<BR><BR>&gt;Long time ago i allowed blasters to be "invented" in the imperium. my<BR>&gt;thoughts at the time is that energy weapons manufactures would try and find<BR>&gt;a way to negate reflec armor. so after many years of research the<BR>discovered<BR>&gt;blasters.<BR>Errrr, quick question, negating reflec already existed, slug throwers? or am<BR>I missing the point here?<BR><BR>&gt;my&nbsp; feeling was that blasters where not lasers. they were closer related to<BR>&gt;a meson gun. they generated and fired a stream of energized particles.<BR>these<BR>&gt;particles upon hitting matter of greater density than atmosphere would then<BR>&gt;cause a reaction and detonate there by exploding and doing damage that way.<BR>&gt;this way if a person was wearing reflec they would be for most intents and<BR>&gt;purposes unprotected.<BR>non physisist comment : How does the energised particles distinguish between<BR>densities of matter.&nbsp; I would have thought that some of the particles would<BR>detonate in the air (interacting wioth air particles).<BR><BR>&gt;because of the particles exploding when hitting matter of a certain density<BR>&gt;or greater i restricted these weapons use on certain worlds where the<BR>&gt;atmosheric density was to high to allow the weapon to be fired. of course<BR>&gt;the less dense the atmospher the better. In zero g these weapons would ahve<BR>&gt;no recoil and would blow holes in Refleced vacc suits.<BR>Recoil should be unaffected by zero-G or the density of the atmosphere I<BR>believe.<BR><BR>&gt;anyway that was what i did. i did it more to add spice to the game.<BR>Good enough reason for doing it.<BR><BR>&gt;what i want to know is there any scientific bases for this type of weapon?<BR>&gt;or was i just in my youth being to nieve?<BR>Don't think there is but one of the Real Life (TM) physicists on this list<BR>should be able to confirm or deny.<BR><BR>Peter<BR>http://www.myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk (Trav &amp; AD&amp;D)<BR>peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR><BR>IMTU: tc+ tm tn++ t4- ru+ !3i+ c+ jt- au- ls ta- hi++ ith++ va+ as- so&nbsp; zh+<BR>vi-<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; And life is harsh and rarely fair.<BR><BR>Never appeal to a man's 'better nature.'&nbsp; He may not have one.<BR>Lazarus Long, Time Enough For Love (By Robert.Heinlan)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 15:24:38 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question.....<BR><BR>Im sorry using a 12 gage shot gun in&nbsp; zero g does not sound like&nbsp; a very<BR>smart thing to do.<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: David C. Broussard [mailto:broussa@connecti.com]<BR>Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2001 3:10 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Question.....<BR><BR><BR>This reminds me of a conversation my wife and I had when Space Rangers was<BR>on TV.<BR><BR>She made the comment that why are these people in space using slug throwers.<BR><BR>My comment was that the slug thrower is much like the sword.&nbsp; It is simple,<BR>cheap, and efficient.&nbsp; Energy weapons are expensive, complex, and fragile.<BR><BR>Thus, unless there is a darn good reason (armour so good that slug throwers<BR>will not work is a good one), there is little reason to use anything other<BR>then a slug thrower.<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 23:08:22 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: New First Survey<BR><BR>At 11:56 -0500 25/1/01, "Mark Preston" &lt;mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Ok, so we all admit (even Marc, it seems from the messages) that First<BR>&gt;Survey is....welll...garbage. How about someone (like BITS maybe?)<BR>&gt;getting a whole lot of us together and doing a decent version?<BR><BR>If the people who did the work on this a while back send it to me, I <BR>will compile it and host it under 'Milieu 0' on the CORE site <BR>http://www.core.org.uk/<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 19:42:33 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>On Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:05:51 -0500 (EST), shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard<BR>Erickson) wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Initially, all worlds will start with J1, which makes following the mains<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; natural.&nbsp; But, how long does it take to establish a Deep Base (to allow<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; bridging of J2 gaps), and how do you decide where to establish them?<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; IMnon-TU, I didn't have to worry about that since the only limit to<BR>&gt;&gt; distance was time and resupply.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; In a Traveller universe, I'd probably apply a modifier to<BR>&gt;&gt; "attractiveness" of a planet based on how far outside jump range it<BR>&gt;&gt; is.&nbsp; I'd just assume Deep Bases to be established anywhere needed,<BR>&gt;&gt; adding costs in time, materials and labour.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; For Jump-1 technology, the "costs" might go<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Parsecs&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 4<BR>&gt;&gt; Cost&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 8&nbsp; &nbsp; 15<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; or something like that.<BR><BR>&gt;Nope. If 2 parsecs is "4", then the costs go like this (or *worse*, not<BR>&gt;better!):<BR><BR>&gt; Parsecs&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 6 <BR>&gt; Cost&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 16&nbsp;&nbsp; 64&nbsp;&nbsp; 256&nbsp; 1024<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4^0&nbsp; 4^1&nbsp; 4^2&nbsp; 4^3&nbsp; 4^4&nbsp; 4^5<BR><BR>&gt;It's an exponential progression. <BR><BR>Why not <BR><BR>Parsecs&nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp;&nbsp; 2&nbsp;&nbsp; 3&nbsp;&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp; 5&nbsp;&nbsp; 6&nbsp;&nbsp; 7<BR>Cost&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp;&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp; 9&nbsp; 16&nbsp; 25&nbsp; 36&nbsp; 49<BR><BR>?<BR><BR>Or some other reasonably intuitive relationship between distance and cost.<BR>IOW, if I'm going to just pull numbers out of a hat, why should I pick some<BR>particular set instead of others?&nbsp;&nbsp; And if I _don't_, what should be the<BR>basis for figuring the cost?<BR><BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 19:42:30 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>On Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:07:29 -0500 (EST), "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Well, is there one?<BR><BR>Yes and no.&nbsp; Kenji has been cleaning up one that the Traveller-Culture list<BR>worked up a while back - and boy did it need cleaning - but the results<BR>haven't been returned yet.&nbsp; If you join the Traveller-Culture list at<BR>eGroups, you'll find the dirty wordlist as an Excel spreadsheet - 97 or<BR>2000, for Windows, IIRC - in the file vilani/vilvocab2.zip.<BR><BR>If you're on a DOSWin system, you can also download the word generator that<BR>I wrote; links are in Freelance Traveller's Computer Connection, under<BR>Windows programs.&nbsp; There's also a Java implementation of same, in the<BR>"others" list.&nbsp; One of the language definition files is for Vilani.<BR><BR>Side question, for Kenji: Why does it seem that the 'standard' 'sample<BR>texts' are always North Wind and Sun, and the Babel story from Genesis?<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 20:44:39 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3559<BR><BR>&gt; Has anything canonical been written about Mertactor (the "capital" of<BR>&gt; District 268)?&nbsp; I know it was mentioned in "Adventure 10: Safari Ship,"<BR>&gt; and received a paragraph of coverage in "G.T.: Behind the Claw," but is<BR>&gt; it, otherwise, a blank slate?<BR><BR>GT:Starports sort of goes through the basics of its starport.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 20:46:49 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 08:29:50 -0500<BR>&gt; From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;The Finnish translation of the book annoyed me quite much. The title was<BR>&gt; &gt;translated as "Vieras tulevaisuudesta", which means something like "A<BR>&gt; &gt;Visitor from the Future". That kind of spoiled the suspension of<BR>characters<BR>&gt; &gt;in the book not knowing where the sphere was from.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Other direct translations of Finnish titles for famous science fiction<BR>&gt; stories:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "War of the Worlds" -- "They All Catch a Cold and Die"<BR>&gt; "Ender's Game" -- "It's Not a Game, It's Real!"<BR>&gt; "Dune" -- "Paul Atreides, the Kwisatz Haderach Who Will Be Emperor"<BR>&gt; "Fahrenheit 451" -- "Memorizing Books"<BR>&gt; "The Martian Chronicles" -- "*We* Are The Martians!"<BR><BR>Hurm, these titles sound suspiciously like the faux Chinese translations of<BR>American movie titles.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3561<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (rly-yg01.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.1]) by air-yg01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 20:52:57 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 20:52:16 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id UAA95304;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 20:50:53 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 25 Jan 2001 20:49:25 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id UAA95245<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 20:49:25 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 20:49:25 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101260149.UAA95245@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3561<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3562</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/26/01 2:17:19 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 26 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3562<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>FASA closes<BR>Re: Traveller Sectors<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>A Call for TML Landgrab Papers!<BR>Penguins...<BR>Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Penguins...<BR>RE: Credit where due<BR>RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>RE: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR>RE: JTAS chat tonight<BR>RE: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR>RE: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR>RE: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 01:59:29 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: FASA closes<BR><BR>http://www.fasa.com/PressReleases/PRClose.html<BR><BR>25 January 2001<BR><BR>After 20 happy-and difficult-years in business, FASA Corporation is <BR>closing its doors.<BR>The adventure gaming world has changed much in those years, and it is <BR>time for the<BR>founders of FASA to move on. We may produce a few remaining products <BR>in the next<BR>month, but then we will close up shop.<BR><BR>We will remain open to fill all orders from our inventory until April <BR>30, 2001. We do<BR>not plan to print any new inventory; when an item goes out of stock, <BR>it will be gone<BR>forever.<BR><BR>Making this decision now will allow FASA to meet all of its <BR>obligations to suppliers,<BR>&nbsp; authors, artists and other freelancers. Our plan is to sell our <BR>inventory, collect all of our<BR>receivables and royalties and continue to manage our subsidiary rights.<BR><BR>We are selling our BattleTech and Shadowrun properties to Wizkids <BR>LLC, along with<BR>certain assets of Ral Partha Enterprises.<BR><BR>As most of you know, Wizkids was started by Jordan Weisman, a founder of FASA<BR>and the creator of the incredibly successful new game line Mage <BR>Knight Rebellion. We<BR>know that FASA's properties will be in very good hands at Wizkids.<BR><BR>I want to thank all of our loyal fans and customers who over these 20 <BR>years have made<BR>FASA Corporation a fun place to be and a company of which we are very proud.<BR><BR>Morton Weisman<BR>Ross Babcock<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 22:08:44 -0500<BR>From: Thom Jones-Low &lt;tjoneslo@together.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Sectors<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:34:06 +0000<BR>&gt; From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; on 23/1/01 2:41 am, Gordon Horne at gordon.horne@home.com wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Just one question... how the heck do you do that? :) Is there some trick to<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; generating stats from Gal24 or have you exported everything into a mammoth<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; spreadsheet?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; I've been dumping various people's sector notes into a giant<BR>&gt; &gt; spreadsheet. Who did what is lost to the mists of time, in part<BR>&gt; &gt; because i edit the data so everything has the same detail, in part<BR>&gt; &gt; because i've kept lousy records 8^(<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Nice one. Any chance of making it available?<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Goto http://maps.grandsurvey.com&nbsp; Anthony Jackson, who did a fair<BR>amount of the analysis that you are asking about also has a complete<BR>text file with all the sectors/files of know canon space. <BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; http://www.solstation.com/core/astrogation_en.htm<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; This is my source of all the GENII files and a good place to download<BR>all of the various files. As far as I can tell, this is where Anthony<BR>got his files from as well. <BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thomas Jones-Low<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; tjoneslo@together.net<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 21:31:37 -0500<BR>From: "Fred Ramen" &lt;von_rammen@email.msn.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>Craig Berry &lt;cberry@cinenet.net&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &lt;bristle&gt;Precisely why (along with the pun value) I chose<BR>&gt; "terrarist".&lt;/bristle&gt; It's similar to "rockhead", meant to suggest a<BR>&gt; creator in the medium of dirt or ground.&nbsp; There's no connection to the<BR>&gt; planet Earth, or Terra, or Tellus, or Fred.<BR><BR>Hey! what do I have to do with this! :-D<BR><BR>&gt;No prob, was just having fun...though throwing "Fred" in there would<BR>&gt;defuse the tone.<BR><BR>Oh...<BR><BR>You know, the problem with using Greek or Latin words to describe planetary<BR>design enthusiasts is that neither of these ancient languages really had a<BR>word to describe the planet as a whole (yeah, you could fall back on<BR>"planet" which is Greek, after all, but that certainly wasn't the sense<BR>*they* used it in.)<BR><BR>Why not use a language that reached its maturity during the period of modern<BR>science, one whose speakers have led not only in the natural sciences, but<BR>the social as well? Rather than the mildly derogatory Rockhead, I propose<BR>that planet design enthusiast be known as:<BR><BR>Weltschpfungsingenieuren!*<BR><BR>Yeah, that'll show them!<BR><BR>Fred Ramen<BR><BR>*(World Creation Engineers)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 21:23:42 -0500<BR>From: "Fred Ramen" &lt;von_rammen@email.msn.com&gt;<BR>Subject: A Call for TML Landgrab Papers!<BR><BR>Attention Landgrab Terrarists, Rockheads, or what have you!<BR><BR>Some (well, at least one) of you have been following my serial novel of the<BR>Fifth Frontier War, "The Hostile Stars," which is being hosted on Freelance<BR>Traveller.<BR><BR>I have actually finished the story (although it will be some time yet before<BR>all of it goes up on Freelance Traveller) and am pondering the sequel.<BR><BR>It won't give away too much to say that much of the action of the next story<BR>will take place along the Spinward Main in District 268. (Approximately from<BR>Glisten to Caliburn.) What I would like to do is incorporate the work of<BR>Landgrabbers who have worlds on the Main in the sequel. So if you have<BR>anything about these worlds, sketches, notes, 3D models ;) I would like, if<BR>it's not too much trouble, to take a look at them.<BR><BR>I can't offer you much more than the chance to have the world dramatized,<BR>and at least an advance look at the chapter. (If you want, I can put you on<BR>the mailing list that gets the story as I write it, not when I send it to<BR>Jeff.) You can send me information at von_rammen@msn.com.<BR><BR>Thanks (in advance) for your hard work and time!<BR><BR>Regards,<BR><BR>Fred Ramen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 22:57:32 -0500<BR>From: "Greenly, Jeff" &lt;greenlyj@rcbhsc.wvu.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Penguins...<BR><BR>Fellow Travellers,<BR><BR>Check out the cover art of the The New Yorker Magazine, week of 29 Jan<BR>2001...<BR><BR>Jeff<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 19:06:56 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Scouts v. First In v. H&amp;E<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; On Wed, 24 Jan 2001 16:05:51 -0500 (EST), shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard<BR>&gt; Erickson) wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Initially, all worlds will start with J1, which makes following the mains<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; natural.&nbsp; But, how long does it take to establish a Deep Base (to allow<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; bridging of J2 gaps), and how do you decide where to establish them?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; IMnon-TU, I didn't have to worry about that since the only limit to<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; distance was time and resupply.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; In a Traveller universe, I'd probably apply a modifier to<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; "attractiveness" of a planet based on how far outside jump range it<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; is.&nbsp; I'd just assume Deep Bases to be established anywhere needed,<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; adding costs in time, materials and labour.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; For Jump-1 technology, the "costs" might go<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Parsecs&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 4<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Cost&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 8&nbsp; &nbsp; 15<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; or something like that.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Nope. If 2 parsecs is "4", then the costs go like this (or *worse*, not<BR>&gt;&gt;better!):<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Parsecs&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 2&nbsp; &nbsp; 3&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 5&nbsp; &nbsp; 6 <BR>&gt;&gt; Cost&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp; &nbsp; 4&nbsp; &nbsp; 16&nbsp;&nbsp; 64&nbsp;&nbsp; 256&nbsp; 1024<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4^0&nbsp; 4^1&nbsp; 4^2&nbsp; 4^3&nbsp; 4^4&nbsp; 4^5<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;It's an exponential progression. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Why not <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Parsecs&nbsp;&nbsp; 1&nbsp;&nbsp; 2&nbsp;&nbsp; 3&nbsp;&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp; 5&nbsp;&nbsp; 6&nbsp;&nbsp; 7<BR>&gt; Cost&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1&nbsp;&nbsp; 4&nbsp;&nbsp; 9&nbsp; 16&nbsp; 25&nbsp; 36&nbsp; 49<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; ?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Or some other reasonably intuitive relationship between distance and cost.<BR>&gt; IOW, if I'm going to just pull numbers out of a hat, why should I pick some<BR>&gt; particular set instead of others?&nbsp;&nbsp; And if I _don't_, what should be the<BR>&gt; basis for figuring the cost?<BR><BR>The basic concept I was working from was thnat the major component of<BR>the cost was the extra fuel that had to be transported. <BR><BR>Therefore if it takes 4 "units" of fuel to get a ship an extra parsec,<BR>it'll take 4*4 to get it an extra two parsecs. And so on. It's no<BR>different than a multi-stage rocket, which *also* has an exponential<BR>increase per stage. It's actually a *bit* more complicated, but for a<BR>"rule of thumb" it'll work.<BR><BR>The squaring method doesn't remotely resemble anything realistic.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 00:01:39 -0500<BR>From: "DaveShayne" &lt;daveshayne@email.msn.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 11:06:27 -0600 (CST)<BR>&gt; From: Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; On Tue, 23 Jan 2001, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; ...But I'm a planetary<BR>&gt; &gt; gearhead (do we need a name for this?)...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I think Loren called us rockheads in a JTAS editorial once.<BR><BR>Might I suggest "Planetology Wonk"<BR><BR>Dave Shayne<BR><BR>"Every day my metal friend<BR>Shakes my bed at 6 AM (Wake up)<BR>Then the shiny servant clones<BR>Running with my telephones."<BR><BR>"Living in the Plastic Age" - Horn/Downes<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 00:23:15 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>On 01/26/01 at 12:01 AM,&nbsp; "DaveShayne" &lt;daveshayne@email.msn.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 11:06:27 -0600 (CST)<BR>&gt;&gt; From: Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; On Tue, 23 Jan 2001, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; ...But I'm a planetary<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; gearhead (do we need a name for this?)...<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; I think Loren called us rockheads in a JTAS editorial once.<BR><BR>&gt;Might I suggest "Planetology Wonk"<BR><BR>...but we want to have a single word like gearhead.&nbsp; Hum, I suppose we could combine Planetology Wonk and get Plonk.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Yeah, that's the ticket!&nbsp; Take that, you plonk! &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 01:33:51 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Penguins...<BR><BR>On 01/25/01 at 10:57 PM,&nbsp; "Greenly, Jeff" &lt;greenlyj@rcbhsc.wvu.edu&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;Fellow Travellers,<BR><BR>&gt;Check out the cover art of the The New Yorker Magazine, week of 29<BR>&gt;Jan 2001...<BR><BR>Or the cover art of this week's Inforworld!&nbsp; Fierce and feral, now<BR>*that's* how I picture Penguin Boy!&nbsp; &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 02:05:21 -0500<BR>From: "DaveShayne" &lt;daveshayne@email.msn.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Credit where due<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 18:37:47 +1300<BR>&gt; From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Credit where due<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Anthony Jackson wrote :<BR>&gt; &gt; The Imperial credit is apparently a fiat currency.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; You can buy Fiats with it ?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Frankie<BR><BR>You sure can.<BR><BR>CT Book 3 page 21<BR><BR>&nbsp; "Ground Car (5)&nbsp; Cr4,000, 2 tons. An ordinary self-powered wheeled<BR>vehicle....<BR>&lt;after lots of snippage&gt; Other models (convertibles, *sports models*, ...<BR>etc.) may<BR>be available at varying prices."<BR><BR>In the spirit of which I give you the CT Fiat -<BR><BR>&nbsp; 1) Five times normal cost.<BR>&nbsp; 2) 1.5 times maximum speed<BR>&nbsp; 3) 3 times more likely to suffer mechanical failure<BR>&nbsp; 4) +2 DM for any carousing task attempted with, in, or on this vehicle<BR>&nbsp; 5) Double worlds Law Level when determining the posibility of police<BR>interest/involvement with group.<BR><BR>&nbsp; Hope This Helps.<BR><BR>Dave Shayne<BR><BR>"Every day my metal friend<BR>Shakes my bed at 6 AM (Wake up)<BR>Then the shiny servant clones<BR>Running with my telephones."<BR><BR>"Living in the Plastic Age" - Horn/Downes<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:12:18 -0000<BR>From: Matt Bond &lt;MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:17:23 -0800 (PST)<BR>&gt; From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Interstellar War Query<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I find the period of the Interstellar wars fascinating.&nbsp; Lately, I've<BR>&gt; been wanting to translate the starships in Imperium into TNE <BR>&gt; for use as<BR>&gt; a backdrop to a new campaign set in the 22nd century.&nbsp; I'm <BR>&gt; running into<BR>&gt; a number of problems, though.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What are the sizes of the warships?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; According to High Guard, the maximum ship size, at each tech level, is<BR>&gt; dependent upon the computer available at that tech level, and yields<BR>&gt; the following results:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; TL 7-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1000 dtons<BR>&gt; TL 9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4000 dtons<BR>&gt; TL10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 10,000 dtons<BR>&gt; TL11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 50,000 dtons<BR>&gt; TL12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 100,000 dtons<BR>&gt; TL13&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1,000,000 dtons<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; So, if our two adversaries are at TL11 (Jump-2) capable, the maximum<BR>&gt; ship size should be only 50,000 tons.<BR><BR>Actually, if you read p.22 of HG2 you will see that "Each specific<BR>tonnage level includes all values between it and the next highest stated<BR>level. Thus, tonnage code A includes all tonnages from 1,000 to 1,900<BR>tons."<BR><BR>So you table should read:<BR>TL5-6&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 699 dtons<BR>TL7-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1999 dtons<BR>TL9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4999 dtons<BR>TL10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 19,999 dtons<BR>TL11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 74,999 dtons<BR>TL12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 199,999 dtons<BR>TL13&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; infinite... (1,000,000+ dtons)<BR><BR>&gt; Fighting Ships of the Shattered Imperium, an MT product, puts the BB11<BR>&gt; at 300,000 dtons, six times the maximum size allowed by High Guard.<BR><BR>This is one of the reasons it is often called "Shattered Ships of the<BR>Fighting Imperium"... also the design parameters changed considerably in<BR>MT, so differences to High Guard are to be expected<BR><BR>&gt; Other CT sources (Trillion Credit Squadron comes to mind) also<BR>&gt; contradict the maximum hull size rule above (at TL9, I cannot see the<BR>&gt; three hollowed-out asteroid ships displacing only 4000 tons).<BR><BR>And as for the TCS Asteroid Colony ships, they were sublight and used<BR>variant technology for propulsion (ie not standard Manoeuvre Drives), so<BR>not being either Bk2 or HG2 designs they can be whatever the GM or<BR>Author wants... (see also Annic Nova....)<BR><BR>Matt<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:31:26 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR><BR>This weeks (27 Jan)...I bought it yesterday<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>&gt;-----Original Message-----<BR>&gt;From: Bernie McGeehan [mailto:einreb62@yahoo.com]<BR>&gt;Sent: 25 January 2001 22:13<BR>&gt;To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What is the date for that issue? I must have issed<BR>&gt;that when it went by...<BR>&gt;--- Mark S Peace &lt;mark.s.peace@dunelm.org.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 22:41:29 -0600<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; From: "D. Smart" &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Subject: We Have Met The Zhos..And They Are Us!<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; The New Scientist site has posted an interesting<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; story about the discovery of "mind-reading" cells<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; existing in every human being.<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Even more interesting in an article in the magazine<BR>&gt;&gt; about habitable planets<BR>&gt;&gt; around red dwarf stars.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Mark<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;=====<BR>&gt;"I don't know much about what I like, but I do know Art."&nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>&gt;me @ the Rijksmuseum, Amsterdam (Terra/Sol <BR>&gt;3)http://prattfall.tripod.com/index.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;__________________________________________________<BR>&gt;Do You Yahoo!?<BR>&gt;Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>&gt;http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:33:00 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: JTAS chat tonight<BR><BR>Darn! Went home before this reached my mail box.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>&gt;-----Original Message-----<BR>&gt;From: Christopher Thrash [mailto:thrash@io.com]<BR>&gt;Sent: 25 January 2001 20:41<BR>&gt;To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;Subject: JTAS chat tonight<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Where: JTAS Online &lt;http://jtas.sjgames.com&gt;<BR>&gt;When: Thursday, Jan 25, 7PM CST (1am GMT) <BR>&gt;Who: Loren Wiseman <BR>&gt;Topic: Loren discusses the GURPS Traveller line.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:49:34 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Abundence of high-purity silicates on surface. If the <BR>&gt;environment also<BR>&gt;&gt; contained anything which could function similarly to liquid <BR>&gt;crystal, that<BR>&gt;&gt; would be a bonus.<BR>&gt;&gt; Thin atmosphere rich in sulphur compounds (in particular sulphur<BR>&gt;&gt; hexafluoride).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;These two conditions are incompatible. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;If a world has enough fluorine for SF6 to be a normal atmospheric<BR>&gt;component, that won't *be* any oxygen compounds (such as silicates) in<BR>&gt;the crust. You'd have silicon fluoride, with oxygen fluoride as an<BR>&gt;atmospheric component.<BR><BR>I'm not to worried about oxygen being present. DOn't need any.<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Also, "high purity silicates" is an overly vague term. I suspect you<BR>&gt;mean high purity silica (SiO2). <BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Yeah, that's fine.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;Finally, "liquid crystals" are a family of complex carbon compounds<BR>&gt;that can't exist in the presence of the SF6. And I'n not sure that any<BR>&gt;sort of carbon-fluorine compound would have the requisite properties.<BR><BR>That's OK...I'll just have to find another mechanism.<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Occasional high-intensity bombardment by stellar radiation (something<BR>&gt;&gt; equivalent to the effects of 100 fs from a femtosecond YAG laser).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;You haven't told us the wavelength *nor* the energy. <BR><BR>No. Fair enough.<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;And laser radiation is&nbsp; more than a little different than other forms<BR>&gt;of radiation.<BR><BR>Granted. More thought required.<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Firstly: Is it possible for such an environment to occur naturally?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;No. The elemental abundance of fluorine is such that a world like this<BR>&gt;is essentially impossible. You'd need an *incredibly* skewed elemental<BR>&gt;abundance in the solar system in question.<BR><BR>Awww, I was hoping not to have to bring the Ancients in on this! :)<BR><BR><BR>Thanks, Leonard...I was thinking of you in particular when I asked for input<BR>on this.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:03:35 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR><BR>&gt;Dean Jones writes:<BR>&gt;&gt;Hmm, That's OK. I'm trying to create a black silicon based species and<BR>&gt;&gt;wanted to try to reduce the hand-waving to a minimum. Black silicon is<BR>&gt;&gt;fabricated by subjecting a fairly pure source of silicon to <BR>&gt;an intense light<BR>&gt;&gt;source (ie the laser) in an atmosphere of complex sulphur compounds.<BR>&gt;&lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I don't understand exactly the process that you <BR>&gt;describe, but you<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; didn't seem to explain how organisms of some sort resulted from<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; the processes above.&nbsp; I might be able to give you more useful<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; comments if the genesis of life on this world was more<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; explicit.<BR><BR>The process of creating black silicon is covered in New Scientist 13 Jan<BR>2001 and I believe that spin-off topics are being covered in Science and<BR>Applied Physics Letters. I particularly wanted to use this material because<BR>it looks really cool. I'm going to have to work on the actual mechanism<BR>through which life arises (or at leat get a vague, psuedo-scientific<BR>explanation)<BR><BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;As far as the critters themselves go, I see a lot of big <BR>&gt;standing stones<BR>&gt;&gt;communicating by mircowave-frequency laser. The actual <BR>&gt;thinking apparatus is<BR>&gt;&gt;likely to be either optical (that's what I wanted the liquid crystal<BR>&gt;&gt;for...switching) or just plain electronic.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I recommend thinking in terms of the evolution of <BR>&gt;these life forms.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; How did they start?&nbsp; How does their heredity work?&nbsp; <BR>&gt;How did they<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; get energy and other resources?&nbsp; How did they reproduce?&nbsp; What<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; traits would then be favoured by natural selection?&nbsp; Why would<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; intelligence be favoured?&nbsp; How do they compete with each other?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; What are limiting factors in growth and reproduction?&nbsp; Do they<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ever have a reason to cooperate?<BR><BR>Scribble, scribble.<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Adventure seed: A mineralogical survey has detected vast <BR>&gt;deposits of black<BR>&gt;&gt;silicon, a valuable material for communications arrays, on an <BR>&gt;uninhabited<BR>&gt;&gt;planet in-system. Since black silicon is expensive to <BR>&gt;manufacture, mining is<BR>&gt;&gt;far cheaper. However, it seems someone wants the mining <BR>&gt;expedition to fail,<BR>&gt;&gt;because a miner has just been found dead, with multiple <BR>&gt;laser-burns in his<BR>&gt;&gt;suit...<BR>&gt;&gt;Of course, the Sentinels were just trying to talk to him!<BR>&gt;&gt;What do you think?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sounds very cool.&nbsp; Of course, the strong magnetic <BR>&gt;field of the planet,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; and the powerful solar activity, interfere with the <BR>&gt;sensors of the<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; explorers so that they cannot detect the curious <BR>&gt;activity of the<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; local rock formations.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Well, of course. Shame that there are so many thing that can go wrong with<BR>sensors :)<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:13:44 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>&gt;Leonard Erickson wrote :<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Alas, "terra" is *not* the proper root. Terra is "dirt" or "ground".<BR>&gt;&gt; Tellus (as in "Tellus Mater" = "Mother Earth" is). We are <BR>&gt;"Tellurians",<BR>&gt;&gt; not "Terrans".<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;But you can't use Tellus, it's the trademark of a vaccuum <BR>&gt;cleaner company.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; And even if you use "terra" relate stuff, you get <BR>&gt;"terrestrial" as the<BR>&gt;&gt; starting point. :-(<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;So :&nbsp; we are the Terrestrials, take us to your leader !<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Or is that Terrestrians ?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;or Terrestriani ?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Personally, I think the planet gearheads should call themselves<BR>&gt;"Territorials"<BR>&gt;&lt;grin&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>LOL...how about Territorial Artists...TA?<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:41:06 +0100<BR>From: Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>Farewell, Freedonian Aerospace Administration.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:13:49 +0000<BR>From: Rob Day &lt;Rob@glisten.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>&gt;Yes and no.&nbsp; Kenji has been cleaning up one that the Traveller-Culture list<BR>&gt;worked up a while back - and boy did it need cleaning - but the results<BR><BR>I must have missed something - are you (Kenji) changing the file that's<BR>currently on the egroups site?<BR><BR>&gt;haven't been returned yet.&nbsp; If you join the Traveller-Culture list at<BR>&gt;eGroups, you'll find the dirty wordlist as an Excel spreadsheet - 97 or<BR>&gt;2000, for Windows, IIRC - in the file vilani/vilvocab2.zip.<BR><BR>I mirrored the files that are held there because some people weren't<BR>happy with where they were being held -<BR><BR>http://www.oberlindes.com/rob/traveller/tcfiles.htm<BR><BR>&gt;If you're on a DOSWin system, you can also download the word generator that<BR>&gt;I wrote; links are in Freelance Traveller's Computer Connection, under<BR>&gt;Windows programs.&nbsp; There's also a Java implementation of same, in the<BR>&gt;"others" list.&nbsp; One of the language definition files is for Vilani.<BR><BR>I moved my trav-culture page away from geocites (not that it's been<BR>updated for a long time) -<BR><BR>http://www.oberlindes.com/rob/traveller/index.htm<BR><BR>On there is the latest version of my HTML based Vilani word generator,<BR>plus older versions of Zhodani and Vargr - should work on any OS that<BR>has a browser which can run Javascript. (At least the Vilani one is also<BR>available on Jesse's site)<BR><BR>Plus, if you're windows based, a flexible word generator (you can define<BR>you're own languages etc.)<BR><BR>Rob.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3562<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yd02.mx.aol.com (rly-yd02.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.2]) by air-yd05.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 05:17:19 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yd02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 05:16:52 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id FAA13080;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 05:16:07 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 26 Jan 2001 05:14:57 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id FAA12986<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 05:14:57 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 05:14:57 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101261014.FAA12986@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3562<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3563</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/26/01 8:06:20 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 26 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3563<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re: Penguins...<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Traveller-digest V1999 #3559<BR>Please send further IP queries to Marc...<BR>RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>Re: Penguins...<BR>Re: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR>FW: Dr. Gaimari's Sinister Cyber-Elephants<BR>Re: JTAS Chat tonight<BR>Re: JTAS Chat tonight<BR>RE: JTAS Chat tonight<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>RE: FASA closes<BR>RE: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR>RE: FASA closes<BR>RE: FASA closes<BR>RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>Interstellar War Timeline<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 23:33:26 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>On 26 Jan 01, at 1:59, Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; After 20 happy-and difficult-years in business, FASA Corporation is <BR>&gt; closing its doors.<BR><BR>&lt;/Andrew bows his head in one minutes silence&gt;<BR><BR>The people who brought us the Skyraiders trilogy, Uragyad'n of the Seven <BR>Pillars, Ordeal by Eshaar and many others.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 01:19:46 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Penguins...<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Fellow Travellers,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Check out the cover art of the The New Yorker Magazine, week of 29 Jan<BR>&gt; 2001...<BR><BR>A Linux game called "Penguin Command" just came across the Fidonet file<BR>distribution network. It claims to be based on the old Missile Command<BR>game. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 03:00:46 -0800<BR>From: "Kelly St.Clair" &lt;kellys@efn.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>&gt;Farewell, Freedonian Aerospace Administration.<BR><BR>*salute*<BR><BR>They had a pretty good run, didn't they?&nbsp; How many terms is that?<BR><BR><BR>- --------------<BR>Kelly St.Clair&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "'Cause you've got Trouble<BR>kellys@efn.org&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Right here in fair Verona<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; With a capital T that rhymes with D<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That stands for Duel..."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 03:57:16 -0800<BR>From: Roger Sanger &lt;rodge@nwnexus.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3559<BR><BR>From: Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR><BR>and I am, as RS<BR>called it, Traveller insane ;-)<BR><BR>BTW: Rodge, since you have returned to the TML, one question. Do you<BR>still have the rights to the DGP Materials? If so, what are the<BR>chances of _finally_ seeing them reprinted, or you selling the rights<BR>to someone who could get that done?<BR>At this point, the DGP stuff is treated as "forbidden canon" by SJG<BR>and MM, but we'd like to see it become part of the usable Traveller canon<BR>once again.<BR>So how about it?<BR><BR>- ---------------------------------<BR><BR>That's 4 questions.&nbsp; :-)<BR><BR>1) My position is unchanged.&nbsp; 2) I don't know.&nbsp; 3) Pretty good, if his name is Santa Claus, because only he would be willing to meet the terms of both sides.&nbsp; Only if you saw the terms would you know what I mean.&nbsp; Unfortunately, I'm not at liberty to disclose them (see below).&nbsp;&nbsp; 4) Its canon-status is up to Marc. I posted permission on the TML for such use years ago, and it still stands (see that document for details), but you still need Marc's permission.<BR><BR>From here on, I'm deferring all IP (intellectual property) issues to Marc.&nbsp; I believe he explained the situation in a previous posting.<BR><BR>Please send all further IP queries to him.&nbsp; He has my permission to disclose the terms he offered.&nbsp; If he does so, forward them to me, and I'll be glad to comment.<BR><BR>Thank you.<BR><BR>Rodge<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 04:08:49 -0800<BR>From: Roger Sanger &lt;rodge@nwnexus.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Please send further IP queries to Marc...<BR><BR>From: Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;:<BR><BR>and I am, as RS<BR>called himself, Traveller insane ;-)<BR><BR>BTW: Rodge, since you have returned to the TML, one question. Do you<BR>still have the rights to the DGP Materials? If so, what are the<BR>chances of _finally_ seeing them reprinted, or you selling the rights<BR>to someone who could get that done?<BR>At this point, the DGP stuff is treated as "forbidden canon" by SJG<BR>and MM, but we'd like to see it become part of the usable Traveller canon<BR>once again.<BR>So how about it?<BR><BR>- ---------------------------------<BR><BR>That's 4 questions.&nbsp; :-)<BR><BR>1) My position is unchanged.&nbsp; 2) I don't know.&nbsp; 3) Pretty good, if his name is Santa Claus, because only he would be willing to meet the terms of both sides.&nbsp; Only if you saw the terms would you know what I mean.&nbsp; Unfortunately, I'm not at liberty to disclose them (see below).&nbsp;&nbsp; 4) Its canon-status is up to Marc. I posted permission on the TML for such use years ago, and it still stands (see that document for details), but you still need Marc's permission.<BR><BR>From here on, I'm deferring all IP (intellectual property) topics to Marc.&nbsp; I believe he explained the situation in a previous posting.<BR><BR>Please send all further IP queries to him.&nbsp; He has my permission to disclose the terms he offered.&nbsp; If he does so, forward them to me, and I'll be glad to comment.<BR><BR>Thank you.<BR><BR>Rodge<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 04:16:18 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>Thanks for correcting my table.&nbsp; Cranial flatulence is getting to be a<BR>problem in my old age.<BR><BR><BR>- --- Matt Bond &lt;MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:17:23 -0800 (PST)<BR>&gt; &gt; From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: Interstellar War Query<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; I find the period of the Interstellar wars fascinating.&nbsp; Lately,<BR>&gt; I've<BR>&gt; &gt; been wanting to translate the starships in Imperium into TNE <BR>&gt; &gt; for use as<BR>&gt; &gt; a backdrop to a new campaign set in the 22nd century.&nbsp; I'm <BR>&gt; &gt; running into<BR>&gt; &gt; a number of problems, though.<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; What are the sizes of the warships?<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; According to High Guard, the maximum ship size, at each tech level,<BR>&gt; is<BR>&gt; &gt; dependent upon the computer available at that tech level, and<BR>&gt; yields<BR>&gt; &gt; the following results:<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; TL 7-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1000 dtons<BR>&gt; &gt; TL 9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4000 dtons<BR>&gt; &gt; TL10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 10,000 dtons<BR>&gt; &gt; TL11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 50,000 dtons<BR>&gt; &gt; TL12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 100,000 dtons<BR>&gt; &gt; TL13&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1,000,000 dtons<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; So, if our two adversaries are at TL11 (Jump-2) capable, the<BR>&gt; maximum<BR>&gt; &gt; ship size should be only 50,000 tons.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Actually, if you read p.22 of HG2 you will see that "Each specific<BR>&gt; tonnage level includes all values between it and the next highest<BR>&gt; stated<BR>&gt; level. Thus, tonnage code A includes all tonnages from 1,000 to 1,900<BR>&gt; tons."<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; So you table should read:<BR>&gt; TL5-6&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 699 dtons<BR>&gt; TL7-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 19,999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 74,999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 199,999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL13&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; infinite... (1,000,000+ dtons)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt; &gt; Fighting Ships of the Shattered Imperium, an MT product, puts the<BR>&gt; BB11<BR>&gt; &gt; at 300,000 dtons, six times the maximum size allowed by High Guard.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This is one of the reasons it is often called "Shattered Ships of the<BR>&gt; Fighting Imperium"... also the design parameters changed considerably<BR>&gt; in<BR>&gt; MT, so differences to High Guard are to be expected<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Other CT sources (Trillion Credit Squadron comes to mind) also<BR>&gt; &gt; contradict the maximum hull size rule above (at TL9, I cannot see<BR>&gt; the<BR>&gt; &gt; three hollowed-out asteroid ships displacing only 4000 tons).<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; And as for the TCS Asteroid Colony ships, they were sublight and used<BR>&gt; variant technology for propulsion (ie not standard Manoeuvre Drives),<BR>&gt; so<BR>&gt; not being either Bk2 or HG2 designs they can be whatever the GM or<BR>&gt; Author wants... (see also Annic Nova....)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Matt<BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 04:17:45 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Penguins...<BR><BR>All these signs foretell the return of THE GREAT ONE!&nbsp; <BR><BR><BR>OPUS!<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 04:47:30 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Abundence of high-purity silicates on surface. If the <BR>&gt;&gt;environment also<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; contained anything which could function similarly to liquid <BR>&gt;&gt;crystal, that<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; would be a bonus.<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Thin atmosphere rich in sulphur compounds (in particular sulphur<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; hexafluoride).<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;These two conditions are incompatible. <BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;If a world has enough fluorine for SF6 to be a normal atmospheric<BR>&gt;&gt;component, that won't *be* any oxygen compounds (such as silicates) in<BR>&gt;&gt;the crust. You'd have silicon fluoride, with oxygen fluoride as an<BR>&gt;&gt;atmospheric component.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'm not to worried about oxygen being present. DOn't need any.<BR><BR>But you need oxygen *compounds*. :-)<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;No. The elemental abundance of fluorine is such that a world like this<BR>&gt;&gt;is essentially impossible. You'd need an *incredibly* skewed elemental<BR>&gt;&gt;abundance in the solar system in question.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Awww, I was hoping not to have to bring the Ancients in on this! :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Thanks, Leonard...I was thinking of you in particular when I asked for input<BR>&gt; on this.<BR><BR>Oh god! I'm a *resource* to be *exploited*! Oh the shame!<BR><BR>:-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 13:15:35 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: FW: Dr. Gaimari's Sinister Cyber-Elephants<BR><BR>The following two mails were posted on the 2300ad mail&nbsp; list&nbsp; but<BR>I thought it might be of interest&nbsp; for&nbsp; those&nbsp; of&nbsp; you&nbsp; who&nbsp; have<BR>Ditzie, combat penguins, and similar in your TUs.&nbsp; (Conversion of<BR>the salient facts from&nbsp; 2300ad&nbsp; to&nbsp; Traveller&nbsp; shouldn't&nbsp; be&nbsp; too<BR>tricky.)<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Bill &amp; Lara Bacon [mailto:rasher@austarnet.com.au] <BR>&gt; Sent: 26 January 2001 10:25<BR>&gt; To: 2300ad@yahoogroups.com<BR>&gt; Subject: [2300ad] Dr. Gaimari's Sinister Cyber-Elephants<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Dr. Gaimari emerged from the squalid cosmetic surgery &amp; genetic<BR>&gt; engineering markets of Calcutta. Squeezed between Shakespeare and<BR>&gt; Ho Chi Minh Sarani, DNA square has long been a provolution<BR>&gt; recruiting ground. Dr. Gaimari first came to the attention of the<BR>&gt; Bengali government in the investigation following the Subcontiental<BR>&gt; Cricket Cup of '59 Neural Sheathing scandal. The deal that saw him<BR>&gt; protected from prosecution also found him working for the Bengali<BR>&gt; Bio-warfare department were he produced the "Ganesh"..<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "Ganesh" Information Gathering Elephant.<BR>&gt; Intermittent<BR>&gt; Initiative: 2, Size: 3000kg, Speed: 40, Armour: 0.4, CL/LL: 10/12<BR>&gt; To Hit: Difficult, DPV: 4 (x2), Signature: +4<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Working from the principal that an Elephant never forgets, the<BR>&gt; "Ganesh" has an enlarged brain specifically designed for total<BR>&gt; recall. Four weeks of information can be stored in this manner<BR>&gt; before the "Ganesh" requires downloading. This is accomplished<BR>&gt; via a Neural Jack located behind the Elephants right ear.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; To Analyse Information Collected by "Ganesh" : Formidable. Information<BR>&gt; Gathering. 1 Hour.<BR>&gt; If analyst is jacked directly into "Ganesh" reduce difficulty by one<BR>level.<BR>&gt; If analyst has Biology or Riding (Elephant) reduce difficulty by one<BR>level.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The "Ganesh" was widely deployed along the armed border with Burma,<BR>&gt; the cease fire line with Bihar and within the Cantonese Client<BR>&gt; Kingdom of Butan. The model enjoyed only mixed results as covertly<BR>&gt; positioning an Elephant where required, proved to be a large problem.<BR>&gt; However, Dr. Gaimari was already working on the next model...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "Andaman" Covert Commando Elephant.<BR>&gt; Intermittent<BR>&gt; Initiative: 6, Size: 3000kg, Speed: 80, Armour: 0.8, CL/LL: 12/14<BR>&gt; To Hit: Easy, DPV: 6 (x2), Signature: +4<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Physically the "Andaman" appears no different from an ordinary<BR>&gt; Elephant. It has however subdermal armour, Neural Sheathing and<BR>&gt; Muscle Implants. Fitted into the trunk is a small desalination<BR>&gt; unit that allows the "Andaman" to drink sea water.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The "Andaman" was used for disruption and sabotage within the<BR>&gt; Andaman islands, with a significant degree of success. Elephants<BR>&gt; have been used for centuries on the islands and the "Andaman" was<BR>&gt; able to operate almost openly as it swam from island to island<BR>&gt; causing random destruction.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The rampage of the "Andaman" was ended when Indonesia created the<BR>&gt; 150km Elephant Exclusion Zone around the Andaman Islands in '68<BR>&gt; and it was soon after that when Dr. Gaimari was involved in the<BR>&gt; Calcutta uprising. This short lived revolt by mainly Hindi<BR>&gt; Calcutta was crushed by Bengali Mutasib Forces and Dr. Gaimari<BR>&gt; found himself a wanted terrorist. He later surfaced in the (now<BR>&gt; province of Indochina) Thailand were he found himself involved<BR>&gt; in the shadowy world were the Cantonese Government, Provolution<BR>&gt; and Tao Biogenics overlap in the labs of Chang Mai....<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Royal Thai Cyber Elephant.<BR>&gt; Intermittent.<BR>&gt; Initiative: 5, Size: 3000kg, Speed: 60, Armour: 2, CL/LL: 12/14<BR>&gt; To Hit: Easy, DPV: 6 (x2), Signature: +6<BR>&gt; External armour, turret mounted Quinn-Darlan Mk 2-A2 PGMP and twin<BR>&gt; Guiscard Aero-12 single shot launchers.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The Royal Thai Cyber-Elephant was designed for formal processions<BR>&gt; and guarding the royal persons, they have never been used in combat.<BR>&gt; In '77 one of the Royal Elephants exploded as a recorded message<BR>&gt; from the King was being played. It latter proved to have been fitted<BR>&gt; with a detonator keyed to His Royal Highnesses voice pattern and Dr.<BR>&gt; Gaimari was once again on the run. The Cyber Elephants have since<BR>&gt; been withdrawn from service and are never armed.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The whereabouts of Dr. Gaimari is unknown and he is still wanted<BR>&gt; for acts of terrorism in Manchuria and Japan. He was last seen at<BR>&gt; the recently closed down "Thylacine World" in Tasmania.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Bill Bacon<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Rob Myers [mailto:robm@onetel.net.uk] <BR>&gt; Sent: 26 January 2001 11:11<BR>&gt; To: 2300ad@yahoogroups.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: [2300ad] Dr. Gaimari's Sinister Cyber-Elephants<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Army surplus Ganeshes are often psychotically disturbed due to<BR>&gt; their recall of all the horrors they have seen in action.<BR>&gt; Cyberjackers down on their luck can make good money counselling<BR>&gt; Ganeshes for new owners by jacking in direct to the animals'<BR>&gt; brains and closing off the offending memory areas, although this<BR>&gt; is a hazardous operation. Some crime bosses have been known to<BR>&gt; give jackers they wish to dispose of a Ganesh with a terminal<BR>&gt; memory set, destroying the jacker's mind when they connect.<BR>&gt; Surviving such a "white elephant" is regarded as a sign of extreme<BR>&gt; luck, or for the religious, divine favour.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; - Rob.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 14:19:07 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: JTAS Chat tonight<BR><BR>Is the log available on the SJG web site?<BR><BR>TIA<BR>Mike<BR><BR><BR>- ----Original Message Follows----<BR>From: "Kelly St.Clair" &lt;kellys@efn.org&gt;<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 03:00:46 -0800<BR><BR><BR>&gt;Farewell, Freedonian Aerospace Administration.<BR><BR>*salute*<BR><BR>They had a pretty good run, didn't they?&nbsp; How many terms is that?<BR><BR><BR>- --------------<BR>Kelly St.Clair&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "'Cause you've got Trouble<BR>kellys@efn.org&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Right here in fair Verona<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; With a capital T that rhymes with D<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That stands for Duel..."<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:37:40 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: JTAS Chat tonight<BR><BR>Michael McKeown wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Is the log available on the SJG web site?<BR><BR>Brubek's chat logs are available on JTAS to subscribers.<BR><BR>&lt;&lt;snip&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 14:34:15 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: JTAS Chat tonight<BR><BR>Not yet. <BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>&gt;-----Original Message-----<BR>&gt;From: Michael McKeown [mailto:mmckeown67@hotmail.com]<BR>&gt;Sent: 26 January 2001 14:19<BR>&gt;To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: JTAS Chat tonight<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Is the log available on the SJG web site?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;TIA<BR>&gt;Mike<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;----Original Message Follows----<BR>&gt;From: "Kelly St.Clair" &lt;kellys@efn.org&gt;<BR>&gt;Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 03:00:46 -0800<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Farewell, Freedonian Aerospace Administration.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;*salute*<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;They had a pretty good run, didn't they?&nbsp; How many terms is that?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;--------------<BR>&gt;Kelly St.Clair&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "'Cause you've got Trouble<BR>&gt;kellys@efn.org&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Right here in fair Verona<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; With a capital T that rhymes with D<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That stands for Duel..."<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;_________________________________________________________________<BR>&gt;Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:45:58 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR>&gt; After 20 happy-and difficult-years in business, FASA Corporation is<BR>&gt; closing its doors.<BR>&gt; The adventure gaming world has changed much in those years, and it is<BR>&gt; time for the<BR>&gt; founders of FASA to move on. We may produce a few remaining products<BR>&gt; in the next<BR>&gt; month, but then we will close up shop.<BR><BR>*silence*<BR><BR>This is sad. I have enjoyed Shadowrun and, more rarely, Battletech. What<BR>is even more disturbing is that this is not an isolated event. About two<BR>months ago, Iron Crown Enterprices went bankrupt. Just a short while<BR>ago, Hasbro fired a bunch of gaming personell.<BR><BR>Don't like the way it's all headed...<BR><BR>Thankfully, SJGames seem healthy enough. White Wolf is prospering. TSR<BR>is by no means dead. The hobby remains, but some om the more well-known<BR>and lasting companies close down.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 14:49:36 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: FASA closes<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;sigh&lt;&lt;<BR><BR>Farewll, sweet Fasa. I shall fondly remember your sourcebooks and<BR>supplements;<BR>Traveller, Shadowrun and the Dr. Who RPG.<BR>Battletech no more. :(<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:02:38 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR><BR>&gt;-----Original Message-----<BR>&gt;From: shadow@krypton.rain.com [mailto:shadow@krypton.rain.com]<BR>&gt;Sent: 26 January 2001 12:48<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;These two conditions are incompatible. <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;If a world has enough fluorine for SF6 to be a normal atmospheric<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;component, that won't *be* any oxygen compounds (such as <BR>&gt;silicates) in<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;the crust. You'd have silicon fluoride, with oxygen fluoride as an<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;atmospheric component.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; I'm not to worried about oxygen being present. DOn't need any.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;But you need oxygen *compounds*. :-)<BR><BR>OK, I'm obviously being a bit thick...What for? I don't really need<BR>silicates...silica itself would do. Still, I suppose there not way to *stop*<BR>oxygen getting into the planetary mix :)<BR><BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;No. The elemental abundance of fluorine is such that a world <BR>&gt;like this<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;is essentially impossible. You'd need an *incredibly* skewed <BR>&gt;elemental<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;abundance in the solar system in question.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Awww, I was hoping not to have to bring the Ancients in on this! :)<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Thanks, Leonard...I was thinking of you in particular when I <BR>&gt;asked for input<BR>&gt;&gt; on this.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Oh god! I'm a *resource* to be *exploited*! Oh the shame!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;:-)<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>We start strip mining as soon as we get rid of those pesky protestors!<BR>Mua-ha-ha-ha!<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:03:00 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: FASA closes<BR><BR>Dean Jones wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;sigh&lt;&lt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Farewll, sweet Fasa. I shall fondly remember your sourcebooks<BR>&gt; and supplements; Traveller, Shadowrun and the Dr. Who RPG.<BR>&gt; Battletech no more. :(<BR><BR>And don't forget the original Star Trek RPG (from which rules the<BR>Dr Who RPG was largely derived) and the spinoff product Star Trek<BR>Combat Simulator (which is much better than SFB).<BR><BR>:-(<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:07:34 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: FASA closes<BR><BR>&gt;-----Original Message-----<BR>&gt;From: Trevor, Peter [mailto:Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com]<BR>&gt;Sent: 26 January 2001 15:03<BR>&gt;To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt;Subject: RE: FASA closes<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Dean Jones wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;sigh&lt;&lt;<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Farewll, sweet Fasa. I shall fondly remember your sourcebooks<BR>&gt;&gt; and supplements; Traveller, Shadowrun and the Dr. Who RPG.<BR>&gt;&gt; Battletech no more. :(<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;And don't forget the original Star Trek RPG (from which rules the<BR>&gt;Dr Who RPG was largely derived) and the spinoff product Star Trek<BR>&gt;Combat Simulator (which is much better than SFB).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;:-(<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Not forgotten...I almost had a haiku, that was all :)<BR>Earthdawn deserves a mention, too.<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 07:43:15 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>&gt;From: Matt Bond &lt;MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>...<BR>&gt;&gt; TL 7-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1000 dtons<BR>&gt;&gt; TL 9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4000 dtons<BR>&gt;&gt; TL10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 10,000 dtons<BR>&gt;&gt; TL11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 50,000 dtons<BR>&gt;&gt; TL12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 100,000 dtons<BR>&gt;&gt; TL13&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1,000,000 dtons<BR>...<BR>&gt;Actually, if you read p.22 of HG2 you will see that "Each specific<BR>&gt;tonnage level includes all values between it and the next highest stated<BR>&gt;level. Thus, tonnage code A includes all tonnages from 1,000 to 1,900 tons."<BR><BR>&nbsp; "Ship is the ship requiring this computer as a minimum" (HG2, p.26).<BR>At TL 9 your computer Model/3 computer can support a 9,999 Dt ship (see<BR>HG2 p. 28 for example). The wording isn't the easiest...<BR><BR>&gt;So you table should read:<BR>&gt;TL5-6&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 699 dtons<BR>&gt;TL7-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1999 dtons<BR>&gt;TL9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4999 dtons<BR>&gt;TL10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 19,999 dtons<BR>&gt;TL11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 74,999 dtons<BR>&gt;TL12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 199,999 dtons<BR>&gt;TL13&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; infinite... (1,000,000+ dtons)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:02:50 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Interstellar War Timeline<BR><BR>I've been dealing with competing canon timelines (Imperium,<BR>MegaTraveller Imperial Enyclopedia and Referee's Companion, Library<BR>Data (A-M, N-Z), Alien Module 6) trying to hash out the sequence of<BR>events from the period of the Interstellar Wars. <BR><BR>The problem is, no two sources seem to agree on anything, and in at<BR>least one case (Imperium) it disagrees with itself.<BR><BR>For instance, Alien Module 6 places the Terran discovery of Jump Drive<BR>in 2087, while Imperium puts it in 2090.&nbsp; One has the U.S. making the<BR>trip to Barnard in 2096, and the other in 2113.&nbsp; The First Interstellar<BR>War erupted in either 2110, 2113 or 2118.<BR><BR>The most egregious example of non-sequitorness (is that a word) is in<BR>Imperium, wherein the Terrans discover jump drive in 2090, discover the<BR>Vilani in 2113 - only 23 years - but the text in the same paragraph<BR>claims 43 years.<BR><BR>Well, complaining aside, I think I've worked out a decent timeline for<BR>the Interstellar War period.&nbsp; For gaming purposes, I think the best<BR>period would be the 188 years the Terrans were stuck at TL 11 (2120 to<BR>2308).&nbsp; All but the First and Nth Interstellar Wars fall within this<BR>period.&nbsp; The Terran national fleets are reorganized in the early part<BR>of this period and a goodly portion of Terran colonization is going on<BR>in the general neighborhood of Sol.<BR><BR>2022&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Treaty of New York places the armed forces of the major nations<BR>of Earth under United Nations control.<BR>2087&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Jump Drive developed at UNSCA's asteroid belt lab.<BR>2096&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; U.S. Space Force team jumps to Barnard Star and discovers the<BR>Vilani.<BR>2110&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Terrans achieve TL 10<BR>2110 to 2118&nbsp; &nbsp; First Interstellar War.<BR>2120&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Terrans achieve TL 11.<BR>2120&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Terran Confederation Established.<BR>2132&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Terran Navy begins purchasing robots.<BR>2308&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Terrans achieve TL 12.<BR>2333 to 2349&nbsp; &nbsp; Nth Interstellar War.<BR><BR>I think I'm going to go with the High Guard limitation on ship sizes<BR>(TL 11 limited to 74,999 dtons - thanks guys for setting me straight)<BR>even though there is no practical reason why ships should be limited in<BR>size.&nbsp; I figure that since this in the Terrans first interstellar war,<BR>they are going to be experimenting with ship designs, tactics and<BR>doctrine, and you don't build a million-dton super-dreadnaught until<BR>you've established a naval doctrine that requires one.&nbsp; As for the<BR>Vilani, being as conservative as they are, and having waged the<BR>Consolidation Wars ages before, and not really having any major rivals<BR>on the interstellar front until the Terrans and Vargr showed up, they<BR>really have no need for Really Big warships, as their navy probably<BR>fulfills more of an anti-piracy, customs, SAR role.<BR><BR>Of course, other people may have other ideas.&nbsp; I'd love to hear them.<BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3563<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-ye03.mx.aol.com (rly-ye03.mail.aol.com [172.18.151.200]) by air-ye01.mail.aol.com (v77.35) with ESMTP; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 11:06:20 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-ye03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 11:05:46 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id LAA24781;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 11:03:05 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 26 Jan 2001 11:02:54 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA24747<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 11:02:53 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 11:02:53 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101261602.LAA24747@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3563<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3564</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/26/01 12:58:28 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 26 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3564<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: FASA closes<BR>Re: Ship Sizes (was IW Query)<BR>HG2 Ship Sizes - The correct table at last :-)<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re:<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Penguins...<BR>Re: Penguins...<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query)<BR>RE: Question.....<BR>Re: HG2 Ship Sizes - The correct table at last :-)<BR>Re:<BR>Re: Traveller Sectors<BR>M.D.&nbsp; vs. Guns<BR>Re: M.D. vs. Guns<BR>Re: Please send further IP queries to Marc...<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re: <BR>Re: Traveller Sectors<BR>Landgrab proposal: Sacnoth, Gram<BR>Re: Please send further IP queries to Marc...<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Historical Example: What's in a ship's locker? (longish)<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 16:07:02 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: FASA closes<BR><BR>Dean Jones wrote:<BR>&gt; From: Trevor, Peter<BR>&gt; &gt; Dean Jones wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;&gt;sigh&lt;&lt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Farewll, sweet Fasa. I shall fondly remember your sourcebooks<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; and supplements; Traveller, Shadowrun and the Dr. Who RPG.<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Battletech no more. :(<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; And don't forget the original Star Trek RPG (from which rules the<BR>&gt; &gt; Dr Who RPG was largely derived) and the spinoff product Star Trek<BR>&gt; &gt; Combat Simulator (which is much better than SFB).<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; :-(<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Not forgotten...I almost had a haiku, that was all :)<BR>&gt; Earthdawn deserves a mention, too.<BR><BR>Ah.&nbsp; How about ...<BR><BR>Remembering your sourcebooks:<BR>&nbsp; Farewell, sweet FASA.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Battletech, et al, no more.<BR><BR>or ...<BR><BR>Happy games we once did play<BR>&nbsp; All with sweet FASA<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; One more giant fades to dust.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:34:12 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ship Sizes (was IW Query)<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:12:18 -0000<BR>&gt; From: Matt Bond &lt;MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>&gt; Actually, if you read p.22 of HG2 you will see that "Each specific<BR>&gt; tonnage level includes all values between it and the next highest stated<BR>&gt; level. Thus, tonnage code A includes all tonnages from 1,000 to 1,900<BR>&gt; tons."<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; So you table should read:<BR>&gt; TL5-6&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 699 dtons<BR>&gt; TL7-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 4999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 19,999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 74,999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 199,999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL13&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; infinite... (1,000,000+ dtons)<BR><BR>Actually again, High Guard says that starships range from 100 to 1,000,000<BR>tons, so that should be the top of your scale. Whether this was intended<BR>to mean that ships larger than 1,000,000 tons cannot be constructed, or<BR>simply have not been constructed, is open to interpretation. Based on<BR>engineering analysis, however, megaton starships are going to face some<BR>pretty severe limitations, even allowing for the magical materials<BR>available at TL12+.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 16:38:41 -0000<BR>From: Matt Bond &lt;MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: HG2 Ship Sizes - The correct table at last :-)<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 07:43:15 -0800<BR>&gt; From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;Actually, if you read p.22 of HG2 you will see that "Each specific<BR>&gt; &gt;tonnage level includes all values between it and the next <BR>&gt; highest stated<BR>&gt; &gt;level. Thus, tonnage code A includes all tonnages from 1,000 <BR>&gt; to 1,900 tons."<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; "Ship is the ship requiring this computer as a minimum" (HG2, p.26).<BR>&gt; At TL 9 your computer Model/3 computer can support a 9,999 Dt <BR>&gt; ship (see<BR>&gt; HG2 p. 28 for example). The wording isn't the easiest...<BR><BR>Doh! Oh well, only been doing it wrong for 19 years :) <BR><BR>So the table should actually read:<BR><BR>TL5-6&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 999 dtons<BR>TL7-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 3999 dtons<BR>TL9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 9999 dtons<BR>TL10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 49,999 dtons<BR>TL11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 99,999 dtons<BR>TL12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 999,999 dtons<BR>TL13&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; infinite... (1,000,000+ dtons)<BR><BR>and in the same digest...<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:02:50 -0800 (PST)<BR>&gt; From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Interstellar War Timeline<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt; <BR><BR>&gt; I think I'm going to go with the High Guard limitation on ship sizes<BR>&gt; (TL 11 limited to 74,999 dtons - thanks guys for setting me straight)<BR>&gt; even though there is no practical reason why ships should be <BR>&gt; limited in size. <BR><BR>99,999 dtons, as I have now realised....<BR><BR>Matt<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:42:16<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>At 10:41 AM 1/26/2001 +0100, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Farewell, Freedonian Aerospace Administration.<BR><BR>Indeed.&nbsp; They produced some of the best games in the field.<BR><BR>GDW, ICE, TSR, and now FASA...&nbsp; Damn.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:43:33<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re:<BR><BR>At 04:33 PM 1/25/2001 -0600, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Bruce, famous Exhibitionists for 500. This 60's music group's lead<BR>&gt;singer couldn't keep his pants on.<BR><BR>Umm.. who are all of them?&nbsp; :P<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:48:21<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>At 04:53 PM 1/25/2001 -0600, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Hey!&nbsp; How come he gets a gearhead question!&nbsp; Why didn't I get a gearhead<BR>&gt;question?<BR><BR>Too easy.&nbsp; You'd have enjoyed that.<BR><BR>Me?&nbsp; I got "describe the effects on the Traveller universe if the Ancients<BR>uplifted flightless Antarctic seafowl, rather than wolves, as assistants."<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:57:37<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Penguins...<BR><BR>At 04:17 AM 1/26/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;All these signs foretell the return of THE GREAT ONE!&nbsp; <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;OPUS!<BR><BR>Heretic!<BR><BR>Chilly Willy is the One True Penguin!<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas "Penguin Boy" Berry&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&nbsp; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>"But that's not the point!" raged Ford. "The point is that I am now a<BR>perfectly safe penguin, and my colleague here is rapidly running out of<BR>limbs!"&nbsp; - The Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:58:44<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Penguins...<BR><BR>At 01:19 AM 1/26/2001 PST, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;A Linux game called "Penguin Command" just came across the Fidonet file<BR>&gt;distribution network. It claims to be based on the old Missile Command<BR>&gt;game. :-)<BR><BR>This post has been forwarded to Kirsten, retitled "Why we need Linux, #327."<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:54:56<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>At 09:31 PM 1/25/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Weltschpfungsingenieuren!*<BR><BR>I'm now going to frighten all of you.<BR><BR>How many spoken syllables is that, and an example of what it would rhyme<BR>with, please? <BR><BR>:)<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp;&nbsp; Templar Agent at Large.<BR>gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR><BR>TravGeekCode: <BR>tc+ tm+ !tn- t4@ ?tg+ tt@ to(CORPS)++ ru@ $ge++ 3i<BR>ii+ au st+ ls+ pi kk+ so(++) va++ dr+ zh+ sw++ ?da<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:08:01<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Sphere (Was : RE: Interstellar War Query)<BR><BR>At 01:49 PM 1/25/2001 -0600, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Ask Jerry Pournelle about the German translation of _The Mercenary_ some<BR>&gt;&gt;time.. :)<BR><BR>&gt;In short, what did he do to it?<BR><BR>The translator was a member of the Communist Party, and cut *all* of the<BR>dialogue about a soldiers responsibilities out.&nbsp; He left it looking like a<BR>Mack Bolan novel.<BR><BR>Pournelle found out, and cornered the guy at a British WorldCon.&nbsp; The last<BR>thing anybody heard before the fight broke out was the translator stating<BR>"you are a fascist, you should read like a fascist!"<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>Embrace Fascism.&nbsp; &nbsp; The uniforms look cool<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:04:42<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question.....<BR><BR>At 03:24 PM 1/25/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Im sorry using a 12 gage shot gun in&nbsp; zero g does not sound like&nbsp; a very<BR>&gt;smart thing to do.<BR><BR>As long as you a braced, and ready to deal with the recoil, you'd do fine.<BR><BR>We tried to deal with this in ACQ, requiring a skill roll after firing any<BR>weapon with recoil to retain your correct orientation.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:27:09 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: HG2 Ship Sizes - The correct table at last :-)<BR><BR>But the next hull size up is Q, which is 75,000 tons...<BR>Maybe, once again, I'm not grasping the problem correctly.&nbsp; It's this<BR>lousy head cold and all those lovely pills I've been popping.<BR><BR>It was bad enough to know I've been doing it all wrong since Christmas<BR>1981 (when I first started playing); it sucks to know I still cannot<BR>get it right.<BR><BR>- --- Matt Bond &lt;MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 07:43:15 -0800<BR>&gt; &gt; From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: RE: Interstellar War Query<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;Actually, if you read p.22 of HG2 you will see that "Each specific<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;tonnage level includes all values between it and the next <BR>&gt; &gt; highest stated<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;level. Thus, tonnage code A includes all tonnages from 1,000 <BR>&gt; &gt; to 1,900 tons."<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; "Ship is the ship requiring this computer as a minimum" (HG2,<BR>&gt; p.26).<BR>&gt; &gt; At TL 9 your computer Model/3 computer can support a 9,999 Dt <BR>&gt; &gt; ship (see<BR>&gt; &gt; HG2 p. 28 for example). The wording isn't the easiest...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Doh! Oh well, only been doing it wrong for 19 years :) <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; So the table should actually read:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; TL5-6&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL7-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 3999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 9999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 49,999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 99,999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 999,999 dtons<BR>&gt; TL13&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; infinite... (1,000,000+ dtons)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt; and in the same digest...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:02:50 -0800 (PST)<BR>&gt; &gt; From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: Interstellar War Timeline<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;snip&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; I think I'm going to go with the High Guard limitation on ship<BR>&gt; sizes<BR>&gt; &gt; (TL 11 limited to 74,999 dtons - thanks guys for setting me<BR>&gt; straight)<BR>&gt; &gt; even though there is no practical reason why ships should be <BR>&gt; &gt; limited in size. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 99,999 dtons, as I have now realised....<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Matt<BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:32:12 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Kiri Aradia Morgan &lt;tiamat@tsoft.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re:<BR><BR>On Fri, 26 Jan 2001, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 04:33 PM 1/25/2001 -0600, you wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;Bruce, famous Exhibitionists for 500. This 60's music group's lead<BR>&gt; &gt;singer couldn't keep his pants on.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Umm.. who are all of them?&nbsp; :P<BR>&gt; <BR>Bzzt!<BR><BR>Who are the Doors?<BR><BR>Morrison distinguished himself by not being able to keep them on when he<BR>was on stage, instead of just backstage.<BR><BR>Kiri<BR><BR>******************************************************************************<BR>Kiri Aradia Morgan&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 93!&nbsp; Thou Art God<BR>tiamat@tsoft.com<BR><BR>"If time passes, everything turns into beauty<BR>If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away<BR>Everything starts wearing fresh colors<BR>Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody<BR>Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic<BR>Desire is embraced in a dream..."&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -- X-JAPAN<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:51:21 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Sectors<BR><BR>Thom Jones-Low writes:<BR>&gt; &gt; Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:34:06 +0000<BR>&gt; &gt; From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3548<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; on 23/1/01 2:41 am, Gordon Horne at gordon.horne@home.com wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;&gt; Just one question... how the heck do you do that? :) Is there some<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;&gt; trick to generating stats from Gal24 or have you exported everything<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;&gt; into a mammoth spreadsheet?<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; I've been dumping various people's sector notes into a giant<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; spreadsheet. Who did what is lost to the mists of time, in part<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; because i edit the data so everything has the same detail, in part<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; because i've kept lousy records 8^(<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Nice one. Any chance of making it available?<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Goto http://maps.grandsurvey.com&nbsp; Anthony Jackson, who did a fair<BR>&gt; amount of the analysis that you are asking about also has a complete<BR>&gt; text file with all the sectors/files of know canon space. <BR><BR>As well as multiple less canon files.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; http://www.solstation.com/core/astrogation_en.htm<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; This is my source of all the GENII files and a good place to download<BR>&gt; all of the various files. As far as I can tell, this is where Anthony<BR>&gt; got his files from as well. <BR><BR>In part; I have sectors that Core doesn't have, and there are situations where<BR>I've used different files from Core, such as the HIWG NSC files.&nbsp; In most<BR>cases I have notes in my sector.txt files as to what my source is.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 13:10:18 -0500<BR>From: "Thom Harris" &lt;thomharr@mediaone.net&gt;<BR>Subject: M.D.&nbsp; vs. Guns<BR><BR>Number of physicians in the US = 700,000<BR>Accidental deaths caused by physicians per year = 120,000<BR>Accidental deaths per physician = 0.171<BR>(as per US Dept. of Health &amp; Human Services)<BR><BR>Number of gun owners in the US = 80,000,000<BR>Number of accidental gun deaths per year (all age groups) =1500<BR>Accidental deaths per gun owner = 0.0000188<BR>(US Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco &amp; Firearms)<BR><BR>Therefore, doctors are approximately 9,000 times more dangerous than gun<BR>owners.<BR><BR>(Taken from the Benton County News Tribune on the 17th of November 1999)<BR><BR>Thom Harris - GOFIR - &lt;Gnarly Old Fart In Residence&gt;<BR>~I started out with nothing.....I still have most of it left~<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 13:32:21 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: M.D. vs. Guns<BR><BR>&gt;Number of accidental gun deaths per year (all age groups) =1500<BR><BR>I believe it's the 12,000 or so non-accidental gun deaths (USA, 1997)that <BR>concern most.<BR><BR>What does this have to do with Traveller?<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:24:53 +0100<BR>From: Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Please send further IP queries to Marc...<BR><BR>On Friday, January 26, 2001, 1:08:49 PM, the following was written:<BR><BR>Ok, so it was 4 questions. But one common topic. That should count for<BR>something...<BR><BR>RS&gt; 1) My position is unchanged.&nbsp; 2) I don't know.&nbsp; 3) Pretty good, if his name is Santa Claus, because only he would be willing to meet the terms of both sides.&nbsp; Only if you saw the terms would you<BR>RS&gt; know what I mean.&nbsp; Unfortunately, I'm not at liberty to disclose them (see below).<BR>RS&gt; 4) Its canon-status is up to Marc. I posted permission on the TML for such use years ago,<BR>RS&gt; and it still stands (see that document for details), but you still need Marc's permission.<BR><BR>RS&gt; From here on, I'm deferring all IP (intellectual property) topics to Marc.<BR>RS&gt; I believe he explained the situation in a previous posting.<BR><BR>RS&gt; Please send all further IP queries to him.&nbsp; He has my permission to disclose the terms<BR>RS&gt; he offered.&nbsp; If he does so, forward them to me, and I'll be glad to comment.<BR>Hmm, I would be interested inknowing more details. Who wouldnt? So<BR>Marc, whats up? Where is the real problem?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:21:26 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>Last Unicorn Games and Mayfair as well....<BR><BR><BR>- ----Original Message Follows----<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:42:16<BR><BR>At 10:41 AM 1/26/2001 +0100, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Farewell, Freedonian Aerospace Administration.<BR><BR>Indeed.&nbsp; They produced some of the best games in the field.<BR><BR>GDW, ICE, TSR, and now FASA...&nbsp; Damn.<BR>- --<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:56:01 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>on 26/1/01 2:45 pm, Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm at jenry023@student.liu.se<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; This is sad. I have enjoyed Shadowrun and, more rarely, Battletech. What<BR>&gt; is even more disturbing is that this is not an isolated event. About two<BR>&gt; months ago, Iron Crown Enterprices went bankrupt. Just a short while<BR>&gt; ago, Hasbro fired a bunch of gaming personell.<BR><BR>Shadowrun, Battletech and Ral Partha lines are being taken up by Wizkids,<BR>best known for their Mageknight line. That's the good news.<BR><BR>&gt; Don't like the way it's all headed...<BR><BR>However, sometimes it's hard to keep a good game down. For those of us who<BR>want to honour the games that came back from the dead, Eden studios<BR>publishes The Zombie Awards:<BR><BR>http://www.zombieawards.org/<BR><BR>&gt; Thankfully, SJGames seem healthy enough. White Wolf is prospering. TSR<BR>&gt; is by no means dead. The hobby remains, but some om the more well-known<BR>&gt; and lasting companies close down.<BR><BR>Being an eternal optimist (albeit somewhat cynical) I feel that some of the<BR>changes in the industry will eventually serve us well. The WotC<BR>republication of AD&amp;D certainly looks more stable than under the last<BR>management of TSR. Having Marc Miller holding the cards for his creations is<BR>definitely a good thing. Licensing to SJG, RPGRealms/Judges Guild (for they<BR>are back) and BITS is a strong start. The strength behind these two classic<BR>games alone will be very positive for the industry. The licensing of AD&amp;D<BR>shows links to more popular media (such as computer games and novels) is<BR>important. Marc appears to appreciate this.<BR><BR>I'm still somewhat concerned about the high street however. A long time back<BR>Games Workshop infamously refocused on just their own lines, and it looks<BR>like WotC is going to do something fairly similar. Only the 'indie' stores<BR>carry wide ranges today. If the new editions of the great RPGs are to get<BR>the exposure they deserve, they need more retail strength, ideally through<BR>generic major chains IMO.<BR><BR>When I first started with RPGs, I had to order from distributors like<BR>Esdevium. As the hobby grew, my players could get material easily on any<BR>major high street. Today, we're back to the state of the early days. Were it<BR>not for the WotC chain, the AD&amp;D movie, software and CCG tie-ins would<BR>probably change this. As it is, it may only provide exposure to a small<BR>subset controlled by a single company.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:56:02 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: <BR><BR>on 25/1/01 7:50 pm, John Lambert at hovtej@hotmail.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I've rejoined the Traveller list after several years absence and wanted to<BR>&gt; see who was still signed on from before. However, I sent the "who" query to<BR>&gt; the list rather than to Majordomo. I had planned on lurking for awhile.<BR><BR>Didn't know that was enabled. So it is...<BR><BR>(who's reading it at netcraft.co.uk? Hello there... if this isn't a new<BR>Internet census feature ;) )<BR><BR>&gt; I'm glad to see that a lot of the old timers are still here and I'm looking<BR>&gt; forward to "meeting" the newer travellers. For reference, I'm listed in the<BR>&gt; "Citizens of the TML" and have a very abbreviated description of being<BR>&gt; "spaced" quoted in the TML FAQ.<BR><BR>Hi,<BR><BR>I'm one of the newcomers, though an older Traveller. I spent a few terms in<BR>the Navy, now I've returned for a second career in the Scouts. :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:56:03 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Sectors<BR><BR>on 26/1/01 3:08 am, Thom Jones-Low at tjoneslo@together.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; I've been dumping various people's sector notes into a giant<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; spreadsheet. Who did what is lost to the mists of time, in part<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; because i edit the data so everything has the same detail, in part<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; because i've kept lousy records 8^(<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Nice one. Any chance of making it available?<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Goto http://maps.grandsurvey.com&nbsp; Anthony Jackson, who did a fair<BR>&gt; amount of the analysis that you are asking about also has a complete<BR>&gt; text file with all the sectors/files of know canon space.<BR><BR>Aha, useful resource...<BR><BR>&gt; http://www.solstation.com/core/astrogation_en.htm<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This is my source of all the GENII files and a good place to download<BR>&gt; all of the various files. As far as I can tell, this is where Anthony<BR>&gt; got his files from as well.<BR><BR>Again. Thanks very much!<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:56:03 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Landgrab proposal: Sacnoth, Gram<BR><BR>Hi,<BR><BR>I'm doing some writing based in the Sword Worlds, and would like to make a<BR>claim on two higher-tech worlds in the region: Sacnoth and Gram. I would<BR>appreciate hearing any objections and/or sources for canon material I should<BR>include. I suppose I should mention that my preference is for a T4-&gt;CT-&gt;GT<BR>timeline: MTU of the 'eighties never went the MT/TNE way. However, it's my<BR>intention to cover all periods/timelines to some degree, so I'd like to know<BR>about any Sword World stuff in any edition. If I don't have it, I'll shift<BR>it up my purchase list. :)<BR><BR>What would the geek code be for somebody like me who is strongly CT, but<BR>likes the GT milieu (but not rules) over later GDW ones? Awkward++?<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 20:17 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Please send further IP queries to Marc...<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;3A7168D1.517D1078@nwnexus.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>While IP rights have to be sorted out by those who have an interest <BR>therein, I'd urge people to consider the benefits of web publishing as a <BR>tool for continuing to make available material that otherwise would <BR>languish in some forgotten limbo. <BR><BR>It does not cost much from the purely 'production' point of view to do a <BR>really good job - and, if the owners of the IP rights still wish to profit <BR>(after all, the poor dears have to eat!) material can be sold rather than <BR>freely given away - be it CD-ROM dispatched on receipt of payment or a <BR>simple 'shopping cart' mechanism that only makes the download files <BR>available once you've paid up.<BR><BR>As a college webmaster, I earn my keep taking people's notes and other <BR>instructional materials and making them accessible to students via web <BR>technology, so I know what I'm on about :-)<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 20:17 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;3.0.5.16.20010126084821.4647e96a@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>Nobody gave me an essay assignment when I joined the list...<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:56:15 -0500<BR>From: "Walt Smith" &lt;firelock_ny@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Historical Example: What's in a ship's locker? (longish)<BR><BR>I was perusing a web site having to do with US Navy submarines,<BR>and encountered this description of tools and equipment from<BR>a submarine.&nbsp; It immediately struck me as a fine example of<BR>the kind of things one would expect to find in the ship's<BR>locker of a long-service Free Trader...<BR><BR>"The following is a list of tools that can probably be found in any M-<BR>div toolbox on any boat. See if you have or remember these (add to to<BR>list!): A wire brush with all the bristles bent back rendering unusable<BR>unless you turn it on its side. Three or more wrench roll sets, missing<BR>the 7/16", 1/2", 9/16", and 3/4" wrenches, but boy do we have a bunch<BR>of 11/16" and 13/16" wrenches available. A socket set missing the same<BR>sizes as mentioned for the wrenches. When a 9/16" socket is found, it<BR>is a 1/2" drive and the only working ratchet is 3/8". Of course, there<BR>is an adapter to go from 1/2" to 3/8", but none vice versa. A wrench<BR>modified by being cut in half, leaving a 2" handle. Wouldn't do any<BR>good anyway, someone used it as a slugging wrench. A ball peen hammer<BR>with a broken handle. If the handle isn't broken, it's cracked and held<BR>together with duct tape. A four pound sledge on a short handle. Used<BR>to "calibrate" them valves. Affectionately call "Thor", "Hey, go hand<BR>me Thor, this handwheel is stuck" A dried up bottle of graphite<BR>suspended in isopropanol (aka Neolube). A tube of prussian blue, with<BR>the crimped end blown open so every tool on the bottom of the toolbox<BR>has a greasy blue coating. Stainless steel pipe caps (FME or foreign<BR>material exclusion covers). Some still have useful Grade "A" stickers<BR>with the QA guys initials on them, covers your butt on those 2 AM<BR>repair jobs when NR comes to visit. Three broken ratchets. Various size<BR>ferrules from those Swagelok fittings we weren't suppose to use. Most<BR>are bent, some are still connected to a cut off piece of tubing with<BR>the hopes that we "may need a 1-1/2" section of tubing with the<BR>ferrules still on it" Special tools that no one seems to know what they<BR>are or how they work. For example, the funky spanner used to take the<BR>bottom of the DeLaval purifier bowl off. The cradle of the SSTG shaft<BR>lifting device, no one knows where the rest of it is. A hacksaw blade<BR>with a big wad of HP tape wrapped around one end as a handle. Had to<BR>use the HP tape, the hacksaw handle is missing the little tabs that<BR>normally hold the blade. A piece of string. A wad of Kimwipes that were<BR>once used in an attempt to clean the prussian blue off the bottom of<BR>the tool box. A few QA 5 tags A primary valve cap vent screw, source<BR>unknown, must have been free released, its been here since I came<BR>aboard! A few slightly crushed primary valve cap O-rings, see previous<BR>comment. Speaking of O-rings, there are a few of them in opened<BR>packages, the cure date was removed when the package was opened. A few<BR>deck plate screws, some are cross-threaded. A roll of RadCon tape. A<BR>light dusting of tri-sodium phosphate from the ELTs weighing chemicals<BR>on the M-div workbench. An impact wrench, brand new, never used because<BR>it won't fit anywhere you need to use it. Pea grinder wrenches, taped<BR>together. A few Yarway steam trap parts, including a steam cut cap. A<BR>FME cover formerly used as a mixing bowl for that messy red lead,<BR>graphite and mineral oil anti-sieze. A pair of lockwire pliers with the<BR>jaws damaged. Lots of little pieces of lockwire. A bunch of swaged<BR>fittings assembled to make a little piping system by the CNTP (Chief of<BR>Naval Tinkering and Puttering) One of those long bladed screwdrivers<BR>that was stolen from the E-div toolbox. The shaft is bent from use as a<BR>pry bar, what the hey, its not ours! Nut drivers, also stolen from E-<BR>div toolbox in revenge for them losing the only functional ratchet. A<BR>1/2" wrench that spent three months between frames 54 and 55 in the<BR>engineroom bilge, corrosion has rendered it useless except for training<BR>on chloride pitting corrosion. A shackle that hasn't been load tested<BR>since the boat was commisioned in 1974 (1956 if you were on my boat) A<BR>large chunk of lead, used to hammel the bejesus out of the gasket<BR>material with those dull gasket punches, also in the bottom of the tool<BR>box. Zincs, enough said A dried up tube of that non-hardening gasket<BR>sealant. A 15 inch strap wrench with a 6 inch strap. 19/32 " wrench.<BR>One large bastard file with HP tape on the handle. A glass cutter.<BR>Packing pullers with the end broken off. You had a strap on your strap<BR>wrench? Most of ours were missing the straps! We had a crescent wrench,<BR>but it was too big to put in the tool box. The damn thing was 48" long<BR>and wieghed 40 lbs. It was mounted next to our diesel gageboard. No one<BR>ever new why we had it, but it kind of set the tone that the engineroom<BR>belonged to M-div. I used it once during a repel boarders drill. The<BR>specwar guy who managed to infiltrate the engineroom one night on the<BR>midwatch laughed his butt off when I confronted him with it. During the<BR>critique, it was pointed out that there probably wasn't enough room in<BR>ERLL to swing the damn thing! We also kept a special roll of HP tape<BR>for playing "Bowling for Lower Level Watches." The ERUL watch would<BR>call to ERLL and ask him to come to the aft ladder. From the other end<BR>of the ER, we would bowl the roll of tape just as the first strands of<BR>ERLL watch hair poked out of the hatch. If you put the right spin on<BR>the tape, it would bean the ERLL right between the eyes! Those guys<BR>never learned, we did this to the same guys two or three times a watch!<BR>Then there was the Drill Index that is missing all the small bits in<BR>the front row (lost in the prussian blue), the medium size bits are all<BR>dull, and the large size are all in the index upside down with burrs on<BR>their shanks, except the 1/2" which is in the condensate bay bilge. I<BR>remember that screwdriver. The big yellow screwdriver, with the handle<BR>that someone had used a visegrip (registered trademark) or a pair of<BR>pliers on the handle, raising sharp bits of plastice so that it hurt<BR>when you tried to put some torque on it. Usually remedied by copius<BR>quantities of duct tape."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - from http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/3392/humor.html,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; "The Golden Rivet" Submarine Humor Page<BR><BR>Walt Smith<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3564<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xd04.mx.aol.com (rly-xd04.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.169]) by air-xd04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:58:28 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xd04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:58:00 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id PAA36220;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:57:03 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:56:49 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id PAA36182<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:56:49 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:56:49 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101262056.PAA36182@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3564<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3565</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/26/01 4:08:50 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, January 26 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3565<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Blasters<BR>FASA closes<BR>Re: Penguins...<BR>RE: Historical Example: What's in a ship's locker? (longish)<BR>Re: Vilani Word List?<BR>Re: Vilani Word List?<BR>Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR>Re: Penguins...<BR>Re: Interstellar War Timeline<BR>Re: HG2 Ship Sizes - The correct table at last :-)<BR>re:&nbsp; FASA closes&nbsp; :-&lt;<BR>Re: famous exhibitions<BR>Re: M.D. vs. Guns<BR>RE: <BR>RE: M.D. vs. Guns<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>FASA closes, Matador starts up, "Star Worn" premiers in New Zealand<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 07:59:40 +1100<BR>From: "Katharine Whitchurch" &lt;katts@globalfreeway.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Blasters<BR><BR>&gt; From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Question....<BR>&gt; Long time ago i allowed blasters to be "invented" in the imperium. my<BR>&gt; thoughts at the time is that energy weapons manufactures would try and<BR>find<BR>&gt; a way to negate reflec armor. so after many years of research the<BR>discovered<BR>&gt; blasters.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; my&nbsp; feeling was that blasters where not lasers. they were closer related<BR>to<BR>&gt; a meson gun. they generated and fired a stream of energized particles.<BR>these<BR>&gt; particles upon hitting matter of greater density than atmosphere would<BR>then<BR>&gt; cause a reaction and detonate there by exploding and doing damage that<BR>way.<BR>&gt; this way if a person was wearing reflec they would be for most intents and<BR>&gt; purposes unprotected.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Sounds like a handheld particle accelerator weapon to me.<BR><BR>The most obvious example of this type is the FS Toys and Games 'Barbie's Own<BR>Batteldress Accessory Kit 3a - Barbie's Own Particle Carbine', which some<BR>TMLer will probably repost (*grin*). I dont think FS ever released a bigger<BR>version of it.<BR><BR>The only rules tweak is to say that "light&nbsp; PAWs" may lack a Beam Pointer,<BR>just like light lasers can be built without one.<BR><BR>&gt; because of the particles exploding when hitting matter of a certain<BR>density<BR>&gt; or greater i restricted these weapons use on certain worlds where the<BR>&gt; atmosheric density was to high to allow the weapon to be fired. of course<BR>&gt; the less dense the atmospher the better. In zero g these weapons would<BR>ahve<BR>&gt; no recoil and would blow holes in Refleced vacc suits.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Sounds like a PAW to me. Theres a 'atmosphere attenuation' table in FFS2<BR>that cuts the ranges of PAWs in atmospheres they arent tuned to.<BR><BR>&gt; anyway that was what i did. i did it more to add spice to the game.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; what i want to know is there any scientific bases for this type of weapon?<BR>&gt; or was i just in my youth being to nieve?<BR><BR>I dunno about scientific basis, but there is certainly a basis under FFS2.<BR><BR>Ian Whitchurch<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:16:48 -0600<BR>From: "Lloyd Robinson" &lt;lloyd.robinson@intercept.net&gt;<BR>Subject: FASA closes<BR><BR>There is a group at http://www.ironcrown.org/ that has a good <BR>chance of getting the rights for the ICE product line. They <BR>are getting ready to submit a bid in the next two weeks. Stop<BR>by and see if you can help out.<BR><BR>Lloyd J Robinson Jr<BR>lrobinson@intercept.net<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:42:16<BR>&gt;From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;At 10:41 AM 1/26/2001 +0100, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;Farewell, Freedonian Aerospace Administration.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Indeed.&nbsp; They produced some of the best games in the field.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;GDW, ICE, TSR, and now FASA...&nbsp; Damn.<BR>&gt;- -- <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt;http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:35:47 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Penguins...<BR><BR>"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; At 04:17 AM 1/26/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;All these signs foretell the return of THE GREAT ONE!<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;OPUS!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Heretic!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Chilly Willy is the One True Penguin!<BR><BR>Are you sure?&nbsp; I always thought that Burgess Meredith was the One True<BR>Penguin....<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 13:34:33 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Historical Example: What's in a ship's locker? (longish)<BR><BR>A few additional Notes<BR><BR>Tool Lockers for EMO-2 of the USS. Missouri BB-63 Circa 1985-86<BR>(was lower level Engineroom petty officer.)<BR><BR>1) Multi port air manifold. simular to that mentioned in the list. Nice<BR>little spot where i had a fireman take a file to it to remove the letters<BR>(LBNSY). was lifted from a yard bird in retaliation for some yard bird<BR>lifting my blue coat 8P<BR><BR>2) 1 Pnuematic grinder. see above.<BR><BR>3) both lower level engine room tool lockers were wielded to the deck<BR>plates. This was against regs i believe but paid a yard bird to do it with 3<BR>hamburgers snuck from the galley by one of my guys who was doing KP duty.<BR>Satan would be Shovelling his car out before those BTs Stole my lockers.<BR><BR>4) a few red tags. signed by god knows who. for those times when the E-div<BR>pissed you off. so you took a red tag and locked out the hot water to their<BR>showers. For those who were not in the navy a red tag cant be removed except<BR>by the person who who placed it. (theoretically)<BR><BR>5) 4 MREs. being at quarters during GQ usually ment balogny sandwiches sent<BR>to the personel from the galley. well those MREs are much better than those<BR>sandwiches.<BR><BR>6) small tin cup from a ww2 canteen.<BR><BR>7) a large spoon appropriated from the galley.<BR><BR>8) an heat protective glove. Used with 6 and 7 and a low pressure steam<BR>petcock valve to cook some of the 5's as needed.<BR><BR>9) 50 or 60 grinding wheels. approriated from EMO-4(i hated their chief) or<BR>yard birds as needed.<BR><BR>10) pair of ruined eye protectors<BR><BR>11) a flat file that was broke into two pieces ( was used to pry on<BR>something god knows what 8P)<BR><BR>I know there was more but i cant remember off the top of my head. if i<BR>remember ill pass it along 8P<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Walt Smith [mailto:firelock_ny@hotmail.com]<BR>Sent: Friday, January 26, 2001 12:56 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Historical Example: What's in a ship's locker? (longish)<BR><BR><BR>I was perusing a web site having to do with US Navy submarines,<BR>and encountered this description of tools and equipment from<BR>a submarine.&nbsp; It immediately struck me as a fine example of<BR>the kind of things one would expect to find in the ship's<BR>locker of a long-service Free Trader...<BR><BR>"The following is a list of tools that can probably be found in any M-<BR>div toolbox on any boat. See if you have or remember these (add to to<BR>list!): A wire brush with all the bristles bent back rendering unusable<BR>unless you turn it on its side. Three or more wrench roll sets, missing<BR>the 7/16", 1/2", 9/16", and 3/4" wrenches, but boy do we have a bunch<BR>of 11/16" and 13/16" wrenches available. A socket set missing the same<BR>sizes as mentioned for the wrenches. When a 9/16" socket is found, it<BR>is a 1/2" drive and the only working ratchet is 3/8". Of course, there<BR>is an adapter to go from 1/2" to 3/8", but none vice versa. A wrench<BR>modified by being cut in half, leaving a 2" handle. Wouldn't do any<BR>good anyway, someone used it as a slugging wrench. A ball peen hammer<BR>with a broken handle. If the handle isn't broken, it's cracked and held<BR>together with duct tape. A four pound sledge on a short handle. Used<BR>to "calibrate" them valves. Affectionately call "Thor", "Hey, go hand<BR>me Thor, this handwheel is stuck" A dried up bottle of graphite<BR>suspended in isopropanol (aka Neolube). A tube of prussian blue, with<BR>the crimped end blown open so every tool on the bottom of the toolbox<BR>has a greasy blue coating. Stainless steel pipe caps (FME or foreign<BR>material exclusion covers). Some still have useful Grade "A" stickers<BR>with the QA guys initials on them, covers your butt on those 2 AM<BR>repair jobs when NR comes to visit. Three broken ratchets. Various size<BR>ferrules from those Swagelok fittings we weren't suppose to use. Most<BR>are bent, some are still connected to a cut off piece of tubing with<BR>the hopes that we "may need a 1-1/2" section of tubing with the<BR>ferrules still on it" Special tools that no one seems to know what they<BR>are or how they work. For example, the funky spanner used to take the<BR>bottom of the DeLaval purifier bowl off. The cradle of the SSTG shaft<BR>lifting device, no one knows where the rest of it is. A hacksaw blade<BR>with a big wad of HP tape wrapped around one end as a handle. Had to<BR>use the HP tape, the hacksaw handle is missing the little tabs that<BR>normally hold the blade. A piece of string. A wad of Kimwipes that were<BR>once used in an attempt to clean the prussian blue off the bottom of<BR>the tool box. A few QA 5 tags A primary valve cap vent screw, source<BR>unknown, must have been free released, its been here since I came<BR>aboard! A few slightly crushed primary valve cap O-rings, see previous<BR>comment. Speaking of O-rings, there are a few of them in opened<BR>packages, the cure date was removed when the package was opened. A few<BR>deck plate screws, some are cross-threaded. A roll of RadCon tape. A<BR>light dusting of tri-sodium phosphate from the ELTs weighing chemicals<BR>on the M-div workbench. An impact wrench, brand new, never used because<BR>it won't fit anywhere you need to use it. Pea grinder wrenches, taped<BR>together. A few Yarway steam trap parts, including a steam cut cap. A<BR>FME cover formerly used as a mixing bowl for that messy red lead,<BR>graphite and mineral oil anti-sieze. A pair of lockwire pliers with the<BR>jaws damaged. Lots of little pieces of lockwire. A bunch of swaged<BR>fittings assembled to make a little piping system by the CNTP (Chief of<BR>Naval Tinkering and Puttering) One of those long bladed screwdrivers<BR>that was stolen from the E-div toolbox. The shaft is bent from use as a<BR>pry bar, what the hey, its not ours! Nut drivers, also stolen from E-<BR>div toolbox in revenge for them losing the only functional ratchet. A<BR>1/2" wrench that spent three months between frames 54 and 55 in the<BR>engineroom bilge, corrosion has rendered it useless except for training<BR>on chloride pitting corrosion. A shackle that hasn't been load tested<BR>since the boat was commisioned in 1974 (1956 if you were on my boat) A<BR>large chunk of lead, used to hammel the bejesus out of the gasket<BR>material with those dull gasket punches, also in the bottom of the tool<BR>box. Zincs, enough said A dried up tube of that non-hardening gasket<BR>sealant. A 15 inch strap wrench with a 6 inch strap. 19/32 " wrench.<BR>One large bastard file with HP tape on the handle. A glass cutter.<BR>Packing pullers with the end broken off. You had a strap on your strap<BR>wrench? Most of ours were missing the straps! We had a crescent wrench,<BR>but it was too big to put in the tool box. The damn thing was 48" long<BR>and wieghed 40 lbs. It was mounted next to our diesel gageboard. No one<BR>ever new why we had it, but it kind of set the tone that the engineroom<BR>belonged to M-div. I used it once during a repel boarders drill. The<BR>specwar guy who managed to infiltrate the engineroom one night on the<BR>midwatch laughed his butt off when I confronted him with it. During the<BR>critique, it was pointed out that there probably wasn't enough room in<BR>ERLL to swing the damn thing! We also kept a special roll of HP tape<BR>for playing "Bowling for Lower Level Watches." The ERUL watch would<BR>call to ERLL and ask him to come to the aft ladder. From the other end<BR>of the ER, we would bowl the roll of tape just as the first strands of<BR>ERLL watch hair poked out of the hatch. If you put the right spin on<BR>the tape, it would bean the ERLL right between the eyes! Those guys<BR>never learned, we did this to the same guys two or three times a watch!<BR>Then there was the Drill Index that is missing all the small bits in<BR>the front row (lost in the prussian blue), the medium size bits are all<BR>dull, and the large size are all in the index upside down with burrs on<BR>their shanks, except the 1/2" which is in the condensate bay bilge. I<BR>remember that screwdriver. The big yellow screwdriver, with the handle<BR>that someone had used a visegrip (registered trademark) or a pair of<BR>pliers on the handle, raising sharp bits of plastice so that it hurt<BR>when you tried to put some torque on it. Usually remedied by copius<BR>quantities of duct tape."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - from http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/3392/humor.html,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; "The Golden Rivet" Submarine Humor Page<BR><BR>Walt Smith<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 16:37:16 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>At 7:42 PM -0500 1/25/01, Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Side question, for Kenji: Why does it seem that the 'standard' 'sample<BR>&gt;texts' are always North Wind and Sun, and the Babel story from Genesis?<BR><BR>It's just an old tradition on the CONLANG mailing list.&nbsp; Might have <BR>changed, actually; I haven't been subscribed for most of two years <BR>now.&nbsp; It lets people compare each other's constructed and auxiliary <BR>languages in a pretty concise and "applied" way, in addition to the <BR>grammars they write.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 16:42:15 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>At 10:13 AM +0000 1/26/01, Rob Day wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;Yes and no.&nbsp; Kenji has been cleaning up one that the Traveller-Culture list<BR>&gt;&gt;worked up a while back - and boy did it need cleaning - but the results<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I must have missed something - are you (Kenji) changing the file that's<BR>&gt;currently on the egroups site?<BR><BR>Oh yeah.&nbsp; The one I posted was a small fraction of what's in the <BR>total glossary; the older Excel sheet is basically a data dump, with <BR>emphasis on "dump" ;).&nbsp; Consider yourself added to the recipient list <BR>for the pretty, new, still woefully incomplete and sloppy glossary :)<BR><BR>Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 21:43:05 -0000<BR>From: "Mark S Peace" &lt;mark.s.peace@dunelm.org.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR><BR>&gt; What is the date for that issue? I must have issed<BR>&gt; that when it went by...<BR><BR>You might not have got it yet - No 2275 (27th Jan 2001).<BR><BR>&gt; - --- Mark S Peace &lt;mark.s.peace@dunelm.org.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 22:41:29 -0600<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; From: "D. Smart" &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Subject: We Have Met The Zhos..And They Are Us!<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; The New Scientist site has posted an interesting<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; story about the discovery of "mind-reading" cells<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; existing in every human being.<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Even more interesting in an article in the magazine<BR>&gt; &gt; about habitable planets<BR>&gt; &gt; around red dwarf stars.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 09:03:09 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Penguins...<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; A Linux game called "Penguin Command" just came across the Fidonet file<BR>&gt; distribution network. It claims to be based on the old Missile Command<BR>&gt; game. :-)<BR><BR>... and no doubt *everyone* has had endless hours playing "tuxracer",<BR>like I have.&nbsp; I mean, the game is perfect -- what's not to like about<BR>playing a penguin sliding down an icy and snowy mountain slope on his<BR>belly, trying to get herring on the way to the finish line?&nbsp; Flicking<BR>out a flipper to speed up or slow down as you rocket through icy<BR>canyons, dodging trees, rocks, and gravel patches, and launching from<BR>ice ramps to fly through the air as penguins were always meant to!<BR><BR>http://www.tuxracer.com/<BR><BR>OK, so it's not entirely finished and there's no opponents yet.&nbsp; But<BR>it's free, and it's fun!<BR><BR>Ahem.&nbsp; Back to your regularly scheduled discussion.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 11:12:19 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Interstellar War Timeline<BR><BR>On 26 Jan 01, at 8:02, Gerry Harris wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Of course, other people may have other ideas.&nbsp; I'd love to hear them.<BR><BR>I've done some work on the Interstellar Wars era. Its online at downport.<BR><BR>http://www.downport.com/amv/<BR><BR>You can also find a lot in GT Rim of Fire<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 22:57:39 -0000<BR>From: "Matthew Bond" &lt;mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: HG2 Ship Sizes - The correct table at last :-)<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Gerry Harris" &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Friday, January 26, 2001 5:27 PM<BR>Subject: Re: HG2 Ship Sizes - The correct table at last :-)<BR><BR><BR>But the next hull size up is Q, which is 75,000 tons...<BR>Maybe, once again, I'm not grasping the problem correctly.&nbsp; It's this<BR>lousy head cold and all those lovely pills I've been popping.<BR><BR>It was bad enough to know I've been doing it all wrong since Christmas<BR>1981 (when I first started playing); it sucks to know I still cannot<BR>get it right.<BR>- ---------------------<BR><BR>Well I've been playing since about the same time, and it appears I had<BR>misunderstood it as well :)<BR><BR>Basically, the computer table on p.26 of HG doesn't show the *largest*<BR>size class that a given computer can control, but rather the *smallest*<BR>size code that *requires* a computer *at least that powerful*...<BR><BR>So Size code R (100,000 - 199,000 dtons) is the smallest size ship that<BR>*requires* a TL12 computer. Therefore, a TL11 computer can control any<BR>ship up to 99,999 dtons, and this is therefore the largest TL11 hull<BR>that can be built.<BR><BR>Once you grasp the wording on p.28 it all falls into place...<BR><BR>Matt<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 17:55:50 -0500<BR>From: Laning &lt;laning@wizard.net&gt;<BR>Subject: re:&nbsp; FASA closes&nbsp; :-&lt;<BR><BR>Hail, hail, Freedonia.<BR>Hail, hail, hail.<BR><BR>- --Laning (clutching his Freedonian Consumer's Guide close to his chest and<BR>brushing at a tear in the corner of his eye)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 18:00:40 -0500<BR>From: Laning &lt;laning@wizard.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: famous exhibitions<BR><BR>Heh, I see your point, Doug.&nbsp; But, that would be The Doors' Jim Morrison.<BR>Ray Manzarek and Co. to this day claim he was wrongly convicted and it was<BR>all a product of fevered imaginations and hostile cops.&nbsp; For fans out<BR>there, a couple of months ago The Doors discovered something like 15 or 20<BR>never-previously-released songs that they plan to dribble out over the next<BR>couple of years.&nbsp; Not exactly The Dead's vault, but it's more than we had.<BR><BR>- --Laning (who will always have a soft spot for Jim Morrison and The Doors)<BR><BR>At 03:56 PM 1/26/01 , Doug Berry wrote:<BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:43:33<BR>&gt;From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;At 04:33 PM 1/25/2001 -0600, you wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Bruce, famous Exhibitionists for 500. This 60's music group's lead<BR>&gt;&gt;singer couldn't keep his pants on.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Umm.. who are all of them?&nbsp; :P<BR>&gt;- -- <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:07:56 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: M.D. vs. Guns<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;&gt;Number of accidental gun deaths per year (all age groups) =1500<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I believe it's the 12,000 or so non-accidental gun deaths (USA, 1997)that <BR>&gt;concern most.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What does this have to do with Traveller?<BR><BR>&nbsp; The _correct_ question is "What does this have to do with the TML?"<BR><BR>&nbsp; A: It's time for our first 2001 TML gun control flamewar!<BR><BR>&nbsp; But this time, the penguins are ready...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 18:13:03 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: <BR><BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; who<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Who wrote "M-m-m-m-m-myyyygeneration..."?<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; end<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Who are the Doors?<BR>&gt;&gt; I'll take strange queries for 500, Alex!<BR><BR>&gt;Um, Bruce...that would be Who are the Who? &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Nope. It wouldn't be. The Doors wrote "The End", not the Who (although<BR>perhaps "The Who" wrote a song called "The End" which I'm unaware of), and I<BR>think that was the thrust of Bruce's joke. They're two separate answers and<BR>two separate questions (in Jeopardy format). Although I don't want to<BR>attempt to read Bruce's mind, it seemed he was going for something like<BR>this:<BR><BR>Alex Trebec: Who<BR>Bruce: Who wrote "M-m-m-m-myyyygeneration..."?<BR><BR>Alex: End<BR>Bruce: Who are the Doors?<BR><BR>(If you're unfamiliar with Jeopardy, it's a gameshow on which the host gives<BR>you the answers, and the player must come up with the appropriate question).<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:19:33 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: M.D. vs. Guns<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; A: It's time for our first 2001 TML gun control flamewar!<BR><BR><BR>Please, let's not.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>.<BR>We haven't hidden all the bodies from the last round yet ;)<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; But this time, the penguins are ready...<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>LOL!!!<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 23:27:26 -0000<BR>From: "Matthew Bond" &lt;mgb@akira.swinternet.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Weltschpfungsingenieuren!*<BR><BR>I'm now going to frighten all of you.<BR><BR>How many spoken syllables is that, and an example of what it would rhyme<BR>with, please?<BR><BR>:)<BR>- --<BR><BR>7 syllables<BR><BR>As for the rest, you are on your own you crazy foo'<BR><BR>Matt<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 18:52:07 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>Matt Bond wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" <BR><BR>&gt;Weltschpfungsingenieuren!*<BR><BR>I'm now going to frighten all of you.<BR><BR>How many spoken syllables is that, and an example of what it would rhyme<BR>with, please?<BR><BR>:)<BR>- --<BR><BR>&gt;7 syllables<BR><BR>&gt;As for the rest, you are on your own you crazy foo'<BR><BR>&gt;Matt<BR><BR>How about 'I'll stop to fling my urine'?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 13:07:19 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: FASA closes, Matador starts up, "Star Worn" premiers in New Zealand<BR><BR>I also mourn the loss of FASA<BR><BR>Who remembers the original Star Trek RPG ?<BR>Or the great ST Combat Simulator that came with it ?<BR><BR>Or the "Renegade Legion" series, including "Centurion" (the source of all my<BR>grav tank models), "Interceptor", "Leviathan" and "Prefect" ?<BR><BR>Which, when combined, provide the absolute best simulation of a complete<BR>spacebourne assault, from gaining spatial superiority, to taking<BR>close-orbit, to landing and reducing planet-bound resistamce, available<BR>today.<BR><BR>But, I suspect FASA could easily have kept going, and that the owners have<BR>just decided to call it a day and live off their profits from licensing<BR>BattleTech and Crimson Skies to Microsoft.<BR><BR>And at the same time, little companies are starting up with great games,<BR>such as a couple of freinds of mine, Matt &amp; Debbie Cowens, at Matador Games<BR>(http://www.matador.co.nz/games.html).<BR>"Cow" is the fastest and one of the most fun card games I've ever played.<BR><BR>Sorry for the blatant advertising, but this couple are just starting out in<BR>the publishing biz, and their first publications are pure genius. They could<BR>go a long way with a bit of help.<BR><BR>They are also damn good roleplayers, Debbbie won one of the LARP prizes at<BR>last weekends KapCon for her wonderful portrayal of a bright &amp; happy<BR>born-again christian, as she became a brain-eating zombie in the Apocalypse<BR>Team's lastest masterpiece "Breakout Day", subtitled "The Call-Centre of<BR>Cthulu".<BR><BR>Just to blow my own trumpet a bit, I won "Best Fantasy Storyteller" for my<BR>"Return to the 100 Aker Wood" freeform.<BR><BR>And to bring this diversion all back round to Traveller again, I ran BITS<BR>"Star Worn" as well, and much fun was had by all. The effect of those coca<BR>leaves the Ewok's had on the stormtroopers was very, ah, interesting.<BR><BR>And Daft Vader joined the Rebels, because old Uncle Nobi managed to convince<BR>Lukie to donate one of his silver lame jackets to Daft, so he no longer had<BR>to put up with pure black.<BR><BR>Morgue played Handy Solo as if he was the star of "Men Behaving Badly", so<BR>Princess Layme (pronounced "Lah - y' - meh", according to the Princess)<BR>found no real men, and begun to serious consider Daft as the best of a bad<BR>lot.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 18:02:41 -0600<BR>From: Charles McKnight &lt;cmcknight01@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>7 syllables, I think.<BR><BR>Velt-shop-foong-sing-e-nyoo-ren, or something like <BR>that.&nbsp; Maybe.&nbsp; Fahrvenugen!!!!! fnord<BR><BR>At 08:54 AM 1/26/01 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;At 09:31 PM 1/25/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Weltschpfungsingenieuren!*<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I'm now going to frighten all of you.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;How many spoken syllables is that, and an example of what it would rhyme<BR>&gt;with, please?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;:)<BR>&gt;--<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Douglas E. Berry&nbsp;&nbsp; Templar Agent at Large.<BR>&gt;gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt;http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;TravGeekCode:<BR>&gt;tc+ tm+ !tn- t4@ ?tg+ tt@ to(CORPS)++ ru@ $ge++ 3i<BR>&gt;ii+ au st+ ls+ pi kk+ so(++) va++ dr+ zh+ sw++ ?da<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:06:47 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;These two conditions are incompatible. <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;If a world has enough fluorine for SF6 to be a normal atmospheric<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;component, that won't *be* any oxygen compounds (such as <BR>&gt;&gt;silicates) in<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;the crust. You'd have silicon fluoride, with oxygen fluoride as an<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;atmospheric component.<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; I'm not to worried about oxygen being present. DOn't need any.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;But you need oxygen *compounds*. :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; OK, I'm obviously being a bit thick...What for? I don't really need<BR>&gt; silicates...silica itself would do. <BR><BR>Silicia *is* an oxygen compound. SiO2. <BR><BR>And free silicon just plain *won't* happen in the presences of<BR>noticable amounts of fluorine.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Thanks, Leonard...I was thinking of you in particular when I <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; asked for input on this.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Oh god! I'm a *resource* to be *exploited*! Oh the shame!<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;:-)<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; We start strip mining as soon as we get rid of those pesky protestors!<BR>&gt; Mua-ha-ha-ha!<BR><BR>I have no objections to being stripped, preferably by lovely ladies.<BR>Mining? What's that, some new kink? &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3565<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yh04.mx.aol.com (rly-yh04.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.36]) by air-yh04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:08:50 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yh04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:08:25 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id TAA44085;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:06:14 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:05:52 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id TAA44038<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:05:52 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:05:52 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101270005.TAA44038@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3565<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3566</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/27/01 9:01:20 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Saturday, January 27 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3566<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>re: HG2 Ship Sizes - The correct table at last :-)<BR>FFE004<BR>Re: Cargonaut (and also DGP (attn: Rodge))<BR>More FF&amp;S Weapons Testing ?<BR>Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR>Re: Question on Jump<BR>Build your own fusion reactor<BR>Judges Guild online (was Re: Cargonaut)<BR>Re: M.D.&nbsp; vs. Guns<BR>Re:<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Penguins...<BR>Re: Vilani Word List?<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re : M.D. vs. guns<BR>re: FASA closes, Matador starts up...<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>RE: Judges Guild online (was Re: Cargonaut)<BR>Challenger Anniversary<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Question on Jump<BR>RE: Using Light For storage<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 16:12:35 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: re: HG2 Ship Sizes - The correct table at last :-)<BR><BR>&gt;From: Matt Bond &lt;MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: HG2 Ship Sizes - The correct table at last <BR>...<BR>&gt;Doh! Oh well, only been doing it wrong for 19 years :) <BR><BR>&nbsp; Ha! My last (?) HG2 error was discovered this month, and<BR>was only propagated for 17 years. I must be a fast learner!<BR><BR>&gt;So the table should actually read:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;TL5-6&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 999 dtons<BR>&gt;TL7-8&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 3999 dtons<BR>&gt;TL9&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 9999 dtons<BR>&gt;TL10&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 49,999 dtons<BR>&gt;TL11&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 99,999 dtons<BR>&gt;TL12&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 999,999 dtons<BR>&gt;TL13&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; infinite... (1,000,000+ dtons)<BR><BR>&nbsp; Yes; note also that the target size hit DM's don't match up, so<BR>there aren't any "natural" sizes to build ships at; the designers<BR>budget and mission drive the process, not rules break-points.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Steven Hudson<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 00:10:03 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: FFE004<BR><BR>"According to Marc Miller, the latest Classic Traveller reprint, The Short<BR>Adventures is currently at the printer, and should begin shipping in about<BR>two weeks."<BR><BR>Posted this evening by "Hunter" at http://www.rpgrealms.com<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 21:03:31 -0500<BR>From: "Robert A. Smith II" &lt;rsmith@rasinsurance.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Cargonaut (and also DGP (attn: Rodge))<BR><BR>&gt; Tee-Hee, I am a happy camper ;-) (One that loves E-Bay)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Last week I bid on the complete "Lost Traveller" Collection and today,<BR>&gt; a large package arrived. Paul, if you are still around, thanks a lot,<BR>&gt; you did an excellent job. I have not started reading it yet, but the<BR>&gt; books look excellent. I got Rogues in Space twice now, but that<BR>&gt; doesnt matter, as they are both different editions, and I am, as RS<BR>&gt; called it, Traveller insane ;-)<BR><BR>E-Bay is our friend! :)<BR><BR>My in-laws (with my wife's help) got the Lost Traveller Collection off E-bay<BR>and gave it to me for Xmas.<BR>I can't wait to unleash the Rogues on my players. &lt;eg&gt;<BR><BR>Angus<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 15:22:32 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: More FF&amp;S Weapons Testing ?<BR><BR>For those that don't regulalrly go to the Daily Illuminator <BR>(http://www.sjgames.com/ill/)<BR>have a look at this automatic vampire slaying machine <BR>(two stakes a minute, can penetrate 1/8" steel plate) :<BR><BR>http://www.srl.org/machines/pitching/index.html<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 18:20:56 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Bernie McGeehan &lt;einreb62@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR><BR>You're right...got the January 20th issue today<BR>(friday 1/26).<BR>- --- Mark S Peace &lt;mark.s.peace@dunelm.org.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; What is the date for that issue? I must have issed<BR>&gt; &gt; that when it went by...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; You might not have got it yet - No 2275 (27th Jan<BR>&gt; 2001).<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; - --- Mark S Peace &lt;mark.s.peace@dunelm.org.uk&gt;<BR>&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 22:41:29 -0600<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; From: "D. Smart" &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; Subject: We Have Met The Zhos..And They Are<BR>&gt; Us!<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; The New Scientist site has posted an<BR>&gt; interesting<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; story about the discovery of "mind-reading"<BR>&gt; cells<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt; existing in every human being.<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Even more interesting in an article in the<BR>&gt; magazine<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; about habitable planets<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; around red dwarf stars.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>"I don't know much about what I like, but I do know Art."&nbsp; &nbsp; me @ the Rijksmuseum, Amsterdam (Terra/Sol 3)http://prattfall.tripod.com/index.html<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 22:15:35 EST<BR>From: Damage169@cs.com<BR>Subject: Re: Question on Jump<BR><BR>Anthony Jackson writes:<BR><BR>&gt; William Lane writes:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; I have always been under the understanding that if a Jump 2 ship jumps 2<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; par secs it took a week in time. and that a jump 6 ship could do a 2<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; parsec jump in say a 3rd of a week. is this true? or is this wrong?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; It's wrong.&nbsp; All jumps take a week.<BR><BR>Another question: Do all jumps take the same amount of fuel? Does a Jump 4 <BR>engine use the same amount of fuel to jump 2 parsecs as it uses to jump 4 <BR>parsecs? Or is the fuel usage based on distance? I know I used to know the <BR>answer to this, but I can't for the life of me remember the answer OR find me <BR>LBBs.<BR><BR>Doug Grimes<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 20:20:04 -0800<BR>From: Leonard Erickson &lt;shadow@krypton.rain.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Build your own fusion reactor<BR><BR>I though folks would be interested in this post from<BR>rec.arts.sf.science. Especially in the URLs for *working* reactors that<BR>fit on a tabletop. They may not produce more power than they use, but<BR>they really *do* fuse atoms!<BR><BR>Maybe Traveller Fusion reactors work like this, but with some extra<BR>tricks using CG fields or the like?<BR><BR>Charles R Martin wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This _may_ be a frequently asked question, in which case be gentle,<BR>&gt; but as I pondered my electric rockets and the world in which they<BR>&gt; would be embedded -- and as I listened to the news from California --<BR>&gt; I got wondering about the _other_ effect inertial-electrostatic<BR>&gt; confinement would have on life, the universe and everything.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; SO ehre's the question: what would the effects be of _really_ cheap<BR>&gt; power?&nbsp; For definiteness assume 3.0e-8 dollars per kWh (computed<BR>&gt; below.)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Thanks for all thoughts.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Charlie<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Computation of projected cost<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Let's set up a few parameters.&nbsp; These IEC fusors that Bussard has laid<BR>&gt; out are basically big spherical vacuum containers [1] with a very<BR>&gt; little bit of wire and ceramics on the inside to establish the<BR>&gt; electrostatic fields, some way of introducing ions of whatever fuels<BR>&gt; you're using, and some way to get power out of them.&nbsp; Bussard has<BR>&gt; estimated that a 5-meter fusor using proton-11Boron fusion could<BR>&gt; produce 10 gigawatts as roughly 6500 amps at 1.5 megavolts DC.&nbsp; We'll<BR>&gt; use this as our example reactor.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The pressure vessel and all are amazingly cheap: I did some back of<BR>&gt; envelope numbers and got about $250K to fabricate the whole thing,<BR>&gt; vacuum pumps and all.&nbsp; Of course, if I knew how to _really_ build one<BR>&gt; I'd be too busy to post, so let's be real generous and assume that it<BR>&gt; costs ten times that, $2.5 million.&nbsp; It takes another 20 technicians<BR>&gt; to run and maintain the thing (exclusive of the people running the<BR>&gt; electric power grid, just the reactor technicians) which is somethig<BR>&gt; like another $2 million per year loaded (ie, including overhead and<BR>&gt; benefits.)&nbsp;&nbsp; Building and plant, let's just SWAG in another $10<BR>&gt; million.&nbsp; (Among other things, the most efficient way I can think of<BR>&gt; to turn 6500 amps @ 1.5MV DC into line current is by running a great<BR>&gt; big motor-alternator set, and that isn't going to be cheap.)&nbsp; We'll<BR>&gt; also assume just 25 percent efficiency, so the real power output is<BR>&gt; 2.5 gigawatts.&nbsp; We'll assume that building and powerplant then are<BR>&gt; depreciated to no recovery value in 10 years, straight-line, and get a<BR>&gt; total annual cost of $3.25 million per year. 2.5 gigawatts gives about<BR>&gt; 22,000 gigawatt-hours per year, so total cost per kWh is in the close<BR>&gt; neighborhood of 1.5e-8 dollars per kWh. (!!)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; [1] _American Scientist_ has a nice article, including some<BR>&gt; pictures of desktop fusors, at:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://www.sigmaxi.org/amsci/issues/Sciobs99/sciobs99-07fusion.html<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; There is a copy of an _Analog_ article on building a deskto fusor at:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://fus.x0r.com/theory.html<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; "Never laugh at live dragons." -- Baggins<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Charlie Martin, Broomfield, CO USA 40 N 105 W<BR><BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 05:05:04 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Judges Guild online (was Re: Cargonaut)<BR><BR>on 27/1/01 2:03 am, Robert A. Smith II at rsmith@rasinsurance.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; E-Bay is our friend! :)<BR><BR>Sure can be. I just bought everything Traveller from Judges Guild with the<BR>exception of Starships and Spacecraft and Glimmerdrift Reaches from there<BR>for about $80 - 19 books and a couple of doubles.<BR><BR>I picked up Glimmerdrift Reaches direct from Judges Guild for $9. So now I<BR>just need Starships and Spacecraft for a complete collection. Fortunately I<BR>know where to get it cheaply.<BR><BR>If anybody is interested, there's quite a few old stock Traveller items at<BR>the new JG online store:<BR><BR>Judges Guild (www.rpgrealms.com/www.judgesguild.com):<BR><BR>Crucis Margin (6) $9.00<BR>Fifty Starbases (9) $9.00<BR>Glimmerdrift Reaches (8) $9.00<BR>Ley Sector (7) $9.00<BR>Maranantha-Alkahest Sector (6) $9.00<BR><BR>Navigator's Starcharts (8) $9.00<BR><BR>Corsairs of the Turku Waste (36) $6.00<BR>Darkling Ship (292) $6.00<BR>Doom of the Singing Star (8) $12.00<BR>Dra'k'ne Station (7) $5.00<BR>Rogue Moon of Spinstorme (31) $6.00<BR>WaspWinter (21) $6.00<BR><BR>The numbers in brackets are the number of copies left in stock.<BR><BR>Judges Guild have just released their first 'new' publication, a revised<BR>version of their AD&amp;D classic "City Sate of the Invincible Overlord". I<BR>played a campaign based on the original when it first came out. Our D&amp;D DM<BR>had more money than this Traveller GM while at school, so I never had the<BR>Traveller stuff from them. I soon will. :)<BR><BR>Traveller die-hard collectors note: there is a new copy of Classic Traveller<BR>books 1-3 in a single volume available as a part of the Traveller edition of<BR>GRIP. New art on the cover, but only currently available as part of the $55<BR>GRIP Traveller edition. It does say $12 on the page, so maybe they will sell<BR>it separately once they've shipped a few copies of GRIP. After all, if they<BR>don't, they will be penalising folk who already bought GRIP Traveller.<BR><BR>Now the buying spree is over, I think I'll get some sleep... yawn.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 18:15:35 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: M.D.&nbsp; vs. Guns<BR><BR>On 26 Jan 01, at 13:10, Thom Harris wrote:<BR><BR>Move along citizen, nothing to see here.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 23:38:54 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re:<BR><BR>On 01/26/01 at 09:32 AM,&nbsp; Kiri Aradia Morgan &lt;tiamat@tsoft.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;On Fri, 26 Jan 2001, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; At 04:33 PM 1/25/2001 -0600, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;Bruce, famous Exhibitionists for 500. This 60's music group's lead<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;singer couldn't keep his pants on.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Umm.. who are all of them?&nbsp; :P<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;Bzzt!<BR><BR>&gt;Who are the Doors?<BR><BR>You win!&nbsp; However, Doug's question was funnier. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Morrison distinguished himself by not being able to keep them on<BR>&gt;when he was on stage, instead of just backstage.<BR><BR>LOL!<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 22:56:59<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>At 08:17 PM 1/26/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;In-Reply-To: &lt;3.0.5.16.20010126084821.4647e96a@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Greetings dear hearts.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Nobody gave me an essay assignment when I joined the list...<BR><BR>Curses!&nbsp; Well, that is easily fixed..<BR><BR>Discuss:&nbsp; The effects on the Third Imperium of a looser economic policy,<BR>from allowing competing regional currencies to reduced border controls.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 23:02:15<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Penguins...<BR><BR>At 09:03 AM 1/27/2001 +1100, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;... and no doubt *everyone* has had endless hours playing "tuxracer",<BR>&gt;like I have.&nbsp; I mean, the game is perfect -- what's not to like about<BR>&gt;playing a penguin sliding down an icy and snowy mountain slope on his<BR>&gt;belly, trying to get herring on the way to the finish line?&nbsp; Flicking<BR>&gt;out a flipper to speed up or slow down as you rocket through icy<BR>&gt;canyons, dodging trees, rocks, and gravel patches, and launching from<BR>&gt;ice ramps to fly through the air as penguins were always meant to!<BR><BR>Reason #372 to get Linux.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 02:25:10 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>On Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:05:52 -0500 (EST), Kenji Schwarz<BR>&lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;At 10:13 AM +0000 1/26/01, Rob Day wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &gt;Yes and no.&nbsp; Kenji has been cleaning up one that the Traveller-Culture list<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;worked up a while back - and boy did it need cleaning - but the results<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;I must have missed something - are you (Kenji) changing the file that's<BR>&gt;&gt;currently on the egroups site?<BR><BR>&gt;Oh yeah.&nbsp; The one I posted was a small fraction of what's in the <BR>&gt;total glossary; the older Excel sheet is basically a data dump, with <BR>&gt;emphasis on "dump" ;).&nbsp; Consider yourself added to the recipient list <BR>&gt;for the pretty, new, still woefully incomplete and sloppy glossary :)<BR><BR>Kenji, do please remember to get a copy either to me or uploaded to the<BR>list's shared file area - which is about to become a Yahoo!-style<BR>"briefcase" or some such; they're starting to make the merger changes...<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 09:29:30 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>On Fri, 26 Jan 2001, Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR>&gt; on 26/1/01 2:45 pm, Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm at jenry023@student.liu.se<BR>&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; This is sad. I have enjoyed Shadowrun and, more rarely, Battletech. What<BR>&gt; &gt; is even more disturbing is that this is not an isolated event. About two<BR>&gt; &gt; months ago, Iron Crown Enterprices went bankrupt. Just a short while<BR>&gt; &gt; ago, Hasbro fired a bunch of gaming personell.<BR>&gt; Shadowrun, Battletech and Ral Partha lines are being taken up by Wizkids,<BR>&gt; best known for their Mageknight line. That's the good news.<BR><BR>Isn't Earthdawn currently being done by some firm? I think I remember<BR>hearing that a while ago. (Sorry, I can't bring myself to seek any<BR>information on the current Web with Lynx...)<BR><BR>And yes, it is sad that FASA went bankrupt. I have enjoyed Shadowrun for<BR>all its being, that is, for ten years. (I don't like the system, but the<BR>world and supplements are great). Let's hope Wizkids do a good job.<BR><BR>[snip] <BR>&gt; &gt; Thankfully, SJGames seem healthy enough. White Wolf is prospering. TSR<BR>&gt; &gt; is by no means dead. The hobby remains, but some om the more well-known<BR>&gt; &gt; and lasting companies close down.<BR><BR>I think Columbia Games is also somewhat stable, even with their abysmal<BR>schedule - there are quite a few people who buy everything with<BR>"Harn"-label on it (myself almost included). <BR><BR>&lt;shameless ad&gt;<BR>The new High Colonies process has lurched a bit forwards. The estimated<BR>date is in the beginning of 2002...<BR><BR>The main author said that although Traveller is the hardest hard-sf game<BR>to date, the HC will be harder. B-) <BR>&lt;/shameless ad&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 19:46:25 +1100<BR>From: "Robert O'Connor" &lt;robocon@ozemail.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re : M.D. vs. guns<BR><BR>Thom Harris wrote :-<BR>&gt; Therefore, doctors are approximately 9,000 times more dangerous than gun<BR>&gt; owners.<BR><BR>A medico would attempt to treat far more people in a year than the<BR>average gun owner would handle their weapons.<BR><BR>Suppose we assume a *very conservative* average of 100 patients per<BR>week.<BR><BR>700,000 X 52 X 100 = 3.64 X 10^9 episodes of care/year<BR>accidental deaths 120,000/year<BR>risk = (1.2 X 10^5)/(3.64 X 10^9) = ~3.3 X 10^(-5)<BR><BR>So doctors are still twice as dangerous as gun owners?<BR>The homicide rate in the U.S. is 14/100,000 i.e. a risk of 1.4 X<BR>10^(-4).<BR>Most of these are gun related, so guns are still about five times as<BR>risky as doctors ; numbers can be bent pretty easily, eh?<BR><BR>Lies, damn lies and statistics.<BR><BR>The Harvard study that provides the basis for the Health and Human<BR>Services number has been criticised for methodological problems ; but<BR>the problem is real (if somewhat exaggerated), and at least we're trying<BR>to do something about it as a profession.<BR><BR>Some other illustrative risks :-<BR>Chance of dying during coronary angiogram : 0.1-1%<BR>Chance of dying from general anaesthetic : 1/25,000 (U.S.) to 1/50,000<BR>(Australia)<BR>Chance of dying in motor vehicle accident : 1/10,000 (OECD)<BR><BR>Number needed to treat to prevent one death from :-<BR>hypertension (antihypertensives) : 500<BR>hyperlipidaemia (cholesterol lowering drugs) : 1200<BR>acute myocardial infarction (emergency thrombolysis/angioplasty) : 50000<BR><BR>Ob Trav : Life is risky. Even in the 3I, nothing runs perfectly.<BR><BR><BR>Robert O'Connor<BR>Medico, Gamer<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 00:43:17 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: re: FASA closes, Matador starts up...<BR><BR>&gt;From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: FASA closes, Matador starts up, "Star Worn" premiers in New Zealand<BR>...<BR>&gt;And at the same time, little companies are starting up with great games,<BR>&gt;such as a couple of freinds of mine, Matt &amp; Debbie Cowens, at Matador Games<BR>&gt; http://www.matador.co.nz/games.html<BR>&gt;"Cow" is the fastest and one of the most fun card games I've ever played.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Sorry for the blatant advertising, but this couple are just starting out in<BR>&gt;the publishing biz, and their first publications are pure genius. They could<BR>&gt;go a long way with a bit of help.<BR><BR>&nbsp; So how do people in the poor benighted wilds of North America<BR>get these? (/blatant hint/)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 00:57:11 -0800<BR>From: Evyn MacDude &lt;wmacdude@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 04:53 PM 1/25/2001 -0600, you wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Hey!&nbsp; How come he gets a gearhead question!&nbsp; Why didn't I get a gearhead<BR>&gt; &gt;question?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Too easy.&nbsp; You'd have enjoyed that.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Me?&nbsp; I got "describe the effects on the Traveller universe if the Ancients<BR>&gt; uplifted flightless Antarctic seafowl, rather than wolves, as assistants."<BR><BR>Mine was to describe the ritual Funeral Meals of the uplands Vilaini.<BR><BR>- --<BR>Evyn<BR><BR>The theme of the whole thing is clear. We have to be careful with wisdom. We<BR>have to make certain we're ready for it when it comes knocking on our door.<BR>Knowledge isn't always a blessing;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; sometimes, it's damnation.<BR>Play Dirty: Let's All Go to the Movies!, by John Wick<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 10:53 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;3.0.5.16.20010126225659.351febfe@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry said "Discuss:&nbsp; The effects on the Third Imperium of a <BR>looser economic policy, from allowing competing regional currencies to <BR>reduced border controls."<BR><BR>And my strange mind actually started to formulate an answer..... :-)<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 22:16:50 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>Megan Robertson wrote:<BR>&gt; Douglas E. Berry said "Discuss:&nbsp; The effects on the Third Imperium of a <BR>&gt; looser economic policy, from allowing competing regional currencies to <BR>&gt; reduced border controls."<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; And my strange mind actually started to formulate an answer..... :-)<BR><BR>So did mine, and it isn't even my question :-)<BR><BR>I didn't get an essay topic when I signed on either, but I probably<BR>don't rate one since this latest burst of posts is the third time I've<BR>signed onto the TML: I'm not really new here.&nbsp; It's nice to have my<BR>own mailserver so I can keep up with the posts now.&nbsp; The last time I<BR>was signed on (a few years ago) my university email account got frozen<BR>after a few weeks of not reading it :-)<BR><BR>ObTrav: Imagine a glut of mailing-list posts accumulating from 11,000<BR>worlds, arriving in one big batch from the latest Xboat :)<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 11:23:32 -0000<BR>From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Judges Guild online (was Re: Cargonaut)<BR><BR>&lt;snip ebay&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I picked up Glimmerdrift Reaches direct from Judges Guild for <BR>&gt;$9. So now I<BR>&gt;just need Starships and Spacecraft for a complete collection. <BR>&gt;Fortunately I<BR>&gt;know where to get it cheaply.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;If anybody is interested, there's quite a few old stock <BR>&gt;Traveller items at<BR>&gt;the new JG online store:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Judges Guild (www.rpgrealms.com/www.judgesguild.com):<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Thanks, Gordon. For those interested,&nbsp; the stock of sector books has just<BR>been reduced by one each :). Hmmm (consults huge map on wall) where's<BR>Maranantha-Alkahest?<BR><BR>Dean<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 05:00:41 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Challenger Anniversary<BR><BR>It's been 15 years to the day since the Challenger disaster.<BR><BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 08:41:57 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>&gt;Douglas E. Berry said "Discuss:&nbsp; The effects on the Third Imperium of a<BR>&gt;looser economic policy, from allowing competing regional currencies to<BR>&gt;reduced border controls."<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;And my strange mind actually started to formulate an answer..... :-)<BR><BR>Then I must be strange too, 'coz I'd actually be interested in hearing that <BR>answer.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 14:06:47 GMT<BR>From: TML@stempest.demon.co.uk (Stephen Tempest)<BR>Subject: Re: Question on Jump<BR><BR>Damage169@cs.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt;Another question: Do all jumps take the same amount of fuel? <BR><BR>If using CT:<BR><BR>Book 2, page 6:&nbsp; all jumps take the same amount of fuel.<BR>Book 5 (2nd edition), page 22:&nbsp; fuel use is dependent on the distance<BR>jumped.<BR><BR>I believe a gizmo called the "jump governor" was invented to explain<BR>this discrepancy:&nbsp; it limits the drive's fuel use to the jump actually<BR>made, and is incorporated into naval (High Guard) ships automatically.<BR>I don't know if stats were ever published for buying one and<BR>incorporating it into Book Two ships.<BR><BR>Stephen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 16:39:28 -0000<BR>From: "Mark Preston" &lt;mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Using Light For storage<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of John Fox<BR>&gt; Sent: 25 January 2001 17:22<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Using Light For storage<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Last Thrusday (ie the 18th) the New York Times had an<BR>&gt; article about how some<BR>&gt; physics people at two labratories had slowed light down to<BR>&gt; a speed of zero.<BR>&gt; They then proceeded to reconstitute the light so it came<BR>&gt; out exactly as it had<BR>&gt; entered.<BR>&gt;<BR>If you think of light as something that can be "created" then you get<BR>nowhere working out what they did. Llight is just a state of being and<BR>it moves more slowly in dense media than in a vaccuum. If you let it<BR>get into a medium of any sort, then it can (and does) move by exiting<BR>the electrons in the medium to "jump up" to energised states. When<BR>they "fall back" to the normal state, the energy that made them take<BR>the jump comes back out - the light carries on.<BR><BR>To make things _really_ slow, what these people have done is to use a<BR>light beam to pump up _all_ the electrons that can be made to to<BR>change states into the highest state they can reach. When more light<BR>hits the medium, the only thing it can change now is the way that the<BR>nucleus of the atoms of the medium spin in relation to each other.<BR>That is a very slow process, so the light slows down - and is not new<BR>(it is the basis for most of the quantuum computing work so far done).<BR><BR>The real trick that these people have come up with is a way of<BR>switching off the "pumping" light beam without letting the light<BR>energy "trapped" in the nuclear spin escape. When the pumping beam is<BR>switched back on, the nuclear spin can jumble up again and the light<BR>that was used to change the spins can be released again to carry on.<BR>So, nothing special, new or unusual is happening to the light - it has<BR>been know for a long time that this sort of thing was possible.<BR><BR>What is very special is that the light does not need to be<BR>continuous - it can be used like electricity stored in a capacitor and<BR>be switched on or off with another light beam like a transistor by<BR>another electrical impulse. And - most importantly - the light stored<BR>carries information about the spin of the nuclei of the medium it was<BR>"stored" in. There are two big and important things there...<BR><BR>1. Since the light does not need to be continuous, it can be used in a<BR>switched "light circuit" - such as a logic gate in a computer. In<BR>other words, it can be used in place of electricity in a "normal"<BR>computer.<BR><BR>2. Since the light coming out represents the spin of the nuclei, it<BR>can store the information in the medium - like RAM, but using light.<BR>And here is the crunch - nuclear spin is a quantuum property, not an<BR>"either-or" one like in a switch. So, anything that happens to the<BR>spin while the light is trapped can be read back when it is released -<BR>and changes to the spin are what quantuum computing work is based on<BR>(at the moment). That means the system can be used to set and read the<BR>data in a quantuum computer system. Now, we just need to be able to<BR>build the things and make them work...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3566<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yg04.mx.aol.com (rly-yg04.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.4]) by air-yg03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Sat, 27 Jan 2001 12:01:20 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yg04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sat, 27 Jan 2001 12:00:53 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id LAA80687;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sat, 27 Jan 2001 11:59:40 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sat, 27 Jan 2001 11:58:43 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA80644<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sat, 27 Jan 2001 11:58:43 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 11:58:43 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101271658.LAA80644@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3566<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background="" bgColor=#3dffff><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3567</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/28/01 6:39:06 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sunday, January 28 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3567<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy ...<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Judges Guild online (was Re: Cargonaut)<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>RE: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR>Re: Challenger Anniversary<BR>Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR>Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR>Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR>Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR>StarCom Communications<BR>The Drellesarr Reservoir<BR>re: Traveller Deck Plan 2: Modular Cutter<BR>Re: StarCom Communications<BR>Re: Challenger Anniversary<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Science Magazines for Eris' Nephew<BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 16:36:03 +0200<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 09:41:28 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy ...<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;ObTrav: Imagine a glut of mailing-list posts accumulating from 11,000<BR>&gt;worlds, arriving in one big batch from the latest Xboat :)<BR><BR>&nbsp; How about "what triggered the Long Night", Alex?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 18:09 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;F1474lX0hyiqLQxDqoN00000b21@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Douglas E. Berry said "Discuss:&nbsp; The effects on the Third Imperium of a<BR>&gt;&gt;looser economic policy, from allowing competing regional currencies to<BR>&gt;reduced border controls."<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;And my strange mind actually started to formulate an answer..... :-)<BR><BR>&gt;Then I must be strange too, 'coz I'd actually be interested in hearing <BR>&gt;that answer.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Cheers,<BR>&gt;Paul Drye<BR><BR>Eeek... does this mean that I actually have to come up with something?<BR><BR>Hmmm. The effect of a looser economic policy is to enable greater <BR>variation between parts of the 3I in terms of productivity, prosperity and <BR>indicators such as inflation and growth rates. The importance of financial <BR>information will increase as sub-sector and sector level stock markets <BR>develop trading in currency, futures and stocks and shares from the worlds <BR>within that area if not beyond.<BR><BR>Individual star-spanning corporations will begin to organise their <BR>holdings such that manufacturing occurs on planets where labour costs and <BR>raw materials are cheap, while administrative, marketing and R&amp;D occur in <BR>other worlds where the population is well-educated and able to perform <BR>these functions efficiently.<BR><BR>Currency trading will develop into a very profitable activity, as will the <BR>use of negotiable instruments to enable interstellar trade. While the 3I <BR>sponsored Credit will continue as a 'standard' against which regional <BR>currencies will be officially measured, faith in it will be eroded and <BR>other means of conducting transactions will need to be devised.<BR><BR>There will be an increase in black and grey marketing as regulations are <BR>reduced and, more importantly, begin to vary between worlds.<BR><BR>There's a few thoughts off the top of my head...<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 18:17:07 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Judges Guild online (was Re: Cargonaut)<BR><BR>on 27/1/01 11:23 am, Jones, Dean at Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; If anybody is interested, there's quite a few old stock<BR>&gt;&gt; Traveller items at<BR>&gt;&gt; the new JG online store:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Judges Guild (www.rpgrealms.com/www.judgesguild.com):<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Thanks, Gordon. For those interested,&nbsp; the stock of sector books has just<BR>&gt; been reduced by one each :). Hmmm (consults huge map on wall) where's<BR>&gt; Maranantha-Alkahest?<BR><BR>According to Jim Vassilakos' Gal2.4 program, it's an alternate universe,<BR>which probably means the publication had it overlayed over a later-created<BR>canon sector. Trying to find out via the web... it turns out to be quite a<BR>good search string for finding vendors of used Traveller products. :)<BR><BR>Guess I'll have to find out when I get it - unless somebody else here knows.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 18:44:50 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>on 27/1/01 7:29 am, Mikko V. I. Parviainen at mvparvia@cc.hut.fi wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Isn't Earthdawn currently being done by some firm? I think I remember<BR>&gt; hearing that a while ago. (Sorry, I can't bring myself to seek any<BR>&gt; information on the current Web with Lynx...)<BR><BR>Yes, Living Room Games: http://www.lrgames.com/<BR><BR>The second edition is due soon, and unaffected by the FASA announcement.<BR>It's currently beating Space 1889 quite comprehensively in the first annual<BR>Zombie awards that I previously mentioned. Traveller missed out by being<BR>resurrected before the awards were instituted, so it's in the Zombie hall of<BR>fame.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 11:31:32<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>At 06:09 PM 1/27/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;In-Reply-To: &lt;F1474lX0hyiqLQxDqoN00000b21@hotmail.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Eeek... does this mean that I actually have to come up with something?<BR><BR>It's always fun when somebody does.&nbsp; Tends to start very interesting threads.<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Currency trading will develop into a very profitable activity, as will the <BR>&gt;use of negotiable instruments to enable interstellar trade. While the 3I <BR>&gt;sponsored Credit will continue as a 'standard' against which regional <BR>&gt;currencies will be officially measured, faith in it will be eroded and <BR>&gt;other means of conducting transactions will need to be devised.<BR><BR>One possibility is that the Megacorps would start issuing their own money.<BR>Especially the more widely diversified ones.&nbsp; It would be used between<BR>subsidiaries, keeping the funds "in-house" while allowing stronger growth.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 17:05:04 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>On 01/27/01 at 11:31 AM,&nbsp; "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;At 06:09 PM 1/27/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;In-Reply-To: &lt;F1474lX0hyiqLQxDqoN00000b21@hotmail.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Eeek... does this mean that I actually have to come up with<BR>&gt;&gt;something?<BR><BR>&gt;It's always fun when somebody does.&nbsp; Tends to start very<BR>&gt;interesting threads.<BR><BR>&gt;&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Currency trading will develop into a very profitable activity, as<BR>&gt;&gt;will the use of negotiable instruments to enable interstellar<BR>&gt;&gt;trade.&nbsp; While the 3I sponsored Credit will continue as a<BR>&gt;&gt;'standard' against which regional currencies will be officially<BR>&gt;&gt;measured, faith in it will be eroded and other means of conducting<BR>&gt;&gt;transactions will need to be devised.<BR><BR>I'm dealing with this sort of thing in my games.&nbsp; <BR><BR>My Akus PBEM is set in an Imperiumless universe within the Quental<BR>Main Sector (don't look for it on solstation, 'tis my own design<BR>&lt;g&gt;).&nbsp; There are several small (subsector or smaller sized)<BR>competing empires and lots and lots of independent worlds in the<BR>PC's area of operations.&nbsp; There are many, many currencies around,<BR>but six are fairly widely spread across the sector:&nbsp; three from the<BR>largest empires and three from trading hubs on independent worlds.<BR>Currency trading and speculation are important activities, and so is<BR>the generation and transfer of financial information useful in<BR>guessing how currencies might move in relation to one another from<BR>system to system.&nbsp; In the background, several banks (and other<BR>institutions) have formed interlocking agreements allowing<BR>relatively secure transfer of credit from system to system, but that<BR>also opens up the need to physically transfer instruments around<BR>from bank to bank.&nbsp; It also makes the thief, forgery, or<BR>manipulation of these instruments an "interesting" possibility.<BR><BR>The other game I'm running is set in Reaver's Deep in 1120.&nbsp; The<BR>Rebellion is destroying the Imperium's economy and the small states<BR>and independent worlds of the Deep are slipping into "hard times"<BR>with depression, crime and shortages getting worse and worse.&nbsp; The<BR>Impcr (Imperial credit) is still the currency of choice, but several<BR>small states are beginning to promote their own (Carrill, Caledonia,<BR>and Gralyn to name three) as the Imperial presence, power and<BR>influence fades away.&nbsp; As of yet, the PC's haven't run into a world<BR>that won't accept Impcrs, but its value is starting to decrease<BR>throughout the Sector.&nbsp; The time is going to come when it will make<BR>sense to buy devalued Impcrs in one system and sell them (or trade<BR>them for goods) in a system where it is still more highly valued a<BR>few parsecs away.&nbsp; Of course, that condition won't persist and<BR>getting stuck with the wrong currency at the wrong place and time<BR>would be a disaster.&nbsp; IAC, I am moving the Deep toward the same<BR>fractured financial situation I have in the Quential Main.<BR><BR>&gt;One possibility is that the Megacorps would start issuing their own<BR>&gt;money. Especially the more widely diversified ones.&nbsp; It would be<BR>&gt;used between subsidiaries, keeping the funds "in-house" while<BR>&gt;allowing stronger growth.<BR><BR>Corporate and municipal "script" actually existed in the US during<BR>the depression.&nbsp; It wasn't legal for a corp. or city to mint its own<BR>currency, but ways were found to get around the law.&nbsp; While legal<BR>tender was still preferred, stamps, paper coupons and vouchers<BR>issued by corporations and bus and subway tokens issued by cities<BR>were often used to facility local trade.<BR><BR>Ob Trav:&nbsp; That big bag of plastic chits the PC's found in the bottom<BR>of the chest appears to entitle them to rides on the Skypr shuttle<BR>system and have no apparant value here on Gralyn.&nbsp; However, if they<BR>were on Skypr they would find they could use these chits to buy<BR>goods worth 200,000 Impcr.&nbsp; They don't know that, but that guy at<BR>the next table in the starport bar does:<BR><BR>Roll 1d6<BR><BR>1.&nbsp; He and his band of cutthroats intend to steal that bag.<BR><BR>2.&nbsp; He intends to scam the PC's out of their bag of chits.<BR><BR>3.&nbsp; He gives the PC's the information if they will pay his bar bill.<BR><BR>4.&nbsp; He will to sell his information for a quarter of the chits in<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; the bag.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <BR>5.&nbsp; He is mistaken about the value, they are worth (1-3 only 50,000<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Impcr; 4-6 over 500,000 Impcr).<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <BR>6.&nbsp; He is lying about the information, and just wants to scam the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; PC's for his useless information.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>Eris&nbsp; &nbsp; <BR><BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 17:08:35 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>On 01/26/01 at 01:59 AM,&nbsp; Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;After 20 happy-and difficult-years in business, FASA Corporation is<BR>&gt; closing its doors.<BR><BR>Bummer! <BR><BR>Well, I haven't really been interested in FASA products since they stopped producing Traveller material, but it's a shame to see another company closing its doors.<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 17:10:13 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>On 01/26/01 at 10:41 AM,&nbsp; Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;Farewell, Freedonian Aerospace Administration.<BR><BR>Yeah, it made me very "Groucho" when I heard about FASA closing.<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 17:12:53 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>On 01/26/01 at 07:21 PM,&nbsp; "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;Last Unicorn Games and Mayfair as well....<BR><BR>&gt;At 10:41 AM 1/26/2001 +0100, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Farewell, Freedonian Aerospace Administration.<BR><BR>&gt;Indeed.&nbsp; They produced some of the best games in the field.<BR><BR>&gt;GDW, ICE, TSR, and now FASA...&nbsp; Damn.<BR><BR>Not to mention Imperium Games.<BR><BR>Hey, I said NOT to mention Imperium Games!<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 17:25:08 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: RE: Extreme Planetary conditions<BR><BR>On 01/25/01 at 04:54 PM,&nbsp; "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;Black silicon is fabricated by subjecting a fairly pure source of<BR>&gt;silicon to an intense light source (ie the laser) in an atmosphere<BR>&gt;of complex sulphur compounds.&nbsp; The silicon forms a surface of<BR>&gt;micron-scale spikes topped with spheres with the sulphur and<BR>&gt;fluorine embedded into it.&nbsp; The S and Fl seem to introduce extra<BR>&gt;electron states into the silicon band gap which enable low-power<BR>&gt;(such as infra-red) photons to climb up to the conduction band in<BR>&gt;steps.&nbsp; Simplified, the absorption of the black silicon is at<BR>&gt;around 97% visible and IR light, rather than the 60% visible, 0.1%<BR>&gt;IR managed by grey silicon.&nbsp; Black silicon also seems to be a very<BR>&gt;impressive transmitter as well.<BR><BR>This is new to me!&nbsp; Sounds like this stuff would be a major<BR>breakthrough in solar energy.&nbsp; Do you have some online info sources<BR>for black silicon?<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 16:57:47 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Challenger Anniversary<BR><BR>On Sat, 27 Jan 2001 05:00:41 -0800 (PST) harrisgwjr@yahoo.com (Gerry Harris)<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;It's been 15 years to the day since the Challenger disaster.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Dammit! just a mention of that brings tears to my eye...<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; "To absent friends!"<BR><BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 17:55:57 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR><BR>On 01/25/01 at 02:13 PM,&nbsp; Bernie McGeehan &lt;einreb62@yahoo.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;What is the date for that issue? I must have issed<BR>&gt;that when it went by...<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; The New Scientist site has posted an interesting<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; story about the discovery of "mind-reading" cells<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; existing in every human being.<BR><BR>What about a review of _New Scientist_ magazine?&nbsp; Are we talking hard science, softer speculative science or pseudo-science?&nbsp; If you were to compare its articles to another journal/magazine would it be an IEEE journal, _Science_, _Scientific American_, _Popular Science_, fact articles in _Analog_ or articles published in usenet?&nbsp; Is it available in outside the UK and what does it cost?<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 00:25:06 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR><BR>on 27/1/01 11:55 pm, eris@pcola.gulf.net at eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; What about a review of _New Scientist_ magazine?&nbsp; Are we talking hard science,<BR>&gt; softer speculative science or pseudo-science?&nbsp; If you were to compare its<BR>&gt; articles to another journal/magazine would it be an IEEE journal, _Science_,<BR>&gt; _Scientific American_, _Popular Science_, fact articles in _Analog_ or<BR>&gt; articles published in usenet?&nbsp; Is it available in outside the UK and what does<BR>&gt; it cost?<BR><BR>New Scientist is fairly respectable. While it does not cater to science<BR>post-grads to the level that (for example) Nature does, it does tend to have<BR>a fairly high standard of both research and journalism. The articles are<BR>intended for an educated audience, perhaps about the level of Scientific<BR>American. However, it doesn't necessarily always abide by the consensus view<BR>of modern science, so one might find articles by generally unaccepted<BR>scientists such as (say) Fred Hoyle. Some of the articles, although written<BR>by qualified authors, and containing appropriate caveats, are of a<BR>speculative nature. At least one third of the publication is a list of jobs<BR>and research positions, primarily in the UK educational and civil service<BR>sectors. It is available outside the UK by subscription or through<BR>specialist newstands. I've seen it in B&amp;N in the NY tri-state area.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 19:30:38 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR><BR>&gt;What about a review of _New Scientist_ magazine?<BR><BR>It's kind of a weekly Scientific American, with shorter articles. I like <BR>them because, as well as their original stuff, they also reference what's <BR>going on in the more serious journals, and have nice day-to-day science <BR>news.<BR><BR>Their web site carries a nice cross-section of their articles (about 1 in 3, <BR>apparently):<BR><BR>www.newscientist.com<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 22:12:25 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR><BR>On 01/27/01 at 07:30 PM,&nbsp; "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;What about a review of _New Scientist_ magazine?<BR><BR>&gt;It's kind of a weekly Scientific American, with shorter articles. I<BR>&gt;like&nbsp; them because, as well as their original stuff, they also<BR>&gt;reference what's&nbsp; going on in the more serious journals, and have<BR>&gt;nice day-to-day science&nbsp; news.<BR><BR>How does it compare to _The Science News_? For those that don't know _The Science News_ is a weekly synopsis of science and technology that's been in publication for about 75 years. I recieved a subscription to it when I was about 10 and only let it lapse after I entered college. I remember it fondly.<BR><BR>BTW, I have a nephew who is turning 8 in March. He has expressed an interest in "being a scientist" when he grows up. Does anyone have a good suggestion for a children's science magazine? He's a little young for any of the magazines I'm familar with.<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 22:38:33 -0600<BR>From: "D. Smart" &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR>Subject: StarCom Communications<BR><BR>Folks, you're gonna love this! It's a way to<BR>use meteor atmospheric trails for communications.<BR><BR>Quite a novel idea. Thanks, Rob E., for the<BR>headsup.<BR><BR>http://www.starcomwireless.com/technology/articlereader.asp?tf=StarCom_Technology.txt<BR><BR>ObTrav: Very cool emergency or covert comm-links.<BR><BR>David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 01:40:01 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: The Drellesarr Reservoir<BR><BR>I don't post these kinds of details from my games often, but I<BR>thought this might be of interest to the list as a bit of "color"<BR>you might use sometime or other.<BR><BR>Anyway, here is a copy of a post I sent out today about the<BR>underground resevoir on Drellesarr, a vacuum rockball of a world.<BR><BR>&lt;repost&gt;<BR>On 01/27/01 at 01:27 PM,&nbsp; Suz Dollar &lt;Suz_Dollar@worldnet.att.net&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;Swim?&nbsp; what is dress code for our special swimming hole? I might<BR>&gt;have to&nbsp; stop and get a suit... and can I get one for my 30cr<BR>&gt;left??? &lt;G&gt;<BR><BR>LOL!&nbsp; Only if you are modest.&nbsp; &lt;g&gt; No, the only rule is don't scare<BR>the children or visitors.&nbsp; Suits are optional in some areas, and are<BR>required in others.&nbsp; In the reservoir itself you'll need a wetsuit<BR>and a breather, but there is more to the Reservoir Area than just<BR>the reservoir.&nbsp; It consists of the water reservoir, a large<BR>recreational area, and living/working areas for water creatures,<BR>like dolphins. <BR><BR>The reservoir is very large, close to 500 meters in diameter and<BR>over 50 meters deep at the deepest point.&nbsp; It is in a huge<BR>artificial cavern lined with a plastic film.&nbsp; Most of the reservoir<BR>stays at the constant temperature of about 15c (59f), which takes no<BR>energy to maintain, but which would give you hypothermia in 10<BR>minutes. <BR><BR>A smaller, and shallower section is kept at 25c (77f), with many<BR>sections warmer still.&nbsp; Of course smaller is relative.&nbsp; This<BR>recreational section branches off from the reservoir and winds<BR>through several, mostly, natural caverns forming canals, grottos and<BR>pools with depths ranging from less than 2 meters to more than 10<BR>meters.&nbsp; People can swim, float and wade for hundreds of meters in<BR>several directions through these dimly lighted caverns.&nbsp; They can<BR>rest on sandy shores and rock ledges along the edges, dive from rock<BR>overhangs into deep pools, join with others in popular sections near<BR>the lifts, or find small secluded pools deeper within the cavern<BR>system for private recreations.<BR><BR>There are fish and other water creatures throughout the whole area.<BR>For the most part the water creatures are harvested for food, but in<BR>some of the warm recreational areas you'll find colorful creatures<BR>there only for fun. <BR><BR>The living quarters for dolphin, and similar travellers, are<BR>adjacent to the reservoir.&nbsp; You can often find dolphins swimming,<BR>playing and doing business throughout the reservoir area.<BR><BR>The reservoir system, built and stocked hundreds of years ago,<BR>contains enough water, and oxygen, to maintain the entire population<BR>of Drellesarr's lone city, Blackjack, indefinately.&nbsp; All they need<BR>to supply is power and fusion gives them that.&nbsp; With plentiful water<BR>and power Blackjack is also self-suffecient in food production and<BR>could be a net exporter if it chose to be. <BR><BR>With this large reserver, Drellesarrians are not as strict as most<BR>vacuum or near vacuum planets when it comes to air and water<BR>controls.&nbsp; However, they do have the regulations in place and are<BR>ready to put them into effect if ever they need to.<BR><BR><BR>Eris<BR>RDeep Game<BR><BR>&lt;/repost&gt;<BR><BR>Hope you enjoyed it.<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 02:07:07 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: re: Traveller Deck Plan 2: Modular Cutter<BR><BR>&gt;Traveller Deck Plan 2: Modular Cutter<BR>...<BR>&gt;Also included is a sheet of all-new Traveller Cardboard<BR>&gt;Heroes miniatures, created specifically for this set.<BR>&gt;Explorers, scientists, doctors, civilians . . . including<BR>&gt;a Virushi surgeon and a Bwap clerk! <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Stock #6620, ISBN 1-55634-480-5. $16.95<BR><BR>&nbsp; &lt;drool&gt; ... must get ...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 01:14:38 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: StarCom Communications<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Folks, you're gonna love this! It's a way to<BR>&gt; use meteor atmospheric trails for communications.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Quite a novel idea. Thanks, Rob E., for the<BR>&gt; headsup.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; http://www.starcomwireless.com/technology/articlereader.asp?tf=StarCom_Techno<BR>&gt; logy.txt<BR><BR>They've been using that in Alaska for *decades*. :-)<BR><BR>&gt; ObTrav: Very cool emergency or covert comm-links.<BR><BR>Not terribly "covert" I'm afraid. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 13:39 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Challenger Anniversary<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;MailDrop1.2d7k-PPC.1010127165747@ppp08.pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>It doesn't seem that long ago.<BR><BR>I got home, turned the TV on and there was that dreadful shot of the <BR>launch going up and then exploding. I turned to my dearly beloved and said <BR>"They've lost a Shuttle" while he was still trying to figure out what was <BR>going on.<BR><BR>It delayed an experiment I'd had a hand in that was to go on the next <BR>launch for about 3 years too :-(<BR><BR>But that's trivial beside those who did not come back. These pioneers who <BR>made the ultimate sacrifice should, along with White, Grisson and Chaffee, <BR>be remembered by all starfarers...<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 13:39 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;200101272304.XAA92903@pompano.pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>Ooops... what have I started now?<BR><BR>(Maybe it was due to spending Friday putting loadsa historical economics <BR>material on the college intranet... how the Nazis revitalised the German <BR>economy 1933-39 if you must know...)<BR><BR>Actually, I find economics quite important in creating the sort of <BR>'alternate reality' I like to have in the stuff I write. The underlying <BR>financial structures need to work; then from that it's easy when the <BR>players want to know how much something costs. One trick is to work on a <BR>formula of 'current price x an odd multiplier', then it's a case of simple <BR>arithmetic to tell them how much a beer, or a suit of clothes, or a <BR>handgun or whatever will cost them. Game-specific items can be <BR>extrapolated... e.g. for a spell use the cost of a bit of custom <BR>programming, for a spaceship consider how much a biggish boat (the sort <BR>you'd use for diving live-aboard charters, that sort of size) would cost, <BR>and so on. Just don't let on what the multiplier is, and the players are <BR>unaware of what is going on, but get the gut feeling that the whole game <BR>world has an underlying coherence.<BR><BR>The concept of 'company script' is handled very well in the game BLUE <BR>PLANET, for those who are interested. <BR><BR>Eris, your PBEM sounds fun, any room?<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 08:49:21 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Science Magazines for Eris' Nephew<BR><BR>&gt;How does it compare to _The Science News_?<BR><BR>Don't know that one, sorry. Hopefully someone else here can compare.<BR><BR>&gt;BTW, I have a nephew who is turning 8 in March. He has expressed an <BR>&gt;interest in "being a scientist" when he grows up. Does anyone have a good <BR>&gt;suggestion for a children's science magazine? He's a little young for any <BR>&gt;of the magazines I'm familar with.<BR><BR>When I was that age I got my start in science with a Canadian magazine <BR>called "Owl Magazine" and National Geographic's kid magazine "World". Owl is <BR>still extant, much to my surprise, and even have a (half-hearted) web site <BR>at:<BR><BR>www.owl.on.ca/owl/owl.html<BR><BR>"World" has a web presence at the National Geographic website:<BR><BR>http://www.nationalgeographic.com/media/world/index.html<BR><BR>(My, my quite the trip down memory lane there....)<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 16:36:03 +0200<BR>From: "Mark and Caroline Russell" &lt;markrus@netactive.co.za&gt;<BR>Subject: Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 16:36:03 +0200<BR><BR>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C08948.67D903A0<BR>Content-Type: text/plain;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>unsubscribe<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C08948.67D903A0<BR>Content-Type: text/html;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>&lt;!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"&gt;<BR>&lt;HEAD&gt;<BR>&lt;META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =<BR>http-equiv=3DContent-Type&gt;<BR>&lt;META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000" name=3DGENERATOR&gt;<BR>&lt;STYLE&gt;&lt;/STYLE&gt;<BR>&lt;/HEAD&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face='3D"Comic' MS?="<BR" Sans>size=3D2&gt;unsubscribe</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C08948.67D903A0--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3567<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zd03.mx.aol.com (rly-zd03.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.227]) by air-zd03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 09:39:06 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zd03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 09:38:40 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id JAA25703;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 09:38:16 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sun, 28 Jan 2001 09:38:00 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id JAA25656<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 09:38:00 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 09:38:00 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101281438.JAA25656@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3567<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3568</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/28/01 1:06:42 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sunday, January 28 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3568<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>More Interstellar War Thoughts (semi-long)<BR>Re: Challenger Anniversary<BR>online sporadically for a couple weeks<BR>Cargonaut Press - new ISP<BR>Re: More Interstellar War Thoughts (semi-long)<BR>RE: FASA closes<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re: New Scientist<BR>Maranantha-Alkahest?<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>Re: Now I've gone and done it!<BR>Re: Question.....<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Azhanti HL<BR>Re: Question.....<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Azhanti HL<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 14:48:36 -0000<BR>From: "Alistair J. R. Young" &lt;avatar@arkane.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>&gt; ObTrav: Imagine a glut of mailing-list posts accumulating from 11,000<BR>&gt; worlds, arriving in one big batch from the latest Xboat :)<BR><BR>For that matter, estimate what percentage of the total capacity of the<BR>Xboat system is used to shuffle about 11,000 worlds-worth of spam -<BR>noting of course that travel-time delays don't allow for silly WWW<BR>tricks, so the messages themselves have to include all the gimmicks.<BR><BR>(For extra credit, how many copies of "ILOVEYOU.vbs" are still floating<BR>about in the system, despite all efforts to eradicate it...)<BR><BR>Alistair<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 08:13:36 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: More Interstellar War Thoughts (semi-long)<BR><BR>The treaty of New York in 2022 would have had huge political<BR>ramifications.&nbsp; Putting a nation's armed forces under United Nations<BR>control would have been a blow to national sovereignty.&nbsp; While there is<BR>not a whole lot of information surrounding this treaty, one might draw<BR>several inferences from it and subsequent events.<BR><BR>One, something major must have happened bring the world's nation states<BR>to make such a momentous move.&nbsp; One possibility is that the world came<BR>to the brink of World War III during the first two decades of the 21st<BR>century, and this scared the people into forcing this move on their<BR>governments.<BR><BR>Secondly, there are going to be some nations not willing to surrender<BR>their national armed forces to some ultra-national organization.&nbsp; I<BR>cannot see some of the more fundamentalist Moslem countries, such as<BR>Iran, willy nilly turning over their armies to an organization pretty<BR>much run by the Satanic Western superpowers.&nbsp; Additionally, even within<BR>signatory nations there are going to be nationalists who will see such<BR>a treaty as a major threat.&nbsp; For instance, can one see certain segments<BR>of the U.S. (mostly Southern and Western) easily accepting such a blow<BR>to national sovereignty?&nbsp; There would be constant low-level rebellions<BR>going on all over the world.<BR><BR>It is difficult to believe that with advances in radio telescopy and<BR>similar technologies, that the United Nations did not know ahead of<BR>time that there were "aliens" at Barnard's Star.&nbsp; Let's assume for a<BR>moment that the Terrans invented jump drive from first principles (as<BR>has been stated before in these threads) and not from a derelict Vilani<BR>starship.&nbsp; Instead of going to Alpha Centauri, a much closer star<BR>system with a relatively Sol-like sun, they headed toward Barnard "for<BR>various scientific reasons" (radio intercepts, maybe?).<BR><BR>The Terrans probably didn't realize the extent of the interstellar<BR>civilization they were dealing with after first contact with the<BR>Vilani, but the UN did know a political boon when they saw one.&nbsp; Here<BR>was an outside agency that might bring the few recalcitrant<BR>nation-states on Earth under the UN umbrella, and might cut the legs<BR>out from under the nascent nationalist movements in the signatory<BR>states.&nbsp; Obviously, things did not work out as planned, so the<BR>powers-that-be sparked a war with the Vilani - as nothing unifies<BR>diverse populations like an exterior threat.&nbsp; The premise of the war<BR>was very flimsy - a Vilani trade caravan ignores Terran traffic control<BR>signals in a star system the Vilani owned before the upstart Terrans<BR>showed up?&nbsp; This has all the markings of an engineered conflict.<BR><BR>Within a couple of years after the end of the First Interstellar War,<BR>someone at the UN makes a naked power grab.&nbsp; The UN is effectively<BR>abolished (the Security Council is disbanded, the General Assembly is<BR>reduced to a figure-head body).&nbsp; Of course, one could envision the<BR>Secretary General claiming the move was done in order to strengthen<BR>Earth's defenses against the nefarious Vilani hordes.&nbsp; There was<BR>probably some military backing of the coup, as the folks on the sharp<BR>end probably wanted to deal with a single command structure as opposed<BR>to having to contend with conflicting signals from various governments.<BR><BR>Of course, what isn't written in the official histories can also be<BR>inferred - military and economic campaigns were launched to bring<BR>non-signatory nations into the fold; rebellions in signatory nations<BR>would be ruthlessly oppressed (martial law would have to be declared in<BR>some regions); and all the while propaganda machines churned out<BR>screeds on how all this was necessary to defeat the menace from beyond<BR>the stars.<BR><BR>Over the ensuing decades there would have been a tightening of<BR>government control of all aspects of Terran life, both to keep a lid on<BR>potential rebellion, and to maintain the wartime economy necessary to<BR>fight the Vilani.&nbsp; This may have been the origins of the Solomani<BR>police state which arose centuries later.<BR><BR>The increasing militarization of Terran society does explain one of the<BR>mysteries of the game, Imperium - monitors.&nbsp; Monitors are sublight<BR>warships which take years to plod between stars.&nbsp; Evidently they<BR>achieve a sizeable fraction of c as they move a half parsec every two<BR>years.&nbsp; Since it takes four or more years to travel between star<BR>systems, one wonders how the crews were recruited for these efforts. <BR>We can surmise that the crew were in low berths to reduce life support<BR>problems, but the morale of crews separated from home and loved ones<BR>for years at a stretch is hard to fathom.&nbsp; In a free society without<BR>military conscription, operation tempo is a primary consideration for<BR>recruiting and retention and there is some effort to reduce the stress<BR>of long deployments on service members and their families.&nbsp; In<BR>authoritarian societies with military conscription, this does not<BR>matter.<BR><BR>Estigarriba's coup in 2364 can now be seen as a logical outgrowth of<BR>the militarized society now firmly entrenched in the Terran psyche.&nbsp; <BR>And the collapse of the Rule of Man can be attributed more to the<BR>inability of the militarized Solomani being unable to integrate Vilani<BR>society, than to the any failings on the part of the latter.<BR><BR>Note: My timeline is off by about 50 years from that presented in<BR>MegaTraveller.&nbsp; This is because the several sources I consulted did not<BR>agree on the dates of several important events, so I fudged.<BR><BR>BTW, the contention that the Terrans invented jump drive from first<BR>principles seems flawed on further study.&nbsp; For instance, Vilani jump<BR>theory is noted as being flawed, preventing the development of any jump<BR>number higher than two.&nbsp; The Terrans went from Jump 1 to Jump 2 rather<BR>rapidly, but then took nearly 200 years to achieve Jump 3.&nbsp; Other<BR>technologies did not lag in this regard - the TCN was purchasing TL 12<BR>robots only 12 years after the discovery of Jump 2 (TL 11), but 176<BR>years before the development of TL 12 jump technology.&nbsp; This could be<BR>chalked up to the Terrans working with the same flawed jump theories as<BR>the Vilani, which would have had to have been accepted in terrestrial<BR>scientific circles before the construction of the first Jump 1, and<BR>long before official contact with the Vilani.<BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Do You Yahoo!?<BR>Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. <BR>http://auctions.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 08:13:11<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Challenger Anniversary<BR><BR>At 01:39 PM 1/28/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I got home, turned the TV on and there was that dreadful shot of the <BR>&gt;launch going up and then exploding. I turned to my dearly beloved and said <BR>&gt;"They've lost a Shuttle" while he was still trying to figure out what was <BR>&gt;going on.<BR><BR>I was there.&nbsp; Standing on the beach, telling my friends that it was so damn<BR>cool that normal folks were finally going up.&nbsp; The last thing i remember is<BR>saying "No, that's not right.."<BR><BR>*sigh*<BR><BR>But a few months after the event, Bay Area filkers had a memorial concert.<BR>This was one of the ypbeat songs, and since I prefer hope of sadness, I'm<BR>playing it here.&nbsp; Remember, we now have the ISS up!<BR><BR>Keep the Dream Alive<BR><BR> 1986 Stephen Savitzky.<BR>(All rights reserved.)<BR><BR><BR>In the year of Nineteen Eighty Six, <BR>On an icy winter's day<BR><BR>The shuttle Challenger left the pad<BR>And started on her way<BR>The shuttle Challenger lifted off<BR>With seven brave women and men <BR>In flames they died just ten miles high, <BR>And never came home again.<BR><BR>Never came home again,<BR>In flames they died just ten miles high<BR>And never came home again.<BR><BR>But never say that they died in vain<BR>Nor stay on the ground afraid,<BR>The stars are one step closer now<BR>Because of the price we've paid.<BR>And mourn for the shuttle that flies no more,<BR>And weep for the friends we've lost,<BR>But to leave the Earth will still be worth<BR>Whatever it has to cost.<BR><BR>Whatever it has to cost.<BR>But to leave the Earth will still be worth<BR>Whatever it has to cost.<BR><BR>So fire no guns in last salute<BR>But let the rockets roar,<BR>And reach for the wide and starry sky<BR>As Challenger did before.<BR>And raise no earthbound slab of stone, <BR>To mark the place they lie,<BR>But write their names with a shuttle's flames,<BR>Ten miles in the sky.<BR><BR>Ten miles in the sky.<BR>But write their names with a shuttle's flames,<BR>Ten miles in the sky.<BR><BR>And here's a toast to the Challenger's crew<BR>Who died for the dream of space<BR>And all the pioneers who have<BR>The sky for a resting place.<BR>No grave nor tombstone do they need,<BR>For their memory will survive<BR>As long as we fly beyond the sky<BR>And keep the dream alive.<BR><BR>Keep the dream alive,<BR>As long as we fly beyond the sky<BR>And keep the dream alive.<BR><BR>Keep the dream alive,<BR>Let the shuttles fly beyond the sky<BR>And keep the dream alive.<BR><BR>- -<BR><BR>BTW, I think it is long out of print, but if you can find the Challenger<BR>Memorial tape, it is well worth it.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 11:41:59 EST<BR>From: GypsyComet@aol.com<BR>Subject: online sporadically for a couple weeks<BR><BR>I'm currently in the middle of a move (literally: leaving the old place as <BR>much as two weeks before moving in to the new) and will be only sporadically <BR>checking email until mid-February. This address will not be going away (one <BR>of the GOOD things about using a national "I"SP like AOL), but expect to wait <BR>a couple days for a response...<BR><BR>Jim Kundert<BR>gypsycomet@aol.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 12:15:40 -0700<BR>From: "J. Paul Sanders" &lt;jps64@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Cargonaut Press - new ISP<BR><BR>For those on the list who keep track of such things - I'm moving over to a <BR>new ISP and the Cargonaut Press website will now be located at the <BR>following url: <BR>http://home.earthlink.net/~jps64/supplements/supplements.html and my <BR>memorial site to J. Andrew Keith at: <BR>http://home.earthlink.net/~jps64/andrewkeith/andrewkeith.html<BR>My new email is now: jps64@earthlink.net<BR><BR>L8r,<BR>Paul<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 16:56:56 +0000<BR>From: Paul Campbell &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: More Interstellar War Thoughts (semi-long)<BR><BR>On Sun, Jan 28, 2001 at 08:13:36AM -0800, Gerry Harris wrote:<BR><BR>Great stuff.&nbsp; Filing this one away safely. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Paul Campbell (Sourceforge) &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>GPG Key fingerprint = 9C4F 31A3 8814 9F94 A533 A979 E63F 0C69 A771 0F24<BR>http://www.kemitix.uklinux.net<BR>jupiter: 4:55pm up 19 days, 6:35, 2 users, load average: 0.22, 0.36, 0.29<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 18:46:00 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: FASA closes<BR><BR>At 11:02 -0500 26/1/01,&nbsp; "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;Farewll, sweet Fasa. I shall fondly remember your sourcebooks and<BR>&gt;supplements;<BR>&gt;Traveller, Shadowrun and the Dr. Who RPG.<BR>&gt;Battletech no more. :(<BR><BR><BR>Shadowrun and Battletech will live on, at one of the other founder's <BR>companies, as it says on the PR.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 18:50:37 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:21:26&nbsp; "Michael McKeown" <BR>&lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt; writes:<BR>&gt;Last Unicorn Games and Mayfair as well....<BR><BR>LUG was voluntary - WotC bought them out. Not a business failure.<BR><BR>Mayfair is still in business, but AFAIK not in RPGs anymore.<BR><BR>The just shipped another expansion for _Settlers of Catan_ anyway.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 11:43:52 -0800<BR>From: "Bruce Macintosh" &lt;bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: New Scientist<BR><BR>&gt;What about a review of _New Scientist_ magazine?<BR>&gt;Are we talking hard science, softer speculative science or pseudo-science?<BR>&gt;If you were to compare its articles to another journal/magazine would it be an<BR>&gt;IEEE journal, _Science_, _Scientific American_, _Popular Science_,<BR>&gt; fact articles in _Analog_ or articles published in usenet?<BR>Is it available in outside the UK and what does it cost?<BR>Somewhere between "Scientific American" and "fact articles in Analog";<BR>definitely popularizing, with less meaty articles than Scientific American and<BR>a tendency to publish fairly loose results (eg from press releases or<BR>conference presentations that haven't been published in a reviewed journal)<BR>and to chose for amusment value rather than scientific respect. Not that<BR>that's a bad thing. Purchasable in the US, but they also have a pretty<BR>decent free website.<BR><BR>Bruce<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 15:13:54 EST<BR>From: JimVassila@aol.com<BR>Subject: Maranantha-Alkahest?<BR><BR>- --part1_9a.f58768d.27a5d782_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/28/01 6:39:06 AM Pacific Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Hmmm (consults huge map on wall) where's Maranantha-Alkahest?<BR><BR>Just trailing (east) of Ley.<BR><BR>&gt; According to Jim Vassilakos' Gal2.4 program, it's an alternate universe,<BR>&gt; which probably means the publication had it overlayed over a later-created<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>In 1981, Judges Guild published Dave Sering's Maranantha-Alkahest Sector, at <BR>the time an approved Traveller product, though it was declared invalid by GDW <BR>in 1984. It is in this publication that we see first mention of the "Gateway <BR>Quadrant" which seems to be intended to refer to the entire area of space <BR>covered by the four Judges Guild sectors.<BR><BR>In the Aug/Sept 1982 issue of _Pegasus_, Judges Guild published Edward Kuns' <BR>Tagret Sector, placing it at the exact same location of M-A (whether they <BR>realized they were revising an area of space that they themselves already <BR>already covered remains a mystery).<BR><BR>Finally, some years later, The Gateway Sector (designed by Thomas A. Dundee)&nbsp; <BR>was published by Digest Group Publications in _The Megatraveller Journal_, <BR>#4. It was apparently for Willian H. Keith's Lords of Thunder Campaign (circa <BR>1120-1123). And they chose to place it at same location as both M-A &amp; Tagret.<BR><BR>"Y'know, Jamison, there's something very odd about that star field over <BR>yonder. It weren't always there, y'see... there was different stars before... <BR>and still different ones before them. Has something to do with the Zhos if <BR>y'ask me..."<BR><BR>- -Jim<BR><BR>PS: If anyone knows any more about this, please email me your info...<BR><BR><BR>- --part1_9a.f58768d.27a5d782_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT size=2>In a message dated 1/28/01 6:39:06 AM Pacific Standard Time, <BR><BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>&lt;BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"&gt;Hmmm (consults huge map on wall) where's Maranantha-Alkahest?</FONT><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF">&lt;/BLOCKQUOTE&gt;<BR><BR><BR><BR></FONT><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF">Just trailing (east) of Ley.<BR><BR></FONT><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"><BR><BR></FONT><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=2 FAMILY="SANSSERIF">&lt;BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"&gt;According to Jim Vassilakos' Gal2.4 program, it's an alternate universe,<BR><BR>which probably means the publication had it overlayed over a later-created<BR><BR>canon sector. &lt;/BLOCKQUOTE&gt;<BR><BR><BR><BR>In 1981, Judges Guild published Dave Sering's Maranantha-Alkahest Sector, at <BR><BR>the time an approved Traveller product, though it was declared invalid by GDW <BR><BR>in 1984. It is in this publication that we see first mention of the "Gateway <BR><BR>Quadrant" which seems to be intended to refer to the entire area of space <BR><BR>covered by the four Judges Guild sectors.<BR><BR><BR><BR>In the Aug/Sept 1982 issue of _Pegasus_, Judges Guild published Edward Kuns' <BR><BR>Tagret Sector, placing it at the exact same location of M-A (whether they <BR><BR>realized they were revising an area of space that they themselves already <BR><BR>already covered remains a mystery).<BR><BR><BR><BR>Finally, some years later, The Gateway Sector (designed by Thomas A. Dundee) &amp;nbsp;<BR><BR>was published by Digest Group Publications in _The Megatraveller Journal_, <BR><BR>#4. It was apparently for Willian H. Keith's Lords of Thunder Campaign (circa <BR><BR>1120-1123). And they chose to place it at same location as both M-A &amp;amp; Tagret.<BR><BR><BR><BR>"Y'know, Jamison, there's something very odd about that star field over <BR><BR>yonder. It weren't always there, y'see... there was different stars before... <BR><BR>and still different ones before them. Has something to do with the Zhos if <BR><BR>y'ask me..."<BR><BR><BR><BR>-Jim<BR><BR><BR><BR>PS: If anyone knows any more about this, please email me your info...<BR><BR></FONT><BR><BR>- --part1_9a.f58768d.27a5d782_boundary--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 14:49:47 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>On Sun, 28 Jan 2001, Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:21:26&nbsp; "Michael McKeown" <BR>&gt; &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt; writes:<BR>&gt; &gt;Last Unicorn Games and Mayfair as well....<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; LUG was voluntary - WotC bought them out. Not a business failure.<BR><BR>I don't know how voluntary it was, but the consequences have only been<BR>negative.&nbsp; They lost Star Trek, they lost Dune, and many of them lost<BR>their jobs.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:39:01 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>Gordon Horne wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;For some reason I'm picturing customs officials on the way out of<BR>&gt; &gt;the system saying "Are you sure you wouldn't like a tinkle break<BR>&gt; &gt;before you leave, sirs? No, really, we insist."<BR><BR>Just sit them down at a competition table at any major con, give them<BR>some dice to roll and wait for 90 mins.<BR><BR>:-)<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:50:05 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Now I've gone and done it!<BR><BR>"Robert A. Smith II" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; My players just presented me with a major turning point in my Traveller<BR>&gt; campaign and I could use some input from the TML peanut gallery on where to<BR>&gt; go from here.&nbsp; I should start with a little background on MTU, which<BR>&gt; diverges significantly from the OTU.<BR><BR><BIG snip Big><BR><BR>Hey, kill the lot of them.<BR><BR>lol<BR><BR>If every PC party in the multiverse managed to foil/complete every impossible<BR>plot then all the 'civvies' would become adventurers.&nbsp; The life of an adventurer<BR>has got to be dangerous and challenging otherwise everyone would do it.<BR><BR>If the players have manoeuvred themselves into this position, then i would give<BR>them a couple of chances to back out and if they don't take the hint then frag<BR>them.&nbsp; After all if Psi Corp can't have them then i am damn sure they won't let<BR>anyone else get the chance (assuming the name psi-corp in your world is the same<BR>as the one i am thinking about.<BR><BR>If you got the party in this situation then come up with a good reason why some<BR>critical bit of info was either not identified or was identified incorrectly.<BR><BR>Either way good luck !<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 20:37:42 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question.....<BR><BR>"David C. Broussard" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; This reminds me of a conversation my wife and I had when Space Rangers was<BR>&gt; on TV.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; She made the comment that why are these people in space using slug throwers.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; My comment was that the slug thrower is much like the sword.&nbsp; It is simple,<BR>&gt; cheap, and efficient.&nbsp; Energy weapons are expensive, complex, and fragile.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Thus, unless there is a darn good reason (armour so good that slug throwers<BR>&gt; will not work is a good one), there is little reason to use anything other<BR>&gt; then a slug thrower.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>You mean apart from the fact that every time you fire it you will have to<BR>remember exactly what G world/area you are in and compensate the aim point.<BR><BR>FGMP-15 it's the only way to be sure :-)<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 20:40:51 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; http://www.fasa.com/PressReleases/PRClose.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; 25 January 2001<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; After 20 happy-and difficult-years in business, FASA Corporation is<BR>&gt; closing its doors<BR><BR>Thanks for everything guys.&nbsp; I have spent many an enjoyable evening popping gauss<BR>gun shells off at other mech's heads and Shadowrunning with my old crew.<BR><BR>Things won't be quite the same anymore.<BR><BR>Take care and all the best<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 20:57:00 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>Megan Robertson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In-Reply-To: &lt;F1474lX0hyiqLQxDqoN00000b21@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Greetings dear hearts.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;snip&gt;.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; There's a few thoughts off the top of my head...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hugs and kisses,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mexal.<BR><BR>Your GOOD!!<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:03:21 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Azhanti HL<BR><BR>I hope this new reprinting of the CT books hasn't dropped the value of<BR>my lovely (virtually mint) AHL<BR><BR>&lt;listens carefully for any noises of envy&gt;<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 20:37:42 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question.....<BR><BR>"David C. Broussard" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; This reminds me of a conversation my wife and I had when Space Rangers was<BR>&gt; on TV.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; She made the comment that why are these people in space using slug throwers.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; My comment was that the slug thrower is much like the sword.&nbsp; It is simple,<BR>&gt; cheap, and efficient.&nbsp; Energy weapons are expensive, complex, and fragile.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Thus, unless there is a darn good reason (armour so good that slug throwers<BR>&gt; will not work is a good one), there is little reason to use anything other<BR>&gt; then a slug thrower.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>You mean apart from the fact that every time you fire it you will have to<BR>remember exactly what G world/area you are in aX-Mozilla-Status: 0009point.<BR><BR>FGMP-15 it's the only way to be sure :-)<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 20:40:51 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; http://www.fasa.com/PressReleases/PRClose.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; 25 January 2001<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; After 20 happy-and difficult-years in business, FASA Corporation is<BR>&gt; closing its doors<BR><BR>Thanks for everything guys.&nbsp; I have spent many an enjoyable evening popping gauss<BR>gun shells off at other mech's X-Mozilla-Status: 0009g with my old crew.<BR><BR>Things won't be quite the same anymore.<BR><BR>Take care and all the best<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 20:57:00 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>Megan Robertson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In-Reply-To: &lt;F1474lX0hyiqLQxDqoN00000b21@hotmail.com&gt;X-Mozilla-Status: 0009rts.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;snip&gt;.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; There's a few thoughts off the top of my head...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hugs and kisses,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mexal.<BR><BR>Your GOOD!!<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:03:21 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Azhanti HL<BR><BR>I hope this new reprinting of the CT books hasn't dropped the value of<BR>my lovely (virtually mint) AHL<BR><BR>&lt;listens carefully for any noises of envy&gt;<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:07:47 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; http://www.fasa.com/PressReleases/PRClose.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; 25 January 2001<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; After 20 happy-and difficult-years in business, FASA Corporation is<BR>&gt; closing its doors<BR><BR>Thanks for everything guys.&nbsp; I have spent many an enjoyable evening<BR>popping gauss<BR>gun shells off at other mech's or shadowrunning with my old crew.<BR><BR>Things won't be quite the same anymore.<BR><BR>Take care and all the best<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3568<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-za04.mx.aol.com (rly-za04.mail.aol.com [172.31.36.100]) by air-za04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 16:06:42 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-za04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 16:06:17 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id QAA40580;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 16:04:53 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sun, 28 Jan 2001 16:04:05 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id QAA40399<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 16:04:05 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 16:04:05 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101282104.QAA40399@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3568<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></BIG></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3569</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/28/01 4:12:27 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sunday, January 28 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3569<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Azhanti HL<BR>Re: Water merchants<BR>Re: More Interstellar War Thoughts (semi-long)<BR>Re: Challenger Anniversary<BR>Re: Scary thoughts....<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>RE: Question.....<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Azhanti HL<BR>Re: More Interstellar War Thoughts (semi-long)<BR>Re: FASA closes<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>Re: Question on Jump<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Xboat Spam [Was:Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?]<BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:07:59 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>Megan Robertson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In-Reply-To: &lt;F1474lX0hyiqLQxDqoN00000b21@hotmail.com&gt;X-X-Mozilla-Status: 0009s.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;snip&gt;.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; There's a few thoughts off the top of my head...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hugs and kisses,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mexal.<BR><BR>Your GOOD!!<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:08:08 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Azhanti HL<BR><BR>I hope this new reprinting of the CT books hasn't dropped the value of<BR>my lovely (virtually mint) AHL<BR><BR>&lt;listens carefully for any noises of envy&gt;<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:08:23 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Water merchants<BR><BR>Gordon Horne wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;For some reason I'm picturing customs officials on the way out of<BR>&gt; &gt;the system saying "Are you sure you wouldn't like a tinkle break<BR>&gt; &gt;before you leave, sirs? No, really, we insist."<BR><BR>Just sit them down at a competition table at any major con, give them<BR>some dice to roll and wait for 90 mins.<BR><BR>:-)<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 12:59:18 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: More Interstellar War Thoughts (semi-long)<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; It is difficult to believe that with advances in radio telescopy and<BR>&gt; similar technologies, that the United Nations did not know ahead of<BR>&gt; time that there were "aliens" at Barnard's Star.&nbsp; Let's assume for a<BR>&gt; moment that the Terrans invented jump drive from first principles (as<BR>&gt; has been stated before in these threads) and not from a derelict Vilani<BR>&gt; starship.&nbsp; Instead of going to Alpha Centauri, a much closer star<BR>&gt; system with a relatively Sol-like sun, they headed toward Barnard "for<BR>&gt; various scientific reasons" (radio intercepts, maybe?).<BR><BR>Actually, Barnard's Star isn't all that far from Earth. It's one of the<BR>5 or 6 nearest stars, as I recall. I also vaguely recall that while<BR>Alpha Centauri is closer, things sort of "thin out" from there on. <BR><BR>To use Traveller Terms, AC isn't on a "main". Maybe Barnards *is*?<BR>That'd be a good reason for jumping to it. <BR><BR>&gt; BTW, the contention that the Terrans invented jump drive from first<BR>&gt; principles seems flawed on further study.&nbsp; For instance, Vilani jump<BR>&gt; theory is noted as being flawed, preventing the development of any jump<BR>&gt; number higher than two.&nbsp; The Terrans went from Jump 1 to Jump 2 rather<BR>&gt; rapidly, but then took nearly 200 years to achieve Jump 3.&nbsp; Other<BR>&gt; technologies did not lag in this regard - the TCN was purchasing TL 12<BR>&gt; robots only 12 years after the discovery of Jump 2 (TL 11), but 176<BR>&gt; years before the development of TL 12 jump technology.&nbsp; This could be<BR>&gt; chalked up to the Terrans working with the same flawed jump theories as<BR>&gt; the Vilani, which would have had to have been accepted in terrestrial<BR>&gt; scientific circles before the construction of the first Jump 1, and<BR>&gt; long before official contact with the Vilani.<BR><BR>Or it could be that Terran theory was equally flawed. And that adding<BR>in Vilani theory merely muddied the waters further. And the fact that<BR>the Vilani had been unable to do better after trying for thousands of<BR>years has to have an effect as well. If the terrans don't make a<BR>breakthrough in the first decade or so, it's liable to be like fusion<BR>reasearch where we've been "20 years from working units" for the last<BR>50 years. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 12:56:29 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Challenger Anniversary<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; I was there.&nbsp; Standing on the beach, telling my friends that it was so damn<BR>&gt; cool that normal folks were finally going up.&nbsp; The last thing i remember is<BR>&gt; saying "No, that's not right.."<BR><BR>&lt;wince&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; *sigh*<BR><BR>&gt; But a few months after the event, Bay Area filkers had a memorial concert.<BR>&gt; This was one of the ypbeat songs, and since I prefer hope of sadness, I'm<BR>&gt; playing it here.&nbsp; Remember, we now have the ISS up!<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; BTW, I think it is long out of print, but if you can find the Challenger<BR>&gt; Memorial tape, it is well worth it.<BR><BR>I've got one, and *I'm* not parting with mine. But I do need to get it<BR>and my other tapes onto CDs one of these days...<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:22:32 GMT<BR>From: "John G. Wood" &lt;elvwood@ntlworld.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Scary thoughts....<BR><BR>"Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; "Groat: Herbivore native to Fulacin in the Rhylanor subsector."<BR><BR>I've just finished reading "A Civil Campaign" (the latest Vorkosigan book) <BR>and they scatter groats on the ground at the emperor's wedding. I hope they <BR>sedated the poor beasts first...<BR><BR>John<BR>http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:22:38 GMT<BR>From: "John G. Wood" &lt;elvwood@ntlworld.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>Apologies for the late reply; I haven't been able to get to the TML for a <BR>week and now have a backlog of almost 500 messages to sort through...<BR><BR>Shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson) wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Very true, but have any of these prevented you from adopting <BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; technology to apply them?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; No, but in our history the problems the rules were set up to prevent <BR>&gt; &gt; have never included "disaster caused by over-reliance on unsustainable <BR>&gt; &gt; technology".<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Actually, that *has* happened to *several* cultures right here on<BR>&gt; Earth. The folks who built Angkor Wat to name the best known example. I<BR>&gt; forget the exact details of that one.<BR><BR>I wasn't saying there had been no such disasters, just that they had not led <BR>to changes in the rules governing behaviour. I thought the people involved <BR>either died out or moved elsewhere and continued to use the technology. <BR>However:<BR><BR>&gt; Another was a culture in Mexico(?) that had extensive irrigation<BR>&gt; systems using water from a huge dam they'd built up over several<BR>&gt; generations.&nbsp; Then the dam failed. And they realized there was no way<BR>&gt; to get it repaired well enough to grow the crops they'd need to support<BR>&gt; the current population. So they just abandoned their "city", and spread<BR>&gt; back out into the surrounding territories so that they'd be able to<BR>&gt; live off the land (luckily they still knew how). <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; And that was the end of agriculture in *that* area. <BR><BR>OK, I was wrong about there being no examples. If I had remembered this I <BR>would have used it in support of my position (which is that, in the right <BR>circumstances, a disaster caused by over-reliance on unsustainable <BR>technology could lead to a long-term distrust of that technology).<BR><BR>Do you happen to know how long their non-agricultural society lasted?<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; A perfect example. If controlling population by preventing new births <BR>&gt; &gt; had been seen as more important than new ways of killing the neighbours <BR>&gt; &gt; - or even if it had been given the same priority as saving people's <BR>&gt; &gt; lives - how soon would we have had reliable contraception?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I hate to point this out, but there was a simple method of dealing with<BR>&gt; unwanted births, practiced pretty much uniformly around the world until<BR>&gt; you get cities and not much wildreness near them.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; It's called "exposure". You take that baby out from the village and<BR>&gt; leave it.<BR><BR>My use of the phrase "by preventing new births" was a deliberate attempt to <BR>exclude exposure from the discussion, but it probably made the example too <BR>contrived to be useful. Exposure doesn't solve the problem of the mother <BR>being occupied unproductively for a couple of months (or else damaging her <BR>health by carrying on as normal).<BR><BR>Seed: Many worlds have large uninhabitable areas near settlements, so <BR>exposure becomes a viable method of population control. Some worlds start <BR>using it, to the horror of their neighbours. Is it a Hiver plot to reduce <BR>the negative reaction they get from fumigating unwanted larvae?<BR><BR>John<BR>http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:22:45 GMT<BR>From: "John G. Wood" &lt;elvwood@ntlworld.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &gt; Very true, but have any of these prevented you from adopting<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;&nbsp; technology to apply them?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;No, but in our history the problems the rules were set up to prevent<BR>&gt; &gt;have never included "disaster caused by over-reliance on unsustainable<BR>&gt; &gt;technology".<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Mesopotamia, Easter Island and the American Mid-West (ongoing). To <BR>&gt; our credit we are developing rules to slow or halt the last.<BR>[Snip]<BR><BR>I wasn't disputing that there have been such disasters, just saying that <BR>they hadn't affected our "deep" cultural rules. See my (equally-late) reply <BR>to Leonard for more details.<BR><BR>I'm glad we are finally beginning to develop these rules, but I think it'll <BR>be (at the very least) another generation before it can really be called a <BR>fundamental aspect of Western culture.<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;And if<BR>&gt; &gt;children had been seen as men's responsibility rather than women's,<BR>&gt; &gt;would we now be using male pills?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; An excellent point. Just to comment on the particular example, it <BR>&gt; seems at the moment that the male pill has even nastier side effects <BR>&gt; than the female variety, which is an unpleasant little beast itself. <BR><BR>Acknowledged; Ian Ferguson said something similar.<BR><BR>&gt; How would this effect our choice?<BR><BR>Depends on how important men are seen to be in this hypothetical society...<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;ObTrav: A lot of worlds IMTU have higher environmental tech than their<BR>&gt; &gt;UWP rating, because they need it to survive and it is therefore a<BR>&gt; &gt;priority. With millennia of settlement on non-Earthlike worlds I can see<BR>&gt; &gt;this being a common attitude.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; That's a good idea, but it adds another item to the list of things <BR>&gt; the UWP tech code is not.<BR><BR>Ever since World Builder's Handbook I've treated the UWP tech rating as an <BR>average value (with "average" carefully undefined).<BR><BR>&lt;Handwave&gt;<BR>The UWP is a Vilani-designed scale that has been expanded but not <BR>fundamentally altered since the Ziru Sirka, and it reflects Vilani cultural <BR>biases (Solomani based biotech, for example, is much more advanced than <BR>their overall rating would suggest).<BR><BR>The ZS concentrated on colonising fairly earthlike (vlandlike?) worlds. As a <BR>result their environmental tech lagged, and this is reflected in the UWP. <BR>Worlds ignored by the Vilani but colonised during the Ramshackle Empire (or <BR>later) often faced more difficult problems and have correspondingly higher <BR>envirotech.<BR>&lt;/Handwave&gt;<BR><BR>How's that?<BR><BR>&gt; Weren't you inspired by impossible worlds <BR>&gt; to be creative? According to the rules, you were supposed to be 8^) <BR><BR>I like to exercise my creativity in moderation. ;-)<BR><BR>&gt; You still run into the problem that the infrastructure to support a <BR>&gt; high environmental tech locally requires a larger population than <BR>&gt; many worlds which need it have.<BR><BR>&lt;Sigh&gt; And they're not allowed to use robots, either. Perhaps it's a good <BR>job I don't have an active Traveller group at the moment. 8-(<BR><BR>John<BR>http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 15:31:46 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question.....<BR><BR>&gt; You mean apart from the fact that every time you fire it you will have to<BR>&gt; remember exactly what G world/area you are in aX-Mozilla-Status:<BR>&gt; 0009point.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; FGMP-15 it's the only way to be sure :-)<BR><BR>If you have to make a slug thrower that will be used in varying gravity, you<BR>simply have adjustable sights.&nbsp; An advanced slug thrower would have<BR>automatically adjustable sights.&nbsp; Such things are possible now...but not<BR>used because zeroing a slug thrower is very easy, and most importantly at<BR>the distances slug throwers are used...the variance of the drop is very very<BR>slight.<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 15:31:51 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>On 01/28/01 at 02:49 PM,&nbsp; Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;On Sun, 28 Jan 2001, Dominic Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:21:26&nbsp; "Michael McKeown" <BR>&gt;&gt; &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt; writes:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;Last Unicorn Games and Mayfair as well....<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; LUG was voluntary - WotC bought them out. Not a business failure.<BR><BR>&gt;I don't know how voluntary it was, but the consequences have only<BR>&gt;been negative.&nbsp; They lost Star Trek, they lost Dune, and many of<BR>&gt;them lost their jobs.<BR><BR>That's all too, too, true.&nbsp; OTOH, and AFAIK, LUG wasn't in financial trouble, but just got an offer they didn't want to refuse. <BR><BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 13:10:33 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; ObTrav: Imagine a glut of mailing-list posts accumulating from 11,000<BR>&gt;&gt; worlds, arriving in one big batch from the latest Xboat :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; For that matter, estimate what percentage of the total capacity of the<BR>&gt; Xboat system is used to shuffle about 11,000 worlds-worth of spam -<BR>&gt; noting of course that travel-time delays don't allow for silly WWW<BR>&gt; tricks, so the messages themselves have to include all the gimmicks.<BR><BR>You won't see much spam via x-boats. For several reasons.<BR><BR>First, the *sender* has to pay for the message. Especially for big ones<BR>with "all the gimmicks".<BR><BR>Second, due to time lag and cultural differences between worlds, the<BR>rate of return *sucks* so badly it's not worth it. Also, if they *are*<BR>interested in your product they can get it two weeks faster locally. <BR><BR>Finally, due to the complaints, and the "chokepoint" provided by the<BR>facilities that collect email for X-boat transmission, and the only<BR>that feed it into the local nets, it'll be rather thoroughly filtered.<BR>You won't be able to play the games with "spoofed" headers. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:47:57 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Azhanti HL<BR><BR>on 28/1/01 9:03 pm, Simon Brodie at mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I hope this new reprinting of the CT books hasn't dropped the value of<BR>&gt; my lovely (virtually mint) AHL<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;listens carefully for any noises of envy&gt;<BR><BR>Perhaps it will be worth more if you post this a few more times? :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 15:52:55 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: More Interstellar War Thoughts (semi-long)<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; In mail [Gerry Haris] wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; It is difficult to believe that with advances in radio telescopy and<BR>&gt; &gt; similar technologies, that the United Nations did not know ahead of<BR>&gt; &gt; time that there were "aliens" at Barnard's Star.&nbsp; Let's assume for a<BR>&gt; &gt; moment that the Terrans invented jump drive from first principles (as<BR>&gt; &gt; has been stated before in these threads) and not from a derelict Vilani<BR>&gt; &gt; starship.&nbsp; Instead of going to Alpha Centauri, a much closer star<BR>&gt; &gt; system with a relatively Sol-like sun, they headed toward Barnard "for<BR>&gt; &gt; various scientific reasons" (radio intercepts, maybe?).<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Actually, Barnard's Star isn't all that far from Earth. It's one of the<BR>&gt; 5 or 6 nearest stars, as I recall. I also vaguely recall that while<BR>&gt; Alpha Centauri is closer, things sort of "thin out" from there on.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; To use Traveller Terms, AC isn't on a "main". Maybe Barnards *is*?<BR>&gt; That'd be a good reason for jumping to it.<BR><BR>Note also that, according to GT: Rim of Fire, the European Union had<BR>launched a sublight colony ship to Alpha Centauri in -2468, over 40<BR>years before the American jump-drive expedition to Barnard's Star.&nbsp; One<BR>explanation for the US Space Force's choice of Barnard's Star, rather<BR>than Alpha Centauri, for the first interstellar jump expedition is that<BR>"the Americans simply wanted to avoid playing messenger for the new<BR>Prometheus [Alpha Centauri] colony." [See GT:RoF, pages 39-40 for<BR>further details.]<BR><BR>Depending on the Illumination of your campaign, these details may<BR>&lt;fnord&gt;. <BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; BTW, the contention that the Terrans invented jump drive from first<BR>&gt; &gt; principles seems flawed on further study.<BR><BR>Both Marc Miller and Loren Wiseman have stated that the True Men (we<BR>few, we happy few, we band of Terrans) developed the jump drive from<BR>first principles.&nbsp; It seems, Citizen Gerry, that you ought to report to<BR>the nearest available Funtime Re-Education Center to be reminded of the<BR>truth of Terran/Solomani discovery of the jump drive....<BR><BR>&lt;&lt;snip&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:45:26 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FASA closes<BR><BR>At 16:04 -0500 28/1/01,&nbsp; Gregory Carl Kettler <BR>&lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; LUG was voluntary - WotC bought them out. Not a business failure.<BR>&gt;I don't know how voluntary it was, but the consequences have only been<BR>&gt;negative.&nbsp; They lost Star Trek, they lost Dune, and many of them lost<BR>&gt;their jobs.<BR><BR>If it isn't a hostile takeover, nor a bail out (and LUG were <BR>allegedly doing okay) then it is a voluntary act on the part of the <BR>company's owners.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 17:05:43 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>&gt;And if children had been seen as men's responsibility rather than women's, <BR>&gt;would we now be using male pills?<BR><BR>Missed this the first time around, so I'm not sure who said it. Anyway....<BR><BR>There is a more fundamental problem with male birth control pills. You only <BR>have to stop one egg, but you have to stop lots and lots of sperm (and *all* <BR>the time too). It's "problematic", as they say.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 22:10:45 GMT<BR>From: "John G. Wood" &lt;elvwood@ntlworld.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &gt; &gt; ...But I'm a planetary<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;&nbsp; &gt; gearhead (do we need a name for this?)...<BR>&gt; I like rockheads. Loren, do you want to claim credit for coining the term?<BR><BR>If not, I will. I've certainly used it on the TML in the past; if Loren <BR>invented the phrase it was either independent creation or subconscious <BR>imitation on my part.<BR><BR>I also coined the term "meathead" for character creation gearheads...<BR><BR>John<BR>http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 16:41:02 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Question on Jump<BR><BR>On 01/26/01 at 10:15 PM,&nbsp; Damage169@cs.com said:<BR><BR>&gt;Anthony Jackson writes:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; William Lane writes:<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &gt; I have always been under the understanding that if a Jump 2 ship jumps 2<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &gt; par secs it took a week in time. and that a jump 6 ship could do a 2<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; &gt; parsec jump in say a 3rd of a week. is this true? or is this wrong?<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; It's wrong.&nbsp; All jumps take a week.<BR><BR>&gt;Another question: Do all jumps take the same amount of fuel? Does a<BR>&gt;Jump 4&nbsp; engine use the same amount of fuel to jump 2 parsecs as it<BR>&gt;uses to jump 4&nbsp; parsecs? Or is the fuel usage based on distance? I<BR>&gt;know I used to know the&nbsp; answer to this, but I can't for the life<BR>&gt;of me remember the answer OR find me&nbsp; LBBs.<BR><BR>I think, originally the rules said that a Jump 4 engine took 40% of<BR>the ship's volume to jump *any* distance from 1 to 4.&nbsp; I never<BR>played it that way, though, and I think, eventually, the "jump<BR>governor" was introduced in ?JTAS? as an option.&nbsp; (Yes, I know it<BR>showed up in HG, too, but I vaguely remember it being in JTAS.)<BR><BR>Anyway, unless you want to get complicated, this formula works...<BR><BR>Fuel Needed = Ship volume x Parsecs jumped x 0.1<BR><BR>Eris&nbsp; <BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 09:37:25 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; First, the *sender* has to pay for the message. Especially for big ones<BR>&gt; with "all the gimmicks".<BR><BR>Yes, very true.&nbsp; This would probably be enough.&nbsp; Even 0.001 Cr/message<BR>would be enough to dissuade people from sending a few million copies<BR>of spam.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Second, due to time lag and cultural differences between worlds, the<BR>&gt; rate of return *sucks* so badly it's not worth it. Also, if they *are*<BR>&gt; interested in your product they can get it two weeks faster locally. <BR><BR>When have either of these ever crossed the mind of a real-life<BR>spammer?&nbsp; I have heard of *one* spammer getting $10 from some idiot,<BR>*once*.&nbsp; i.e. drastically lower returns than begging on the streets,<BR>as well as being less dignified and causing a lot more hassle to<BR>others.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Finally, due to the complaints, and the "chokepoint" provided by the<BR>&gt; facilities that collect email for X-boat transmission, and the only<BR>&gt; that feed it into the local nets, it'll be rather thoroughly<BR>&gt; filtered.&nbsp; You won't be able to play the games with "spoofed"<BR>&gt; headers.<BR><BR>You will, but it will no doubt be a lot harder.&nbsp; I expect it will also<BR>be considered defrauding the Imperium, with heavy penalties.&nbsp; Outside<BR>a typical spammer's expertise and risk tolerance.<BR><BR>However, I don't doubt that unsolicited commercial email will still<BR>exist -- there will no doubt still be people sending stuff across<BR>interstellar space, for expansion into millions of copies at the<BR>*destination* world.&nbsp; Whether due to some loose coalition of spammers<BR>or just another marketing company (or both) depends on how much<BR>trouble and cost is involved in using a world's local net.&nbsp; This would<BR>put less load on the Xboats of course.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:19:08 -0500<BR>From: Thom Jones-Low &lt;tjoneslo@together.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Xboat Spam [Was:Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?]<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 14:48:36 -0000<BR>&gt; From: "Alistair J. R. Young" &lt;avatar@arkane.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: &nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; ObTrav: Imagine a glut of mailing-list posts accumulating from 11,000<BR>&gt; &gt; worlds, arriving in one big batch from the latest Xboat :)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; For that matter, estimate what percentage of the total capacity of the<BR>&gt; Xboat system is used to shuffle about 11,000 worlds-worth of spam -<BR>&gt; noting of course that travel-time delays don't allow for silly WWW<BR>&gt; tricks, so the messages themselves have to include all the gimmicks.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; (For extra credit, how many copies of "ILOVEYOU.vbs" are still floating<BR>&gt; about in the system, despite all efforts to eradicate it...)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Alistair<BR>&gt; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; What exactly do you think the xboat pilots do for the entire week they<BR>trapped in a Jumpspace? They weed spam and script-kiddie viruses. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thomas Jones-Low<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; tjoneslo@together.net<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 15:08:53 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Apologies for the late reply; I haven't been able to get to the TML for a <BR>&gt; week and now have a backlog of almost 500 messages to sort through...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson) wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; Very true, but have any of these prevented you from adopting <BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; technology to apply them?<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; No, but in our history the problems the rules were set up to prevent <BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; have never included "disaster caused by over-reliance on unsustainable <BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; technology".<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Another was a culture in Mexico(?) that had extensive irrigation<BR>&gt;&gt; systems using water from a huge dam they'd built up over several<BR>&gt;&gt; generations.&nbsp; Then the dam failed. And they realized there was no way<BR>&gt;&gt; to get it repaired well enough to grow the crops they'd need to support<BR>&gt;&gt; the current population. So they just abandoned their "city", and spread<BR>&gt;&gt; back out into the surrounding territories so that they'd be able to<BR>&gt;&gt; live off the land (luckily they still knew how). <BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; And that was the end of agriculture in *that* area. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; OK, I was wrong about there being no examples. If I had remembered this I <BR>&gt; would have used it in support of my position (which is that, in the right <BR>&gt; circumstances, a disaster caused by over-reliance on unsustainable <BR>&gt; technology could lead to a long-term distrust of that technology).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Do you happen to know how long their non-agricultural society lasted?<BR><BR>Nope, but at a guess, I'd say it lasted until more advanced socities<BR>displaced them. Say 500 to 1000 years.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; A perfect example. If controlling population by preventing new births <BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; had been seen as more important than new ways of killing the neighbours <BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; - or even if it had been given the same priority as saving people's <BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; lives - how soon would we have had reliable contraception?<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; I hate to point this out, but there was a simple method of dealing with<BR>&gt;&gt; unwanted births, practiced pretty much uniformly around the world until<BR>&gt;&gt; you get cities and not much wildreness near them.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; It's called "exposure". You take that baby out from the village and<BR>&gt;&gt; leave it.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; My use of the phrase "by preventing new births" was a deliberate attempt to <BR>&gt; exclude exposure from the discussion, but it probably made the example too <BR>&gt; contrived to be useful. Exposure doesn't solve the problem of the mother <BR>&gt; being occupied unproductively for a couple of months (or else damaging her <BR>&gt; health by carrying on as normal).<BR><BR>Actually, in such societies (and even to a great extent in *ours*)<BR>"carrying on as normal" *doesn't* have any major long term health<BR>effects on most women.<BR><BR>It's just that the exceptions tend to be rather serious. It tends<BR>towards an all or nothing sistuation.<BR><BR>&gt; Seed: Many worlds have large uninhabitable areas near settlements, so <BR>&gt; exposure becomes a viable method of population control. Some worlds start <BR>&gt; using it, to the horror of their neighbours. Is it a Hiver plot to reduce <BR>&gt; the negative reaction they get from fumigating unwanted larvae?<BR><BR>I seem to recall that in some cultures, the child was exposed for a set<BR>period of time (overnight?) and if it was alive when they went to<BR>check, the mother got to keep it, because it was the "will of the gods"<BR>or some such.<BR><BR>BTW, exposure is *still* used even in the US. Look up "dumpster babies"<BR>:-(<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3569<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yc05.mx.aol.com (rly-yc05.mail.aol.com [172.18.149.37]) by air-yc04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:12:27 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yc05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:12:00 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id TAA47845;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:11:13 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:11:05 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id TAA47546<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:11:05 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:11:05 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101290011.TAA47546@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3569<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3570</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/28/01 10:13:53 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Monday, January 29 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3570<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR>RE: Commie Atheist Films (was: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3417)<BR>Re: Xboat Spam [Was:Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?]<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Question on Jump<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: More Interstellar War Thoughts (semi-long)<BR>Re: StarCom Communications<BR>Schlock Mail<BR>Re: More Interstellar War Thoughts (semi-long)<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Question.....<BR>Another Andromeda/Traveller Moment<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Question.....<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 15:14:58 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and tech levels [LONG]<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Gordon Horne &lt;gordon.horne@home.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &gt; Very true, but have any of these prevented you from adopting<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt;&nbsp; technology to apply them?<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;No, but in our history the problems the rules were set up to prevent<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;have never included "disaster caused by over-reliance on unsustainable<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;technology".<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Mesopotamia, Easter Island and the American Mid-West (ongoing). To <BR>&gt;&gt; our credit we are developing rules to slow or halt the last.<BR>&gt; [Snip]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I wasn't disputing that there have been such disasters, just saying that <BR>&gt; they hadn't affected our "deep" cultural rules. See my (equally-late) reply <BR>&gt; to Leonard for more details.<BR><BR>They haven't affected *our* rules, because we aren't descended from<BR>those cultures. <BR><BR>&gt; I'm glad we are finally beginning to develop these rules, but I think it'll <BR>&gt; be (at the very least) another generation before it can really be called a <BR>&gt; fundamental aspect of Western culture.<BR><BR>Probably longer. &lt;sigh&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; You still run into the problem that the infrastructure to support a <BR>&gt;&gt; high environmental tech locally requires a larger population than <BR>&gt;&gt; many worlds which need it have.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;Sigh&gt; And they're not allowed to use robots, either. Perhaps it's a good <BR>&gt; job I don't have an active Traveller group at the moment. 8-(<BR><BR>Oddly, there are examples from the last 10-20 years that argue that<BR>recycling *doesn't* need to be "high tech". <BR><BR>There are sewage treatment systems that essentially consist of a series<BR>of artifical "marshes". Sewage goes in one end, and drinkable water<BR>comes out the other. The final stage ponds are often used to raise fish<BR>(tilpia). <BR><BR>And the "reeds"/"marsh grass" in the initial stages take up things like<BR>heavy metals, and can be burned to produce an ash that is worth<BR>processing for them.<BR><BR>This takes up some space, but adds in a *lot* of ecological "buffering"<BR>for the habitat. Remember, as a general rule, the more living biomass<BR>you have, the more stable the system is. <BR><BR>As an added bonus, this would also recycle air fairly well.<BR><BR>With small nukes or things like fusion torches, carving out *large*<BR>cavern systems isn't that hard. <BR><BR>BTW, a world using this sort of "air plant"[1], will encourage ships to<BR>empty their sewage holding tanks, as things like nitrogen and<BR>phosphorus are the limiting materials for their ecosystem. They can<BR>*afford* to swap water for sewage on a kilo for kilo basis.<BR><BR>Well, hydrogen is a bit of a limit too, but that's more easily obtained<BR>by visiting the local gas giant or comet. <BR><BR>[1] reference to an incident in one of George O. Smith's "Venus<BR>Equilateral" stories. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:42:37 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Commie Atheist Films (was: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3417)<BR><BR>&gt;I wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Many artists in the new and idealistic Soviet Union would latch onto this<BR>&gt;&gt; movement and identify with it, and their works would define the<BR>&gt;&gt; Constructivist style. In the early 30s, the Soviets would decide that an<BR>&gt;&gt; artistic movement known as Socialist Realism was "better" and they would<BR>&gt;&gt; discourage the creation of all forms of abstract art.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Alan Bradley wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;This is as good an example of what Stalinism means as anything else.<BR>&gt;&gt;Something creative, energetic and vibrant gets turned into its opposite.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; This was pretty much the way things were going across the Western world.<BR>Stalin discouraged abstract art, the Nazi regime discouraged abstract art,<BR>and did it a bit more forcefully than the Soviets did. Something similar,<BR>but more subtle, happened in the United States as well during World War II<BR>(basically, the "Madison Avenue" naturalist artists took on the "fine"<BR>artists of the day for government funding and recognition via propaganda<BR>posters, and won).<BR><BR>&gt;It sounds like the styles parallel the class divisions in the society.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; It would certainly appear that way.<BR><BR>&gt;(I hadn't noticed, because I don't know much about art.)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; It's worthwhile to poke around a bit, especially when you begin to discover<BR>that art, history, politics and a wide variety of other cultural pursuits<BR>are pretty closely tied together. Personally, I've always been most<BR>fascinated by the dawn of modern art and how it was connected with the<BR>political movements of the early-to-mid 20th century (which is a big part of<BR>the reason I usually don't get involved in the frequent "French-bashing"<BR>threads on this list &lt;g&gt;).<BR><BR>&gt;Probably not a coincidence.&nbsp; I will have to look out for this next time I<BR>see the film.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; It probably isn't a coincidence, as filmmakers at that point -- especially<BR>German filmmakers -- were influenced heavily by the motifs and themes of<BR>other artistic media. The filmmakers of that era weren't buffered, as many<BR>of them are today, by huge monolithic studios pathological terrified by the<BR>prospect of taking risks.<BR><BR>ObTrav: Coherent and consistent artistic movements would really add a lot to<BR>a game session or a campaign. As probably everyone reading this knows, those<BR>films which seem to have a sort of unifying theme running through their<BR>design tend to be most memorable. Blade Runner and Alien are perhaps two of<BR>the most striking examples (and it's no accident that they were both<BR>directed by the same guy). The problem with translating this sort of thing<BR>to a roleplaying game is that sessions are mostly oral&nbsp; in nature. It is<BR>possible to print out or design interesting visual works, but that's pretty<BR>problematic as no examples of modern Darmine art or Vilani folk art exist.<BR>Another problem is that the characters would be surrounded, at all times, by<BR>examples of art: industrial design, interior decoration (given the<BR>commonplace nature of interstellar travel, and the ubiquitous nature of<BR>relatively low-priced civilian starships, and the age of some of these<BR>ships, the variations could be rather astonishing), film, video, music (both<BR>live and recorded, there is a huge gulf of difference between the two),<BR>actual traditional media (photography, painting, and so on), and a host of<BR>media yet to be invented.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I'm at a loss as to how to get all of this from the GM's mind to the gaming<BR>table.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; One more or less "half-assed" solution is to have the characters rub<BR>shoulders with art and artists of all sorts. Players are notoriously<BR>imaginative, and they'll fill in the blanks from a few verbal cues. The<BR>"secret" to this is to tie these things together. Art -- much like the<BR>majority of human pursuits -- does not exist in a vaccuum. Influences and<BR>reactions will jump back and forth, and similar themes or motifs will<BR>characterize several different and seemingly unrelated artistic movements in<BR>a given era (cubism, jazz and film, for a real world example).<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; This isn't a perfect solution, but it should get the feel across.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 11:54:16 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Xboat Spam [Was:Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?]<BR><BR>Thom Jones-Low wrote:<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; What exactly do you think the xboat pilots do for the entire<BR>&gt; week they trapped in a Jumpspace? They weed spam and script-kiddie<BR>&gt; viruses.<BR><BR>Or some, burned-out after 12 years of virtually nothing but jumpspace<BR>and sleep, *write* spam and script-kiddie viruses while reading<BR>everybody's mail :)<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 00:59 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;3A74879C.FE64308@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>Thanks, Si... but that really was thrown together as I typed :-)<BR><BR>Maybe it's just that everything I hear/read sticks... and that EVERYTHING <BR>is analysed as 'how can this be woven into a game somewhere'!<BR><BR>Benefits (?) of over 23 years roleplaying.<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 20:12:06 -0500<BR>From: Thom Jones-Low &lt;tjoneslo@together.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 13:10:33 PST<BR>&gt; From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; You won't see much spam via x-boats. For several reasons.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; First, the *sender* has to pay for the message. Especially for big ones<BR>&gt; with "all the gimmicks".<BR>&gt; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Even when the sender pays, there will still be a fair amount of<BR>unsolicited advertising. Just think of how much junk mail you get<BR>through the post office. <BR><BR>&gt; Second, due to time lag and cultural differences between worlds, the<BR>&gt; rate of return *sucks* so badly it's not worth it. Also, if they *are*<BR>&gt; interested in your product they can get it two weeks faster locally.<BR>&gt; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; One of the current ideas behind advertising is building brand<BR>awareness. While spam may be looking for the instant response, most<BR>advertising is not. While the 3I may be somewhat more sophisticated in<BR>the art of Advertising, I can't imaging giving up the mass marketing<BR>approach. <BR><BR>&gt; Finally, due to the complaints, and the "chokepoint" provided by the<BR>&gt; facilities that collect email for X-boat transmission, and the only<BR>&gt; that feed it into the local nets, it'll be rather thoroughly filtered.<BR>&gt; You won't be able to play the games with "spoofed" headers.<BR>&gt; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; This may be the most limiting factor of the spam via xboat. The problem<BR>is not only will the xboat facilities (at both ends) filter obvious,<BR>illegal spam messages, but so can the recipient's computer. Sending a<BR>billion messages to a billion computers, almost all of them will be<BR>automatically deleted unread by the receiving computer. At TL12 even,<BR>the household communications system should be sophisticated enough to<BR>"read" through several thousand messages and keep only the offers you<BR>may be interested in. <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thomas Jones-Low<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; tjoneslo@together.net<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 00:49:01 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question on Jump<BR><BR>At 19:11 -0500 28/1/01,&nbsp; eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote:<BR>&gt;I think, originally the rules said that a Jump 4 engine took 40% of<BR>&gt;the ship's volume to jump *any* distance from 1 to 4.&nbsp; I never<BR>&gt;played it that way, though, and I think, eventually, the "jump<BR>&gt;governor" was introduced in ?JTAS? as an option.&nbsp; (Yes, I know it<BR>&gt;showed up in HG, too, but I vaguely remember it being in JTAS.)<BR><BR>It actually showed up in HG1 - I'm not sure if HG2 has the flavour text?<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 16:08:00 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; First, the *sender* has to pay for the message. Especially for big ones<BR>&gt;&gt; with "all the gimmicks".<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Yes, very true.&nbsp; This would probably be enough.&nbsp; Even 0.001 Cr/message<BR>&gt; would be enough to dissuade people from sending a few million copies<BR>&gt; of spam.<BR><BR>Well, do keep in mind that if you are *willing* to have it IDed as<BR>being multi-posted, you can send *on* copy of the message with a list<BR>of addresses for it to go to. <BR><BR>And *real* mailing lists will use "expanders". At each world the<BR>traffic for the list will go to a dummy address that then forwards the<BR>messages to the list members on that world. <BR><BR>And some of the member addresses will be expanders for subscribers at<BR>large domains. This last is done *now* to cut down on loading of servers.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Second, due to time lag and cultural differences between worlds, the<BR>&gt;&gt; rate of return *sucks* so badly it's not worth it. Also, if they *are*<BR>&gt;&gt; interested in your product they can get it two weeks faster locally. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; When have either of these ever crossed the mind of a real-life<BR>&gt; spammer?&nbsp; I have heard of *one* spammer getting $10 from some idiot,<BR>&gt; *once*.&nbsp; i.e. drastically lower returns than begging on the streets,<BR>&gt; as well as being less dignified and causing a lot more hassle to<BR>&gt; others.<BR><BR>The *commercial* spammers get a response that's enough to pay for the<BR>(minimal) time involved *and* to pay for the "throwaway" accounts they<BR>have to post from.<BR><BR>This will be reduced to non-existent for offworld messages. <BR><BR>Also, I doubt that spamming will survive as much as a century. <BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Finally, due to the complaints, and the "chokepoint" provided by the<BR>&gt;&gt; facilities that collect email for X-boat transmission, and the only<BR>&gt;&gt; that feed it into the local nets, it'll be rather thoroughly<BR>&gt;&gt; filtered.&nbsp; You won't be able to play the games with "spoofed"<BR>&gt;&gt; headers.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; You will, but it will no doubt be a lot harder.&nbsp; I expect it will also<BR>&gt; be considered defrauding the Imperium, with heavy penalties.&nbsp; Outside<BR>&gt; a typical spammer's expertise and risk tolerance.<BR><BR>Heck, *right now* it's arguably a federal felony to use false headers<BR>to get past filters (comes under the heading of "giving false<BR>information to gain access to a computer"). Just try getting a US<BR>Attorney to prosecute.<BR><BR>&gt; However, I don't doubt that unsolicited commercial email will still<BR>&gt; exist -- there will no doubt still be people sending stuff across<BR>&gt; interstellar space, for expansion into millions of copies at the<BR>&gt; *destination* world.&nbsp; Whether due to some loose coalition of spammers<BR>&gt; or just another marketing company (or both) depends on how much<BR>&gt; trouble and cost is involved in using a world's local net.&nbsp; This would<BR>&gt; put less load on the Xboats of course.<BR><BR>The commerical stuff is apt to be better done the same way real ads<BR>are. You contract with someone on the world in question to produce ads<BR>that are appropriate for the local culture. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 19:56:39 -0600<BR>From: "CDW" &lt;aremis@amaonline.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; One possibility is that the Megacorps would start issuing their own money.<BR>&gt; Especially the more widely diversified ones.&nbsp; It would be used between<BR>&gt; subsidiaries, keeping the funds "in-house" while allowing stronger growth.<BR><BR>It's not hard to imagine the former Vilani bureaux doing this.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 01:54:12 GMT<BR>From: TML@stempest.demon.co.uk (Stephen Tempest)<BR>Subject: Re: More Interstellar War Thoughts (semi-long)<BR><BR>Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt; writes:<BR><BR><BR>&gt;It is difficult to believe that with advances in radio telescopy and<BR>&gt;similar technologies, that the United Nations did not know ahead of<BR>&gt;time that there were "aliens" at Barnard's Star.&nbsp; <BR><BR>If the Vilani presence at Barnard's Star was a tiny, temporary<BR>outpost, it's unlikely to have been sending out much in the way of<BR>radio traffic that could be detected here.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; This has all the markings of an engineered conflict.<BR><BR>:-)<BR><BR>&gt;Over the ensuing decades there would have been a tightening of<BR>&gt;government control of all aspects of Terran life, both to keep a lid on<BR>&gt;potential rebellion, and to maintain the wartime economy necessary to<BR>&gt;fight the Vilani.&nbsp; This may have been the origins of the Solomani<BR>&gt;police state which arose centuries later.<BR><BR>Millennia later.&nbsp; However, the effective military dictatorship that<BR>was the Rule of Man probably started here.<BR><BR>&gt;Monitors are sublight<BR>&gt;warships which take years to plod between stars.&nbsp; Evidently they<BR>&gt;achieve a sizeable fraction of c as they move a half parsec every two<BR>&gt;years.&nbsp; <BR><BR>and, hopefully, they don't crash into the enemy planets when they<BR>reach them...<BR><BR>&gt;Since it takes four or more years to travel between star<BR>&gt;systems, one wonders how the crews were recruited for these efforts. <BR>&gt;We can surmise that the crew were in low berths to reduce life support<BR>&gt;problems, but the morale of crews separated from home and loved ones<BR>&gt;for years at a stretch is hard to fathom.&nbsp; In a free society without<BR>&gt;military conscription, operation tempo is a primary consideration for<BR>&gt;recruiting and retention and there is some effort to reduce the stress<BR>&gt;of long deployments on service members and their families.&nbsp; In<BR>&gt;authoritarian societies with military conscription, this does not<BR>&gt;matter.<BR><BR>Morale is often *higher* in a free society where public opinion is<BR>genuinely convinced that they're in a life-and-death struggle to<BR>defend their homes against an evil aggressor.&nbsp; <BR><BR>OTOH, I imagine life for the monitor crews could be like something out<BR>of Haldeman's "Forever War"...&nbsp; They wouldn't be away from their<BR>families for very long, but the family would be much older when they<BR>got back.<BR><BR>Then again, when I was playing Imperium I never bothered sending<BR>monitors through normal space - too slow to have any effect.&nbsp; If the<BR>game was double-blind or had fog of war, it might be another story.<BR><BR>&gt; This could be<BR>&gt;chalked up to the Terrans working with the same flawed jump theories as<BR>&gt;the Vilani, which would have had to have been accepted in terrestrial<BR>&gt;scientific circles before the construction of the first Jump 1, and<BR>&gt;long before official contact with the Vilani.<BR><BR>How about:<BR><BR>The Terrans developed Jump-1 in the late 21st century, by themselves.<BR><BR><BR>They encounter the Vilani, capture a few of their ships, and study<BR>their jump drives.&nbsp; They are astonished to find that these work on a<BR>different principle to their own, and are twice as effective!&nbsp; Copies<BR>of these drives are put into production immediately, giving the Terran<BR>fleets jump-2 capability. (initially these drives will be built at a<BR>TL higher than Earth's sustainable level, but the massive infusion of<BR>knowledge gained from studying the Vilani will quickly boost the rest<BR>of Terra's industry to TL11).<BR><BR>Some of Earth's scientists believe that jump-3 or greater is possible.<BR>However, information gained from the Vilani says jump-2 is the best<BR>you get, and the consensus on Earth is that since they've been<BR>building starships for thousands of years, they're probably right.<BR>The scientists are encouraged to direct their research into more<BR>productive areas.<BR><BR>Many years later, at about the time Professor Robert Meson is<BR>developing the weapon system that will bear his name, researchers dust<BR>off the old jump space theories, look at them again, and realise that<BR>jump-3 is possible after all.&nbsp; The result is Terra at TL12, the Nth<BR>Interstellar War and the defeat of the Ziru Sirka (as described in Rim<BR>of Fire).<BR><BR><BR>Stephen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:06:56 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: StarCom Communications<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>David said:<BR>&gt;Folks, you're gonna love this! It's a way to<BR>&gt;use meteor atmospheric trails for communications.<BR>[snip]<BR>&gt;<BR>http://www.starcomwireless.com/technology/articlereader.asp?tf=StarCom_Technology.txt<BR><BR><BR>As used by David Drake in at least one of his Slammers novels (the one that<BR>parallels the Tet Offensive).<BR><BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:27:45 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Schlock Mail<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Here's a letter to us all from Howard Tayler of Schlock Mercenary fame<BR>(http://www.schlockmercenary.com/):<BR>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+<BR>Open Letter, January 27th, 2001: You know how sometimes on the radio you'll<BR>hear a caller dedicate a song to someone who might or might not be<BR>listening to the station at that time?<BR><BR>Well, this open letter is like that. I've seen some message board and fan<BR>mail traffic lately indicating that somebody on the Traveller Mailing List<BR>happened across Schlock Mercenary and started a discussion of the science.<BR>I've not been a party to the discussion, but I've seen some amazing science<BR>come off of those lists and make its way onto the wide world of the web,<BR>including a treatise on using a can of ravioli as a weapon (which may make<BR>its way onto Chalain's Science Corner if we can ever properly credit the<BR>author.) Anyway, I finally got the following letter from Dean:<BR><BR>&gt;I've been reading Schlock for a few weeks, and frankly it rocks. There has<BR>been a lot of<BR>&gt;discussion of the strip on my &gt;mailing list recently... I think the first<BR>was my post on near-C<BR>&gt;rocks. Could you say hi to the guys on the TML for me (I need to<BR>&gt;find a way to end this sentence with the word 'rocks')<BR><BR>And so, a big plasma-powered howdy goes out to the fine folks on the<BR>Traveller Mailing List. You people play a smart, smart game, and I'm proud<BR>to find at least a few of you perusing my schlock. Someday when I'm a<BR>full-time cartoonist (if you tell all your friends about this strip, that<BR>day will come sooner rather than later), and I've got time for RPG's again,<BR>I expect an invitation to one of your games. And you need to let me bring<BR>the BH-209i with me. I'll leave the Teraport at home... I can understand<BR>you disallowing that. And if you've been having fun discussing Schlock<BR>Mercenary science, there's a great episode starting Sunday that involves<BR>Really Big Explosives.<BR>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 17:42:05 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: More Interstellar War Thoughts (semi-long)<BR><BR>On 28 Jan 01, at 8:13, Gerry Harris wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; The treaty of New York in 2022 would have had huge political<BR>&gt; ramifications.&nbsp; Putting a nation's armed forces under United Nations<BR>&gt; control would have been a blow to national sovereignty.&nbsp; While there is<BR>&gt; not a whole lot of information surrounding this treaty, one might draw<BR>&gt; several inferences from it and subsequent events.<BR><BR>Well, the Treaty of NY only "placed _much_ of the _major_ nation's armed <BR>forces" (GT:RoF, p39) under UN control, and the 1st IW was fought "by <BR>several national squadrons under a tenuous fleet control imposed by the <BR>UNSCA" (AM6, p5). So, I'd say whatever the Treaty of NY did it was either <BR>fairly limited or rather ineffective in practice. Most likely the treaty just <BR>implemented article 49(?) of the UN charter (which requires the member <BR>states to provide a list of forces available for UN deployment) and created a <BR>sort of small general staff to coordinate UN deployments.<BR><BR>&gt; One, something major must have happened bring the world's nation states<BR>&gt; to make such a momentous move.&nbsp; One possibility is that the world came<BR>&gt; to the brink of World War III during the first two decades of the 21st<BR>&gt; century, and this scared the people into forcing this move on their<BR>&gt; governments.<BR><BR>Its not really that big a deal. Its just the final implementation of an existing <BR>clause in the UN charter. Perhaps it was just a logical rationalisation of the <BR>haphazzard and costly UN deployments that have occured up till then. I <BR>see it as more like providing a more formalised framework for peacekeeping <BR>deployments than had been inplace before.<BR><BR>&gt; Secondly, there are going to be some nations not willing to surrender<BR>&gt; their national armed forces to some ultra-national organization.&nbsp; I<BR>&gt; cannot see some of the more fundamentalist Moslem countries, such as<BR>&gt; Iran, willy nilly turning over their armies to an organization pretty<BR>&gt; much run by the Satanic Western superpowers.&nbsp; Additionally, even within<BR>&gt; signatory nations there are going to be nationalists who will see such<BR>&gt; a treaty as a major threat.&nbsp; For instance, can one see certain segments<BR>&gt; of the U.S. (mostly Southern and Western) easily accepting such a blow<BR>&gt; to national sovereignty?&nbsp; There would be constant low-level rebellions<BR>&gt; going on all over the world.<BR><BR>But the minor nations (which is where you will find the fundamentalists and <BR>rapid military dicatorships) did not turn over their forces, only the major <BR>nations did. And if its just a formalised command framework, then the <BR>opposition would be much less. I don't think that there would have been <BR>that much violent opposition, though there might well have been some <BR>limited outbreaks of violence.<BR><BR>&gt; It is difficult to believe that with advances in radio telescopy and<BR>&gt; similar technologies, that the United Nations did not know ahead of<BR>&gt; time that there were "aliens" at Barnard's Star.&nbsp; Let's assume for a<BR>&gt; moment that the Terrans invented jump drive from first principles (as<BR>&gt; has been stated before in these threads) and not from a derelict Vilani<BR>&gt; starship.&nbsp; Instead of going to Alpha Centauri, a much closer star<BR>&gt; system with a relatively Sol-like sun, they headed toward Barnard "for<BR>&gt; various scientific reasons" (radio intercepts, maybe?).<BR><BR>This is a very popular consipracy theory in Traveller. Quite plausable.<BR><BR>[massive snip]<BR><BR>I really think you're jumping the gun. While the UN's power did increase in <BR>the 21st century, I don't think the evidence supports the level you are <BR>suggesting. Certainly it was not powerful enough to exercise more than <BR>tenative control during the 1st IW. The reorganisation that reduced the <BR>general assembly to powerlessness didn't occur until after the war.<BR><BR>The really big increase comes in the 22nd century after the 1st IW when <BR>Terra's survival is on the line. Then you'll get the widespread opposition and <BR>low-level rebellions.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 20:51:56 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; In-Reply-To: &lt;3A74879C.FE64308@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>&gt; Greetings dear hearts.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Thanks, Si... but that really was thrown together as I typed :-)<BR><BR>Gee, someone ese who "composes" replies the way I do. :-)<BR><BR>&gt; Maybe it's just that everything I hear/read sticks...<BR><BR>Well, with me it's "gist" of it that sticks. And pointers to where to<BR>find it if it's in a book. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 00:45:32 -0500<BR>From: "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question.....<BR><BR>&gt; If you have to make a slug thrower that will be used in varying gravity,<BR>you<BR>&gt; simply have adjustable sights.&nbsp; An advanced slug thrower would have<BR>&gt; automatically adjustable sights.&nbsp; Such things are possible now...but not<BR>&gt; used because zeroing a slug thrower is very easy, and most importantly at<BR>&gt; the distances slug throwers are used...the variance of the drop is very<BR>very<BR>&gt; slight.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; DCB<BR><BR>It's a little more complex than that. Consider varying atmospheric pressures<BR>and the effect of low G (or zero G) on recoil (i.e. reaction...remember<BR>Newton?). How embarrassing would it be in 1/2G to land on your butt as a<BR>result of every shot? Not good for morale and rate of fire. Especially since<BR>every shot misses because of a high pressure atmosphere. Then you throw the<BR>projectile weapon away because the atmosphere just happens to also be<BR>corrosive...<BR><BR>Projectile weapons would certainly have their uses, but by no means would<BR>they be "universal".<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 00:58:50 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: Dalton Spence &lt;dalton.spence@hwcn.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Another Andromeda/Traveller Moment<BR><BR>First we had the High Guard, then the Long Night and Ethically<BR>Challenged Merchants. Now we have a "friendly neighbourhood<BR>Traveller's Aid Society" distributing news, weather reports and<BR>mail while the merger of two major transport megacorps threaten the<BR>small independant merchant with extinction. Do any of these things<BR>from the new TV series Andromeda sound vaguely familiar? ;)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; @==================================================@<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Dalton S. Spence, B.Sc. &lt;dalton.spence@hwcn.org&gt; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Home Page: http://www.hwcn.org/~ag775/home.html&nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Family Motto: Virtute Acquiritur Honos&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |&nbsp; &nbsp; "Trade is the lifeblood of the Imperium."&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; Cleon I, First Emperor of the Third Imperium&nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Princess Leia intimidates the sinister petunia.&nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; FNORD!&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; @==================================================@<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 08:04:57 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>On Mon, 29 Jan 2001, Megan Robertson wrote:<BR>&gt; Benefits (?) of over 23 years roleplaying.<BR><BR>Gaah, it always discomforting to realise that roleplaying is so old a<BR>hobby. You have been playing almost as long as I have been in existence.<BR>B-)&nbsp; <BR><BR>Still, the hobby is younger here. I am of the second wave of roleplayers<BR>in Finland, there were some roleplayers in the beginning of the Eighties<BR>(a few people who started importing them). I started playing in 1988, when<BR>D&amp;D got translated. (As a matter of fact, very badly, it has been out of<BR>print for some eight years, and is still remembered for the awful<BR>translation. Seems that we could use better translators B-)<BR><BR>ObTrav:<BR>Having owned (Mega)Traveller for some ten years now, I refereed my first<BR>session yesterday. Went pretty well, I might do it a second time. B-)<BR><BR>Me, a collector? No way...<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 17:15:52 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question.....<BR><BR>Ray Rangel wrote:<BR>&gt; How embarrassing would it be in 1/2G to land on your butt as a<BR>&gt; result of every shot?<BR><BR>How unlikely would it be?&nbsp; It might happen once, the first time a<BR>given person uses a firearm of exceptionally high recoil in an low-G<BR>environment.&nbsp; I can't imagine any trained firearm user falling over,<BR>no matter what the gravity.&nbsp; People have a *lot* more mass than<BR>bullets.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Especially since every shot misses because of a high pressure<BR>&gt; atmosphere.<BR><BR>Why would a high pressure atmosphere make every shot miss, when you<BR>would otherwise expect to hit?&nbsp; In your explanation, remember that<BR>atmospheric pressure varies over Earth, too.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Then you throw the projectile weapon away because the atmosphere<BR>&gt; just happens to also be corrosive...<BR><BR>Any particular reason why corrosive atmospheres would be more likely<BR>to cause failure in a simple and robust projectile weapon than the<BR>complex interdependent set of components needed by an energy weapon?<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3570<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xa03.mx.aol.com (rly-xa03.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.72]) by air-xa01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 01:13:53 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xa03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 01:13:23 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id BAA60606;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 01:12:30 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 29 Jan 2001 01:12:09 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id BAA60561<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 01:12:09 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 01:12:09 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101290612.BAA60561@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3570<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3571</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/29/01 1:59:36 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Monday, January 29 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3571<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3567<BR>Re: Judges Guild online (was Cargonaut)<BR>Re: Question.....<BR>RE: Question.....<BR>RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR>RE: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR>Re: Azhanti HL<BR>RE: Question.....<BR>RE: Another Andromeda/Traveller Moment<BR>RE: Question.....<BR>RE: Question.....<BR>de-canonized material<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Another Andromeda/Traveller Moment<BR>Re: Another Andromeda/Traveller Moment<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3567<BR>Re: Question.....<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 00:51:23 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>On 01/29/01 at 08:04 AM,&nbsp; "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;On Mon, 29 Jan 2001, Megan Robertson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Benefits (?) of over 23 years roleplaying.<BR><BR>&gt;Gaah, it always discomforting to realise that roleplaying is so old<BR>&gt;a hobby. You have been playing almost as long as I have been in<BR>&gt;existence. B-)&nbsp; <BR><BR>LOL! Let me discomfort you a little more. I'm in my 27th year of roleplaying, *and* I was 23 when I officially started with the newly published D&amp;D. &lt;g&gt; I'd already been roleplaying through minitures, wargames and historical simulations for years, it just wasn't formally called that. <BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 09:01:03 -0000<BR>From: "Jeff Rowse" &lt;jeffrowse@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3567<BR><BR>In mail, Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&lt;SNIP&gt;<BR>I don't know how voluntary it was, but the consequences have only been<BR>negative.&nbsp; They lost Star Trek, they lost Dune, and many of them lost<BR>their jobs.<BR>&lt;/SNIP&gt;<BR><BR>A quick glance at the WotC website says that 'due to resource constraints <BR>and contractual issues', the Dune RPG has been cancelled completely.&nbsp; They <BR>have also "announced" that (their) Call of Cthulhu RPG has been rescheduled <BR>from October 2001 to January 2002 with NO follow-up products.<BR>I cannot help wondering if they had any idea, when they bought up all the <BR>rights to these titles, that they may not be publishing much - if anything.<BR>Are WotC now going to hold on to the IP rights and prevent anyone else doing <BR>anything with them, or are they going to be nice and say 'we can't do it, <BR>does nayone else want it?'&nbsp; I know which I would prefer, but I don't think <BR>it'll be what happens.<BR><BR>ObTrav:<BR>One of the PCs has a relative who works fora Little Company taken over by a <BR>Big Company.&nbsp; BC then 'realises' they need to downsize and use the "Last in, <BR>First out" clause to dump the LC staff. LC staff then start disappearing (BC <BR>has a policy od removing anyone who may notice they are Asset-Stripping a <BR>whole load of LC's - including several [or lot of] suppliers to military <BR>subcontractors...)<BR><BR>Jeff.<BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 11:30:15 GMT<BR>From: "John G. Wood" &lt;elvwood@ntlworld.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Judges Guild online (was Cargonaut)<BR><BR>"Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; Thanks, Gordon. For those interested,&nbsp; the stock of sector books has just<BR>&gt; been reduced by one each :). Hmmm (consults huge map on wall) where's<BR>&gt; Maranantha-Alkahest?<BR><BR>It was renamed Gateway when GDW de-canonised the JG material.<BR><BR>John<BR>http://www.elvw.demon.co.uk/Traveller/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 07:19:53 -0500<BR>From: "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question.....<BR><BR>&gt; Ray Rangel wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; How embarrassing would it be in 1/2G to land on your butt as a<BR>&gt; &gt; result of every shot?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; How unlikely would it be?&nbsp; It might happen once, the first time a<BR>&gt; given person uses a firearm of exceptionally high recoil in an low-G<BR>&gt; environment.&nbsp; I can't imagine any trained firearm user falling over,<BR>&gt; no matter what the gravity.&nbsp; People have a *lot* more mass than<BR>&gt; bullets.<BR><BR>Perhaps a single shot. But most projectile weapons now depend more on<BR>placing a number of rounds within a given area. To this end, most proj.<BR>weapons are capable of full auto. The recoil is not caused by the slug. It<BR>is caused by the escaping gases. That's why a shotgun, for instance, will<BR>put an unsuspecting firer on their keaster. A very large volume (because of<BR>the gun's large bore) of gas escapes at relative low velocity (compared to a<BR>rifle). Also remember that absorbing reaction is also a function of gravity.<BR>Recoil the force of the gas minus the force used to accelerate the tiny<BR>little slug down the barrel. The ability to resist being moved requires<BR>force. In the case of shooting, one leans into the shot. The resistance to<BR>the recoil is a function of friction between the shooter and the ground.<BR>Friction is a fucntion of weight which is...wait for it...gravity acting on<BR>a mass.<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Especially since every shot misses because of a high pressure<BR>&gt; &gt; atmosphere.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Why would a high pressure atmosphere make every shot miss, when you<BR>&gt; would otherwise expect to hit?&nbsp; In your explanation, remember that<BR>&gt; atmospheric pressure varies over Earth, too.<BR><BR>Because of the alteration, not only of the wind resistance, but the effect<BR>on the aerodynamics of the slug, the effect of a high, or low, pressure<BR>environment on the expansion of gases in the weapon (and, thus, muzzle<BR>velocity). While atmoshperic pressure varies over the surface of the globe,<BR>the degree of variance from one spot to another is very small compared to<BR>what might be encountered from on planet to another.<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Then you throw the projectile weapon away because the atmosphere<BR>&gt; &gt; just happens to also be corrosive...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Any particular reason why corrosive atmospheres would be more likely<BR>&gt; to cause failure in a simple and robust projectile weapon than the<BR>&gt; complex interdependent set of components needed by an energy weapon?<BR><BR>Friction between the rapidly expanding gases traveling down the bore along<BR>with the friction of the slug which it is pushing ahead of it cause the<BR>barrel to heat. Heat is a great catalyst for many forms of corrosion.<BR><BR>P.S.<BR>Exploding gases is not the only way to push a slug. Various methods have<BR>been postulated including so-called "rail guns" that use a magnetic field to<BR>accelerate the slug. True enough, a rail gun would have very little, if any,<BR>recoil. However, I would postulate that by the time one had a weapon that<BR>employed such technology along with technology sophisticated enough to<BR>compensate for extreme conditions, and made of materials that wouldn't react<BR>with corrosive atmospheres, one might as well invest in an energy<BR>weapon...it would be cheaper.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 06:48:50 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question.....<BR><BR>Recoil:<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Chemically propelled projectile weapons have three components that need to<BR>be addressed for recoil. Projectile mass, Propellant mass and muzzle<BR>velocity are the three main components. Bore size is irrelevant, peak<BR>operating pressure is irrelevant.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Other factors are action type (This does not affect gross recoil but it<BR>does affect the time to recoil), physical leverage, and environment.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Dense atmospheres, you would think, would slow the muzzle velocity of a<BR>given round. This might not always be the case. Adding the mass of the<BR>atmosphere in the barrel would increase recoil, but it would also alter the<BR>burning characteristics of the propellant (under pressure), possibly to the<BR>point of boosting pressures to beyond what would be considered normal, thus<BR>actually increasing the muzzle velocity. (Most pistols and SMGs can<BR>withstand this sort of abuse: I've seen many fired underwater successfully<BR>with no damage to the weapon, although I cannot recommend the practice.<BR>Firing a high pressure rifle cartridge underwater could result in a damaged<BR>weapon at the least or a catastrophic failure at worst.)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Most firearms do not have much in the way of recoil compared to a human's<BR>mass. Even in Zero-G, the recoil of a typical 9mm pistol, if properly<BR>handled, would not send one spinning out of control. You may have to grab a<BR>handhold to right yourself, but it isn't going to slam you into the wall,<BR>either.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Muzzlebrakes use the propellant's mass and heat energy to help counteract<BR>recoil. Recoiling actions also absorb some of the recoil energy, and<BR>increase the length of the recoil cycle to a more manageable level.<BR>Interestingly, firearm sound suppressors are also very efficient recoil<BR>control devices.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; As far as corrosive atmospheres go, any reasonable designed weapon should<BR>be quite reliable in all but the most unfriendly environs. You would think<BR>that TL 9+ firearms designed with space exploration and wide operating<BR>environments would be made of material that would resist a wide variety of<BR>element. Stainless Steels, Plastics, Ceramics and titanium alloys would be<BR>used to this end. Bullets sheathed in plastic or Teflon have much lower bore<BR>heating characteristics than copper jacketed projectiles. (Why do you think<BR>most Cannons use a plastic driving band?)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Good food for thought, though.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 08:25:06 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR><BR>&gt;A quick glance at the WotC website says that 'due to resource constraints<BR>&gt;and contractual issues', the Dune RPG has been cancelled completely.&nbsp; They<BR>&gt;have also "announced" that (their) Call of Cthulhu RPG has been rescheduled<BR>&gt;from October 2001 to January 2002 with NO follow-up products.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Erm, when WotC's d20 version of "Call of Cthulhu" was announced, it was<BR>going to be a one shot product. There was never any indication that there<BR>were ever going to be any follow-up materials released by Wizards... but<BR>keep scrolling down, as things get much more interesting.<BR><BR>&gt;I cannot help wondering if they had any idea, when they bought up all the<BR>&gt;rights to these titles, that they may not be publishing much - if anything.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Chaosium, to the best of my knowledge, never gave up their license to<BR>publish roleplaying supplements based on the Cthulhu mythos. They merely<BR>licensed WotC to do a single rulebook. It's actually a very smart move on<BR>the part of Chaosium. Why? A larger company will publish a roleplaying game<BR>based on the property they have the rights to. Wizards will eat the<BR>production costs and distribute it to more outlets than Chaosium could<BR>imagine doing, as WotC has a much bigger distribution network. As a result,<BR>the WotC d20 "Call of Cthulhu" product will sit on more shelves, which means<BR>that it could very well reach lots of people. If the product tanks, Chaosium<BR>does not have to eat the losses. If the product sells well, Chaosium ends up<BR>making money.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The fact that WotC will not be publishing any supplements doesn't matter in<BR>the slightest, as the WotC "Call of Cthulhu" rules will be published using<BR>the d20 system. The way WotC is handling d20 licensing means that Chaosium<BR>will be able to publish d20 supplements which will be fully compatible with<BR>the WotC "Call of Cthulhu" product. So it will be supported if it does well.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The end result is that everyone involved in the deal is happy. Wizards of<BR>the Coast will make money on each d20 "Call of Cthulhu" core rulebook which<BR>is sold. Chaosium will be paid by Wizards of the Coast on each d20 "Call of<BR>Cthulhu" core rulebook sold. Since Wizards can publish and distribute on a<BR>scale which is simply beyond Chaosium's capabilities, Chaosium stands to<BR>gain from that end (and stands to lose absolutely nothing).<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The catch is that the d20 CoC will most likely not include certain crucial<BR>elements relating to character design, which means that potential CoC<BR>players will have to get their hands on a copy of the D&amp;D "Player's<BR>Handbook". From Chaosium's end, this doesn't really matter (and in a certain<BR>way is something of an advantage, as everybody who has already bought a copy<BR>of the "Player's Handbook" instantly becomes a potential CoC player), but<BR>from WotC's end, this makes all the difference, as those desiring to play<BR>under the new system will have to buy the Player's Handbook. So, in the<BR>deal, Wizards may sell more copies of their own product based on the<BR>strength of the Cthulhu mythos "brand". Even if Wizards decides not to go<BR>this route, they still make money if the product itself sells.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Before cursing Wizards for such a "shady" tactic (as some are probably<BR>already mulling over), keep in mind that this appears to be pretty similar<BR>to the relationship between Marc Miller and Steve Jackson Games. Marc Miller<BR>is licensing SJG to produce GURPS Traveller materials. Steve Jackson wins by<BR>gaining "homeless" Traveller players, selling more GURPS core rulebooks to<BR>those who want to play Traveller in its latest incarnation, and selling GT<BR>materials to the already established base of GURPS fans. Marc Miller wins<BR>because he makes money on each GT book sold, and with the brand featured<BR>prominently he's able to produce the Classic Traveller reprints and sell<BR>them to a wider audience.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Potentially, we all win. Not only because Traveller materials are back in<BR>print, but because folks like Doug Berry, Jon Zeigler and the legion of fans<BR>who have written books or JTAS articles supporting GT can now be paid for<BR>that.<BR><BR>&gt;Are WotC now going to hold on to the IP rights and prevent anyone else<BR>doing<BR>&gt;anything with them, or are they going to be nice and say 'we can't do it,<BR>&gt;does nayone else want it?'&nbsp; I know which I would prefer, but I don't think<BR>&gt;it'll be what happens.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The Lovecraft and mythos properties are quite valuable, so it's unlikely<BR>that Arkham House is going to completely sell them off to WotC. Go to your<BR>video store and check out the horror section. You'll probably see<BR>"Re-Animator" there, and it's possible that you'll see "Bride of<BR>Re-Animator", "From Beyond", "The Unnamable", "The Curse" (and its sequel)<BR>and a few other movies which were based on Lovecraft properties. Arkham<BR>House, if I remember correctly, is making money off of the sales of those<BR>videos (and "Re-Animator" is a horror staple, anyone who's stocking the<BR>shelves in a rental place knows that "Re-Animator" is a brisk rental).<BR>Unless your local bookstore is utterly abysmal, they probably have a pretty<BR>decent Lovecraft section. Arkham House is making money off of each of these<BR>books (I think Ballantine/Del Rey is still publishing them, but I'm not<BR>sure). However, WotC could wrest the roleplaying game rights away from<BR>Chaosium, and that would certainly suck for Chaosium. On the other hand,<BR>Wizards has a vision of the future in which they aren't juggling a<BR>half-dozen brands, so it's quite likely that they'll be happy with the sales<BR>of the CoC core rulebook and the D&amp;D Player's Handbook. In fact, I'm willing<BR>to bet that if this product works out, Wizards will attempt to get other<BR>gaming companies to allow them to produce and distribute core rulebooks<BR>based on their brands.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Unless I've been asleep at the wheel and I've missed a huge sale both in<BR>the horror genre and the roleplaying field, Hasbro / Wizards has not<BR>purchased the rights to the Cthulhu mythos properties. Further, unless I<BR>missed something else, Chaosium still has the right to produce roleplaying<BR>game materials based on the mythos properties. The only way WotC could get<BR>these rights would be to negotiate with Arkham House, or possibly buy<BR>Chaosium outright... and I'm not sure that would be in their best interests,<BR>financially. It would certainly not be in their best interests to do any of<BR>the above and then sit on the rights and not produce anything, and in the<BR>latter two instances Arkham House could always negotiate a deal with some<BR>other roleplaying game company if they wanted to. Although I'm a little less<BR>clear on the Dune scenario, I'm willing to bet that the Dune copyright<BR>holders will be able to negotiate a new deal with another company, should<BR>they so desire. WotC simply cannot sit on rights which it doesn't own, and<BR>again, unless I've really been asleep at the wheel I don't think that WotC<BR>has purchased the full rights to Dune. The worst case scenario is that they<BR>have a contract which will keep the rights to a Dune game out of the hands<BR>of another company for the space of a few years, but I'm not sure that's the<BR>case (I am curious about the contractual obligations which kept them from<BR>publishing the RPG).<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The guys who could lose out in the "new model" roleplaying industry are<BR>those who are already publishing generic systems, as WotC has made it quite<BR>clear that they wish to take the d20 line in that direction. The biggest,<BR>fattest contender in that arena is Steve Jackson Games with the GURPS line<BR>(although one could argue that the Storyteller system is generic, after a<BR>fashion, and White Wolf's market share is a lot bigger than SJG's). However,<BR>it's too early to make dire predictions because GURPS has never really been<BR>aimed at beginning players anyway, they've always provided an advanced<BR>product to people who are already involved in the hobby. The huge success of<BR>the new D&amp;D line may introduce more people to the concepts inherent in<BR>roleplaying, which could create a larger market for roleplaying games, which<BR>means that GURPS could end up getting a boost as well. For example, I can<BR>easily imagine a scenario in which gamers who want realism over the heroic<BR>flavor of the d20 system may see GURPS as a viable alternative. In fact,<BR>that's been happening for years, and if the percentages stay the same, but a<BR>greater number of players are floating around, it's certainly possible that<BR>SJG might make more money. It all depends on whether the whole industry has<BR>room for growth or not, or whether it can only be dominated by a very few<BR>major players.<BR><BR>ObTrav: This one has nothing to do with the Third Imperium, but has<BR>everything to do with Traveller. If GURPS takes a severe hit, or (and I hope<BR>this won't be the case) gets competed out of business, the results would<BR>obviously be pretty bad for the Traveller brand. It would also be bad for<BR>those of us who are enjoying the Classic Traveller reprints, as I suspect<BR>that a significant factor -- perhaps the most significant -- in their<BR>production is the money Marc is making from the GURPS Trav license.<BR>Roleplaying games are at a major turning point right now, perhaps the<BR>biggest ever. WotC really has a pretty sound business strategy (although I'm<BR>unsure about the whole Last Unicorn Games purchase and how it fits in), and<BR>they certainly have their sights set on the generic RPG market. They do have<BR>the clout to pull it off. The next few years are going to be very<BR>interesting. I think five or ten years down the line, a lot of bit players<BR>in the industry now will be major players, and some of the major players now<BR>will disappear or get knocked down a few pegs. If there is a massive battle,<BR>it's going to be between the Wizards and the big ol' Wolf, although when all<BR>is said and done I have my suspicions that Palladium is particularly<BR>vulnerable... unless, of course, Hasbro decides to simply eliminate Wizards<BR>at which point the pen and paper roleplaying industry will be in a heap of<BR>trouble.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 20:14:04 -0000<BR>From: "Mark Preston" &lt;mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of<BR>&gt; eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>&gt; Sent: 27 January 2001 23:56<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Habitable planets around red dwarfs<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; On 01/25/01 at 02:13 PM,&nbsp; Bernie McGeehan &lt;einreb62@yahoo.com&gt; said:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;What is the date for that issue? I must have issed<BR>&gt; &gt;that when it went by...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; The New Scientist site has posted an interesting<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; story about the discovery of "mind-reading" cells<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; &gt; existing in every human being.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What about a review of _New Scientist_ magazine?&nbsp; Are we<BR>&gt; talking hard science, softer speculative science or<BR>&gt; pseudo-science?&nbsp; If you were to compare its articles to<BR>&gt; another journal/magazine would it be an IEEE journal,<BR>&gt; _Science_, _Scientific American_, _Popular Science_, fact<BR>&gt; articles in _Analog_ or articles published in usenet?&nbsp; Is<BR>&gt; it available in outside the UK and what does it cost?<BR>&gt;<BR>I can't really compare it to US magazines, since I don't really know<BR>much about them. Certainly, it is of the level of Scientific American<BR>(the only one I do know and have read) with the one major difference.<BR>New Scientist publishes articles (not scientific papers) based on work<BR>done but _without_ peer review before publication. Essentially it is a<BR>"popularised" version of a general scientific journal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 09:27:33 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: Michael Houghton &lt;herveus@Radix.Net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Azhanti HL<BR><BR>Howdy!<BR><BR>&gt; I hope this new reprinting of the CT books hasn't dropped the value of<BR>&gt; my lovely (virtually mint) AHL<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;listens carefully for any noises of envy&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Si<BR>&gt; <BR>You suck!<BR><BR>yours,<BR>Michael<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Michael and MJ Houghton&nbsp;&nbsp; | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly<BR>herveus@radix.net&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | White Wolf and the Phoenix<BR>Bowie, MD, USA&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 08:21:19 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question.....<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Matthew W. Helton [mailto:mwhelton@cox-internet.com]<BR>Sent: Monday, January 29, 2001 4:49 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; Most firearms do not have much in the way of recoil compared to a<BR>human's<BR>&gt;mass. Even in Zero-G, the recoil of a typical 9mm pistol, if properly<BR>&gt;handled, would not send one spinning out of control. You may have to grab a<BR>&gt;handhold to right yourself, but it isn't going to slam you into the wall,<BR>&gt;either.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>This supposes that the firer is close to a ship or object which is of far<BR>greater mass he can grab hold off and "steady" himself. What if he is<BR>between say Point A and Point B? nothing near by to steady himself off of.<BR>first shot may start a slight tumble what if he has to fire again? or what<BR>if he is carrying a shotgun? or what if he fires a 4 round burst from a<BR>submachinegun?<BR><BR>if he has a MMU or something to its effect. This will mean he will need to<BR>expend fuel to correct his tumble. Assuming a high tech level MMU has more<BR>fuel compared to current MMU's he could afford to expend this fuel. however<BR>what happens in an extended fire fight?<BR><BR>to me these questions are the reason energy weapons exist.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 08:26:00 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Another Andromeda/Traveller Moment<BR><BR>What new TV series?<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Dalton Spence [mailto:dalton.spence@hwcn.org]<BR>Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2001 9:59 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Another Andromeda/Traveller Moment<BR><BR><BR>First we had the High Guard, then the Long Night and Ethically<BR>Challenged Merchants. Now we have a "friendly neighbourhood<BR>Traveller's Aid Society" distributing news, weather reports and<BR>mail while the merger of two major transport megacorps threaten the<BR>small independant merchant with extinction. Do any of these things<BR>from the new TV series Andromeda sound vaguely familiar? ;)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; @==================================================@<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Dalton S. Spence, B.Sc. &lt;dalton.spence@hwcn.org&gt; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Home Page: http://www.hwcn.org/~ag775/home.html&nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Family Motto: Virtute Acquiritur Honos&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |&nbsp; &nbsp; "Trade is the lifeblood of the Imperium."&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; Cleon I, First Emperor of the Third Imperium&nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Princess Leia intimidates the sinister petunia.&nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; FNORD!&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; @==================================================@<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:35:36 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question.....<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR>&gt; What if he is between say Point A and Point B? nothing near by<BR>&gt; to steady himself off of.&nbsp; first shot may start a slight tumble<BR>&gt; what if he has to fire again? or what if he is carrying a<BR>&gt; shotgun? or what if he fires a 4 round burst from a submachinegun?<BR><BR>In the B-movie "Moontrap" (staring Walter Koenig&nbsp; of&nbsp; ST&nbsp; and&nbsp; B5<BR>fame) a character finding himself in zero-G drifting out of reach<BR>of handholds used an SMG as an improvised&nbsp; MMU&nbsp; (sustained&nbsp; burst<BR>fire).&nbsp; Just remember to hold the SMG low (center mass) or you'll<BR>get a spin.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 11:15:22 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question.....<BR><BR>The firing position for a 0-G weapon is very different from normal earth.<BR>This would be one reason for extended sights (a la Shadowrun Smartlinks), or<BR>laser sights.&nbsp; Recoil compensators would also be common on a weapon designed<BR>for 0-G.&nbsp; Thus part of 0-G CBT training is learning how to shoot a slug<BR>thrower in that environment.<BR><BR>As for the gravity/atmospheric density/etc. arguments.&nbsp; Currently the US<BR>military in its Tanks and Artillery use sensors tied to computers that<BR>measure barrel droop, barometric pressure, wind, temperature, and a myriad<BR>of other factors that affect accuracy.<BR><BR>With a personal Slug thrower...on earth...there is no need to do the same<BR>(though a case can be made for a Sniper Rifle).&nbsp; The inherent inaccuracy of<BR>a human as a firing cradle means that these factors are mostly subsumed by<BR>the person shooting the weapon.&nbsp; Now, on a high tech slug thrower designed<BR>for use in varying atmospheres, and gravity, some simple calibration<BR>techniques that are automated can easily be incorporated.&nbsp; As you arrive on<BR>a planet...the weapon itself take a quick scan of local gravitometric<BR>conditions, and air density.&nbsp; It then auto zero's itself, or even better the<BR>electronic sight adjusts it's aim point based upon where you target it<BR>making you put the dot on the target, and almost guarantee a hit<BR>(mathematically).<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 15:54:36 -0500<BR>From: "Anthony Colosetti" &lt;acoloset@kent.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: de-canonized material<BR><BR>&gt; It was renamed Gateway when GDW de-canonised the JG material.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; John<BR><BR>I've been curious about this for a while now and maybe I just missed<BR>something, but does anyone out there know WHY GDW de-canonized the Judges<BR>Guild material?&nbsp; And my second question is if this happened to JG what other<BR>material has suffered the same treatment?&nbsp; Just wondering....<BR><BR>Anthony Colosetti<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 12:26:37 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; On Mon, 29 Jan 2001, Megan Robertson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Benefits (?) of over 23 years roleplaying.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Gaah, it always discomforting to realise that roleplaying is so old a<BR>&gt; hobby. You have been playing almost as long as I have been in existence.<BR>&gt; B-)&nbsp; <BR><BR>Well, I started role playing in 1974. I bet that *really* bothers you.<BR>:-) <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 12:28:09 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; On 01/29/01 at 08:04 AM,&nbsp; "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt; said:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;On Mon, 29 Jan 2001, Megan Robertson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; Benefits (?) of over 23 years roleplaying.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Gaah, it always discomforting to realise that roleplaying is so old<BR>&gt;&gt;a hobby. You have been playing almost as long as I have been in<BR>&gt;&gt;existence. B-)&nbsp; <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; LOL! Let me discomfort you a little more. I'm in my 27th year of <BR>&gt; roleplaying, *and* I was 23 when I officially started with the newly <BR>&gt; published D&amp;D. <BR><BR>Ok, I've got you beat on one thing. I was only 19 or 20 when we started<BR>playing D&amp;D. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 12:30:16 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Another Andromeda/Traveller Moment<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; What new TV series?<BR><BR>"Gene Rodenberry's Andromeda". Mostly known as "Andromeda".<BR><BR>I gave up trying to watch it because the stations that show it (WGN and<BR>one of the smaller local stations) have it one at inconvenient times<BR>and it gets preempted a lot.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 12:32:04 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Another Andromeda/Traveller Moment<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; First we had the High Guard, then the Long Night and Ethically<BR>&gt; Challenged Merchants. Now we have a "friendly neighbourhood<BR>&gt; Traveller's Aid Society" distributing news, weather reports and<BR>&gt; mail while the merger of two major transport megacorps threaten the<BR>&gt; small independant merchant with extinction. Do any of these things<BR>&gt; from the new TV series Andromeda sound vaguely familiar? ;)<BR><BR>A bit. On the other hand, the "Nietscheans"(sp) strike me as having<BR>been modeled on David Gerrold's "Morthans". <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 15:36:50 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Michael Feldhusen &lt;mike_f@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3567<BR><BR>On Mon, 29 Jan 2001, Jeff Rowse wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In mail, Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;SNIP&gt;<BR>&gt; I don't know how voluntary it was, but the consequences have only been<BR>&gt; negative.&nbsp; They lost Star Trek, they lost Dune, and many of them lost<BR>&gt; their jobs.<BR>&gt; &lt;/SNIP&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; A quick glance at the WotC website says that 'due to resource constraints <BR>&gt; and contractual issues', the Dune RPG has been cancelled completely.&nbsp; They <BR>&gt; have also "announced" that (their) Call of Cthulhu RPG has been rescheduled <BR>&gt; from October 2001 to January 2002 with NO follow-up products.<BR><BR>From the very beginning, the D20 Call of Cthulhu was a one-shot.<BR>Chaosium would not give them any rights to any further follow ups to<BR>it.<BR><BR>&gt; I cannot help wondering if they had any idea, when they bought up all the <BR>&gt; rights to these titles, that they may not be publishing much - if anything.<BR>&gt; Are WotC now going to hold on to the IP rights and prevent anyone else doing <BR>&gt; anything with them, or are they going to be nice and say 'we can't do it, <BR>&gt; does nayone else want it?'&nbsp; I know which I would prefer, but I don't think <BR>&gt; it'll be what happens.<BR><BR>Well, that won't happen with CoC, as Chaosium still holds those rights<BR>and only sold a one-time sub-license to WotC.&nbsp; That's why WotC hasn't<BR>canceled the D20 CoC game, they've signed the contract and if you<BR>think Chaosium would let them out of it, you'd be mistaken.&nbsp; Plus<BR>Chaosium is counting on the reciprical licensing they get, including<BR>doing a D20 version of Elric/Eternal Champion.<BR><BR>&gt; ObTrav:<BR>&gt; One of the PCs has a relative who works fora Little Company taken over by a <BR>&gt; Big Company.&nbsp; BC then 'realises' they need to downsize and use the "Last in, <BR>&gt; First out" clause to dump the LC staff. LC staff then start disappearing (BC <BR>&gt; has a policy od removing anyone who may notice they are Asset-Stripping a <BR>&gt; whole load of LC's - including several [or lot of] suppliers to military <BR>&gt; subcontractors...)<BR><BR>Hmm. . . .&nbsp; Sounds a lot like my job right now. . . .<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Michael Feldhusen<BR>mike_f@io.com<BR>http://www.io.com/~mike_f/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 08:59:02 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question.....<BR><BR>Ray Rangel wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; I can't imagine any trained firearm user falling over,<BR>&gt; &gt; no matter what the gravity.&nbsp; People have a *lot* more mass than<BR>&gt; &gt; bullets.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Perhaps a single shot. But most projectile weapons now depend more on<BR>&gt; placing a number of rounds within a given area.<BR><BR>For suppression, sure.&nbsp; Not when trying to hit a target.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; To this end, most proj.&nbsp; weapons are capable of full auto. The<BR>&gt; recoil is not caused by the slug.<BR><BR>Wrong.&nbsp; The slug causes recoil, most of it.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; It is caused by the escaping gases.<BR><BR>A small fraction.&nbsp; It is a simple question of momentum.&nbsp; Gases -- even<BR>high-velocity gases -- don't carry as much momentum as a slug.&nbsp; If<BR>they do, you'd better redesign your firearm to be more efficient.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; A very large volume (because of the gun's large bore) of gas escapes<BR>&gt; at relative low velocity (compared to a rifle).<BR><BR>Bore size is irrelevant.&nbsp; For a given mass, low velocity *reduces*<BR>recoil.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Recoil the force of the gas minus the force used to accelerate the tiny<BR>&gt; little slug down the barrel.<BR><BR>Wrong.&nbsp; It's simply action and reaction, Newton's third law.&nbsp; Do the<BR>math.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; The ability to resist being moved requires force.<BR><BR>It requires *mass*.&nbsp; In fact, that's pretty much the definition of<BR>inertial mass.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; In the case of shooting, one leans into the shot. The resistance to<BR>&gt; the recoil is a function of friction between the shooter and the<BR>&gt; ground.&nbsp; Friction is a fucntion of weight which is...wait for<BR>&gt; it...gravity acting on a mass.<BR><BR>Try looking up the recoil impulses for typical firearms.&nbsp; Compare with<BR>the typical impulse imparted by a brief gust of wind.&nbsp; In zero-G,<BR>adopt a different firing stance.&nbsp; For example, a "prone" posture which<BR>both minimises your cross-section to the enemy and directs the recoil<BR>force through a line far closer to your centre of mass.<BR><BR>Of course, you'll almost certainly want some cover, and cover means an<BR>object with which you can maneuver or cancel recoil.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Because of the alteration, not only of the wind resistance, but the<BR>&gt; effect on the aerodynamics of the slug,<BR><BR>The variation in background atmosphere is trivial compared with<BR>pressure variations met during flight due to high speeds.&nbsp; The only<BR>time you'd bother taking them into account is when you're firing at<BR>extremely long range in otherwise perfect conditions (and you're<BR>already taking into account any wind, temperature, motion of target,<BR>etc which all add up to a much greater effect).&nbsp; Not likely for a<BR>hand-held firearm fired on short notice at short range.&nbsp; And if it is,<BR>you'll have the sensors needed anyway.<BR><BR>(BTW, what sort of idiot fights on a planet for which they don't even<BR>know such basic properties of the atmosphere?)<BR><BR><BR>&gt; the effect of a high, or low, pressure environment on the expansion<BR>&gt; of gases in the weapon<BR><BR>Trivial again.&nbsp; If you can actually put some numbers together that<BR>contradict mine, feel free to post them.&nbsp; Hint: the variations in<BR>pressure in firing chamber already absolutely dwarf any pressure<BR>difference you might find in atmosphere.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Friction between the rapidly expanding gases traveling down the bore along<BR>&gt; with the friction of the slug which it is pushing ahead of it cause the<BR>&gt; barrel to heat. Heat is a great catalyst for many forms of corrosion.<BR><BR>Care to post a minmally-plausible design for an energy weapon that<BR>doesn't generate *even more* heat for the same ability to kill?<BR><BR><BR>&gt; However, I would postulate that by the time one had a weapon that<BR>&gt; employed such technology along with technology sophisticated enough<BR>&gt; to compensate for extreme conditions,<BR><BR>Which you will need for energy weapons anyway.&nbsp; Basically every energy<BR>weapon I've seen in Traveller is either a laser weapon or shoots<BR>plasma.<BR><BR>Laser weapons are *already* extremely dependent on atmospheric<BR>conditions -- needing adaptive optics, having problems with smoke,<BR>fog, etc.&nbsp; Furthermore, they are less efficient than projectile<BR>weapons -- and hence generate more heat for your corrosive atmosphere.<BR><BR>Plasma weapons are even worse -- I haven't seen a plausible method for<BR>actually penetrating a reasonable thickness of atmosphere at all, let<BR>alone remaining coherent enough to do damage in the direction you want<BR>to fire.&nbsp; Take the aiming problem for high-speed metal slugs and<BR>multiply them by a factor of 100 or so for volumes of diffuse ionised<BR>atoms.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; and made of materials that wouldn't react with corrosive<BR>&gt; atmospheres, one might as well invest in an energy weapon...it would<BR>&gt; be cheaper.<BR><BR>Again, you've avoided the question of what that corrosive atmosphere<BR>will do to your complex and expensive energy weapon.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3571<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (rly-yg01.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.1]) by air-yg03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:59:36 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:58:35 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id QAA93330;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:56:54 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:55:14 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id QAA93259<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:55:14 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:55:14 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101292155.QAA93259@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3571<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3572</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/29/01 10:03:44 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 30 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3572<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR>Subject: de-canonized material<BR>RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR>WotC/LUG products dropped was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3567<BR>Re: Question.....<BR>Re: Question.....<BR>Re: Question.....<BR>Re: Question.....<BR>Re: de-canonized material<BR>Re: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR>Re: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR>RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR>RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR>Who wants a near mint cogs and dogs?<BR>re: Inspectors for Imperial Rules of War<BR>RE: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 17:43:54 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR><BR>&gt; Erm, when WotC's d20 version of "Call of Cthulhu" was announced, it was<BR>&gt; going to be a one shot product. There was never any indication that there<BR>&gt; were ever going to be any follow-up materials released by Wizards... but<BR>&gt; keep scrolling down, as things get much more interesting.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;I cannot help wondering if they had any idea, when they bought up all the<BR>&gt; &gt;rights to these titles, that they may not be publishing much - if<BR>anything.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Chaosium, to the best of my knowledge, never gave up their license to<BR>&gt; publish roleplaying supplements based on the Cthulhu mythos. They merely<BR>&gt; licensed WotC to do a single rulebook. It's actually a very smart move on<BR>&gt; the part of Chaosium. Why? A larger company will publish a roleplaying<BR>game<BR>&gt; based on the property they have the rights to. Wizards will eat the<BR>&gt; production costs and distribute it to more outlets than Chaosium could<BR>&gt; imagine doing, as WotC has a much bigger distribution network. As a<BR>result,<BR>&gt; the WotC d20 "Call of Cthulhu" product will sit on more shelves, which<BR>means<BR>&gt; that it could very well reach lots of people. If the product tanks,<BR>Chaosium<BR>&gt; does not have to eat the losses. If the product sells well, Chaosium ends<BR>up<BR>&gt; making money.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The fact that WotC will not be publishing any supplements doesn't matter<BR>in<BR>&gt; the slightest, as the WotC "Call of Cthulhu" rules will be published using<BR>&gt; the d20 system. The way WotC is handling d20 licensing means that Chaosium<BR>&gt; will be able to publish d20 supplements which will be fully compatible<BR>with<BR>&gt; the WotC "Call of Cthulhu" product. So it will be supported if it does<BR>well.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The end result is that everyone involved in the deal is happy. Wizards of<BR>&gt; the Coast will make money on each d20 "Call of Cthulhu" core rulebook<BR>which<BR>&gt; is sold. Chaosium will be paid by Wizards of the Coast on each d20 "Call<BR>of<BR>&gt; Cthulhu" core rulebook sold. Since Wizards can publish and distribute on a<BR>&gt; scale which is simply beyond Chaosium's capabilities, Chaosium stands to<BR>&gt; gain from that end (and stands to lose absolutely nothing).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The catch is that the d20 CoC will most likely not include certain crucial<BR>&gt; elements relating to character design, which means that potential CoC<BR>&gt; players will have to get their hands on a copy of the D&amp;D "Player's<BR>&gt; Handbook". From Chaosium's end, this doesn't really matter (and in a<BR>certain<BR>&gt; way is something of an advantage, as everybody who has already bought a<BR>copy<BR>&gt; of the "Player's Handbook" instantly becomes a potential CoC player), but<BR>&gt; from WotC's end, this makes all the difference, as those desiring to play<BR>&gt; under the new system will have to buy the Player's Handbook. So, in the<BR>&gt; deal, Wizards may sell more copies of their own product based on the<BR>&gt; strength of the Cthulhu mythos "brand". Even if Wizards decides not to go<BR>&gt; this route, they still make money if the product itself sells.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Before cursing Wizards for such a "shady" tactic (as some are probably<BR>&gt; already mulling over), keep in mind that this appears to be pretty similar<BR>&gt; to the relationship between Marc Miller and Steve Jackson Games. Marc<BR>Miller<BR>&gt; is licensing SJG to produce GURPS Traveller materials. Steve Jackson wins<BR>by<BR>&gt; gaining "homeless" Traveller players, selling more GURPS core rulebooks to<BR>&gt; those who want to play Traveller in its latest incarnation, and selling GT<BR>&gt; materials to the already established base of GURPS fans. Marc Miller wins<BR>&gt; because he makes money on each GT book sold, and with the brand featured<BR>&gt; prominently he's able to produce the Classic Traveller reprints and sell<BR>&gt; them to a wider audience.<BR>&gt;<BR>The d20 arrangement is an "Open Gaming License" borrowed ideas prevalent in<BR>the software field.&nbsp; Anyone can write (and more importantly, sell) d20<BR>material as long as they adhere to the OGL and refrain from changing core<BR>rules.&nbsp; The idea is that the Player's Handbook is still "off limits" and<BR>therefore required to play.&nbsp; So ultimately, WotC hopes, it leads to more<BR>sales of their merchandise.&nbsp; A little different from CT/GURPS distinction<BR>since (1) CT is no longer issuing new products, and (2) only SJG can publish<BR>GURPS stuff.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 17:47:03 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Subject: de-canonized material<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; It was renamed Gateway when GDW de-canonised the JG material.<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I've been curious about this for a while now and maybe I just missed<BR>&gt; something, but does anyone out there know WHY GDW de-canonized the Judges<BR>&gt; Guild material?&nbsp; And my second question is if this happened to JG what<BR>other<BR>&gt; material has suffered the same treatment?&nbsp; Just wondering....<BR>&gt;<BR>Strange, because the state boundaries in M-A track exactly the limits of<BR>those in the big Imperium map.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 23:05:54 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR><BR>At 16:55 -0500 29/1/01 "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; Chaosium, to the best of my knowledge, never gave up their license to<BR>&gt;publish roleplaying supplements based on the Cthulhu mythos. They merely<BR>&gt;licensed WotC to do a single rulebook. It's actually a very smart move on<BR>&gt;the part of Chaosium. Why? A larger company will publish a roleplaying game<BR>&gt;based on the property they have the rights to. Wizards will eat the<BR>&gt;production costs and distribute it to more outlets than Chaosium could<BR>&gt;imagine doing, as WotC has a much bigger distribution network. As a result,<BR>&gt;the WotC d20 "Call of Cthulhu" product will sit on more shelves, which means<BR>&gt;that it could very well reach lots of people. If the product tanks, Chaosium<BR>&gt;does not have to eat the losses. If the product sells well, Chaosium ends up<BR>&gt;making money.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; The fact that WotC will not be publishing any supplements <BR>&gt;doesn't matter in<BR>&gt;the slightest, as the WotC "Call of Cthulhu" rules will be published using<BR>&gt;the d20 system. The way WotC is handling d20 licensing means that Chaosium<BR>&gt;will be able to publish d20 supplements which will be fully compatible with<BR>&gt;the WotC "Call of Cthulhu" product. So it will be supported if it does well.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Note that this is interesting in that Chaosium is taking a different, <BR>yet similar approach with their Moorcock license; they are producing <BR>and selling 'Dragon Lords of Melnibone' which is a D20 Elric! game. <BR>I'm willing to bet that it will include conversion rules for Elric! <BR>and Stormbringer!, instantly giving a tranche of supplements for the <BR>world for D20 players. Initially, I thought that this was being done <BR>in house because of license issues, but that doesn't appear to be the <BR>case as Darcsyde are being licensed to produce the Corum and Hawkmoon <BR>supplements for Elric!<BR><BR>I'd be interested to see if Chaosium start publishing supplements for <BR>CoC with dual stats, or if they stick with CoC 5.6, which is their <BR>core game now that they have protected themselves by placing <BR>PenDragon and Hero Wars with other companies.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>PS having played both Elric! and DND3, Elric! is to my mind a far <BR>better heroic scale system (and very, very lethal)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 23:06:28 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: WotC/LUG products dropped was Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3567<BR><BR>At 16:55 -0500 29/1/01, "Jeff Rowse" &lt;jeffrowse@hotmail.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;They<BR>&gt;have also "announced" that (their) Call of Cthulhu RPG has been rescheduled<BR>&gt;from October 2001 to January 2002 with NO follow-up products.<BR><BR>That is *not* news. The deal with Chaosium was only for a D20 <BR>rulebook. It specifically excluded follow on products. Chaosium is <BR>being smart, and I suspect that the D20 rules will have conversions <BR>for the BRP system - hence, WotC sells more copies of D20 and pays <BR>license to Chaosium, and Chaosium sells more sourcebooks and possibly <BR>more versions of CoC 5.6.<BR><BR>&gt;I cannot help wondering if they had any idea, when they bought up all the<BR>&gt;rights to these titles, that they may not be publishing much - if anything.<BR><BR>AFAIK The Star Trek rights were revoked because Paramount didn't want <BR>the game in the same house as Star Wars.<BR><BR>Dune, I'm unsure of the reason (but it's a shame as the IKON system <BR>version was good).<BR><BR>&gt;Are WotC now going to hold on to the IP rights and prevent anyone else doing<BR>&gt;anything with them, or are they going to be nice and say 'we can't do it,<BR>&gt;does nayone else want it?'&nbsp; I know which I would prefer, but I don't think<BR>&gt;it'll be what happens.<BR><BR>The only IP WotC can hold onto is the system, in reality. Ideally, <BR>I'd like to see the LUG people set up a new company and reaquire <BR>IKON, and the ST/Dune licences.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 15:59:06 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question.....<BR><BR>on 1/28/01 9:45 PM, Ray Rangel at ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; It's a little more complex than that. Consider varying atmospheric pressures<BR>&gt; and the effect of low G (or zero G) on recoil (i.e. reaction...remember<BR>&gt; Newton?). How embarrassing would it be in 1/2G to land on your butt as a<BR>&gt; result of every shot? Not good for morale and rate of fire. Especially since<BR>&gt; every shot misses because of a high pressure atmosphere. Then you throw the<BR>&gt; projectile weapon away because the atmosphere just happens to also be<BR>&gt; corrosive...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Projectile weapons would certainly have their uses, but by no means would<BR>&gt; they be "universal".<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Certainly, but you can adopt a projectile weapon that will be useful on<BR>almost any world humans are likely to inhabit. The gauss rifle, is in fact,<BR>such an ideal weapon.&nbsp; By having a very high velocity, the ballistic arc<BR>within meaningful combat ranges is minimal.&nbsp; Recall that almost all small<BR>arms combat occurs&nbsp; at less than 500 meters (about 60% at 100 meters or<BR>less).&nbsp; This is due to the firer's inability to see the target due to<BR>camouflage and terrain, not the capabilities of the weapon.<BR><BR>With a muzzle velocity of 1500 m/s, the gauss rifle requires basically no<BR>sight correction at these ranges.&nbsp; Further, recoil impulse with such a small<BR>projectile (relative to launcher mass + firer) means recoil is also a minor<BR>factor (except perhaps in microgravity).<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:02:05 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question.....<BR><BR>on 1/28/01 10:15 PM, Timothy Little at tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Then you throw the projectile weapon away because the atmosphere<BR>&gt;&gt; just happens to also be corrosive...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Any particular reason why corrosive atmospheres would be more likely<BR>&gt; to cause failure in a simple and robust projectile weapon than the<BR>&gt; complex interdependent set of components needed by an energy weapon?<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Given that polymers and ceramics are becoming more and more prevalent in<BR>small arms due to cost, durability and corrosion resistance, one can easily<BR>posit future firearms that will be far more resistant to corrosive<BR>environments than their users.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:25:02 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question.....<BR><BR>on 1/29/01 4:19 AM, Ray Rangel at ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Perhaps a single shot. But most projectile weapons now depend more on<BR>&gt; placing a number of rounds within a given area. To this end, most proj.<BR>&gt; weapons are capable of full auto. The recoil is not caused by the slug. It<BR>&gt; is caused by the escaping gases.<BR><BR>Incorrect.&nbsp; Recoil is caused by a reaction to mass being ejected toward the<BR>target.&nbsp; This mass can be high velocity gas or the projectile proper.<BR><BR>&gt; That's why a shotgun, for instance, will<BR>&gt; put an unsuspecting firer on their keaster. A very large volume (because of<BR>&gt; the gun's large bore) of gas escapes at relative low velocity (compared to a<BR>&gt; rifle). <BR><BR>Shotguns also propel a much more massive projectile, or projectiles.<BR>Consider the typical shotgun slug, which weigh in at 1 to 1.25 ounces (<BR>that's about 35 grams).&nbsp; Compare that to .308 (7.62x51) rifle, which<BR>launches a projectile of 155 to 200 grains (about 13 grams).<BR><BR>If recoil were derived solely from propellant gasses, EM guns would have no<BR>recoil, but, in fact, they do.<BR><BR>&gt; Also remember that absorbing reaction is also a function of gravity.<BR>&gt; Recoil the force of the gas minus the force used to accelerate the tiny<BR>&gt; little slug down the barrel. The ability to resist being moved requires<BR>&gt; force. In the case of shooting, one leans into the shot. The resistance to<BR>&gt; the recoil is a function of friction between the shooter and the ground.<BR>&gt; Friction is a fucntion of weight which is...wait for it...gravity acting on<BR>&gt; a mass.<BR><BR>Sorry, this is only partially correct.&nbsp; Resistance to motion is caused by<BR>mass.&nbsp; This is known as inertia.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Because of the alteration, not only of the wind resistance, but the effect<BR>&gt; on the aerodynamics of the slug, the effect of a high, or low, pressure<BR>&gt; environment on the expansion of gases in the weapon (and, thus, muzzle<BR>&gt; velocity). While atmoshperic pressure varies over the surface of the globe,<BR>&gt; the degree of variance from one spot to another is very small compared to<BR>&gt; what might be encountered from on planet to another.<BR><BR>Projectile will be effected to a greater or lesser extent by their design.<BR>Retardation is based on cd (coefficent of drag).&nbsp; Retardation can be easily<BR>calculated using Mach's equation.&nbsp; In any atmosphere that humans are like to<BR>inhabit, the effect will be negligible (I'm ignoring underwater colonies).<BR><BR>Friction between the rapidly expanding gases traveling down the bore along<BR>&gt; with the friction of the slug which it is pushing ahead of it cause the<BR>&gt; barrel to heat. Heat is a great catalyst for many forms of corrosion.<BR><BR>Actually, most of the heat is generated by the combustion of the propellant.<BR><BR>&gt; P.S.<BR>&gt; Exploding gases is not the only way to push a slug. Various methods have<BR>&gt; been postulated including so-called "rail guns" that use a magnetic field to<BR>&gt; accelerate the slug. True enough, a rail gun would have very little, if any,<BR>&gt; recoil. However, I would postulate that by the time one had a weapon that<BR>&gt; employed such technology along with technology sophisticated enough to<BR>&gt; compensate for extreme conditions, and made of materials that wouldn't react<BR>&gt; with corrosive atmospheres, one might as well invest in an energy<BR>&gt; weapon...it would be cheaper.<BR><BR>Who needs a rail gun?&nbsp; Build a flechette firing rifle with a ceramic barrel<BR>and ceramic/polymer parts.&nbsp; Recoil from a typical 8 gn flechette fired at<BR>1500 m/s is essentially zero (see test data from the SPIW trials).&nbsp; These<BR>technologies are available today!<BR><BR>And, the most failure prone component in a chemical propelled projectile<BR>weapon is the round of ammunition.&nbsp; If you get a failure to fire, you eject<BR>the cartridge and fire again.&nbsp; Compare this to any energy weapons.<BR><BR>There is a reason that current militaries of the world have essentially<BR>stopped upgrading their small arms.&nbsp; Newer designs add very little in terms<BR>of hit probability, lethality or reliability at a much greater cost.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:31:04 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question.....<BR><BR>on 1/29/01 8:21 AM, William Lane at wlane@Asera.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Matthew W. Helton [mailto:mwhelton@cox-internet.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: Monday, January 29, 2001 4:49 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Most firearms do not have much in the way of recoil compared to a<BR>&gt;&gt; human's<BR>&gt;&gt; mass. Even in Zero-G, the recoil of a typical 9mm pistol, if properly<BR>&gt;&gt; handled, would not send one spinning out of control. You may have to grab a<BR>&gt;&gt; handhold to right yourself, but it isn't going to slam you into the wall,<BR>&gt;&gt; either.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This supposes that the firer is close to a ship or object which is of far<BR>&gt; greater mass he can grab hold off and "steady" himself. What if he is<BR>&gt; between say Point A and Point B? nothing near by to steady himself off of.<BR>&gt; first shot may start a slight tumble what if he has to fire again? or what<BR>&gt; if he is carrying a shotgun? or what if he fires a 4 round burst from a<BR>&gt; submachinegun?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; if he has a MMU or something to its effect. This will mean he will need to<BR>&gt; expend fuel to correct his tumble. Assuming a high tech level MMU has more<BR>&gt; fuel compared to current MMU's he could afford to expend this fuel. however<BR>&gt; what happens in an extended fire fight?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; to me these questions are the reason energy weapons exist.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>A simple chevron style muzzle brake may be all that is required.&nbsp; Careful<BR>design and the brake will cancel most if not all of the recoil.<BR>Additionally, there are a number of soft recoil or recoilless weapons<BR>designs, anyone of which is substantially simpler and cheaper than an energy<BR>weapon.&nbsp; In the 1940s one inventor demostrated a soft recoil .50 caliber<BR>machinegun that could easily be fired fully automatic, from the shoulder of<BR>a standing soldier.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 19:44:18 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: de-canonized material<BR><BR>Anthony Colosetti wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; It was renamed Gateway when GDW de-canonised the JG material.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; John<BR><BR>&gt;I've been curious about this for a while now and maybe I just missed<BR>&gt;something, but does anyone out there know WHY GDW de-canonized the Judges<BR>&gt;Guild material?&nbsp; And my second question is if this happened to JG what other<BR>&gt;material has suffered the same treatment?&nbsp; Just wondering....<BR><BR>I believe that ALL third-party material not produced by FASA, Gamelords, or Digest Group was de-canonized.&nbsp; I know that the Paranoia Press material was.&nbsp; The reason why presumably has to do with a desire at GDW to maintain tighter control over the quality (in the case of JG) and/or 'tone' (in the case of PP) of 'their' universe.&nbsp; FASA, Gamelords, and DGP were exceptions because their design teams were much more closely associated with GDW and therefore known to be 'on the same page' (The brothers Keith of FASA/Gamelords actually wrote or co-wrote a good deal of GDW's Traveller material ca. 1982-85; the same with DGP ca. 1986-91).<BR><BR>It's also worth noting that these de-canonizations were all post-hoc, after the companies had already stopped publishing Traveller product.&nbsp; The only company I know of that actually had its Traveller license revoked mid-stream is Imperium Games.<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 01:29:03 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR><BR>on 29/1/01 10:43 pm, Michael Daumen at daumen@mindspring.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; A little different from CT/GURPS distinction<BR>&gt; since (1) CT is no longer issuing new products<BR><BR>In a couple of weeks, FFE will publish:<BR><BR>Memory Alpha<BR>A Plague of Perruques<BR><BR>For the first time, I believe? :)<BR><BR>Perruques are wigs and/or hair-pieces?<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 20:59:32 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR>&gt; on 29/1/01 10:43 pm, Michael Daumen at daumen@mindspring.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; A little different from CT/GURPS distinction<BR>&gt;&gt; since (1) CT is no longer issuing new products<BR><BR>&gt;In a couple of weeks, FFE will publish:<BR><BR>&gt;Memory Alpha<BR>&gt;A Plague of Perruques<BR><BR>&gt;For the first time, I believe? :)<BR><BR>Well, kinda.&nbsp; 'A Plague of Perruques' was published (possibly modified) in Traveller's Digest #10 (1987).&nbsp; 'Memory Alpha' was published (definitely modified) in the T4 Ref Screen (1997).&nbsp; Both were (as I suspected and someone else recently confirmed) originally tournament modules.&nbsp; So, yes and no.<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 21:25:45 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR><BR>Dom Mooney wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Note that this is interesting in that Chaosium is taking a different,<BR>&gt;yet similar approach with their Moorcock license; they are producing<BR>&gt;and selling 'Dragon Lords of Melnibone' which is a D20 Elric! game.<BR>&gt;I'm willing to bet that it will include conversion rules for Elric!<BR>&gt;and Stormbringer!, instantly giving a tranche of supplements for the<BR>&gt;world for D20 players. Initially, I thought that this was being done<BR>&gt;in house because of license issues, but that doesn't appear to be the<BR>&gt;case as Darcsyde are being licensed to produce the Corum and Hawkmoon<BR>&gt;supplements for Elric!<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I think that it's mostly a matter of audience. The Lovecraft and the<BR>Cthulhu Mythos properties have a lot more potential, at least here in the<BR>United States. In the early 90s, Lovecraft's works went through a resurgence<BR>in popularity. I remember when I was first getting involved in reading his<BR>stuff, I had to hit garage sales and used bookstores to find the 70s<BR>paperback printings. About four years later, all of the stuff was<BR>re-released by Del Rey / Ballantine and now Lovecraft's works are a staple<BR>in most bookstores, even the crappy little mall "shoebox" style chain<BR>stores. 'Round these parts, Lovecraft's pretty close to being canonized as a<BR>master of the horror genre and a legitimate literary figure in the same way<BR>that Poe was in the early quarter of the 20th century (I was about to say<BR>"this century" before I caught myself).<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I'm not sure about Wizards' distribution in Britain, but in the United<BR>States customers can find D&amp;D products in pretty much every comic shop and<BR>bookstore (and with Hasbro's distribution network they'll have a lot of toy<BR>stores locked down as well). From what I've seen, Chaosium doesn't really<BR>have much in the way of penetration in bookstores, so this is a big step up.<BR>As a result, non-roleplaying horror fans will be much more likely to see the<BR>d20 product. Then, of course, you have lots of D&amp;D fans who are also<BR>Lovecraft fans who would love to use Mythos nasties in their own campaigns.<BR>Then, you have people who are new to roleplaying and have familiarity with<BR>the d20 system as applied to D&amp;D, but are are put off by having to learn a<BR>whole new system to try a game set in Lovecraft's universe.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; On the other hand, at least in my own experience, Moorcock's works don't<BR>seem to be nearly as popular as Lovecraft's here in the U.S. My suspicion is<BR>that this is the reason Chaosium has decided to publish their core d20<BR>products based on their Moorcock license "in house". Of course, it's always<BR>possible that WotC initiated the negotiations and showed no interest in the<BR>Elric license from the start. As it stands now, there are a number of d20<BR>products of varying quality intended specifically for the D&amp;D system, but no<BR>company has really gone out on a limb by producing a d20 version of their<BR>own game. WotC might feel that getting a very limited CoC license might "get<BR>the ball rolling". Like I said though, I don't really know about the<BR>circumstances under which the deal between Chaosium and Wizards came to<BR>exist.<BR><BR>&gt;I'd be interested to see if Chaosium start publishing supplements for<BR>&gt;CoC with dual stats, or if they stick with CoC 5.6, which is their<BR>&gt;core game now that they have protected themselves by placing<BR>&gt;PenDragon and Hero Wars with other companies.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; My bet is that they'll publish supplements for CoC with dual stats. It will<BR>open their line up to D&amp;D / d20 fans, which could be huge. It'll also keep<BR>their supplements compatible with the d20 version of "Call of Cthulhu", and<BR>this will be big if the Wizards product does well. I think that it makes<BR>better sense to support the product than it does not to. If the CoC<BR>experiment works out, I wouldn't be surprised if the d20 logo on the back of<BR>the PHB ends up becoming more prominent in future versions, or moves up to<BR>the front.<BR><BR>&gt;PS having played both Elric! and DND3, Elric! is to my mind a far<BR>&gt;better heroic scale system (and very, very lethal)<BR><BR>I've always wanted to check out the Elric RPG, as I've always had something<BR>of an interest in the universe. If my current job works out I'll probably<BR>move it up on my "to buy" list a bit. The only problem is that I have a<BR>slight bias against games tightly tied into a universe which has already<BR>been extensively developed in some other medium. I prefer having a lot of<BR>tools at my fingertips with which I can weave my own universe from, as<BR>opposed to materials made for fans of a specific book or movie series.<BR>Still, if the system is good it should be worth checking out.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 21:53:08 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR><BR>Michael Daumen wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;The d20 arrangement is an "Open Gaming License" borrowed ideas prevalent in<BR>&gt;the software field.&nbsp; Anyone can write (and more importantly, sell) d20<BR>&gt;material as long as they adhere to the OGL and refrain from changing core<BR>&gt;rules.&nbsp; The idea is that the Player's Handbook is still "off limits" and<BR>&gt;therefore required to play.&nbsp; So ultimately, WotC hopes, it leads to more<BR>&gt;sales of their merchandise.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I understand the way that the d20 "open system" works (especially since<BR>I've been kicking around some ideas and I want to make sure I'll be able to<BR>publish them), and I did mention in the post you're responding to that the<BR>CoC book will likely not include certain rules on character design, which<BR>are off limits in the OGL, which in turn will necessitate the purchase of<BR>the PHB. Then again, it's also possible that the Wizards CoC product will be<BR>able to stand alone. Since I'm not sure of the specifics, I won't go any<BR>further. Remember, WotC is not bound by that aspect of the Open Gaming<BR>License. They can publish information for character design and incrementing<BR>levels in a hundred different books if they want to... it's just that other<BR>publishers cannot.<BR><BR>&gt;A little different from CT/GURPS distinction since (1) CT is no longer<BR>issuing new products, and (2)<BR>&gt;only SJG can publish GURPS stuff.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Keep in mind that I said that the situations are "similar" not "exactly the<BR>same". They are similar in that, as I said, Marc is licensing the universe<BR>to Steve Jackson Games. Ol' "Evil Stevie" (and I mean that affectionately)<BR>gets the advantage of existing Traveller fans being much more likely to buy<BR>his products, and those who are interested in a very detailed, rich and<BR>well-supported sci-fi gaming product turning to the GURPS version of<BR>Traveller. Remember, GT marks the first time since the GURPS Supers debacle<BR>that Steve Jackson Games has gone out on a limb by publishing supplements to<BR>a world book. On the other hand, Marc gets the advantage of a steady cash<BR>flow, which allows him to release products through his own FFE company. In<BR>addition, distributors are much more likely to pick up the Classic Traveller<BR>reprint series if GT is selling briskly. Ultimately, though, when SJG picked<BR>up the license, it was hoped that it would lead to an increase in sales of<BR>their core products, as well as sales of the GURPS Traveller books. You'll<BR>likely need the D&amp;D PHB to play d20 CoC, just as you need the GURPS Core<BR>Book to play GT.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 21:26:42 -0600<BR>From: "Joseph R. Dietrich" &lt;yikes@evansville.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Who wants a near mint cogs and dogs?<BR><BR>Hey kids,<BR><BR>I just picked up a near mint DGP Vilani &amp; Vargr from a FLUBS (Favorite Local<BR>Used Books store) for $3.95 USD.<BR><BR>I have this book already.<BR><BR>I want to sell this one.<BR><BR>I was going to put it on eBay, but I know how sentimental some of you guys<BR>are about this stuff. ;-)<BR><BR>So, I am going to hold a little bidding contest. Email me privately if you<BR>are interested at yikes@evansville.net. Please *do not* email the list. I<BR>give it a day or two to take first inquiries, then I will email back<BR>privately everyone when I start the process.<BR><BR>P.S. Bidding will start at $3.95 USD plus shipping. I would like to make my<BR>money back, at least.<BR><BR>Ciao,<BR><BR>Joseph R. Dietrich, yikes@evansville.net<BR>Not a TML Great Old One yet, but he's gone all quiet like he's one.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 21:06:31 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Inspectors for Imperial Rules of War<BR><BR>re:&nbsp; From: anders.backman@aniware.se (Anders Backman)<BR><BR>&gt;And who, actually, is checking that these conflicts comply <BR>&gt;to the Imperial Rules of War IRW)? Either some kind of <BR>&gt;Diplomatic figures entirely civilian or maybe some IISS guys? The Navy,<BR>&gt;Army, Marines can <BR>[deletion]<BR>&gt;The Dorsai trilogy by Gordon Dickson had some kind of mercenary<BR>&gt;inspectors (in purple cloaks if I remember correctly) that fit the <BR>&gt;bill.<BR><BR>I don't think that there will be any inspectors per se.&nbsp; Parties who are<BR>losing or who believe that they are losing, as well as suffering<BR>non-belligerents, will complain about violations of the rules to the local<BR>nobility and/or Imperial military, who will investigate and <BR>intervene on an ad hoc basis. <BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 19:14:22 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Leonard Erickson<BR>&gt; Sent: Tuesday, 30 January 2001 09:27<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; On Mon, 29 Jan 2001, Megan Robertson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Benefits (?) of over 23 years roleplaying.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Gaah, it always discomforting to realise that roleplaying is so old a<BR>&gt; &gt; hobby. You have been playing almost as long as I have been in existence.<BR>&gt; &gt; B-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Well, I started role playing in 1974. I bet that *really* bothers you.<BR>&gt; :-)<BR><BR>I started roleplaying in about 1965.<BR>I think I was playing the role of a dinosaur...<BR>I was four at the time.<BR>&lt;grin&gt;<BR><BR>Seriously, its hard to tell when I started "roleplaying" as a hobby, I was<BR>wargaming in the<BR>early seventies, and started playing Steve Curtis' "Old West Skirmish<BR>Wargaming" game, which had many aspects of roleplaying, especially with the<BR>"campaign" games and the representation of "non-combatants" such as<BR>bar-girls, priests, school-marms, farmers, and kids on the battlefield.<BR><BR>There was also the related "Colonial Skirmish Wargaming" playing gentlemen<BR>with stiff upper lips as they machine-gunned large numbers of Zulu's before<BR>being over-run, and "Rudis" the gladiatorial conbat game.<BR><BR>I do remember that we played D&amp;D before we had the rulebooks. A overseas<BR>visitor to a wargames convention ran one game based off the original beige<BR>books, and we wrote our own rules on the train home from the convention<BR>based on our remembrances and a hand-written copy of the reference sheets,<BR>and played those for the four or five months it took for a copy to get into<BR>the country again.<BR><BR>A guy with more generosity than sense loaned me his originaal LBBs, at the<BR>next years convention, but I did get them back to him a few months later...<BR><BR>He deserves an SEH for putting up with me.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3572<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zb03.mx.aol.com (rly-zb03.mail.aol.com [172.31.41.3]) by air-zb02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 01:03:44 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zb03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 01:03:19 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id BAA11094;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 01:01:10 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 30 Jan 2001 01:00:58 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id BAA11043<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 01:00:57 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 01:00:57 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101300600.BAA11043@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3572<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3573</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/30/01 10:26:34 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 30 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3573<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: WotC's CoC, &amp; Andromeda<BR>Re: WotC/LUG products dropped was Re: Traveller-digest V1999<BR>Web Sites<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Unofficial TNS<BR>Re: Starports and TL<BR>RE: de-canonized material<BR>Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Weapon recoil (RE: Question.....)<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: WotC<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR>Need advice...<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 08:16:09 -0000<BR>From: "Jeff Rowse" &lt;jeffrowse@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: WotC's CoC, &amp; Andromeda<BR><BR>First off, I'd like to thank all those who put me straight over my confusion <BR>re WotC's CoC etc - it's just that, the first time I checked their website <BR>this year it said they would be releasing a whole list of sourcebooks and <BR>supplements for Dune, CoC etc.&nbsp; When I checked the other day it said they <BR>wouldn't be doing half the things they were tumpeting at the start of the <BR>year.<BR>Having seen several FLGS' be crowded out by a certain chain of megastores <BR>which have now reduced their 'role-playing game' stocklist to little more <BR>than Pokemon cards and a few D&amp;D books, Paranoia struck.<BR><BR>Gene Roddenberry's Andromeda is shown Monday night at 8pm on SkyOne in the <BR>UK.&nbsp; I like it, but then I think that rain is wet, so who am I to judge?<BR><BR>Jeff.<BR>(ps ObTrav&gt;&nbsp; The PCs hear half a rumor and instantly jump off the deep <BR>end... &lt;cynical&gt;and, although everyone else tries to prove otherwise, events <BR>prove the PCs right. &lt;/cynical&gt;!!)<BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 00:50:24 -0800<BR>From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>Subject: Re: WotC/LUG products dropped was Re: Traveller-digest V1999<BR><BR>Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; AFAIK The Star Trek rights were revoked because Paramount didn't want<BR>&gt; the game in the same house as Star Wars.<BR><BR>Yep.<BR><BR>&gt; Dune, I'm unsure of the reason (but it's a shame as the IKON system<BR>&gt; version was good).<BR><BR>Frank Herbert's estate pulled the license, I'm unclear as to the <BR>reasons.&nbsp; Hasbro really got burned with the LUGs purchase, they <BR>got *nothing* as far as IPs.&nbsp; Sort of amazing for such a large an <BR>powerful company, or perhaps not since reverse economies of <BR>scale and entrenched dilbertism both often seem endemic with <BR>companies that large.<BR><BR><BR>- -John Snead sneadj@Mindspring.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:14:49 -0000<BR>From: "Antony Farrell" &lt;Skaran@bigpond.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Web Sites<BR><BR>How about a challenge for all the Traveller enthusiasts with web sites.<BR><BR>Lets all put in a concerted efforts to get some updates up and running.<BR><BR>I find it a little disappointing to go through site after site and get<BR>"coming soon" messages dated more than a year ago.<BR><BR>Come on, we can do it.<BR><BR>Antony<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 11:09:14 +0100<BR>From: "Jens Maskus" &lt;megulon@web.de&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>On Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:14:49 -0000, Antony Farrell wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I find it a little disappointing to go through site after site and get<BR>&gt;"coming soon" messages dated more than a year ago.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Come on, we can do it.<BR><BR>me too,<BR><BR>let us have just one site!<BR><BR>Jens<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 11:38:40 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>Antony Farrell wrote:<BR>&gt; I find it a little disappointing to go through site after site<BR>&gt; and get "coming soon" messages dated more than a year ago.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Come on, we can do it.<BR><BR>This could be&nbsp; a&nbsp; result&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; feedback&nbsp; (or&nbsp; lack&nbsp; of)&nbsp; that<BR>webmeisters get for their efforts.&nbsp; If you see&nbsp; a&nbsp; "coming&nbsp; soon"<BR>message gathering dust why not drop a quick line to&nbsp; the&nbsp; author.<BR>If they know people are reading their site and taking an interest<BR>they might be more inclined to keep working on it.&nbsp; I&nbsp; admit&nbsp; I'm<BR>guilty of this sin, too.&nbsp; And how many people here use "Galactic"<BR>but haven't achknowledged this to Jim Vassila, or use&nbsp; "Heaven&nbsp; &amp;<BR>Earth" and haven't achknowledged this to Stuart Fenris, or any of<BR>the other software tools out there?<BR><BR>I'd like to suggest we start *routinely* posting reviews of&nbsp; each<BR>other's web sites.&nbsp; This would both raise the profile of some&nbsp; of<BR>these sites by highlighting items of general interest and/or&nbsp; use<BR>to the TML community, and provide a minimum standard of&nbsp; feedback<BR>to the authors ... which in turn will encourage further work.<BR><BR>I only have email access at work&nbsp; but&nbsp; as&nbsp; soon&nbsp; as&nbsp; I&nbsp; get&nbsp; home<BR>tonight I am going to pick and review at least one site ...&nbsp; lets<BR>all do the same thing and see what we get over the next few days.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 12:48:57 +0100<BR>From: "Kjeld Johansen" &lt;kjeld@games.dk&gt;<BR>Subject: Unofficial TNS<BR><BR>I have started writing an unofficial TNS:<BR>&lt;http://traveller.virvar.net/&gt;<BR>It is based on the Gurps timeline, is starting in year 1121 and is centered<BR>in the Spinward Marches.<BR><BR>If anyone else is running a campaign in this place / time, then I would love<BR>to receive news from your Traveller universe. This way I could bring the<BR>universe even more to live.<BR><BR>Kjeld.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:03:54 +0100<BR>From: Hans Rancke-Madsen &lt;rancke@diku.dk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Starports and TL<BR><BR>Reply-To: <BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson writes:<BR>&gt;This phrase could be used with a number of other artifacts within the OTU;<BR>&gt;hmmm, jumpspace and jump drives, reactionless thrusters, length of the Long<BR>&gt;Night and other timescales, the Terran conquest of the Ziru Sirka, noblesse<BR>&gt;oblige and the Imperial feudal system...<BR><BR>Yeah, having the Terrans overrun the Siru Zirka is as silly as having the goths<BR>overrun Rome.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Hans<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:08:46 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: de-canonized material<BR><BR>Anthony Colosetti wrote:<BR>&gt; I've been curious about this for a while now and maybe I just<BR>&gt; missed something, but does anyone out there know WHY GDW<BR>&gt; de-canonized the Judges Guild material?&nbsp; And my second question<BR>&gt; is if this happened to JG what other material has suffered the<BR>&gt; same treatment?&nbsp; Just wondering....<BR><BR>About 6 months ago I saw an alleged internal GDW&nbsp; email&nbsp; sent&nbsp; at<BR>the time Atlas Of The Imperium was published.&nbsp; In it&nbsp; the&nbsp; status<BR>of all published sectors were listed ... the&nbsp; sectors&nbsp; of&nbsp; Judges<BR>Guild, Paranoia Press, and Group One were de-canonised as "not of<BR>sufficient quality to be included".<BR><BR>Personnaly, if true I think that was a little harsh ...&nbsp; I&nbsp; admit<BR>the&nbsp; stellar&nbsp; arrangement&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; I*Shed Ni Heptad (sp?)&nbsp; looks<BR>dubious but not much more than the Sword Worlds backwards "K".&nbsp; I<BR>would have kept the sectors but maybe de-canonised&nbsp; some&nbsp; of&nbsp; the<BR>supporting products (or parts of). ... No E-circuit modules IMTU.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:18:53 +0100<BR>From: Hans Rancke-Madsen &lt;rancke@diku.dk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR><BR>Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm writes:<BR>&gt;Christopher Thrash wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;If you're interested in a statistical summary of the results that First In<BR>&gt;&gt;does give, I have done some of the work and posted it:<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;http://www.io.com/~thrash/firstin.html<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;Nice analysis. Useful as an eye-opener.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;On average, one in every 5367 systems develop intelligent life.<BR><BR>Far too few for the Traveller feel. The theoretical figure is one per three<BR>subsectors[*] (roughly 1 per hundred). In practice it seems closer to one per<BR>subsector on the average, though that's just a feeling I have.<BR><BR>[*] There is supposed to be about 100 minor non-human races in the Imperium and<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; the Imperium has about 300 subsectors.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>Hans<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 06:44:48 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>How about an updated posting showing which sites contain which<BR>information?&nbsp; For instance, if I needed to find the Wet Navy design<BR>sequences for FF&amp;S, I'd simply consult the latest update showing that<BR>this can be found X site (I can't remember which one).<BR><BR>Basically, we'd be creating an index of all Traveller resource material<BR>on the internet.<BR><BR>- --- "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; Antony Farrell wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; I find it a little disappointing to go through site after site<BR>&gt; &gt; and get "coming soon" messages dated more than a year ago.<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Come on, we can do it.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This could be&nbsp; a&nbsp; result&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; feedback&nbsp; (or&nbsp; lack&nbsp; of)&nbsp; that<BR>&gt; webmeisters get for their efforts.&nbsp; If you see&nbsp; a&nbsp; "coming&nbsp; soon"<BR>&gt; message gathering dust why not drop a quick line to&nbsp; the&nbsp; author.<BR>&gt; If they know people are reading their site and taking an interest<BR>&gt; they might be more inclined to keep working on it.&nbsp; I&nbsp; admit&nbsp; I'm<BR>&gt; guilty of this sin, too.&nbsp; And how many people here use "Galactic"<BR>&gt; but haven't achknowledged this to Jim Vassila, or use&nbsp; "Heaven&nbsp; &amp;<BR>&gt; Earth" and haven't achknowledged this to Stuart Fenris, or any of<BR>&gt; the other software tools out there?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I'd like to suggest we start *routinely* posting reviews of&nbsp; each<BR>&gt; other's web sites.&nbsp; This would both raise the profile of some&nbsp; of<BR>&gt; these sites by highlighting items of general interest and/or&nbsp; use<BR>&gt; to the TML community, and provide a minimum standard of&nbsp; feedback<BR>&gt; to the authors ... which in turn will encourage further work.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I only have email access at work&nbsp; but&nbsp; as&nbsp; soon&nbsp; as&nbsp; I&nbsp; get&nbsp; home<BR>&gt; tonight I am going to pick and review at least one site ...&nbsp; lets<BR>&gt; all do the same thing and see what we get over the next few days.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Regards PLST<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:06:06 +0200<BR>From: Antti Lahtinen &lt;lahtinen@ee.tut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Weapon recoil (RE: Question.....)<BR><BR>Ray Rangel wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; The recoil is not caused by the slug. It is caused by the escaping<BR>&gt; gases. That's why a shotgun, for instance, will put an unsuspecting<BR>&gt; firer on their keaster.<BR><BR>Matthew W. Helton wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Chemically propelled projectile weapons have three components that need<BR>&gt; to be addressed for recoil. Projectile mass, Propellant mass and muzzle<BR>&gt; velocity are the three main components. Bore size is irrelevant, peak<BR>&gt; operating pressure is irrelevant.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Other factors are action type (This does not affect gross recoil but it<BR>&gt; does affect the time to recoil), physical leverage, and environment.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; A agree to the above statement.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; When a round of ammunition is fired, the impulse is caused by<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; both projectile and propellant exiting from the weapon. When the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; projectile has exited from the barrel, the propellant gas left<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; in the barrel will expand at its free expansion velocity. For<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; smokeless powder, the free expansion velocity is generally<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; assumed to be around 2000 m/s.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Example: .44 Remington Magnum ammunition<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Projectile mass: 19.4 g<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Projectile velocity: 403 m/s (at muzzle)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Projectile impulse: 7.8 Ns<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Projectile energy: 1575 J (at muzzle)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Propellant mass: 1.25 g<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Propellant velocity: 2000 m/s (estimate for smokeless powder)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Propellant impulse: 2.5 Ns<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Total impulse: 10.3 Ns<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; 24.2% of the total impulse results from the propellant<BR><BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Example: 5.56 x 45 mm ammunition<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Projectile mass: 3.6 g<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Projectile velocity: 955 m/s (at muzzle)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Projectile impulse: 3.44 Ns<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Projectile energy: 1641.6 J (at muzzle)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Propellant mass: 1.46 g<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Propellant velocity: 2000 m/s (estimate for smokeless powder)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Propellant impulse: 2.92 Ns<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Total impulse: 6.36 Ns<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; 45.9% of the total impulse results from the propellant<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; To estimate how much recoil affects the aiming (to-hit changes<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for the subsequent shots), divide the total impulse by the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; weapon mass. The resulting value is the weapon velocity (m/s)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; and is close to the Traveller:TNE recoil value.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Example: recoil velocity<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The mass of fully loaded Ruger Super Redhawk is 1.788 kg. When<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; this weapon is used to fire the above .44 Magnum ammunition, the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; recoil velocity is 5.76 m/s.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The mass of fully loaded IMI TAR-21 is 3.635 kg. When this<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; weapon is used to fire the above 5.56x45 mm load, the recoil<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; velocity is 1.75 m/s.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; According to these values, the .44 Magnum revolver has much<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; higher recoil impulse and recoil velocity than the 5.56 x 45 mm<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; carbine. Additionally the carbine is held against shoulder and<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; is straight-recoil bullpup (no muzzle rise) while the revolver<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; is held with hands and has high barrel line. This would suggest<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; that while these weapons have roughly equal muzzle energies, a<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; person armed with the carbine is less affected by recoil than<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; one armed with the revolver.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; For comparison, a 4 mm gauss rifle (Traveller:TNE) would be:<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Projectile mass: 0.5 g<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Projectile velocity: 4000 m/s (at muzzle)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Projectile impulse: 2 Ns<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Projectile energy 4000 J (at muzzle)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Weapon mass: 4 kg<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Recoil velocity: 0.5 m/s<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; According to these values, the gauss rifle has very low<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; recoil compared to its muzzle energy.<BR>- --<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Antti Lahtinen&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; lahtinen@ee.tut.fi<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Researcher, MSc (Eng)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.ee.tut.fi/~lahtinen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:04:41 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>Gerry Harris wrote:<BR>&gt; How about an updated posting showing which sites contain which<BR>&gt; information?&nbsp; For instance, if I needed to find the Wet Navy<BR>&gt; design sequences for FF&amp;S, I'd simply consult the latest update<BR>&gt; showing that this can be found X site (I can't remember which<BR>&gt; one).<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Basically, we'd be creating an index of all Traveller resource<BR>&gt; material on the internet.<BR><BR>A great idea ... and one that's been tried before&nbsp; (IIRC&nbsp; it&nbsp; was<BR>called the Alexadra Files after the infamous&nbsp; library).&nbsp; It&nbsp; will<BR>only work if the index maintainer is prepared to put in a lot&nbsp; of<BR>effort (both in initial setup and in&nbsp; keeping&nbsp; it&nbsp; up&nbsp; to&nbsp; date).<BR>Keeping the index up to date includes regularly visiting sites to<BR>look for new material and dead sites.&nbsp; Are you volunteering?<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 09:21:22 -0600<BR>From: "Thomas Vickers" &lt;tvickers@conroe.isd.tenet.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>I have to agree with that. give the site owner some feedback. There are several<BR>projects at my 2300 site that are languishing because I get no feedback. Why<BR>keep plugging away when you have no clue who is seeing it or if it is useful.<BR><BR>TV<BR><BR>_______________________________________<BR>"The mome rath isn't born that could outgrabe me!"<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Nicol Williamson<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 10:47:30 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: "William 'Commander X' Prankard" &lt;cmdrx@ao.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR>Many are remembering this day and where they were when this tradgedy<BR>happened, but how many TMLers were actualy there to witness the event?<BR><BR>I am one.&nbsp; And the image is still burned into my brain 15 years later (my<BR>ghods, has it been that long?)<BR><BR>I had recently moved to Titusville Florida in June of&nbsp; '85 and being a<BR>space fanatic thought it was so cool to see a Shuttle launch for<BR>real.&nbsp; (So THIS is what it is like to live near a TL7 Type D Starport!) By<BR>the end of the year I've seen alot of shots go off (this was in that age<BR>of "Go Fever") and by then I've pretty much gotten used to how a launch is<BR>supposed to look and sound.&nbsp; It was all pretty routine in my mind by 1986.<BR><BR>That January day in 1986 I remeber how un-Florida-ly cold it was.&nbsp; I was<BR>in 10th grade biology class when we were allowed to go outside and watch<BR>the launch.&nbsp; Titusville High School is on US 1 and you can see the<BR>launchpad and VAB directly across the rivers..Yes It's that<BR>close.&nbsp; Challenger took off as usual, orange-red fire trail and billowing<BR>white trail below&nbsp; and the familliar earthquake.&nbsp; Then, something wasn't<BR>quite right.&nbsp; I couldn't do anything but look directly into the explosion<BR>absolutely dumbfounded.&nbsp; The Two SRBs were spinning madly away from the<BR>billowing cloud of smoke and debris.&nbsp; I must have been in shock, my eyes<BR>frozen on the image not realizing what had happened.&nbsp; I broke out of it<BR>when I heard someone cry out "The Shuttle exploded!&nbsp; The Shuttle<BR>Exploded!"&nbsp; No, it couldn't be!&nbsp; Could it?&nbsp; I looked again at the cloud<BR>hoping that the astronauts had escaped.&nbsp; Was that a parachute?&nbsp; No, only<BR>smoldering debris falling into the Atlantic.&nbsp; Still could someone&nbsp; have<BR>survived?<BR><BR>Sadly, I leared the answer was no when our school principal anounced the<BR>news on the intercom. Challenger was totaly destroyed and all hands<BR>lost.&nbsp; Then he put the radio on and we heard the entire story that the<BR>Challenger 7 had "sliped the surly bonds of Earth to touch the face of<BR>God".<BR><BR>I knew then that I had personaly witnessed human history.&nbsp; An event in<BR>time as significant as the Hindenburg or the JFK assasination.<BR><BR>By the time NASA launched another shuttle, I had graduated from high<BR>school and already in college.&nbsp; But it was good to see we did not give up<BR>the quest for the stars, albeit a bit more cautiously and wiser.&nbsp; <BR><BR>\\&nbsp; &nbsp; //&nbsp; Commander X<BR>\\&nbsp; //&nbsp;&nbsp; CEO X-TEK Industries of Deneb, LIC<BR>&nbsp; T E K&nbsp;&nbsp; Starship Contractor &amp; High Energy Weapons Research<BR>//&nbsp; \\&nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.ao.net/~cmdrx/xtek<BR>//&nbsp; &nbsp; \\&nbsp; 0608 D557777-A kk- va+ so+ zh+ da+ A723<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 07:58:25 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>I'd be willing to contribute a webpage (I have a bit of room left on<BR>the ther Traveller yahoo site) and a a bit of time perusing sites.&nbsp; Of<BR>course, if everyone sent in links to their sites and the information<BR>found therein, the project would go quite a bit faster.<BR><BR><BR>- --- "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; Gerry Harris wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; How about an updated posting showing which sites contain which<BR>&gt; &gt; information?&nbsp; For instance, if I needed to find the Wet Navy<BR>&gt; &gt; design sequences for FF&amp;S, I'd simply consult the latest update<BR>&gt; &gt; showing that this can be found X site (I can't remember which<BR>&gt; &gt; one).<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Basically, we'd be creating an index of all Traveller resource<BR>&gt; &gt; material on the internet.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; A great idea ... and one that's been tried before&nbsp; (IIRC&nbsp; it&nbsp; was<BR>&gt; called the Alexadra Files after the infamous&nbsp; library).&nbsp; It&nbsp; will<BR>&gt; only work if the index maintainer is prepared to put in a lot&nbsp; of<BR>&gt; effort (both in initial setup and in&nbsp; keeping&nbsp; it&nbsp; up&nbsp; to&nbsp; date).<BR>&gt; Keeping the index up to date includes regularly visiting sites to<BR>&gt; look for new material and dead sites.&nbsp; Are you volunteering?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Regards PLST<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 11:31:00 EST<BR>From: Kagehira@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: WotC<BR><BR>- --part1_13.10c3ee32.27a84644_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR>In a message dated 1/29/01 1:59:36 PM Pacific Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; quick glance at the WotC website says that 'due to resource constraints <BR>&gt; and contractual issues', the Dune RPG has been cancelled completely.&nbsp; They <BR>&gt; have also "announced" that (their) Call of Cthulhu RPG has been rescheduled <BR>&gt; from October 2001 to January 2002 with NO follow-up products. I cannot help <BR>&gt; wondering if they had any idea, when they bought up all the rights to these <BR>&gt; titles, that they may not be publishing much - if anything. Are WotC now <BR>&gt; going to hold on to the IP rights and prevent anyone else doing anything <BR>&gt; with them, or are they going to be nice and say 'we can't do it, does <BR>&gt; nayone else want it?'&nbsp; I know which I would prefer, but I don't think <BR>&gt; .<BR><BR><BR>Hasbro(?), WotC's parent company is having financial problems last I heard, <BR>and of course the Pokeman cards are no longer the big thing (not for at least <BR>the last seven months).<BR><BR>Bryan<BR><BR><BR><BR>- --part1_13.10c3ee32.27a84644_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT size=2>In a message dated 1/29/01 1:59:36 PM Pacific Standard Time, <BR><BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR><BR><BR>&lt;BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"&gt;quick glance at the WotC website says that 'due to resource constraints <BR><BR>and contractual issues', the Dune RPG has been cancelled completely. &amp;nbsp;They <BR><BR>have also "announced" that (their) Call of Cthulhu RPG has been rescheduled <BR><BR>from October 2001 to January 2002 with NO follow-up products. I cannot help <BR><BR>wondering if they had any idea, when they bought up all the rights to these <BR><BR>titles, that they may not be publishing much - if anything. Are WotC now <BR><BR>going to hold on to the IP rights and prevent anyone else doing anything <BR><BR>with them, or are they going to be nice and say 'we can't do it, does <BR><BR>nayone else want it?' &amp;nbsp;I know which I would prefer, but I don't think <BR><BR>it'll be what happens&lt;/BLOCKQUOTE&gt;.</FONT><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF"><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>Hasbro(?), WotC's parent company is having financial problems last I heard, <BR><BR>and of course the Pokeman cards are no longer the big thing (not for at least <BR><BR>the last seven months).<BR><BR><BR><BR>Bryan<BR><BR><BR><BR></FONT><BR><BR>- --part1_13.10c3ee32.27a84644_boundary--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:58:55 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>on 30/1/01 5:14 pm, Antony Farrell at Skaran@bigpond.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; How about a challenge for all the Traveller enthusiasts with web sites.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Lets all put in a concerted efforts to get some updates up and running.<BR><BR>Updates! I'm busy writing my first Traveller website.<BR><BR>&gt; I find it a little disappointing to go through site after site and get<BR>&gt; "coming soon" messages dated more than a year ago.<BR><BR>You won't even get that on mine. :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:35:04 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>on 30/1/01 11:38 am, Trevor, Peter at Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I only have email access at work&nbsp; but&nbsp; as&nbsp; soon&nbsp; as&nbsp; I&nbsp; get&nbsp; home<BR>&gt; tonight I am going to pick and review at least one site ...&nbsp; lets<BR>&gt; all do the same thing and see what we get over the next few days.<BR><BR>Aye to that. Can we agree to prefix something like [Website Review] into the<BR>subject so that the next Alexandria project has an easy off?<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 08:13:49<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>At 11:38 AM 1/30/2001 -0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Antony Farrell wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; I find it a little disappointing to go through site after site<BR>&gt;&gt; and get "coming soon" messages dated more than a year ago.<BR><BR>&gt;This could be&nbsp; a&nbsp; result&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; feedback&nbsp; (or&nbsp; lack&nbsp; of)&nbsp; that<BR>&gt;webmeisters get for their efforts.<BR><BR>Exactly.<BR><BR>My site (Sylea Downport) has been around for several years now, starting<BR>life as Traveller: The Silly Era.&nbsp; Despite the presence of a plea for<BR>feedback and material on every page, response has been nearly nil.&nbsp; In<BR>fact, I may take down the Gridlore Tech page because nobody has ever<BR>commented on it.&nbsp; I'll just reformat the weapon tables and send them to<BR>Andy for an ACQ pdf.<BR><BR>I work full time, and am beginning to write Traveller for money.&nbsp; Taking<BR>care of a large site takes up free time that I'd honestly rather spend with<BR>my wife.&nbsp; It isn't very satisfying to spend hours in front of the computer<BR>for no return.<BR><BR>I will now stop ranting, and go to bed.&nbsp; <BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp;&nbsp; Templar Agent at Large.<BR>gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR><BR>TravGeekCode: <BR>tc+ tm+ !tn- t4@ ?tg+ tt@ to(CORPS)++ ru@ $ge++ 3i<BR>ii+ au st+ ls+ pi kk+ so(++) va++ dr+ zh+ sw++ ?da<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 10:16:11 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>Douglas dont do it yet let me go look first 8)<BR><BR>thanks<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Douglas E. Berry [mailto:gridlore@pop.mindspring.com]<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 12:14 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR><BR>At 11:38 AM 1/30/2001 -0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Antony Farrell wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; I find it a little disappointing to go through site after site<BR>&gt;&gt; and get "coming soon" messages dated more than a year ago.<BR><BR>&gt;This could be&nbsp; a&nbsp; result&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; feedback&nbsp; (or&nbsp; lack&nbsp; of)&nbsp; that<BR>&gt;webmeisters get for their efforts.<BR><BR>Exactly.<BR><BR>My site (Sylea Downport) has been around for several years now, starting<BR>life as Traveller: The Silly Era.&nbsp; Despite the presence of a plea for<BR>feedback and material on every page, response has been nearly nil.&nbsp; In<BR>fact, I may take down the Gridlore Tech page because nobody has ever<BR>commented on it.&nbsp; I'll just reformat the weapon tables and send them to<BR>Andy for an ACQ pdf.<BR><BR>I work full time, and am beginning to write Traveller for money.&nbsp; Taking<BR>care of a large site takes up free time that I'd honestly rather spend with<BR>my wife.&nbsp; It isn't very satisfying to spend hours in front of the computer<BR>for no return.<BR><BR>I will now stop ranting, and go to bed.&nbsp; <BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp;&nbsp; Templar Agent at Large.<BR>gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR><BR>TravGeekCode: <BR>tc+ tm+ !tn- t4@ ?tg+ tt@ to(CORPS)++ ru@ $ge++ 3i<BR>ii+ au st+ ls+ pi kk+ so(++) va++ dr+ zh+ sw++ ?da<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:21:05 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR><BR>Chris Seamans wrote:<BR>&gt; 'Round these parts, Lovecraft's pretty close to being canonized as a<BR>&gt;master of the horror genre and a legitimate literary figure in the same way<BR>&gt;that Poe was in the early quarter of the 20th century (I was about to say<BR>&gt;"this century" before I caught myself).<BR><BR>Lovecraft's literary profile has been gaining steadily for the last 2 decades or so, and I daresay the game has a little something to do with it.&nbsp; I remember hearing about 5 years ago from Sandy Petersen (original CoC designer) that there have been more Call of Cthulhu products sold than HPL books.&nbsp; This is misleading, of course, since it doesn't count second-hand sales or take into account the fact that the same people are buying multiple game products (not to mention the fact that HPL's entire output fits into 4-5 volumes vs. 100+ CoC books), but it does give some idea of the game's profile and influence.<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt;Then, of course, you have lots of D&amp;D fans who are also<BR>&gt;Lovecraft fans who would love to use Mythos nasties in their own campaigns.<BR><BR>Heh, heh.&nbsp; I remember the thrill when I got the 1st edition of 'Deities &amp; Demigods;' not because of the collectability, but just imagining what those guys were going to do to the poor, unkowing PCs in my campaign.&nbsp; Funny that 20 years later things have come full circle.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;PS having played both Elric! and DND3, Elric! is to my mind a far<BR>&gt;&gt;better heroic scale system (and very, very lethal)<BR><BR>&gt;I've always wanted to check out the Elric RPG, as I've always had something<BR>&gt;of an interest in the universe. If my current job works out I'll probably<BR>&gt;move it up on my "to buy" list a bit. <BR><BR>'Elric!' is a streamlined version of the same 'Basic Roleplaying' system that started as RuneQuest and was also used for Stormbringer, Call of Cthulhu, Ringworld, Nephilim, and every other Chaosium rpg (except Pendragon).&nbsp; Percentile-based, intuitive, and easy, but (as with anything percentile-based) tending to break down near the edges.&nbsp; Aside from better organization (based on many years of refinements) and some Moorcock-specific magic and creatures, I'm not sure what, if anything, distinguishes 'Elric!' from any of the other BRP games (or what that exclamation point is supposed to mean).<BR><BR>Trent<BR>&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 10:22:18 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Need advice...<BR><BR>Ok we just wrapped up an adventure. I wanted to award skills at the end of<BR>each adventure. i have been searching for some rules in core traveller about<BR>skill advancement. the only thing i find is this 4 year long process. well<BR>that takes WAY to much time. <BR><BR>the advice i need is<BR><BR>1) do other gms award skills from adventures?<BR>2) is so what system do you use?<BR>3) if you dont award skills what do you do?<BR><BR>what i use to do is pick a couple of skills that i thought the player used<BR>the most and give them a point in them. basically im curious as to what<BR>others do. I have never had the ears of a lot of other traveller gms. so i<BR>figure best to get the advice while i can.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3573<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-ye05.mx.aol.com (rly-ye05.mail.aol.com [172.18.151.202]) by air-ye01.mail.aol.com (v77.35) with ESMTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:26:34 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-ye05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:25:40 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id NAA36978;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:23:35 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:23:00 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id NAA36924<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:23:00 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:23:00 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101301823.NAA36924@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3573<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3574</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/30/01 1:39:32 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 30 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3574<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Need advice...<BR>indexing web sites<BR>Gridlore good!<BR>Re: Need advice...<BR>RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR>Re: Need advice...<BR>Re: First In statistics (was MT, GT, and H&amp;E)<BR>RE: Need advice...<BR>Re: Need advice...<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Need advice...<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>System Writeup Outline<BR>Plush?<BR>Re: Need advice...<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: Need advice...<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 12:32:44 -0800<BR>From: "Pat Connaughton" &lt;patconnaughton@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need advice...<BR><BR>My technique harks back a bit in time and<BR>style. When a player successfully achieves a <BR>task of more that normal difficulty and by more<BR>than a mere point or so, then I have hit note<BR>the success as an AT (usually a hatch mark<BR>next to the skill list on whatever character<BR>sheet that their using).<BR><BR>Every couple of gaming sessions (usually<BR>but not limited to once a month) I let them<BR>try to use the AT's to roll to improve their<BR>skill level. <BR><BR>The mechanism works as follows;<BR>The basic roll for all success is 8 or <BR>more on 2D6. <BR><BR>So if a player with a skill of 1 in <BR>Gunnery wants to get to a 2 then<BR>his basic roll to succeed on 2D6<BR>is a 9 or better. Each accumulated<BR>AT that I award can reduce the required<BR>die roll by 1/2. Obviously I'm pretty carefull<BR>about handing out AT's.<BR><BR>Also, attempting the roll and failing, eliminates<BR>all current AT and the player must start from<BR>scratch.<BR><BR>Hope this helps<BR>Thanks<BR>Pat Connaughton<BR>e-mail - ptconn@earthlink.net<BR>homepage - www.home.earthlink.net/~ptconn<BR>ICQ # 2535086<BR>"He who knows not how to dissemble knows not<BR>how to reign"<BR>Tiberius, Emperator and Princips of Rome<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:59:42 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: indexing web sites<BR><BR>Webring had decent search tools that used the indexing of sites in a ring.<BR>Yahoo has managed not to screw this feature up too badly yet.<BR><BR>Yahoo has made it very hard for owners to manage large rings like the TWR.<BR><BR>I've started an alternate Gearhead ring on ringsurf.com.<BR>Any new gearhead sites will be added there instead of the mess Yahoo has <BR>made of the old webring.org.<BR><BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>Opinions should be yours too! -- http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>"Tension, apprehension and dissension have begun." -- Alfred Bester<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:02:17 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Gridlore good!<BR><BR>Please keep it up, unless of course you can make a buck off the material...<BR><BR>Material like can be fairly static.&nbsp; Ship &amp; small arm designs are useful to <BR>people who's first search is two years after you post the material.<BR><BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/ - Opinions should be yours too!<BR>Did you read what I read?&nbsp; Write it right here in red.<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:13:40 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: Need advice...<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR>&gt; Ok we just wrapped up an adventure. I wanted to award skills at the end of<BR>&gt;each adventure. i have been searching for some rules in core traveller about<BR>&gt;skill advancement. the only thing i find is this 4 year long process. well<BR>&gt;that takes WAY to much time. <BR><BR>The problem with awarding skill-points directly at the end of adventures in Traveller is that per char-gen most folks earn a max of 1-2 skill points a YEAR.&nbsp; Giving out skill-points at the end of each adventure (unless you employ a Pendragon-style 1 adventure per year rule) will quickly lead to PCs with skill levels way out of line with all but the oldest and most experienced of NPCs.&nbsp; If you're running a high-powered superhero-type game this might not be a problem, but, assuming you're not:<BR><BR>&gt;the advice i need is<BR><BR>&gt;1) do other gms award skills from adventures?<BR><BR>Not directly.<BR><BR>&gt;2) is so what system do you use?<BR><BR>Award some sort of Improvement Points, used as DMs for a task-roll to improve the skill.&nbsp; Optionally, a relatively large number of IP could be traded in directly for a skill-point with no die-roll.&nbsp; MegaTraveller has a fairly detailed system for working all this out, which works fine for me, but involves more record-keeping and slower advancement than a lot of folks are willing to accept.&nbsp; There are also numerous variant systems, which usually go hand-in-hand with the assorted Task System reforms.<BR><BR>&gt;3) if you dont award skills what do you do?<BR><BR>Rewards for successful adventures in Traveller should be more along the lines of knowledge, contacts/influence, and 'treasure' (valuables or gimmick items).&nbsp; In this way, Traveller is closer to 'real life' than to DnD.&nbsp; Once your players get past the idea of expecting their characters to 'gain levels' and gradually become super-powered, they'll come to value these sorts of in-game rewards, and (hopefully) understand the logic behind the system.&nbsp; In the long run, building up a mercantile empire or gaining access to the Imperial Court is a much more substantial and rewarding accomplishment than being able to show off your character's Pilot-9 skill to the munchkins at the FLGS.<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 19:18:18 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR><BR>At 01:00 -0500 30/1/01, "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; I'm not sure about Wizards' distribution in Britain, but in the United<BR>&gt;States customers can find D&amp;D products in pretty much every comic shop and<BR>&gt;bookstore (and with Hasbro's distribution network they'll have a lot of toy<BR>&gt;stores locked down as well). From what I've seen, Chaosium doesn't really<BR>&gt;have much in the way of penetration in bookstores, so this is a big step up.<BR>&gt;As a result, non-roleplaying horror fans will be much more likely to see the<BR>&gt;d20 product. Then, of course, you have lots of D&amp;D fans who are also<BR>&gt;Lovecraft fans who would love to use Mythos nasties in their own campaigns.<BR>&gt;Then, you have people who are new to roleplaying and have familiarity with<BR>&gt;the d20 system as applied to D&amp;D, but are are put off by having to learn a<BR>&gt;whole new system to try a game set in Lovecraft's universe.<BR><BR>It's interesting because in the UK it seems to be more common to see <BR>Chaosium stuff in bookshops/comic shops as a result of the publishing <BR>houses for Cthulhu/PenDragon etc. There again, the whole distribution <BR>side can be surreal. It wasn't possible to get a DND3 Player's <BR>Handbook before Christmas in the UK. Friends in the business told me <BR>that WotC in Belgium decided to do a stock take which stopped all <BR>shipments!!!! Hence my FLGS had 20 copies of the PH arrive two weeks <BR>after Christmas!<BR><BR>I really hope that this isn't true!<BR><BR>&gt;Elric license from the start. As it stands now, there are a number of d20<BR>&gt;products of varying quality intended specifically for the D&amp;D system, but no<BR>&gt;company has really gone out on a limb by producing a d20 version of their<BR>&gt;own game. WotC might feel that getting a very limited CoC license might "get<BR>&gt;the ball rolling". Like I said though, I don't really know about the<BR>&gt;circumstances under which the deal between Chaosium and Wizards came to<BR>&gt;exist.<BR><BR>Well, DLoM is a D20 version of Elric! so I suppose Chaosium is <BR>leading the way here...<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;PS having played both Elric! and DND3, Elric! is to my mind a far<BR>&gt; &gt;better heroic scale system (and very, very lethal)<BR>&gt;I've always wanted to check out the Elric RPG, as I've always had something<BR>&gt;of an interest in the universe. If my current job works out I'll probably<BR>&gt;move it up on my "to buy" list a bit. The only problem is that I have a<BR>&gt;slight bias against games tightly tied into a universe which has already<BR>&gt;been extensively developed in some other medium. I prefer having a lot of<BR>&gt;tools at my fingertips with which I can weave my own universe from, as<BR>&gt;opposed to materials made for fans of a specific book or movie series.<BR>&gt;Still, if the system is good it should be worth checking out.<BR><BR>It's a good buy - imagine a faster, more slick, version of RuneQuest <BR>which is more lethal to an extent. I really like it, and it's a silly <BR>price (less than the current GT supplements!)<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:40:52 -0600<BR>From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need advice...<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Ok we just wrapped up an adventure. I wanted to award skills at the end of<BR>&gt; each adventure. i have been searching for some rules in core traveller about<BR>&gt; skill advancement. the only thing i find is this 4 year long process. well<BR>&gt; that takes WAY to much time.<BR><BR>Yes, that's CT for you. &lt;g&gt; The idea is that once the PC's beginning<BR>adventuring they have developed just about all the skills they are going<BR>to have. Even Marc's T5 draft only allows one increase per game year on<BR>the PC's birthday. <BR><BR>&gt; the advice i need is<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 1) do other gms award skills from adventures?<BR>&gt; 2) is so what system do you use?<BR>&gt; 3) if you dont award skills what do you do?<BR><BR>1. Yes, I do, but more slowly than you probably have in mind.<BR><BR>2. I award one or, rarely, two points (not levels) per game month or<BR>adventure segment. These points can be put into skills the PC has<BR>attempted to use several times, practiced extensively, or spent several<BR>hours learning in the previous segment.<BR><BR>To improve from no skill to Skill-0 requires 1 point.<BR>To improve from Skill-0 to Skill-1 requires 1 point.<BR>To improve from Skill-1 to Skill-2 requires 4 points<BR>To improve from Skill-2 to Skill-3 requires 9 points.<BR>IOW, past Skill-0 improving a skill requires points equal to the square<BR>of the level to which the skill is improving.<BR><BR>With only 1 or 2 points given at infrequent intervals the PC skill<BR>*levels* still increase slowly, but they do have a record of what they<BR>have and how much more they need, and that helps keep them motivated.<BR><BR>[BTW, if PC's don't occasionally use a skill, they also *lose* points in<BR>that skill. "I'll pilot the ship's boat. Okay, but you haven't touched a<BR>control in 5 years, so you're going to be *very* rusty..."]<BR><BR>The points can also be put into Brownie points, that can be used to<BR>improve a roll when they really, really need to succeed. Players might<BR>say, "I'm trying really hard...burn one of my Brownie points on this<BR>roll."&nbsp; I rationalize this as their past experiences giving them a<BR>slight boost.<BR><BR>3. IMO, Traveller differs from classic D&amp;D in that skill awards<BR>shouldn't be an important motivator to players. You play Traveller to<BR>solve problems and puzzles, to 'visit strange new worlds', and to<BR>roleplay with friends NOT to make your PC a Level 20 Fighter. &lt;g&gt;<BR>Frankly, in many cases, it's more fun to play with characters that have<BR>to use their cunning and guile to succeed than it is with<BR>super-characters. <BR><BR>So, what do you give Traveller PC's if you don't give them experience<BR>points?&nbsp; You give them more adventures! &lt;g&gt;&nbsp; What you give them is new<BR>challenges that grow out of what they have already accomplished. They<BR>may not be a lot smarter, stronger, or more skilled, but they *are* more<BR>experienced and what they have learned about their universe should help<BR>them in their next adventure.&nbsp; Ideally...&lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>...but in the real world you might want to give them one or two of the<BR>following: an NPC contact they didn't have before, a new enemy, a minor<BR>improvement at some skill, a little knowledge they didn't have before,<BR>some more (or less) money and/or equipment, a modification to their ship<BR>(good or bad), a medal or award, a warrant (generally make it a minor<BR>one, not an Imperial Warrant), or a promotion in rank...and always,<BR>always, always, a new challenge. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:16:56 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: First In statistics (was MT, GT, and H&amp;E)<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:18:53 +0100<BR>&gt; From: Hans Rancke-Madsen &lt;rancke@diku.dk&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: MT, GT, and H&amp;E<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm writes:<BR>&gt; &gt;On average, one in every 5367 systems develop intelligent life.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Far too few for the Traveller feel. The theoretical figure is one per three<BR>&gt; subsectors[*] (roughly 1 per hundred). In practice it seems closer to one per<BR>&gt; subsector on the average, though that's just a feeling I have.<BR><BR>Works out better if you don't insist that the stars on the flat map<BR>represent all that there are, but rather just the "interesting" ones<BR>(whatever that means to&nbsp; you). Of course, this implies that there should<BR>be a strong bias towards F-G-K class stars, which doesn't exist either.<BR><BR>My personal feeling is that GDW went *'way* too far in concentrating<BR>non-human intelligences, both in Traveller and in 2300 AD. I'd rather see<BR>ten minors at most for each major, spread over the volume represented by<BR>Charted Space, instead of 100:1 or five within 30 ly of Earth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 12:20:20 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Need advice...<BR><BR>To everyone who is replying thank you. this is great advice. My worry was if<BR>i started just handing skills out i would make them super hero types fast by<BR>game mechanics and i dont want to do that. many years ago when i was in my<BR>teens (1982 or so) we would fudge the rules a bit on skills. i seem to<BR>remember having some seriously powerful chars and it really messed the game<BR>up. but we were kids and had to have that Super god of what ever fix for our<BR>egos.<BR><BR>Now i want to reward them yet at the same time not over powerthem. here are<BR>some of the things they came out of the adventure with<BR><BR>1) 2 contacts with a race who are enemys with the Imperium<BR>2) they gained a corparation (or better yet certain people in the corp) as<BR>enemys<BR>3) they beat the heck out of some hit men from a Mafia type crime syndicate<BR>so lord knows what those guys will do in the future &lt;evil gm grin&gt;<BR>4) 200,000 Credits (split 4 ways or 50,000 credits apiece *not bad for 2<BR>months worth of work*)<BR>5) a special set of stun guns<BR><BR>They seemed to expect skill raises and i was thinking about it because we<BR>followed the rules exactly for the most part on character generation and<BR>some of them rolled pretty bad.And so i was thinking skill raises might be<BR>good to counter the poor rolls. but i was afraid that if i got moving into<BR>that realm then next thing you would know we would be in this super<BR>character situation. So i figured Advice towards where to go and what to do<BR>would be great.<BR><BR>Also as a side note. I tend to see the Imperium as a fascist type state. are<BR>there other Games out there that depect the Imperium this way? or am i the<BR>only one?<BR><BR>any more advice would be greatly appreciated.<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Eris Reddoch [mailto:eris@pcola.gulf.net]<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 11:41 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Need advice...<BR><BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Ok we just wrapped up an adventure. I wanted to award skills at the end of<BR>&gt; each adventure. i have been searching for some rules in core traveller<BR>about<BR>&gt; skill advancement. the only thing i find is this 4 year long process. well<BR>&gt; that takes WAY to much time.<BR><BR>Yes, that's CT for you. &lt;g&gt; The idea is that once the PC's beginning<BR>adventuring they have developed just about all the skills they are going<BR>to have. Even Marc's T5 draft only allows one increase per game year on<BR>the PC's birthday. <BR><BR>&gt; the advice i need is<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 1) do other gms award skills from adventures?<BR>&gt; 2) is so what system do you use?<BR>&gt; 3) if you dont award skills what do you do?<BR><BR>1. Yes, I do, but more slowly than you probably have in mind.<BR><BR>2. I award one or, rarely, two points (not levels) per game month or<BR>adventure segment. These points can be put into skills the PC has<BR>attempted to use several times, practiced extensively, or spent several<BR>hours learning in the previous segment.<BR><BR>To improve from no skill to Skill-0 requires 1 point.<BR>To improve from Skill-0 to Skill-1 requires 1 point.<BR>To improve from Skill-1 to Skill-2 requires 4 points<BR>To improve from Skill-2 to Skill-3 requires 9 points.<BR>IOW, past Skill-0 improving a skill requires points equal to the square<BR>of the level to which the skill is improving.<BR><BR>With only 1 or 2 points given at infrequent intervals the PC skill<BR>*levels* still increase slowly, but they do have a record of what they<BR>have and how much more they need, and that helps keep them motivated.<BR><BR>[BTW, if PC's don't occasionally use a skill, they also *lose* points in<BR>that skill. "I'll pilot the ship's boat. Okay, but you haven't touched a<BR>control in 5 years, so you're going to be *very* rusty..."]<BR><BR>The points can also be put into Brownie points, that can be used to<BR>improve a roll when they really, really need to succeed. Players might<BR>say, "I'm trying really hard...burn one of my Brownie points on this<BR>roll."&nbsp; I rationalize this as their past experiences giving them a<BR>slight boost.<BR><BR>3. IMO, Traveller differs from classic D&amp;D in that skill awards<BR>shouldn't be an important motivator to players. You play Traveller to<BR>solve problems and puzzles, to 'visit strange new worlds', and to<BR>roleplay with friends NOT to make your PC a Level 20 Fighter. &lt;g&gt;<BR>Frankly, in many cases, it's more fun to play with characters that have<BR>to use their cunning and guile to succeed than it is with<BR>super-characters. <BR><BR>So, what do you give Traveller PC's if you don't give them experience<BR>points?&nbsp; You give them more adventures! &lt;g&gt;&nbsp; What you give them is new<BR>challenges that grow out of what they have already accomplished. They<BR>may not be a lot smarter, stronger, or more skilled, but they *are* more<BR>experienced and what they have learned about their universe should help<BR>them in their next adventure.&nbsp; Ideally...&lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>...but in the real world you might want to give them one or two of the<BR>following: an NPC contact they didn't have before, a new enemy, a minor<BR>improvement at some skill, a little knowledge they didn't have before,<BR>some more (or less) money and/or equipment, a modification to their ship<BR>(good or bad), a medal or award, a warrant (generally make it a minor<BR>one, not an Imperial Warrant), or a promotion in rank...and always,<BR>always, always, a new challenge. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:29:44 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: Need advice...<BR><BR>Eris Reddoch wrote:<BR>&gt;To improve from no skill to Skill-0 requires 1 point.<BR>&gt;To improve from Skill-0 to Skill-1 requires 1 point.<BR>&gt;To improve from Skill-1 to Skill-2 requires 4 points<BR>&gt;To improve from Skill-2 to Skill-3 requires 9 points.<BR>&gt;IOW, past Skill-0 improving a skill requires points equal to the square<BR>&gt;of the level to which the skill is improving.<BR><BR>The problem with a system like this for Traveller is that, per char-gen it's no more or less difficult to go from skill-0 to skill-1 than skill-5 to skill-6.&nbsp; Under this system it's 36x harder (and, perhaps more importantly, takes 36x longer).&nbsp; No comment on which way is better or more 'realistic,' but they're definitely incompatible.<BR><BR>&gt;The points can also be put into Brownie points, that can be used to<BR>&gt;improve a roll when they really, really need to succeed. Players might<BR>&gt;say, "I'm trying really hard...burn one of my Brownie points on this<BR>&gt;roll."&nbsp; I rationalize this as their past experiences giving them a<BR>&gt;slight boost.<BR><BR>The Brownie Points idea is half-heartedly implemented into MT char-gen, and I'd have liked to see it carried over to the rest of the system as well.&nbsp; They're not so frequent or powerful that they make a huge difference in the game, but 1 or 2 'good karma' points as a reward for a job well done seems like a nice compromise reward between the sort of Experience Points most games give out and Traveller's traditional in-game rewards.&nbsp; Does anybody else actually use these in-game?<BR><BR>&gt;3. IMO, Traveller differs from classic D&amp;D in that skill awards<BR>&gt;shouldn't be an important motivator to players. <BR>&lt;snip a lot more, all of which I strenuosuly agree with&gt;<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:33:44 -0500<BR>From: "Rob Davenport" &lt;rgd@ohio.voyager.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>On 28 Jan 2001, at 20:12, Thom Jones-Low wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; You won't see much spam via x-boats. For several reasons.<BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; This may be the most limiting factor of the spam via xboat. The problem<BR>&gt; is not only will the xboat facilities (at both ends) filter obvious,<BR><BR>This made me wonder, how much commercial/personal traffic flows via the<BR>x-boat system, as compared to official Imperial/governmental <BR>information?&nbsp; Is it the only interworld communication system IYTU?<BR>I believe there is canon mention of a military system that speeds <BR>military communication, and I wouldn't expect anything less in that <BR>regard.&nbsp; Are there corporate routes/services?&nbsp; Local governmental<BR>services (within the 3I)?<BR><BR>I can see the Imperial X-Boat Service being the carrier of choice for <BR>long distance messages as the Imperium is possibly the only entity <BR>capable of maintaining such a large public(?) communication system.&nbsp; <BR>(Oh, I suppose the mega corps might actually have more capital to use, <BR>but not political authority to establish routes.)<BR><BR>But wouldn't there be inter/intra-sector, -subsector, and -world <BR>systems that run with increasing frequency as the distance diminishes?<BR>Two worlds 1pc apart with moderately large intertwined economies <BR>might have a service that runs between them every day or even hour. <BR>(though what happens when it ships sent out an hour later beat the<BR>ships sent out earlier?)<BR><BR>Too many thoughts clogging the brain this afternoon, <BR>pardon while I tidy up,<BR><BR>Rob<BR>- --<BR>Rob<BR><BR>More Slightly Less Common Latin Phrases:<BR>Raptus regaliter&nbsp;&nbsp; --&nbsp; &nbsp; Royally screwed<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:35:33 -0600<BR>From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need advice...<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; To everyone who is replying thank you. this is great advice. My worry was if<BR>&gt; i started just handing skills out i would make them super hero types fast by<BR>&gt; game mechanics and i dont want to do that. many years ago when i was in my<BR>&gt; teens (1982 or so) we would fudge the rules a bit on skills. i seem to<BR>&gt; remember having some seriously powerful chars and it really messed the game<BR>&gt; up. but we were kids and had to have that Super god of what ever fix for our<BR>&gt; egos.<BR><BR>I came out of D&amp;D way, *way* back, so I knew what would happen if they<BR>got too powerful for the environment, and I was running in a close to<BR>normal person environment. So, I didn't fall into that trap, but I know<BR>plenty of people that did. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; Now i want to reward them yet at the same time not over powerthem. here are<BR>&gt; some of the things they came out of the adventure with<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 1) 2 contacts with a race who are enemys with the Imperium<BR>&gt; 2) they gained a corparation (or better yet certain people in the corp) as<BR>&gt; enemys<BR>&gt; 3) they beat the heck out of some hit men from a Mafia type crime syndicate<BR>&gt; so lord knows what those guys will do in the future &lt;evil gm grin&gt;<BR>&gt; 4) 200,000 Credits (split 4 ways or 50,000 credits apiece *not bad for 2<BR>&gt; months worth of work*)<BR>&gt; 5) a special set of stun guns<BR><BR>That seems about right to me. &lt;g&gt;&nbsp; Enemies are a reward to the<BR>*players*, because they make adventuring fun, but not to the PC's. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; They seemed to expect skill raises and i was thinking about it because we<BR>&gt; followed the rules exactly for the most part on character generation and<BR>&gt; some of them rolled pretty bad.And so i was thinking skill raises might be<BR>&gt; good to counter the poor rolls. but i was afraid that if i got moving into<BR>&gt; that realm then next thing you would know we would be in this super<BR>&gt; character situation. So i figured Advice towards where to go and what to do<BR>&gt; would be great.<BR><BR>I understand that too!&nbsp; That's where I might give a little more help to<BR>the PC's skills, getting them some more 0's and 1's.&nbsp; IMG (in my games)<BR>a skill-0 means you can try a skill without a penalty. If you don't have<BR>a skill at all the task becomes, at least, one level harder, so Skill-0<BR>is a very worthwhile benefit.&nbsp; A no-skill Astrogator is attempting a<BR>Formidable task to plot a course, a Skill-0 Astrogator is attempting a<BR>Routine task...even with 0 help from the skill that's a *big*<BR>difference! &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 22:39:29 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>On Mon, 29 Jan 2001, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt; &gt; On Mon, 29 Jan 2001, Megan Robertson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Benefits (?) of over 23 years roleplaying.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Gaah, it always discomforting to realise that roleplaying is so old a<BR>&gt; &gt; hobby. You have been playing almost as long as I have been in existence.<BR>&gt; &gt; B-)&nbsp; <BR>&gt; Well, I started role playing in 1974. I bet that *really* bothers you.<BR>&gt; :-) <BR><BR>Actually, not that much; I have realised long ago that you must be very<BR>old, by the wealth of information your brains carry...<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 20:44 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;20010130144448.39654.qmail@web10104.mail.yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>I am currently rewriting the 'System Resources' pages for the RPGA UK <BR>website (a job their webmaster has passed on to me, someone must have told <BR>him I write websites for a living, drat!); and there will naturally be a <BR>page devoted to TRAVELLER.<BR><BR>I scavenge every URL people mention here :-)<BR><BR>Hope this will help... once it gets done!<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:55:10 -0600<BR>From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>Subject: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>I spent a lot of time over the weekend working on a system for my Akus<BR>game. When I finished ( well, not finished even though it's up to 12<BR>pages, but stopped for now &lt;g&gt; ) I was very unimpressed at how poorly it<BR>was organized. I suspect my players would agree with that assessment,<BR>seeing as when I asked what they thought my only response was "I'm still<BR>digesting it."...yeah, and how long will it take to digest *that* rock?<BR>;-&lt;&nbsp; I have astrological data, then a textual writeup, then some<BR>culture, some NPC's, some organizations in a directory, then some trade<BR>stuff...just a mishmash without a coherent organization...and I know I<BR>left things out, and probably duplicated stuff. My fault, of course, but<BR>acknowledging that my scattered brain can't come up with anything better<BR>right now, I thought I'd appeal to the master-rockheads on the TML for<BR>some help.<BR><BR>What do you think *has* to be in system details and how should it be<BR>organized for best use? Do you have some examples, published or<BR>web-published of really good writeups you'd suggest I emulate?<BR><BR>Ideally, I'd like to see a "master outline" for the system writeup's<BR>developed that would have the data people want/need to see and its<BR>order. I figure with such an outline, scatterbrain designers, like me,<BR>wouldn't forget important details...or at least would know what details<BR>we need to come up with, and players would have a better chance of<BR>*finding* the details in the data.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Anyway, if the rockheads have some ideas, I'd like to see them.<BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:57:15 -0600<BR>From: Loren Wiseman &lt;lkw@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Plush?<BR><BR>Anybody out there work in plush or soft foam? Know anybody who does?<BR><BR>Jesse and some others have discussed making a hiver costume -- is anybody<BR>interested in making me a plush, cuddly Hiver (in the same manner as the<BR>plush Cthulhus that show up from time to time)? How about a foam rubber<BR>Hiver hat (this is a hat that looks like a little Hiver and is worn by<BR>people)?<BR><BR>Loren Wiseman<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; lkw@io.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:00:38 -0600<BR>From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need advice...<BR><BR>trentfs@ix.netcom.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Eris Reddoch wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;To improve from no skill to Skill-0 requires 1 point.<BR>&gt; &gt;To improve from Skill-0 to Skill-1 requires 1 point.<BR>&gt; &gt;To improve from Skill-1 to Skill-2 requires 4 points<BR>&gt; &gt;To improve from Skill-2 to Skill-3 requires 9 points.<BR>&gt; &gt;IOW, past Skill-0 improving a skill requires points equal to the square<BR>&gt; &gt;of the level to which the skill is improving.<BR><BR>&gt; The problem with a system like this for Traveller is that, <BR>&gt; per char-gen it's no more or less difficult to go from skill-0 <BR>&gt; to skill-1 than skill-5 to skill-6.&nbsp; Under this system it's 36x <BR>&gt; harder (and, perhaps more importantly, takes 36x longer).&nbsp; No <BR>&gt; comment on which way is better or more 'realistic,' but they're <BR>&gt; definitely incompatible.<BR><BR>Shrug! Chargen is before the game starts and experience is after. The<BR>fact that the two approaches are incompatible doesn't bother me in the<BR>least, but of course, YMMV. &lt;g&gt; <BR><BR>Eris<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:19:01 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>went to Sylea Downport nice site. when will Gridlore Technologes be back up?<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk<BR>[mailto:mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk]<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 12:44 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Cc: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;20010130144448.39654.qmail@web10104.mail.yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>I am currently rewriting the 'System Resources' pages for the RPGA UK <BR>website (a job their webmaster has passed on to me, someone must have told <BR>him I write websites for a living, drat!); and there will naturally be a <BR>page devoted to TRAVELLER.<BR><BR>I scavenge every URL people mention here :-)<BR><BR>Hope this will help... once it gets done!<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:28:02 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: Re: Need advice...<BR><BR>Eris Reddoch wrote:<BR>&gt; trentfs@ix.netcom.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; The problem with a system like this for Traveller is that, <BR>&gt;&gt; per char-gen it's no more or less difficult to go from skill-0 <BR>&gt;&gt; to skill-1 than skill-5 to skill-6.&nbsp; Under this system it's 36x <BR>&gt;&gt; harder (and, perhaps more importantly, takes 36x longer).&nbsp; No <BR>&gt;&gt; comment on which way is better or more 'realistic,' but they're <BR>&gt;&gt; definitely incompatible.<BR><BR>&gt;Shrug! Chargen is before the game starts and experience is after. The<BR>&gt;fact that the two approaches are incompatible doesn't bother me in the<BR>&gt;least, but of course, YMMV.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Yeah, it's a peeve of mine, but judging from the way games are written most people aren't too bothered by it.&nbsp; However, consider 2 characters: during char-gen character A serves 3 terms and gets skill-5, skill-4, skill-1 (x3); character B serves 3 terms in the same service and gets skill-3, skill-2 (x2), and skill-1 (x5).&nbsp; If improving skills by experience in-game works differently than gaining skills in char-gen, then supposedly-equal character B is at a big disadvantage: he'll probably never be able to improve his skills to level-4 or 5, whereas character A can pick up a few more level-1 skills relatively easily.<BR><BR>As you wrote, YMMV on whether or not this is a major issue, but if I were the player of character B I'd be pretty PO'd about it, especially if I didn't realize what was happening until the campaign had been going for awhile and I suddenly found myself with a sub-standard character.<BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:35:44 -0700<BR>From: Cliff Linehan &lt;clinehan@sfamipec.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:14:49 -0000 From: "Antony Farrell"<BR>&gt; &lt;Skaran@bigpond.com&gt;<BR>&gt;How about a challenge for all the Traveller enthusiasts with web sites.<BR>&gt;Lets all put in a concerted efforts to get some updates up and running.<BR><BR>I have updated my site already today (Jan 30, 2001), and the last time I<BR>updated it was yesterday (Jan 29, 2001).<BR><BR>&gt;"coming soon" messages dated more than a year ago.<BR><BR>It should read "Nothing to see, Please move on."<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 11:38:40 -0000 From: "Trevor, Peter"<BR>&gt; &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>&gt;This could be&nbsp; a&nbsp; result&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; feedback&nbsp; (or&nbsp; lack&nbsp; of)&nbsp; that<BR>&gt;webmeisters get for their efforts.<BR><BR>I can count on one hand the number of people that have e-mailed me about my<BR>site, and I still have fingers left over.<BR><BR>&gt;If they know people are reading their site and taking an interest<BR>&gt;they might be more inclined to keep working on it.<BR><BR>Any response is always nice.<BR><BR>&gt;And how many people here use "Galactic"<BR>&gt;but haven't achknowledged this to Jim Vassila.<BR><BR>His last name is Vassilakos, and I am currently working with him on fixing a<BR>few bugs in Galactic.<BR><BR>&gt;I only have email access at work&nbsp; but&nbsp; as&nbsp; soon&nbsp; as&nbsp; I&nbsp; get&nbsp; home<BR>&gt;tonight I am going to pick and review at least one site ...&nbsp; lets<BR>&gt;all do the same thing and see what we get over the next few days.<BR>&gt;Regards PLST<BR><BR>You are welcome to review mine if you wish.<BR>http://herons-reach.homepage.com/traveller<BR><BR>Clifford Linehan<BR>http://herons-reach.homepage.com/traveller<BR>Developing Vlanchiets Qlom and the Core Route.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3574<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yc04.mx.aol.com (rly-yc04.mail.aol.com [172.18.149.36]) by air-yc01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:39:32 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yc04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:38:35 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id QAA44709;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:35:57 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:35:37 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id QAA44658<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:35:36 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:35:36 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101302135.QAA44658@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3574<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3575</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/30/01 3:57:54 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 30 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3575<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: System Writeup Outline<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3574<BR>Re: Plush?<BR>re: Plush?<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players<BR>Another question...<BR>Rockhead webring?<BR>Re: System Writeup Outline<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>Re: Another question...<BR>RE: Another question...<BR>Re: Another question...<BR>RE: Another question...<BR>RE: Plush?<BR>RE: Plush?<BR>RE: Another question...<BR>OT: Princess Bride Sequel<BR>Re: Another question...<BR>RE: Princess Bride Sequel<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:49:16 -0600<BR>From: Chris Olson &lt;chris@pdaguy.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>Eris Reddoch wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I spent a lot of time over the weekend working on a system for my Akus<BR>&gt; game. When I finished ( well, not finished even though it's up to 12<BR>&gt; pages, but stopped for now &lt;g&gt; ) I was very unimpressed at how poorly it<BR>&gt; was organized. I suspect my players would agree with that assessment,<BR>&gt; seeing as when I asked what they thought my only response was "I'm still<BR>&gt; digesting it."...yeah, and how long will it take to digest *that* rock?<BR>&gt; ;-&lt;&nbsp; I have astrological data, then a textual writeup, then some<BR>&gt; culture, some NPC's, some organizations in a directory, then some trade<BR>&gt; stuff...just a mishmash without a coherent organization...and I know I<BR>&gt; left things out, and probably duplicated stuff. My fault, of course, but<BR>&gt; acknowledging that my scattered brain can't come up with anything better<BR>&gt; right now, I thought I'd appeal to the master-rockheads on the TML for<BR>&gt; some help.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What do you think *has* to be in system details and how should it be<BR>&gt; organized for best use? Do you have some examples, published or<BR>&gt; web-published of really good writeups you'd suggest I emulate?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Ideally, I'd like to see a "master outline" for the system writeup's<BR>&gt; developed that would have the data people want/need to see and its<BR>&gt; order. I figure with such an outline, scatterbrain designers, like me,<BR>&gt; wouldn't forget important details...or at least would know what details<BR>&gt; we need to come up with, and players would have a better chance of<BR>&gt; *finding* the details in the data.&nbsp; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Anyway, if the rockheads have some ideas, I'd like to see them.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Eris<BR>&gt; <BR>I'm no organizational genius, but basing it on how most encyclopedia do <BR>it sounds like a good idea to me.&nbsp; The outline I would use would be:<BR><BR>System Name (ala standard format)<BR><BR>Labelled system diagram (pick a type you like)<BR><BR>Population and demographic information (could be encoded above)<BR><BR>General system description as well as what the system, as a whole, <BR>imports and exports.&nbsp;&nbsp; (Note that worlds in the system may import/export <BR>more than these items, but thier needs may be met by in-system traffic).<BR><BR>For each important world/body in the system:<BR><BR>World/Body Name and location<BR>Map<BR>Almanac information (census, major imports and exports, starports and <BR>largest 3 pop. centers)<BR>Cultural information (ethnic groups and groupings, religious <BR>affiliations, customs varying from the 'norm' of the compiler, and local <BR>holidays)<BR>Agricultural Information (what is grown and where) [hint - use maps]<BR>Natural Resource Information (what is mined and where) [hint - use maps]<BR>Tourist Information (some overlap with culture here, but don't worry <BR>about it).<BR><BR>Anybody else got anything they think should be added?<BR><BR>Chris Olson<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:40:50 -0000<BR>From: "Stuart Ferris" &lt;stuart.ferris@virgin.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>&gt;This could be&nbsp; a&nbsp; result&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; feedback&nbsp; (or&nbsp; lack&nbsp; of)&nbsp; that<BR>&gt;webmeisters get for their efforts.&nbsp; If you see&nbsp; a&nbsp; "coming&nbsp; soon"<BR>&gt;message gathering dust why not drop a quick line to&nbsp; the&nbsp; author.<BR>&gt;If they know people are reading their site and taking an interest<BR>&gt;they might be more inclined to keep working on it.&nbsp; I&nbsp; admit&nbsp; I'm<BR>&gt;guilty of this sin, too.&nbsp; And how many people here use "Galactic"<BR>&gt;but haven't achknowledged this to Jim Vassila, or use&nbsp; "Heaven&nbsp; &amp;<BR>&gt;Earth" and haven't achknowledged this to Stuart Fenris, or any of<BR>&gt;the other software tools out there?<BR><BR>I've a pretty good idea how many people use my program using a couple of<BR>free web services, namely, Hitbox and Yahoo! Groups.<BR><BR>Hitbox is a great tool which gives me a huge amount of detail on the number<BR>of accesses to the site. What is also interesting is the ability to see the<BR>location of the links being used to access the sites and the number of hits<BR>associated with these links. (Thanks Downport, BITS &amp; SJG).<BR><BR>Yahoo! Groups is also a good tool providing a Mailing List for the program<BR>allowing features and bugs to be debated within an expanding group of at the<BR>time of mailing 124 people. However, feedback is sometimes less than<BR>forthcoming and I would estimate that only around 10-20% of the group<BR>actively participate. I know that Jim V also has a similar list.<BR><BR>Whether these service provide an accurate reflection of the programs<BR>propularity is probably a point to debate, but it is probably the most<BR>accurate assessment I can get.<BR><BR>H&amp;E very neary came to a complete stop due to lack of feedback and I think<BR>TML members need to carefully assess the thin line that their hobby walks.<BR>The companies that produce Traveller and the people who voluntarily work<BR>hard to support their hobby need feedback and support from the people that<BR>actually play the game. I admire Marc Miller and his resilience. I would<BR>probably have given up on Traveller long ago if I had been him.<BR><BR>Stuart Ferris<BR>stuart.ferris@virgin.net<BR>http://freespace.virgin.net/stuart.ferris/index.htm<BR><BR>"A people should know when they're conquered"<BR>Quintus Magnus, Regimental Commander, Army of the North<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:51:45 -0700<BR>From: "David J. Golden" &lt;goldendj@pcisys.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3574<BR><BR>At 04:35 pm 1/30/01 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:55:10 -0600<BR>&gt;From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>&gt;What do you think *has* to be in system details and how should it be<BR>&gt;organized for best use? Do you have some examples, published or<BR>&gt;web-published of really good writeups you'd suggest I emulate?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Talk about a bizarre koinkydink ... I was just this afternoon<BR>browsing the CIA World Factbook (www.cia.gov), and thinking how<BR>wonderful it would be for something like that to be available for<BR>Traveller ... ALL the world writeups, in all the detail available, in<BR>one *standard* format (and even amenable to automated processing ...).<BR>- --"Those who cast the votes decide nothing, those who count the votes<BR>decide<BR>everything." Josef Stalin<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:00:33 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Plush?<BR><BR>On Tue, 30 Jan 2001, Loren Wiseman wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; How about a foam rubber<BR>&gt; Hiver hat (this is a hat that looks like a little Hiver and is worn by<BR>&gt; people)?<BR><BR>Man walks into a bar with a Hiver on his head.&nbsp; The bartender asks, "What<BR>the hell is that?"<BR>So the Hiver says, "I don't know, but it started out as a pimple on my<BR>butt!"<BR><BR>I'd buy one just for that joke.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:13:13 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: re: Plush?<BR><BR>&nbsp; Somehow that's just a vaguely worrisome subject line :)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:22:48 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Tim Mac &lt;satelism@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>As a brand new TML member I see one thing that might<BR>be nice. <BR>Every webpool that I go to on a subject has too many<BR>sights with 70% of the same and only 10% different<BR>content. <BR>How about instead of a list of what each site has to<BR>offer and all that massive work and upkeep. Why not<BR>some one with a long standing Trav. web page (maybe<BR>the ring owner/manager create a living list of what<BR>Traveler needs for each type of game. I.e. CT, T4,<BR>etc. People can contribute to the list and choose one<BR>thing at a time that they might like to work on to<BR>completion.<BR>Now there might be some things that are placed in the<BR>index that to start may not appear to be that big of a<BR>deal or that important; but like we all know, once you<BR>get started those creative juices can really flow and<BR>we may need to pay people to stop writing. People can<BR>work together on a subject and such. The list owner<BR>can be updated as to the status of the project and can<BR>place a simple statment on the index list as to the<BR>status. I.e. When started, whom working on, URL, open<BR>for review, completede, what revision number, etc.<BR><BR>OK now I am dumb, er, done!<BR><BR>- --- "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>wrote:<BR>&gt; At 11:38 AM 1/30/2001 -0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Antony Farrell wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; I find it a little disappointing to go through<BR>&gt; site after site<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; and get "coming soon" messages dated more than a<BR>&gt; year ago.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;This could be&nbsp; a&nbsp; result&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; feedback&nbsp; (or <BR>&gt; lack&nbsp; of)&nbsp; that<BR>&gt; &gt;webmeisters get for their efforts.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Exactly.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; My site (Sylea Downport) has been around for several<BR>&gt; years now, starting<BR>&gt; life as Traveller: The Silly Era.&nbsp; Despite the<BR>&gt; presence of a plea for<BR>&gt; feedback and material on every page, response has<BR>&gt; been nearly nil.&nbsp; In<BR>&gt; fact, I may take down the Gridlore Tech page because<BR>&gt; nobody has ever<BR>&gt; commented on it.&nbsp; I'll just reformat the weapon<BR>&gt; tables and send them to<BR>&gt; Andy for an ACQ pdf.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I work full time, and am beginning to write<BR>&gt; Traveller for money.&nbsp; Taking<BR>&gt; care of a large site takes up free time that I'd<BR>&gt; honestly rather spend with<BR>&gt; my wife.&nbsp; It isn't very satisfying to spend hours in<BR>&gt; front of the computer<BR>&gt; for no return.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I will now stop ranting, and go to bed.&nbsp; <BR>&gt; -- <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Douglas E. Berry&nbsp;&nbsp; Templar Agent at Large.<BR>&gt; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; TravGeekCode: <BR>&gt; tc+ tm+ !tn- t4@ ?tg+ tt@ to(CORPS)++ ru@ $ge++ 3i<BR>&gt; ii+ au st+ ls+ pi kk+ so(++) va++ dr+ zh+ sw++ ?da<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <BR><BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:34:47 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players<BR><BR>&gt;From: "Rob Davenport" &lt;rgd@ohio.voyager.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>...<BR>&gt;information?&nbsp; Is it the only interworld communication system IYTU?<BR>&gt;I believe there is canon mention of a military system that speeds <BR>&gt;military communication, and I wouldn't expect anything less in that <BR>&gt;regard.&nbsp; Are there corporate routes/services?&nbsp; Local governmental<BR>&gt;services (within the 3I)?<BR><BR>&nbsp; "No" &amp; "correct" for the first two. IMTU there are corporate routes<BR>and/or services; as for local government, what does that mean within<BR>the Imperium? I'd say yes, and use that as a partial hand-wave if I<BR>wanted to use some of the goofy X-Boat routes that have been listed.<BR><BR>&gt;I can see the Imperial X-Boat Service being the carrier of choice for <BR>&gt;long distance messages as the Imperium is possibly the only entity <BR>&gt;capable of maintaining such a large public(?) communication system.&nbsp; <BR>&gt;(Oh, I suppose the mega corps might actually have more capital to use, <BR>&gt;but not political authority to establish routes.)<BR><BR>&nbsp; The political authority issue only arises if the Imperium chooses <BR>to oppose them, which it probably wouldn't (YMMV).<BR><BR>&gt;But wouldn't there be inter/intra-sector, -subsector, and -world <BR>&gt;systems that run with increasing frequency as the distance diminishes?<BR>&gt;Two worlds 1pc apart with moderately large intertwined economies <BR>&gt;might have a service that runs between them every day or even hour. <BR><BR>&nbsp; Agree - even more so for heretics who allow sub-100 Dt starships.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Steven Hudson<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:55:33 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Another question...<BR><BR>Here is a hypothetical for you guys.<BR><BR>if you could go back in time and Slap the design Documments down for say the<BR>new f-22 in front of John and wilbur Wright. what do you think they would<BR>get from looking at them?<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:00:46 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Bernie McGeehan &lt;einreb62@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Rockhead webring?<BR><BR>Is there a rockhead or Landgrab webring?<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 22:57:00 +0000<BR>From: Paul Campbell &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>On Tue, Jan 30, 2001 at 04:51:45PM -0700, David J. Golden wrote:<BR>&gt; At 04:35 pm 1/30/01 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:55:10 -0600<BR>&gt; &gt;From: Eris Reddoch &lt;eris@pcola.gulf.net&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Subject: System Writeup Outline<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;What do you think *has* to be in system details and how should it be<BR>&gt; &gt;organized for best use? Do you have some examples, published or<BR>&gt; &gt;web-published of really good writeups you'd suggest I emulate?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Talk about a bizarre koinkydink ... I was just this afternoon<BR>&gt; browsing the CIA World Factbook (www.cia.gov), and thinking how<BR>&gt; wonderful it would be for something like that to be available for<BR>&gt; Traveller ... ALL the world writeups, in all the detail available, in<BR>&gt; one *standard* format (and even amenable to automated processing ...).<BR><BR>This was part of the original intent behind the Grandsurvey project.<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com I've got a partly worked database schema<BR>for storing this information.&nbsp; It's mostly based on WBH, although I'd<BR>like to be able to extend.&nbsp; Things I'd like to add: Notes (free text), <BR>characters, locations (i.e. things smaller than planets).<BR><BR>Get the latest version at:<BR><BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com/pcampbell/gs-db-0.0.2.tar.gz<BR><BR>On a related note to the Web Sites thread.&nbsp; I've been discouraged from<BR>working too much on this because to the lack of feedback.&nbsp; It's<BR>something I want to develop for myself, but it is a large project, and<BR>if more people were interested it would be much easier to get<BR>motivated.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Paul Campbell (Sourceforge) &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>GPG Key fingerprint = 9C4F 31A3 8814 9F94 A533 A979 E63F 0C69 A771 0F24<BR>http://www.kemitix.uklinux.net<BR>jupiter: 10:48pm up 21 days, 12:28, 4 users, load average: 0.04, 0.22, 0.31<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:02:22 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Bernie McGeehan &lt;einreb62@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>OK! I'm on it...firing up the graphics, sah!<BR>- --- Antony Farrell &lt;Skaran@bigpond.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; How about a challenge for all the Traveller<BR>&gt; enthusiasts with web sites.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Lets all put in a concerted efforts to get some<BR>&gt; updates up and running.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I find it a little disappointing to go through site<BR>&gt; after site and get<BR>&gt; "coming soon" messages dated more than a year ago.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Come on, we can do it.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Antony<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>"I don't know much about what I like, but I do know Art."&nbsp; &nbsp; me @ the Rijksmuseum, Amsterdam (Terra/Sol 3)http://prattfall.tripod.com/index.html<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:27:55 -0800<BR>From: "Dave Strebe" &lt;strebe@intergate.bc.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR>Mostly a headache :) seriously don't think they would make heads or<BR>tails...oh before I<BR>go to far off on a tangent define "design documents" do you mean the<BR>"blueprints"<BR>or the document outlining the parameters the aircraft is supposed to operate<BR>within?<BR><BR>Dave<BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "William Lane" &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 2:55 PM<BR>Subject: Another question...<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Here is a hypothetical for you guys.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; if you could go back in time and Slap the design Documments down for say<BR>the<BR>&gt; new f-22 in front of John and wilbur Wright. what do you think they would<BR>&gt; get from looking at them?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Bill<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:13:15 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Another question...<BR><BR>good point lets say they got ahold of the blue prints and some of the<BR>engineers notes.<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Dave Strebe [mailto:strebe@intergate.bc.ca]<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 3:28 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR><BR>Mostly a headache :) seriously don't think they would make heads or<BR>tails...oh before I<BR>go to far off on a tangent define "design documents" do you mean the<BR>"blueprints"<BR>or the document outlining the parameters the aircraft is supposed to operate<BR>within?<BR><BR>Dave<BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "William Lane" &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 2:55 PM<BR>Subject: Another question...<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Here is a hypothetical for you guys.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; if you could go back in time and Slap the design Documments down for say<BR>the<BR>&gt; new f-22 in front of John and wilbur Wright. what do you think they would<BR>&gt; get from looking at them?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Bill<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:39:31 -0800<BR>From: "Dave Strebe" &lt;strebe@intergate.bc.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR>As I was saying mostly a headache. Don't think much of it would<BR>make sense to them and the parts that did they would consider<BR>unbuildable be their present standards. Just my opinion.<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "William Lane" &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 3:13 PM<BR>Subject: RE: Another question...<BR><BR><BR>&gt; good point lets say they got ahold of the blue prints and some of the<BR>&gt; engineers notes.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Dave Strebe [mailto:strebe@intergate.bc.ca]<BR>&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 3:28 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Another question...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mostly a headache :) seriously don't think they would make heads or<BR>&gt; tails...oh before I<BR>&gt; go to far off on a tangent define "design documents" do you mean the<BR>&gt; "blueprints"<BR>&gt; or the document outlining the parameters the aircraft is supposed to<BR>operate<BR>&gt; within?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Dave<BR>&gt; ----- Original Message -----<BR>&gt; From: "William Lane" &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>&gt; To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 2:55 PM<BR>&gt; Subject: Another question...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Here is a hypothetical for you guys.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; if you could go back in time and Slap the design Documments down for say<BR>&gt; the<BR>&gt; &gt; new f-22 in front of John and wilbur Wright. what do you think they<BR>would<BR>&gt; &gt; get from looking at them?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Bill<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:28:45 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Another question...<BR><BR>Not a whole heck of a lot.&nbsp; Mostly because the materials tech to make 99% of<BR>the F-22 had not been invented yet.&nbsp; Now, give them a working model, or<BR>proof that it works...then they have a design to work towards, and most good<BR>engineers will figure out how to get it done with what they have...or<BR>develop what is needed.<BR><BR>Let's look at another example.&nbsp; Someone drops into NASA plans for a Free<BR>Trader (a la CT).&nbsp; Complete with Jump Drive, Gravatic M-drive, anti-grav<BR>plates, the whole nine yards.<BR><BR>Could they build a Free Trader?&nbsp; Not likely anytime soon.<BR><BR>Not to say that there would not be immediate improvements in many aspects of<BR>our lives...but almost impossible to build.<BR><BR>What do they do when the plans show the space to install the Sternmetal<BR>Horizons LIC Model 2/bis computer?&nbsp; Too much of a design is components that<BR>are magic boxes for all intents and purposes.<BR><BR>Now here is a question that would bake your noodle.&nbsp; Drop yourself in<BR>Revolutionary America, with the plans for a Ford Mustang.&nbsp; Can you build it?<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:26:56 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Plush?<BR><BR>ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Gregory Carl Kettler<BR>&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 2:01 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Plush?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; On Tue, 30 Jan 2001, Loren Wiseman wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; How about a foam rubber<BR>&gt; &gt; Hiver hat (this is a hat that looks like a little Hiver and is worn by<BR>&gt; &gt; people)?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Man walks into a bar with a Hiver on his head.&nbsp; The bartender asks, "What<BR>&gt; the hell is that?"<BR>&gt; So the Hiver says, "I don't know, but it started out as a pimple on my<BR>&gt; butt!"<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I'd buy one just for that joke.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:26:56 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Plush?<BR><BR>ROFL!!!!&nbsp; I like the hat idea!&nbsp; I'm a little too busy right now to do it<BR>though....<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Loren Wiseman<BR>&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 12:57 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Plush?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Anybody out there work in plush or soft foam? Know anybody who does?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Jesse and some others have discussed making a hiver costume -- is anybody<BR>&gt; interested in making me a plush, cuddly Hiver (in the same manner as the<BR>&gt; plush Cthulhus that show up from time to time)? How about a foam rubber<BR>&gt; Hiver hat (this is a hat that looks like a little Hiver and is worn by<BR>&gt; people)?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Loren Wiseman<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; lkw@io.com<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:27:54 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Another question...<BR><BR>do you think they could adapt anything out of what they saw to something on<BR>their write flyer? Like would they add flaps or spoilers? <BR><BR>I am trying to get an idea as to what an engineer from a lower tech level<BR>could gain from having something from a higher tech level thrust into his<BR>hands for a month. and if he could back engineer something from that higher<BR>tech level to something he could build or produce.<BR><BR>basically it comes down to that tech level.<BR><BR>what can an engineer at say tech level 15 do with something from say tech<BR>level 19 or 20?<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Dave Strebe [mailto:strebe@intergate.bc.ca]<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 3:40 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR><BR>As I was saying mostly a headache. Don't think much of it would<BR>make sense to them and the parts that did they would consider<BR>unbuildable be their present standards. Just my opinion.<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "William Lane" &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 3:13 PM<BR>Subject: RE: Another question...<BR><BR><BR>&gt; good point lets say they got ahold of the blue prints and some of the<BR>&gt; engineers notes.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Dave Strebe [mailto:strebe@intergate.bc.ca]<BR>&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 3:28 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Another question...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mostly a headache :) seriously don't think they would make heads or<BR>&gt; tails...oh before I<BR>&gt; go to far off on a tangent define "design documents" do you mean the<BR>&gt; "blueprints"<BR>&gt; or the document outlining the parameters the aircraft is supposed to<BR>operate<BR>&gt; within?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Dave<BR>&gt; ----- Original Message -----<BR>&gt; From: "William Lane" &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>&gt; To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 2:55 PM<BR>&gt; Subject: Another question...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Here is a hypothetical for you guys.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; if you could go back in time and Slap the design Documments down for say<BR>&gt; the<BR>&gt; &gt; new f-22 in front of John and wilbur Wright. what do you think they<BR>would<BR>&gt; &gt; get from looking at them?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Bill<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 23:35:36 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: OT: Princess Bride Sequel<BR><BR>Apparently there's a Princess Bride Sequel Novel planned by William <BR>Goldman called 'Buttercup's Baby'. I don't know any more except the <BR>first chapter is in the recent UK 25th anniversary reprint of the <BR>book.<BR><BR>BTW if you have only seen the film (and liked it) read the book! It's <BR>far funnier.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:41:36 -0500<BR>From: "Daniel Phelps" &lt;phelpsd@gate.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR>You wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I am trying to get an idea as to what an engineer from a lower tech level<BR>&gt;could gain from having something from a higher tech level thrust into his<BR>&gt;hands for a month. and if he could back engineer something from that higher<BR>&gt;tech level to something he could build or produce.<BR><BR><BR>Careful lad, the boys from Area 51 may be listening.<BR><BR>Dan<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:54:02 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Princess Bride Sequel<BR><BR>I love the "Princess Bride" i just recently purchased the DVD to replace the<BR>tape i lost on my move to california.<BR><BR>I die laughing through the whole things 8)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; "You only think I guessed wrong!&nbsp; That's what's so funny!&nbsp; I<BR>switched<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; glasses when your back was turned! Ha ha, you fool!! You fell victim<BR>to<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; one of the classic blunders.&nbsp; The most famous is never get involved<BR>in a<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; land war in Asia; and only slightly less well known is this:&nbsp; Never<BR>go<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; in against a Sicilian, when death is on the line!"<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Dominic Mooney [mailto:dom@cybergoths.u-net.com]<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 3:36 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: OT: Princess Bride Sequel<BR><BR><BR>Apparently there's a Princess Bride Sequel Novel planned by William <BR>Goldman called 'Buttercup's Baby'. I don't know any more except the <BR>first chapter is in the recent UK 25th anniversary reprint of the <BR>book.<BR><BR>BTW if you have only seen the film (and liked it) read the book! It's <BR>far funnier.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3575<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xb01.mx.aol.com (rly-xb01.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.102]) by air-xb02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:57:54 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xb01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:57:03 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id SAA50599;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:55:35 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:54:49 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id SAA50527<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:54:48 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:54:48 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101302354.SAA50527@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3575<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3576</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/30/01 5:21:11 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 30 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3576<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR>Re: Another question...<BR>Re: System Writeup Outline<BR>webrings<BR>RE: Challenger Aniversary<BR>Re: System Writeup Outline<BR>Re: Plush?<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: Need advice...<BR>Re: Need advice...<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>Re: System Writeup Outline<BR>Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR>Re: Need advice...<BR>RE: Need advice...<BR>Re: System Writeup Outline<BR>Re: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:36:25 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;"coming soon" messages dated more than a year ago.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; It should read "Nothing to see, Please move on."<BR><BR>No, no!<BR><BR>We need a graphic of the Neuralizer (from Men in Black) with Tommy Lee<BR>Jones saying "Please look into the light..." :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:40:32 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Many are remembering this day and where they were when this tradgedy<BR>&gt; happened, but how many TMLers were actualy there to witness the event?<BR><BR>And as somwone pointed out on another group, the day before the<BR>Challenger disaster was the anniversary of the Apollo 1 fire. 34 years<BR>ago. <BR><BR>And we shouldn't forget Soyuz 1 and Soyuz 11 (anybody have the dates<BR>for those?)<BR><BR>So far we've lost 14 people on the road to space. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:47:46 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Here is a hypothetical for you guys.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; if you could go back in time and Slap the design Documments down for say the<BR>&gt; new f-22 in front of John and wilbur Wright. what do you think they would<BR>&gt; get from looking at them?<BR><BR>Damned little. In fact, I don't think you'd be able to convince them it<BR>*could* work, much less that it *does* work. <BR><BR>The airframe has a *stall* speed that's faster than any mademade object<BR>in their time (other than bullets) could attain. The aerodynamics for<BR>the speed it cruises at are considerably different from those at the<BR>speeds they could reach.<BR><BR>The engines and control systems would be even worse.<BR><BR>And for that matter, if they *did* believe you, you'd probably<BR>discourage the *hell* out of them. :-(<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:59:34 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; I spent a lot of time over the weekend working on a system for my Akus<BR>&gt; game. When I finished ( well, not finished even though it's up to 12<BR>&gt; pages, but stopped for now &lt;g&gt; ) I was very unimpressed at how poorly it<BR>&gt; was organized. I suspect my players would agree with that assessment,<BR>&gt; seeing as when I asked what they thought my only response was "I'm still<BR>&gt; digesting it."...yeah, and how long will it take to digest *that* rock?<BR>&gt; ;-&lt;&nbsp; I have astrological data, then a textual writeup, then some<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ^^^^^^^^^^^^<BR><BR>I think you mean "astrographic" or "planetological" data. Astrological<BR>data has to do with stuff like "you have Mars in your seventh house". :-)<BR><BR>&gt; What do you think *has* to be in system details and how should it be<BR>&gt; organized for best use?<BR><BR>Mainworld info has to be there. After that, it is going to depend on<BR>things like whether the group just treats space as something they have<BR>to cross to get between mainworlds, or they are actually curious (or<BR>even interested) in the other stuff that may be in the system. <BR><BR>Levels of detail for the mainworld (and the star) likewise depend on<BR>whether they treat mainworlds as "mostly interchangeable" backdrops, or<BR>if the "details" of the world affect the adventure (or even form part<BR>of it). <BR><BR>*If* the system details matter to the group, I'd consider making a<BR>set of "generic system" maps. Basicly, something like the old<BR>Battlefleet Mars maps of the Solar System (or the Triplanetary map). <BR><BR>Basicly a set of circles representing the possible orbits, marked off<BR>into spaces for planet counters to move along. Alas, you'd need a<BR>different map for each type of star, as the orbital periods depend on<BR>the mass of the star.<BR><BR>Still, it would add some flavor. <BR><BR>&gt; Ideally, I'd like to see a "master outline" for the system writeup's<BR>&gt; developed that would have the data people want/need to see and its<BR>&gt; order. I figure with such an outline, scatterbrain designers, like me,<BR>&gt; wouldn't forget important details...or at least would know what details<BR>&gt; we need to come up with, and players would have a better chance of<BR>&gt; *finding* the details in the data.&nbsp; <BR><BR>&gt; Anyway, if the rockheads have some ideas, I'd like to see them.<BR><BR>Well, as I've mentioned in the past, I'd love to have something that<BR>you could maintain a sort of interactive database on. Even if you<BR>couldn't take the computer to the game, you could print out the<BR>"library data" entries, and (if you care about such details) a set of<BR>maps showing where things are in the system at that time.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 19:06:13 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: webrings<BR><BR>hhhmmm...<BR><BR>Off the top of my head<BR><BR>The Traveller Webring<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; http://www.webring.org/cgi-bin/webring?ring=travgearhead;home<BR><BR>The Traveller Gearhead webring (parallel ring on ringsurf.com)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; http://www.ringsurf.com/netring?ring=travgearhead;action=home<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; http://www.webring.org/cgi-bin/webring?ring=travgearhead;home<BR><BR>The Traveller Deckplans webring<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; http://hartwick.edu/~smithw/deckring.htm<BR><BR><BR>If you want to build a Rockhead or landgrab webring, my advice (based on <BR>years of ringmastering multiple rings) is to put it on <BR>http://www.ringsurf.com and stay far, far away from yahoo webring (yahoo <BR>bought webring.org and took it straight to FUBAR).<BR><BR>rings are great ways to build small interest groups.&nbsp; If the users index <BR>well, then the ring search features become really handy.<BR>Since ringsurf actually allows ringmasters to manage the ring, it's <BR>feasible for ringmasters to update the keyword index for a site his/herself.<BR><BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>www.urbin.net/EWW/ -- These opinions are mine, no one else wants `em.<BR>"Driving a Hudson Hornet on the disinformation triple bypass: cruising for<BR>burgers &amp; garage sales. Hooks baited, lines entangled, roadkill cooked"<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:19:11 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR>In january of 1986 I was serving in the united states navy. I was about to<BR>be promoted to MM3 or e-4 for you Land Lubbers out there. my ship was the<BR>USS Missouri BB-63. I did not find out about the explosion till that<BR>evening. they were broadcasting the news on a ship board television in the<BR>galley. Needless to say i was shocked. I was so sad for the crew of<BR>challenger and especailly the school teacher who NASA had sent up with them<BR>that flight. <BR><BR>I am glad that that Nasa has been much more careful in launches since then.<BR><BR>You have had the pleasure of something i have only been able to dream about.<BR>watching a Launch. have always dreamed of it.<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: William 'Commander X' Prankard [mailto:cmdrx@ao.net]<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 7:48 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR><BR>Many are remembering this day and where they were when this tradgedy<BR>happened, but how many TMLers were actualy there to witness the event?<BR><BR>I am one.&nbsp; And the image is still burned into my brain 15 years later (my<BR>ghods, has it been that long?)<BR><BR>I had recently moved to Titusville Florida in June of&nbsp; '85 and being a<BR>space fanatic thought it was so cool to see a Shuttle launch for<BR>real.&nbsp; (So THIS is what it is like to live near a TL7 Type D Starport!) By<BR>the end of the year I've seen alot of shots go off (this was in that age<BR>of "Go Fever") and by then I've pretty much gotten used to how a launch is<BR>supposed to look and sound.&nbsp; It was all pretty routine in my mind by 1986.<BR><BR>That January day in 1986 I remeber how un-Florida-ly cold it was.&nbsp; I was<BR>in 10th grade biology class when we were allowed to go outside and watch<BR>the launch.&nbsp; Titusville High School is on US 1 and you can see the<BR>launchpad and VAB directly across the rivers..Yes It's that<BR>close.&nbsp; Challenger took off as usual, orange-red fire trail and billowing<BR>white trail below&nbsp; and the familliar earthquake.&nbsp; Then, something wasn't<BR>quite right.&nbsp; I couldn't do anything but look directly into the explosion<BR>absolutely dumbfounded.&nbsp; The Two SRBs were spinning madly away from the<BR>billowing cloud of smoke and debris.&nbsp; I must have been in shock, my eyes<BR>frozen on the image not realizing what had happened.&nbsp; I broke out of it<BR>when I heard someone cry out "The Shuttle exploded!&nbsp; The Shuttle<BR>Exploded!"&nbsp; No, it couldn't be!&nbsp; Could it?&nbsp; I looked again at the cloud<BR>hoping that the astronauts had escaped.&nbsp; Was that a parachute?&nbsp; No, only<BR>smoldering debris falling into the Atlantic.&nbsp; Still could someone&nbsp; have<BR>survived?<BR><BR>Sadly, I leared the answer was no when our school principal anounced the<BR>news on the intercom. Challenger was totaly destroyed and all hands<BR>lost.&nbsp; Then he put the radio on and we heard the entire story that the<BR>Challenger 7 had "sliped the surly bonds of Earth to touch the face of<BR>God".<BR><BR>I knew then that I had personaly witnessed human history.&nbsp; An event in<BR>time as significant as the Hindenburg or the JFK assasination.<BR><BR>By the time NASA launched another shuttle, I had graduated from high<BR>school and already in college.&nbsp; But it was good to see we did not give up<BR>the quest for the stars, albeit a bit more cautiously and wiser.&nbsp; <BR><BR>\\&nbsp; &nbsp; //&nbsp; Commander X<BR>\\&nbsp; //&nbsp;&nbsp; CEO X-TEK Industries of Deneb, LIC<BR>&nbsp; T E K&nbsp;&nbsp; Starship Contractor &amp; High Energy Weapons Research<BR>//&nbsp; \\&nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.ao.net/~cmdrx/xtek<BR>//&nbsp; &nbsp; \\&nbsp; 0608 D557777-A kk- va+ so+ zh+ da+ A723<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 00:30 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;3A7744EC.6070706@pdaguy.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts.<BR><BR>Astronomical data (star type, planets orbiting same, moons, asteroids, <BR>Oort cloud, etc.)<BR><BR>Main inhabited world (UPP, then expand on that in text much as Chris Olsen <BR>has suggested, only add in to his list: local armed forces, government <BR>type and personalities, notable flora and fauna, renowned academic <BR>institutions, one or two 'stellar' personalities - musicians, poets, <BR>physicists, rpg designers, whatever. Oh, and any strange local laws or <BR>customs that visitors should look out for... unless of course you want <BR>them taken by surprise!)<BR><BR>Other inhabited worlds - similar details as above.<BR><BR>Space habitats - such details as are relevant.<BR><BR>Gas giant (if present) - any information about use of same for fuel <BR>skimming. Do you have to report in/ask permission anywhere, is there a <BR>fee, etc.<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 00:30 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: Re: Plush?<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;l03010d16b69cda2918d1@[206.224.92.67]&gt;<BR>Greetings Loren.<BR><BR>I probably could... but you are a bit far away to deliver it!<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal (in England).<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 11:29:56 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Peter replied to Gerry:<BR>&gt;&gt; How about an updated posting showing which sites contain which<BR>&gt;&gt; information?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;It&nbsp; will<BR>&gt;only work if the index maintainer is prepared to put in a lot&nbsp; of<BR>&gt;effort (both in initial setup and in&nbsp; keeping&nbsp; it&nbsp; up&nbsp; to&nbsp; date).<BR><BR>This is what I partially tried to do with my links page. The problem is<BR>manifold:<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - a complete list is out of the question: a) it's too long, and b)<BR>sites change too often for any such list to be kept current;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - I put in a few things, but only what _I'm_ interested in - others<BR>may not be interested the same things (deckplans - drool!);<BR><BR>&gt;Keeping the index up to date includes regularly visiting sites to<BR>&gt;look for new material and dead sites.&nbsp; Are you volunteering?<BR><BR>Keeping the thing up-to-date is a bitch.<BR><BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 19:30:28 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Re: Need advice...<BR><BR>&gt; Also as a side note. I tend to see the Imperium as a fascist type <BR>&gt; state. are there other Games out there that depect the Imperium this<BR>way? or am <BR>&gt; i the only one?<BR><BR>It's certainly possible to run it that way.&nbsp; IMTU, the Imperium can be a<BR>bit heavy-handed, but it's impossible for them to keep track of every<BR>citizen, so as long as you don't call too much attention to yourself,<BR>they don't bother you too much.<BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 19:26:06 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Re: Need advice...<BR><BR>&gt; Ok we just wrapped up an adventure. I wanted to award skills at the <BR>&gt; end of each adventure. i have been searching for some rules in core <BR>&gt; traveller about skill advancement. the only thing i find is this 4 year<BR>long <BR>&gt; process. well that takes WAY to much time. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; the advice i need is<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 1) do other gms award skills from adventures?<BR>&gt; 2) is so what system do you use?<BR>&gt; 3) if you dont award skills what do you do?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; what i use to do is pick a couple of skills that i thought the <BR>&gt; player used the most and give them a point in them. basically im<BR>curious as to <BR>&gt; what others do. I have never had the ears of a lot of other traveller <BR>&gt; gms. so i figure best to get the advice while i can.<BR><BR>This is the system I'm toying with for my upcoming CT campaign.<BR><BR>Characters, after an adventure, get 1-5 Experience Points (2-3 being<BR>average), based on the length &amp; difficulty of the adventure (this part is<BR>taken almost straight from the T4 method).&nbsp; PCs can do two things with<BR>these EPs:<BR><BR>1)&nbsp; Put them into a Brownie Point pool.&nbsp; BPs allow characters to reroll<BR>dice checks, at a cost of 1 BP per reroll.<BR><BR>2)&nbsp; Assign them as Improvement Points to a skill.&nbsp; The two limitations to<BR>this are A) a PC can only put one IP to any specific skill per adventure,<BR>and B) the skill in question must have been sucessfully used sometime<BR>during the adventure.<BR><BR>Characters trying to improve a skill must roll on 2d6 a total of 10 + the<BR>skill level you're trying to raise the skill to.&nbsp; As this is not an easy<BR>roll, PCs may opt not to roll right away, but instead add extra IPs to<BR>the skill in question.&nbsp; Each IP added (max 1 per adventure) reduces to<BR>target number of the roll by one.&nbsp; If you fail a skill improvement roll,<BR>all IPs invested toward that skill are lost, and you have to start over<BR>again (of course, if you suceed in raising the skill, the IPs are gone as<BR>well).&nbsp; A 2 always fails, and a 12 always succeeds.<BR><BR>Stats can modify these rolls, as they modify the actual skill rolls<BR>during the adventure.&nbsp; For reference, in my game, the stat mod is<BR>(stat/3, round down) - 2.&nbsp; This means that:<BR><BR>Stat&nbsp; &nbsp; 1-2&nbsp; &nbsp; 3-5&nbsp; &nbsp; 6-8&nbsp; &nbsp; 9-11&nbsp; &nbsp; 12-14&nbsp; &nbsp; 15+<BR>Mod&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -2&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -1&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; +1&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; +2&nbsp; &nbsp; +3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <BR><BR>(In your game, you would have to modify this, depending on how stats can<BR>affect rolls)<BR><BR>Example:&nbsp; Jan Kaalin has just survived a rather dangerous espionage<BR>mission deep in Solomani territory, and is rewarded 4 EPs as a result. <BR>She sinks one of her EPs into her BP pool, leaving her with 3 EP left. <BR>These go into IP.&nbsp; Looking at the skills she sucessfully used this<BR>adventure, the ones she most wants to improve are Disguise, Carousing,<BR>and Pilot.<BR><BR>Her current skill rankings for these skills are Disguise-3, Carousing-0,<BR>&amp; Pilot-1.&nbsp; Her stats include and INT of 10 (relevant to Disguise), SOC<BR>of 5 (relevant to Carousing), and DEX of 8 (relevant to Pilot).&nbsp; She gets<BR>to add +1 to her Disguise roll, but must suffer a -1 penalty on her<BR>Carousing roll (no mod on the Pilot roll).&nbsp; Assuming she doesn't have any<BR>extra IPs put toward improving these skills, she would need to roll a<BR>natural 12 to improve her Pilot skill to 2 (10 + 2 = 12).&nbsp; Likewise, she<BR>would need to roll a natural 12 to improve Carousing to 1 (actually needs<BR>an 11+, but suffers a -1 on her roll).&nbsp; Technically, she would need a 13<BR>to improve Disguise to 4 (modified 14+, get +1 on her roll, but a natural<BR>12 will do the job in any case).<BR><BR>If she does have some IPs invested into these skills from previous<BR>adventures - lets say 4 IPs each - then she would need an 8+ to improve<BR>Carousing, another 8+ to improve Pilot, and 9+ to improve Disguise.<BR><BR>Characters can try to pick up new skills (at level 0) using this method,<BR>if they manage to successfully use a skill they don't have.&nbsp; However,<BR>because they're doing so unskilled, so to speak, there is a +2 penalty on<BR>the difficulty number (requires a natural 12 on the 2d6 roll, not<BR>counting any extra IP they may have been able to save away).<BR><BR>Characters may even try to improve stats using this method (no stat mods<BR>for this, obviously), but it will for the most part be a very time<BR>consuming method (if you're trying to improve your STR from 7 to 8, you<BR>need an unmodified 18+ on your roll.&nbsp; Start saving up those IPs.)<BR><BR>This makes skill advancement a tangible goal, but not a quick one. <BR>Alternatively, if a PC is happy with his skills the way they are, they<BR>can simply sink most or all of their EPs into their BP pool, making<BR>actual adventuring a bit easier, since you can reroll those really<BR>critical rolls.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 19:29:49 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>http://dmoz.org/Games/Roleplaying/Systems/Traveller/<BR><BR>While you are out there updating your web site, or making a new one, be sure<BR>to add or update the URL on the Open Directory at the link above. There are<BR>110 active sites listed there, but we have room for plenty more.<BR><BR>While I'm at it, the following four sites have recently broken their links<BR>and I don't know where they may have moved to. If you have that info, please<BR>contact me directly at the email addy below.<BR><BR>Traveller's Guide to the Community<BR>http://www.truserve.com/~igor/traveller/<BR><BR>Jump Point<BR>http://users.citnet.com/letterworks/<BR><BR>Traveller - The Web pages<BR>http://www.geocities.com/~signal-gk/<BR><BR>Starport 276 - Atrium<BR>http://www.davtechsys.com/traveller/atrium.html<BR><BR>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~&lt;&gt;&lt;~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>Colin Michael, webmaster@downport.com<BR>www.Downport.com - "The Traveller Domain"<BR><BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Antony Farrell" &lt;Skaran@bigpond.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; How about a challenge for all the Traveller enthusiasts with web sites.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Lets all put in a concerted efforts to get some updates up and running.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I find it a little disappointing to go through site after site and get<BR>&gt; "coming soon" messages dated more than a year ago.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Come on, we can do it.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:47:15 -0800<BR>From: "Pat Connaughton" &lt;patconnaughton@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>I've a quick question,<BR>Has anyone a suggestion for a reasonably easy to access list<BR>of star types? I've collected a few descriptions and notes for<BR>my own use, but a more complete list would be helpful<BR><BR>Thanks<BR>Pat<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: Megan Robertson &lt;mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Cc: &lt;mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk&gt;<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 4:30 PM<BR>Subject: Re: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR><BR>&gt; In-Reply-To: &lt;3A7744EC.6070706@pdaguy.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Greetings dear hearts.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Astronomical data (star type, planets orbiting same, moons, asteroids,<BR>&gt; Oort cloud, etc.)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Main inhabited world (UPP, then expand on that in text much as Chris Olsen<BR>&gt; has suggested, only add in to his list: local armed forces, government<BR>&gt; type and personalities, notable flora and fauna, renowned academic<BR>&gt; institutions, one or two 'stellar' personalities - musicians, poets,<BR>&gt; physicists, rpg designers, whatever. Oh, and any strange local laws or<BR>&gt; customs that visitors should look out for... unless of course you want<BR>&gt; them taken by surprise!)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Other inhabited worlds - similar details as above.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Space habitats - such details as are relevant.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Gas giant (if present) - any information about use of same for fuel<BR>&gt; skimming. Do you have to report in/ask permission anywhere, is there a<BR>&gt; fee, etc.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hugs and kisses,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mexal.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 11:54:46 +1100<BR>From: Rob &lt;rhoughto@one.net.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Many are remembering this day and where they were when this tradgedy<BR>&gt; &gt; happened, but how many TMLers were actualy there to witness the event?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; And as somwone pointed out on another group, the day before the<BR>&gt; Challenger disaster was the anniversary of the Apollo 1 fire. 34 years<BR>&gt; ago.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; And we shouldn't forget Soyuz 1 and Soyuz 11 (anybody have the dates<BR>&gt; for those?)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; So far we've lost 14 people on the road to space.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>That we know of...I hate to sound like a conspiricy theroist...but it's<BR>possible that the USSR and even the US have lost people in black programs?<BR><BR>Other Rob<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:48:27 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need advice...<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; the advice i need is<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; 1) do other gms award skills from adventures?<BR><BR>I award experience points at the end of every game session.&nbsp; This is under the<BR>KB3 experience system.&nbsp; Basically, you get points every game session, and when<BR>you build up enough, you can try to see if your skill goes up.<BR><BR>The rolls are hard, so most times you try, you fail.&nbsp; This is by design--I<BR>wanted the experience system to mimic chargen.&nbsp; PCs in my campaign tend to go up<BR>about 1 skill per game year (more if intense gaming, less if not).<BR><BR>But, the experience points help the players "feel" like their characters are<BR>advancing.<BR><BR>And, oh, is it so nice when you make one of those experience rolls, raising your<BR>skill level.<BR><BR>This KB3 experience system provides improvement on the skills the PCs use, but<BR>there is also a built in factor that will allow players to groom their<BR>characters--increasing skills that they don't normally use all the time (or even<BR>learn new ones).<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:58:52 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Need advice...<BR><BR>What is KB3? and where can i get a copy of this to look at?<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions<BR>[mailto:dreamer@brokersys.com]<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 4:48 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Need advice...<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; the advice i need is<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; 1) do other gms award skills from adventures?<BR><BR>I award experience points at the end of every game session.&nbsp; This is under<BR>the<BR>KB3 experience system.&nbsp; Basically, you get points every game session, and<BR>when<BR>you build up enough, you can try to see if your skill goes up.<BR><BR>The rolls are hard, so most times you try, you fail.&nbsp; This is by design--I<BR>wanted the experience system to mimic chargen.&nbsp; PCs in my campaign tend to<BR>go up<BR>about 1 skill per game year (more if intense gaming, less if not).<BR><BR>But, the experience points help the players "feel" like their characters are<BR>advancing.<BR><BR>And, oh, is it so nice when you make one of those experience rolls, raising<BR>your<BR>skill level.<BR><BR>This KB3 experience system provides improvement on the skills the PCs use,<BR>but<BR>there is also a built in factor that will allow players to groom their<BR>characters--increasing skills that they don't normally use all the time (or<BR>even<BR>learn new ones).<BR><BR>Kenneth.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:13:08 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; I'm no organizational genius, but basing it on how most encyclopedia do <BR>&gt; it sounds like a good idea to me.&nbsp; The outline I would use would be:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; System Name (ala standard format)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Labelled system diagram (pick a type you like)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Population and demographic information (could be encoded above)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; General system description as well as what the system, as a whole, <BR>&gt; imports and exports.&nbsp;&nbsp; (Note that worlds in the system may import/export <BR>&gt; more than these items, but thier needs may be met by in-system traffic).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; For each important world/body in the system:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; World/Body Name and location<BR>&gt; Map<BR>&gt; Almanac information (census, major imports and exports, starports and <BR>&gt; largest 3 pop. centers)<BR>&gt; Cultural information (ethnic groups and groupings, religious <BR>&gt; affiliations, customs varying from the 'norm' of the compiler, and local <BR>&gt; holidays)<BR>&gt; Agricultural Information (what is grown and where) [hint - use maps]<BR>&gt; Natural Resource Information (what is mined and where) [hint - use maps]<BR>&gt; Tourist Information (some overlap with culture here, but don't worry <BR>&gt; about it).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Anybody else got anything they think should be added?<BR><BR>Yeah, you need the length of the year and day for the important worlds.<BR>And you may need info to let you position the worlds on a map such as I<BR>decribed in another message. But that gets kinda hairy to handle by hand.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:16:05 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; This was part of the original intent behind the Grandsurvey project.<BR>&gt; http://www.grandsurvey.com I've got a partly worked database schema<BR>&gt; for storing this information.&nbsp; It's mostly based on WBH, although I'd<BR>&gt; like to be able to extend.&nbsp; Things I'd like to add: Notes (free text), <BR>&gt; characters, locations (i.e. things smaller than planets).<BR><BR>Does anybody have a scan of the old wall-poster map of known space? <BR><BR>I think it'd be neat to have a scan of that, where you could click on<BR>the sectors (or maybe domains?) and get a zoom to where the<BR>sector(domain) filled most of the screen, and then repeat the<BR>select/zoom process all the way down to world level (or beyond if you<BR>want to get crazy).<BR><BR>For that matter, being able to zoom out a few times would be nice, if<BR>only to give perspective on just how little of the galaxy is "known". <BR><BR>Hmmm, for that matter, you need the zoom out just to get the Zhodani<BR>core expeditions onto the map. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3576<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yb02.mx.aol.com (rly-yb02.mail.aol.com [172.18.146.2]) by air-yb05.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 20:21:11 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yb02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 20:20:33 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id UAA54400;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 20:19:20 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 30 Jan 2001 20:19:11 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id UAA54354<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 20:19:11 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 20:19:11 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101310119.UAA54354@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3576<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3577</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/30/01 8:57:38 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tuesday, January 30 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3577<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>RE: Another question...<BR>RE: Princess Bride Sequel<BR>RE: Need advice...<BR>Re: Another question...<BR>RE: de-canonized material<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>Re: Hitech lowtech<BR>Re: Unofficial TNS<BR>Who do I hire to terraform this place?<BR>Re: System Writeup Outline<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>Re: Plush?<BR>Re: Plush?<BR>Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR>RE: de-canonized material<BR>Subject:TNE<BR>Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:22:12 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; On Mon, 29 Jan 2001, Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; On Mon, 29 Jan 2001, Megan Robertson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&gt; Benefits (?) of over 23 years roleplaying.<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Gaah, it always discomforting to realise that roleplaying is so old a<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; hobby. You have been playing almost as long as I have been in existence.<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; B-)&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&gt; Well, I started role playing in 1974. I bet that *really* bothers you.<BR>&gt;&gt; :-) <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Actually, not that much; I have realised long ago that you must be very<BR>&gt; old, by the wealth of information your brains carry...<BR><BR>&lt;curmudgeon&gt;<BR><BR>You young whippersnapper just don't appreciate the wisdom of your elders!<BR><BR>&lt;/curmudgeon&gt;<BR><BR>I'm not *that* old!<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:37:49 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Another question...<BR><BR>You mean Orville and Wilbur Wright.<BR><BR>They wouldn't even understand the preface, much less the specifications on<BR>the first read through. In today's acronym laden world, they would be badly<BR>floundering. Concepts like lift to drag, center of gravity, were<BR>empirically-determined on a per aircraft basis, rather than determined and<BR>predicted during the design phase.<BR><BR>By contrast, we are currently less then 10 years away from a totally<BR>computer-evaluated design and testing program to full production aircraft.<BR>They are on the cusp of it right now with some engineering bureaus,<BR>depending on the overall parameters of the aircraft. The days of prototyping<BR>are coming to a close in the aerospace industry. The next big hurdles to<BR>overcome are servicing and overhaul manuals becoming fully integrated with<BR>the design phase of the aircraft (within the next 10-20 years) with regard<BR>to Human Factors. The possibility of installing parts incorrectly will also<BR>be reduced during the design phase by making parts only able to fit one way,<BR>and so forth. The "easy to maintain" designs (current "low maintenance"<BR>designs are difficult to even identify some parts properly) will become a<BR>reality with step-by-step instructions (Including lists of required tools<BR>and removal and installation diagrams) on how to service any part of the<BR>aircraft available on a laptop or data pad without the need for massive<BR>amounts of paperwork support currently needed to keep an engineering library<BR>current.<BR><BR>It would almost like showing the blueprints for the Royal Caribbean Voyager<BR>of the Seas to a Viking longboat shipwright in 900 A.D. Same place of<BR>origin, just a little different technology.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of William Lane<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 4:56 PM<BR>To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>Subject: Another question...<BR><BR>Here is a hypothetical for you guys.<BR><BR>if you could go back in time and Slap the design Documments down for say the<BR>new f-22 in front of John and wilbur Wright. what do you think they would<BR>get from looking at them?<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:56:01 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Princess Bride Sequel<BR><BR>Mandy Patinkin really did a fine job on that movie. Cary Elwes was<BR>sufficiently boorish as well. It helps to have a director that actually DID<BR>read the book before working on a script.<BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of William Lane<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 5:54 PM<BR>To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>Subject: RE: Princess Bride Sequel<BR><BR>I love the "Princess Bride" i just recently purchased the DVD to replace the<BR>tape i lost on my move to california.<BR><BR>I die laughing through the whole things 8)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; "You only think I guessed wrong!&nbsp; That's what's so funny!&nbsp; I<BR>switched<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; glasses when your back was turned! Ha ha, you fool!! You fell victim<BR>to<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; one of the classic blunders.&nbsp; The most famous is never get involved<BR>in a<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; land war in Asia; and only slightly less well known is this:&nbsp; Never<BR>go<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; in against a Sicilian, when death is on the line!"<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Dominic Mooney [mailto:dom@cybergoths.u-net.com]<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 3:36 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: OT: Princess Bride Sequel<BR><BR><BR>Apparently there's a Princess Bride Sequel Novel planned by William<BR>Goldman called 'Buttercup's Baby'. I don't know any more except the<BR>first chapter is in the recent UK 25th anniversary reprint of the<BR>book.<BR><BR>BTW if you have only seen the film (and liked it) read the book! It's<BR>far funnier.<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 20:49:21 -0500<BR>From: trentfs@ix.netcom.com<BR>Subject: RE: Need advice...<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR>&gt; What is KB3? and where can i get a copy of this to look at?<BR><BR>LOL!&nbsp; SOMEBODY must not've been on the list during the last couple weeks of December 2000.&nbsp; KB3 is Kenneth's latest controversial alternative Task System for Traveller.&nbsp; I'm sure he'll be more than happy to tell you about it and point out where to find it.&nbsp; If you can't wait, search the list archive for any of the couple thousand messages devoted to it last month. <BR><BR>Trent<BR><BR>P.S. to Kenneth:&nbsp; No offense meant here.&nbsp; I've said before and I'll say again, I think discussing and attempting to improve the rules of the game is a Good Thing.&nbsp; Even though I still prefer MT.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:17:51 -0800<BR>From: "Mark F. Cook" &lt;markc@peak.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR>William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt; writes:<BR><BR>&gt;if you could go back in time and Slap the design Documments down for say the<BR>&gt;new f-22 in front of John and wilbur Wright. what do you think they would<BR>&gt;get from looking at them?<BR><BR>Vertigo? :^)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - Mark C.<BR><BR>&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:24:32 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: RE: de-canonized material<BR><BR>Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com responded thus to Anthony Colosetti who wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; I've been curious about this for a while now and maybe I just<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; missed something, but does anyone out there know WHY GDW<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; de-canonized the Judges Guild material?&nbsp; And my second question<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; is if this happened to JG what other material has suffered the<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt; same treatment?&nbsp; Just wondering....<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; About 6 months ago I saw an alleged internal GDW&nbsp; email&nbsp; sent&nbsp; at<BR>&gt;&nbsp; the time Atlas Of The Imperium was published.<BR><BR>I'd be interested to know the source of this "alleged internal e-mail."<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:38:09 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>on 1/30/01 9:14 AM, Antony Farrell at Skaran@bigpond.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; How about a challenge for all the Traveller enthusiasts with web sites.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Lets all put in a concerted efforts to get some updates up and running.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I find it a little disappointing to go through site after site and get<BR>&gt; "coming soon" messages dated more than a year ago.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Come on, we can do it.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Antony<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Anthony, we have new material every week (albiet mostly game notes).&nbsp; Check<BR>out http://www.travellercentral.com.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:38:35 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Hitech lowtech<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;I am trying to get an idea as to what an engineer from a lower tech level<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;could gain from having something from a higher tech level thrust into his<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;hands for a month. and if he could back engineer something from that <BR>higher<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;tech level to something he could build or produce.<BR><BR>I had a idea for a novel based on the sentence: "The only secret worth <BR>keeping is 'It can be done.'"&nbsp; <BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:40:28 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Unofficial TNS<BR><BR>on 1/30/01 3:48 AM, Kjeld Johansen at kjeld@games.dk wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I have started writing an unofficial TNS:<BR>&gt; &lt;http://traveller.virvar.net/&gt;<BR>&gt; It is based on the Gurps timeline, is starting in year 1121 and is centered<BR>&gt; in the Spinward Marches.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; If anyone else is running a campaign in this place / time, then I would love<BR>&gt; to receive news from your Traveller universe. This way I could bring the<BR>&gt; universe even more to live.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Kjeld.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Check out our website at http://ww.travellercentral.com.&nbsp; We are running in<BR>1122.&nbsp; There are game notes that contain info, as well as 4 publications for<BR>Regina/REGINA:&nbsp; The Times, the Tattler, Free Thoughts and Le Mercenaire.<BR>See Regina Press.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:47:11 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Who do I hire to terraform this place?<BR><BR>Are there any references in canon to megacorporations that are interested in <BR>terraforming in and around 1115-1120? I'm in need of a likely organization <BR>that would be engaged in cutting edge research in the field.<BR><BR>I'll invent a connection of my own if I have to, but it's so much more fun <BR>to loop back on what has gone before, if possible!<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:51:49 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>on 1/30/01 2:57 PM, Paul Campbell at kemitix@users.sourceforge.net wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Talk about a bizarre koinkydink ... I was just this afternoon<BR>&gt;&gt; browsing the CIA World Factbook (www.cia.gov), and thinking how<BR>&gt;&gt; wonderful it would be for something like that to be available for<BR>&gt;&gt; Traveller ... ALL the world writeups, in all the detail available, in<BR>&gt;&gt; one *standard* format (and even amenable to automated processing ...).<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This was part of the original intent behind the Grandsurvey project.<BR>&gt; http://www.grandsurvey.com I've got a partly worked database schema<BR>&gt; for storing this information.&nbsp; It's mostly based on WBH, although I'd<BR>&gt; like to be able to extend.&nbsp; Things I'd like to add: Notes (free text),<BR>&gt; characters, locations (i.e. things smaller than planets).<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Get the latest version at:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://www.grandsurvey.com/pcampbell/gs-db-0.0.2.tar.gz<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; On a related note to the Web Sites thread.&nbsp; I've been discouraged from<BR>&gt; working too much on this because to the lack of feedback.&nbsp; It's<BR>&gt; something I want to develop for myself, but it is a large project, and<BR>&gt; if more people were interested it would be much easier to get<BR>&gt; motivated.<BR><BR>Paul, don't be too discouraged.&nbsp; I plan on contributing as soon as I get<BR>time.&nbsp; Meanwhile, aside from maintaining 8 websites (5 Traveller related),<BR>working 50 hours a week, taking care of 2 kids while mom travels, porting<BR>H&amp;E to the mac (Yes, Stuart, I'm still working on this.&nbsp; I probably just<BR>should have written it from scratch), working on a major gun project and<BR>trying to keep up with the TML.<BR><BR>Some day I'll have spare time.<BR><BR>I Promise to review the latest material this weekend and send you my<BR>comments.<BR><BR>Everyone, Paul is doing great work.&nbsp; He needs help.&nbsp; If you'd like to<BR>volunteer to help with the Grand Survey project, join the mailing list.&nbsp; Go<BR>to http://www.grandsurvey.com for info.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:55:18 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>on 1/30/01 4:29 PM, david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au at<BR>david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This is what I partially tried to do with my links page. The problem is<BR>&gt; manifold:<BR>&gt; - a complete list is out of the question: a) it's too long, and b)<BR>&gt; sites change too often for any such list to be kept current;<BR>&gt; - I put in a few things, but only what _I'm_ interested in - others<BR>&gt; may not be interested the same things (deckplans - drool!);<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Keeping the index up to date includes regularly visiting sites to<BR>&gt;&gt; look for new material and dead sites.&nbsp; Are you volunteering?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Keeping the thing up-to-date is a bitch.<BR><BR>Yeah, I understand.&nbsp; I'm still waiting for my website entry after your great<BR>review of our site posted on our guestbook 6/26/2000. :)<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:59:10 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Plush?<BR><BR>&gt;From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Plush?<BR>...<BR>&gt;I probably could... but you are a bit far away to deliver it!<BR><BR>&nbsp; The stuffed Cthulhoids would at least be able to cast Gate and<BR>channel POW from their vict^h^h "owners". A stuffed Hiver would<BR>have to get someone to carry it onto a flight - and convince them<BR>that it was their own idea in the first place.<BR><BR>&nbsp; Frankly, it sounds like childs play to me...&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; :)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:24:11 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Plush?<BR><BR>Steven Hudson wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>&gt; &gt;Subject: Re: Plush?<BR>&gt; ...<BR>&gt; &gt;I probably could... but you are a bit far away to deliver it!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; The stuffed Cthulhoids would at least be able to cast Gate and<BR>&gt; channel POW from their vict^h^h "owners". A stuffed Hiver would<BR>&gt; have to get someone to carry it onto a flight - and convince them<BR>&gt; that it was their own idea in the first place.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Frankly, it sounds like childs play to me...&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; :)<BR><BR>Y'know, the more I think about it, the more I would like to see Ithklur<BR>plushies....<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 03:25:06 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR>on 31/1/01 12:54 am, Rob at rhoughto@one.net.au wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; That we know of...I hate to sound like a conspiricy theroist...but it's<BR>&gt; possible that the USSR and even the US have lost people in black programs?<BR><BR>It is clearly possible, but how likely is it? Certainly there are astronauts<BR>that are not in the media eye - several X-plane test pilots have been<BR>publicly given astronaut's wings. However, we're considering programs that<BR>are less public than these for which astronaut's&nbsp; wings will not be awarded.<BR><BR>Some of the black program lifting bodies (the alleged Aurora for example)<BR>and the Waverider-based systems spotted near Macrihanish, Kintyre are<BR>clearly developments aimed at either space systems or near-space systems.<BR>But are they manned at this stage? Recent strategic focus on RASFOR (RApid<BR>Space FOrce Reconstitution) suggests that more military systems are likely<BR>being developed for manned programs. So there is an increasing likelihood of<BR>loss of life in the development of a classified space program. Which still<BR>doesn't give us too much of a hint at whether such a loss of life has<BR>occurred already. Clearly these losses could be accounted for under<BR>'training' losses at present.<BR><BR>I'd have to guess that the chances are small within NATO block forces, based<BR>on both Air Force and Army interests in space technology. Until<BR>comparatively recent times, military space systems have been focussed on<BR>unmanned programs. Since we can observe military strategy better than we can<BR>observe the programs themselves, it is likely that because strategic focus<BR>has only recently shifted towards manned systems, none are at a particularly<BR>developed stage at this point.<BR><BR>Russia (and indeed, very shortly China) are more of a problem to predict,<BR>since our knowledge of their activities or even strategies is scant outside<BR>intelligence circles.<BR><BR>But my overall guess would be that while there _may_ be some atmospheric and<BR>ground fatalities unclaimed for space projects within the former USSR, it's<BR>not likely that the number of actual space fatalities is any higher in any<BR>of the manned programs.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 20:55:57 -0700<BR>From: "J. Paul Sanders" &lt;jps64@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: de-canonized material<BR><BR>At 09:24 PM 1/30/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com responded thus to Anthony Colosetti who wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &gt; I've been curious about this for a while now and maybe I just<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &gt; missed something, but does anyone out there know WHY GDW<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &gt; de-canonized the Judges Guild material?&nbsp; And my second question<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &gt; is if this happened to JG what other material has suffered the<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &gt; same treatment?&nbsp; Just wondering....<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; About 6 months ago I saw an alleged internal GDW&nbsp; email&nbsp; sent&nbsp; at<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; the time Atlas Of The Imperium was published.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I'd be interested to know the source of this "alleged internal e-mail."<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;LKW<BR><BR>Actually, Peter mis-spoke - it wasn't an email, but rather an internal GDW <BR>memo... I have it sitting right here in front of me... as for how I came by <BR>it - Marc sent it to me several years ago along with a lot of other <BR>'freebie' items when he was filling an order. I've typed in the text below <BR>- - for those who would like to view the memo, send me an email off the list <BR>and I will attach a scan of it.<BR><BR>Paul<BR><BR>*****<BR><BR>Game Designers' Workshop<BR>P.O.Box 1646<BR>Bloomington, Illinois 61701<BR>(309) 452-3632<BR><BR>BACKGROUND - Not for publication without prior arrangement.<BR><BR>Subject: Sectors Assigned to Individuals and Companies.<BR><BR>Trojan Reach - granted to Bob McWilliams of Games Workshop. Portions mapped <BR>by him in Leviathan. Remaining 14 subsectors will be mapped by Marc W <BR>Miller in Atlas of the Imperium.<BR><BR>Riftspan Reaches - granted to Andy Slack of Games Workshop. Proposed <BR>mapping by him proved unsatisfactory. Will be mapped by Marc W Miller in <BR>Atlas of the Imperium.<BR><BR>Corridor - used as a personal preserve by Marc W Miller.<BR><BR>Reavers Deep - granted to Bill and Andrew Keith of Marischal Adventures. <BR>Their mapping will appear in Atlas of the Imperium.<BR><BR>Old Expanses - granted to Jim Cunningham of High Passage Magazine. His <BR>mapping will appear in Atlas of the Imperium.<BR><BR>Solomani Rim - mapped by John Harshman.<BR><BR>Far Frontiers - granted to FASA and mapped by Dale L. Kemper. When FASA <BR>discontinued production of Traveller materials, they set Dale loose with <BR>his manuscript, which he offered to Ares magazine. They published it in <BR>Special Edition 2.<BR><BR>Theta Borealis - mapped using a computer program at GDW and supplied to <BR>Group One. Frankly, I disremember if they ever published the sector map and <BR>data, although they worked from the data.<BR><BR>Vanguard Reaches - granted to Chuck Kallenbach of Paranoia Press. See Beyond.<BR><BR>Beyond - granted to Don Rapp of Paranoia Press. These two early sectors <BR>(Vanguard Reaches and Beyond) contain materials which are now thought <BR>unacceptable, and as a result we consider them to be like Prester John's <BR>Kingdom - wild stories of far away places rather than accurate readings of <BR>astrography. Both are out of print, with the rights sold to FASA: FASA has <BR>been informed that they cannot be reprinted in their present form and will <BR>require approval prior to a new addition.<BR><BR>Ley Sector - granted to Judges Guild.<BR><BR>Glimmerdrift - granted to Judges Guild.<BR><BR>Marantha-Alkahest - granted to Judges Guild.<BR><BR>Crucis Margin - granted to Judges Guild.<BR><BR>All four Judges Guild sectors were granted at their urging with promises of <BR>many adventures set within their boundaries. At one point, GDW specifically <BR>urged more adventures before new sectors were published, but JG said they <BR>needed the entire four sectors in print first. Once they were in print, <BR>adventures just never appeared. The Judges Guild license has lapsed, and no <BR>new products from them are expected. These sectors are now considered <BR>unacceptable; entirely new star maps are being generated for inclusion in <BR>the Atlas of the Imperium.<BR><BR><BR>*****<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 19:56:58 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Don Roberts &lt;tne1201@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Subject:TNE<BR><BR>I know that I am going to probably start a storm of<BR>controversy here, but I am rather fond of the TNE<BR>setting for Traveller.&nbsp; I think the setting was well<BR>thought out and reflected an imaginatively fresh way<BR>of looking at the traveller universe.&nbsp; I am curious if<BR>anyone has any Ideas as to what the "Black Curtain"<BR>actually was.&nbsp; It was referred to in the TNE rulebook<BR>and I have found hints in my other sourcebooks, but I<BR>think GDW went out of business before they could fill<BR>in the blanks.&nbsp; I am certainly up to anyones guess.&nbsp; Thanks.<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 18:52:54 -0500<BR>From: "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>To be sure, the discussion has been interesting. However there are some<BR>misconceptions about what recoil (reaction) is. Recoil is not caused by the<BR>slug. Envision the cartridge as a rocket engine. As the ignition takes place<BR>the rapidly expanding gases push against all sides of the cartridge casing<BR>equally. The gases escape from the end with the slug ejecting it at close to<BR>the velocity of the gaseous expansion. The opposite end has no hole but the<BR>gases still push on it. Recoil. This is exactly how a rocket motor works.<BR>Thank you Sir Newton. This, by the way is why a present day "recoil-less"<BR>rifle works. Some of the gases are allowed to escape at the breech thus<BR>reducing the delta in pressure and thus reducing the recoil.<BR><BR>Now, as to the bore of the barrel, well the bore determines the rate at<BR>which gases can escape the combustion chamber. Remembering that the recoil<BR>is caused by the delta in pressure between the open end of the cartridge and<BR>closed we can readily see that a larger bore (for the same size charge)<BR>allows lower pressure (a result of a higher volume of gases released at a<BR>particular instant) and thus a lower delta. Now, shotguns generally have a<BR>larger charge and lower burn rate. This results a longer recoil if not a<BR>more potent one.<BR><BR>To bring all this in the SF universe. The advantages of projectile weapons<BR>on any given world is that they are cheap, easy to fabricate, dependable,<BR>and don't require sophisticated power sources. Thus, I believe that they<BR>would be fairly common on many worlds. The weapons would be a product of<BR>technological evolution in their particular environment. Importing weapons<BR>from worlds where the technology has evolved to compensate for, perhaps, a<BR>completely different environment would be questionable.<BR><BR>Again, I think a "universal" use of firearms is a dubious vision of the<BR>future. By the time enough technology is employed to make firearms<BR>dependable in any environment in which they might find themselves deployed,<BR>the cost of the weapon would become prohibitively high and the MTBF (Mean<BR>Time Between Failures) would be prohibitively low. There go the advantages<BR>of cheap, easy to fabricate, and dependable.<BR><BR>No, I think that high technology armies would use direct energy weapons<BR>simply because they can be used in any environment. Look at it this way: I<BR>could choose to zap my opponent with my trusty ray gun or I can choose to<BR>take one step up from throwing rocks and chose to fling little bits of metal<BR>at him. Hummm.... That's a tough one....<BR><BR>Low technologies will use firearms...but they aren't going very far from<BR>home anyway.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 04:56:20 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR>on 30/1/01 11:40 pm, Leonard Erickson at shadow@krypton.rain.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; And we shouldn't forget Soyuz 1 and Soyuz 11 (anybody have the dates<BR>&gt; for those?)<BR><BR>24th April, 1967 and 29th June, 1971.<BR><BR>&gt; So far we've lost 14 people on the road to space.<BR><BR>Well, that depends on how you're counting. I think there are more people who<BR>have died trying to get there than that:<BR><BR>One died (Valentin Bondarenko, Mar. 23, 1961) in an oxygen fire, his death<BR>was not made public until 1986.<BR><BR>One died (Theodore C. Freeman, Oct. 31, 1964) in a training crash.<BR><BR>Two died (Gemini 9 crew: Elliot See and Charlie Bassett, February 28, 1966)<BR>in a transit flight between bases, when See misjudged landing and hit<BR>assembly building 101.<BR><BR>Three died (Apollo 1 crew, Roger B. Chaffee, Virgil "Gus" Grissom, Edward H.<BR>White II, Jan. 27, 1967) in an oxygen fire.<BR><BR>One died (Soyuz 1 crew, Vladimir Komarov, Apr. 24, 1967) re-entering the<BR>atmosphere.<BR><BR>One died (Edward Givens, Jun 6, 1967) in a car crash.<BR><BR>One died (Clifton C. Williams Jr., Oct. 5, 1967) in a T38 training crash.<BR><BR>One died (Robert H. Lawrence, Dec. 8, 1967) in an F104 training crash - the<BR>first black US astronaut - only recently recognised as such.<BR><BR>One died (Major Yuri Gagarin, Mar. 27, 1968) training for his next flight.<BR><BR>One died (Pavel Belyayev, Jan. 10, 1970) during a surgical operation.<BR><BR>Three died (Soyuz 11 crew, Georgi Dobrovolsky, Viktor Patsayev, Vladislaw<BR>Volkov, Jun. 29, 1971) of asphyxiation.<BR><BR>Which makes 16 - <BR><BR>The Apollo 15 crew left a plaque and tin sculpture of the fallen astronaut:<BR><BR>http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/pao/History/alsj/a15/as15-88-11894.jpg<BR><BR>The names being:<BR><BR>Theodore Freeman (Oct. 1964, aircraft accident)<BR>Charles Bassett (Feb. 1966, aircraft accident)<BR>Elliot See (Feb. 1966, aircraft accident)<BR>Edward Givens (1967, automobile accident)<BR>Roger Chaffee (Jan. 1967, Apollo 1 fire)<BR>Gus Grissom (Jan. 1967, Apollo 1 fire)<BR>Edward White (Jan. 1967, Apollo 1 fire)<BR>Vladimir Komarov (Apr. 1967, re-entry parachute failure)<BR>C.C. Williams (Oct. 1967, aircraft accident)<BR>Yuri Gagarin (Mar 1968, aircraft accident)<BR>Pavel Belyayev (Jan. 1970, disease)<BR>Viktor Patsayev (Jun. 1971, re-entry pressurization failure)<BR>Vladislaw Volkov (Jun. 1971, re-entry pressurization failure)<BR>Georgi Dobrovolsky (Jun. 1971 re-entry pressurization failure)<BR><BR>And then the unthinkable:<BR><BR>Seven died (Challenger, STS 51-L crew Christa McAuliffe, Gregory B. Jarvis,<BR>Ronald E. McNair, Ellison S. Onizuka, Judith A. Resnik, Francis "Dick"<BR>Scobee, Michael J. Smith, Jan. 28, 1986) during lift-off.<BR><BR>One more that made it to the memorial mirror outside KSC:<BR><BR>One died (Manley L. "Sonny" Carter, April 5, 1991) in a commercial aircraft<BR>flight.<BR><BR>For a total of 24 named fallen astronauts. I believe that there may have<BR>been another three cosmonauts who have yet to be officially recognised, and<BR>at least another two astronauts who were killed during training - yet to<BR>become astronauts but selected. :(<BR><BR>Sorry this took so long to compile - most of my records are on dead tree<BR>matter.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3577<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xb03.mx.aol.com (rly-xb03.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.104]) by air-xb04.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 23:57:38 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xb03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 23:57:14 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id XAA62621;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 23:56:30 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Tue, 30 Jan 2001 23:56:05 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id XAA62566<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 23:56:05 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 23:56:05 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101310456.XAA62566@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3577<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3578</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/31/01 3:54:21 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; Wednesday, January 31 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3578<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: X-boat traffic<BR>Re: Another question...<BR>Re: Another question...<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Another question...<BR>Re: Another question...<BR>Re: Ah...<BR>Re: TNE<BR>Re: TNE<BR>RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR>Re: Plush?<BR>RE: Plush?<BR>RE: TNE<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons (rebuttal - long)<BR>RE: Challenger Aniversary<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy ...<BR>Re: System Writeup Outline<BR>Re: Who do I hire to terraform this place?<BR>RE: de-canonized material<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>[Website Review] The Imperial Marshal Campaign<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 01:44:49 -0500<BR>From: Thom Jones-Low &lt;tjoneslo@together.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: X-boat traffic<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:33:44 -0500<BR>&gt; From: "Rob Davenport" &lt;rgd@ohio.voyager.net&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; On 28 Jan 2001, at 20:12, Thom Jones-Low wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; You won't see much spam via x-boats. For several reasons.<BR>&gt; &lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; This may be the most limiting factor of the spam via xboat. The problem<BR>&gt; &gt; is not only will the xboat facilities (at both ends) filter obvious,<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This made me wonder, how much commercial/personal traffic flows via the<BR>&gt; x-boat system, as compared to official Imperial/governmental<BR>&gt; information?&nbsp; Is it the only interworld communication system IYTU?<BR>&gt; I believe there is canon mention of a military system that speeds<BR>&gt; military communication, and I wouldn't expect anything less in that<BR>&gt; regard.&nbsp; Are there corporate routes/services?&nbsp; Local governmental<BR>&gt; services (within the 3I)?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I can see the Imperial X-Boat Service being the carrier of choice for<BR>&gt; long distance messages as the Imperium is possibly the only entity<BR>&gt; capable of maintaining such a large public(?) communication system.<BR>&gt; (Oh, I suppose the mega corps might actually have more capital to use,<BR>&gt; but not political authority to establish routes.)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; But wouldn't there be inter/intra-sector, -subsector, and -world<BR>&gt; systems that run with increasing frequency as the distance diminishes?<BR>&gt; Two worlds 1pc apart with moderately large intertwined economies<BR>&gt; might have a service that runs between them every day or even hour.<BR>&gt; (though what happens when it ships sent out an hour later beat the<BR>&gt; ships sent out earlier?)<BR>&gt; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; IMTU, the x-boat system is something like the highway system in the US.<BR>Originally designed for military purposes, the civilian applications<BR>have largely taken over the entire thing. It's not the fastest method of<BR>information transmittal, but it is the most reliable and cheapest. <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; But the x-boats don't go everywhere. So there is a lot of overflow<BR>traffic from the nearest x-boat station to the various worlds not on the<BR>links, which are served by the various corporations, or who ever the<BR>local governments can hire. Small, low population worlds may not even<BR>have regular traffic, but sometimes the smaller merchants can find a<BR>reasonably reliable income source by providing a needed mail link. <BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; There have been attempt by various megacorps to establish a FedEx style<BR>substitute for the X-boat, but the IISS runs a pretty tight ship. And<BR>since the Emperor is a voting member of every corporation, there is a<BR>good reason why they never go very far. <BR>- -- <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thomas Jones-Low<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; tjoneslo@together.net<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 05:05:42 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR>on 30/1/01 10:55 pm, William Lane at wlane@Asera.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; if you could go back in time and Slap the design Documments down for say the<BR>&gt; new f-22 in front of John and wilbur Wright. what do you think they would<BR>&gt; get from looking at them?<BR><BR>We'd be celebrating them as two of the most visionary science-fiction<BR>writers of their time, and somebody else would have beaten them to propelled<BR>flight. :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 23:31:34 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR>On Wed, 31 Jan 2001, Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR>&gt; on 30/1/01 10:55 pm, William Lane at wlane@Asera.com wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; if you could go back in time and Slap the design Documments down for say the<BR>&gt; &gt; new f-22 in front of John and wilbur Wright. what do you think they would<BR>&gt; &gt; get from looking at them?<BR>&gt; We'd be celebrating them as two of the most visionary science-fiction<BR>&gt; writers of their time, and somebody else would have beaten them to propelled<BR>&gt; flight. :)<BR><BR>How would they have made it as science fiction writers?&nbsp; Even for science<BR>fiction, their stories would have been too far out for anyone to<BR>publish.<BR>Editor:&nbsp; "HOW much did you say one of these things would<BR>cost?&nbsp; You're nuts!&nbsp; Get out and stop wasting my time!"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:51:56 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>Ray Rangel wrote:<BR>&gt; No, I think that high technology armies would use direct energy weapons<BR>&gt; simply because they can be used in any environment.<BR><BR>Explain why the problems you point out as "plaguing" projectile<BR>weapons don't apply even more so to energy weapons.&nbsp; In particular,<BR>mention what sort of technology you intend to use to combat<BR>diffraction and diffusion, obtain sufficiently high energy densities,<BR>cool your weapon between firing cycles, store lots of energy in a form<BR>safe enough to take into a combat zone where the container will be<BR>subhect to extreme conditions, yet deliver a peak power in the<BR>terawatt range, and do all of the above in a device small enough to<BR>carry, maintainable by a field soldier who may be cut off from base,<BR>rugged enough for heavy combat duty, and have sufficient advantages<BR>over projectile weapons that the cost of the far more advanced<BR>technology required is justified.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Look at it this way: I could choose to zap my opponent with my<BR>&gt; trusty ray gun<BR><BR>Unreliable, expensive and fragile raygun, hardly "trusty" -- unless<BR>you can demonstrate otherwise.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; or I can choose to take one step up from throwing rocks and chose to<BR>&gt; fling little bits of metal at him<BR><BR>With a highly reliable, inexpensive, robust projectile weapon with<BR>performance virtually unchanged in a wide range of atmospheric and<BR>other environmental conditions.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:39:05 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; To bring all this in the SF universe. The advantages of projectile weapons<BR>&gt; on any given world is that they are cheap, easy to fabricate, dependable,<BR>&gt; and don't require sophisticated power sources. Thus, I believe that they<BR>&gt; would be fairly common on many worlds. The weapons would be a product of<BR>&gt; technological evolution in their particular environment. Importing weapons<BR>&gt; from worlds where the technology has evolved to compensate for, perhaps, a<BR>&gt; completely different environment would be questionable.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Again, I think a "universal" use of firearms is a dubious vision of the<BR>&gt; future. By the time enough technology is employed to make firearms<BR>&gt; dependable in any environment in which they might find themselves deployed,<BR>&gt; the cost of the weapon would become prohibitively high and the MTBF (Mean<BR>&gt; Time Between Failures) would be prohibitively low. There go the advantages<BR>&gt; of cheap, easy to fabricate, and dependable.<BR><BR>&gt; No, I think that high technology armies would use direct energy weapons<BR>&gt; simply because they can be used in any environment. Look at it this way: I<BR>&gt; could choose to zap my opponent with my trusty ray gun or I can choose to<BR>&gt; take one step up from throwing rocks and chose to fling little bits of metal<BR>&gt; at him. Hummm.... That's a tough one....<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Low technologies will use firearms...but they aren't going very far from<BR>&gt; home anyway.<BR><BR>Actually, firearms can *already* be used in most environments that<BR>occur on Traveller mainworlds. "Exotic" atmospheres might be a problem.<BR>So might Insidious.<BR><BR>Corrosive ones aren't too likely to be much of a problem. After all,<BR>the main reason for cleaning your gun often is because the gases from<BR>the powder (and *primer*!) deposit corrosive materials on the barrel. <BR><BR>Energy weapons are likely to be *disastrous* in a Corrosive atmosphere.<BR>And not a lot better in Exotic or Insidious. Heck, most types of<BR>*tainted* atmosphere will be a problem for lasers!<BR><BR>You have to realize that the range of a laser in atmosphere is *highly*<BR>dependent on what the composition of that atmosphere *is*. Otherwise,<BR>most of the energy is liable to be absorbed in the atmosphere within a<BR>few meters of the muzzle. Which will be *really* bad for whoever is<BR>holding the weapon.<BR><BR>Plasma weapons could be even worse.<BR><BR>In any case, some types of atmosphere are apt to react badly to high<BR>energy discharges...<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 22:01:16 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; do you think they could adapt anything out of what they saw to something on<BR>&gt; their write flyer? Like would they add flaps or spoilers? <BR><BR>They already *had* the idea. They warped the wings, which, given their<BR>design, does the same thing, but better.<BR><BR>&gt; I am trying to get an idea as to what an engineer from a lower tech level<BR>&gt; could gain from having something from a higher tech level thrust into his<BR>&gt; hands for a month. and if he could back engineer something from that higher<BR>&gt; tech level to something he could build or produce.<BR><BR>&gt; basically it comes down to that tech level.<BR><BR>It depends on the difference in tech levels.<BR><BR>&gt; what can an engineer at say tech level 15 do with something from say tech<BR>&gt; level 19 or 20?<BR><BR>Nothing. There are just too many gaps to fill. We won't have the<BR>materials *or* the tools. John W. Campbell wrote a couple of editorials<BR>once pointing out what would happemif early 60s "high tech" fell thru a<BR>time warp into 1930. <BR><BR>He picked a ramjet powered drone plane sent to collect samples from a<BR>nuclear test. <BR><BR>The *only* thing the folks back in 1930 *might* be able to pick up from<BR>it is the idea of "composition" resistors (ie resistors where the<BR>resistance is a mix of clay and carbon) to replace the "wire wound"<BR>resistors used then. <BR><BR>Plans wouldn't be much better, as they tend to tell you things like<BR>"fabricate from Alloy 117, using the Weismuller process". Or specify an<BR>XYZ123 chip.<BR><BR>They tell you *what*, but not *how* or *why*. And they take a *lot* for<BR>granted. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 22:13:55 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Let's look at another example.&nbsp; Someone drops into NASA plans for a Free<BR>&gt; Trader (a la CT).&nbsp; Complete with Jump Drive, Gravatic M-drive, anti-grav<BR>&gt; plates, the whole nine yards.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Could they build a Free Trader?&nbsp; Not likely anytime soon.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Not to say that there would not be immediate improvements in many aspects of<BR>&gt; our lives...but almost impossible to build.<BR><BR>Actually, it's unlikely there'd be any improvements for a long time.<BR>Simply because the plans won't tell you how to build the parts, nor how<BR>they work.<BR><BR>&gt; What do they do when the plans show the space to install the Sternmetal<BR>&gt; Horizons LIC Model 2/bis computer?&nbsp; Too much of a design is components that<BR>&gt; are magic boxes for all intents and purposes.<BR><BR>Yep.<BR><BR>&gt; Now here is a question that would bake your noodle.&nbsp; Drop yourself in<BR>&gt; Revolutionary America, with the plans for a Ford Mustang.&nbsp; Can you build it?<BR><BR>Not a chance. You'd need to *invent* precision machining (which is one<BR>of the reasons that Babbage (who was working more than 50 years later)<BR>couldn't get his difference engine built.<BR><BR>You'd need to invent a way to create various alloys. And build a<BR>complete steel mill, including the rolling mill to produce the sheet<BR>metal. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 01:20:33 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Ah...<BR><BR>&gt; Actually, Peter mis-spoke - it wasn't an email<BR><BR>I was gonna say, GDW didn't have e-mail at that time . . . <BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 01:22:53 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: TNE<BR><BR>&gt; I am curious if<BR>&gt;&nbsp; anyone has any Ideas as to what the "Black Curtain"<BR>&gt;&nbsp; actually was.<BR><BR>Yep. <BR><BR>Don't ask, I can't tell you.<BR><BR>Maybe this should go in the FAQ? :&nbsp; )<BR><BR>Loren Wiseman<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; GDW Emeritus<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; SJ Games Emigre<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 22:58:14 -0800<BR>From: "Jeffrey Yin" &lt;jsyin@cats.ucsc.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: TNE<BR><BR>I am unsure if the Black Curtain is anything other then a really dangerous<BR>part of the wilds. I know there are references that say no ship has been<BR>known to enter it and return, but I do not believe it has anything to do<BR>with unnatural forces. Rather, I believe, the Black Curtain is dangerous due<BR>to the high density of Vampire ships in the region. The concentration of<BR>Vampire Fleets is the result of a war going on between two of the more<BR>powerful, and rare, Virus strains. One is dedicated to eliminating Lucan, in<BR>revenge for his Black War strike on Cymbeline, the home planet of the<BR>proto-virus chips. The other faction worships Lucan as the creator/god<BR>figure, and has taken to protecting the borders of his former faction.<BR><BR>Jeffrey Yin<BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: &lt;GDWGAMES@aol.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 10:22 PM<BR>Subject: Re: TNE<BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt; I am curious if<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; anyone has any Ideas as to what the "Black Curtain"<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; actually was.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Yep.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Don't ask, I can't tell you.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Maybe this should go in the FAQ? :&nbsp; )<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Loren Wiseman<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; GDW Emeritus<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; SJ Games Emigre<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 20:35:29 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR><BR>&gt; 'Elric!' is a streamlined version of the same 'Basic Roleplaying'<BR>&gt; system that started as RuneQuest and was also used for<BR>&gt; Stormbringer, Call of Cthulhu, Ringworld, Nephilim, and every<BR>&gt; other Chaosium rpg (except Pendragon).&nbsp; Percentile-based,<BR>&gt; intuitive, and easy, but (as with anything percentile-based)<BR>&gt; tending to break down near the edges.<BR><BR>Such as when two people with skills of 50% try to beat each other up, and<BR>fail to hit each other for a very long time....<BR><BR>&gt; Aside from better organization (based on many years of<BR>&gt; refinements) and some&nbsp; Moorcock-specific magic and creatures,<BR>&gt; I'm not sure what, if<BR>&gt; anything, distinguishes 'Elric!' from any of the other BRP games<BR>&gt; (or what that exclamation point is supposed to mean).<BR><BR>It means the Melniboneans were the forebears of the Kalahari Bushmen.<BR><BR>Actually that was the point. BRP was GURPS before there was GURPS.<BR>Just as in GURPS, only background details, skills, magic, and specific rules<BR>for the genre, distinguish the many BRP games<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 09:44:27 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Plush?<BR><BR>On Tue, 30 Jan 2001, John Groth wrote:<BR>&gt; Y'know, the more I think about it, the more I would like to see Ithklur<BR>&gt; plushies....<BR><BR>How about My Little K'Kree dolls?<BR><BR>They could have (vegetarian) human sidekicks.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 21:16:23 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Plush?<BR><BR>Steven Hudson wrote :<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Somehow that's just a vaguely worrisome subject line :)<BR><BR>Plush, Plush<BR>I heard somebody calling my name, now<BR>Plush, Plush<BR>...<BR><BR><BR>Sorry<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 02:13:04 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: TNE<BR><BR>Hi Loren,<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Does this mean that there is possibility that TNE storyline will continue<BR>at some point?&nbsp; I too am a TNE fan...and would love to see more done with<BR>that timeline.<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:54:58 -0000<BR>From: "Antony Farrell" &lt;Skaran@bigpond.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>Anthony, we have new material every week (albiet mostly game notes).&nbsp; Check<BR>out http://www.travellercentral.com.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>Just had a look, very impressive.<BR>Now to be fair since I seem to have started this line, I should do some more<BR>updating on my own Traveller site. I have been adding to it fairly steadily,<BR>though it is not always obvious where.<BR><BR>Incidentally no "h" in Antony<BR><BR>Antony<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 02:57:14 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons (rebuttal - long)<BR><BR>Ray,<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I understand your arguments. However, point by point, here we go.<BR>Recoilless rifles either vent some or nearly all of their propellant gasses<BR>(There is one that moves a countermass as wel)l. The fact that all of the<BR>projectile thrust does not bear on any fixed portion of the weapon is what<BR>makes them "recoilless". Fire an RPG-7 or an Armbrust Antitank weapon and<BR>see if it is actually "recoilless" They are not, and they have quite a bit<BR>more recoil than you might otherwise assume.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The Bore of weapon does not determine the rate of expansion of the<BR>propellant. It does determine the expansion RATIO, however. Shotguns are the<BR>lowest pressure weapons in use that use smokeless powder. Burning rates of<BR>powder used in shotshells are paradoxically the fastest. Shotguns cannot be<BR>safely loaded to high pressures with the way their barrels are made: look<BR>how thin they are, note that also larger bores have much more internal<BR>surface area so higher pressures are going to be more difficult to contain<BR>without making the weapon into a light cannon. A typical shotgun shell<BR>generates peak pressures of 10,000 to 11,000 Lead Units of Pressure<BR>(~8000-10,000 this is only an approximation: there is no direct conversion<BR>due to the difference between transducer determined pressure readings and<BR>crusher-type pressure readings). Peak pressure occurs at about 2 to 5" from<BR>the end of the chamber, depending on the type of powder used (Faster powders<BR>have a shorter time to peak pressure).<BR><BR>The high expansion ratio of the bore compared to case capacity makes<BR>velocity due to barrel length somewhat dubious: Most shotshells loads have a<BR>hard time exceeding 1300 Feet per second at the muzzle for a standard charge<BR>weight of shot regardless of barrel length: As long as the barrel is long<BR>enough to allow the consumption of all of the powder, velocity differences<BR>between a 20" field gun and a 30" trap gun are minimal. The difference in<BR>barrel lengths is to better control the expansion of the shot as it leaves<BR>the bore. Most shotguns use some amount of constriction at the muzzle, be it<BR>swaged into the muzzle, or in the form of a screw-in choke. This leads us<BR>into the interior profile of shotgun bore, which is anything but a straight<BR>walled tube in a commercially produced shotgun. There are many factors that<BR>come into play, but this moves us away from the discussion of recoil.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Smokeless powders burning rates are determined by physical size and shape<BR>(exterior surface area) of the kernel, the type and amount of retardant<BR>(Natural charcoal, graphite or lime are the most commonly used retardants)<BR>applied to the outside of the flake or granule, as well as the chemical<BR>composition of the powder itself (all currently used are<BR>Nitrocellulose-based: Cordite hasn't been manufactured in decades, and SNPE<BR>powders were inordinately expensive to produce). Pistol and shotgun powders<BR>are very fast burning: Indeed they share most of the same types of powders<BR>used today. Rifle powders are only rarely used in some high-intensity pistol<BR>cartridges. Again: Shotgun shells produce pressures of 8000-10000 PSI peak,<BR>Handgun Cartridges from 12,000 to 50,000 PSI peak, and Rifle Cartridges from<BR>20,000 to 65,000 PSI peak in commercially loaded ammunition.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Powder charges vary widely based on burning rate, starting combustion<BR>chamber volume, the size and mass of the projectile and the bore length (in<BR>that order). Smokeless powders are designed to burn efficiently under<BR>pressure. The pressure generated by the burning powder starts to drop after<BR>a certain volume is reached, even though the powder may still not be<BR>completely burned. There is a common misconception that once a cartridge is<BR>fired, pressures rise until all of the powder is burned: this is sadly not<BR>the case. Remember that the pressures will rise until the projectile starts<BR>moving down the bore: As long as the rate of expansion of the propellant is<BR>greater than the speed of the projectile, the projectile will be<BR>accelerated. But, as the projectile moves down the bore, the propellant<BR>spends more and more of its potential energy simply MAINTAINING pressure<BR>rather than accelerating the projectile (Boyle's Law). As the propellant is<BR>consumed, and the volume of the gas behind the projectile increases the<BR>amount of additional pressure generated drops off precipitously. Even the<BR>slowest burning powders with the most efficient cartridges generate peak<BR>pressures only 6-12" down the bore. Longer barrels will start producing less<BR>and less of a velocity gain the longer they get to the point of equilibrium,<BR>or even to where the friction of the projectile moving down the bore is<BR>greater then muzzle pressures - too long a barrel and you start to lose<BR>velocity. The kicker is peak pressures: If you could keep the peak pressures<BR>constant for a longer period, dramatically higher velocities could be<BR>achieved: Smokeless powders are formulated as best they can be to do this,<BR>but it is a difficult job for a propellant with a more or less constant<BR>burning rate to do. (Some cannons and recoilless rifles use several<BR>different types of powders bagged sequentially to help with this, though<BR>this uncommon today) Computer-governed ETC/Plasma based propellants promise<BR>a solution to this problem.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Shotguns deliver a fairly large payload at a moderate velocity: Moving a 1<BR>Ounce mass at 1100 to 1300 Feet per second is pretty noteworthy in terms of<BR>recoil. The propellant mass is only about 40 to 50 grains. This 40 to 50<BR>grains of mass is a constant, as is the projectile mass: what is changing<BR>here is the heat of combustion raising pressures and pushing the payload and<BR>the propellant out of the end of the bore due to pressure differences.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; As you pointed out, the gas acts equally on all sides of the combustion<BR>chamber of the cartridge, however, the breech, chamber and barrel are fixed,<BR>and are incapable of moving. That leaves us with the propellant pushing the<BR>projectile down the barrel, but since the pressure is forcing the projectile<BR>in one direction, then the entire weapon must be moved in the equal and<BR>opposite direction as well: this IS recoil. You have figure in the mass of<BR>the projectile. The mass of the propellant is nearly inconsequential when<BR>you figure it out on paper.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; If you hadn't guessed, I'm a professional in this area.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; As mentioned by others, "Ray Guns" are even more limited by their<BR>surroundings than firearms. It's much easier to determine the problem with a<BR>mechanical firearm than with a solid state "Ray Gun" in the field. It is<BR>even more possible to effect repairs the firearm than with the "Ray Gun".<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 03:03:57 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR>One died (Soyuz 1 crew, Vladimir Komarov, Apr. 24, 1967) re-entering the<BR>atmosphere.<BR><BR>Komarov didn't die during re-entry:<BR><BR>His craft started tumbling while in orbit, and nearly all hope was lost of<BR>him regaining control of it, yet he managed to stop the tumble, one axis at<BR>a time. After re-entry, his capsules' parachute failed to properly deploy.<BR>He reported his crafts status and altitude until impact. Remember that the<BR>Soviets drop zones were over land...<BR><BR>Brave people all.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 10:52:48 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy ...<BR><BR>Steven Hudson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;ObTrav: Imagine a glut of mailing-list posts accumulating from 11,000<BR>&gt; &gt;worlds, arriving in one big batch from the latest Xboat :)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; How about "what triggered the Long Night", Alex?<BR><BR>Imagine what would happen if the number of new posts every week is<BR>higher than what the X-boats can ship away. That would crash the<BR>system...<BR><BR>Flame War, anyone?&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 22:22:11 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; I've a quick question,<BR>&gt; Has anyone a suggestion for a reasonably easy to access list<BR>&gt; of star types? I've collected a few descriptions and notes for<BR>&gt; my own use, but a more complete list would be helpful<BR><BR>It depends on what you mean by "star type". <BR><BR>But just about any "intro to astronomy" textbook will have most of the info.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 23:08:31 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Who do I hire to terraform this place?<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Are there any references in canon to megacorporations that are interested in <BR>&gt; terraforming in and around 1115-1120? I'm in need of a likely organization <BR>&gt; that would be engaged in cutting edge research in the field.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'll invent a connection of my own if I have to, but it's so much more fun <BR>&gt; to loop back on what has gone before, if possible!<BR><BR>Keep in mind that terraforming is a process that'll take *generations*.<BR>More likely centuries to millenia.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 11:11:07 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: de-canonized material<BR><BR>J. Paul Sanders wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;&nbsp; About 6 months ago I saw an alleged internal GDW&nbsp; email&nbsp; sent&nbsp; at<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;&nbsp; the time Atlas Of The Imperium was published.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;I'd be interested to know the source of this "alleged <BR>&gt; internal e-mail."<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;LKW<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Actually, Peter mis-spoke - it wasn't an email, but rather an<BR>&gt; internal GDW memo... I have it sitting right here in front of<BR>&gt; me... as for how I came by it - Marc sent it to me several years<BR>&gt; ago along with a lot of other 'freebie' items when he was filling<BR>&gt; an order. I've typed in the text below - for those who would like<BR>&gt; to view the memo, send me an email off the list and I will attach<BR>&gt; a scan of it.<BR><BR>Ah, yes, that was it.&nbsp; I knew I saw something about half&nbsp; a&nbsp; year<BR>ago ... and with my&nbsp; swiss-cheese&nbsp; memory&nbsp; I'm&nbsp; lucky&nbsp; if&nbsp; I&nbsp; can<BR>remember last week!<BR><BR>However, how I came to see it I do not recall ... except&nbsp; what&nbsp; I<BR>saw was an electronic document not a hardcopy or&nbsp; scan.&nbsp; Hmmm,&nbsp; I<BR>have a hard disk on my PC at home that is&nbsp; little&nbsp; more&nbsp; than&nbsp; an<BR>electronic skip filled with all sorts of junk&nbsp; ...&nbsp; I'll&nbsp; have&nbsp; a<BR>look tonight.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 11:13:13 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>Cliff Linehan wrote:<BR>&gt; You are welcome to review mine if you wish.<BR>&gt; http://herons-reach.homepage.com/traveller<BR><BR>Okay, it shall be done.&nbsp; Watch this space.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 11:49:33 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: [Website Review] The Imperial Marshal Campaign<BR><BR>The Traveller Website Review<BR>- ----------------------------<BR><BR>Closing my eyes and&nbsp; picking&nbsp; a&nbsp; site&nbsp; at&nbsp; random&nbsp; from&nbsp; dmoz.org<BR>brings up ...<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Arcturus Rising: The Imperial Marshal Campaign<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (http://home.nc.rr.com/lachance/Marshal.htm)<BR><BR>This website supports a Traveller PBeM.&nbsp; Set in the time&nbsp; of&nbsp; the<BR>Restored Third Imperium (year 1354) the characters are "marshals"<BR>working for the MoJ.&nbsp; In this time the R3I is about half the size<BR>of the original 3I, loosing much territory rimward and&nbsp; trailing,<BR>but extending further spinward.&nbsp; The campaign is based in the R3I<BR>border in the Massilia sector.&nbsp; The 3 PCs and 5 NPCs have a&nbsp; TL18<BR>(yup 18!) 300 dton far courier ship.<BR><BR>Okay, so what's it all like?&nbsp; Well the text is *tiny* verging&nbsp; on<BR>unreadable, and some of the graphics&nbsp; could&nbsp; benefit&nbsp; from&nbsp; anti-<BR>aliasing, but this is&nbsp; a&nbsp; review&nbsp; of&nbsp; Traveller&nbsp; not&nbsp; webweaving.<BR>Simple deckplans of the ship are provided, as is&nbsp; a&nbsp; ship&nbsp; design<BR>spreadsheet (in WKS format).&nbsp; There are 8 major characters and 16<BR>minor characters, a score of worlds are presented&nbsp; (with&nbsp; capsule<BR>descriptions),&nbsp; a&nbsp; dozen&nbsp; TNS&nbsp; headlines,&nbsp; and&nbsp;&nbsp; assorted&nbsp;&nbsp; other<BR>material.<BR><BR>Obveiously a site ment to&nbsp; support&nbsp; a&nbsp; specific&nbsp; game&nbsp; will&nbsp; have<BR>limited generic functionality, but there are some useful tidbits.<BR>The 1354 milieu draws a line under the less&nbsp; than&nbsp; popular&nbsp; Virus<BR>period and extends&nbsp; the&nbsp; timeline&nbsp; forward&nbsp; of&nbsp; that&nbsp; point.&nbsp; The<BR>setting allows&nbsp; for&nbsp; the&nbsp; 3I&nbsp; to&nbsp; coexist&nbsp; with&nbsp; the&nbsp; Reformation<BR>Coalition ... and thus reunites both TNE and&nbsp; non-TNE&nbsp; fans.&nbsp; And<BR>the players as Imperial Marshals idea has potential either as the<BR>focus of a campaign (as it is used here) or as&nbsp; a&nbsp; stick&nbsp; to&nbsp; use<BR>against recalcitrant players.&nbsp; (Having another branch of the&nbsp; MoJ<BR>besides FASA's Special Branch also makes the MoJ more rounded.)<BR><BR>There are two graphics&nbsp; of&nbsp; note:&nbsp; on&nbsp; the&nbsp; Characters&nbsp; page&nbsp; the<BR>picture of the Vargr is mildly amusing, and the R3I Emperor looks<BR>remarkably like Yul Brinner!<BR><BR>In summary: the 1354 milieu is an interesting one,&nbsp; the&nbsp; Imperial<BR>Marshals are useful to any 3I-based&nbsp; campaign,&nbsp; and&nbsp; there&nbsp; is&nbsp; a<BR>collection of worlds and NPCs.&nbsp; Beyond that there is little&nbsp; else<BR>for visitors who are not part of the Arcturus Rising PBeM.<BR><BR>Improvements: to bring the milieu to life the&nbsp; TNS&nbsp; entries&nbsp; need<BR>some serious fleshing out.&nbsp; More recent events type background is<BR>needed.&nbsp;&nbsp; Matching&nbsp; the&nbsp; character&nbsp; pictures&nbsp; to&nbsp; the&nbsp;&nbsp; character<BR>descriptions would also be good.&nbsp; More info&nbsp; on&nbsp; the&nbsp; MoJ&nbsp; senior<BR>officers (the PC's bosses) and on the local villains and opposing<BR>forces is also a must for the&nbsp; non-PBeM&nbsp; visitor&nbsp; ...&nbsp; but&nbsp; maybe<BR>revealing that info is not appropriate for the PBeM visitor.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yd04.mx.aol.com (rly-yd04.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.4]) by air-yd01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 06:54:20 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yd04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 06:53:20 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id GAA78011;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 06:52:42 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 31 Jan 2001 06:52:13 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id GAA77956<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 06:52:13 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 06:52:13 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101311152.GAA77956@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background="" bgColor=#3dffff><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3579</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/31/01 8:28:12 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; Wednesday, January 31 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3579<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Landgrabs<BR>RE: Rockhead webring?<BR>RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR>Landgrab<BR>Re: Who do I hire to terraform this place?<BR>RE: TNE<BR>Re: Subject:TNE<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons (rebuttal - long)<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Help please!<BR>RE: Challenger Aniversary<BR>Re: Need advice...<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 11:54:13 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Landgrabs<BR><BR>I notice that the TML Landgrab page&nbsp; (at&nbsp; downport.com)&nbsp; has&nbsp; not<BR>been maintained&nbsp; for&nbsp; awhile&nbsp; despite&nbsp; there&nbsp; being&nbsp; some&nbsp; recent<BR>changes.&nbsp; What gives?&nbsp; Is the 'Claims Officer' on this list?<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 12:29:31 -0000<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Rockhead webring?<BR><BR>Bernie McGeehan wrote:<BR>&gt; Is there a rockhead or Landgrab webring?<BR><BR>There is a Landgrab page (on&nbsp; downport.com).&nbsp; It&nbsp; lists&nbsp; all&nbsp; the<BR>claims and, for those completed, has links to the authors'&nbsp; site.<BR>In cases where an author doesn't have a site then the write-up is<BR>hosted at downport itself (and there is a link there instead).<BR><BR>However, the list is a few months behind on its updates.<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 12:43:28 -0000<BR>From: Matt Bond &lt;MBOND@karpad.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Now here is a question that would bake your noodle.&nbsp; Drop <BR>&gt; yourself in<BR>&gt; &gt; Revolutionary America, with the plans for a Ford Mustang.&nbsp; <BR>&gt; Can you build it?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Not a chance. You'd need to *invent* precision machining (which is one<BR>&gt; of the reasons that Babbage (who was working more than 50 years later)<BR>&gt; couldn't get his difference engine built.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; You'd need to invent a way to create various alloys. And build a<BR>&gt; complete steel mill, including the rolling mill to produce the sheet<BR>&gt; metal. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; - -- <BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR><BR>You couldn't build a Ford Mustang, but you could 'uplift' the<BR>revolutionary Americans. Assuming you had the knowledge in question, and<BR>some financial backing. Within 10 years I would imagine they could have<BR>reached mid 19C tech, another 10 to get early 20C and another 10 to get<BR>to mid 20C.<BR><BR>So by the end of ~30 years (say 1810) you could have your Mustang. And<BR>the US could have Tanks, Jets, Computers, and maybe even nuclear<BR>power...<BR><BR>You just have to concentrate on 'enabling' technologies, those that let<BR>you build better tools to build better enabling technologies etc...<BR><BR>But anything in general production before ~1970 (ie before microchips<BR>were stuffed into everything...) should be relatively straightforward to<BR>recreate, once you have the appropriate tools and materials.<BR><BR>So basically you need to end up in Revolutionary America with the latest<BR>Encyclopaedia Britannica as well as (or instead of) your Mustang<BR>Blueprints.<BR><BR>Matt<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 07:40:16 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Landgrab<BR><BR>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C08B59.0DCF1800<BR>Content-Type: text/plain;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="Windows-1252"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>Howdy, partners!<BR><BR>I'm interested in grabbing a system - as long as it doesn't appear in =<BR>the Landgrab list it's fair game?&nbsp; How do I get my claim on said list?<BR><BR>2733 Edenelt/Trin A-4638BD-B will do quite nicely.<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C08B59.0DCF1800<BR>Content-Type: text/html;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="Windows-1252"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>&lt;!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"&gt;<BR>&lt;HEAD&gt;<BR>&lt;META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-1252" =<BR>http-equiv=3DContent-Type&gt;<BR>&lt;META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2014.210" name=3DGENERATOR&gt;<BR>&lt;STYLE&gt;&lt;/STYLE&gt;<BR>&lt;/HEAD&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT size=3>Howdy, partners!</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT size=3>I'm interested in grabbing a system - as long as it =<BR>doesn't=20<BR>appear in the Landgrab list it's fair game?&amp;nbsp; How do I get&amp;nbsp;my =<BR>claim on=20<BR>said list?</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT size=3>2733 Edenelt/Trin A-4638BD-B will do quite=20<BR>nicely.</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C08B59.0DCF1800--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 08:08:25 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Who do I hire to terraform this place?<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;Are there any references in canon to megacorporations that are interested <BR>&gt;&gt;in terraforming in and around 1115-1120? I'm in need of a likely <BR>&gt;&gt;organization that would be engaged in cutting edge research in the field.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Keep in mind that terraforming is a process that'll take *generations*.<BR>&gt;More likely centuries to millenia.<BR><BR>Meaning what, that a private concern wouldn't be interested in it? There are <BR>endless possibilities for turning a profit along the way.<BR><BR>"I'll put a comet in planetary orbit for MCr 1.2"<BR><BR>"This genetically modified grass will grow at the temperatures of your <BR>equatorial zone. Want to buy it?"<BR><BR>"This software will let you model your weather, and adapt as water vapour <BR>starts to appear in the air for the first time in geologic history. Only <BR>Cr4450, on special!"<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 13:10:49 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: TNE<BR><BR>There is some references to the Longbow site in GT as mentioned in the GT <BR>main book...there isn't much though..I think Loren wants to develop it more <BR>:)<BR>Maybe the Empress Wave hits the Zhos in GT and the Imperials know about <BR>it..but I seriously doubt that the virus is part of the GT future...As was <BR>mentioned in Rim of Fire...<BR><BR>Just my two credits worth...<BR><BR>Mike<BR><BR><BR>- ----Original Message Follows----<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: TNE<BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 02:13:04 -0600<BR><BR>Hi Loren,<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Does this mean that there is possibility that TNE storyline will continue<BR>at some point?&nbsp; I too am a TNE fan...and would love to see more done with<BR>that timeline.<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 13:40:56 +0000<BR>From: Rob Myers &lt;robm@onetel.net.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Subject:TNE<BR><BR>The setting and system are great (I flicked through a copy at the BITS stand at Dragonmeet), they just aren't Traveller in spirit. It's not Galactica 1980, but it does feel like an exploitation sequel. It's like 2300AD had Hard Times following the Kafer War. Now there's a thought...<BR><BR>- - Rob.<BR><BR>On Wednesday, January 31, 2001, at 03:56 AM, Don Roberts wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I know that I am going to probably start a storm of <BR>&gt; controversy here, but I am rather fond of the TNE <BR>&gt; setting for Traveller.&nbsp; I think the setting was well <BR>&gt; thought out and reflected an imaginatively fresh way <BR>&gt; of looking at the traveller universe.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 08:53:21 -0500 (EST)<BR>From: Michael Houghton &lt;herveus@Radix.Net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>Howdy!<BR><BR>[snip]<BR>&gt; Again, I think a "universal" use of firearms is a dubious vision of the<BR>&gt; future. By the time enough technology is employed to make firearms<BR>&gt; dependable in any environment in which they might find themselves deployed,<BR>&gt; the cost of the weapon would become prohibitively high and the MTBF (Mean<BR>&gt; Time Between Failures) would be prohibitively low. There go the advantages<BR>&gt; of cheap, easy to fabricate, and dependable.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; No, I think that high technology armies would use direct energy weapons<BR>&gt; simply because they can be used in any environment. Look at it this way: I<BR>&gt; could choose to zap my opponent with my trusty ray gun or I can choose to<BR>&gt; take one step up from throwing rocks and chose to fling little bits of metal<BR>&gt; at him. Hummm.... That's a tough one....<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Low technologies will use firearms...but they aren't going very far from<BR>&gt; home anyway.<BR>&gt; <BR>In the LBBs, there is a short treatise on "why slug throwers will be the<BR>primary weapon on the battlefield". In a nutshell, in order to incapacitate<BR>a target, one must deliver a suitably concentrated dose of energy to the<BR>target. The kinetic energy carried by slugs is very reliable at the small<BR>end, with explosive shells filling at larger shell sizes. Directed energy<BR>weapons (laser, plasma, Bob Meson's ray gun, etc.) all face serious<BR>limitations in a battlefield environment. Thus was explained why CT did <BR>not have hand blasters, or why the laser rifle was not the hottest stick<BR>in town.<BR><BR>yours,<BR>Michael<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Michael and MJ Houghton&nbsp;&nbsp; | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly<BR>herveus@radix.net&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | White Wolf and the Phoenix<BR>Bowie, MD, USA&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 07:11:15 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>on 1/29/01 3:52 PM, Ray Rangel at ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; To be sure, the discussion has been interesting. However there are some<BR>&gt; misconceptions about what recoil (reaction) is. Recoil is not caused by the<BR>&gt; slug. Envision the cartridge as a rocket engine.<BR><BR>Ah, but the projectile does effect recoil.&nbsp; Newton's law and all that.&nbsp; The<BR>propellant byproducts are merely a multitude of very small projectiles at a<BR>very high velocity.<BR><BR>Any good book on ballistics will give you the formula to calculate free<BR>recoil:<BR><BR>MG*VG=MC*C+MB*BV<BR><BR>where:<BR>MG is the mass of the gun<BR>VG is the velocity of the gun<BR>MC is the mass of the powder charge<BR>C is the&nbsp; velocity of the powder charge<BR>MB is the mass of the bullet<BR>BV is the velocity of the bullet<BR><BR>C is generally given to be 4000 f/s based on test and convention<BR><BR>Free recoil is the energy developed and used in the gun itself, without<BR>adding any external factors.<BR><BR>VG=32.17 * I/W<BR><BR>where:<BR>VG is free velocity in fps<BR>I is the recoil in in fps<BR>W is the weight of the gun in lbs<BR><BR>I is obtained from <BR>I= bw*bv + cw*c<BR><BR>where :<BR>bw is the bullet weight in grains<BR>bv is the bullet velocity in fps<BR>cw is the&nbsp; propellant charge in grains<BR>c is the propellant charge constant (4000 fps)<BR><BR>thus RE= W*VG^2/64.348<BR><BR>(Recoil energy in foot-lbs)<BR><BR>Sorry for the lack of metrics.&nbsp; Ballistics books tend to use English<BR>measures.&nbsp; In any case, from the above, it should be obvious that in a<BR>typical firearm, the expanding propellant gases for only a percentage of the<BR>recoil.&nbsp; This is why loading lighter bullets in a given caliber reduces<BR>recoil.<BR><BR>&gt; Thank you Sir Newton. This, by the way is why a present day "recoil-less"<BR>&gt; rifle works. Some of the gases are allowed to escape at the breech thus<BR>&gt; reducing the delta in pressure and thus reducing the recoil.<BR><BR>No, a large amount of high velocity gas is expelled in the opposite<BR>direction of the projectile.&nbsp; RCL guns typically have very high masses of<BR>propellant in relation to their projectile so that they can generate enough<BR>momentum to overcome that caused by the ejected projectile.<BR><BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 07:27:13 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons (rebuttal - long)<BR><BR>on 1/31/01 12:57 AM, Matthew W. Helton at mwhelton@cox-internet.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Ray,<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I understand your arguments. However, point by point, here we go.<BR>&gt; Recoilless rifles either vent some or nearly all of their propellant gasses<BR>&gt; (There is one that moves a countermass as wel)l. The fact that all of the<BR>&gt; projectile thrust does not bear on any fixed portion of the weapon is what<BR>&gt; makes them "recoilless". Fire an RPG-7 or an Armbrust Antitank weapon and<BR>&gt; see if it is actually "recoilless" They are not, and they have quite a bit<BR>&gt; more recoil than you might otherwise assume.<BR><BR>&lt;minor nit&gt;<BR><BR>The RPG is not a true recoiless weapon by design.&nbsp; It uses a small charge to<BR>propel the rocket a safe distance from the firer before the rocket motor<BR>ignites.&nbsp; The German Armbrust, on the other hand uses the countermass<BR>priciple.&nbsp; The projectile is expelled at the target, while an equal mass of<BR>compressed plastic flakes is expelled rearward, cancelling the momentum<BR>generated by the projectile.&nbsp; All propellant gasses are trapped in a steel<BR>envelope within the body of the launcher.&nbsp; The ejected countermass begins to<BR>break up immediatly in exit, and is 'safe' approximately 3 meters from the<BR>rear of the tube.<BR><BR>&lt;/minor nit&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; The Bore of weapon does not determine the rate of expansion of the<BR>[snip a bunch of great stuff]<BR>&gt; you figure it out on paper.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 07:42:39 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>on 1/31/01 5:53 AM, Michael Houghton at herveus@Radix.Net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; In the LBBs, there is a short treatise on "why slug throwers will be the<BR>&gt; primary weapon on the battlefield". In a nutshell, in order to incapacitate<BR>&gt; a target, one must deliver a suitably concentrated dose of energy to the<BR>&gt; target. The kinetic energy carried by slugs is very reliable at the small<BR>&gt; end, with explosive shells filling at larger shell sizes. Directed energy<BR>&gt; weapons (laser, plasma, Bob Meson's ray gun, etc.) all face serious<BR>&gt; limitations in a battlefield environment. Thus was explained why CT did<BR>&gt; not have hand blasters, or why the laser rifle was not the hottest stick<BR>&gt; in town.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>There is a reason that the 'hand gonne' has remained in in service for<BR>several hundred years, despite competition.&nbsp; The long bow remained a more<BR>accurate long range weapon with a higher rate of fire past the Napoleonic<BR>wars, but the gun was simpler to operate and train a soldier to use.<BR>Current, high tech weapons like the ACR (the real one, not the Traveller<BR>weapon) gave only marginally better performance over existing weapons at a<BR>higher cost.&nbsp; The OICW is expected to cost tens of thousands of dollars, and<BR>even mass production will only bring this down into the thousands, while the<BR>typical assault rifle can be mass produced for under $100 per unit.<BR><BR>Some very minor refinements in human interface design, sighting systems and<BR>ammunition are probably the only feature we will see change in firearms<BR>through the 21st century. Hypervelocity ammunition is probably coming soon.<BR>Flechette technology hasn't been there up to now, but new manufacturing<BR>technologies may make them cost effective.<BR><BR>Drive a flechette at over the magic 1450 meters/s (the speed of sound in<BR>tissue) and you can a huge leap in lethality.&nbsp; Plus the high velocity<BR>flechette has a nearly flat ballistic arc at combat ranges, meaning no need<BR>to compensate for range.<BR><BR>And finally, in a military sense, small arms are a negligible part of the<BR>whole military combat system.&nbsp; Why carry a complex blaster, when a cheap<BR>targeting laser slaved to remote or orbital weapons is available.<BR><BR>The most dangerous man on the modern battlefield is not the one with the<BR>nastiest weapon.&nbsp; He's the one carrying the big radio.<BR><BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 08:15:51 -0800<BR>From: "J A \(Jim\) Cooper" &lt;tloql@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Help please!<BR><BR>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0105_01C08B5E.0679B4C0<BR>Content-Type: text/plain;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>Hi guys,<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I would like to contact Russell Borns????? (sorry, can't remember =<BR>how to spell the last name) with regards to his Youth Schooling program, =<BR>ages 0 to 17~22. I had a copy of same but lost it to the *VIRUS* and =<BR>would like to get another copy to play with. I thought I had originally =<BR>downloaded it from Freelance Traveller - 'Doing it my way', but in =<BR>querying it, I guess I got it elsewhere. The program included 6 class =<BR>levels that one could attend, such as 'Geeks &amp; Hackers'. If anyone can =<BR>give me an e-mail address or web sight to go to, or if Russell is still =<BR>on line would he contact me at:<BR>tloql@home.com=20<BR><BR>Thanks much,<BR><BR>Jim Cooper<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0105_01C08B5E.0679B4C0<BR>Content-Type: text/html;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>&lt;!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"&gt;<BR>&lt;HEAD&gt;<BR>&lt;META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =<BR>charset=3Diso-8859-1"&gt;<BR>&lt;META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4611.1300" name=3DGENERATOR&gt;<BR>&lt;STYLE&gt;&lt;/STYLE&gt;<BR>&lt;/HEAD&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face=3DArial size=3>Hi guys,</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face=3DArial size=3></FONT>&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face=3DArial size=3>&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; I would like to =<BR>contact Russell=20<BR>Borns????? (sorry, can't remember how to spell the last name) with =<BR>regards to=20<BR>his Youth Schooling program, ages 0 to 17~22. I had a copy of same but =<BR>lost it=20<BR>to the *VIRUS* and would like to get another copy to play with. I =<BR>thought I had=20<BR>originally downloaded it from Freelance Traveller - 'Doing it my way', =<BR>but in=20<BR>querying it, I guess I got it elsewhere.&amp;nbsp;The program included 6 =<BR>class=20<BR>levels that one could attend, such as 'Geeks &amp;amp; Hackers'. If anyone =<BR>can give=20<BR>me an e-mail address or web sight to go to, or if =<BR>Russell&amp;nbsp;is&amp;nbsp;still on=20<BR>line would he contact me at:</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face=3DArial size=3>&lt;A=20<BR>href=3D"mailto:tloql@home.com"&gt;tloql@home.com</A></FONT>&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face=3DArial size=3></FONT>&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face=3DArial size=3>Thanks much,</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face=3DArial size=3></FONT>&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face=3DArial size=3>Jim Cooper</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0105_01C08B5E.0679B4C0--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 08:24:09 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR>was C.C. Williams the one schedualed to be the LEM pilot on Apollo 12?<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Gordon Hundley [mailto:gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk]<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 8:56 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR><BR>on 30/1/01 11:40 pm, Leonard Erickson at shadow@krypton.rain.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; And we shouldn't forget Soyuz 1 and Soyuz 11 (anybody have the dates<BR>&gt; for those?)<BR><BR>24th April, 1967 and 29th June, 1971.<BR><BR>&gt; So far we've lost 14 people on the road to space.<BR><BR>Well, that depends on how you're counting. I think there are more people who<BR>have died trying to get there than that:<BR><BR>One died (Valentin Bondarenko, Mar. 23, 1961) in an oxygen fire, his death<BR>was not made public until 1986.<BR><BR>One died (Theodore C. Freeman, Oct. 31, 1964) in a training crash.<BR><BR>Two died (Gemini 9 crew: Elliot See and Charlie Bassett, February 28, 1966)<BR>in a transit flight between bases, when See misjudged landing and hit<BR>assembly building 101.<BR><BR>Three died (Apollo 1 crew, Roger B. Chaffee, Virgil "Gus" Grissom, Edward H.<BR>White II, Jan. 27, 1967) in an oxygen fire.<BR><BR>One died (Soyuz 1 crew, Vladimir Komarov, Apr. 24, 1967) re-entering the<BR>atmosphere.<BR><BR>One died (Edward Givens, Jun 6, 1967) in a car crash.<BR><BR>One died (Clifton C. Williams Jr., Oct. 5, 1967) in a T38 training crash.<BR><BR>One died (Robert H. Lawrence, Dec. 8, 1967) in an F104 training crash - the<BR>first black US astronaut - only recently recognised as such.<BR><BR>One died (Major Yuri Gagarin, Mar. 27, 1968) training for his next flight.<BR><BR>One died (Pavel Belyayev, Jan. 10, 1970) during a surgical operation.<BR><BR>Three died (Soyuz 11 crew, Georgi Dobrovolsky, Viktor Patsayev, Vladislaw<BR>Volkov, Jun. 29, 1971) of asphyxiation.<BR><BR>Which makes 16 - <BR><BR>The Apollo 15 crew left a plaque and tin sculpture of the fallen astronaut:<BR><BR>http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/pao/History/alsj/a15/as15-88-11894.jpg<BR><BR>The names being:<BR><BR>Theodore Freeman (Oct. 1964, aircraft accident)<BR>Charles Bassett (Feb. 1966, aircraft accident)<BR>Elliot See (Feb. 1966, aircraft accident)<BR>Edward Givens (1967, automobile accident)<BR>Roger Chaffee (Jan. 1967, Apollo 1 fire)<BR>Gus Grissom (Jan. 1967, Apollo 1 fire)<BR>Edward White (Jan. 1967, Apollo 1 fire)<BR>Vladimir Komarov (Apr. 1967, re-entry parachute failure)<BR>C.C. Williams (Oct. 1967, aircraft accident)<BR>Yuri Gagarin (Mar 1968, aircraft accident)<BR>Pavel Belyayev (Jan. 1970, disease)<BR>Viktor Patsayev (Jun. 1971, re-entry pressurization failure)<BR>Vladislaw Volkov (Jun. 1971, re-entry pressurization failure)<BR>Georgi Dobrovolsky (Jun. 1971 re-entry pressurization failure)<BR><BR>And then the unthinkable:<BR><BR>Seven died (Challenger, STS 51-L crew Christa McAuliffe, Gregory B. Jarvis,<BR>Ronald E. McNair, Ellison S. Onizuka, Judith A. Resnik, Francis "Dick"<BR>Scobee, Michael J. Smith, Jan. 28, 1986) during lift-off.<BR><BR>One more that made it to the memorial mirror outside KSC:<BR><BR>One died (Manley L. "Sonny" Carter, April 5, 1991) in a commercial aircraft<BR>flight.<BR><BR>For a total of 24 named fallen astronauts. I believe that there may have<BR>been another three cosmonauts who have yet to be officially recognised, and<BR>at least another two astronauts who were killed during training - yet to<BR>become astronauts but selected. :(<BR><BR>Sorry this took so long to compile - most of my records are on dead tree<BR>matter.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 10:23:53 -0600<BR>From: Kenneth Bearden -- Walker Jane Productions &lt;dreamer@brokersys.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Need advice...<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; What is KB3? and where can i get a copy of this to look at?<BR><BR>KB3 is my Traveller task system.&nbsp; Here are the notes I posted on the experience<BR>system (you can use the ideas with whatever task system you are currently<BR>using--just modify the rolls).<BR><BR>These are the rough thoughts on the experience system as I have not yet<BR>finalized it.&nbsp; I'll probably write up a shorter, more clear and concise set of<BR>rules at that time.<BR><BR>- ----------<BR><BR><BR>I designed the KB3 Experience System today.&nbsp; It's becoming a fully<BR>fledged system with all the bells and whistles.<BR><BR>Here's the brush strokes (non-finalized, non-playtested version of the<BR>experience rules--just the idea):<BR><BR><BR>(1)&nbsp; At the end of each gaming session, the GM will award experience<BR>points to the players for their PCs.&nbsp; These points will allow players to<BR>grow and expand their characters.&nbsp; The system is designed to reflect<BR>character growth based on standard T4/MT/CT character generation<BR>(meaning that the system will improve your character slowly--1 skill<BR>level per game year for a character that does not adventure that often,<BR>more points for characters who are placed in adventure situations more<BR>often).<BR><BR>(2)&nbsp; The award is typically one point, and a tally of points is kept<BR>next to the appropriate skill.&nbsp; GMs should award points to skills used<BR>during the night's gaming session that "had an impact" on the game.<BR>(ie&nbsp; I wouldn't give a PC a point for every skill he threw on during the<BR>session, but I would give the PC a point for those skills that had some<BR>sort of dramatic effect on the gaming session.)<BR><BR>(3)&nbsp; Awarding experience shouldn't be a big production--simply award one<BR>point to each skill that was used "in an important manner" during the<BR>game.&nbsp;&nbsp; Players simply make a mark on their character sheets to keep<BR>track of points.&nbsp; The awarding of experience at the end of the night<BR>should be a time the players enjoy--when they can look back on the game<BR>and be rewarded for the things that they attempted.&nbsp; The roll in<BR>question did not have to be a successful one--at the GM's option.&nbsp; As<BR>long as the roll was dramatic, and the GM deems the PC "learned<BR>something" from his skill roll attempt, an experience point can be<BR>awarded.<BR><BR>(4)&nbsp; GM's can award discretionary points too--for great ideas during the<BR>game or fantastic role playing.&nbsp; Since no roll is involved with these<BR>points, players can use these points whereever they want--grooming their<BR>characters in the direction they want them to go.<BR><BR>(5)&nbsp; Points can also be awarded for skills the PC does not have (this is<BR>how he learns new skills through experience) and for attributes (to<BR>improve STR, DEX, etc).&nbsp; When a PC earns experience points for a skill<BR>he does not have, simply write the skill on the character's sheet (in<BR>his skill list), but write the skill in parenthesis (the parenthesis<BR>will indicate that the character does not yet have the skill).<BR>Attributes are done the same way:&nbsp; for example (Dexterity) may be<BR>written on the character's skill list on his sheet, indicating that the<BR>PC has earned experience points for that attribute (you can only earn<BR>attribute experience points through attribute checks or by placing<BR>discretionary points toward the attribute).<BR><BR>(6)&nbsp; At the beginning of game sessions (or at the end of sessions after<BR>experience is awarded), the GM will allow players to roll to see if<BR>skill improvement has occurred.&nbsp; This is a skill throw, so players use<BR>whatever skill they are trying to improve (if you are learning a new<BR>skill, then you throw 1D).&nbsp; That throw is made against a difficulty<BR>throw based on the skill level you are trying to attempt (ie&nbsp; if you<BR>have Pistol-0 and you are trying to gain Pistol-1, then you will throw<BR>1D versus 2D).&nbsp; This is a skill throw, so the player may use KB3 skill<BR>options if he wishes.<BR><BR>(7)&nbsp; In order to improve your skill (or gain a new skill) through<BR>experience, the roll has to be successful as a Greater Success<BR>throw--all other results are failures.&nbsp; Use the stat most appropriate to<BR>govern the throw (ie, the GM may decide that Int is the appropriate stat<BR>for Pistol to be improved instead of Dex).<BR><BR>(8)&nbsp; Skill improvement attempts may be made on any skill that has enough<BR>prerequisite points.&nbsp; You have to have a number of points equal to your<BR>new skill level in order to attempt skill improvement (if you have<BR>Pistol-0, and you are attempting to gain Pistol-1, then you have to have<BR>1 experience point to attempt the improvement throw).&nbsp; If you do not<BR>succeed on your improvement throw, you loose 1 experience point for the<BR>attempt (it's the cost of trying).&nbsp; If a PC has more than the<BR>prerequisite points needed to attempt an improvement throw, then these<BR>extra points may be used like skill options (you can use them to lower<BR>your target number or improve your stat for measuring purposes).&nbsp; Any<BR>experience points used as skill options are lost after the throw is<BR>completed, whether successful or not.<BR><BR>(9)&nbsp; If a character's total skill levels is higher than his Int+Edu, but<BR>lower than double this amount, double the prerequisite points and doulbe<BR>the penalty for a non-successful throw.&nbsp; If the character's total skill<BR>levels are higher than 2 x Int+Edu, but lower than 3 x Int+Edu, then<BR>triple the prerequisite and penalty points, etc.<BR><BR>(10)&nbsp; If a skill improvement roll is successful, all experience points<BR>are lost (you've got to start with a clean slate at the next level).<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>How does all this play out?<BR><BR>Here's an example of the experience point system in action......<BR><BR><BR><BR>THE GAME SESSION:<BR><BR>Ted the PC has Pistol-0, and during the night's gaming session, he makes<BR>a spectacular shot with his pistol.&nbsp; It was a great moment in the game,<BR>and the player is pleased.<BR><BR><BR>EXPERIENCE POINT AWARDS:<BR><BR>After the game session is over, the GM awards Ted for making that shot.<BR>Ted is given 1 experience point, and the player marks this point on<BR>Ted's sheet, right next to his Pistol-0 skill.&nbsp; Ted already had 1 point<BR>of experience on that skill from&nbsp; previous game sessions, so now it<BR>totals 2.<BR><BR>The player running Ted also did a superb job role playing that evening,<BR>and the GM recognized this.&nbsp; As a reward for great play, the GM awards<BR>Ted a discretionary point for the outstanding role playing.<BR><BR>This discretionary point can be put on Ted's sheet where ever the player<BR>wishes--allowing the player to guide his character's growth.&nbsp; The player<BR>really wants Ted to improve his Pistol skill, so he puts it there.&nbsp; Ted<BR>ends the game session with 3 experience points on his Pistol skill.<BR><BR><BR>THE IMPROVEMENT THROW:<BR><BR>The GM always allows improvement throws before the beginning of the next<BR>game session, and the player running Ted has decided to give his Pistol<BR>skill a try (he could wait and try to rack up some more experience<BR>points if he wanted to).<BR><BR>Ted has Int 7, Edu 6, so he uses a total of 13 points to measure his<BR>prerequisites.&nbsp; Adding up all of Ted's skills, the player sees that Ted<BR>is just over this limit with total skills of 14 levels.&nbsp; That means<BR>that, in order to earn an improvement throw for his Pistol skill, Ted<BR>needs 2 points (It normally takes 1 point to attempt a throw on a level<BR>1 skill, but this is doubled because of Ted's total skill levels--that's<BR>2 points.&nbsp; And, those same 2 points are needed--again it is doubled--in<BR>case the throw is a failure).&nbsp; The player looks down at Ted's skill and<BR>sees that Pistol has racked up 3 experience points for last night's game<BR>session and previous game sessions.&nbsp; He's got what he needs to make an<BR>attempt.<BR><BR>The player running Ted throws 1D.&nbsp; 2 of his 3 experience points are used<BR>as the prerequisite points, and these same 2 points can be used in case<BR>of failure.&nbsp; 1 experience point is left over.&nbsp; Ted decides to use this<BR>point to his advantage, and he can use it to either reduce his target<BR>number or raise his stat for measuring purposes.<BR><BR>The GM states that either Dex or Int can be used to measure the<BR>throw--at the player's option.&nbsp; Ted uses his Int since it his higher<BR>than his Dex-5.&nbsp; And, since success on an improvement throw only occurs<BR>when Greater Success is thrown, the player decides to use his extra<BR>point increase his Int from 7 to 8 for measuring purposes.<BR><BR>Ted is attempting to attain Pistol-1, so the GM will throw 2D for<BR>difficulty.<BR><BR>The player running Ted throws 1D vs 2D.&nbsp; The player rolls a "6", and<BR>since this is the E-Die, that total is doubled to 12.&nbsp; The difficulty<BR>throw results in a 7, with nither a "1" nor a "6" on the E-Die.<BR><BR>Normally, the player would have succeeded on this throw with a Regular<BR>Success (the "7" difficulty is measured with the modified Int of 8), but<BR>a Greater Success is needed to succeed on an improvement throw.<BR><BR>Ted's Pistol skill is not improved this time.&nbsp; The player can try again<BR>when he has enough experience points to do so.<BR><BR>Ted would usually loose 1 point for the attempt, but 2 points are lost<BR>because of the "doubling" effect caused by his total skill levels being<BR>higher than the total of his Int+Edu.&nbsp; And, any experience points used<BR>as skill options are lost after the attempt, so Ted looses a third<BR>point.<BR><BR>The game session starts, and Ted moves into the game with his skill<BR>remaining at Pistol-0 and no experience points next to the skill.&nbsp; Ted<BR>will have to rack up some more points (at least 2) before he can make<BR>the attempt at improvement again.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>EXPERIENCE SYSTEM NOTES:<BR><BR>(A)&nbsp; If Ted would have made that improvement roll with a Greater<BR>Success--say he rolled total of 5 versus a difficulty throw of 4<BR>(Greater Success occurs because the roll beat the difficulty throw but<BR>was under the governing stat)--then Ted would have started the game with<BR>Pistol-1 and no experience points (because you loose all experience<BR>points when you go up a level--starting at the new level with a clean<BR>slate).<BR><BR><BR><BR>(B)&nbsp; I haven't quite worked out how I'm going to throw for attribute<BR>improvement, but it will be some sort of attribute check with the<BR>prerequiste points being equal to the level of the stat (you will RARELY<BR>improve your stats this way--which is how it should be).<BR><BR><BR><BR>(C) The experience system is designed to improve characters through<BR>their experiences--but there is another way character's can improve:<BR>through instruction and practice.&nbsp; People can lift weights, start<BR>running, read books, take classes, and have experts show them how to do<BR>things.&nbsp; I want to incorporate this aspect of character improvement into<BR>my system--and I haven't quite got that worked out yet.&nbsp; But, it will<BR>probably entail the awarding of experience points based on what the<BR>character does to learn something new--then the improvement rolls will<BR>be the same (just the method of obtaining experience points will be<BR>different).<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>A couple of other notes about the experience system that may not be evident<BR>upon first reading....<BR><BR>(1)&nbsp; Since PCs are penalized through prerequisite points and failure cost if<BR>their total skill levels exceed the total of Int + Edu, players may choose<BR>*not to improve* skills where they have enough experience points to make an<BR>attempt.&nbsp; Player will keep an eye on their total skill levels and not<BR>blatantly improve everything they can.&nbsp; This is another fashion that players<BR>can groom their characters.<BR><BR>(2)&nbsp; Because players can groom the growth of their characters through<BR>discretionary experience points earned through role playing (and through the<BR>method described above in point #1), the standard Traveller character<BR>generation system is reflected in game play.<BR><BR>Under the chargen systems, players can pick skill charts but have to roll to<BR>see which skill they obtain.&nbsp; Under the KB3 experience system, players can<BR>groom their characters through the above methods, but they have less control<BR>on which skills will be awarded expereince points (because you never know<BR>which skill will have a dramatic impact on the game and result with the GM<BR>award of experience).<BR><BR>(3)&nbsp; Think of experience points as a method of measuring "the potential a<BR>character has of improving a skill".&nbsp; Experience points are not a measure of<BR>*absolute* learning.&nbsp; It's a measure of potential..."There's a chance that<BR>the PC learned something new about his skill...maybe he learned enough to<BR>improve it to the next level".<BR><BR>(4)&nbsp; Awarding points at the end of a game session should be "fun".&nbsp; Players<BR>should look forward to it.&nbsp; It is a time of sitting back, laughing with your<BR>gaming friends, reflecting over the night's gaming.<BR><BR>At the same time, the GM should not award experience points too freely.&nbsp; He<BR>should keep awards to 1 point per award topic:<BR><BR>"OK, you did some good role playing tonight--better than usual--so here's a<BR>discretionary point!"<BR><BR>- -----<BR><BR>"That was a great idea you had that saved every body's butt!&nbsp; Here's a<BR>discretionary point.&nbsp; Put it on anything you wish to improve!"<BR><BR>- -----<BR><BR>"Oh, that Edu attribute check you made was incredible!&nbsp; That one roll<BR>changed the whole game.&nbsp; You've are now know so much more about the scenario<BR>than you did before.&nbsp; Take an experience point on your Edu stat!"<BR><BR>- -----<BR><BR>"You're Piloting roll tonight saved the ship and kept your vessel from being<BR>boarded!&nbsp; Give yourself an experience point on your Pilot skill!"<BR><BR>- -----<BR><BR>"You don't have the Intrustion skill, but you were able to make that<BR>incredilbe roll, against all odds, deactivating that alarm.&nbsp; If the alarm<BR>had sounded, you and the group would have been in a world of hurt...give<BR>yourself an experience point on a new skill...Intrusion!"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3579<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-ye02.mx.aol.com (rly-ye02.mail.aol.com [172.18.151.199]) by air-ye02.mail.aol.com (v77.35) with ESMTP; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 11:28:12 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-ye02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 11:27:41 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id LAA88773;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 11:26:55 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 31 Jan 2001 11:26:31 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA88718<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 11:26:31 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 11:26:31 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101311626.LAA88718@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3579<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background="" bgColor=#3dffff><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3580</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/31/01 12:38:19 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; Wednesday, January 31 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3580<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: de-canonized material<BR>Re: Who do I hire to terraform this place?<BR>unsubscribing<BR>Re: unsubscribing<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>RE: Another question...<BR>Re: System Writeup Outline<BR>Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR>Re: TNE<BR>RE: Challenger Aniversary<BR>Re: Plush?<BR>RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR>Re: Weapon recoil (RE: Question.....)<BR>Re: Landgrab proposal: Sacnoth, Gram<BR>Re: Weapon recoil (RE: Question.....)<BR>RE: Anyone ever list geograpy ...<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 08:40:38 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: RE: de-canonized material<BR><BR>&gt;From: "J. Paul Sanders" &lt;jps64@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: RE: de-canonized material<BR>...<BR>&gt;Corridor - used as a personal preserve by Marc W Miller.<BR><BR>&nbsp; Gee, that would make him a Sector Duke, right? :&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 09:14:03 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Who do I hire to terraform this place?<BR><BR>Paul Drye writes:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;Keep in mind that terraforming is a process that'll take *generations*.<BR>&gt; &gt;More likely centuries to millenia.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Meaning what, that a private concern wouldn't be interested in it? There<BR>&gt; are&nbsp; endless possibilities for turning a profit along the way.<BR><BR>More likely, meaning a private concern wouldn't be running the show, though<BR>they'd be perfectly willing to contract out for specific tasks.&nbsp; If a <BR>corporation actually was running the show, it would probably be a corporation<BR>created for the purpose -- i.e. the Planet Y Terraforming Company.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:15:15 +0200<BR>From: "Mark and Caroline Russell" &lt;markrus@netactive.co.za&gt;<BR>Subject: unsubscribing<BR><BR>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C08BBA.242ED200<BR>Content-Type: text/plain;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>Could someone please point me to the latest F.A.Q for the TML as the =<BR>instructions for unsubscribing in the F.A.Q. dated 20 October 2000 do =<BR>not seem to work.<BR>Thanks<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C08BBA.242ED200<BR>Content-Type: text/html;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>&lt;!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"&gt;<BR>&lt;HEAD&gt;<BR>&lt;META content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1" =<BR>http-equiv=3DContent-Type&gt;<BR>&lt;META content=3D"MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000" name=3DGENERATOR&gt;<BR>&lt;STYLE&gt;&lt;/STYLE&gt;<BR>&lt;/HEAD&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face='3D"Comic' size=3 MS? Sans>Could someone please point me =<BR>to the=20<BR>latest F.A.Q for the TML as the instructions for unsubscribing in the =<BR>F.A.Q.=20<BR>dated 20 October 2000 do not seem to work.</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face='3D"Comic' MS?="<BR" Sans>size=3D2&gt;Thanks</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C08BBA.242ED200--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 09:26:50 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: unsubscribing<BR><BR>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01C08B67.F1228E80<BR>Content-Type: text/plain;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>Try using the TML form on my website.&nbsp; http://www.travellercentral.com , =<BR>follow the TML link on the nav bar<BR><BR>Tod<BR>&nbsp; ----- Original Message -----=20<BR>&nbsp; From: Mark and Caroline Russell=20<BR>&nbsp; To: traveller@lists.ient.com=20<BR>&nbsp; Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2001 9:15 AM<BR>&nbsp; Subject: unsubscribing<BR><BR><BR>&nbsp; Could someone please point me to the latest F.A.Q for the TML as the =<BR>instructions for unsubscribing in the F.A.Q. dated 20 October 2000 do =<BR>not seem to work.<BR>&nbsp; Thanks<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01C08B67.F1228E80<BR>Content-Type: text/html;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>&lt;!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"&gt;<BR>&lt;HEAD&gt;<BR>&lt;META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =<BR>charset=3Diso-8859-1"&gt;<BR>&lt;META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4611.1300" name=3DGENERATOR&gt;<BR>&lt;STYLE&gt;&lt;/STYLE&gt;<BR>&lt;/HEAD&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face=3DArial size=3>Try using the TML form on my =<BR>website.&amp;nbsp; &lt;A=20<BR>href=3D"http://www.travellercentral.com"&gt;http://www.travellercentral.com&lt;=<BR>/A&gt; ,=20<BR>follow the TML link on the nav bar</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face=3DArial size=3></FONT>&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face=3DArial size=3>Tod</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20<BR>style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =<BR>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"&gt;----- Original Message ----- &lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV=20<BR>&nbsp; style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =<BR>black"&gt;<B>From:</B>=20<BR>&nbsp; <A title=3Dmarkrus@netactive.co.za ="<BR">href=3D"mailto:markrus@netactive.co.za"&gt;Mark=20<BR>&nbsp; and Caroline Russell</A> &lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"&gt;<B>To:</B> <A ="<BR">title=3Dtraveller@lists.ient.com=20<BR>href=3D"mailto:traveller@lists.ient.com"&gt;traveller@lists.ient.com</A> =<BR>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"&gt;<B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, January 31, =<BR>2001 9:15=20<BR>&nbsp; AM&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"&gt;<B>Subject:</B> unsubscribing&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face='3D"Comic' size=3 MS? Sans>Could someone please point =<BR>me to the=20<BR>&nbsp; latest F.A.Q for the TML as the instructions for unsubscribing in the =<BR>F.A.Q.=20<BR>&nbsp; dated 20 October 2000 do not seem to work.</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face='3D"Comic' MS?="20<BR" Sans>size=3D2&gt;Thanks</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;&lt;/BLOCKQUOTE&gt;<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01C08B67.F1228E80--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 08:59:00<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>At 01:19 PM 1/30/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;went to Sylea Downport nice site. when will Gridlore Technologes be back up?<BR><BR>It depends.&nbsp; Since I am now making some money for writing GURPS Traveller,<BR>I am going to use the Shiny New Computer to start doing GURPS designs.&nbsp; It<BR>is rather frustating to do all these wonderful FFS2 ships that don't have a<BR>combat syatem attached.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 10:59:20 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>On Mon, 29 Jan 2001 18:52:54 -0500 ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net (Ray Rangel)<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Again, I think a "universal" use of firearms is a dubious vision of the<BR>&gt;future. By the time enough technology is employed to make firearms<BR>&gt;dependable in any environment in which they might find themselves deployed,<BR>&gt;the cost of the weapon would become prohibitively high and the MTBF (Mean<BR>&gt;Time Between Failures) would be prohibitively low. There go the advantages<BR>&gt;of cheap, easy to fabricate, and dependable.<BR><BR>Why? It's largely a simple matter of making resistant to corrosion and vaccuum<BR>welding. We _can_ do that today, though the cost of small batches of special<BR>materials and political considerations prevent the widespread adoption, at TL<BR>13 it should be trivial. <BR><BR>Atmospheric differences should present no major problems, except for sniping,<BR>but that's a different issue than the firearm. The technology and design is<BR>well understood and well proven; it's just a matter of materials engineering.<BR><BR>Hell I could probably take my 60-year old S&amp;W revolver just about anywhere in<BR>the OTU and have it work pretty damn reliably. Not mil-spec, in the field for<BR>months without cleaning under constant fire reliable, but definitely as a<BR>carry sidearm reliable.<BR><BR>&gt;No, I think that high technology armies would use direct energy weapons<BR>&gt;simply because they can be used in any environment. Look at it this way: I<BR>&gt;could choose to zap my opponent with my trusty ray gun or I can choose to<BR>&gt;take one step up from throwing rocks and chose to fling little bits of metal<BR>&gt;at him. Hummm.... That's a tough one....<BR><BR>Why would newer technology like energy weapons be of greater reliability and<BR>ruggedness than firearms? <BR><BR>You have a high energy power supply to contend with, and unless they end up<BR>making megawatt Diode lasers se we have solid-state death rays, the beam<BR>weapon part is going to be complex, and likely more fragile than a firearm. <BR><BR>IOW, Why is your 'trusty ray gun' trusty? <BR><BR>What findamental properties of the device make it more reliable than a couple<BR>of hunks of moving parts? <BR><BR>(literally, a couple of hunks...a functional, reasonably accurate and deadly<BR>firearm can be made with 1 (ONE) moving part, a simple hinge. Of course,<BR>matchlocks are slow to load, but as Captain Kirk showed us, they can be made<BR>just about anywhere.) <BR><BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 09:56:52 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>Does anyone know where there is or might be an additional listing of gear or<BR>items. my group has the basic gear from the core traveller books but i would<BR>like more things to offer them for use. also im reading up on robots right<BR>now. Now i remember why i never used them that book was very confusing to me<BR>and still is. think it could have been better written. is there a better<BR>written or maybe explained set of notes for that book anywhere?<BR><BR>thanks<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Douglas E. Berry [mailto:gridlore@pop.mindspring.com]<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2001 12:59 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR><BR>At 01:19 PM 1/30/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;went to Sylea Downport nice site. when will Gridlore Technologes be back<BR>up?<BR><BR>It depends.&nbsp; Since I am now making some money for writing GURPS Traveller,<BR>I am going to use the Shiny New Computer to start doing GURPS designs.&nbsp; It<BR>is rather frustating to do all these wonderful FFS2 ships that don't have a<BR>combat syatem attached.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 17:57:22 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>Are you working on another GT book? :-)<BR><BR>Mike<BR><BR><BR>- ----Original Message Follows----<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 08:59:00<BR><BR>At 01:19 PM 1/30/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;went to Sylea Downport nice site. when will Gridlore Technologes be back <BR>up?<BR><BR>It depends.&nbsp; Since I am now making some money for writing GURPS Traveller,<BR>I am going to use the Shiny New Computer to start doing GURPS designs.&nbsp; It<BR>is rather frustating to do all these wonderful FFS2 ships that don't have a<BR>combat syatem attached.<BR>- --<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 10:20:02 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Another question...<BR><BR>ok lets change things a bit. lets say orville (where the heck i got john is<BR>beyond me 8P)and wilbur are handed the plans to a circa 1937 Spitfire Mark 1<BR>and they have some notes scribbled down about by say their competitor mr.<BR>curtis who had taken 2 years trying to reverse engineer this thing. what do<BR>you think the Brothers would make of that?<BR><BR>Also I know the Wright brothers were using wing warping heck they patented<BR>that process. so others found a way around all their patents. is why half<BR>the terminology in Aviation today is in french. Aleron. fusalage. Empinage.<BR>(and i know my spellings off. It has always been one of my failings.) <BR><BR>to give you an idea of the situation. The players in the last adventure came<BR>across some plan for a high tech fighter. they became hunted because they<BR>had this information. One of the players is like an engineer 4 he is trying<BR>to reverse engineer something out of these plans.<BR><BR>So you know the plans belonged to a race who are a few tech levels ahead of<BR>the imperium. an aircraft corp had aquired the plans spent a few years<BR>trying to reverse engineer them to produce fighters for the imperium.<BR>figuring if they could then they could deffinatly aquire the contracts for a<BR>LOT of fighters for the next few years. lots of money on the line. They<BR>succeded in producing 2 prototypes which were of far poorer quality then the<BR>originals. ie lack of proper materials magic boxes that were not as magical<BR>as the orignial boxes. the fighters were supperior to what was currently on<BR>the market.<BR><BR>I am trying to get an idea if in 3 weeks he could pull anything useful out<BR>of it. the time he ahd with it was actually less than that because they had<BR>to decrypt the data to begin with. All in all i would say he had maybe at<BR>most a week or maybe a week and half with the complete plans.<BR><BR>I appreciate the advice. thanks<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com [mailto:shadow@krypton.rain.com]<BR>Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 10:14 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Let's look at another example.&nbsp; Someone drops into NASA plans for a Free<BR>&gt; Trader (a la CT).&nbsp; Complete with Jump Drive, Gravatic M-drive, anti-grav<BR>&gt; plates, the whole nine yards.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Could they build a Free Trader?&nbsp; Not likely anytime soon.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Not to say that there would not be immediate improvements in many aspects<BR>of<BR>&gt; our lives...but almost impossible to build.<BR><BR>Actually, it's unlikely there'd be any improvements for a long time.<BR>Simply because the plans won't tell you how to build the parts, nor how<BR>they work.<BR><BR>&gt; What do they do when the plans show the space to install the Sternmetal<BR>&gt; Horizons LIC Model 2/bis computer?&nbsp; Too much of a design is components<BR>that<BR>&gt; are magic boxes for all intents and purposes.<BR><BR>Yep.<BR><BR>&gt; Now here is a question that would bake your noodle.&nbsp; Drop yourself in<BR>&gt; Revolutionary America, with the plans for a Ford Mustang.&nbsp; Can you build<BR>it?<BR><BR>Not a chance. You'd need to *invent* precision machining (which is one<BR>of the reasons that Babbage (who was working more than 50 years later)<BR>couldn't get his difference engine built.<BR><BR>You'd need to invent a way to create various alloys. And build a<BR>complete steel mill, including the rolling mill to produce the sheet<BR>metal. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 18:30:39 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>on 31/1/01 2:47 am, Pat Connaughton at patconnaughton@earthlink.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I've a quick question,<BR>&gt; Has anyone a suggestion for a reasonably easy to access list<BR>&gt; of star types? I've collected a few descriptions and notes for<BR>&gt; my own use, but a more complete list would be helpful<BR><BR>Difficult to answer. I presume you want the spectral types commonly<BR>encountered, the "Oh Be A Fine Girl Kiss Me (Right Now)"? If so, here's the<BR>meat:<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; R-N<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |<BR>W-O-B-A-F-G-K-M<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; |<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; S<BR><BR>W: Wolf-Rayet, characterised by broad bright bands of H-He emissions, carbon<BR>and nitrogen appearing to be mutually exclusive, hence WC and WN subclass.<BR><BR>O: ave. temp. 30,000K highly ionised absorption lines, include He, N, O<BR><BR>B: ave. temp. 13,000K to 20,000K, bluish-white (eg Rigel), stronger H lines<BR>than O, strength increasing B0 to B9, He strongest B2, decays when B9, lines<BR>of ionised Si, O, Mg<BR><BR>A: ave. temp. 10,000K, (eg Sirius, Vega, Altair), no He lines, at A0 Balmer<BR>H at strongest, K line of Ca increases thru class<BR><BR>F: ave. temp. 7,000K to 9,000K, yellowish (eg Procyon), H lines decline thru<BR>class, K line Ca increases, metals such as Fe, Na, Mn as neutral/ionised<BR>atoms<BR><BR>G: ave. temp. 5,000K to 6,000K, yellow (eg Sol, type G2), H lines decrease<BR>thru class, metal lines increase, K line Ca strong<BR><BR>K: ave. temp. 4,000K, reddish (eg Aldebran, Arcturus), H lines fade to<BR>insignificant, spectrum dominated by H and K lines of Ca, lines due to<BR>molecules appear<BR><BR>M: ave. temp. 3,000K, red (eg Antares, Betelgeuse), stronger molecular<BR>bands, especially Ti oxide, metallic lines still present - equivalent to<BR>Secchi's group III<BR><BR>R: ave. temp. 2,300K to 2,600K, orange-red<BR>N: ave. temp. 2,300K to 2,600K, orange-red, carbon compounds<BR>R and N sometimes classed as C<BR><BR>S: complex spectra, bright H lines and also bands from ZrO<BR><BR>There are also:<BR><BR>P: spectra suggests nuclei contained in expanding shells, no decimal<BR>subclasses<BR><BR>Q: nova-type star, no decimal subclasses<BR><BR>There are prefixes:<BR><BR>c: sharp spectral lines, narrow profile - supergiants (eg Deneb - cA2)<BR><BR>g: spectral features peculiar to giant stars<BR><BR>d: spectral features peculiar to dwarf stars<BR><BR>And suffixes:<BR><BR>n: broad shallow lines, means high rotational speed<BR><BR>s: sharp lines without fineness of prefix c<BR><BR>e: emission lines in spectra<BR><BR>v: variable spectra<BR><BR>ev: variable emission lines<BR><BR>k: spectrum shows interstellar absorption features<BR><BR>p: peculiar spectrum - usually strong metallic lines<BR><BR>pq: peculiar spectrum - similar to novae<BR><BR>It gets more complicated once you try and define the sub-groups of giant<BR>stars above the main sequence and dwarfs below. :)<BR><BR>MKK classifications, used as suffixes to the above:<BR><BR>Ia: most luminous supergiants<BR>Ib: supergiant<BR>II: luminous giant<BR>III: giant<BR>IV: subgiant<BR>V: main sequence<BR><BR>eg: B5Ib<BR><BR>There are also common bands of subdwarfs and a cluster of white dwarfs<BR>outside the MKK bands.<BR><BR>Will that do for a start? All references are from "Astronomy: Structure of<BR>the Universe" by A. E. Roy and D. Clarke, a standard 1st year astronomy<BR>textbook in the UK.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 18:41:34 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR>on 31/1/01 4:24 pm, William Lane at wlane@Asera.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; was C.C. Williams the one schedualed to be the LEM pilot on Apollo 12?<BR><BR>Yes, he was also backup pilot for Gemini 10. Alan Bean took his place in the<BR>Apollo program.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 10:39:20 -0800<BR>From: "Mark F. Cook" &lt;markc@peak.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: TNE<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; I am curious if anyone has any Ideas as to what the "Black Curtain"<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; actually was.<BR><BR>Velveteen. *LOTS* of Velveteen. Hence the fall of the Imperium. A combination<BR>of bankruptcy and the death by exhaustion of darn near every tailor in Core<BR>sector. :^)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - Mark C.<BR><BR>&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 10:46:41 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR>thought so i was not totally sure. if i remember correctly in the Apollo 12<BR>patch there are 4 stars 3 for the 3 who went and 1 for Williams who was<BR>suppose to go.<BR><BR>weird the things i remember LOL.<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Gordon Hundley [mailto:gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk]<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2001 10:42 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Challenger Aniversary<BR><BR><BR>on 31/1/01 4:24 pm, William Lane at wlane@Asera.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; was C.C. Williams the one schedualed to be the LEM pilot on Apollo 12?<BR><BR>Yes, he was also backup pilot for Gemini 10. Alan Bean took his place in the<BR>Apollo program.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 10:52:14 -0800<BR>From: Evyn MacDude &lt;wmacdude@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Plush?<BR><BR>"Mikko V. I. Parviainen" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; On Tue, 30 Jan 2001, John Groth wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Y'know, the more I think about it, the more I would like to see Ithklur<BR>&gt; &gt; plushies....<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; How about My Little K'Kree dolls?<BR><BR>They already make these It's called "beef jerky"<BR><BR>- --<BR>Evyn<BR><BR>The theme of the whole thing is clear. We have to be careful with wisdom. We<BR>have to make certain we're ready for it when it comes knocking on our door.<BR>Knowledge isn't always a blessing;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; sometimes, it's damnation.<BR>Play Dirty: Let's All Go to the Movies!, by John Wick<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 13:14:33 -0600 (CST)<BR>From: Gregory Carl Kettler &lt;gckettle@midway.uchicago.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR><BR>On Wed, 31 Jan 2001, Matt Bond wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; You couldn't build a Ford Mustang, but you could 'uplift' the<BR>&gt; revolutionary Americans. Assuming you had the knowledge in question, and<BR>&gt; some financial backing. Within 10 years I would imagine they could have<BR>&gt; reached mid 19C tech, another 10 to get early 20C and another 10 to get<BR>&gt; to mid 20C.<BR><BR>This is starting to sound like _A Connecticut Yankee in King Arthur's<BR>Court_, in which the title character has enough time to build a<BR>manufacturing base for advanced TL3 production in King Arthur's England.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 11:28:11 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Weapon recoil (RE: Question.....)<BR><BR>[snip]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Example: 5.56 x 45 mm ammunition<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Projectile mass: 3.6 g<BR>&gt; Projectile velocity: 955 m/s (at muzzle)<BR>&gt; Projectile impulse: 3.44 Ns<BR>&gt; Projectile energy: 1641.6 J (at muzzle)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Propellant mass: 1.46 g<BR>&gt; Propellant velocity: 2000 m/s (estimate for smokeless powder)<BR>&gt; Propellant impulse: 2.92 Ns<BR>&gt; Total impulse: 6.36 Ns<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; 45.9% of the total impulse results from the propellant<BR>&gt;<BR>[snip]<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Antti Lahtinen&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; lahtinen@ee.tut.fi<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Researcher, MSc (Eng)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.ee.tut.fi/~lahtinen<BR><BR>Antti,<BR><BR>Do you have the formulas for recoil impulse and free recoil energy for<BR>metric units.&nbsp; All my references use grains, lbs and fps and give results in<BR>foot pounds.&nbsp; I'd prefer not to have to convert the formulas myself, if you<BR>already have the metric versions.&nbsp; Thanks.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:59:38 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrab proposal: Sacnoth, Gram<BR><BR>on 26/1/01 7:56 pm, Gordon Hundley at gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I'm doing some writing based in the Sword Worlds, and would like to make a<BR>&gt; claim on two higher-tech worlds in the region: Sacnoth and Gram. I would<BR>&gt; appreciate hearing any objections and/or sources for canon material I should<BR>&gt; include. <BR><BR>No replies to this, so I'm replying myself. Wake up at the back. :)<BR><BR>Having recently subscribed to JTAS, I've been going through the archives,<BR>and I've spotted the following:<BR><BR>The Sacnoth Dominate by Hans Rancke-Madsen<BR><BR>and:<BR><BR>The Sword Worlders by Robert Prior<BR>Sword Worlds Characters by Robert Prior<BR><BR>All are very good articles, and which suggest that others are doing<BR>extensive work in this area.<BR><BR>I've done some background work and complete system generation (which doesn't<BR>fit with the details given by Hans) but not much more as yet, so I'm willing<BR>to give up on these ones if there are other parties actively involved in<BR>world creation in these systems. I'm also happy to provide the word tables<BR>and such for Old Norse and Icelandic that I've been using to assist in<BR>naming worlds and satellites to whoever wants them (Hans?). Otherwise, if<BR>you chaps don't want to continue, I can adapt what I've done to fit with the<BR>details you've published so far, and take over.<BR><BR>So, Hans and Robert, it's your call. I'm not bothered either way, but I'd<BR>like a place to 'call my own', so in the meantime, I'll look out some other<BR>unclaimed medium-tech worlds to 'conquer'. :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 20:53:25 +0100<BR>From: "Tage Borg" &lt;tage@hem.passagen.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Weapon recoil (RE: Question.....)<BR><BR>&gt; [snip]<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Example: 5.56 x 45 mm ammunition<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Projectile mass: 3.6 g<BR>&gt; &gt; Projectile velocity: 955 m/s (at muzzle)<BR>&gt; &gt; Projectile impulse: 3.44 Ns<BR>&gt; &gt; Projectile energy: 1641.6 J (at muzzle)<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Propellant mass: 1.46 g<BR>&gt; &gt; Propellant velocity: 2000 m/s (estimate for smokeless powder)<BR>&gt; &gt; Propellant impulse: 2.92 Ns<BR>&gt; &gt; Total impulse: 6.36 Ns<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; 45.9% of the total impulse results from the propellant<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; [snip]<BR>&gt; &gt; --<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Antti Lahtinen&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; lahtinen@ee.tut.fi<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Researcher, MSc (Eng)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.ee.tut.fi/~lahtinen<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Antti,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Do you have the formulas for recoil impulse and free recoil energy for<BR>&gt; metric units.&nbsp; All my references use grains, lbs and fps and give results<BR>in<BR>&gt; foot pounds.&nbsp; I'd prefer not to have to convert the formulas myself, if<BR>you<BR>&gt; already have the metric versions.&nbsp; Thanks.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Tod<BR><BR>Well, I'm not Antti, but this is easy:<BR><BR>p = mv (impulse in newton seconds equals mass in kilograms times velocity in<BR>meters/second)<BR>Wk = (mv^2)/2 (kinetic energy in Joules equals mass in kilograms times<BR>velocity in meters/second times velocity in meters per second divided by<BR>two)<BR><BR>how do you do that in grains, pounds, feet and hands? it can't be very<BR>different, except for a few factors of multiplication here and there, yes?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; /tage<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:27:41 -0000<BR>From: "Alistair J. R. Young" &lt;avatar@arkane.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Anyone ever list geograpy ...<BR><BR>&gt; Steven Hudson wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;ObTrav: Imagine a glut of mailing-list posts accumulating from<BR>11,000<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;worlds, arriving in one big batch from the latest Xboat :)<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; How about "what triggered the Long Night", Alex?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Imagine what would happen if the number of new posts every week is<BR>&gt; higher than what the X-boats can ship away. That would crash the<BR>&gt; system...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Flame War, anyone?&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>I'm envisioning the "31137 skript kiddiez" in their basement on Capital,<BR>gathered around a map of the Imperium, working out travel times for the<BR>biggest DDoS attack ever...<BR><BR>Alistair<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3580<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xd04.mx.aol.com (rly-xd04.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.169]) by air-xd01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:38:19 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xd04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:37:50 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id PAA98904;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:37:12 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:36:42 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id PAA98850<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:36:42 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:36:42 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101312036.PAA98850@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3580<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3581</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/31/01 2:37:06 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; Wednesday, January 31 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3581<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR>Re: Landgrabs<BR>Re: Landgrabs<BR>Landgrab Question<BR>Re: Landgrabs<BR>RE: Another question...<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>RE: Subject:TNE<BR>Blast From the Past! Original TML Landgrab Proposal!<BR>TML Landgrab Questions Answered by Example [Fwd: Heya/Regina]<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:35:18 -0000<BR>From: "Alistair J. R. Young" &lt;avatar@arkane.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players...?<BR><BR>&gt; In mail you write:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; For that matter, estimate what percentage of the total capacity of<BR>the<BR>&gt; &gt; Xboat system is used to shuffle about 11,000 worlds-worth of spam -<BR>&gt; &gt; noting of course that travel-time delays don't allow for silly WWW<BR>&gt; &gt; tricks, so the messages themselves have to include all the gimmicks.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; You won't see much spam via x-boats. For several reasons.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; First, the *sender* has to pay for the message. Especially for big<BR>ones<BR>&gt; with "all the gimmicks".<BR><BR>That hasn't stopped people from exploiting open relays now. As long as<BR>some other poor sucker pays for the byteage...<BR><BR>&gt; Second, due to time lag and cultural differences between worlds, the<BR>&gt; rate of return *sucks* so badly it's not worth it. Also, if they *are*<BR>&gt; interested in your product they can get it two weeks faster locally. <BR><BR>Since when has that made any difference to spammers? As I understand it,<BR>they tend to be paid based on the number of messages they send out.<BR>Whether there's a worthwhile rate of return (negligible even for current<BR>spam), whether the recipient is even relevant to the product (US-only<BR>stuff send to UK addresses), or even if the message ever gets to a<BR>recipient all seem to be irrelevant.<BR><BR>&gt; Finally, due to the complaints, and the "chokepoint" provided by the<BR>&gt; facilities that collect email for X-boat transmission, and the only<BR>&gt; that feed it into the local nets, it'll be rather thoroughly filtered.<BR>&gt; You won't be able to play the games with "spoofed" headers. <BR><BR>Well, being a believer in the Vingean "mature software environment", I<BR>would expect the code of the X-boat routing software to have code headed<BR>"sendmail.c -- (c) 19xx Eric Allman, &amp;c." buried somewhere within it,<BR>and so...<BR><BR>More seriously, I don't expect the security-hole-of-the-month club to be<BR>going away any time soon, or ever. Every enhancement made to the<BR>software only provides more potential for the nth century cracker.<BR><BR>Alistair<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 20:44:35 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrabs<BR><BR>on 31/1/01 11:54 am, Trevor, Peter at Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I notice that the TML Landgrab page&nbsp; (at&nbsp; downport.com)&nbsp; has&nbsp; not<BR>&gt; been maintained&nbsp; for&nbsp; awhile&nbsp; despite&nbsp; there&nbsp; being&nbsp; some&nbsp; recent<BR>&gt; changes.&nbsp; What gives?&nbsp; Is the 'Claims Officer' on this list?<BR><BR>I assume they'd all be on the list, so folk, please use this sorted version<BR>that I culled from Downport and comment on what's missing or superseded:<BR><BR>L'oeil d'Dieu/Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; Robert O'Connor<BR>Naseem/Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; SEC:UNCLASS*<BR>Patinir / Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; Jesse DeGraff<BR>Zila/Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; Derek Dees<BR><BR>Cipango/Chronor&nbsp; &nbsp; P-O Bergstedt<BR><BR>Bularia/Darrian&nbsp; &nbsp; Andy Akins<BR><BR>567-908/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Ron Brown<BR>Collace/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Bloo<BR>Elixabeth/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Tim Reynolds<BR>Forine/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tim Reynolds<BR>Milagro/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Rob Miracle<BR>Sequallia/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Walt Smith<BR>Singer/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Tommy Grav<BR><BR>875-496/Five Sisters&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; Justice Hypercleats<BR>876-574/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Mike McKeown<BR>Andory/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; David Summers<BR>Candory/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; David Summers<BR>Karin/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Nick Wright<BR>Ochetate/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Ian Whitchurch<BR>Penelope/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Kurt Brown<BR>Wonstar/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Michael Houghton<BR><BR>Aki/Glisten&nbsp; &nbsp; Glenn Grant<BR>Aster/Glisten&nbsp; &nbsp; AB<BR>Tirem/Glisten&nbsp; &nbsp; Awchee Rin-Tin-Tindell<BR><BR>871-438/Jewel&nbsp; &nbsp; X-TEK<BR>Esalin/Jewell&nbsp; &nbsp; Luther Martin<BR>Mongo/Jewell&nbsp; &nbsp; Glenn Goffin<BR><BR>Cogri/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Roderick Elliott<BR>Dinom/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Denis Alain<BR>Equus/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Eric Holmes<BR>Lanth/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Paulo Vicente<BR>Quopist/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Miller<BR>Wypoc/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; William Hostman<BR>Ylaven/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Paul Campbell<BR><BR>Spirelle/Lunion&nbsp; &nbsp; Steve Charlton<BR>Tenalphi/Lunion&nbsp; &nbsp; Doug Berry<BR><BR>Carey/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Roderick Elliott<BR>Dojodo/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Newman<BR>Duale/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Eberhard Schulz<BR>Mora/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Dan Lane<BR>Nexine/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Shane Thomas<BR>Rorise/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; AB<BR><BR>Retinae/Querion&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Eberhard Schulz<BR>Thanber/Querion&nbsp; &nbsp; Jason Postma<BR><BR>Heya/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Doug Berry<BR>Jenghe/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Cheryl Stella<BR>Moughas/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; *Michael Hughes<BR>Regina/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Cheryl Glenn<BR>Uakye/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Todd Moody<BR>Yori/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Trevor<BR><BR>Cipatwe/Rhylanor&nbsp; &nbsp; Kevin C. Carpenter<BR>Jivije/Rylanor&nbsp; &nbsp; Darryl Adams<BR>Rhylanor/Rhylanor&nbsp; &nbsp; Volker Greimann<BR><BR>Excalibur/Sword Worlds&nbsp; &nbsp; Colin Michael<BR>Sting/Sword Worlds&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Trevor<BR><BR>Conway/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; Julius Waller<BR>Leander/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; Baroness Margaret<BR>Prilissa/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; John Wood<BR>Trin/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; Ben Aaronovitch<BR><BR>Arden/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; James Lindsay<BR>Ficant/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; A. M-Vallance<BR>Phlume/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; Alan Bradley<BR>Tavonni/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; David Jaques-Watson<BR><BR>If required, I'm happy to offer my services to maintain the list.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 12:54:25 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrabs<BR><BR>on 1/31/01 12:44 PM, Gordon Hundley at gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; on 31/1/01 11:54 am, Trevor, Peter at Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; I notice that the TML Landgrab page&nbsp; (at&nbsp; downport.com)&nbsp; has&nbsp; not<BR>&gt;&gt; been maintained&nbsp; for&nbsp; awhile&nbsp; despite&nbsp; there&nbsp; being&nbsp; some&nbsp; recent<BR>&gt;&gt; changes.&nbsp; What gives?&nbsp; Is the 'Claims Officer' on this list?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I assume they'd all be on the list, so folk, please use this sorted version<BR>&gt; that I culled from Downport and comment on what's missing or superseded:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; L'oeil d'Dieu/Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; Robert O'Connor<BR>&gt; Naseem/Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; SEC:UNCLASS*<BR>&gt; Patinir / Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; Jesse DeGraff<BR>&gt; Zila/Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; Derek Dees<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Cipango/Chronor&nbsp; &nbsp; P-O Bergstedt<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Bularia/Darrian&nbsp; &nbsp; Andy Akins<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 567-908/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Ron Brown<BR>&gt; Collace/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Bloo<BR>&gt; Elixabeth/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Tim Reynolds<BR>&gt; Forine/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tim Reynolds<BR>&gt; Milagro/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Rob Miracle<BR>&gt; Sequallia/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Walt Smith<BR>&gt; Singer/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Tommy Grav<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 875-496/Five Sisters&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; Justice Hypercleats<BR>&gt; 876-574/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Mike McKeown<BR>&gt; Andory/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; David Summers<BR>&gt; Candory/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; David Summers<BR>&gt; Karin/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Nick Wright<BR>&gt; Ochetate/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Ian Whitchurch<BR>&gt; Penelope/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Kurt Brown<BR>&gt; Wonstar/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Michael Houghton<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Aki/Glisten&nbsp; &nbsp; Glenn Grant<BR>&gt; Aster/Glisten&nbsp; &nbsp; AB<BR>&gt; Tirem/Glisten&nbsp; &nbsp; Awchee Rin-Tin-Tindell<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 871-438/Jewel&nbsp; &nbsp; X-TEK<BR>&gt; Esalin/Jewell&nbsp; &nbsp; Luther Martin<BR>&gt; Mongo/Jewell&nbsp; &nbsp; Glenn Goffin<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Cogri/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Roderick Elliott<BR>&gt; Dinom/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Denis Alain<BR>&gt; Equus/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Eric Holmes<BR>&gt; Lanth/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Paulo Vicente<BR>&gt; Quopist/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Miller<BR>&gt; Wypoc/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; William Hostman<BR>&gt; Ylaven/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Paul Campbell<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Spirelle/Lunion&nbsp; &nbsp; Steve Charlton<BR>&gt; Tenalphi/Lunion&nbsp; &nbsp; Doug Berry<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Carey/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Roderick Elliott<BR>&gt; Dojodo/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Newman<BR>&gt; Duale/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Eberhard Schulz<BR>&gt; Mora/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Dan Lane<BR>&gt; Nexine/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Shane Thomas<BR>&gt; Rorise/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; AB<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Retinae/Querion&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Eberhard Schulz<BR>&gt; Thanber/Querion&nbsp; &nbsp; Jason Postma<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Heya/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Doug Berry<BR>&gt; Jenghe/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Cheryl Stella<BR>&gt; Moughas/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; *Michael Hughes<BR>&gt; Regina/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Cheryl Glenn<BR>&gt; Uakye/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Todd Moody<BR>&gt; Yori/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Trevor<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Cipatwe/Rhylanor&nbsp; &nbsp; Kevin C. Carpenter<BR>&gt; Jivije/Rylanor&nbsp; &nbsp; Darryl Adams<BR>&gt; Rhylanor/Rhylanor&nbsp; &nbsp; Volker Greimann<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Excalibur/Sword Worlds&nbsp; &nbsp; Colin Michael<BR>&gt; Sting/Sword Worlds&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Trevor<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Conway/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; Julius Waller<BR>&gt; Leander/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; Baroness Margaret<BR>&gt; Prilissa/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; John Wood<BR>&gt; Trin/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; Ben Aaronovitch<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Arden/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; James Lindsay<BR>&gt; Ficant/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; A. M-Vallance<BR>&gt; Phlume/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; Alan Bradley<BR>&gt; Tavonni/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; David Jaques-Watson<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; If required, I'm happy to offer my services to maintain the list.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Gordon.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Gordon, this is just what I need.&nbsp; I have grabbed the domain<BR>spinwardmarches.com, and as I build the sector maps, I'll put links to all<BR>the landgrab websites.&nbsp; anyone who has data that needs a place to live, I'll<BR>be glad to host it at spinwardmarches.com.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 13:06:49 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Landgrab Question<BR><BR>How does one participate in the landgrab?<BR><BR>what are the rules?<BR><BR>I would like to do this also.<BR><BR>thanks<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Tod Glenn [mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com]<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2001 12:54 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrabs<BR><BR><BR>on 1/31/01 12:44 PM, Gordon Hundley at gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; on 31/1/01 11:54 am, Trevor, Peter at Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; I notice that the TML Landgrab page&nbsp; (at&nbsp; downport.com)&nbsp; has&nbsp; not<BR>&gt;&gt; been maintained&nbsp; for&nbsp; awhile&nbsp; despite&nbsp; there&nbsp; being&nbsp; some&nbsp; recent<BR>&gt;&gt; changes.&nbsp; What gives?&nbsp; Is the 'Claims Officer' on this list?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I assume they'd all be on the list, so folk, please use this sorted<BR>version<BR>&gt; that I culled from Downport and comment on what's missing or superseded:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; L'oeil d'Dieu/Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; Robert O'Connor<BR>&gt; Naseem/Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; SEC:UNCLASS*<BR>&gt; Patinir / Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; Jesse DeGraff<BR>&gt; Zila/Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; Derek Dees<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Cipango/Chronor&nbsp; &nbsp; P-O Bergstedt<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Bularia/Darrian&nbsp; &nbsp; Andy Akins<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 567-908/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Ron Brown<BR>&gt; Collace/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Bloo<BR>&gt; Elixabeth/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Tim Reynolds<BR>&gt; Forine/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tim Reynolds<BR>&gt; Milagro/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Rob Miracle<BR>&gt; Sequallia/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Walt Smith<BR>&gt; Singer/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Tommy Grav<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 875-496/Five Sisters&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; Justice Hypercleats<BR>&gt; 876-574/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Mike McKeown<BR>&gt; Andory/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; David Summers<BR>&gt; Candory/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; David Summers<BR>&gt; Karin/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Nick Wright<BR>&gt; Ochetate/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Ian Whitchurch<BR>&gt; Penelope/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Kurt Brown<BR>&gt; Wonstar/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Michael Houghton<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Aki/Glisten&nbsp; &nbsp; Glenn Grant<BR>&gt; Aster/Glisten&nbsp; &nbsp; AB<BR>&gt; Tirem/Glisten&nbsp; &nbsp; Awchee Rin-Tin-Tindell<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; 871-438/Jewel&nbsp; &nbsp; X-TEK<BR>&gt; Esalin/Jewell&nbsp; &nbsp; Luther Martin<BR>&gt; Mongo/Jewell&nbsp; &nbsp; Glenn Goffin<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Cogri/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Roderick Elliott<BR>&gt; Dinom/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Denis Alain<BR>&gt; Equus/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Eric Holmes<BR>&gt; Lanth/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Paulo Vicente<BR>&gt; Quopist/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Miller<BR>&gt; Wypoc/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; William Hostman<BR>&gt; Ylaven/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Paul Campbell<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Spirelle/Lunion&nbsp; &nbsp; Steve Charlton<BR>&gt; Tenalphi/Lunion&nbsp; &nbsp; Doug Berry<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Carey/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Roderick Elliott<BR>&gt; Dojodo/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Newman<BR>&gt; Duale/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Eberhard Schulz<BR>&gt; Mora/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Dan Lane<BR>&gt; Nexine/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Shane Thomas<BR>&gt; Rorise/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; AB<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Retinae/Querion&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Eberhard Schulz<BR>&gt; Thanber/Querion&nbsp; &nbsp; Jason Postma<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Heya/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Doug Berry<BR>&gt; Jenghe/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Cheryl Stella<BR>&gt; Moughas/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; *Michael Hughes<BR>&gt; Regina/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Cheryl Glenn<BR>&gt; Uakye/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Todd Moody<BR>&gt; Yori/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Trevor<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Cipatwe/Rhylanor&nbsp; &nbsp; Kevin C. Carpenter<BR>&gt; Jivije/Rylanor&nbsp; &nbsp; Darryl Adams<BR>&gt; Rhylanor/Rhylanor&nbsp; &nbsp; Volker Greimann<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Excalibur/Sword Worlds&nbsp; &nbsp; Colin Michael<BR>&gt; Sting/Sword Worlds&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Trevor<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Conway/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; Julius Waller<BR>&gt; Leander/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; Baroness Margaret<BR>&gt; Prilissa/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; John Wood<BR>&gt; Trin/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; Ben Aaronovitch<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Arden/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; James Lindsay<BR>&gt; Ficant/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; A. M-Vallance<BR>&gt; Phlume/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; Alan Bradley<BR>&gt; Tavonni/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; David Jaques-Watson<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; If required, I'm happy to offer my services to maintain the list.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Gordon.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Gordon, this is just what I need.&nbsp; I have grabbed the domain<BR>spinwardmarches.com, and as I build the sector maps, I'll put links to all<BR>the landgrab websites.&nbsp; anyone who has data that needs a place to live, I'll<BR>be glad to host it at spinwardmarches.com.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 21:26:02 <BR>From: "John Lambert" &lt;hovtej@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrabs<BR><BR>To help me decide where to make a landgrab, I created a map of the Spinward <BR>Marches with the taken worlds marked. It might be of interest to others so I <BR>posted it at:<BR>http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/j_lambert/landgrab.htm<BR>The map is based on the information at the downport site as of 25 Jan 01. <BR>I'll update the map as the information at the site changes.<BR><BR>John<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 14:30:25 -0700<BR>From: johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu<BR>Subject: RE: Another question...<BR><BR>On Wed, 31 Jan 2001 10:20:02 -0800 wlane@Asera.com (William Lane) wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;ok lets change things a bit. lets say orville (where the heck i got john is<BR>&gt;beyond me 8P)and wilbur are handed the plans to a circa 1937 Spitfire Mark 1<BR>&gt;and they have some notes scribbled down about by say their competitor mr.<BR>&gt;curtis who had taken 2 years trying to reverse engineer this thing. what do<BR>&gt;you think the Brothers would make of that?<BR><BR>A lot more. A Spitfire is only, at most, one TL ahead of the Wright Brothers.<BR>It's controlled by cables manually moved by the pilot, and the RollsRoyce<BR>engine is an incremental improvement on their own inline engine. The biggest<BR>difference is that the aircraft is a monocoque construction, whihc, while<BR>important, was done very early on...I believe the first all-metal monocoque<BR>airframe flew around 1920.<BR><BR>In Traveller terms a Spitfire is TL6, the Wright Flyer is high TL5, maybe<BR>early TL6. Very closely related. <BR><BR>It is NOT a fly-by-wire inherently unstable turbojet propelled aircraft made<BR>of advanced composites designed to operate in the trans-sonic regime.<BR><BR>An F-22 is solidly TL-8 in many respects. (I know I know, at TL8 we're<BR>supposed to have contragrav, but TL 8 computers weigh tons and 'Advanced<BR>Composites' are TL-8 material.)<BR><BR>&gt;So you know the plans belonged to a race who are a few tech levels ahead of<BR>&gt;the imperium. an aircraft corp had aquired the plans spent a few years<BR>&gt;trying to reverse engineer them to produce fighters for the imperium.<BR>&gt;figuring if they could then they could deffinatly aquire the contracts for a<BR>&gt;LOT of fighters for the next few years. lots of money on the line. They<BR>&gt;succeded in producing 2 prototypes which were of far poorer quality then the<BR>&gt;originals. ie lack of proper materials magic boxes that were not as magical<BR>&gt;as the orignial boxes. the fighters were supperior to what was currently on<BR>&gt;the market.<BR><BR>'A few Tech levels' is a huge leap! A few tech levels separate the 'Thrust<BR>SSC' from a 'Tom Thumb'...<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I am trying to get an idea if in 3 weeks he could pull anything useful out<BR>&gt;of it. the time he ahd with it was actually less than that because they had<BR>&gt;to decrypt the data to begin with. All in all i would say he had maybe at<BR>&gt;most a week or maybe a week and half with the complete plans.<BR><BR>In a week? He wouldn't be able to do much more than look at the pretty<BR>pictures. Give them two years, and they might start to understand things.<BR><BR>Equivalent: Go get an advanced astrophysics, electronics or medical text<BR>(something you don't know much about) .<BR><BR>Now get the Russian edition.<BR><BR>NOW try to pass a PhD orals exam (the equivalent of building a fighter plane)<BR>in that subject in a week.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:52:52 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>Tod Glenn writes:<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;Current, high tech weapons like the ACR (the real one, not the Traveller<BR>&gt;weapon) gave only marginally better performance over existing weapons at a<BR>&gt;higher cost.&nbsp; The OICW is expected to cost tens of thousands of dollars, and<BR>&gt;even mass production will only bring this down into the thousands, while the<BR>&gt;typical assault rifle can be mass produced for under $100 per unit.<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Efficiency considerations like this will certainly influence the use of<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; weapons on many worlds, but for units like marines that are costing<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; huge amounts to move from planet to planet, it may be worth<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; spending a lot to get a little increase in lethality.&nbsp; For that reason I<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; have always assumed that planetary armies tend to equip their<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; soldiers with relatively cheap weapons (rifles, autorifles, assault<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; rifles) while marines carry as good as they can get.&nbsp; Of course,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; most armies will also include elite units with top-of-the-line<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; equipment.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 09:00:45 +1100 <BR>From: Paul Harris &lt;paul.harris@dytech.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Subject:TNE<BR><BR>Bad...bad Rob...bad bad Rob go sit in the corner... very bad... no<BR>Traveller for you for a week! ;&gt;<BR><BR>It had jump drives, all of the traveller ships and weapons, shared the<BR>same history. I'm using TNE to play a campaign in the middle of the<BR>Fifth Frontier War. Its spirit feels fine to me. <BR><BR>Have no problems with the setting either. <BR><BR>But that is just my not so humble opinion.<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Rob Myers [mailto:robm@onetel.net.uk]<BR>Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 12:41 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Subject:TNE<BR><BR><BR>The setting and system are great (I flicked through a copy at the BITS<BR>stand at Dragonmeet), they just aren't Traveller in spirit. It's not<BR>Galactica 1980, but it does feel like an exploitation sequel. It's like<BR>2300AD had Hard Times following the Kafer War. Now there's a thought...<BR><BR>- - Rob.<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>On Wednesday, January 31, 2001, at 03:56 AM, Don Roberts wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I know that I am going to probably start a storm of <BR>&gt; controversy here, but I am rather fond of the TNE <BR>&gt; setting for Traveller.&nbsp; I think the setting was well <BR>&gt; thought out and reflected an imaginatively fresh way <BR>&gt; of looking at the traveller universe.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:31:02 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Blast From the Past! Original TML Landgrab Proposal!<BR><BR>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR>- --------------0CA9846816CB335F9F3E93EE<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR>Here's Doug Berry's original post that kicked off the TML Landgrab:<BR><BR><BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>- --------------0CA9846816CB335F9F3E93EE<BR>Content-Type: message/rfc822<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR>Content-Disposition: inline<BR><BR>Received: from lists.imagiconline.com (lists.imagiconline.com [204.85.32.11])<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by premier1.premier.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id RAA24573;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 17:19:42 -0600 (CST)<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.imagiconline.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id SAA64305;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 18:03:25 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com)<BR>Received: by lists.imagiconline.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 13 Mar 2000 18:03:18 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.imagiconline.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id SAA64288<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-outgoing; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 18:03:18 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com)<BR>Received: from smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (smtp10.atl.mindspring.net [207.69.200.246])<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.imagiconline.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id SAA64283<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for &lt;traveller@lists.imagiconline.com&gt;; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 18:03:17 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from gridlore@pop.mindspring.com)<BR>Received: from user-2inio83.dialup.mindspring.com (user-2inio83.dialup.mindspring.com [165.121.97.3])<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by smtp10.atl.mindspring.net (8.9.3/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA15680;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 13 Mar 2000 18:03:14 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;3.0.5.16.20000313150314.474f323a@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>X-Sender: gridlore@pop.mindspring.com<BR>X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (16)<BR>Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 15:03:14<BR>To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Apathy (was: re: ULTIMATE yaddayaddayadda)<BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;v04210100b4f2f2f4fba8@[195.102.197.10]&gt;<BR>Mime-Version: 1.0<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"<BR>Sender: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000<BR><BR>At 07:44 PM 3/13/2000 +0000, Dom wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I fully support people actively trying to promote Traveller by their <BR>&gt;work in it, or by offering to help; I feel cynical about the reality <BR>&gt;of a mass of people sitting there waiting to be asked to make it <BR>&gt;right.<BR><BR>Damn right, and well said!<BR><BR>Folks, I have in hand my first published game design. It did not happen<BR>because I waited for it to happen, it happened because I put my ideas out<BR>there, James Lindsay pounded me on the head to show me where I was wrong,<BR>and Andy Lilly published the thing. So now I can look up my name in the<BR>Library of Congress. I have an ISBN number. That may not mean much to you,<BR>but for me it's quite important. Because someday, somewhere, I'm going to<BR>confuse the hell out of a grad student looking up something.<BR><BR>So think of an idea and do something! The whole "Mafia in Traveller" thread<BR>has me preparing an idea for Andy about a "101 Mobs" book for BITS. Not the<BR>greatest writer? Find somebody on the TML who wants to work with you. I've<BR>never met James, wouldn't know him if he punched me in the face, but we<BR>managed to write what I think is a very nice set of rules over the Internet.<BR><BR>Here on the TML we like to talk about the "Black Hole of Quality;" the<BR>mysterious force that sucks well-developed and useful ideas directly onto<BR>hard drives. I have over two megs of old messages that I saved because they<BR>impressed me as being useful.&nbsp; The talent is here. What we do with it is up<BR>to us.<BR><BR>We can't re-write Traveller. Marc is doing that, and has been kind enough<BR>to solicit our opinions. We can't resurrect old versions of the game as a<BR>universal panacea for all Traveller fans. What we can do is keep building<BR>on the base that Traveller has.<BR><BR>To go back to our "Dune" discussions of last week, "Apathy is the<BR>Game-killer". Too many good games and companies have gone down the tubes<BR>because the fans just expected to be fed an ever-increasing diet of quality<BR>materials. Doesn't work that way anymore kids.<BR><BR>To shake the apathy, I have a suggestion: The TML 2000 Landgrab. <BR><BR>Anyone interested takes a world in the Spinward Marches and details the<BR>hell out of it. First In would be preferred, but any of the earlier systems<BR>will be acceptable. climate, Culture, Ecosystems, Government, odd laws,<BR>religions, notable events for 1100-1120, linguistic notes.. everything to<BR>make each world a living experience.<BR><BR>Unlike the THUDDD, these would be cooperative endeavors. If I need help<BR>with determining if a certain set of laws is feasible, I can call upon the<BR>assembled brains of the TML for help; if somebody has a question about how<BR>an army would be organized, I'd probably be able to answer. This would<BR>stimulate the already fascinating conversations we have here.<BR><BR>As we finish, we post our worlds either here or on a web site (to be named<BR>later) for everyone's use. Then you take another world. Doesn't matter how<BR>long it takes, but the end result should be a living planet.<BR><BR>I dibs Regina/Heya (2402)<BR><BR>&lt;MST3K&gt;Well, what do you think, Sirs?&lt;/MST3K&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/sylea.html<BR><BR>TML Great Old One<BR>Plague of the Traveller Riders of the Apocalypse<BR>Chant "Gridlore" thrice to summon.<BR><BR><BR><BR>- --------------0CA9846816CB335F9F3E93EE--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:33:44 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: TML Landgrab Questions Answered by Example [Fwd: Heya/Regina]<BR><BR>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR>- --------------DCC60E39F329712F36A7DD47<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR>And here's Doug's post describing Heya:<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>- --------------DCC60E39F329712F36A7DD47<BR>Content-Type: message/rfc822<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR>Content-Disposition: inline<BR><BR>Received: from lists.imagiconline.com (lists.imagiconline.com [204.85.32.11])<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by premier1.premier.net (8.9.3/8.9.3) with ESMTP id OAA13132;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 14:30:06 -0500 (CDT)<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.imagiconline.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id PAA10421;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 15:14:44 -0400 (EDT)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com)<BR>Received: by lists.imagiconline.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 5 Apr 2000 15:14:42 -0400<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.imagiconline.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id PAA10395<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-outgoing; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 15:14:42 -0400 (EDT)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com)<BR>Received: from smtp6.mindspring.com (smtp6.mindspring.com [207.69.200.110])<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.imagiconline.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with ESMTP id PAA10386<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for &lt;traveller@lists.imagiconline.com&gt;; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 15:14:40 -0400 (EDT)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from gridlore@pop.mindspring.com)<BR>Received: from user-33qtgnh.dialup.mindspring.com (user-33qtgnh.dialup.mindspring.com [199.174.194.241])<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by smtp6.mindspring.com (8.9.3/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA31604<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for &lt;traveller@lists.imagiconline.com&gt;; Wed, 5 Apr 2000 15:14:35 -0400 (EDT)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;3.0.5.16.20000405121205.09cfec7e@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>X-Sender: gridlore@pop.mindspring.com<BR>X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.5 (16)<BR>Date: Wed, 05 Apr 2000 12:12:05<BR>To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Heya/Regina<BR>Mime-Version: 1.0<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"<BR>Sender: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000<BR><BR>Well, here it is:<BR><BR><BR>Heya/Regina B-667745-5 Ag Ri<BR><BR>Primary : Bellus, K6v&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Secondary : Zyra, M0v<BR>Temperature 4940 K&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Temperature 3900 K<BR>Luminosity&nbsp; .312 sols&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Luminosity&nbsp; 0.071 sols<BR>Mass&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; .747 sols&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Mass&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0.516 sols<BR>Radius&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0.007 AU&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Radius&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 0.005 AU<BR>Safe Jump&nbsp;&nbsp; 1.4 AU&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Safe Jump&nbsp;&nbsp; 1.08 AU<BR>Age&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 3.7 billion years&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Age&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 3.7 billion years<BR><BR>Orbital distances, AU&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Companion Parameters<BR>Inner limit 0.15&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Average orbital radius 17 AU<BR>Inner life&nbsp; 0.53&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Eccentricity&nbsp;&nbsp; 0.8<BR>Outer life&nbsp; 0.73&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Revolution period 81.1 years<BR>Snow line&nbsp;&nbsp; 2.8<BR>Outer limit 29.8<BR><BR>NOTE: During portions of Zyra's orbit, the star's mass can interfere with<BR>jumpspace insertion or exit. Consult IISS/SM Publication #33243 _Pilot<BR>Advisories For Regina/Spinward Marches_ for details.<BR><BR>Worlds :-<BR>Orbit&nbsp;&nbsp; Name&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Diam|Dens|Grav&nbsp;&nbsp; Rot&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Rev&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; e&nbsp; &nbsp; Type<BR><BR>.3 AU&nbsp;&nbsp; Bracers&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Planetoid Belt<BR><BR>.7 AU&nbsp;&nbsp; Heya&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 5656|5.4|.67&nbsp; &nbsp; 22.5h&nbsp; &nbsp; 247.5d&nbsp; .05&nbsp; Earthlike<BR><BR>1.1 AU&nbsp; MacBride&nbsp;&nbsp; 35,644|1.4|1.1&nbsp; &nbsp; 14.2h&nbsp; &nbsp; 487.6d&nbsp; .05&nbsp; Gas Giant<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;5&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; eight shepherd moons, ring system<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 6&nbsp; Colin&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 2317|3.9|.18&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; TideLock&nbsp;&nbsp; 19.3h&nbsp;&nbsp; .03&nbsp; Rockball<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Fuel processing station<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 9&nbsp; Angus&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 382|4.1|.03&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; TideLock&nbsp;&nbsp; 23.6h&nbsp;&nbsp; .04&nbsp; Rockball<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 12 Kate&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 415|3.2|.03&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 131.8h&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 27.2h&nbsp;&nbsp; .002 Rockball<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 16 Jacob&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1068|3.5|.08&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 29.4h&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 31.5h&nbsp;&nbsp; .001 Rockball<BR><BR>Notes for pilots: Heya system is remarkably clear of debris.&nbsp; Orbital<BR>control typical of that required by Class IV Starports. <BR><BR>Imperial Interstellar Scout Service<BR>System Overview: Heya/Regina 1120<BR><BR>SUMMARY: An agricultural world, which is vital to the stability of the<BR>subsector.&nbsp; Several recent events have begun to destabilize this world and<BR>must be dealt with quickly.<BR><BR>PHYSICAL: Heya is a small, dense world.&nbsp; Despite its unusual mass, mining<BR>operations have been unprofitable. The planet is seismicaly active, with<BR>five major plates. The most tectonicaly active portion of the planet is the<BR>Disappointment Mountains, which have several large volcanoes, and are<BR>moving northwest at 8mm/standard year.&nbsp; The average gravity is .67 g<BR><BR>The planet's surface is divided between oceans that cover 70% of the<BR>surface, two major continents, and numerous islands.&nbsp; There is geological<BR>evidence that a third continent sank within the last million years.<BR><BR>Heya is tilted 55 degrees, and orbits Bellus once every 247.5 days. This<BR>extreme tilt, combined with the relatively dense atmosphere (1.2 atm) makes<BR>weather on Heya very intense.&nbsp; The passage of Zyra adds to the energy<BR>potential of the atmosphere, creating even stronger storms once a standard<BR>century.<BR><BR>The average planetary temperature is 297 K (75 F).&nbsp; Zyra's passage adds<BR>only a few degrees.&nbsp; The world has no permanent ice caps, but seasonal caps<BR>do appear.<BR><BR>BIOLOGY: Life on Heya is as diverse as anywhere in known space.&nbsp; The base<BR>of the food chain is found in the micro-life of the oceans. Sea life is<BR>found in an astounding variety of forms. The largest sea-forms are the<BR>Levits, gigantic animals up to 500 feet long that act as filters, scooping<BR>up what ever enters their vacuum-like gullets.&nbsp; <BR><BR>On land, life has had to adapt to the harsh climate. Plant life tends to be<BR>low and firmly rooted.&nbsp; One interesting adaptation is fasciweed, which<BR>secretes a gluey resin. When individual plants are blown into each other,<BR>they stick together, increasing their collective strength.&nbsp; Facsiweed is a<BR>major cash crop, but also a major annoyance as it tends to stick to<BR>everything is touches.<BR><BR>Area producers like most grasses never developed on Heya. The need for<BR>plants to grab energy from the weak light of Bellus caused plants to<BR>develop broad leaves. This blocks out the light, leaving surface types to<BR>starve. Despite this, there are several types of moss-like plant that feed<BR>on the decaying leaves of the larger plants around them.<BR><BR>Heya's land animals show the same sturdiness.&nbsp; Animals are hexapods, and<BR>tend to be squat and massive.&nbsp; Oddly, most predators are aerial, taking<BR>advantage of the strong winds to carry them to different hunting grounds.<BR>The Heyan Dragon is the largest of these, averaging 400 kg.&nbsp; Animal life is<BR>either migratory, or equipped to deal with the harsh seasonal storms.<BR>There is an entire set of life forms that are adapted to the conditions of<BR>Zyra's passage.<BR><BR>CULTURAL: Heya was settled by members of the Thammerite Church in the late<BR>400s after acquiring the colonization rights from Sternmetal Horizons.&nbsp; The<BR>sect that settled on Heya had come to the conclusion that an over-reliance<BR>on technology was "Null-Bartha" (wrong or evil), and that a simple life is<BR>the key to happiness.<BR><BR>The colonists have voluntarily limited themselves to an industrial,<BR>pre-fusion level of manufacturing capability.&nbsp; Even then, lower tech<BR>solutions are commonly employed.&nbsp; In the countryside, animal drawn wagons<BR>are the most common form of transportation, and visitors marvel at the hand<BR>built windmills that power grain mills.<BR><BR>Heyans have not completely rejected technology; they just judge whether an<BR>item is necessary to their lives.&nbsp; Each farming community will have one<BR>grav ambulance with a life support unit to handle emergencies, and most<BR>farmsteads have ties to the global weather net.&nbsp; The overall mix of<BR>technological levels can become very confusing, as a local will actively<BR>embrace one item, but refuse to use a similar item for reason that are<BR>incomprehensible to the observer.<BR><BR>Life on Heya is centered around the family and the village.&nbsp; Villages from<BR>focal points for the collection of products for sale, and a point for<BR>skilled craftsmen to work from.&nbsp; Local government (see below) usually base<BR>from the village hall, which doubles as a meeting place, school, or dance<BR>hall as needed.&nbsp; Families are large, an average of 4.7 children per family.<BR>Heyans are monogamist, and marriage is treated as a very solemn, sacred<BR>thing.<BR><BR>When dealing with outsiders, Heyans have been described as taciturn<BR>bordering on mute.&nbsp; Visitors are lucky to receive answers with more than a<BR>quick "Ayep" or "Naw."&nbsp; Asking for directions when away from the major<BR>settlements can be difficult, as most Heyans will not only use physical<BR>landmarks, but local history as well.&nbsp; ("When you get the field where Old<BR>Will got his hip broke by the 'ket back in '91, turn left.")<BR><BR>GOVERNMENT: Heya is classified as a Representative Democracy.&nbsp; The planet<BR>is divided into five Districts, each of which has a Council which in turn<BR>elects members to the World Council.&nbsp; The franchise is granted to all<BR>members of the Thammerite Church upon reaching their 20th birthday.<BR><BR>The Councils are responsible for the writing of all laws and regulations.<BR>Law enforcement and judicial powers are vested in the Proctors, a<BR>quasi-religious group that use both the written law and Thammerite sacred<BR>writings to investigate crimes and hand down judgments.&nbsp; Overall, the laws<BR>are not overly burdensome and cover the standard range of criminal offenses.<BR><BR>In 1117, the World Council began moving to create an oversight committee<BR>that would have power of review over the Proctors.&nbsp; Many of the more<BR>conservative elements of society are vehemently opposed to this as an<BR>unwarranted intrusion on the traditional powers of the Proctors.<BR><BR>Elections are held once every two local years, and are generally low-key<BR>affairs.&nbsp; Councilors are returned to their seats more than 70% of the time.<BR>Seats on the World Council are held for life, or until the Councilor's<BR>home District votes to remove him.<BR><BR>ECONOMY:&nbsp; Heya is an agricultural world, and ships the majority of its<BR>produce to the high population worlds of Regina subsector.&nbsp; Fasciweed in<BR>particular is quite nutritious, and is ground into flour or meal.&nbsp; Heyan is<BR>also known for its seafood, but this is more a delicacy than a staple.&nbsp; The<BR>cost of shipping from remote Heya makes Heyan seafood extremely expensive.<BR>As such, it has become something of a status symbol on Efate/Regina.<BR><BR>Heya has a World Trade Number (Lunion School of Economics method) of 4.<BR><BR>The local currency is the Lar, and is issued by the Central Bank of Brian's<BR>Crossing under license from the World Council.&nbsp; The Central Bank maintains<BR>mints in each of the five District capitals, and keeps a close hold on the<BR>planet's money supply.&nbsp; The rate of exchange is 32 Lar = 1 Imperial Credit.<BR>Credits are usually accepted in Brian's Crossing, but it is difficult to<BR>find anyone in the rural areas set up to accept them.&nbsp; Travellers should<BR>also be advised that items like credit transfer sticks are practically<BR>unknown on Heya.&nbsp; Cash, or hand-written checks drawn on established<BR>accounts are the norm.<BR><BR>The average per capita income for a Heyan is Cr. 1,718/54,976 Lar.&nbsp; The<BR>actual income is lower, as taxes are fairly high.&nbsp; There is a sharp<BR>division in actual income between a number of wealthy landowners and the<BR>tenants who farm their lands under contract.&nbsp; Depending upon the<BR>personality of the land owner, the tenants can live comfortably or in<BR>abject poverty.&nbsp; The Gross Planetary Product for 1115 was 120 billion Credits.<BR><BR>MAJOR SETTLEMENTS:&nbsp; The single large city on Heya is Brian's Crossing,<BR>located at the mouth of the Revel River.&nbsp; As of 1120, the city has a<BR>population of 2.3 million.&nbsp; Brian's Crossing (BC to the locals) has been<BR>described as "a collision between the Imperium and Heya."&nbsp; The presence of<BR>Eric Minous Starport and the trading companies buying Heya's abundant<BR>agricultural products does lead to such incongruous sight as a steam<BR>powered train transferring drain to a modern grav cargo loader.<BR><BR>In the last six years, a large Vargr ghetto has grown up on the south side<BR>of BC, near the starport.&nbsp; This area has become an increasing problem to<BR>both the Proctors and the Starport officials, as it is obvious that the<BR>Vargr are establishing an extensive criminal organization.<BR><BR>RECENT HISTORY:&nbsp; During the Fifth Frontier War, Heya was attacked and<BR>briefly occupied by vargr force attached to the Gireel Fleet.&nbsp; While there<BR>was little actual damage done, the Heyans were angered deeply by the<BR>actions of the vargr troops, who did little to endear themselves to the<BR>populace by engaging in large scale looting and vandalism.<BR><BR>After the war, the Imperium was attempting to settle the millions of vargr<BR>refugees that had washed up on worlds like Jesedipere and Lablon.<BR>Desperately seeking space, the Ministry of Colonization shipped fifty<BR>thousand refugees to Heya in 1114.<BR><BR>When the World Council objected, the Ministry quietly reminded them of the<BR>massive loans granted to the world for starport upgrades and the purchase<BR>and subsidy of the gigantic bulk carriers.&nbsp; The message was clear: accept<BR>the vargr, or the balance on the loans would be called in immediately.<BR><BR>The vargr were not suited for Heya.&nbsp; very few had been farmers, or had any<BR>desire to be farmers.&nbsp; Most of the transported vargr stayed in Brian's<BR>Crossing, creating an instant crush on the civic services.&nbsp; The few who did<BR>venture into the farming areas found themselves practically enslaved as<BR>tenant farmers, never quite making enough to pay off their debts.<BR><BR>In Brian's Crossing itself, the vargr found themselves at the mercy of the<BR>Proctors, who applied the law with no mercy.&nbsp; The new Heyans quickly<BR>learned that crimes against them went uninvestigated, while even the most<BR>minor offense committed by a Vargr led to harsh punishments.&nbsp; This further<BR>isolated the new vargr community, who began to look inward for leadership<BR>and protection.<BR><BR>To add to the problem, some humans began treating the vargr as legitimate<BR>targets for abuse.&nbsp; The hysteria reached a peak in 1118 when Tal Mori, a<BR>respected by very conservative religious leader declared that all vargr<BR>were Null-Bartha, and as such were not protected as intelligent beings.<BR><BR>Faced with this environment, the vargr of Heya naturally began forming<BR>ad-hoc protection groups, usually under a single charismatic leader.<BR>Clashes between human and vargr escalated throughout the summer of 1119,<BR>Culminating with the grisly discovery of twelve human heads stacked on the<BR>Davis St. bridge over the Revel.&nbsp; This bridge marks the boundary of<BR>Dogtown, and the heads were those of a known anti-vargr gang. A note<BR>attached to the pile said "don't ask what we did with the bodies."<BR><BR>Since that night, a state of near siege has existed in Brian's Crossing.<BR>At the request of the World Council, the Imperial Navy has stationed<BR>Cruiser Squadron 7721 (INV Dawson's Christen, CL-12769 and INV Leslie Fish,<BR>CL-129200) on permanent picket duty, due to fears of vargr raids.&nbsp; It is<BR>known that the vargr are making contact with off-world allies, and<BR>attempting to smuggle in weapons and gear.&nbsp; In return, the World Council<BR>and Proctors continue to enact even more restrictive laws against the Vargr<BR>population.<BR><BR>IISS and Subsector officials are hoping to find a way to mediate the<BR>situation at talks scheduled to begin on 130-1120.<BR><BR>- --<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>"I created the universe; give ME the gift certificate!!"<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - Lisa Simpson, Overachiever<BR><BR><BR><BR>- --------------DCC60E39F329712F36A7DD47--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3581<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yc03.mx.aol.com (rly-yc03.mail.aol.com [172.18.149.35]) by air-yc01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 17:37:06 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yc03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 17:36:00 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id RAA05374;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 17:32:55 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 31 Jan 2001 17:32:26 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id RAA05318<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 17:32:26 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 17:32:26 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200101312232.RAA05318@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3581<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3582</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/31/01 4:11:30 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; Wednesday, January 31 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3582<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: System Writeup Outline<BR>trav url<BR>RE: Landgrabs<BR>Re: trav url<BR>RE: trav url<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>re: Landgrab Question<BR>Re: Blast From the Past! Original TML Landgrab Proposal!<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>re: TML Landgrab Questions Answered by Example [Fwd: <BR>Re: TML Landgrab Questions Answered by Example [Fwd: <BR>RE: TML Landgrab Questions Answered by Example [Fwd: <BR>who invented the jump drive (was RE: Interstellar <BR>URGENT: Contact for Swordy?<BR>RE: A ship design question<BR>Re: URGENT: Contact for Swordy?<BR>Re: who invented the jump drive (was RE: Interstellar <BR>Re: Landgrab Question<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 09:38:23 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: System Writeup Outline<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Eris asked:<BR>&gt;What do you think *has* to be in system details and how should it be<BR>&gt;organized for best use? Do you have some examples, published or<BR>&gt;web-published of really good writeups you'd suggest I emulate?<BR><BR>When I wrote the RICE Paper for Tavonni I looked through some of the world<BR>write-ups that were done by GDW and DGP, plus a few of the other RICE<BR>Papers. I didn't put every subject heading in, but just the ones I felt<BR>were relevant (ie. the ones I could write info for!).<BR><BR>Things such as basic stats, history, verbal system description, mainworld<BR>description including planetary highlights, society description,<BR>government, and system UPP's in a table at the end. Other elements could<BR>include a description of any minor race that calls the world "home", plus a<BR>set of write-ups on the worlds major NPC's - or, the ones the PC's are more<BR>likely to encounter. In other words, think along the lines of the old JTAS:<BR>Contact!, Casual Encounter, etc.<BR><BR>Other things, more specific to the PC's might be world-specific trade<BR>rules, equipment availability lists, and other details you have<BR>hand-tailored for the world. Don't forget a Tech Profile and Legal Profile<BR>from _World Builder's Handbook_; these can be used to let the PC's know<BR>what items of equipment are legal, or act as a catalyst for you to think up<BR>some weird or unusual laws. For example, automatic weapons might be<BR>allowed, but there might be a ban on all robotics, for instance.<BR><BR>Just extra flavour to make each world different.<BR><BR>(BTW, unless you have copious amounts of time, you only go into this<BR>full-fledged detail for your main "base" campaign world - or set of worlds<BR>- - otherwise you end up tearing your hair out over all the details. GDW went<BR>into this sort of detail for all the main worlds of the RC, for example.<BR>Another option is to used previously-published worlds, after filing off the<BR>serial numbers of course.)<BR><BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 09:42:29 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: trav url<BR><BR>- ------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:35:44 -0700<BR>From: Cliff Linehan &lt;clinehan@sfamipec.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:14:49 -0000 From: "Antony Farrell"<BR>&gt; &lt;Skaran@bigpond.com&gt;<BR>&gt;How about a challenge for all the Traveller enthusiasts with web sites.<BR>&gt;Lets all put in a concerted efforts to get some updates up and running.<BR><BR>I have updated my site already today (Jan 30, 2001), and the last time I<BR>updated it was yesterday (Jan 29, 2001).<BR><BR>&gt;"coming soon" messages dated more than a year ago.<BR><BR>It should read "Nothing to see, Please move on."<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 11:38:40 -0000 From: "Trevor, Peter"<BR>&gt; &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>&gt;This could be&nbsp; a&nbsp; result&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; feedback&nbsp; (or&nbsp; lack&nbsp; of)&nbsp; that<BR>&gt;webmeisters get for their efforts.<BR><BR>I can count on one hand the number of people that have e-mailed me about my<BR>site, and I still have fingers left over.<BR><BR>&gt;If they know people are reading their site and taking an interest<BR>&gt;they might be more inclined to keep working on it.<BR><BR>Any response is always nice.<BR><BR>&gt;And how many people here use "Galactic"<BR>&gt;but haven't achknowledged this to Jim Vassila.<BR><BR>His last name is Vassilakos, and I am currently working with him on fixing<BR>a<BR>few bugs in Galactic.<BR><BR>&gt;I only have email access at work&nbsp; but&nbsp; as&nbsp; soon&nbsp; as&nbsp; I&nbsp; get&nbsp; home<BR>&gt;tonight I am going to pick and review at least one site ...&nbsp; lets<BR>&gt;all do the same thing and see what we get over the next few days.<BR>&gt;Regards PLST<BR><BR>You are welcome to review mine if you wish.<BR>http://herons-reach.homepage.com/traveller<BR><BR>Clifford Linehan<BR>http://herons-reach.homepage.com/traveller<BR>Developing Vlanchiets Qlom and the Core Route.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 14:59:53 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Landgrabs<BR><BR>Im going to try and do one also.<BR><BR>Ill go search the spinward marches and figure out what world i am going to<BR>do 8)<BR><BR>hasta<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Gordon Hundley [mailto:gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk]<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2001 12:45 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrabs<BR><BR><BR>on 31/1/01 11:54 am, Trevor, Peter at Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I notice that the TML Landgrab page&nbsp; (at&nbsp; downport.com)&nbsp; has&nbsp; not<BR>&gt; been maintained&nbsp; for&nbsp; awhile&nbsp; despite&nbsp; there&nbsp; being&nbsp; some&nbsp; recent<BR>&gt; changes.&nbsp; What gives?&nbsp; Is the 'Claims Officer' on this list?<BR><BR>I assume they'd all be on the list, so folk, please use this sorted version<BR>that I culled from Downport and comment on what's missing or superseded:<BR><BR>L'oeil d'Dieu/Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; Robert O'Connor<BR>Naseem/Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; SEC:UNCLASS*<BR>Patinir / Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; Jesse DeGraff<BR>Zila/Aramis&nbsp; &nbsp; Derek Dees<BR><BR>Cipango/Chronor&nbsp; &nbsp; P-O Bergstedt<BR><BR>Bularia/Darrian&nbsp; &nbsp; Andy Akins<BR><BR>567-908/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Ron Brown<BR>Collace/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Bloo<BR>Elixabeth/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Tim Reynolds<BR>Forine/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Tim Reynolds<BR>Milagro/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Rob Miracle<BR>Sequallia/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Walt Smith<BR>Singer/District 268&nbsp; &nbsp; Tommy Grav<BR><BR>875-496/Five Sisters&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; Justice Hypercleats<BR>876-574/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Mike McKeown<BR>Andory/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; David Summers<BR>Candory/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; David Summers<BR>Karin/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Nick Wright<BR>Ochetate/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Ian Whitchurch<BR>Penelope/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Kurt Brown<BR>Wonstar/Five Sisters&nbsp; &nbsp; Michael Houghton<BR><BR>Aki/Glisten&nbsp; &nbsp; Glenn Grant<BR>Aster/Glisten&nbsp; &nbsp; AB<BR>Tirem/Glisten&nbsp; &nbsp; Awchee Rin-Tin-Tindell<BR><BR>871-438/Jewel&nbsp; &nbsp; X-TEK<BR>Esalin/Jewell&nbsp; &nbsp; Luther Martin<BR>Mongo/Jewell&nbsp; &nbsp; Glenn Goffin<BR><BR>Cogri/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Roderick Elliott<BR>Dinom/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Denis Alain<BR>Equus/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Eric Holmes<BR>Lanth/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Paulo Vicente<BR>Quopist/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Miller<BR>Wypoc/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; William Hostman<BR>Ylaven/Lanth&nbsp; &nbsp; Paul Campbell<BR><BR>Spirelle/Lunion&nbsp; &nbsp; Steve Charlton<BR>Tenalphi/Lunion&nbsp; &nbsp; Doug Berry<BR><BR>Carey/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Roderick Elliott<BR>Dojodo/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Newman<BR>Duale/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Eberhard Schulz<BR>Mora/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Dan Lane<BR>Nexine/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; Shane Thomas<BR>Rorise/Mora&nbsp; &nbsp; AB<BR><BR>Retinae/Querion&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Eberhard Schulz<BR>Thanber/Querion&nbsp; &nbsp; Jason Postma<BR><BR>Heya/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Doug Berry<BR>Jenghe/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Cheryl Stella<BR>Moughas/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; *Michael Hughes<BR>Regina/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Cheryl Glenn<BR>Uakye/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Todd Moody<BR>Yori/Regina&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Trevor<BR><BR>Cipatwe/Rhylanor&nbsp; &nbsp; Kevin C. Carpenter<BR>Jivije/Rylanor&nbsp; &nbsp; Darryl Adams<BR>Rhylanor/Rhylanor&nbsp; &nbsp; Volker Greimann<BR><BR>Excalibur/Sword Worlds&nbsp; &nbsp; Colin Michael<BR>Sting/Sword Worlds&nbsp; &nbsp; Peter Trevor<BR><BR>Conway/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; Julius Waller<BR>Leander/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; Baroness Margaret<BR>Prilissa/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; John Wood<BR>Trin/Trin's Veil&nbsp; &nbsp; Ben Aaronovitch<BR><BR>Arden/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; James Lindsay<BR>Ficant/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; A. M-Vallance<BR>Phlume/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; Alan Bradley<BR>Tavonni/Vilis&nbsp; &nbsp; David Jaques-Watson<BR><BR>If required, I'm happy to offer my services to maintain the list.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 09:43:55 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: Re: trav url<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Sorry, typed in the wrong address shortcut. I've now sent it (correctly)<BR>home).<BR><BR>- - Hyphen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:06:01 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: trav url<BR><BR>Well i found a really great map site at that url. and if you were going to<BR>include a different url (at least that is what it seems from your message<BR>here) you forgot to add it.<BR><BR>Nice site book marked it for future refrence.<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>[mailto:david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au]<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2001 2:44 PM<BR>To: traveller@ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: trav url<BR><BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Sorry, typed in the wrong address shortcut. I've now sent it (correctly)<BR>home).<BR><BR>- - Hyphen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 18:03:54 -0500<BR>From: "Daniel Phelps" &lt;phelpsd@gate.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>Was written:<BR><BR>&gt;Hell I could probably take my 60-year old S&amp;W revolver just about anywhere<BR>in<BR>&gt;the OTU and have it work pretty damn reliably. Not mil-spec, in the field<BR>for<BR>&gt;months without cleaning under constant fire reliable, but definitely as a<BR>&gt;carry sidearm reliable.<BR><BR><BR>Recall Webber's scene where Honor Harrington pulls a recreated 1911 A1 out<BR>of a box and puts paid to the nasties?&nbsp; It was "below their radar" and<BR>didn't register as a weapon.&nbsp; Should have been your S&amp;W revolver recreated.<BR><BR>Simple rugged and efficient systems work because a truly good design,<BR>operated within its design parameters, is universal in its application and<BR>economical in its production.<BR><BR>Dan<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:17:11 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Landgrab Question<BR><BR>&gt;From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>&gt;How does one participate in the landgrab?<BR>&gt;what are the rules?<BR><BR>First, you have to post a thorough and detailed essay analyzing the<BR>differences between world scaping as described by Roger Zelazney in Isle<BR>of the Dead and To Die in Italbar with ordinary terraforming as practiced<BR>by the Imperial Ministry of Colonization and its Zhodani and Solomani<BR>counterparts.&nbsp; Provide special sections addressing: functionality of end<BR>result to ordinary world dwellers; advantages and disadvantages of each<BR>method to interstellar society; and consideration of approaches likely<BR>used by the Ancients.&nbsp; <BR><BR>A panel of Great Old Ones will review your essay and grant you entry to<BR>the Landgrab.&nbsp; <BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 23:29:20 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Blast From the Past! Original TML Landgrab Proposal!<BR><BR>Here's Gypsy Comets take on what a Landgrab document should have...Apologies <BR>for the HTML tags...<BR><BR>Mike<BR>....................<BR><BR>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; GypsyComet@aol.com<BR><BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR><BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR><BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR><BR></FONT><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=2 PTSIZE="10" FAMILY="SANSSERIF" BACK="#ffffff"><BR><BR></FONT><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial lang=0 size=3 PTSIZE="10" FAMILY="SANSSERIF" BACK="#ffffff">Someone <BR>asked what a Landgrab Document should include...<BR><BR><BR><BR>For starters, take your favorite Anal-Retentive world book (Scouts, Grand <BR><BR><BR>Survey/Census, World Builder's, World Tamer's, Pocket Empires or First In) <BR><BR><BR>and do EVERYTHING it provides procedures for (that apply; no need to <BR>generate <BR><BR>the entire history ala P.E.). Whether you roll dice or pull values off the <BR><BR><BR>chart to suit is of no import.<BR><BR>Next, use all this information to generate several finished documents:<BR><BR><BR><BR>- -The "short-form" Library Data entry that players will get if they look up <BR><BR><BR>the world. This should be no more than a few paragraphs, and often only <BR>one.<BR><BR>- -The Astrogator's Guide to the system: The UWPs for the entire system, as <BR><BR><BR>well as supplementary info like orbital eccentricities and orbital periods <BR><BR><BR>(ie. year length). Can also include notes on expected solar activity, <BR><BR>restricted flight paths, how the solar jump-horizon affects travel, <BR>available <BR><BR>highports vs downports, and other things the pilot/navigator would want to <BR><BR><BR>know.<BR><BR>- -The "One-Page" Library Data entry created by DGP: world UWP, system <BR><BR>schematic, world map, lots of color text. This will also include notes about <BR><BR><BR>Amber or Red status.<BR><BR>- -The "long form" Library Data entry that player Scouts get when they look up <BR><BR><BR>the world. May include most of the above generated info, as well as a basic <BR><BR><BR>UWP page for the entire system. This can include notes about Amber or Red <BR><BR><BR>status and tips for "Surviving the first 48 hours Onworld".<BR><BR><BR><BR>Other things are also possible. The recent tour prospectus is a marvelous <BR><BR><BR>example. Details like the Octogon Society buildings, whether or not the <BR>world <BR><BR>is on the XBoat routes, the name of the JTAS facility onworld, the name of <BR><BR><BR>the main port's StationMaster and/or PortMaster (or just the Security <BR><BR>Chief...)<BR><BR><BR><BR>You can also choose to ignore me&nbsp; ;&gt;&nbsp; but I would still consider the first <BR><BR><BR>three documents easy to do and most useful...<BR><BR><BR><BR>GC<BR>&lt;----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR><BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com&gt;<BR><BR><BR><BR>- ----Original Message Follows----<BR>From: John Groth<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To: TML<BR>Subject: Blast From the Past! Original TML Landgrab Proposal!<BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:31:02 -0600<BR>Here's Doug Berry's original post that kicked off the TML Landgrab:<BR>- --<BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR>&lt;&lt; message3.txt &gt;&gt;<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:33:46 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;Current, high tech weapons like the ACR (the real one, not the Traveller<BR>&gt; &gt;weapon) gave only marginally better performance over existing weapons at<BR>a<BR>&gt; &gt;higher cost.&nbsp; The OICW is expected to cost tens of thousands of dollars,<BR>and<BR>&gt; &gt;even mass production will only bring this down into the thousands, while<BR>the<BR>&gt; &gt;typical assault rifle can be mass produced for under $100 per unit.<BR>&gt; &lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Efficiency considerations like this will certainly influence the<BR>use of<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; weapons on many worlds, but for units like marines that are<BR>costing<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; huge amounts to move from planet to planet, it may be worth<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; spending a lot to get a little increase in lethality.&nbsp; For that<BR>reason I<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; have always assumed that planetary armies tend to equip their<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; soldiers with relatively cheap weapons (rifles, autorifles,<BR>assault<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; rifles) while marines carry as good as they can get.&nbsp; Of course,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; most armies will also include elite units with top-of-the-line<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; equipment.<BR><BR>I'm not sure, at least so far as small arms are concerned.&nbsp; Military<BR>procurement is geared to&nbsp; buying large numbers of items, and to simplify<BR>logistics, you want commonality.&nbsp; Plus the difference in lethality may be<BR>very modest, and the difference in cost could be better redirected<BR>elsewhere.&nbsp; Take the Assault rifle vs.&nbsp; the OICW.<BR><BR>Say the assault rifle is Cr100 to produce, the OICW is Cr1000.&nbsp; Assume a<BR>best case, and the OICW doubles the lethality of the old assault rifle.<BR>Firstly, small arms are responsible for only a small amount if battlefield<BR>casualties.&nbsp; Artillery, support weapons (MGs) mines and bombs make up over<BR>90% of the kills.&nbsp; Total effectiveness increase in negligible.<BR><BR>Lets suppose for the same cost of the OICS, we instead buy our assault<BR>rifle, and spend the difference buying more heavy weapons, bombs, mines etc.<BR>We get a much better return on our money in terms of the enemy casualties we<BR>can create.<BR><BR>Also, if we are transporting our troops all over hell and gone, we want<BR>simple, rugged weapons with lots of spare when our supply train is measured<BR>in parsecs.&nbsp; We can afford to buy every trooper two rifles.&nbsp; We still have<BR>money left over to buy grenades, LAWs or whatever. Does anyone realize how<BR>many weapons fail or are lost during combat? Lots.&nbsp; You'll need replacements<BR><BR>Slightly superior firearms will not carry the day.&nbsp; The German StG-44 was<BR>the most advanced weapon on the battlefield, but had no significant impact<BR>in any theatre employed.<BR><BR>I should also point out that the difference between cheap and effective and<BR>"top of the line" in terms of effectiveness is really minor.&nbsp; How much more<BR>effective is an HK MP-5 over a WWII MP-40?&nbsp; It's better packaging and there<BR>are provisions fore mounting special optics, silencer etc. Lethality is<BR>identical, reliability is close.<BR><BR>This, of course is different when you add a wide disparity in tech levels.<BR>What is cheap and effective at TL 5 is different than what is cheap and<BR>effective at TL15.<BR><BR>I expect marines to be equipped with the highest tech level available.&nbsp; But<BR>their weapons (small arms) will still be relatively low cost comparatively<BR>speaking. Logistics is what ultimately wins wars.&nbsp; Not super weapons or<BR>super warriors.&nbsp; Whoever gets the most bang for the buck prevails<BR>(typically).<BR><BR>JMHO, YMMV<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:38:57 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: TML Landgrab Questions Answered by Example [Fwd: <BR><BR>&gt;From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;And here's Doug's post describing Heya:<BR><BR>Doug's post led pretty directly to the Heyan Civil War, sometimes called<BR>the Heyan Farmers' War, in which the forcibly relocated Vargr who had<BR>turned to farming found themselves having to go to war with the human<BR>farmers who had been there for generations in order to avoid<BR>pauperization.&nbsp; The first skirmish of that war was a tank battle near the<BR>starport in which the human forces handily defeated the poorly designed<BR>(but very nicely painted) Vargr tanks.&nbsp; Another battle is expected to take<BR>place on 18 February 2001 at Dundracon in San Ramon, California.&nbsp; If I<BR>don't go skiing that weekend, I will attend.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Luther, if I do go skiing, shall I send you my red Vargr tanks?<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR><BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:44:25 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: TML Landgrab Questions Answered by Example [Fwd: <BR><BR>&gt; (but very nicely painted) Vargr tanks.&nbsp; Another battle is expected to take<BR>&gt; place on 18 February 2001 at Dundracon in San Ramon, California.&nbsp; If I<BR>&gt; don't go skiing that weekend, I will attend.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Luther, if I do go skiing, shall I send you my red Vargr tanks?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; --Glenn<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>If you do attend, can I expect another 'report from the field' for Le<BR>Mercenaire?<BR><BR>http://merc.travellercentral.com<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:44:02 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: TML Landgrab Questions Answered by Example [Fwd: <BR><BR>is San remon near San Francisco? <BR><BR>(just moved to cali 6 months ago. only reason i know where sacramento is<BR>because i drove through it 8P)<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Glenn Goffin [mailto:gmgoffin@yahoo.com]<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2001 3:39 PM<BR>To: traveller mailing aa list<BR>Subject: re: TML Landgrab Questions Answered by Example [Fwd: <BR><BR><BR>&gt;From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;And here's Doug's post describing Heya:<BR><BR>Doug's post led pretty directly to the Heyan Civil War, sometimes called<BR>the Heyan Farmers' War, in which the forcibly relocated Vargr who had<BR>turned to farming found themselves having to go to war with the human<BR>farmers who had been there for generations in order to avoid<BR>pauperization.&nbsp; The first skirmish of that war was a tank battle near the<BR>starport in which the human forces handily defeated the poorly designed<BR>(but very nicely painted) Vargr tanks.&nbsp; Another battle is expected to take<BR>place on 18 February 2001 at Dundracon in San Ramon, California.&nbsp; If I<BR>don't go skiing that weekend, I will attend.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Luther, if I do go skiing, shall I send you my red Vargr tanks?<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR><BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:56:25 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: who invented the jump drive (was RE: Interstellar <BR><BR>&gt;From: "Jones, Dean" &lt;Dean.Jones@fox-europe.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;The Aslan invention/back engineering of the jump drive is <BR>&gt;one of the corner stones of one of the games I'm playing now. <BR>&gt;Why not go all the way...perhaps noone except the Ancients <BR>&gt;actually invented the jump drive...the Major Races were just better at <BR>&gt;expoiting it and keeping the truth hidden.<BR><BR>Actually, the jump drive was invented by a race far older than the<BR>Ancients.&nbsp; This race did not need starships or jump bubbles.&nbsp; Jump drive<BR>is actually a misnomer.&nbsp; They could just examine the unholy geometry of<BR>jump space and will themselves through it.&nbsp; Such exercises are possible<BR>for the life forms that exist today, but we are generally driven insane or<BR>killed by the exposure.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Modern jump navigation involves computer assisted analysis of the<BR>relationship between jump and normal space and those self-same geometries.<BR>The real invention was the lanthanum grid and the ability take advantage<BR>of jump space while remaining in the comfort, safety, and sanity of normal<BR>space.&nbsp; Every major race, and the Ancients, developed the jump drive from<BR>careful collation and analysis of the clues left behind by the original<BR>developers.&nbsp; <BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:02:09 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: URGENT: Contact for Swordy?<BR><BR>I need to get in contact with Swordy; Downport is misbehaving again, and I<BR>have an update for Freelance Traveller pending.&nbsp; I sent a message to admin@<BR>and webmaster@, but they seem to be undeliverable.&nbsp; Can someone give me a<BR>known-to-be-working address, or ask him to get in touch with me either at<BR>freelancetraveller@yahoo.com or jzeitlin@cyburban.com ?<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:59:31 -0800<BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: A ship design question<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Gordon Hundley [mailto:gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk]<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2001 4:19 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: A ship design question<BR><BR><BR>on 17/1/01 11:59 pm, Kelly St.Clair at kellys@efn.org wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; A quick comment:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; I'm even thinking that since the drives used to jump that mass will be<BR>&gt;&gt; thirsty, that they will not be required (or desired) in the subsequent<BR>&gt;&gt; jump(s). The discarded drives would be left with a coded transponder so<BR>that<BR>&gt;&gt; a recovery vessel could return them to the host shipyard.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Instead of having a recovery ship pick it up if you made the tanks out of a<BR>fairly cheap material you could just drop them and keep going.<BR><BR>again re inventing Drop tanks but hey why not. and what if this methode<BR>could be addapted to other vessles. reducing the need to skim or refuel on a<BR>long trip if it were required. IE emergancy situation ect..<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 18:10:36 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: URGENT: Contact for Swordy?<BR><BR>Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I need to get in contact with Swordy; Downport is misbehaving again, and I<BR>&gt; have an update for Freelance Traveller pending.&nbsp; I sent a message to admin@<BR>&gt; and webmaster@, but they seem to be undeliverable.&nbsp; Can someone give me a<BR>&gt; known-to-be-working address, or ask him to get in touch with me either at<BR>&gt; freelancetraveller@yahoo.com or jzeitlin@cyburban.com ?<BR><BR>He posted to the TML on Tuesday (30 Jan 01) with the following address:<BR><BR>SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com<BR><BR>Hope this helps!<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:08:53 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: who invented the jump drive (was RE: Interstellar <BR><BR>&gt; Modern jump navigation involves computer assisted analysis of the<BR>&gt; relationship between jump and normal space and those self-same geometries.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; The real invention was the lanthanum grid and the ability take advantage<BR>&gt; of jump space while remaining in the comfort, safety, and sanity of normal<BR>&gt; space.&nbsp; Every major race, and the Ancients, developed the jump drive from<BR>&gt; careful collation and analysis of the clues left behind by the original<BR>&gt; developers.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; --Glenn<BR><BR>I thought it was cannon that Humans (Terrans) developed jump drive<BR>independantly.<BR>Inquiring minds want to know<BR>- -Torquemada<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 18:11:39 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrab Question<BR><BR>Glenn Goffin wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;How does one participate in the landgrab?<BR>&gt; &gt;what are the rules?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; First, you have to post a thorough and detailed essay analyzing the<BR>&gt; differences between world scaping as described by Roger Zelazney in Isle<BR>&gt; of the Dead and To Die in Italbar with ordinary terraforming as practiced<BR>&gt; by the Imperial Ministry of Colonization and its Zhodani and Solomani<BR>&gt; counterparts.&nbsp; Provide special sections addressing: functionality of end<BR>&gt; result to ordinary world dwellers; advantages and disadvantages of each<BR>&gt; method to interstellar society; and consideration of approaches likely<BR>&gt; used by the Ancients.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; A panel of Great Old Ones will review your essay and grant you entry to<BR>&gt; the Landgrab.<BR><BR>&lt;tongue-in-cheek&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;very fine print&gt;<BR><BR>Note that the prospective Landgrabber [hereafter "Victim"] may (and in<BR>some cases must) submit any Landgrabs in the Spinward Marches (or in<BR>other regions and/or jurisdictions within the OTU or any known or<BR>potential variants, as may be determined by any interested parties) to<BR>the Great Old Ones [hereafter "GOOs] via psionic means.&nbsp; Note also that<BR>submitting a Landgrab to the GOOs (or other interested parties), by any<BR>means, may involve _awakening_ said GOOs (or other interested parties),<BR>with potential deleterious effects on the Victim, the immediate family<BR>of the Victim, any other chattels and/or associates belonging, related,<BR>or pertaining to the Victim, and/or the reality paradigm of the Victim. <BR>By submitting a prospective Landgrab to the GOOs (or to any other<BR>interested parties), via any means, the Victim totally and permanently<BR>absolves the following entities of any liability for damages or harms<BR>related in any way to participation in the TML, the TML Landgrab, and/or<BR>any other activities related in any way to the GOOs, the TML, or the TML<BR>Landgrab: The GOOs (to include any entity that has been, currently is,<BR>or may in the future be described as or known as a GOO in any context);<BR>past, present, and/or future TML members; past, present, and future<BR>Landgrab participants; the various hosting and sponsoring bodies of the<BR>TML, past present, or future; Bill and/or Hillary Clinton; any other<BR>firms associated with the TML (including, but not limited to: the ISPs<BR>of past, present, and/or future TML members; any Web hosting services<BR>used by past, present, and/or future TML members; the ISPs of past,<BR>present, and/or future Landgrab participants; any Web hosting services<BR>used by past, present, and/or future Landgrab participants); any other<BR>entities, known or unknown, related or pertaining to the TML Landgrab;<BR>and any other entity in any known or unknown universe or reality.<BR><BR>&lt;/very fine print&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;/tongue-in-cheek&gt;<BR><BR>Glenn, did I miss anyone or anything?&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3582<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yg02.mx.aol.com (rly-yg02.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.2]) by air-yg05.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:11:30 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yg02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:10:41 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id TAA09790;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:09:36 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:08:05 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id TAA09725<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:08:05 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:08:05 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102010008.TAA09725@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3582<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3583</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>1/31/01 7:42:05 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; Wednesday, January 31 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3583<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE:TNE<BR>Re: RE:TNE<BR>TML Landgrab - Spirelle<BR>Re: TML Landgrab Questions Answered by Example <BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>RE: TML Landgrab Questions Answered by Example <BR>Re: who invented the jump drive <BR>Re: Landgrab Question<BR>Landgrabs<BR>FAQ: Frequently Asked Questions about the Traveller Storyline<BR>A couple of questions<BR>Re: Landgrabs -- Bael<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: A couple of questions<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>RE: de-canonized material<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:09:37 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Don Roberts &lt;tne1201@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE:TNE<BR><BR>I often thought that the black curtain may have had<BR>something to do with the empress wave or maybe<BR>something even more sinister.&nbsp; Someone out there knows<BR>and does not want to fess up.&nbsp; Even though the line<BR>has been discontinued and the company is out of<BR>business.&nbsp; I always envisioned the Black Curtain as a<BR>space/time anomoly or something more heinous.&nbsp; Maybe<BR>even reacting from an ancients' artifact.&nbsp; Any<BR>thoughts on this guys?<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:14:28 -0800<BR>From: "Jeffrey Yin" &lt;jsyin@cats.ucsc.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: RE:TNE<BR><BR>I would have to disagree. Like I said in my earlier post, I believe it is<BR>much more likely that it is simply more dangerous due to the war going on<BR>between two Vampire Fleet factions. This would even go very far in<BR>explaining why no ships have returned. Not only do you have the standard<BR>danger of hostile vessels, but they all have Virus as well.<BR><BR>Jeffrey Yin<BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Don Roberts" &lt;tne1201@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2001 4:09 PM<BR>Subject: RE:TNE<BR><BR><BR>&gt; I often thought that the black curtain may have had<BR>&gt; something to do with the empress wave or maybe<BR>&gt; something even more sinister.&nbsp; Someone out there knows<BR>&gt; and does not want to fess up.&nbsp; Even though the line<BR>&gt; has been discontinued and the company is out of<BR>&gt; business.&nbsp; I always envisioned the Black Curtain as a<BR>&gt; space/time anomoly or something more heinous.&nbsp; Maybe<BR>&gt; even reacting from an ancients' artifact.&nbsp; Any<BR>&gt; thoughts on this guys?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; __________________________________________________<BR>&gt; Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35<BR>&gt; a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 17:20:15 -0700<BR>From: Steve Charlton &lt;steve.charlton@ifsna.com&gt;<BR>Subject: TML Landgrab - Spirelle<BR><BR>This message is in MIME format. Since your mail reader does not understand<BR>this format, some or all of this message may not be legible.<BR><BR>- ------_=_NextPart_001_01C08BE4.C0106C40<BR>Content-Type: text/plain;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR><BR>I have not yet given up on the Spirelle writeup; other duties have made my<BR>free time a bit more limited than I like.&nbsp; But I do plan on having something<BR>out in February!&nbsp; The outline and some of the real text is done.&nbsp; I amy even<BR>try to expand it for&nbsp; a possible GT:Worldbook proposal.<BR><BR>Steve Charlton<BR><BR>- ------_=_NextPart_001_01C08BE4.C0106C40<BR>Content-Type: text/html;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="iso-8859-1"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>&lt;!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN"&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;HEAD&gt;<BR>&lt;META HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; =<BR>charset=3Diso-8859-1"&gt;<BR>&lt;META NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server version =<BR>5.5.2653.12"&gt;<BR>&lt;TITLE&gt;TML Landgrab - Spirelle&lt;/TITLE&gt;<BR>&lt;/HEAD&gt;<BR><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>I have not yet given up on the Spirelle writeup; =<BR>other duties have made my free time a bit more limited than I =<BR>like.&amp;nbsp; But I do plan on having something out in February!&amp;nbsp; =<BR>The outline and some of the real text is done.&amp;nbsp; I amy even try to =<BR>expand it for&amp;nbsp; a possible GT:Worldbook proposal.</FONT></P><BR><BR>
<P><FONT size=3>Steve Charlton</FONT><BR></P><BR><BR><BR><BR>- ------_=_NextPart_001_01C08BE4.C0106C40--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:31:17 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: TML Landgrab Questions Answered by Example <BR><BR>&gt;From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR><BR>I had written:<BR>&gt;&gt; Another battle is expected to take place on 18 February 2001 at<BR>&gt;&gt;Dundracon in San Ramon, California.&nbsp; If I don't go skiing that weekend,<BR>&gt;&gt;I will attend.<BR><BR>You replied:<BR>&gt;If you do attend, can I expect another 'report from the field' for Le<BR>&gt;Mercenaire?<BR><BR>Yes, of course.&nbsp; Long after my report on the first battle had faded from<BR>my memory, someone emailed me asking about a subscription to Le<BR>Mercenaire.&nbsp; I referred that person to you (once I figured out what he (or<BR>she) was talking about).&nbsp; <BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:30:54 -0800<BR>From: Russell Bornschlegel &lt;kaleja@estarcion.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>Tod Glenn wrote:<BR>&gt; Also, if we are transporting our troops all over hell and gone, we want<BR>&gt; simple, rugged weapons with lots of spare when our supply train is measured<BR>&gt; in parsecs.&nbsp; We can afford to buy every trooper two rifles.&nbsp; We still have<BR>&gt; money left over to buy grenades, LAWs or whatever. Does anyone realize how<BR>&gt; many weapons fail or are lost during combat? Lots.&nbsp; You'll need replacements<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Slightly superior firearms will not carry the day.&nbsp; The German StG-44 was<BR>&gt; the most advanced weapon on the battlefield, but had no significant impact<BR>&gt; in any theatre employed.<BR><BR>Though, very indirectly, it certainly had an impact in a number of post-WWII <BR>theatres. :)<BR><BR>&gt; I should also point out that the difference between cheap and effective and<BR>&gt; "top of the line" in terms of effectiveness is really minor.&nbsp; How much more<BR>&gt; effective is an HK MP-5 over a WWII MP-40?&nbsp; It's better packaging and there<BR>&gt; are provisions fore mounting special optics, silencer etc. Lethality is<BR>&gt; identical, reliability is close.<BR><BR>The "better packaging" yields compactness and ergonomics, which can be <BR>helpful, but your point is still completely valid - no way are you going <BR>to get, say, a 2:1 effectiveness ratio of MP5-equipped troops versus MP-40. <BR>Mostly, in the slugthrower realm, a higher tech, better designed, more <BR>reliable SMG/assault rifle/"individual weapon" isn't going to do much <BR>different.<BR><BR>About the only thing I can think of is that soldiers who died because their<BR>gun jammed or because they couldn't actuate the ill-designed safety/mag <BR>release/single-versus-auto selector fast enough or because the sights got <BR>caught on their pants leg when they were trying to bring the gun up -- <BR>those poor sons of Murphy could have been saved by higher tech guns (though, <BR>depending on your philosophy/belief systems/superstitions, maybe they <BR>were destined to bite it anyway). <BR><BR>Thus, a more advanced weapon can be looked at as an investment in "accident<BR>insurance", or as due diligence for the government issuing the weapon. In <BR>the case where you have plenty of money but not so many soldiers, spending <BR>a little extra on the gun might be worthwhile. <BR><BR>- - Russell B<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:34:23 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: TML Landgrab Questions Answered by Example <BR><BR>&gt;From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;is San remon near San Francisco? <BR><BR>It's way on the other side of the Bay.&nbsp; It takes forever to get there from<BR>San Francisco, almost an hour.&nbsp; <BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>You do know that there are so many TML people in the Bay Area that we have<BR>a separate mailing list called travellerinsf, don't you?&nbsp; Ask Doug Berry<BR>for details.&nbsp; <BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:36:57 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: who invented the jump drive <BR><BR>&gt;From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;I thought it was cannon that Humans (Terrans) developed jump drive<BR>&gt;independantly.&nbsp; Inquiring minds want to know<BR><BR>It depends on the nature and degree of Illumination in your Traveller<BR>universe, I suppose.&nbsp; What I wrote is what I understand really happened. <BR>That may not agree with canon.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:39:45 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrab Question<BR><BR>&gt;From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Glenn, did I miss anyone or anything?&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>I hesitate to opine.&nbsp; Anyone -- or particularly anything -- you missed<BR>will no doubt let you know about it after dark tonight.&nbsp; I'd as soon not<BR>have them reminding me as well.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR><BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:44:39 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Landgrabs<BR><BR>&gt; I assume they'd all be on the list, so folk, please use this sorted<BR>version<BR>&gt; that I culled from Downport and comment on what's missing or superseded:<BR>&gt;<BR>Edenelt/Trin's Veil - hereby grabbed by Michael Daumen.<BR><BR>Thanks!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 20:09:05 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: FAQ: Frequently Asked Questions about the Traveller Storyline<BR><BR>OK, folks!&nbsp; Time to add these to the Traveller FAQ at Freelance Traveller.<BR>Problem is, I only have three of them, and no answers at this time.&nbsp; I'd<BR>appreciate if people here could brainstorm me some answers - with citations<BR>if you're getting your info from published materials (and _not_ inferring<BR>what the published material "means" - so you can't tell me that the Black<BR>Curtain represents the boundary of a Virus-run empire and cite any of the<BR>extant TNE stuff!).<BR><BR>Inferences are OK for answers, just don't cite for them or mark them<BR>authoritative, unless you're Marc Miller or Loren Wiseman; anything you're<BR>willing to say about them will be taken as official.<BR><BR>Also, if anyone has any ideas for additional questions in this section,<BR>please feel free to post the questions - I'll add them, and we can all have<BR>fun brainstorming more answers to them.<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 20:27:00 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: A couple of questions<BR><BR>Is duelling legal in the Third Imperium?<BR><BR>Also, in what CT books are the Darrians, specifically Darrian chargen,<BR>described? (Not counting the Darrians Aliens Module)<BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 01:32:47 <BR>From: "John Lambert" &lt;hovtej@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrabs -- Bael<BR><BR>The "good" landgrabs are going fast. I'll lay claim to Bael / Querion. If I <BR>missed someone else's claim to this garden spot, please let me know.<BR><BR>John<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 20:41:54 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR><BR>In a message dated 31-Jan-01 5:54:21 AM Central Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Subject: RE: TNE<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; Hi Loren,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Does this mean that there is possibility that TNE storyline will continue<BR>&gt;&nbsp; at some point?&nbsp; I too am a TNE fan...and would love to see more done with<BR>&gt;&nbsp; that timeline.<BR><BR>Can't say.<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 21:00:59 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>Tod Glenn writes:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;Current, high tech weapons like the ACR (the real one, not the Traveller<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;weapon) gave only marginally better performance over existing weapons<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;at a higher cost.<BR>&gt;&gt;Efficiency considerations like this will certainly influence the use of<BR>&gt;&gt;weapons on many worlds, but for units like marines that are costing<BR>&gt;&gt;huge amounts to move from planet to planet, it may be worth spending<BR>&gt;&gt;a lot to get a little increase in lethality.&nbsp; For that reason I have always<BR>&gt;&gt;assumed that planetary armies tend to equip their soldiers with<BR>&gt;&gt;relatively cheap weapons (rifles, autorifles, assault rifles) while marines<BR>&gt;&gt;carry as good as they can get.&nbsp; Of course, most armies will also<BR>&gt;&gt;include elite units with top-of-the-line equipment.<BR>&gt;I'm not sure, at least so far as small arms are concerned.&nbsp; Military<BR>&gt;procurement is geared to&nbsp; buying large numbers of items, and to simplify<BR>&gt;logistics, you want commonality.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Commonality is certainly an issue.&nbsp; Worlds with smallish armies<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; would have to avoid multiple weapons, and even larger ones may<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; be assumed to use a limited number of different small arms.&nbsp; Still,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I can see elite units being outfitted separately if their size is<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; sufficient and the advantages big enough.<BR><BR>&gt;Plus the difference in lethality may be<BR>&gt;very modest, and the difference in cost could be better redirected<BR>&gt;elsewhere.&nbsp; Take the Assault rifle vs.&nbsp; the OICW.<BR>&gt;Say the assault rifle is Cr100 to produce, the OICW is Cr1000.&nbsp; Assume a<BR>&gt;best case, and the OICW doubles the lethality of the old assault rifle.<BR>&gt;Firstly, small arms are responsible for only a small amount if battlefield<BR>&gt;casualties.&nbsp; Artillery, support weapons (MGs) mines and bombs make up over<BR>&gt;90% of the kills.&nbsp; Total effectiveness increase in negligible.<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Your argument is well made.&nbsp; Where it does not exactly apply is in<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; units that are transported at great cost per soldier.&nbsp; If you are<BR>investing<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; a lot of credits to move a limited number of soldiers into the<BR>theatre of<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; operations, then it may be cheaper to increase the lethality of the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; individual soldiers by 5% that it would be to bring 5% more soldiers.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; This is true whether or not you are also bringing in lots of artillery,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; AFVs, support weapons, etc.&nbsp; Put another way, it may be cheaper to<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; spend the extra money on weapons that increase the lethality of the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; troops that you are bringing by 5%, and then bring 5% fewer troops.<BR><BR>&gt;Also, if we are transporting our troops all over hell and gone, we want<BR>&gt;simple, rugged weapons with lots of spare when our supply train is measured<BR>&gt;in parsecs.&nbsp; We can afford to buy every trooper two rifles.&nbsp; We still have<BR>&gt;money left over to buy grenades, LAWs or whatever. Does anyone realize how<BR>&gt;many weapons fail or are lost during combat? Lots.&nbsp; You'll need replacements<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Reliability is of prime importance.&nbsp; CT, at least, assumes similar<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; reliability for most weapons (lasers are said to be not sturdy enough to<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; be used as a club, but I believe that they are not particularly<BR>likely to<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; fail under combat conditions), but real energy weapons might not enjoy<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; this level of reliability.<BR><BR>&gt;I expect marines to be equipped with the highest tech level available.&nbsp; But<BR>&gt;their weapons (small arms) will still be relatively low cost comparatively<BR>&gt;speaking. Logistics is what ultimately wins wars.&nbsp; Not super weapons or<BR>&gt;super warriors.&nbsp; Whoever gets the most bang for the buck prevails<BR>&gt;(typically).<BR>&gt;JMHO, YMMV<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Ever heard of the Star Trigger?&nbsp; ;)&nbsp; I agree, super weapons will not<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; generally win wars (although a couple of HMGs carefully used might<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; be pretty useful in a TL 3 battle).&nbsp; Of course, I would suggest that no<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; one thing will win wars.&nbsp; Still, your point is well taken.&nbsp; I worked up<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; some efficiency figures for CT a while ago and came to the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; conclusion that a rifle with cloth armour was the most efficient way<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; to equip a soldier (you could afford enough of these soldiers to give<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; you an edge in open battle over any other kit).&nbsp; I don't recall the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; assumptions that I used, and they were probably flawed, but I liked<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; it because it gave me a rationalization for Rifle being the standard<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; skill for Army personel.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:55:03 -0600<BR>From: Andy Holzrichter &lt;jhereg@southwind.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Here is a question for the gearheads out there.&nbsp; Where can I find stats on <BR>man portable solar power for traveller?&nbsp; Our group is planning an <BR>expedition to a low tech (TL2) world and is trying to cover all <BR>options.&nbsp; They want some type of solar recharger for energy weapons (laser <BR>rifles mostly.)&nbsp; I realize the recharge times will probably be LONG, but <BR>does anyone have appropriate figures?&nbsp; One idea was the top/sides of a <BR>backpack covered with solar cells.&nbsp; Thanks in advance.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Andy Holzrichter <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 21:22:33 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A couple of questions<BR><BR>&gt;Is duelling legal in the Third Imperium?<BR><BR>It seems to be left up to the individual world. I'm aware of at least one <BR>world in canon (Towers [3103 Spinward Marches], as described in "The <BR>Traveller Adventure") where duelling is a way of life.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 18:42:41 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>on 1/31/01 4:30 PM, Russell Bornschlegel at kaleja@estarcion.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; The "better packaging" yields compactness and ergonomics, which can be<BR>&gt; helpful, but your point is still completely valid - no way are you going<BR>&gt; to get, say, a 2:1 effectiveness ratio of MP5-equipped troops versus MP-40.<BR>&gt; Mostly, in the slugthrower realm, a higher tech, better designed, more<BR>&gt; reliable SMG/assault rifle/"individual weapon" isn't going to do much<BR>&gt; different.<BR><BR>It's interesting to note that HK has released their latest SMG (UMP) and<BR>removed many of the "superior" features of the MP-5, like the roller lock<BR>system.&nbsp; I expect refinements to be along the lines of better ergonomics,<BR>sights and designs that lend themselves to inexpensive mass manufacture.<BR><BR>The MP-5 and before it, the MP-40 were inexpensive stamping based designs.<BR>The UMP can be injection molded for a fraction of the cost.&nbsp; Ultimately, I<BR>expect to see polymer and ceramic firearms that are cheap, durable,<BR>impervious to the elements, light, and still just as effective as there<BR>modern day counterparts<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:02:27 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>on 1/31/01 5:00 PM, Ian Ferguson at ian@vax2.concordia.ca wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Commonality is certainly an issue.&nbsp; Worlds with smallish armies<BR>&gt; would have to avoid multiple weapons, and even larger ones may<BR>&gt; be assumed to use a limited number of different small arms.&nbsp; Still,<BR>&gt; I can see elite units being outfitted separately if their size is<BR>&gt; sufficient and the advantages big enough.<BR><BR>It also help if elite units can buy "off the shelf".&nbsp; Typically, small elite<BR>units have mechanisms for going around procurement procedures.&nbsp; If there is<BR>a source of weaponry outside of the regular channels, and it enhances the<BR>mission, expect elite units to have them.<BR><BR>We know from 'canon' that several megacorps produce weapons, so doubtless<BR>there will be a wide variety of unofficial weapons in use by special units.<BR>And these weapons, often made for civilian sales are likely to be of<BR>superior quality compared with military weapons.&nbsp; When the military buys 8<BR>million ACRs, it doesn't worry about 1/4 minute of angle accuracy, but a<BR>sniper in an elite unit may need this to complete his very specialized<BR>mission.<BR><BR>I expect elite planetary units in the Imperium to be equipped with higher<BR>tech weaponry, despite higher cost, particularly when the tech difference is<BR>meaningful enough to give a significant advantage (TL5 to TL 8, not much<BR>difference.&nbsp; Flintlock vs. ACRs, different story).&nbsp; Also, expect the "palace<BR>guard" to have the highest tech it can afford, particularly when the ruling<BR>party is not well liked.<BR>&gt; AFVs, support weapons, etc.&nbsp; Put another way, it may be cheaper to<BR>&gt; spend the extra money on weapons that increase the lethality of the<BR>&gt; troops that you are bringing by 5%, and then bring 5% fewer troops.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Good point.&nbsp; Ultimately, its all cost/benefit.&nbsp; And get a disparate enough<BR>tech level, and it becomes worth it.<BR><BR>&gt; Reliability is of prime importance.&nbsp; CT, at least, assumes similar<BR>&gt; reliability for most weapons (lasers are said to be not sturdy enough to<BR>&gt; be used as a club, but I believe that they are not particularly<BR>&gt; likely to<BR>&gt; fail under combat conditions), but real energy weapons might not enjoy<BR>&gt; this level of reliability.<BR><BR>I haven't done up the reliability tables for energy weapons yet, but see my<BR>'house rule' about weapons malfunctions at http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>under House Rules.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; speaking. Logistics is what ultimately wins wars.&nbsp; Not super weapons or<BR>&gt;&gt; super warriors.&nbsp; Whoever gets the most bang for the buck prevails<BR>&gt;&gt; (typically).<BR>&gt;&gt; JMHO, YMMV<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Ever heard of the Star Trigger?&nbsp; ;)<BR><BR>Ok, I was thinking in terms of small arms.&nbsp; Strategic weapons are a<BR>different matter, particularly if the other side can't reply in kind.<BR><BR>&gt; you an edge in open battle over any other kit).&nbsp; I don't recall the<BR>&gt; assumptions that I used, and they were probably flawed, but I liked<BR>&gt; it because it gave me a rationalization for Rifle being the standard<BR>&gt; skill for Army personel.<BR><BR>I also envision the rifle as a standard weapon, probably a fairly mature<BR>version of the assault rifle.&nbsp; The Traveller ACR just doesn't seem<BR>practical.&nbsp; Gauss is nice at the appropriate tech.<BR><BR>Another reason to stick with cartridge weapons, BTW.&nbsp; The users are tied to<BR>their ammunition.&nbsp; It helps keep wackos and revolutionaries from having too<BR>great an impact if they need ammo.&nbsp; When you have an energy weapon, as long<BR>as you have power, you have an infinite supply of ammo (which might be a<BR>better reason for marines to use energy weapons.&nbsp; No ammo to cart around.<BR>Just plug into the nearest wall socket to reload).<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 16:09:36 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: de-canonized material<BR><BR>On 31 Jan 01, at 8:40, Steven Hudson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;From: "J. Paul Sanders" &lt;jps64@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Subject: RE: de-canonized material<BR>&gt; ...<BR>&gt; &gt;Corridor - used as a personal preserve by Marc W Miller.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Gee, that would make him a Sector Duke, right? :&gt;<BR><BR>No, you didn't read it right. corridor is just his _fief_. Given that even <BR>Strephon doesn't have a sector as a fief, I think it makes him God Emperor <BR>of the Universe.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 21:30:19 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Andy Holzrichter wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Here is a question for the gearheads out there.&nbsp; Where can I find stats on<BR>&gt; man portable solar power for traveller?&nbsp; Our group is planning an<BR>&gt; expedition to a low tech (TL2) world and is trying to cover all<BR>&gt; options.&nbsp; They want some type of solar recharger for energy weapons (laser<BR>&gt; rifles mostly.)&nbsp; I realize the recharge times will probably be LONG, but<BR>&gt; does anyone have appropriate figures?&nbsp; One idea was the top/sides of a<BR>&gt; backpack covered with solar cells.&nbsp; Thanks in advance.<BR><BR>According to Altair Energy's Web site, a current tech (TL8) photovoltaic<BR>array can produce 800 Watts of DC power with 100 square feet of<BR>photovoltaic cell array.<BR><BR>http://www.altairenergy.com/what/earth-friendly.htm<BR><BR>Further, according to the American Solar Energy Society site:<BR><BR>http://www.ases.org/solarguide/fbhdt.html<BR><BR>"Full sun" energy equals approximately 1 kilowatt per m^2 of<BR>photovoltaic cell, although the efficiency of photovoltaic cells in<BR>converting this energy to electricity varys by type:<BR><BR>"In 1954 Bell Telephone Laboratories produced a silicon PV cell with a<BR>4% efficiency and later achieved 11% efficiency." [ibid.]<BR><BR>Based on these two sources, it seems that each m^2 of photovoltaic cell<BR>can produce about 100 Watts of electricity with current (pun intended)<BR>technology.&nbsp; Improved technology should increase the efficiency<BR>somewhat.&nbsp; My PIOTA guess would suggest that TL15 would have<BR>photovoltaic cells at 20-25% efficiency, giving a total of 200-250 Watts<BR>per m^2 with Terran "full sun" exposure.<BR><BR>Note that maximum solar energy (and thus photovoltaic yield) will vary<BR>based on stellar luminosity and distance from the primary star.&nbsp; My next<BR>PIOTA guess would suggest that the "blackbody" temperature divided by<BR>278, then multiplied by 1000 Watts) would work as a field-expedient<BR>gauge of maximum solar energy, IAW GT: First In, page 75.&nbsp; Thus Terra<BR>receives 1 kilowatt per square meter, calculated as follows:<BR><BR>Terra's blackbody temperature equals<BR><BR>(278 x 1^1/4) / 1^1/2<BR><BR>When this figure is divided by 278, we get a raw answer of 1, which we<BR>then multiply by 1000 Watts to reach the 1 kW/m^2 figure mentioned<BR>earlier.<BR><BR>OTOH, given a stellar luminosity (for a MV0 star) of .011 and an orbital<BR>radius of .12 AU [both figures from my TML Landgrab work], Leander (in<BR>the Trin's Veil subsector of the Spinward Marches) would have a maximum<BR>solar energy value of 935 Watts per m^2:<BR><BR>[(278 x .011^1/4 / .12^1/2)/278 x 1000] (.935 MW), <BR><BR>multiplied by 1000 to find the number of Watts that fall on Leander's<BR>planetary surface.&nbsp; Given a 10% efficiency, each m^2 of photovoltaic<BR>cell (at our present TL) will produce 93.5 Watts per hour of exposure to<BR>stellar radiation.<BR><BR>Leander is close enough to its primary star for the difference in<BR>luminosity between Leander's dim star and Sol to be offset by the<BR>reduced distance.<BR><BR>Naturally, as one may notice here on Earth, environmental conditions<BR>(such as cloud cover, axial tilt, and density of atmospheric<BR>particulates) will radically affect the actual solar energy per m^2 for<BR>a given world at a given time.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 14:41:49 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Andy Holzrichter wrote:<BR>&gt; One idea was the top/sides of a backpack covered with solar cells.<BR>&gt; Thanks in advance.<BR><BR>This depends a *lot* on the local conditions.<BR><BR>Although total insolation will be within a relatively narrow range for<BR>any habitable world, the form it takes will make a big difference.<BR>Stars significantly higher or lower in temperature from our Sun will<BR>probably radiate large fractions of their power outside the bands that<BR>pass through atmosphere.&nbsp; This will heat the planet to habitable<BR>temperatures, but won't be useful for solar cells.<BR><BR>Next, you have to consider weather.&nbsp; It is quite plausible for a<BR>planet to be in near-perpetual cloud.&nbsp; This has basically the same<BR>effects as above.<BR><BR>Third, the axial tilt may be large.&nbsp; This means that (apart from<BR>weather effects) the planet's sun will be lower in the sky over large<BR>areas of the surface and light would have to pass through more<BR>atmosphere.&nbsp; The sun may even stay below the horizon.<BR><BR>What about life?&nbsp; Are there tree-analogues or other life forms that<BR>intercept sunlight before it reaches the surface?<BR><BR>Does the expedition have the luxury of setting up a semi-permanent<BR>power collection station in good locations, or do they have to be on<BR>the move too much?<BR><BR>If they need to be one the move (which seems likely given your<BR>"backpack" idea), then power available will be greatly reduced.<BR><BR><BR>Under ideal conditions, the power available will probably be no more<BR>than 500 W/m^2.&nbsp; If the star is far from G-class, then it will be<BR>reduced, maybe to as low as 100 W/m^2 for an M-class that radiates<BR>nearly all its power in IR wavelengths absorbed by the atmosphere.&nbsp; If<BR>lots of cloud, reduce by another possible factor of 5 or more.&nbsp; If in<BR>jungle-like conditions, probably the same factor again.&nbsp; If in winter<BR>on a planet with significant tilt, roughly halve it or worse.&nbsp; Don't<BR>forget to decrease the proportion of day/night as well.&nbsp; For really<BR>high-tech collectors, efficiency might be 60% or so (I can't remember<BR>what the canonical efficiencies are).<BR><BR>If the expedition has to carry their collectors, e.g. on a backpack,<BR>they will probably only have about 0.2 m^2 of effective area each at<BR>most, maybe 0.1 m^2 average if the collectors aren't permitted to be<BR>too bulky.&nbsp; For a base station, the effective area would be based on<BR>whatever they could bring and set up, maybe up to 100 m^2 of tough<BR>flexible material (depends on technology again).<BR><BR>For laser rifles, you would need at least 5 kJ of energy per shot.<BR>Again, I don't know what canonical sources say.&nbsp; The power source<BR>would of course need to be rechargable; this may add bulk, reduce<BR>shots, or reduce effectiveness if the standard is non-rechargable.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Basically, most of Earth is near-ideal for solar power compared to how<BR>much might be available on other planets.&nbsp; This is probably not<BR>surprising -- nearly all life on Earth depends (ultimately) on<BR>converting light reaching the surface into useful energy.<BR><BR>It is not unlikely that most worlds capable of supporting Earth life<BR>depend upon at least the same order of magnitude of light reaching the<BR>surface.&nbsp; Still, it may be that (like a jungle) the expedition can't<BR>*get to* that sunlight.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3583<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zc01.mx.aol.com (rly-zc01.mail.aol.com [172.31.33.1]) by air-zc05.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:42:05 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zc01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:41:11 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id WAA18162;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:38:15 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:37:37 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id WAA18103<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:37:37 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:37:37 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102010337.WAA18103@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3583<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background="" bgColor=#3dffff><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3584</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/1/01 2:39:52 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, February 1 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3584<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: de-canonized material<BR>RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR>Re: TNE &amp; Re: Plush?<BR>RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR>Re:&nbsp; FAQ: Frequently Asked Questions about the Traveller Storyline<BR>Re:&nbsp; Landgrab Question<BR>Re: Landgrab<BR>Re: Landgrabs<BR>Re: A couple of questions<BR>Re: Landgrabs<BR>RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: URGENT: Contact for Swordy?<BR>Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR>Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR>Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR>RE: Who do I hire to terraform this place?<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: FAQ: Frequently Asked Questions about the Traveller Storyline<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 12:26:36 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: de-canonized material<BR><BR>&gt; From: Peter Trevor<BR>&gt; However, how I came to see it I do not recall ... except&nbsp; what&nbsp; I<BR>&gt; saw was an electronic document not a hardcopy or&nbsp; scan.&nbsp; Hmmm,&nbsp; I<BR>&gt; have a hard disk on my PC at home that is&nbsp; little&nbsp; more&nbsp; than&nbsp; an<BR>&gt; electronic skip filled with all sorts of junk&nbsp; ...&nbsp; I'll&nbsp; have&nbsp; a<BR>&gt; look tonight.<BR><BR>It has been posted on the list before.<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 12:35:04 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR><BR>&gt; From: Matt Bond <BR>&gt; You couldn't build a Ford Mustang, but you could 'uplift' the<BR>&gt; revolutionary Americans. <BR><BR>But why would you want to make Americans sentient?&nbsp; : )<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 12:39:35 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: TNE &amp; Re: Plush?<BR><BR>&gt; From: Mark F. Cook<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; I am curious if anyone has any Ideas as to what the "Black Curtain"<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;&nbsp; actually was.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Velveteen. *LOTS* of Velveteen. Hence the fall of the Imperium. A<BR>&gt; combination of bankruptcy and the death by exhaustion of darn near every<BR>&gt; tailor in Core sector. :^)<BR><BR>&gt; From: Evyn MacDude<BR>&gt; &gt; How about My Little K'Kree dolls?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; They already make these It's called "beef jerky"<BR><BR>Damn.&nbsp; Keyboard killed twice in a single Digest.<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 12:30:44 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR><BR>&gt; From: "Frank G. Pitt" <BR>&gt; &gt; Aside from better organization (based on many years of<BR>&gt; &gt; refinements) and some&nbsp; Moorcock-specific magic and creatures,<BR>&gt; &gt; I'm not sure what, if<BR>&gt; &gt; anything, distinguishes 'Elric!' from any of the other BRP games<BR>&gt; &gt; (or what that exclamation point is supposed to mean).<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; It means the Melniboneans were the forebears of the Kalahari Bushmen.<BR><BR>Alan falls over, laughing.<BR><BR>Actually, I thought the Kalahari Bushmen spoke K'kree.<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:57:00 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR><BR>on 1/31/01 6:35 PM, Alan Bradley at alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; From: Matt Bond <BR>&gt;&gt; You couldn't build a Ford Mustang, but you could 'uplift' the<BR>&gt;&gt; revolutionary Americans.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; But why would you want to make Americans sentient?&nbsp; : )<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Life's already hard enough for us Yanks without sentience.&nbsp; You can keep<BR>your dang new-fangled sentience.&nbsp; Ole Grandad didn't need no sentience to<BR>get by.&nbsp; Reckon we don't neither.<BR><BR>Tod (who notes that sentience may be developing in the Bay area after the<BR>appearance of a mysterious black obelisk)<BR><BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://www.travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 23:06:42 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re:&nbsp; FAQ: Frequently Asked Questions about the Traveller Storyline<BR><BR>&gt; OK, folks!&nbsp; Time to add these to the Traveller FAQ at Freelance Traveller.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Problem is, I only have three of them, and no answers at this time.&nbsp; I'd<BR>&gt;&nbsp; appreciate if people here could brainstorm me some answers - with citations<BR>&gt;&nbsp; if you're getting your info from published materials (and _not_ inferring<BR>&gt;&nbsp; what the published material "means" - so you can't tell me that the Black<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Curtain represents the boundary of a Virus-run empire and cite any of the<BR>&gt;&nbsp; extant TNE stuff!).<BR><BR>Could you repeat the questions? <BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Inferences are OK for answers, just don't cite for them or mark them<BR>&gt;&nbsp; authoritative, unless you're Marc Miller or Loren Wiseman; anything you're<BR>&gt;&nbsp; willing to say about them will be taken as official.<BR><BR>Fair enough.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:59:28 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re:&nbsp; Landgrab Question<BR><BR>Visit this link and all will be explained... or not. Looks like its time for<BR>a major update this weekend!<BR><BR>http://www.downport.com/landgrab/<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "William Lane" &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>&gt; How does one participate in the landgrab?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; what are the rules?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I would like to do this also.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 23:03:37 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrab<BR><BR>This is a multi-part message in MIME format.<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0083_01C08BDA.0B1C2860<BR>Content-Type: text/plain;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="Windows-1252"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>BTW, I'll be updating the Landgrab pages this weekend, so get any and =<BR>all info to me ASAP<BR><BR>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~&lt;&gt;&lt;~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>Colin Michael, webmaster@downport.com<BR>www.Downport.com - "The Traveller Domain"<BR>&nbsp; ----- Original Message -----=20<BR>&nbsp; From: Michael Daumen=20<BR>&nbsp; To: traveller@lists.ient.com=20<BR>&nbsp; Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2001 7:40 AM<BR>&nbsp; Subject: Landgrab<BR><BR><BR>&nbsp; Howdy, partners!<BR><BR>&nbsp; I'm interested in grabbing a system - as long as it doesn't appear in =<BR>the Landgrab list it's fair game?&nbsp; How do I get my claim on said list?<BR><BR>&nbsp; 2733 Edenelt/Trin A-4638BD-B will do quite nicely.<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0083_01C08BDA.0B1C2860<BR>Content-Type: text/html;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; charset="Windows-1252"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR><BR>&lt;!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"&gt;<BR>&lt;HEAD&gt;<BR>&lt;META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =<BR>charset=3Dwindows-1252"&gt;<BR>&lt;META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4611.1300" name=3DGENERATOR&gt;<BR>&lt;STYLE&gt;&lt;/STYLE&gt;<BR>&lt;/HEAD&gt;<BR><BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face=3DArial size=3>BTW, I'll be updating the Landgrab =<BR>pages this=20<BR>weekend, so get any and all info to me ASAP</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face=3DArial size=3></FONT>&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;DIV&gt;<FONT face="3DArial=20<BR">size=3D2&gt;~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~&amp;lt;&amp;gt;&amp;lt;~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>Colin Michael, =<BR>&lt;A=20<BR>href=3D"mailto:webmaster@downport.com"&gt;webmaster@downport.com</A><BR>&lt;A=20<BR>href=3D"http://www.Downport.com"&gt;www.Downport.com</A> - "The Traveller=20<BR>Domain"</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20<BR>style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =<BR>BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"&gt;----- Original Message ----- &lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV=20<BR>&nbsp; style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =<BR>black"&gt;<B>From:</B>=20<BR>&nbsp; <A title=3Ddaumen@mindspring.com ="<BR">href=3D"mailto:daumen@mindspring.com"&gt;Michael=20<BR>&nbsp; Daumen</A> &lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"&gt;<B>To:</B> <A ="<BR">title=3Dtraveller@lists.ient.com=20<BR>href=3D"mailto:traveller@lists.ient.com"&gt;traveller@lists.ient.com</A> =<BR>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"&gt;<B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, January 31, =<BR>2001 7:40=20<BR>&nbsp; AM&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"&gt;<B>Subject:</B> Landgrab&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV&gt;<BR>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV&gt;<FONT size=3>Howdy, partners!</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV&gt;<FONT size=3>I'm interested in grabbing a system - as long as =<BR>it doesn't=20<BR>&nbsp; appear in the Landgrab list it's fair game?&amp;nbsp; How do I get&amp;nbsp;my =<BR>claim=20<BR>&nbsp; on said list?</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/DIV&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &lt;DIV&gt;<FONT size=3>2733 Edenelt/Trin A-4638BD-B will do quite=20<BR>&nbsp; nicely.</FONT>&lt;/DIV&gt;&lt;/BLOCKQUOTE&gt;<BR><BR>- ------=_NextPart_000_0083_01C08BDA.0B1C2860--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 23:05:46 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrabs<BR><BR>I am indeed here, but things with the Landgrab have been slow for awhile. I<BR>am dedicating a portion of my weekend to the project. Sit down!<BR>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~&lt;&gt;&lt;~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>Colin Michael, webmaster@downport.com<BR>www.Downport.com - "The Traveller Domain"<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>&gt; I notice that the TML Landgrab page&nbsp; (at&nbsp; downport.com)&nbsp; has&nbsp; not<BR>&gt; been maintained&nbsp; for&nbsp; awhile&nbsp; despite&nbsp; there&nbsp; being&nbsp; some&nbsp; recent<BR>&gt; changes.&nbsp; What gives?&nbsp; Is the 'Claims Officer' on this list?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 23:20:29 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Re: A couple of questions<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;Is duelling legal in the Third Imperium?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; It seems to be left up to the individual world. I'm aware of at <BR>&gt; least one world in canon (Towers [3103 Spinward Marches], as described<BR>in "The <BR>&gt; Traveller Adventure") where duelling is a way of life.<BR><BR>Oh, I figured individual worlds would have their own take on it, but what<BR>I was asking was whether TI law (as opposed to local world law) had<BR>anything to say about duelling one way or the other.&nbsp; To make myself<BR>clearer, in a situation where only the TI laws apply (say, on an Navy<BR>ship or somesuch), would duelling be legal? <BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 15:31:51 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrabs<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I assume they'd all be on the list, so folk, please use this sorted<BR>&gt; version that I culled from Downport and comment on what's missing or<BR>&gt; superseded:<BR><BR>I'm planning to detail Feri/Regina.&nbsp; Unfortunately I do not own a lot<BR>of worldbooks or atlases or whatever.&nbsp; Is there any published data on<BR>Feri at all?<BR><BR>I plan to detail it anyway for my own campaign, regardless of such<BR>data -- but it would be more useful to other people if I didn't stray<BR>too far from canon.<BR><BR>Is there an online source for astrometric data on named systems,<BR>e.g. stellar classes, orbital periods, etc?&nbsp; All I've been able to<BR>find so far is UWP data.&nbsp; Am I free to make up anything I like in<BR>these respects?&nbsp; (Well, of course I am) More to the point, is there<BR>anything I should know about to maximise usefulness to others by<BR>avoiding conflict with well-known material?<BR><BR>One thing I find very difficult is constructing history and society in<BR>a way that other people will find useful.&nbsp; Planetary development does<BR>not occur in a (social) vacuum, but as more people contribute to<BR>descriptions of nearby planets, it becomes more and more difficult to<BR>keep things coherent.<BR><BR>If I specify that the people on "my" planet have very close ties to<BR>someone else's, there is a problem if the other person subsequently<BR>specifies that their people have nothing to do with Feri inhabitants.<BR>Likewise for wars, nobility, corporations, or any number of other<BR>inter-system details.<BR><BR>How have other people dealt with this?&nbsp; Is it even feasible for me to<BR>develop such detail (for public consumption) without owning a lot more<BR>Traveller products than I do?<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:29:12 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>You bring up good points about the MP-5 Series vis a vis the UMP: The<BR>original MP-5 was dramatically overengineered: the roller locking system was<BR>completely unnecessary, as was the fluted chamber. Half of the reason these<BR>features were incorporated into the MP-5 is that they were already present<BR>in the G3 automatic rifle.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; HK was well-aware of the MP-5's shortcomings by the late 1970's. The roller<BR>locking system, while workable, didn't do much to help accuracy or<BR>controllability, nor did the fluted chamber significantly help ejection. In<BR>fact, the bolt assembly of the MP-5 was quite bit heavier than many open<BR>bolt full auto weapons with a lower cyclic rate. The body of the weapon was<BR>made of many precision sheet metal stampings and the internals were very<BR>complex machined and stamped parts by any standard.<BR>The blackish MP-5 PIP and MP-2000 explored the expanded use of polymers and<BR>simplified manufacturing techniques as well as new ergonomics.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Finally, when the MP-5's tooling was nearing the end of its useful lifespan<BR>was a completely new weapon family explored. The UMP is the direct<BR>evolutionary descendant of the MP-5. The action stroke and magazine well was<BR>made larger to accommodate larger rounds such as the .45 ACP, 10mm, .40 S&amp;W<BR>and 9mm interchangeably. The action was simplified to a long throw, straight<BR>blowback style action (The action stroke is nearly a full inch longer than<BR>necessary to complete the loading and unloading cycle of the weapon - the<BR>ability of the bolt to "run out" without striking a spring stop or a recoil<BR>buffer goes a long way towards softening the recoil impulse). The bolt on<BR>the UMP was made heavier than necessary to further slow the cyclic rate and<BR>smooth the recoil impulse.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The body of the new weapon was made completely of plastics with metal<BR>inserts strengthening high stress areas and accessory mounting points. This<BR>resulted in a weapon 50% lighter with comparable recoil characteristics, as<BR>well as superior handling and ease of manufacturing. Call the original MP-5<BR>a T.L. 8 weapon in terms of design technology built with T.L 6 technology,<BR>with the UMP a T.L. 6 weapon in terms of design technology built with T.L. 8<BR>materials.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Weird, but looking at it this way, we find it true. Small Arms development<BR>on this planet is very backwards compared to nearly everything else we<BR>produce.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 23:17:27 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: URGENT: Contact for Swordy?<BR><BR>Geez, you'd think I'd died off or something. If all else fails, I can be<BR>reached via swordworlder@yahoo.com, an address that has followed me through<BR>thick and thin for nearly five years :-)<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Jeff Zeitlin" &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>&gt; I need to get in contact with Swordy; Downport is misbehaving again, and I<BR>&gt; have an update for Freelance Traveller pending.&nbsp; I sent a message to<BR>admin@<BR>&gt; and webmaster@, but they seem to be undeliverable.&nbsp; Can someone give me a<BR>&gt; known-to-be-working address, or ask him to get in touch with me either at<BR>&gt; freelancetraveller@yahoo.com or jzeitlin@cyburban.com ?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 23:45:11 -0500<BR>From: "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR><BR>Ok, I give.<BR><BR>I had a long discussion today at work about the physics of recoil at work<BR>today with an aeronautical engineer and a mechanical engineer. The first<BR>question they asked me was why I, a software engineer, would ever undertake<BR>a discussion concerning such a "concrete" subject (I often chide them about<BR>being unable to comprehend software engineering "abstract" concepts!).<BR><BR>Oh well, I guess I get what I deserve. I won't bore you all with the<BR>details, but after much patient explanation, they convinced me that, while I<BR>was on the right track in several areas (and on the wrong track in others),<BR>I'd best leave the physics to them and attend to my systems analysis as they<BR>weren't going to be able to teach me their post grad physics over lunch.<BR><BR>HOWEVER, I can respond to one question that has been repeated several<BR>times..."Why would a ray-gun be more reliable?"<BR><BR>Simply because it requires no moving parts and can be totally encased<BR>(potted) in a polymer. A ray-gun, could, in effect, be a solid object. We<BR>started to discuss the merits of energy weapons, but the boss broke it up<BR>and reminded us that we have a real weapon system to work on (we work for<BR>the USAF)....<BR><BR>In reading all the posts today, I am most intrigued by two concepts. Those<BR>being flechettes (hyper-velocity darts) and the other being self-propelled<BR>munitions. Given, for the sake of argument, that although the traveller<BR>universe has folks "jumping" from star to star, LASER technology hasn't<BR>surpassed today's...the next best alternative would be flechettes fired by a<BR>rail gun or some kind of "smart" self-propelled round that could correct its<BR>flight enroute to the designated target.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 16:09:40 +1100<BR>From: Rob &lt;rhoughto@one.net.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR><BR>Oh course...If you design it, it will be a 'Ray'-gun...and you will be immortal<BR>like that Bob Meson guy...<BR><BR>Other rob<BR><BR>Ray Rangel wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Ok, I give.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I had a long discussion today at work about the physics of recoil at work<BR>&gt; today with an aeronautical engineer and a mechanical engineer. The first<BR>&gt; question they asked me was why I, a software engineer, would ever undertake<BR>&gt; a discussion concerning such a "concrete" subject (I often chide them about<BR>&gt; being unable to comprehend software engineering "abstract" concepts!).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Oh well, I guess I get what I deserve. I won't bore you all with the<BR>&gt; details, but after much patient explanation, they convinced me that, while I<BR>&gt; was on the right track in several areas (and on the wrong track in others),<BR>&gt; I'd best leave the physics to them and attend to my systems analysis as they<BR>&gt; weren't going to be able to teach me their post grad physics over lunch.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; HOWEVER, I can respond to one question that has been repeated several<BR>&gt; times..."Why would a ray-gun be more reliable?"<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Simply because it requires no moving parts and can be totally encased<BR>&gt; (potted) in a polymer. A ray-gun, could, in effect, be a solid object. We<BR>&gt; started to discuss the merits of energy weapons, but the boss broke it up<BR>&gt; and reminded us that we have a real weapon system to work on (we work for<BR>&gt; the USAF)....<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In reading all the posts today, I am most intrigued by two concepts. Those<BR>&gt; being flechettes (hyper-velocity darts) and the other being self-propelled<BR>&gt; munitions. Given, for the sake of argument, that although the traveller<BR>&gt; universe has folks "jumping" from star to star, LASER technology hasn't<BR>&gt; surpassed today's...the next best alternative would be flechettes fired by a<BR>&gt; rail gun or some kind of "smart" self-propelled round that could correct its<BR>&gt; flight enroute to the designated target.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:13:17 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR><BR>on 1/31/01 8:45 PM, Ray Rangel at ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net wrote:<BR>&gt; In reading all the posts today, I am most intrigued by two concepts. Those<BR>&gt; being flechettes (hyper-velocity darts) and the other being self-propelled<BR>&gt; munitions. Given, for the sake of argument, that although the traveller<BR><BR>high velocity flechette promise to vastly improve conventional small arms<BR>lethality, however they have been hampered by problems related to<BR>construction and cost.<BR><BR>The benefits of flechettes over conventional projectiles are as follows.<BR><BR>high cross sectional density.&nbsp; Flechettes, being long and thin are excellent<BR>at penetrating armor.&nbsp; They are highly effective against soft body armor du<BR>to their ability to penetrate the weave.<BR><BR>High velocity.&nbsp; Flechettes are typically held in a sabot, and are very<BR>light, but highly aerodynamic.&nbsp; They can easily be driven at hyper velocity<BR>(defined as more than 1450 m/s -- the speed of sound in tissue). Projectile<BR>striking soft tissue at these velocities tend to cause a 'shattering'<BR>effect. Soft tissue behave as a solid.&nbsp; Further, flechettes have a long body<BR>and tend to hook and tumble in tissue.&nbsp; This allows them to transfer there<BR>energy more violently to the target.<BR><BR>Also, because of there low mass, flechette firing weapons generate a low<BR>recoil impulse. The high velocities also result in a nearly flat ballistic<BR>arc at normal combat ranges (less than 500 m) so the firer doesn't need to<BR>compensate for distance.<BR><BR>Because flechettes are typically fin stabilized, they are fired from smooth<BR>bore guns, which are easier to manufacture and produce less drag on the<BR>projectile as it is fired.<BR><BR>Detailed information can be found in several, fairly rare, books.<BR><BR>There is extensive treatment of the flechettes lethality in "Anti-Personnel<BR>Weapons" published by the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute<BR>(SIPRI).&nbsp; Another text worth noting is "SPIW: The deadliest weapon that<BR>never was" publish by Collector Grade Publications.<BR><BR>There are also several detailed studies made by DARPA as part of the SCHV<BR>project, and the later ACR project.<BR><BR>Let me know what you're looking for.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>" There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to<BR>govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 19:36:15 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Who do I hire to terraform this place?<BR><BR>&gt; Are there any references in canon to megacorporations<BR>&gt; that are interested in terraforming in and around 1115-1120?<BR>&gt; I'm in need of a likely&nbsp; organization that would be engaged<BR>&gt; in cutting edge research in the field.<BR><BR>There a couple of articles on terrforming by Doug Houseman in Different<BR>Words 22 &amp; 23.<BR><BR>The company mentioned therein is caled Terrax, and here's part of the first<BR>page of the article from DW 22 :<BR><BR>NEWLY OPENED!<BR>105-852 FOR SETTLEMENT<BR>The Terrax Corporation announced today that the long awaited opening of<BR>105-852 will come this week. After almost a century of work, Terrax will<BR>turn the completed planet over to the major owners tomorrow and the first<BR>city ships will load before the end of the month. Terrax, reputedly the<BR>biggest terraforming organization in the lrnperium, released this<BR>information from their corporate headquarters on Capital.<BR><BR>HISTORY<BR>685 Terrax founded as Terrax Terraforming Inc. within the Solornani sphere.<BR>722 Pirates destroy almost completed planetary atmosphere worked on by<BR>Terrax, as well as some Terrax ships.<BR>726 Pirates badly beaten by Terrax and Solomani navy ships.<BR>731 Terrax terraforms 817-122, unwittingly destroying the planet's<BR>previously undetected intelligent life-forms. Company accused of genocide.<BR>735 lmperium seizes all Terrax assets and property as punishment. A<BR>nationalized Terrax plagued by problems.<BR>789 Terrax rejuvenated by Imperial navy.<BR>820 Terrax sold to Epprine family after numerous accidents.<BR>890 During the Diawel crisis, Terrax reportedly plots with Zhodani. Epprine<BR>family destroyed by navy.<BR>1002 Admiral Jacsey becomes corporate head of Terrax.<BR><BR>TERRAX POLICY<BR>Admiral Jacsey is a hard taskmaster. He will not tolerate any deviation from<BR>his own Commandments of Terraforrning. These rules lay down the basis of<BR>operation for the company. Each of these rules was learned the hard way, and<BR>Admiral Jacsey does not want to repeat the lessons. The commandments are:<BR>1 -- Always pick a lifeless planet.<BR>2 -- Make a complete survey.<BR>3 -- Ensure the system has enough mass to support the job.<BR>4 -- Engineer the planet for easy travel and good weather<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; unless otherwise specified by the owners.<BR>5 -- Ensure that 40 percent or more of the planet's surfact<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; is water when the job is done.<BR>6 -- Ensure an orbital inclination of 30 degrees or less.<BR>7 -- Provide at least a full square kilometer of cropland<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; for every three planned inhabitants.<BR>8 -- Locate city sites at least 300 kilometers apart.<BR>9 -- Be sure of financial guarantees.<BR>10 - Do not take anything for granted.<BR><BR><BR>As you can see, Terrax comes from a slightly non-standard Imperium, one that<BR>"nationalizes" a companies acssets merely for wiping out an intelligent<BR>race, and which later runs taht corporation, after eliminatong it's owneres<BR>for reported treason.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 01:08:19 -0800<BR>From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; If the expedition has to carry their collectors, e.g. on a backpack,<BR>&gt; they will probably only have about 0.2 m^2 of effective area each at<BR>&gt; most, maybe 0.1 m^2 average if the collectors aren't permitted to be<BR>&gt; too bulky.&nbsp; For a base station, the effective area would be based on<BR>&gt; whatever they could bring and set up, maybe up to 100 m^2 of tough<BR>&gt; flexible material (depends on technology again).<BR><BR>Given that we are slowly heading into the regions of flexible <BR>displays and similar things today, I'm guessing by TL 10 there will <BR>be solar cells that basically look like black sheets of tough canvas <BR>or PVC cloth.&nbsp; You could make the backpacks out of them, or <BR>perhaps even the PC's overcoats (recharge as you walk).&nbsp; By TL <BR>12+ I'm guessing that the efficiency could be as high as 40-50% <BR>(higher is likely impossible).&nbsp; So (measuring the back of my coat) <BR>you could fit ~0.33 M^2 of solar cells on the back of a coat, with <BR>40% efficiency you'd get ~130 watts out of that.&nbsp; Not bad for a <BR>power source that is infinitely portable. <BR><BR>I'd also assume that since such cells are likely durable, light, and <BR>pretty cheap they would be exported throughout the Imperium for <BR>us on low tech worlds which need portable electricity.<BR><BR>- -John Snead sneadj@mindspring.com&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 21:02:29 +1100<BR>From: "Robert O'Connor" &lt;robocon@ozemail.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Andy Holzrichter wrote :-<BR>&gt; They want some type of solar recharger for energy weapons (laser <BR>&gt; rifles mostly.)&nbsp; I realize the recharge times will probably be LONG, but <BR>&gt; does anyone have appropriate figures?&nbsp; One idea was the top/sides of a <BR>&gt; backpack covered with solar cells. <BR><BR>To reiterate earlier comments by John Groth and Tim Little:-<BR>The solar constant is 1353W / m2 at 1 AU (150 million km). <BR><BR>It varies with :- <BR>- - 1/(distance)^2 <BR>- - directly with luminosity <BR>- - inversely with atmospheric pressure <BR>- - roughly, with the cosine of latitude <BR><BR>Most semiconductors use visible and near infrared wavelengths.<BR><BR>On the ground, maximum energy obtainable is 956 W/m^2 on Earth (due to<BR>the atmosphere, assuming a 100% efficient collector!). <BR><BR>A less broken solar cell table :-&nbsp; <BR>TL Power&nbsp; Price Efficiency<BR>6&nbsp; 0.001&nbsp; 0.005 0.06<BR>7&nbsp; 0.0016 0.006 0.1<BR>8&nbsp; 0.0024 0.006 0.15<BR>9&nbsp; 0.0032 0.006 0.2<BR>10 0.006&nbsp; 0.006 0.35<BR>11 0.008&nbsp; 0.006 0.5<BR><BR>Power is in MW per m3 of cells. Price is in MCr per m3. <BR>All cell arrays have an area of 12m2 per m3 and a density of 2 tons per<BR>m3. <BR>These are flat panel arrays. <BR><BR>You could leave your solar cells in orbit and transmit the power to a<BR>ground station (which could be mounted on a vehicle).<BR>Tuned parabolic collectors to receive laser light are possible from TL<BR>8. <BR>Power per 12m2 = 36kW at TL 8, 81kW at TL9, 121kW at TL 10. <BR><BR>A microwave rectenna is another option.<BR><BR>Tim Little wrote :-<BR>&gt; For laser rifles, you would need at least 5 kJ of energy per shot.<BR>&gt; Again, I don't know what canonical sources say.<BR>Traveller laser weapons seem to have discharge energies in the 5-20kJ<BR>range for man portable devices.<BR><BR><BR>Robert O'Connor<BR>Medico, Gamer<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 05:35:33 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: FAQ: Frequently Asked Questions about the Traveller Storyline<BR><BR>On Wed, 31 Jan 2001 20:09:05 -0500, I wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;OK, folks!&nbsp; Time to add these to the Traveller FAQ at Freelance Traveller.<BR>&gt;Problem is, I only have three of them, and no answers at this time.&nbsp; I'd<BR>&gt;appreciate if people here could brainstorm me some answers - with citations<BR>&gt;if you're getting your info from published materials (and _not_ inferring<BR>&gt;what the published material "means" - so you can't tell me that the Black<BR>&gt;Curtain represents the boundary of a Virus-run empire and cite any of the<BR>&gt;extant TNE stuff!).<BR><BR>&gt;Inferences are OK for answers, just don't cite for them or mark them<BR>&gt;authoritative, unless you're Marc Miller or Loren Wiseman; anything you're<BR>&gt;willing to say about them will be taken as official.<BR><BR>&gt;Also, if anyone has any ideas for additional questions in this section,<BR>&gt;please feel free to post the questions - I'll add them, and we can all have<BR>&gt;fun brainstorming more answers to them.<BR><BR>DOH!&nbsp; I forgot to give you the questions I already have!<BR><BR>(1) What is the black curtain?<BR><BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; Speculation has run rampant on this on, with answers centering on the<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; idea that it's due in some way to Virus.&nbsp; Common guesses have been that<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; it's a Virus-run empire of some sort, or that it's the scene of an<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; ongoing war between two 'factions' of Virus, one revering Lucan as a<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; god, the other demonizing him.&nbsp; All we know from published materials<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; [TNE] is that no ship has been known to enter it and return.<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; [Loren Wiseman on the TML] "Don't ask, I can't tell you.<BR><BR>(2) What is the Empress Wave?<BR><BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; Another question that seems to have caused lots of speculation, most<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; guesses are that it seems to be a psionic phenomenon of some sort.<BR><BR>(3) Will the Empress Wave be followed up in GURPS Traveller?<BR><BR>No answer to this one as yet.&nbsp; Loren?<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3584<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yd03.mx.aol.com (rly-yd03.mail.aol.com [172.18.150.3]) by air-yd03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 01 Feb 2001 05:39:52 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yd03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 01 Feb 2001 05:39:02 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id FAA33246;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 1 Feb 2001 05:31:10 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 1 Feb 2001 05:30:48 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id FAA33192<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 1 Feb 2001 05:30:48 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 05:30:48 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102011030.FAA33192@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3584<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3585</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/1/01 9:02:35 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, February 1 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3585<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: RE:TNE<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR>[Website Review] Traveller Core Route Maps<BR>Re: Landgrabs<BR>Re: A couple of questions<BR>On feedback<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: On feedback<BR>RE: On feedback<BR>RE: On feedback<BR>RE: On feedback<BR>RE: On feedback<BR>RE: On feedback<BR>Duelling<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 02:31:18 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: RE:TNE<BR><BR>Somewhere in the Black Curtain is a cyborg Lucan, half mad because of<BR>age and a strain of virus infecting his implant computer...<BR><BR><BR>- --- Jeffrey Yin &lt;jsyin@cats.ucsc.edu&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; I would have to disagree. Like I said in my earlier post, I believe<BR>&gt; it is<BR>&gt; much more likely that it is simply more dangerous due to the war<BR>&gt; going on<BR>&gt; between two Vampire Fleet factions. This would even go very far in<BR>&gt; explaining why no ships have returned. Not only do you have the<BR>&gt; standard<BR>&gt; danger of hostile vessels, but they all have Virus as well.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Jeffrey Yin<BR>&gt; ----- Original Message -----<BR>&gt; From: "Don Roberts" &lt;tne1201@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>&gt; To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2001 4:09 PM<BR>&gt; Subject: RE:TNE<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; I often thought that the black curtain may have had<BR>&gt; &gt; something to do with the empress wave or maybe<BR>&gt; &gt; something even more sinister.&nbsp; Someone out there knows<BR>&gt; &gt; and does not want to fess up.&nbsp; Even though the line<BR>&gt; &gt; has been discontinued and the company is out of<BR>&gt; &gt; business.&nbsp; I always envisioned the Black Curtain as a<BR>&gt; &gt; space/time anomoly or something more heinous.&nbsp; Maybe<BR>&gt; &gt; even reacting from an ancients' artifact.&nbsp; Any<BR>&gt; &gt; thoughts on this guys?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; __________________________________________________<BR>&gt; &gt; Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35<BR>&gt; &gt; a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 21:46:16 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>sneadj@mindspring.com wrote:<BR>&gt; Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; If the expedition has to carry their collectors, e.g. on a backpack,<BR>&gt; &gt; they will probably only have about 0.2 m^2 of effective area each at<BR>&gt; &gt; most, maybe 0.1 m^2 average if the collectors aren't permitted to be<BR>&gt; &gt; too bulky.<BR><BR>[...]<BR>&gt; (measuring the back of my coat) you could fit ~0.33 M^2 of solar<BR>&gt; cells on the back of a coat,<BR><BR>It won't be at the optimal angle relative to the sun, particularly<BR>when the sun is high in the sky.&nbsp; That means the *effective* area will<BR>be much lower, around the 0.1 m^2 I mentioned.&nbsp; This will be<BR>particularly true given that you won't always be walking away from the<BR>sun, and that some of the jacket area will probably be obscured by<BR>non-solar-cell objects.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; with 40% efficiency you'd get ~130 watts out of that.<BR><BR>Only if the cell area was uncovered and perfectly perpendicular to the<BR>sun, on a cloudless day with a near-ideal star spectrum, unobscured by<BR>any form of clouds, fog, smoke or dust particles, on a planet near the<BR>inside of its life zone and with a thin atmosphere relative to Earth.<BR><BR>A more typical figure for solar cell clothing might be 15 watts,<BR>taking into account one or more of less than perfect sun angle,<BR>efficiency, stellar spectrum, atmospheric absorption and reflection,<BR>shading by items carried or by other parts of the body, posture, dust<BR>or dirt, shadowing by trees or other objects, and clouds.<BR><BR>Even so, that's only 10 minutes per 10 kJ laser rifle shot.&nbsp; Quite<BR>sufficient for general survival power.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; I'd also assume that since such cells are likely durable, light, and<BR>&gt; pretty cheap they would be exported throughout the Imperium for us<BR>&gt; on low tech worlds which need portable electricity.<BR><BR>Maybe so.&nbsp; It really depends on how Earth-like you imagine other<BR>worlds to be.&nbsp; They would provide significantly less power on<BR>Mars-like worlds than on Earth-like ones, and be near-useless on<BR>worlds with a permanent cloud cover.<BR><BR>I suspect other portable energy sources would be more generally<BR>useful.&nbsp; But yes, solar power would probably be an attractive backup<BR>source.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 03:24:06 -0800<BR>From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>Subject: Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>"Robert O'Connor" &lt;robocon@ozemail.com.au&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; A less broken solar cell table :-&nbsp; <BR>&gt; TL Power&nbsp; Price Efficiency<BR>&gt; 6&nbsp; 0.001&nbsp; 0.005 0.06<BR>&gt; 7&nbsp; 0.0016 0.006 0.1<BR>&gt; 8&nbsp; 0.0024 0.006 0.15<BR>&gt; 9&nbsp; 0.0032 0.006 0.2<BR>&gt; 10 0.006&nbsp; 0.006 0.35<BR>&gt; 11 0.008&nbsp; 0.006 0.5<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Power is in MW per m3 of cells. Price is in MCr per m3. <BR>&gt; All cell arrays have an area of 12m2 per m3 and a density of 2 tons<BR>&gt; per m3. These are flat panel arrays.<BR><BR>That all looks great, except that the 12m2 per m3 means the <BR>panels are all more than 8 cm thick!&nbsp; I'm thinking that at maximum <BR>they will be maybe 2-3 mm thick (with thinner (0.5-1 mm) flexible <BR>versions at maybe 2-3x the price).&nbsp; With memory material and <BR>such even an auto-folding array should likely only be 5-8 mm thick. <BR><BR><BR>Comments?<BR>- -John Snead sneadj@mindspring.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 22:52:50 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>sneadj@mindspring.com wrote:<BR>&gt; That all looks great, except that the 12m2 per m3 means the <BR>&gt; panels are all more than 8 cm thick!<BR><BR>That probably about right for large fixed solar arrays, at lower tech<BR>levels especially.&nbsp; A bit too thick for the high-efficiency vehicle<BR>mounted cells I've seen, though only by a factor of two or so. *Far*<BR>too thick for portable devices.<BR><BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; I'm thinking that at maximum they will be maybe 2-3 mm thick (with<BR>&gt; thinner (0.5-1 mm) flexible versions at maybe 2-3x the price).<BR><BR>The minimum thickness will probably be determined by structural<BR>strength.&nbsp; If not flexible, 2-3mm is really far too thin for<BR>supporting a structure at least a metre across.<BR><BR>It is possible, though, that higher efficiencies might only be<BR>achieved by focusing the light (some types of existing cell have this<BR>property), and hence have a minimum thickness dictated by focal<BR>length.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:48:34 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: [Website Review] Traveller Core Route Maps<BR><BR>The Traveller Website Review<BR>- ----------------------------<BR><BR>Clifford Linehan asked me to review his site, so here is ...<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Traveller Core Route Maps<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (http://herons-reach.homepage.com/traveller/)<BR><BR>The site describes itself as ...<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; "The intent of this site is to&nbsp; provide&nbsp; maps&nbsp; for&nbsp; the&nbsp; Core<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Route.&nbsp; No histories / descriptions are going to be&nbsp; written.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; No cultures other than Zhodani, and a&nbsp; few&nbsp; Droyne,&nbsp; will&nbsp; be<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; named on the maps.&nbsp; Over 160 sectors will be&nbsp; created&nbsp; before<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; this project is completed."<BR><BR>... and it keeps true to this 'mission objective'.&nbsp; The&nbsp; HTML&nbsp; is<BR>elementary, and there are&nbsp; few&nbsp; on-page&nbsp; graphics.&nbsp; Some&nbsp; of&nbsp; the<BR>pages have very large tables that on a 56K modem can take&nbsp; a&nbsp; few<BR>minutes to load (even without graphics).&nbsp; But what you get&nbsp; is&nbsp; a<BR>resource!<BR><BR>Most of the site is a catalogue of the 160+ sectors on the way to<BR>the galactic core.&nbsp; Many have downloadable SAR format files,&nbsp; the<BR>sector archive file type of Jim Vassilakos' "Galactic"&nbsp; software.<BR>(If you don't have this DOS program then get it now, it might not<BR>have the system generation functionality of "Heaven&amp;Earth" but it<BR>is a fast&nbsp; sector/subsector&nbsp; viewer&nbsp; and&nbsp; campaign&nbsp; note&nbsp; taker.)<BR>Rather than downloading each sector individually, you can instead<BR>choose to download&nbsp; the&nbsp; 97&nbsp; currently&nbsp; mapped&nbsp; sectors&nbsp; (in&nbsp; SAR<BR>format) of the 'core path' as a single 1.1Mb ZIP file.&nbsp; There are<BR>also 12 other sectors from various sources available.<BR><BR>On other pages you will find a table of&nbsp; sectors&nbsp; with&nbsp; subsector<BR>names given where known.&nbsp; And a map of the Milky Way galaxy at&nbsp; 8<BR>parsecs a pixel!&nbsp; (This 4.4Mb Jpeg can be downloaded as an&nbsp; 800Kb<BR>ZIP file.)<BR><BR>In summary: if you're either a Traveller astrogation freak or you<BR>are running a campaign based on the Zhodani Core Expeditions then<BR>this site is for you!&nbsp; Accept no substitute.<BR><BR>Improvements: the main list is wide and if&nbsp; your&nbsp; browser&nbsp; window<BR>isn't large enough it word wraps and becomes confusing.&nbsp; I had my<BR>browser maximised to 1152 x 864 and it seemed that&nbsp; much&nbsp; smaller<BR>would have problems.&nbsp; It&nbsp; would&nbsp; be&nbsp; better&nbsp; to&nbsp; have&nbsp; horizontal<BR>scrolling or a different&nbsp; layout.&nbsp; I&nbsp; haven't&nbsp; had&nbsp; a&nbsp; chance&nbsp; to<BR>install corepath.zip yet so I don't fully know what's in the&nbsp; SAR<BR>files (that'll have to wait for&nbsp; the&nbsp; weekend)&nbsp; ...&nbsp; but&nbsp; someone<BR>should develop a few adventures to run along the way.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 13:36:19 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrabs<BR><BR>IMO..You need at least the Regency Sourcebook or GT:BTC and Book 6 Scouts or <BR>GT First in for a complete write up...Part of the Landgrab requirements were <BR>a complete write up from First In or Book 6...<BR><BR>Mike<BR><BR>- ----Original Message Follows----<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrabs<BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 15:31:51 +1100<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I assume they'd all be on the list, so folk, please use this sorted<BR>&gt; version that I culled from Downport and comment on what's missing or<BR>&gt; superseded:<BR><BR>I'm planning to detail Feri/Regina.&nbsp; Unfortunately I do not own a lot<BR>of worldbooks or atlases or whatever.&nbsp; Is there any published data on<BR>Feri at all?<BR><BR>I plan to detail it anyway for my own campaign, regardless of such<BR>data -- but it would be more useful to other people if I didn't stray<BR>too far from canon.<BR><BR>Is there an online source for astrometric data on named systems,<BR>e.g. stellar classes, orbital periods, etc?&nbsp; All I've been able to<BR>find so far is UWP data.&nbsp; Am I free to make up anything I like in<BR>these respects?&nbsp; (Well, of course I am) More to the point, is there<BR>anything I should know about to maximise usefulness to others by<BR>avoiding conflict with well-known material?<BR><BR>One thing I find very difficult is constructing history and society in<BR>a way that other people will find useful.&nbsp; Planetary development does<BR>not occur in a (social) vacuum, but as more people contribute to<BR>descriptions of nearby planets, it becomes more and more difficult to<BR>keep things coherent.<BR><BR>If I specify that the people on "my" planet have very close ties to<BR>someone else's, there is a problem if the other person subsequently<BR>specifies that their people have nothing to do with Feri inhabitants.<BR>Likewise for wars, nobility, corporations, or any number of other<BR>inter-system details.<BR><BR>How have other people dealt with this?&nbsp; Is it even feasible for me to<BR>develop such detail (for public consumption) without owning a lot more<BR>Traveller products than I do?<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- <BR>kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 16:46:42 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A couple of questions<BR><BR>knightsky@juno.com wrote:<BR>&gt; Oh, I figured individual worlds would have their own take on it, but what<BR>&gt; I was asking was whether TI law (as opposed to local world law) had<BR>&gt; anything to say about duelling one way or the other.&nbsp; To make myself<BR>&gt; clearer, in a situation where only the TI laws apply (say, on an Navy<BR>&gt; ship or somesuch), would duelling be legal?<BR><BR>IMO:<BR><BR>Not in situations where allowing duels would be potentially dangerous to<BR>other individuals than the duelists. In other words, no challenging of<BR>officers during missions et al.<BR><BR>Duels between nobles should be rather common when arguments get too<BR>heated. Jealousy, insults, that sort of thing...<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 16:52:42 +0100<BR>From: "Patrik Holmstrm" &lt;glappkaeft@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: On feedback<BR><BR>1 out of the 2 feedback messages I've ever got looks like this (just got <BR>it).<BR><BR>&gt;From: FragginBastitch@aol.com<BR>&gt;To: glappkaeft@hotmail.com<BR>&gt;Subject: About your Traveller site.<BR>&gt;Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 06:51:31 EST<BR>&gt;It's real simple. Without Pictures or Deckplans , which TRUE players &gt;and <BR>&gt;gamemasters love , your site SUCKS!! End of story.<BR><BR>Its a wonder people even bother with webpages.<BR><BR>Patrik "Who promises he will begin to offer more feedback Real Soon Now..."<BR>http://www.docs.uu.se/~paho9211/trav/<BR><BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 11:03:08 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>John Snead writes:<BR>&gt;Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;If the expedition has to carry their collectors, e.g. on a backpack,<BR>&gt;&gt;they will probably only have about 0.2 m^2 of effective area each at<BR>&gt;&gt;most, maybe 0.1 m^2<BR>&gt;Given that we are slowly heading into the regions of flexible <BR>&gt;displays and similar things today, I'm guessing by TL 10 there will <BR>&gt;be solar cells that basically look like black sheets of tough canvas <BR>&gt;or PVC cloth.&nbsp; You could make the backpacks out of them, or <BR>&gt;perhaps even the PC's overcoats (recharge as you walk).&nbsp; By TL <BR>&gt;12+ I'm guessing that the efficiency could be as high as 40-50% <BR>&gt;(higher is likely impossible).&nbsp; So (measuring the back of my coat) <BR>&gt;you could fit ~0.33 M^2 of solar cells on the back of a coat, with <BR>&gt;40% efficiency you'd get ~130 watts out of that.&nbsp; Not bad for a <BR>&gt;power source that is infinitely portable.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; This approach could give most low power devices pretty<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; much infinite use.&nbsp; Bear in mind, however, that it is the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; area of sunlight that matters, not the area of the clothing.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Unless the clothing is spread out perpendicular to the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; light rays these will not be the same.<BR><BR>&gt;I'd also assume that since such cells are likely durable, light, and <BR>&gt;pretty cheap they would be exported throughout the Imperium for <BR>&gt;us on low tech worlds which need portable electricity.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; There goes the groat-powered generating stations.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 11:20:39 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>Tod Glenn writes:<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;I expect elite planetary units in the Imperium to be equipped with higher<BR>&gt;tech weaponry, despite higher cost, particularly when the tech difference is<BR>&gt;meaningful enough to give a significant advantage (TL5 to TL 8, not much<BR>&gt;difference.&nbsp; Flintlock vs. ACRs, different story).&nbsp; Also, expect the "palace<BR>&gt;guard" to have the highest tech it can afford, particularly when the ruling<BR>&gt;party is not well liked.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Very true.&nbsp; A company of spearmen with archers would have little<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; chance against a squad with rifles and an autorifle on an open<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; plain, but a company with rifles and a few autorifles would give a<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; squad with ACRs and a RAM GL pause for thought.<BR><BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;I haven't done up the reliability tables for energy weapons yet, but see my<BR>&gt;'house rule' about weapons malfunctions at http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>&gt;under House Rules.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I have seen those and rather like them.&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;Logistics is what ultimately wins wars.&nbsp; Not super weapons or super<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;warriors.<BR>&gt;&gt;Ever heard of the Star Trigger?&nbsp; ;)<BR>&gt;Ok, I was thinking in terms of small arms.&nbsp; Strategic weapons are a<BR>&gt;different matter, particularly if the other side can't reply in kind.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; :)&nbsp; Sorry about that, I knew that we were dealing with small<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; arms but I couldn't resist cheating.<BR><BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;Another reason to stick with cartridge weapons, BTW.&nbsp; The users are tied to<BR>&gt;their ammunition.&nbsp; It helps keep wackos and revolutionaries from having too<BR>&gt;great an impact if they need ammo.&nbsp; When you have an energy weapon, as long<BR>&gt;as you have power, you have an infinite supply of ammo (which might be a<BR>&gt;better reason for marines to use energy weapons.&nbsp; No ammo to cart around.<BR>&gt;Just plug into the nearest wall socket to reload).<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Both excellent points.&nbsp; This especially applies to shipping marines from<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; system to system: cargo space can be saved if you can 'reload' most<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; weapons from the ship's power plant.&nbsp; Support weapons and AFVs<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; would tend to use energy weapons for this reason as well.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 08:23:12 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: John Fox &lt;jfox@verity.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Hello Everyone:<BR>&nbsp; To give you an idea of what is avalible (as of July 1999) go to <BR>&nbsp; http://www.enn.com/enn-news-archive/1999/07/072699/newsolar_4532.asp<BR>&nbsp; for look at thin film stuff for PV cells.<BR>&nbsp; I will be doine more looking and if I find more info more posting about PV <BR>cell stuff.<BR>&nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; John W. Fox<BR>&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:24:03 EST<BR>From: WriteFool@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: On feedback<BR><BR>In a message dated 2/1/01 9:53:59 AM Central Standard Time, <BR>glappkaeft@hotmail.com writes:<BR><BR>&lt;&lt; 1 out of the 2 feedback messages I've ever got looks like this (just got <BR>it).<BR><BR>&gt;From: FragginBastitch@aol.com<BR>&gt;To: glappkaeft@hotmail.com<BR>&gt;Subject: About your Traveller site.<BR>&gt;Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 06:51:31 EST<BR>&gt;It's real simple. Without Pictures or Deckplans , which TRUE players &gt;and <BR>&gt;gamemasters love , your site SUCKS!! End of story.<BR><BR>Its a wonder people even bother with webpages.<BR><BR>Patrik "Who promises he will begin to offer more feedback Real Soon Now..."<BR>http://www.docs.uu.se/~paho9211/trav/<BR>&nbsp; &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>I wouldn't sweat it too much, here is the User Profile for the wordsmith who <BR>wrote that feedback:<BR><BR>Member Name:&nbsp; &nbsp; None o' yer fraggin' bizness!!<BR>Location:&nbsp;&nbsp; None o' yer fraggin' bizness!!<BR>Sex:&nbsp; &nbsp; Male<BR>Marital Status: I'm fraggin' single,OK??<BR>Hobbies:&nbsp; &nbsp; None o' yer fraggin' bizness!!<BR>Computers:&nbsp; Dis fraggin' piece o' crap!!<BR>Occupation: Im da worse fraggin' bastitch youse evah met!!<BR>Personal Quote: Fraggin' (peeps call me Shaggy) Bastitch!!<BR><BR>A real credit to pre-Terran Confederation Society<BR><BR>Michael Breen<BR>Professional Lurker<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 08:23:50 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: On feedback<BR><BR>Pat,<BR><BR>he is an A$$<BR><BR>Lets leave it at that.<BR>Also deckplans are not the end all and be all of traveller. they are great.<BR>but the things like the landgrab and new items or equipment(not just weapons<BR>but gadgets) are just as important. And i love reading some of the ships<BR>logs out there. give me neat ideas for adventures.<BR><BR>you can if you wish send a message back for me basically tell him to "Blow<BR>it out his airlock!"<BR><BR>8P<BR><BR>me<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Patrik Holmstrm [mailto:glappkaeft@hotmail.com]<BR>Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 7:53 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: On feedback<BR><BR><BR><BR>1 out of the 2 feedback messages I've ever got looks like this (just got <BR>it).<BR><BR>&gt;From: FragginBastitch@aol.com<BR>&gt;To: glappkaeft@hotmail.com<BR>&gt;Subject: About your Traveller site.<BR>&gt;Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 06:51:31 EST<BR>&gt;It's real simple. Without Pictures or Deckplans , which TRUE players &gt;and <BR>&gt;gamemasters love , your site SUCKS!! End of story.<BR><BR>Its a wonder people even bother with webpages.<BR><BR>Patrik "Who promises he will begin to offer more feedback Real Soon Now..."<BR>http://www.docs.uu.se/~paho9211/trav/<BR><BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 08:34:39 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: On feedback<BR><BR>"I weep for the species."<BR>?, Titan A.E.<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of WriteFool@aol.com<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 8:24 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: On feedback<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In a message dated 2/1/01 9:53:59 AM Central Standard Time,<BR>&gt; glappkaeft@hotmail.com writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;&lt; 1 out of the 2 feedback messages I've ever got looks like this<BR>&gt; (just got<BR>&gt;&nbsp; it).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;From: FragginBastitch@aol.com<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;To: glappkaeft@hotmail.com<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;Subject: About your Traveller site.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 06:51:31 EST<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;It's real simple. Without Pictures or Deckplans , which TRUE<BR>&gt; players &gt;and<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;gamemasters love , your site SUCKS!! End of story.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Its a wonder people even bother with webpages.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Patrik "Who promises he will begin to offer more feedback Real<BR>&gt; Soon Now..."<BR>&gt;&nbsp; http://www.docs.uu.se/~paho9211/trav/<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; &gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I wouldn't sweat it too much, here is the User Profile for the<BR>&gt; wordsmith who<BR>&gt; wrote that feedback:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Member Name:&nbsp; &nbsp; None o' yer fraggin' bizness!!<BR>&gt; Location:&nbsp;&nbsp; None o' yer fraggin' bizness!!<BR>&gt; Sex:&nbsp; &nbsp; Male<BR>&gt; Marital Status: I'm fraggin' single,OK??<BR>&gt; Hobbies:&nbsp; &nbsp; None o' yer fraggin' bizness!!<BR>&gt; Computers:&nbsp; Dis fraggin' piece o' crap!!<BR>&gt; Occupation: Im da worse fraggin' bastitch youse evah met!!<BR>&gt; Personal Quote: Fraggin' (peeps call me Shaggy) Bastitch!!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; A real credit to pre-Terran Confederation Society<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Michael Breen<BR>&gt; Professional Lurker<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 08:40:57 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: On feedback<BR><BR>What amazes me is that this cretin even took the time to write.....wait, on<BR>second thought that's probably how he gets his jollies.&nbsp; Never mind.<BR><BR>Anybody have a correct Latin translation for "Don't let the bastards drag<BR>you down"?&nbsp; A really quick search on Google gave me a couple different<BR>versions, none of which is the one that I've seen before ;)<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Patrik Holmstrm<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 7:53 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: On feedback<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; 1 out of the 2 feedback messages I've ever got looks like this (just got<BR>&gt; it).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;From: FragginBastitch@aol.com<BR>&gt; &gt;To: glappkaeft@hotmail.com<BR>&gt; &gt;Subject: About your Traveller site.<BR>&gt; &gt;Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 06:51:31 EST<BR>&gt; &gt;It's real simple. Without Pictures or Deckplans , which TRUE<BR>&gt; players &gt;and<BR>&gt; &gt;gamemasters love , your site SUCKS!! End of story.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Its a wonder people even bother with webpages.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Patrik "Who promises he will begin to offer more feedback Real<BR>&gt; Soon Now..."<BR>&gt; http://www.docs.uu.se/~paho9211/trav/<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; _________________________________________________________________________<BR>&gt; Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:46:22 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: On feedback<BR><BR>At 8:40 AM -0800 2/1/01, Jesse Degraff wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Anybody have a correct Latin translation for "Don't let the bastards drag<BR>&gt;you down"?&nbsp; A really quick search on Google gave me a couple different<BR>&gt;versions, none of which is the one that I've seen before ;)<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Not sure it's correct, but what I've heard is 'non carborundum <BR>illegitimi'.&nbsp; My former boss used to use it a lot, referring to sneak <BR>audits by the AG's office.<BR><BR>Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 08:56:36 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: On feedback<BR><BR>That sounds like the one I remember :)<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Kenji Schwarz<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 8:46 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Cc: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: On feedback<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; At 8:40 AM -0800 2/1/01, Jesse Degraff wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Anybody have a correct Latin translation for "Don't let the bastards drag<BR>&gt; &gt;you down"?&nbsp; A really quick search on Google gave me a couple different<BR>&gt; &gt;versions, none of which is the one that I've seen before ;)<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Not sure it's correct, but what I've heard is 'non carborundum<BR>&gt; illegitimi'.&nbsp; My former boss used to use it a lot, referring to sneak<BR>&gt; audits by the AG's office.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 11:54:36 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Duelling<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;Is duelling legal in the Third Imperium?<BR>&gt; &gt; It seems to be left up to the individual world. I'm aware of at<BR>&gt; &gt; least one world in canon (Towers [3103 Spinward Marches], as described<BR>&gt;in "The<BR>&gt; &gt; Traveller Adventure") where duelling is a way of life.<BR>&gt;Oh, I figured individual worlds would have their own take on it, but what<BR>&gt;I was asking was whether TI law (as opposed to local world law) had<BR>&gt;anything to say about duelling one way or the other.&nbsp; To make myself<BR>&gt;clearer, in a situation where only the TI laws apply (say, on an Navy<BR>&gt;ship or somesuch), would duelling be legal?<BR><BR>Not on duty, or if it effected the Chain of Command, or interfered with <BR>'the mission'<BR><BR>General rule of thumb answer: no.<BR><BR><BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/ - Opinions should be yours too!<BR>"We don't just borrow words; on occasion, English has pursued<BR>other languages down alleyways to beat them unconscious and<BR>rifle their pockets for new vocabulary." - James D. Nicoll<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3585<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xd05.mx.aol.com (rly-xd05.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.170]) by air-xd03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 01 Feb 2001 12:02:35 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xd05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 01 Feb 2001 12:02:06 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id LAA47491;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:56:53 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:56:35 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA47441<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:56:35 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:56:35 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102011656.LAA47441@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3585<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3586</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/1/01 11:09:01 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, February 1 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3586<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: A couple of questions<BR>Re: On feedback<BR>Re: On feedback<BR>Re: [TML] TNE [FILK]<BR>re: A couple of questions<BR>re: A couple of questions<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>re: A couple of questions<BR>Re: A couple of questions<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>RE: [Website Review] Traveller Core Route Maps<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>RE: On feedback<BR>Re: Landgrabs<BR>Re: [TML] On feedback<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 09:49:41 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A couple of questions<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Oh, I figured individual worlds would have their own take on it, but<BR>what<BR>&gt; &gt; I was asking was whether TI law (as opposed to local world law) had<BR>&gt; &gt; anything to say about duelling one way or the other.&nbsp; To make myself<BR>&gt; &gt; clearer, in a situation where only the TI laws apply (say, on an Navy<BR>&gt; &gt; ship or somesuch), would duelling be legal?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; IMO:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Not in situations where allowing duels would be potentially dangerous to<BR>&gt; other individuals than the duelists. In other words, no challenging of<BR>&gt; officers during missions et al.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Duels between nobles should be rather common when arguments get too<BR>&gt; heated. Jealousy, insults, that sort of thing...<BR><BR>Typically, duels would only be between officers of equivalent rank, as well.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 09:53:56 -0800<BR>From: "Thing" &lt;thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: On feedback<BR><BR>On Thursday, February 01, 2001 8:41 AM<BR>Jesse Degraff said,<BR><BR>&gt; Anybody have a correct Latin translation for "Don't let the bastards drag<BR>&gt; you down"?&nbsp; A really quick search on Google gave me a couple different<BR>&gt; versions, none of which is the one that I've seen before ;)<BR><BR>I think this is what you are looking for.&nbsp; One of my favorites.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; ILLEGITIMIS NIL CARBORUNDUM<BR>:&nbsp; Don't let the bastards grind you down.<BR>&nbsp; (From the mediaeval jingle, "Si te dominorum vis/Facit<BR>furibundum,/ Dico "illegitimis Nichil carborundum")<BR><BR>G.D.D.<BR>ThingUnderTheStairs<BR>===================<BR>"Sic Georgianos Allos Subitatos Nunc"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 09:53:06 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: On feedback<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 8:40 AM<BR>Subject: RE: On feedback<BR><BR><BR>&gt; What amazes me is that this cretin even took the time to write.....wait,<BR>on<BR>&gt; second thought that's probably how he gets his jollies.&nbsp; Never mind.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Anybody have a correct Latin translation for "Don't let the bastards drag<BR>&gt; you down"?&nbsp; A really quick search on Google gave me a couple different<BR>&gt; versions, none of which is the one that I've seen before ;)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Jesse<BR><BR>Some thing like "Illegitimus Non Tandem Carborundum"?<BR><BR>Apologies to a latin scholars out there.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 12:55:37 -0500<BR>From: Jonathan McDermott &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: [TML] TNE [FILK]<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 02:31:18 -0800 (PST)<BR>&gt;From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: RE:TNE<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Somewhere in the Black Curtain is a cyborg Lucan, half mad because of<BR>&gt;age and a strain of virus infecting his implant computer...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;- --- Jeffrey Yin &lt;jsyin@cats.ucsc.edu&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; I would have to disagree. Like I said in my earlier post, I believe<BR>&gt; &gt; it is<BR>&gt; &gt; much more likely that it is simply more dangerous due to the war<BR>&gt; &gt; going on<BR>&gt; &gt; between two Vampire Fleet factions. This would even go very far in<BR>&gt; &gt; explaining why no ships have returned. Not only do you have the<BR>&gt; &gt; standard<BR>&gt; &gt; danger of hostile vessels, but they all have Virus as well.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Jeffrey Yin<BR><BR>Why, yes... that makes sense!&nbsp; In fact... he's in a white <BR>room....&nbsp; (Danger, Will Robinson!&nbsp; The tone-deaf Muse has reawakened....)<BR><BR>BLACK CURTAIN<BR>===== =======<BR>(from: "White Room" by Jack Bruce and Pete Brown<BR><BR>In the sector 'hind Black Curtain near Sylea.<BR>Blackwar-ravaged, no gold pavements, broken starships.<BR>A grand madness ran o'er Empire in my dark eyes.<BR>Hard Times smiled at my leaving, your contentment.<BR><BR>I'll wait in this place where the sun never shines;<BR>Wait in this place where the starships run from themselves.<BR><BR>I said nothing could hold me back from my Empire.<BR>Vengeance Fleet, restless dreaming, mighty Palace.<BR>I walked into such a sad time in the Empire.<BR>As I walked out, felt the madness just beginning.<BR><BR>I'll be in the Core when the ships come back;<BR>Here alone where the starships run from themselves.<BR><BR>In my heyday it was so grand, my Imperium.<BR>Damn Ilelish, damn that Strephon, damn them all.<BR>Now I sit here in my Palace barely seeing<BR>I cannot leave, this my Palace, this my Prison.<BR><BR>I'll sleep in this place with nobody else;<BR>Lie in the dark where the starships run from themselves.<BR><BR>- -30-<BR><BR>Blargh... I gotta find happier songs to filk. =/<BR><BR>Maybe...<BR>o/~ Oops, I did it again... I broke Interdiction, on a Red Zone world...! o/~<BR>Maybenot. =)<BR><BR>o/~ You got to know when to pull 'em... know when to forge 'em... know when <BR>to be Archduke... know when to clone.... o/~&nbsp; 'The Archduke,' anyone?<BR><BR>Maybe something from Bananarama? o/~ Hiver on a mountain-top // Wavin' all <BR>those spiny leaves // Manipulation is his game // An' Eneri is his name <BR>WOOOO! // It's got it // Yeah baby, it's got it // Have a corn dog // It's <BR>your Hiver // It's on fire.... o/~<BR><BR>I'll... just go over and finish off my lunch and have my medication now, I <BR>think....<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 10:05:35 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: A couple of questions<BR><BR>&gt;From: knightsky@juno.com<BR><BR>&gt;Is duelling legal in the Third Imperium?<BR><BR>It's an interesting question that we bounce around every now and again. <BR>The social function of a duel has varied somewhat from place to place and<BR>time to time (compare 18th Century France with 14th Century Japan, for<BR>example).&nbsp; Usually it involves cleansing one's honor by combat with the<BR>person who made it dirty.&nbsp; It need not be to the death, as the injured<BR>party (in some cultures and at some times) need only fight until he has<BR>had satisfaction.&nbsp; (See Kubrick's vastly underrated and far too rarely<BR>screened "Barry Lyndon".&nbsp; The cinematography is too good for a video<BR>rental; it really must be seen in a theater.)&nbsp; <BR><BR>Governments traditionally oppose duelling, with varying amounts of effort<BR>and success, because the custom has traditionally been folllowed by the<BR>aristocracy -- the very people with the money, connections, and education<BR>that makes them too valuable to the country to throw away.&nbsp; On the other<BR>hand, having your henchman take out a dangerous potential rival in a duel<BR>is an ancient tradition mentioned (if I recall correctly) by Machiavelli<BR>in The Prince.&nbsp;&nbsp; <BR><BR>In my Traveller universe, duelling on Imperial property (an imprecise word<BR>referring to Imperial bases, worlds directly administered by the Imperium,<BR>vessels registered on Imperial member worlds, starports, and the like) is<BR>a disturbance of the peace of the realm, subject to being quashed by<BR>Imperial military forces like any insurrection, and carrying serious<BR>penalties such as imprisonment and forfeiture of titles.&nbsp; On the other<BR>hand, Imperial member states treat duelling differently, according to<BR>their own laws.&nbsp; People who want to duel should accordingly take it<BR>outside the extrality line.&nbsp; <BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 13:11:38 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: A couple of questions<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;Is duelling legal in the Third Imperium?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;It's an interesting question that we bounce around every now and again.<BR>&gt;The social function of a duel has varied somewhat from place to place and <BR>&gt;time to time (compare 18th Century France with 14th Century Japan, for <BR>&gt;example).&nbsp; Usually it involves cleansing one's honor by combat with the <BR>&gt;person who made it dirty.<BR><BR>Which reminds me that there are supposed to be plenty of Aslan citizens of <BR>the Imperium. What do they do?<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 08:59:33<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>At 05:57 PM 1/31/2001, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Are you working on another GT book? :-)<BR><BR>I'm writing a proposal for one of the _GT: Small Wars_ books.&nbsp; Let me<BR>bounce the idea off of you.<BR><BR>What happens when a high-pop, TL12 world suddenly finds itself faced with a<BR>destabilizing social upheveal caused by serious rifts between the have<BR>minority and the have-nots who do all the work?<BR><BR>What do you do if you're the Subsector Duke, and the bulk of your Army is<BR>from this world?<BR><BR>What do you do if those shipyards are needed by the Navy?<BR><BR>What do you do when rioting breaks out in an arcology?<BR><BR>Think fast.<BR><BR>Because Strouden is burning.<BR><BR>Anybody interested?&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>(Loren, I swear I'm doing nothing tommorrow but writing the proposal.<BR>Promise!)<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 10:30:34 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Kiri Aradia Morgan &lt;tiamat@tsoft.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: A couple of questions<BR><BR>On Thu, 1 Feb 2001, Paul Drye wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;Is duelling legal in the Third Imperium?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;It's an interesting question that we bounce around every now and again.<BR>&gt; &gt;The social function of a duel has varied somewhat from place to place and <BR>&gt; &gt;time to time (compare 18th Century France with 14th Century Japan, for <BR>&gt; &gt;example).&nbsp; Usually it involves cleansing one's honor by combat with the <BR>&gt; &gt;person who made it dirty.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Which reminds me that there are supposed to be plenty of Aslan citizens of <BR>&gt; the Imperium. What do they do?<BR>&gt; <BR>The usual solution for persons in this position is to try very hard NOT to<BR>get caught.&nbsp; Injuries sustained in duelling will be passed off as<BR>something else whenever possible, except in the company of sympathetic<BR>persons.<BR><BR>I've always wondered about the law in Japan against suicide (meant to<BR>discourage seppuku, which almost never happens these days, and lovers'<BR>suicides, which sometimes do).&nbsp; I would think that once you have succeeded<BR>you are pretty much beyond the reach of the long arm of the law-- but I<BR>suppose you could be punished if you screw it up and live.&nbsp; That doesn't<BR>happen often with seppuku as even a screwed up one is liable to do you in,<BR>but lovers' suicides often fail because people take the wrong amount of<BR>poison, etc.<BR><BR>Fortunately, I've never known anyone who knew what happened when somebody<BR>tries this.&nbsp; <BR><BR>Kiri&nbsp; ^_^<BR><BR>******************************************************************************<BR>Kiri Aradia Morgan&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 93!&nbsp; Thou Art God<BR>tiamat@tsoft.com<BR><BR>"If time passes, everything turns into beauty<BR>If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away<BR>Everything starts wearing fresh colors<BR>Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody<BR>Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic<BR>Desire is embraced in a dream..."&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -- X-JAPAN<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 10:37:10 -0800<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A couple of questions<BR><BR>&gt; I've always wondered about the law in Japan against suicide (meant to<BR>&gt; discourage seppuku, which almost never happens these days, and lovers'<BR>&gt; suicides, which sometimes do).&nbsp; I would think that once you have succeeded<BR>&gt; you are pretty much beyond the reach of the long arm of the law-- but I<BR>&gt; suppose you could be punished if you screw it up and live.&nbsp; That doesn't<BR>&gt; happen often with seppuku as even a screwed up one is liable to do you in,<BR>&gt; but lovers' suicides often fail because people take the wrong amount of<BR>&gt; poison, etc.<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Well, we have laws against suicide in that States too, except here in<BR>Oregon, but you need a prescription :). Suicide would seem to be the<BR>ultimate act of individualism.&nbsp; Can't have that, can we?<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 10:39:03 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>Oooooooo............<BR><BR>Sounds like fun :)<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Douglas E. Berry<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 9:00 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; At 05:57 PM 1/31/2001, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Are you working on another GT book? :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'm writing a proposal for one of the _GT: Small Wars_ books.&nbsp; Let me<BR>&gt; bounce the idea off of you.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What happens when a high-pop, TL12 world suddenly finds itself<BR>&gt; faced with a<BR>&gt; destabilizing social upheveal caused by serious rifts between the have<BR>&gt; minority and the have-nots who do all the work?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What do you do if you're the Subsector Duke, and the bulk of your Army is<BR>&gt; from this world?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What do you do if those shipyards are needed by the Navy?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What do you do when rioting breaks out in an arcology?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Think fast.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Because Strouden is burning.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Anybody interested?&nbsp; :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; (Loren, I swear I'm doing nothing tommorrow but writing the proposal.<BR>&gt; Promise!)<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 10:47:06 -0800<BR>From: "Thing" &lt;thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>On Thursday, February 01, 2001 8:59 AM<BR>"Douglas E. Berry" said,<BR><BR>&gt; What happens when a high-pop, TL12 world suddenly finds itself faced with<BR>a<BR>&gt; destabilizing social upheveal caused by serious rifts between the have<BR>&gt; minority and the have-nots who do all the work?<BR><BR>Sounds like time for "A short victorious war".<BR><BR>Reminds me, I've been working on a Mega Corp IMTU that has a secret contract<BR>to develop alien looking technology for when the Imperium needs an excuse to<BR>rally the troops and there are no convienient minor factions that they<BR>really want to take on.<BR><BR>A few vat grown bugs with weird weapons out on the rim too send the troops<BR>off chasing after.<BR><BR>G.D.D.<BR>ThingUnderTheStairs<BR>==============<BR>"The great masses of the people... will more easily fall victims to a big<BR>lie than to a small one." - Adolf Hitler<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:10:16 -0800<BR>From: "Dave Strebe" &lt;strebe@intergate.bc.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>Hmm does the Subsector Duke have his own 'HouseHold Guard Unit' if so send<BR>them in to<BR>stabilize the situation (emphasis on stabilize not invade) or at worst have<BR>them hold the<BR>shipyards? Hopefully he has occupied the Army elsewhere in the subsector.<BR>Or hire an elite mercenary unit to accomplish the above task again hopefully<BR>the majority<BR>of the Subsector Army is occupied faraway. If not then the best he could<BR>probley do<BR>is bend over and...well you know the rest I'm sure. Just my opinion<BR><BR>Dave<BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 8:59 AM<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR><BR>&gt; At 05:57 PM 1/31/2001, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Are you working on another GT book? :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'm writing a proposal for one of the _GT: Small Wars_ books.&nbsp; Let me<BR>&gt; bounce the idea off of you.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What happens when a high-pop, TL12 world suddenly finds itself faced with<BR>a<BR>&gt; destabilizing social upheveal caused by serious rifts between the have<BR>&gt; minority and the have-nots who do all the work?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What do you do if you're the Subsector Duke, and the bulk of your Army is<BR>&gt; from this world?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What do you do if those shipyards are needed by the Navy?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What do you do when rioting breaks out in an arcology?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Think fast.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Because Strouden is burning.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Anybody interested?&nbsp; :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; (Loren, I swear I'm doing nothing tommorrow but writing the proposal.<BR>&gt; Promise!)<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:55:53 -0700 <BR>From: Cliff Linehan &lt;clinehan@sfamipec.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: [Website Review] Traveller Core Route Maps<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:48:34 -0000 From: "Trevor, Peter"<BR>&lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt;Improvements: the main list is wide and if&nbsp; your&nbsp; browser&nbsp; window<BR>&gt;isn't large enough it word wraps and becomes confusing.&nbsp; I had my<BR>&gt;browser maximized to 1152 x 864 and it seemed that&nbsp; much&nbsp; smaller<BR>&gt;would have problems.&nbsp; It&nbsp; would&nbsp; be&nbsp; better&nbsp; to&nbsp; have&nbsp; horizontal<BR>&gt;scrolling or a different&nbsp; layout.&nbsp; I&nbsp; haven't&nbsp; had&nbsp; a&nbsp; chance&nbsp; to<BR>&gt;install corepath.zip yet so I don't fully know what's in the&nbsp; SAR<BR>&gt;files (that'll have to wait for&nbsp; the&nbsp; weekend)&nbsp; ...&nbsp; but&nbsp; someone<BR>&gt;should develop a few adventures to run along the way.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Regards PLST<BR><BR>Greetings Peter,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I thank you for the review of my website.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The browser width problem I had not been aware of (mainly because I<BR>use 1280 x 1024 resolution). I have taken corrective measures and horizontal<BR>scrolling will be available soon.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; As I said before, I am working with Jim Vassilakos in correcting<BR>some bugs in his program.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; One of the bugs is an error that does not allow the full display of<BR>the sectors on the main sector display view. If you, or anyone else, loads<BR>all of the Core Route sectors into Galactic 2.4 Rev B the sectors will not<BR>display correctly or the program will crash.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Until Jim Vassilakos releases the Galactic 2.4 Rev C patch, or<BR>allows me to put the patch on my website, I do not recommend that you or<BR>anyone uploads all of the Core Route sectors into Galactic at once.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; My current recommendation for viewing the Core Route sectors is in<BR>groups of 5. So load 5 sectors and view, play, run crazy. But delete the<BR>first five before loading the next five.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; And yes, I do have the Rev C patch and it is working well. I am<BR>currently testing it for Jim. So far it is robust.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; In regards to the adventures on the Core Route. If anyone wishes to<BR>send me an adventure for the Core Route, long, short, or just an idea. I<BR>will add them to my site.<BR><BR>Clifford Linehan<BR>http://herons-reach.homepage.com/traveller<BR>Developing Vlanchiets Qlom and the Core Route.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 10:54:53 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>except for the local govenor sounds like the french revolution 8P<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Jesse Degraff [mailto:jedegraf@cisco.com]<BR>Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 10:39 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR><BR>Oooooooo............<BR><BR>Sounds like fun :)<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Douglas E. Berry<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 9:00 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; At 05:57 PM 1/31/2001, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Are you working on another GT book? :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'm writing a proposal for one of the _GT: Small Wars_ books.&nbsp; Let me<BR>&gt; bounce the idea off of you.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What happens when a high-pop, TL12 world suddenly finds itself<BR>&gt; faced with a<BR>&gt; destabilizing social upheveal caused by serious rifts between the have<BR>&gt; minority and the have-nots who do all the work?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What do you do if you're the Subsector Duke, and the bulk of your Army is<BR>&gt; from this world?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What do you do if those shipyards are needed by the Navy?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What do you do when rioting breaks out in an arcology?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Think fast.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Because Strouden is burning.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Anybody interested?&nbsp; :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; (Loren, I swear I'm doing nothing tommorrow but writing the proposal.<BR>&gt; Promise!)<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 13:56:51 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: On feedback<BR><BR>Patrik wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;1 out of the 2 feedback messages I've ever got looks like this (just got<BR>&gt;it).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;From: FragginBastitch@aol.com<BR>&gt;&gt;To: glappkaeft@hotmail.com<BR>&gt;&gt;Subject: About your Traveller site.<BR>&gt;&gt;Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 06:51:31 EST<BR>&gt;&gt;It's real simple. Without Pictures or Deckplans , which TRUE players &gt;and<BR>&gt;&gt;gamemasters love , your site SUCKS!! End of story.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Its a wonder people even bother with webpages.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Patrik "Who promises he will begin to offer more feedback Real Soon Now..."<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; He's just lashing out because he's a miserable little dill with nothing<BR>resembling what over people might call a life. Dollars to donuts says he has<BR>very few, if any, friends. Hell, this guy has probably never seen a TRUE<BR>player or gamemaster because that would actually require being in the<BR>presence of others for more than a five or ten minutes. With his charming<BR>ways and winning personality, I have my doubts about whether or not<BR>reasonably sane people would be driven to murderous rage.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; This guy's obviously a pathetic little wretch. The user profile which<BR>Michael Breen sent to the list illustrates that, at the "State Fair"[1],<BR>this guy would certainly bring home the blue ribbon for being the biggest,<BR>most moronic dolt in the whole state. He's a real winner. The next day, in<BR>the papers, they'd refer to this guy as something like the "chimp champ".<BR>Although I must point out that such a thing would be insensitive, as it's is<BR>utterly insulting and unfair to chimpanzees. After all, chimps are<BR>inherently lovable, as they're like big, hairy children while this guy is<BR>like a wretched, mewling self-centered child in the Augustinian sense (and<BR>anyone who's read St. Augustine's "Confessions" knows what I'm talking<BR>about). He's about as cute and amusing as a leaky wooden crate full of crap.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; In short this guy's a Loser. Please note the capital "L", which he earns<BR>because his user profile makes it apparent that he thinks that he's cool and<BR>he imagines himself to be witty on some level.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; So, to sum all of this up: Patrik, this two-bit jackass and his insipid<BR>"diarrhea-of-the-mouth" comments really aren't worth your time or<BR>consideration. He simply wants attention from somebody, and he wants to<BR>exert his "non-existant" power over others to combat his own sense of<BR>impotence when it comes to all aspects of life.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; [1] For those of you who are "fureigners" a "State Fair" is a big<BR>agriculturally-themed gathering where judges select the best pigs, cows and<BR>other barnyard favorites in the state. This activity is frequently combined<BR>with carnival-style rides and funnel cake... lots and lots of yummy funnel<BR>cake.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mmmmmm... Damn, I could go for some funnel cake right about now.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:02:46 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Tim Mac &lt;satelism@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrabs<BR><BR>Wow, good Idea and Very nicly done!<BR><BR>- --- John Lambert &lt;hovtej@hotmail.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; To help me decide where to make a landgrab, I<BR>&gt; created a map of the Spinward <BR>&gt; Marches with the taken worlds marked. It might be of<BR>&gt; interest to others so I <BR>&gt; posted it at:<BR>&gt;<BR>http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/j_lambert/landgrab.htm<BR>&gt; The map is based on the information at the downport<BR>&gt; site as of 25 Jan 01. <BR>&gt; I'll update the map as the information at the site<BR>&gt; changes.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; John<BR>&gt;<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>&gt; Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at<BR>&gt; http://explorer.msn.com<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 14:00:41 -0500<BR>From: Jonathan McDermott &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: [TML] On feedback<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:24:03 EST<BR>&gt;From: WriteFool@aol.com<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: On feedback<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;In a message dated 2/1/01 9:53:59 AM Central Standard Time,<BR>&gt;glappkaeft@hotmail.com writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&lt;&lt; 1 out of the 2 feedback messages I've ever got looks like this (just got<BR>&gt;&nbsp; it).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;From: FragginBastitch@aol.com<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ^^^^^^^^<BR>All due respects to the posters and lurkers who are forced to use an AOL <BR>account, or use it because it's simple and free (perfectly valid reasons,) <BR>but this should not come as a surprise....<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;To: glappkaeft@hotmail.com<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;Subject: About your Traveller site.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 06:51:31 EST<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;It's real simple. Without Pictures or Deckplans , which TRUE players &gt;and<BR><BR>TRUE players and gamemasters?&nbsp; Obviously this guy isn't one of that august <BR>body.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;gamemasters love , your site SUCKS!! End of story.<BR><BR>Pictures or Deckplans make or break the site....&nbsp; Riiiiiiiight.&nbsp; Obviously <BR>a spoiled brat on broadband, who's blind to what constitutes 'content.'<BR><BR>And that 'End of story,' bit.&nbsp; I love that.&nbsp; The hallmark of mediocrity.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Its a wonder people even bother with webpages.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Patrik "Who promises he will begin to offer more feedback Real Soon Now..."<BR>&gt;&nbsp; http://www.docs.uu.se/~paho9211/trav/<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; &gt;&gt;<BR><BR>Pat, I've looked at your site, and I like it a lot.&nbsp; You've got a good eye <BR>for site design, and the trav stuff is very good. =) I particularly like <BR>the Lightning fighter, actually.&nbsp; I, however, am one of those people who <BR>don't give feedback as much as I should, and I have been very recalcitrant <BR>in giving any sort of feedback.&nbsp; &nbsp; I am honestly working to correct this <BR>flaw.&nbsp; Please, consider this definitely positive feedback. =)<BR><BR>&gt;I wouldn't sweat it too much, here is the User Profile for the wordsmith who<BR>&gt;wrote that feedback:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Member Name:&nbsp; &nbsp; None o' yer fraggin' bizness!!<BR><BR>*sigh* That's almost as bad a start as "It was a dark and stormy night."<BR><BR>&gt;Location:&nbsp;&nbsp; None o' yer fraggin' bizness!!<BR><BR>Cuts down on the letter bombs, at least.<BR><BR>&gt;Sex:&nbsp; &nbsp; Male<BR><BR>Actually, I don't give a 'frag' what his gender is. =)&nbsp; I'm surprised he <BR>thought that it SHOULD be our business.<BR><BR>&gt;Marital Status: I'm fraggin' single,OK??<BR><BR>And it looks like he will be that way for quite some time.<BR><BR>&gt;Hobbies:&nbsp; &nbsp; None o' yer fraggin' bizness!!<BR><BR>My fraggin' bizness is doing quite well without his patronage, thanks.<BR><BR>&gt;Computers:&nbsp; Dis fraggin' piece o' crap!!<BR><BR>That's not all that's a piece of... ahem....<BR><BR>&gt;Occupation: Im da worse fraggin' bastitch youse evah met!!<BR><BR>Oh, I know some Marines who would (gleefully) contest that.&nbsp; Heck, I know <BR>some toddlers who would contest that.<BR><BR>&gt;Personal Quote: Fraggin' (peeps call me Shaggy) Bastitch!!<BR><BR>So he's a Shaggy Bastich?&nbsp; I would recommend Nair to take care of that <BR>first condition.&nbsp; Nitro works for the second.&nbsp; Preferably involuntarilly <BR>applied.<BR><BR>Offhand, I'd give him an 'F' for grammar, and an 'F' for content.&nbsp; He can <BR>bring that up to a D+ if he follows my recommendation about the Nair.&nbsp; And <BR>the Nitro.<BR><BR>&gt;A real credit to pre-Terran Confederation Society<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Michael Breen<BR>&gt;Professional Lurker<BR><BR>Indeed, Mr. Breen.&nbsp; I guess we know why the Interstellar Wars started, at <BR>least....<BR><BR>By the way, for Jesse Degraff: back in college when I was a drill <BR>instructor, we had shirts which had on them the motto, 'Illegitimi non <BR>Carborundrum,' which I think is the Latin you're looking for. =)<BR><BR>Cheers<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3586<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (rly-yg01.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.1]) by air-yg02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 01 Feb 2001 14:09:01 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yg01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 01 Feb 2001 14:08:23 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id OAA52864;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 1 Feb 2001 14:04:20 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 1 Feb 2001 14:04:01 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id OAA52816<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 1 Feb 2001 14:04:01 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 14:04:01 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102011904.OAA52816@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3586<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3587</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/1/01 4:27:37 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Thursday, February 1 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3587<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: On feedback<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: A couple of questions<BR>Study Says Penguins Are Sensible<BR>Re: A couple of questions<BR>New hope for red dwarfs<BR>Re: On feedback<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>Short &amp; Nasty<BR>RE: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>RE: On feedback<BR>Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: Vilani Word List?<BR>RE: Vilani Word List?<BR>Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>RE: On feedback<BR>re: A couple of questions<BR>RE: A couple of questions<BR>RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:07:19 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: On feedback<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; He's just lashing out because he's a miserable little dill with<BR>nothing<BR>&gt;resembling what over people might call a life. Dollars to donuts says he<BR>has<BR>&gt;very few, if any, friends. Hell, this guy has probably never seen a TRUE<BR>&gt;player or gamemaster because that would actually require being in the<BR>&gt;presence of others for more than a five or ten minutes. With his charming<BR>&gt;ways and winning personality, I have my doubts about whether or not<BR>&gt;reasonably sane people would be driven to murderous rage.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; This guy's obviously a pathetic little wretch. The user profile<BR>which<BR>&gt;Michael Breen sent to the list illustrates that, at the "State Fair"[1],<BR>&gt;this guy would certainly bring home the blue ribbon for being the biggest,<BR>&gt;most moronic dolt in the whole state. He's a real winner. The next day, in<BR>&gt;the papers, they'd refer to this guy as something like the "chimp champ".<BR>&gt;Although I must point out that such a thing would be insensitive, as it's<BR>is<BR>&gt;utterly insulting and unfair to chimpanzees. After all, chimps are<BR>&gt;inherently lovable, as they're like big, hairy children while this guy is<BR>&gt;like a wretched, mewling self-centered child in the Augustinian sense (and<BR>&gt;anyone who's read St. Augustine's "Confessions" knows what I'm talking<BR>&gt;about). He's about as cute and amusing as a leaky wooden crate full of<BR>crap.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; In short this guy's a Loser. Please note the capital "L", which he<BR>earns<BR>&gt;because his user profile makes it apparent that he thinks that he's cool<BR>and<BR>&gt;he imagines himself to be witty on some level.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; So, to sum all of this up: Patrik, this two-bit jackass and his<BR>insipid<BR>&gt;"diarrhea-of-the-mouth" comments really aren't worth your time or<BR>&gt;consideration. He simply wants attention from somebody, and he wants to<BR>&gt;exert his "non-existant" power over others to combat his own sense of<BR>&gt;impotence when it comes to all aspects of life.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; [1] For those of you who are "fureigners" a "State Fair" is a big<BR>&gt;agriculturally-themed gathering where judges select the best pigs, cows and<BR>&gt;other barnyard favorites in the state. This activity is frequently combined<BR>&gt;with carnival-style rides and funnel cake... lots and lots of yummy funnel<BR>&gt;cake.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; Mmmmmm... Damn, I could go for some funnel cake right about now.<BR><BR>I am truely humbled to be in the presence of a Master Insulter. not only can<BR>you combine true wit with insult in your post you do it with a flare that is<BR>genius.<BR><BR>i bow in awe <BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:12:32 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>Are you assuming the Sector duke does not want the revolution or civil war?<BR>yes he will need the military base and ship yards but you never know he<BR>might actually be for the revolution under the table. he could hold the nav<BR>base and ship yards and tell the two sides it is neutral territory yada yada<BR>yada.<BR><BR>what if he feels that if the majority wins the civilwar it will bring a new<BR>better evironment for technilogical growth or provide better workers who<BR>ahve a high morale and work harder ie less days off due to Blue Flu and that<BR>sort of thing?<BR><BR>hasta<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Dave Strebe [mailto:strebe@intergate.bc.ca]<BR>Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 11:10 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR><BR>Hmm does the Subsector Duke have his own 'HouseHold Guard Unit' if so send<BR>them in to<BR>stabilize the situation (emphasis on stabilize not invade) or at worst have<BR>them hold the<BR>shipyards? Hopefully he has occupied the Army elsewhere in the subsector.<BR>Or hire an elite mercenary unit to accomplish the above task again hopefully<BR>the majority<BR>of the Subsector Army is occupied faraway. If not then the best he could<BR>probley do<BR>is bend over and...well you know the rest I'm sure. Just my opinion<BR><BR>Dave<BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 8:59 AM<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR><BR>&gt; At 05:57 PM 1/31/2001, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Are you working on another GT book? :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'm writing a proposal for one of the _GT: Small Wars_ books.&nbsp; Let me<BR>&gt; bounce the idea off of you.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What happens when a high-pop, TL12 world suddenly finds itself faced with<BR>a<BR>&gt; destabilizing social upheveal caused by serious rifts between the have<BR>&gt; minority and the have-nots who do all the work?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What do you do if you're the Subsector Duke, and the bulk of your Army is<BR>&gt; from this world?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What do you do if those shipyards are needed by the Navy?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What do you do when rioting breaks out in an arcology?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Think fast.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Because Strouden is burning.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Anybody interested?&nbsp; :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; (Loren, I swear I'm doing nothing tommorrow but writing the proposal.<BR>&gt; Promise!)<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>&gt; http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 20:26:18 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: A couple of questions<BR><BR>Tod Glenn wrote:<BR>&gt; Typically, duels would only be between officers of equivalent rank, as well.<BR><BR>Or between personell of roughly equal noble rank, which can be very<BR>different from navy/army/whatever rank. Thus, an enlisted soldier might<BR>end up in a duel with a general.<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 11:43:26 -0800<BR>From: "Thing" &lt;thingunderthestairs@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Study Says Penguins Are Sensible<BR><BR>I had to post another Penguins in the news link<BR>http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/ap/20010201/sc/practical_penguins_1.html<BR><BR>Of course no one mentions the startling implications of these penguins<BR>watching our air traffic and reporting back to there secret master.<BR><BR>G.D.D.<BR>ThingUnderTheStairs<BR>==============<BR>"A man will fight harder for his interests than for his rights." - Napoleon<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 20:05:58 GMT<BR>From: TML@stempest.demon.co.uk (Stephen Tempest)<BR>Subject: Re: A couple of questions<BR><BR>Kiri Aradia Morgan &lt;tiamat@tsoft.com&gt; writes:<BR><BR>&gt;I've always wondered about the law in Japan against suicide (meant to<BR>&gt;discourage seppuku, which almost never happens these days, and lovers'<BR>&gt;suicides, which sometimes do).&nbsp; I would think that once you have succeeded<BR>&gt;you are pretty much beyond the reach of the long arm of the law-- <BR><BR>True - but at least historically, laws against suicide would have a<BR>deterrent effect:<BR><BR>...if you believe that the type of funeral rites your body receives<BR>will affect your situation in the afterlife&nbsp; (eg, suicides in Europe<BR>were not buried in consecrated ground, which the superstitious might<BR>believe would condemn them to Hell).<BR><BR>...if the law says that the property of a felon is confiscated by the<BR>state, meaning that your family would not inherit any of your<BR>possessions asfter you've killed yourself.<BR><BR>Both situations would mean that you could be punished after your<BR>death...<BR><BR>Stephen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 15:13:56 EST<BR>From: JimVassila@aol.com<BR>Subject: New hope for red dwarfs<BR><BR>- --part1_46.100eb747.27ab1d84_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR>Interesting article on red dwarf stars:<BR><BR>http://www.spacer.com/news/life-01c.html<BR><BR>I'd always assumed that life-bearing worlds would be impossible due to the <BR>biozone being so close as to require a tidal lock, however, the news is that <BR>while the mainworld would be tidally locked, it could still retain its <BR>atmosphere (given that it's thick enough). It would be a strange place (as <BR>described in the article), but it might be livable. Since the vast majority <BR>of stars are red dwarfs, this is big news.<BR><BR>Two questions come to my mind after reading the article, however. The first <BR>is wrt metallicity. What percentage of MVs have a high enough metal content <BR>to allow terrestrial worlds to form? I'm not up on current theory, but I <BR>yakked w/ the author of this article a few years back (over email), and he <BR>educated me a bit on the four stellar populations. I'd still be curious to <BR>see a makeshift chart on the probabilities of each star type/class falling <BR>into each population (i.e. what percentage of local MVs are thin disk versus <BR>thick disk versus stellar halo and likewise for every other type of star).<BR><BR>The second question is... just because an atmosphere around a red dwarf can <BR>sustain itself w/o freezing out (given that it is thick enough), does that <BR>necessarily mean that it can form in the first place? I'm wondering what the <BR>likelihood is that this will happen naturally, and that if it won't, just how <BR>hard it would be to terraform the place so that it does happen.<BR><BR><BR>- --part1_46.100eb747.27ab1d84_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT size=2>Interesting article on red dwarf stars:<BR><BR><BR><BR>http://www.spacer.com/news/life-01c.html<BR><BR><BR><BR>I'd always assumed that life-bearing worlds would be impossible due to the <BR><BR>biozone being so close as to require a tidal lock, however, the news is that <BR><BR>while the mainworld would be tidally locked, it could still retain its <BR><BR>atmosphere (given that it's thick enough). It would be a strange place (as <BR><BR>described in the article), but it might be livable. Since the vast majority <BR><BR>of stars are red dwarfs, this is big news.<BR><BR><BR><BR>Two questions come to my mind after reading the article, however. The first <BR><BR>is wrt metallicity. What percentage of MVs have a high enough metal content <BR><BR>to allow terrestrial worlds to form? I'm not up on current theory, but I <BR><BR>yakked w/ the author of this article a few years back (over email), and he <BR><BR>educated me a bit on the four stellar populations. I'd still be curious to <BR><BR>see a makeshift chart on the probabilities of each star type/class falling <BR><BR>into each population (i.e. what percentage of local MVs are thin disk versus <BR><BR>thick disk versus stellar halo and likewise for every other type of star).<BR><BR><BR><BR>The second question is... just because an atmosphere around a red dwarf can <BR><BR>sustain itself w/o freezing out (given that it is thick enough), does that <BR><BR>necessarily mean that it can form in the first place? I'm wondering what the <BR><BR>likelihood is that this will happen naturally, and that if it won't, just how <BR><BR>hard it would be to terraform the place so that it does happen.<BR><BR></FONT><BR><BR>- --part1_46.100eb747.27ab1d84_boundary--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 13:40:58 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: On feedback<BR><BR>WriteFool@aol.com wrote:<BR><BR><BR>&gt; I wouldn't sweat it too much, here is the User Profile for the wordsmith who <BR>&gt; wrote that feedback:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Member Name:&nbsp; &nbsp; None o' yer fraggin' bizness!!<BR>&gt; Location:&nbsp;&nbsp; None o' yer fraggin' bizness!!<BR>&gt; Sex:&nbsp; &nbsp; Male<BR>&gt; Marital Status: I'm fraggin' single,OK??<BR><BR>And will be for a long, looong time to come, at this rate!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 13:50:23 -0700 <BR>From: Cliff Linehan &lt;clinehan@sfamipec.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 08:59:33 From: "Douglas E. Berry"<BR>&lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt;I'm writing a proposal for one of the _GT: Small Wars_ books.&nbsp; Let me<BR>&gt;bounce the idea off of you.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What happens when a high-pop, TL12 world suddenly finds itself faced with a<BR>&gt;destabilizing social upheveal caused by serious rifts between the have<BR>&gt;minority and the have-nots who do all the work?<BR><BR>You are looking at a full riot situation, OR if the population does not<BR>believe in violence as a general rule, a general world wide sit-down strike<BR>effectively shutting down the basic supply chain. (think of the UK during<BR>that petrol shortage).<BR><BR>&gt;What do you do if you're the Subsector Duke, and the bulk of your Army is<BR>&gt;from this world?<BR><BR>Inform them that military rule is still in effect and that the best thing<BR>that they can do for their world is to follow the orders of their<BR>commanders.<BR><BR>&gt;What do you do if those shipyards are needed by the Navy?<BR><BR>Impose marshal law on the ship yards until the situation is resolved.<BR><BR>&gt;What do you do when rioting breaks out in an arcology?<BR><BR>Release the sleeping gas into the ventilation system.<BR><BR>&gt;Think fast.<BR><BR>Ouch!<BR><BR>&gt;Because Strouden is burning.<BR><BR>Marshmallows for everyone!<BR><BR>&gt;Anybody interested?&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>I'm an inter-stellar cartographer, not a wordsmith.<BR><BR>&gt;Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR><BR>Clifford Linehan<BR>http://herons-reach.homepage.com/traveller<BR>Developing Vlanchiets Qlom and the Core Route.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 13:55:47 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 05:57 PM 1/31/2001, you wrote:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt; What happens when a high-pop, TL12 world suddenly finds itself faced with a<BR>&gt; destabilizing social upheveal caused by serious rifts between the have<BR>&gt; minority and the have-nots who do all the work?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What do you do if you're the Subsector Duke, and the bulk of your Army is<BR>&gt; from this world?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What do you do if those shipyards are needed by the Navy?<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; What do you do when rioting breaks out in an arcology?<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; Think fast.<BR><BR>Send in Christian Johnny and the Line Troops....or their 3I equivalents, <BR>the Imperial Marines.<BR>The probable stock 3I reply would be crush the rebellion quick and <BR>brutal-like, then quietly fix the conditions that caused the problem.<BR><BR>Lining a number of those 'haves' up against the wall afterwards would <BR>probably go a long way.<BR><BR>The long term answer, of course is make the world rich enough that the <BR>have-nots have too much to risk losing by fighting. This ties <BR>wonderfully with the mercantilist 3I, as happy masses aint sh*t compared <BR>to happy masses with creds to spend.<BR><BR>Happy masses with creds to spend are more valuable than happy small <BR>minorities with megacreds. Why else are all the capitalists excreting <BR>all sorts of bodily fluids over getting into the China market?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 16:22:02 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Short &amp; Nasty<BR><BR>&gt;I'm writing a proposal for one of the _GT: Small Wars_ books.&nbsp; Let me<BR>&gt;bounce the idea off of you.<BR>&gt;What happens when a high-pop, TL12 world suddenly finds itself faced with a<BR>&gt;destabilizing social upheveal caused by serious rifts between the have<BR>&gt;minority and the have-nots who do all the work?<BR>&gt;What do you do if you're the Subsector Duke, and the bulk of your Army is<BR>&gt;from this world?<BR>&gt;What do you do if those shipyards are needed by the Navy?<BR>&gt;What do you do when rioting breaks out in an arcology?<BR>&gt;Think fast.<BR>&gt;Because Strouden is burning.<BR>&gt;Anybody interested?&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>Find &amp; take out the ringleaders, as quickly as possible.<BR><BR>Then make it nasty for the masses to resist &amp; easy to submit.<BR>Keep close surveillance in place after masses return to work.<BR>This is to cull out troublemakers who want to flare things up again.<BR><BR>You bring in a TL 14/15 Merc group that specializes in "Police Action" work <BR>rather than military intervention.<BR>Heavy in surveillance electronics and deep cover agents.<BR>A few Psionic team members would be a plus.<BR><BR>The 'muscle' part of the unit would be divided into two parts:<BR><BR>1. Strike teams: Remove the head of the serpent.<BR><BR>2. Crowd control: Lot's of large beings with impersonal body armor &amp; <BR>non-lethal weapons (with lethal backup).<BR>Shock batons, stun guns (various flavors), slippery &amp; sticky foam, <BR>paintball guns that fire pepper spray, etc.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 13:46:41 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>On a side note on at URL<BR><BR>http://www.link-11.com/iiss/<BR><BR>there is a listing of gear. One of the items is a small Fusion generator for<BR>Scout camps away from the ship. there is also a grav carrier that could<BR>carry this item with no effort or little effort on their part. Now unless<BR>they have a "prime directive" seems this might be the way to go. take a<BR>small fusion generator with you take a small supply of fuel say several<BR>canasters and your good to go.<BR><BR>I am going to send this guy a comment and let him know i love his site.<BR><BR>hasta<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Andy Holzrichter [mailto:jhereg@southwind.net]<BR>Sent: Wednesday, January 31, 2001 5:55 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Here is a question for the gearheads out there.&nbsp; Where can I find<BR>stats on <BR>man portable solar power for traveller?&nbsp; Our group is planning an <BR>expedition to a low tech (TL2) world and is trying to cover all <BR>options.&nbsp; They want some type of solar recharger for energy weapons (laser <BR>rifles mostly.)&nbsp; I realize the recharge times will probably be LONG, but <BR>does anyone have appropriate figures?&nbsp; One idea was the top/sides of a <BR>backpack covered with solar cells.&nbsp; Thanks in advance.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Andy Holzrichter <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 16:49:22 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>&gt;Happy masses with creds to spend are more valuable than happy small<BR>&gt;minorities with megacreds. Why else are all the capitalists excreting all <BR>&gt;sorts of bodily fluids over getting into the China market?<BR><BR>Because they've improved so much from the happy masses in blue suits going <BR>on and on and on about Chairman Mao.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 22:05 +0000 (GMT)<BR>From: mcrobertson@cix.compulink.co.uk (Megan Robertson)<BR>Subject: RE: On feedback<BR><BR>In-Reply-To: &lt;PIEFIHNLNBEMHOILBEBPGEOACFAA.jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Greetings dear hearts,<BR><BR>'Nil carborundum illigitimae'<BR><BR>Hugs and kisses,<BR><BR>Mexal - but I taught myself Latin from a book I rescued from a skip at the <BR>school I worked at about 17 years ago...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 17:27:35 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Timothy Little writes:<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;The minimum thickness will probably be determined by structural<BR>&gt;strength.&nbsp; If not flexible, 2-3mm is really far too thin for<BR>&gt;supporting a structure at least a metre across.<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; True, if the array has no frame.&nbsp; It shouldn't be too hard to<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; stretch a 1 mm sheet over a 1 m square wire frame.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Perhaps a solar parisol that fits on a backpack, or a hat<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; if you want to look really goofy while protecting yourself<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; from the sun and recharging your radio.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 14:28:35 -0800<BR>From: sneadj@mindspring.com<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>John Fox &lt;jfox@verity.com&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Hello Everyone:<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; To give you an idea of what is avalible (as of July 1999) go to<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; http://www.enn.com/enn-news-archive/1999/07/072699/newsolar_4532.asp<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; for look at thin film stuff for PV cells. I will be doine more<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; looking and if I find more info more posting about PV&nbsp; cell stuff.<BR><BR>It's typical, I predict something and then find out it already exists.&nbsp; <BR>Cheap, really thin, and 18% efficient at TL 8.&nbsp; Boost the efficiency <BR>somewhat, back them with some fancy memory plastics (or merely <BR>a really thin, folding superdense grid) and likely by TL 12 you've got <BR>a large folding array that can fit into a briefcase.&nbsp; Cool!<BR><BR>The question then becomes, what kind of easily portable solar cells <BR>might you have at TL15.&nbsp; One option that comes to mind is a <BR>geneered grass-like substance that converts a portion of the <BR>sunlight that hits it into electricity.&nbsp; Like grassphalt, but it's also a <BR>power source.&nbsp; The efficiency would likely only be around 30%, <BR>since the plant will need much of the energy to grow.&nbsp; However, <BR>given that plants are already shaped to be ideal solar collectors, <BR>they'd be ideal.&nbsp; I'd expect this sort of thing to be used for lots of <BR>low-budget (it's gong to be far cheaper than fusion) or highly <BR>isolated (no need for spare parts) research stations, as well as in <BR>numerous low tech worlds.&nbsp; What should it be called, <BR>"electrograss", and "power-lawn" both come to mind.<BR><BR>- -John Snead sneadj@mindspring.com&nbsp; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 17:53:24 -0500<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>At 2:25 AM -0500 1/27/01, Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kenji, do please remember to get a copy either to me or uploaded to the<BR>&gt;list's shared file area - which is about to become a Yahoo!-style<BR>&gt;"briefcase" or some such; they're starting to make the merger changes...<BR><BR>Err.. just realized there was a severe formatting glitch in the copy <BR>I sent out the other week... all the headings for compound and <BR>derived words were not printed, but the rest of their definitions <BR>were glommed onto the stem entry :(&nbsp; I'll fix that, uh, real soon now.<BR><BR>Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 14:55:50 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR>No worries Loved what i got more would be even better 8)<BR><BR>and Kenji thank you for the effort you ahve put into this.<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Kenji Schwarz [mailto:schwarz@fas.harvard.edu]<BR>Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 2:53 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Cc: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Vilani Word List?<BR><BR><BR>At 2:25 AM -0500 1/27/01, Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Kenji, do please remember to get a copy either to me or uploaded to the<BR>&gt;list's shared file area - which is about to become a Yahoo!-style<BR>&gt;"briefcase" or some such; they're starting to make the merger changes...<BR><BR>Err.. just realized there was a severe formatting glitch in the copy <BR>I sent out the other week... all the headings for compound and <BR>derived words were not printed, but the rest of their definitions <BR>were glommed onto the stem entry :(&nbsp; I'll fix that, uh, real soon now.<BR><BR>Kenji<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 15:17:07 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR>Can someone give me the URL to get the deck plans to this ship. i know they<BR>have been published. however i cant remember where i saw them and my local<BR>game store cant find them.<BR><BR>any help would be appreciated.<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 15:34:00 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: On feedback<BR><BR>&gt;From: Kenji Schwarz &lt;schwarz@fas.harvard.edu&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Not sure it's correct, but what I've heard is 'non carborundum <BR>&gt;illegitimi'.&nbsp; My former boss used to use it a lot, referring to sneak <BR>&gt;audits by the AG's office.<BR><BR>I think it has to be something like "Noli illegitimem te carborundum"<BR><BR>Noli:&nbsp; imperative verb, be unwilling<BR><BR>illegitimem:&nbsp; this should be accusative plural of illegitemus, bastard,<BR>which is second declension; I may not have the ending right<BR><BR>te:&nbsp; second person singular pronoun, accusative case, direct object of the<BR>gerundive verb carborundum<BR><BR>carborundum:&nbsp; gerundive form of verb carborundere, to wear down.&nbsp; Latin<BR>allows the familiar English locution "I made him do it" (or, more likely,<BR>English adopted it from the Latin during the Roman occupation).&nbsp; <BR>I subject, nominative case<BR>made main verb<BR>him direct object of main verb, accusative case<BR>do secondary verb, upon which the direct object of the main verb is acting<BR>it direct object of secondary verb<BR><BR>Luther, did I get that right?<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR><BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 15:41:32 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: A couple of questions<BR><BR>&gt;From: Kiri Aradia Morgan &lt;tiamat@tsoft.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;I've always wondered about the law in Japan against suicide <BR>&gt;(meant to discourage seppuku, which almost never happens these days, <BR>&gt;and lovers' suicides, which sometimes do).&nbsp; I would think that once you <BR>&gt;have succeeded you are pretty much beyond the reach of the long arm of<BR>&gt;the law-- but I suppose you could be punished if you screw it up and<BR>&gt;live.&nbsp; <BR><BR>The only appropriate punishment for attempted suicide is, obviously,<BR>death.<BR><BR>The only appropriate punishment for successful suicide is reanimation,<BR>followed by death.&nbsp; Where reanimation cannot be accomplished, a stern<BR>lecture and a severe flogging should be administered to the body.<BR><BR>The Catholic Church has another set of sanctions for suicide.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 15:47:49 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: A couple of questions<BR><BR>I was always under the impression that in japan there was no law against<BR>Suicide. Modern day may be different. but my understanding was there was<BR>nothing to keep one from commiting Seppuku. In some ways it was a very<BR>honorable way to regain face. and yes the punishment in japan back then was<BR>death. i dont think they had any other form of punishment.<BR><BR>Or did i miss some point or facts along the way in this thread?<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Glenn Goffin [mailto:gmgoffin@yahoo.com]<BR>Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 3:42 PM<BR>To: traveller mailing aa list<BR>Subject: re: A couple of questions<BR><BR><BR>&gt;From: Kiri Aradia Morgan &lt;tiamat@tsoft.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;I've always wondered about the law in Japan against suicide <BR>&gt;(meant to discourage seppuku, which almost never happens these days, <BR>&gt;and lovers' suicides, which sometimes do).&nbsp; I would think that once you <BR>&gt;have succeeded you are pretty much beyond the reach of the long arm of<BR>&gt;the law-- but I suppose you could be punished if you screw it up and<BR>&gt;live.&nbsp; <BR><BR>The only appropriate punishment for attempted suicide is, obviously,<BR>death.<BR><BR>The only appropriate punishment for successful suicide is reanimation,<BR>followed by death.&nbsp; Where reanimation cannot be accomplished, a stern<BR>lecture and a severe flogging should be administered to the body.<BR><BR>The Catholic Church has another set of sanctions for suicide.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 16:24:48 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR>Hi Bill,<BR>SJG's Traveller site is:<BR>http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/<BR><BR>When you go into the product listings and click on an entry, you'll see a<BR>little "In Print&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Click Here to Order!" section under the title.&nbsp; Click<BR>there (duh! ;) and it'll take you to the Warehouse 23 section for that<BR>product.&nbsp; You can order directly from there if your FLGS can't get 'em or<BR>find 'em.<BR><BR>Best,<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of William Lane<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 3:17 PM<BR>&gt; To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; Subject: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Can someone give me the URL to get the deck plans to this ship. i<BR>&gt; know they<BR>&gt; have been published. however i cant remember where i saw them and my local<BR>&gt; game store cant find them.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; any help would be appreciated.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3587<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yc03.mx.aol.com (rly-yc03.mail.aol.com [172.18.149.35]) by air-yc01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Thu, 01 Feb 2001 19:27:37 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yc03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Thu, 01 Feb 2001 19:26:48 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id TAA66948;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thu, 1 Feb 2001 19:25:15 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Thu, 1 Feb 2001 19:24:10 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id TAA66647<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Thu, 1 Feb 2001 19:24:09 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 19:24:09 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102020024.TAA66647@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3587<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3588</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/1/01 10:35:25 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, February 2 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3588<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Errrr, am I missing something?<BR>RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>Re: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy ...<BR>Re: Anyone ever list geograpy ...<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>GT: Small Wars (was: Re: Web Sites)<BR>Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR>RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR>RE: Study Says Penguins Are Sensible<BR>Why smart Americans? (Was RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578)<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 19:40:28 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Errrr, am I missing something?<BR><BR>Looking at First In's tech level descriptions, I'm sensing a problem here. <BR>Biological Science TL 0 includes "Useful animals and plants are <BR>domesticated".<BR><BR>Soooo....<BR><BR>What are pure hunter-gatherers, without the foggiest notions that a plant or <BR>animal has uses besides being tracked down in the wilderness and berated <BR>with a pointed stick? Biological Tech Level negative one?<BR><BR>There seems to be a similar problem with Environment TL 0 ("Primitive <BR>agriculture. Villages and towns")<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 16:45:45 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR>Thanks Jesse,<BR><BR>Ordered.<BR><BR>are they going to produce a scout ship the same way some day?<BR><BR>Hasta me<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Jesse Degraff [mailto:jedegraf@cisco.com]<BR>Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 4:25 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR><BR>Hi Bill,<BR>SJG's Traveller site is:<BR>http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/<BR><BR>When you go into the product listings and click on an entry, you'll see a<BR>little "In Print&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Click Here to Order!" section under the title.&nbsp; Click<BR>there (duh! ;) and it'll take you to the Warehouse 23 section for that<BR>product.&nbsp; You can order directly from there if your FLGS can't get 'em or<BR>find 'em.<BR><BR>Best,<BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of William Lane<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 3:17 PM<BR>&gt; To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; Subject: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Can someone give me the URL to get the deck plans to this ship. i<BR>&gt; know they<BR>&gt; have been published. however i cant remember where i saw them and my local<BR>&gt; game store cant find them.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; any help would be appreciated.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 16:48:42 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; Tod Glenn writes:<BR>&gt; &lt;snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;I expect elite planetary units in the Imperium to be equipped with higher<BR>&gt;&gt;tech weaponry, despite higher cost, particularly when the tech difference is<BR>&gt;&gt;meaningful enough to give a significant advantage (TL5 to TL 8, not much<BR>&gt;&gt;difference.&nbsp; Flintlock vs. ACRs, different story).&nbsp; Also, expect the "palace<BR>&gt;&gt;guard" to have the highest tech it can afford, particularly when the ruling<BR>&gt;&gt;party is not well liked.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Very true.&nbsp; A company of spearmen with archers would have little<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; chance against a squad with rifles and an autorifle on an open<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; plain, but a company with rifles and a few autorifles would give a<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; squad with ACRs and a RAM GL pause for thought.<BR><BR>Don't sell archer's short. If they are up to the "standard" of the<BR>English at Agincourt, while the squad is up to modern standards,<BR>they'll take casualties, but the squad will be eliminated. Volley fire<BR>from a company of archers is a fearsome thing.<BR><BR>And no, kevlar vests won't help. Hell, trauma plate will just mean that<BR>you get incapacitated by the arrows in the places that they *don't*<BR>protect (arms &amp; legs, for example).<BR><BR>You can *only* make things go in the rifle's favor if you engage the<BR>archers from well beyond their max effective range. And that range<BR>(several hundred yards) is well beyond the range soldiers with rifles<BR>typically engage the enemy at.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 17:08:28 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR>I can truthfully say [fnord]&nbsp; (Hint; if you're a JTAS subscriber go through<BR>the log from the 25 January 2001 chat, if it's up yet).<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of William Lane<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 4:46 PM<BR>&gt; To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Thanks Jesse,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Ordered.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; are they going to produce a scout ship the same way some day?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hasta me<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Jesse Degraff [mailto:jedegraf@cisco.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 4:25 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hi Bill,<BR>&gt; SJG's Traveller site is:<BR>&gt; http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; When you go into the product listings and click on an entry, you'll see a<BR>&gt; little "In Print&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Click Here to Order!" section under the<BR>&gt; title.&nbsp; Click<BR>&gt; there (duh! ;) and it'll take you to the Warehouse 23 section for that<BR>&gt; product.&nbsp; You can order directly from there if your FLGS can't get 'em or<BR>&gt; find 'em.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Best,<BR>&gt; Jesse<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>&gt; deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>&gt; -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; &gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; &gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of William Lane<BR>&gt; &gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 3:17 PM<BR>&gt; &gt; To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Can someone give me the URL to get the deck plans to this ship. i<BR>&gt; &gt; know they<BR>&gt; &gt; have been published. however i cant remember where i saw them<BR>&gt; and my local<BR>&gt; &gt; game store cant find them.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; any help would be appreciated.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 19:22:57 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR>Jesse Degraff wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I can truthfully say [fnord]<BR><BR>Pining for the fnords, are you?<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; (Hint; if you're a JTAS subscriber go through<BR>&gt; the log from the 25 January 2001 chat, if it's up yet).<BR><BR>It is (or was yesterday...).<BR><BR>&lt;&lt;snip&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:15:14 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR><BR>&gt; From: Mark Urbin <BR>&gt; Find &amp; take out the ringleaders, as quickly as possible.<BR>&lt;rest snipped&gt;<BR><BR>The problem with this approach is that all you are doing is suppressing the<BR>initial revolt.&nbsp; You are going to have to deal with the causes, unless you<BR>want to get bogged down in a long &amp; nasty counter-insurgency.<BR><BR>The other question is: how big is your merc unit?&nbsp; Strouden, IIRC, is a<BR>high-population world.<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:24:38 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>&gt; From: "Douglas E. Berry" <BR>&gt; I'm writing a proposal for one of the _GT: Small Wars_ books.&nbsp; Let me<BR>&gt; bounce the idea off of you.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What happens when a high-pop, TL12 world suddenly finds itself faced with<BR>&gt; a destabilizing social upheveal caused by serious rifts between the have<BR>&gt; minority and the have-nots who do all the work?<BR><BR>Umm, this isn't necessarily a _Small_ war!&nbsp; In fact, it could become rather<BR>_large_.&nbsp; But I guess the challenge is to prevent that.<BR><BR>&gt; Because Strouden is burning.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Anybody interested?&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>"The Regina Regional Committee of the Ine Givar (Solidariti) wishes to<BR>express its support for the just struggle of the Stroudenese against their<BR>'Noble' and megacorporate oppressors.&nbsp; Forward to Victory!"<BR><BR>Let's see:&nbsp; my brain just snapped into "General Secretary of the RRCIG(S)"<BR>mode, so I think that's a yes.<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 17:40:23 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy ...<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Steven Hudson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;ObTrav: Imagine a glut of mailing-list posts accumulating from<BR>&gt; 11,000<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; &gt;worlds, arriving in one big batch from the latest Xboat :)<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; How about "what triggered the Long Night", Alex?<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Imagine what would happen if the number of new posts every week is<BR>&gt;&gt; higher than what the X-boats can ship away. That would crash the<BR>&gt;&gt; system...<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Flame War, anyone?&nbsp; ;-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'm envisioning the "31137 skript kiddiez" in their basement on Capital,<BR>&gt; gathered around a map of the Imperium, working out travel times for the<BR>&gt; biggest DDoS attack ever...<BR><BR>That requires the ability to send mail for free and anonymously. Which<BR>ain't gonna happen. <BR><BR>That sort of nonsense *only* works because most "professionals" haven't<BR>a clue about securing their systems. And because system &amp; network<BR>designs are still full of security holes. Neither is going to be true<BR>when the technology is as old as it is in the Imperium. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 17:24:59 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy ...<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Steven Hudson wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;ObTrav: Imagine a glut of mailing-list posts accumulating from 11,000<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;worlds, arriving in one big batch from the latest Xboat :)<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; How about "what triggered the Long Night", Alex?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Imagine what would happen if the number of new posts every week is<BR>&gt; higher than what the X-boats can ship away. That would crash the<BR>&gt; system...<BR><BR>Not even close.<BR><BR>Remember, they've been doing this for *millenia*. Their systems don't<BR>have that kind of shoddy design/programming. The data will just get<BR>stored until it can be passed on. <BR><BR>All they'll do is schedule some extra X-boats to handle the extra<BR>traffic. <BR><BR>If the storage fills, you'll just get a "XXX system mailbox full,<BR>please resend later" and your computer will store the message locally<BR>to be resent later. <BR><BR>And they'll consider expanding the short term message storage directories.<BR><BR>Oh yeah, since you have to pay for mail, odds are that the will be<BR>various "priorities" of mail:<BR><BR>Priority&nbsp; Official&nbsp; &nbsp; Civilian<BR>- --------&nbsp; ----------&nbsp; -----------------<BR>1&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "Urgent"<BR>2&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "Routine"&nbsp;&nbsp; "High priority"<BR>3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "Minor"&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "Standard" <BR>4&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "Space Available"<BR><BR>Official traffic always bumps civilian traffic of the same or lower<BR>priority. <BR><BR>And in spite of the typical bureaucratic urge to consider everything<BR>important, the fact that mis-classifying official traffic costs the<BR>X-Boat office money (in terms of delays in processing the civilian<BR>traffic that brings in the money) I expect that there are frequent<BR>audits with *nasty* consequences for folks caught mis-using the<BR>priority levels on official traffic, or trying to slip personal traffic<BR>in as official.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 18:51:11 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>on 2/1/01 4:48 PM, Leonard Erickson at shadow@krypton.rain.com wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Very true.&nbsp; A company of spearmen with archers would have little<BR>&gt;&gt; chance against a squad with rifles and an autorifle on an open<BR>&gt;&gt; plain, but a company with rifles and a few autorifles would give a<BR>&gt;&gt; squad with ACRs and a RAM GL pause for thought.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Don't sell archer's short. If they are up to the "standard" of the<BR>&gt; English at Agincourt, while the squad is up to modern standards,<BR>&gt; they'll take casualties, but the squad will be eliminated. Volley fire<BR>&gt; from a company of archers is a fearsome thing.<BR><BR>Note, that if this is a modern (American) rifle squad, according to TO&amp;E it<BR>includes a grenadier (M-203) and a light machinegun (M-249).&nbsp; On an open<BR>plain the archers will be massacred by HE and machinegun fire.&nbsp; The riflemen<BR>are just there for company.<BR><BR>If we are talking just riflemen, recall that modern troops use camouflage<BR>uniforms, and are taught to use cover and terrain.&nbsp; Further, the troops will<BR>be spread out.&nbsp; 15 meters intervals or larger in open terrain.&nbsp; Masses<BR>archery fire is really at it's best against massed targets.&nbsp; At 300 meters<BR>an archer is aiming at a formation, not a single man.<BR><BR>And unlike a rifleman, an archer cannot fire from the prone position.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; And no, kevlar vests won't help. Hell, trauma plate will just mean that<BR>&gt; you get incapacitated by the arrows in the places that they *don't*<BR>&gt; protect (arms &amp; legs, for example).<BR><BR>But arrows, unlike bullets, do not produce cavitation and hydrostatic shock.<BR>Ask any bow hunter about the likelihood of an instant kill using modern<BR>razor broadheads.&nbsp; Period iron arrowheads are far less efficient.&nbsp; Wounded<BR>soldiers will be able to return fire.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; You can *only* make things go in the rifle's favor if you engage the<BR>&gt; archers from well beyond their max effective range. And that range<BR>&gt; (several hundred yards) is well beyond the range soldiers with rifles<BR>&gt; typically engage the enemy at.<BR><BR>The main reason most rifle fire takes place at less than 500 meters (80% at<BR>300 meters or less) is because of 1) the inability of the soldier to see the<BR>target and 2) intervening terrain.&nbsp; True, semiautomatic fire from an average<BR>soldier is not great at long range, but you average rifleman is expected to<BR>be able to hit a man silhouette at 400 meters (500 meters if you are a<BR>marine).&nbsp; Add autofire and the fact that you are shooting at massed troops<BR>from cover and concealment, in the prone position, and it gets really ugly<BR>for the archers.<BR><BR>The rifle company will take casualties, maybe, but that company of archers<BR>will be in pretty bad shape.<BR><BR>Note that this doesn't even take into account the psychological effects of<BR>gunfire on the 'primitives'. Recall the before the invention of gunpowder,<BR>the loudest noise a yeoman ever heard was probably thunder.&nbsp; When guns were<BR>first introduced in battle, the noise probably had more effect on the enemy<BR>than the projectiles fired.<BR><BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 14:28:15 +1100<BR>From: "Robert O'Connor" &lt;robocon@ozemail.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>John Snead wrote :-<BR>&gt; That all looks great, except that the 12m2 per m3 means the <BR>&gt; panels are all more than 8 cm thick!<BR>It was one of the only FF&amp;S parameters I kept.<BR>I've assumed up to now that a bit of the 8cm is air and structural<BR>support. <BR><BR>Tim Little wrote :-<BR>&gt; A bit too thick for the high-efficiency vehicle<BR>&gt; mounted cells I've seen, though only by a factor of two or so. *Far*<BR>&gt; too thick for portable devices.<BR>Right, we'll tweak the numbers then.<BR>The original poster didn't specify whether vehicles were available or<BR>not. Man-portability is highly desirable, though.<BR><BR>How about a fold-up parabolic collector?<BR>Deploy, beam some power down from orbiting satellite, and pack up.<BR>It might even be able to be used to 'amaze the natives'.<BR><BR><BR>Robert O'Connor<BR>Medico, Gamer<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 21:14:04 -0600<BR>From: Terry Mixon &lt;tmixon@ghg.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>"Trevor, Peter" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Cliff Linehan wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; You are welcome to review mine if you wish.<BR>&gt; &gt; http://herons-reach.homepage.com/traveller<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Okay, it shall be done.&nbsp; Watch this space.<BR><BR>Mine is always terminally behind.<BR><BR>http://www.ghg.net/tmixon/Trade<BR><BR>Work has been a bear and I am having to revamp some of it.<BR><BR>But if you need some kind of trade map for Gurps Traveller come on by.<BR><BR>Terry<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 21:23:59 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: GT: Small Wars (was: Re: Web Sites)<BR><BR>"Douglas E. Berry" wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; At 05:57 PM 1/31/2001, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Are you working on another GT book? :-)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I'm writing a proposal for one of the _GT: Small Wars_ books.&nbsp; Let me<BR>&gt; bounce the idea off of you.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What happens when a high-pop, TL12 world suddenly finds itself faced with a<BR>&gt; destabilizing social upheveal caused by serious rifts between the have<BR>&gt; minority and the have-nots who do all the work?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What do you do if you're the Subsector Duke, and the bulk of your Army is<BR>&gt; from this world?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What do you do if those shipyards are needed by the Navy?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What do you do when rioting breaks out in an arcology?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Think fast.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Because Strouden is burning.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Anybody interested?&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>I was interested enough to look at the SJG Wish List for GT, where I<BR>found the following:<BR><BR>http://www.sjgames.com/general/author/capsules.html#HolidayInCambodia<BR><BR>**begin quote**<BR><BR>GURPS Traveller: Small Wars <BR><BR>Each Small Wars book will describe a small "brushfire war" in sufficient<BR>detail for it to serve as an open-ended military/mercenary campaign. The<BR>book will give a brief history of both sides in the conflict, describe<BR>the military forces involved, the objectives of all involved parties<BR>(not just the two belligerents, but any outside interests), and present<BR>a general outline of the progress of the war. Adventure seeds, NPCs, and<BR>short adventures should encompass a wide variety of military actions,<BR>enabling GMs to introduce almost any group of adventurers into the<BR>situation. Allowance should be made for full-scale battles, raids,<BR>espionage and sabotage behind the lines, smuggling, psychological<BR>operations, and other situations for individual characters as well as<BR>groups. 128 pages. <BR><BR>Other Notes: The book can depict a war between two worlds or between two<BR>political entities on a single, balkanized world, and may be either<BR>within or outside of the Imperium. If the action is set within the<BR>Imperium, the author should incorporate a chapter describing Imperial<BR>political and military responses should the war threaten to spread<BR>beyond the local area. Authors must be familiar with GURPS Traveller,<BR>Ground Forces, and Star Mercs, as well as any other relevant Traveller<BR>publications.<BR><BR>**end quote**<BR><BR>Assuming that The Powers That Be buy off on your conflict between Haves<BR>and Have-Nots on the particular world of Strouden (a conflict not<BR>mentioned in CT Supp 3 [The Spinward Marches]), your capsule description<BR>looks tres cool.<BR><BR>Note that Strouden is listed as GTL-12 in GT:BtC (page 94), while the<BR>same world is listed as TTL-13 (at best GTL-11) in CT Supp 3.<BR><BR>Of course, this discrepancy may well provide the fuel for conflict on<BR>Strouden (e.g., between the Native Tech [TTL-13/GTL-11] faction and the<BR>Maximalist Tech [imported tech of TTL-15/GTL-12] faction).&nbsp; One might<BR>well conclude that one faction would constitute the "Haves," while the<BR>other constitutes the "Have-Nots."&nbsp; Note that the relative strength of<BR>the two factions may _not_ coincide with the relative TL of the<BR>factions.&nbsp; Forex, the "Haves" may well have lower technology than the<BR>"Have-Nots," with their strength being based on economic and/or<BR>demographic advantage.<BR><BR>At any rate, this sounds like a good proposal for a GT book.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 14:36:56 +1100<BR>From: "Robert O'Connor" &lt;robocon@ozemail.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Checked out the link posted by John Fox.<BR>Wow!<BR><BR>John Snead wrote :-<BR>&gt; The question then becomes, what kind of easily portable solar cells <BR>&gt; might you have at TL15.<BR><BR>Put solar cells on every surface that might be exposed to light<BR>(assuming that you can print them or even 'paint' them on by TTL 15).<BR><BR>&gt; One option that comes to mind is a <BR>&gt; geneered grass-like substance that converts a portion of the <BR>&gt; sunlight that hits it into electricity.&nbsp; Like grassphalt, but it's also a <BR>&gt; power source.&nbsp; The efficiency would likely only be around 30%, <BR>&gt; since the plant will need much of the energy to grow.<BR>Photosynthesis is very inefficient in converting sunlight to glucose.<BR><BR>I'd use plant geometry, but build them out of inorganic material.<BR><BR><BR>Robert O'Connor<BR>Medico, Gamer<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 22:41:55 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>&gt;Don't sell archer's short. If they are up to the "standard" of the<BR>&gt;English at Agincourt, while the squad is up to modern standards,<BR>&gt;they'll take casualties, but the squad will be eliminated. Volley fire<BR>&gt;from a company of archers is a fearsome thing.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; As I understand it, the problem is that nobody's really certain what the<BR>"standard" of the English at Agincourt really was. There's a huge variance<BR>between the estimates of contemporary historians. This is mostly because the<BR>exact characteristics of the bows remain unknown. There are a handful of<BR>surviving Renaissance-era bows floating around, but the characteristics of<BR>the bows -- specifically their draw-weight -- vary considerably.<BR>Contemporary estimates place the average draw-weight of the bows between<BR>about 60 lbs. and 110 lbs. A few of the surviving bows seem to indicate the<BR>draw-weight was about 90 lbs., but some would seem to have characteristics<BR>at the low end of the estimate.<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;You can *only* make things go in the rifle's favor if you engage the<BR>&gt;archers from well beyond their max effective range. And that range<BR>&gt;(several hundred yards) is well beyond the range soldiers with rifles<BR>&gt;typically engage the enemy at.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Due to the problems contemporary historians have when it comes to figuring<BR>out how powerful the bows were, there is considerable disagreement about the<BR>effective range of war arrows launched from them. Most sources agree that it<BR>was somewhere between about 180 and 250 yards or so. Now, I'm not too sure<BR>about contemporary combat-rifle theory, so I'm not sure what range<BR>firefights occur at, although for some reason 300 meters or so keeps running<BR>through my brain.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; As far as range goes, there's a slight advantage on the part of the<BR>riflemen, if they're using something contemporary, like an M-16. If they're<BR>using M-14s or World War I rifles, I believe the difference in range favors<BR>the rifle squad quite a bit. Of course, massed archers would be a big, fat<BR>juicy target for the riflemen, while the riflemen (if they had a couple of<BR>brain cells to rub together between the lot of them) would likely spread out<BR>to cut down the effectiveness of the hail of arrows that their enemies would<BR>be sending their way.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Personally, I believe the safe money would be on the guys with the<BR>contemporary rifles.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 23:07:36 -0500<BR>From: knightsky@juno.com<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>&gt; But arrows, unlike bullets, do not produce cavitation and hydrostatic<BR>shock.<BR><BR>Please tell me we're not going to go into a "hydrostatic shock myth"<BR>thread... :-(<BR><BR>(they just had the same thing about a month ago on rec.games.frp.misc,<BR>and it was about as pointless as you might imagine)<BR><BR><BR>Perry<BR>"In a war of nerves, your own arsenal can destroy you."<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 16:26:31 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Robert O'Connor wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Put solar cells on every surface that might be exposed to light<BR>&gt; (assuming that you can print them or even 'paint' them on by TTL 15).<BR><BR>Assuming the cells are fairly high efficiency, that would make for a<BR>really dreary colour scheme.&nbsp; :^P<BR><BR>By definition, any surface that captures most incident light is dark<BR>in colour.&nbsp; Welcome to the World of Darkness :)<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 19:03:29 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Study Says Penguins Are Sensible<BR><BR>Another piece of penguin information<BR><BR>The dead bodies of the killers of seventy-odd little blue penguins were<BR>displayed live on national television as a deterrant to others, here in New<BR>Zealand a couple of nights ago.<BR><BR>They were shot by a Department of Conservation officer when they tried to<BR>enter the penguin colony for another murderous rampage.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 00:58:12 -0500<BR>From: "DaveShayne" &lt;daveshayne@email.msn.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Why smart Americans? (Was RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578)<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 12:35:04 +1000<BR>&gt; From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; From: Matt Bond<BR>&gt; &gt; You couldn't build a Ford Mustang, but you could 'uplift' the<BR>&gt; &gt; revolutionary Americans.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; But why would you want to make Americans sentient?&nbsp; : )<BR><BR>So we'd stop doing damn fool things like voting Republican?<BR><BR>&lt;grin,duck,run&gt;<BR><BR>Dave Shayne<BR><BR>"Every day my metal friend<BR>Shakes my bed at 6 AM (Wake up)<BR>Then the shiny servant clones<BR>Running with my telephones."<BR><BR>"Living in the Plastic Age" - Horn/Downes<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3588<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xb05.mx.aol.com (rly-xb05.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.106]) by air-xb02.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 02 Feb 2001 01:35:25 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xb05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 02 Feb 2001 01:35:02 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id BAA80595;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 2 Feb 2001 01:33:03 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 2 Feb 2001 01:32:44 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id BAA80551<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 2 Feb 2001 01:32:44 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 01:32:44 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102020632.BAA80551@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3588<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3589</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/2/01 8:06:48 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, February 2 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3589<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>RE: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>re: A couple of questions<BR>Re: Landgrab proposal: Sacnoth, Gram<BR>Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: Errrr, am I missing something?<BR>RE: Study Says Penguins Are Sensible<BR>Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR>Great Myths laid to rest...<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Technology Marches On: NeuroTransmitter-Controlled Craft<BR>Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR>Re: A couple of questions<BR>Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: Archers vs Rifles<BR>Re: Questions<BR>RE: TL 0 biological science<BR>Re: Sui Degeneris<BR>Re: 'Illegitimi non whatever<BR>Re: FLGS<BR>[Website Review] Starbase Progress - A Traveller Homepage<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 01:26:35 -0500<BR>From: "DaveShayne" &lt;daveshayne@email.msn.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Thu, 01 Feb 2001 08:59:33<BR>&gt; From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; At 05:57 PM 1/31/2001, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Are you working on another GT book? :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'm writing a proposal for one of the _GT: Small Wars_ books.&nbsp; Let me<BR>&gt; bounce the idea off of you.<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; Anybody interested?&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>Well I know what I (as an imperial noble) would do faced with those<BR>circumstances.<BR><BR>Discredit, co-opt, and kill. (In that order.)<BR><BR>It sounds like a good extended adventure. I'd buy it.<BR><BR>Dave Shayne<BR><BR>"Every day my metal friend<BR>Shakes my bed at 6 AM (Wake up)<BR>Then the shiny servant clones<BR>Running with my telephones."<BR><BR>"Living in the Plastic Age" - Horn/Downes<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 00:17:13 -0600<BR>From: Andy Holzrichter &lt;jhereg@southwind.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Thanks to everyone who responded, or even thought about the concept. <BR>&lt;g&gt;&nbsp; The idea on our end is to have *SOME* man portable source of <BR>power.&nbsp;&nbsp; There have been two many jokes around our group about a "3 hour <BR>cruise" for characters to feel comfortable w/o the basic minimum of <BR>equipment they can pickup and carry off if they need to.&nbsp; The characters <BR>are planning to have a ship and associated vehicles, they want to have <BR>something to recharge their gauss weaponry, laser weaponry, small <BR>electronics and other items.&nbsp; (At TL15, assuming 40% efficiency and roughly <BR>earthlike conditions ) It looks like options might be<BR><BR>Clothing&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; approx 15 - 20 w<BR>1 m solar array/sunscreen, self aligning&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; approx&nbsp; 500 w<BR>2m x 10m panel&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; up to approx&nbsp; 10kw (Maybe an <BR>average of 5 kw?)<BR>Can be folded / rolled up to 1m x ???? diameter<BR><BR>The clothing won't give off much power, but it would be steady and probably <BR>reasonably consistent.&nbsp; The solar umbrella might be a little fragile, <BR>unwieldy and fun in the wind. :-}&nbsp; The big panel might be rolled up like a <BR>sleeping bag and carried w/ a pack.&nbsp; Any thoughts on practicality, cost and <BR>weight?&nbsp; (Assuming reasonably rugged, but not absurdly so.)<BR><BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Andy<BR><BR>- - Copyright  2000 by Andy Holzrichter<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 18:03:25 +1100<BR>From: "Jeffrey Michael Malone" &lt;NarellePark@bigpond.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>Returning to the original thrust of the thread, one of the great advantages<BR>of energy weapons versus projectile weapons is the logistic burden needed to<BR>sustain a force.&nbsp; In essence, if you have power, you have ammunition.&nbsp; The<BR>only draw-back of this is of course that expended (but rechargable) energy<BR>cells (or what have you) still have considerable weight, whereas the only<BR>wieght for a projectile weapon is the weight of empty magazines.&nbsp; One would<BR>imagine that the ratio of 'dead weight', if you will, for energy weapons<BR>will almost certainly be greater than for projectile weapons (be these<BR>either magzine fed or belt fed).&nbsp; This probably doesn't matter for vehicle<BR>mounts (especially given that running a vehicle will allow the energy cells<BR>to be constantly topped up), but certainly will matter for personnel-carried<BR>weapons.<BR><BR>There is also the advantage of (in ground combat terms) effectively zero<BR>time to target compared to projectile weapons.&nbsp; Needless to say, this is one<BR>of the reasons that in the RW that DEW are increasingly coming under<BR>consideration for AD and anti-missile defence (both close-in tactical and<BR>strategic - ABL for example), and for other time-critical targeting<BR>(anti-artillery round applications like the THEL recently tested against<BR>Katusha-type FFRs).<BR><BR>My 0.2 Cr worth.<BR><BR>J.M.M.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 10:11:21 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: re: A couple of questions<BR><BR>[On duelling]<BR>On Thu, 1 Feb 2001, Paul Drye wrote:<BR>&gt; Which reminds me that there are supposed to be plenty of Aslan citizens of <BR>&gt; the Imperium. What do they do?<BR><BR>If they are culturally Aslan, whatever comes naturally, erm, culturally.<BR><BR>If they have adopted the barbarian ways, they do as the barbarians around<BR>them, without honour.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:03:18 +0100<BR>From: Hans Rancke-Madsen &lt;rancke@diku.dk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrab proposal: Sacnoth, Gram<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley writes:<BR><BR>&gt;I'm doing some writing based in the Sword Worlds, and would like to make a<BR>&gt;claim on two higher-tech worlds in the region: Sacnoth and Gram. I would<BR>&gt;appreciate hearing any objections and/or sources for canon material I should<BR>&gt;include.<BR><BR>You might be interested to know that I'm working on a series of articles for<BR>JTAS Online detailing the Sword Worlds at various points of their history. At<BR>the moment I've had one covering the Sacnoth Dominate (including their early<BR>history) published and I'm working on one describing them during the 1st Century<BR>(will propably wind up titled "The Five States"). I hope to eventually produce<BR>four or five more.<BR><BR>You're welcome to contact me by e-mail to talk about it.<BR><BR><BR>Hans<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 22:13:09 +1100<BR>From: "Robert O'Connor" &lt;robocon@ozemail.com.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re : Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Tim Little wrote :-<BR>&gt; Assuming the cells are fairly high efficiency, that would make for a<BR>&gt; really dreary colour scheme.&nbsp; :^P<BR>Perhaps they could be 'tuned' not to absorb certain wavelengths, like<BR>chlorophyll or haemoglobin, etc. The performance hit would probably be<BR>dreadful, though.<BR><BR>&gt; By definition, any surface that captures most incident light is dark<BR>&gt; in colour.&nbsp; Welcome to the World of Darkness :)<BR>It might be OK if you're trying to go for that noir look ;-)<BR><BR><BR>Robert O'Connor<BR>Medico, Gamer<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 12:23:45 +0100<BR>From: Hans Rancke-Madsen &lt;rancke@diku.dk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Errrr, am I missing something?<BR><BR>Paul Drye writes:<BR><BR>&gt;Looking at First In's tech level descriptions, I'm sensing a problem here. <BR>&gt;Biological Science TL 0 includes "Useful animals and plants are <BR>&gt;domesticated".<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Soooo....<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What are pure hunter-gatherers, without the foggiest notions that a plant or <BR>&gt;animal has uses besides being tracked down in the wilderness and berated <BR>&gt;with a pointed stick? Biological Tech Level negative one?<BR><BR>They're still TL 0. A society does not have to have all possible technologies<BR>associated with its TL. A TL just means "They have at least some of the stuff<BR>belonging to a TL and nothing better". This leads to concepts like "Early TL X"<BR>and "Late TL X". Note that even "Late TL X" don't necessarily have everything<BR>possible at that TL. Two Traveller-relevant examples are Fusion+ and drop<BR>tanks. Fusion+ is possible at TTL 12 (possibly earlier? I forget), but it<BR>wasn't invented until around Year -30. Yet a number of planets reached TL 12<BR>during the Rule of Man even though they didn't have Fusion+. Similarily drop<BR>tanks can be constructed as early (or rather, as low) as TL 9, but the<BR>capacitors that makes them possible wasn't invented until around 1080 or so.<BR>That's an invention that could have been made since the Vilani reached TL 9<BR>11,000 years earlier, but wasn't. <BR><BR>For a real life example, telescopes weren't invented until several centuries<BR>after lenses good enough to make telescopes with was developed. Yet to claim<BR>that spectacles and telescopes belong to two different TLs is (IMO anyway) just<BR>plain wrong.<BR><BR><BR>Hans<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 03:28:04 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Study Says Penguins Are Sensible<BR><BR>Were they human, or some sort of anti-penguin critter?<BR><BR>- --- "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; Another piece of penguin information<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The dead bodies of the killers of seventy-odd little blue penguins<BR>&gt; were<BR>&gt; displayed live on national television as a deterrant to others, here<BR>&gt; in New<BR>&gt; Zealand a couple of nights ago.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; They were shot by a Department of Conservation officer when they<BR>&gt; tried to<BR>&gt; enter the penguin colony for another murderous rampage.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Frankie<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Thu, 1 Feb 2001 17:50:19 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller-digest V1999 #3578<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Now here is a question that would bake your noodle.&nbsp; Drop <BR>&gt;&gt; yourself in<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Revolutionary America, with the plans for a Ford Mustang.&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&gt; Can you build it?<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Not a chance. You'd need to *invent* precision machining (which is one<BR>&gt;&gt; of the reasons that Babbage (who was working more than 50 years later)<BR>&gt;&gt; couldn't get his difference engine built.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; You'd need to invent a way to create various alloys. And build a<BR>&gt;&gt; complete steel mill, including the rolling mill to produce the sheet<BR>&gt;&gt; metal. <BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; - -- <BR>&gt;&gt; Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; You couldn't build a Ford Mustang, but you could 'uplift' the<BR>&gt; revolutionary Americans. Assuming you had the knowledge in question, and<BR>&gt; some financial backing. Within 10 years I would imagine they could have<BR>&gt; reached mid 19C tech, another 10 to get early 20C and another 10 to get<BR>&gt; to mid 20C.<BR><BR>Nope. Not possible. <BR><BR>Check stuff like census data. Something like90% of the population was<BR>rural. And most of *them* were *required* to produce the food for the<BR>other 10%. <BR><BR>There aren't enough workers available. There isn't enough *capital*<BR>available to build the required plants. <BR><BR>&gt; You just have to concentrate on 'enabling' technologies, those that let<BR>&gt; you build better tools to build better enabling technologies etc...<BR><BR>Yeah, and the problem is that you'll need to improve agriculture<BR>considerably *and* increase the population drastically *first*. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 12:08:59 -0000<BR>From: "Jeff Rowse" &lt;jeffrowse@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Great Myths laid to rest...<BR><BR>Further proof that, while the rest of the world struggles with the minor <BR>problems of dimishing fossil fuels and global changes, the BBC (British <BR>Broadcasting Corporation) continues to send us the *real* cutting-edge <BR>stories... (more on the 'Penguins evolved from Weebles' mythos)<BR><BR>http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/sci/tech/newsid_1149000/1149900.stm<BR><BR>Jeff.<BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 04:57:29 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;firefights occur at, although for some reason 300 meters or so keeps running<BR>&gt;through my brain.<BR><BR>&nbsp; IIRC, that's the maximum range of bows in _Warhamster_ :&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; As far as range goes, there's a slight advantage on the part of the<BR>&gt;riflemen, if they're using something contemporary, like an M-16. If they're<BR>&gt;using M-14s or World War I rifles, I believe the difference in range favors<BR>&gt;the rifle squad quite a bit. Of course, massed archers would be a big, fat<BR>&gt;juicy target for the riflemen, while the riflemen (if they had a couple of<BR>&gt;brain cells to rub together between the lot of them) would likely spread out<BR>&gt;to cut down the effectiveness of the hail of arrows that their enemies would<BR>&gt;be sending their way.<BR><BR>&nbsp; Heck, if you're not going to try and compare apples and oranges (as it<BR>were) then why are you even bothering to post to the TML? :|<BR><BR>&nbsp; Yes, jokes aside, effective ranges should diverge massively if the<BR>same standards are used.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 07:19:30 -0600<BR>From: "D. Smart" &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Technology Marches On: NeuroTransmitter-Controlled Craft<BR><BR>Below are excerpts from a post on the Beyond 2000 website.<BR>The full story can be found at:<BR>http://www.beyond2000.com/news/Feb_01/story_1002.html<BR><BR>- -- quote --<BR><BR>Imagine the pilot of your aircraft flying with no hands and<BR>without even being present in the cockpit. Sound like a<BR>recipe for disaster? NASA scientists have recently<BR>demonstrated the ability to control a 757 jet simulation,<BR>using only human muscle-nerve signals linked to a computer.<BR>The pilot jockeyed his machine simply by waving at it. <BR><BR>The aviator concerned, was outfitted with an armband<BR>implanted with eight electrodes. The sensors read muscle<BR>nerve signals as the pilot made the gestures needed to land<BR>a computer-generated aircraft. The pilot was also able to<BR>land a damaged aircraft during emergency landing drills...<BR><BR>...To demonstrate bioelectric muscle control of the<BR>simulated 757<BR>airplane during emergencies, researchers combined this<BR>technology<BR>with two other NASA developments, the ability of the neural<BR>net<BR>software to learn to fly damaged aircraft, and propulsion<BR>only<BR>landing of aircraft.<BR><BR>Severe damage, such as partially destroyed wings, fuselage<BR>holes<BR>or sensor failures greatly alter how an airplane handles and<BR>a<BR>pilot's controls may respond oddly or might not work at all.<BR>In<BR>about one sixth of a second a computer on board a damaged<BR>aircraft can relearn to fly a plane, giving the pilot better<BR>control...<BR><BR>..."When we combined the three technologies, the<BR>neuroelectrically<BR>wired pilot took the simulated aircraft into landing<BR>scenarios with<BR>a cascading series of accidents, first locking rudder<BR>controls and<BR>then progressing to full hydraulic failure," says Jorgensen.<BR>"For<BR>each case, successful landings were demonstrated for<BR>autopilot,<BR>damaged and propulsion only control."...<BR><BR>- -- end quote --<BR><BR>ObTrav: Could this be a glimpse of how high-TL starships are<BR>run?<BR>Makes a crew jumpsuit something more than just an article of<BR>clothing - they're the control panels!<BR><BR>David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 08:18:40 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; From: Mark Urbin<BR>&gt; &gt; Find &amp; take out the ringleaders, as quickly as possible.<BR>&gt;&lt;rest snipped&gt;<BR>&gt;The problem with this approach is that all you are doing is suppressing the<BR>&gt;initial revolt.&nbsp; You are going to have to deal with the causes, unless you<BR>&gt;want to get bogged down in a long &amp; nasty counter-insurgency.<BR><BR>No problem.&nbsp; The question was how to put down the revolt, not how to keep <BR>it from<BR>reoccurring long term.<BR><BR>Putting the revolt quickly allows you time for dealing with the causes.<BR><BR>&gt;The other question is: how big is your merc unit?&nbsp; Strouden, IIRC, is a<BR>&gt;high-population world.<BR><BR>The 'de-heading' part doesn't have to be big.<BR>The non-lethal sections needs to fair sized, but well supported.<BR>In nice big TL C city sized buildings, control of the environmental systems <BR>is a huge force multiplier.<BR>- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/&nbsp; Opinions Mine!<BR>Mort Sahl: General, aren't you supporting Castro by smoking that Havana cigar?<BR>Alexander Haig: I prefer to think of it as burning his crops to the ground.<BR>(from an interview of Mort Sahl on National Public Radio, 23nov91)<BR>- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 05:09:06 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: A couple of questions<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Tod Glenn wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Typically, duels would only be between officers of equivalent rank, as <BR>&gt; well.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Or between personell of roughly equal noble rank, which can be very<BR>&gt; different from navy/army/whatever rank. Thus, an enlisted soldier might<BR>&gt; end up in a duel with a general.<BR><BR>Nope, under military regs, you are *forbidden* to issue a challenge to<BR>a superior officer. He can challenge *you* however.[1]<BR><BR>The reasoning is quite simple. It keeps good duelists from getting<BR>themselves promoted by creating openings. <BR><BR>So even if the private has a higher noble rank, he'd *still* get court<BR>martialed for issuing the challenge. <BR><BR>[1] this is essentially the way British Navy regs worked during the<BR>Napoleonic era, and I suspect Army regs were the same.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 05:14:00 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; HOWEVER, I can respond to one question that has been repeated several<BR>&gt; times..."Why would a ray-gun be more reliable?"<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Simply because it requires no moving parts and can be totally encased<BR>&gt; (potted) in a polymer. A ray-gun, could, in effect, be a solid object.<BR><BR>Sorry, not even *close*. You can't "pot" it unless you want to have it<BR>melt. Likewise, parts, even electronic ones *fail* and need replacement<BR>(I just had to replace a power supply that died with no warning)<BR><BR>Lasers are going to have moving parts. The aiming/focusing mechanism at<BR>the very least. And it's unlikely that the lasing medium will be solid.<BR>Not at the required energy levels. Which means you'll have both<BR>focusing mirrors and the lasing cavity that can get knocked out of<BR>alignment. <BR><BR>Oh yeah, a speck of *dust* on the optics of a weapons grade laser will<BR>cause an explosion... What was that film? "Real Genius"? I'm told the<BR>explosion from the vaseline on the lens was done pretty accurately. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 05:02:09 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Given that we are slowly heading into the regions of flexible <BR>&gt; displays and similar things today, I'm guessing by TL 10 there will <BR>&gt; be solar cells that basically look like black sheets of tough canvas <BR>&gt; or PVC cloth.&nbsp; You could make the backpacks out of them, or <BR>&gt; perhaps even the PC's overcoats (recharge as you walk).&nbsp; By TL <BR>&gt; 12+ I'm guessing that the efficiency could be as high as 40-50% <BR>&gt; (higher is likely impossible).&nbsp; So (measuring the back of my coat) <BR>&gt; you could fit ~0.33 M^2 of solar cells on the back of a coat, with <BR>&gt; 40% efficiency you'd get ~130 watts out of that.&nbsp; Not bad for a <BR>&gt; power source that is infinitely portable. <BR><BR>Except that what counts isn't the *actual* area. It's the area of the<BR>"shadow" the cells would cast. The *minimum* area shadow. In other<BR>words a sort of "cross section" at right angles to the direction the<BR>light is coming from. <BR><BR>And 130 watts will take over 2 hours to produce 1 MJ of energy. That's<BR>*one* shot from a *weak* laser. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 10:39:26 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Archers vs Rifles<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt;&gt;Very true.&nbsp; A company of spearmen with archers would have little<BR>&gt;&gt;chance against a squad with rifles and an autorifle on an open<BR>&gt;&gt;plain, but a company with rifles and a few autorifles would give a<BR>&gt;&gt;squad with ACRs and a RAM GL pause for thought.<BR>&gt;Don't sell archer's short. If they are up to the "standard" of the<BR>&gt;English at Agincourt, while the squad is up to modern standards,<BR>&gt;they'll take casualties, but the squad will be eliminated. Volley fire<BR>&gt;from a company of archers is a fearsome thing.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I'm trying not to.&nbsp; A squad of marksmen (equivalent, perhaps,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; to the "standard" of the English at Agincourt) spread out and<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; supported by an autorifle would inflict nasty damage on a<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; bunch of archers packed together without cover.&nbsp; Such<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; damage could be inflicted before the archers got into range,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; even if we think in terms of reality rather than Traveller (all<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I know are the CT rules).&nbsp; If the archers are somehow able to<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; continue to advance in the face of this, they will still be<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; mowed down at an appalling rate as they mass to fire.&nbsp; No<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; doubt the riflemen would take casualties, but I would still<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; put my money on the rifle squad (if I were a betting man).<BR><BR>&gt;And no, kevlar vests won't help.<BR>&lt;snipped&gt;<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I was assuming no armour on either side.&nbsp; Of course,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; with CT rules armour would increase the disparity.<BR><BR>&gt;You can *only* make things go in the rifle's favor if you engage the<BR>&gt;archers from well beyond their max effective range. And that range<BR>&gt;(several hundred yards) is well beyond the range soldiers with rifles<BR>&gt;typically engage the enemy at.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I wasn't putting forth a "typical" engagement.&nbsp; In the scenario<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; that I proposed, all else being equal, the rifle squad looks to<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; me to have the advantage.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 10:36:50 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Questions<BR><BR>&gt; (1) What is the black curtain?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Speculation has run rampant on this on, with answers centering on the<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; idea that it's due in some way to Virus.&nbsp; Common guesses have been that<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; it's a Virus-run empire of some sort, or that it's the scene of an<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; ongoing war between two 'factions' of Virus, one revering Lucan as a<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; god, the other demonizing him.&nbsp; All we know from published materials<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; [TNE] is that no ship has been known to enter it and return.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; [Loren Wiseman on the TML] "Don't ask, I can't tell you.<BR><BR>Dealt with already.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; (2) What is the Empress Wave?<BR><BR>Asnwer to this one is the same as to 1: I cannot answer this question.<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; (3) Will the Empress Wave be followed up in GURPS Traveller?<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; No answer to this one as yet.&nbsp; Loren?<BR><BR>Still no answer . . . I don't want to spoil the surprise.<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 10:44:21 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: TL 0 biological science<BR><BR>Paul Drye writes:<BR>&gt;Looking at First In's tech level descriptions, I'm sensing a problem here. <BR>&gt;Biological Science TL 0 includes "Useful animals and plants are <BR>&gt;domesticated".<BR>&gt;Soooo....<BR>&gt;What are pure hunter-gatherers, without the foggiest notions that a plant or <BR>&gt;animal has uses besides being tracked down in the wilderness and berated <BR>&gt;with a pointed stick? Biological Tech Level negative one?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I'm not sure if there is anything to it, but some researchers have<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; suggested that chimpanzees and other animals may "medicate"<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; themselves by choosing to eat certain plants when ill.&nbsp; Certainly<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; there are no human societies known that had no knowledge at all<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; about herbal remidies (though such knowledge may sometimes<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; be unreliable).&nbsp; I guess it comes down to how you define TL, but<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; one could argue that all sentients that evolved locally have at least<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; some "medical" knowledge.<BR><BR>&gt;There seems to be a similar problem with Environment TL 0 ("Primitive <BR>&gt;agriculture. Villages and towns")<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That sounds harder to defend.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 10:48:32 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Sui Degeneris<BR><BR>&gt; Well, we have laws against suicide in that States too, except here in<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Oregon, but you need a prescription :). Suicide would seem to be the<BR>&gt;&nbsp; ultimate act of individualism.&nbsp; Can't have that, can we?<BR><BR>And, as Month Python said, what's a murder if not an extroverted suicide?<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 10:55:10 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: 'Illegitimi non whatever<BR><BR>&gt; By the way, for Jesse Degraff: back in college when I was a drill <BR>&gt;&nbsp; instructor, we had shirts which had on them the motto, 'Illegitimi non <BR>&gt;&nbsp; Carborundrum,' which I think is the Latin you're looking for. =)<BR><BR>It isn't really Latin y'know . . . just a modern invention that makes a swell <BR>t-shirt/plaque/coffee mug/grafitti/embroidered wall hanging.<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:02:51 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: FLGS<BR><BR>&gt; When you go into the product listings and click on an entry, you'll see a<BR>&gt;&nbsp; little "In Print&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Click Here to Order!" section under the title.&nbsp; <BR>Click<BR>&gt;&nbsp; there (duh! ;) and it'll take you to the Warehouse 23 section for that<BR>&gt;&nbsp; product.&nbsp; You can order directly from there if your FLGS can't get 'em or<BR>&gt;&nbsp; find 'em.<BR><BR>Or have your FLGS get in touch with SJ Games (numerous contact addresses, <BR>phone numbers, etc on the website), and we'll get him/her/it a list of <BR>distributors who will be happy to sell him our entire line.<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 16:02:09 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: [Website Review] Starbase Progress - A Traveller Homepage<BR><BR>The Traveller Website Review<BR>- ----------------------------<BR><BR>Another site needing review is Patrik Holmstrm's<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Starbase Progress - A Traveller Homepage<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (http://www.docs.uu.se/~paho9211/trav/)<BR><BR>This is a semi-professional looking site with good layout and the<BR>odd on-screen&nbsp; graphic,&nbsp; and&nbsp; easy&nbsp; navigation&nbsp; (either&nbsp; with&nbsp; or<BR>without frames ... nice touch).&nbsp; Pages load at reasonable&nbsp; speed,<BR>too.&nbsp; The theme of the site appears&nbsp; to&nbsp; be&nbsp; that&nbsp; of&nbsp; the&nbsp; sales<BR>catalogue&nbsp; of&nbsp; "Dimashq&nbsp;&nbsp; Starships",&nbsp;&nbsp; "Dimashq&nbsp;&nbsp; Vehicles"&nbsp;&nbsp; (a<BR>subsidiary?), and "Arms &amp; Ordinance".<BR><BR>From Dimashq Starships what you&nbsp; get&nbsp; are&nbsp; 25&nbsp; ships&nbsp; and&nbsp; things<BR>ranging from the 1 dton Crystal Ball sensor&nbsp; drone&nbsp; to&nbsp; the&nbsp; 900k<BR>dton Recurrent Glory super&nbsp; dreadnaught.&nbsp; From&nbsp; an&nbsp; initial&nbsp; look<BR>around&nbsp; they&nbsp; are&nbsp; designed&nbsp; using&nbsp; FF&amp;S2&nbsp;&nbsp; and&nbsp;&nbsp; Andrew&nbsp;&nbsp; Akins'<BR>spreadsheet.&nbsp; TL is 15.<BR><BR>The Dimashq Vehicles section is still in its&nbsp; early&nbsp; stages&nbsp; with<BR>only 11 TL8 missiles (overall stats, no design).<BR><BR>From Arms &amp; Ordinance you get&nbsp; 4&nbsp; TL12&nbsp; ETC&nbsp; autopistols&nbsp; and&nbsp; 10<BR>assorted TL8 weapons ranging from a revolver to a HMG.&nbsp; There&nbsp; is<BR>also a battery discharge modifier table (of possible interest&nbsp; to<BR>gearheads).<BR><BR>There is also a link page (taking you to 10 other sites) as&nbsp; well<BR>as access to both the Traveller webring and the Gearhead webring.<BR><BR>Finally, there is a "What's New" page.&nbsp; From&nbsp; this&nbsp; you&nbsp; can&nbsp; see<BR>that updates appear fairly frequently.&nbsp; One minor&nbsp; problem&nbsp; here,<BR>however, is that some of the links are broken&nbsp; (for&nbsp; example&nbsp; the<BR>Pirate Interdiction Cruiser, the Police Patrol Grav Car, and&nbsp; the<BR>Mengingjord Super Dreadnought).<BR><BR>In summary: a well put together site, but&nbsp; evidentially&nbsp; still&nbsp; a<BR>work in progress.&nbsp; As&nbsp; the&nbsp; content&nbsp; increases&nbsp; along&nbsp; the&nbsp; lines<BR>mapped out in the site this will become for T4&nbsp; aficionados&nbsp; what<BR>the Dean Files is for MT.<BR><BR>Improvements: apart from fix the&nbsp; broken&nbsp; links&nbsp; (obviously)&nbsp; and<BR>increase the content as shown to&nbsp; be&nbsp; planned&nbsp; (perhaps&nbsp; focusing<BR>more on the underweight vehicles and guns&nbsp; sections),&nbsp; there&nbsp; are<BR>two areas of potential improvement.&nbsp; First, while not&nbsp; necessary,<BR>some illustrations and/or deckplans would be nice.&nbsp; Second,&nbsp; some<BR>background on Dimashq would be great ... who are&nbsp; they,&nbsp; how&nbsp; big<BR>are they, how long have they been around,&nbsp; that&nbsp; sort&nbsp; of&nbsp; thing.<BR>Also, why&nbsp; is&nbsp; this&nbsp; site&nbsp; called&nbsp; "Starbase&nbsp; Progress"&nbsp; and&nbsp; not<BR>"Dimashq Corporation"?<BR><BR><BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3589<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yg05.mx.aol.com (rly-yg05.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.5]) by air-yg03.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 02 Feb 2001 11:06:48 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yg05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 02 Feb 2001 11:06:16 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id LAA01299;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:05:14 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:04:49 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA01241<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:04:48 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:04:48 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102021604.LAA01241@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3589<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3590</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/2/01 12:26:36 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, February 2 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3590<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Gearhead question<BR>Re: [TML] Questions [OT]<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>Re: [Website Review] Starbase Progress - A Traveller Homepage<BR>Urgent: UWP Code and mapping question<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Urgent: UWP Code and mapping question<BR>: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Subsector maps needed<BR>RE: Subsector maps needed<BR>RE: Subsector maps needed<BR>Ahetowa<BR>Re: Ahetowa<BR>Vargr Scout<BR>Re: Ahetowa<BR>Re: Ahetowa<BR>Re: Question.....<BR>Re: Azhanti HL<BR>Re: Azhanti HL<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>Re: Another question...<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 08:12:36 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Gearhead question<BR><BR>In FF&amp;S, I want to strap a rocket onto a wheeled vehicle.&nbsp; How do I<BR>determine the power-to-weight ratio (which is usually given in<BR>MW/tonnes) and thus the speed of the hybrid vehicle?<BR><BR><BR><BR>=====<BR>Gerry Harris<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>ther Traveller  http://www.aethertraveller.com <BR>Soldier's Companion  http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Galaxy/6316/Soldiers/soccomp1.html<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR>"Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war"  Antony, "Julius Caesar," Act 3, Scene 1<BR>**********************************************************************************************<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 11:56:13 -0500<BR>From: Jonathan McDermott &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: [TML] Questions [OT]<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 10:36:50 EST<BR>&gt;From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Questions<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; (1) What is the black curtain?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Speculation has run rampant on this on, with answers centering on the<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; idea that it's due in some way to Virus.&nbsp; Common guesses have been that<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; it's a Virus-run empire of some sort, or that it's the scene of an<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; ongoing war between two 'factions' of Virus, one revering Lucan as a<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; god, the other demonizing him.&nbsp; All we know from published materials<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; [TNE] is that no ship has been known to enter it and return.<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; [Loren Wiseman on the TML] "Don't ask, I can't tell you.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Dealt with already.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; (2) What is the Empress Wave?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Asnwer to this one is the same as to 1: I cannot answer this question.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; (3) Will the Empress Wave be followed up in GURPS Traveller?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; No answer to this one as yet.&nbsp; Loren?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Still no answer . . . I don't want to spoil the surprise.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;LKW<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;------------------------------<BR><BR>This is getting almost painful with the anticipation/wonder/worry.&nbsp; To not <BR>even know if we MIGHT hear the answers, or clues to them...!&nbsp; Though I'm <BR>sure there are people out there who (a) don't care to know about anything <BR>in TNE, or (b) actively don't want to know anything about those two TNE.<BR><BR>I'm not either of that type. =)<BR><BR>Since we know Loren can't be moved by whining, does anybody have any idea <BR>what his price is?*&nbsp; Maybe a teddy groat for Valentine's Day...? =)<BR><BR>Cheers!<BR><BR><BR><BR>* Well, I'm sure a fully-functional jump drive and set of engineering <BR>manuals for same would get him talking right quick, but I don't have any <BR>spares handy.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 04:50:36 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Here is a question for the gearheads out there.&nbsp; Where can I<BR>&gt; find stats on man portable solar power for traveller?&nbsp; Our group is<BR>&gt; planning an expedition to a low tech (TL2) world and is trying to<BR>&gt; cover all options.&nbsp; They want some type of solar recharger for energy<BR>&gt; weapons (laser rifles mostly.)&nbsp; I realize the recharge times will<BR>&gt; probably be LONG, but does anyone have appropriate figures?<BR>&gt; One idea was the top/sides of a backpack covered with solar cells.<BR><BR>Here on Earth (at 1 AU from a G type star, and with a "standard"<BR>atmosphere) the absolute *maximum* you *could* get, from a 100%<BR>efficient solar panel, oriented perpendicular to the direction the<BR>sunlight is coming from, is 750 watts per square meter.<BR><BR>That means it'd take over 20 minutes to get 1 MJ of energy. <BR><BR>Now, reduce that as the sun gets nearer to the horizon. Reduce it again<BR>if the panel is at the wrong angle (basicly, the *effective* surface<BR>area is the area you'd see looking at it from the direction of the<BR>sun). Reduce again if it's overcast. Reduce again if the cells are less<BR>than 100% efficient (current cells are lucky to hiyt 30%, and those are<BR>*expensive*).<BR><BR>Then consider that the dimmer the star, the lower the power. Likewise,<BR>the farther from the star you are, the lower the power. <BR><BR>In short, they'd be a *lot* better off hauling along a hand cranked<BR>generator, or a "bicycle" that they could assemble and pedal away on.<BR>An hour of cranking or pedalling would likely produce more energy than<BR>a days worth of sunlight on a pack covered with solar cells (which<BR>would be lucky to have an *effective* area of 1/10th of a square meter<BR>most of the time).<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 09:17:19 -0800<BR>From: "Mark F. Cook" &lt;markc@peak.org&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR>Everybody seems to be really happy with the Beowulf deckplans.&nbsp; I wish<BR>I'd done 'em! "^)&nbsp; I think the bulk of the deckplans for all the recent SJG<BR>supplements have been generated by either Andy Akins or myself.<BR><BR>What I wanna know is when Andy is going to do a set like the Beowulf<BR>(and on the same scale) for AHL! :^)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - Mark C.<BR><BR>&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 12:40:35 -0500<BR>From: "Paul Drye" &lt;p_drye@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: [Website Review] Starbase Progress - A Traveller Homepage<BR><BR>&gt;The Dimashq Vehicles section is still in its&nbsp; early&nbsp; stages&nbsp; with<BR>&gt;only 11 TL8 missiles (overall stats, no design).<BR><BR>Missiles are vehicles? What is this, "Dr. Strangelove"?<BR><BR>Tongue firmly in cheek,<BR>Paul Drye<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:53:38 -0600<BR>From: "Andy Akins" &lt;andyakins@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Urgent: UWP Code and mapping question<BR><BR>Ack...I'm busy doin some maps for Loren and I don't have my books handy:<BR><BR>What does a base code of A mean? Is it both Navy and Scouts (I thought that<BR>was B) - or is it something else?<BR><BR>And if it is something else, what is the map symbol for it?<BR><BR>Thanks,<BR><BR>&nbsp; Andy Akins<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 10:38:28 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>on 2/1/01 11:03 PM, Jeffrey Michael Malone at NarellePark@bigpond.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Returning to the original thrust of the thread, one of the great advantages<BR>&gt; of energy weapons versus projectile weapons is the logistic burden needed to<BR>&gt; sustain a force.&nbsp; In essence, if you have power, you have ammunition.&nbsp; The<BR>&gt; only draw-back of this is of course that expended (but rechargable) energy<BR>&gt; cells (or what have you) still have considerable weight, whereas the only<BR>&gt; wieght for a projectile weapon is the weight of empty magazines.&nbsp; One would<BR>&gt; imagine that the ratio of 'dead weight', if you will, for energy weapons<BR>&gt; will almost certainly be greater than for projectile weapons (be these<BR>&gt; either magzine fed or belt fed).&nbsp; This probably doesn't matter for vehicle<BR>&gt; mounts (especially given that running a vehicle will allow the energy cells<BR>&gt; to be constantly topped up), but certainly will matter for personnel-carried<BR>&gt; weapons.<BR><BR>All this assuming that energy weapons are really as reliable, effective and<BR>lethal as projectile weapons.&nbsp; Good points though.&nbsp; I mention the logistical<BR>point in an earlier post. I certainly does change things.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 10:50:04 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>on 2/2/01 4:57 AM, Steven Hudson at shudson@lightspeed.ca wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; ...<BR>&gt;&gt; firefights occur at, although for some reason 300 meters or so keeps running<BR>&gt;&gt; through my brain.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; IIRC, that's the maximum range of bows in _Warhamster_ :&gt;<BR><BR>That is also the result published in the little know Johns Hopkins report<BR>with the catchy title of "Operational Requirements for Infantry Hand<BR>Weapons".&nbsp; Based on after action reports in WWII and Korea, it was<BR>determined that 90% of all small arms fire occurs at ranges of 300<BR>yards(meters) or less.&nbsp; In the European Theatre of Operations (ETO) the<BR>average range of small arms engagements was 75 yards.<BR><BR>Strangely, these number continue to hold true today, regardless of terrain<BR>(reports from the Arab/Israeli conflicts generate the same numbers.<BR><BR>The main factor is not rifle accuracy or power, but rather the rifleman's<BR>ability to identify a target to shoot at, due to camouflage, intervening<BR>terrain and the use of cover and concealment.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 10:54:03 -0800<BR>From: "Jeffrey Yin" &lt;jsyin@cats.ucsc.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Urgent: UWP Code and mapping question<BR><BR>A is both Naval and Scout bases, B is Naval Base and Way Station.<BR><BR>Jeffrey Yin<BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Andy Akins" &lt;andyakins@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Friday, February 02, 2001 9:53 AM<BR>Subject: Urgent: UWP Code and mapping question<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Ack...I'm busy doin some maps for Loren and I don't have my books handy:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What does a base code of A mean? Is it both Navy and Scouts (I thought<BR>that<BR>&gt; was B) - or is it something else?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; And if it is something else, what is the map symbol for it?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Thanks,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Andy Akins<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 11:07:57 -0800<BR>From: "James W. Brewer" &lt;jwbrewer@ucsd.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: : Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 04:57:29 -0800<BR>&gt;From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>&gt;...<BR>&gt;&gt;firefights occur at, although for some reason 300 meters or so <BR>keeps &gt;running<BR>&gt;&gt;through my brain.<BR>&gt;IIRC, that's the maximum range of bows in _Warhamster_ :&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; As far as range goes, there's a slight advantage on the part of the<BR>&gt;&gt;riflemen, if they're using something contemporary, like an M-16. If they're<BR>&gt;&gt;using M-14s or World War I rifles, I believe the difference in range favors<BR>&gt;&gt;the rifle squad quite a bit. Of course, massed archers would be a big, fat<BR>&gt;&gt;juicy target for the riflemen, while the riflemen (if they had a couple of<BR>&gt;&gt;brain cells to rub together between the lot of them) would likely <BR>spread &gt;&gt;out<BR>&gt;&gt;to cut down the effectiveness of the hail of arrows that their <BR>enemies &gt;would<BR>&gt;&gt;be sending their way.<BR>&gt;&gt;Heck, if you're not going to try and compare apples and oranges (as it<BR>&gt;were) then why are you even bothering to post to the TML? :|<BR>&gt;Yes, jokes aside, effective ranges should diverge massively if the<BR>&gt;same standards are used.<BR><BR>The US Army uses 300 meters as the normal maximum engagement distance with <BR>the M16 rifle because most soldiers can't engage targets effectively (hit a <BR>man sized target 50% of the time) past this due to eyesight and <BR>marksmanship problems.&nbsp; The USMC uses 500 meters as the maximum effective <BR>range and a friend who was a ranger in Vietnam made a kill at 800 <BR>meters.&nbsp; The ranges for massed volley fire would be considerably greater <BR>but unlikely to occur against enemies armed with modern weapons.<BR><BR>Jim Brewer<BR>jwbrewer@ucsd.edu<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 11:01:17 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Subsector maps needed<BR><BR>Greetings all,<BR><BR>I am hard at work on spinwardmarches.com, prepping it to hold all that good<BR>landgrab data (or pointers thereto)..&nbsp; Right now I'm looking for some decent<BR>subsector maps to include.<BR><BR>I tried scanning them in from the deluxe set map, but they didn't look very<BR>good.<BR><BR>Illustrator format would be great, or anything that photoshop will import.<BR><BR>Thanks<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:08:52 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Subsector maps needed<BR><BR>Right now i am looking Closely at Rio in the chronor Subsector.<BR><BR>I have not seen it on the list as taken. however i am looking at the maps<BR>and will make a final decision this weekend.<BR><BR>i cant wait to do this this is going to be a blast 8)<BR><BR>Hasta<BR><BR>me<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Tod Glenn [mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com]<BR>Sent: Friday, February 02, 2001 11:01 AM<BR>To: TML<BR>Subject: Subsector maps needed<BR><BR><BR>Greetings all,<BR><BR>I am hard at work on spinwardmarches.com, prepping it to hold all that good<BR>landgrab data (or pointers thereto)..&nbsp; Right now I'm looking for some decent<BR>subsector maps to include.<BR><BR>I tried scanning them in from the deluxe set map, but they didn't look very<BR>good.<BR><BR>Illustrator format would be great, or anything that photoshop will import.<BR><BR>Thanks<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:28:05 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: John Fox &lt;jfox@verity.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Subsector maps needed<BR><BR>&nbsp; Knowing William, he will probably have the home world called Texas, the moon <BR>call Okie and the rest of the stuff called "Those other little states and <BR>countries". <BR>&nbsp; In addition the official music of Texas will be Country and Western and the <BR>heroine will be Tamie Winet.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Of course they will all eat beef chili and other fixens.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; JWF<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; <BR>&gt; From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>&gt; To: "'traveller@lists.ient.com'" &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Subsector maps needed<BR>&gt; Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 11:08:52 -0800 <BR>&gt; MIME-Version: 1.0<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Right now i am looking Closely at Rio in the chronor Subsector.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I have not seen it on the list as taken. however i am looking at the maps<BR>&gt; and will make a final decision this weekend.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; i cant wait to do this this is going to be a blast 8)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Hasta<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; me<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Tod Glenn [mailto:webmaster@travellercentral.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: Friday, February 02, 2001 11:01 AM<BR>&gt; To: TML<BR>&gt; Subject: Subsector maps needed<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Greetings all,<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I am hard at work on spinwardmarches.com, prepping it to hold all that good<BR>&gt; landgrab data (or pointers thereto)..&nbsp; Right now I'm looking for some decent<BR>&gt; subsector maps to include.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I tried scanning them in from the deluxe set map, but they didn't look very<BR>&gt; good.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Illustrator format would be great, or anything that photoshop will import.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Thanks<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Tod<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt; "There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>&gt; They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>&gt; -- <BR>&gt; Tod L Glenn<BR>&gt; webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>&gt; http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>&gt; http://www.solsec.org<BR>&gt; http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>&gt; http://travellerguns.com<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 14:33:29 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Ahetowa<BR><BR>Will someone who has Challenge 56 (my copy is still in a storage locker 1100 <BR>miles away) please check and see if there are any illustrations accompanying <BR>the article? I need scans of them ASAP.<BR><BR>Loren Wiseman<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 19:52:22 +0000<BR>From: Paul Campbell &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ahetowa<BR><BR>On Fri, Feb 02, 2001 at 02:33:29PM -0500, GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>&gt; Will someone who has Challenge 56 (my copy is still in a storage locker 1100 <BR>&gt; miles away) please check and see if there are any illustrations accompanying <BR>&gt; the article? I need scans of them ASAP.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Loren Wiseman<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Contact: Ahetaowa<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; ^<BR><BR>There is a single full page b/w pic by Dell Harris (loved his stuff).<BR>The picture is of a tall, 12' bent nearly double, Ahetaowa apparently<BR>'talking' to an Aslan with the tentacles it it's top,<BR><BR>The picture is partly obscured by the article banner about a third of<BR>the page down, 2" high.&nbsp; I could scan it, but it would be tomorrow<BR>morning (UK time) if I popped into work (say in about 13-14 hours).<BR>Can anyone else bet me?<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Paul Campbell (Sourceforge) &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>GPG Key fingerprint = 9C4F 31A3 8814 9F94 A533 A979 E63F 0C69 A771 0F24<BR>http://www.kemitix.uklinux.net<BR>jupiter: 7:43pm up 24 days, 9:23, 3 users, load average: 0.07, 0.20, 0.17<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 19:58:12 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Vargr Scout<BR><BR>Does someone have the GT stats for the ship from AM3? It wasn't included in <BR>GT: AR1....<BR><BR>Mike&lt;---- Non Gearhead type :-)<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 21:07:06 +0100<BR>From: Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ahetowa<BR><BR>On Friday, February 02, 2001, 8:33:29 PM, the following was written:<BR><BR>Gac&gt; Will someone who has Challenge 56 (my copy is still in a storage locker 1100 <BR>Gac&gt; miles away) please check and see if there are any illustrations accompanying <BR>Gac&gt; the article? I need scans of them ASAP.<BR><BR>Yes, an Aslan with a box and an Ahetaowa.<BR>Ill send you a scan today...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 21:08:51 +0100<BR>From: Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ahetowa<BR><BR>On Friday, February 02, 2001, 8:33:29 PM, the following was written:<BR><BR>Gac&gt; Will someone who has Challenge 56 (my copy is still in a storage locker 1100 <BR>Gac&gt; miles away) please check and see if there are any illustrations accompanying <BR>Gac&gt; the article? I need scans of them ASAP.<BR><BR>Yes, an Aslan with a box and an Ahetaowa.<BR>Ill send you a scan today...<BR>In what quality do you need it?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:16:27 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Question.....<BR><BR>"David C. Broussard" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; You mean apart from the fact that every time you fire it you will have to<BR>&gt; &gt; remember exactly what G world/area you are in aX-Mozilla-Status:<BR>&gt; &gt; 0009point.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; FGMP-15 it's the only way to be sure :-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; If you have to make a slug thrower that will be used in varying gravity, you<BR>&gt; simply have adjustable sights.&nbsp; An advanced slug thrower would have<BR>&gt; automatically adjustable sights.&nbsp; Such things are possible now...but not<BR>&gt; used because zeroing a slug thrower is very easy, and most importantly at<BR>&gt; the distances slug throwers are used...the variance of the drop is very very<BR>&gt; slight.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; DCB<BR>&gt; David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>&gt; ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>I don't disagree, but the difference in gravity between 0.5G and 2G will make a<BR>significant difference to WHERE you hit the target - not too good if you want to<BR>exit some being with the first shot and it just takes his jaw (or mandibles)<BR>off.<BR><BR>And i would contest the fact that slug throwers are used over short distances.<BR>I fully agree that the majority of modern armed (and i am thinking military here<BR>not downtown!!) exchanges are from about 50m out to a couple of hundred.&nbsp; But<BR>that doesn't stop the fact that these weapons (remember we are talking 1950/1960<BR>technology) are still lethal (and effective) out to much longer ranges.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:17:19 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Azhanti HL<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; on 28/1/01 9:03 pm, Simon Brodie at mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk<BR>&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; I hope this new reprinting of the CT books hasn't dropped the value of<BR>&gt; &gt; my lovely (virtually mint) AHL<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &lt;listens carefully for any noises of envy&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Perhaps it will be worth more if you post this a few more times? :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Gordon.<BR><BR>you think?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:24:32 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Azhanti HL<BR><BR>Michael Houghton wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Howdy!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; I hope this new reprinting of the CT books hasn't dropped the value of<BR>&gt; &gt; my lovely (virtually mint) AHL<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &lt;listens carefully for any noises of envy&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Si<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; You suck!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; yours,<BR>&gt; Michael<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt; Michael and MJ Houghton&nbsp;&nbsp; | Herveus d'Ormonde and Megan O'Donnelly<BR>&gt; herveus@radix.net&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | White Wolf and the Phoenix<BR>&gt; Bowie, MD, USA&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; | Tablet and Inkle bands, and other stuff<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | http://www.radix.net/~herveus/<BR><BR>Thank you.&nbsp; My life is no longer a meaningless sea of impotence and<BR>non-acheivement.<BR><BR>:-)<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:40:44 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>Megan Robertson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I am currently rewriting the 'System Resources' pages for the RPGA UK<BR>&gt; website (a job their webmaster has passed on to me, someone must have told<BR>&gt; him I write websites for a living, drat!); and there will naturally be a<BR>&gt; page devoted to TRAVELLER<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mexal.<BR><BR>This seems like an opportune moment for me a lowly helper to the RD in South<BR>Wales (that's in the UK to all you Americans &lt;grin&gt;) to remind all of you to<BR>join the RPGA.&nbsp; Go to the site and join or do it at a con or from a leaflet in<BR>a magazine but JOIN.<BR><BR>The RPGA is there to support your hobby (i know the word hobby doesn't convey<BR>our love for RPGs but i thought the work life was a wee bit pretentious).&nbsp; and<BR>for those of you in the UK, i hope you are all bits members (British Isles<BR>Traveller Support).&nbsp; 5 gets you life membership with frequent magazines and a<BR>second-hand sales brochure every few months.&nbsp; The web site is at www.bits.org<BR>i think.<BR><BR>BITS it's the only way to be sure.<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:49:36 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR>William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Here is a hypothetical for you guys.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; if you could go back in time and Slap the design Documments down for say the<BR>&gt; new f-22 in front of John and wilbur Wright. what do you think they would<BR>&gt; get from looking at them?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Bill<BR><BR>Absolutely nothing.&nbsp; They had only a rudimentary grasp on Aerodynamics and<BR>forces of flight and were looking to design a stable platform to allow flight.<BR>3rd/4th&nbsp; generation fighter ac are designed by computer to be inherently<BR>unstable and require computers in order to fly at all.&nbsp; This makes them<BR>incredibly responsive, agile and manoeuvrable.&nbsp; Also they have been designed to<BR>provide a modicum of stealth due to layout and shape (and many other nice 'pixie<BR>dust' inventions i do not intend to discuss).&nbsp; These again have taken the Raptor<BR>further away from a 'conventional' monocoque constructed, mid bodied monoplane<BR>(3 aspects the wrights had neither heard off or would have though possible<BR>methinks), they would not apart from a basic wing structure, resemble what the<BR>Wright brother's would conceive as being an aeronautical machine.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3590<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xb02.mx.aol.com (rly-xb02.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.103]) by air-xb01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Fri, 02 Feb 2001 15:26:36 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xb02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 02 Feb 2001 15:26:19 1900<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id PAA12614;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 2 Feb 2001 15:25:36 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 2 Feb 2001 15:25:12 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id PAA12508<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 2 Feb 2001 15:25:12 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 15:25:12 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102022025.PAA12508@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3590<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3591</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/2/01 3:32:54 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, February 2 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3591<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>Re : Urgent: UWP Code and mapping question<BR>RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Another question...<BR>Re: Errrr, am I missing something?<BR>Re: [TML] Questions [OT]<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: Gearhead question<BR>Re: non-IISS xboat systems (was: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players)<BR>RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>Re: [Website Review] Traveller Core Route Maps<BR>Origins<BR>RE: Origins<BR>Subsector Names<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: [TML] TNE [FILK]<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 22:28:47 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>Ray Rangel wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; To be sure, the discussion has been interesting.<BR><BR><BIG snip><BR><BR>Ah an engineer speaks at last (or i hope you are from your eloquent and spot on<BR>reply).&nbsp; Only thing you missed is that energy weapons (specifically lasers) are<BR>very hard to dodge (speed of light and all that stuff).<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 14:48:57 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>- -Ah an engineer speaks at last (or i hope you are from your eloquent and<BR>spot on<BR>reply).&nbsp; Only thing you missed is that energy weapons (specifically lasers)<BR>are<BR>very hard to dodge (speed of light and all that stuff).-<BR><BR>So are Projectiles moving at anything faster than 200 Meters per<BR>second...Especially if they are moving over 1000 Meters per second. It's<BR>hard to outrun a bullet if you are a soldier on foot.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 14:58:39 -0600<BR>From: "Andy Akins" &lt;andyakins@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR>Mark F. Cook &lt;markc@peak.org&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; Everybody seems to be really happy with the Beowulf deckplans.&nbsp; I wish<BR>&gt; I'd done 'em! "^)&nbsp; I think the bulk of the deckplans for all the recent<BR>SJG<BR>&gt; supplements have been generated by either Andy Akins or myself.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What I wanna know is when Andy is going to do a set like the Beowulf<BR>&gt; (and on the same scale) for AHL! :^)<BR><BR>Just wanna be clear - in case anyone was wondering - I didn't do the<BR>Beowulf. I don't know who did - someone at SJG I suppose. I agree with<BR>Mark - I wish I _had_ done them - they do appear to be real popular. Of<BR>course I'm hoping the Cutter deckplans will be popular as well - but it can<BR>be said I have a bias :)<BR><BR>Although otherwise I believe Mark is right. While Jesse may be the<BR>render-king (all hail his majesty), Mark and I have done most (if not all)<BR>of the recent Deckplans.<BR><BR>As far as a AHL set of plans at the packet-scale.......dear lord!!! How many<BR>pages would that end up to be???<BR><BR>Not that I wouldn't like it, mind you :)<BR><BR>&nbsp; Andy<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 21:00:16 -0000<BR>From: "Peter Scarrott" &lt;peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re : Urgent: UWP Code and mapping question<BR><BR>A - Imperial Naval and Scout Bases<BR><BR>B - Imperial Naval Base and Scout Way Station<BR><BR>Andy Akins asked<BR>&gt;Ack...I'm busy doin some maps for Loren and I don't have my books handy:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What does a base code of A mean? Is it both Navy and Scouts (I thought that<BR>&gt;was B) - or is it something else?<BR><BR>Though I bet someone else answered first :-(<BR><BR>Peter<BR>http://www.myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk (Trav &amp; AD&amp;D)<BR>peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR><BR>IMTU: tc+ tm tn++ t4- ru+ !3i+ c+ jt- au- ls ta- hi++ ith++ va+ as- so&nbsp; zh+<BR>vi-<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; And life is harsh and rarely fair.<BR><BR>Never appeal to a man's 'better nature.'&nbsp; He may not have one.<BR>Lazarus Long, Time Enough For Love (By Robert.Heinlan)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 13:05:13 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR>I think Loren said that an AHL would be approximately 50-55 pages :D&nbsp; I'm<BR>game if you're game ;)<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Andy Akins<BR>&gt; Sent: Friday, February 02, 2001 12:59 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mark F. Cook &lt;markc@peak.org&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Everybody seems to be really happy with the Beowulf deckplans.&nbsp; I wish<BR>&gt; &gt; I'd done 'em! "^)&nbsp; I think the bulk of the deckplans for all the recent<BR>&gt; SJG<BR>&gt; &gt; supplements have been generated by either Andy Akins or myself.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; What I wanna know is when Andy is going to do a set like the Beowulf<BR>&gt; &gt; (and on the same scale) for AHL! :^)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Just wanna be clear - in case anyone was wondering - I didn't do the<BR>&gt; Beowulf. I don't know who did - someone at SJG I suppose. I agree with<BR>&gt; Mark - I wish I _had_ done them - they do appear to be real popular. Of<BR>&gt; course I'm hoping the Cutter deckplans will be popular as well -<BR>&gt; but it can<BR>&gt; be said I have a bias :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Although otherwise I believe Mark is right. While Jesse may be the<BR>&gt; render-king (all hail his majesty), Mark and I have done most (if not all)<BR>&gt; of the recent Deckplans.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; As far as a AHL set of plans at the packet-scale.......dear<BR>&gt; lord!!! How many<BR>&gt; pages would that end up to be???<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Not that I wouldn't like it, mind you :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Andy<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 13:08:53 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>Matthew W. Helton writes:<BR><BR>&gt; So are Projectiles moving at anything faster than 200 Meters per<BR>&gt; second...Especially if they are moving over 1000 Meters per second. It's<BR>&gt; hard to outrun a bullet if you are a soldier on foot.<BR><BR>Actually, while deliberately dodging bullets is difficult, at least for a<BR>human, accidentally dodging bullets at long ranges isn't too difficult.<BR>At 500 meters, a human moving erratically is quite capable of not being<BR>where a rifle was aimed, even if you were correctly tracking for constant<BR>movement speed.&nbsp; However, practically speaking this only matters for snipers,<BR>under typical battlefield conditions other forms of inaccuracy are more <BR>important than the speed of the bullet.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 16:09:17 -0500<BR>From: michael stasica &lt;stosh@sympatico.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Another question...<BR><BR>Simon Brodie wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; William Lane wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; SNIP<BR><BR>&gt; Absolutely nothing.&nbsp; They had only a rudimentary grasp on Aerodynamics and<BR>&gt; forces of flight and were looking to design a stable platform to allow flight.<BR>&gt; 3rd/4th&nbsp; generation fighter ac are designed by computer to be inherently<BR>&gt; unstable and require computers in order to fly at all.&nbsp; This makes them<BR>&gt; incredibly responsive, agile and manoeuvrable.&nbsp; Also they have been designed to<BR><BR>This is not meant as a smart ass comment, but this feature could almost be looked at<BR><BR>as 'early' contra grav W/O Fusion power in a TL discussion.<BR><BR>Michael<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 08:17:44 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Errrr, am I missing something?<BR><BR>Hans Rancke-Madsen wrote:<BR>&gt; They're still TL 0. A society does not have to have all possible<BR>&gt; technologies associated with its TL.<BR><BR>I tend to use TLs to mean that a given society *does* have the ability<BR>to produce all the items of technology associated with a given TL.&nbsp; At<BR>least, all the ones a traveller would be interested in.&nbsp; Of course,<BR>most worlds have access to the scientific theories appropriate to<BR>TL15, even if they can't build the items.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; A TL just means "They have at least some of the stuff belonging to a<BR>&gt; TL and nothing better".<BR><BR>IMTU, every world I've detailed so far has some stuff of higher TL<BR>than their overall (UWP) TL.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 14:28:08 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: [TML] Questions [OT]<BR><BR>Jonathan McDermott wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; <BR><BR>&gt; Since we know Loren can't be moved by whining, does anybody have any <BR>&gt; idea what his price is?*&nbsp; Maybe a teddy groat for Valentine's Day...? =)<BR><BR>Oh Eeeeeewwwwwww!!! That brought, unbidden, to mind a picture of <BR>livestock in lingere!<BR><BR>I really don't think that would be Loren's price.<BR><BR>Bruce the sigless<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 08:34:56 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; And 130 watts will take over 2 hours to produce 1 MJ of<BR>&gt; energy. That's *one* shot from a *weak* laser.<BR><BR>Are you sure you're not confusing kilojoules with megajoules?&nbsp; Even if<BR>the lasers use a single pulse rather than a pulse stream, 1 MJ is the<BR>energy of explosion of a quarter-kilogram of TNT.&nbsp; At the least, it<BR>would cause a surface explosion sufficient to blow a person in half.<BR>Hardly a "weak" laser.<BR><BR>On the other hand, a 1 kJ pulse train seems likely to be enough to put<BR>a possibly fatal hole in a person.&nbsp; Very likely near the lower limit<BR>though.&nbsp; It sounds about right for "one shot from a *weak* laser".<BR>Allowing for some inefficiency and for a good margin of effectiveness,<BR>10 kJ per shot should be quite effective.<BR><BR>(Of course, real-life pulsed lasers that would fit into a hand weapon<BR>are nearly 3 orders or magnitude weaker.&nbsp; There's a *lot* of<BR>technology needed before we get Traveller-level lasers, if they are<BR>ever useful at all)<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 08:48:53 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Gearhead question<BR><BR>Gerry Harris wrote:<BR>&gt; In FF&amp;S, I want to strap a rocket onto a wheeled vehicle.&nbsp; How do I<BR>&gt; determine the power-to-weight ratio (which is usually given in<BR>&gt; MW/tonnes) and thus the speed of the hybrid vehicle?<BR><BR>I don't have FF&amp;S, but I believe GURPS Vehicles is based on similar<BR>principles.&nbsp; In general, power = force * velocity.&nbsp; How does FF&amp;S<BR>determine top speed from power/mass?&nbsp; Just replace "power" in the<BR>formula with "thrust * topspeed", and rearrange to get top speed.<BR><BR>Make sure that the units are consistent: if thrust is in newtons, and<BR>speed in metres/second, then power should be in watts.&nbsp; Use the<BR>appropriate multipliers if you're using inconsistent units.<BR><BR>If this is impractical (e.g. if there is no formula, just a table),<BR>you could approximate by giving a rocket an "effective" power.&nbsp; For<BR>example, thrust * 1 km/s (again, convert units as appropriate).<BR><BR>Just out of curiosity, does FF&amp;S make the same mistake as GURPS in<BR>neglecting aerodynamic drag when calculating top speeds for ground<BR>vehicles?&nbsp; Power/weight should really only be relevant to calculation<BR>of acceleration.&nbsp; You can get some really weird top speeds as a<BR>consequence.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 16:50:08 -0500<BR>From: "Rob Davenport" &lt;rgd@ohio.voyager.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: non-IISS xboat systems (was: Re: Anyone ever list geograpy locals of players)<BR><BR>On 30 Jan 2001, at 14:34, Steven Hudson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;regard.&nbsp; Are there corporate routes/services?&nbsp; Local governmental<BR>&gt; &gt;services (within the 3I)?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; "No" &amp; "correct" for the first two. IMTU there are corporate routes<BR>&gt; and/or services; as for local government, what does that mean within<BR>&gt; the Imperium? I'd say yes, and use that as a partial hand-wave if I<BR>&gt; wanted to use some of the goofy X-Boat routes that have been listed.<BR><BR>Hmm - how did the x-boat routes arise again? A purely Imperial <BR>government function?&nbsp; Or would/did they parcel out routes to commercial <BR>interests as the post office does today, and did in the U.S. Old West?<BR><BR>Would some megacorps want their own private system for moving their own<BR>personnel, information, and inventory?&nbsp; For security,&nbsp; or efficiency if <BR>they have better ships/equipment or the IISS doesn't go where they need <BR>to go.<BR><BR>I would imagine the corporate routes would of course follow their <BR>interests, going between major regional operations centers out to the <BR>field offices, etc.&nbsp; Different motives and influences behind routing<BR>decisions than the 3I.&nbsp; (Great, now I want to map out the major <BR>megacorp routes...)<BR><BR>Do financial institutions IYTU use the IISS x-boat system or a <BR>commercial system, or their own?&nbsp; If trade is the lifeblood of the<BR>Imperium, who carries the vital financial information?<BR>If it's not the IISS, I'd suppose that the routes for official <BR>financial information would be fast and well-protected.&nbsp; The wealthy <BR>protect their wealth.<BR><BR>I suppose all this depends on the density of the region in question.&nbsp; <BR>If it is sparsely populated (cf. U.S. Old West; e.g. Spinward Marches), <BR>there may be no other choice than the X-Boat system.&nbsp; If it's dense, <BR>(cf. modern New York City, e.g. Core), there may be a lot of choices.<BR><BR>(Sorry I'm just thinking out loud, I may not be adding anything useful<BR>at this point. :)<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;But wouldn't there be inter/intra-sector, -subsector, and -world <BR>&gt; &gt;systems that run with increasing frequency as the distance diminishes?<BR>&gt; &gt;Two worlds 1pc apart with moderately large intertwined economies <BR>&gt; &gt;might have a service that runs between them every day or even hour. <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Agree - even more so for heretics who allow sub-100 Dt starships.<BR><BR>To answer my own question - I could see such non-IISS routes more in<BR>denser, older parts of the Imperium.<BR><BR>I guess I keep thinking of the Imperium (or the Marches in particular<BR>where my group gamed) as more dense and, say, continental/developed, <BR>than it may be viewed by everyone else.&nbsp; I suppose that's because the <BR>other GMs tended to have a *very* efficient Imperial police force that <BR>would catch PCs for violations of weapons ordinances or 'adventurous <BR>activity' and whisk them off to jail.&nbsp; It's kind of soured them on<BR>Traveller for a long while and I'm trying to come up with a view of <BR>the Imperium and it's regions that might be more fun for them to play <BR>in.<BR><BR>Rambling on,<BR><BR>Rob<BR>- --<BR>Rob<BR><BR>'Lottery: A tax on people who are bad at math.'<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 13:49:07 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>Where exactly can i fiind this under the JTAS site. i went in but im not<BR>sure what sub header the chat logs are listed under.<BR><BR>Hasta<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: Jesse Degraff [mailto:jedegraf@cisco.com]<BR>Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 5:08 PM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR><BR>I can truthfully say [fnord]&nbsp; (Hint; if you're a JTAS subscriber go through<BR>the log from the 25 January 2001 chat, if it's up yet).<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of William Lane<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 4:46 PM<BR>&gt; To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Thanks Jesse,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Ordered.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; are they going to produce a scout ship the same way some day?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hasta me<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Jesse Degraff [mailto:jedegraf@cisco.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 4:25 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hi Bill,<BR>&gt; SJG's Traveller site is:<BR>&gt; http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; When you go into the product listings and click on an entry, you'll see a<BR>&gt; little "In Print&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Click Here to Order!" section under the<BR>&gt; title.&nbsp; Click<BR>&gt; there (duh! ;) and it'll take you to the Warehouse 23 section for that<BR>&gt; product.&nbsp; You can order directly from there if your FLGS can't get 'em or<BR>&gt; find 'em.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Best,<BR>&gt; Jesse<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>&gt; deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>&gt; -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; &gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; &gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of William Lane<BR>&gt; &gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 3:17 PM<BR>&gt; &gt; To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Can someone give me the URL to get the deck plans to this ship. i<BR>&gt; &gt; know they<BR>&gt; &gt; have been published. however i cant remember where i saw them<BR>&gt; and my local<BR>&gt; &gt; game store cant find them.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; any help would be appreciated.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 13:55:21 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR>It's under the Brubek's section, scroll down a bit to "Logs".&nbsp; Here's the<BR>exact link:<BR>http://jtas.sjgames.com/login/chatlogs/2001/01.25.html<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of William Lane<BR>&gt; Sent: Friday, February 02, 2001 1:49 PM<BR>&gt; To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Jesse<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Where exactly can i fiind this under the JTAS site. i went in but im not<BR>&gt; sure what sub header the chat logs are listed under.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hasta<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Jesse Degraff [mailto:jedegraf@cisco.com]<BR>&gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 5:08 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I can truthfully say [fnord]&nbsp; (Hint; if you're a JTAS subscriber<BR>&gt; go through<BR>&gt; the log from the 25 January 2001 chat, if it's up yet).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Jesse<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>&gt; deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>&gt; -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; &gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; &gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of William Lane<BR>&gt; &gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 4:46 PM<BR>&gt; &gt; To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Thanks Jesse,<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Ordered.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; are they going to produce a scout ship the same way some day?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Hasta me<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; &gt; From: Jesse Degraff [mailto:jedegraf@cisco.com]<BR>&gt; &gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 4:25 PM<BR>&gt; &gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; &gt; Subject: RE: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Hi Bill,<BR>&gt; &gt; SJG's Traveller site is:<BR>&gt; &gt; http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/traveller/<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; When you go into the product listings and click on an entry,<BR>&gt; you'll see a<BR>&gt; &gt; little "In Print&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Click Here to Order!" section under the<BR>&gt; &gt; title.&nbsp; Click<BR>&gt; &gt; there (duh! ;) and it'll take you to the Warehouse 23 section for that<BR>&gt; &gt; product.&nbsp; You can order directly from there if your FLGS can't<BR>&gt; get 'em or<BR>&gt; &gt; find 'em.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Best,<BR>&gt; &gt; Jesse<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; "They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>&gt; &gt; deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>&gt; &gt; -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of William Lane<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Sent: Thursday, February 01, 2001 3:17 PM<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; To: 'traveller@lists.ient.com'<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Subject: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Can someone give me the URL to get the deck plans to this ship. i<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; know they<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; have been published. however i cant remember where i saw them<BR>&gt; &gt; and my local<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; game store cant find them.<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; any help would be appreciated.<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 16:59:32 EST<BR>From: JimVassila@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: [Website Review] Traveller Core Route Maps<BR><BR>- --part1_5c.6b0ba3f.27ac87c4_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR>Cliff writes:<BR>&gt; Until Jim Vassilakos releases the Galactic 2.4 Rev C patch, or<BR>&gt; allows me to put the patch on my website, I do not recommend that you or<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Cliff, as long as the patch seems to be working okay, go ahead and post it on <BR>your website so that people can see your handiwork in all its glory :-)<BR><BR>BTW, does anyone know how to get AOL60 to send just text mail rather than <BR>this gibberish which is coming out at the bottom of my TML posts? (Must get <BR>linux box hooked up before I go crazy)<BR><BR><BR>- --part1_5c.6b0ba3f.27ac87c4_boundary<BR>Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII"<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT size=2>Cliff writes:<BR><BR>&lt;BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px"&gt;Until Jim Vassilakos releases the Galactic 2.4 Rev C patch, or<BR><BR>allows me to put the patch on my website, I do not recommend that you or<BR><BR>anyone uploads all of the Core Route sectors into Galactic at once.&lt;/BLOCKQUOTE&gt;<BR><BR><BR><BR>Cliff, as long as the patch seems to be working okay, go ahead and post it on <BR><BR>your website so that people can see your handiwork in all its glory :-)<BR><BR><BR><BR>BTW, does anyone know how to get AOL60 to send just text mail rather than <BR><BR>this gibberish which is coming out at the bottom of my TML posts? (Must get <BR><BR>linux box hooked up before I go crazy)<BR><BR></FONT><BR><BR>- --part1_5c.6b0ba3f.27ac87c4_boundary--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 15:01:23 -0600<BR>From: "Andy Akins" &lt;andyakins@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Origins<BR><BR>Hey, I realize its 6 months away, but...<BR><BR>I'm going to be attending my first major convention this year - Origins in<BR>Columbus OH. Just wondering if any other TMLs frequent this con...it would<BR>be spiffy to meet some people, in between getting thrashed in the Babylon 5<BR>Wars games (I love the game, but I don't get to play it often, so my<BR>expectations of beating die-hard players is rather low...)<BR><BR>Just curious...<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Andy<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 14:20:19 -0800<BR>From: "Jesse Degraff" &lt;jedegraf@cisco.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Origins<BR><BR>Wasn't on my list of major out-of-state cons to try and hit (DragonCon &amp;<BR>GenCon), but ya' never know ;)<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>"They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety<BR>deserve neither liberty nor safety."<BR>- -Benjamin Franklin, Historical Review of Pennsylvania, 1759<BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Andy Akins<BR>&gt; Sent: Friday, February 02, 2001 1:01 PM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Origins<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Hey, I realize its 6 months away, but...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'm going to be attending my first major convention this year - Origins in<BR>&gt; Columbus OH. Just wondering if any other TMLs frequent this con...it would<BR>&gt; be spiffy to meet some people, in between getting thrashed in the<BR>&gt; Babylon 5<BR>&gt; Wars games (I love the game, but I don't get to play it often, so my<BR>&gt; expectations of beating die-hard players is rather low...)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Just curious...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Andy<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 14:26:59 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Don Roberts &lt;tne1201@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Subsector Names<BR><BR>I was wondering if anyone has a list of "canon"<BR>subsector names or knows where I can get one via the<BR>web or e-mail<BR><BR>thanks.<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 14:29:54 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Timothy Little writes:<BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; And 130 watts will take over 2 hours to produce 1 MJ of<BR>&gt; &gt; energy. That's *one* shot from a *weak* laser.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Are you sure you're not confusing kilojoules with megajoules?&nbsp; Even if<BR>&gt; the lasers use a single pulse rather than a pulse stream, 1 MJ is the<BR>&gt; energy of explosion of a quarter-kilogram of TNT.&nbsp; At the least, it<BR>&gt; would cause a surface explosion sufficient to blow a person in half.<BR>&gt; Hardly a "weak" laser.<BR><BR>Well, it's weak in an anti-vehicle role, or for that matter for making holes<BR>in anything with any degree of armor.&nbsp; Traveller for reasons I'm not 100%<BR>sure of assumes that focusing 1 MJ onto 1 cm^2 won't penetrate more than 2<BR>cm steel, which is somewhere around 8x the actual heat of vaporization of<BR>steel, but I suppose the actual hole is a bit larger.<BR><BR>Against unarmored targets, 1 kilojoule would probably blow a nasty crater in<BR>skin, but that's only enough energy to vaporize 0.4 grams of water, so it<BR>won't produce any deep wounds.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 18:25:41 EST<BR>From: "Michael A. Hoxie" &lt;ludowick@juno.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: [TML] TNE [FILK]<BR><BR>Jonathan McDermott wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Why, yes... that makes sense!&nbsp; In fact... he's in a white <BR>&gt;room....&nbsp; (Danger, Will Robinson!&nbsp; The tone-deaf Muse has<BR>&gt;reawakened....)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;BLACK CURTAIN<BR>&gt;===== =======<BR>&gt;(from: "White Room" by Jack Bruce and Pete Brown<BR><BR>&lt;snip shnazzy "White Room" filk&gt;<BR><BR>A good one!&nbsp; I'm a big fan of Cream (Clapton peaked early, IMHO).<BR><BR>Ludowick <BR><BR>________________________________________________________________<BR>GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO!<BR>Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less!<BR>Join Juno today!&nbsp; For your FREE software, visit:<BR>http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3591<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yb01.mx.aol.com (rly-yb01.mail.aol.com [172.18.146.1]) by air-yb04.mail.aol.com (v77_r1.21) with ESMTP; Fri, 02 Feb 2001 18:32:54 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yb01.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 02 Feb 2001 18:32:21 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id SAA20847;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 2 Feb 2001 18:26:38 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 2 Feb 2001 18:26:21 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id SAA20772<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 2 Feb 2001 18:26:21 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 18:26:21 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102022326.SAA20772@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3591<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BIG></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3592</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/2/01 7:13:32 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Friday, February 2 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3592<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>spinwardmarches.com<BR>Re: spinwardmarches.com<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Rio<BR>Re: Errrr, am I missing something?<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>re: Technology Marches On: NeuroTransmitter-Controlled <BR>RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: Ahetowa<BR>[www] 04 Feb 2001 - Freelance Traveller Updated<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Archers vs Rifles<BR>TNE Info<BR>Re: Questions<BR>Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 15:26:25 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: spinwardmarches.com<BR><BR>All landgrab and other interested parties.&nbsp; I have begun the sector databse<BR>for all worlds in the spinward marches.&nbsp; I will be including all canon data<BR>and links or data from the respective landgrabees.&nbsp; Just the shell now, but<BR>take a look at http://www.spinwardmarches.com<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 15:59:02 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Tim Mac &lt;satelism@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: spinwardmarches.com<BR><BR>Looks very nice and CLEAN. I like that!<BR>Now if I could just get back into a game myself...<BR><BR>- --- Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; All landgrab and other interested parties.&nbsp; I have<BR>&gt; begun the sector databse<BR>&gt; for all worlds in the spinward marches.&nbsp; I will be<BR>&gt; including all canon data<BR>&gt; and links or data from the respective landgrabees. <BR>&gt; Just the shell now, but<BR>&gt; take a look at http://www.spinwardmarches.com<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Tod<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt; "There are men in all ages who mean to govern well,<BR>&gt; but they mean to govern.<BR>&gt; They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be<BR>&gt; masters."<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -Daniel<BR>&gt; Webster<BR>&gt; -- <BR>&gt; Tod L Glenn<BR>&gt; webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>&gt; http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>&gt; http://www.solsec.org<BR>&gt; http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>&gt; http://travellerguns.com<BR>&gt; <BR><BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 11:13:30 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Anthony Jackson wrote:<BR>[...1 MJ lasers vs. 1 kJ lasers...]<BR>&gt; Well, it's weak in an anti-vehicle role, or for that matter for<BR>&gt; making holes in anything with any degree of armor.<BR><BR>Sure, if it was just used as a big dumb flashlight.&nbsp; With a properly<BR>timed and tuned pulse train, it could penetrate at least 10 cm of<BR>steel and do significant damage to things inside.<BR><BR>Besides, when were weapons capable of putting holes in armoured<BR>vehicles considered "weak" in terms of personal firearms for survival<BR>on a low-tech planet?<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Against unarmored targets, 1 kilojoule would probably blow a nasty<BR>&gt; crater in skin, but that's only enough energy to vaporize 0.4 grams<BR>&gt; of water, so it won't produce any deep wounds.<BR><BR>Again, using it only as a big dumb flashlight.&nbsp; There was recently a<BR>discussion on rec.arts.sf.science on the topic, with subject "Laser<BR>pistol EverReadys".&nbsp; It should be available on Deja, even in the<BR>site's current sorry state.<BR><BR>To summarise, the likely most efficient means of damaging people is by<BR>application of a rapid pulse train of high-power pulses.&nbsp; Each pulse<BR>blasts a small hole in the victim, creating a temporary cavity.&nbsp; The<BR>next pulse hits the back of the cavity while it's still expanding.<BR>Repeat a hundred times or so in the space of about a millisecond.<BR><BR>One big pulse makes a shallow surface wound.&nbsp; Lots of little pulses<BR>make a deep wound channel, more likely to reach vital areas.&nbsp; The<BR>damaging principle is not directly by vaporisation of tissue, but the<BR>tearing and breaking that results when extremely high pressure vapour<BR>expands on timescales of microseconds, constrained by surrounding<BR>tissues.<BR><BR>Think of it not as 0.4g of water slowly vapourised, but in terms of a<BR>small explosion along a line through the body, almost instantly<BR>producing ultra-high-pressure steam that tears flesh and breaks bone<BR>as it expands.&nbsp; The energy released (and peak pressures involved) are<BR>about the same as that of the propellant in a pistol round, only it<BR>happens inside the target instead of inside the firing chamber of a<BR>pistol.<BR><BR><BR>A similar principle would work on vehicles, although rigid materials<BR>like armour generally have energies of deformation much closer to<BR>their heats of vaporisation than body tissues do, so the difference<BR>would be less pronounced.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 16:15:08 -0800 <BR>From: William Lane &lt;wlane@Asera.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Rio<BR><BR>I am thinking of Doing the system of Rio in the Chronor Subsector.<BR><BR>the question i have is this. no matter what planet i use i need to know what<BR>Data besides what is in the books i got. Books 0-8 and supplements 1 -13 of<BR>CT. is there some way to search for information? a searchable database<BR>somewhere? I am guessing not. However I would like to ensure i got as much<BR>data as possible before beginning.<BR><BR>If anyone knows anything about this system please let me know. im going to<BR>scour my books looking for information.<BR><BR>thanks<BR><BR>Bill<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 14:57:46 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Errrr, am I missing something?<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Looking at First In's tech level descriptions, I'm sensing a problem here. <BR>&gt; Biological Science TL 0 includes "Useful animals and plants are <BR>&gt; domesticated".<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Soooo....<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; What are pure hunter-gatherers, without the foggiest notions that a plant or <BR>&gt; animal has uses besides being tracked down in the wilderness and berated <BR>&gt; with a pointed stick? Biological Tech Level negative one?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; There seems to be a similar problem with Environment TL 0 ("Primitive <BR>&gt; agriculture. Villages and towns")<BR><BR>The TLs cover a *range*. What's listed is the *max* item that's<BR>available. <BR><BR>So TL 0 covers the range from talking apes up to late Neolithic. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 14:36:39 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; And no, kevlar vests won't help. Hell, trauma plate will just mean that<BR>&gt;&gt; you get incapacitated by the arrows in the places that they *don't*<BR>&gt;&gt; protect (arms &amp; legs, for example).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; But arrows, unlike bullets, do not produce cavitation and hydrostatic shock.<BR>&gt; Ask any bow hunter about the likelihood of an instant kill using modern<BR>&gt; razor broadheads.&nbsp; Period iron arrowheads are far less efficient.&nbsp; Wounded<BR>&gt; soldiers will be able to return fire.<BR><BR>Bullets don't leave 40 inch shafts stuck thru your limbs or body<BR>either. Returning fire with arrows sticking out of you is not easy. <BR><BR>And I daresay that seeing that arrow sticking out of them will shock a<BR>"modern" soldier a lot more than a you may be accounting for. <BR><BR>They aren't going to be using razor broadheads, either. More likely<BR>something along the lines of a bodkin point. Which isn't that different<BR>from a "tent stake" type bayonet except in size.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; You can *only* make things go in the rifle's favor if you engage the<BR>&gt;&gt; archers from well beyond their max effective range. And that range<BR>&gt;&gt; (several hundred yards) is well beyond the range soldiers with rifles<BR>&gt;&gt; typically engage the enemy at.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The main reason most rifle fire takes place at less than 500 meters (80% at<BR>&gt; 300 meters or less) is because of 1) the inability of the soldier to see the<BR>&gt; target and 2) intervening terrain.&nbsp; True, semiautomatic fire from an average<BR>&gt; soldier is not great at long range, but you average rifleman is expected to<BR>&gt; be able to hit a man silhouette at 400 meters (500 meters if you are a<BR>&gt; marine).&nbsp; Add autofire and the fact that you are shooting at massed troops<BR>&gt; from cover and concealment, in the prone position, and it gets really ugly<BR>&gt; for the archers.<BR><BR>Well, the English longbowmen were except to hit *smaller* targets at<BR>ranges of over 100 yards. I actually expect that while the rifles will<BR>have a range advantage, it won't be as marked as you seem to think.<BR><BR>Also, if there *is* any sort of concealment available, the archers have<BR>the advantage, as their weapons are *very* "suppressed". :-)<BR><BR>&gt; The rifle company will take casualties, maybe, but that company of archers<BR>&gt; will be in pretty bad shape.<BR><BR>Depends a *lot* on the terrain and other variables.<BR><BR>&gt; Note that this doesn't even take into account the psychological effects of<BR>&gt; gunfire on the 'primitives'. Recall the before the invention of gunpowder,<BR>&gt; the loudest noise a yeoman ever heard was probably thunder.&nbsp; When guns were<BR>&gt; first introduced in battle, the noise probably had more effect on the enemy<BR>&gt; than the projectiles fired.<BR><BR>Unless this is "first contact", they'll know about guns. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 16:31:57 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Technology Marches On: NeuroTransmitter-Controlled <BR><BR>&gt;From: "D. Smart" &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Below are excerpts from a post on the Beyond 2000 website.<BR>&gt;The full story can be found at:<BR>&gt;http://www.beyond2000.com/news/Feb_01/story_1002.html<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;- -- quote --<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Imagine the pilot of your aircraft flying with no hands and<BR>&gt;without even being present in the cockpit. Sound like a<BR>&gt;recipe for disaster? NASA scientists have recently<BR>&gt;demonstrated the ability to control a 757 jet simulation,<BR>&gt;using only human muscle-nerve signals linked to a computer.<BR>&gt;The pilot jockeyed his machine simply by waving at it. <BR><BR>The Soviets developed this technology in the 1970s, and built a<BR>high-performance fighter around it.&nbsp; NATO code named the fighter<BR>"Firefox", in keeping with its two syllable "F" word code names (Foxbat,<BR>Frogger, and I forget the others).&nbsp; Clint Eastwood did an excellent<BR>documentary (entitled "Firefox") on how the US stole the technology from<BR>the Soviets.<BR><BR>The Soviets simply lacked the capital to deploy the technology<BR>effectively, and it never entered service on a large scale.&nbsp; In the United<BR>States, the manufacturers of traditional cockpit controls lobbied the Air<BR>Force heavily against adopting the new technology until they had squeezed<BR>every last drop of profit out of their then-current products.&nbsp; That has<BR>now been achieved, and we are going forward with the Firefox technology.<BR><BR>Incidentally, the Firefox technology makes a much smoother interface with<BR>the gravitic drives taken developed from the Gray ship that crashed at<BR>Roswell, but it tends to take a greater toll on pilot sanity.<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 00:25:43 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: WotC, Dune, CoC and GURPS Traveller<BR><BR>At 06:52 -0500 31/1/01,&nbsp; "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; 'Elric!' is a streamlined version of the same 'Basic Roleplaying'<BR>&gt; &gt; system that started as RuneQuest and was also used for<BR>&gt; &gt; Stormbringer, Call of Cthulhu, Ringworld, Nephilim, and every<BR>&gt; &gt; other Chaosium rpg (except Pendragon).&nbsp; Percentile-based,<BR>&gt; &gt; intuitive, and easy, but (as with anything percentile-based)<BR>&gt; &gt; tending to break down near the edges.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Such as when two people with skills of 50% try to beat each other up, and<BR>&gt;fail to hit each other for a very long time....<BR><BR>Well, if you look at it, every blow will result in a 25% chance of a <BR>hit (50% chance to hit x 50% chance of parry) which will damage. <BR>[Actually, this may not be exact as criticals and impales impact the <BR>success rates of parries].<BR><BR>Pretty average damage is D8+1 , which is 5.5 hit points average. <BR>Armour is typically around D6 points (leathers) although half plate <BR>is D8+1.<BR><BR>Elric! adds both major wounds (&gt; half total hit points in a single <BR>blow) which will incapacitate after a few rounds, culmulative minor <BR>wounds which will result in unconsciousness, and automatic <BR>unconsiousness at 2 HP. A typical adventurer will have 13.5 HP so 7hp <BR>total is enough to put them down.<BR><BR>The system as a result is a lot more free flowing (and deadly) than <BR>other versions of BRP - very polished and will organised. A really <BR>nice game.<BR><BR>Of course, to get a very fast and lethal ruleset for Traveller I <BR>recommend considering using the Blue Planet V2 rules...<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 00:29:58 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>At 15:36 -0500 31/1/01,&nbsp; "Douglas E. Berry" <BR>&lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;It depends.&nbsp; Since I am now making some money for writing GURPS Traveller,<BR>&gt;I am going to use the Shiny New Computer to start doing GURPS designs.&nbsp; It<BR>&gt;is rather frustating to do all these wonderful FFS2 ships that don't have a<BR>&gt;combat syatem attached.<BR><BR>MayDay M4.1 (PDF at BITS) is a working (AFAIK) T4 combat system for ships...<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 01:42:12 +0100<BR>From: Volker &lt;volker@greimann.de&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ahetowa<BR><BR>On Friday, February 02, 2001, 8:52:22 PM, the following was written:<BR><BR>PC&gt; On Fri, Feb 02, 2001 at 02:33:29PM -0500, GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Will someone who has Challenge 56 (my copy is still in a storage locker 1100 <BR>&gt;&gt; miles away) please check and see if there are any illustrations accompanying <BR>&gt;&gt; the article? I need scans of them ASAP.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Loren Wiseman<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR><BR>PC&gt; Contact: Ahetaowa<BR>PC&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ^<BR><BR>PC&gt; There is a single full page b/w pic by Dell Harris (loved his stuff).<BR>PC&gt; The picture is of a tall, 12' bent nearly double, Ahetaowa apparently<BR>PC&gt; 'talking' to an Aslan with the tentacles it it's top,<BR><BR>PC&gt; The picture is partly obscured by the article banner about a third of<BR>PC&gt; the page down, 2" high.&nbsp; I could scan it, but it would be tomorrow<BR>PC&gt; morning (UK time) if I popped into work (say in about 13-14 hours).<BR>PC&gt; Can anyone else bet me?<BR><BR><BR>Already did!<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 20:05:55 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: [www] 04 Feb 2001 - Freelance Traveller Updated<BR><BR>Freelance Traveller, the Electronic Fan-Supported Traveller Resource has<BR>posted its most recent update to http://come.to/FreelanceTraveller and<BR>http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/Default.htm.&nbsp; <BR><BR>In this update:<BR><BR>- Chapter eleven of _The_Hostile_Stars_, Fred Ramen's ongoing serial<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; story, has been posted to Raconteur's Rest. <BR><BR>- A whole new section on storyline questions, and minor updates to reflect<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; forthcoming SJG items, have been added to the FAQ. The FAQ can be found<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; in the Information Center.<BR><BR>- Updates to Traveller on the Internet to reflect added web sites,<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; reported site address changes, and the conversion of eGroups to Yahoo!<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; Groups.<BR><BR>Your questions, comments, and ideas are always welcome at Freelance<BR>Traveller.&nbsp; Please write to freelancetraveller@yahoo.com with any and all<BR>of them, as we are in the process of reconfiguring the forms, and they may<BR>be temporarily disabled.&nbsp; Freelance Traveller depends on the good will of<BR>Traveller fans both to visit our site and justify our existence, and to<BR>write for us, making our existence possible.<BR><BR>Freelance Traveller is mirrored at http://w3.execnet.com/jeffz.<BR><BR>Freelance Traveller wishes to extend its thanks and appreciation to The<BR>Traveller Downport (http://www.downport.com) and to Executive Network<BR>Information Systems (http://www.execnet.com) for hosting services. Without<BR>organizations willing to cooperate with Freelance Traveller's ever-growing<BR>needs, we would be unable to bring you the articles and other resources<BR>that have made Freelance Traveller one of the premier Traveller sites on<BR>the 'net.<BR><BR><BR>Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture <BR>Enterprises, 1977-2000.&nbsp; Use of the trademark in <BR>this notice and in the referenced materials is not <BR>intended to infringe or devalue the trademark.<BR><BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin, Editor<BR>Freelance Traveller - The Electronic Fan-Supported Traveller Resource<BR>http://come.to/FreelanceTraveller<BR>http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/Default.htm<BR>freelancetraveller@yahoo.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 17:04:35 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Timothy Little writes:<BR><BR>&gt; Sure, if it was just used as a big dumb flashlight.&nbsp; With a properly<BR>&gt; timed and tuned pulse train, it could penetrate at least 10 cm of<BR>&gt; steel and do significant damage to things inside.<BR><BR>Hm...assuming you're just barely vaporizing the material, that's enough energy<BR>to bore a hole 10 cm deep with an average cross section of 1.6 cm^2.&nbsp; I doubt<BR>that you can actually bore holes that efficiently, though I suspect you can<BR>do better than the standard FF&amp;S figure of ~1 cm.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Besides, when were weapons capable of putting holes in armoured<BR>&gt; vehicles considered "weak" in terms of personal firearms for survival<BR>&gt; on a low-tech planet?<BR><BR>I didn't actually call it weak, I said it was weak vs armor vehicles ;)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Against unarmored targets, 1 kilojoule would probably blow a nasty<BR>&gt; &gt; crater in skin, but that's only enough energy to vaporize 0.4 grams<BR>&gt; &gt; of water, so it won't produce any deep wounds.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Again, using it only as a big dumb flashlight.&nbsp; There was recently a<BR>&gt; discussion on rec.arts.sf.science on the topic, with subject "Laser<BR>&gt; pistol EverReadys".&nbsp; It should be available on Deja, even in the<BR>&gt; site's current sorry state.<BR><BR>Hm..ok, found it.&nbsp; Basically, you are applying 1 joule pulses every 5 microsec<BR>for 5 milliseconds.&nbsp; In order to get material out of the hole fast enough, <BR>material will tend to go in non-useful directions at lot), it needs to be<BR>moving at 0.5 cm/5 ms, or 1,000 meters/second, requiring on the order of<BR>500 joules/gram.&nbsp; Ok, you might accomplish a 2 g/cm^2 penetration there<BR>(2 cm flesh, about 0.25 cm steel), though holding a beam on the same square<BR>centimeter of a moving target for 5 ms is actually not trivial, a 2<BR>meter/second velocity is sufficient to scatter your hole.&nbsp; You're also <BR>creating 200 khz sound waves in the target, which might be useful, and <BR>probably 200 khz sound waves in your focusing apparatus, which is probably <BR>not useful.<BR><BR>If you could get the material to deform forward, that would be much better,<BR>but unfortunately water is mostly incompressible, so it won't deform forward<BR>to any significant degree.<BR><BR>The actual energy of deformation of flesh is low, but deforming it fast enough<BR>isn't all that easy.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 17:12:49 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Anthony Jackson writes:<BR>&gt; Timothy Little writes:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Sure, if it was just used as a big dumb flashlight.&nbsp; With a properly<BR>&gt; &gt; timed and tuned pulse train, it could penetrate at least 10 cm of<BR>&gt; &gt; steel and do significant damage to things inside.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Hm...assuming you're just barely vaporizing the material, that's enough<BR>&gt; energy to bore a hole 10 cm deep with an average cross section of 1.6<BR>&gt; cm^2.&nbsp; I doubt that you can actually bore holes that efficiently, though I<BR>&gt; suspect you can do better than the standard FF&amp;S figure of ~1 cm.<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Besides, when were weapons capable of putting holes in armoured<BR>&gt; &gt; vehicles considered "weak" in terms of personal firearms for survival<BR>&gt; &gt; on a low-tech planet?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I didn't actually call it weak, I said it was weak vs armor vehicles ;)<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Against unarmored targets, 1 kilojoule would probably blow a nasty<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; crater in skin, but that's only enough energy to vaporize 0.4 grams<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; of water, so it won't produce any deep wounds.<BR>&gt; &gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Again, using it only as a big dumb flashlight.&nbsp; There was recently a<BR>&gt; &gt; discussion on rec.arts.sf.science on the topic, with subject "Laser<BR>&gt; &gt; pistol EverReadys".&nbsp; It should be available on Deja, even in the<BR>&gt; &gt; site's current sorry state.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Hm..ok, found it.&nbsp; Basically, you are applying 1 joule pulses every 5<BR>&gt; microsec for 5 milliseconds.&nbsp; In order to get material out of the hole<BR>&gt; fast enough,&nbsp; material will tend to go in non-useful directions at lot), it<BR>&gt; needs to be moving at 0.5 cm/5 ms, or 1,000 meters/second, requiring on the<BR><BR><BR>On reading further, they're talking 1mm beams, which helps penetration by a <BR>huge amount (around 4 orders of magnitude in theory) but multiplies any <BR>problems associated with time on target, and reduces range by quite a bit.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 19:07:38 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>I spoke with my cousin about bows and rifles. Since he is both an avid<BR>bowhunter (and 1984 NCAA Outdoor Archery National Champion) as well as with<BR>rifles. I asked him about this matchup. He would pick the rifle every time.<BR>He said that judging distance is the single most difficult thing to do when<BR>hunting, and since bows have very low velocities and high trajectories, even<BR>the smallest miscalculation in range will result in a clean miss (At ranges<BR>past about 50 meters where you misjudge distance by more than 5 meters will<BR>result in a clean miss most of the time - this is with a compound bow, using<BR>modern arrows used by arguably one of the most competent archers in the<BR>United States).<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; You also cannot match the sheer volume of fire the Rifleman can put out.<BR>Assuming a company of Archers met a company of Rifleman on terrain that<BR>allowed line of sight past 300 meters, I doubt seriously there would be any<BR>casualties on the part of the Riflemen on the first volley. Since the<BR>Riflemen will be under only moderately in harms way, they will have the time<BR>to use considerable fire discipline to decimate the Archers before they can<BR>even get their range.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; In a hide and seek scenario where engagements are closer and obscured the<BR>Riflemen will be able to lay down fire supression the likes of which the<BR>Archers are not likely to survive. Snap shooting a bow is impossible past 20<BR>meters, snap shooting a rifle is possible by nearly any trained soldier out<BR>to 50 meters possibly up to 100-150 meters if they are expert.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Look at Feudal Japan, where Musketeers slaughtered Archers after the<BR>tactics were worked out. Now imagine each Musketeer with a rifle with three<BR>or four times the range, and 10 times the accuracy and 50 times the<BR>firepower. Tactics become less important, and Archers become extinct.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 15:10:39 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Archers vs Rifles<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson writes:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;Very true.&nbsp; A company of spearmen with archers would have little<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;chance against a squad with rifles and an autorifle on an open<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;plain, but a company with rifles and a few autorifles would give a<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;squad with ACRs and a RAM GL pause for thought.<BR>&gt;&gt;Don't sell archer's short. If they are up to the "standard" of the<BR>&gt;&gt;English at Agincourt, while the squad is up to modern standards,<BR>&gt;&gt;they'll take casualties, but the squad will be eliminated. Volley fire<BR>&gt;&gt;from a company of archers is a fearsome thing.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; I'm trying not to.&nbsp; A squad of marksmen (equivalent, perhaps,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; to the "standard" of the English at Agincourt) spread out and<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; supported by an autorifle would inflict nasty damage on a<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; bunch of archers packed together without cover.&nbsp; Such<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; damage could be inflicted before the archers got into range,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; even if we think in terms of reality rather than Traveller (all<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; I know are the CT rules).&nbsp; If the archers are somehow able to<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; continue to advance in the face of this, they will still be<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; mowed down at an appalling rate as they mass to fire.&nbsp; No<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; doubt the riflemen would take casualties, but I would still<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; put my money on the rifle squad (if I were a betting man).<BR><BR>Assuming they are *stupid* enough to advance in a massed group.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;You can *only* make things go in the rifle's favor if you engage the<BR>&gt;&gt;archers from well beyond their max effective range. And that range<BR>&gt;&gt;(several hundred yards) is well beyond the range soldiers with rifles<BR>&gt;&gt;typically engage the enemy at.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; I wasn't putting forth a "typical" engagement.&nbsp; In the scenario<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; that I proposed, all else being equal, the rifle squad looks to<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; me to have the advantage.<BR><BR>Only if you assume "low tech" = "stupid". <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 01:50:24 -0000<BR>From: "Peter Scarrott" &lt;peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: TNE Info<BR><BR>Peter<BR>http://www.myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk (Trav &amp; AD&amp;D)<BR>peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR><BR>IMTU: tc+ tm tn++ t4- ru+ !3i+ c+ jt- au- ls ta- hi++ ith++ va+ as- so&nbsp; zh+<BR>vi-<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; And life is harsh and rarely fair.<BR><BR>Never appeal to a man's 'better nature.'&nbsp; He may not have one.<BR>Lazarus Long, Time Enough For Love (By Robert.Heinlan)<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: Peter Scarrott [mailto:peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk]<BR>&gt; Sent: 02 February 2001 21:08<BR>&gt; To: harrisgwjr@yahoo.com; caraig@mindspring.com<BR>&gt; Subject: TNE Info<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Having seen quite a few posts about TNE I guess its time to<BR>&gt; mention the Traveller TNE mailing list and subscription info.&nbsp; We<BR>&gt; discuss many matters about TNE and 'keep the Flame', I'd suggest<BR>&gt; cross-posting TNE questions to both lists to get the best results<BR>&gt; and answers.&nbsp; The list is busy discussing and reading the huge<BR>&gt; amounts of data generated by Peter Guye and his TNE world,<BR>&gt; subsector and sector write-ups along the Spinward reaches of the Regency.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; To subscribe, e-mail: tne-rces-subscribe@silent-tower.org<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Peter<BR>&gt; http://www.myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk (Trav &amp; AD&amp;D)<BR>&gt; peter@myhelliconia.freeserve.co.uk<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; IMTU: tc+ tm tn++ t4- ru+ !3i+ c+ jt- au- ls ta- hi++ ith++ va+<BR>&gt; as- so&nbsp; zh+ vi-<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; And life is harsh and rarely fair.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Never appeal to a man's 'better nature.'&nbsp; He may not have one.<BR>&gt; Lazarus Long, Time Enough For Love (By Robert.Heinlan)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 17:55:17 -0800<BR>From: "Kelly St.Clair" &lt;kellys@efn.org&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Questions<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; [Loren Wiseman on the TML] "Don't ask, I can't tell you.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Dealt with already.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; (2) What is the Empress Wave?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Asnwer to this one is the same as to 1: I cannot answer this question.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; (3) Will the Empress Wave be followed up in GURPS Traveller?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Still no answer . . . I don't want to spoil the surprise.<BR><BR>The CONTINUUM time-travel RPG has an even better phrase for such <BR>situations:&nbsp; "Further information is not available here."&nbsp; It doesn't even <BR>admit that you /know/, but can't say.<BR><BR>(Given the need to /not/ impart any information in a setting where the <BR>Observer Effect is in full force, a totally contentless reply can be <BR>useful.&nbsp; If frustrating.)<BR><BR><BR>- --------------<BR>Kelly St.Clair&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; "'Cause you've got Trouble<BR>kellys@efn.org&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Right here in fair Verona<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; With a capital T that rhymes with D<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; That stands for Duel..."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 18:54:56<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR><BR>At 08:18 AM 2/2/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;The other question is: how big is your merc unit?&nbsp; Strouden, IIRC, is a<BR>&gt;&gt;high-population world.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The 'de-heading' part doesn't have to be big.<BR>&gt;The non-lethal sections needs to fair sized, but well supported.<BR>&gt;In nice big TL C city sized buildings, control of the environmental systems <BR>&gt;is a huge force multiplier.<BR><BR>Strouden is habitable without excessive aid.&nbsp; And since it is the most<BR>populous system in Lunion, and site to masses of Imperial-vital industies,<BR>solutions involving brute force will be frowned upon.<BR><BR>Trust me, I chose this system for very specific reasons.<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 19:10:58 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>on 2/2/01 2:36 PM, Leonard Erickson at shadow@krypton.rain.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Well, the English longbowmen were except to hit *smaller* targets at<BR>&gt; ranges of over 100 yards. I actually expect that while the rifles will<BR>&gt; have a range advantage, it won't be as marked as you seem to think.<BR><BR>Note that rifle targets vary in size with range also.&nbsp; At 50 yards, the<BR>target is essentially a head and shoulders.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Also, if there *is* any sort of concealment available, the archers have<BR>&gt; the advantage, as their weapons are *very* "suppressed". :-)<BR><BR>True, but it's very easy to backtrack the flight of an arrow.&nbsp; Heck, you can<BR>watch one in flight.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; The rifle company will take casualties, maybe, but that company of archers<BR>&gt;&gt; will be in pretty bad shape.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Depends a *lot* on the terrain and other variables.<BR><BR>Yes, and who surprises who.&nbsp; It will be a lot easier to hide or move a five<BR>man squad compared to company of archers.&nbsp; And locating riflemen by sound is<BR>a lot harder than one might expect.&nbsp; You get something like "there over<BR>there somewhere".&nbsp; Again, not really helpful if you are trying to hit a lone<BR>infantryman.<BR><BR>If your archers are dispersed, they lose the advantage of massed fire (the<BR>real killer at Agincourt, not precision accuracy).&nbsp; Then terrain will be<BR>crucial.&nbsp; However, the original poster stated open terrain, so our rifleman<BR>will be shooting from the prone at kneeling or standing bowman.<BR><BR>And despite the prowess of English yeoman, reloading is far faster with a<BR>magazine fed assault rifle.&nbsp; I can get off an reasonably aimed shot every<BR>second.&nbsp; Thirty rounds to a magazine, and reloads in about 5 seconds.<BR><BR>Also, the English bow was the primary combat weapon for infantry.&nbsp; In modern<BR>times, this is the machinegun.&nbsp; Riflemen are really there to support the<BR>machinegun (the real killer).&nbsp; The effectiveness of the MG is the main<BR>reason that lighter and light weapons have been developed to place the MG<BR>further down the TO&amp;E.&nbsp; Now we have the Squad automatic weapon (SAW), like<BR>the M-249 (Minimi). It is quite easy to engage point target at 600m and area<BR>target out to 1000 (assuming M855 ammunition).<BR><BR>Lastly, in an extended campaign, the archers will definitely lose.&nbsp; Every<BR>archer take a lifetime to train, but a new rifleman can be produced in a few<BR>days (or even hours) time.&nbsp; A modern soldier is expected to learn all the<BR>basics of infantry combat, including BRM (Basic Rifle Marksmanship), land<BR>navigation, radio operation, first aid, tactics and a host of other skills<BR>all in 8 weeks.&nbsp; If memory serves, I think we spent a week on rifle<BR>marksmanship (as well as mainenance).<BR><BR>Think of that.&nbsp; One needn't import offworld troops, just some cadre and<BR>assault rifles.&nbsp; Arm the dispossed serfs, and give them an assault rifle.<BR>Now some poor sot with two weeks training can be on at least equal terms<BR>with the cream of the yeomanry.<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Note that this doesn't even take into account the psychological effects of<BR>&gt;&gt; gunfire on the 'primitives'. Recall the before the invention of gunpowder,<BR>&gt;&gt; the loudest noise a yeoman ever heard was probably thunder.&nbsp; When guns were<BR>&gt;&gt; first introduced in battle, the noise probably had more effect on the enemy<BR>&gt;&gt; than the projectiles fired.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Unless this is "first contact", they'll know about guns.<BR><BR>If they've experienced coming under full auto fire, they'll know not to<BR>engage rifles in an open plain.<BR><BR>Note, the original poster to this thread posited a rifle squad, and it was<BR>assumed this meant (typically 5) rifleman.&nbsp; I would have said a modern rifle<BR>squad.<BR><BR>Squad leader<BR>Light machine gunner<BR>Grenadier<BR>2 riflemen<BR><BR>Now if this is a modern mechanized rifle squad...<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3592<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yg03.mx.aol.com (rly-yg03.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.3]) by air-yg02.mail.aol.com (v77_r1.21) with ESMTP; Fri, 02 Feb 2001 22:13:32 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yg03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Fri, 02 Feb 2001 22:12:57 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id WAA30810;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Fri, 2 Feb 2001 22:12:07 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Fri, 2 Feb 2001 22:11:06 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id WAA30749<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Fri, 2 Feb 2001 22:11:06 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 22:11:06 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102030311.WAA30749@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3592<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3593</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/3/01 2:29:01 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Saturday, February 3 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3593<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR>MT starship combat<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>AHL Deck plans...<BR>Re: Rio<BR>FASA memorial haiku<BR>re: Interstellar War Timeline<BR>RE: AHL Deck plans...<BR>Re: Ahetowa<BR>Re: spinwardmarches.com<BR>Re: [Website Review] Traveller Core Route Maps<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Landgrabs -- Bael<BR>Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR>Re: [www] 04 Feb 2001 - Freelance Traveller Updated<BR>Re: On feedback<BR>Re: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR>AHL and Space Hulk<BR>Re: Gearhead question<BR>Re: Great Myths laid to rest...<BR>Re: GT: Small Wars (was: Re: Web Sites)<BR>Re: Great Myths laid to rest...<BR>Re: Questions<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 19:18:56 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR><BR>on 2/2/01 6:54 PM, Douglas E. Berry at gridlore@pop.mindspring.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 08:18 AM 2/2/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; The other question is: how big is your merc unit?&nbsp; Strouden, IIRC, is a<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt; high-population world.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; The 'de-heading' part doesn't have to be big.<BR>&gt;&gt; The non-lethal sections needs to fair sized, but well supported.<BR>&gt;&gt; In nice big TL C city sized buildings, control of the environmental systems<BR>&gt;&gt; is a huge force multiplier.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Strouden is habitable without excessive aid.&nbsp; And since it is the most<BR>&gt; populous system in Lunion, and site to masses of Imperial-vital industies,<BR>&gt; solutions involving brute force will be frowned upon.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Trust me, I chose this system for very specific reasons.<BR><BR>Well, what have your secret police been doing all these years.&nbsp; Don't they<BR>know all the ringleader, so they can all be liquidated.<BR><BR>And cut of food supplies, natch.&nbsp; Most modern cities only have a few days.<BR><BR>Get those psiops people to work, as well.&nbsp; Make sure to flood the airwaves<BR>with scenes of loyal citizens who were forced to take part surrendering and<BR>being well treated and getting food.&nbsp; Broadcast the nastiest Big Lies about<BR>the leaders of the revolt.<BR><BR>I'll have to research Strouden in more detail.<BR><BR>Very interesting problem...<BR><BR>Naturally, we don't have problems like this in the Confederation, where<BR>everyone loves his government, and all are treated with respect and their<BR>need seen to.<BR><BR>This kind of uprising is just going to happen in any society where the<BR>leadership is held by a privilidged elite with little in common with the<BR>'unwashed masses'.&nbsp; Let them eat cake, hah!<BR><BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 19:56:44 -0800<BR>From: "A. O'Mary" &lt;omary@my-deja.com&gt;<BR>Subject: MT starship combat<BR><BR>I recently ran a MT starship combat for the first time in several years. I've applied the errata corrections but the tables to penetrate a defense still look...wrong. As I understand the rules, you find the attacking weapon factor (row) vs the defense factor (column). The number at the intersection is applied as a defensive bonus ie subtarcted from the 2d6 roll. The formula as stated in the book comes out to-<BR>(A - attacking vessel's computer #)<BR>(D - defending vessels computer #)<BR>(T - value from table)<BR>2d6 + A -(D+T)<BR><BR>The problem is that, according to the table, the higher the value of A, the greater the value of T. In other words, a factor A laser is less likely to penetrate a factor 1 sandcaster screen than is a factor 1 laser. In fact, a factor A laser gets -11 to penetrate a factor 1 sand screen, making the task impossible unless the difference in computers is grossly overwhelming.<BR>Is T supposed to be added instead of subtracted?<BR><BR>ALO<BR><BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>- --== Sent via Deja.com ==--<BR>http://www.deja.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 15:13:22 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Anthony Jackson wrote:<BR>&gt; Hm...assuming you're just barely vaporizing the material, that's<BR>&gt; enough energy to bore a hole 10 cm deep with an average cross<BR>&gt; section of 1.6 cm^2.<BR><BR>Again, you are assuming that the primary mechanism is vaporisation.<BR>It is more efficient to vaporise only a small amount, and use the<BR>pressure of the vapour to stress the material beyond its breakign<BR>point.&nbsp; Since the energy required to break most materials is well<BR>below the energy needed to vaporise them, this is a far more efficient<BR>use of energy.<BR><BR>From a chemical point of view, this is pretty obvious -- boiling a<BR>material requires enough energy to break *all* its molecular (or<BR>atomic) bonds.&nbsp; Causing structurl failure requires only a subset of<BR>bonds to be broken.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Hm..ok, found it.&nbsp; Basically, you are applying 1 joule pulses every<BR>&gt; 5 microsec for 5 milliseconds.&nbsp; In order to get material out of the<BR>&gt; hole fast enough, material will tend to go in non-useful directions<BR>&gt; at lot<BR><BR>The only *non* useful direction is out of the hole -- material in<BR>every other direction causes wounding.&nbsp; Besides, the hole is better if<BR>it starts narrower.&nbsp; On the order of a few millimetres should be<BR>achievable.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; holding a beam on the same square centimeter of a moving target for<BR>&gt; 5 ms is actually not trivial,<BR><BR>By my calculation, good results should be obtained with different<BR>figures.&nbsp; For a 2 mm beam diameter, each pulse should be about 30<BR>Joules, spaced about 5 microseconds apart.&nbsp; The temporary cavity<BR>should be about 5 mm deeper by the time the next pulse arrives (though<BR>not as much wider, since the expansion is anisotropic).&nbsp; The second<BR>pulse vaporises part of the rear surface, enlarging the temporary<BR>cavity further.<BR><BR>For a penetration depth of 30 cm, the pulse train should thus be about<BR>0.3 milliseconds long, not 5 ms.<BR><BR>The cavity will collapse in a few milliseconds; the duration varies<BR>with intensity.&nbsp; The maximum diameter would be somewhere around 2-4<BR>centimetres, occurring around 10-20 milliseconds after the initial<BR>pulse (depending on how you define "collapse").<BR><BR>If the target is moving, then penetration will be reduced.&nbsp; The first<BR>critical speed is where the beam axis moves by more than the cavity<BR>diameter between pulses.&nbsp; This corresponds to a speed of abou 500<BR>metres per second, and means that the pulse train scores a line on the<BR>surface instead of penetrating.<BR><BR>The second critical speed depends upon penetration depth, and occurs<BR>because the radial expansion of the cavity is decelerating.<BR>Eventually the beam overtakes it, and starts the process again at a<BR>reduced depth.&nbsp; For a depth of 20 cm (40 pulses), the critical speed<BR>is about 20 m/s.&nbsp; Over this speed, there is a significant chance that<BR>the higher-up parts of the cavity (at that time, about 1-2 cm in<BR>diameter) are hit by the beam before reaching that depth.&nbsp; (Note: this<BR>is also about the timescale over which the temporary cavity starts to<BR>develop serious asymmetries)<BR><BR><BR>&gt; If you could get the material to deform forward, that would be much<BR>&gt; better, but unfortunately water is mostly incompressible, so it<BR>&gt; won't deform forward to any significant degree.<BR><BR>Incompressibility simply means that you can't *compress* it by much.<BR>You can most certainly deform it, and the enormous pressure gradients<BR>ensure that it deforms very quickly indeed.&nbsp; The expansion is<BR>initially supersonic, and some of the energy goes into formation of<BR>shock fronts.&nbsp; The main effect is subsonic though, and there is<BR>sufficient time for a bulk outward flow from the cavity to stabilise.<BR>(This is one of the factors that cause the cavity to break symmetry<BR>ealier than it would if treating it as an elastic solid)<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 20:07:01 -0800<BR>From: "Mark F. Cook" &lt;markc@peak.org&gt;<BR>Subject: AHL Deck plans...<BR><BR>Andy Akins wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;As far as a AHL set of plans at the packet-scale.......dear lord!!! How many<BR>&gt;pages would that end up to be???<BR><BR>It'd have to be sort of like one of those dreadful Time-Life book offers:<BR><BR>"INTRODUCTORY OFFER!! Pick any 3 decks for only 99 cents!&nbsp; There after,<BR>receive one deck a month for only $9.95 (plus shipping and handling.)&nbsp; No<BR>obligation!&nbsp; Cancel your subscription at any time..." :^)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; - Mark C.<BR><BR>&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 23:41:49 -0600<BR>From: Jimmy Simpson &lt;nimrodd@earthlink.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Rio<BR><BR>At 04:15 PM 2/2/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;I am thinking of Doing the system of Rio in the Chronor Subsector.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;the question i have is this. no matter what planet i use i need to know what<BR>&gt;Data besides what is in the books i got. Books 0-8 and supplements 1 -13 of<BR>&gt;CT. is there some way to search for information? a searchable database<BR>&gt;somewhere? I am guessing not. However I would like to ensure i got as much<BR>&gt;data as possible before beginning.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;If anyone knows anything about this system please let me know. im going to<BR>&gt;scour my books looking for information.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;thanks<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Bill<BR><BR>The only items about Cronor, are I believe in Adv 6(?) Expedition to Zhodane.<BR><BR>Jimmy Simpson<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; nimrodd@mail.com<BR><BR>"The avalanche has already started.<BR>It is too late for the pebbles to vote."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Kosh Naranek (Babylon 5)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 22:27:29 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: FASA memorial haiku<BR><BR>This one bounced, so I'm sending it again:<BR><BR><BR>Seven Pillars and Eshaar<BR>Sky Raiders' Legend<BR>Keith brothers wrote and drew<BR><BR>- --Glenn<BR><BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 22:29:26 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Glenn Goffin &lt;gmgoffin@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Interstellar War Timeline<BR><BR>This one bounced, so I'm resending it: <BR><BR>&gt;From: Gerry Harris &lt;harrisgwjr@yahoo.com&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;I've been dealing with competing canon timelines (Imperium,<BR>&gt;MegaTraveller Imperial Enyclopedia and Referee's Companion, <BR>&gt;Library Data (A-M, N-Z), Alien Module 6) trying to hash out the <BR>&gt;sequence of events from the period of the Interstellar Wars. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The problem is, no two sources seem to agree on anything, and in at<BR>&gt;least one case (Imperium) it disagrees with itself.<BR><BR>Such is the nature of historical research, after all.&nbsp; Figuring out what<BR>probably happened from inconsistent and contradictory source materials is<BR>just what historians do.&nbsp; It looks like you have undertaken a pretty<BR>thorough analysis (although I haven't examined it in sufficient detail to<BR>agree or disagree).<BR><BR>- --Glenn (yes I have a history degree)<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 22:25:46 -0800<BR>From: Jesse DeGraff &lt;jdegraff@pacbell.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: AHL Deck plans...<BR><BR>LOL!!!&nbsp; :)<BR><BR>Jesse<BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Mark F. Cook<BR>&gt; Sent: Friday, February 02, 2001 8:07 PM<BR>&gt; To: Traveller Mail List<BR>&gt; Subject: AHL Deck plans...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Andy Akins wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;As far as a AHL set of plans at the packet-scale.......dear <BR>&gt; lord!!! How many<BR>&gt; &gt;pages would that end up to be???<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; It'd have to be sort of like one of those dreadful Time-Life book offers:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; "INTRODUCTORY OFFER!! Pick any 3 decks for only 99 cents!&nbsp; There after,<BR>&gt; receive one deck a month for only $9.95 (plus shipping and handling.)&nbsp; No<BR>&gt; obligation!&nbsp; Cancel your subscription at any time..." :^)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; - Mark C.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; mark f. cook&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp;&nbsp; shoestring graphics &amp; printing&nbsp;&nbsp; *&nbsp; markc@ssgfx.com<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; 7160 n.w. somerset dr. * corvallis, or, 97330&nbsp; *&nbsp; http://www.ssgfx.com<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Phone: 541-745-5709&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Fax: 541-745-5818<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 07:14:37 +0000<BR>From: Paul Campbell &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Ahetowa<BR><BR>On Sat, Feb 03, 2001 at 01:42:12AM +0100, Volker wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; On Friday, February 02, 2001, 8:52:22 PM, the following was written:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; PC&gt; On Fri, Feb 02, 2001 at 02:33:29PM -0500, GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Will someone who has Challenge 56 (my copy is still in a storage locker 1100 <BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; miles away) please check and see if there are any illustrations accompanying <BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; the article? I need scans of them ASAP.<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Loren Wiseman<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; PC&gt; Contact: Ahetaowa<BR>&gt; PC&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ^<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; PC&gt; There is a single full page b/w pic by Dell Harris (loved his stuff).<BR>&gt; PC&gt; The picture is of a tall, 12' bent nearly double, Ahetaowa apparently<BR>&gt; PC&gt; 'talking' to an Aslan with the tentacles it it's top,<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; PC&gt; The picture is partly obscured by the article banner about a third of<BR>&gt; PC&gt; the page down, 2" high.&nbsp; I could scan it, but it would be tomorrow<BR>&gt; PC&gt; morning (UK time) if I popped into work (say in about 13-14 hours).<BR>&gt; PC&gt; Can anyone else bet me?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Already did!<BR><BR>Cool, I can go back to bed then. &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Paul Campbell (Sourceforge) &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>GPG Key fingerprint = 9C4F 31A3 8814 9F94 A533 A979 E63F 0C69 A771 0F24<BR>http://www.kemitix.uklinux.net<BR>jupiter: 7:14am up 24 days, 20:54, 2 users, load average: 0.43, 0.39, 0.21<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 07:25:51 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: spinwardmarches.com<BR><BR>on 2/2/01 11:26 pm, Tod Glenn at webmaster@travellercentral.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; All landgrab and other interested parties.&nbsp; I have begun the sector databse<BR>&gt; for all worlds in the spinward marches.&nbsp; I will be including all canon data<BR>&gt; and links or data from the respective landgrabees.&nbsp; Just the shell now, but<BR>&gt; take a look at http://www.spinwardmarches.com<BR><BR>You hero! Nice start. I hope to be contributing soon.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 07:25:51 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: [Website Review] Traveller Core Route Maps<BR><BR>on 2/2/01 9:59 pm, JimVassila@aol.com at JimVassila@aol.com wrote:<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Cliff, as long as the patch seems to be working okay, go ahead and post it on<BR>&gt; your website so that people can see your handiwork in all its glory :-)<BR><BR>Nice one. I just downloaded Cliff's Core route zip, then saw his warning. So<BR>that will make me happy. I really like Gal24 - it's perfect for Mac users<BR>who have to deal with emulation speeds. I am planning to try some Tcl/Tk<BR>software I saw on http://www.radix.net/~herveus/traveller/ that professes to<BR>be able to use the same map files though. Particularly since running Virtual<BR>PC on MacOS 9 under MacOS X is a bit overkill (oh for a native OSX PC<BR>emulator). ;)<BR><BR>&gt; BTW, does anyone know how to get AOL60 to send just text mail rather than<BR>&gt; this gibberish which is coming out at the bottom of my TML posts? (Must get<BR>&gt; linux box hooked up before I go crazy)<BR><BR>Can I suggest - hook the Linux box up, then port Gal24 to Linux - please? ;)<BR><BR>Sorry - can't offer any real advice for AOL - I tried their demo, but it was<BR>woefully buggy on a Mac, and I had little need for it. I can offer help in<BR>setting up your Linux box though - 18 years of Unix experience makes Linux<BR>fiddling a 'natural' for me. Feel free to ask me if you've got any problems.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 07:25:51 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>on 2/2/01 10:36 pm, Leonard Erickson at shadow@krypton.rain.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Also, if there *is* any sort of concealment available, the archers have<BR>&gt; the advantage, as their weapons are *very* "suppressed". :-)<BR><BR>I agree. This is where the real advantage of bow weapons comes from. Because<BR>they do have a somewhat ballistic trajectory, it's hard to pin down<BR>concealed archers. If they have a spread and good cover, they can inflict<BR>decent damage against even fairly well armoured opponents, or at the very<BR>least cause them to disengage. A sustained volley by a fair sized group of<BR>concealed archers is tough for even an advanced mercenary unit to face.<BR><BR>Of course, there are higher-tech bows too - compound devices that add range<BR>without the need for the strength required from an equivalent longbow. Then<BR>there are crossbows, which sacrifice speed for greater penetration and<BR>range. Again, these are pretty quiet weapons, and married with later<BR>(potentially imported through trade) technology can fire explosive devices.<BR>Even low-tech archers have used natural poisons, flaming arrows and the<BR>like. The potential for using biotech heads in combination, or Chinese-style<BR>rocket bolts also exists for the creative GM. ;)<BR><BR>In the right circumstances, even blowpipes and darts are deadly. Properly<BR>trained mercenaries who operate in low-tech environments would be very<BR>cautious about engaging massed archers who had a concealment advantage.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 07:25:51 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrabs -- Bael<BR><BR>on 1/2/01 1:32 am, John Lambert at hovtej@hotmail.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; The "good" landgrabs are going fast. I'll lay claim to Bael / Querion. If I<BR>&gt; missed someone else's claim to this garden spot, please let me know.<BR><BR>Naaah! Look how many are still left... glad to see lots of new claims. :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 2 Feb 2001 23:46:38 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Kiri Aradia Morgan &lt;tiamat@tsoft.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR><BR>On Fri, 2 Feb 2001, Douglas E. Berry wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 08:18 AM 2/2/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;The other question is: how big is your merc unit?&nbsp; Strouden, IIRC, is a<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;high-population world.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;The 'de-heading' part doesn't have to be big.<BR>&gt; &gt;The non-lethal sections needs to fair sized, but well supported.<BR>&gt; &gt;In nice big TL C city sized buildings, control of the environmental systems <BR>&gt; &gt;is a huge force multiplier.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Strouden is habitable without excessive aid.&nbsp; And since it is the most<BR>&gt; populous system in Lunion, and site to masses of Imperial-vital industies,<BR>&gt; solutions involving brute force will be frowned upon.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Trust me, I chose this system for very specific reasons.<BR><BR>oh fucking shit.<BR><BR>is this the Kisaragi haut-Rensselaer fief?<BR><BR>::gulp::<BR><BR>******************************************************************************<BR>Kiri Aradia Morgan&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 93!&nbsp; Thou Art God<BR>tiamat@tsoft.com<BR><BR>"If time passes, everything turns into beauty<BR>If the rains stop, tears clean the scars of memory away<BR>Everything starts wearing fresh colors<BR>Every sound begins playing a heartfelt melody<BR>Jealousy embellishes a page of the epic<BR>Desire is embraced in a dream..."&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -- X-JAPAN<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 08:05:52 +0000<BR>From: Paul Campbell &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: [www] 04 Feb 2001 - Freelance Traveller Updated<BR><BR>On Fri, Feb 02, 2001 at 08:05:55PM -0500, Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt; Freelance Traveller, the Electronic Fan-Supported Traveller Resource has<BR>&gt; posted its most recent update to http://come.to/FreelanceTraveller and<BR>&gt; http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/Default.htm.&nbsp; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; In this update:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; - Chapter eleven of _The_Hostile_Stars_, Fred Ramen's ongoing serial<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; story, has been posted to Raconteur's Rest. <BR><BR>Chapter Eleven!&nbsp; Here I come, ready or not! &lt;g&gt;<BR><BR>Erm... The link to Raconteur's Rest in the left hand menu is broken.<BR>Go in through the Descriptive Table of Content at the top, that gives<BR>a working link.<BR><BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; - A whole new section on storyline questions, and minor updates to reflect<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; forthcoming SJG items, have been added to the FAQ. The FAQ can be found<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; in the Information Center.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; - Updates to Traveller on the Internet to reflect added web sites,<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; reported site address changes, and the conversion of eGroups to Yahoo!<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; Groups.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Your questions, comments, and ideas are always welcome at Freelance<BR>&gt; Traveller.&nbsp; Please write to freelancetraveller@yahoo.com with any and all<BR>&gt; of them, as we are in the process of reconfiguring the forms, and they may<BR>&gt; be temporarily disabled.&nbsp; Freelance Traveller depends on the good will of<BR>&gt; Traveller fans both to visit our site and justify our existence, and to<BR>&gt; write for us, making our existence possible.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Freelance Traveller is mirrored at http://w3.execnet.com/jeffz.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Freelance Traveller wishes to extend its thanks and appreciation to The<BR>&gt; Traveller Downport (http://www.downport.com) and to Executive Network<BR>&gt; Information Systems (http://www.execnet.com) for hosting services. Without<BR>&gt; organizations willing to cooperate with Freelance Traveller's ever-growing<BR>&gt; needs, we would be unable to bring you the articles and other resources<BR>&gt; that have made Freelance Traveller one of the premier Traveller sites on<BR>&gt; the 'net.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture <BR>&gt; Enterprises, 1977-2000.&nbsp; Use of the trademark in <BR>&gt; this notice and in the referenced materials is not <BR>&gt; intended to infringe or devalue the trademark.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt; Jeff Zeitlin, Editor<BR>&gt; Freelance Traveller - The Electronic Fan-Supported Traveller Resource<BR>&gt; http://come.to/FreelanceTraveller<BR>&gt; http://www.downport.com/freelancetraveller/Default.htm<BR>&gt; freelancetraveller@yahoo.com<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Paul Campbell (Sourceforge) &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>GPG Key fingerprint = 9C4F 31A3 8814 9F94 A533 A979 E63F 0C69 A771 0F24<BR>http://www.kemitix.uklinux.net<BR>jupiter: 8:03am up 24 days, 21:43, 2 users, load average: 0.24, 0.41, 0.48<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 20:49:25 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: On feedback<BR><BR>Kenji Schwarz wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; At 8:40 AM -0800 2/1/01, Jesse Degraff wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Anybody have a correct Latin translation for "Don't let the bastards drag<BR>&gt; &gt;you down"?&nbsp; A really quick search on Google gave me a couple different<BR>&gt; &gt;versions, none of which is the one that I've seen before ;)<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Not sure it's correct, but what I've heard is 'non carborundum<BR>&gt; illegitimi'.&nbsp; My former boss used to use it a lot, referring to sneak<BR>&gt; audits by the AG's office.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Kenji<BR><BR>I believe this uses the term grind instead of drag though<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 10:58:57 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Beowulf Deck plans...<BR><BR>Jesse Degraff wrote:<BR>&gt; I think Loren said that an AHL would be approximately 50-55 pages :D&nbsp; I'm<BR>&gt; game if you're game ;)<BR><BR>The scary thing is that it wouldn't be impossible...<BR><BR>You might want to add a few pages of diagrams explaining which pages<BR>connect to which pages, though...<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 11:00:19 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: AHL and Space Hulk<BR><BR>How about using a complete set of AHL deckplans with the Space Hulk<BR>rules? Wouldn't that be a blast?<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 11:05:59 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Gearhead question<BR><BR>Gerry Harris wrote:<BR>&gt; In FF&amp;S, I want to strap a rocket onto a wheeled vehicle.&nbsp; How do I<BR>&gt; determine the power-to-weight ratio (which is usually given in<BR>&gt; MW/tonnes) and thus the speed of the hybrid vehicle?<BR><BR>Read this:<BR><BR>http://www.purrsia.com/freefall/ff200/fv00102.htm<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 11:09:32 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Great Myths laid to rest...<BR><BR>Jeff Rowse wrote:<BR>&gt; Further proof that, while the rest of the world struggles with the minor<BR>&gt; problems of dimishing fossil fuels and global changes, the BBC (British<BR>&gt; Broadcasting Corporation) continues to send us the *real* cutting-edge<BR>&gt; stories... (more on the 'Penguins evolved from Weebles' mythos)<BR><BR>After reading this, I realize that they really *have to* try using a<BR>glider (un-powered aircraft) of some kind. Currently, the penguins go<BR>away because they are afraid of the engine noise. They might watch a<BR>silent aircraft&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 11:16:19 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: GT: Small Wars (was: Re: Web Sites)<BR><BR>John Groth wrote:<BR>&gt; I was interested enough to look at the SJG Wish List for GT,<BR><BR>Where did you find that page?<BR><BR>&gt; where I found the following:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; http://www.sjgames.com/general/author/capsules.html#HolidayInCambodia<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; **begin quote**<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; GURPS Traveller: Small Wars<BR>&lt;snip&gt; <BR>&gt; **end quote**<BR><BR>Mmmmmmmmmm... I would buy it. I have a feeling some others around here<BR>would as well... ;-)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 10:19:22 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Great Myths laid to rest...<BR><BR>on 3/2/01 10:09 am, Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm at jenry023@student.liu.se<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Jeff Rowse wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; Further proof that, while the rest of the world struggles with the minor<BR>&gt;&gt; problems of dimishing fossil fuels and global changes, the BBC (British<BR>&gt;&gt; Broadcasting Corporation) continues to send us the *real* cutting-edge<BR>&gt;&gt; stories... (more on the 'Penguins evolved from Weebles' mythos)<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; After reading this, I realize that they really *have to* try using a<BR>&gt; glider (un-powered aircraft) of some kind. Currently, the penguins go<BR>&gt; away because they are afraid of the engine noise. They might watch a<BR>&gt; silent aircraft&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>Right, which explains why the RAF reported seeing them fall over in the<BR>Falklands war^H^H^Hconflict. They must have been using silent stealth planes<BR>- - y'know: Avro Vulcans, Panavia Tornadoes, Hawker Harriers... :)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 11:23:28 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Questions<BR><BR>LKW wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; (3) Will the Empress Wave be followed up in GURPS Traveller?<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; No answer to this one as yet.&nbsp; Loren?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Still no answer . . . I don't want to spoil the surprise.<BR><BR>Meaning that he knows and plans on telling us...<BR><BR>Or am I mistaken?&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 09:46:11 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>"Matthew W. Helton" wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; -Ah an engineer speaks at last (or i hope you are from your eloquent and<BR>&gt; spot on<BR>&gt; reply).&nbsp; Only thing you missed is that energy weapons (specifically lasers)<BR>&gt; are<BR>&gt; very hard to dodge (speed of light and all that stuff).-<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; So are Projectiles moving at anything faster than 200 Meters per<BR>&gt; second...Especially if they are moving over 1000 Meters per second. It's<BR>&gt; hard to outrun a bullet if you are a soldier on foot.<BR><BR>Yes but if the first round/burst misses you can always dive for cover (apart<BR>from the big stuff i admit) but at c, you wont even see the missing burst (the<BR>most energetic lasers will be of a wavelength that the human eye is not<BR>receptive to), although i admit you may see the 'impact' point if there is<BR>enough energy released by the beam to vaporize whatever it hits.<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3593<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yb05.mx.aol.com (rly-yb05.mail.aol.com [172.18.146.5]) by air-yb03.mail.aol.com (v77_r1.21) with ESMTP; Sat, 03 Feb 2001 05:29:01 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yb05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sat, 03 Feb 2001 05:28:45 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id FAA49452;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sat, 3 Feb 2001 05:28:09 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sat, 3 Feb 2001 05:27:45 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id FAA49366<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sat, 3 Feb 2001 05:27:45 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 05:27:45 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102031027.FAA49366@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3593<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3594</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/3/01 8:55:52 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Saturday, February 3 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3594<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Classic Traveller Info<BR>Re: Great Myths laid to rest...<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>Partial For Sale List completed<BR>Re: Great Myths laid to rest...<BR>A bit of sad news<BR>Re: Re: Gearhead question<BR>Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR>Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR>RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Great Myths laid to rest...<BR>Traveller Gearhead Ring News<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>Re: Classic Traveller Info<BR>RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>RE: Question.....<BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Landgrab in Glisten.....<BR>Re: spinwardmarches.com<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 10:07:17 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Classic Traveller Info<BR><BR>Since joining the list a couple of weeks ago and reading hundreds of mails,<BR>i am a bit impressed with the depth of both technical and game knowledge.<BR>I therefore feel totally confident that someone out there can answer my CT<BR>request(s).<BR><BR>I would like to know if there are any sites (or if any of you have on your<BR>hard drives) the following info:<BR><BR>A Detailed Classic Traveller timeline.<BR>A CT GM screen format or general aide memoir.<BR><BR>Thanks,<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>oh, BTW i have in my possession a rather interesting aviation magazine<BR>article about cutting edge (well last 10 years or so - so still not<BR>widespread) aviation technology.&nbsp; It includes an interesting snippet about<BR>electrogravitics (it is about their use on the stealth bomber to gain<BR>significant speed increases over the conventional engines fitted).&nbsp; If<BR>anyone wants a copy i will scan it in and mail you.<BR><BR>Also, any CT players in Southern Wales?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 10:40:57 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Great Myths laid to rest...<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; &lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Right, which explains why the RAF reported seeing them fall over in the<BR>&gt; Falklands war^H^H^Hconflict. They must have been using silent stealth planes<BR>&gt; - y'know: Avro Vulcans, Panavia Tornadoes, Hawker Harriers... :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Gordon.<BR><BR>Actually, the Harrier was built by BAe, but whose counting<BR>:-)<BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 11:19:53 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>At 15:25 -0500 2/2/01, Traveller-digest Simon Brodie <BR>&lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;for those of you in the UK, i hope you are all bits members (British Isles<BR>&gt;Traveller Support).&nbsp; 5 gets you life membership with frequent magazines and a<BR>&gt;second-hand sales brochure every few months.&nbsp; The web site is at www.bits.org<BR>&gt;i think.<BR><BR>http://www.bits.org.uk/<BR><BR>http://www.core.org.uk/<BR><BR>&gt;BITS it's the only way to be sure.<BR><BR>;-)<BR><BR>Dom (BITS Webmaster)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 03:39:50 -0800<BR>From: Roger Sanger &lt;rodge@nwnexus.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Partial For Sale List completed<BR><BR>The collection of RPGs I'm putting up for sale so large (2500+ items), I've hardly made a dent (I've inventoried only a few hundred items so far).<BR><BR>So I'm making the list available now, and will add more items to it as time allows.<BR><BR>If you are looking for old Traveller, MegaTraveller, TNE, 2300, RIFTS or other sci-fi game items, drop me a note and I'll send you the list.<BR><BR>Rodge<BR><BR><BR>P.S.:&nbsp; As for the rest of the collection, if you are looking for something in particular (sci-fi or fantasy), let me know and I'll keep a lookout for it as I go through the materials.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 00:52:50 +1300<BR>From: "Andrew Moffatt-Vallance" &lt;a.vallance@netaccess.co.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Great Myths laid to rest...<BR><BR>On 3 Feb 2001, at 10:40, Simon Brodie wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Right, which explains why the RAF reported seeing them fall over in the<BR>&gt; &gt; Falklands war^H^H^Hconflict. They must have been using silent stealth planes<BR>&gt; &gt; - y'know: Avro Vulcans, Panavia Tornadoes, Hawker Harriers... :)<BR><BR>&gt; Actually, the Harrier was built by BAe, but whose counting<BR><BR>Actually you're both right. The Harrier is now built by BAe, but orginally it <BR>was designed and built by Hawker-Siddeley before they were combined <BR>with BAC. And Hawker-Siddeley were the result of the amalgamation of <BR>Hawker and Armstrong-Siddeley, who were the result of the amalgamation <BR>of Armstrong-Whitworth and...<BR><BR>And during the 2nd WW you look at British aircraft and see Avros, Faireys, <BR>De Havillands, Glosters, Hawkers, Bristols, Supermarines, Miles', Shorts, <BR>Handely-Pages and a host of other manufacturers. But in reality there were <BR>only a handful British aircraft companies (Hawker and De Havilland were <BR>the big players, every one else were pretty much bit players). Most of the <BR>aircraft manufacturers were actually part of a larger group (Hawker owned <BR>and controlled Hawker, Gloster, Bristol, Bolton-Paul and a lot of the others).<BR><BR>ObTrav: The birth of a megacorp.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 04:01:05 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Bernie McGeehan &lt;einreb62@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: A bit of sad news<BR><BR>from the Associated Press news service:<BR><BR>RICHFIELD, Minn. (AP) - Gordon R. Dickson, a<BR>science-fiction author who won three<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Hugo awards during a long career that included<BR>more than 80 books and 100 short stories,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; died Wednesday of complications from asthma. He<BR>was 77.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Dickson considered his masterpiece to be the<BR>``Lost Dorsai'' series, an intended 16 volumes<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; covering the time span from 1400 to 2400. He<BR>finished eight books in the series - including<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ``Lost Dorsai'' and ``Soldier, Ask Not'' - and<BR>was at work on the ninth when he died.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; In the series, Dickson toyed with different<BR>ideas of evolution and technology and the effects<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; of both on faith and philosophy. In a 1980<BR>interview with the Minneapolis Star, Dickson said<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; all his books were ``laboratory pieces. I'm<BR>trying something new in each one.''<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; He collaborated with another fledgling sci-fi<BR>writer destined for greatness, Poul Anderson, in<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; publishing his first work in the 1950s.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Dickson's books sold more than 10 million copies<BR>and were translated into such languages as<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Portuguese and Bulgarian. He was president of<BR>the Science Fiction Writers of America from<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1969 to 1971.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; His Hugos were for short fiction. He won one in<BR>1965 for ``Soldier, Ask Not'' and two in<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1981, for ``Lost Dorsai'' and ``The Cloak and<BR>the Staff.'' He also won a Nebula award in<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 1966 for ``Call Him Lord.''<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 06:07:09 -0600<BR>From: "D. Smart" &lt;dsmart@imagin.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re: Gearhead question<BR><BR>"Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" posted:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Gerry Harris wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; In FF&amp;S, I want to strap a rocket onto a wheeled vehicle.&nbsp; How do I<BR>&gt; &gt; determine the power-to-weight ratio (which is usually given in<BR>&gt; &gt; MW/tonnes) and thus the speed of the hybrid vehicle?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Read this:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; http://www.purrsia.com/freefall/ff200/fv00102.htm<BR><BR>The above online comic strip is so true to Traveller<BR>players, it'd<BR>be scary if it wasn't so hilarious.<BR><BR>What's *really* funny is someone actually did this a few<BR>years' back<BR>here in the U.S. The guy mounted the JATO to the top of his<BR>car and<BR>lit it. After a few minutes, he tried to stop, burned out<BR>his brakes,<BR>and then went airborne.<BR><BR>He won the Darwin award (damn shame about that<BR>mountain-side).<BR><BR>David<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 22:11:50 +1000<BR>From: "Alan Bradley" &lt;alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR><BR>&gt; From: Kiri Aradia Morgan <BR>&gt; is this the Kisaragi haut-Rensselaer fief?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; ::gulp::<BR><BR>Now, *I'm* worried.<BR><BR>- --------<BR><BR>Hmm, 128 pages of stuff on this:&nbsp; Pretty intense.&nbsp; It reminds me of some of<BR>the 2300 supplements more than anything published for Traveller yet.<BR><BR>Actually, what I would really like to see would be a book on *Aramanx*. <BR>Anyone up for that one?<BR><BR>Alan Bradley<BR>alanb@elf.brisnet.org.au<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 05:48:35<BR>From: "Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR><BR>At 07:18 PM 2/2/2001 -0800, you wrote:<BR>&gt;on 2/2/01 6:54 PM, Douglas E. Berry at gridlore@pop.mindspring.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Strouden is habitable without excessive aid.&nbsp; And since it is the most<BR>&gt;&gt; populous system in Lunion, and site to masses of Imperial-vital industies,<BR>&gt;&gt; solutions involving brute force will be frowned upon.<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Trust me, I chose this system for very specific reasons.<BR><BR>Hmm.. without revealing too much.. this isn't a "long-simmering" thing.&nbsp; It<BR>is a sudden change to the status quo.&nbsp; And the ringleaders are..<BR><BR>no, that would be telling. :)<BR>- -- <BR><BR>Douglas E. Berry&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; gridlore@mindspring.com<BR>http://gridlore.home.mindspring.com/index.html<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 10:15:13 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>Leonard wrote:<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Returning fire with arrows sticking out of you is not easy.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; True, but it's a lot easier than returning fire with a bone broken or<BR>fragmented by bullet from a rifle, or a fat, cigar-butt-sized pistol slug in<BR>your gut, or grenade shrapnel in your leg. Strangely enough, soldiers have<BR>been known to return fire under such conditions.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Still, even if I'm to accept that any one of the riflemen would have<BR>"arrows" sticking out, and to be honest I suspect the soldier at rifle range<BR>who has "arrows" sticking out really angered some higher power, or simply<BR>was born with no luck whatsoever.<BR><BR>&gt;And I daresay that seeing that arrow sticking out of them will shock a<BR>&gt;"modern" soldier a lot more than a you may be accounting for.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Maybe, but this is perhaps the most bizarre point you've raised in this<BR>discussion so far. If I catch the gist of what you're writing here, the<BR>"modern" soldier is unaccustomed to seeing an arrow sticking out of his body<BR>and, as a result, this will be "shocking". I'm not entirely sure that I<BR>would agree, as I'm not sure (as a modern or a post-modern) if I would be<BR>more shocked by taking a look at my arm or chest and seeing a gaping bullet<BR>wound or a shaft sticking out of my body. On the one hand its somewhat<BR>subjective, but on the other hand modern soldiers are confronted with a<BR>variety of displays on the battlefied which are more gruesome and much more<BR>horrifying. I would say that it's a tough call, but I'm really unaware of<BR>any precedent for this. At various points in history "modern" troops fought<BR>battles against archers employed by enemies, and I'm unaware that the sight<BR>of an arrow-shaft sticking out of the body was ever a special factor. For<BR>example, I'm unaware that American soldiers fighting American Indians were<BR>demoralized more by the sight of their own wounds when compared to Union or<BR>Confederate soldiers in the civil war.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I'm not sure that -- to a soldier familiar with the sights of a<BR>contemporary battlefield -- a wound from a 27 inch arrow shaft is any more<BR>"shocking" than other sorts of wounds which a soldier has seen or suffered.<BR>It may not even be all that important, because a case can be made that a<BR>company of archers may have a harder time hitting their target than you're<BR>claiming.<BR><BR>&gt;They aren't going to be using razor broadheads, either. More likely<BR>&gt;something along the lines of a bodkin point. Which isn't that different<BR>&gt;from a "tent stake" type bayonet except in size.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Well, they'd do much better with broadhead arrows unless the members of the<BR>rifle squad were wearing mail or plate armor. The bodkin was a medieval<BR>"armor piercing" arrow. The broadhead would create a much wider wound<BR>channel, which means it will cause more tissue damage. Due to a broadhead's<BR>construction the wound is bloodier, and since medieval broadheads were<BR>usually barbed, they were harder to remove (unless you happen to subscribe<BR>to the theory that bodkin arrows were not connected tightly to their shafts,<BR>which would cause the head itself to dislodge in the body when someone tried<BR>to pull out the shaft).<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Of course, if the archers' opponents are wearing some sort of armor which<BR>would be a problem for a broadhead to pierce, the bodkin would certainly be<BR>the way to go. Both types of arrows were used by British longbowmen.<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Well, the English longbowmen were except to hit *smaller* targets at<BR>&gt;ranges of over 100 yards. I actually expect that while the rifles will<BR>&gt;have a range advantage, it won't be as marked as you seem to think.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I think that you're overestimating longbowmen, Leonard. Here are some<BR>reasonable guesstimates based on the known performance of various bows<BR>throughout history: Longbows in the 50-90 lb. draw-weight range have a<BR>maximum effective range of between about 190 and 250 yards. That's about the<BR>furthest that an archer with a longbow can be expected to hit a reasonably<BR>sized target with enough force to do some serious damage. At a greater<BR>distance, hits become a factor of an archer's luck. You'll get a little more<BR>range out of a longbow with a greater draw-weight, but it's not going to be<BR>that much more, and such bows are going to be much harder to use.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Now, if I recall correctly, the longest "distance shots" ever recorded with<BR>flight arrows (lighter and less damaging arrows than the British bowmen<BR>would have used) were in the range of 800 to 900 yards or so. At this scale,<BR>being exact isn't terribly important. Even amazing archers would have little<BR>in the way of accuracy at that range and -- perhaps much more importantly --<BR>the arrows themselves wouldn't really penetrate too well, which would mean<BR>that they're not going to do nearly as much damage.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; So, even if we allow war arrows to have the sort of absolute maximum range<BR>that flight arrows could have, the archers aren't going to be nearly as<BR>accurate in the roughly 600 - 700 yard swath between their maximum effective<BR>range and the absolute maximum range of their bows. Even if their arrows do<BR>find their targets at extended range, they're probably not going to be doing<BR>that much in the way of damage.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Now, I feel the need to insert a very important note in here: In another<BR>post on this topic, you commented that what Ian was saying was valid only if<BR>"low-tech" was assumed to be synonymous with "stupid". At ranges beyond<BR>roughly 250 yards, but below the absolute maximum range of the bows, the<BR>archers are only going to have a chance of hitting if they are able to<BR>concentrate their fire. Historically, that was one of the strengths of<BR>longbow archers. In order to do this, they're going to have to coordinate<BR>and it would be to their advantage to fire in volleys. They're going to need<BR>to lay down lots of arrows over a patch of ground at approximately the same<BR>time. This is going to be a lot easier for them if they're massed.<BR>Otherwise, they're going to simply be firing shots which are effectively at<BR>random. Depending on the number of archers in the company, even if they are<BR>able to coordinate well, they might not be able to generate the kind of hail<BR>of arrows which the scenario would required for their survival.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Rifles of various sorts have varying ranges, and the skill level of<BR>riflemen varies today and varied quite a bit in various times and places. At<BR>anything over 300 yards or so, the rifle squad would have the distinct range<BR>advantage. If the riflemen could be said to have a skill level which is<BR>comparable to contemporary U.S. Marines, with relatively low TL bolt action<BR>rifles, then it would pretty much be all over but the cryin'. It would be<BR>possible to cook the situation in various ways: completely green riflemen,<BR>really, really low-powered rifles, demoralized riflemen, untrained riflemen,<BR>or whatever, but none of those were part of the original scenario.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The riflemen would have other advantages as well. First, they wouldn't have<BR>to be as tightly coordinated as the archers would need to be. Even working<BR>as individuals they could simply pick off the archers. This would make it<BR>much more difficult for the archers to "suppress" them in any meaningful<BR>way. They'd have to spread their coverage pretty thin to get at all of the<BR>members of a squad with rifles who are spread out. Second, rifles are much<BR>easier to aim than longbows are, and firing bows with draw-weights between<BR>50 and 90 lbs. is tiring, strenuous work (and the archers are only going to<BR>get long ranges with the strongest types of bows).<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I'm going to stick with the hypothetical situation as originally presented:<BR>on open ground a contemporary rifle squad is going to have a pretty sizable<BR>advantage over the company of longbowmen. If the engagement is moved off of<BR>open ground, then the rifle squad's advantage would likely grow<BR>considerably. Forested terrain would really cut down on the maximum possible<BR>range of the bows, as the arc required to get long ranges would be difficult<BR>to attain. In urban environments, the conditions would favor the riflemen by<BR>a much greater margin, for the obvious reason that massed fire is not really<BR>possible and the rifle squad could make more effective use of cover than the<BR>archers. Windy weather would, in almost all cases, make things much harder<BR>for the archers. At best, favorable winds for the archers would increase the<BR>range of the arrows and the expense of accuracy. In any scenario, both range<BR>and accuracy would be at a premium for the archers.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Even at closer ranges, which would allow longbowmen to take the greatest<BR>advantage of their direct aiming skill, the riflemen would still have<BR>certain advantages. Still, this is where the archers would appear to be most<BR>effective than the riflemen. While longbows are slower than many rifles, the<BR>bowmen would have the advantage of sheer numbers. Still, unless the riflemen<BR>are surprised by the archer company I find it difficult to believe that<BR>riflemen would allow the enemy to get closer than about 250 yards.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; In short, I'm really hard-pressed to imagine a scenario in which the<BR>strength of the company of bowmen could match or surpass the rifle squad.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Longbows were effective because the archers were able to lay a hail of<BR>arrows into the massed ranks of enemy footsoldiers who were armed with melee<BR>weapons. Then, once mounted enemy knights began to close in, the archers<BR>could accurately hit them and their horses. This meant that the opposing<BR>army suffered heavy losses before they got to they point that they could<BR>even use their weapons. The English attitude towards these bows was such<BR>that a large portion of the male population was trained in their use. This<BR>meant that they could launch a mind-boggling amount of arrows with some<BR>degree of accuracy, and they could do it over a very wide area. Other ranged<BR>weapons of the time were largely ineffective against longbowmen. Shortbows<BR>simply didn't have the range to compete, and archers employing them would<BR>have to close in order to engage the longbowmen, with predictable results.<BR>Some crossbows might have had competitive ranges, but they were much too<BR>slow when compared to the crossbow. The longbow could dominate the<BR>battlefield in the middle ages, but it doesn't seem as if it is competive<BR>with the rifle.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Rifles give troops greater accuracy at a greater range than longbows,<BR>they're easier to aim, and in most cases they can fire more quickly.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; It was the tactics of the time which allowed the use of the longbow to<BR>flourish. If you take these poor archers out of their proper environment,<BR>they can't do their job properly and I think it's reasonable to conclude<BR>that they're going to perform poorly against contemporary soldiers.<BR><BR>&gt;Also, if there *is* any sort of concealment available, the archers have<BR>&gt;the advantage, as their weapons are *very* "suppressed". :-)<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; It depends on the type of concealment. For example, a couple of riflemen in<BR>a farmhouse within rifle range of the archers would be pretty much<BR>impervious to any real harm, unless the archers could use flaming arrows. A<BR>couple of riflemen hidden in a small cluster of trees would likewise have a<BR>massive advantage. Many forms of cover and concealment would work to the<BR>advantage of riflemen. In order to lay down a hail of arrows at long range,<BR>the archers would have to keep loading, pulling, aiming and launching. They<BR>simply wouldn't be able to afford to stop, especially at extended range.<BR>This would mean that they couldn't duck behind cover, or assume a prone<BR>position while firing, or frequently even conceal themselves behind certain<BR>types of cover.<BR><BR>&gt;Depends a *lot* on the terrain and other variables.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Not really. It seems to be pretty clear that the rifle is simply much more<BR>versatile than the longbow. Riflemen would likely outperform archers in a<BR>much wider variety of situations, especially at long range.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 15:41:35 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Great Myths laid to rest...<BR><BR>on 3/2/01 10:40 am, Simon Brodie at mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; &lt;snip&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Right, which explains why the RAF reported seeing them fall over in the<BR>&gt;&gt; Falklands war^H^H^Hconflict. They must have been using silent stealth planes<BR>&gt;&gt; - y'know: Avro Vulcans, Panavia Tornadoes, Hawker Harriers... :)<BR>&gt;&gt; <BR>&gt;&gt; Gordon.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Actually, the Harrier was built by BAe, but whose counting<BR>&gt; :-)<BR>&gt; Si<BR><BR>The current ones were (apart from the Boeing ones). Who developed it, and<BR>built all the original service aircraft prior to GR.3? Hawker Siddeley<BR>became part of BAe in 1977, a year after GR.3 was developed by Hawker.<BR><BR>http://www.fighter-planes.com/info/harrier.htm<BR><BR>But as you say, who's counting? ;)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR>PS: I will admit that most of the ones used in the Falklands were GR.3s,<BR>some of which were Hawker bulit, but most of which were BAe built.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 10:39:19 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Traveller Gearhead Ring News<BR><BR>Due to Yahoo's mismanaging of the webring. I can't support new sites using <BR>the y!webring system.<BR><BR>New members will be added to the ringsurf version of the this ring. <A <BR>HREF="http://www.ringsurf.com/netring?ring=travgearhead;action=addform"&gt;join <BR>the ringsurf version</A><BR>I encourage all current members to move to the ringsurf version.<BR>I'm not going to delete this ring, but I can not manage it (lack of tools <BR>under Yahoo mismanagement) and I won't add any new sites."<BR><BR>I'm sending this out to the TML because one of the things Yahoo has <BR>mismanaged to fubar levels is the tool that lets you contact the individual <BR>sites.<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>These opinions are mine, no one else wants `em.<BR>Joan of Arc: the patron saint of welders http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 10:14:20 -0600<BR>From: Charles McKnight &lt;cmcknight01@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>Hey Dom,<BR><BR>What does 5 evaluate to in USD, is BITS available for those of us in the <BR>"colonies"?&nbsp; &lt;grin&gt;<BR><BR>Chuck<BR><BR>At 11:19 AM 2/3/01 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;At 15:25 -0500 2/2/01, Traveller-digest Simon Brodie <BR>&gt;&lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;for those of you in the UK, i hope you are all bits members (British Isles<BR>&gt;&gt;Traveller Support).&nbsp; 5 gets you life membership with frequent magazines <BR>&gt;&gt;and a<BR>&gt;&gt;second-hand sales brochure every few months.&nbsp; The web site is at www.bits.org<BR>&gt;&gt;i think.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;http://www.bits.org.uk/<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;http://www.core.org.uk/<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;BITS it's the only way to be sure.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;;-)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Dom (BITS Webmaster)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 16:23:39 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Classic Traveller Info<BR><BR>on 3/2/01 10:07 am, Simon Brodie at mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk<BR>wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I would like to know if there are any sites (or if any of you have on your<BR>&gt; hard drives) the following info:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; A Detailed Classic Traveller timeline.<BR><BR>Donald McKinney has the Integrated Traveller Timeline:<BR><BR>http://www.prairienet.org/~dmckinne/timeline.html<BR><BR>&gt; A CT GM screen format or general aide memoir.<BR><BR>Can't help there. You could look for:<BR><BR>Judges Guild 75&nbsp; &nbsp; Traveller Referee Screen<BR>Star Quest Games&nbsp;&nbsp; Original Traveller Referee Screen<BR><BR>Apparently an Andrew Kemp was writing one, but it's vanished:<BR><BR>http://www.magicboard.demon.co.uk/traveller.htm<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 10:30:05 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>There is one very good point about Energy Weapons.<BR><BR>If a weapon can be made solid state then it should end up more reliable then<BR>a slug thrower that pretty much requires moving parts.<BR><BR>Also, if that solid state Laser was tunable then an onboard computer could<BR>tune the output to be the most effective for the atmosphere.<BR><BR>Still the limiting factors are can it be solid state (sure in a sci fi game<BR>we can do amlost anything), and can you port enough energy to fuel it.<BR><BR>On point 2, this might be possible if you used somethign other then<BR>batteries.&nbsp; Say small pellets of trituim that you lase to cause small fusion<BR>reactions...then stage that to a higher level for the Laser impulse.&nbsp; Sort<BR>of like one of the Hot Fusion techniques under development.<BR><BR>Of course then you have to carry the pellets, and some moving part has to<BR>place them in position for firing etc.&nbsp; So perhaps that is not a great idea.<BR>B-)<BR><BR>And now I remember why I missed this list for the 4 or so years I was off<BR>it.<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 10:35:44 -0600<BR>From: "David C. Broussard" &lt;broussa@connecti.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Question.....<BR><BR>&gt; I don't disagree, but the difference in gravity between 0.5G and<BR>&gt; 2G will make a<BR>&gt; significant difference to WHERE you hit the target - not too good<BR>&gt; if you want to<BR>&gt; exit some being with the first shot and it just takes his jaw (or<BR>&gt; mandibles)<BR>&gt; off.<BR><BR>The point that I was making with an advanced Slug thrower is that with a<BR>small gravitometric sensor, and auto adjusting sights...it checks the local<BR>gravity, and adjusts the zero point for range accordingly.<BR><BR>&gt; And i would contest the fact that slug throwers are used over<BR>&gt; short distances.<BR><BR>Totally correct.&nbsp; When I was learning to shoot, my Dad warned me that the<BR>.22 I was using was still moving almost a mile downrange...thus I was taught<BR>to never just shoot it without a backstop.<BR><BR>However, it is the ability to stabilize a weapon that determines range.<BR>Now, if you put some stabilization tech on the rifle it could compensate for<BR>a bit, and an optical or electronic imager could extend a bit farther...but<BR>practically engaging a man sized target at over 1000m is a difficult<BR>proposition for the average person.&nbsp; Firing prone from a foxhole with a<BR>scope and a rest...yeah, it is possible.&nbsp; But standing or kneeling, or<BR>returning fire...that is problematic.<BR><BR>DCB<BR>David C. Broussard (broussa@connecti.com)<BR>ICQ PIN 1259783<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR>The opinions represented herein are the sole responsibility of<BR>the proclaimer, and should not be interpreted as dogma, doctrine<BR>philosophy, or anything else other than blabber.&nbsp; However, if you<BR>REALLY like it, then gimme a dollar!<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 16:33:51 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>on 3/2/01 4:14 pm, Charles McKnight at cmcknight01@home.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Hey Dom,<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; What does 5 evaluate to in USD, is BITS available for those of us in the<BR>&gt; "colonies"?&nbsp; &lt;grin&gt;<BR><BR>$7.35 as of just now. It will fluctuate, so here's a live price exchange:<BR><BR>http://www.xe.net/ucc/convert.cgi<BR><BR>"Although BITS was founded in the UK, it has a small number of European and<BR>North American members."<BR><BR>&nbsp; -- from the "About BITS" page on http://www.bits.org.uk/<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 16:39:40 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>on 3/2/01 3:15 pm, Chris Seamans at semo@pil.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I think that you're overestimating longbowmen, Leonard. Here are some<BR>&gt; reasonable guesstimates based on the known performance of various bows<BR>&gt; throughout history: Longbows in the 50-90 lb. draw-weight range have a<BR>&gt; maximum effective range of between about 190 and 250 yards. That's about the<BR><BR>There's a lot riding on standard earth gravity and atmospheric density here,<BR>isn't there. ;)<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 08:49:43 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Michael Cessna &lt;graymask1120@yahoo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Landgrab in Glisten.....<BR><BR>&nbsp; Dear All,<BR><BR>&nbsp; This is to announce the latest Landgrabber: Your's<BR>truly, laying claim to:<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Horosho/Glisten 2138 C3378A6A<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Romar/Glisten&nbsp;&nbsp; 2140 B4504568<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Wurzburg&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 2237 C795300A<BR><BR>&nbsp; Systems will be generated using CT/Book 6, with<BR>supplementary information from GT/BTC.<BR><BR>&nbsp; Be back when I surface for air.......<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Michael A Cessna<BR><BR>__________________________________________________<BR>Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 <BR>a year!&nbsp; http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 08:54:48 -0800<BR>From: "J A \(Jim\) Cooper" &lt;tloql@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: spinwardmarches.com<BR><BR>Looks good to me. S/b a fun project.<BR><BR>Jim<BR><BR><BR>&gt; All landgrab and other interested parties.&nbsp; I have begun the sector<BR>databse<BR>&gt; for all worlds in the spinward marches.&nbsp; I will be including all canon<BR>data<BR>&gt; and links or data from the respective landgrabees.&nbsp; Just the shell now,<BR>but<BR>&gt; take a look at http://www.spinwardmarches.com<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Tod<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3594<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yg04.mx.aol.com (rly-yg04.mail.aol.com [172.18.147.4]) by air-yg05.mail.aol.com (v77_r1.21) with ESMTP; Sat, 03 Feb 2001 11:55:52 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yg04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sat, 03 Feb 2001 11:55:20 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id LAA63948;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sat, 3 Feb 2001 11:54:50 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sat, 3 Feb 2001 11:54:31 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id LAA63889<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sat, 3 Feb 2001 11:54:31 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 11:54:31 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102031654.LAA63889@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3594<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3595</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/3/01 4:05:12 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Saturday, February 3 2001&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3595<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: spinwardmarches.com<BR>Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR>Re: spinwardmarches.com<BR>Bloo's website/map files<BR>Landgrab updates on Downport<BR>Re: Landgrab -- Lablon<BR>Re: Bloo's website/map files<BR>Re: Gearhead question<BR>RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Re: Gearhead question<BR>spinwardmarches.com<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR>Re: AHL and Space Hulk<BR>Thanks to Jimmy Simpson<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>RE: Web Sites<BR>Re: Traveller Gearhead Ring News<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 17:26:43 +0000<BR>From: Paul Campbell &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: spinwardmarches.com<BR><BR>On Fri, Feb 02, 2001 at 03:26:25PM -0800, Tod Glenn wrote:<BR>&gt; All landgrab and other interested parties.&nbsp; I have begun the sector databse<BR>&gt; for all worlds in the spinward marches.&nbsp; I will be including all canon data<BR>&gt; and links or data from the respective landgrabees.&nbsp; Just the shell now, but<BR>&gt; take a look at http://www.spinwardmarches.com<BR><BR>I like it.&nbsp; Should be even better once it's fleshed out with more content.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Paul Campbell (Sourceforge) &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>GPG Key fingerprint = 9C4F 31A3 8814 9F94 A533 A979 E63F 0C69 A771 0F24<BR>http://www.kemitix.uklinux.net<BR>jupiter: 5:25pm up 25 days, 7:05, 2 users, load average: 0.16, 0.49, 0.46<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 09:40:24 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR><BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR>...<BR>&gt;Hmm.. without revealing too much.. this isn't a "long-simmering" thing.&nbsp; It<BR>&gt;is a sudden change to the status quo.&nbsp; And the ringleaders are..<BR><BR>"short &amp; nasty"? Are you _allowed_ to use penguins from GURPS: Technomancer?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 09:40:56 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: spinwardmarches.com<BR><BR>on 2/3/01 9:26 AM, Paul Campbell at kemitix@users.sourceforge.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; On Fri, Feb 02, 2001 at 03:26:25PM -0800, Tod Glenn wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt; All landgrab and other interested parties.&nbsp; I have begun the sector databse<BR>&gt;&gt; for all worlds in the spinward marches.&nbsp; I will be including all canon data<BR>&gt;&gt; and links or data from the respective landgrabees.&nbsp; Just the shell now, but<BR>&gt;&gt; take a look at http://www.spinwardmarches.com<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I like it.&nbsp; Should be even better once it's fleshed out with more content.<BR><BR>Note that this will ultimately be replaced by the Grand Survey.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 09:47:09 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Bloo's website/map files<BR><BR>As I recall, Bloo had some illusrator files for subsector maps on his<BR>website.&nbsp; Anyone know the URL perchance?<BR><BR>Thanks, Tod<BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 13:35:30 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Landgrab updates on Downport<BR><BR>I have begun updating the Landgrab pages -<BR>http://www.downport.com/landgrab -and will continue through the weekend. I<BR>see that I am behind by several months and I wanted to apologize to the<BR>several folks who have waited for their material and claims to appear.<BR><BR>If you notice any mistakes or omissions in the listing, or if you have links<BR>to add, please contact me so that I can get a "known good" copy of this page<BR>up for you this week. Then maybe I can take some time to work on my own grab<BR>;-)<BR><BR>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~&lt;&gt;&lt;~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>Colin Michael, webmaster@downport.com<BR>www.Downport.com - "The Traveller Domain"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 18:42:17 <BR>From: "John Lambert" &lt;hovtej@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrab -- Lablon<BR><BR>I'm putting in claim for Lablon / Aramis. If I've missed an earlier claim, <BR>please let me know.<BR><BR>John<BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 19:00:51 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Bloo's website/map files<BR><BR>on 3/2/01 5:47 pm, Tod Glenn at webmaster@travellercentral.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; As I recall, Bloo had some illusrator files for subsector maps on his<BR>&gt; website.&nbsp; Anyone know the URL perchance?<BR><BR>Either they are somewhere else or he deleted them:<BR><BR>http://portcaddo.com/bloo/traveller/<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 11:31:01 -0800<BR>From: "Pronto" &lt;pronto_r031@telus.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Gearhead question<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: February 3, 2001 2:05 AM<BR>Subject: Re: Gearhead question<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Gerry Harris wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; In FF&amp;S, I want to strap a rocket onto a wheeled vehicle.&nbsp; How do I<BR>&gt; &gt; determine the power-to-weight ratio (which is usually given in<BR>&gt; &gt; MW/tonnes) and thus the speed of the hybrid vehicle?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Read this:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; http://www.purrsia.com/freefall/ff200/fv00102.htm<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; * Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>&gt; | jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>&gt; | ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>&gt; * http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>The problem with that answer, Jens, is it answers 'Why not?' rather than<BR>'How?'<BR><BR>Pronto<BR>AKA Brian Taylor<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 12:43:05 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>On Sat, 3 Feb 2001 10:15:13 -0500 semo@pil.net (Chris Seamans) wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;I'm not entirely sure that I<BR>&gt;would agree, as I'm not sure (as a modern or a post-modern) if I would be<BR>&gt;more shocked by taking a look at my arm or chest and seeing a gaping bullet<BR>&gt;wound or a shaft sticking out of my body.<BR><BR>Except that military, or even civilian firearms, more often than not, tend to<BR>not leave 'gaping bullet wounds' Watch, "Emergency-life in the ER" or "Trauma"<BR>on TLC (if you get it) sometime. You'll see real-life small-arms wounds.<BR><BR>Bullet wounds tend not to be much larger that the bullets themselves. Miltary<BR>jacketed rounds, which tend to produce through&amp;through wounds more often than<BR>softer civilian slugs are even more likely to cause small visible wounds. <BR><BR>In ER situations, it's often difficult to _find_ exit woulds when they occur. <BR><BR>The stereotypical 'Exit wound the size of a basketball' is relatively rare,<BR>and depends on specific types of bullets (large caliber hollowpoint slugs)<BR>under specific conditions, and the damage from such a wound is more likely<BR>than not going to be immediately incapacitating, if not fatal.<BR><BR>Seeing a foot or two of arrow shaft sticking out of you is definitely going to<BR>be more noticeable.<BR><BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 13:01:57 -0700<BR>From: Bruce Johnson &lt;johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Re: Gearhead question<BR><BR>On Sat, 03 Feb 2001 06:07:09 -0600 dsmart@imagin.net (D. Smart) wrote:<BR><BR>be scary if it wasn't so hilarious.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;What's *really* funny is someone actually did this a few<BR>&gt;years' back<BR>&gt;here in the U.S. The guy mounted the JATO to the top of his<BR>&gt;car and<BR>&gt;lit it. After a few minutes, he tried to stop, burned out<BR>&gt;his brakes,<BR>&gt;and then went airborne.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;He won the Darwin award (damn shame about that<BR>&gt;mountain-side).<BR><BR><BR>Bzzzt! Thank you for playing, but the Darwin award version is pure urban<BR>legend.<BR><BR>try :<BR><BR>http://www.wagoneers.com/pages/RocketCar/rockit.html<BR><BR>For a side-splittingly hilarious account of what could be the true story. (The<BR>story's convincing, at any rate, told as first-person, not 'a friend of a<BR>friend' and clears many inconsistencies with the usual version of the story.)<BR><BR>Bruce Johnson<BR>College of Pharmacy<BR>Information Technology Group<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 15:01:12 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: spinwardmarches.com<BR><BR>Clean, yes.&nbsp; Very nicely laid out, and without the non-standard MS only <BR>stuff that some sites are using.<BR><BR>I recently visited a really cool traveller site, that only looked cool <BR>under MS Explorer.<BR><BR>Using Netscape, the page was blank, very uncool.<BR><BR>- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/&nbsp; Opinions Mine!<BR>Mort Sahl: General, aren't you supporting Castro by smoking that Havana cigar?<BR>Alexander Haig: I prefer to think of it as burning his crops to the ground.<BR>(from an interview of Mort Sahl on National Public Radio, 23nov91)<BR>- -------------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 11:33:02 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; And despite the prowess of English yeoman, reloading is far faster with a<BR>&gt; magazine fed assault rifle.&nbsp; I can get off an reasonably aimed shot every<BR>&gt; second.&nbsp; Thirty rounds to a magazine, and reloads in about 5 seconds.<BR><BR>Well, my SKS only holds 10 rounds (unless I use one of those after<BR>market magazines, which I don't trust very far. But the strippers are<BR>easier to carry, and if anything, *quicker* to reload with.<BR><BR>&gt; Think of that.&nbsp; One needn't import offworld troops, just some cadre and<BR>&gt; assault rifles.&nbsp; Arm the dispossed serfs, and give them an assault rifle.<BR>&gt; Now some poor sot with two weeks training can be on at least equal terms<BR>&gt; with the cream of the yeomanry.<BR><BR>Actually, you aren't going to *have* serfs and yeomanry at the same<BR>time. The longbow was one of the reasons peasant *became* yeomanry, and<BR>notable less oppressed. :-)<BR><BR>The musket/rifle just made the situation even worse.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 15:08:35 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Short &amp; Nasty<BR><BR>"Douglas E. Berry" &lt;gridlore@pop.mindspring.com&gt; types:<BR>&gt;At 08:18 AM 2/2/2001 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;The other question is: how big is your merc unit?&nbsp; Strouden, IIRC, is a<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt;high-population world.<BR>&gt; &gt;The 'de-heading' part doesn't have to be big.<BR>&gt; &gt;The non-lethal sections needs to fair sized, but well supported.<BR>&gt; &gt;In nice big TL C city sized buildings, control of the environmental systems<BR>&gt; &gt;is a huge force multiplier.<BR>&gt;Strouden is habitable without excessive aid.&nbsp; And since it is the most<BR>&gt;populous system in Lunion, and site to masses of Imperial-vital industies,<BR>&gt;solutions involving brute force will be frowned upon.<BR>&gt;Trust me, I chose this system for very specific reasons.<BR><BR>Hmmm...in re-reading Dune in preparation for the TV Mini-series, I was <BR>reminded that the Duke had a propaganda corps.<BR><BR>Any good Hearts &amp; Minds unit would have these folks.<BR>Take over ISN, and don't be as heavy handed as President Clark.<BR><BR>I still say use Higher Tech to find &amp; identify the ring leaders and take <BR>'em out in a short &amp; nasty, ok...and quiet way.<BR><BR><BR>- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>urbin@bigfoot.com http://www.bigfoot.com/~urbin/&nbsp; Opinions Mine!<BR>"The whole tide of history has shown us that if you lie loud enough and<BR>long enough that no matter how ludicrous the lie is people will believe it"<BR>Democrat strategist James Carville (United Press International, 8/8/84)<BR>- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 22:25:48 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: AHL and Space Hulk<BR><BR>On Sat, 3 Feb 2001, Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm wrote:<BR>&gt; How about using a complete set of AHL deckplans with the Space Hulk<BR>&gt; rules? Wouldn't that be a blast?<BR><BR>This might need some modifications to the jump space - or where did<BR>some of the misjumped ships go? B-)<BR><BR>(Actually, after I get my players' characters away from their current<BR>situation, they might get stranded in a different universe...)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 12:50:06 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Thanks to Jimmy Simpson<BR><BR>Just to let everyone know, I wanted to say thanks to Jimmy Simpson for<BR>providing a couple of really nice Adobe Illustrator subsector maps, one of<BR>which is now posted at spinwardmarches.com.<BR><BR>I will be expanding the section to include many more worlds, and also making<BR>template files available for those who can help by filling in data on their<BR>own worlds.<BR><BR>We're off and running.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 12:24:30 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; "Matthew W. Helton" wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; -Ah an engineer speaks at last (or i hope you are from your eloquent and<BR>&gt;&gt; spot on<BR>&gt;&gt; reply).&nbsp; Only thing you missed is that energy weapons (specifically lasers)<BR>&gt;&gt; are<BR>&gt;&gt; very hard to dodge (speed of light and all that stuff).-<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; So are Projectiles moving at anything faster than 200 Meters per<BR>&gt;&gt; second...Especially if they are moving over 1000 Meters per second. It's<BR>&gt;&gt; hard to outrun a bullet if you are a soldier on foot.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Yes but if the first round/burst misses you can always dive for cover (apart<BR>&gt; from the big stuff i admit) but at c, you wont even see the missing burst <BR>&gt; (the<BR>&gt; most energetic lasers will be of a wavelength that the human eye is not<BR>&gt; receptive to), although i admit you may see the 'impact' point if there is<BR>&gt; enough energy released by the beam to vaporize whatever it hits.<BR><BR>Any laser capable of a single shot "incapacitation" *will* be visible<BR>in any reasonable atmosphere. In sunlight of Earth level strength, it<BR>may be hard to see (as is fire, if you've ever had a non-smoky fire<BR>outdoors on a sunny day), but there will be stuff you can see from<BR>ionization effects to dust and insects getting zapped by the beam.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 13:04:20 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; By my calculation, good results should be obtained with different<BR>&gt; figures.&nbsp; For a 2 mm beam diameter, each pulse should be about 30<BR>&gt; Joules, spaced about 5 microseconds apart.<BR><BR>If the pulses are 1 microsecond long, that's a power level of 30<BR>megawatts. Shorter pulses *raise* the peak power levels. For instance<BR>if you drop the piulse duration to 1 nanosecond, you raise the power<BR>level to 30 gigawatts.<BR><BR>And it's the peak power level that you need to deal with in designing<BR>the weapon. It's going to be *very* hard to get a weapon that is man<BR>portable *and* achieves that power level, even as pulses.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; The temporary cavity<BR>&gt; should be about 5 mm deeper by the time the next pulse arrives (though<BR>&gt; not as much wider, since the expansion is anisotropic).<BR><BR>5 mm in 5 microseconds is 1000 m/s expansion velocity.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 21:34:40 -0000<BR>From: "Mark Preston" &lt;mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Web Sites<BR><BR>&gt; Megan Robertson wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I am currently rewriting the 'System Resources' pages for<BR>&gt; the RPGA UK website (a job their webmaster has passed<BR>&gt; on to me, someone must have told him I write websites for<BR>&gt; a living, drat!); and there will naturally be a page devoted<BR>&gt; to TRAVELLER<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Mexal.<BR>&gt;<BR>Well, I wonder who that could have been Mexal? &lt;grin&gt;.<BR><BR>Never mind, it could be worse. He's roped me in too, and I'm not even<BR>a member these days.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 16:34:29 -0600<BR>From: Leslie Bates &lt;lesbates@minn.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Gearhead Ring News<BR><BR>At 10:39 AM 2/3/01 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Due to Yahoo's mismanaging of the webring. I can't support new sites using <BR>&gt;the y!webring system.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;New members will be added to the ringsurf version of the this ring. <A <BR>&gt;HREF="http://www.ringsurf.com/netring?ring=travgearhead;action=addform"&gt;join <BR>&gt;the ringsurf version</A><BR><BR>Pardon me sir, but how does a mere surfer access the Ringsurf version of<BR>the webring?<BR><BR>Les<BR><BR>=======================================================<BR>Objects on screen may be more hostile than they appear.<BR>=======================================================<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 14:44:02 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; There is one very good point about Energy Weapons.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; If a weapon can be made solid state then it should end up more reliable then<BR>&gt; a slug thrower that pretty much requires moving parts.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Also, if that solid state Laser was tunable then an onboard computer could<BR>&gt; tune the output to be the most effective for the atmosphere.<BR><BR>Solid state *and* tunable are likely to be contradictory requirements.<BR><BR>&gt; Still the limiting factors are can it be solid state (sure in a sci fi game<BR>&gt; we can do amlost anything), and can you port enough energy to fuel it.<BR><BR>The big problem with solid state is heat. Peak power levels for a laser<BR>weapon are insane. (megawatts to gigawatts or higher). And you need to<BR>be able to get rid of that heat. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 15:00:14 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; on 3/2/01 3:15 pm, Chris Seamans at semo@pil.net wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; I think that you're overestimating longbowmen, Leonard. Here are some<BR>&gt;&gt; reasonable guesstimates based on the known performance of various bows<BR>&gt;&gt; throughout history: Longbows in the 50-90 lb. draw-weight range have a<BR>&gt;&gt; maximum effective range of between about 190 and 250 yards. That's about <BR>&gt; the<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; There's a lot riding on standard earth gravity and atmospheric density here,<BR>&gt; isn't there. ;)<BR><BR>It also depends on how spread out that squad is while advancing. After<BR>all, until they know they are in trouble, they'll be walking, not<BR>crawling. <BR><BR>That max effective range may be extended some if they are just doing<BR>max range high angle covering fire. <BR><BR>Anybody have info/sources that goes into that sort of detail?<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 14:48:31 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; On Sat, 3 Feb 2001 10:15:13 -0500 semo@pil.net (Chris Seamans) wrote:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;I'm not entirely sure that I<BR>&gt;&gt;would agree, as I'm not sure (as a modern or a post-modern) if I would be<BR>&gt;&gt;more shocked by taking a look at my arm or chest and seeing a gaping bullet<BR>&gt;&gt;wound or a shaft sticking out of my body.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Except that military, or even civilian firearms, more often than not, tend to<BR>&gt; not leave 'gaping bullet wounds' Watch, "Emergency-life in the ER" or <BR>&gt; "Trauma"<BR>&gt; on TLC (if you get it) sometime. You'll see real-life small-arms wounds.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Bullet wounds tend not to be much larger that the bullets themselves. Miltary<BR>&gt; jacketed rounds, which tend to produce through&amp;through wounds more often than<BR>&gt; softer civilian slugs are even more likely to cause small visible wounds. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; In ER situations, it's often difficult to _find_ exit woulds when they <BR>&gt; occur. <BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The stereotypical 'Exit wound the size of a basketball' is relatively rare,<BR>&gt; and depends on specific types of bullets (large caliber hollowpoint slugs)<BR>&gt; under specific conditions, and the damage from such a wound is more likely<BR>&gt; than not going to be immediately incapacitating, if not fatal.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Seeing a foot or two of arrow shaft sticking out of you is definitely going <BR>&gt; to be more noticeable.<BR><BR>Also, unless the bullet breaks a bone, or nicks a major artery/tendon<BR>(leaving it on the edge of tearing) you *can* move. It just hurts. <BR><BR>With an arrow in you moving hurts a *lot* more and *will* do more<BR>damage in many cases.<BR><BR>Oh yeah, unless the docs have an arrow drawing spoon, they'll have to<BR>do a moderately large "cut down" to get a barbed arrowhead ot. Either<BR>that or push it thru. <BR><BR>Oh yeah, the other nasty about arrows. Besides carrying a *lot* more<BR>"foreign matter" into the wound, the shaft tends to catch on things as<BR>you try to move around. *especially* if you were prone. <BR><BR>Which is why standard practice seems to have been to break of the shaft<BR>close to the body if you can't extract the arrow, and have to move the<BR>wounded man. <BR><BR>Evil thought... Finding out that some trader sold the natives a few<BR>tens or hundreds thousands of arrow shafts made of some nice strong<BR>alloy or composite material. You *can't* break the ^&amp;@#%$&amp; shafts off!<BR><BR>BTW, it occurs to me that *because* arrows tend to be "high angle"<BR>fire, being prone is actually going to *increase* the chance of being<BR>hit by an arrow!<BR><BR>Every time a bit of grass moves the "wrong" way it's going to get a few<BR>arrows, if the archers suspect you are out there. <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 18:54:34 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>I wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt;I'm not entirely sure that I<BR>&gt;&gt;would agree, as I'm not sure (as a modern or a post-modern) if I would be<BR>&gt;&gt;more shocked by taking a look at my arm or chest and seeing a gaping<BR>bullet<BR>&gt;&gt;wound or a shaft sticking out of my body.<BR><BR>Bruce Johnson wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Except that military, or even civilian firearms, more often than not, tend<BR>to<BR>&gt;not leave 'gaping bullet wounds' Watch, "Emergency-life in the ER" or<BR>"Trauma"<BR>&gt;on TLC (if you get it) sometime. You'll see real-life small-arms wounds.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Bullet wounds tend not to be much larger that the bullets themselves.<BR>Miltary<BR>&gt;jacketed rounds, which tend to produce through&amp;through wounds more often<BR>than<BR>&gt;softer civilian slugs are even more likely to cause small visible wounds.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;In ER situations, it's often difficult to _find_ exit woulds when they<BR>occur.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;The stereotypical 'Exit wound the size of a basketball' is relatively rare,<BR>&gt;and depends on specific types of bullets (large caliber hollowpoint slugs)<BR>&gt;under specific conditions, and the damage from such a wound is more likely<BR>&gt;than not going to be immediately incapacitating, if not fatal.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Slow down there a bit, Bruce. I'm quite sure that I didn't even mention<BR>"stereotypical exit wounds the size of a basketball" anywhere in my post.<BR>Indeed, I'm reasonably sure I never mentioned exit wounds at all, and I<BR>certainly didn't in the segment you quoted. Obviously, "gaping" carried a<BR>connotation I didn't intend, so I'll clarify what I meant when I wrote the<BR>bit that you quoted: I am truly not sure whether I would be more shocked to<BR>see a wide-open wound from a bullet in my body, or the closed wound from the<BR>wooden shaft of an arrow sticking out of my body. I did not mean it to<BR>suggest that I believed exit wounds to be the "size of a basketball", nor<BR>that bullet wounds in general are in some way huge or gigantic. I apologize<BR>for any confusion I may have caused.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The point of the bit of my post you quoted was to challenge Leonard's claim<BR>that the visible evidence of an arrow wound would be "shocking" enough to<BR>modern soldiers to make this an important factor in a battle between bowmen<BR>and riflemen. As I said, I'm not sure that I would agree.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; We do have a few conflicts which have involved bowmen and riflemen to look<BR>at, including the wars between the the United States and several Indian<BR>nations. My reading in this area is more extensive than most, but probably<BR>less estensive than some. I can not remember a single account, written in<BR>the 19th century, which made the claim that the sight of arrow shafts<BR>sticking out of the body had any significant effect on any battle. Whenever<BR>I've read such accounts the differences between bows and guns were always<BR>spelled out in other ways. The Indian's bows were silent, allowing them to<BR>strike unaware enemies quickly without raising the alarm; Indians with bows<BR>could fire more quickly than soldiers with muskets or single-shot rifles;<BR>and so on.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; More generally, I've never come across anything to indicate that, when it<BR>comes to moderns, an arrow wound is anymore "shocking" than a wound suffered<BR>from any other sort of weapon. If you can point me to something, anything,<BR>which indicates otherwise, I'll be happy to reconsider my position on this<BR>point. The only way I can imagine Leonard's claim working is if we assume<BR>that, in some way, that moderns are so "shocked" by arrows because they are<BR>unaccustomed to seeing wooden shafts sticking out of their bodies or the<BR>bodies of their comrades. Fair enough. However, such a position completely<BR>ignores the fact that most people are not accustomed to the vast majority of<BR>horrifying sights that they would see on a contemporary battlefield, and yet<BR>contemporary soldiers seem to be able to do their job in such an<BR>environment.<BR><BR>&gt;Seeing a foot or two of arrow shaft sticking out of you is definitely going<BR>to<BR>&gt;be more noticeable.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; But would it be "shocking" enough to make a difference in combat? That's<BR>what Leonard appeared to be claiming. I honestly don't know, but I'm<BR>inclined to strongly disagree with the claim. Assuming that both the archers<BR>and the riflemen have some combat experience, it's likely that both sides<BR>would have seen things far more horrible than the sight of an arrow sticking<BR>out of a body, even if we're to assume that each only had experiences with<BR>enemy troops wielding weapons of the same tech level.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 11:07:16 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>&gt; If the pulses are 1 microsecond long, that's a power level of 30<BR>&gt; megawatts.<BR><BR>Yep -- power levels are a complete bitch for any energy weapon.<BR>That's one thing I didn't bring up in the projectile-vs-energy debate,<BR>though completely valid.&nbsp; I would just have to assume that the problem<BR>is magically solved by Traveller tech.<BR><BR>Then again, I *have* built a pulsed laser capable of delivering a peak<BR>power of 230 MW (35 mJ pulse with a calculated pulse duration of 0.15<BR>nanoseconds).&nbsp; I'm sure if I really tried I could make one capable of<BR>delivering gigawatts (for a sufficiently short duration).<BR><BR><BR>&gt; And it's the peak power level that you need to deal with in designing<BR>&gt; the weapon. It's going to be *very* hard to get a weapon that is man<BR>&gt; portable *and* achieves that power level, even as pulses.<BR><BR>Well, my laser was certainly man-portable, including the power supply.<BR>Of course, the cycle time was far too long for any weapon use; on the<BR>order of ten seconds.&nbsp; Mean power output of milliwatts instead of<BR>kilowatts.&nbsp; Peak power is trivial.&nbsp; Pulse energy is difficult, as is<BR>reducing cycle time.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; 5 mm in 5 microseconds is 1000 m/s expansion velocity.<BR><BR>That's right.&nbsp; That's about the optimum.&nbsp; Too much faster and most of<BR>the energy is wasted in supersonic shock formation, too much slower<BR>and you don't do much damage and also have to worry more about target<BR>motion.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3595<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-zb02.mx.aol.com (rly-zb02.mail.aol.com [172.31.41.2]) by air-zb01.mail.aol.com (v77_r1.21) with ESMTP; Sat, 03 Feb 2001 19:05:12 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-zb02.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sat, 03 Feb 2001 19:04:56 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id TAA81469;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sat, 3 Feb 2001 19:02:55 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sat, 3 Feb 2001 19:02:36 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id TAA81414<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sat, 3 Feb 2001 19:02:36 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 19:02:36 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102040002.TAA81414@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3595<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3596</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/4/01 1:12:22 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sunday, February 4 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3596<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: Web Sites<BR>Re: Traveller Gearhead Ring News<BR>Landgrab 876-574/Five Sisters (long)<BR>Re: Landgrab 876-574/Five Sisters (long)<BR>52 million ton hull!<BR>Re: Partial For Sale List completed<BR>RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Landgrabs updated!<BR>Re: [TML] TNE [FILK]<BR>Re: [www] 04 Feb 2001 - Freelance Traveller Updated<BR>Travellers Digest 21 - The Pirates of Tetrini<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>SpinwardMarches.com<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR>Re: Bloo's website/map files<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 00:11:30 +0000<BR>From: Dominic Mooney &lt;dom@cybergoths.u-net.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Web Sites<BR><BR>At 11:54 -0500 3/2/01,&nbsp; Charles McKnight &lt;cmcknight01@home.com&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt;What does 5 evaluate to in USD, is BITS available for those of us in the<BR>&gt;"colonies"?&nbsp; &lt;grin&gt;<BR><BR>5 GBP is around $8 (or that's the way the BITS books have translated).<BR><BR>I'm afraid that BITS membership isn't currently available beyond the <BR>UK; we didn't think that the costs were viable. Andy <BR>(bits@bits.org.uk) would be the person to talk to about this though.<BR><BR>As a caveat, I'll add two things - 1stly, there are a few non-UK BITS <BR>authors who get the newsletters as a thank-you (but this is a very <BR>ad-hoc thing for people like Rob Prior who have done a lot) and 2ndly <BR>that Andy may take some time to reply as he is very busy at real work <BR>at the moment.<BR><BR>Cheers,<BR><BR>Dom<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 19:38:44 -0500<BR>From: Mark Urbin &lt;urbin@bigfoot.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Traveller Gearhead Ring News<BR><BR>Leslie Bates &lt;lesbates@minn.net&gt;<BR>&gt;At 10:39 AM 2/3/01 -0500, you wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt;Due to Yahoo's mismanaging of the webring. I can't support new sites using<BR>&gt; &gt;the y!webring system.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;New members will be added to the ringsurf version of the this ring. &lt;A<BR>&gt; &gt;HREF="http://www.ringsurf.com/netring?ring=travgearhead;action=addform"&gt;j <BR>&gt; oin<BR>&gt; &gt;the ringsurf version</A><BR>&gt;Pardon me sir, but how does a mere surfer access the Ringsurf version of<BR>&gt;the webring?<BR><BR>The ringsurf system provides the services that webring.org used to provide <BR>before Yahoo bout webring.org.<BR><BR>The URL for ringsurf is http://www.ringsuft.com/<BR><BR>The URL of the Traveller Gearhead Webring is <BR>http://www.ringsurf.com/netring?ring=travgearhead;action=home<BR><BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>www.urbin.net/EWW/ -- These opinions are mine, no one else wants `em.<BR>"Driving a Hudson Hornet on the disinformation triple bypass: cruising for<BR>burgers &amp; garage sales. Hooks baited, lines entangled, roadkill cooked"<BR>- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 01:07:48 <BR>From: "Michael McKeown" &lt;mmckeown67@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Landgrab 876-574/Five Sisters (long)<BR><BR>I'm reposting this to get some comments :-) I would greatly appreciate some.<BR>Thanks<BR>Mike<BR>TML - Landgrab. 876-574/Five Sisters (0140)<BR>I chose this world because I was basing a campaign around this world.<BR><BR>Main world - E687200-0 Lo nln 702 KV7<BR><BR>Star temperature- 4,100K Luminosity .16 Mass .63 Radius .0062&nbsp; lifespan 41 <BR>100 diameterdistance 1.24<BR><BR>BtC: Starport: Class I, Diameter 5,656 miles (9,100km). Atmosphere: Dense <BR>Oxygen Nitrogen.<BR>Surface Water 65% (deep oceans). Climate: very warm. Government: None. <BR>Control Rating: 0<BR>TL 1.<BR><BR>It orbits a KV7 class star which is dimmer than Sol. The main world is .35 <BR>AU's away. It is in thesecond orbit slot. It has a 100.16 day "year".&nbsp; The <BR>length of day or night is 47 days. The axial tilt<BR>is 29 degrees. The temperature increase for the summer is 16.2 degrees. The <BR>average temperatureof the world according to G: Space is 90 degrees F. <BR>Density 5.6 The main world has one moonwhich is 275 miles in diameter. The <BR>moon orbits at 54,000 miles from the planet.<BR><BR>There are eight planets in this system.<BR><BR>1&nbsp;&nbsp; Y300000-0 .12 AU distance from star<BR>2.. E687200-0 .35 AU distance from star<BR>3.&nbsp; Y510000 0 .82 AU distance from star<BR>4.&nbsp; Y210000 0 1.5 AU distance from star<BR>5. Y200000 0 2.8 AU distance from star<BR><BR><BR>The first four orbits of the star are filled with lifeless rockballs. None <BR>have been surveyed formineral wealth.<BR><BR>6. L GG (129,000 mile diameter 11 satellites 2 medium moons) 6.8 AU distance<BR>7. L GG (141,000 mile diameter 20 satellites 1 medium moons) 11.3 AU <BR>distance<BR>8. Y200000 0 (icy rockball) 22.5 AU distance from star<BR><BR>The outer system is unremarkable except for the 2 large gas gaints.<BR><BR>The starport is little more than several slabs of granite laid out to make a <BR>runway with a firepit nearby for a signal fire to guide ships by. The <BR>Starport was created hundreds of years ago by carving granite out of the <BR>sides of the mountains which line the center of the islands.<BR><BR><BR>BtC has a size of 5,656 and surface water of 65%. Another difference from CT <BR>is that BtC has<BR>this world as an Imperial planet. There is a misprint on pages 51 and 142. <BR>The X-boat link should be to Raweh not 876-574.<BR><BR>There is as far as I know only 2 references to this back water world. One in <BR>BtC and another in<BR>GT; Far Trader. GT; Far Trader has the planet listed with an Exotic Ocean. <BR>p. 129. I have chosen to ignore this in my write up and base the planet on <BR>water oceans. BtC states in part "a world with<BR>a small stone age population of humans inhabiting the planet's jungle <BR>covered islands" Ok...hold back the thoughts of Gilligans island :)<BR><BR>There are seven large islands covering the planet each about roughly 3,800 <BR>square km. Each island contains various mammalian, reptilian and insect <BR>life. The seas are home to a variety of species as well. The tribe hunts a <BR>large sea dwelling carnivore which it uses for a variety of uses. .<BR>The tribe relishes the hunting of the creature and celebrates the hunt in <BR>stories and in dance&nbsp; .Bone carving is one of the tribes pastimes. Volcanic <BR>minerals are used to create weapons to hunt the creatures and to carve the <BR>islands trees to make sea going canoes. They also gather fruit and nuts from <BR>the jungle to add to their diet.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; The IISS first surveyed the system 72 years ago in 1048 as part of the <BR>Second Survey. The two week visit found the human stone age tribe and <BR>several other mammals. Volcanic activity was also noted. No large deposit of <BR>minerals was noted in the 5 week survey of the system. There<BR>was no activity in the system during the 5th Frontier War. After the war the <BR>Imperium annexed the planet. Recently the IISS has sent a survey team to the <BR>planet to investigate slow decrease of<BR>the population. The Donosev class ship has left from the main subsector <BR>scout base at Karin.<BR><BR>Some customs of the tribe from WBH (DGP) -<BR><BR>The stone age tribe wears tree dwelling rodent skins as symbols of high <BR>status.<BR>The warriors of the tribe shave their heads.<BR>Marriages must be blessed by the elders of the tribe.<BR><BR><BR>Tree dwelling rodent stats -<BR><BR>CT - Intermittent 6 kg, hits 5/12 armor none weapons - teeth, A9 F7 S1<BR><BR>GURPS - ST 2 DX 14 IQ HT 13/3 Move/Dodge 7/7 PD/DR 0/0<BR>Damage 1d-5 cr reach: C Size below 1, Weight 12lbs<BR><BR>(I imagine them as large squirrels with long arms and prehensile tails)<BR><BR>IMTU the humans are either a minor race or descendants from settlers fleeing <BR>the dying Vilani Empire. I don't want to give it away to any potential <BR>players :) I know that having the planets inhabitants be Vilani is non <BR>canon. I figured since there are Vilani settlers in other areas of the<BR>Marches what's a few parasecs over.....<BR><BR>The "government" of the planet is class C. There is a chief of each village <BR>on the planet. The humans survive by fishing in the ocean and growing small <BR>gardens. They create weapons from volcanic minerals found in the mountains <BR>in the center of the islands.<BR><BR>Adventure seeds - 1. The PC's are members of a mega-corp survey team ready <BR>to exploit the resources of the world. On the other hand they maybe members <BR>of a IISS team which may recommend the world for a red zone designation to <BR>protect the Stone Age tribe.<BR><BR>2. Ship encounters a) A Zhodani Shiva class patrol frigate is refueling at a <BR>gas giant in the system.<BR>Are they up to anything else? b) An Aslan Ihatei class transport has been <BR>spotted in system. Have the Ihatei arrived to claim this tropical planet <BR>from the Stone Age tribe?<BR><BR>3. Since the world is at the edge of the Imperium....why not a pirate base <BR>in the outer system? The Pirates in District 268 would have another "base" <BR>to come to...and it's a jump away from the<BR>Navy!<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________<BR>Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 19:19:49 -0600<BR>From: John Groth &lt;wombat@premier.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrab 876-574/Five Sisters (long)<BR><BR>Michael McKeown wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&lt;&lt;snip&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; There is as far as I know only 2 references to this back water world. One in<BR>&gt; BtC and another in<BR>&gt; GT; Far Trader. GT; Far Trader has the planet listed with an Exotic Ocean.<BR>&gt; p. 129. I have chosen to ignore this in my write up and base the planet on<BR>&gt; water oceans.<BR><BR>Just so you know: The "Exotic Ocean" reference in GT:FT is an erratum.<BR><BR>Pp. 127-135. <BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Change all instances of Eo (Exotic Ocean) to Lo (Low Population),<BR>and all instances of Fl should be changed to Eo.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Add Ex to the Trade Classes of all worlds with As, De, Eo, Ic or Va<BR>trade class. <BR><BR>http://www.sjgames.com/errata/gurps/traveller-far-trader.html<BR><BR>&lt;&lt;snip&gt;&gt;<BR><BR>- -- <BR>AuricTech Shipyards Journeyman Gearhead<BR>"Gold-Plated [tm] solutions for copper-plated problems!" (r)<BR>Keeper of the TML Keyboard Casualty List<BR><BR>http://www.geocities.com/Area51/Shadowlands/9776<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 02:54:49 -0000<BR>From: "Ben Aaronovitch" &lt;bem@imaginaryfilms.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: 52 million ton hull!<BR><BR>I'm faithfully constructing Trin's highport using the rules in GT:Starports.<BR><BR>As a P/V-8 the second gateway to the Spinward Marches and a high tech, high<BR>population industrial world the highport deals with 6.24 million dtons of cargo<BR>(transiant and system) and 744,000 passengers a week.<BR><BR>According to the rules this translates into a total of around 13 million dtons<BR>of shipping a week.<BR><BR>Multiply this by 4 (as per the rules) and the highport should ideally be 52<BR>million dtons in size.<BR><BR>This seems a tad large to me.<BR><BR>Am I making a mistake somewhere?<BR><BR>Ben<BR><BR>'Let's be honest here - you paid for the women.'<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Bill Murrey - Scrooged<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 22:17:24 -0500<BR>From: "Mike Peters" &lt;Travelleri@home.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Partial For Sale List completed<BR><BR>Rodger,<BR><BR>Please send a copy of your list to me at travelleari@home.com.<BR><BR>Thanks<BR><BR>Mike Peters<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Roger Sanger" &lt;rodge@nwnexus.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Cc: &lt;traveller-digest@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2001 6:39 AM<BR>Subject: Partial For Sale List completed<BR><BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The collection of RPGs I'm putting up for sale so large (2500+ items),<BR>I've hardly made a dent (I've inventoried only a few hundred items so far).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; So I'm making the list available now, and will add more items to it as<BR>time allows.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; If you are looking for old Traveller, MegaTraveller, TNE, 2300, RIFTS or<BR>other sci-fi game items, drop me a note and I'll send you the list.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Rodge<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; P.S.:&nbsp; As for the rest of the collection, if you are looking for something<BR>in particular (sci-fi or fantasy), let me know and I'll keep a lookout for<BR>it as I go through the materials.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 22:50:57 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>Leonard wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;It also depends on how spread out that squad is while advancing. After<BR>&gt;all, until they know they are in trouble, they'll be walking, not<BR>&gt;crawling.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; So, if the bowmen happen to catch the riflemen by complete surprise walking<BR>across an open field then they might come out on top. Fair enough. Then<BR>again, the riflemen might spot the company of archers while they're on the<BR>move from one location to another and surprise them as well.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; So basically, if either side catches the other by surprise, on the move,<BR>then the chance for their side to win the engagement increases considerably.<BR>That doesn't really support the argument that those who are claiming that<BR>the longbowmen won't perform well are underestimating low-tech forces, it<BR>merely punctuates the fact that complete and utter surprise is a distinct<BR>advantage. Hell, given the right situation a band of TL0 types with sharp<BR>sticks might be able to catch a moving squad of riflemen in an ambush and<BR>win the day.<BR><BR>&gt;That max effective range may be extended some if they are just doing<BR>&gt;max range high angle covering fire.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Hmmm... It suddenly occurs to me that Leonard has either killfiled me or is<BR>ignoring my posts entirely, as I touched on this briefly and generally in<BR>another post. I guess you really do learn something new each day.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; In case I'm incorrect: At ranges above the maximum effective range, but<BR>below the absolute maximum range of the bow, the archers are sacrificing a<BR>lot of accuracy for the range advantage. When massed lightly armored<BR>opponents are marching or charging across the field to get to the archers,<BR>either with melee weapons or shortbows, this tradeoff is fine. The archers<BR>would be less interested in hitting individual opponents and more interested<BR>in putting a hell of a lot of arrows at about the current range of the<BR>opponents. This would soften up the opposing force. In the best case, the<BR>enemies would break rank and flee, in the worst case they would simply keep<BR>moving across the battlefield. By the time the enemy troops ended up within<BR>the 250 yard range or so, then the archers would be able to sacrifice range<BR>for accuracy. They'd be able to hit individual footsoldiers, which is an<BR>advantage, because by this time there'd likely be huge gaps in the<BR>opponent's formation and simply putting a lot of arrows in the general area<BR>of the enemy would be less effective. By the time the enemy troops got close<BR>to the longbowmen, a fresh line of footsoldiers could move in to finish off<BR>the weakened enemy.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; In the case of cavalry, including knights, the scenario would be similar.<BR>At the extended range (between the "aimable" range and the maximum possible<BR>range of the bow) a lucky shot out of a hail of arrows might take down a<BR>knight, but even with bodkin arrowheads at that range the penetrating power<BR>wasn't really that impressive. On the other hand, even though the horses<BR>would have barding, much less of a horse's body could be covered by such<BR>armor. The horses would be the weak link, so even at long range the<BR>effectiveness of some of the knights could very well be lowered considerably<BR>by wounding or killing their mounts. As the cavalry closed into the<BR>"aimable" range, the longbow would really shine, and knights and horses<BR>would begin to go down in greater numbers. Then, as the final distance was<BR>closed, the cavalry would have to brake or slow down in order to avoid<BR>getting their horses impaled on the sharpened sticks which the archers set<BR>up in front of them. At that point not only would there less cavalrymen, the<BR>advantages they would have thanks to their momentum would be pretty much<BR>negated.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Many of the other ranged weapons of the time (namely javelins, slings and<BR>shortbows) just couldn't match the range of the longbows. Troops employing<BR>such weapons would have to close in, and as a result they would be as<BR>vulnerable as footsoldiers (if not moreso in some cases). While there were<BR>crossbows which had the kind of range and power longbows had, when it came<BR>to reloading they couldn't compete.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; If the enemy footsoldiers and cavalry could be softened up enough, then the<BR>side with the longbows would have a much better chance of winning the day in<BR>melee combat. If the enemy's ranged troops could be softened up or<BR>neutralized, then the side with the longbows would have more troops with<BR>melee weapons at their disposal, and when the enemy closed in.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; The secret of the longbow's success wasn't that it was sort of unstoppable<BR>super-weapon. The secret was that the longbow allowed new defensive tactics<BR>to be employed against opponents, tactics which were difficult for the<BR>opposing force to counter. For example, one of the glaring problems with the<BR>longbow was that an opposing force could simply decide not to attack a<BR>specific location and then break off. That's one of the problems, a company<BR>of longbow archers (massed to fully take advantage of the strength of the<BR>weapon they're using) would simply not be very mobile.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Riflemen wouldn't be using the kind of tactics longbows were useful against<BR>unless they happened to be really short on brainpower. While the engagement<BR>might happen on the large open areas in which the archers perform best,<BR>rifles perform best in such an evironment as well. So that particular<BR>advantage is effectively negated. In fact, at shorter ranges, most types of<BR>rifles have a much better rate of fire, are easier to aim, and have greater<BR>damage potential. At longer ranges, most types of rifles have vastly<BR>superior range, accuracy and damage potential. So unless one of the riflemen<BR>says something like, "Hey Howie, how's this for a plan? I say we fix<BR>bayonets and charge across this here field at the archers," and he persuades<BR>his buddies to take that course of action, the archers are going to be at a<BR>disadvantage in most scenarios.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; In fact, the riflemen could easily "win" without ever even firing a shot.<BR>It would take a lot of time and effort to conceal a company of archers, and<BR>really effective concealment would probably not be practical over long<BR>periods of time. It would be easier for a squad of riflemen to spot a<BR>company of archers than vice versa, and as a result it would be easier for<BR>the squad of riflemen to simply bypass the archers if the situation allows.<BR>Since the squad would be much more mobile, it would also be easier for the<BR>riflemen to stack the deck in their favor by planning an attack from a<BR>different angle, setting up an ambush if the archers were to start moving,<BR>sniping individual archers from outside the maximum range of the bows, and<BR>so on.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I'm getting a little tired of this thread. It's obvious that you're either<BR>not reading or responding to my posts. In fact, you may not even read this<BR>if I've been killfiled by you. I don't really have a big problem with that,<BR>as I'm sure you have your reasons, and for the most part I can respect that.<BR>However, you also happen to be the fellow who is posting the most<BR>substantive posts on an argument which I strongly disagree with, so it makes<BR>sense for me to reply to your posts. However, if you're not reading or<BR>acknowledging me, that's fine and I'll gladly use the time I would spend<BR>responding to your posts on this thread and others more effectively. So I'll<BR>sum it up in case you're reading this, on the off chance that others are<BR>interested in this topic. I'll go back to the post which started it all and<BR>sum my argument up.<BR><BR>Leonard wrote:<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; "Don't sell archer's short. If they are up to the "standard" of the English<BR>at Agincourt, while the squad is up to modern standards, they'll take<BR>casualties, but the squad will be eliminated. Volley fire from a company of<BR>archers is a fearsome thing."<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I believe that you're overestimating the effectiveness of the longbow in<BR>general. The longbow, as used by the English at Agincourt, was a weapon<BR>which was tactically inflexible when compared to most modern and nearly all<BR>contemporary rifles. Longbow archers proved very effective, historically,<BR>against opponents employing certain offensive tactics, but they didn't<BR>appear to be nearly as useful in an offensive capability. While I can<BR>imagine that there might be exceptions to that generalization these bows<BR>seem to have performed most effectively in the defensive role.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Given the capabilities of such bows (range, penetration and damage<BR>potential at different ranges, rate of fire and the like) it would seem that<BR>they just don't really stack up when compared with many contemporary rifles.<BR>In addition, a squad employing rifles would be much more mobile and much<BR>more flexible, which would mean they would be able to approach the situation<BR>in a variety of ways. Smaller groups can hide more effectively, take<BR>offensive positions without being seen more easily, and so on. The archers<BR>wouldn't have that option, as their company would almost always be easier to<BR>see, easier to hear and easier for an opposing force to detect. To top it<BR>all off, variations in the conditions on the battlefield would tend to favor<BR>the riflemen, not the archers. The more cover there is on the battlefield,<BR>the more options the riflemen have. The more cover there is at the fringes<BR>of the battlefield, the more options the riflemen have. Constricted<BR>battlefields (such as urban environments and forests) could give the<BR>advantage to the archers if used properly, but there's more on this near the<BR>end of this post.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Not only do I seriously doubt that the squad would be eliminated, I'm also<BR>not convinced at all that they would take significant casualties in most<BR>engagements with longbow companies. In order to give the advantage to the<BR>archers, one has to stack the deck with special cases -- such as complete<BR>surprise, or claims about the psychological trauma which may or may not be<BR>caused by the shafts of arrows, or whatever -- but that's a far cry from<BR>making the claim I've quoted above. It would be much more likely that the<BR>squad would eliminate the company of archers, force the archers to retreat,<BR>or demoralize them to the point of causing them to break and run. In any<BR>case, the victory would probably go to the squad of riflemen more frequently<BR>than it would go to the archers.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; None of this is the result of underestimating longbow archers or those who<BR>employed them in battle, nor is it a general stamp of approval for the<BR>argument which is sometimes made that high technology always beats out low<BR>technology. In this case, the riflemen would have superiority in most<BR>situations not merely because they would be wielding high tech weapons, but<BR>because the rifle negates the raw, numerical technological superiority of<BR>the longbow as well as its applied tactical superiority.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; There would certainly be situations in which the longbow company could<BR>outperform the riflemen. If the company of archers were to discover, via a<BR>scout or other form of intelligence, that the squad would be passing through<BR>a certain canyon, or through a certain pass, or on a certain forested road,<BR>or even through a certain town, then the company could conceal themselves<BR>among the rocks, trees or buildings and use their greater numbers and their<BR>excellent accuracy at close range to catch the squad in a deadly ambush.<BR>Retreating archers could employ similar tactics. All of this requires that<BR>the rifle squad, for whatever reason, is not also using its assets<BR>effectively. In most of these special cases, stealth and concealment would<BR>be the deciding factor, not massed archers employing volley fire techniques.<BR>Volley fire works wonderfully against similarly massed opponents with<BR>weapons incapable of reaching the archers. Unfortunately for the archers the<BR>technique is a lot less effective when employed against small, highly mobile<BR>and decentralized units with weapons which can be said to outperform the<BR>longbow in any situation where volley fire would be effective.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 23:14:49 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Landgrabs updated!<BR><BR>I have surprised myself and completed posting all of the updates to the<BR>Landgrab. I have a few ideas for improving the look and usability of the<BR>page, but the info is there. http://www.downport.com/landgrab<BR><BR>What say I add a row of links at the top that jump to the first listing for<BR>subsector? I've added a FAQ page, but I'd like to see it fleshed out a bit.<BR>Perhaps I could change the location of the links, too? A little help...<BR><BR>~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~&lt;&gt;&lt;~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~<BR>Colin Michael, webmaster@downport.com<BR>www.Downport.com - "The Traveller Domain"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 23:29:50 -0500<BR>From: "Jonathan 'Caraig' McDermott" &lt;caraig@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: [TML] TNE [FILK]<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2001 18:25:41 EST<BR>&gt;From: "Michael A. Hoxie" &lt;ludowick@juno.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: [TML] TNE [FILK]<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;A good one!&nbsp; I'm a big fan of Cream (Clapton peaked early, IMHO).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Ludowick<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;________________________________________________________________<BR><BR>Thank you!&nbsp; The idea of Lucan being mentally disturbed (and the <BR>stereotypical white rooms of&nbsp; hospitals) behind the black curtain sort of <BR>screamed for that song. =) And Clapton did do some pretty good songs, <BR>particularly his early stuff.<BR><BR>Cheers!<BR><BR><BR><BR>- ---<BR>==============================================================<BR>Jonathan McDermott, CNE/MCSE&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; NOSPAMcaraig@mindspring.com<BR>System Administrator&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; http:\\caraig.home.mindspring.com<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Anubis@SpatialWastes -*- Caraig,Dermott@FurryMUCK<BR>IMTU tc+ tn t4 ge++ -3i+ c+(**) jt pi+ va+ dr+ pr+ zh+() so@<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; "Never trust a computer you can't throw out a window."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; -Steve Wozniak<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 00:09:39 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: [www] 04 Feb 2001 - Freelance Traveller Updated<BR><BR>On Sat, 3 Feb 2001 05:27:45 -0500 (EST), Paul Campbell<BR>&lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt; wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;Erm... The link to Raconteur's Rest in the left hand menu is broken.<BR>&gt;Go in through the Descriptive Table of Content at the top, that gives<BR>&gt;a working link.<BR><BR>Gaah?&nbsp; It shouldn't be; I didn't change it!<BR><BR>Noted; it'll definitely be fixed in the next update.&nbsp; There _were_ some<BR>problems posting this update; maybe something got junior corruption.<BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 00:09:42 -0500<BR>From: Jeff Zeitlin &lt;jzeitlin@cyburban.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Travellers Digest 21 - The Pirates of Tetrini<BR><BR>I have just had an Italian visitor to Freelance Traveller contact me with<BR>regards to obtaining the issue indicated (Babelfish does such interesting<BR>things...); can anyone provide info?&nbsp; S/He can be reached directly via<BR>email at adriano.libero.it@libero.it.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>jzeitlin@cyburban.com<BR>(ILink: news without the abuse. Ask via email.)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 00:40:17 -0500<BR>From: "DaveShayne" &lt;daveshayne@email.msn.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Sat, 3 Feb 2001 11:33:02 PST<BR>&gt; From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt; Actually, you aren't going to *have* serfs and yeomanry at the same<BR>&gt; time. The longbow was one of the reasons peasant *became* yeomanry, and<BR>&gt; notable less oppressed. :-)<BR><BR>Do you have some citations for that?<BR><BR>My understanding of the proximate cause of the end to serfdom in<BR>England was a labor shortage caused by the black death. By and<BR>large the Yeomen prefered playing football to keeping up with<BR>the long hours of weapons training it takes to become an effective<BR>shot. (So much so that laws banning the sport were promulgated.)<BR><BR>David Shayne<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 23:03:57 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: SpinwardMarches.com<BR><BR>Attention LandGrabbers (and others)<BR><BR>I've completed the basic shell for spinwardmarches.com<BR><BR>Thanks to Jimmy Simpson, I've got 2 nice maps (Querion and Regina) and am<BR>hoping for more.&nbsp; I've added a search engine, guest book and a downloads<BR>area where you can get the templates to add you own worlds to the database.<BR><BR>In the meantime, I will be adding data from canon sources.&nbsp; Please visit,<BR>comment and contribute.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sat, 03 Feb 2001 23:14:48 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>on 2/3/01 7:50 PM, Chris Seamans at semo@pil.net wrote:<BR><BR>[snip]<BR><BR>&gt; I'm getting a little tired of this thread. It's obvious that you're either<BR>&gt; not reading or responding to my posts. In fact, you may not even read this<BR>&gt; if I've been killfiled by you. I don't really have a big problem with that,<BR>&gt; as I'm sure you have your reasons, and for the most part I can respect that.<BR>&gt; However, you also happen to be the fellow who is posting the most<BR>&gt; substantive posts on an argument which I strongly disagree with, so it makes<BR>&gt; sense for me to reply to your posts. However, if you're not reading or<BR>&gt; acknowledging me, that's fine and I'll gladly use the time I would spend<BR>&gt; responding to your posts on this thread and others more effectively.<BR>[snip]<BR><BR>Hey Chris,<BR><BR>I am reading your posts, and they're very illuminating.&nbsp; This one is<BR>definitely getting put in the 'keepers' file.<BR><BR>Thanks, tod<BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 19:05:34 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR><BR>Ben Aaronovitch wrote:<BR>&gt; Multiply this by 4 (as per the rules) and the highport should ideally be 52<BR>&gt; million dtons in size.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; This seems a tad large to me.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Am I making a mistake somewhere?<BR><BR>I doubt it.&nbsp; The world almost certainly has more than one single<BR>structure in space.&nbsp; It probably has a very complex traffic control<BR>system directing space traffic to and from tens or even hundreds of<BR>orbital stations at various altitudes.&nbsp; You could probably put at<BR>least 6 stations in a given orbit (probably a circular equatorial<BR>orbit), then another bunch in a higher orbit, and so on.&nbsp; To avoid<BR>collisions, there would be very strict "lanes" assigned for entering<BR>and departing starships to each station, and for planetary shuttles.<BR><BR>A single big structure would really be an "all eggs in one basket"<BR>problem for such a busy system.<BR><BR>Also, there is no real reason to suppose that all stations orbit the<BR>planet.&nbsp; I suspect there would be a large number of stations in orbit<BR>of moons of gas giants (if it has any), to serve ships "passing<BR>though".<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 03:11:27 -0600<BR>From: Steve Daniels &lt;stevedaniels@portcaddo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Bloo's website/map files<BR><BR>Gordon Hundley wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Either they are somewhere else or he deleted them:<BR><BR>They're there.&nbsp; The full URL for the Maps is<BR>http://portcaddo.com/bloo/traveller/Travmaps/<BR><BR>I just cleaned up the main page, so it has links to<BR>everything that I've previously had only available<BR>with a direct URL.<BR><BR>http://portcaddo.com/bloo/traveller/<BR><BR>- -bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3596<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-xa04.mx.aol.com (rly-xa04.mail.aol.com [172.20.105.73]) by air-xa01.mail.aol.com (v77.31) with ESMTP; Sun, 04 Feb 2001 04:12:22 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-xa04.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sun, 04 Feb 2001 04:11:57 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id EAA02752;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sun, 4 Feb 2001 04:11:18 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sun, 4 Feb 2001 04:10:24 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id EAA02699<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 2001 04:10:24 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 04:10:24 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102040910.EAA02699@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3596<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3597</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/4/01 7:04:37 PM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Sunday, February 4 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3597<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: [www] 04 Feb 2001 - Freelance Traveller Updated<BR>Re: Gearhead question<BR>Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR>Re: Partial For Sale List completed<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR>Re: Uhhhhh<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>RE: Uhhhhh<BR>RE: Uhhhhh<BR>Re: Landgrabs updated!<BR>Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR>ATTN Downport<BR>Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR>Re: CT Character Gen software<BR>Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR>MoJ (was The Imperial Marshal Campaign)<BR>Re: ATTN Downport<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: ATTN Downport<BR>Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>Re: ATTN Downport<BR>Re: ATTN Downport<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 09:23:49 +0000<BR>From: Paul Campbell &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: [www] 04 Feb 2001 - Freelance Traveller Updated<BR><BR>On Sun, Feb 04, 2001 at 12:09:39AM -0500, Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>&gt; On Sat, 3 Feb 2001 05:27:45 -0500 (EST), Paul Campbell<BR>&gt; &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt; wrote:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt;Erm... The link to Raconteur's Rest in the left hand menu is broken.<BR>&gt; &gt;Go in through the Descriptive Table of Content at the top, that gives<BR>&gt; &gt;a working link.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Gaah?&nbsp; It shouldn't be; I didn't change it!<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Noted; it'll definitely be fixed in the next update.&nbsp; There _were_ some<BR>&gt; problems posting this update; maybe something got junior corruption.<BR><BR>Fred Ramen's The Hostile Stars is very good.&nbsp; I really like it.&nbsp; I'd<BR>get my players to read it if our campaign was anywhere near Zho Space.<BR>Can't wait for the rest to be posted.&nbsp; Haven't read the other stories<BR>in RR yet, but I'll hit at least one of them today.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Paul Campbell (Sourceforge) &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>GPG Key fingerprint = 9C4F 31A3 8814 9F94 A533 A979 E63F 0C69 A771 0F24<BR>http://www.kemitix.uklinux.net<BR>jupiter: 9:17am up 25 days, 22:57, 2 users, load average: 0.79, 0.63, 0.34<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 11:47:47 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Gearhead question<BR><BR>Pronto wrote:<BR>&gt; The problem with that answer, Jens, is it answers 'Why not?' rather than<BR>&gt; 'How?'<BR><BR>I don't think it answers the question "Why not?"<BR><BR>It simply says "Why not?"&nbsp;&nbsp; ;-)<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 06:11:07 -0500<BR>From: Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR><BR>&gt;Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 02:54:49 -0000<BR>&gt;From: "Ben Aaronovitch" &lt;bem@imaginaryfilms.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: 52 million ton hull!<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I'm faithfully constructing Trin's highport using the rules in GT:Starports.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;As a P/V-8 the second gateway to the Spinward Marches and a high tech, high<BR>&gt;population industrial world the highport deals with 6.24 million dtons of<BR>cargo<BR>&gt;(transiant and system) and 744,000 passengers a week.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;According to the rules this translates into a total of around 13 million<BR>dtons<BR>&gt;of shipping a week.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Multiply this by 4 (as per the rules) and the highport should ideally be 52<BR>&gt;million dtons in size.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;This seems a tad large to me.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Am I making a mistake somewhere?<BR><BR>No, sounds about right. The published rules actually underestimate some<BR>quantities, particularly fuel tankage required and freight handling spaces<BR>(the editor changed what was written, without consulting anyone).<BR><BR>Remember, this station isn't going anywhere -- you can build almost<BR>arbitrarily large structures if you don't intend to subject them to more<BR>than tiny accelerations. A Stanford torus-style space habitat is 5 million<BR>dtons; O'Neil One was designed to be 37 million dtons.<BR><BR>If you really want some fun, calculate the highport requirements for Muan<BR>Gwi in the Solomani Rim. Using the draft rules for GT: Starports before<BR>they were changed, I worked out that a 1 km diameter (minor axis) torus in<BR>synchronous orbit entirely around the equator would just about do the<BR>trick, with a little room left over for development.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 04:08:10 -0800<BR>From: "Jeffrey Yin" &lt;jsyin@cats.ucsc.edu&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Partial For Sale List completed<BR><BR>I would be interested in most MegaTraveller materials, as well as the<BR>Spinward Marches campaign for Traveller.<BR><BR>Jeffrey Yin<BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Roger Sanger" &lt;rodge@nwnexus.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Cc: &lt;traveller-digest@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2001 3:39 AM<BR>Subject: Partial For Sale List completed<BR><BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; The collection of RPGs I'm putting up for sale so large (2500+ items),<BR>I've hardly made a dent (I've inventoried only a few hundred items so far).<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; So I'm making the list available now, and will add more items to it as<BR>time allows.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; If you are looking for old Traveller, MegaTraveller, TNE, 2300, RIFTS or<BR>other sci-fi game items, drop me a note and I'll send you the list.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Rodge<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; P.S.:&nbsp; As for the rest of the collection, if you are looking for something<BR>in particular (sci-fi or fantasy), let me know and I'll keep a lookout for<BR>it as I go through the materials.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 15:03:43 +0000<BR>From: Simon Brodie &lt;mr_fingle@gravity-sucks.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>&gt; &lt;snip&gt;.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Any laser capable of a single shot "incapacitation" *will* be visible<BR>&gt; in any reasonable atmosphere. In sunlight of Earth level strength, it<BR>&gt; may be hard to see (as is fire, if you've ever had a non-smoky fire<BR>&gt; outdoors on a sunny day), but there will be stuff you can see from<BR>&gt; ionization effects to dust and insects getting zapped by the beam.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>As i said, you won't see the beam, only what it hits.<BR><BR>Si<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 09:26:51 -0600<BR>From: Terry Mixon &lt;tmixon@ghg.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR><BR>Christopher Thrash wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; No, sounds about right. The published rules actually underestimate some<BR>&gt; quantities, particularly fuel tankage required and freight handling spaces<BR>&gt; (the editor changed what was written, without consulting anyone).<BR><BR>Any chance on getting the correct slant on these two from you then?<BR><BR>Terry<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 14:08:42 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Uhhhhh<BR><BR>In a message dated 02-Feb-01 9:13:32 PM Central Standard Time, <BR>owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR><BR>&gt; Clint Eastwood did an excellent<BR>&gt;&nbsp; documentary (entitled "Firefox") on how the US stole the technology from<BR>&gt;&nbsp; the Soviets.<BR><BR>Tongue firmly in cheek here, I hope?<BR><BR>LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 11:48:10 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>&gt;From: "DaveShayne" &lt;daveshayne@email.msn.com&gt;<BR>&gt;Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>...<BR>&gt;&gt; Actually, you aren't going to *have* serfs and yeomanry at the same<BR>&gt;&gt; time. The longbow was one of the reasons peasant *became* yeomanry, and<BR>&gt;&gt; notable less oppressed. :-)<BR>...<BR>&gt;My understanding of the proximate cause of the end to serfdom in<BR>&gt;England was a labor shortage caused by the black death. By and<BR><BR>&nbsp; Your position seems more likely, if less popular.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 22:19:01 +0200 (EET)<BR>From: "Mikko V. I. Parviainen" &lt;mvparvia@cc.hut.fi&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>On Sun, 4 Feb 2001, Simon Brodie wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Any laser capable of a single shot "incapacitation" *will* be visible<BR>&gt; &gt; in any reasonable atmosphere. In sunlight of Earth level strength, it<BR>&gt; &gt; may be hard to see (as is fire, if you've ever had a non-smoky fire<BR>&gt; &gt; outdoors on a sunny day), but there will be stuff you can see from<BR>&gt; &gt; ionization effects to dust and insects getting zapped by the beam.<BR><BR>&gt; As i said, you won't see the beam, only what it hits.<BR><BR>For low power lasers, yes. <BR><BR>See above, about the word "ionization". <BR><BR>(And, as the athmosphere absorbs some of the beam, I would think that it<BR>could show up,at least with energies able to do nasty things to tissue.<BR>I'm not sure about the energy densities, though.)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>+++++++++[&gt;+++++++++&lt;-]&gt;-.&lt;+++++[&gt;+++&lt;-]++&gt;++.&lt;++[&gt;++++&lt;-]+&gt;+.&lt;++[&gt;----<BR>&lt;-]&gt;-.&gt;+++[&gt;++++++++++&lt;-]++&gt;++pare@iki.fi&lt;+[&gt;++++&lt;-]&gt;+.-&gt;+[&gt;++++[&lt;&lt;---&gt;<BR>&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;.&gt;&gt;+++++++[&lt;++++++++++&gt;-]++++[&lt;+++++&gt;-]&lt;-.&gt;[-]&gt;+++[&gt;++[&lt;&lt;&lt;----&gt;&gt;<BR>&lt;&gt;&gt;-]&lt;-]&lt;&lt;.+.&gt;[-]++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;.++.[-]&gt;[-]++++[&lt;++&gt;-]&lt;++.&gt;&gt;++[&gt;++[&gt;-&lt;-]&lt;--]<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 12:34:13 -0800<BR>From: Jesse DeGraff &lt;jdegraff@pacbell.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Uhhhhh<BR><BR>What, you mean that was a joke?!?!?!<BR><BR>;)<BR>Jesse<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; -----Original Message-----<BR>&gt; From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; [mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>&gt; Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2001 11:09 AM<BR>&gt; To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Uhhhhh<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; In a message dated 02-Feb-01 9:13:32 PM Central Standard Time, <BR>&gt; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; Clint Eastwood did an excellent<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; documentary (entitled "Firefox") on how the US stole the <BR>&gt; technology from<BR>&gt; &gt;&nbsp; the Soviets.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Tongue firmly in cheek here, I hope?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; LKW<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 15:02:35 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: RE: Uhhhhh<BR><BR>On 02/04/01 at 12:34 PM,&nbsp; Jesse DeGraff &lt;jdegraff@pacbell.net&gt; said:<BR><BR>&gt;What, you mean that was a joke?!?!?!<BR><BR>&gt;Jesse<BR><BR>Oh, yes, just a joke FNORD or so LKW wants you to believe FNORD<BR>unfortunately.<BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 21:04:48 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Landgrabs updated!<BR><BR>on 4/2/01 4:14 am, SwordWorlder at SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; I have surprised myself and completed posting all of the updates to the<BR>&gt; Landgrab. I have a few ideas for improving the look and usability of the<BR>&gt; page, but the info is there. http://www.downport.com/landgrab<BR><BR>Cool. Also now sorted to subsector, which makes it easier for would-be<BR>landgrabbers to find something to claim.<BR><BR>&gt; What say I add a row of links at the top that jump to the first listing for<BR>&gt; subsector? I've added a FAQ page, but I'd like to see it fleshed out a bit.<BR>&gt; Perhaps I could change the location of the links, too? A little help...<BR><BR>Yes, that will help as the list grows. As soon as I've posted something<BR>about Sacnoth and Gram (currently doing some remodelling based on great<BR>input from Hans Rancke-Madsen) I'll send you a URL. Also, it would be good<BR>to have links into Tod's promising spinwardmarches.com.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 22:27:11 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR><BR>Christopher Thrash wrote:<BR>&gt; If you really want some fun, calculate the highport requirements for Muan<BR>&gt; Gwi in the Solomani Rim. Using the draft rules for GT: Starports before<BR>&gt; they were changed, I worked out that a 1 km diameter (minor axis) torus in<BR>&gt; synchronous orbit entirely around the equator would just about do the<BR>&gt; trick, with a little room left over for development.<BR><BR>Sadly, Rim of Fire states that there are six separate highports. I think<BR>I will change that. The image of such a huge torus is too great not to<BR>use.<BR><BR>"Mmmmm... doughnut!"<BR>- - Homer Simpson<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 22:32:16 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: ATTN Downport<BR><BR>I don't know if I'm the only one having this problem, but when I tried<BR>to access Downport for the first time since the recent update, the main<BR>part of the page (everything except header and the command bar to the<BR>left) come out blank...<BR><BR>I'm using a rather old Netscape for Unix version, so it can't handle<BR>stylesheets and some other features properly. Is this the reason?<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 08:40:21 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR><BR>Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm wrote:<BR>&gt; Sadly, Rim of Fire states that there are six separate highports. I think<BR>&gt; I will change that. The image of such a huge torus is too great not to<BR>&gt; use.<BR><BR>How about six separate toruses?&nbsp; Or one torus and five stations that<BR>are each merely huge?<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 22:47:15 +0000<BR>From: Gordon Hundley &lt;gh@krypteia.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: CT Character Gen software<BR><BR>on 23/1/01 10:44 pm, D. Smart at dsmart@imagin.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; My absolute favorite (which I use for my MT campaigns) is<BR>&gt; Hugh Foster's TravGen. It can be downloaded from his site<BR>&gt; at:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; http://www.gamestruth.com/Hugh/<BR><BR>I've started using this after reading the URL here. I have to say, that this<BR>software is "Absolutely Fabulous". It's the best CT character generator I've<BR>used on any platform. Thank you Hugh.<BR><BR>One thing I've noticed however, is that Merchant Captains (O5/O6) never seem<BR>to get a "Fat Trader" as a mustering out benefit. I've run a few dozen<BR>pensioners through mustering out, and never had one. Anybody else managed<BR>to?<BR><BR>BTW, has anybody produced ship details for the "Fat Trader" as mentioned in<BR>both Merchant Prince and this software? I envisage it having a cargo hold<BR>modified to hold large removable tanks for transporting animal and vegetable<BR>fats.<BR><BR>Gordon.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 14:04:02 -0000<BR>From: "Ben Aaronovitch" &lt;bem@imaginaryfilms.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR><BR>Thanks, I was beginning to get worried.<BR><BR>Ben<BR><BR>'Let's be honest here - you paid for the women.'<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; Bill Murrey - Scrooged<BR>- ----- Original Message ----- <BR>From: Christopher Thrash &lt;thrash@io.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2001 11:11 AM<BR>Subject: Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt;Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 02:54:49 -0000<BR>&gt; &gt;From: "Ben Aaronovitch" &lt;bem@imaginaryfilms.demon.co.uk&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Subject: 52 million ton hull!<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;I'm faithfully constructing Trin's highport using the rules in GT:Starports.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;As a P/V-8 the second gateway to the Spinward Marches and a high tech, high<BR>&gt; &gt;population industrial world the highport deals with 6.24 million dtons of<BR>&gt; cargo<BR>&gt; &gt;(transiant and system) and 744,000 passengers a week.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;According to the rules this translates into a total of around 13 million<BR>&gt; dtons<BR>&gt; &gt;of shipping a week.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Multiply this by 4 (as per the rules) and the highport should ideally be 52<BR>&gt; &gt;million dtons in size.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;This seems a tad large to me.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Am I making a mistake somewhere?<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; No, sounds about right. The published rules actually underestimate some<BR>&gt; quantities, particularly fuel tankage required and freight handling spaces<BR>&gt; (the editor changed what was written, without consulting anyone).<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Remember, this station isn't going anywhere -- you can build almost<BR>&gt; arbitrarily large structures if you don't intend to subject them to more<BR>&gt; than tiny accelerations. A Stanford torus-style space habitat is 5 million<BR>&gt; dtons; O'Neil One was designed to be 37 million dtons.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; If you really want some fun, calculate the highport requirements for Muan<BR>&gt; Gwi in the Solomani Rim. Using the draft rules for GT: Starports before<BR>&gt; they were changed, I worked out that a 1 km diameter (minor axis) torus in<BR>&gt; synchronous orbit entirely around the equator would just about do the<BR>&gt; trick, with a little room left over for development.<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 11:45:39 +1100<BR>From: david.d.jaques-watson@centrelink.gov.au<BR>Subject: MoJ (was The Imperial Marshal Campaign)<BR><BR>Dear Folks -<BR><BR>Peter reviewed the Marshals site:<BR>&gt;(Having another branch of the&nbsp; MoJ<BR>&gt;besides FASA's Special Branch also makes the MoJ more rounded.)<BR><BR>Take a look at my MT chargen for the MoJ, stored in the Tavonni Repair<BR>Bays. It has a few more branches available.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>David "Hyphen" Jaques-Watson&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Beowulf Down (Tavonni/Vilis/SM 1520)<BR>http://www.tip.net.au/~davidjw&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; davidjw@pcug.org.au<BR>"I file things in historical order, with a hashing algorithm of gravity"<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>REQ'D DISCLAIMER - material &amp; opinions contained within are solely those<BR>of the author and do not necessarily represent, in whole or in part, the<BR>position of Centrelink or any other Commonwealth Government agency.<BR>- ------------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 20:49:01 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: ATTN Downport<BR><BR>That's correct. I have held off for two years longer than most, but I am<BR>finally switching over to stylesheets and SSI because of the sheer size of<BR>the site. Unfortunately, there are some browsers with which it will not work<BR>properly due to the size of the include files. Unix platforms seem to have<BR>trouble the most. I am looking for a better solution. I will probably change<BR>over to JSP as soon as we move the site onto our own servers in the next<BR>week or so. With 300+ pages to maintain, I really need to automate as much<BR>as possible :-)<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>&gt; I don't know if I'm the only one having this problem, but when I tried<BR>&gt; to access Downport for the first time since the recent update, the main<BR>&gt; part of the page (everything except header and the command bar to the<BR>&gt; left) come out blank...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I'm using a rather old Netscape for Unix version, so it can't handle<BR>&gt; stylesheets and some other features properly. Is this the reason?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 20:52:54 -0500<BR>From: Laning &lt;laning@wizard.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>Chris Seamans did an excellent job of summing up the advantages and<BR>disadvantages of English longbowmen.&nbsp; Good work!&nbsp; :-&gt;<BR><BR>We could spice it up by changing the archers to a company of samurai, who<BR>would supposedly fight with more individual initiative and smarts, but the<BR>end result would still be lots of dead archers.&nbsp; Which kind of archers were<BR>involved is an angels-on-the-head-of-a-pin argument.<BR><BR>If we are talking only a squad of riflemen, versus a company of archers,<BR>there are two things I want to mention.&nbsp;&nbsp; A company would be 80 to 150<BR>depending on various factors but usually 100 to 120, and a squad would be 5<BR>to 13 but usually 7 or 9.<BR><BR>First thing, if a hundred strapping young men with rocks charged at my<BR>rifle squad from say 300 meters away, it could still end up with some dead<BR>riflemen.&nbsp; If the primitively-equipped but much more numerous fellows<BR>didn't try to make a firefight out of it but simply charged with unshakable<BR>determination, they would have a pretty fair chance of overwhelming the<BR>infantry squad.&nbsp; Communist troops have used exactly this strategem in Korea<BR>and Viet Nam, for instance.&nbsp; Results were mixed.&nbsp; Certainly tragic, though.<BR><BR>Second thing, morale would be a huge factor in any such scenario.&nbsp; Each<BR>side has genuine morale issues in any scenario.&nbsp; The vastly outnumbered<BR>soldiers with rifles could lose their nerve and even break and run.&nbsp; The<BR>numerous but clearly disadvantaged archers could easily do the same.<BR><BR>Imagine being in a squad-sized patrol crossing the long grass in a summer<BR>field and suddenly you hear a huge war cry.&nbsp; Looking up the gentle slope to<BR>your left, you see a solid wall of men has materialized 400 meters away and<BR>is loping en masse through the grass to kill you and your handful of<BR>comrades.&nbsp; Brandishing short swords (which the yeoman typically had) and<BR>howling in a bloodthirsty way.&nbsp; You wonder to yourself, "Gee, I'm a good<BR>shot, but can I really stop **ten** running and dodging guys cold in the<BR>next 60 seconds?&nbsp; And even if I do, can every single other person in the<BR>squad do the same thing?"&nbsp; Suddenly, you might be considering options<BR>besides a fight to the death.<BR><BR><BR>Or imagine that you're one of four- or five-score proud and respected<BR>longbowmen in a company of fellows from the same shire.&nbsp; Sure, you've heard<BR>stories of offworlder weaponry and maybe even seen a rifle bring down a<BR>deer.&nbsp; You've long since figured out that rifles are much like bows, just<BR>nicer.&nbsp; You know it isn't magic.&nbsp; But now, even though you're well out of<BR>the longest range, some hard-to-discern offworlders are peppering away at<BR>your company from the tree line and every few seconds another comrade is<BR>struck down.&nbsp; An awful snap/slapping sound and writhing on the ground where<BR>once he staunchly filled your ranks.&nbsp; You can hear more of the "bullets"<BR>narrowly missing with loud cracks and see the occasional small explosion of<BR>earth in front of you where other "bullets" seek to take your own life.<BR>"Gee, you think.&nbsp; I'm pretty brave, a good shot, and damned tough in a<BR>fight.&nbsp; But even if all five-score of us try to run across this open ground<BR>and get to those offworlders before most of us have been killed or<BR>crippled, how many of the others would keep running beside me and not give<BR>up the charge in the face of this death?"&nbsp; Suddenly, you might be<BR>considering options besides a fight to the death.<BR><BR>Regarding morale, let's look to history for a moment.&nbsp; Heck, my own US<BR>Marine Corps decimated the Chinese divisions surrounding us during a<BR>fighting withdrawal from the Chosin Reservoir in Korea.&nbsp; The technological<BR>advantage was much less lopsided than rifles versus longbows.&nbsp; The<BR>numerical odds were about the same as our longbow vs. riflemen proposal.<BR>Contrariwise, think of the human wave attacks that have completely overrun<BR>entrenched, veteran, skilled troops.&nbsp; Including Chinese human waves against<BR>my same Marines during that same fighting withdrawal.<BR><BR>But no matter how I look at it, if I were the archers I wouldn't want to<BR>make a firefight out of it.&nbsp; Melee would be the main chance.&nbsp; Preferably at<BR>night and/or in dense vegetation.&nbsp; Get as close as possible before giving<BR>the riflemen a viable target.<BR><BR>- --Laning<BR>As a former US Marine, I'll take a 13-man squad of our guys against<BR>anybody's company of archers.&nbsp; And we promise not to use our grenade<BR>launchers, machine guns, or hand grenades.&nbsp; I might use a .45 and an<BR>entrenching tool if things get hand to hand, though.&nbsp; :-&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 20:10:30 -0600<BR>From: eris@pcola.gulf.net<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>On 02/04/01 at 08:52 PM,&nbsp; Laning &lt;laning@wizard.net&gt; said:<BR><BR><BR>&gt;Imagine being in a squad-sized patrol crossing the long grass in a<BR>&gt;summer field and suddenly you hear a huge war cry.&nbsp; Looking up the<BR>&gt;gentle slope to your left, you see a solid wall of men has<BR>&gt;materialized 400 meters away and is loping en masse through the<BR>&gt;grass to kill you and your handful of comrades.&nbsp; Brandishing short<BR>&gt;swords (which the yeoman typically had) and howling in a<BR>&gt;bloodthirsty way.&nbsp; You wonder to yourself, "Gee, I'm a good shot,<BR>&gt;but can I really stop **ten** running and dodging guys cold in the<BR>&gt;next 60 seconds?&nbsp; And even if I do, can every single other person<BR>&gt;in the squad do the same thing?"&nbsp; Suddenly, you might be<BR>&gt;considering options besides a fight to the death.<BR><BR>Sounds like Roark's Drift to me?&nbsp; <BR><BR>Eris<BR>- -- <BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR>eris@pcola.gulf.net&nbsp; &nbsp; using MR/2 ICE #245<BR>http://www.crosswinds.net/~erisr<BR>- -----------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 18:41:52 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: ATTN Downport<BR><BR>on 2/4/01 5:49 PM, SwordWorlder at SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; trouble the most. I am looking for a better solution. I will probably change<BR>&gt; over to JSP as soon as we move the site onto our own servers in the next<BR>&gt; week or so. With 300+ pages to maintain, I really need to automate as much<BR>&gt; as possible :-)<BR><BR>Only 300+ pages.&nbsp; You lucky dog. I wish I only had 300 pages.&nbsp; Fortunately,<BR>I do have 4 helpers. Glad to see everyone busily working on their sites.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.spinwardmarches.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 18:45:27 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>on 2/4/01 6:10 PM, eris@pcola.gulf.net at eris@pcola.gulf.net wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Imagine being in a squad-sized patrol crossing the long grass in a<BR>&gt;&gt; summer field and suddenly you hear a huge war cry.&nbsp; Looking up the<BR>&gt;&gt; gentle slope to your left, you see a solid wall of men has<BR>&gt;&gt; materialized 400 meters away and is loping en masse through the<BR>&gt;&gt; grass to kill you and your handful of comrades.&nbsp; Brandishing short<BR>&gt;&gt; swords (which the yeoman typically had) and howling in a<BR>&gt;&gt; bloodthirsty way.&nbsp; You wonder to yourself, "Gee, I'm a good shot,<BR>&gt;&gt; but can I really stop **ten** running and dodging guys cold in the<BR>&gt;&gt; next 60 seconds?&nbsp; And even if I do, can every single other person<BR>&gt;&gt; in the squad do the same thing?"&nbsp; Suddenly, you might be<BR>&gt;&gt; considering options besides a fight to the death.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Sounds like Roark's Drift to me?<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>Of course one also must consider Isandawana.<BR><BR>Tod<BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 14:02:28 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: ATTN Downport<BR><BR>SwordWorlder wrote:<BR>&gt; Unfortunately, there are some browsers with which it will not work<BR>&gt; properly due to the size of the include files.<BR><BR>I thought SSI was exactly what it says -- *server* side includes.&nbsp; How<BR>does the browser make a difference?&nbsp; All it sees is HTML.<BR><BR>Style sheets I can understand -- Netscape 4 in particular is horrible<BR>at handling them.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; I will probably change over to JSP as soon as we move the site onto<BR>&gt; our own servers in the next week or so. With 300+ pages to maintain,<BR>&gt; I really need to automate as much as possible :-)<BR><BR>Having your own servers would be a real plus.&nbsp; I noticed a huge<BR>difference in the ease of maintaining even my own tiny 6-page site<BR>(not Traveller related).<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 22:03:13 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: ATTN Downport<BR><BR>Well, Downport.com has 1273+ pages as of the last spidering, but I was only<BR>speaking of my own portion that I maintain. Sorry that I did not clarify<BR>that for you. I know the "yours is bigger", but I've had to deal with that<BR>all of my life ;-)<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Tod Glenn" &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Only 300+ pages.&nbsp; You lucky dog. I wish I only had 300 pages.<BR>Fortunately,<BR>&gt; I do have 4 helpers. Glad to see everyone busily working on their sites.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3597<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-ye05.mx.aol.com (rly-ye05.mail.aol.com [172.18.151.202]) by air-ye04.mail.aol.com (v77_r1.21) with ESMTP; Sun, 04 Feb 2001 22:04:37 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-ye05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Sun, 04 Feb 2001 22:04:14 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id WAA41908;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Sun, 4 Feb 2001 22:03:04 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Sun, 4 Feb 2001 22:01:15 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id WAA41837<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Sun, 4 Feb 2001 22:01:15 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 22:01:15 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102050301.WAA41837@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3597<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3598</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/5/01 2:29:37 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Monday, February 5 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3598<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>Re: ATTN Downport<BR>Re: ATTN Downport<BR>Re: Size<BR>Big starports<BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 23:21:48 -0500<BR>Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR>re: Islandwhana and Roark's Drift<BR>(sale) a couple of old Trav items?<BR>Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR>Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR>Re: <BR>Re: ATTN Downport<BR>Re: ATTN Downport<BR>RE: ATTN Downport<BR>RE: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR>RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons; Rangefinding discussion with background.<BR>RE: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 22:15:24 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: ATTN Downport<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Timothy Little" &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>&gt; SwordWorlder wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Unfortunately, there are some browsers with which it will not work<BR>&gt; &gt; properly due to the size of the include files.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; I thought SSI was exactly what it says -- *server* side includes.&nbsp; How<BR>&gt; does the browser make a difference?&nbsp; All it sees is HTML.<BR><BR>I have tried to figure out why the page load dies during the loading of the<BR>menu bar include. If I reduce the size of the file it finishes loading. So<BR>either it is the size of the load or something within the last kb of the<BR>include file. Since I don't have a Unix system online here to check it with,<BR>I have not been able to test as exhaustively as I'd like. Can anyone tell me<BR>what is the LAST bit of HTML that loads before it quits?<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 22:18:26 -0500<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: ATTN Downport<BR><BR>Oops, I was wrong. This was the last spider:<BR><BR>Your site has been spidered.<BR><BR>Our search engine has finished indexing your site:<BR>Site URL&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; : http://www.downport.com/index.html<BR>E-mail&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; : webmaster@downport.com<BR>Site ID&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; : 7110039<BR>Pages Indexed : 1317<BR><BR>I like to be as accurate as possible lest the TML Old Great Ones banish me.<BR><BR>I guess it's your turn to whip it out and put me to shame...<BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "SwordWorlder" &lt;SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com&gt;<BR>&gt; Well, Downport.com has 1273+ pages as of the last spidering, but I was<BR>only<BR>&gt; speaking of my own portion that I maintain. Sorry that I did not clarify<BR>&gt; that for you. I know the "yours is bigger", but I've had to deal with that<BR>&gt; all of my life ;-)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 22:32:04 EST<BR>From: GDWGAMES@aol.com<BR>Subject: Re: Size<BR><BR>&gt; Multiply this by 4 (as per the rules) and the highport should ideally be 52<BR>&gt;&nbsp; million dtons in size.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; <BR>&gt;&nbsp; This seems a tad large to me.<BR><BR>"It's the size of a small moon!"<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 22:38:32 -0500<BR>From: "Michael Daumen" &lt;daumen@mindspring.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Big starports<BR><BR>&gt; &gt;As a P/V-8 the second gateway to the Spinward Marches and a high tech,<BR>high population industrial world the highport deals with 6.24 million dtons<BR>of cargo(transiant and system) and 744,000 passengers a week.<BR>&gt; &gt; . . . .<BR>&gt;&gt;the highport should ideally be 52 million dtons in size.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; Remember, this station isn't going anywhere -- you can build almost<BR>arbitrarily large structures if you don't intend to subject them to more<BR>than tiny accelerations. A Stanford torus-style space habitat is 5 million<BR>&gt; dtons; O'Neil One was designed to be 37 million dtons.<BR>&gt;<BR>Whew, I thought Edenelt's was too big dealing with smaller numbers than<BR>these.<BR><BR>Too bad that the Starports hull table doesn't include the monstrosities that<BR>most of the Class V ports will be.&nbsp; Maybe a bigger table will appear in<BR>Starships.&nbsp; Sadly, Starports also lacks quick tables for random starport<BR>generation when the full process is not necessary.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 23:21:48 -0500<BR>From: "DaveShayne" &lt;daveshayne@email.msn.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 23:21:48 -0500<BR><BR>&gt; Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 11:48:10 -0800<BR>&gt; From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;From: "DaveShayne" &lt;daveshayne@email.msn.com&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt;Subject: Re: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>&gt; ...<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; Actually, you aren't going to *have* serfs and yeomanry at the same<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; time. The longbow was one of the reasons peasant *became* yeomanry, and<BR>&gt; &gt;&gt; notable less oppressed. :-)<BR>&gt; ...<BR>&gt; &gt;My understanding of the proximate cause of the end to serfdom in<BR>&gt; &gt;England was a labor shortage caused by the black death. By and<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; Your position seems more likely, if less popular.<BR><BR>The truly ironic thing about this (as I remembered whilst dropping of<BR>to sleep after I posted) is that serfdom was instituted as a response<BR>to the Flu (or whatever the disease was that also lead to the downfall<BR>of the wetsern roman empire.) It seems all those farmers were heading<BR>into the city to fill all the vacant jobs caeser got pissed and bound them<BR>to the land. So I guess a bunch of other things had to have been involved<BR>as well. (Probably improvements in agricultural productivity in the<BR>intervening centuries would be the big one.)<BR><BR>David Shayne<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 4 Feb 2001 23:53:39 -0500<BR>From: "Ray Rangel" &lt;ray.rangel@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; HOWEVER, I can respond to one question that has been repeated several<BR>&gt; &gt; times..."Why would a ray-gun be more reliable?"<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; Simply because it requires no moving parts and can be totally encased<BR>&gt; &gt; (potted) in a polymer. A ray-gun, could, in effect, be a solid object.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Sorry, not even *close*. You can't "pot" it unless you want to have it<BR>&gt; melt. Likewise, parts, even electronic ones *fail* and need replacement<BR>&gt; (I just had to replace a power supply that died with no warning)<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>Uhh, I new to the Traveller universe, but I thought this was science<BR>fiction. Are you seriously equating today's power supply with that the<BR>*might* exist somewhere in time when we *jump* between stars?<BR><BR>&gt; Lasers are going to have moving parts. The aiming/focusing mechanism at<BR>&gt; the very least. And it's unlikely that the lasing medium will be solid.<BR>&gt; Not at the required energy levels. Which means you'll have both<BR>&gt; focusing mirrors and the lasing cavity that can get knocked out of<BR>&gt; alignment.<BR><BR>Uhh, we a have solid state LASERs in the present. Why would they not exist<BR>in the future? Might I remind you, again, that this is science FICTION?<BR>Focusing mirrors? Mirrors are used to aim LASERs, not focus them (by<BR>definition LASER light is coherent); a hand held LASER needs no mirrors (you<BR>point it in the direction you want the beam to go).<BR><BR>&gt; Oh yeah, a speck of *dust* on the optics of a weapons grade laser will<BR>&gt; cause an explosion... What was that film? "Real Genius"? I'm told the<BR>&gt; explosion from the vaseline on the lens was done pretty accurately.<BR><BR>Huh? It's a wonder we don't have LASER labs all over world blowing up!<BR>Yikes, man, what have you been smokin'? Better yet gimme some of what the<BR>person who advised you to use a MOVIE (and a bad one at that) as support for<BR>your opinion was smokin'!<BR><BR>&gt; --<BR>&gt; Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>&gt; leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2001 00:03:19 -0500<BR>From: Laning &lt;laning@wizard.net&gt;<BR>Subject: re: Islandwhana and Roark's Drift<BR><BR>From what I understand of the Zulu warriors, they were very elite troops.<BR>Very.&nbsp; Like Chris Seamans' earlier reference to one side having a major<BR>advantage if they achieve complete surprise, troop "quality" (for want of a<BR>more accepted term) makes for a huge advantage.<BR><BR>Sigh.&nbsp; All this sort of discussion makes me want to run a Traveller<BR>campaign with some players who have a strong grounding in and genuine<BR>talent for tactics, strategy, armor, and weaponry.&nbsp; Most of gaming<BR>companions seem to be people with a hobbyist's interest in gaming per se,<BR>not in military affairs.&nbsp; When I've tried to ref a Traveller campaign in<BR>the past, or my own SF RFG rules, they invariably get themselves into<BR>military adventures and expect to just hack and slash through.&nbsp; I don't<BR>**like** killing player characters off.&nbsp; Plus, it tends to make for<BR>short-lived campaigns.<BR><BR>Before there is a great outpouring of "Hey, I am that kind of player, where<BR>are you located?" I should mention that I live in Northern Virginia, USA.<BR>And also mention that I'm actually a pretty poor specimen of a ref.&nbsp; I'm<BR>much too uncomfortable with scripting other person's lives for them, even<BR>in a game.<BR><BR>- --Laning<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 21:44:52 -0800<BR>From: shudson@lightspeed.ca (Steven Hudson)<BR>Subject: (sale) a couple of old Trav items?<BR><BR>&nbsp; Some of you guys are likely looking for these still:<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (MegaTraveller)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Assignment: Vigilante (223) [$10, VF]<BR>...<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; Paranoia Press:<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; (Traveller)<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Scouts &amp; Assassins (2nd Ed) (1001) [$26, NM]<BR><BR>...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Re: Quincey's Game Update for (2/4/01)<BR>...<BR>&gt;Quincey Koziol &lt;koziol@ncsa.uiuc.edu&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; ***************************************************************<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; ***&nbsp; IMPORTANT: You must reply to this e-mail to purchase&nbsp;&nbsp; ***<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; ***&nbsp; IMPORTANT: these things.&nbsp; Do not use the order forms&nbsp;&nbsp; ***<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; ***&nbsp; IMPORTANT: at the Titan Games site, I am selling these ***<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; ***&nbsp; IMPORTANT: items personally.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; ***<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; ***************************************************************<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 16:49:13 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR><BR>Ray Rangel wrote:<BR>&gt; Uhh, I new to the Traveller universe, but I thought this was science<BR>&gt; fiction. Are you seriously equating today's power supply with that the<BR>&gt; *might* exist somewhere in time when we *jump* between stars?<BR><BR>Are you seriously suggesting that Traveller technology will *never*<BR>fail?<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Uhh, we a have solid state LASERs in the present.<BR><BR>None that come anywhere remotely close to the energy densities needed<BR>for a weapon.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Focusing mirrors? Mirrors are used to aim LASERs, not focus them (by<BR>&gt; definition LASER light is coherent);<BR><BR>Focussing is necessary, unless you want to basically shine an<BR>unusually bright flashlight at your target.<BR><BR>Coherent != focussed.&nbsp; Try learning some of the terminology.&nbsp; A<BR>typical TV station emits many kilowatts of coherent photons, but they<BR>aren't focussed.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Oh yeah, a speck of *dust* on the optics of a weapons grade laser will<BR>&gt; &gt; cause an explosion...<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Huh? It's a wonder we don't have LASER labs all over world blowing up!<BR><BR>High-power laser labs take extraordinary measures to keep the optics<BR>very clean indeed.&nbsp; Of course, destruction of a laboratory is rather<BR>over-the-top.&nbsp; Most likely is just a shattered lens or mirror (which<BR>would still render a weapon unusable).&nbsp; Such accidents do happen, with<BR>lasers substantially below weapon energy levels.<BR><BR><BR>&gt; &gt; What was that film? "Real Genius"? I'm told the explosion from the<BR>&gt; &gt; vaseline on the lens was done pretty accurately.<BR><BR>&gt; Yikes, man, what have you been smokin'? Better yet gimme some of what the<BR>&gt; person who advised you to use a MOVIE (and a bad one at that) as support for<BR>&gt; your opinion was smokin'!<BR><BR>Despite various bits of very poor science in that movie, smearing<BR>vaseline on the optics of a high power laser will destroy at least<BR>that particular piece of equipment.&nbsp; Contaminants even quickly destroy<BR>optics in (relatively puny) 20W CO2 lasers with which I have personal<BR>experience.<BR><BR>When you're talking about beam energies in the high kilojoule to<BR>megajoule range, it becomes even more so.&nbsp; In fact, a megajoule laser<BR>encountering vaseline *would* seriously damage an unprotected<BR>laboratory as depicted in the movie.&nbsp; (Of course, when working with<BR>megajoule lasers you would really put them behind a lot more shielding<BR>than that)<BR><BR>I could run some real numbers for you, but given your previous<BR>imperviousness to physical facts, I don't think it's worth the effort.<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 17:01:14 +1100<BR>From: Timothy Little &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR><BR>Timothy Little wrote:<BR>[...some personal attacks on Ray...]<BR><BR>I'm sorry, the personal attacks in my post were completely<BR>unwarranted.&nbsp; I apologise for them unreservedly.<BR><BR>It just goes to show that sometimes I should wait 10 minutes before<BR>pressing "send".<BR><BR><BR>- --<BR>IMTU tg+ tc+() !tt tm tn-- ge++ 3i+ c+&gt;++ au+ ls pi-@ ta- he+ va++ as+ so- kk--<BR>Tim Little 0209 D347577-9 S va++ as+ so- kk-- A 822<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2001 00:08:55 -0600<BR>From: Steve Daniels &lt;stevedaniels@portcaddo.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: <BR><BR>DaveShayne wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; The truly ironic thing about this (as I remembered whilst dropping of<BR>&gt; to sleep after I posted) is that serfdom was instituted as a response<BR>&gt; to the Flu (or whatever the disease was that also lead to the downfall<BR>&gt; of the wetsern roman empire.) It seems all those farmers were heading<BR>&gt; into the city to fill all the vacant jobs caeser got pissed and bound them<BR>&gt; to the land. So I guess a bunch of other things had to have been involved<BR>&gt; as well. (Probably improvements in agricultural productivity in the<BR>&gt; intervening centuries would be the big one.)<BR><BR>That would be climatic changes due to a very large Volcano<BR>(don't remember which at the time).&nbsp; Ruined crops and agricultural<BR>productivity for two years.&nbsp; And it happened at the worst possible<BR>time - with the Huns on the door.<BR><BR>- -bloo<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2001 22:27:29 -0800<BR>From: Tod Glenn &lt;webmaster@travellercentral.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: ATTN Downport<BR><BR>on 2/4/01 7:18 PM, SwordWorlder at SwordWorlder@nc.rr.com wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Oops, I was wrong. This was the last spider:<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Your site has been spidered.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Our search engine has finished indexing your site:<BR>&gt; Site URL&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; : http://www.downport.com/index.html<BR>&gt; E-mail&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; : webmaster@downport.com<BR>&gt; Site ID&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; : 7110039<BR>&gt; Pages Indexed : 1317<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I like to be as accurate as possible lest the TML Old Great Ones banish me.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I guess it's your turn to whip it out and put me to shame...<BR>&gt; <BR><BR>OK, I don't have a spider report, so I did a search for "&lt;body", knowing it<BR>would appear once in every html file:<BR><BR>Results:<BR><BR>www.travellercentral.com&nbsp; &nbsp; 572<BR>merc.travellercentral.com&nbsp;&nbsp; 53<BR>www.solsec.org&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; 97<BR>www.spinwardmarches.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 1591 (OK most of these are placeholders)<BR>www.travellerguns.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 97<BR>www.grandsurvey.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 25<BR><BR>grand total Traveller webpages:&nbsp; 2,435<BR><BR>Note that the pages for spinwardmarches.com only include details for Regina<BR>subsector, which has 692 pages.&nbsp; If we assume similar number for each of the<BR>other subsector, we are looking at about about 12,000 pages when it's all<BR>done.&nbsp; Ouch!<BR><BR>However, your 1317 is definitely more than my paltry 572 on my main site,<BR>Traveller Central.<BR><BR>Tod<BR><BR>- --<BR>"There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern.<BR>They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters."<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; -Daniel Webster<BR>- -- <BR>Tod L Glenn<BR>webmaster@travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.travellercentral.com<BR>http://www.spinwardmarches.com<BR>http://www.solsec.org<BR>http://www.grandsurvey.com<BR>http://travellerguns.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 06:47:05 +0000<BR>From: Paul Campbell &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: ATTN Downport<BR><BR>On Sun, Feb 04, 2001 at 10:15:24PM -0500, SwordWorlder wrote:<BR>&gt; ----- Original Message -----<BR>&gt; From: "Timothy Little" &lt;tim@lilly-villa.little-possums.net&gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; SwordWorlder wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; Unfortunately, there are some browsers with which it will not work<BR>&gt; &gt; &gt; properly due to the size of the include files.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; I thought SSI was exactly what it says -- *server* side includes.&nbsp; How<BR>&gt; &gt; does the browser make a difference?&nbsp; All it sees is HTML.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I have tried to figure out why the page load dies during the loading of the<BR>&gt; menu bar include. If I reduce the size of the file it finishes loading. So<BR>&gt; either it is the size of the load or something within the last kb of the<BR>&gt; include file. Since I don't have a Unix system online here to check it with,<BR>&gt; I have not been able to test as exhaustively as I'd like. Can anyone tell me<BR>&gt; what is the LAST bit of HTML that loads before it quits?<BR><BR>When I tried to have a look yesterday at the Landgrab page the last<BR>part was *one* great big huge long line of html.&nbsp; Maybe this is<BR>causing some sort of buffer overflow?&nbsp; Maybe the odd linebreak might<BR>help.&nbsp; But I am only guessing.&nbsp; I was using Linux-Netscape-4.73.<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Paul Campbell (Sourceforge) &lt;kemitix@users.sourceforge.net&gt;<BR>GPG Key fingerprint = 9C4F 31A3 8814 9F94 A533 A979 E63F 0C69 A771 0F24<BR>http://www.kemitix.uklinux.net<BR>jupiter: 6:44am up 26 days, 20:24, 3 users, load average: 0.24, 0.28, 0.20<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 20:20:58 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: ATTN Downport<BR><BR>G'day Swordy,<BR><BR>Hopefully you'll take these comments in the vein in the way they are<BR>intended, as constructive criticism and advice.<BR><BR>&gt; That's correct. I have held off for two years longer than most, but I am<BR>&gt; finally switching over to stylesheets and SSI because of the sheer size of<BR>&gt; the site. Unfortunately, there are some browsers with which it<BR>&gt; will not work properly due to the size of the include files.<BR><BR>You should be able to write a site that is at least _visible_ to older<BR>browsers, even if you are using stylesheets.<BR><BR>SSI, of course, should have no affect at all on display, because it should<BR>be being executed before the browser sees it.<BR><BR>&gt; Unix platforms seem to have trouble the most. I am looking for a better<BR>solution. I will<BR>&gt; probably change over to JSP as soon as we move the site onto our own<BR>servers in the next<BR>&gt; week or so. With 300+ pages to maintain, I really need to automate as much<BR>&gt; as possible :-)<BR><BR>For management of a web site use XSL, not JSP.<BR>Something as simple as the Downport layout is a cinch with XSL.<BR><BR>Having a look at the source for your pages, you haven't really started using<BR>CSS yet, there are still far too many font and colour tags buried in your<BR>text, and the only style sheet you're using seems to be&nbsp; :<BR><BR>td { color: black;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; font-family: arial,verdana,sans-sarif;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; text-decoration: none; }<BR><BR>which certainly shouldn't prevent older browsers from working.<BR><BR>The most likely reason for failure is the (IMO) completely unneccesaary use<BR>of client-side scripting to generate the boiler plate (the code in<BR>"title.js")<BR><BR>It could be that the page does not validate against the doctype it claims to<BR>be, here's the first error :<BR><BR>Line 7, column 55:<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;link rel=stylesheet href="model.css" type="text/css"&gt;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; ^<BR>Error: document type does not allow element "LINK" here<BR><BR>This could theoretically cause a browser to miss the &lt;/head&gt; tag while<BR>looking for the &lt;/link&gt; tag, and then fail to do anything when it doesn't<BR>find either.<BR><BR>But it's probably the script. Not a good way of writing a page, you should<BR>only use client-side script for something like mouse-overs, not navigation<BR>boiler-plate. If I turn off script execution, something a lot of people do,<BR>I get a useless front page too, and the script does rely on certain advanced<BR>features of the javascript document model.<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 03:24:07 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR><BR>Ray wrote:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Sorry, not even *close*. You can't "pot" it unless you want to have it<BR>&gt;&gt; melt. Likewise, parts, even electronic ones *fail* and need replacement<BR>&gt;&gt; (I just had to replace a power supply that died with no warning)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;Uhh, I new to the Traveller universe, but I thought this was science<BR>&gt;fiction. Are you seriously equating today's power supply with that the<BR>&gt;*might* exist somewhere in time when we *jump* between stars?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Actually, it's pretty clear that Leonard wasn't "equating" the power<BR>supplies of today with futuristic power supplies, but instead pointing out<BR>that things break down and that when things break down, they need to be<BR>repaired or replaced. This means that totally encasing something in polymer,<BR>even something with no moving parts, is going to generally be a bad idea<BR>because if even the tiniest part breaks down, the whole device effectively<BR>becomes a paperweight.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Read Leonard's comment again, and I'm sure you'll see that what he wrote is<BR>at variance with what you responded.<BR><BR>&lt;snip&gt;<BR><BR>&gt;Huh? It's a wonder we don't have LASER labs all over world blowing up!<BR>&gt;Yikes, man, what have you been smokin'? Better yet gimme some of what the<BR>&gt;person who advised you to use a MOVIE (and a bad one at that) as support<BR>for<BR>&gt;your opinion was smokin'!<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; You're wrong on two points here. The first point is that "Real Genius" was<BR>a bad film. It was actually a fine film, witty, intelligent, well-scripted<BR>and so on. Since I'm a good guy, I'll allow the relativists' claim -- that<BR>is that aesthetics are subjective -- to hold up for the moment, so I won't<BR>make a big deal about it. That's a joke, please don't get too bent out of<BR>shape. The second point is... well... everything else which you've written<BR>above.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Yes, Virginia, when it comes to powerful lasers, you do indeed have to keep<BR>your optics clean. If you don't, then pretty much what happens in the movie<BR>happens. Think about it for a moment, Ray. If there's anything on that lens,<BR>you're going to be pumping energy into it. If the lens is chipped,<BR>scratched, smudged, coated with vaseline or dirt, you're in really big<BR>trouble.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Why? Because when the laser pumps its energy into that little speck of<BR>dust, there'll be a tiny scorch-mark on the glass, which will block part of<BR>the beam. As the laser's energy pumps into the scorch mark it will heat up<BR>the lens, which will melt the glass. As the glass melts, it will block part<BR>of the beam, which will heat up the lens, which will melt more glass, which<BR>will block part of the beam, which will melt more glass, which will block<BR>part of the beam. The laser is going to be pumping a lot of energy into the<BR>lens, possibly all of the energy from the beam. Eventually...<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; BOOM!<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; No more optics, no more laser weapon.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; That's simply how lasers work.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; I have nothing against lasers. I like lasers. I will keep using them in&nbsp; my<BR>Traveller games. However, I acknowledge that it's entirely possible that<BR>there may never, ever be a day when lasers are used as weapons in the real<BR>world. If they are, then they're going to be certain problems with their use<BR>which will make them tactically inflexible (which is just a fancy way of<BR>saying that they will have very limited and specialized uses in combat).<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; For the most part, this isn't a big problem in the real world. If you're<BR>careless enough to get your CD lens dirty or smudged, then it's not going to<BR>blow up because the output of that tiny little laser isn't as high as it<BR>would have to be to be used on the battlefield. The CD player will, however,<BR>perform erratically because either a part or the whole of the beam is<BR>blocked. If you have a laser rangefinder and the lens gets dirty, it won't<BR>explode either, but there will be problems with performance.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; In labs where they're experimenting with powerful lasers, I'm sure that<BR>they keep their optics crystal clear. If they don't, then thousands and<BR>thousands of dollars of funding get flushed down the drain, and their<BR>projects get set back by days, months or even years. In doctors' offices<BR>where they use&nbsp; powerful lasers to remove warts or unsightly blemishes, I'm<BR>sure they clean the optics regularly to make sure that they won't end up<BR>with an expensive paperweight.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Basically, if you're using a laser which can do serious damage to somebody,<BR>then you're going to have problems if you're careless. Period. The biggest<BR>problem is that the environments and situations laser weapons would be used<BR>in would be the exact same environments and situations most likely to screw<BR>up the optics in some way.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; An example:<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; You're a mercenary sitting in a trench on some godforesaken world. It's<BR>raining and the mud is up around your ankles. You haven't had any real sleep<BR>in weeks. A decent hot meal? You vaguely remember dreaming about one about a<BR>month ago. Suddenly, an artillery shell whistles downward and explodes<BR>nearby, flinging mud and debris all over. The concussion knocks you down and<BR>you drop your trusty laser rifle into the pool of muck at your feet.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; As you come to your senses, you hear the sound of small-arms fire between<BR>the thunderous rumbling of exploding artillery shells. Zhoe war robots have<BR>breached the perimeter! You scramble for your laser and grab it just as a<BR>small crab-like killer reaches the edge of the trench. Your face bunches up<BR>into a grimace as you swing the gun around to fire...<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Unfortunately, the laser pumps all of its energy into the mud and scratches<BR>(which the artillery barrage and the subsequent dropping deposited all over<BR>your lens) instead of into the robot, as you would have expected. The<BR>resulting explosion isn't enough to kill you, or even really hurt you. It's<BR>just a little surprising.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; There's a sound like a loud coughing fit as the little crab-like robot<BR>pumps about a dozen flechettes into you in quick succession.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Your last thought as you sink into the mud?<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; "If I survive this, I'm going to find that Instellarms laser salesman and<BR>make him die a slow, painful, horrible death."<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 03:24:09 -0500<BR>From: "Chris Seamans" &lt;semo@pil.net&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>&gt;Hey Chris,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I am reading your posts, and they're very illuminating.&nbsp; This one is<BR>&gt;definitely getting put in the 'keepers' file.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Thanks Tod, I appreciate the sentiment. I'm glad you've found my post on<BR>the topic informative.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; One caveat for you and others, however: I've been rather generous when it<BR>comes to guesstimating the ranges for the longbow. As I mentioned a few<BR>posts back there's a lot of disagreement about how powerful the bows used by<BR>the English archers really were, and how effective they really were. I've<BR>mentioned an "extended range" for the bows in some of my posts, but that<BR>concept is really steeped in speculation. The longbows may not really have<BR>had the kinds of long ranges I've mentioned before.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Just a warning. :)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 03:20:41 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons; Rangefinding discussion with background.<BR><BR>This goes back to what my Cousin was saying: In college he fired a target<BR>bow at 25, 50, 75(?) and 100(?) or 110(?) meters (I think, It's been a long<BR>time), so getting his sight adjustment was fairly easy as far as his target<BR>bow was concerned. At the longest firing distance, using the lightest of<BR>arrows, with a bow with about a 25KG draw, he elevated his bow about 20<BR>degrees or so. He had the advantage of his own range (Firing across two or<BR>three property lines): his choice of location was due to the fact he wanted<BR>to be practicing in an area with a crosswind present all the time, to better<BR>get a feel for wind deflection. Apparently, it paid off at the<BR>championships. :0)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; When he went hunting for the first time, he dumbfounded at his inability<BR>to hit a soda can at even 15 meters. Judging distance was a whole other<BR>world, and the fairly draggy, heavy hunting arrows he was using didn't help<BR>matters. He almost had to relearn how to shoot a bow. He had us set up<BR>haybales at random distances on his range, firing at a paper plate. The<BR>results were not pretty for a couple of weeks. After a lot of practice, he<BR>learned to judge distance by referencing how big the paper plate was.<BR>It really got fun when we changed the COLOR of the plate from white to tan.<BR>He was used to firing at bulls eye targets colored blue and yellow, so the<BR>change to white wasn't that big of an issue. When he went from white to tan,<BR>he took another serious hit to accuracy. Finally, he ended up shooting a<BR>life-sized target of a deer for nearly six months before he felt comfortable<BR>hunting. He made the comment to me once that most bow hunters in the U.S.<BR>have no business bow hunting: they simply don't practice enough and they<BR>don't practice judging distance anywhere near enough to hit a target past 25<BR>meters, or kill the animal humanely assuming they do score a hit.<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Rifle shooting has all of these associated problems assuming you are using<BR>open sights, but the trajectory of the M855 5.56x45mm NATO round is such<BR>that if you aim for man's chest you will hit the man's chest/abdomen out to<BR>600 meters, assuming your rifle is zeroed at 200 meters (Shooting 2" or 50<BR>mm high at 100 meters).<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Riflemen can be bow hunters, if they practice a great deal (Weeks, months,<BR>years...). Bow hunters who know their craft can be riflemen with only a few<BR>hours or days worth of instruction and practice. But today, most learn to<BR>shoot a rifle first, and a bow later.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Best,<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Matt<BR><BR><BR><BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Chris Seamans<BR>Sent: Monday, February 05, 2001 2:24 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR><BR>&gt;Hey Chris,<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;I am reading your posts, and they're very illuminating.&nbsp; This one is<BR>&gt;definitely getting put in the 'keepers' file.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Thanks Tod, I appreciate the sentiment. I'm glad you've found my<BR>post on<BR>the topic informative.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; One caveat for you and others, however: I've been rather generous<BR>when it<BR>comes to guesstimating the ranges for the longbow. As I mentioned a few<BR>posts back there's a lot of disagreement about how powerful the bows used by<BR>the English archers really were, and how effective they really were. I've<BR>mentioned an "extended range" for the bows in some of my posts, but that<BR>concept is really steeped in speculation. The longbows may not really have<BR>had the kinds of long ranges I've mentioned before.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Just a warning. :)<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 23:36:16 +1300<BR>From: "Frank G. Pitt" &lt;frankie@mundens.gen.nz&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR><BR>Chris Seamans wrote :<BR><BR>A good post, just one bit I;d like to take issue with.<BR><BR>&gt; &nbsp; &nbsp; Actually, it's pretty clear that Leonard wasn't "equating" the power<BR>&gt; supplies of today with futuristic power supplies, but instead pointing out<BR>&gt; that things break down and that when things break down, they need to be<BR>&gt; repaired or replaced. This means that totally encasing something<BR>&gt; in polymer, even something with no moving parts, is going to generally<BR>&gt; be a bad idea because if even the tiniest part breaks down, the<BR>&gt; whole device effectively becomes a paperweight.<BR><BR>This is what the military does today with electronics for aircraft.<BR><BR>I have personally removed said coating in order to carry out a repair and<BR>then "re-potted" the device.&nbsp; Yes, it is a time consuming operation, but the<BR>potting actually increases the MTBF because it prevents (or at least heavily<BR>reduces) stress on the components, so it's cost effective.<BR><BR>Anyway, who cares if it becomes a paperweight as long as it lasts long<BR>enough?<BR><BR>Plug in a new module if the old one breaks. Heck, toss the whole weapon,<BR>they can probably be manufactured for Cr30 each or less, so it's not worth<BR>repairing.<BR><BR>My take on future beam weapons is single or five-shot plastic disposables<BR>looking like, and selling for about the same amount as, a glue gun and a<BR>packet of glue sticks.<BR>&lt;grin&gt;<BR><BR>Frankie<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3598<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-yb03.mx.aol.com (rly-yb03.mail.aol.com [172.18.146.3]) by air-yb04.mail.aol.com (v77_r1.21) with ESMTP; Mon, 05 Feb 2001 05:29:37 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-yb03.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Mon, 05 Feb 2001 05:29:04 -0500<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id FAA57982;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 5 Feb 2001 05:25:16 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 5 Feb 2001 05:24:34 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id FAA57936<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 2001 05:24:34 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 05:24:34 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102051024.FAA57936@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3598<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML><HTML><HEAD><BASE></HEAD>
<BODY background=""><FONT color=#000000 face=Arial>
<TABLE border=1 borderColorDark=#ffffff cellPadding=1 cellSpacing=0 frame=box rules=groups style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #ffffff; FONT-SIZE: x-small" width="100%">
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR align=left bgColor=#ffffff color="#000000">
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Subj: </TD>
<TD><B>Traveller-digest V1999 #3599</B></TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top width="10%">Date: </TD>
<TD>2/5/01 11:16:17 AM Pacific Standard Time</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#ffffff colSpan=2><I>From:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>Sender:&nbsp; &nbsp; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Reply-to:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>To:&nbsp; &nbsp; traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR></I></TD></TR></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR></FONT><FONT size=2 PTSIZE="10"><BR><BR>Traveller-digest&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Monday, February 5 2001&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Volume 1999 : Number 3599<BR><BR><BR><BR>(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>All rights reserved.<BR><BR>The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR><BR>RE: Size<BR>Re: Rangefinding discussion with background.<BR>Re: Islandwhana and Roark's Drift<BR>Request for info<BR>Re: Request for info<BR>Re: Request for info<BR>Re: Lasers<BR>Lasers (was Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....)<BR>Re: Request for info<BR>RE: Request for info<BR>RE: Rangefinding discussion with background.<BR>Re: Archers vs Rifles<BR>[Website Review] Spinward Marches Trade Map<BR>Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR>Re: Big starports<BR>Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR>Re: Uhhhhh<BR>Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR><BR>----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 11:21:34 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Size<BR><BR>GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:<BR>&gt; &gt; Multiply this by 4 (as per the rules) and the highport should<BR>&gt; &gt; ideally be 52 million dtons in size.<BR>&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt; &gt; This seems a tad large to me.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; "It's the size of a small moon!"<BR><BR>Imagine: our happy band of ECMs (ethically challenged&nbsp; merchants)<BR>jump into the system.&nbsp; As they close on the&nbsp; planet&nbsp; they&nbsp; spy&nbsp; a<BR>small craft they want to attack.&nbsp; Cut to bridge scene ...<BR><BR>Rookie ECM: "Look at 'im, he's heading for that small moon."<BR><BR>Veteran ECM: "I think I can get him before he gets there.&nbsp; He's<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; almost in range."<BR><BR>Old Man: "That's no moon, that's a spacestation."<BR><BR>Veteran ECM: "It's too big to be a spacestation."<BR><BR>Rookie ECM: "I've got a very bad feeling about this."<BR><BR>...<BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 07:21:48 -0500<BR>From: "Daniel Phelps" &lt;phelpsd@gate.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Rangefinding discussion with background.<BR><BR>Was written:<BR><BR>&gt;This goes back to what my Cousin was saying: In college he fired a target<BR>&gt;bow at 25, 50, 75(?) and 100(?) or 110(?) meters (I think, It's been a long<BR>&gt;time), so getting his sight adjustment was fairly easy as far as his target<BR>&gt;bow was concerned. At the longest firing distance, using the lightest of<BR>&gt;arrows, with a bow with about a 25KG draw, he elevated his bow about 20<BR>&gt;degrees or so. He had the advantage of his own range (Firing across two or<BR>&gt;three property lines): his choice of location was due to the fact he wanted<BR>&gt;to be practicing in an area with a crosswind present all the time, to<BR>better<BR>&gt;get a feel for wind deflection.<BR><BR>If you can find it check out "The Crossbow"&nbsp; by Payne-Gallaway.&nbsp; It has a<BR>short little chapter where it talks about distance shooting competition with<BR>bows in Turkey.&nbsp; They used very light arrows, heavy bows and over drew the<BR>bows with little horn appliances attached to left arm.<BR><BR>As a side note does anyone know the story of the last "officially recorded"<BR>time the English long bow was used in combat to kill an opponent?&nbsp; Was early<BR>in WWII as the Brits were retreating to the coast.&nbsp; The Brit was an officer<BR>who was an Olympic hopeful with the bow.<BR><BR>Dan<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;-----Original Message-----<BR>&gt;From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Chris Seamans<BR>&gt;Sent: Monday, February 05, 2001 2:24 AM<BR>&gt;To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Hey Chris,<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;I am reading your posts, and they're very illuminating.&nbsp; This one is<BR>&gt;&gt;definitely getting put in the 'keepers' file.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Thanks Tod, I appreciate the sentiment. I'm glad you've found my<BR>&gt;post on<BR>&gt;the topic informative.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; One caveat for you and others, however: I've been rather generous<BR>&gt;when it<BR>&gt;comes to guesstimating the ranges for the longbow. As I mentioned a few<BR>&gt;posts back there's a lot of disagreement about how powerful the bows used<BR>by<BR>&gt;the English archers really were, and how effective they really were. I've<BR>&gt;mentioned an "extended range" for the bows in some of my posts, but that<BR>&gt;concept is really steeped in speculation. The longbows may not really have<BR>&gt;had the kinds of long ranges I've mentioned before.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Just a warning. :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2001 13:59:35 GMT<BR>From: TML@stempest.demon.co.uk (Stephen Tempest)<BR>Subject: Re: Islandwhana and Roark's Drift<BR><BR>Ahem.<BR><BR>Isandhlwana<BR><BR>Rorke's Drift<BR><BR>(please don't ask me to pronounce "Isandhlwana", however...)<BR><BR><BR>According to the 3W game notes of the battle, Rorke's Drift pitted<BR>three Zulu regiments (the uThulwana, uDloko and iNdulyengwe) with<BR>about 3000-4000 men between them, against 152 British soldiers, mostly<BR>from B Company, 2nd Battalion, 24th Regiment (South Wales Borderers).<BR>The TL4 troops suffered 18 killed and 13 wounded, making a 20%<BR>casualty rate.&nbsp; I don't know the Zulu casualties (although I suspect<BR>they realised that the outpost wouldn't be easy to take and gave up<BR>attacking it, rather than actually being "beaten" in the sense of<BR>"huge casualties and broken morale").<BR><BR>Stephen<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2001 15:46:51 -0000<BR>From: "Jeff Rowse" &lt;jeffrowse@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Request for info<BR><BR>Can anyone tell me the effects of someone siting a fighter-type radar on the <BR>floor below my office?&nbsp; Laymans' terms preferably cos we're IT types!&nbsp; <BR>Fairly urgent 'cos they wanted to put it in last week...<BR><BR>Thanks in advance,<BR>Jeff Rowse.<BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Tue, 06 Feb 2001 03:00:30 +1100<BR>From: Rob &lt;rhoughto@one.net.au&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Request for info<BR><BR>- --------------6CA9579CFE56BE4345ED22F8<BR>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR>Layman's terms...think microwave oven and you won't be too far from the<BR>truth...I's not reall all that good for you. Why are they doing it?<BR><BR>Other Rob<BR><BR>Jeff Rowse wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Can anyone tell me the effects of someone siting a fighter-type radar on the<BR>&gt; floor below my office?&nbsp; Laymans' terms preferably cos we're IT types!<BR>&gt; Fairly urgent 'cos they wanted to put it in last week...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Thanks in advance,<BR>&gt; Jeff Rowse.<BR>&gt; _________________________________________________________________________<BR>&gt; Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR><BR>- --------------6CA9579CFE56BE4345ED22F8<BR>Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii<BR>Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit<BR><BR>&lt;!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en"&gt;<BR><BR>Layman's terms...think <I>microwave oven</I> and you won't be too far from<BR>the truth...I's not reall all that good for you. Why are they doing it?<BR>
<P>Other Rob<BR>
<P>Jeff Rowse wrote:<BR>&lt;blockquote TYPE=CITE&gt;Can anyone tell me the effects of someone siting<BR>a fighter-type radar on the<BR><BR>floor below my office?&amp;nbsp; Laymans' terms preferably cos we're IT<BR>types!<BR><BR>Fairly urgent 'cos they wanted to put it in last week...<BR>
<P>Thanks in advance,<BR><BR>Jeff Rowse.<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________________________<BR><BR>Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at <A href="http://www.hotmail.com/" title=http://www.hotmail.com/>http://www.hotmail.com/</A>.&lt;/blockquote&gt;<BR><BR><BR>- --------------6CA9579CFE56BE4345ED22F8--<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2001 11:02:56 -0500<BR>From: Kurt Feltenberger &lt;kurt@blazenet.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Request for info<BR><BR>At 03:46 PM 02/05/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Can anyone tell me the effects of someone siting a fighter-type radar on <BR>&gt;the floor below my office?&nbsp; Laymans' terms preferably cos we're IT types!<BR>&gt;Fairly urgent 'cos they wanted to put it in last week...<BR><BR>I remember reading in V. Belyenko's book, "MiG Pilot", that when they would <BR>sit on the runway doing alerts, that they would take pot shots with their <BR>radar at rabbits at the end of the runway.&nbsp; A decent sweep would generally <BR>cause the bunny to explode...<BR><BR>All in all, I would say this is a *bad* thing.<BR><BR>Kurt Feltenberger<BR><BR>"To our Country! In her intercourse with foreign nations,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; may she always be in the right, but our country, right or wrong!"<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ~Stephen Decatur<BR><BR><BR>mailto:kurt@blazenet.net<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 08:12:21 -0800<BR>From: "Bruce Macintosh" &lt;bruce.macintosh@worldnet.att.net&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Lasers<BR><BR>&gt;I have nothing against lasers. I like lasers. I will keep using them in&nbsp; my<BR>&gt;Traveller games. However, I acknowledge that it's entirely possible that<BR>&gt;there may never, ever be a day when lasers are used as weapons in the real<BR>&gt;world. If they are, then they're going to be certain problems with their use<BR>&gt;which will make them tactically inflexible (which is just a fancy way of<BR>&gt;saying that they will have very limited and specialized uses in combat).<BR><BR>The USAF is funding the YAL-1 airborne laser, which looks likely to be a<BR>effective anti-theatre-ballistic-missile unit, and (whether it can<BR>get TBMs or not) will be near-certain death for aircraft out to its horizon.<BR>This is a pretty serious program...<BR><BR>At traveller tech levels, a mostly-solid-state laser rifle doesn't seem<BR>impractical; it'd be modular, of course, for repairs, but generally mud-tight.<BR>Focusing and adaptive optics could be done through solid-state<BR>transmissive elements rather than mirrors. Keeping mud off the exit window<BR>would be the tricky part - tiny windshield wipers, perhaps? (or a proper<BR>electrostatic charge on the window to at least repel dust?)<BR><BR>Bruce<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 11:29:55 -0500<BR>From: "Matthew P. Picio" &lt;ace@acehunter.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Lasers (was Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....)<BR><BR>&gt; I have nothing against lasers. I like lasers. I will keep using them in<BR>my<BR>&gt; Traveller games. However, I acknowledge that it's entirely possible that<BR>&gt; there may never, ever be a day when lasers are used as weapons in the real<BR>&gt; world. If they are, then they're going to be certain problems with their<BR>use<BR>&gt; which will make them tactically inflexible (which is just a fancy way of<BR>&gt; saying that they will have very limited and specialized uses in combat).<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>1st time posting to the TML - Hello, all.&nbsp; Here's a link to the Tactical<BR>High-Energy Laser (THEL).&nbsp; The media gallery has a few excellent pics.<BR><BR>http://www.trw.com/presskits/detailinfo/1,,2_12^2^12^23,00.html<BR><BR>It's been successfully tested against incoming missiles, and is a<BR>megawatt-class DF (Deuterium Flouride) Laser.<BR>Of course, it'll be interesting to see it try to fire after the artillery<BR>barrage you described - the testing environment certainly isn't as dirty as<BR>the battlefield, and I don't believe it's been fired through smoke or haze.<BR>Looks cool, though.<BR><BR>- -Matt Picio<BR>ace@acehunter.com<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 11:49:36 -0500<BR>From: "Matthew P. Picio" &lt;ace@acehunter.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Request for info<BR><BR>You should be okay if there is a steel floor between your office and the<BR>radar, as long as you're not in its direct arc.&nbsp; A typical fighter radar<BR>only sweeps "up" about 15 degrees, and is harmful to humans out to about 500<BR>feet if you're in the direct path.&nbsp; Outside of the direct path, you're<BR>(relatively) safe.&nbsp; I worked on an aircraft carrier on the flight deck for 2<BR>years, with 5 active radar antennas constantly radiating when we were at<BR>sea, and in the 10 years since getting out have not experienced any ill<BR>effects.&nbsp; YMMV.<BR><BR>Still, I would find out what direction they have it pointing when they<BR>install it.<BR><BR>- -Matt<BR>ace@acehunter.com<BR>http://www.acehunter.com<BR><BR><BR>- ----- Original Message -----<BR>From: "Jeff Rowse" &lt;jeffrowse@hotmail.com&gt;<BR>To: &lt;traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Sent: Monday, February 05, 2001 7:46 AM<BR>Subject: Request for info<BR><BR><BR>&gt; Can anyone tell me the effects of someone siting a fighter-type radar on<BR>the<BR>&gt; floor below my office?&nbsp; Laymans' terms preferably cos we're IT types!<BR>&gt; Fairly urgent 'cos they wanted to put it in last week...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Thanks in advance,<BR>&gt; Jeff Rowse.<BR>&gt; _________________________________________________________________________<BR>&gt; Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 10:46:54 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Request for info<BR><BR>If there is any RF leakage, you could be exposed to enough radiation to have<BR>problems with FLK (Funny Looking Kids), depending on the wattage of the<BR>radar: If it is a high band phased array, like those used in interceptors<BR>for painting targets, this would be enough to cause concern, get the Hazmat<BR>book out and bring it up with your OMBUDSMAN before they plug it in. More<BR>seriously, large amounts of RF/EMI signals can play hob with network<BR>cabling, particularly CAT-5 UTP. Most network cabling setups in electrically<BR>noisy areas use fiber optics.<BR><BR>I concur that that on the surface, I'd be a little nervous with it until I<BR>knew more about it.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Matt Helton<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Kurt Feltenberger<BR>Sent: Monday, February 05, 2001 10:03 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Request for info<BR><BR>At 03:46 PM 02/05/2001 +0000, you wrote:<BR>&gt;Can anyone tell me the effects of someone siting a fighter-type radar on<BR>&gt;the floor below my office?&nbsp; Laymans' terms preferably cos we're IT types!<BR>&gt;Fairly urgent 'cos they wanted to put it in last week...<BR><BR>I remember reading in V. Belyenko's book, "MiG Pilot", that when they would<BR>sit on the runway doing alerts, that they would take pot shots with their<BR>radar at rabbits at the end of the runway.&nbsp; A decent sweep would generally<BR>cause the bunny to explode...<BR><BR>All in all, I would say this is a *bad* thing.<BR><BR>Kurt Feltenberger<BR><BR>"To our Country! In her intercourse with foreign nations,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; may she always be in the right, but our country, right or wrong!"<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; ~Stephen Decatur<BR><BR><BR>mailto:kurt@blazenet.net<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 10:51:22 -0600<BR>From: "Matthew W. Helton" &lt;mwhelton@cox-internet.com&gt;<BR>Subject: RE: Rangefinding discussion with background.<BR><BR>I was under the impression Bows and Crossbows were used by the British up<BR>into the 1960's for some Special Ops troopers before the Sterling (Patchett)<BR>L34A1 became standard issue. The WW2 DeLisle Carbine and Sten MK2S were not<BR>always available, nor were they particularly easy to service.<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Matt Helton<BR><BR>- -----Original Message-----<BR>From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Daniel Phelps<BR>Sent: Monday, February 05, 2001 6:22 AM<BR>To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Re: Rangefinding discussion with background.<BR><BR>Was written:<BR><BR>&gt;This goes back to what my Cousin was saying: In college he fired a target<BR>&gt;bow at 25, 50, 75(?) and 100(?) or 110(?) meters (I think, It's been a long<BR>&gt;time), so getting his sight adjustment was fairly easy as far as his target<BR>&gt;bow was concerned. At the longest firing distance, using the lightest of<BR>&gt;arrows, with a bow with about a 25KG draw, he elevated his bow about 20<BR>&gt;degrees or so. He had the advantage of his own range (Firing across two or<BR>&gt;three property lines): his choice of location was due to the fact he wanted<BR>&gt;to be practicing in an area with a crosswind present all the time, to<BR>better<BR>&gt;get a feel for wind deflection.<BR><BR>If you can find it check out "The Crossbow"&nbsp; by Payne-Gallaway.&nbsp; It has a<BR>short little chapter where it talks about distance shooting competition with<BR>bows in Turkey.&nbsp; They used very light arrows, heavy bows and over drew the<BR>bows with little horn appliances attached to left arm.<BR><BR>As a side note does anyone know the story of the last "officially recorded"<BR>time the English long bow was used in combat to kill an opponent?&nbsp; Was early<BR>in WWII as the Brits were retreating to the coast.&nbsp; The Brit was an officer<BR>who was an Olympic hopeful with the bow.<BR><BR>Dan<BR><BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;-----Original Message-----<BR>&gt;From: owner-traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.ient.com]On Behalf Of Chris Seamans<BR>&gt;Sent: Monday, February 05, 2001 2:24 AM<BR>&gt;To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>&gt;Subject: RE: Projectile Weapons vs Energy Weapons<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;Hey Chris,<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt;I am reading your posts, and they're very illuminating.&nbsp; This one is<BR>&gt;&gt;definitely getting put in the 'keepers' file.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Thanks Tod, I appreciate the sentiment. I'm glad you've found my<BR>&gt;post on<BR>&gt;the topic informative.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; One caveat for you and others, however: I've been rather generous<BR>&gt;when it<BR>&gt;comes to guesstimating the ranges for the longbow. As I mentioned a few<BR>&gt;posts back there's a lot of disagreement about how powerful the bows used<BR>by<BR>&gt;the English archers really were, and how effective they really were. I've<BR>&gt;mentioned an "extended range" for the bows in some of my posts, but that<BR>&gt;concept is really steeped in speculation. The longbows may not really have<BR>&gt;had the kinds of long ranges I've mentioned before.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Just a warning. :)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2001 12:04:54 -0400 (EDT)<BR>From: Ian Ferguson &lt;ian@vax2.concordia.ca&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Archers vs Rifles<BR><BR>I wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;Very true.&nbsp; A company of spearmen with archers would have little<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;chance against a squad with rifles and an autorifle on an open<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;plain, but a company with rifles and a few autorifles would give a<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;squad with ACRs and a RAM GL pause for thought.<BR>Leonard wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;Don't sell archer's short. If they are up to the "standard" of the<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;English at Agincourt, while the squad is up to modern standards,<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;they'll take casualties, but the squad will be eliminated. Volley fire<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;from a company of archers is a fearsome thing.<BR>I wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;I'm trying not to.&nbsp; A squad of marksmen (equivalent, perhaps,<BR>&gt;&gt;to the "standard" of the English at Agincourt) spread out and<BR>&gt;&gt;supported by an autorifle would inflict nasty damage on a<BR>&gt;&gt;bunch of archers packed together without cover.&nbsp; Such<BR>&gt;&gt;damage could be inflicted before the archers got into range,<BR>&gt;&gt;even if we think in terms of reality rather than Traveller (all<BR>&gt;&gt;I know are the CT rules).&nbsp; If the archers are somehow able to<BR>&gt;&gt;continue to advance in the face of this, they will still be<BR>&gt;&gt;mowed down at an appalling rate as they mass to fire.&nbsp; No<BR>&gt;&gt;doubt the riflemen would take casualties, but I would still<BR>&gt;&gt;put my money on the rifle squad (if I were a betting man).<BR>Leonard wrote:<BR>&gt;Assuming they are *stupid* enough to advance in a massed group.<BR>I write:<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; In order to deliver the massed volleys that were so fearsome,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; they probably had to be massed together.&nbsp; The alternative<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; would be to disperse and sacrifice volley effectiveness in<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; order to reduce the rifle and autorifle's deadly fire.&nbsp; On balance,<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I would still lay odds on the firearms squad.<BR><BR>Leonard wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;You can *only* make things go in the rifle's favor if you engage the<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;archers from well beyond their max effective range. And that range<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;(several hundred yards) is well beyond the range soldiers with rifles<BR>&gt;&gt;&gt;typically engage the enemy at.<BR>I wrote:<BR>&gt;&gt;I wasn't putting forth a "typical" engagement.&nbsp; In the scenario<BR>&gt;&gt;that I proposed, all else being equal, the rifle squad looks to<BR>&gt;&gt;me to have the advantage.<BR>Leonard wrote:<BR>&gt;Only if you assume "low tech" = "stupid". <BR>I write:<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; I disagree.&nbsp; I merely proposed that under a particular set of<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; circumstances a given force would have an advantage over<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; another given force.&nbsp; You may think that such circumstances<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; are unlikely without one force being "stupid".&nbsp; While there are<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; many examples of military forces doing arguably "stupid"<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; things, this is entirely beside to point.&nbsp; The point is that<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; under the proposed scenario, the squad would have the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; advantage over the company.&nbsp; This in no way denigrates the<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; intelligence of the spearmen or archers in the company, nor<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; do I think that I am underestimating the effectiveness of<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; longbows in the hands of expert archers (such archers<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; should deserve respect from rifle-equiped soldiers supported<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; by autorifles under many circumstances).&nbsp; I am by no<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; stretch of the imagination an expert on firearms, bows, or<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; warfare, what I do know seems to indicate that the poor<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; company in my scenario would be the likely loosers.<BR><BR>Peez<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 17:11:42 -0000 <BR>From: "Trevor, Peter" &lt;Peter.Trevor@rb.cwplc.com&gt;<BR>Subject: [Website Review] Spinward Marches Trade Map<BR><BR>The Traveller Website Review<BR>- ----------------------------<BR><BR>Next up is Terry Mixon's ...<BR><BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Spinward Marches Trade Map<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (http://www.ghg.net/tmixon/Trade)<BR><BR>Okay, a very quick review here ... this site is what it&nbsp; says&nbsp; it<BR>is.&nbsp; A single function with little that is extraneous.&nbsp; The&nbsp; HTML<BR>is basic (not even a proper&nbsp; in-window&nbsp; heading)&nbsp; and&nbsp; there&nbsp; are<BR>almost no graphics on the front page.&nbsp; Thus the front page&nbsp; loads<BR>fast.<BR><BR>The purpose of this site is to present you&nbsp; with&nbsp; a&nbsp; map&nbsp; of&nbsp; the<BR>Spinward Marches showing the major shipping routes.&nbsp; This can&nbsp; be<BR>viewed as a series of subsector GIFs or as a single sector GIF in<BR>all its glory.&nbsp; The rule system used is GT:Far Trader as fixed by<BR>Jim Maclean.&nbsp; Thus the maps show trade routes from 8 to&nbsp; 12&nbsp; BTN.<BR>When I say&nbsp; 'fixed'&nbsp; I&nbsp; mean&nbsp; it&nbsp; includes&nbsp; all&nbsp; relevant&nbsp; eratta<BR>including junking the WTN+5 rule, and adding GWPx10&nbsp; for&nbsp; smaller<BR>worlds.&nbsp; The fixed trade rules are also available from this&nbsp; site<BR>as a TXT file.&nbsp; (I do wonder about&nbsp; the&nbsp; amount&nbsp; of&nbsp; cross-border<BR>trade between the Imperium and some Zhodani worlds but&nbsp; this&nbsp; has<BR>more to do with the Far Trader rules than with this website.)<BR><BR>In addition to&nbsp; the&nbsp; Spinward&nbsp; Marches&nbsp; there&nbsp; are&nbsp; also&nbsp; preview<BR>versions of Reft Sector and Deneb.&nbsp; These are works&nbsp; in&nbsp; progress<BR>showing the larger trade routes only.<BR><BR>Summary: This site is a must for merchant campaigns based in&nbsp; the<BR>Spinward Marches and using the Far Trader rules.<BR><BR>Improvements: A&nbsp; few&nbsp; cosmetic&nbsp; adjustments&nbsp; to&nbsp; the&nbsp; front&nbsp; page<BR>wouldn't go&nbsp; amiss.&nbsp; Beyond&nbsp; that,&nbsp; to&nbsp; make&nbsp; this&nbsp; site&nbsp; a&nbsp; true<BR>resource for&nbsp; merchant&nbsp; campaigns&nbsp; it&nbsp; would&nbsp; benefit&nbsp; from&nbsp; some<BR>articles on trade (perhaps something to explain that trade volume<BR>with a Zho planet, maybe something exploring the effect temporary<BR>and otherwise of the 5FW,&nbsp; more&nbsp; 101&nbsp; cargos,&nbsp; a&nbsp; bulk&nbsp; freighter<BR>design, etc).<BR><BR><BR><BR>Regards PLST<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2001 19:08:39 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: 52 million ton hull!<BR><BR>Timothy Little wrote:<BR>&gt; How about six separate toruses?<BR><BR>The toruses would need to have slightly different radii (or they would<BR>be connected). You would probably want to place them at different angles<BR>compared to the equator of the plane, since that would (on average) give<BR>a shorter trip from the planet to a highport.<BR><BR>&gt; Or one torus and five stations that are each merely huge?<BR><BR>Could work, but I get a sudden vision of a huge station smashing into a<BR>even larger torus...<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 05 Feb 2001 19:12:47 +0100<BR>From: "Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm" &lt;jenry023@student.liu.se&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Big starports<BR><BR>Michael Daumen wrote:<BR>&gt; Too bad that the Starports hull table doesn't include the monstrosities that<BR>&gt; most of the Class V ports will be.&nbsp; Maybe a bigger table will appear in<BR>&gt; Starships.&nbsp; Sadly, Starports also lacks quick tables for random starport<BR>&gt; generation when the full process is not necessary.<BR><BR>Three words:&nbsp; Fire&nbsp;&nbsp; Fusion&nbsp;&nbsp; Steel<BR><BR>* Jens 'Spacejens' Rydholm * Student at the university *<BR>| jenry023@student.liu.se&nbsp; | of Linkoeping, Sweden&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; |<BR>| ICQ UIN: 3844745&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; | (computer science/tech.)&nbsp; |<BR>* http://spacejens.dhs.org * 22 years old, male&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; *<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 10:26:18 -0800 (PST)<BR>From: Anthony Jackson &lt;ajackson@molly.iii.com&gt;<BR>Subject: Re: Solar Power in Traveller<BR><BR>Timothy Little writes:<BR><BR>&gt; &gt; Hm..ok, found it.&nbsp; Basically, you are applying 1 joule pulses every<BR>&gt; &gt; 5 microsec for 5 milliseconds.&nbsp; In order to get material out of the<BR>&gt; &gt; hole fast enough, material will tend to go in non-useful directions<BR>&gt; &gt; at lot<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; The only *non* useful direction is out of the hole -- material in<BR>&gt; every other direction causes wounding.&nbsp; Besides, the hole is better if<BR>&gt; it starts narrower.&nbsp; On the order of a few millimetres should be<BR>&gt; achievable.<BR><BR>No, because pulverized material doesn't become magically opaque.&nbsp; Useful <BR>directions are any directions which get the water out of the way.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &gt; holding a beam on the same square centimeter of a moving target for<BR>&gt; &gt; 5 ms is actually not trivial,<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; By my calculation, good results should be obtained with different<BR>&gt; figures.&nbsp; For a 2 mm beam diameter, each pulse should be about 30<BR>&gt; Joules, spaced about 5 microseconds apart.&nbsp; The temporary cavity<BR>&gt; should be about 5 mm deeper by the time the next pulse arrives (though<BR>&gt; not as much wider, since the expansion is anisotropic).&nbsp; The second<BR>&gt; pulse vaporises part of the rear surface, enlarging the temporary<BR>&gt; cavity further.<BR><BR>Lessee, to achieve a 5mm cavity in 5 ms, you are moving all of the material <BR>in the cavity at ~1000 meters/second, and nearby material at lower rates.<BR>The main energy requirement here (&gt;50%) is for the material in the cavity, we'll say the hole is 5mm on a side, so you're moving about 1/8 gram.&nbsp; That<BR>requires an energy of 62 joules.<BR><BR>Now, the way you're imparting energy into the cavity is by vaporizing water.<BR>In effect, this is a rocket equation -- the force of boiling water is what<BR>is driving the remaining material inward.&nbsp; Assuming the boiling water is <BR>moving at 2.5 kilometers per second (requiring roughly 5 kilojoules per<BR>gram, including heat of vaporization) we need to vaporize 0.05 grams of <BR>water, taking 250 joules.<BR><BR>So, your energy requirements are off by an order of magnitude, I fear...<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 10:36:53 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Uhhhhh<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt; In a message dated 02-Feb-01 9:13:32 PM Central Standard Time, <BR>&gt; owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com writes:<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Clint Eastwood did an excellent<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; documentary (entitled "Firefox") on how the US stole the technology from<BR>&gt;&gt;&nbsp; the Soviets.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Tongue firmly in cheek here, I hope?<BR><BR>I wasn't sure until I got down to the point where he started talking<BR>about the Grays. :-)<BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 10:43:09 PST<BR>From: shadow@krypton.rain.com (Leonard Erickson)<BR>Subject: Re: Recoil, Second Thoughts....<BR><BR>In mail you write:<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; HOWEVER, I can respond to one question that has been repeated several<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; times..."Why would a ray-gun be more reliable?"<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; Simply because it requires no moving parts and can be totally encased<BR>&gt;&gt; &gt; (potted) in a polymer. A ray-gun, could, in effect, be a solid object.<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;&gt; Sorry, not even *close*. You can't "pot" it unless you want to have it<BR>&gt;&gt; melt. Likewise, parts, even electronic ones *fail* and need replacement<BR>&gt;&gt; (I just had to replace a power supply that died with no warning)<BR>&gt;&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Uhh, I new to the Traveller universe, but I thought this was science<BR>&gt; fiction. Are you seriously equating today's power supply with that the<BR>&gt; *might* exist somewhere in time when we *jump* between stars?<BR><BR>It's *hard* science fiction. Which means that you aren't allowed to<BR>just wave&nbsp; your hands around problems in science or engineering. A few<BR>things (like jump drive) are taken as givens. The rest has to conform<BR>to the laws of physics (Especally since they aren't going to change.<BR>They may get *extended*, but any "changes" will be in the fine print).<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Lasers are going to have moving parts. The aiming/focusing mechanism at<BR>&gt;&gt; the very least. And it's unlikely that the lasing medium will be solid.<BR>&gt;&gt; Not at the required energy levels. Which means you'll have both<BR>&gt;&gt; focusing mirrors and the lasing cavity that can get knocked out of<BR>&gt;&gt; alignment.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Uhh, we a have solid state LASERs in the present. Why would they not exist<BR>&gt; in the future?<BR><BR>Read what I said. "At the required energy levels". There's a big<BR>difference between a laser diode that puts out *milliwatts* and one<BR>that puts out *megawatts*. About like the difference between a<BR>firecracker and an atomic bomb.<BR><BR>&gt; Might I remind you, again, that this is science FICTION?<BR><BR>That's "SCIENCE fiction". The difference between SF and fantasy is that<BR>you don't get to break the rules simply because it's convenient to the<BR>plot. You have a set of rules based on science (usually with a few<BR>changes) AND YOU STICK TOO THEM.<BR><BR>&gt; Focusing mirrors? Mirrors are used to aim LASERs, not focus them (by<BR>&gt; definition LASER light is coherent);<BR><BR>"Coherent" and *collimated* are two very different things. Coherent<BR>merely means that all the wavefronts are "in step". That *doesn't* mean<BR>the beam isn't diverging.<BR><BR>Take a laser pointer and a friend. Set up some markers in a field or<BR>park. Then measure the spot size from a laser pointer at various<BR>ranges. <BR><BR>Also, as has been pointed out here, you *do* need to focus the beam<BR>down to something smaller, so as to make it practical. Otherwise, your<BR>laser has a *higher* energy density (watts/cm^2) than the spot it<BR>illuminates on the target.<BR><BR>&gt; a hand held LASER needs no mirrors (you<BR>&gt; point it in the direction you want the beam to go).<BR><BR>See above. <BR><BR>Also note that we have people on the list who work with *real* lasers.<BR>And they'll confirm what I've said.<BR><BR>&gt;&gt; Oh yeah, a speck of *dust* on the optics of a weapons grade laser will<BR>&gt;&gt; cause an explosion... What was that film? "Real Genius"? I'm told the<BR>&gt;&gt; explosion from the vaseline on the lens was done pretty accurately.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Huh? It's a wonder we don't have LASER labs all over world blowing up!<BR><BR>They use clean rooms and careful handling precautions to *prevent* the<BR>optics from blowing up. <BR><BR>&gt; Yikes, man, what have you been smokin'? Better yet gimme some of what the<BR>&gt; person who advised you to use a MOVIE (and a bad one at that) as support for<BR>&gt; your opinion was smokin'!<BR><BR>You *really* need to work on reading comprehension. I did *not* use<BR>that movie as support for *anything*. I said that the explosion due to<BR>contaminated optics that was shown in it was a fairly accurate<BR>portrayal of reality (as opposed to damn near everything else it it). <BR><BR>- -- <BR>Leonard Erickson (aka Shadow)<BR>shadow@krypton.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;--preferred<BR>leonard@qiclab.scn.rain.com&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;--last resort<BR><BR>------------------------------<BR><BR>End of Traveller-digest V1999 #3599<BR>***********************************<BR><BR>To unsubscribe to Traveller-Digest, send the command:<BR><BR>unsubscribe traveller-digest<BR><BR>in the body of a message to "traveller-request@lists.ient.com".<BR>If you want to subscribe something other than the account the mail is<BR>coming from, such as a local redistribution list, then append that<BR>address to the "subscribe" command; for example, to subscribe<BR>"local-traveller":<BR><BR>subscribe traveller-digest local-traveller@your.domain.net<BR><BR>A non-digest (direct mail) version of this list is also available; to<BR>subscribe to that instead, replace all instances of "traveller-digest"<BR>in the commands above with "traveller".<BR><BR>Multi-Player Games Network http://www.mpgn.com<BR></I></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #fffffe" PTSIZE="10" I <></I></S><XMP></XMP>
<P align=left><FONT color=#0f0f0f face=Arial size=2 PTSIZE="10" BACK="#FFFFFE"><BR><BR>----------------------- Headers --------------------------------<BR>Return-Path: &lt;owner-traveller@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>Received: from&nbsp; rly-za05.mx.aol.com (rly-za05.mail.aol.com [172.31.36.101]) by air-za04.mail.aol.com (v77_r1.21) with ESMTP; Mon, 05 Feb 2001 14:16:17 -0500<BR>Received: from&nbsp; lists.ient.com (lists.ient.com [204.85.32.11]) by rly-za05.mx.aol.com (v77.27) with ESMTP; Mon, 05 Feb 2001 14:15:35 1900<BR>Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) with SMTP id OAA78590;<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; Mon, 5 Feb 2001 14:13:43 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller@lists.ient.com)<BR>Received: by lists.ient.com (bulk_mailer v1.12); Mon, 5 Feb 2001 14:12:50 -0500<BR>Received: (from majordom@localhost)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; by lists.ient.com (8.9.3/8.9.2) id OAA78516<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; for traveller-digest-outgoing; Mon, 5 Feb 2001 14:12:50 -0500 (EST)<BR>&nbsp; &nbsp; (envelope-from owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com)<BR>Date: Mon, 5 Feb 2001 14:12:50 -0500 (EST)<BR>Message-Id: &lt;200102051912.OAA78516@lists.ient.com&gt;<BR>From: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com (Traveller-digest)<BR>To: traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR>Subject: Traveller-digest V1999 #3599<BR>Reply-To: traveller@lists.ient.com<BR>Sender: owner-traveller-digest@lists.ient.com<BR><BR></FONT></P></FONT></FONT></BODY></HTML>